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"S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3"
dabo 25344 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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10-01-10, 11:21 AM (EST)
 
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"S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
LAST EDITED ON 10-01-10 AT 11:23 AM (EST)Shall we do this round robin this season? My turn!  Not as good an episode this time as the first two, at least we got to see a few more players come out.... well, Yve anyway. MY LIST! (You don't have to agree with me but let's keep it fun.) 1. Brenda. Not as much from her this time as last time when she was targeted, but she still seems to be the player almost everything else orbits around in La Flor, NaOnka even went to her with the HII clue! (#1 last week) 2. Jud. HA! There is more going on there than appears, he's got an interesting game going and I love it though I don't really know what he's doing. Fun to watch, though, as well as interesting. (#2 last week) 3. Tyrone. Gave it his all in the challenge though they really should have pulled him out and put Jimmy T. in sooner. Seems to have a handle on the other players on Espada as well, could have legs. (#4 last week) 4. Kelly B. Speaking of legs..  Likeable, trying to get along with others, handled it well when put in the position to play the victim. Wish we could have seen more of that. (#5 last week) 5. Jane. Like her attitude for the most part, but going to Tribal is part of the game you signed on to play, don't hate it embrace it! (#3 last week) 6. Marty. Smart but ego-centric as can be, which is not smart. He will probably never see it coming. Good! (#6 last week) 7. Yve. Hey, welcome to Survivor, glad you finally got to show up! Seems a likeable girl next door type. (#16 last week) 8. Chase. (#8 last week) 9. Jill. Still too smart for this game, over thinking things can be deadly. Has done well to position herself as Marty's wingman, good strategy if you back the right horse, but needs to get her head out of the clouds, whatever you say just feeds his ego. (#9 last week) 10. Alina. Picked the wrong side but is savvy enough to be aware of it and looking for her next play, you go girl! (#11 last week) 11. Sash. (#10 last week) 12. Benry. (#14 last week) 13. Dan. Play with the pain, dude, shake it off. You ain't got no call to be calling anyone a moose. (#12 last week) 14. Kelly S. (#15 last week) 15. Jimmy T. Would be higher if he could get control of himself but he's just too tempermental and, again, ego-centricity is not a good strategy. (#13 last week) 16. Holly. (#17 last week) 17. NaOnka. Would be lower but there's no lower to go. Spinning way out of control, just Jerri-ing herself into being the first one of her alliance that her alliance decides to off. Could say more but, meh, she's not worth the effort. (#18 last week) XX. Jimmy J. Good-bye, coach, thanks for playing, it was fun while it lasted. (#7 last week) 
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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10-01-10, 04:19 PM (EST)
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1. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Good job, dabo, on getting this started. I had been waiting. Pretty annoying show this week, all around. I see a lot of stupid game play out there: just different people making the SAME mistakes that we've seen a hundred times now.1. Brenda - This was a really light episode for anyone in La Flor not named NaBonkers. Still, Brenda remains the center of all things La Flor, who certainly must have the advantage right now. 2. Tyrone - I am just really liking this guy. Reminds me of Earl without the challenge ineptness: a real cool customer who just doesn't seem to get rattled. He gets big props for at least initially refusing to just go along with whatever Marty said. In the end, he had to stick with the unanimous vote. 3. Jill - Great job talking Marty into exposing the idol. It certainly helped unify the tribe while making Marty a possible target at the same time. Marty is an ally, true, but as we saw this week, it is a good idea to keep some checks on this guy. 4. Kelly B - Continues to hang tough on what I think is shaping up as one of the least likable tribes in Survivor history. Handled NaBonker's antics with class and maturity. Will be targeted if La Flor loses. 5. Marty - I disagree with his moves this week, but I'm not going to drop him too far because he is still a player. His plan to "shake up the tribe" seems highly questionable considering they are facing a stronger tribe with the Medallion in tow. The Oldies could be down two players very quickly. I don't see how other people "starting to play the game" will benefit him. If anything, people playing the game should target him. Like Jeff said, let the sleeping dogs lie. Ultimately, I think the decision to get rid of Coach just had to do with ego. 6. Fabio - Dude is funny, and anyone NaBonkers hates must not be that bad. 7. Yves - Got more screen time this episode, and I appreciated that. She comes off as a very likable, relatable woman. She certainly appears to do her share of the work around camp. Not playing the game that we've seen, but I don't care. I would still rather have her on my screen than most others. 8. Alina - Is the #1 target left on La Flor besides Kelly. She also appeared to do a good job keeping her head up. She wants to play but might never recover from the mistake of that first move. Should have went after NaBonkers from the beginning. 9. Kelly Purple - Got more screen time this show, and I appreciate that too. Not much going on gamewise other than staying between Brenda and Sash, not a bad place to be. 10. Benry - Got over props from Jeff. He didn't dominate anything. There were two guys throwing, and one of the two had to win. I have no negative feelings towards the guy, however. 11. Jimmy T - You've got game? You've got talents? Like at what? Shooting your mouth off, that's about it. Your ego is writing checks your @ss won't be able to cash. JT is entertaining though. So, this is as far down as he goes. 12. Jane - Who let Scout back on the show? 13. Chase - His disappearance one week after making his fateful decision is not good news for him. Not good at all. 14. Sash - Pretty much no-showed as well. Sitting pretty though with his peeps around him. 15. Holly - Not worth talking about. 16. Dan - See above. 17. NaBonkers - Of course. This is what Survivor has devolved into. We are now in the days of the over-the-top, put-on-a-show for the cameras, stock TV characters. You can thank Russell and MBs decision to have him dominant the screen for that. Now, everyone wants to be Russell. Well, not everyone, but certainly all of the social misfits like this particular gem. Now, don't get me wrong, NaBonkers is nothing like Russell, other than the magnitude of the DAW-ness and our universal disgust for them. Russell at least had some rationale behind his contemptibility. Not sure how long I'll continue to put up with this chick being on my TV. Surely, I have better things to do with my time. Snuffed-R-Us Wendy - I forget
Shannon - Based off this episode, La Flor could use his "zeal."
Coach JJ - Knew with all the play he was getting he was going home early. I respect that he admitted to being one of the weakest. He probably already knew he was going. It was unanimous after all. I think he would have been a great asset to keep around, but certain egos wouldn't allow for that.
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Toban 110 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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10-01-10, 06:31 PM (EST)
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2. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
1. Kelly B.: Ok, I know we’re being “strongly encouraged” to love her by CBS but despite that, I can’t help but put her at number 1. Her remarkably restrained response to being assaulted by NaBonkers shows a very strong character to me. I hope she sticks around for awhile. Maybe La Flor will go on a winning streak or there will be a tribal swap that saves her. (Also, I wish they would have showed the reactions of some of the other tribe members to the whole incident. Instead we only heard what she and Nay had to say about it.)2. Brenda: I only moved her down a notch because I wanted to put Kelly B. on top. She’s still La Flor’s centrepiece. Everyone seems to gravitate to her. With Nay’s antics, her “threat” status may fall into the background. We didn’t hear from her either about seeking revenge against Kelly B/Alina/Jud for the votes against her at tribal. That, I see, is a good thing for her ;longevity in the game 3. Benry: Did very well under pressure. Nothing negative about him. (As a side note, however, we see yet another challenge in which the talents – or lack thereof—of most of the players were not showcased.) 4. Marty: Yeah, he came off as a little arrogant but that was to the viewing audience, not the rest of his tribe. Apparently, he has Jill wrapped around his finger. He now has Jimmy J in his back pocket too. With this turn of the edit though, interesting things may be in his immediate future. 5. Alina: She really has her head in the game. Again, even though she’s on the wrong side of the tribal alliance, I hope she manages to stick around for awhile. I’d like to see more out of her. 6. Tyrone: I like the fact that he appears to be playing his own game and isn’t a follower. He realizes that because something is good for Marty’s game, it may be the opposite for his game. Also, he showed restraint while being badgered by nutbar Jimmy J in the challenge. 7. Chase: Quiet episode. Very nice to look at. 8. Jud/Fabio: Even though he was on the wrong side of the alliance, he isn’t going anywhere soon. Plus, he’s the bane of Nay’s existence which gives him bonus points in my books. 9. Sash: Not much to add here. He seems to be in a solid position within his alliance. 10. Jill: Please express an opinion at least. (I won’t be too harsh on her because at least she told us why it’s good for her to let Marty call the shots) 11. Yve: Seems like a sweet lady. Hasn’t shown much game yet though. 12. Jane: While she has proven herself to be a competent outdoorsperson, she too hasn’t shown much game. 13. Purple Kelly: Please say something. Anything. I think she muttered something this last episode. 14. Holly: She still gives me a crazy vibe but at least she’s actively trying to build a bond with Jane and she’s not giving up. 15. Dan: What was with the comment about his female tribemates being built like moose? Dan, look at yourself before calling out anyone else. To me, he’s a useless waste of space and should have been the boot. 16. NayBonkers: This woman is a sociopath. She was actually proud of bowling over a disabled woman. What a be-otch! I have to admit, though, that her presence on my TV screen does provide me with entertainment. I kind of hope she sticks around for that purpose alone. 17. Jimmy J: Yikes. This guy seems like an unstable bag of nitro-glycerine about to blow. I would keep far away from him if I was stuck on a tribe with him. Booted: Jimmy J: Seemed like a good guy. Should not have been the boot this week.
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sol 219 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
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10-01-10, 11:10 PM (EST)
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3. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
I know this in the Love/Loathe thread, but I really don't love any of them ... some I loathe a little, and some I loathe a lot, and then there's NaOnka who is so bad she is beyond the loathe chart.
1. Kelly B. – okay, I really don’t loathe her at all, she has a lot to put up with since NaOnka is in her world … and that shouldn’t happen to anyone. No-one on LaFlor has a bigger target on their back, and that’s not very promising for her; but she’s not part of the drama. She is lacking part of her leg, NaOnka is missing all of her brain and all of her heart, and I’m not to sure about her intestines because she sure is full of something.
2. Yve – I’m questioning myself for putting someone who has been nothing more than eye candy this high, but that’s how little I feel for everyone else.
3. Jill – planted the seed in Martys mind to show everyone the HII, so she’s smarter than Marty … at least. But not caring who Marty wants to vote off, not holding the HII when you figured out the clue … you’re not all that smart, and deserve some loathing.
4. Jud – this season really needs some comic relief, and he’s it.
5. Brenda – seems to be the real player in LaFlor, and maybe the whole season so far; almost everyone else is a wannabe.
6. Alina – okay, maybe the target on her back is bigger than Brendas, and she is trying to remain cool … but what choice does she have with NaOnka hogging all the drama.
7. Tyrone – another who didn’t care who Marty wanted to vote off, but wound up following anyhow. He may yet be part of blind-siding Marty and just isn’t showing his hand yet, but I don’t get the feeling that he is really playing this game.
8. Jane – made fire and hasn’t done much since – other than catching minnows … but at least she’s not doing much wrong.
9. Benry – he can now claim he is the bean bag throwing champion of Survivor … not that it counts much at last call and you still haven’t met anyone.
10. Marty – it wasn’t strategy, it must have been jealousy that obsessed him. Marty is a big fish in a small pond, Jimmy J. is a big fish in a BIG pond and Martys ego couldn’t handle it. Jill tells him to show the HII, and he does it … just one more reason why he’s not a thinking player, just wants to control.
11. Kelly Shinn – who wants to call herself Purple, or let herself be called Purple … right, I’ve put her too high. Other than a body to hang a bikini on, what has she done? Okay, she’s befriended that stronger alliance … probably invited as a number rather than as a player.
12. Chase – after thinking with the wrong head he completely disappears. The way Brenda is running things he’ll be nothing more than a number. Quick Chase … how many lugnuts on a tire in Nascar? None, lugnuts attach the wheel, not the tire.
13. Sash – NYs biggest bachelor has nothing of importance to say this episode? Stay close to Brenda, she’ll drag you to F5 because she wants the numbers.
14. Jimmy T. – here only because you deserve a higher rating than Dan. Or maybe not. This guy could be the king of lemmings and wouldn't find any followers. If he's "Americas Choice", America is in big trouble.
15. Holly – the clock is ticking for her next meltdown.
16. Dan – lots of people have directed grief his way because of wearing $1,600 shoes. When the producers saw him exit the plane with them alligators on they told him that was his footwear, the same as Ashley was told to wear them boots in China. Dan is this low for me because he still thinks he is strong and valuable to his tribe. I mean, Marty's deluded, but Dan is the definition of deluded.
1 million to the 1 millionth NaOnka – I won’t be surprised when she says she didn’t mean anything because it was just a game … no … those thoughts are in your mind, that is the way you think … you need some serious counseling. At the Reunion Jiffy will say how she was brought in for her personality and she delivered. And me … well my finger is on the mute button for when she has a confessional, and more than 4 confessionals next ep, and I will be delivered from watching Survivor … at very least until you are gone. When Romber was eliminated from TAR All-Stars I stopped watching because I had zero desire to watch even 10 seconds of the Charla and Mirna show.
Gone - Too soon ... Jimmy Johnson. I wish your adventure had lasted a little longer, but you were the victim of 3 guys who drive trucks with over-sized wheels to make up for what they lack elsewhere. Yes I'm talking about you Marty, Jimmy T and Dan.
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Aruba 1891 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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10-02-10, 05:19 AM (EST)
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5. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Thanks for getting it started his week, Dabo. I agree, this past episode was not good...actually among my worst.JILL - Smart woman; smart player. She makes Marty think he's the puppet master, yet SHE pulled the strings convincing him to show the tribe the HII. She has Marty's trust, not a target of her tribemates, and if she makes the merge will not be percieved a threat to anyone. As doubtful as this appears if Espada goes into the merge with the numbers, I like her chances a lot. MARTY - The guy's a player. Slick move baitng Jimmy T. to suggest Jimmy J. without forcing it on him. Have to credit Marty with the 8-1 landslide vote. While it's smart to remove a weak player, that's not why Marty targeted Jimmy J. His gamplay could be good for Marty's advancement, but will severly weaken Espada. A tribal flip-flop would work to his and Espada's advantage now. BRENDA - Props for NaOinker sharing the clue with you; would be #1 this week but a slight drop for struggling badly while decoding it. And sorry, I'm not giving you points for knowing where the sun sets and what direction the left side of the compass is...even if you do have a cute smile and look good in a bikini. BENRY - Gotta believe he campaigned heavily to be the tosser for a shot at redemption. And boy did he redeem himself. Well done, young man. Now if he only had a confessional we'd find out if he can strategize as well. KELLY B. - I just want to reach through the TV screen and give her a hug. If she ever used her leg to stick it up NaOinker right where the sun don't shine, she'd be my #1 and would stay there for as long as she remains in the game. Kelly B. and Chase both had fathers who passed away recently. I'm surprised that hasn't come up yet. CHASE - A focus in the first two episodes slips into obscurity in Ep. 3 (as did most of La Flor.) Makes me believe there will be no sappy showmance...I'm happy about that. Suffereing no adverse after effects from TC reinforces his likability. Appears to be solid in the five-person "core racial" alliance. TYRONE - Only one (other than Jill) to have Marty figured out. Also the only one from Espada who would be able to keep up with the younger castaways physically. "Ball Hogs" are forgiven when your team wins...but you lost, so you deserved to face the music. JANE - She's got the spunk, but does she have the game and the ability to make smart decisions? I doubt it. Tailormade for a mid-season boot, thus a mid-list ranking. PURPLE KELLY - Only reason I'm ranking her here is because she seems safe in the bosom of the main La Flor alliance. Well OK, maybe not the ONLY reason. Speaking of "bosom" looks the best this season in a bikini. JUD - OHHHH...I get it now! So you want people to THINK you're really a moron. Matt tried that angle in the Amazon when he told us he wanted people to "think" he was a psychopath. I didn't believe Matt then; I'm not believing you now. Matt was a psycho; you are an idiot. IVE - Eight days in the jungle hasn't done Ive any favors. When looking at her Bio pic I questioned why she's in with the older people; now she is visibly beginning to fit it. We did get a confessional out of her, but it was only to complain about Dan's struggles. MATT - Sometimes less is good. Nothing doing for him this episode, so a move up the rankings. Rather interesting your "million-dollar smile" didn't get you a sneak peek at the clue. ALINA - My favorite image in Ep. 3 was Alina diving into the waves. Despite that image, I still can't warm up to her. Apparently neither can La Flor. She better pray they keep winning challenges. HOLLY - Good thing for her she has Jane watching her back. Like Ive, eight days in the jungle provides a drastic contrast to her Bio pic. I know I've said this times before, but it's worth repeating...if there were ways men could enhance their appearance on a regular everyday basis, we'd probably be the most awesome looking species on the face of this earth! JIMMY T. - HMMMM, think he was smitten when Marty showed everyone the HII? Geez, the way Jimmy carried on just make out with the guy already and move on. So he's used to leading and taking charge? Well with Jimmy J gone there's a new sheriff in town...and his name is Marty. So in other words, if you can't keep your trap shut, you're next. DAN - The guy's got a set of guns; I'll give him that. Perhaps he should consider walking on his hands so his tribe would not percieve him as weak. But he's already got that tag so it'll be pretty hard to shake. Appreciate the fact he doesn't give up, but just another one in the long line of casting debacles by an inept production crew. NAONKA - Editing, Schmediting...hands down the most despictable, vile, piece of trash ever casted. The only positive remark I can make is I now agree with her "Greatest Accomplishment" in her Bio stating at age 27 she never had any kids. I hope she can still say that when she's 77. Wretched individuals like her should never be allowed to procreate. BOOTED JIMMY J - Everytime he continues to lament how this experience was the toughest thing he ever endured, he's feeding MB's ego even more than Brenda fed Chase when professing her likeness for him. Although an early departure was imminent, it would have been entertaining to see him stick around a little longer.
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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10-03-10, 02:41 PM (EST)
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6. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Here's how I saw it:1- Brenda: Na’Onka showing her the idol gave the editors another chance to show us she was a smart player, someone who will let have Nay have the power and stay close to her. She was shown as the one that opened the discussion during the pow-wow, putting her symbolically in the role of chairperson. It seems the blur guy took a day off. Thank you! http://www.immunityidol.net/vidcaps/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=267818&g2_serialNumber=2 2- Jill: Her little smile after saying Marty wanted to have his way at TC was a sure indication that this smart woman is the one pulling the strings. She gave Marty the idol and we know how often players have been burned by that idol so that could turn into a smart move for her. Trust is more important than idols. She also convinced Marty to show everyone he had the idol which reduces his options. That also could turn out to be smart on her part. 3- Kelly B.: Now she even gets pushed around by Nay. This likable player has a tough road ahead of her. Called a fool and said to have been scared, I’d like to see Kelly whoop some of the hood out of Na’Onka. 4- Alina: I still see her as a smart player, analyzing her precarious position while the alliance discusses her fate. She is called the most dangerous outsider, the one that can stir things up. Can she find the idol before Nay? That would be something! For one thing, I like her more and more and this little scene didn't hurt: 
5- Ben: I saw Ben sitting with the others as LaFlor had their pwo-wow so he is part of their discussion. He stayed calm during the challenge and he pulled it out. Being the team's go to guy is important. 6- Tyrone: Monday morning quarterbacks can question Jimmy J’s decision not to pull him out sooner but you have to rely on your go to guy. I also agree with him on the voting decision, it should have been Dan. Tyrone is presented as a wise man, knowing that Marty is all about Marty.
7- Jane: She told us what we were supposed to think about the vote. It should have been the slow moving Dan not her fishing buddy. I found her little scene with Holly to be quite interesting. Neither woman was on the block but we still had to be told about their deal.
8- Fabio: With Nay reminding us that Jud was part of Shannon’s alliance, we have to consider him an underdog. I enjoy his spirit and his jokes. His strategy is new so I wonder if the funny guy can actually be the winner? It would make for a very funny story. Did Survivor change slots to be part of Comedy Wednesday? 
9- Yve: She was used to tell a small chapter in Jimmy’s story. She assured us he was a good guy, her favorite player, someone who would have been more useful than Dan.I'd like to hear her story. 10-Marty : He’s in charge, he makes all the decisions but are they the right ones? Yve, Jane, Jill, Tyrone and even Jeff in his final words to the tribe told us they weren't. From a clinical player, Marty became paranoid, obsessed by Jimmy. I remember Alina's opening confessional when she wished Marty would take the leadership role so he could get voted out. Now that he is, will her words come true? At least, he makes a very interesting villain. 11- Na’Onka: Speaking of villains! What a hoot! She is in power, she has a piece of paper that could be worth a million dollar and she wants KB and Juuud out of there. Will this feisty woman be able to storm her way to the end? I blame all you guys who simply loved Russell for the over the top edit Na'Onka is receiving. The editors are trying to get the same response for this evil player. Why isn't she more liked? Because she doesn't say she is the best ever? Really? Or is it because a man acting like this is seen as forceful while a woman doing much the same thing is seen as a b*tch? 12- Holly: She recovered nicely after her disastrous episode and now she has a deal with a well-liked player. Next week’s bad weather should tell us if she can handle Survivor. If she stays, maybe she will get the rewards she said would come from staying in the game.
13- Purple Kelly: She is part of the majority alliance but she still hasn’t had an interview shown on screen. At least she did get some air time!
14- Sash: He is part of LaFlor's majority alliance and he has the alliance with Brenda and Nay inside of that for later on. His story needs to pick up. 15- Chase: Now that he has made his choice, the story moved away from Chase. Is being Brenda's tool his only story or can he turn it in his favor? The answer to that question will determine whether he moves back up in my rankings or continues to plummet. 16- Jimmy T: Although he was right in saying he has skills, he made it sound like he was jealous of Tyrone. It made him look like the locker room distraction that can’t accept to be a second stringer. His attacks on Jimmy Johnson also made him sound jealous and his determination to vote out Jimmy made him a villain.
17- Dan : He’s only been featured as a boot option. dan, I looked at him and he is weak. Shame on him for not admitting it.
Booted - Jimmy J: He was a fun contestant and he didn't deserve to leave tha early. He was more valuable to the tribe than 1 or 2 others.
Ils sont fous, ces Romains!
Thanks Tribe!
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dabo 25344 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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10-04-10, 11:17 AM (EST)
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10. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Fair fight? LOL! I doubt Kelly was expecting or prepared for a body check, and this is something where her handicap was taken advantage of by NaOnka. She knocked the woman over because she had one leg, there's no other way to look at it. A two-legged person, Benry or Alina or Jud, would have been put off-balance a bit, not expecting or being prepared for it, but not to the degree that Kelly B. was. Hardly a fair situation. But she did well after that even though she couldn't get back on her feet in fighting back.Kelly B. is a world-class athlete, might be able to beat NaOinka or any of the other players in a fair race, could certainly show her up in a distance/endurance event. From her page on Wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_Bruno She currently holds world records for amputees in the 200M and 800M distances, has won gold at the 2008 New York Triathlon and ITU World Triathlon Championships in the amputee division, and was the second amputee to finish the Ironman Kona Triathlon in Hawaii in 2007, setting the current record for the course in the process.
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agman 11158 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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10-04-10, 01:25 PM (EST)
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15. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
>Fair fight? LOL! I
>doubt Kelly was expecting or
>prepared for a body check,
>and this is something where
>her handicap was taken advantage
>of by NaOnka. She
>knocked the woman over because
>she had one leg, there's
>no other way to look
>at it. A two-legged
>person, Benry or Alina or
>Jud, would have been put
>off-balance a bit, not expecting
>or being prepared for it,
>but not to the degree
>that Kelly B. was.
>Hardly a fair situation.
>But she did well after
>that even though she couldn't
>get back on her feet
>in fighting back.
Dabo, You took the words right out of my mouth! I was thinking the same thing, but you said it before I got a chance.
bouncy by Ice Cat
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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10-04-10, 06:44 PM (EST)
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17. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
LAST EDITED ON 10-04-10 AT 06:45 PM (EST)"I doubt Kelly was expecting or prepared for a body check" She told us she knew that Nay had seen the clue, she told us she knew that meant trouble. She plunged first towards the basket so, if she wasn't expecting a push, she's dumb. I do not ser her as dumb at all. She was surprised by the force of the attack but, if you go for a fight, you have to expect to receive your opponent's best shot. Or are you saying that Nay should have just given Kelly the clue because she has one leg? If anything blame production for wanting that catfight. The tribe won reward why not give the clue to the tribe? Anyway, look at Kelly's position: Anyone with two legs would have been knocked over if they had decided to simply squat down like that. 
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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10-04-10, 06:53 PM (EST)
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18. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
I don't really need to respond since others did it for me, but -"Sorry but Kelly's first words was to say she didn't want to be seen as handicapped." Oh, never mind, THAT makes it all alright! hahahaha... Uh... yeah, ask anyone with a disability, that is what they'll say. What are they going to say-" Pity me, I have a disability" ? Anyway, NaBonkers is far from treating Kelly as if she weren't handicapped. On the contrary, she can't go a single confession without mentioning it. Rather, I would say she has made it clear that part of her aggression towards Kelly is specifically because she IS handicapped. Good point that Russell winning the Fan Vote has helped bring on NaBonkers. I certainly didn't vote for his sorry @ss. But Russell won the vote because he was perceived as the best player, not because of his personality. Can't blame the viewers for seeing him as the best player that season considering the edit.
>
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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10-04-10, 07:27 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
"Can't blame the viewers for seeing him as the best player that season considering the edit."Quite the contrary, I totally blame the viewers for not understanding that this is a social game. And it wasn't just "that season"; RussHole won FF two times in a row. The viewers wanted more and now that they have it they don't like it. Like I said, I see Nay's actions as much less dangerous than Russell's and she did it for the same reason Russell did: To get further in the game. But what good is further if you can't win the vote? And Nay has only one way to see Kelly: Someone who stands in her way to the million. Producers know that there will be fights, they encourage them! Applicants and recruits alike know that there will be wrestling and shoving, that's what we've seen on every season lately. If it was unfair to have a handicapped player then why cast her or why accept to be on the show? Or why encourage the fights in the first place? Remember Erick tossing Amanda on her "friggin' head". Now that was an unfair fight. To prove this point all I have to ask are the following questions:
- When did Kelly B see the clue? Immediately at the challenge location.
- Why did she wait until Na'Onka arrived and grabbed her side of the basket? Because the players are under strict orders. Kely wasn't allowed to touch the clue until the tribe crossed the unseen boundary of their camp. Only then could they go for the clue. Reality TV? Hardly. That was set up just like a wrestling match. It would actually not surprised me at all to learn that the producers said: Kelly and Na'Onka will be in charge of carrying the basket. Unfair? It was what the producers wanted.
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Aruba 1891 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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10-04-10, 07:45 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
I will always find it comical when you play the "edit card," but to suggest we're pulling the "gender card" out of the deck in reference to NaOinker has me shaking my head.Personally, I could care less whether she's female, male, or a hermaphrodite; she's a nasty and repulsive individual. Actually, it's NaOnka herself, who may be playing the gender card. I know you want to believe the reason NaOinker shares the clue with Brenda is because Brenda is one of the early "superstars" of this season. Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see Brenda advance far in the game; but don't you think Brenda being the only other FEMALE minority on the tribe has a "little" something to do with why they hang together and consequently shared the clue? As for the Russell comparison...WOW, where do I start??? First of all when viewers were casting their vote for Russell they weren't voting for their favorite sweetheart in the human race. Among the several reasons Russell was a fan favorite were 1) finding the HIIs without any clues, 2) advancing by being able to manipulate players without them knowing they were manipulated (until they were voted out,) 3) by winning the final IC thus determining who the sole survivor would be.
Russell made it abundantly clear in the Samoa Season premier that his antics and ultimate advancement in the game were to reinforce the kind of idiots and morons who are normally casted...a factual reference I've been drivng home ever since I stumbled upon this Forum. Conversely, NaOinker can't find the HII even with TWO clues; heck, she needed Brenda to tell her that the left side of the compass points to the west. Her obnoxious, in-your-face behavior makes it virtually impossible for her to unknowingly manipulate others as Russell did. And if she advances to the endgame it is yet to be seen how she will fare in the individual ICs. Finally on Kelly B. saying she doesn't want to be seen as a handicap... Sure a person with a handicap does not want any pity or sympathy, but on the same token, they don't want ANY attention whatsoever drawn to their handicap. At least a majority feel that way. I think the understatement of the season is we will not hear any pity or smypathy from NaOnka on Kelly's handicap. But for NaOinker to sarcastically reference it on a continual basis is just as bad and precisely what Kelly B. (or most anyone with a handicap) does NOT want when they say they do not want to be seen as a handicap.
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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10-04-10, 10:04 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
LAST EDITED ON 10-04-10 AT 11:44 PM (EST)"Conversely, NaOinker can't find the HII even with TWO clues" Where do I start? Russell did have a clue when he found his first idol: He had seen Yasmin looking in trees. That alone is enough but add that many believe the producers placed the 2nd idol where they knew Russell would go snoop because they wanted to help him. That idol wasn't really hidden and that makes your argument meaningless.
Second, Jeff said they made the clues harder to decipher and the idols harder to find this season. Look at Espada: They had the same 2 clues, and they were very lucky to have a fisherman that knew what a yardarm was (I had NEVER heard the term so that little arrow pointing to the ship's yardarm, the minus sign and the arm were totally meaningless to me and to most). Still, all 9 members of Espada couldn't find the clue. It took a Doctor to figure out that the tree and the man => tree male => tree mail. I won't blame Nay and Brenda yet if we consider what it took for 9 people to find.
"2) advancing by being able to manipulate players without them knowing they were manipulated"
I see you really like to drink Burnett's kool-aid!! Russell may have said he was manipulating others but he manipulated very little. Most votes were decided by others, certainly all the important ones. And Natalie manipulated him more than he ever manipulated her. "3) by winning the final IC thus determining who the sole survivor would be." Yes, and it was not him!!!!! What good does it do to win a challenge if you don't win the war? Stupid Russell won the final IC twice and, both times, he made the wrong decisions on who to bring to the end. A really Dumb player but the viewers loved him. Anyway, who says Nay doesn't win F3 IC. Careful, you may have to love her! "Sure a person with a handicap does not want any pity or sympathy" But we give it to them anyway. She decided to play Survivor. She's a participant like the others. I'm also sure the interviewers ask Na'Onka to make those comments on Kelly. They know which buttons to push to get the "juicy" details.
Ils sont fous, ces Romains!
Thanks Tribe!
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Aruba 1891 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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10-05-10, 12:40 PM (EST)
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23. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Welcome to Michel's Survivor rendition of Robert Redford's movie Quiz Show. Except in this thread we're not discussing how the popular TV show "Twenty-One" was fixed...we'll focus on how HIIs are not really hidden but placed strategically and purposely for one (and only one) player to find. And castaways do not really "confess" anything in a confessional...they are reciting scripts prepared by interviewers.You're a Riot...AN ABSOLUTE RIOT! ROFLMAO 1) Jeff stated that Russell right from the getgo spent hours scouring the camp and surrounding areas looking for HIIs. We even saw a clip of him doing this on the Reunion Show. If he combed the area as thoroughly as stated, of course there's a great chance a HII would be hidden where he once looked. As for the first HII he found, I guess what you're saying is he found the idol without a clue BEFORE someone else found the same idol with a clue. Guess he deserves absolutely NO credit for that, Huh? In ep. 2 I did not get a good look at clue #2, so when Jimmy T. came up with "yard"arm I was impressed. But what I noticed in ep. 3 was the second line showing three feet (picture of three footprints) = ?. And they still couldn't come up with a "yard?" Do you need to fish for a living to figure that out? OHHHH, but NaOinker and Brenda are not podiatrists by profession either, so let's give them a pass on that one too. LOL 2) Speaking of "pass" I'm going to give you one for your statement that Russell manipulated "very little" and Natalie manipulated more than Russell. I believe you're saying that to stir the pot even more and/or get a charge out of me. I'll defer this dilussion to anyone else who cares to read it. If a majority feel Russell manipulated very little, I guess I'll have to reevaluate how I watched Survivor: Samoa. 3) So if any individal or team puts out optimum effort, even if they do not win in the end, they deserve no props? Largely due to a disgrunted, belly-aching, and sore-losing Jury, Russell did not win, but the guy proved to be a hard-core power player of the game who never quit. THAT'S why he was voted fan fav. You don't have to "love" a player personally to admire and "love" their efforts. By comparison, it is yet to be seen whether NaOinker is just as hardcore of a player for the duration of the season. She's shown to have a mouth for the game during the first eight days, but will she be able to back it up the remaining 31? My prediction is NO, but I could be wrong. I guess that's why comparing a player with two seasons under his belt to another only eight days into the game is futile as this point. 4) OHHHH, I get it...they're feeding NaOinker the lines...forcing her to drink from Michel's imaginary vat of MB kool-aid. Why not make similiar erroneous assumptions that Russell was directed by Production to empty the canteens and was told to put the socks in the fire? Let me say one more time...You're a Riot; AN ABSOLUTE RIOT!!!
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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10-05-10, 06:23 PM (EST)
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24. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Can't you see that there are ways to hide an idol where no one can find it without a clue and that there are ways to put an idol in the path of a snoop. Put the idol underground 10 feet away from the bridge and Russell NEVER finds it. Put it simply under the bridge and you might as well give it to him. And I am far from the only person to say that. Dozens of posters have said the same. They just don't argue with you as I do."And castaways do not really "confess" anything in a confessional...they are reciting scripts prepared by interviewers." Scripts no, never said that but they are asked pointed questions and, when the answers don't suit the editors, they splice and dice the player's words to get what they want. If you paid attention, you'd realize when you have cuts and changes of sound quality. You see players starting a confessional dressed one way and end it with different clothes on. That sounds like reality to you? For Na'Onka, they simply have to ask her how she feels about someone and she gives them what they want. Then, they ask for more, maybe adding something to get her going like "But don't you think Kelly deserves an apology?" For Russell's first idol, he himself said he saw Yasmin looking in trees before he went to that big tree trunk. The edit made it seem he found it before Yasmin ever came to Foa Foa but he himself told us otherwise. Keep up with the news! All I was saying about this season was that Espada had the same two clues and it took 9 people to figure them out, including a doctor, so I'm not blaming he girls just yet. 2a) Betsy's vote was unanimous. Russell didn't do a thing.
2b) Ben was done against Russell's wishes.
2c) Ashley's was unanimous.
2d) Liz was a joint Natalie/Russell effort to convince Jaison and Mick
2f) Erik was all Natalie, Jaison and Laura. Russell was fooled into playing an idol.
2g) Kelly was Shambutch getting her way. Russell should have booted Brett right then.
2h) Laura was also all Shambutch's doing.
2i) John had everyone against him. The others actually manipulated Russell in voting out his best goat.
2j) Dave, Monica and Brett were no brainers. Again, Russell missed an opportunity to vote Brett because he wasn't immune when Dave left.
2k) Natalie masterfully manipulated Russell in keeping her instead of Shambutch, his last goat.
2l) Russell and Natalie together got Mick to agree to eliminate Jaison. See, Russell talked a lot but did very little! The only vote to his credit is Marisa and, as first boot, everyone agrees as long as it isn't them "it is yet to be seen whether NaOinker is just as hardcore of a player for the duration of the season" Ha! but your vote is only for this week and, this week, as you've just admitted, she WAS hardcore. I agree, Nay was one of the most pro-active players, your ideal type of players. Why not a top 5 rating then?!!!!!!
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
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10-05-10, 08:25 PM (EST)
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25. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Come on, now. Unlike the show, let's keep it real here. First off, Russell is an A-hole.
Second of all, NaBonkers is a much better comparison with Lisi than with Russell.
Lastly, Russell controlled nearly all the votes in FU FU. Marisa- Russell targeted her because she was smart. The women acquiesced because she was blazing hot.
Betsy- She went home because Russell wanted her to go home, period.
Ben- Mega-loser that Jaison wanted gone. Russell acquiesced, wisely.
Ashley- Russell wanted her gone because she was smarter than Natalie.
Liz- Russell wanted gone from the get go.
Erik- Voted out by his own tribe, idiotically. If Russell doesn't have the idol or Galu doesn't know he has the idol, they vote for him as a no brainer.
Kelly- Totally controlled by Russell. Remember, Russell goes home if not for the idol that HE found. Yeah, Shambo suggested Kelly, but Nat, Jaison and Mick don't vote for her unless Russell agrees.
Laura- See Kelly.
John- Expedient vote for Russell. Russell had no chance to beat him. So he was no goat.
Dave, Monica, and Brett- See Kelly and Laura.
Shambo- Russell was foolish to dump her, but it wouldn't have mattered to him, regardless. Galu had already decided he wasn't winning. Since he got John and Shambo's vote, Russell only loses a vote if he decides to keep either.
Jaison- Wins for sure if Russell doesn't boot him. In fact, according to Laura, Galu thought so little of Natalie that they were planning on giving the money to Mick. If nothing else, through Nat, Jaison, and Mick's votes, Russell controlled nearly every boot. Russell also controlled the boots of Tyson, B-Rob, Coach, Snarkney, and Danielle in
H v. V. Parvati called him, "an incredible force in this game" and said, "he obviously knows what he is doing." I would give an assessment from Parvati plenty of weight. Any attempts to debunk Russell's game play is just that- bunk. >
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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10-05-10, 09:44 PM (EST)
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26. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
I'll just clear this up once more but if you don't understand than it's not my fault.Betsy was supposed to go first, so leaving second wasn't manipulation, that's what the tribe wanted all along.
Russell was the one being manipulated during the Ben vote.
Ashley lost a challenge so Russell didn't need to persuade anyone. We are talking manipulation here. No one was manipulated.
Natalie did as much to save herself when it was between her and Liz. Mick and Jaison liked Liz's strength, Natalie had to prove her loyalty.
In the Erik vote, if Natalie doesn't intervene, Monica was the one voted out which would have removed some tension in Galu. Shambutch herself said it was Erik' boot that convinced her to flip for good. Russell's idol was meaningless.
For Kelly, we are talking manipulation remember? For sure, Russell had the idol but Shambutch was the one that played mind games on Russell, convincing him to vote out Kelly when it should have been Brett. The manipulation part of the Kelly vote wasn't done by Russell but ON Russell.
Same with John who was a goat according to all of Galu. They hated him in LL, they wouldn't have given him the money. Laura was Shambutch's target from day 1. It was her doing, plain and simple. Russell was simply lucky the two hated each other. Tyson controlled Tyson's boot.
The only person that had to be manipulated to eliminate BRob was Coach and Jerri did that, not Russell.
Courtney was a huge mistake for Russell. Parvati wanted Jerri out, Danielle wanted Sandra out, Russell should have gone with Danielle.
As for Coach, Sandra manipulated Russell, not the other way around.
And, finally, voting out Danielle was the DUMBEST vote of them all and that was all Russell. Danielle was a goat not Sandra. He's a stupid player and finally Parvati realized it at that moment. BTW: Parvati said Russell was a force in the game because her friend in production had told her about him.
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Aruba 1891 desperate attention whore postings
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10-08-10, 06:28 AM (EST)
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27. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Sure they could have buried the HII 10 feet underground. Why? To purposely make it harder for someone putting out more effort? Anyone that season could have put in the time and effort looking for HIIs, but to his credt only Russell did. So punish smeone who's trying the hardest to play that particular aspect of the game? On Cook Islands when they realized they casted an Aqualung (Ozzy) why not take all the future challenges out of the water to neutralize Ozzy's efforts (strength) and essentially "punish" him too? Let's apply this to real life:
When the Indy Colts come into town should the NFL limit passing attempts to only 20 per team because Payton Manning is too good of a QB?Just because interviewers may ask questions about Kelly B, I guess it gives NaOinker the green might to make derogitory comments about the handicap? If Russell and Kelly were casted the same season I'm pretty sure Russell wouldn't be referencing Kelly's one leg the way NaOnka is doing even if inteviewers asked him specific questions about it. I must commend you on your research and/or recall with the Samoa boots. As a result, your PhD in Spin-ology has now escalated beyond the General Surgeon status. I got a kick out of how you conveniently include Natalie in all of the boots Russell was responsible for. Also, just because a boot was unanimous it doesn't mean one person didn't spearhead it. Most recently, Jummy J's boot was unanimous, but certainly orchestrated by Marty. John's boot was all about Russell. And I see you are still hanging onto the notion that Natalie caused Erik's boot. The two TCs before Erik's boot he proceeded to shoot himself in the foot and place the noose around his neck. The player most responsible for Erik's boot was Erik himself. I could go on and on to rebute your spinology and all you example, but here's the bottomline: I firmly believe Russell makes it to the end even if Natalie is not casted that season. On the other hand, no way Natalie even makes the Finals, nevermind "win" Survivor, without Russell taking her in. Finally, the only "hard-core" label I can put on NaOinker right now is that of a trash-talker. And you wonder why she is not in my Top Five??? In her defense we have not seen her make her mark in any challenges, so physically she's a question mark at this point. Mentally, her inability to decipher anything on the HII clue was a joke. Socially she's a lost cause. And psychologically she's a pressure cooker ready to explode. Top Five? Yeah, right. LOL. I'm offically done with his thread. I just posted the Ep. 4 Love/Loath list. New week...new thread. And new spinology no doubt!
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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10-08-10, 08:13 AM (EST)
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28. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
This is simply too funny to let die!
"Sure they could have buried the HII 10 feet underground. Why? To purposely make it harder for someone putting out more effort?"
Why? Well maybe because it is called a HIDDEN immunity idol! A player, no matter how much the producers love him, shouldn't be given an idol. Did you realize that they put the idol there while the people who did receive the clue were out of camp on reward and couldn't look for it? By the time they came back, the idol was already in Russell's dirty underwear. Not a place to look. Many people, including me, say: Fixed. And Russell didn't make derogatory comments about the women, especially his dumb blondes? I wouldn't defend Russell by using his "good manners"!!!!!!!!!!!!! "just because a boot was unanimous it doesn't mean one person didn't spearhead it. Most recently, Jummy J's boot was unanimous, but certainly orchestrated by Marty" Stupid move by Marty by the way. Ayway, yes, a unanimous vote can be spearheaded by someone. JJ's boot wasn't the tribe's first choice so it had to be pushed by Marty. But Betsy's and Ashley's votes were the tribe's first choice. No manipulation involved. If Natalie doesn't convince Laura then the Galu women vote for Jaison, the rest all vote for Monica and RussHole plays with his idol. Natalie was instrumental in that vote, Russell wasn't and that was the key vote of the season.
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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10-08-10, 05:50 PM (EST)
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30. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Whoa! I never said bury it 10 feet underground!! Read again please! I said bury it 10 feet away from the bridge instead of put it under the bridge in plain sight. It certainly would have been less than 2 feet underground, just like Nicaragua's idol but it would have been hidden not given.
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krismiss2us 768 desperate attention whore postings
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10-09-10, 10:35 AM (EST)
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32. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
you don't think there's a hint of truth in that movie? seriously?
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
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10-09-10, 06:23 PM (EST)
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34. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
No, that religion comment had to do with YOU, not me, but everyone knows how much I love me some Russell. I'm sure everyone remembers my sweet words of adoration after his argument with Rupert last season.JFK is a great fricking movie. Great fricking movie, to paraphrase Kevin Bacon. Yeah, I thought there was some truth in it too until I saw an hour long special on the History channel specifically debunking that movie. Should have known anything from Oliver Stone has only a kernel of truth in it, at best. Stone's career pretty much went in the tank after that, BTW. Still, I encourage everyone to see the movie, and then watch the hour long History special right after. You'll get entertained and then informed. P/O >
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Colonel Zoidberg 3645 desperate attention whore postings
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10-04-10, 12:09 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
I blame all you guys who simply loved Russell for the over the top edit Na'Onka is receiving. The editors are trying to get the same response for this evil player. Why isn't she more liked? Because she doesn't say she is the best ever? Really? Or is it because a man acting like this is seen as forceful while a woman doing much the same thing is seen as a b*tch?OK, maybe Russell is the Na'Onka ancestor; however, the difference is this. Russell was well-liked because he was a hardcore player. Everything he did was in the interests of winning. Yes, he lied, cheated, freed chickens, left the seat up - and he knew exactly what he was doing and wasn't shy about it. Na'Onka, on the other hand, has a few screws loose. Yes, she's a hardcore player, and no one's doubting that - and anyone who is should check again. The problem? We're not seeing a lot of this as gameplay because she's not being cast as the hardcore player Russell was. She's just the crazy hood rat as far as what we see. Probably a big chunk of that is production, but a bigger chunk is that they're working with what she gives them. Russell referring to his "dumb-ass girls alliance" isn't much different from Na'Onka gloating about body-checking a one-legged athlete. Both are doing exactly what they feel they need to. Russell's just more polished.
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krismiss2us 768 desperate attention whore postings
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10-04-10, 12:54 PM (EST)
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13. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
I don't know that Russell was more "polished". I think it was more a matter of he was more up front about his intentions in his confessionals. He said from the start what he would do to win this game. I think people (read, viewers) appreciated (?) his "honesty" about his intentions on gameplay. NaBonkers is just mean. Say what you want about Russell being a big meanie, but I don't think even he would sink to the level of threatening to put a fake leg in the fire. It's not like he's Joey or anything either.
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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10-04-10, 07:32 PM (EST)
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20. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
Russell polished? He's the complete opposite of polished: An uncultured bully. Na'Onka doesn't express herself like Russell but she is saying exactly the same thing and is playing the same way: She's the baddest one there and she won't let anyone come in her way.
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Survivorerist 4103 desperate attention whore postings
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10-04-10, 12:47 PM (EST)
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12. "RE: S21 Love/Loathe List Ep3" |
1. Tyrone (10) - Besides carrying his team in the challenge, I really like the "team player" edit this guy is getting. Maybe not the best strategy, but it certainly makes him likeable2. Fabio (3) - Still a riot. "There was a what? A piece of paper?" 3. Alina (5) - She's definitely getting the season's "girl next door" underdog edit, and I definitely can't resist that. 4. Benry (7) 5. Kelly B. (1) - Aside from the fact that she has one leg, she doesn't really excite me all that much. To be honest, the only reason she's even this high is because of all the airtime she's getting. 6. Brenda (6) 7. Yve (18) - Getting a bit more airtime this week. I get a good vibe from her. 8. Jill (8) - Pulling strings while flying under the Marty radar suggests that this one is a player, which I suppose is something I can appreciate. 9. Chase (9) 10. Holly (13) 11. Sash (11) - Apathetic towards these three this week, so they're more or less interchangeable. I just put them in alphabetical order. 12. Naonka (15) - As much as I dislike her villain edit, I will admit that she makes the show interesting. And who cares about the difference between hood and ghetto? You're still annoying as heck. 13. Dan (14) - I don't care what he says, this man is weak. News flash...you're not fooling anybody. 14. Marty (2)- This guy just flat out annoys me. His gigantic ego and need to be in control makes me want to see him fall flat on his face. 15. Jimmy T. (11) - "You're wasting me coach. You're wasting me." Way to sound like a giant tool. 16. Jane (16) - So apparently she started the fire in the first episode? I don't remember that and she hasn't given me anything to rank her on. 17. Kelly P. (17) - Still hasn't gotten enough airtime for me to have anything to say.
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