The Amazing Race   American Idol   The Apprentice   The Bachelor   The Bachelorette   Big Brother   The Biggest Loser
Dancing with the Stars   So You Think You Can Dance   Survivor   Top Model   The Voice   The X Factor       Reality TV World
   
Reality TV World Message Board Forums
PLEASE NOTE: The Reality TV World Message Boards are filled with desperate attention-seekers pretending to be one big happy PG/PG13-rated family. Don't be fooled. Trying to get everyone to agree with you is like herding cats, but intolerance for other viewpoints is NOT welcome and respect for other posters IS required at all times. Jump in and play, and you'll soon find out how easy it is to fit in, but save your drama for your mama. All members are encouraged to read the complete guidelines. As entertainment critic Roger Ebert once said, "If you disagree with something I write, tell me so, argue with me, correct me--but don't tell me to shut up. That's not the American way."
"The Players, The Game, The Editing ..."
Email this topic to a friend
Printer-friendly version of this topic
Bookmark this topic (Registered users only)
Previous Topic | Next Topic
Conferences Survivor Spoilers Forum (Protected)
Current Message

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"

12-10-11, 05:15 PM (EST)
Click to EMail michel Click to send private message to michel Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster
55. "Episode 12 - Editing Thoughts:"
Previously on Survivor…At the Upolu tribe, a random conversation (Coach said “There were 5 of us sitting by the canoe”) on the first night turned into a Final 5 pact.
<Albert was heard saying that he had the best vibe off the people sitting there)

Later, Coach added Edna to the group as a 6th
<Coach: “It is my job to protect her.”>

After the merge, when the alliance of 6 was in danger, Coach persuaded Cochran to flip and join his alliance as their 7th.
<Coach: “I’ve got Cochran on our side to play the rest of this game. I have convinced him that he will be valued and loved over here.”>

But, on the day when he was on the block, Cochran used all that he learned in Harvard Law to make a final summation.
<Sophie: “He said we feel indebted to him. I don’t feel indebted. Screw you.”>

At Tribal Council, once again Brandon put his foot in his mouth.
<Brandon: “Tonight, my vote is for Cochran and then, the next night, I am voting out Edna.”>
He infuriated his allies by publically revealing their plans.
Now Cochran heads to Redemption Island and Edna has to figure a way to stay in the game.

In a season with very little strategy, all the moves have been credited to Coach once more in this recap. If the game is still about Outwitting, then Coach should win, If the game is about not making moves, then these could all turn against him.

“The moves you make early will dictate your success”


RI – Night 30

When Cochran told him he had been fooled, Ozzy had a reply that made me laugh: “It happens to the best of us.”
(He should know!)

Cochran: “The move…may not have been the best move. I absolutely feel that Upolu used me. The fact that they didn’t show any gratitude except for lip service is insulting to me.”

Ozzy told Cochran he could get his revenge on Upolu by voting for him at the end.
He asked: “If you had a choice between me and Coach?”
Cochran didn’t answer. Instead he started looking around at the shelter’s roof.
Cochran told us that it was insulting that Ozzy already considered that he was going to win the duel.
The scene ended with Ozzy telling us that Cochran didn’t stand a chance.

Cochran’s jury question to Coach was all spelled out right here. It will come down to Coach needing to convince Cochran once more that he had been sincere at the merge but that his hands were tied. Sophie’s “Screw you” tells us he wouldn’t want to vote for her. Will Cochran be able to find the truth, the whole truth?
Ozzy’s final comment could simply be a joke for this episode or it could foreshadow that he becomes over-confident and loses to someone he should have beaten. Cochran came close.

Camp – Day 31

This time, we saw a rotting crab being eaten by bugs and then the bugs landed on Rick.

Brandon called out for Albert to join them in a morning prayer.
Edna walked away, saying she wasn’t really part of the tribe.
That upset Coach.

Edna: “Brandon…made it clear to me yesterday at Tribal that I’m not part of the tribe…I feel, like Cochran has, I feel duped. Coach…he is the one that is preaching it day in and day out that this is reality, this is real life for these people. To treat me like a second class citizen, is that real life?”

She then went to sit with Coach in the shelter.
He told her: “Everybody gets deceived.”
When she said she felt like a 2nd class citizen, he said that it wasn’t true.
Then tree mail arrived.
Before reading it, Edna told Coach she was angry that a 19 year old drop-out was going to decide her destiny.

Now we know what question Coach will have to answer when Edna steps up.

Coach: “Right in the middle of Edna’s meltdown, Brandon comes running into camp...so here’s this phone.”

I don’t think Coach can count on her vote if he dismisses her question at FTC the way he did here!

As we saw the family videos, we only heard Edna and Brandon’s comments.
This could have been a moment to humanize Sophie a bit but, instead, all we heard was her father saying she had made it this far like she had said she would.
Even the father only talks about the situation in the game!

The Duel

If the kooky music that we heard as Cochran missed his early throws had been present when he delivered his pre-merge confessionals, we would have seen his end coming back then!
We heard Albert coaching Cochran and we heard Upolu cheering him on.
Jeff had a fun comment when he saw Cochran just shooting his ball through the maze: “Coachran has a lot of success. It’s a crazy strategy, but it’s working.”

The duel was very close, Cochran’s ball lipping out just before Ozzy finished his maze.

Jeff said: “Because you risked, because you weren’t the most likely guy to be on this show and you found your way out here and you were ridiculed and people picked on you, you didn’t back down but in fact you made one of the biggest moves still in this game, you better be a new guy because I think a part of you died out here and a new part was reborn.”

With his words, Jeff brought Cochran’s journey to destination. This neatly manucured edit was simply a Journeyman’s edit that didn’t even make the final episode. Journey’s are usually successful but this one needed Jeff’s positive remarks to reach its goal.

As for the remaining players, we can say that with Upolu’s cheers during the duel, we have the sense that they worry about Ozzy returning to the game but, from what we are shown, it isn’t mentioned out loud in camp which is something that makes me think Ozzy won’t return, that he won’t be a factor down the stretch.

Proceeding to the twist, Ozzy gave family visits to Albert, Coach and Brandon. He then brought all 6 to his residence.

A really dumb twist if you ask me. Ozzy already has a chance to bond with the jury has they each come to RI so why give him another opportunity? These decisions should be left to the players, to give them the chance to make enemies, to make something happen out there. And, by the way, who thinks Ozzy was told to choose Hantz? If production didn’t twist his hand then I believe Jeff would have asked him to pick one more until the two Hantz were reunited. It simply HAD to be!

Story-wise, Ozzy didn’t consider Sophie for the reward. It must mean that he doesn’t see her as someone significant.
Interesting that Jeff used the visit from Coach’s brother to tell us that Coach is real.

RI

Coach: “It’s a one in 10 million opportunity to get to the loved one’s visit…It’s an incredible pick-me-up at this time of the game. I think Ozzy picked me in the hopes that I would be in his corner but I have one better for you Ozzy: I am in your house, I want to talk to you.”

He then offered him, as a Christian man, a Final 3 deal.

Coach: “That is an irrevocable promise. I want to take Ozzy to the end: Two noble warriors fighting it out to see who the Sole Survivor is.”

Is Coach making too many promises? Now we know what Ozzy will ask him at the end if he is on the jury and not the Final 3. But will he be on the jury? This really opens the door to see Ozzy make it to the end. Unfortunately, Ozzy didn’t comment on it. So, we have to think that this scene was really part of Coach’s story only, not Ozzy’s.

Brandon told his father that he was ready to spit on the million dollars.
Russell’s brother had other ideas: “You are here to do a job.”
Sean then went to talk to Coach, to make sure Coach will take Brandon to the F3.

Coach: “They are all cut out of the same cloth. Brandon’s dad comes out here and basically tries to bully me into making sure his son goes all the way to the end and wins a million dollars. It’s all about manipulation and control, and the Hantz family are the kingpins. I’m not going to have anybody browbeat me and handcuff me into a final 3 alliance with Brandon. The kid’s a loose canon and, tic-tic-tic-tic: Brandon is a ticking time bomb but, guess what? That tick-tock isn’t your timer, that is your clock and your time is about to be expired on this island.”

Now we know how Brandon is going to question Coach. I flashed back to the scene where Coach worried about being duped again by a Hantz and wondered if we had pictured the wrong Hantz being Coach’s biggest problem!

As the scene ended, a question came up: Has anyone ever been ignored during a family visit as much as Albert was? Also, I wanted to hear Coach’s brother to see if he would call him Ben or Coach but, unfortunately that didn’t happen either. This was the worse family visit edit in the series history. I blame this other Hatnz! It’s always the Hantzes.

The Challenge

Jeff asked Coach if this challenge was a metaphor for the game: “The moves you make early will dictate your success later?”

Coach liked that metaphor and so he should because it has been his moves earlier in the game that have been stressed in every recap. He also won this challenge so if it is a metaphor for the whole game then we have been told who wins.

After noting that Edna was being squeezed out, which she wasn’t yet, Jeff noted that Coach was making a “dragon slayer” type of gesture.
Albert was eliminated first followed by Brandon who just had to talk about his strategy: Make sure someone in particular didn’t win.
Edna knew he was talking about her and she said that it was simply because she wasn’t on the beach on day 1.
Coach won the challenge.

Brandon: “Brandon opens his mouth and sticks his foot into it. I have no problem with that. If she wants me to be the bad guy today, I’ll be the bad guy.”

Camp – Day 32

Sophie: “Every day, people in this tribe surprise me with the things that they do. Every day, I am re-calculating who I think the jury is going to hate and who the jury is going to love. Brandon opened his mouth and he was really rude to Edna. There’s no reason to tell her that we are trying to get you out. That’s just a bullying thing to do.”

Rick: “Why did you have to do that, Brandon? I like Edna so it didn’t need to happen. She was clearly not going to win the game so why kick her in the guts? Like calling over a little dog and then kicking it. That’s not right.”

Brandon apologized but Edna told him that it didn’t change what happened.

Edna: “Brandon did verbalize an apology but it’s insincere.”

Sophie: “Brandon thinks that an apology absolves all sins and maybe that works in church but, on Survivor, people are not as forgiving as Jesus-Christ is and Edna isn’t as forgiving and the rest of the tribe, it didn’t go unnoticed with us.”

Sophie once more just narrated events around her. Notice that her first confessional started off well, preparing us to hear her thoughts on the end game but she then went off track. Brandon is obviously someone that the jury would hate but what is she planning to do about it? Is she planning a move to take him with her? It seems implied but it wasn’t verbalized. At this stage, winners always verbalize their strategy. And notice that Rick upstaged her with a confessional of his own on top of hers and one that was much more colorful.

Edna approached Coach, Sophie and Albert, trying to rally the vote against Brandon. While she made a vibrant plea in favor of honor and integrity, Sophie looked less than concerned, playing with her toes instead of paying attention.



Coach: “Edna, provocatively, put something on the table: “Put out Brandon tonight, keep me and then the four of us will take ownership of this game.” Systematically, she laid it all out for us. If there’s any argument for us sending somebody else home tonight, she served Brandon, she served him up slow-pitch softball style. A big, fat, weak pitch that we could knock out of the park. On a day where we thought Edna was definitely going to go home, that’s not the case anymore.”

Edna then talked to Coach alone, asking that he gave it to her straight.
Coach told her: “You take an independent jury and you put Edna on the stand and you put Brandon on the stand; who will be convicted guilty? Brandon. Who is more deserving of staying? Edna. Absolutely. But, they don’t want to send Brandon to redemption and have him win and come back.”

She asked him for his idol and, when he refused, she asked what he was planning to do with it.
Coach answered: “I don’t think I’ll use it. If I use the idol right now, everybody else in the game doesn’t trust me. If I play the idol I am for sure the next person to go. If I give you the idol, they will vote my ass off…You should tell Albert and Sophie: I talked to Coach and everything is cool. See at tribal, see how they vote.”

This scene squarely puts the blame on Sophie and Albert for eliminating Edna, the nice one. She becomes their victim because Coach just offered his vote to Edna if she can get theirs.

Edna then went to Albert and Sophie. Once more, Sophie showed no interest in Edna’s ideas.


Albert, at least, told her he was thinking about it.
Albert: “Edna can feel the heat bearing down on her but Edna made some very good points. She said straight up: “I am not a threat to win the game, I am not going to be very competitive in challenges. Just save my neck now and I can guarantee you a place in the Final 4. On day 32 on Survivor, anytime you can have a guaranteed place that deep in the game, that is something pretty appealing. There’s a chance that Brandon will have a big surprise tonight.”

This scene now puts the blame mostly on Sophie since Albert considered the plan. If it was rejected, the viewer is to assume that it was because Sophie didn’t budge. Just like those images showed.

Tribal Council

Edna told Jeff that she tried to target Brandon because he didn’t follow their mantra.
When she asked Coach to spell out that mantra, Jim reacted less than positively. Cochran looked disappointed while Keith was dismayed.
Edna brought back Brandon’s lie int eh first TC.
Brandon didn’t want to say anything negative about Edna except that she had been inaccurate about a lot of things.
Jeff interrupted, saying he remembered that first TC and his lie.
Once more Brandon apologized, adding though that he doesn’t like that Edna was taking shots at his character.
Brandon said he would be hurt if he was voted out.

Asked about the difficulties of this stage of the game, Sophie said: “As everybody said, we are a family, we have all this unity, we have all this loyalty, but as Savaii is reminding us, it’s going to end soon and I think today is the day that it’s ending.”
As she said this, Edna turned to the jury and mouthed “Blah, Blah, Blah” then smiled.
The jury (in their best Sophie imitation!) didn’t react to Sophie’s words.
Albert said: “A lot of people contributed to us getting here <Cochran raised his eyebrows at that> but, when you look at that core, it always gets thinner and thinner as you get deep in this game. We are making a decision on how the game has played out and the promises that were made early on.”

They then went to vote with Coach, much like Rob last year, was shown voting last.

As she got up to get her torch, Edna gave Coach a hug that seemed to puzzle Dawn.

Jeff, finally in touch with the viewers concluded: “From the beginning, you said it would be the five of you. Now what?”
Sophie and Coach were shown smiling while Brandon looked worried.

Edna’s final words were directed at Coach, saying she was disappointed that he wrote her name down.

The Story

Will Coach get the jury votes? That is the only story since Keith’s elimination. This episode focused on the specific questions that most of the jurors will ask at FTC:

- Cochran will aks Coach if he was only giving lip service.
- Edna will ask him about being treated like a 2nd class citizen and why he voted against her.
- Ozzy will ask about that F3 deal made on RI.
- Brandon will ask about the meaning of a Christian man’s word.
- Jim will aks about honor, loyalty and integrity.

The Characters

Ozzy: The image of the rotting crab, like the dead fish seen on Upolu’s beach pre-merge, has been an editing tool used in previous season to tell us that a tribe was doomed. It was used as misdirection this time even if it is too subtle for the average viewers. Misdirectio that is, unless Ozzy wins. Even if his “He doesn’t stand a chance” could be seen as arrogance, his portrayal since his turnaround, outside of the recap, has been solid. I don’t think that he makes it to the end though because they showed us Coach’s F3 offer. Ozzy would certainly get the Savaii except Coachran’s and that would be enough so there is little doubt in the viewers’ mind. Why remove doubts that he would be in danger when he returns? I see Ozzy’s edit more as a way to keep viewers interested in the season than anything else.
Albert: Last week, we saw Prince Albert, this week we saw a character that was completely ignored during his family visit so Albert cannot be our winner.
Neither can Edna, Brandon and Rick.

Sophie: She is the only one that could receive the votes from a disgruntled jury. Her presence has been a constant in every episode and that seems enough for her supporters but, with all of it being narration, it leaves us with a hollow story.
Why would the jury vote for her? We do not know because she hasn’t been shown interacting with them. That means they would be voting against Coach.

That is certainly possible but I will hang on to the following observation. When she talked about her jury assesment, she forgot one thing: The jury does consider who they like, who they hate but they also need to see someone playing the game. Consider Stephen’s fate in Tocantins where everyone liked him well enough but never realized he was even playing the game, thinking it was all JT’s strategy. There is a possibility that Sophie is hiding herself too much.

It could very well be grasping at straws but consider that Ozzy asked Cochran who he would vote for between himself and Coach. It was as if, in his mind, no one else mattered. And before anyone objects that is only Ozzy’s vote, consider that he has already talked to everyone on the jury.

Coach: For all his troublesome scenes (the one where he forced his tribe to their knees after a challenge win isn’t even the worst in my eyes. The one where he says “everyone calls me Coach” was.) Coach is the only player with a positive story left. He has the jury connections. They will make him suffer, no doubt, but we have seen Coach able to field the tough questions this season. His “everyone gets deceived” comment to Edna is an example. Will it be enough? Coach has been the only one making the moves this season so it would be the only ending that wouldn’t lead to the conclusion that Survivor, as a game, is dead.


  Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Table of Contents
  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
 The Players, The Game, The Editing ...   VerucaSalt     11-25-11       
   RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit...   television     11-25-11     1  
   Recap New Scenes:   michel     11-25-11     2  
     RE: Recap New Scenes:   dabo     11-25-11     3  
         RE: Recap New Scenes:   Belle Book     11-26-11     6  
     RE: Recap New Scenes:   Belle Book     11-26-11     5  
   Thoughts on the Recap Episode   dabo     11-26-11     4  
     RE: Thoughts on the Recap Episode   Belle Book     11-26-11     7  
     RE: Thoughts on the Recap Episode   Toban     11-26-11     8  
         RE: Thoughts on the Recap Episode   dabo     11-26-11     11  
             RE: Thoughts on the Recap Episode   Outfrontgirl     11-26-11     12  
     The Individual Games   dabo     11-26-11     14  
         RE: The Individual Games   michel     11-27-11     16  
   Post Merge recap   michel     11-26-11     9  
     RE: Post Merge recap   Belle Book     11-26-11     10  
     RE: Post Merge recap   Slider     11-26-11     13  
         RE: Post Merge recap   michel     11-27-11     15  
             RE: Post Merge recap   Belle Book     11-27-11     17  
                 RE: Post Merge recap   glennyfromtheblock     11-29-11     18  
             RE: Post Merge recap   SurvivorFan101     11-29-11     19  
                 RE: Post Merge recap   dabo     11-29-11     20  
                 RE: Post Merge recap   michel     11-29-11     21  
   Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-03-11     22  
     RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   dabo     12-03-11     23  
         RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-03-11     24  
             RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   dabo     12-03-11     25  
                 RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-03-11     29  
             RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Outfrontgirl     12-03-11     26  
                 RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-03-11     28  
     RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Flowerpower     12-03-11     27  
         RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-03-11     30  
             RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Flowerpower     12-03-11     31  
             RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Belle Book     12-03-11     32  
                 Answer to editing question   OllieKat     12-04-11     33  
     RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   parathor     12-05-11     34  
         RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Belle Book     12-05-11     35  
             RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   glennyfromtheblock     12-06-11     36  
                 RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   parathor     12-06-11     37  
                     RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Belle Book     12-06-11     38  
                 RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-06-11     39  
                     RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Outfrontgirl     12-06-11     40  
                         RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-06-11     41  
                             RE: Episode 11 - Editing Thoughts:   Outfrontgirl     12-07-11     42  
   Episode 12 family visit thoughts   Outfrontgirl     12-09-11     43  
     RE: Episode 12 family visit thought...   glennyfromtheblock     12-09-11     44  
         RE: Episode 12 family visit thought...   michel     12-09-11     45  
             RE: Episode 12 family visit thought...   glennyfromtheblock     12-09-11     46  
             RE: Episode 12 family visit thought...   Toban     12-09-11     47  
             RE: Episode 12 family visit thought...   CTgirl     12-09-11     48  
                 RE: Episode 12 family visit thought...   dabo     12-10-11     49  
                     RE: Episode 12 family visit thought...   Flowerpower     12-10-11     52  
   RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit...   matt     12-10-11     50  
     RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit...   dabo     12-10-11     51  
         RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit...   Flowerpower     12-10-11     53  
             RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit...   Belle Book     12-10-11     54  
   Episode 12 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-10-11     55  
     RE: Episode 12 - Editing Thoughts:   rose1974     12-11-11     56  
         RE: Episode 12 - Editing Thoughts:   michel     12-11-11     57  
             RE: Episode 12 - Editing Thoughts:   suzzee     12-12-11     58  
                 RE: Episode 12 - Editing Thoughts:   parathor     12-13-11     59  
                     RE: Episode 12 - Editing Thoughts:   Booted     12-15-11     60  
   Penultimate Episode - Editing Thoug...   michel     12-17-11     61  
     RE: Penultimate Episode - Editing T...   glennyfromtheblock     12-17-11     63  
     RE: Penultimate Episode - Editing T...   Belle Book     12-17-11     64  
         RE: Penultimate Episode - Editing T...   Outfrontgirl     12-17-11     65  
             RE: Penultimate Episode - Editing T...   dabo     12-18-11     66  
                 RE: Penultimate Episode - Editing T...   Outfrontgirl     12-18-11     67  
                 RE: Penultimate Episode - Editing T...   michel     12-18-11     69  
                     RE: Penultimate Episode - Editing T...   dabo     12-18-11     73  
   Thoughts on likability of likely fi...   Outfrontgirl     12-17-11     62  
   Final Thoughts...   Flowerpower     12-18-11     68  
     RE: Final Thoughts...   michel     12-18-11     70  
     RE: Season Finale   VerucaSalt     12-18-11     71  
         RE: Season Finale   michel     12-18-11     72  
             RE: Season Finale   VerucaSalt     12-20-11     83  
         RE: Season Finale   Outfrontgirl     12-18-11     74  
             RE: Season Finale   michel     12-20-11     84  
     RE: Final Thoughts...   Outfrontgirl     12-18-11     75  
   A season in a nutshell   michel     12-19-11     76  
     RE: A season in a nutshell   Belle Book     12-19-11     77  
     RE: A season in a nutshell   PepeLePew13     12-19-11     78  
         RE: A season in a nutshell   michel     12-19-11     79  
             RE: A season in a nutshell   Outfrontgirl     12-19-11     80  
                 RE: A season in a nutshell   michel     12-19-11     81  
                     RE: A season in a nutshell   suzzee     12-21-11     90  
                         RE: A season in a nutshell   michel     12-21-11     92  
                 RE: A season in a nutshell   Corvis     12-20-11     82  
                     RE: A season in a nutshell   michel     12-20-11     85  
                         RE: A season in a nutshell   PepeLePew13     12-20-11     86  
                         RE: A season in a nutshell   Outfrontgirl     12-20-11     88  
                             RE: A season in a nutshell   michel     12-21-11     89  
                                 RE: A season in a nutshell   Belle Book     12-21-11     91  
                                     RE: A season in a nutshell   Outfrontgirl     12-21-11     93  
                                         RE: A season in a nutshell   Belle Book     12-22-11     94  
                                         RE: A season in a nutshell   michel     12-22-11     95  
             RE: A season in a nutshell   PepeLePew13     12-20-11     87  

Lobby | Topics | Previous Topic | Next Topic

p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e - p l a c e h o l d e r t e x t g o e s h e r e -
about this site   •   advertise on this site  •   contact us  •   privacy policy   •