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PLEASE NOTE: The Reality TV World Message Boards are filled with desperate
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"Penny/Ted in Final 4??"
tribephyl 12393 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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11-17-02, 03:55 PM (EST)
 
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1. "RE: Penny/Ted in Final 4??" |
My first reaction was the same as your's, coybowroo. Although it is not unheard of for the "crack" MB editing staff to include footage from later(and earlier) episodes to convey a message, or mood in the upcoming episode. I wonder if this is just a little too convienient.And not to mess with the tragectory of this thread, but, I am deciding to re-re-post the picture of Paratroopers F5. Because, with only 2 folks left to vote out until then it is getting a lot easier to identify them. 
3 women on the left, which would imply that Helen, Jan and Penny are all in F5, with 2 men. Clay and Ted. So, cowboyroo, it very well could be a shot from a future episode. And Penny has outlasted Jake and Brian, "for sure". Plus, someone other than Ted and Penny were voted off the night before, the cave shot you posted. Sure looks good for Penny.
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Rain Crow 374 desperate attention whore postings
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11-18-02, 10:32 AM (EST)
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5. "Have to disagree." |
Rarely do I disagree with you Webby, but check this out.
In the above photo, the 8 torches are leaning against the rock and some long sticks are lying on the ground underneath. Note also the round rock on the ground to the left of the torches and the angles of the rock faces. Unless I am mistaken, there are 2 silver torches and 6 gold torches. Compare them to the next vidcap: 
The 4 torches have been moved slightly to the left of where the 8 were placed. They have been moved somwhat, but the rock is still there and so are a couple of the sticks on the ground. There are now 2 gold and 2 silver torches. Unless there is a torch out of sight, then I think we are seeing the final four torches...which means Penny and Ted are hangin' in there. I don't think we ever figured out if everyone uses a "personal" torch, or if they just grab one and go to TC. Now is when this would be a big help...and I have to admit that I am no help on this last question. Anybody else been keeping track? 
"Onward Thru the Fog"
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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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11-18-02, 11:17 AM (EST)
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6. "RE: Have to disagree." |
Yes, I want to know who has the 2 silver torches. Anyone know?
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SurvivorBlows 15230 desperate attention whore postings
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11-18-02, 01:49 PM (EST)
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9. "RE: Still have to disagree." |
I'm not going to insist that the pole on the ground is a torch, I'll see if I can get any better closeups when I'm home tonight, but I have two comments:1) As to your "respect for the torch" mention, I really think you're reading too much into Burnett and Jiffy's pseudo traditions, these people don't even leave the cave to go to the bathroom, I find it hard to believe they'd be holding their torches in such reverance. 2) I don't think we can assume all the torches are in one location. If you look at the below vidcaps I took back during the early episodes, you can see that it looks like at least Jan might have been keeping her torch in another location: http://community.realitytvworld.com/boards/DCForumID2/3037.shtml I simply look at it like this -- which is more likely: ...that Burnett accidently slipped a scene from Ep13 into the previews for Ep10, that the last of the pagongong didn't happen, and that everyone keeps their torches huddled together in the same location, or that this scene is from the proper episode and for whatever reason 4 of the torches are together and the rest are elsewhere. I consider the later more likely. Even if that isn't a fifth torch on the ground all we can say is that there are 4 torches in the image -- it doesn't mean there are no other torches elsewhere. -SB
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tribephyl 12393 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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11-18-02, 02:24 PM (EST)
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12. "I'm with RainCrow" |
LAST EDITED ON 11-18-02 AT 02:28 PM (EST) I mean no disrespect SB.
I also believe that the stick on the ground is just that, a stick...not a torch. If for the only fact that, the survivors are a lil more careful with their torches. They are usually full of fuel. If one of them noticed the torch spilling out onto the sand , I suspect they would pick the torch up and right it. And from what I can tell from all of the lovely caps you both have displayed, the "stick" is much less vibrant. Or much more of a natural "bamboo" color than the shimmering gold or silver color of the torches. I do have to conceed to the fact that; even if the shot is of only 4 torches (with 1 or 2 kept elsewhere)it doesn't necessarily mean that the shot is from F4. Yet, we should keep it in mind, that the possibility is out there, and perhaps both Penny and Ted make the F4. Edited to add: Darn, RainCrow, you posted your retraction, just as I was posting my agreement with you. Oh well.
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Rain Crow 374 desperate attention whore postings
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11-18-02, 07:01 PM (EST)
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18. "RE: I'm with RainCrow" |
Not really a retraction at all...just an agreement with Webby on certain parts of the discussion. I mentioned in my original post that another torch could be just out of view. Also, there is no other evidence to prove this is a final four vidcap. Even Jan's calendar scratches are hard to read. I agreed that I may have been overly confident that their torches would have some emotional value that would preclude them being left lying around on the sand and whiz.I still think the thing on the ground is a stick, maybe even bamboo with very smooth nodes. But I agree that it does look very smooth and lacks the normal bumpy nodes frequently seen on bamboo. I can see where some people might believe it to be a torch handle. As I mentioned, I like to really explore spoiler clues that look especially good...like this one. Sometimes I tend to get really deep into the analysis and overlook other aspects that may have bearing. I think SB is just trying to curb my enthusiam a bit since we need more evidence to confidently place this as a final four vidcap. I think the give and take discussions we often experience on this board is extremely valuable...a real mental exercise that often yeilds unexpected results as a result of the "additive mind power" available. Let's keep looking. As the number of survivors gets smaller, the smallest bit of evidence can take on great significance.
"Onward Thru the Fog"
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PhoenixMons 4696 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Stuff Magazine Centerfold"
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11-19-02, 02:27 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: Sookies torch colors (as seen in ep. 7)" |
I was reading this thread earlier so I decided to dig up and analyze the two episodes I have taped (last week's and the Shii Ann boot). I watched Ep. 7 (Shii Ann boot) but I didn't yet get a chance to watch last week's for comparison - I will as soon as I can get my baby girl to go to sleep  From ep. 7, we can determine two things: the color of everyone's torches (at least for that episode, so that wouldn't help much if they do choose randomly each time) AND that the survivors are seated in the same order as their torches are shown behind them. The only torches that are shown in hand are Shii Ann's and Erin's. Shii's is silver and Erin's is gold. However, they are shown placing their torches in the last two slots, which is the same order in which they are seated at TC (Shii's torch is behind her, Erin's behind her, etc.)...which leads me to believe that the other three torches/survivors are also in order. There were 3 silver torches and 2 gold. Erin and Ken have the gold torches. Shii, Penny, and Jake have silver. I can only assume that this is the arrangement for each TC (seating = order of torches). I just wanted to post this now (before I get to watch the other show) in case anyone else can verify this with any tapes they have so we can see if the colors/torches are indeed the same throughout or if they are randomly chosen each week (that seems HIGHLY unlikely as the torches are a symbol of each person's life). Another thing, I did a yahoo search earlier today for "survivor torch silver gold" to see if I could find anything...well an old post from Webby appeared and here is the link to it: http://community.realitytvworld.com/boards/DCForumID2/3006.shtml
I have no idea whether this has later been retracted, but he establishes a color for each Chuay Gahn member. I'd be interested to see what anyone with tapes of any of the first 3 episodes would be able to find out. 
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PhoenixMons 4696 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Stuff Magazine Centerfold"
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11-19-02, 04:11 PM (EST)
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23. "RE: Too good to be true :(" |
LAST EDITED ON 11-19-02 AT 04:12 PM (EST)Well, just finished going through ep. 9 and it seems pretty clear that the torches ARE chosen at random. In the "last week on Survivor" intro, we are shown Erin getting her SILVER torch snuffed out. Ep. 7 her torch was clearly GOLD (she is shown placing her gold torch into its position). This time we have 3 silver, 5 gold. The silvers are Brian, Helen, and Jake.
Helen and Jan are the only ones shown with/near their respective torches. When they are seated, they actually sit in the wrong seats (wrong meaning, not in order as they came in, like everyone else), so they are not in line with their respective torch (everyone else is). I was REALLY hoping there was something to this, but it appears there is not. Erin's torch was clearly visible (in her hand) in two different shots (one from ep.7 TC and other other from ep. * TC) and she has two different torches. Bummer!
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TXlady 11 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson"
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11-19-02, 10:01 AM (EST)
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20. "RE: Braid" |
I French braid my hair all the time by myself. So it can be done, easily! Although in earlier episodes, Penny always had someone else doing her hair.
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samboohoo 17173 desperate attention whore postings
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11-18-02, 03:37 PM (EST)
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13. "Count The Torches Again" |
I have counted a bunch of times, and it could just be a case of tired eyes but here goes:Look at SB's post (#7) and look at Rain Crow's posts (#5 and #8). If you count the torches by counting at the top of the torch, you get 8 torches. BUT, if you count the torches by counting the bottom, you get 9 (the top of the ninth is behind Ken). Also, Erin is in the picture. Erin was booted in Episode 8. At the beginning of Ep. 8, there are 9 people left (4 Sookies and 5 Chewies). Thus, there would be 9 torches. So, it is very possible that this is a picture of the final four torches, and Ted and Penny make the final four. Another thing to keep in mind that kind of relates to this is that while trying to keep yourself in the game and eliminating the stronger people, you also try to keep the people in the game you would want to be up against in the end. Penny has been made fun of by the Chewies, and we know that they see right through her "charm." And of course, Ted got on Helen and Jan's bad side with the whole Ghandia incident. Then of course last week, he goes off on his little canoe trip. So it's very possible that Penny and Ted are 2 of the final 4. Just my 5 cents. Fire away!
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ulalame 778 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
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11-19-02, 06:56 PM (EST)
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27. "RE: Penny's Braids" |
It is possible for a person to french braid their own hair, so don't base your decision solely on that.
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Helenwins 14 desperate attention whore postings
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11-20-02, 08:41 PM (EST)
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34. "RE: Penny's Braids" |
Only Erin was subserviant enough to do Penny's braids. Helen would never stoop that low, so I don't think the messy braids indicate anything.
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Q 2569 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Survivor-themed Cruise Spokesperson"
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11-19-02, 10:51 AM (EST)
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21. "Agree" |
I have been lurking the past few days because work is getting really crazy these days. But I have been thinking about all the posts, my gut feelings, etc.I think these caps and the analysis of them are fantastick. You guys rock. However, I see no reason here or anywere else for that matter to conclude that Penny does not make the final four. Jake will be the next SJ to go, not Penny. We all ASSUMED after the Shii incident that Penny would go because she was "outed" to the Chewies as a schemer. But after her initial "and obvious" sucking up to Brian/Ted/Clay she has swithced to be closer to the CG women regardless of the way they joke about her "cheerleaderness". Jake became the "infiltrator" not her. He will go while she will slip by. Then some faction on the Chewies (Ted and ??) will use her to eliminated some threats from within (Helen and Clay, IMO) and then low and behold she is in the F4. As to what happens then, who knows, but I think she will win. Clay was at her Wedding and the Enquirer is not being sued (that we know) because there story is wrong, and the general public will be thrown off by that. Clay will be exorcised by Ted/Brian and that will cost one of them the game. We see the beginnings of that already, and Clays story line is gearing up to gear down, while Helens is already peaked. Also as to Ivory's theory about not saying anything bad in Ep 1, Penny only commented (I think) about the good looking guys on her tribe, so did not really put down the other Team like the other SJs did. It all seems to be falling into place for Penny to make the F4. Well this is most likely total crap by the way, but I just am beginning to get this feeling about how the rest of the game plays out based on all the amazing posts here lately.
Never Let Them See You Bleed
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Seyz 198 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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11-18-02, 03:55 PM (EST)
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15. "RE: Penny/Ted in Final 4??" |
Here in this picture, we see Erin and Ken... makes me believe that this is after Shii Ann is booted. There are 9 torches, and 9 people left in the game, leading me to think that they DO indeed keep on their torches together in the same place. So the penny and Ted pick probably does show all the torches...
unless some people suddenly started to put their torches away from other people's torches.
Could happen though.. if there's a division somewhere.. say Ted defects to join Penny and Jake.. there could be a 4/3 split or a 4/2 split.. or something like that.. and they may not put their torches together because of rivalry. But ah.. things do look good for penny and Ted. It almost seems like Ted may start becoming the swing vote and somehow save Penny.
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SurvivorBlows 15230 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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11-18-02, 04:11 PM (EST)
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16. "The vidcap is from Ep8" |
LAST EDITED ON 11-18-02 AT 04:14 PM (EST)Just to clarify, the above vidcap is from the group of images that I took for the "Survivors and their sneakers" thread, and yes, they are from the beginning of Episode 8, from the scene of them returning from the BREATHING SPACE immunity challenge. In fact, CBS has it's own image from this time period on their site: http://www.cbs.com/primetime/survivor5/show/episode08/s5challenges.shtml Just to play along here for a minute, six gold and three silver torches are clearly visible in the CBS image: 
...two silvers are shown in the "4 Torches" image, do we know of Erin or Ken had a silver torch? -SB
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big idiot 193 desperate attention whore postings
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11-18-02, 04:35 PM (EST)
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17. "Item on ground = non-torch" |
Compare the photos Raincrow posted side-by-side in post #8 (9 torches on wall vs 4 torches on wall) (Great job Raincrow!) if you look at the "unknown stick/torch" underneath the 4 torches, you will see a similar item under the 9 torches. If there are suppose to be 9 torches in that photo and there is a "non-torch" on the ground under them, then I think it is safe to assume that the item in question under the 4 torches is a "non-torch" (it is practically identical).I think this area is the "home" of the torches because of the way the cave wall is indented (I wanted to use "concave" but it gave me the pun-creepies) so the torches don't fall over. If so, then the Survivors are careful where they put their torches and lessens the chance of the unknown item on the ground being a torch. Another support statement would be the absence of any vidcaps of a torch EVER being on the ground (I don't know if this is true, but if no one can produce a pic of a torch on the ground then I'd again assume that they ARE careful with their torches). If all the torches are together when there are nine, I'd also assume that they are together when there are less. The calendar can prove that it is not when there are more (10) The bow that wraps this up is the calendar, are there more angles? streaming video? Of course, why would this have been released? That scares me. Perhaps they have gotten more digital-savvy than the "Gervase X"...but the evidence stands (for me) until it is debunked. Great thread start Cowboyroo and great work by others.
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samboohoo 17173 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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11-20-02, 09:40 AM (EST)
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28. "Shot From Episode 10" |
Last night I watched my tape of CSI Miami and there was a commercial in there for this week's episode. I watched the commercial a couple of times, and I'm pretty certain that this shot is in the previews for this week's episode. Penny is saying, "Oh my God" like maybe a reaction to the two people returning from their elephant trip. Has anyone else seen this commercial or am I now seeing this stuff in my sleep? Looks like MB played a nice little trick on us.
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SurvivorBlows 15230 desperate attention whore postings
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11-20-02, 10:46 AM (EST)
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29. "RE: Shot From Episode 10" |
> I'm pretty certain that this shot is
>in the previews for this week's episode.Of course it is -- that's where I got the vidcap from. The fact it's in the preview for this week's episode has never been in dispute. ...what's in dispute is whether just because the scene is shown in the preview for this week's episode, the scene will actually appear in this week's episode, and if it does appear in the episode, is it actually from the Day 28-30 timeframe that Episode 10 will cover (or is it slipped in from some future Day) -SB
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Q 2569 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Survivor-themed Cruise Spokesperson"
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11-20-02, 03:32 PM (EST)
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32. "RE: Shot From Episode 10" |
I know I look like a real dumba_ _ right now -- that's what happens when I overanalyze thingsLOL, Samboohoo, that is my native state around here, to overanalyze and end up looking idiotic. But its fun! And besides I like to at least have a theory of my own (no matter how off-base and wrong it is, before, I become a lemming and follow the crowd. Besides the more we question theories the more the good theories become clearer.
Never Let Them See You Bleed
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pancho 82 desperate attention whore postings
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11-20-02, 03:46 PM (EST)
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33. "another twist on the calendar" |
When does Jan mark the calendar?
Say Jan marks the calendar the night before - say before they leave for tribal council on day 33. Jan gets voted out an day 33 and the final four leave the calendar as it is. Or they come back after TC11 and mark the calendar one last time as a memorial for Jan.
My main thought is once Jan is gone will anyone continue with the calendar? It could be a final four picture.
pancho
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jsanb 178 desperate attention whore postings
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11-22-02, 12:12 PM (EST)
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35. "RE: Penny/Ted in Final 4??" |
This photo was brilliantly planted my MB. This was last night with the other 3 torches on the other side of the cave. Another "spoiler" that turns out to be nothing.Of course my thread was locked for trying to bring that point up. Peanut Butter Jeff
"If you thought S3 was bad just wait until S5."
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p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e -
p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e -
p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e -
p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e -
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