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PLEASE NOTE: The Reality TV World Message Boards are filled with desperate
attention-seekers pretending to be one big happy PG/PG13-rated family. Don't
be fooled. Trying to get everyone to agree with you is like herding cats,
but intolerance for other viewpoints is NOT welcome and respect for other
posters IS required at all times. Jump in and play, and you'll soon find out
how easy it is to fit in, but save your drama for your mama. All members are
encouraged to read the
complete guidelines.
As entertainment critic Roger
Ebert once said, "If you disagree with something I write, tell me so, argue
with me, correct me--but don't tell me to shut up. That's not the American way."
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"That's it"
prosecutor 449 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
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03-21-06, 01:09 PM (EST)
 
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"That's it" |
I've had it. This season is the worst ever.
I am done. If I care I will come read the
summary. Donald why'd you have to gang up
on Brent too. It's like the kid in school
who gets bullied only to have the principal
and vp etc.not do anything about it. WTF did
you have to fire Brent for? You could have
made him PM you did it before,then fire him
if he lost. You could say, no respect from team
you will never be able to lead them etc.etc.then
fire his a$$. but this took you down in my books.
George had a look on his face like WTF too. Ivanka,well
she's a chip off the old block obviously.
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Wacko Jacko 2434 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Seventeen Magazine Model"
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03-21-06, 02:23 PM (EST)
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2. "RE: That's it" |
There was no purpose for keeping him around any longer. THANK YOU DONALD!....but then again what was he doing on this show in the first place.
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dafnaf 38 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
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03-21-06, 06:44 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: That's it" |
I disagree with your last statement. I don't think Brent was ever going to punch anyone. When Stacy said she was threatened by him, we could clearly see what really had happened, and that he was really reacting like any other person who would get interrupted the way Stacy interrupted him. I think anyone would also want to crack if someone told him he couldn't present because he'm fat (or have a bad hair  ), it's only human.
I don't think Brent would be a good apprentice, but I hated how the team treated him.
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singer 1910 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-21-06, 02:56 PM (EST)
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4. "RE: That's it" |
The anti-Brent editing pile-on was "yuck" in a Lord of the Flies kind of way. He really was not responsible for the team's loss in the last task.That being said, he seemed really disruptive to his team. Too bad. I think that he probably had more to offer than he was given a chance to show. I agree that this season is bad, but it's not as bad as The Donald and Mark Burnett trying to create a fiction that a 24-year-old could ever be better at business than a 34-year-old Rhodes Scholar. That was really bad, as far as I can tell. I think that Ivanka is really smart and that she has a good head on her shoulders, in spite of the fact that her father insists on fathering his own grandchildren. --Singer
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singer 1910 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-23-06, 08:12 AM (EST)
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25. "RE: That's it" |
I get your point, Wacko, but following your logic, Andy should never have been fired in the Kelley season. There were loads of people who thought that Kelley and another older contestant were not as qualified as Andy, and that the two of them tried to steamroll Andy in a number of tasks and public presentations (by ignoring or stealing his ideas or by trying to keep him down).Some people thought that in spite of Andy's youth, he was simply better than some of the older candidates. (At least that is a strongly stated opinion that I saw on these boards.) I also noted that in that situation, few people, Kelley-supporters in particular, suggested that Kelley, at 37, was far too old to be an apprentice. People said he was boring, but I did not recall seeing any arguments that suggested that his age should eliminate him from being The Donald's apprentice. The Donald's son ended up hiring Andy post-season. This suggests that Andy was pretty good at something...I admit that I could see Burnett and The Donald giving Andy the job, because, apparently, he is a bright, productive young person--even compared to his main competition (Kelley). My comments (here and in earlier notes to you from last season) go to the way that Burnett skewed the editing to create a fiction that Randal was incompetent. That season was a low point for me, because the idea that someone of Randal's background could be less good than the Rebecca that they showed us on television was quite frankly, ludicrous. It simply does not compute. (Of course, that's my position, and I respect your completely different take on this.) I was also struck by any arguments that Randal's age should disqualify him from being The Apprentice, especially given the analyses that I read about why it was a good thing that Robot Kelley became The Apprentice in his season. He was, during his competition, older than Randal. It is for these reasons that, at least for me, last season was a low point, and this season, while definitely bad, is not as bad as that. But Mark Burnett may throw another curve ball and end up treating other candidates as horribly as he treated Brent in the editing process. His shallow editing process is destroying what once was a pretty good show. --Singer
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Wacko Jacko 2434 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Seventeen Magazine Model"
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03-27-06, 10:20 AM (EST)
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31. "RE: That's it" |
Look, I won't argue that Randal may of been the most qualified of all the contestents. I was just saying that each employer looks for different things and Donald may of seen something in Rebecca that Randal did not have. Youth may of been one of those factors. But in the end Donald did hire Randal and Randal thus must've been the best for Donald. Who can argue that? I was just saying that Rebecca was quality too, in different ways that Randal.
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Estee 55194 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-21-06, 04:00 PM (EST)
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8. "RE: Why was Brent even ON this show" |
No, you've got it. That was the reason he was chosen. Very insightful for a first post. Really. 
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tinkerer 90 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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03-21-06, 09:18 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: That's it" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-22-06 AT 00:15 AM (EST)LAST EDITED ON 03-21-06 AT 09:25 PM (EST) >Donald why'd you have to gang up on Brent too. It's like the kid in school who gets bullied only to have the principal and vp etc.not do anything about it. < Precisely. Brent NEVER had a chance from the moment he joined the team. Brent, you see, is a little funny looking. Short. Wide. Kind of waddles when he walks. He's probably been the outsider from his first days at school. So what does an outsider do, when they want to be accepted as part of the group? Well, the usual advice is to get involved in some project and do your best to try to make suggestions. This is what Brent did. In fact, there were at least TWO suggestions he made which directly led to a solution for the group, but NOBODY in the group was willing to give him credit. Suggestion #1: The Team Name. Brent made the first suggestion, Killer Instinct. The group realized that this was not the way they wanted to go, they wanted a name to suggest cooperation, not vicious competition. So Synergy was suggested-with Brent's applause. Even though his suggestion was rejected, Brent's suggestion crystallized the thinking of the team as to what they wanted to convey in a name. No Killer Instinct suggestion, no Synergy suggestion. True, it was just a name for the group, but Brent's suggestion really did lead to something positive.
Suggestion #2: The Lure Into Sam's Club. The whole team was aimlessly palavering about what they were going to do to get people into the store to get memberships. Brent suggested karaoke in front of the store. Rejected. So, Brent modified it to free hairdo's for the women. That too was dismissed, with an air of exasperation by the team. But when another member modified the hairdo idea to massages, the team all adopted it enthusiastically. Clearly, it was Brent's idea, slightly modified. And it won. Yet, every time Brent made a suggestion in subsequent tasks, the whole team either cut him off or rolled their eyes to sky as if to say, "I can't BELIEVE this guy!"
In appreciation for his coming up with the winning idea, Brent's project manager put him up in the blimp to get him out of the way during the task. Beautiful. Yes, it is true that Brent should have handled his confrontation with Stacy more diplomatically. And he really hung himself in the boardroom when he said how much Tammy, the Project Manager, "stank"-thereby destroying any sympathy Trump might have for him. But that is what happens when people get insulted and embarrassed time after time. I mean, Tammy had put him in charge of choosing the clothes for the presentation-how humiliating is that? At the end, it got to the point that anything Brent did at all, no matter how well intentioned, was taken as evidence by his "team" of yet more outrageous behavior. So he finally caved in to the pressure and lashed out-which usually leads to bad consequences. Except for Roxanne, who at least tried to be decent, I hope the rest of "Synergy" goes down in flames, starting with Andrea and Tammy and working the way down the line. I hope Synergy becomes another Net Worth, where they lose week after week after week.
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ItsyBitsy 4 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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03-22-06, 07:17 AM (EST)
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13. "RE: That's it" |
I agree! After the whole Stacy J firing I thought Trump had learned his lesson about allowing teams to gang up on one person just to get rid of them!!! Very childish!
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LakerLuv 151 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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03-22-06, 11:54 AM (EST)
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17. "RE: That's it" |
Brent only reacted to the attack his team gave him from day one. I don't think Brent came to the show to be disruptive. From what I could tell, his intention was to contribute and play fairly but every time he opened his mouth, he was attacked. Brent developed a defensive attitude and that was his undoing. They disliked him from jump street because he was over weight and not pretty. It was awful the way he was treated. They never listened to his ideas and just shut him down. As many people have said, he was picked to be on the show for a reason. He's not an idiot. He's just not pretty enough for some people. Had they listened to Brent, they may have won because his idea to market the cereal as a weight loss tool probably would have worked. Afterall Kellogg's has already done it with their Special K cereal and Post could have done it with this new cereal but instead, Brent was ignored. It was awful.
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big brutha 47 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
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03-22-06, 01:34 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: That's it" |
In the real business world guys that look like Brent rule the earth.
You posters that said he gave the team clarity from his lame ideas are the same people who think you should get a medal for an making a lame attempt.
Brent is bad on the eyes he has no charisma, he is not liked, he was crushed when the stepford wife told him I make more money then you do so shut up!
He was the bafoon of the show.
For a fat ugly guy to do well on this show he has to be slick, and smart and be loved.
He was neither.
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big brutha 47 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
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03-23-06, 00:18 AM (EST)
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23. "RE: That's it" |
In the real world Brent looks like most of the guys in business. Big, fat, big nose slimey, he is probably a defense lawyer.
Look laker luv you know what I'm talking about guys like Brent are the guys you sit next to in the nose bleed seats at GW and watch the Lakers get owned week in week out.
Tv wants pretty people to win.
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tinkerer 90 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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03-23-06, 00:40 AM (EST)
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24. "RE: That's it" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-23-06 AT 02:01 AM (EST)>You posters that said he gave the team clarity from his lame ideas are the same people who think you should get a medal for an making a lame attempt.> If you watched this show, you would know that when deciding whom to fire, Trump does indeed give points for a comparatively lame attempt over making no attempt at all. Or that he spares the applicant who made poor decisions over the applicant who avoided decisions. Where have you been? You seem to be under the impression that ideas come in two types: good and bad. And further, that each idea is a separate entity in and of itself, unconnected to the idea voiced just before and the idea stated immediately after. Well, that is not the way ideas come at all during a meeting or discussion. Even if a concrete idea is rejected, it forces the people rejecting it to think about WHY they are rejecting it, and that leads to more acceptable ideas. I have given two examples where Brent's suggestion led directly to a successful solution: the Team Name and the Lure For Sam's Club. Synergy was a direct answer to Brent's suggested Killer Instinct, and Brent's suggestion of hairdo's in Sam's Club was indeed the basis for the other member's suggestion of massages. The massages won the task. Or do you seriously think that Brent's suggeston of a personal care offer, (hairdo's), was NOT the basis of the other member's suggestion of massages a half second later?
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Backster 14 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson"
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03-23-06, 10:20 AM (EST)
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27. "RE: That's it" |
Brent's looks may have been part of his problem and yes, there still is a lot of looks and weight discrimination in the business world, but his biggest problem was his unwillingness to try to be liked. The business world isn't made just out of the people that weren't popular in high school (that's the I.T. department! kidding) and so a lot of the same popularity games do come into play. At the very least you need to be able to put ideas forward in a way that seem they're ideas for the team, not just balloons you are launching up to have shot so you can cry about nobody liking your ideas. If Brent had social skills, his ideas that were shot down would get discussed as to why and he'd be able to make himself part of the team that worked through the ideas and ended on the good ones - instead he comes off so entrenched and entitled, that when the actual solution is arrived at, it seems to be only as a negative response to him, and not as a journey from his original idea.
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tinkerer 90 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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03-27-06, 10:56 AM (EST)
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33. "RE: That's it" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-27-06 AT 11:11 AM (EST)LAST EDITED ON 03-27-06 AT 11:05 AM (EST)
> If Brent had social skills, his ideas that were shot down would get discussed as to why and he'd be able to make himself part of the team that worked through the ideas and ended on the good ones - instead he comes off so entrenched and entitled, that when the actual solution is arrived at, it seems to be only as a negative response to him, and not as a journey from his
original idea.> The massage idea was proposed and accepted about five seconds after Brent stated his hairdo idea. Before Brent made his suggestions, nobody was suggesting anything. It is quite impossible for anyone not to realize that the winning idea was Brent's idea, slightly modified. As for social skills, I think you might direct your attention towards Brent's "teammates" on that score. On any job, from low paid to the highest rank, there are certain expectations the employer has the right to expect from you. Brent's team got together and tried to fire him. They took the word of one teammate, and decided to send him home. Now where, oh where, do you see anything in the rules or past episodes which says they can do that? What would happen to an employee or group of employees who took it upon themselves, without the employer's knowledge or consent, to simply inform a fellow employee he's been fired? I'll tell you what happens-they likely end up fired themselves. Once Brent, to his credit, refused to go along with this insanity, the team simply put The Big Freeze on him. They refused to deal with Brent in any professional way. In the real world, this would also be unacceptable. The employer has the right to expect his new employees at least have some idea of minimally acceptable behavior towards people both in the company and outside it. Imagine, for instance, if Trump or any employer told one of Synergy's members, (except Brent), to negotiate a deal with another company's representative. The representative shows up, and like Brent he's kind of fat, and perhaps a bit quirky. A real professional would simply look past that, treat the rep courteously, and get the deal done. Or if the deal does not get done, it would be because of good, sound business reasons-not personal reasons. Trump or any employer has the right to expect that from anyone who works for him. Can you imagine if that Synergy member treated that rep with the same contempt and hositility that they each showed towards Brent? Try to envision this scene: Trump: "Did you get the deal done with the representative?" Synergy: "No. Sent him on his way after a few minutes." Trump: "What happened?" Synergy: "Ooooh, that representative was so icky. He was fat. He waddled when he walked. His hair was kind of springy instead of lying flat-I just HATE that. After a short while I just ended the negotiations-I could barely stay in the same room with him". Sounds ridiculous, doesn't it? Obviously, any person who told Trump or any employer that would get fired on the spot. Yet, that is precisely the way Synergy treated Brent almost from the minute Brent joined the team. I can agree with you and other posters that it is a fact of life that fat people might not get quite the nice treatment that Hollywood handsome types get. But Synergy's tratment of Brent was beyond the pale. Brent was appointed by Trump's selection process to be on the Apprentice team, and he had every right to a measure of professional treatment. In the actual business world, what Synergy pulled on Brent would get them fired, once the facts came out.
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tinkerer 90 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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03-27-06, 02:09 PM (EST)
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35. "RE: That's it" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-27-06 AT 02:26 PM (EST)LAST EDITED ON 03-27-06 AT 02:12 PM (EST) You're partly confusing how one deals with a customer - which an opposing party on a business deal is - with a fellow employee. People don't get fired for all deciding that someone is difficult, abrasive and disruptive.... I really haven't seen any particularly disruptive behavior on Brent's part, outside of being somewhat rude to a contestant who was rude to him. But apart from that: As I stated before, there is a level of behavior an employer has the right to expect his employees to follow with people both inside and outside the company. Synergy did not even come close to meeting that level. I notice that you did not even begin to deal with what would happen in a real company if the boss came in one morning and found out that several employees had come together, without his permission or consent, and fired one of his employees in his absence. Hoo boy. There would be hell to pay there. Funny thing about bosses-they expect their underlings-or job applicants-to actually know who the boss is. If they demonstrate that they don't-it's sayonara. As far as this being a game-it is a game where the contestants are judged by their fitness to take over a $500,000 job in a Manhattan real estate and building firm. If the contestants show an inability to comprehend even the most basic limits of their authority, whether in a game or in business, then they have shown that they are unqualified to asssume that authority in the first place.
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singer 1910 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-27-06, 03:25 PM (EST)
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37. "Backster and Tinkerer, I'm enjoying this discussion..." |
LAST EDITED ON 03-28-06 AT 08:55 AM (EST)and I'm noticing that the "Brent-bash" reminded me of the Stacy J thing and even a bit of what the team did in Season 1 to my favourite strange contestant Sam. It probably would end up being a major problem for a manager if a team made a universal decision to freeze out a member in the real workplace. That being said, this is a game show, and while the team's decision was "yuck," somehow The Donald seems content with it. I remain unconvinced that it was a smart team move strategically, in spite of Brent's low likeability (sp?) quotient, simply because Brent may have been able to help the entire team effort better had he not been embattled and ostracised. --Singer
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Backster 14 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson"
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03-27-06, 04:01 PM (EST)
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39. "RE: That's it" |
I don't disagree with any of the above - I think that it will put a much clearer emphasis on performance, instead of on personality, which is a good thing. I just don't think it can be argued though that Brent was a suitable candidate given how unlikeable he was - or that his unlikeability was largely of his own making, not because of his looks. Editing or not, he came off as pompous, whiny and aggressive, which is hard to do.
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tinkerer 90 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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03-27-06, 05:10 PM (EST)
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40. "Brent's firing" |
Because they didn't fire him. They alienated him and made him look like someone that nobody could get along with to the boss and the boss fired him.That statement is simply wrong. They did try to fire him. You must have been getting a sandwich when Project Manager Pepe was shown talking to Brent alone, and informed Brent that the team voted to send him home as a result of what Stacy said. Brent was stuck having to argue the obvious-that only Donald Trump can send him home, the team was totally out on a limb. It was a very key scene. It illustrated that in regards to Brent, the team had left the bounds of reality and had become an ignorant lynch mob. This is what is so horrifying about Synergy. These people are college graduates and presumably well above average in intelligence and general ability, yet once the ball started rolling against Brent, nobody had the guts or ability to stand up and make this group realize that they were going way, way too far. In addition to being factually incorrect, you also have conveniently neglected to give any examples of where Brent was obnoxious, outside of the time that he confronted Stacy in regards to her rudeness. Personally, I think Brent could have handled that better-but it was hardly that far over the line.
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tinkerer 90 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
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03-27-06, 06:16 PM (EST)
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42. "RE: Helpers vs Candidates" |
I remember when Kwame and Bill were in the finals on the first Apprentice. When Omarosa sabatoged Kwame Donald Trump said Kwame should have fired her.I did not see the first or second season. But did Omarossa do this sabotaging in the final task? Because if she did, then she was no longer a candidate, but simply a helper sent to aid one of the final two candidates. I remember Tana saying in the Season Three finals that she would fire any helper who was messing up-both she and Kendra were laughing about the people the show sent to help them. They have since changed that policy, and now the final two candidates hire their own helpers from that season. The status of a helper is not the same as a candidate. Just as the status of outside temporary help is not the same as an employee the boss hired. For instance, suppose the owner of a company wants to move the operation into a new office. He sends several of his empolyees down to accomplish the move, and also hires several outside day laborers to help accomplish the move. Once in the office, the employee in charge of the move sees the day laborers are throwing things around, broke some things, and generally were messing up. So he steps up and sends the day laborers home, and decides to work several hours overtime to make up the slack. That is not a usurpation of the boss' authority. Now, if the same employee was dissatisfied with the performance of one of his fellow coworkers, the ones the boss hired, he would NOT be in the position to fire them. He might reprimand them, he might change their tasks, but unless there was a prior understanding that he could fire people, that employee could not fire the coworker without being in trouble with the boss. Same thing goes on the Apprentice. These candidates were selected by Trump's organization, and the other candidates have to work with them. That is part of the task. Moreover, the Project Manager is expected to meet a certain professional standard in dealing with any of the other candidates, just as an employee is expected to deal in a professional manner with any other employees the boss tells him to work with. If a Project Manager does not like a candidate he can give them a small, inconsequential job. But if he loses the task, the Poject Manager has to justify to Trump why he gave them that job and would not allow the candidate to help out more. And Trump better like the answer.
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