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"Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List"
iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-19-11, 06:23 AM (EST)
 
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"Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-19-11 AT 06:31 AM (EST)I would say this was a pretty average week of Survivor, but the editing raises it slightly above that. I believe you really have to watch this one multiple times to try to put together the puzzle that all the foreshadowing, faux foreshadowing and symbolism presents you with. Obviously there is a sense of doom building around Zapatera, but it is also possible that much of that was a redirect from another completely predictable TC. In the end, I think Julie's words rang truest- Zapatera "won in losing." 1. B-Rob - Game continues to come together for him with a well-timed trip to RI leading to Stephanie and Krista pledging their allegiance. It would now actually be to his benefit if Krista beat Matt. The best two moments of the show were his defeat of Stephanie at the puzzle even after dropping a piece and his confessional around the finding of the 2nd HII clue. Indeed, he has to do something to amuse himself. Great stuff! 2. Andrea - I move my fellow Wisconsinite up to 2nd even though she only got one confessional in the show. Even with the light edit, she still was obviously cast as the likable underdog. She has done everything right to ingratiate herself with Rob's alliance. If Ihmotep loses an IC, she is likely gone, but she is probably the most likable person on the show right now. She's nice to look at too, with one of the better Survivor women washing themselves scenes of recent memory. 3. Mike - Got two confessionals and the camera found him often, once again. He stayed out of the flap around the lost IC, and Krista had nothing to say about his comeback that she had no strategy because she formed no bonds. He wanted Stephanie gone though, so he is not making the voting decisions. I loved his comment about Stephanie and Krista literally and metaphorically making their bed with Russell. 4. Julie - Who led in confessionals? it might surprise some people, but it was Julie. She wanted Krista gone before Stephanie, which was the way it went, suggesting she might have a fair amount of say in the vote. Strangely, she voiced concerns over bad karma before the lost IC, but then astutely noted afterwards that the Zap6 had won by losing. With getting rid of a turncoat, I would say that is accurate. 5. Steve - He also got his share of screen time, making a comeback from last week, and was presented in a fairly positive light. He wisely suggested trying to bring Stephanie and Krista into the fold, but then he was never shown actually offering them anything. Ironically, the girls targeted him, which may actually just show how far out of the loop the girls were. Stephanie's comical comment about him not being a good athlete, when he is a former NFL player, may have just been there to slam that point home. 6. Phillip - Got a big time edit, once again, and delivered some decent confessionals. It is mostly his fault that the girls scurry from him, but he still was a near sympathetic character this week. He might be working himself into the perfect goat. 7. Ashley - Definitely was edited in a poor light this episode, but she still continues to blow Natalie and Andrea away in confessionals and face time. The confessional with her laying on her belly was the best shot of the show, but her reactions to Philip, even if understandable, were not so much. Being stuck up and lazy is not attractive. 8. David - He avoided the overconfidence that plagued the Zap6 this episode. He was depicted as being on the edges of the alliance, but that might be a good place to be. Not a clutch player? Hahaha! He is a defense attorney! His comments that he was better qualified for the puzzle were prophetic. On the other hand, why be forceful about it and put that pressure on yourself? 9. Sarita - Bad episode for her. She unwisely picked Stephanie to do the puzzle and then she made a bigger mistake by arguing about it. In confessional she made herself look even worse by suggesting she wanted David gone before the two girls who have already pre-flipped, just add merge. Poor awareness there. On the other hand, she continues to get her voice heard, on the tribe and on camera. 10. Ralph - Went so quiet he lost his nickname for now. No Russell to oppose, and now he's disappeared. 11. Natalie - No confessionals. No voice overs. Nothing. And cast in as bad a light as Ashley. 12. Grant - Only screen time was around the HII clue. Is the archetypical what Brian first coined- "the good soldier." 13. Stephanie - A good and bad episode for her. She got plenty of screen time, though most of it centered on the pointless and desperate RI gambit. She got beat on the puzzle when she had her chance to really shine. She appeared to make no attempt to crack the Zap6 when there were actual divisions to exploit. Her decision to target Steve made zero sense and showed her and Krista really had no clue about where the cracks might be. Being a free agent at the merge, IF she can make it, could get her far, but is she aware the Zap6 are likely jurors? You can't hate everyone and win this game, dumb-@ss. RI Matt - the Redeemer. Doesn't seem likely Krista would beat him, considering the light edit for her. On the other hand, why no scenes of him at RI? Not a good sign. Krista - TC played out like she and Stephanie clearly knew who was going home ahead of time, with Stephanie playing nice and Krista going off. A second viewing of the show more impressed me with the notion that much of the editing revolved around proving Krista wrong. She criticized the Zap6 for not playing the game, and yet she sat and did nothing while the editing revealed the opportunity for plays to be made. She also said the Zap6 would not make the end, and those kind of predictions have a habit of being foreshadowing the other way. While being very nice eye candy for the show, she somehow managed to make herself less likable than Stephanie. Props on that rare feat.
Burned
Francesa - aloha means goodbye
Russell - cry on your own time
Kristina - tried to be the Dragonslayer, got Robbed >
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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03-19-11, 07:29 PM (EST)
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3. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Iltarion, I enjoyed your list even if I see it the other way: Krista, in my opinion, was edited as a prophet.
Since you enjoy the editing of the show so much, maybe you could join us the the editing thread:http://community.realitytvworld.com/boards/DCForumID2/7592.shtml#48 I know, I know, it's in the spoiler thread but there are no spoilers this season, just speculations. As for how I saw the players: 1- Rob: No one hustles like the Robfadda so, if that's the way to make a dollar, Rob should get the prize. He continues to dominate the season and he's entertaining himself. That scene cracked me up. 2- Stephanie: This was her episode. How dumb to let the two girls go to RI without a chaperone. They made out like crazy and, since Stephanie was the one to tell us she didn't want to see her head rolling (the line of the evening) I expect she will find a way to make it work for her. She wanted to go to the end following Russell. How amazing would it be if she wound up using Rob? Also, you have to admire that she didn't shy away from the challenge. 3- Andrea: She is presented as a smart, cautious player. She separated herself from the vapid Omie girls but it has been dangerous to make deals with Phillip. 4- Phillip: The most amazing thing in the episode was that Phillip didn't screw up in the blindfold challenge. Comparing the girls to crabs that run away from him was also a great line. It shows once more that he has self-awareness even if he doesn't seem to be in touch with reality. 5- Ashley: Her world would be perfect if it wasn't for Phillip. 6- Matt: He continues to dominate the duels but he showed weakness when he asked why he had been voted out.
7- Natalie: She was only used as decoration but at least she didn't do anything stupid like those listed after her.
8- David: The only Zap6 that didn't show a total lack of understanding when it came to playing Survivor, he still did something awful: He was in complete agreement with choosing Stephanie (you saw him pointing at her when they were asking who should do the puzzle) and then he complained about the result. I don't like people that don't step up and then shoot down those that did. 9- Grant: For being so easily tricked, Rob's sidekick must have been kicking himself when he watched the episode. 10- Ralph: Your other left
11- Krista: I always enjoy seeing someone going out kicking so hearing her telling it like it is at TC was fun.
12- Mike: He was the one that let the girls have a chance to go to RI. He couldn't see that they could play a role down the line but players on the outskirts of a tribe are the most dangerous. 13- Steve: Who is he kidding? Zapatera isn't a family. Maybe there isn't a I in team but Survivor isn't a team sport. And why did the girls think he isn't a good athlete? Is he sick or is he lazy?
14- Sarita: So, Russell was right to name her as leader. That's a good place to be only if the tribe is united, not when it's divided in pairs. And why did she decide such a critical role on her own?
15- Julie: How dumb can one be? When she said: “Now that Russell is gone, Krista and Stephanie are not even a threat. They can go do whatever they want, they can talk about whatever they want, we really don’t care. There are just pawns in this big game. They can’t do any damage to us.” I thought: Have you even seen this show? I NEVER thought I'd hear something that stupid. That's exactly when players become threats. If she belives in Bad Karma, she should realize that a loss is a loss, not a win. More than momentum, victory unites a team and, right now, the Omies are much more united than the Zaps. 
Ils sont fous, ces Romains!
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-20-11, 11:27 PM (EST)
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4. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-20-11 AT 11:52 PM (EST)I can see someone reading the editing that way, michel. In fact, that was the way I read it the first time. I mean, how many more members of the Zap6 have to be dismissive of Stephanie and Krista in order for us to get the point? You could say that was sledgehammer foreshadowing there. OR, as I watched a second time, you could go the other way and say it was a clever way to build doubt of an otherwise obvious result. Without the benefit of spoilers, this is what happened. Stephanie blew it on the puzzle, and Krista got voted off. The Zap6 expressed, seemingly foolishly, that Stephanie and Krista had no power and were no threat. Well, Stephanie and Krista were so ineffectual that they just stood on the chopping block, not even trying to save themselves. I would say that exactly fulfilled their words. The editing showed a divisive argument among the Zap6 and another, unnecessary scene, where Sarita told Julie she would like to see David gone before the girls. Why show us this? Maybe to show us that there were moves to be made, despite what Stephanie told Krista. In fact, I definitely respect Stephanie more if she told Krista there were no moves to be made to make sure Krista got booted instead of her. But the climax of the show is Stephanie losing to Rob after she had a lead and then her main ally being voted off, and yet that was HER episode? That is a strange take indeed, unless you can see 4 or 5 episodes into the future, which I can not. Of course, it is a great coup for her and Rob if Krista can beat Matt, but I have hard time seeing that, especially considering the previews showing Matt in trouble. If Stephanie can join with Rob and make the end, then she would likely be looking at a jury with a majority of Zap6 members. I have a very hard time seeing her winning a vote. I am not going to say it would be impossible, but it sure doesn't seem likely. In that sense, Andrea is playing the far better game. If she can make the end, her own tribemates would actually vote for her. Plus, again, we have the vote for Steve. Does this not confirm the girls are completely out of the loop? Stephanie only gave challenge and utility around camp reasons for the vote, nothing showing any awareness of the social workings of the Zap6. Votes for Sarita or David would have shown that maybe Krista knew what she was talking about. If Steve is close with Mike and Julie, as Krista said, then why target him? Seemed like either desperation or cluelessness to me. Oh, I do agree that it was a Gufu for the Zap6 to allow the girls to go to RI together. On the other hand, though Mike certainly shares the blame, I don't see how it can be entirely or even mostly blamed on him. Actually, when I considered mentioning the error on my list, I was going to put it on Sarita since she was the chief de joure of the tribe. Regardless, the RI move, which you seem overly excited about, actually does NOTHING to help Stephanie. IF she were to make the merge, she can join Rob with open arms, regardless of whether he knew ahead of time or not. The person that move helps is Rob, as it informs him of the real numbers he is facing. It would only help Stephanie if Rob threw a challenge to save her, which seems incredibly unlikely considering this is Rob we are talking about. >
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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03-21-11, 07:33 AM (EST)
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5. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
It definitely was Stephanie's episode: She had the title quote: "We Hate Our Tribe". She had the most airtime, the camera following her throughout her trek to RI and she didn't shy from going toe to toe against the Puzzle Master. It showed that she didn't want her fate decided by someone else. She failed, yes, but, in turn it saved her.Don't forget that telling Rob sets the stage for the merge. It's always good to have a calling card, an introduction, a reference when applying for a new job and that's what Steph did: Apply to join Rob's team. I'm excited about 5that move because we spent a lot of time being told about it. The editors planted a sequoia in our brains. OK, it could amount to as much as the vaunted Tocantins cross-tribal alliance but I don't think so. If there was a move to be made, the ones wanting to make the move should have approached the girls, not the other way around. Scrambling only scares people away. And, yes, apparently the Zap6 told Steph she was safe.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-21-11, 04:26 PM (EST)
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6. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-21-11 AT 04:30 PM (EST)Scrambling only scares people away? I thought you notoriously criticized people who didn't scramble? In fact, actually, in the past you've equated it with giving up- Colby in H vs. V comes to mind. The girls were the ones in trouble. Therefore, it was incumbent upon them to approach the Zap6, not the other way around. Any of the Zap6 who approached the girls could potentially be committing suicide. For instance, if Sarita approaches the girls and floats the idea of voting for David, the girls can go to David and tell him Sarita is trying to get him out. The bottom line is trust. Would you rather work within the Zap6 to figure out an F3 after merge, or would you want to work with Stephanie and Krista, who have given you absolutely no reason to trust them? No brainer there, really. Mike said Krista had been abrasive from the start. That's craziness. Why would she be abrasive to Mike? Mega-stuck- up? Even that is hard to believe. Krista had no response for Mike's accusation. Krista as a prophet?? Hard to believe.
In a job interview, the recruiter has many options to choose from. In looking for a postmerge traitor, Rob will have one. No introduction necessary. Stephanie, Welcome Aboard!
>
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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03-21-11, 06:03 PM (EST)
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7. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Of course, last minute scrambling scares people away. You could get lucky but it's better if it looks like a well-thought out alternative instead of scrambling. Steph didn't need to scramble because she was told she wasn't going home. When you are alone and clearly the target then yes, you should try everything you can but this wasn't the case for Stephanie.
"Any of the Zap6 who approached the girls could potentially be committing suicide."
Then that means there were no moves to be made. Look at the four most famous desperate situations we've seen:
- Twila was the one that approached Chris who, in turn, approached Eliza. - Gary went crazy during his last days, scrambling 10 times more than what was shown. He was voted out even if Rafe and Stephenie knew him better than Danni. She kept her calm and, in time, Rafe came to her, saying that they would need to prove to Stephenie that Judd was a liar. - JT and Stephen didn't scramble; they let Coach come to them with his grand plan to eliminate the Dragon. - Natalie couldn't go to Laura before Erik told the Foa Foas that Monica was the target. This clearly proves that you need an opening and either go with it or reverse it. The Zap6 weren't playing the game so there wasn't that opening. Now, at 7 is a great time to find a little crack. I'd love to put a friendly wager on whether or not Krista's words will be prophetic! Mike never even talked to them so he was being full of hot air just like he was throughout the episode. There was no way to answer him because he had never listened before. Saying that you can't stay 6 strong to the end is basic Survivor. As for the job application metaphor did you notice that Rob was very cautious when he heard the proposal? He'd have been as cautious at the merge. Maybe the deal would have failed because he'd have seen it as last-minute scrambling. Now, with the first interview out of the way, Rob will be looking for more clues that he can trust her. There's a reason why "A foot in the door" became an expression.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-21-11, 11:55 PM (EST)
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8. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
"A foot in the door" is a sales technique that became a popular expression during the door-to-door sales era of the 40's and 50's. "Mike never even talked to them so he was being full of hot air just like he was throughout the episode." Not at all. Mike's opinion wasn't dependent on ever having spoken with Krista or Stephanie. It was simple logic. If "Mike never even talked to them" then they never talked with him, and if Krista never talked with Mike, then how would she know what plans Mike has made? She wouldn't. It doesn't take Sherlock Holmes to figure that out. So, how is that "hot air"? It is either in spoilers or your imagination because it isn't in the edit. What moves has Krista made that anyone should listen to her? Yeah, she played so well that she just got voted off. Great game. When is she writing the book- How to play Survivor before the Merge- ? It would be a big seller, I'm sure. >
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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03-22-11, 06:22 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-22-11 AT 06:26 PM (EST)>It is either
>in spoilers or your imagination
>because it isn't in the
>edit. It hurts that, after all this time, you'd think I'd resort to lying by passing spoilers as speculation. It is in the edit but you missed it: This is why I say Krista was being prophetic: Episode 4 started as usual: A visit to Redemption island where Matt greeted Russell but then, instead of going to the tribe returning from Council as had been the norm, we went to the Omies' camp. Episode #5 didn't even have a visit to Redemption Island at the start, we went straight to see the Omies. That tells me the important tribe, the one that will have the players at the end, is Ometepe, not Zapatera. In Zap's first segment of the latest episode, we have 3 consecutive scenes that show how naive the tribe really is:
- Steve saying we are family.
- Mike opening the door for the two girls to go to RI without a chaperone
-Julie saying the girls can't do any damage. Next we had Krista's own contibution where she said that the Zap6 weren't playing the game and what did we see on screen? 
That is the editor's way of telling us that Krista is right, they aren't playing. So when she makes her prophecy: "If I had to put money on it, I’d say that none of them are going to make it to the end." I see it as the culmination of all the preparation we've had concerning Zap's failure. BTW, I didn't say Mike was full of hot air because of his TC comments but rather these confessionals:
- “They were part of Russell’s alliance and they’ve remained very tight. There definitely are some risks but I don’t see it playing into the game too much at this point.” That over-confidence has killed many players in the past. -"With Stephanie’s floundering today at the puzzle, I might put her on the chopping block number one.” I didn't see him offering to do the job so he should shut up about floudering. As for Krista making connections, Mike was quick to say he was a military man, he became obviously tight with Steve and he's always praising Ralph so I don't think he'd ever have considered aligning with Krista.
>What moves has Krista made that
>anyone should listen to her?
>Yeah, she played so well
>that she just got voted
>off. Great game. When is
>she writing the book- How
>to play Survivor before the
>Merge- ? It would be
>a big seller, I'm sure.
I never said Krista was a good player. I said she was being prophetic and added that she was right in saying an alliance of 6 will have to turn on itself at one point. Simple logic.
Stephanie is probably the only real player on Zapatera and I believe that saying there were no moves to be made was her way to keep Krista in check, prevent her from scrambling. It worked.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-22-11, 09:51 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Oh, I see, it was the yawn! Mike, that lazy SOB!Yeah, a tribe of 6 does need to break up- at F6. Not premerge. Of course Imhotep is the important tribe. It has B-Rob on it! I agree. If Stephanie told Krista not to scramble because she knew the vote was Krista, then its the first good move she made. She better hope the "dumb @sses" pull it together fast. One more IC loss and she's going to RI next.
>
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-23-11, 05:52 PM (EST)
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16. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Sure, 3rd place pays more than 6th, right? Ian's play at F3 doesn't change the fact he made the right play at F6.Hearing peoples' stories around camp isn't the same as talking with them. What good are two votes if you can't trust them? >
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-23-11, 08:30 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
#2 is first loser? Haha... who are you? ESPN? I won't tolerate any losers on this message board... hahaha.... >
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dabo 25344 desperate attention whore postings
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03-22-11, 02:30 PM (EST)
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9. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Well, I missed last week and forgot where I had everyone. But..01. Andrea. Playing a decent social game while not making waves, keeping her ear to the ground, we should keep an eye on this one. 02. Steve. The only diplomat at Zap, needs to take charge and get his tribe under control. 03. Rob. Playing a good control game but if he hadn't wiped out the other real players he would be in serious trouble. But fun to watch and handling the HII with no emotional investment. 04. Julie. Who says trying to put a good face on a bad situation is dumb. Probst? Let's see him play the game. 05. Mike. Seems a pretty straightforward type. 06. Grant. Goober to Rob's Gomer, wingman is a good place to be right now. 07. Natalie. Who says coat-tailing isn't good game? 08. Phillip. At least he is aware his game is going south and the big lug is bringing in food so he may be entitled to an extra portion now and then. Can't fault him for trying to think of a way to improve his position but he's pretty much painted himself into a corner. 09. Stephanie. At least she is playing the game, too bad she can't do her own thinking. 10. Ashley. See Natalie. Needs to find something to talk about besides herself and Phillip's butt. 11-13. David, Sarita, Ralph. If they didn't conspire to throw Stephanie under the bus at the challenge, I don't know what they were about out there; and then getting into a finger-pointing match afterwards was pretty stupid. Ralph at least seems to have learned after the challenge when to keep his mouth shut. RI Matt. Golden child getting the best possible edit. Krista. Took the hit for Stephanie because she was even harder to put up with? Girl got no game. Good-bye Kristina. Shame. If Rob and Russ hadn't been tossed into the mix she might have had legs. Russell. Take that, troll. Crybaby. That's what bullies do when they get beat, whine and vacillate and vow revenge and be total sh*ts in every possible way. Francesca. Sassy!
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dabo 25344 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-23-11, 06:40 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
I was talking about what she said after the challenge loss, which Probst griped about in a tweet. No question that letting Stephanie and Krista go to the arena together was a gufu, the Zap6 had no representative and have no clue what was said there.
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
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03-23-11, 06:45 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Ha! I understand. Still, as I pointed out, it would have been better for Zap's unity to win that challenge. David and Sarita seem to hate each other. Steve must think that someone said something to the girls for them to vote against him. A loss always brings doubts to a team.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
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03-23-11, 08:36 PM (EST)
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23. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Actually, the Zap6 should lose the next IC and send Stephanie to RI. She is a turncoat anyway. Best case scenario: Matt beats both of them. Even if there is one more challenge before the merge, Matt would even the numbers if the Zap6 were to lose again. Andrea, of course, would give the Zap6 the outright numbers, though they don't know that. Worst case scenario: one of the girls beats Matt. Still, in this scenario, you've disposed of either Krista or Stephanie, giving B-Rob one less number after merge. >
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Toban 110 desperate attention whore postings
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03-24-11, 05:25 PM (EST)
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26. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
I kinda liked Stephanie's scrappiness and would have preferred that she stayed but I think the Zap6 (minus David) is better off with loyal Sarita than Stephanie who would turn at the drop of the hat.
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dabo 25344 desperate attention whore postings
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03-24-11, 05:45 PM (EST)
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27. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
Well, Sarita is better off.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
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03-24-11, 05:54 PM (EST)
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28. "RE: Survivor 22 Episode #5 Lvoe List" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-25-11 AT 02:32 AM (EST)Stephanie's ego has been her problem from the get go. If she would have condescended to "suck up to people" she "hates," before things became desperate, she probably would still be around. As Cerie said, don't come to me when you need me. Redemption Island could be exactly what she needs though. Matt is probably approaching burnt out status, and playing with an ego like B-Rob would work perfectly for her. Fortunately for her, merge is approaching. That was a no brainer vote. Stephanie has already pledged her allegiance to B-Rob. I had suggested losing on purpose just to get rid of her. >
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