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"Teblew it."
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Original message

Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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02-15-13, 06:21 PM (EST)
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"Teblew it."
Well, so much for having a career in a blue state.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/02/15/1187355/-Tim-Tebow-aligns-with-Hatemongering-Mega-Church

I will not argue about the headline being biased. Of course the headline is biased. (You can find more neutral stories by searching for the names: I used this one for the embedded videos.) But the summation of the preacher's positions is accurate, and if that's where Tubya wants to make a personal appearance -- well, it's a very large brush and he'll find it can hold enough tar for everyone.

We knew he was likely gone from New York. It may be in his best interests to leave immediately.

I wish I could say I was surprised -- no, I don't.

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  Table of Contents

  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
 RE: Teblew it. KeithFan 02-17-13 1
   RE: Teblew it. Estee 02-17-13 2
       RE: Teblew it. PepeLePew13 02-17-13 3
       RE: Teblew it. KeithFan 02-18-13 4
           I'll translate. Estee 02-18-13 5
               RE: I'll translate. KeithFan 02-19-13 6
                   RE: I'll translate. Estee 02-19-13 7
                       RE: I'll translate. KeithFan 02-20-13 8
 RE: Teblew it. Colonel Zoidberg 02-20-13 9
   RE: Teblew it. AyaK 02-20-13 10
       RE: Teblew it. Estee 02-20-13 11
       RE: Teblew it. Colonel Zoidberg 02-20-13 12
       RE: Teblew it. KeithFan 02-20-13 13
 Te-bowing out cahaya 02-21-13 14
   RE: Te-bowing out Estee 02-21-13 15
 Another take. Estee 02-23-13 16
 Shut up, Rex. Estee 03-19-13 17
 RE: Teblew it. cahaya 06-10-13 18
   RE: Teblew it. Estee 06-10-13 19
       Well. . . AyaK 06-10-13 20
           RE: Well. . . cahaya 06-10-13 21
           RE: Well. . . Estee 06-10-13 22
               RE: Well. . . cahaya 06-10-13 23
                   RE: Well. . . AyaK 06-11-13 24
                       Vinny says... cahaya 06-11-13 27
       RE: Teblew it. bullzeye 06-18-13 34
           RE: Teblew it. AyaK 06-18-13 35
               RE: Teblew it. bullzeye 06-21-13 39
 Hoodie's press conference. Estee 06-11-13 25
   RE: Hoodie's press conference. AyaK 06-11-13 26
       RE: Hoodie's press conference. cahaya 06-11-13 28
           RE: Hoodie's press conference. AyaK 06-11-13 29
               RE: Hoodie's press conference. cahaya 06-11-13 30
                   RE: Hoodie's press conference. AyaK 06-12-13 31
                       RE: Hoodie's press conference. cahaya 06-12-13 32
                           Blast from the past AyaK 06-14-13 33
                               RE: Blast from the past cahaya 06-18-13 36
                                   RE: Blast from the past AyaK 06-19-13 37
 Grank and Hernandez status? HobbsofMI 06-21-13 38
   NE tight ends AyaK 06-21-13 40
       RE: NE tight ends HobbsofMI 06-22-13 41
           Arrest approaching. Estee 06-22-13 42
               Arrested! cahaya 06-26-13 43
                   RE: Arrested! Estee 06-26-13 44
                   Cut from the team! PepeLePew13 06-26-13 45
                       RE: Cut from the team! Estee 06-26-13 46
                       Charged with murder! PepeLePew13 06-26-13 48
                           Priorities. Estee 06-26-13 49
                               RE: Priorities. cahaya 06-26-13 50
                                   RE: Priorities. AyaK 06-26-13 51
                                   RE: Priorities. Estee 06-26-13 52
                                       RE: Priorities. cahaya 06-26-13 53
                                           RE: Priorities. AyaK 06-27-13 54
 The NFL's day gets worse. Estee 06-26-13 47
   Serial Killer? kidflash212 06-27-13 55
       RE: Serial Killer? cahaya 06-27-13 56
           Detectives are gum shoes cahaya 06-28-13 57
 Making the remainder collector's it... Estee 06-28-13 58
   RE: Making the remainder collector'... cahaya 06-28-13 59
       RE: Making the remainder collector'... PepeLePew13 06-28-13 60
           $287.00 cahaya 07-01-13 63
               RE: $287.00 cahaya 07-05-13 67
   RE: Making the remainder collector'... AyaK 07-01-13 64
       Full circle cahaya 07-03-13 65
           RE: Full circle AyaK 07-05-13 66
               Day 1: 1200 jerseys exchanged AyaK 07-09-13 68
 And they don't pass on the savings ... Estee 06-29-13 61
   Personal misconduct cahaya 06-29-13 62
 Football players who don't kill peo... Estee 07-24-13 69
   RE: Football players who don't kill... kingfish 07-25-13 70
   RE: Football players who don't kill... AyaK 07-26-13 71
       Grand jury indictment today AyaK 08-22-13 77
   Meanwhile, his letters from jail... cahaya 08-04-13 72
 Oof. Estee 08-06-13 73
   Howard Bryant AyaK 08-22-13 75
 One (probable) gun down... Estee 08-21-13 74
   RE: One (probable) gun down... AyaK 08-22-13 76
 NFLPA files grievance for alleged s... AyaK 08-27-13 78
   RE: NFLPA files grievance for alleg... Estee 08-27-13 79
       RE: NFLPA files grievance for alleg... PepeLePew13 08-28-13 80
 Hoodie releases the Tebow Snidget 08-31-13 81
   RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow AyaK 08-31-13 82
       RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow bondt007 08-31-13 83
           RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow Estee 08-31-13 84
               RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow bondt007 08-31-13 86
           RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow PepeLePew13 08-31-13 85
               RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow bondt007 08-31-13 87
 Official Hernandez plea: not guilt... Estee 09-06-13 88
 Back to Tebow Bebo 09-06-13 89
   RE: Back to Tebow Estee 11-10-13 90

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KeithFan 7414 desperate attention whore postings
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02-17-13, 05:25 PM (EST)
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1. "RE: Teblew it."
Ya! Keep talking Tim! Chicago is blue, we don't want you!
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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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02-17-13, 06:41 PM (EST)
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2. "RE: Teblew it."
So that's what ultimate desperation sounds like.

Is there a genuine rumor of him drifting in your general direction, or is this general sports fan paranoia combined with the possibility of your team's owner potentially being exactly this clueless?

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PepeLePew13 24836 desperate attention whore postings
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02-17-13, 07:47 PM (EST)
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3. "RE: Teblew it."
It's not like the Bears need someone to tear apart the team and have most of the guys on offense hate him and the offensive line willing to look the other way while the likes of Jared Allen rush in practically untouched at the QB - they already have Jay Cutler for that.
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KeithFan 7414 desperate attention whore postings
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02-18-13, 04:09 AM (EST)
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4. "RE: Teblew it."
Well the new OC was asked about him, and he gave the "great athlete, yada yada" speech and speculated as to how he would do at TE (a glaring Bear need)
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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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02-18-13, 09:42 AM (EST)
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5. "I'll translate."
You're screwed.

He won't do well with much of the populace. There's always a hardcore fundamentalist presence to support his preaching if not his play -- but I think he could reasonably expect a high degree of pre-rejection going in.

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KeithFan 7414 desperate attention whore postings
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02-19-13, 00:30 AM (EST)
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6. "RE: I'll translate."
I don't think it is anywhere near serious talk. Bears don't have the cap space to take care of all the guys they would like to keep already, they don't need stunt trades to keep the base interested, and we got lucky to some degree with a potential locker room cancer (Marshall) growing up and becoming Mr. Great Teammate. The only reason I'd ever want to see him in Midnight Blue and Orange would be for a photo-op with surly Jay. That might be a hoot.
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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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02-19-13, 09:37 AM (EST)
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7. "RE: I'll translate."
*nods sagely*

Screwed and in denial.

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KeithFan 7414 desperate attention whore postings
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02-20-13, 02:05 AM (EST)
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8. "RE: I'll translate."
How else would *I* end up with 2 kids?
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Colonel Zoidberg 3658 desperate attention whore postings
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02-20-13, 01:15 PM (EST)
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9. "RE: Teblew it."
As far as I knew, Tebow has never stated his beliefs on homosexuality publicly. That having been said, either he agrees with their stance, in which case he'll find only limited support a la Michael Vick, except without the talent, and he won't last, or he's just looking for a mouthpiece, in which case, he'll find himself with a career as a guest speaker at every megachurch in the country, riding the Heisman win for the rest of his life.

Either way, he's definitely in minute 15 in the mainstream.

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AyaK 10231 desperate attention whore postings
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02-20-13, 04:18 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: Teblew it."
Maybe I'm missing something, which isn't difficult since, as an atheist, I don't support any Christian church, but why is Tebow's speech at this church being seen as his endorsement of it?

I've seen tapes of Tebow speaking, and the only thing I've seen him endorse is the idea that God will act as a personal Lord and savior -- which is a silly idea, but in no way related to the hate being spewn by this church. It would seem to me that a devout Christian would want to testify far and wide -- even to a Muslim church if it would host him -- because that would be consistent with Jesus' instruction to his disciples in Matthew 10:16-22 to speak to hostile audiences as well as friendly ones:

"Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves; so be shrewd as serpents and innocent as doves. But beware of men, for they will hand you over to the courts and scourge you in their synagogues; and you will even be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. But when they hand you over, do not worry about how or what you are to say; for it will be given you in that hour what you are to say. For it is not you who speak, but it is the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.

"Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved."

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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02-20-13, 04:32 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: Teblew it."
Because of this silly belief which has been making the rounds lately -- you know, the one that states 'If you step foot inside a church, you must believe and support everything the person in charge of that facility says and does'. I'm pretty sure it started a couple of elections back. A lot of people subscribe to it and have Amazon auto-renewal. Someone will tar him with that brush.

I'm trying to imagine him getting up in front of that congregation and speaking on behalf of equality and same-gender marriage. And I'm managing it. But it keeps ending with a lynching.

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Colonel Zoidberg 3658 desperate attention whore postings
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02-20-13, 05:54 PM (EST)
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12. "RE: Teblew it."
LAST EDITED ON 02-20-13 AT 05:55 PM (EST)

why is Tebow's speech at this church being seen as his endorsement of it?

For the same reason George W. Bush's speech at Bob Jones University in 2000 was seen as endorsement of the school's policy against interracial dating.

Seriously, though, that misses the point of my rant. Tim Tebow is known for two things - being a Heisman Trophy winner and not a subpar NFL player, and for being a devout and outspoken Christian. And his NFL career is turning sour before our eyes, so all he'll have left is his college career and his faith.

Obviously these megachurches are hardly above exploiting his faith, and people who won big awards in college football are not above riding that award for the rest of their lives. See: Griffin, Archie, who is on Columbus sports' version of Mount Rushmore next to Woody Hayes. Such a future of speaking at churches and grand openings is Tebow's future. And frankly, given enough time, no one outside of north Florida will give two sh!ts about him.

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KeithFan 7414 desperate attention whore postings
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02-20-13, 07:59 PM (EST)
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13. "RE: Teblew it."
That is enough internet for me today. AyaK is quoting scripture.
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cahaya 18974 desperate attention whore postings
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02-21-13, 12:57 PM (EST)
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14. "Te-bowing out"
From Tebow's twitter:

While I was looking forward to sharing a message of hope and Christ's unconditional love with the faithful members of the historic...

... First Baptist Church of Dallas in April, due to new information that has been brought to my attention, I have decided to cancel my...

...upcoming appearance. I will continue to use the platform God has blessed me with to bring Faith, Hope and Love to all those...

...needing a brighter day. Thank you for all of your love and support. God Bless!

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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02-21-13, 01:05 PM (EST)
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15. "RE: Te-bowing out"
Turning the new question into 'Was he somehow truly not aware and is now backing away in horror at maximum speed, or does he secretly agree with all of it while having to defend his public reputation?'

The world may never know.

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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02-23-13, 07:44 PM (EST)
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16. "Another take."
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8975694/tim-tebow-simply-win-critics

Note the heavy implication that the AFA agrees with everything Jeffries has to say and is ashamed of Tebow for not publicly doing so as a proper Christian. Beyond that -- well, yes, we didn't know what he was going to say. But I still find it unlikely he was showing up to be lynched.

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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03-19-13, 05:39 PM (EST)
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17. "Shut up, Rex."
http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/9070314/rex-ryan-makes-clear-new-york-jets-qb-job-grabs

So the head coach's positions are as follows: he wants Tubya to stay in town, he wants a quarterback controversy, he wants the winner to be completely ineffective because you can't pass when you're looking over your shoulder, and he wants every back page headline from August through December. But not January, because they're not making the playoffs.

Anyone want to trade blowhards?

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cahaya 18974 desperate attention whore postings
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06-10-13, 06:05 PM (EST)
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18. "RE: Teblew it."
Well, guess which team just signed Tebow!

So, what position(s) will he play? Surely Bill will come up with something.

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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06-10-13, 06:30 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: Teblew it."
LAST EDITED ON 06-10-13 AT 07:00 PM (EST)

Well, this should be interesting. I've never seen AyaK cry before.

ETA: ESPN now confirming, so add Bullzeye to the suicide watch.

Understand: it's not about what Tebow might be able to accomplish under the right coach or with the proper position, nor is it about any potential attempt to one-up the Jets again. To me, this mainly concerns what might be the single stupidest move of Hoodie's career: putting Tebow together with the Boston Media. I thought he was smarter than that. I thought Andy Reid would be smarter than that.

Start the fatality count now. It's going to be high.

Re-ETA: ESPN says the rumor is Tebow's been signed as a quarterback and their blogger feels Hoodie might be doing this partially to prove he can stop the media circus.

*hollow laugh*

...yeah, he's lost it.

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AyaK 10231 desperate attention whore postings
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06-10-13, 07:54 PM (EST)
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20. "Well. . ."
I've been expecting this news for some time. The only reason New England didn't sign him earlier is that he's only a third-string QB in New England, and Tebow had still been hoping for more than that.

Tebow will not be at all divisive in New England, because the only way he'll play in a game that matters, other than on a trick play, is if BOTH Tom Brady and Ryan Mallett get injured, and he had to accept that coming in.

It amazed me when someone supposedly "in the know" wrote that Belichick hated Tebow. Even though Tebow brings his own set of issues, Belichick would never turn down the chance of helping out one of Urban Meyer's proteges unless he thought that doing so would hurt the Patriots.

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cahaya 18974 desperate attention whore postings
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06-10-13, 08:15 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: Well. . ."
Belichick has long been a fan of Tebow, and this goes back even to April 30 this year (article archived).

I'm curious what his official position will be both on the team and in the Yahoo fantasy leagues. How about a QB/TE/RB combo?

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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06-10-13, 08:21 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: Well. . ."
It's like having Jafar wish to be a genie: you've got it -- and everything that goes with it. There are Tebow crazies in Boston and the surrounding area who will immediately start chanting for some Perceived Divine Intervention. You are about to find out just how many.

Divine Interception, maybe...

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cahaya 18974 desperate attention whore postings
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06-10-13, 08:34 PM (EST)
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23. "RE: Well. . ."
I wager Tim won't be throwing the ball much, not with Tom under center. But put the both of them in the backfield together, they could be a potentially dangerous combination, a tandem Belichick is no doubt hoping to exploit.

Let's not forget with Belichick did with highly underrated Danny Woodhead, a mere 5'9" 200-pound, but very determined, running back, who'd mouse his way through opponents defenses. And say what you want, Tebow can run and he doesn't fumble the ball. He is very fast around the corner.

Tebow has accounted for 29 touchdowns (17 pass/12 rush) and just 16 turnovers in three seasons since the Denver Broncos selected him in the first round of the 2010 NFL draft. He has also averaged five yards per carry. Obviously, the numbers aren't all bad once you get away from the pure-passer elements.

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AyaK 10231 desperate attention whore postings
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06-11-13, 11:24 AM (EST)
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24. "RE: Well. . ."
I think Belichick looks at Tebow and sees another Vinnie Testaverde project.
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06-11-13, 05:35 PM (EST)
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27. "Vinny says..."
LAST EDITED ON 06-11-13 AT 05:36 PM (EST)

Speaking of Testaverde and fancy footwork... (ESPN, April 29, about a month and a half ago)

Testaverde and former NFL QB Chris Weinke, one of the top instructors at IMG, evaluated Tebow last month. Testaverde and Weinke "speak the same quarterback language," as Testaverde put it, because they both played under Dan Henning, a former Jets and Panthers coordinator.

"Chris and I looked at Tim careful and we were both amazed," Testaverde said. "Everybody has been focusing on his throwing motion, trying to fix that, but nobody had picked up his footwork. His footwork was all screwed up. Chris and I looked at each other after about four or five throws, and we saw the same thing. We got his footwork fixed. His throwing motion is now a non-issue.

"He throws with what we call 'effortless power.' He doesn't have that elongated motion anymore and his head isn't moving 2 1/2 feet when he throws it."

Asked to explain Tebow's footwork flaws in layman's terms, Testaverde said "he was stepping in the wrong direction when he was throwing the football."

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bullzeye 4982 desperate attention whore postings
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06-18-13, 12:42 PM (EST)
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34. "RE: Teblew it."
ETA: ESPN now confirming, so add Bullzeye to the suicide watch.

That would probably have been the case had we not experienced Randy Moss. I thought Moss was going to be a nightmare when he was signed, and he turned out to be a phenomenal acquisition. I suspect Bill knows a bit more about these things than I do.

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AyaK 10231 desperate attention whore postings
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06-18-13, 03:50 PM (EST)
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35. "RE: Teblew it."
One of the things we've learned is that you can never tell how a Patriots' acquisition of a controversial player will work out, but you can guarantee that there won't be another Lawyer Milloy incident (with the player mouthing off about Belichick).

Good acquisitions: Corey Dillon, Randy Moss, Aqib Talib
Bad acquisitions: Albert Haynesworth, Chad "Ochocinco" Johnson
To be determined: Tim Tebow, LeGarrette Blount

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bullzeye 4982 desperate attention whore postings
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06-21-13, 11:30 AM (EST)
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39. "RE: Teblew it."
Oops! Forgot about Chad. What a "Chad" he turned out to be!
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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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06-11-13, 11:39 AM (EST)
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25. "Hoodie's press conference."
LAST EDITED ON 06-11-13 AT 11:43 AM (EST)

At this point in his career, I truly don't understand why any members of the press would show up not to be talked to.

ETA: I indulged in a little sports talk radio earlier. Not only is Tubya the lead (and nearly only) story, but theories of why Hoodie signed him are growing wild on fertile fields of total crap. My favorite to date: because Brady is getting up there in quarterback years, Hoodie may not want to risk having him stay at his position in the fourth quarter of blowout games. So rather than follow the great Hoodie tradition of running up the score, he'll simply pull Brady and put Tubya in to run the game's last few plays.

As one of the hosts immediately noted, this would mean Hoodie has just hired a knee-taking specialist.

Well, he does take one in such a 'special' way...

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06-11-13, 04:51 PM (EST)
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26. "RE: Hoodie's press conference."
None of that is going to happen, as we all know.

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06-11-13, 05:51 PM (EST)
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28. "RE: Hoodie's press conference."
There's the media joshing around and then there is Josh.

Tim Tebow has signed with the New England Patriots and the media has already dubbed the move as the "Boston Tebow Party."

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06-11-13, 08:27 PM (EST)
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29. "RE: Hoodie's press conference."
McDaniels is part of it, but those of us in Boston remember Belichick praising Tebow when Tebow was still in college (and before McDaniels went to Denver).

I brought up Testaverde because I had also seen Vinnie Testaverde's quote and I know that there are few people that Belichick respects more than Testaverde.

When Bernie Kosar suffered his ultimately career-ending injuries (that he tried to play through), Belichick decided to replace him with Testaverde, whom Belichick was able to get cheaply from Tampa Bay, where Testaverde had been a JaMarcus Russell-sized bust (although he'd lasted there for 6 years).

Testaverde went on to play for another 15 years in the NFL.

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06-11-13, 09:38 PM (EST)
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30. "RE: Hoodie's press conference."
Testaverde went on to play for another 15 years in the NFL.

He still holds a lot of NFL and franchise records, simply because of his longevity and ability to stay on the field.

Alas, his record with the Pats is a paltry 2/3 passing for 29 yards and a (record season extending) TD pass.

Career-wise, he had a 275 TD / 267 Int ratio, for a vanilla 75.0 passer rating, playing for 8 different teams, mainly with the Bucs, Browns and the Jets.

Even so, it's pretty incredible for a QB to last for an amazing 21 seasons ('87-'07) like he did.

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06-12-13, 06:29 PM (EST)
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31. "RE: Hoodie's press conference."
While Testaverde only played part of one season with the Patriots, he played for Belichick in both Cleveland and New York prior to that.
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06-12-13, 07:11 PM (EST)
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32. "RE: Hoodie's press conference."
LAST EDITED ON 06-12-13 AT 07:22 PM (EST)

Thanks, that's something I didn't know. I missed out on a lot of NFL living overseas until playing FF. As a kid and a paperboy who religiously read the sports columns and stats (not to mention the stock market), I lived on this kind of thing.

We'll see. I think the Tebow experiment could turn out well, given who is coaching him. He has the qualities that Bill seeks most, work ethic, determination, ability to learn, teamwork and an example and elan that can make a team a winner. Tebow has all of these qualities, but whether he can translate it to team wins on the field (or even make the 90-man cut) obviously still remains to be seen.

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06-14-13, 02:18 PM (EST)
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33. "Blast from the past"
Here's an article from 1993, right after Belichick waived Bernie Kosar to give the starting job in Cleveland to a (then-injured) Testaverde, which led to the Browns missing the playoffs. The Browns would have made the playoffs had Belichick kept and started Kosar, but he didn't want a QB controversy to such an extreme extent that he was willing to miss the playoffs to prevent one.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1138788/

The Browns made the playoffs the next year behind Testaverde and beat Bill Parcells' New England Patriots in the first round of the playoffs. But then Browns' owner/moron Art Modell announced at the start of the 1995 season that he was going to move the team to Baltimore for 1996, leading to the team (and Belihick) quitting on Modell during the season. Testaverde, who was under contract, was stuck and had to go to Baltimore, but Belichick went to New England, which made the Super Bowl. At the end of the season, Parcells and Belichick fled to the New York Jets in a turf battle with Bobby Grier (who won that battle but lost the war three years later when he was fired to make way for Belichick's return).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Grier_(American_football_coach)

After their first season in New York, Parcells and Belichick acquired Testaverde from the Ravens (which was only possible because Testaverde had missed almost all of the 1997 season due to injury), and he was the Jets' starting QB for the next two years while Belichick was there, until Belichick went back to New England (where he already had Drew Bledsoe and then drafted a rookie named Tom Brady). Testaverde, meanwhile, stayed in NYC through 2003, after which Parcells (now in Dallas) traded for him for the Cowboys.

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06-18-13, 07:00 PM (EST)
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36. "RE: Blast from the past"
LAST EDITED ON 06-18-13 AT 07:02 PM (EST)

Thanks! Love that first article, which in part goes:

Belichick knows it's all weird, but there's a catch: He doesn't care. That's just the way he is. Take him or leave him. This is football, and in football there's no room for hand-wringing and squishy psychoanalysis. "You prepare a team as best you can," he says. "You put them on the field, and you do your very best to win. The rest hardly matters. I may look at the paper every now and then, but come on. I've got other things to worry about."

At least he's consistent. He spends much of an interview at the Browns' training complex explaining how much he hates doing interviews. He would rather chew aluminum foil for an hour than be interviewed. He is by turns dour, suspicious and ornery, although in an unfailingly polite sort of way. If Bill Belichick: The Movie were ever made, Belichick would be played by Harrison Ford: aloof, rumpled, preoccupied by things the rest of us will never fully understand.

He hasn't changed a bit, has he?

(ETA) Hey, grats on your 10 K, Aya K!

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06-19-13, 01:38 PM (EST)
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37. "RE: Blast from the past"
He hasn't changed a bit, has he?

He really hasn't. The difference was that in Cleveland, people already hated Art Modell for firing Marty Schottenheimer to hire the disorganized Bud Carson, who then had to be fired in his second season and was replaced with Belichick instead of the people's choice, Bill Cowher (who was then hired by Pittsburgh the next year).

In New England, Belichick came in as the people's choice to replace Pete Carroll, as a link back to the Super Bowl season under Parcells. Thus, his flaws were seen much less critically than they were viewed in Cleveland.

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06-21-13, 10:35 AM (EST)
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38. "Grank and Hernandez status?"
Well it now looks like NE will be losing both their star TE's for a while so this may not be a bad signing if he can catch and make him a TE.


sig Syren, bouncy by IceCat, bobble head by Tribephyl, and snoglobe by agman

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06-21-13, 07:32 PM (EST)
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40. "NE tight ends"
Well, the Patriots still have Jake Ballard, who missed all of last year with an injury but was part of the Giants' Super Bowl-winning team (over NE) the year before that. They also have Michael Hoomanawanui and rookie Zack Sudfeld at tight end. Plus, the truth is that Julian Edelman (if he can stay healthy) also plays a modified H-back position. And Rob Gronkowski will be back, although staying healthy is again a question.

The Aaron Hernandez story, at this point, sounds similar to the Ray Lewis story. Hernandez was supporting a group of thugs, including renting cars for them to drive. The charges against him are designed to pressure him into talking, because Hernandez, like Ray Lewis and other U. Miami thugs before, during, and after them, has internalized the "no snitchin'" mentality of the thug life. Ultimately, like Ray Lewis, he'll get some kind of a league suspension -- although the idea of him being involved in the murder is far-fetched, because he'd have to be a bigger fool than we've ever seen to have left one of his rented cars, which he loaned to the victim, at the scene of the crime -- leading the police directly to him.

He finally hired competent legal counsel yesterday. Now, if he does what counsel tells him, his legal trouble is likely to blow over fairly quickly, although the stink will never go away.

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06-22-13, 06:19 AM (EST)
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41. "RE: NE tight ends"
Even thought I'm not doing FF I know their roster of TE's for some reason and was being sarcastic.

Yes, the Hernandez story it seems is the same story of an professional athlete who is running with a bunch of leaches but I got to love the Boston media following him around by air like OJ.


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06-22-13, 07:21 AM (EST)
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42. "Arrest approaching."
He's doing a magnificent job of digging himself in deeper. If the latest stories are to be believed, the police asked for his home security system and cell phone. He turned both over -- broken into multiple pieces.

Supposedly he should be brought in under warrant pretty soon -- but that'll leave him free on bail within hours.

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06-26-13, 09:18 AM (EST)
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43. "Arrested!"
LAST EDITED ON 06-26-13 AT 09:49 AM (EST)

Breaking news, more details to come.

More details, charges still pending.

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06-26-13, 10:32 AM (EST)
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44. "RE: Arrested!"
The ESPN story notes that he 'casually spit' into some bushes as the police brought him out.

Public relations are not his strong suit.

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06-26-13, 10:53 AM (EST)
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45. "Cut from the team!"
The Patriots have cut him from the team. Wow. Talk about being painted guilty until proven innocent!

Most of the comments on the CNN story are from people whining that they already had their early drafts or they're stuck with Hernandez in their keeper leagues. Aww. Odin Lloyd's family sympathizes with you.

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06-26-13, 11:03 AM (EST)
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46. "RE: Cut from the team!"
Remember that one player who was cut just before the Super Bowl for a considerably lesser suggested offense? I wouldn't be surprised if this had been Hoodie's decision.
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06-26-13, 03:09 PM (EST)
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48. "Charged with murder!"
LAST EDITED ON 06-26-13 AT 03:13 PM (EST)

He's now been formally charged with murder and five gun-related charges including unlawful possession of a firearm and possession of a large-capacity firearm.


ETA: Further new info has come in through twitter:

Prosecutor: Police have #Hernandez on tape with firearm and saying "you can't trust anyone anymore" before picking up Lloyd.

---------

#Hernandez's (undestroyed) phone included texts to the victim and two friends on the night of murder.

---------

Prosecutor says Aaron Hernandez was 'upset' with Odin Lloyd after Lloyd had spoken at a nightclub to people Hernandez 'had troubles with.'

---------

Prosecutor: When he gets home, Hernandez walks through home with gun in hand -- and it's captured on video.

---------

Prosecutor: Shell casing was found in the car Hernandez rented. It matched the casings found at the scene. #itsover

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06-26-13, 04:01 PM (EST)
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49. "Priorities."
The darkest humor I've found in this has been from learning about the complaints from people who demand that Hernandez be freed and reinstated, or just freed and picked up by another franchise on waivers -- because this arrest and release are hurting their prospective fantasy team.
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06-26-13, 08:12 PM (EST)
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50. "RE: Priorities."
No bail, no play.

For any FF'ers out there, cut him like the Pats just did and take your losses. It happens. The game goes on, and you can still win the fantasy league.

Hernandez just lost $40m and potentially many years of his free life. His game is over.

"He orchestrated the crime from the beginning, he took steps to conceal and destroy evidence and he took steps to prevent the police from speaking to ... an important witness," the prosecutor said. A judge ordered that Hernandez be held without bail.

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06-26-13, 08:40 PM (EST)
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51. "RE: Priorities."
It's going to be an interesting transition to move from a mansion where you are surrounded by your posse of friends to a cell where you are surrounded by people who have little to lose by taking you on.
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06-26-13, 09:25 PM (EST)
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52. "RE: Priorities."
Hernandez just lost $40m

Found this on Grantland, from Bill Barnwell.

"The Patriots can try to recoup some of the money owed to Hernandez, but it's unlikely to prevent the deal from hitting their salary cap. NFL Network's Ian Rapoport noted that Hernandez's contract does not contain any "failure to perform" clauses that would allow the Patriots to skip out on paying him the remaining $3.25 million due from his signing bonus or his guaranteed base salaries in 2013 ($1.32 million) and 2014 ($1.14 million). According to Rapoport, most Patriots contracts contain such a clause, but Hernandez's deal only holds that to be the case in terms of his workout bonuses, which should save the Patriots a mere $82,000 in 2013 and $500,000 in 2014. The only way the Patriots could save more money would be if another team signed Hernandez, with their payments offsetting some or all of the money the Patriots were otherwise due to pay him."

Well, now we know how he might pay for any potential appeal.

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06-26-13, 09:36 PM (EST)
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53. "RE: Priorities."
Quick link for interested readers.

It should be more than enough to buy gang protection and contraband behind the bars.

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06-27-13, 11:22 AM (EST)
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54. "RE: Priorities."
LAST EDITED ON 06-27-13 AT 11:24 AM (EST)

I seriously doubt Rapaport's interpretation, and even he says that his "analysis" is speculation that "could" mean what he claims. But the one thing that's certain is that the Patriots will take a real cap hit as a result of this move, because the already-paid portions of Hernandez's signing bonus will now hit the cap over the next two years.

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06-26-13, 01:11 PM (EST)
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47. "The NFL's day gets worse."
At least this one is still alive -- and with luck, that's more than just 'for now'. And we can only hope for a full recovery.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9424219/ausar-walcott-cleveland-browns-rookie-arrested-tuesday-charged-attempted-murder

Still thinking about Hernandez as well. He has, to date, been an idiot. I'm wondering if that stupidity would extend into trying a run.

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06-27-13, 02:35 PM (EST)
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55. "Serial Killer?"
Might be more rumor and speculation right now than anything else but now they are saying this might not be his first murder.


http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/27/19170321-hernandez-probed-in-two-drive-by-killings-last-year-sources-say?lite

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06-27-13, 04:05 PM (EST)
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56. "RE: Serial Killer?"
It's looking worse and worse, and who knows what else might come next...

Apparently, they've linked him to an SUV they've been looking for and that he rented for the 2012 killings, according to CNN.

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06-28-13, 08:18 PM (EST)
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57. "Detectives are gum shoes"
And a criminals are gum chews...

Bubblegum evidence

And a trail of blue bubblegum colorfully shows Hernandez's path that night, according to prosecutors...

There, the defendant offered an attendant a piece of blue Bubblicious, prosecutors say. What appeared to be a piece of chewed blue gum was left lying inside the vehicle, prosecutors say. Next to it was a spent .45-caliber casing. The casing matches the empty shells Investigators recovered near Lloyd's body, prosecutors say. If that gum was in Hernandez's mouth, DNA tests will connect him to the casings, prosecutors say.

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06-28-13, 08:43 PM (EST)
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58. "Making the remainder collector's items."
The Patriots have offered a chance to exchange Hernandez jerseys for any of equivalent value on July 6th and 7th -- but only at their pro shop.

I call this a PR move. A real effort would have involved a longer duration, mailed packages, and connecting up with the NFL's online store.

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06-28-13, 10:37 PM (EST)
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59. "RE: Making the remainder collector's items."
Trade in that cursed 81 for a high 5 while you can!
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06-28-13, 10:50 PM (EST)
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60. "RE: Making the remainder collector's items."
There'll always be someone out there looking to add a Hernandez jersey to complement his Rae Carruth jersey framed on the wall.
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07-01-13, 12:55 PM (EST)
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63. "$287.00"
Yup, that's the going price on eBay.

A store-bought Hernandez jersey sold for a whopping $287 on the auction site this weekend. Another one, purchased for $50, has seen bidding rise to $227. The jersey pictured below has 36 bids and is up to $207.

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07-05-13, 03:13 AM (EST)
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67. "RE: $287.00"
Make that a more than a grand now.

Official Hernandez jerseys are selling for as much as $1,300 online as former fans try to cash in on the athlete's fall from grace and others try to snatch a bizarre collectible.

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07-01-13, 02:37 PM (EST)
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64. "RE: Making the remainder collector's items."
Even if it's only a PR move, it's an expensive PR move. The exchange covers any official NFL jersey sold at the Patriots' pro shop (made by either Nike or Reebok), and those jerseys sell for up to $140 each. Even if their cost, including royalties, is only $20-40 (depending on style), that's a huge hit on the jerseys being given away -- of which there will be thousands.

Nobody is offereing to buy back old Chad Ochocinco jerseys.

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07-03-13, 01:14 PM (EST)
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65. "Full circle"
Tebow in, Hernandez out, Tebow once played peacemaker with his former teammate.

Ironies of ironies.

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07-05-13, 00:56 AM (EST)
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66. "RE: Full circle"
As we move to a sports world in which athletes want to be like Jay-Z, and even want him to represent them, I guess it's no wonder that they also want to act like Jay-Z (who shot his older brother when he was 12).
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07-09-13, 05:55 PM (EST)
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68. "Day 1: 1200 jerseys exchanged"
That's according to the Patriots' official Twitter feed.

No feed number on the second day, but let's guess that the total exchange was around 2,000 Aaron Hernandez jerseys.

Too bad there wasn't a tattoo exchange as well.

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06-29-13, 01:37 PM (EST)
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61. "And they don't pass on the savings to you."
A breaking radio story claimed the Patriots have been able to use a Personal Conduct clause to escape from paying $6m of the future guaranteed money.

Prospective prison life just got bit harder -- unless you're seeing Hernandez as the NFL's arguable rarest creation: the money saver. And we already know he had some degree of circle/entourage: those come with a price -- one that's partially financial.

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06-29-13, 03:38 PM (EST)
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62. "Personal misconduct"
LAST EDITED ON 06-29-13 AT 06:41 PM (EST)

And apparently they don't pass the savings on to him either.

With those guidelines in place, Hernandez stands to lose up to $10 million of his signing bonus, depending on the amount of time he would be incarcerated or suspended. He has earned one-fifth of the prorated bonus by playing last season, and that amount cannot be paid back. Any bonus forfeiture moving forward would be prorated based on how many weeks he would be unavailable to the Patriots.

"It's hard to say at this point what he's going to lose," said former player agent Joel Corry, now a contract and salary-cap analyst for the National Football Post and CBSSports.com "But even if he's not charged, it should trigger a suspension under the personal conduct policy."

Hernandez's signing bonus was broken into three payments: $6 million at the time of signing, $3.25 million this March and $3.25 million in March of 2014. Corry said, in the worst case scenario of Hernandez being imprisoned for the remainder of his contract, the Patriots would likely file a grievance to stop payment on the final installment and recoup $6.75 million of what's already been paid.

(eta) More coverage of the salary and cap hits.

NFL Players Association records show that the Patriots have voided all of Hernandez's remaining guaranteed money, which is $5.91 million. The hits on the Patriots salary cap will start at $2.55 million in 2013, then escalate until Hernandez's five-year contract leaves the books in 2015.

Hernandez signed a five-year, $39.768 million extension in August 2012, with $16 million guaranteed. It included a $12.5 million signing bonus, prorated over five years. Hernandez has already collected roughly $10 million.

The Patriots believe an umbrella clause that allows a team to suspend a contract for "conduct detrimental to the best interests of professional football" will keep Hernandez from collecting any more money from the team.

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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07-24-13, 07:30 PM (EST)
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69. "Football players who don't kill people."
On the day Hernandez went back into the court and the state asked for a little additional time for case-building (granted), it's nice to have a reminder that the sport is also populated by human beings.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9504862/tennessee-titans-rookie-jonathan-willard-saves-family-burning-car

Plus the occasional hero.

Unfortunately, I've also been seeing articles on Grantland about an upcoming college player named Jadeveon Clowney who is described as being too violent for football. There's a phrase you don't see every day. In fact, there's a phrase you don't really want to see at all.

I am in no way accusing that one of an inclination towards doing things off the field, although I will cite him for stupidity: he made a happy statement about getting Jay-Z as an agent when he was about to become a college player. But too violent for football... gah. No, I don't want to watch him. Or have him on my team. In fact, I'm not sure I want him in the sport at all.

There are fans looking forward to stats columns reading Tackles, Sacks, Body Count. I'm not among them.

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07-25-13, 09:08 AM (EST)
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70. "RE: Football players who don't kill people."
LAST EDITED ON 07-25-13 AT 09:09 AM (EST)

But how bad can a a guy named Clowney be? He's fun at kids parties, he directs the comedy in the center ring. So what if he rips arms off opposing quarterbacks and pushes the heads of offensive linemen out their anuses (anusi?).

He must be least partially human, and that would probably qualify him to run for President.

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07-26-13, 05:36 PM (EST)
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71. "RE: Football players who don't kill people."
... and the state asked for a little additional time for case-building (granted) ...

The state never had any intention of holding a probable cause hearing. It would rather get a grand jury indictment.

But it also wants to use the grand jury to see what it can find out about a possible Hernandez role in the previous double homicide, as well. Once the grand jury indicts, that "secret" avenue is closed, because the defense is entitled to a copy of the grand jury testimony -- but until then, the defense isn't entitled to know anything about what the grand jury is doing.

Thus, no indictment yet.

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08-22-13, 03:18 PM (EST)
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77. "Grand jury indictment today"
As predicted in the prior post.

Now that the state found the second gun (in a traffic stop!) and have traced it to Hernandez, it's time to stop fishing and start prosecuting.

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08-04-13, 12:20 PM (EST)
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72. "Meanwhile, his letters from jail..."
get published on TMZ site.

Oops.

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08-06-13, 12:42 PM (EST)
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73. "Oof."
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9532176/tom-brady-bill-belicheck-disappoint-reaction-aaron-hernandez-espn-magazine

I will now consider Tom Brady as having been punched in the face.

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08-22-13, 03:10 PM (EST)
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75. "Howard Bryant"
You know, I'd been wondering how long it would take before Howard Bryant showed up to attack the Patriots. He still blames the Patriots, especially Belichick, for his getting fired by the Boston Herald -- and not his own reporting, which didn't give two sh--s about what actually happened and instead focused on the underlying (and,, in his opinion, generally racist) causes of it, whatever it was.

He made a splash when he came into Boston by writing about the long-deceased Tom Yawkey's ugly history of racisim, which everyone knew but no one talked about. But that splash evaporated, and he came off as a one-trick pony.

I always expected him to wind up in the Obama White House.

Basically, I'll let others respond to Bryant for me.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/08/06/espns-howard-bryant-trashes-tom-brady-bill-belichick-for-aaron-hernandez-response/

In truth, there may have been a salient point or two to be made from Bryant’s opinion, except for, well, they were buried underneath heaps of verbal garbage and logically bankrupt statements. * * * *

With regard to Belichick, Bryant sarcastically referred to the coach as a “molder of men.” I’d challenge Bryant to find one person in the history of sports, writing and the English language who ever referred to Belichick as a molder of men. Belichick does not coach in Pop Warner, high school or college; he coaches professionals in the NFL, men who make millions of dollars to compete in a game. Belichick’s job is to employ those men in the best way possible to win on Sundays. It is not his job to “mold men,” nor does anyone think it is. Yet Bryant slams Belichick for not doing it, because again, Bryant wanted to say it. * * * *

Where Bryant did have a point was in the media fawning over Belichick for simply “acting like a human being.” That praise went overboard. Fine. But is it Belichick’s fault what media members say about him? Let’s crush the coach because a football writer had horrible perspective! That’s what magazine writing is all about!

He’s also correct in pointing out that sports organizations create myths of character in players that don’t always have any. Given the very public arrest record of many athletes, that much is universally known and accepted. It probably didn’t warrant its own column. We’re not idiots and can figure that out on our own. But thank you so very much, Mr. Bryant, for the drowning toddler hyopthetical. I’m surprised you didn’t criticize Belichick for not saving a baby this week while you were at it.

Alas, Bryant wrote his column knowing it would invite the spotlight upon him, and in that sense it worked. But my, what an embarrassing price to pay to get some attention.

Yet there is reason to believe Bryant himself is in on the joke. He opened his column by lamenting the “sports industrial complex,” the very industry that allows him to make what can be assumed to be a very nice salary. He complains that sports discussions are “routinely transforming both the English language and any sense of perspective into self-indulgent mush.”

On that point, there is no counterargument. With his column bashing two men for not living up to impossible, ridiculous standards, Bryant proved he’s an expert in the area of self-indulgent mush.

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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08-21-13, 12:06 PM (EST)
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74. "One (probable) gun down..."
espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/_/id/9585709/police-find-gun-possible-aaron-hernandez-link-reports

...one to go.

*sigh*

Although I wouldn't exactly be surprised if we got to three and beyond.

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AyaK 10231 desperate attention whore postings
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08-22-13, 03:13 PM (EST)
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76. "RE: One (probable) gun down..."
Mark Twain once wrote, "Lack of money is the root of all evil."

Multi-millionaire Aaron Hernandez has singlehandedly disproved Twain's saying.

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AyaK 10231 desperate attention whore postings
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08-27-13, 04:09 PM (EST)
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78. "NFLPA files grievance for alleged serial killer"
Showing once again how strongly the NFLPA supports criminals. here is today's news.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nflpa-files-grievance-behalf-hernandez-182643573--nfl.html

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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08-27-13, 04:56 PM (EST)
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79. "RE: NFLPA files grievance for alleged serial killer"
{dark}But how can you ask them to turn against forty percent of their membership?{/dark}
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PepeLePew13 24836 desperate attention whore postings
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08-28-13, 10:07 PM (EST)
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80. "RE: NFLPA files grievance for alleged serial killer"
LAST EDITED ON 08-28-13 AT 10:08 PM (EST)

Forty percent? Oh look, see who has such faith in humanity to believe that sixty percent in the NFL are actually decent enough people. It's the Tebow effect on the NY media market, right?

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08-31-13, 11:40 AM (EST)
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81. "Hoodie releases the Tebow"
Back into the wild where he can kneel free.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/patriots/2013/08/31/patriots-release-tim-tebow-cut/2750815/

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AyaK 10231 desperate attention whore postings
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08-31-13, 04:09 PM (EST)
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82. "RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow"
Honestly, I don't understand Tebowmania. Why is this such a big news story?

I thought it was obvious that (1) Belichick picked Tebow up as a favor to Urban Meyer; (2) once Aaron Hernandez was gone, Tebow had no real function with the team unless he could master the offensive reads; and (3) Tebow wasn't going to make the Patriots.

Can Tebow play quarterback in the NFL? He's simply got to make better reads than he does now. If so, yes, he can -- but that's not something you can learn as the scout team QB.

Belichick also isn't averse to having players switch positions, as people speculated he'd do with the Patriots. Starting Patriots H-back Julian Edelman was a college QB (at Kent State). But, again, anyone actually listening to what the people were saying would know that wasn't going to happen. If Tebow had been interested in doing that, some other team would have signed him. He said that he wasn't. He's still saying that.

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bondt007 3395 desperate attention whore postings
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08-31-13, 07:01 PM (EST)
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83. "RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow"
One of the largest reasons - maybe the only reason - it's a story in the media and a thread here, is that's it's a lot of fun for people to poke fun at a Christian. It's in style and acceptable. And for a short while it infuriated people that he seemed to have some limited success in Denver so it's fun for them to see him cut.



>Issued by "Q" and RollDdice

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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08-31-13, 07:51 PM (EST)
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84. "RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow"
I suspect you're overlooking something.

For those in the media and outside it of a more religious bent, there is the following angle: 'Here we have a man of visible faith who professes the following system of beliefs. Therefore, any success he enjoys in life is a direct sign of that deity's approval of said faith and beliefs'.

Or in the shorter form, 'Every time he throws a touchdown, we're right.'

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bondt007 3395 desperate attention whore postings
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08-31-13, 09:22 PM (EST)
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86. "RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow"
So (a) you're agreeing with me and (b) success or failure, HE doesn't seem to agree with what you (or others) are assuming. I think that, too, is frustrating to most, and why it's a story.



>Issued by "Q" and RollDdice

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PepeLePew13 24836 desperate attention whore postings
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08-31-13, 09:19 PM (EST)
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85. "RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow"
Or there could be a much simpler explanation that doesn't require any reading between the lines: He's a crappy QB.
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bondt007 3395 desperate attention whore postings
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08-31-13, 09:31 PM (EST)
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87. "RE: Hoodie releases the Tebow"
Nope. Too many crappy QB's were released with no story or threads... so that's not it.


>Issued by "Q" and RollDdice

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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09-06-13, 04:16 PM (EST)
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88. "Official Hernandez plea: not guilty on all charges."
Que surprise.

So this officially sends things into 'my defense can obfuscate better than your prosecution can clarify'. Maybe the NFLPA can testify on his behalf as a mass character witness. He pays his dues, therefore he's innocent. Yay, standard policy!

Jury selection on this one is going to be fascinating.

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09-06-13, 10:19 PM (EST)
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89. "Back to Tebow"
The latest word is that there was another team interested in signing Tebow but didn't want him to play QB. He said no, he only wants to be an NFL QB. He's also turned down playing in Canada.

He tweeted:
"I will remain in relentless pursuit of continuing my lifelong dream of being an NFL quarterback."

Keep dreaming.

http://tracking.si.com/2013/09/05/tim-tebow-position-change-refusal/?xid=si_nfl

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Estee 55633 desperate attention whore postings
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11-10-13, 01:32 PM (EST)
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90. "RE: Back to Tebow"
At this point, his best hope might be changing the date on his birth certificate backwards by a couple of decades, then claiming to have post-concussion memory loss.

...hey, worked for the other guy.

Basic fact: when the BrINT is getting phone calls and you're not? It is a message. Silence speaks loudly in this particular business, and this particular piece of quiet is saying Your Professional Career Is Over Unless You Change Your Direction.

But he can't. He doesn't know how.

There is no backup plan.

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