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Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 04:17 PM (EST) "Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Say, let's play a quick card game for real money! I've got a deck right here. Just give a minute... *shuffles* *glances at top fourteen cards* *shuffles* *glances at top fourteen cards* *shuffles* *glances at top fourteen cards* *shuffles* *glances at top fourteen cards* ...hang on, it's taking a little longer to properly screw you out of any hope of winning than I thought...   Top

Subject     Author     Message Date     ID    RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Brownroach 03-19-14 1    RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Estee 03-19-14 5  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Estee 03-19-14 2  Drop your buffs! Brownroach 03-19-14 3  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... dabo 03-19-14 4  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Estee 03-19-14 6    RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Murphy3126 03-19-14 15  New tribes Brownroach 03-19-14 7  Stupid mat talk Estee 03-19-14 8  Doesn't seem fair Estee 03-19-14 9  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... dabo 03-19-14 10    RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Estee 03-19-14 12  RC Brownroach 03-19-14 11  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Estee 03-19-14 13  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Brownroach 03-19-14 14    RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... dabo 03-19-14 17        RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Brownroach 03-19-14 18            RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... dabo 03-19-14 20                RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Brownroach 03-19-14 39        RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Estee 03-19-14 19    RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... CTgirl 03-19-14 41  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Brownroach 03-19-14 16  China flashback. Estee 03-19-14 21    RE: China flashback. personofinterest 03-20-14 43        RE: China flashback. Estee 03-20-14 48            RE: China flashback. personofinterest 03-21-14 50                RE: China flashback. tribephyl 03-21-14 51  IC Brownroach 03-19-14 22  RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... Estee 03-19-14 23    RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing?... dabo 03-19-14 25  Post IC Brownroach 03-19-14 24    RE: Post IC Estee 03-19-14 26  Back at camp Brownroach 03-19-14 27    RE: Back at camp Estee 03-19-14 28  TC Brownroach 03-19-14 29    Congrats! dabo 03-19-14 30        RE: Congrats! Brownroach 03-19-14 35            RE: Congrats! dabo 03-19-14 38                RE: Congrats! Brownroach 03-19-14 40        RE: Congrats! personofinterest 03-20-14 44    RE: TC Estee 03-19-14 34        RE: TC MandC 03-20-14 42  Wrap-up Brownroach 03-19-14 31    RE: Wrap-up dabo 03-19-14 32  Quit Boat? Estee 03-19-14 33    RE: Quit Boat? Flowerpower1 03-19-14 36    RE: Quit Boat? Brownroach 03-19-14 37    RE: Quit Boat? personofinterest 03-20-14 45        RE: Quit Boat? Corvis7 03-20-14 46            RE: Quit Boat? CTgirl 03-20-14 47                RE: Quit Boat? Flowerpower1 03-20-14 49

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:04 PM (EST) 1. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Previously, Morgan lost her ally in Brice. Brawn keeps winning. Brains keep losing. Back at Brains camp: Hugs all around. Spencer is "rising back up" in his own words. Tasha and Kass kept Spencer because he kicks butt. Spencer says the only thing standing between them and F3 is two other tribes. The Brains want a comeback. Tasha says Spencer will be put to the test in RC.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:07 PM (EST) 5. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" So we have some degree of Morgan focus coming up. Let me know when the edit goes to Drake. She'll be looking for an ally in the new assembly. Pet nerd?   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:05 PM (EST) 2. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Yeah, leave an unattended fire going. Once again: Brains tribe! Interesting edit in the recap. Associating J'Tia with loyalty may be their way of implying Spencer isn't. And after this lack of cast credits, commence screwing.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:05 PM (EST) 3. "Drop your buffs!" Segues into... You guessed it! No opening credits! They really don't want us to know who these people are.   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:06 PM (EST) 4. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 09:45 PM (EST) Brains competing for Spirit Awards! And, yah ok, let's use this thread. ETA for the FLOWERPOWER condenced summary go to http://community.realitytvworld.com/boards/DCForumID2/8183.shtml   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:09 PM (EST) 6. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" See that Live Chat flash on the screen? Copycats! Jeff tells everyone to open their small package. Tony reaches for his pants.   Top

Murphy3126 223 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 03-19-14, 08:27 PM (EST) 15. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Funny!   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:09 PM (EST) 7. "New tribes" Everyone picks a covered buff. They open their packets. New Tribes are Solana and Aparri. But they are reversed from what we thought. The 5 Brawns are now on Solana. Jefra is excited to be with the former Brawns.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:11 PM (EST) 8. "Stupid mat talk" The Bury Yourself In The Sand challenge finds instant winners.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:14 PM (EST) 9. "Doesn't seem fair" Really, Jeff? Really?   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:16 PM (EST) 10. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Mount Cliff wins reward!   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:19 PM (EST) 12. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" So how many free throws were all those fouls worth? Highlight was Sarah kicking Tony. Sure, she might not have enjoyed it at the time, but looking back...   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:17 PM (EST) 11. "RC" First to 2 wins reward. Breakfast stuff is the prize. Lindsey and Tasha attached to poles. Morgen and Sarah attacking Lindsey. Tasha is beset by Trish and jefra, to no avail. Aparri scores a point. Jeremiah and Spencer go after Cliff. Alexis removed easily. We are tied. Spencer and Jeremiah go after Cliff again. Tony and Lindsey go after Sarah, and drag her across the finish line! Solana wins reward. Spencer says it's nice to upgrade from the moms to the girls but still everything seems to go wrong for the Brains. Commercial.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:26 PM (EST) 13. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Sarah complains about knowing who she can trust. Yeah, Sarah. We saw your choice of ally. And sure enough, Morgan gets outed. Gossip flies. Keys to the tribe are handed out. No secrets are kept. Impress the nerds! Recruit the jock! Who's gonna do my homework?   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:26 PM (EST) 14. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 11:16 PM (EST) LJ says winning the RC is bad news. He wants Brawn to absorb him as a teammate. Massachusetts connection between LJ and Trish, not lost on LJ. He will use it. Lindsey down on Trish. Cliff also watching the Trish/LJ developments. Maybe Trish will be in trouble... Morgan admits she went for the idol instead of the rice. A surprise to Alexis at least. So she will jump ship stat! She is talking to the Brains now. Spencer is very observant through all this. Alexis badmouthing both Jeremiah and Morgan. Morgan and Jeremiah do likewise. Brains are quite happy with these developments. Spencer notes how gossipy they are and quick to turn on each other. Tasha feels this is strengthening the Brains' status.   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:30 PM (EST) 17. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Brains are getting cocky.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:31 PM (EST) 18. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" I don't see it that way. Rather, the Beauties are being quite stupid.   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:34 PM (EST) 20. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" They need to get some wins. Having targets for TC is great, but they need a win now.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 09:46 PM (EST) 39. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" And so they got one. Spencer's earlier "Final 3" comment registered very positively, on the heels of his promise last week to be loyal to Tasha and Kass. I think those three are going very very far...   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:32 PM (EST) 19. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Those whom Jeff would destroy...?   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 11:10 PM (EST) 41. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" This was filmed last July I think - perfect timing for a "Boston Strong" alliance to have formed! Its so much fun watching these newbies play Survivor - so many rookie mistakes! Returning players really play a different game.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:29 PM (EST) 16. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 09:02 PM (EST) Now Trish seems to be trying to align with Jefra. Jefra wants to find a place for herself and LJ. Trish wants to get herself up from the bottom of the barrel. Trish is getting a major Boot Edit. We'll see what transpires... I am so FED UP with having to go back and correct Auto-correct.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:34 PM (EST) 21. "China flashback." It's the return of Jeff's Giant Log! (Not a good night for Tony.)   Top

personofinterest 292 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 03-20-14, 09:35 AM (EST) 43. "RE: China flashback." Seriously, was that the most phallic-centric challenge ever? Poor Tony indeed.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-20-14, 11:07 AM (EST) 48. "RE: China flashback." LAST EDITED ON 03-20-14 AT 11:11 AM (EST) You had to see the original edition. (Open warning: proceed at your own risk.) During the China season, we had Be The Survivor roleplaying threads. I had taken on Jeff's voice for the duration. As such, I started each episode thread and put up a mini-summary to kick things off, speaking as 'Jeff". The following comes from That Episode. "Here comes the Immunity challenge! Here's how it's going to work. Here is my giant log. Run your hands all over my giant log. Get a feel for it. Appreciate the fine lines and classic shape. Notice how many of you it takes to lift it. Yes, my giant log is a six-person operation, because one recipient just can't handle all that wood. You will use my giant log to batter down two walls, which is something I could do any time I wanted all by myself, but frankly, I just don't like to brag. After that, you will carefully caress and manipulate my giant log until you've worked it through to its greatest point of extension. At this point, it will hit a G-spot, and G stands for Gong, which rhymes with Hong, which gives us our theme back for this episode, but who cares? I want to see some giant log handling. And there they go! Notice how easily Dave tires! Dave just can't handle my giant log. I'm not sure Dave even knows how to handle a twig. James, on the other hand, can handle my giant log all day and night and still have strength to bury someone afterwards. Frosti has to switch Dave out to the rear position because Frosti's so much better with the rhythm at the head of my giant log, and don't think I won't remember that for later. But it's still my giant log versus the walls, and naturally, my giant log is winning. There, we're through! Now start manipulating -- carefully, carefully -- speed it up a little... the Tigers just can't get my giant log to extend, can they? The Dragons have my giant log proudly jutting straight out, but the Tigers have no idea what to do with my giant log and with every extra foot the Dragons go past them, the Tigers lessen their chances of ever getting their hands on it again. Let us watch my giant log extend. Ahhhh... majestic, isn't it? Phil thinks his golf equipment is so special, but I? Have a giant log. And the Dragons use my giant log to hit the G-spot! Dragons, you're safe again. Tigers, go talk about who's going out and I'll see you in a few hours. Maybe more than a few hours. Actually, I'll just call you when I'm ready." I'm still not sorry. And then this happened. It still shows up every once in a while. You can't keep a good log down. Incidentally, the following week's challenge involved flaming balls.   Top

personofinterest 292 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 03-21-14, 09:48 AM (EST) 50. "RE: China flashback." Ha! I wish I had been active on this board back in those days. I did not remember this challenge from China. I do remember Frosti. Maybe I will have to read the archives and remember how Frosti did with a flaming balls challenge!   Top

tribephyl 12393 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-21-14, 08:42 PM (EST) 51. "RE: China flashback." JP's Big Log, Frosti's Flaming Balls... and don't forget to read 'Courtney rides the dragon' as well. Yes, they are all code.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:37 PM (EST) 22. "IC" Gatecrashing, as tribe and Sheldor revealed. Trish and Morgan sit out. Solana through the first gate. Aparri now through. Neck and neck thru second gate. Both on the maze. Aparri wins immunity! (Happy dance!)   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:38 PM (EST) 23. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" Tony fails to understand how his group could have lost. Clearly he just didn't lie to them enough.   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:40 PM (EST) 25. "RE: Survivor #28 (Bothered Bribing? Bilked.) Episode #4 East Coast Spoiler Thread" LOL! I was afraid they might intentionally tank it to keep Sarah safe, but they are Brawn for a reason.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:39 PM (EST) 24. "Post IC" Tony wants to vote out LJ as a threat...we'll see...commercial.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:48 PM (EST) 26. "RE: Post IC" Poor Tony. Only able to destroy one dream at a time and unable to choose which.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:48 PM (EST) 27. "Back at camp" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 10:09 PM (EST) LJ says they should have won. Most likely he or Jefra is screwed. Cliff mentions Massachusetts bond between LJ and Trish. Woo wants to vote LJ. No one thinks about Hii. TRish tells LJ she is "in". She wants to get rid of Cliff. LJ is surprised. Looks like Trish is gonna bite it. Trisha talks to Tony, telling him she thinks Cliff should go. Tony still wants to get rid of LJ. Now Tony isn't sure Cliff shouldn't go. Cliff wants LJ to go. LJ is putting his trust in Trisha and Tony. He will play his HI if necessary.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:53 PM (EST) 28. "RE: Back at camp" Apparently Garrett set the trend this season: no one at this Council knows how to conceal their cards.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:54 PM (EST) 29. "TC" LJ felt uncomfortable in his new home. Now Cliff seems to be bad mouthing Trish. Trish opens mouth, puts foot in. Way in. Cliff says this is like an NBA game. Time to vote Woo votes LJ Jefra votes Cliff Tony says nothing personal, don't see who he voted for LJ does not play HI LJ Cliff LJ Cliff LJ Cliff Cliff! is out! Did not see that coming at all!   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:56 PM (EST) 30. "Congrats!" EPJP. Well, they got us this week, let's shake it off and get 'em next time.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 09:12 PM (EST) 35. "RE: Congrats!" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 11:26 PM (EST) I don't think there's any way we could have spoiled that boot. Possible rationale: Cliff was in danger last week when Sarah tried to throw the IC. But even then it was unclear if everyone necessary was on board, and in any case they muffed it. So -- were we to think that he would be the victim this week, even though Sarah, the person who had wanted him gone, was no longer on his tribe? Hard to make any of those connections.   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 09:43 PM (EST) 38. "RE: Congrats!" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 10:08 PM (EST) With Sarah split off from the alliance unprotected, and she being the connection in alliance to Woo, shoring up Brawn solidity should have been Tony's concern. He left Woo out in the cold. He conferred with Cliff but not with Lindsey, so now she might as well go rogue. And Jefra and L.J. can't consider themselves in except with Trish. Mind-boggling how much this doesn't make sense.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 10:22 PM (EST) 40. "RE: Congrats!" I'm guessing Tony thought of himself as in an alliance only with Sarah, and now that she's on the other tribe he's not counting on that alliance for the future. So he doesn't feel particularly committed to anyone else from Brawn, hence his disinterest in coordinating with Woo, and his being open to discarding Cliff. How throwing in with Trish, LJ and Jefra will help him, I can't immediately see.   Top

personofinterest 292 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 03-20-14, 09:41 AM (EST) 44. "RE: Congrats!" I didn't think there was any way that Cliff's tribe would lose. I like Cliff and am a little sad that they didn't show him more. His chuckle made him seem so affable. After the reward challenge, you could hear him chuckle as the three guys were still on the ground. However, when it looked like LJ was going to get votes, I found myself hoping that he would play that idol. Good on him for taking that chance. I am glad that he is still here.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 09:03 PM (EST) 34. "RE: TC" So the preview-hidden question: what happens when the flipper is backtracked? And raise your hand if you thought LJ was about to join the Out With An Idol In The Pocket Club.   Top

MandC 5 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson" 03-20-14, 01:14 AM (EST) 42. "RE: TC" Hand raised   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 08:58 PM (EST) 31. "Wrap-up" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 11:24 PM (EST) Next week: Trish and Lindsey feud.   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 09:00 PM (EST) 32. "RE: Wrap-up" Brawnwar! I love it when a tribe shatters apart.   Top

Estee 57126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 09:00 PM (EST) 33. "Quit Boat?" "I'm not in the majority any more. I'm the bullied instead of the bully. What's my best excuse to get out of here?"   Top

Flowerpower1 4361 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Jerry Springer Show Guest" 03-19-14, 09:25 PM (EST) 36. "RE: Quit Boat?" I agree, Estee....Quit boat is a comin'. She can't hack it anymore without her buddy, Cliff?   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-19-14, 09:26 PM (EST) 37. "RE: Quit Boat?" LAST EDITED ON 03-19-14 AT 10:10 PM (EST) Oh now you've made me all nostalgic. I loved the Quit Boat! Do you think it's always out there, circling, every season, just in case?   Top

personofinterest 292 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 03-20-14, 09:44 AM (EST) 45. "RE: Quit Boat?" On the EW website, Dalton Ross asks Jeff for a tease for next week and Jeff says that it is another survivor first. Maybe the quit is after Lindsey beats the snot out of Trish. Well, Jeff calls it a first. Who knows what that means. Loved this episode. I think more than half of the DAWs could have received votes!   Top

Corvis7 100 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 03-20-14, 10:27 AM (EST) 46. "RE: Quit Boat?" Hmmm... Well, if Lindsey does hit Trish, she'd be disqualified. And that would be a first.   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 03-20-14, 10:55 AM (EST) 47. "RE: Quit Boat?" That makes more sense to me than if she quit. She didn't strike me as a quitter last night especially in the reward challenge. She has been seen mocking Trish and laughing at Sarah. She's more of a bad a$$ than a quitter.   Top

Flowerpower1 4361 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Jerry Springer Show Guest" 03-20-14, 01:11 PM (EST) 49. "RE: Quit Boat?" Well, for me it is never a good sign when Jiffy is summoned at night time, no less... And, when he arrives the first thing he asks is "what's going on?" She's either hurt or she's throwing in the towel....imho...   Top

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