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PLEASE NOTE: The Reality TV World Message Boards are filled with desperate
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with me, correct me--but don't tell me to shut up. That's not the American way."
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"It must be rigged"
flower 97 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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01-15-04, 10:44 PM (EST)
 
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1. "RE: It must be rigged" |
I haven't seen the show yet, had to work! I'm taping it!
I saw an interview with Trump after the first show aired, and he seems to like Sam. Trump gave him a lot of compliments. I was thinking that either Sam wins this thing or goes far in the game!
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choochoo 553 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
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01-18-04, 07:10 PM (EST)
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42. "RE: Sam...the Untrained Psychologist" |
LAST EDITED ON 01-18-04 AT 08:36 PM (EST)It get weirder and weirder....looks like Sam had a talk radio show while at Colgate U. called "The Untrained Psychologist"!!! http://kendrick.colgate.edu/maroon/ArchivesS98/apr2498/wyner2.html Wow, "talk about the blind leading the blind". Looks like he could use some self-analysis right about now..  What hasn't this guy done????
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ladro 1168 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Politically Incorrect Guest"
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01-19-04, 12:02 PM (EST)
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47. "RE: It must be rigged" |
interesting theroy. I had not thought of that. Could be. But I wouldn't bet my live on it yet. Since MarkB has never used any plants on Survivor, I am less inclined to believe you.
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choochoo 553 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
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01-16-04, 01:40 AM (EST)
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5. "RE: Disagree" |
Poor business decisions aside, I agree, Sam's character certainly appears to be "scripted". Given the trend for "plot twists" in recent reality shows, I wouldn't put it past the producers putting a "plant" or "mole" like Sam in the group to keep things interesting. After all, there are 11 more episodes to go. *Now don't get me started on Omerosa playing the "race card" in the second episode. Saw that one coming a mile away*
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blue_islander 6 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-19-04, 01:53 AM (EST)
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44. "RE: Disagree" |
I think that the men's error went way beyond not meeting with the client. After all, the client did not choose between the 2 campaigns. The owner of the ad agency did. He told them what to do- "swing for the fence". Did they? After saying that, and obviously trying to create an edgy image (eg people riding scooters through your offices) how in the world could he then tell the women that they had gone too far? He couldn't. If it would've been me, I would've said (to the men) "Is this your idea of swinging for the fence? Guys in suits and wives talking about how much safer their husbands are?" They were obviously not listening. When the decsion maker says, "Here are the two big things to keep in mind" then that is the time to listen even if you don't remember anything else. Then subtly remind him of those 2 things when you deliver your presentation that has obviously been crafted with his own priorities. What's he gonna say?
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geg6 14941 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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01-16-04, 10:06 AM (EST)
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14. "RE: Disagree" |
LAST EDITED ON 01-16-04 AT 03:43 PM (EST)I don't know about you, but in the beginning of my career I made amateur mistakes. I was never fired for it. I was taken to task, sent for further training, and/or demoted. I learned from my mistakes and am now the truly indispensible professional who is an integral piece of the puzzle that makes up a major university. (Plus I remain humble despite my amazing success...ha,ha,ha!) However, had I ever, ever, ever been caught acting so unprofessionally as to sleep on the floor of my office instead of completing an assignment (even one of the many that I have been given that I thought was stupid or boring), I wouldn't have lasted two seconds longer. Mistakes are forgivable, unprofessionalism and laziness are not. Justin did make a mistake, but remember that it wasn't the client actually making the decision here. It was the head of the ad agency, who was admittedly torn between both. We don't really know what the client wanted because they never showed what the substance of his conversation with the women was.
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subman 1546 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
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01-28-04, 02:13 AM (EST)
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49. "RE: Disagree" |
The whole point of this show is to expose the two teams of job candidates to basic business principles and then determine in the field how successful each team will be in the practical application of their combined education and work experience. Jason failed in this regard not only because he ignored the first principle of marketing (identify the needs of the client), but because he failed to actively solicit and then act on the input of the other team members, his subordinates in this instance. The first responsibility of any team leader who wants to succeed is to assess the individual strengths/weaknesses of the people on his team and then provide them with tasks that make the best use of their specials skills and talents. In this case, Jason was told point blank by a Harward MBA and others that his strategy was flawed from the beginning. However, instead of listening to the advice of people on his team with more education or work experience, he asserted his authority in the interest of protecting his ego but at the expense of meeting the team's objective.
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IceCat 17415 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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01-16-04, 05:02 AM (EST)
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7. "Trump is Burnett's employee..." |
LAST EDITED ON 01-16-04 AT 06:49 AM (EST)Mark Burnett hired Donald Trump to appear on this show. So an employee of the producers is choosing who wins or loses. It's the same as if Jeff Probst got to choose who went home evey week on Survivor. This is not a game show... It is scripted television with non scripted scenes contained within it. Of course it is 'rigged'... but MB never said it wasn't, did he?
Edited to add:
For that matter, Trump is listed as an Executive Producer for the show so that pretty much says it all when it comes to whether this is 'rigged' or not. Trump will make his choices under Burnett's direction in order to make sure that the remaining contestants provide the greatest interest in terms of conflict and personality. The choice has nothing to do with merit but has everything to do with making the subsequent episodes more sensational. Sam breeds conflict so he will be kept for a while longer. Next week, Sam is made the leader so look for another competition where the 'client' choses the winning team using completely subjective criteria (like lastnight's ad campaign competition). The men will not lose next week. MB will tell the client to give the competition to the men regardless of the quality of the each teams apparent performance.
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gman 9 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-16-04, 06:07 PM (EST)
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29. "RE: Trump is Burnett's employee..." |
great analysis!
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jackandjill 204 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
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01-16-04, 09:08 AM (EST)
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9. "RE: It must be rigged" |
There wasn't a whole lot of sleeping on the job discussion with Trump so he may not have known that Sam was snoozing. There was more talk about the bone-headed decision not to talk to the client. That's why Jason got canned.I think the women's campaign ad was much better than the men. Sexual subliminal message works with high-powered men.
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Marrakesh 2 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-16-04, 01:29 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: It must be rigged" |
Just wanted to note, that I disagree with the sleeping on the job will get you fired. At my old job for a reputable large soft drink company, in the marketing division,( in head office no less!) we always took cat-naps.
There were 20 of us in the one division, and if someone got tired we were in agreement, that crashing at the back, on the floor was totally acceptable !! The same way Sam did.
Of course I would use my coat as a pillow, but, hey, it was no different.
We would come back and be refreshed and of much more use to the "team".
The boss did not care if we did this as long as we got the job done, and done well, with few errors..
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geg6 14941 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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01-16-04, 02:44 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: It must be rigged" |
It would have gotten you fired if you didn't complete the task to which you were assigned, which is exactly what Sam did. And then he multipled the offense by lying about his laziness. I hope the rest of the guys beat the crap out of him when he gets back and the other guy tells them how he lied. What little creep!
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Wacko Jacko 2438 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Seventeen Magazine Model"
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01-16-04, 03:18 PM (EST)
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25. "Who should be fired? Jason or Sam" |
From my points and also Trump's standpoint, no doubt Sam should of.Jason is 24 years old. He is going to make mistakes like interrupting his boss or not talking to the client. With Trump's mentoring Jason he would learn from his mistakes. Sam on the other hand as Trump mentioned is a loose cannon. He is not moldable and was disliked by all of his teammates. Working in a business environment myself I know that no task is ever performed by one person. All tasks are performed by a team. I ask Trump? Who would you want on your team Jason or Sam. In my opinion, yes Jason lost the account for the men (not sam), but what would you expect? Jason is basically a college kid. He will make mistakes. But Jason unlike Sam will learn from those mistakes. I think if Jason stayed he would've grown so much more as a person. Sam on the other hand i doubt. So basically comes down to mentoring and being a teammate. If I were making the decision Jason wins hands down.
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rowDorchester 9 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-18-04, 10:21 AM (EST)
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39. "RE: Who should be fired? Jason or Sam" |
You are missing the point. Jason was the PM for this account. The bottom line: he lost the account.What we don't know: How much was the account worth? Regardless of the amount, his ignorance cost the team the account and more importantly, him the game. Ask yourself this question: Can you afford Jason and/or other businessmen/women to make a multimillion dollar mistake on accounts? As I mentioned to anotherkim, Rule number one: Always ask the client what he/she wants. Remember it’s their money and their product. Never ever think that it is NOT important to ask the client for their comments and/or how they want their project completed. You’ll always fail in doing so. Donald Trump was correct for firing Jason. (He doesn't need my approval). Sam was definitely on my ##### list for sleeping on the job, but he was not the culprit for losing the account. The PM is responsible for seeing to the entirety of the project and must accept, unequivocally, all responsibilities for the project. He's the team leader. He made a fatal mistake and in the end it cost him the job. As for Sam, I'm flummoxed. He is a "loose cannon." He appears to have no self respect for Donald Trump and his advisors, or his team. We'll have to see what happens to him in the weeks to come.
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subman 1546 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
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01-28-04, 02:50 AM (EST)
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50. "RE: Who should be fired? Jason or Sam" |
I think you're missing the point of this challenge. Regardless of Jason's relative youth and inexperience, he is on an equal footing with every other contestant. In turn, each contestant, Jason included, has unique skills and experience relative to every other player. Some are good looking and sexy, others have more experience, and a few have a business education. If, as you said, you consider Jason to be a young and inexperienced kid, then he should have been more aware of his skills relative to those of his team memebers. This would include checking his ego and being willing to solicit and then act on the informed opinions held by others on his team that he was making a mistake by not meeting with the client. He made his first mistake by creating a plan that ignored the needs of the client. However, he still could have salvaged the plan by changing it in light of new information. More seriously, as a leader, he failed to develop a consensus among the team that the plan they would follow was sound. If there were objections to the plan, and there were, Jason should have had the answers. If he could not defend his course of action, he should have deferred to the input from others on his team with a better idea. Instead, he compounded his first mistake by taking charge over people rather than leading them, ignoring the advice of others and by not admiting that his initial plan was flawed. Jason deserved to be fired and will learn much from his mistake. However, others on the team should at least have been dressed down by "The Donald" for not sticking to their guns in defending their recommendation that a visit to the client was a necessity. Good team members don't let their boss walk in to a bear trap like that.
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Marrakesh 2 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-16-04, 04:42 PM (EST)
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26. "RE: It must be rigged" |
I don't think that it is a surprise that Sam is still there, look at the reaction it has caused! People hate him, people are amused etc... He is causing a reaction. From the viewers, and those competing with him in the show.
Perhaps Trump wants him there, because, it is like real life. Remember he mentioned that to Nick, not all members of a team will pull their weight. Live with it, its life.
Trump is probably interested to see how the other team members treat Sam, because he is a loose cannon. Maybe he is acting, to cause reactions which will give Trump insight into the others. Who knows.
However, the kid that was fired (Jason?) I can't remember his name.. anyway, he was already a target from the first board meeting when he cut Trump off and said "Let me finish".
If he is to be the apprentice , he has to listen to the Boss. That is what Trump reiterated again this time, that Jason (?) did not go to the Boss, to get clarification of what kind of ad campaign was their target.
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Cinder 8 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-16-04, 05:21 PM (EST)
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27. "RE: It must be rigged" |
Someone else mentioned about Sam being the project leader on the next episode and that 'now we'll see what he's made of.'I dont think so. From the way they showed the upcoming show, the men intentionally made him leader so they could set him up to fail. And then they have a much better chance of getting rid of him (since so far, incompetance hasnt worked). They'll make his life miserable and fail on purpose in their tasks...or at least I think that's what they have in mind...but what about the stakes? Lose for the THIRD time to the women? Maybe lose out on a great reward like flying in a private jet to a fancy restaurant? It'll be interesting to see which wins out...saving Sam or saving their own butts. (BTW, if I was Trump, I would have questioned why Jason gave Sam so little responsibility and not enough to do that Sam had time to go off and sleep...why didnt he use this team member better?...THAT is poor team management. From what they showed, Sam had a small, insignificant task to do, but then again, they dont always show enough.)
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coolflowerpowerman 456 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
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01-16-04, 08:21 PM (EST)
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31. "Why Sam is still here" |
If you read the end credits carefully, it says something to the effect that the producers DO have input on Donald's decision. Because of this, it should NOT be surprising that some of the more "interesting" characters last deep into the game.
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munson 1314 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
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01-17-04, 11:50 AM (EST)
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35. "RE: It must be rigged" |
LAST EDITED ON 01-17-04 AT 11:51 AM (EST)LOL, I like that ad! The difference here is that this is a 13-week interview, not an internship. Sam's behavior and performance wouldn't be tolerated in an employment scenario. The best part about Sam is he isn't a hypothetical. Instead, here's a living, breathing management challenge. Everyone in the game would have some text book answer about how to deal with the Sams of the world. Trump might just be saying, "Yeah, well, show me!" I still lean towards Sam sticking around for entertainment purposes.
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HyperTyper 63 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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01-17-04, 06:05 PM (EST)
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36. "Annoying entertainment..." |
For entertainment, could be. Wait and see I guess, like Trump said in the clip for the next episode to Sam, "Do you think they made him project manager in hopes that he would fail and he get the boot."
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tapit 1 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-17-04, 08:22 PM (EST)
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37. "RE: It must be rigged" |
I don't think that Sam is a plant, but I'm sure that he's being kept for dramatic interest. He's the guy you love to hate... Always good for a show.
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