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DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-05-09, 03:37 PM (EST) "Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Press Release for the next episode (UK version): In order to atone for the awful sins of his past, Ben attempts to summon the Smoke Monster ready to be judged. As he seeks redemption, we learn more about Ben's terrible actions and meet some faces from the past. His relationship with 'daughter' Alex is revealed, as is the story of how he came to steal her from Danielle. But what is the truth behind the enmity between Ben and Charles Widmore – and did he make good on his vow to avenge Alex's death? And yes, Sonya Walger (Penny) is on the guest list for this episode.   Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Subject     Author     Message Date     ID    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead Buggy 04-08-09 1    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead zombiebaby 04-09-09 3        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead Buggy 04-09-09 4        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead maroonclowns mom 04-09-09 5    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead HobbsofMI 04-09-09 9  RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead shimane22 04-09-09 2    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead sica077 04-09-09 26        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead weltek 04-10-09 28            RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead Buggy 04-10-09 29  RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead dajaki 04-09-09 6  RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead DoodleBug 04-09-09 7    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead trigirl 04-09-09 8        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead DoodleBug 04-09-09 14            RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead sisyphus 04-09-09 20                RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead weltek 04-09-09 23                    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead DoodleBug 04-10-09 30        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead shimane22 04-09-09 25  RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead warp_core breach 04-09-09 10    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead HobbsofMI 04-09-09 13        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead DoodleBug 04-09-09 16    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead trigirl 04-09-09 21        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead DoodleBug 04-13-09 34  Smokey Meemo 04-09-09 11    RE: Smokey warp_core breach 04-09-09 12        RE: Smokey DoodleBug 04-09-09 17    RE: Smokey DoodleBug 04-09-09 18  RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead mrc 04-09-09 15    RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead Breezy 04-09-09 19        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead HobbsofMI 04-09-09 22        RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead BrassFan 04-14-09 35    The statue & the box weltek 04-14-09 36  The Shadow of the Statue dajaki 04-09-09 24    RE: The Shadow of the Statue Road Kill 04-10-09 27        RE: The Shadow of the Statue DoodleBug 04-10-09 31  RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead blacknwhitedog 04-10-09 32  RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead zombiebaby 04-11-09 33

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Buggy 5089 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-08-09, 09:15 PM (EST) 1. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Wow! I mean, WOW! To quote John Locke, " I'm going to have to watch that again."   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

zombiebaby 7355 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 07:33 AM (EST) 3. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Buggy! I still wonder if Stephen King has any involvement in this! I know the creators say he is an influence and I know it is one of his favorite shows but I just feel like he is secretly involved. It would be just like him to find another way to get his story out since he likes to experiment with different media outlets. If we see a cameo from him then I guess so!   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Buggy 5089 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 08:12 AM (EST) 4. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" I read that the team behind Lost is making a movie ( or movies) of The Dark Tower after Lost is done. Do you LOVE it?!   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

maroonclowns mom 1102 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Politically Incorrect Guest" 04-09-09, 08:33 AM (EST) 5. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Funny you should mention that. Have had Stephen King on my mind for weeks. Thinking maybe this could "end" back at the boarding room in the airport.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

HobbsofMI 15959 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 10:50 AM (EST) 9. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" LAST EDITED ON 04-09-09 AT 10:50 AM (EST) Second, Second.... Loved it and need to see it again. Watch your back Sun! GO WINGS! 2008 Stanley Cup Champs! sig JSlice and by IceCat, and bobble head by Tribephyl   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

shimane22 142 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 04-09-09, 02:47 AM (EST) 2. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Hooray for Penny being alive! Hooray for Alex (RIP)! Does anyone else prefer Ben to smug Locke at this point? That wig they put on Michael Emerson for the flashbacks was hilariously awful... I was surprised to see Caesar get offed so soon, but now I'm interested about what will happen next with Ilana, Lord of the Flies. Hopefully she's the one that gets shot by Juliet when they're in the outriggers. That'll teach her for messing with Lapidus.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

sica077 523 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 04-09-09, 11:38 PM (EST) 26. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" >Hooray for Penny being alive! So, playing devil's advocate here... Is it possible that Penny does not make it? Ben said at one point, "Tell Desmond I am sorry." Now, Ben should certainly be apologizing just for the sheer attempt to kill her. However, Desmond definitely does a number on Ben; could Ben's apology be for something we haven't seen yet? >Does anyone else prefer Ben to >smug Locke at this point? To be honest, I like both of their characters better than ever before. Locke was toyed with by the Island and Ben for so long, it seems he kind of deserves this power. Ben's character has been so evil, and now it has been rationalized by his devotion to the Island (the smoke monster says so!). I also enjoy his child-like amazement at the things the Island can do... >I was surprised to see Caesar >get offed so soon And then Ben goes and does something like this! Well, he wouldn't be Ben without a little streak of evil. DH and I were surprised he didn't just steal Caesar's gun and have a threat be the end of it!   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

weltek 16933 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-10-09, 07:48 AM (EST) 28. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" I think the "Tell Desmond I'm sorry" bit is definitely for what we saw. He shot Desmond, almost killed his wife, and terrified his child. I think the moment Ben saw the child, he immediately felt remorse. Ben had to get to the airport, so I don't think there was more to that story. I'd guess Ben hightailed it out of there, as did Desmond & Penny. -A Tribetastic Creation   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Buggy 5089 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-10-09, 08:21 AM (EST) 29. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" My daughter and I talked about the effect of the child on Ben. Ben suffered as a child because his mother died, I think that is also the reason he didn't kill Danielle.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

dajaki 1453 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson" 04-09-09, 08:52 AM (EST) 6. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Despite the bad toupee, it was great to see a more human side of Ben. And the episode answered some of my questions from last week. It was nice to see Smokey Alex, though I still have a plethora of questions as to the nature and purpose of Smoke Monster. So what happened with Ilana? What lies in the shadow of the statue? Did she somehow get the same "illness" that the French team did? Is she just getting island fever? If Dead is Dead, is John Locke dead? Is he a projection of the island (my view of Christian) who just happens to be more social than the rest? How can he lead Sun across time to Jin? Maybe he doesn't and he simply leads her to the mass Dharma grave. Widmore is still interesting too. Why did he spend so much time off the island, thus eventually leading to his expulsion, if he loved it so much?   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 09:38 AM (EST) 7. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Best.Episode.Ever!! Loved this!! The judgment of Ben for killing his daughter was gripping and emotional. Wow. Smokey Alex got her just cause by telling Ben he must bow down to his new leader. Ben lives because he agrees to follow Locke, but will he? He has, after all, lost his innocence. And the tomb of smokey was uber-cool! Now we know that the front of the statue is most likely the jackal-headed Anubis (like in the drawing above the vents) who is associated with the afterlife and god of the dead: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anubis (dead is dead!) Speaking of Egyptian gods, I'm pretty sure that Richard Alpert is Ra: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra Locke is spooky cool and confident. He reminds me of Christian - who is there to guide Locke. Now it seems Locke's purpose is to guide Ben. Very interesting. Now that Locke is the walking dead, will we see Christian anymore? Ilana has me puzzled - but "what lies in the shadow of the statue" is code! I think she is working for Widmore. The last communication he had with Ben was that he was going back to the island and was going to kill his daughter. I'm betting Widmore doesn't know where to find Penny, so he sends Ilana back to the island to kill Ben. That's my guess. And she's weeding them out trying to determine which side their on by asking the code that Widmore gave to her. If they don't know what you are talking about, then they're in your way. Yay that Penny lives. And yay for Desmond!! What a scene that was!! One disappointment for me was that Ben didn't know the '06 were in the Dharma Initiative. It appeared that when he was healed, his memory was erased also - or was he hiding the truth? Ben tends to talk out of both sides of his mouth, so we will see.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

trigirl 2844 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 04-09-09, 10:15 AM (EST) 8. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Ilana has me puzzled - but "what lies in the shadow of the statue" is code! I think she is working for Widmore. I agree. When Sayid asked her if she worked for Benjamen Linus she didn't agree. I also think that Ben was slightly surprised to see Sayid on flight 316. I was kind of sad to see Caesar go...I liked him. Remember when Locke saw the smoke monster in season 1, he said it was the most beautiful thing he had ever seen.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 12:59 PM (EST) 14. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" And Locke wasn't afraid (well maybe a little) when it dragged him through the jungle. It was about to take him down into a hole - Jack had a hold of him and Locke said "it's ok" to let him go. Smokey let go of him though... Locke is definitely the special one.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

sisyphus 321 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host" 04-09-09, 03:00 PM (EST) 20. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" I agree that locke is the special/chosen one, but it seems so was Ben and Charles at one time.....I am going to bet my last dime that the key to this whole story lies with Richard Alpert....ever present even when charles widmore was a young man...he just seems to go along...   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

weltek 16933 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 05:35 PM (EST) 23. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" If Christian Shephard really is alive (which I do believe he is), it would seem Christian and John are the really special ones (and maybe Richard?). I'm just not sure what ties them. I think it was a very important message that Charles "broke the rules" by having a child with a wife outside the group. So did Charles have a baby with a Dharma member or with someone outside of the island? I think we have a series relationship lychpin in that part. -A Tribetastic Creation   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-10-09, 01:21 PM (EST) 30. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Maybe Richard is an "undead" guy like Christian and Locke and that's why he hasn't aged. I guess you would stop aging if you were "undead".   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

shimane22 142 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 04-09-09, 10:11 PM (EST) 25. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" They definitely did a fake-out with Caesar and Ilana, setting him up to be the big bad guy when it turns out she is actually the bigger threat to our heroes.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

warp_core breach 469 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star" 04-09-09, 11:16 AM (EST) 10. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" A great episode following a couple of duds. 1. Gawd!! I absolutely freakin LOVE Ben! He's the best TV villian... EVER! It says a lot that you can actually feel sorry at times for a man as evil as he is. 2. Whew!! Penny lives to see another day... thank you little Charlie! Seeing Desmond go ballastic on Ben was frightening. 3. Young Charles looked dashing riding in on his horse... then he becomes creepy older Charles. Exactly how did he come and go from the island? Was he secretive about it or did he just say a fvck you to all and did whatever he pleased? 4. Ilana is tied to the island somehow. How else can you explain that cryptic riddle? Is she a long-lost native of the island? 5. Ceasar is dead... that sucks. I thought he would have a bigger role but this is Lost so you never know. 6. Young Ethan was a little too eager to kill Danielle which sort of answers my earlier question as to what part he had in his parents' death. 7. Locke is officially creepy. 8. It's interesting to see Richard go back and forth from a leadership type role to the background when there's a leader in place. I would really like to know why he doesn't age. 9. I always liked Alex and was disappointed when she was killed off. Now she has the opportunity to return as many times as she wants as Smokey Alex. Seeing "her" threaten her father was spooky! 10. A Jack-free episode is always nice A Gift from Agman   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

HobbsofMI 15959 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 12:57 PM (EST) 13. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Did the purge already happen then when Ben took Alex? How many of the Dharma children survived? Where is Ben's girlfriend? GO WINGS! 2008 Stanley Cup Champs! sig JSlice and by IceCat, and bobble head by Tribephyl   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 01:08 PM (EST) 16. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Did the purge already happen then when Ben took Alex? I don't think so. Danielle had been on the island for 16 years when 815 crashed, so Alex would have been born in 1988 (2004-16). The purge happened in 1992. When Ben was swinging little Alex, the purge had already occurred (she looked to be 4 or 5 years old). How many of the Dharma children survived? Ethan is the only Dharma child we have really seen (besides Ben and Annie). My guess is there isn't many. Where is Ben's girlfriend? Do you mean Annie? I'd like to know that too!   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

trigirl 2844 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 04-09-09, 03:05 PM (EST) 21. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Ilana is tied to the island somehow. How else can you explain that cryptic riddle? Is she a long-lost native of the island? Totally reminded me of the first time we met Desmond. Remember "What did one Snowman say to the other Snowman"?   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-13-09, 12:54 PM (EST) 34. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Then maybe she's Dharma and they are hoping for a comeback?? Hmmmmm This one will be interesting to see play out.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Meemo 3517 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Thong Contest Judge" 04-09-09, 11:41 AM (EST) 11. "Smokey" So if the Smoke Monster's job is to judge, perhaps we should consider others who have lived or died because of it: Ecko - what did he deserve to be judged with death? Widmore's mercenaries - they killed Ben's daughter, so that judgment was understandable The pilot in season 1 - not enough info Locke - survived, obviously because he serves a greater purpose Ben - survives - who knows why Any others? Half man, half amazing, all DAW   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

warp_core breach 469 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star" 04-09-09, 12:02 PM (EST) 12. "RE: Smokey" Ecko was a warlord in Africa. Then he impersonated his minister brother while his brother was presumably killed and then trapped on the drug plane as it flew away. All this as a result of Ecko setting up the drug transaction. And I think he also coerced his brother into the whole drug transaction. A Gift from Agman   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 01:13 PM (EST) 17. "RE: Smokey" Also, when Yemi appeared to Eko and said is was time to confess his sins, Eko said he had not sinned. He didn't apologize. I don't think Smokey liked that very much. The difference with Ben is that he admitted he killed his daughter and said he was sorry. http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Eko   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 01:20 PM (EST) 18. "RE: Smokey" Smokey "scanned" Juliet and Kate in the jungle once. Here are all occurrences of The Monster: http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/The_Monster   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

mrc 10020 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 01:01 PM (EST) 15. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" Those Egyptians sure know how to burn Hot Pockets in the microwave--did you see all that smoke? What a great episode! So many questions. 1. Do we know who Penny's mother is? 2. Where was Elle? 3. Why did Illana want to know about the statue? Was she sent there by Widmore? Seems awful convenient that guns were stashed on the plane. That was what was in the big metal box, right? Or was there something else in there? 4. The banter between Ben and Locke was priceless. I like Ben's character, evil as he is. Bunnies eat nerds.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Breezy 18379 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 02:27 PM (EST) 19. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" I don't think the guns were in the box, they seemed to be still dragging it somewhere. So what is in the box?   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

HobbsofMI 15959 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-09-09, 04:18 PM (EST) 22. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" I think they are going to take the box to the main island. I have no clue what is inside... a tracking device for Witmore? GO WINGS! 2008 Stanley Cup Champs! sig JSlice and by IceCat, and bobble head by Tribephyl   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

BrassFan 322 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host" 04-14-09, 01:37 PM (EST) 35. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" >I don't think the guns were >in the box, they seemed >to be still dragging it >somewhere. So what is >in the box? I think Widmore is in the box..just waiting to be released so he can return to the island.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

weltek 16933 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-14-09, 01:45 PM (EST) 36. "The statue & the box" Maybe whatever is in the box is supposed to be delivered to/for "what lies in the shadow of the statue." It might have been written on the box and that is why Illana asked the question. -A Tribetastic Creation   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

dajaki 1453 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson" 04-09-09, 07:11 PM (EST) 24. "The Shadow of the Statue" Agree that Richard Alpert is Ra. But then, who knows with this show? So the statue . . . Also agree that it's a code. But, what is in its shadow? The statue, assuming the foot belongs to Anubis, is on the coast. And assuming it's facing either east or west, its shadow hits the sea and whatever is in the jungle behind it. We know the Well with the Wheel is directly behind the statue (though a bit of a distance), thus, at least once a day it's in the shadow of the statue.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Road Kill 1101 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Politically Incorrect Guest" 04-10-09, 07:24 AM (EST) 27. "RE: The Shadow of the Statue" Could the bomb buried years ago be in the shadow of the statue? It seems like we need to get back to the bomb somehow. This new group could be our way there.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

DoodleBug 5133 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-10-09, 01:25 PM (EST) 31. "RE: The Shadow of the Statue" I think it could be jughead. That's the guess on other sites that I visit.   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

blacknwhitedog 6528 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-10-09, 09:51 PM (EST) 32. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" I am SO back on board with this show!!! created by tribephyl 2005   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

zombiebaby 7355 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 04-11-09, 06:44 AM (EST) 33. "RE: Episode 5.12: Dead is Dead" I don't think Jughead lies in the shadow of the statue. It's either just a spy-like phrase to see who is privy to their information or it is something completely different. Maybe a person, like Ben would lie there cause he lies anywhere and they like to play with words. Or even the wheel. I wonder if the coming war will have everyone associated with the island on one side, Ben, Locke, Widemore, Sawyer, Jack etc. I think the war is between those that want to expose it and those that want to keep it hidden. Also I think that not only is Amy a Hostile but Horace is as well. I noticed when Ben was going to kill Penny that we saw a boat named "Savage". Previously when we were at the marina a boat name that was visible all the time was "Illusion". It's possible that Ben does not know that Jack, Kate and Hurley were in Dharma in the 70's as we don't know how long he was being healed and how much longer they remained there. I think he knew Juliet and Sawyer were there though. It's also possible that he is lying. Locke mentioned last night the way Ben lead was "corporate" and that is running along how he previously mentioned Ben lead a rather cushy life in Otherton in other episodes. Ties into the fact that The Economist does not like technology. You've been hotpocketed!   Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

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