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AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-28-06, 04:03 PM (EST) "More Iraq fraud from the MSM" LAST EDITED ON 12-28-06 AT 04:19 PM (EST) Last time it was Reuters. This time it's the AP producing fraudulent "news" from the Middle East. Compared to these clowns in the mainstream media, Bush almost seems honest. Almost. Here's the AP story that triggered the controversy: Six burned alive in Iraq Horrible stuff, right? Even though everyone denies it happened, the AP claimed to have gotten a statement from "police Capt. Jamil Hussein." It turns out that Hussein has been a source for 61 AP stories over the last two years. It also turns out that he doesn't exist. Paging Capt. Hussein Even the lefties at Editor & Publisher can't put a good spin on this one, though they've tried their hardest: UPDATE: Jamil Hussein, Disputed AP Source, Lost, 'Found,' Lost Again "Disputed"? That's like calling the CBS National Guard forgeries "disputed." The correct word is "nonexistent." Or "fictitious." Or, most probably, "fraudulent." Edited to add: More fraud in the story: Two workers at Kazamiyah Hospital also confirmed that bodies from the clashes and immolation had been taken to the morgue at their facility. They refused to be identified by name, saying they feared retribution. Problem? There is no morgue at Kazamiyah Hospital. The AP never issued a correction of this story, but it did see fit to attack the US military in this story, claiming that it had contacted the supposed captain: Seeking further information about Friday's attack, an AP reporter contacted Hussein for a third time about the incident to confirm there was no error. The captain has been a regular source of police information for two years and had been visited by the AP reporter in his office at the police station on several occasions. The captain, who gave his full name as Jamil Gholaiem Hussein, said six people were indeed set on fire. Since the guy apparently doesn't exist, this rebuttal calls the AP's entire credibility in Iraq into issue -- and the AP has responded with complete silence since then. I guess the AP liked Nixon's "stonewall" tactics after all: keep quiet and hope the story goes away. Still another edit: Here's a very good story by Christopher Hitchens on the current situation in Iraq, including the Shiite ethnic cleansing in Baghdad: http://www.slate.com/id/2156273/nav/tap2/   Top

Subject     Author     Message Date     ID    Why? J I M B O 12-28-06 1    RE: Why? AyaK 12-28-06 2        RE: Why? PepeLePew13 12-28-06 3        RE: Why? J I M B O 12-28-06 4            RE: Why? AyaK 12-28-06 5  AP keeps stonewalling AyaK 01-02-07 6    RE: AP keeps stonewalling zipperhead 01-02-07 7        RE: AP keeps stonewalling AyaK 01-02-07 8            RE: AP keeps stonewalling zipperhead 01-02-07 9  Quel surprise SherpaDave 01-08-07 10    Wow AyaK 01-08-07 11        RE: Wow SherpaDave 01-08-07 12    RE: Quel surprise I_Got_Nutn 01-08-07 14        RE: Quel surprise SherpaDave 01-08-07 15            RE: Quel surprise I_Got_Nutn 01-08-07 16                RE: Quel surprise SherpaDave 01-08-07 17                    RE: Quel surprise AyaK 01-08-07 18                        RE: Quel surprise SherpaDave 01-08-07 19  RE: More Iraq fraud from the MSM geg6 01-08-07 13  Hmmm AyaK 01-22-07 20    RE: Hmmm HobbsofMI 01-22-07 21        RE: Hmmm zipperhead 01-22-07 22            RE: Hmmm HobbsofMI 01-22-07 23                RE: Hmmm HistoryDetective 01-22-07 24

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J I M B O 6839 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-28-06, 05:59 PM (EST) 1. "Why?" I just don't understand what motive there could be on their end to do something so risky, or stupid if you prefer.   Top

AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-28-06, 06:05 PM (EST) 2. "RE: Why?" Actually, what it seems like to me is similar to what's been taking place in the Iraqi police forces, which have been infiltrated with crooks and partisans (see the Hitchens article). Seems to me that the AP also got infiltrated, and it doesn't have the integrity to own up to it.   Top

PepeLePew13 26138 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-28-06, 06:11 PM (EST) 3. "RE: Why?" Any chance the Bush Administration might be behind these reports as "proof" that their troops are needed in Iraq, using the unsuspecting AP as pawns? A Tribe siggie "Tsk, tsk. Pepe's messing with the newbies again." Spidey, 3/30/05   Top

J I M B O 6839 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-28-06, 06:12 PM (EST) 4. "RE: Why?" Infiltrated by pseudo-journalists with an agenda? Sure, but you'd think there's enough actual news to report on which would do (almost) as much damage. They may need to spin a viewpoint to hit their target...but at least base the propaganda on some semblance of fact to avoid the total embarrassment of getting caught like this. Or...maybe there really isn't anything all that dramatic going on in the way they'd like to report.   Top

AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-28-06, 06:38 PM (EST) 5. "RE: Why?" >Sure, but you'd think there's enough >actual news to report on >which would do (almost) as >much damage. They may need >to spin a viewpoint to >hit their target...but at least >base the propaganda on some >semblance of fact to avoid >the total embarrassment of getting >caught like this. > >Or...maybe there really isn't anything all >that dramatic going on in >the way they'd like to >report. There is no question that there is enough violence going on. As Hitchens points out, the violence even has a non-random pattern. The question is how much reporting is actually being done, because I've never seen anyone in Iraq before Hitchens mention the actual pattern, although I've seen speculation about it in US blogs. Whether the violence is dramatic enough to catch the US public's attention is another question. After all, saying that six people had been burned alive got headlines all over the US. Would the simple execution of six more people by the Sadr militia have gotten those headlines -- even though the deaths are horrific either way? I think not. As the Investors Business Daily article points out, this seems most similar to the Reuters photo-doctoring scandal. In that case, Reuters bought pictures from a Shiite stringer who didn't think his pictures were dramatic enough to draw attention in the West, so he photoshopped them to make them more dramatic. Here, I'd guess that the AP was taken in by a Sunni stringer who was getting information from one of the Sunni militias but exaggerated it ... and attributed it to a phony Iraqi police officer to cover up the real source.   Top

AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-02-07, 05:05 PM (EST) 6. "AP keeps stonewalling" http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003526364 Really, the AP should be a laughingstock for its mockery of serious journalism: Linda Wagner, AP's director of media relations and public affairs, said she had just seen Jordan's post, but did not expect to have more to say about it. She said "it would be highly unusual for any news organization to provide sources on the demands of critics." In other words, once we make up a name, you want proof? Proof? We don't need no steekin' proof. We say he exists, then he exists, even if no one on earth can find him. I'm still betting that the AP gets away with the stonewall, though I'll bet we never see the name of Jamil Hussein appear in the AP again.   Top

zipperhead 3442 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity" 01-02-07, 05:54 PM (EST) 7. "RE: AP keeps stonewalling" Earlier today, I heard the meat-head filling in for Rush Limbaugh say that Greenland was named such by the Vikings because back in their day it was actually green. Does he support his claim with any scientific or historic proof? Of course not. Are thousands of dittoheads now going to regurgitate that same bit of misinformation for years to come? Probably. In actuality, parts of the southern coast are green enough to support farming in the summer months. But the vast majority of the island has been covered in ice for many thousands of years. Just goes to show that any source of "information" can be skewed, tainted, distorted and absolutley meaningless. Always scrutinize what you read or hear, people!   Top

AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-02-07, 06:18 PM (EST) 8. "RE: AP keeps stonewalling" LAST EDITED ON 01-02-07 AT 06:19 PM (EST) Just goes to show that any source of "information" can be skewed, tainted, distorted and absolutely meaningless. That's true, but I have to admit that I wouldn't put much credence in any "facts" uttered on the Rush Limbaugh Show (or any other radio "opinion" show), whereas I'd expect the AP to uphold the #1 rule of journalism and get its facts right. Are we equating the AP and Rush Limbaugh as reliable sources of information? For the AP's sake, I hope not. But ... digressing to Greenland for a moment ... did you know that between the fjords and the glacier, there isn't a road on the entire island that connects two towns? The entire island is like Juneau, Alaska: it's only accessible by boat.   Top

zipperhead 3442 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity" 01-02-07, 06:25 PM (EST) 9. "RE: AP keeps stonewalling" I would never put the AP and Rush on the same level, but I know of people who do. Sadly, these people skim headlines from the newspaper or internet and then get their "in-depth analysis" from talk radio. I spend more time arguing with these people than I want to.   Top

SherpaDave 8326 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 03:57 PM (EST) 10. "Quel surprise" The source does exist. Our gubmint just didn't want to admit it. http://www.usatoday.com/life/columnist/mediamix/2007-01-07-media-mix_x.htm See Dave write. See Dave edit. See Dave blog. See Dave space.   Top

AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 04:13 PM (EST) 11. "Wow" LAST EDITED ON 01-08-07 AT 04:14 PM (EST) Perhaps I'm insufficiently skeptical, but it seems asinine to me both that the Iraqi government and US military would deny the guy's existence if he really was there. What a bunch of maroons. Eason Jordan, a former CNN executive who now runs a website devoted to Iraq called Iraqslogger.com, says he is "relieved" for the AP that Iraqi officials confirmed Hussein's existence. But, he says, "all parties in this could have handled this better, starting with the Iraqi and U.S. government stating flat-out that Hussein did not exist. That set off the whole controversy." I'm not sure I agree with Jordan about the AP's blame. The entire controversy exists SOLELY because the Iraqi government and U.S. military said the guy didn't exist. Under those circumstances, the AP's response makes sense -- they don't want the source to be killed for speaking to them. To me, the blame can only go to the Iraqi government and the US military -- and I feel like a fool for believing their statements, even if they made sense when combined with the AP's other error about what happened to the bodies. Maybe the same people who "determined" Iraq had WMDs were the ones who "determined" that Jamil Hussein didn't exist....   Top

SherpaDave 8326 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 04:16 PM (EST) 12. "RE: Wow" If there's one thing that both the Iraqi and American governments seem to excel at, it's asininity.   Top

I_Got_Nutn 897 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent" 01-08-07, 05:14 PM (EST) 14. "RE: Quel surprise" I would feel better about this if I could find any source besides the AP reporting it.   Top

SherpaDave 8326 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 05:19 PM (EST) 15. "RE: Quel surprise" Considering the link is from USA Today, I have to assume you're just trying to be funny.   Top

I_Got_Nutn 897 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent" 01-08-07, 05:46 PM (EST) 16. "RE: Quel surprise" LAST EDITED ON 01-08-07 AT 05:47 PM (EST) The USA Today article is using the AP report as its source for the existence of Hussein. Google it, the AP is the only new service reporting that the Interior Ministry has confirmed the existence of Hussein. Everyone else is just citing the AP report. ETA: ing, reporting. That would have gotten me 5 minutes in front of the mirror of truth.   Top

SherpaDave 8326 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 06:11 PM (EST) 17. "RE: Quel surprise" And yet, the only folks kvetching about it are the same right-wing bloggers who freaked out in the first place. Hmmm.   Top

AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 06:31 PM (EST) 18. "RE: Quel surprise" A Disputed A.P. Source Turns Up, but Bloggers Are Not Appeased   Top

SherpaDave 8326 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 06:43 PM (EST) 19. "RE: Quel surprise" Yep, that was one of the articles I read before forming the opinion that there's a whole lot o' whinin' goin' on.   Top

geg6 14941 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-08-07, 04:30 PM (EST) 13. "RE: More Iraq fraud from the MSM" Okay, after reading this whole thread, all I can do is laugh and shake my head. Whatever. I don't believe one single word from our government any more. Not one. I'm much more prepared to believe the AP than anything out of any mouths from the Pentagon, State Department, Homeland Security (what a misnomer!), or the White House. They could say the sky is blue and I'd not believe them. And I won't even begin to discuss what I think of the Iraqi "government." The strongest man in the world is he who stands alone. — Henrik Ibsen If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away. - Henry David Thoreau   Top

AyaK 10426 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-22-07, 12:56 PM (EST) 20. "Hmmm" Looks like the real issue has turned into whether this guy's stories are true. Destroyed - Not AP Executive Editor Kathleen Carroll indignantly attacked those who had questioned the global news organization's reporting: "I never quite understood why people chose to disbelieve us about this particular man on this particular story," she told Editor and Publisher. "AP runs hundreds of stories a day, and has run thousands of stories about things that have happened in Iraq." Well, Bryan Preston and I visited the area during our Iraq trip last week. Several mosques did, in fact, come under attack by Mahdi Army forces. But the "destroyed" mosques all still stand. Iraqi and U.S. Army officials say that two of them received no fire damage whatsoever. Another, which we filmed, was abandoned and empty when it was attacked. WE obtained summary reports and photos filed at the time by Iraqi and U.S. Army troops on the scene. They contain no corroborating evidence of Hussein's claim that "Shiite militiamen grabbed six Sunnis as they left Friday worship services, doused them with kerosene and burned them alive near Iraqi soldiers who did not intervene."... And if this <story> doesn't <stand up>, how many others don't? As AP exec Carroll herself said, "AP runs hundreds of stories a day, and has run thousands of stories about things that have happened in Iraq." Jamil Hussein supplied the AP with information for scores of stories, not just this faulty one. Rumor-based reporting serves no one's interests but those who would see Iraq fail. Lt. Col. Steven Miska, commander of the Dagger Brigade at Forward Operating Base Justice, observed: "Part of it is, if you're relying on Iraqi reporters, well, what are their biases? What clans are they from and tribes? Why are they telling me this? What's his underlying motivation? And if you quote a police chief, well, those guys have underlying motivations, too . . ." "I've gone out and found police chiefs on the street and said, 'What happened here?' Something just blew up and he told me, 'Well, U.S. airplanes just bombed this building.' "I said, 'What are you talking about? It was freakin' insurgent rockets that just hit the building, I picked them up on radar.' " But he just told the reporter on the street that U.S. warplanes bombed the building and killed 13 people. "So, rumors on the street Iraqis will take at face value. Trying to get them to do investigations is like pulling teeth out of their head."   Top

HobbsofMI 16065 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-22-07, 01:09 PM (EST) 21. "RE: Hmmm" When US/European reporters are to scared to venture out what do you expect? I don't think we'll ever find out what truly is going on there. Too many people with too many agenda's to figure out what is true and what is false. Save the Cheerleader Save the World sig by Syren and bouncy by IceCat   Top

zipperhead 3442 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity" 01-22-07, 01:32 PM (EST) 22. "RE: Hmmm" If OT peeps want to take up a collection and send me to Iraq, I will gladly give you bona fide reporting. Whaddya say?   Top

HobbsofMI 16065 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-22-07, 01:47 PM (EST) 23. "RE: Hmmm" I think PRE would object to your reporting....lol..... Save the Cheerleader Save the World sig by Syren and bouncy by IceCat   Top

HistoryDetective 9516 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 01-22-07, 01:53 PM (EST) 24. "RE: Hmmm" Perhaps, but PRE has repeatedly objected when anybody has suggested that he himself should spend time in Iraq supporting the cause that he so firmly believes in. Maybe they could both go, one as a soldier and the other as a reporter, so we could have more than one perspective from OT peeps on the ground.   Top

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