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esquire 1095 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Politically Incorrect Guest" 05-03-03, 11:05 PM (EST) "Does Matt have a clue?" When I was watching last week's episode, I was shocked beyond belief that Matt voted against Christy. I almost screamed at my TV set. I couldn't believe he would stay with people he couldn't trust or like. However, it finally occured to me that it was one of the most brilliant moves strategically ever. Matt is now in a 4 person alliance and he can beat everyone of them easily in the finals. No one hates Matt. He spends all of his time working hard for the tribe and catching fish. In addition, his actions last week with the reward challenge may have elevated him to Saint Matt. Everyone hates Rob. Heidi and Jenna have several enemies (Christy, Rob and Butch at a minimum and probably Deena and Dave as well). His toughest competition in a final 2 vote would have been against Christy or Butch and they will both soon be gone. In addition, he is by far the best player left at immunity challenges and the one most likely to go on a immunity run like Colby Matt has learned the game well and should now be the favorite to win it all.   Top

Subject     Author     Message Date     ID    RE: Does Matt have a clue? frisky 05-04-03 1    RE: Does Matt have a clue? Loree 05-04-03 2        Does Butch have a clue? Jims02 05-04-03 3            RE: Does Butch have a clue? Loree 05-04-03 6    RE: Does Matt have a clue? Fast Eddie 05-04-03 4  I vote for clueless Fast Eddie 05-04-03 5    RE: I vote for clueless esquire 05-04-03 7        RE: I vote for clueless Fast Eddie 05-05-03 8            RE: I vote for clueless Brownroach 05-05-03 9                Bravo, Brownroach! DoodleBug 05-05-03 11                Ditto samboohoo 05-05-03 13                    RE: Ditto Brownroach 05-05-03 16    RE: I vote for clueless mistofleas 05-05-03 10        RE: I vote for clueless Devious Weasel 05-05-03 12            RE: I vote for clueless mistofleas 05-05-03 14                RE: I vote for clueless dabo 05-05-03 15                    RE: I vote for clueless Loree 05-05-03 17        Practising bending over - just in c... Fast Eddie 05-05-03 18    Nope, Matt is playing to win Thaibeach 05-06-03 19        RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win Jims02 05-06-03 20            RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win Thaibeach 05-06-03 25        RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win Fast Eddie 05-06-03 26            RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win Thaibeach 05-06-03 27            RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win Brownroach 05-06-03 28  RE: Does Matt have a clue? Ms_Ultra 05-06-03 21    RE: Does Matt have a clue? amylynne321 05-06-03 24  RE: Does Matt have a clue? Devious Weasel 05-06-03 22    RE: Does Matt have a clue? Brownroach 05-06-03 23

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frisky 11695 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-04-03, 00:12 AM (EST) 1. "RE: Does Matt have a clue?" 1. Not to mention he has Butch in his back pocket. I think Butch threw his vote last week. I don't think Matt is on the level with Rob about his alliance with Butch. He knows how jittery Rob is getting, and he isn't going to want him to get nervous about Matt/Butch, or else Rob will allign with H/J to oust Matt or Butch. So, he gets Butch to throw his vote at Heidi/Jenna. All he needs is one more person to flip flop if he wants someone out. But the others don't know that. At any point now, Matt can approach H/J/R and say "final three, guaranteed" and he's got them on side. He's like a snake in the grass. 2. I keep thinking about that scene back in episode such-and-such, where they did the bow and arrow challenge, and there was that bit of foreshadowing where Rob praised Matt for learning so quickly about the game of Survivor, and just as he said that the bow sprung back and the arrow "bit" him. 3. Everyone keeps talking about how Matt doesn't have a clue about the game, he doesn't know a thing about it...hell, he has even said so himself. But look at Richard Hatch. He didn't have a clue either. He had no precedent to follow. But he figured it out well enough and played a brilliant endgame (or so I've heard...I missed S1).   Top

Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-04-03, 10:56 AM (EST) 2. "RE: Does Matt have a clue?" I don't believe Butch threw his vote last week. From what he said when voting (thanks to Marko and the Yahoo Insider) he really thought he was in a strong 4-person alliance with Christy, Matt and Rob. When Jenna gave the IC necklace to Heidi, Butch truly thought along with Christy that Jenna was the target. As Matt has told him, he is on a need-to-know basis. And Matt and Rob did not think it was best to tell Butch about the vote change. They didn't need Butch's vote to oust Christy and they were probably afraid he may tell her. Butch will just have to adjust once again. He is still there and hanging on. This week Butch might be very popular as the swing vote between the girls and the boys.   Top

Jims02 7407 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-04-03, 03:00 PM (EST) 3. "Does Butch have a clue?" Loree, I completely agree about Butch. The fact that Butch didn't vote with Rob and Matt is very telling. Why didn't Rob approach Butch about their plan to boot Christy. I mean, that way Rob would keep another ally. But, as well all know, Rob DIDN'T tell Butch anyway, which clearly indicates that Rob wants Butch isolated alliance-wise. Think about it. If Rob needed Butch's vote next week to boot Heidi or Jenna, why did he leave Butch in the dark last week? Now, if Rob wants a Jenna/Heidi boot, he poses the risk of Butch siding with the ladies. So, Rob probably wants to boot Butch next. The only other reason why Rob would keep Butch in the dark (that I can think of) is that Rob wants Matt gone as soon as possible. It could happen, but the odds are better for a Butch boot. (By the way Loree, you need a siggy... I always seem to associate posters by their sigs, so it confuses me when I think "Wow, this newbie knows their stuff" when it's really 2000+ DAW Loree!) In Honor of Summary Writers... 7. "Christy wins the Jan Gentry “Aim High” Award" -Fester 8. "Heidi and Jenna are more Butch than Butch" -Draco 9. "Matthew: DINNER!" -Anotherkim 10. "Janet misplaces her granola bar. Granolagate!" -Swami 11. CARLA: "C'mon...do something! They just do jackbleep" -dabo   Top

Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-04-03, 03:53 PM (EST) 6. "RE: Does Butch have a clue?" LOL! Yes, Jim but my uniqueness is not having a siggy. Much more mysterious. And I can't be bothered.   Top

Fast Eddie 625 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 05-04-03, 03:11 PM (EST) 4. "RE: Does Matt have a clue?" >so himself. But look >at Richard Hatch. He >didn't have a clue either. > He had no precedent >to follow. He had no precedent, but certainly wasn't clueless. He went in with a well thought-out game plan - which he had to abandon. But then he came up with a new one. He explained it as he went along and it clear to the viewer whet he was doing. At no point was he ever portrayed as being clueless; quite the opposite. MB in his book called him a "master strategist". Certainly the concept of creating an alliance wasn't clueless. Nobody else (except Stacey) thought of it and there was still a lot of debate by the viewers and contestants as to whether it was ethical. Imagine what reaction Rob's conniving would have had on S1!   Top

Fast Eddie 625 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 05-04-03, 03:19 PM (EST) 5. "I vote for clueless" There seems to be a group of people who think that Matt is brilliant. I can never figure out why, as there is never any evidence. We saw absolutely nothing about any conversation between Rob & Matt about booting Christy, so we don't know what went down. Did he think about it and actively choose to go that way? Or did he cluelessly just do as he was told? Maybe some people are far more observant than I and are seeing something I'm missing. If it comes out this way at the end, I will bow and scrape at the feet of those observers. But for now I'll stick with Occam's Razor and accept the obvious and simplest explanation: Matt is where he is through no active thinking or action of his own.   Top

esquire 1095 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Politically Incorrect Guest" 05-04-03, 09:51 PM (EST) 7. "RE: I vote for clueless" >Did >he think about it and >actively choose to go that >way? Or did he >cluelessly just do as he >was told? Ok. He may be clueless and very lucky, but if you were playing Survivor6 and heading to the end game, what better people to be in your alliance but Jenna, Heidi and Rob. With the exception of Roger, these are the most disliked people in this version of the game. And to quote the great Yogi (Yogi Berra) "i'ld rather be lucky than good"   Top

Fast Eddie 625 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 05-05-03, 10:02 AM (EST) 8. "RE: I vote for clueless" Oh, I agree 100%. I think this guy may well stand up at the end, hold a symbolic $1 million check, and have absolutely no idea how he got it. If Rob is his opponent, he'll get votes from those who can put aside personal feelings and vote based on who played the best - Deena and maybe Alex, possibly Butch. Against Twiggy and Sticky, Matt wins all 7 votes. Being lucky is definitely the best way to go. But I prefer to see good game players win. So I hope I'm wrong about him and that he'll explain at the end that he had it planned all along and just let oh-so-willing Rob do the dirty work and be the point man. But I still think he'll say something equivalent to "Wha hoppen?"   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 11:40 AM (EST) 9. "RE: I vote for clueless" LAST EDITED ON 05-05-03 AT 12:11 PM (EST) I think Matt has gotten smarter as the game progressed, although even early on he was intuitive about certain things, such as recognizing his precarious position after Daniel got booted. Clearly he felt clueless, as he said several times, about the mechanics of actively strategizing, in comparison to Rob, who always had his pulse on the tribe and plotted actively to ensure that things went his way. But Matt, probably unintentionally, was following the best game plan for himself: he was in fairly tight with the biggest schemer, Rob, while staying out of the spotlight (except as an challenge threat, but even that hasn't really hurt him). But with the endgame near, Matt seemed to have realized that it was time to start taking matters into his own hands. After Deena got the boot, Matt realized that he needed to sway Rob to vote out one of the other sunbathers. Fortunately Rob came to him first with the same idea, making Rob seem like the desperate one. Matt trusts Rob to a degree, but not as much as Rob thinks he does, imo -- ironically I think Rob trusts Matt more, which works to Matt's advantage. I do think Matt realizes he is in a good position with Rob doing the dirty work, particularly since Rob's endgame is clearly falling apart now. Contrast Matt with Christy, who was also out the loop for most of the game, though she was apparently made some promises by Deena. When the time came for Christy to start thinking about the endgame, she did the same thing as always: she waited around for people to come to her. But when she realized she had a choice that might influence the outcome of the game, she waffled in front of both sides, giving everyone the impression that she was a loose cannon, even at TC. Matt at least knows enough to appear trustworthy when it's necessary.   Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 01:10 PM (EST) 11. "Bravo, Brownroach!" Doodlebug says ditto! Couldn't have said it better myself.   Top

samboohoo 17173 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 02:21 PM (EST) 13. "Ditto" Same as Doodlebug. I wouldn't call Matt brilliant, but I wouldn't call him clueless either. He is a student of the game and has obviously learned from being in it, rather than just watching it.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 02:49 PM (EST) 16. "RE: Ditto" Thanks, Doodle and Sam. And Samboohoo, your observation is the most accurate and succinct appraisal of Matthew, imo.   Top

mistofleas 8043 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 12:13 PM (EST) 10. "RE: I vote for clueless" LAST EDITED ON 05-05-03 AT 02:24 PM (EST) Maybe some people are far more observant than I and are seeing something I'm missing. If it comes out this way at the end, I will bow and scrape at the feet of those observers. *takes off her shoes in preparation for Fast Eddie having to kiss her pretty feet* --likes to be prepared edited to change preparted to prepared because the former just sounds...*ahem* wrong   Top

Devious Weasel 18756 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 01:31 PM (EST) 12. "RE: I vote for clueless" Preparted?   Top

mistofleas 8043 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 02:23 PM (EST) 14. "RE: I vote for clueless" Preparted? Oh my! That doesn't sound good does it? --runs to edit   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 02:42 PM (EST) 15. "RE: I vote for clueless" LAST EDITED ON 05-05-03 AT 02:43 PM (EST) Next thing you know someone on OT will initiate someone the preparted. While Matt has been saying all along that he really doesn't know the game, in his CBS bio he outlined how he would play the game, and he has stuck to that gameplan. He's trying to be the Columbo of Survivor, just bumbling along while all the time fitting the pieces together in order to come out a winner at the end. While Rob is trying to play himself off to everyone as the bad guy you want to be sitting next to at the F2, what Matt will want at F2 is to not be sitting next to a strong manipulative obvious player of the game. "If all machines were to be annihilated at one moment, so that not a knife nor lever nor rag of clothing nor anything whatsoever were left to man but his bare body alone that he was born with, and if all knowledge of mechanical laws were taken from him so that he could make no more machines, and all machine-made food destroyed so that the race of man should be left as it were naked upon a desert island, we should become extinct in six weeks." (Samuel Butler, "Erewhon")   Top

Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-05-03, 02:51 PM (EST) 17. "RE: I vote for clueless" the Columbo of Survivor - LOL! Now I have visions of Matt holding up his finger at TC and saying "just one more thing..."   Top

Fast Eddie 625 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 05-05-03, 03:27 PM (EST) 18. "Practising bending over - just in case" This medium allows one to practise safe scraping and bowing, and you won't have to worry about catching SARS from here in Toronto. I would be very glad if Matt's pitch to the jury was an explanation of how he had this all planned - something he would need to do in order to get the votes of those who want the best player, not the least dislikeable. I'd rather be wrong and have the best player win than to be right and have the luckiest player have the prize fall into his lap.   Top

Thaibeach 872 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent" 05-06-03, 04:09 AM (EST) 19. "Nope, Matt is playing to win" There seems to be a group of people who think that Matt is brilliant. I can never figure out why, as there is never any evidence. We saw absolutely nothing about any conversation between Rob & Matt about booting Christy, so we don't know what went down. Did he think about it and actively choose to go that way? Or did he cluelessly just do as he was told? The following excerpt from Markopolo's post of Survivor Insider Platinum shows Matt's comments as he voted for Christy. He's allied with Rob for now but thinking on his own - and playing to win: TRIBAL COUNCIL VOTING Butch (votes Jenna): Jenna I am in a very strong alliance and I gave them my word. I think you're a great girl, this is nothing against you personally but the alliance is very strong. I'm staying with the alliance. Best of luck to you. Rob (votes Christy): I made you an offer that you couldn't refuse, and you said 'let me think about it' She who hesitates is lost. Matt (votes Christie): She dug her own grave. She had a secure fourth place finish at a minimum. She refused to follow through with our alliance. She chose to distance herself from us. She deserves what she's getting. I was very disappointed. And she’s a great girl. I bent over backwards to help her She basically thumbed her nose up at me. She deserves this. Butch, on the other hand, seems genuinely clueless. This week ought to be fun to watch as we see everyone courting poor ol' Butchie to get his vote.   Top

Jims02 7407 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-06-03, 06:55 AM (EST) 20. "RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win" Then again, they might simply boot Butch instead. He IS, after all, out of the loop. In Honor of Summary Writers... 7. "Christy wins the Jan Gentry “Aim High” Award" -Fester 8. "Heidi and Jenna are more Butch than Butch" -Draco 9. "Matthew: DINNER!" -Anotherkim 10. "Janet misplaces her granola bar. Granolagate!" -Swami 11. CARLA: "C'mon...do something! They just do jackbleep" -dabo   Top

Thaibeach 872 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent" 05-06-03, 12:04 PM (EST) 25. "RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win" Absolutely, Jims02, you're right. But I think Rob will try to use Butch this week to split up the Boobsie twins. He doesn't want a strongly allied pair making it into the F4. If god is good and Matt wins immunity (or Butch or Rob - anyone but either bimbo) it's goodbye,Heidi. Then again, maybe everyone is p*ssed at Rob this week and will vote together to get rid of him. Rob should never have told Jenna his ultimate goal was to be in F2 with HER. Now she knows she should go for the same F2 since anyone else has a good chance to beat her. (As many posters have stated before, I think Rob would beat her too. If only I could have a chance to beat her! With a big trout, as someone suggested last week. ) If wishes were horses...   Top

Fast Eddie 625 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 05-06-03, 01:27 PM (EST) 26. "RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win" >The following excerpt from Markopolo's post >of Survivor Insider Platinum Is this something easily available to all? I'd love to hear/read the comments but most don't air. >She dug her >own grave. She had a >secure fourth place finish at >a minimum. She refused to >follow through with our alliance. >She chose to distance herself >from us. She deserves what >she's getting. I was very >disappointed. And she’s a great >girl. I bent over backwards >to help her She basically >thumbed her nose up at >me. She deserves this. If this is all you saw, who would you guess said it? Sounds like vintage Rob to me. Did Matt come up with it on his own or is he just parroting what Rob told him? >Butch, on the other hand, seems >genuinely clueless. This week >ought to be fun to >watch as we see everyone >courting poor ol' Butchie to >get his vote. I couldn't understand why he was left out of the loop. All I can imagine is that Rob felt that there was no "need to know" and that if Butch did know, it could have raised problems, as he liked Christy. I'm sure he must feel very insecure at this point and open to listening to the sticks. However, he seems a very responsible and mature man, beyond being courted by fluttering eyelashes. It should be easy to show him that the pair absolutely must be broken up.   Top

Thaibeach 872 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent" 05-06-03, 01:50 PM (EST) 27. "RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win" Fast Eddie, there's a thread started by Markopolo here in Spoilers - entitled "Survivor Insider Ep.11 Yahoo Platinum". Marko, god bless him, has been nice enough to pay for, transcribe, and share with all of us, the transcripts from the Platinum content each week.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-06-03, 01:56 PM (EST) 28. "RE: Nope, Matt is playing to win" Is this something easily available to all? I'd love to hear/read the comments but most don't air. MarkoPolo paid something like $9.99 to get the service awhile back, and has been kind enough to type out transcripts and post them on the spoiler board. I couldn't understand why he was left out of the loop Imo, Rob doesn't think about Butch unless he needs Butch to do something, which he didn't in this case. And the decision to vote out Christy seemed to have been made fairly late so Rob may not have had enough time to convince Butch. Heidi and Jenna had agreed; Rob just needed to grab Matt, and that was that. I agree with VerucaSalt that Butch is just like Jan.   Top

Ms_Ultra 16 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson" 05-06-03, 10:01 AM (EST) 21. "RE: Does Matt have a clue?" >Matt is now in a 4 >person alliance and he can >beat everyone of them easily >in the finals. Herein lies a problem - this 4 person alliance could quickly become a 3 person alliance (H/J/R and get rid of their biggest threat Matt.) >No one hates Matt. He >spends all of his time >working hard for the tribe >and catching fish. In >addition, his actions last week >with the reward challenge may >have elevated him to Saint >Matt. I agree no one outwardly hates Matt but this is all the more reason to get rid of him. Why keep someone around who is a sure fire bet to win votes in F2????? If Matt doesn't win IN he could very well be the next one to go. >Everyone hates Rob. > Heidi and Jenna have >several enemies (Christy, Rob and >Butch at a minimum and >probably Deena and Dave as >well). Exactly, H/R/J all have made enemies....Matt really hasn't....those three need to realize this really quick and get rid of their threat. >His toughest competition >in a final 2 vote >would have been against Christy >or Butch and they will >both soon be gone. This is the exact reason why Matt needs go soon. Who wants to go up against him in F2????? >In addition, he is by far >the best player left at >immunity challenges and the one >most likely to go on >a immunity run like Colby Matt definitely needs to go on an immunity run but I don't know that he will succeed. It can be argued he threw Rob immunity, but definitely didn't throw immunity last week. He may not be as successful at IC as everyone assumes. >Matt has learned the game well >and should now be the >favorite to win it all. > While I don't think Matt is clueless and he's definitely learned the game but he is no where near to mastering Survivor. I think he's got himself in a bind now by being too nice, too well-liked, works too hard, made no real enemies.....everyone left sees this. He's put himself in a position where if he doesn't win immunity to get himself to F2 no one else will want to bring him to F2, this will be a lesson he learns too late.......   Top

amylynne321 30 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge" 05-06-03, 11:11 AM (EST) 24. "RE: Does Matt have a clue?" I think one of the biggest indicators as to Matt's "cluelessness" or lack thereof comes from the fact that he has been wearing a huge red target on his chest since EP3, and yet, he's still around. He's been singled out by various people as "number one bootie" (if you know what I mean <<wink, wink, rhahar>>...) during nearly every single episode since Ep3, he's only won immunity once, and yet- he's still there. Rob might coach him, but I think the key to Matt's sucess is when it comes down to winning the right immunity challenge/reward challenge at the right time (and losing when it's more benificial) Matthew does exactly the right thing every time. He kissed Rob's ass and stroked his ego (just what Rob needed) when he HANDED him immunity during the Q&A challenge. He's voted with Rob since EP2, but he's drawn none of the suspicion that Rob has. He's acted like a loner, a psycho and an out and out clueless idiot for the majority of the time, but he never gets voted out. He's the biggest immunity threat in the tribe and the strongest man in the group (and has been since day one) yet he's still around. I think he got lucky in the sense that Rob was also on this season of Survivor, but beyond that, I don't think he can be as clueless as he's being shown to be. Dumb luck alone wouldn't have carried him this far.   Top

Devious Weasel 18756 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-06-03, 10:59 AM (EST) 22. "RE: Does Matt have a clue?" This assumes that there is a M/R/H/J alliance. I don’t think there is. For one thing, H/J don’t trust Rob. The Yahoo Premium footage showing why Jenna gave Heidi the immunity necklace proves this. They still thought there was a possibility Rob would turn on them, and they wanted to make sure that Heidi stayed in the game. Based on the same footage, and the fact that Rob went to Jenna instead of Heidi to discuss the endgame, I think that Rob doesn’t want Heidi around a second longer than he needs her to be. Therefore, I think this week we will fall back to a M/B/R alliance and a H/J alliance. Rob knows he can trust Butch and Matt, and that he can’t trust Heidi and Jenna. He will be maneuvering towards an F2 that features him and Jenna, and to get there he first needs to break up H/J.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 05-06-03, 11:09 AM (EST) 23. "RE: Does Matt have a clue?" LAST EDITED ON 05-06-03 AT 11:11 AM (EST) I tend to agree Weasel. The only reason last week's plan changed at the eleventh hour was because Rob could not get a definite answer from Christy about her vote. Otherwise Heidi would have been gone. I think Rob still wants Heidi out next. **edited to add: Well, actually, Jenna would have been gone since she transferred immunity to Heidi.   Top

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