"The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Redemption" - Reality TV World Message Board Forums - "The Players, The Game, The Editing

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"The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Redemption"

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"	02-15-11, 07:41 PM (EST)
"The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Redemption"
Better late than never I say Returning players always adds a dynamic to Survivor with a double edged sword. Is the player valuable because a jury would not give them a million dollars when they have played that many times before (in this instance) or do players want to get rid of them immediately so they don't even get close to the end for fear that they COULD actually win by a jury who may be impressed they got that far? Rob and Russell are very interesting characters to have as Rob truly evolved into a very heroic individual and his personality has become increasingly popular. Many love Rob now and may, in fact, be a bit star struck by him. Russell, on the other hand, has certainly built his own reputation and it stands to reason that most of the contestants may want to just get rid of him even if he is someone who could end up being very beneficial in sitting with at end game. With Redemption Island, the twist of being able to return to the game will also throw the show into a tailspin and editing will play a crucial role in those that can re-enter the game as short term players normally do not receive loving hands in the shape of their edit. It is my understanding that the player voted off gets to compete against the next voted off and the victor then has the opportunity to return to the game. Below are the "characters" and I would love input from those who are still interested in what this thread is about - dissecting the editing of the characters to determine their longevity and how they fit into the overall story the show wishes to convey. Rob Mariano- A character who has raised his own bar. Extremely popular and I would hazard a guess that his fellow tribemates (while worried about his advancement) can't help but follow his lead. Rob has shown himself to get along with both males and females but he trends towards women so it would not be surprising should he former partnerships with the female variety. Some of the men may demonstrate the usual ego fare and want him gone. Andrea 21, student: "I've been raised on a farm my whole life," she says, "and I've been hunting since I was 12 and fishing and camping, so I'm not too worried about the elements." Grant 29, yoga instructor: "I played professional football for the San Diego Chargers, the Denver Broncos and the Tennessee Titans." Francesca 36, attorney: "There's a mean girl inside of me," she says. "I terrorized some girls in elementary school." Ashley, 25, nurse: "I really think pageants get a bad rap sometimes," she says, "but in all honesty, it really takes a lot of mental toughness." Kristina 46, law student: "I'm a complete package," she says. Natalie 19, professional dancer: "Of course I'm going to use my girly instincts," she says. "I can be flirtatious and I hopefully will know when to stop." Matt 22, pre-med student:"Out here when people feel alone and isolated," he says, "I have a warmth towards people that I think they'll respond to and want to keep me around and probably trust me." Phillip, 52, technology executive: "I have a terrific smile and when I really let it pop, you look at that smile and it disarms you," he says. Logically, we must always place the oldest in harm's way by virtue of age; this also goes for anyone who is too bossy or sick or lacking physicality to help their tribe. Phillip is the oldest which could be problematic by virtue of his age and Francesca and Kristina are the oldest women. Logically, these three need to be watched for possible short term player status although we cannot discount many elders who were long term players if they hitch themselves to the right wagon. Francesca's own words sound possibly like an issue waiting to happen and she may ruffle some feathers Russell - I probably don't even need to say much about Russell and more than likely, the only reason he may stand the test of some time is from intimidation and perception that he may be attractive to sit next to at the end of the game. That being said, this is not a full cast of returning players who all had targets on their back for various reasons and I would hazard a guess that Russell is not going to do as well as he thinks he will. Julie 50, firefighter: "I'm newly divorced. I have 100 percent custody for two children and I'm paying alimony, I'm paying child support and my house is in foreclosure," she says. Krista 25, pharmaceutical: "I competed for three years in the Miss Alabama pageant and then two years in the Miss Alabama USA pageant," she says. Mike 31 – former marine "The great thing about Survivor, though, is nobody's shooting at you," says the Iraqi vet. "I'll take that over going on deployment to Iraq any day." David 31, defense attorney: "I think I'm going to have to start the game taking myself down a notch," he says. "It sounds awful to say it but I'm going to have but I'm going to have to bring myself down to their level." Sarita36, visual effects producer: "It's a good group," she says of her costars, "so that of course makes me excited but also like, what's the catch?" Stephanie25, waitress: "I'm always right even when I'm wrong," she says. "I always get my way just because I know how." Ralph 44, farmer: "I'll make you laugh your ##### off," he says, "because I say things not proper." Steve 51, former NFL player: "I played for the Cowboys, the Baltimore Colts, the Indianapolis Colts, the Los Angeles Raiders," he says. It will be interesting to see how Russell showcases himself with these contestants as this group certainly seems a bit more diverse and perhaps combative. Russell has always utilized women in his quest for the end so I doubt that would change in any way. These women know Russell very well though so I don't think he will be able to lead them around on a leash. Julie is the eldest female so she may have issues in staying power and depending on how Steve and Ralph fit with the rest of the tribe, they need to be careful as the older males and despite Ralph indicating that he is a hoot and a holler, perception is everything and his sense of humor may be more annoying than humorous especially since he embodies a caricature we have seen before which has not always been successful. David emotes arrogance so it will be interesting to see how he and Russell get along and if there is a battle of the egos between the two
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Table of Contents

  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID

RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... Scarlett O Hara 02-15-11 1

RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... michel 02-15-11 2

RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... dabo 02-16-11 3

RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... Outfrontgirl 02-16-11 4

the duel twist Outfrontgirl 02-16-11 5

Episode #1: Editing Thoughts michel 02-19-11 6

   RE: Episode #1: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 02-22-11 8

       RE: Episode #1: Editing Thoughts michel 02-22-11 9

episode 1 Outfrontgirl 02-20-11 7

Episode #2: Editing Thoughts michel 02-26-11 10

   RE: Episode #2: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-01-11 11

       RE: Episode #2: Editing Thoughts dabo 03-01-11 12

       RE: Episode #2: Editing Thoughts michel 03-01-11 13

Episode #3: Editing Thoughts michel 03-05-11 14

   RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-05-11 15

       RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts michel 03-05-11 17

   RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts Belle Book 03-05-11 16

   RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-06-11 18

       RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts michel 03-06-11 19

           RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-06-11 20

               RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts Corvis 03-06-11 21

Um, michel? kiki_k 03-11-11 22

   RE: Um, michel? dabo 03-11-11 23

       RE: Um, michel? kiki_k 03-11-11 24

           RE: Um, michel? dabo 03-11-11 25

               Next time on...The editing thread: michel 03-11-11 26

                   RE: Next time on...The editing thre... kiki_k 03-11-11 27

                       RE: Next time on...The editing thre... Travel_Queen 03-11-11 30

                   RE: Next time on...The editing thre... Flowerpower 03-11-11 28

                   RE: Next time on...The editing thre... Brownroach 03-11-11 29

Episode #4: Editing Thoughts michel 03-11-11 31

   RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts tmontgomery71 03-12-11 32

   RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-12-11 33

       RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts michel 03-12-11 34

   RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts Belle Book 03-12-11 35

       RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts michel 03-12-11 36

   RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-12-11 37

       RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts michel 03-13-11 38

           RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-13-11 39

               RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts michel 03-13-11 40

                   RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 03-14-11 41

           note Outfrontgirl 03-17-11 46

   Sweet! suzzee 03-15-11 42

   RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts Outfrontgirl 03-17-11 47

Episode 5 Thoughts... PepeLePew13 03-17-11 43

   RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... dabo 03-17-11 44

   RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... Outfrontgirl 03-17-11 45

   RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... michel 03-18-11 48

       RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... kiki_k 03-19-11 49

       RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... Belle Book 03-19-11 51

       RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... Flowerpower 03-20-11 56

           RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... michel 03-20-11 57

               RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... Flowerpower 03-20-11 58

   RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... Philip Outfrontgirl 03-22-11 59

Rob vs. Rooster PepeLePew13 03-19-11 50

   RE: Rob vs. Rooster michel 03-19-11 52

       RE: Rob vs. Rooster PepeLePew13 03-19-11 53

           RE: Rob vs. Rooster dabo 03-19-11 54

               RE: Rob vs. Rooster PepeLePew13 03-19-11 55

A Look Back michel 03-22-11 60

   RE: A Look Back HitmanPayne 03-22-11 61

       RE: A Look Back Travel_Queen 03-22-11 62

           RE: A Look Back HitmanPayne 03-22-11 63

   Eagerly awaiting your insights Chillicrab 03-25-11 64

       RE: Eagerly awaiting your insights michel 03-26-11 68

Post episode 6... Flowerpower 03-25-11 65

   RE: Post episode 6... dabo 03-25-11 66

   RE: Post episode 6... michel 03-26-11 67

       RE: Post episode 6... Flowerpower 03-26-11 69

       RE: Post episode 6... parathor 03-27-11 74

           RE: Post episode 6... HitmanPayne 03-27-11 75

               RE: Post episode 6... michel 03-28-11 77

                   RE: Post episode 6... suzzee 03-30-11 80

       RE: Post episode 6... suzzee 03-30-11 79

   RE: Post episode 6... suzzee 03-30-11 78

Nash Theory as applied to Redemptio... KObrien_fan 03-27-11 70

   RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redem... michel 03-27-11 71

       RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redem... KObrien_fan 03-27-11 72

           RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redem... michel 03-27-11 73

   RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redem... Flowerpower 03-27-11 76

   RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redem... CTgirl 04-04-11 106

Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-02-11 81

   RE: Episode #7: Thoughts parathor 04-02-11 82

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-02-11 84

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Flowerpower 04-02-11 86

   RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Flowerpower 04-02-11 83

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-02-11 85

           RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Flowerpower 04-03-11 92

               RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Outfrontgirl 04-04-11 95

   RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Georjanna 04-02-11 87

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Outfrontgirl 04-03-11 89

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-03-11 90

   RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Chillicrab 04-02-11 88

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-03-11 91

           RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Outfrontgirl 04-04-11 93

               RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-04-11 97

                   RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Corvis 04-04-11 98

                       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-04-11 103

                           RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Corvis 04-06-11 107

                               RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-06-11 108

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Outfrontgirl 04-04-11 94

           RE: Episode #7: Thoughts dabo 04-04-11 100

           RE: Episode #7: Thoughts suzzee 04-04-11 101

               RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-04-11 104

       RE: Episode #7: Thoughts Chillicrab 04-04-11 96

           RE: Episode #7: Thoughts dabo 04-04-11 99

               RE: Episode #7: Thoughts michel 04-04-11 102

                   RE: Episode #7: Thoughts dabo 04-04-11 105

The Merge: Thoughts on the Story: michel 04-09-11 109

   RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Stor... Outfrontgirl 04-10-11 110

       RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Stor... michel 04-10-11 112

           RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Stor... Outfrontgirl 04-10-11 116

       RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Stor... Flowerpower 04-10-11 114

           RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Stor... michel 04-10-11 115

   RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Stor... Scarlett O Hara 04-10-11 111

       RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Stor... michel 04-10-11 113

EP9 Godfather edit Krautboy 04-15-11 117

   RE: EP9 Godfather edit Flowerpower 04-15-11 118

       RE: EP9 Godfather edit Travel_Queen 04-15-11 119

   RE: EP9 Godfather edit Flowerpower 04-16-11 120

       Fantasy Games dabo 04-16-11 121

       RE: EP9 Godfather edit michel 04-17-11 125

           RE: EP9 Godfather edit television 04-19-11 157

               RE: EP9 Godfather edit michel 04-19-11 159

   RE: EP9 Godfather edit michel 04-16-11 122

       RE: EP9 Godfather edit Flowerpower 04-16-11 123

       RE: EP9 Godfather edit kiki_k 04-17-11 124

           RE: EP9 Godfather edit Round Robin 04-18-11 126

   Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 127

       RE: Andrea's edit dabo 04-18-11 128

           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 134

               RE: Andrea's edit dabo 04-18-11 139

                   RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 143

                       RE: Andrea's edit Brownroach 04-19-11 156

                           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 161

                               RE: Andrea's edit Brownroach 04-19-11 165

                                   RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 169

                                       RE: Andrea's edit Corvis 04-19-11 173

                                           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 176

                                               RE: Andrea's edit Corvis 04-19-11 178

       RE: Andrea's edit PepeLePew13 04-18-11 129

           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 135

               RE: Andrea's edit PepeLePew13 04-18-11 138

                   RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 140

                       RE: Andrea's edit dabo 04-18-11 142

                           RE: Andrea's edit Brownroach 04-18-11 146

                               RE: Andrea's edit Corvis 04-18-11 147

                                   RE: Andrea's edit Outfrontgirl 04-18-11 150

                                       RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 151

                               RE: Andrea's edit dabo 04-18-11 152

                                   RE: Andrea's edit Brownroach 04-19-11 158

                                       RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 160

                                           RE: Andrea's edit Brownroach 04-19-11 166

                                               RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 170

       RE: Andrea's edit Corvis 04-18-11 130

           RE: Andrea's edit dabo 04-18-11 131

           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 136

               RE: Andrea's edit PepeLePew13 04-18-11 137

                   RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 144

               RE: Andrea's edit Corvis 04-18-11 145

                   RE: Andrea's edit PepeLePew13 04-18-11 148

                   RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-18-11 149

               RE: Andrea's edi Outfrontgirl 04-18-11 153

                   RE: Andrea's edi dabo 04-18-11 154

                   RE: Andrea's edi michel 04-19-11 155

                       RE: Andrea's edi Corvis 04-19-11 174

                           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 177

                               RE: Andrea's edit Corvis 04-19-11 180

       RE: Andrea's edit parathor 04-18-11 132

       RE: Andrea's edit dabo 04-19-11 162

           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 163

               RE: Andrea's edit Brownroach 04-19-11 167

                   RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 171

                       RE: Andrea's edit Brownroach 04-19-11 175

                           RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 179

               RE: Andrea's edit dabo 04-19-11 168

                   RE: Andrea's edit michel 04-19-11 172

Nietzche's Übermensch michel 04-18-11 133

   RE: Nietzche's Übermensch dabo 04-18-11 141

       RE: Nietzsche's Übermensch michel 04-19-11 164

Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: michel 04-22-11 181

   RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: dabo 04-22-11 182

   RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: kiki_k 04-23-11 183

       RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: dabo 04-23-11 184

           RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: kiki_k 04-23-11 185

       RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: michel 04-23-11 186

           RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: kiki_k 04-23-11 187

               Matt's Edit michel 04-24-11 188

Episode #11 - Observations: michel 04-30-11 189

   RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Flowerpower 04-30-11 190

       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 04-30-11 191

           RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Flowerpower 05-01-11 194

               RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-01-11 195

   RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-01-11 192

       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Flowerpower 05-01-11 193

       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-01-11 196

           RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-01-11 197

               RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-01-11 198

                   RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-02-11 199

                       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Flowerpower 05-02-11 200

                       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-02-11 202

                           RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-02-11 203

                               RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-02-11 204

                                   RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-03-11 206

                                       IMHO dabo 05-03-11 207

                                       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-03-11 209

                                           RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-03-11 210

                                               RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-03-11 211

                                                   RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-03-11 213

                                                   RE: Episode #11 - Observations: PepeLePew13 05-03-11 214

                                                       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: kiki_k 05-03-11 215

                                                           RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-03-11 218

                                                               RE: Episode #11 - Observations: kiki_k 05-04-11 220

                                                       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Outfrontgirl 05-03-11 216

                                                           RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-03-11 219

                                                       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-03-11 217

   RE: Episode #11 - Observations: suzzee 05-02-11 201

       RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-02-11 205

           RE: Episode #11 - Observations: Round Robin 05-03-11 208

               RE: Episode #11 - Observations: michel 05-03-11 212

enough is enough dabo 05-04-11 221

   carry on dabo 05-04-11 222

       RE: carry on PepeLePew13 05-05-11 224

           RE: carry on Naked 05-05-11 225

               RE: carry on dabo 05-06-11 229

                   RE: carry on Naked 05-06-11 230

                       RE: carry on PepeLePew13 05-06-11 231

                           RE: carry on Naked 05-06-11 234

                   RE: Enough michel 05-06-11 232

Week 12 dabo 05-05-11 223

   RE: Week 12 kiki_k 05-05-11 226

   RE: Week 12 Outfrontgirl 05-05-11 227

   RE: Week 12 Flowerpower 05-05-11 228

       RE: Week 12 Brownroach 05-06-11 233

   RE: Week 12 michel 05-07-11 235

       RE: Week 12 kiki_k 05-07-11 237

   RE: Week 12 kiki_k 05-07-11 236

       RE: Week 12 Flowerpower 05-07-11 238

           RE: Week 12 Outfrontgirl 05-07-11 240

   RE: Week 12 michel 05-07-11 239

       RE: Week 12 dabo 05-08-11 241

           RE: Week 12 Outfrontgirl 05-08-11 242

               RE: Week 12 michel 05-08-11 243

                   RE: Week 12 dabo 05-08-11 244

                   RE: Week 12 parathor 05-08-11 245

                   RE: Week 12 Outfrontgirl 05-08-11 246

Week 13 Flowerpower 05-14-11 247

   RE: Week 13 kiki_k 05-14-11 248

       RE: Week 13 dabo 05-14-11 249

       RE: Week 13 Outfrontgirl 05-14-11 253

           RE: Week 13 michel 05-15-11 254

               RE: Week 13 Round Robin 05-15-11 255

               RE: Week 13 Outfrontgirl 05-15-11 256

                   RE: Week 13 michel 05-15-11 257

   Thoughts on the Penultimate Episode michel 05-14-11 250

       RE: Thoughts on the Penultimate Epi... Flowerpower 05-14-11 251

       RE: Thoughts on the Penultimate Epi... Scarlett O Hara 05-14-11 252

           RE: Thoughts on the Penultimate Epi... michel 05-15-11 258

A Few Observations michel 05-16-11 259

   RE: A Few Observations PepeLePew13 05-17-11 260

       RE: A Few Observations Naked 05-17-11 261

           RE: A Few Observations parathor 05-17-11 262

           RE: A Few Observations Travel_Queen 05-17-11 263

               RE: A Few Observations michel 05-17-11 265

           RE: A Few Observations michel 05-17-11 264

               RE: A Few Observations CTgirl 05-17-11 266

                   RE: A Few Observations NedraSue 05-17-11 267

                       RE: A Few Observations dabo 05-17-11 268

                       RE: A Few Observations michel 05-17-11 269

                           RE: A Few Observations Naked 05-17-11 270

                               RE: A Few Observations michel 05-17-11 271

                               RE: A Few Observations dabo 05-17-11 272

           RE: A Few Observations samboohoo 05-18-11 273

               RE: A Few Observations iltarion 05-18-11 274

                   RE: A Few Observations michel 05-18-11 275

                       RE: A Few Observations iltarion 05-18-11 276

                           RE: A Few Observations michel 05-18-11 277

Post-Mortem michel 08-04-11 278

   RE: Post-Mortem sportsjoe 08-08-11 279

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Messages in this topic

Scarlett O Hara 3439 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
02-15-11, 08:44 PM (EST)

1. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Redemption"

Good day Veruca! I couldn't resist jumping in feet first when I saw the "0" posts number.
Count me as a Boston Rob fan. I thought it was telling in the vidcaps to see the team that gained Boston Rob all clapping while the team that got Russell just kind of stood there. I think most any fan of Survivor would be familiar with Boston Rob.
I don't count Russell in the same class as Rob and look forward to the day when Russell gets voted out and hopefully, that will happen this season!
You called the cast diverse. To me, it seems more of the same. We have three lawyers, two former NFL football players, a couple of beauty pageant participants, a couple of farmers, a few students, a technology exec and a marine. Where are the creative types? The architects, advertising execs and so forth?
Also, the addition of the Redemption Island theme will take the show in an entirely new direction. The old recipe of Reward challenge followed by camp life followed by Immunity challenge followed by Tribal Council is gone. From now on, will we see the Daws competing in only one challenge - a combined RC/IC, only to make room for the Redemption Island "Duel" footage? This is a major twist in the layout of the standard formula and I find myself already missing the two challenge format. I hope they have made the right decision! Time will tell. Looking forward to following along this thread this season!

Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-15-11, 09:10 PM (EST)

2. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Redemption"

Hello Veruca! I'm glad to see you back.
I'm not so happy about this season however. I haven't done howework on the players, I don't have any pre-season impressions so I'll have to let the edit guide me.

Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-16-11, 01:55 AM (EST)

3. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Redemption"

Welcome back! Not much to go on since the first ep has yet to air, but I think it notable that preview promos are giving little away. Each new face is getting a little attention, otherwise they are just going heavy on the Rob v Russ duel and the Redemption Island gamechanger. Hype overload, repetitive hard sell more than they've done for any previous season, attention to the individual players seems a very back seat "oh, yeah, let's do some of that also, viewers need to be able to put names and faces together" afterthought.
Another observation comes from my son, who doesn't pay very much attention to Survivor anymore but still knows what goes on, who says: "Why are they having Rob and Russ back, neither of them can win, the new players won't vote for either of them." I think that he's onto something there, it isn't a good idea to mix first-time players and returning all-stars, neither Rob or Russ may have a chance of winning no matter what they do.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-16-11, 03:32 AM (EST)

4. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Redemption"

Yay, Veruca is back!
Jeff also did a cast assessment and made comments in the TV Guide preview segments, but I don't offhand know where they are transcribed. I haven't even finished the TV guide preview yet, nor have I watched all the cast videos.
I think what you said about the elders in Rob's tribe is right on. They all three admit to being the types who could ruffle feathers. In fact, I am just going to lump them together as BIG targets.
Kristina has another quote where she says she has a very big mouth.
Francesca says she is all mouth.
Phillip has, per Jeff, some plan to communicate his Special Forces training.
Also, I hate to say it, but the African-American men have not done well in recent seasons -- with the exception of Russell Swann and Jaison. I really think that there is an experience and culture gap between them and the mactor types, and it is not really very fair that EPM casts ONE black guy and ONE black girl. Tyrone was bounced quickly for being bossy, and Phillip is going to be pushy.
Matt, or Fabio v.2, also has a sports background (doesn't he?), and I could see him getting along with and not threatening Rob. Jeff calls him an introvert.
Grant -- Aras v.2, another question mark. I have to see him in the game. No clue how yoga guy and Rob will get along, or how football guy and baseball guy will hit it off.
Ashley and Andrea -- sorry to lump them together as they are individual enough other than being blonde, but I do think they have got what it takes, and so do they, and so does Jeff. They are both farm girls. Ashley is a nurse, a business owner, an athlete, a pageant winner, and she is gorgeous. Unless she really ticks people off, I think she could do well, and Andrea as well. Both will work hard. Andrea has just watched all the seasons again.
I think these two girls have the most sheer Survivor game going in of their team, in terms of really knowing the game and putting their heads into it.
Natalie, the other pretty young girl, I have no feeling for yet. I see no reason for them to boot her early though.
On Russell's team, we have Natalie v.2 in the form of
Krista, blonde southern pharmaceutical rep. She seems way less fragile than Natalie. In her interview, she did not like Russell, but she seems like the one he would go for. Even though Jeff says he wants Andrea to break the pharm rep mold, pharm sales people have done well in this game. Natalie and Stephenie ... and I'm likely forgetting a few.
Sarita looks great to me. She has a hippy background and it seems like a colorful life that has made her tough. Unlike the other older women, she didn't make the speech that she knows she has a big mouth but she isn't going to hold back. I hope she gets a good edit. I like her hat.
Julie, because she is a leader in the firehouse, seems like a candidate for Betsy Bolan of the season. Maybe she will do alright, but I fear she will fall into the bossy mold.
Stephanie-- well Jeff comes out and says that she's the obvious first boot. He doesn't even extend her benefit of the doubt. In her interview, she says she has a very opinionated mouth. She also says she respects Russell. Hmm.
David -- may be diabolical enough to appreciate Russell's usefulness. Smart like Dave Ball, but less quirky? I'm hoping I like David and that he lasts, because he doesn't seem like a cookie cutter contestant to me.
Steve is one who said he didn't like Russell, and I could see them being enemies. He seems like the Tom Westman of the group, a guy who could win if they had no returning players. Perhaps Gary Hogeboom is a better comparison than Tom, but Steve has a commanding presence.
Mike is clearly very competitive. Jeff said he keeps asking about the rules. Question mark as to whether he'll be targeted as a threat early on or kept for his obvious qualities as a challenge star. (At least I think he would be a star.)
Rooster -- I'm up in the air. Jeff loves Tom v.2, of course. He seems nicer than Tom, but he's equally incomprehensible when he speaks. A good ol boy to work with Russell or someone Russ won't respect?
I figure there are going to be roughly 3 or 4 players on each side who will not make the merge. Nothing has been said about how many episodes or when the merge is, but I feel it will not be late if there is any chance for RvR to materialize and go head to head on the merge tribe. Scratch that if Russell or Rob goes early, but if not, I think producers would be trying to facilitate putting the two together.
Anyhow, if there are 3-4 players each tribe who won't make jury, and they don't swap (which they could), and one tribe doesn't dominate and pound the other (which could happen), I think the people who are older and have the self-professed big mouths or alpha personalities are very much at risk to be the casualties. Both Rob and Russell prefer more passive, malleable partners.
See, I'm leaning towards Rob being embraced, and Russell being somewhat appreciated. In Guatemala, both returnees made the merge, as we all remember, and one made F2 of course. These people don't seem foolish enough to take Russell to the end, but when one tribe has the benefit of an experienced player, provider, etc.., wouldn't the other tribe be at a disadvantage to immediately show the veteran the door? I think they would.
I am rooting for Bahston Rahb, I admit it. I was so bummed when he got taken out early in HvV, and this is his almost for sure last shot.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-16-11, 03:44 AM (EST)

5. "the duel twist"

>>> It is my understanding that the player voted off gets to compete against the next voted off and the victor then has the opportunity to return to the game.
Burnett explained it in his teleconference. The first duel will be Ep 3, after two votes. The duel loser is out of the game for good. The winner is not back in the game, but continues to live on RI, dueling the next votee to arrive.
I am going to post what you might call a "rule spoiler" -- as it says nothing about who does well nor contains any names. Call sheets left in a hotel indicate that there is a duel fought when the F5 person is voted out. Most think that is the last duel, and the person comes back in and there is then another F5. Apparently the Israeli version of the game was played this way.
There MAY be someone who comes back earlier. I don't know. What Burnett does say is that theoretically, the first boot could win all the duels and come back in near the end and win the game. Makes it sound more like there's only one redemption. To me that sounds like a LONG wait for a payoff on the duel.
But, and this is important, what is of note is that the jury is seated in order of the players who lose duels during that phase of the game. Making merge probably doesn't guarantee that boot (or the next) a jury seat, not if an earlier votee beats them in the duel.
So, not only can someone voted off win the game (but whether that is likely I don't know at all, as Lil sure didn't have a shot in Pearl Islands) -- but it is no longer SAFE to vote off your allies pre-merge with the thought that the backstab won't have consequences. That person could survive on RI and be a jury vote.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-19-11, 08:16 PM (EST)

6. "Episode #1: Editing Thoughts"

Playing With Amateurs
The opening reminded me of both Heroes vs Villains and Australia, Jeff sitting precariously at the back of a flying machine. I didn’t get any visual hints; the camera did not focus on one member in particular when Jeff mentioned key words in his intro.
We did have some early confessionals:
Phillip: “I’m the CEO of my own software company but are there more layers to me? Absolutely. I’m a former federal agent. That’s right: Special Agent Sheppard. That was my first and middle name for years.”
(I found it hysterical that the editors weren’t buying it, placing a question mark on screen after Federal Agent.)
Matthew: “My faith is everything. My entire life revolves around it. I pray every day as I strive to be more like my Savior.”
Ralph: “They will call me a redneck. One crazy, stupid bastard! We never had a dumbass win the game, have we? Maybe it’s my turn.”

We can easily guess why Phillip received an early confessional but we’ll have to keep track of Matthew and Ralph who really didn’t need to be shown but gave us a clear read into their character. Their stories weren’t developed in this episode so we can expect they will somewhere down the road. Ralph gave us a possible winning quote while Matt set himself up for a journey.
Right after the intros, we had a first confessional from our future booted player:
Francesca : “We’re on the beach and I saw the mat and I thought: This is really happening.”
Normally, I wouldn’t waste time on the booted player but one of them will be returning down the line so let’s keep an eye out for special treatment. However, I doubt Francesqwoi will make a sweep of the duels so I won’t record all her quotes. This confessional showed her somewhat overwhelmed, a good indication of what was to come.
Mike: “While I was in the Marine corps, I spent two deployments, went to Iraq twice. I think I’m gonna win just because of my background. I think I’ve trained for something like this.”
This is another very personal introduction containing a possible winning quote. Of course, the editors love the soldiers but we can put Mike on the short list of players to watch. There seems to be more men than women on that list.
As Jeff welcomed them to Survivor, the camera went immediately to Matthew, raising his arms in victory.
Rob was greeted by applause, Russell by “OH no” from Mike and Krista.
Stephanie : “OMG! It’s Russell. I don’t even know on which team he’s going to be but I’ll stare down Russell. When I stare down Russell, he’ll know that “she’s got a little evil inside of her” because if I’m not the one person that he picks to take to the end then, no matter what, I’m going to be out. I’m going to be out.”
Note that the first confessional that contained strategy came from a person who didn’t give us any insight into her personality, unless you count “a little evil.” I don’t think that bodes well for Stephanie.
After Jeff made his sales pitch for the returning players, commenting on how great they were, we heard Franciskwa saying: “They’re sizing us up as if we’re prey”. Those unnecessary words meant she was singling herself out of the “heard”. If that wasn’t enough, she explained that Rob and Russell were “two of the most famous trouble-makers in the history of Survivor.”
To answer the prayers of Andrea (we could almost hear her saying “please, please, please”) for Ometepe and Stephanie for Zapatera, Rob picked Orange, Russell picked Purple.
When Jeff explained the Redemption Island twist, it was Matthew’s surprised reaction that we heard first. Will he the one coming back from the island? The camera also panned to Kristina, Krista, Ashley, Francesca and David while Jeff explained the living conditions on the island, leading me to believe these people will spend time there. Russell was the one shown when Jeff explained the duels. Will he win some or is that where is game will end? After that the cameras showed Mike, Grant, Steve, Boston Rob before we went back to Russell when Jeff said the words “out of the game for good”. (if only!) Mike and Steve seemed to get the focus when Jeff mentioned the return.
Russell: “Redemption Island does not scare me one bit, it’s a vacation. Yeah! Put me on that island and see what happens. I’m gonna win the challenges and come back and take some heads off.”
Interesting how the editors focused on Russell’s take of the island. I believe that it will be his Waterloo.
Francesca : “When Jeff told us about Redemption Island…it makes Rob and Russell being here more complicated.”

This led to the first commercial. We will have to remember the players that had early confessionals, especially Matthew, Ralph, Mike and Stephanie. The ones without confessionals (and that includes Rob) have a small question mark in front of their edit: Why were they ignored?
Zapatera
Russell: “As soon as I walked to the camp, I was so grateful to be back to get my title of Sole Survivor. The first two, I was a schoolboy. This one, I’m bringing it. This is gonna be the new me: I’m gonna be the leader to my tribe. When I sit them down and take control of the camp, I’ll become the leader of the camp.”
Note that Steve hugged Russell after saying: “The Power of Purple”. Will Zapatera dominate?
Russell, with Krista’s help, called a meeting to tell them how tough Survivor really is. He also promised not to sabotage the tribe.
David: “I think that anybody who doesn’t think Russell is dangerous is foolish. He played the game twice and ended up in the finals twice. He hasn’t won and it’s no mystery why he hasn’t won, it’s the way he chose to play the game both times. He’s too aggressive; he wants the blood on his hands.”
Another leader emerged:
Ralph: “When I seen a big box of nails and all that, I loved it. I can’t wait to get started. I’ve camped, I’ve built cabins, I’ve done all this kind of stuff. If they listen to me, I believe we can build a decent shack. Some of them don’t know what is going on but I don’t want to let them know that.”
Note again that Steve was heard saying: “We’ve got it all” which could be another sign of Zapatera’s dominance.
We also had a little conversation between Mike and Ralph, Zapatera’s two players with a personal story.
Mike had another confessional: “My first impressions? Very good impression. I think we’ve got a bunch of worker bees which is good. As long as we can win and stay away from the immunity challenges, we will do damn well.”
(OK, Mike may not know the concept yet but he has been featured up to now!)
Steve and Krista were the silent players that we were given as examples of worker bees, which I’d count as a good sign for both, at least over the other silent members of the cast. Mike and Ralph’s partnership in building the shelter was once more shown, especially with Mike asking: “Ralph, tell us what you need.”
Note that, at this time, we had a shot of Stephanie looking at people and Russell just walking around, reminding us that there were schemers inside the group of worker bees.
Ometepe
Matthew: “Things are going really well right now. It is such a blessing to have Rob here. With his history in construction work and his experience being here with his laid-back approach, he’s bringing a lot of harmony to this tribe. We might as well call it camp-harmony right now.”
Natalie: “I’m so glad that we have Boston Rob. He is amazing! I’m having so much fun with him and I feel a sense of comfort. I think, if Russell was here, we’d all be on edge because he’s nuts. He would have been crazy.”
This confessional probably served to introduce us to the young players’ alliance on Ometepe but it also served as introduction to a new kind of crazy because Phillip was about to start giving directions to the ladies.
Fransaskatchewan: “The most annoying person so far is Phillip...”

Andrea: “Apparently my hatching isn’t the correct technique. I don’t have really the best aim so I’m just going at it. I live on a farm so I know how to use an axe and I know how to use a hammer. I think he just likes to play the father role so I’ll let him do that.”
Andrea shared a laugh with Ashley.
Phillip gathered all the women to tell them he was a federal agent, that his word was good and that he could help them determine who was lying once they get to the merge.
Fransasqua: “One of the best things about Phillip is the comic relief that is provided by the fact that he thinks he used to be a federal agent is a big secret bombshell that he has and he’s holding and that would blow everyone’s mind if they knew. It’s hilarious. Who cares?!”
Kristina: “We have a whole basket full of stuff and nobody is looking for the immunity idol which is kind of weird because you’d think it’s somewhere in our stuff.”
Rob noticed her snooping around so he asked her about it after getting Andrea to go help Matt. He told Kristina that he’d help keep people away.
Kristina: “Everything is new and everyone is trying to get their footing, it isn’t easy. The fact that Rob knows I was looking for the clue worries me a little bit because I don’t want to come off like this big strategizer and turn people off so, hopefully he’s the only one that understood what was going on. It drives me crazy. I want it!”
With a shot of the women all working on the palm fronds for the shelter, we heard Rob telling Phillip that the 5 girls would vote against the 4 guys. Phillip understood and added: “I definitely want to be working together.”
Rob agreed saying he liked Phillip’s work ethic and that they would talk later.
(So, was Phillip on a secret mission for Rob?! His mission: infiltrate the small group of “terrorist” armed with a weapon of ASS destruction and expose them at tribal council!)
Phillip: “When you look at this game, and a lot of people get super paranoid. The thing about me and any Sheppard: No. Rob is sizing me up. I like to think we are two male lions that are checking each other out. We’re doing a little dance but there will come a point where that is going to take over.”
Phillip went to Kristina asking for her help to keep the young girls from blabbing too much and adding that Rob told him to watch out for the girls’ advantage in numbers. Phillip added: “He’s going to try and divide and conquer and he’s going to play me as the fool and I’m going to play along but I’m going to stick to the girls.”
Zapatera
Russell was off to get water with his newest partner. He asked Stephanie what she thought of the tribe.
She said the other tribe looked more physical. The first part of Stephanie’s confessional was inserted here. Right after, Russell told her that they had to be on the right team and that she was that girl for him and that they simply needed to get to the merge.

Stephanie : “Russell and I were looking for the tree mail and he came up to me and I got all nervous because I thought “prom date”… “Russell is so sneaky, He was like: Let’s form an alliance which is great because he made it to the top three every time he played. Of course I said yes.”
As Stephanie walked back in camp, the cameras followed her and gave us a hint that this new couple may not last long.
We heard a woman’s voice (Sarita who hasn’t been identified on screen yet) saying: “He’s getting the girls.”
David, who was with Sarita, answered: “Please don’t let that happen.”
Sarita added: “We don’t want that to happen. We got to get Russell out of this game immediately.”
David went to Mike who didn’t see Russell as a threat. David disagreed completely, saying that Russell had his hooks on Stephanie. He added: “He does it every time: He gets a cute little girl and turns her into the villainess and I’m not going to let that happen.”
Mike: “I like David. David seems like a nice guy and he’s pretty savvy. David told me that Russell had his hooks in Stephanie. Any pros of having Russell around have quickly evaporated. He’s just going to spread paranoia and be a cancer of the tribe. There’s nothing to be done yet except for the task at hand which is get Russell gone as soon as possible.”
Note that this confessional could have been given to Sarita who definitely would have needed one. Or it could have gone to David, reinforcing his early role as the strategist. Instead it went to Mike who, after getting a personal story, a connection with the fun character of the tribe, then got into the strategic part of the story. The confessional painted David as a positive player but Mike’s story is starting to look very good.
Ometepe
Kristina: “I don’t want to have Rob stick around that long. I like the guy, he’s a great guy but he’s dangerous to have on the tribe. The guys are in awe of Rob and he’s going after the young girls because they are easy pickings.” (Ashley was shown almost flirting with him, playing with his hair while Natalie and Andrea giggled.) “So whatever I do, I think he’s going to be the one I focus on really quickly. If there is an idol out there, I will do everything to find it, I’ll do it. If anyone can find one on this tribe, it’s me.”
So she went on the hunt while the editors used a musical score and visuals of the sun and the sandy beach that reminded me of a Sergio Leone movie. She soon found it and found a secure spot to hide it again. Then she observed Rob walking on the beach with Matthew, Natalie, Andrea and Ashley in tow, almost like his disciples.
Kristina : “The immunity idol means power. I’m probably going to tell somebody about it but I haven’t decided yet. I could make this big giant splash of move and get rid of Rob tonight if I wanted to. I really could. The faster he goes, the better.”
Fransascat and Phillip were on board to put Rob’s name on the chopping block.
Phillip: “I’m a great process person so if you came to me and said you want to form this alliance and we want you to be a part of it and we want you to vote out Rob, I’m going to hear it for what it is and then I’m going to step back and I’m going to go through how you got there. It’s called corroboration.”
He told Kristina that she only had 3 votes so he wanted to know who the other votes were.
(Isn’t that what a spy working for Rob would do?!)
The three got into a fight over his attitude.
Fransasquatch: “I don’t know how it happened, how I got sucked with the old annoying guy in the fuchsia briefs. He is such a pain in my ass. Did I mention we were in an alliance together? How awesome!”
The Immunity Challenge
Despite Jeff’s claim that Rob was an amazing puzzle maker, Ometepe couldn’t overcome the advantage that an extra man on the first part of the challenge had given Zapatera.
Russell stepped forward to get the idol from Jeff as Rob looked on, disappointment crooking his jaw. After Ralph kissed the idol and Julie received flint from Jeff, Russell seemed to taunt Rob by showing him who had the idol.
Russell had a confessional as he left the challenge area: “We are stronger than they are, we are faster than they are, we are smarter than they are. I know how Boston Rob thinks and right now he’s thinking: “OH! Crap. I’m stuck with a bunch of weenies.”
Ometepe
Day 3
Ashley had a confessional: “We lost the first challenge today which totally sucks. In a way, I don’t know if other people feel this way but I feel like we let Rob down. It’s weird but you want to please your leader, I guess but it sucks that we have to go to tribal council tonight.”
Kristina told Francesca that she had the idol and wanted the vote directed towards herself to blindside Rob.
Francesca was happy to hear that but tried to direct the vote to Natalie, the weakest player they had.
Kristina : “Voting Natalie is better for the tribe, voting Rob is better for me. I don’t know, maybe. I would love to vote out Rob tonight.”
Kristina asked Rob who he wanted to eliminate but he simply told her he didn’t know. She left with a frown on her face, knowing what that meant.
Rob : “Originally, I wanted to vote Francesca off because the very first time I met her, she stood up on the mat, looked at Jeff and said: “I don’t want to play with him because he’s too sneaky.” She knows my game so I don’t want someone like that on my tribe. After thinking about it some more, the second we landed on our beach, Kristina was the one looking through all the supplies, looking for the immunity idol. She’s dangerous. She knows strategy and she knows to go out there and to work for it. To me, I don’t need somebody like that with me.”
Rob told his 5 allies that he saw Kristina looking through the stuff and that she probably had the idol. Andrea said she had seen the same thing. Matthew looked surprised and the camera focused on him through a lot of this discussion. Rob told them to split the vote: The guys voting for Francine…Francesca…Ashley suggested to call her Fran which was simpler but not as much fun. The women would vote Kristine(!). He begged them not to screw this up because of what happened during his last season. Andrea was shown laughing at the memory of Tyson’s move.
Back in camp, Phillip still wanted to know who the other votes were so Kristina showed her the idol.
Kristina : “I’m extremely nervous telling Phillip about the idol…I didn’t trust the guy so I hated telling him but I just had to tell him…Hopefully he will keep a lid on it but that is a risk…”
Phillip : “It might not be in the tribe’s best interest to get rid of Rob but is it in the interest of Phillip Sheppard and Company who came to play a game and make some bold moves? I think the longer Rob is around, solidifying those girls and the whole thing, I’m weakened so I need to get rid of him now. Bam. Good bye Rob and you’re looking at the new leader of our tribe.”
The Phillip Sheppard Show
As the players approached Tribal Council, a lion was heard in the darkness, an obvious reference to Phillip’s earlier comment about two lions fighting it out, except this wasn’t a fight!
Rob told Jeff they went straight to work, that Phillip set the tone, that everyone chipped in and that they have a pretty good shelter.
Phillip said he made suggestions rather than being a leader.
Asked if Phillip was leader, Matthew said that Phillip lets you know if you are doing something that is counter-productive and that it wasn’t “very well received on the first day”.
Francesca said they would vote to keep the tribe strong so that implied a woman would go.
Kristina said she didn’t feel safe.
Rob knew that, even if the guys could be getting a free pass, he could be walking away and that there would be nothing he could do about it.
Francesca said Redemption Island added a layer of complexity to the game, saying: “If Rob got voted out tonight, which he isn’t going to, he would be fine and we all feel there would be a very good chance he is going to come back.”
That caught Phillip’s ear and that launched the festivities: “Francesca and Kristina asked me to cast my vote for Rob.”
Francesca denied it. Her interruption irritated Phillip but rejoiced Jeff and Rob.
Phillip went into a rampage: “Jeff, I am a former special agent so if I make a statement to you, I will do everything that I can to adhere to that and I will not betray you. I will go down on a sinking ship until I hear something different and I heard something different so my vote is going to be for Francesqwa.”
Kristina leaned over and whispered to vote out Phillip, adding for everyone that Phillip was a bit unstable.
Phillip was up in arms: “She wanted me to go along with them because she has an immunity idol.”
That was funny news to everyone and Jeff got Kristina to admit she had it and that they were planning on voting Natalie instead of Rob.
Rob got Kristina to show him the idol, making a deal with her: “Give me the immunity idol and you’ll stay.”
She couldn’t do that.
Rob gave his troops the plan by saying: “It might save you for 3 more days but I’m going to do what I said I was going to do with the people I said I was going to do it with.”
Jeff called this an amazing Tribal Council and, for once, I agreed with it.
Rob voted Francesca saying: “It feels so good to play with you amateurs; you give away so much. You don’t even know to keep your mouth shut.”
Brazingly, Kristina kept the idol. She probably knew that Phillip was good for his word and would vote Francesqua.
The Story
The Theme that struck me during this first episode was underlined by Rob’s voting comment. Some players made rookie mistakes while others showed they knew what they were doing. Both tribes were shown building good shelters so that will not help us this season but we did have some hints that Purple will be the stronger team. Indeed, there are some stories, conflicts, which seem long term in that tribe while Ometepe seems much more short term, all contained in the Phillip Sheppard show.
The Characters

Going with the perceived theme, I will rate the players according to what we were shown about their game knowledge.
The Undrafted Free Agents
I’ll put in this category the players that haven’t been given an introduction yet, namely Grant, Julie, Krista, Steve and Sarita. It’s very possible that a nearly invisible player makes it far, one or two always do, but the edits of these 5 are seriously lacking.
Grant: We know he is in Rob’s alliance so that should tell us he knows the game and that he has been picked up to play in the majors but the camera almost separated him from that group. He wasn’t in the shot of Rob walking on the beach with his disciples, he was mostly off screen when the group of 6 decided to split the votes and he was the only Ometepe without a confessional or a Tribal Council intervention.
Julie : She wasn’t shown in any way, barely an extra so she doesn’t have a story.
Krista : We saw her greeting Russell even if she didn’t really want him on her team and we saw her working in camp so I have more hope for her story to emerge than the first two but we will have to wait and see.
Steve: Like Krista, he welcomed Russell with open arms and his words were used to let us know that Purple was a strong team. It wasn’t much but he has time to grow.
Sarita : She only had a small role so we can say that the scouts haven’t recognized her talent yet but her scene was vital to Zapatera’s story. We often get these unknown players making a sudden splash later in the game so I wouldn’t count Sarita out yet. Of the undrafted players, she seems to have to most to offer.
The Rookies: They received differing amount of “playing time”; some made good use of it while others showed their limitations, making rookie mistakes.
Fran : Being the first player ever to Redemption Island, she’ll probably get a Janu-type treatment. Let’s wait and see her win a duel before eliminating her completely.
Phillip : I’d really like to believe that Phillip had been acting as Rob’s secret agent because that would be hilarious but his confessionals about fighting lions make it obvious he won’t be working with Rob. He’ll probably be sacrificed in order to get rid of Kristina’s idol but I do hope Ometepe can win a few challenges to give time for Phillip to bring the laughs.
Stephanie : I’d categorize wanting to be Russell’s girl as a rookie mistake. The cameras showed us that her tribe wasn’t blind to the strategy so, without an idol, there is little chance she can advance. I’ll take her talk with Russell about needing to make it to the merge as an indication that they don’t make it together. However, the game could change very quickly so she could prove me wrong.
Kristina: Finding the idol demonstrated the knowledge of a veteran but once she had it, Kristina was shown making a rookie mistake, letting the wrong person know she had it. What we saw was a very likable person that now faces an insurmountable task. We could be looking at the edit of a Victim so it will be important to see which players in Rob’s alliance are spared the blame of her elimination. Up to now, we only have Natalie because she was mentioned as the target.
Ashley : The confessional she had immediately after the challenge loss could be an indication that she will narrate Ometepe’s journey but it’s too early to tell. She commented on the theme of Rob versus Russell, saying that she was unhappy to have let her leader down but others had confessionals about the tribe.
Natalie : She was one of them, saying how happy she was to have Rob around. We even heard her asking Rob what to do which he answered by saying: “You know what you are doing” so that is a good point for her.
Andrea : For a rookie, we saw a player that had studied some film and was somewhat prepared. She knew about Tyson’s dumb move, she knew Kristina was looking for an idol and she knew not to get in a fight with Phillip but to let him “show” her what to do with an axe. That confessional had a small personal touch, the audience getting to know she’s a farm girl. She also showed us that she knew having Boston Rob was much better than Russell.
Matt: He could be the narrator of Ometepe but I see him more on a journey as he said, to be closer to his savior. Quite a big task but a prolonged and victorious stay on Redemption Island, with a possible monastic angle, could serve the purpose. Of all these rookies, Matthew is the one that has the biggest upside, the most potential for rookie of the year because of the personal side to his story.
The Pros : In addition to the returning veterans, these players showed that they know the game and know what to do out there.
Rob : This was probably the driest episode Boston Rob had in his 4 seasons. No laughs, no personal touches, just discussions about strategy. I’d say his future doesn’t look too bright even if he is leading a solid alliance of 6.
Russell : For a grizzled veteran, a new man, Russell kept his same game plan except, this time, people are prepared for it. Sometimes veterans have to learn new moves or know when to retire. I think that his edit showed us that this will be one season too many for him. His first confessional was about Redemption Island so, as stated above, I think that will be his Waterloo.
David : He wasn’t about to let Russell dictate strategy. With Sarita and Mike, he plans on stopping Russell. The man with a plan doesn’t have a personal story yet and he was featured during Jeff’s talk about Redemption Island so we will need more information on him before considering him as a contender.
Ralph : Speaking of contenders, Ralph had a very good episode. We know he is a character; he quite naturally became the tribe’s leader immediately after Russell claimed he wanted to be leader and he got a connection to another strong, likable player in Mike. Are they in an alliance? We didn’t see it formalized which can be a very good sign because we just know it had to be discussed.
Mike : This leaves us with the player that gave me the best first impression. Certainly, Mike had two comments that made us realize he isn’t a seasoned pro (his talk of winning in order to avoid the immunity challenges and saying that he didn’t consider Russell a threat) but we saw that he learned quickly. He is now a player with a personal touch, that of a proud soldier no less, he is aligned with likable characters and he has a plan. That makes for a pretty strong content for only one episode.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-22-11, 05:07 PM (EST)

8. "RE: Episode #1: Editing Thoughts"

Hi Veruca! Hi everyone! I thought that it was a great episode, and a great premiere! I am not going to go over the blow by blow, but I sure appreciate that michel did, as I may use his post to refer to it. Great observations there, btw, michel!
First of all, you all probably know that I am a Boston Rob fan. I remember watching in the first few episodes of Marquesas, and I thought he was a little punk, I didn't like him at all. But, boy, did I change my way of thinking. As time went by, he really grew on me, and I really appreciated the way he played the game. He's clever, he's a physical threat, he's got a great mind, he's certainly snarky and entertaining, but the thing I liked the most is that the guy is FUN. He makes the most of his situation, and he brings others along for the ride as well. He also gracefully lost, he respected his opponents and gave them their props. Well done, BR!
All-stars certainly highlighted the real Rob. Remember, we all called them the "Happy Chappy's", because of Rob. They flourished, with food, with shelter, and with down time.
I surely hope that my love of Rob doesn't cloud my perspective on the season. But, I have to tell you, after episode one, my juices are flowing....Rob is looking GOOD, imo. I also know that someone else, JIFFY, shares my love for Boston Rob, which also makes me wonder if this stellar editing is just "Rob-Love". Time will tell.
This season the whole game is supposed to be about redemption. Now, with RI, great players and strategists will get there second chance to get back in the game. For me, the first confessionals were interesting, talking about themselves...Phillip, Matt, Ralph...perhaps the characters. The one that stood out to me LATER, after I'd seen the episode was Matt's.
It tells about him, how his faith is everything...he's a GOOD boy. Substitute Rob in there now...
“My faith is everything. My entire life in this game revolves around Rob. I pray every day as I strive to be more like my hero, Rob.”
I arrived at this transition, as this is how Matt seemed to play the game. As long as I do what Rob tells me to do, I'm good, I want to be more like him....I felt that this confessional could be made "Rob-centric", and that's what I saw...in retrospect.
Additionally, I also saw Grant, Andrea, Ashley, Matt, and Natalie all have Rob LOVE. Ashley, Matt, and Natalie even had "Rob Love" confessionals. Andrea and Grant showed their Rob Love with their actions. They all seemed to be happy that Rob was on their tribe, and gave the seasoned veteran the benefit of the doubt. They were eager to please him and bummed when they let him/the tribe down at the challenge. Now, why am I so happy? Because we all know that Rob is a leader. I will note that even in the Insider videos, posted on the CBS site and transcribed on the boards, so NOT a spoiler, Rob notes that if there is one thing that he's learned about his game from his past experiences and that is that he HAS to be the leader. He can not, try as he may, be a follower. So, in this tribe full of folks that want to follow him, he can be the leader. I also know that in games with 1 or 2 definite leaders, the leader will win. In a game full of alphas/leaders, a follower will win. So, with a fine set of young, athletic, faithful disciples, Rob should make it to the merge, IF his tribe can win some challenges. With the group that is there and Rob's challenge prowess, I have alot of faith that they can persevere. At the merge, there could be some fireworks. But, I am encouraged after this first episode. I think Rob has some substance.
Now, for my observation regarding the other tribe. I think that tribe may have quite a few alphas....we darn sure know that RussHell is. And, with his confessional, I’m gonna be the leader to my tribe. When I sit them down and take control of the camp, I’ll become the leader of the camp.”, he tells us so. Other possible leaders: Mike. I think he did get a stellar first edit for his tribe. I can't decide if this is because he's really going to be something special, or is it because I think EPMB and company really love him. Jiffy referred to him as Captain America. He's the all-American Naval Academy, 2 tour Marine, leader who is physically and mentally sharp, he's the ideal Survivor player...
The other players, like Ralph, Steve, David, Stephanie, and even Sarita all strike me as potential alpha types, either from their actions in the first episode, OR, from their pre-show comments, bios. Time will tell. At any rate, I do feel like while Rob was a target in the very first episode, and his tribe lost, he's still sitting better than RussHell.....
I also got a real "man" feeling from this first episode. The females were either seen as supporting characters, or as schemers to foil the status quo...I don't know what to make of that.
Phillip is a silly character, not there to really win, but for the adventure. His tribemates can see this, imo. Kristina is a dead woman walking, imo. Rob was correct in his TC confessional, that playing with amateurs was fun because they didn't know how to keep their mouths shut...yes, Rob got a fantastic introduction, imo.
Alot more character development to come, especially as many received no confessionals. Also, with the intro this year, our stars didn't have a chance for a first confessional. Russell's first Confessional was in regard to RI, so yes, I'd say he'll spend some time there. Rob didn't have a confessional until strategy time. Too many others got confessionals to tell the initial story, so I am going to add that Rob has alot of time yet to tell us his perspective.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-22-11, 07:15 PM (EST)

9. "RE: Episode #1: Editing Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 02-22-11 AT 07:24 PM (EST)
I really enjoyed reading your comments, FP!
You know, you may have something there in regards to Matt seeing Rob as his Savior. RussHell was painted as the Devil in Samoa and he hasn't changed, so who better than "Jesus-Rob" to oppose him!
I did mention that the scene of Rob walking on the beach with Matt and the girls looked like he was leading his disciples. If that is how the editors are painting this story then the winner will be someone close to Rob but "Jesus-Rob" himself will probably fall on Day 33!
ETA: Too bad that little reptile running on water didn't show up right before a scene with Rob. Maybe that would have been too obvious!! Let's keep track where and when it shows up next.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-20-11, 06:00 AM (EST)

7. "episode 1"

Right off the batt, they gave all the confessionals on the helicopter to men. I didn't like that at all.
The intro gave me the impression that Matt could win. I hope this is misdirection. He seems nice enough, but I don't like contestants who talk about Jesus. I was thinking Matt would be a fun enough guy until he opened his mouth and sounded like Chase.
Last season they were very transparent, giving the first confessional to the winner. I hope they are doing something else this time. If a woman wins, they could possibly throw in a Samoa type editing where they don't show her right away.
In response to the Waterloo idea, I agree to an extent, but must also point out that every player shy of the Final 4 will experience an RI duel as the death knell of their game. That includes Russell, unless he gets much closer to the end than is likely, given his initial reception. Russell's fate is not necessarily any more tied to RI than the other players' fates.
I was going to write something on all the players, not just Matt, but I ran out of energy. My two favorites going in -- other than BR -- were Ashley and Andrea. Ashley didn't have a whole lot going on in Ep 1, and even Andrea had less than I expected with her country girl background.
However, the story that needed to be told was of the alliance fiasco of the three, so those on Rob's side didn't get much highlighting. It was odd that Grant was so invisible, and that seems to bode not so fantastic for him. However, he could still do reasonably well. I thought it possible they were showing him separated from Rob's flock because they wanted to create suspense about a possible fourth vote. He may not have been as marginal as they made it look. We'll see.
Mike made a good impression on me, and I also found David and Sarita interesting. Steve I hope to see more of as I do Matt.
Ralph and Phillip both seem to me the kind of characters that Probst loves -- outrageous, kooky, not the norm. I am not sure he has any other potential than to be exploited as a colorful character. I think he's a fish out of water and the same with Julie. Zapatera has some savvy players on it (David, Sarita, Steve, Mike, Russell, and quite possibly Krista), and I don't see these two worker bees making it into the core of the majority alliance.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-26-11, 07:39 PM (EST)

10. "Episode #2: Editing Thoughts"

Jeff told us that previously, 16 castaways were airlifted to a remote beach in Nicaragua where “they were surprised by two of Survivor’s most villainous rivals.”
Matt’s surprise when Jeff mentioned Redemption Island took a new meaning now that we know the outcome of episode #2.
Jeff went on telling us that, “at Zapatera, Russell lost no time aligning with the pretty young tribe mate…
But everyone else, immediately figured out what Russell was up to.”
<Mike was heard saying he wanted Russell gone pronto>
“At the Ometepe tribe, almost everyone fell under Boston Rob’s charismatic spell.”
<Matt said they were in camp-Harmony>
Kristina… “joined forces with Phillip and Francesca to get him out.
When Kristina found the hidden immunity idol, her plan seemed fool-proof but, at tribal, Phillip turned on his allies and spilled the beans on his entire tribe.
Francesca was voted out.”
The only editing manipulations in this straight-forward summary were the use of the word “villainous” to describe Russell and Rob both as well as the few scenes of Matthew. Jeff could have said two of Survivor’s biggest rivals, a more neutral epithet, especially for Rob who was supposed to have shed his role of villain. That and the few reaction shots from harmony-loving Matthew prepared us for the episode’s stunning turn.
This episode introduced us to…
The Perfect Partners
We had a quick scene of Francesca at Redemption Island. Despite seeing that she still has hope to return, none of her quotes seemed like foreshadowing future events. If she lasts, we will have time to revisit what she said.
Ometepe
Kristina (laughing at herself a bit): “Tribal council didn’t go exactly as I had hoped. It would have been perfect if I hadn’t mentioned anything to Phillip at all about having the immunity idol. I lost a battle but it’s not the end of the game. I still have the idol in my possession and I am so grateful that I didn’t play that thing. I am so happy.”
Rob in interview as we see him go off to talk with Phillip: “I know for a fact that Kristina and Phillip were lying but it doesn’t take a genius FBI man to figure that out. You just have to look at their faces and watch their lips moving. This guy Phillip, FBI, special agent, whatever, he is a piece of work. He told me that I own his vote for the rest of the time he’s here until he goes to Redemption Island. I don’t know if he’s delusional; I think he’s a good hearted guy, I do. He just might not all be there. Let that be a lesson to you: Government job…Stressful.”
We saw Rob solidifying his alliance of 6 and putting the target squarely on Phillip.
Rob’s confessional continued: “With the exception of Phillip’s little twist where he decided to out Francesca, things went pretty much according to plan. It seems as if this group of players knows how to follow directions. Phillip did it to himself; he’s an idiot.”
Ometepe
Day 4
Phillip: “When I went hunting for the crabs, you find yourself going back to that primal state. There’s a part of you that comes to a point where you realize that, here in Survivor, you are going to be tested in so many ways. When I revealed to the girls that I was a former Federal agent, it was designed to let the girls know that I am a trustworthy person. At tribal Council last night, Francesca maligned my character. I was definitely impacted emotionally because (choking up) one of the things about me is that I love my country. Having worn the uniform; I swore that I was prepared to protect and defend. To have her try to take some of that pride I have…it hurt me, it made me angry. I have a lot of emotions going on. I think that the best lesson I got from last night for me personally, besides the game aspect, was: I still love Phillip Sheppard. He’s a good guy and that’s OK.”
Note that this hunt went for quite a while because Phillip isn’t wearing the same shoes when he catches a crab as he did when he started. Having this funny scene intertwined with a Heroic-type confessional is extremely strange. It certainly endeared Phillip to many viewers but did it make us hate those that were watching and laughing at him? I suggest it doesn’t because the audience had to be doing the same thing.
Zapatera
Day 4
Ralph was turning into a rooster and Mike called him a legend as Russell observed.
Russell: “These fools that I am dealing with, they ain’t too bright and, poor ole Ralph! That might be the dumbest player to ever play…he may be the dumbest person on the face of the Earth besides being the dumbest player to play Survivor. These ain’t All-Stars I’m dealing with. It’s pitiful but I got a good player with me. Stephanie is a good player. Now, all I need is Krista. Three worked for me before, I believe it just might work for me again.” After telling Krista to keep an eye out for a HII clue, he had another confessional: “I’ve come to realize that I can’t trust nobody but my people. Krista and Stephanie are my alliance. My two girls! That’s it. I believe that’s all I have right now. I have to go all out so my plan is to find the idol. You’ve seen me play before. You know what you’ve seen? You’ve seen my find idols. It’s how I play this game.”
Steve and Mike observed Russell on his search but no one was paying attention to Ralph who was just picking rocks.
Ralph: “I was picking up a few rocks and I just happen to look in that stump and wondered what’s a rock doing in there? I pulled it back and there was the idol. I can’t believe I found it that easy! Russell; he’s the king at finding idols but that was simple as wiping your hiney with toilet paper. So, Russell, eat your heart out, man!”
Haven’t we always said that the idols were too easy to find in Russell’s seasons? We just never quite put is as bluntly as Ralph did! The confrontation has been built up between these two characters and its resolution cannot be too far down the road. Either Russell or Ralph is being set-up for a hard fall. All our editing experience tells us that Russell should be the one to take that fall because he’s the one that denigrated Ralph. The problem is, however, that we are talking about Russell, someone that the editors have chosen as their star for two seasons. So much so that is trash-talk is seen as strategy by the audience.
Ometepe
Day 5
Matthew and Andrea were relaxing and talking, Matthew saying he was happy not to be on his own.
Andrea: “Matt is really cute and good to look at but we’re close and I think we have a little bit of loyalty going on.”
Rob: “Matt is trying to play the good guy but Andrea knows what she wants. If she can have her puppy dog along for the ride, she’s gonna walk ‘em, she’s gonna walk ‘em all around this island but, for me, that’s not good because I know how strong a pair can be in this game like Amber and I. Now, I’m thinking about who I’m going to sit next to in the end.”
Rob had a talk of his own with Natalie who called the pair dangerous. Rob went on: “I think Natalie’s a perfect partner at this point but it’s going to be hard though. It’s going to be literally picking the girl up, putting her on my back and I’m gonna drag her ass to the end and, hopefully, they are going to give it to me in the end.”
Rob said the vote should be either Phillip or Andrea to keep the tribe strong. Natalie said it sounded good.
Natalie: “I’m going to make big moves but I really trust Rob. I think making big moves along with him will be smart.”
The Challenge
Zapatera was surprised to see Francesca was the one voted out because, as one of their women put it: “she was strong but they are dumb”. Imagine their surprise next week!
Jeff knew to ask for Phillip’s reaction to Ralph’s confident claim of getting the idol back. Phillip told us it brought out the animal in him. I guess that’s why those two were paired off for a showdown in the end. There was a funny exchange after this:
Phillip: “I will outlast any man over there!”
Amused, Jeff asked: “What about the women?”
Phillip, sternly: “That’s for another day. We’ll see.”
Stephanie wasn’t impressed.
Was Zapatera told off-air that they had to sit a man to even things out? If not, then sitting out David is puzzling for his chances in this group. This was described as combination Immunity/Reward so why sit a man in a physical contest unless he’s not feeling well?
For the challenge, we saw that the pool was too small for Grant, that he could be as strong a swimmer as Ozzy if there are more water challenges.
Note that Ashley, Andrea, Sarita and Julie were the chosen swimmer for the women. They wanted to show their athletic abilities but it didn’t exactly work: Andrea did a belly-flop and Sarita didn’t impress anyone.
Stephanie proved to be a better lock-picker than Natalie and that is what essentially cost Ometepe the challenge yet we didn’t hear no one blaming Natalie. That was a good sign for her because it probably was brought up, especially during Phillip “debriefing”.
Phillip and Ralph did all the throwing, leaving Krista and Kristina in the role of ball retriever.
After Zapatera won the challenge, we saw Matthew walking over to them to shake Steven’s hand. That gesture didn’t escape Rob who was shown asking Grant: “What is he doing?” Note that Ralph was seen holding out his hand to Matt but stopping and looking back in Jeff’s direction, as if told to stay away by the host and rules enforcer. Matt left and returned to his side with a disgusted gesture in Jeff’s direction.
Rob: “Matt shaking the opposition’s hand after we lost, was despicable. When we just got our asses kicked, not once but twice, back-to-back, I’m not going to the other team to give them hugs and kisses.”
Russell made sure he’d get the basket of goodies to bring back to camp and he didn’t ask for help to carry it!
Zapatera
Day 5
Russell: “We just won the challenge so I grabbed the basket because I know that, if there was going to be a clue, it was going to be in that basket. As I’m walking, I see the clue sliding out of the flippers. I didn’t say anything to anybody after I arrived and the clue; I just put it in my hand. I know this game, this isn’t my first rodeo.”
The others, particularly Mike again, were congratulating Ralph on his awesome shooting demonstration.
Ralph: “When we come back to camp I seen Russell with a little rolled up piece of paper. I say to myself: He has got that daggone clue out of that daggone basket. Russell; he is going to pay the price because it is not Russell’s game. This is my game!”
Julie was heard (!) agreeing with Ralph: “From now on, we take the reward.”
Russell went off with his girls to read the clue and laugh at Sarita’s poor swimming skills. Stephanie even borrowed a line from Courtney, saying that Sarita “sucks at life.”
Mike: “After our victory, Sarita came and told me that in the fishing gear that we won there was a clue. Russell stuffed it in his pocket, Ralph saw it. He knew. That’s what comes from experience because he knew the clue was in there. The guy is the most untrustworthy character I’ve ever met in my life. You preach over and over that this game is about trust and who you can go deep with but, if we’re in this together, show me some faith and share the clue”
So, there were some unseen discussions between Russell and Mike to go deep together. We had only been shown Mike acting against Russell but there was/is something hidden between them. And how will Mike react if he finds out that Ralph had the idol all along? Isn’t that an even bigger show of distrust?
During Mike’s confessional, we saw Russell handing to clue to Stephanie and Krista to read. (He had asked Parvati to read JT’s note, so this is another indication that he may just be unable to read.)
Russell: “I have three people, three votes. Is Russell counting himself or does he have a third, unseen ally? That could be the key to Zapatera’s next vote. “That’s all I need. I’ve never had numbers but I always make it to the end. I don’t need no stinking numbers? All I need is trust, loyalty. That’s how I play this game.”
Mike joined the threesome at the water-well and agreed that Sarita was weak. It was only when Ralph came in that the talks became confrontational. Ralph directly asked Russell if there was a clue in the basket.
Ralph said it was their clue since they all won it.
We saw David joining the group.
Russell denied there was a clue.
Russell threatened: “You are either with me or against me…I don’t like how you are coming at me. I know how to play this game. Are you trying to tell me how to play the game?”
Ralph replied: “This ole boy here does too”. He walked away.
Ralph: “He’s got it. That’s all right, I already have one. I didn’t need it. I’ll play his game. I’ll show him how smart I can be. Right on!”
Russell: “What the hell was that? Ralph went off. He says he knows how to play this game. He’s like: “I know how to play this game too. Really? You just done that? To me? To Russell Hantz? And you know how to play this game?”
Redemption Island showed us that Francesca received her luxury item, a journal.
Ometepe
Rob: “We get back from the challenge and once again we have to endure the pre-tribal council before tribal council.”
Phillip said they should be proud of their effort and apologized for not performing as well as they did. Note that nothing was said about Natalie losing their lead.
Rob stepped up and said they win or lose as a team.
Rob: “Phillip blew the challenge, plain and simple, but when we just got our asses kicked twice, Matt goes over to congratulate the other team. Matt is trying to play the good Christian, the good social game and the end game on day friggin’ five! Wake up, brother.”

Kristina (wearing the idol around her neck): “Tonight, I am playing the idol. I don’t have a choice. They still have enough votes to vote off whoever they want so there’s no way they are going to take a chance and not give me the majority and let me slip by again. So, I’m playing it for sure which is really sad.”
With Grant and Ashley, Rob sealed Matt’s fate. (What was that tarp that Rob had over his shoulder?)
Grant (the editors choosing a good time to give us the opinion of an ex-NFL player): “It’s not something you want to see when you are in the heat of the moment of a challenge you just lost: Your team mate going over and shaking hands. I don’t know. There’s a time and place for those things and that wasn’t one of those times.”
Rob: “The first plan was to vote for Phillip or Andrea but Matt is getting four votes. I didn’t want to play Survivor like this, I really didn’t. I wanted to keep my team strong. I get it; Matt’s playing Survivor, he’s playing textbook but he’s playing with me!”
Andrea (in confessional after talking with the other five): “The plan is to split the votes: The guys vote for Phillip, the girls for Kristina. We’re assuming that Kristina will use her immunity idol and Phillip will go home.”
Rob: “As far as Matt and Andrea are concerned, we are going to split the votes 3-3, the girls are voting for Kristine, the guys are voting for Phillip but, in actuality, none of that is happening: Myself, Ashley, Natalie and Grant are voting for Matt. And Kristine, she better play that idol. If she does and, with Andrea and Matt, it’s a homerun.”
Matt: “Every day, Rob impresses me. It is unbelievable how well he can talk to people, play this game and see what they need and fulfill that need. It’s absolutely amazing.”
Rob was walking with Phillip, telling him he would be fine, warning him about going on a tirade, making it appear as if he knew he was going home but waiting for Rob to put his hand on someone’s shoulder to know who would be the target.
Rob: “Phillip’s a tough cookie. I have to wait until one minute before tribal council. I may even have to wait until Tribal council to tell him who to vote for because Phillip likes to talk a lot. This will be a good test to see if Phillip does what he says he’s going to do. If he does, he can start to earn his way back into the rotation. If I get there tonight and Phillip starts telling everybody what I told him, Phillip will be sent packing.”
Tribal Council
Kristina explained that she had a feeling that she didn’t need to play the idol the last time.
Phillip explained about the gorilla and the lion and how he felt about his family and the US.
Rob said he understood how Phillip felt.
Matt said Phillip was an asset but in this game it could happen like that.
Phillip said that he wouldn’t lay down and die in Redemption Island.
Matt said they wondered how many people were coming back from RI and when.
Jeff didn’t answer that.
With that, in a very Judas-like move, Rob caught Phillip’s attention and put his hand on Kristina’s shoulder.
Kristina played her idol.
After Jeff revealed the vote, Andrea was stunned while Matt simply said it was good work and to have fun.
Jeff congratulated them for their vicious blindside.
In Redemption Island, Matt said Rob had set him of to have the biggest comeback in Survivor history.
The Story
In this episode, the two big rivals explained their games to us: Russell wants to have 2 completely loyal allies and thinks he can take any majority alliance. Rob’s game consists of having one perfect partner inside the strong alliance. That puts their partners, Stephanie, Krista and Natalie, in a very strong position if not in the game then in the edited story. If one of them is going to be the star of the season, then I prefer Natalie’s chances because Rob’s plan spoke of going to the end, Russell of making it to the merge And, maybe it was a hint but Phillip told us that outlasting the women would be a different matter than outlasting men.

The Characters
Matt: I had mentioned that his portrayal in the first episode looked like the prelude to a prolonged, monastic stay on Redemption Island and his words about the biggest comeback in Survivor history was a continuation of that. I will keep an eye out for Matt and certainly not count him out just yet.
The Players without a story
Julie: She seems to be against Russell, saying they had to keep the reward baskets away from him but until we see her vote or have a confessional, we don’t know where she stands. It certainly shouldn’t be in the winner’s circle.
Sarita: Once more, she was relegated to the one observing Russell and telling Mike about his actions. We didn’t learn anything about Sarita except that she was considered weak in the challenge. She could be sacrificed in order to keep Zapatera winning.
Grant: I believe his confessional served only to make Rob’s decision palatable. After all, if an ex-NFL player (even if he could get a question mark after that job description because he didn’t play many games in the NFL!) says that what Matt did was unacceptable then it makes the vote understandable.
Steve: Besides showing he can compete, Steve’s story is still sitting on the bench.
David: After a brief stint in the big leagues, it seems that David was sent back to the minors. As I wrote above, unless Jeff said that Zapatera had to sit a man, it was troubling that he was the one designated to sit out a challenge that was for both reward and challenge. If Zapatera could sit anyone and they chose him then it would be bad for David’s game: Just like Sarita, he could be sacrificed despite the tribe’s divisions. If Jeff’s comment were edited out, it would be bad for David’s edit: The editors didn’t care to protect him from being seen as weak by the audience.
Ashley: This rookie is still with the big team but her role is very limited. Much like a player that comes in during the 8th inning just for defensive purposes, Ashley is only asked to come in when it’s time to vote.
The Opposing Forces:
Kristina: Just like her confessionals in this episode, it seemed that Kristina’s story was simply connected to the idol. I doubt she will be seen as a victim when she is voted out, just a necessary move by the tribe. She has shown a nice personality and an ability to laugh at herself in this game but I doubt she can make it back in the rotation unless there’s a switch coming up.
Phillip: Coach used to have confessionals that sounded epic while others were shown laughing at him but Coach was mostly talking about his own grandeur. Phillip has a nobler story to tell, even if he talks about himself in the third person. Must be that stress! The editors seem to be telling us that it’s ok to laugh at Phillip but that he is a good guy. I’m really interested in seeing how his story develops.
Ralph : Is this the edit of the new Fan Favorite? There’s no doubt that Ralph could be set-up to fall to the legend of Russell, the editors making him look more surrounded by allies than he really is but, for now, I see him outwitting Russell, sending him to Redemption Island where his story will quickly end. Ralph’s own story seems much more promising but, again, we have to see Zapatera’s first tribal Council. Ralph is hard to understand but his last confessional, where he said he had “one” made me wonder if players could think there is more than one idol available.
Mike: He seems determined to vote out Russell but is that editing manipulation? Why would he say he was expecting that they were “in this together”? Maybe Russell had said that about the whole tribe but let’s not forget that Russell’s true alliance at the start of Samoa was with the guys, Ben, Mick and Jaison. The dumb blondes were being kept around to vote as he wanted.
Andrea: There is a nice consistent edit about this player that was just thrown out of the majority alliance. We’ve had enough confessionals about her to make her likable to the audience. Had she been ignored, she could have been voted out next and people wouldn’t care. Why did the editors care enough about Andrea to introduce us to her? They’ve made her into a likable underdog which is always a big character in Survivor lore.
The Big Sluggers:
Rob: So much for the “Jesus-Rob” angle to the story! If Rob is going to have any god-like qualities it will be that of a vengeful god. I will note however that Matt’s elimination was thoroughly explained to the viewers. It seemed that the editors wanted us to feel that Rob didn’t have a choice. We heard him say that he didn’t want to play like this (even if that was exactly what he did to Hunter and Cesternino) and we heard Rob say that he had a plan to get to the end. Much more than the first episode, this one made me think that Rob will win his duel with Russell but that should be the extent of his victory. This isn’t his game. We heard that said about the previous returnees, BJ and Stephenie. We heard it said about Russell. It should be also the way potential jurors would feel about Rob even if he got there.
Russell: Is Russell being edited to be out-Russelled? He’s shown saying his game is about having a small group of loyal players and using the idol to make it to the end but we hear him repeatedly bashing the one person that found the idol without a clue, Russell’s own big claim to survivor fame.
The Perfect Partners
Krista: She really should be in the players without a story but Russell put her in this group and we know Russell Hantz: The women he chooses outlast him! If Zapatera decides to keep Russell for his muscles, Krista could be the one sacrificed. That is about all her story tells me thus far.
Stephanie: She was still a big part of the story but we didn’t hear it from her point of view so it seems she is more part of Russell’s story than having one of her own. We’ll have to wait to see if she does or says anything to get out of Russell’s shadow and if they do something about those stinking numbers. Right now, I see her as sinking with Russell’s ship.
Natalie: Speaking of saying something to get out of a big player’s shadow, that’s what Natalie’s confessional sounded like. It was short but it was very well placed, coming right after Rob told us she was his perfect partner to take to the end. If Natalie’s role would have been to serve only as Rob’s puppet, we wouldn’t have heard that confessional. Players that do poorly in challenges but that don't receive blame from others are usually spared by the editors for a reason. She told us she’d be doing some big moves so I’m keeping an eye out for her story.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-01-11, 02:18 PM (EST)

11. "RE: Episode #2: Editing Thoughts"

Wow, I am surprised that we haven't had more reaction to such a shocking episode. Boy, color me surprised...! Again I won't go over alot of things that I noted but may refer to michel's astute obersvations. Rob firmly took control over at Ometepe, as the narrator, director, dictator...I don't know what to make of an episode where we only heard once from him, to one where he was so dominant with confessionals. As a BR fan, it has me worried. I couldn't help thinking that Rob may have just cut off his own foot, by getting rid of Matt. Regardless of Rob's rationale, which we certainly heard....he doesn't trust the couple, as look at he and Amber. He's(Matt) too good, playing the social game on day 5, etc. It did seem as though Rob gave the final choice of Andrea or Matt to the group though, and Grant chose Matt. Grant was seen noting Andrea's challenge performance....that may bode well for BR, I don't know.
Matt is being set up for Redemption Island, and his solitary life I think, which may bode well for him there. We have been given alot more of Matt than Francesca, so I would favor Matt for succeeding over Francesca on RI.
Couldn't agree more, Rob's savior image went right down the toilet. He seems like he does however have his eye on the prize and he's playing to win. I found myself re-thinking his previous game play and soothed myself with noting that he did target Hunter and Rob Cesternino early as well, as michel noted, but this was swift, bold, and ruthless, which I don't think Rob was before. Is this what you call changing your old game up, or adapting? Seems like it's time for damage control and unification, and it seems that is what we see Rob attempting in the preview promo. Will it work? It seems as though he does have Phillip's vote, yet he's been so erratic, I don't know if he can be depended upon, as Rob noted. Regardless, when this episode ended, alarm bells were going off for me concerning Rob's longevity.
Now, at the challenge there was some interesting narrating by Jiffy, paired with selective close-up shots of the daws....When Jiffy spoke at the challenge, where the loser will face TC, and one will go to RI....He specifically said, Someone will be going to Redemption Island, zoom in on RUSSHELL, with DAVID on one side of him, and ROOSTER on the other side of him, all three in the frame. ...and will have to face off, zoom in on STEVE alone, against Francesca, after he says this the camera zooms in on KRISTINA then JULIE, in a duel.
This makes me believe that Russhell, (David/Rooster), Steve, Kristina and Julie will all be at RI sooner rather than later...hmmmm? I also found it intriguiging that all of the ones zoomed in on during this narration were ALL from Zapatera....hmmm?
AS we have seen before, there were many zoom ins on Matt at the end of the challenge when Jiffy is talking about having to go to TC. When they shot them leaving, Matt was featured.
AS far as drama that is mounting....definitely we are being set up for a RussHell vs. Rooster show down. Rooster found the idol without a clue, he tells RussHell that "this ole boy knows how to play this game, too", while RussHell calls him the dumbest player, person ever...seems to me that Rooster has scored one, zero for RussHell. RussHell is made to look like a fool, Rooster has bested him at his own game, and we see RussHell revert back to the same game he's always played. He's not adjusting/adapting, as it appears Rob is with a vengeance. Will this spell disaster for RussHell or will the same game plan work the same way it has for his past 2 seasons? Time will tell. The editing is making me think that RussHell will be going down. Could be misdirection, I don't know. Rooster has already told us that "he's a dumb a$$, will he know what to do with the idol?
The editing also makes me feel that camp Zapatera is somewhat polarized. RussHell and "concubines" on one side, everyone else on the other....don't know how divisive it is yet though, as many of Zapatera's tribe remains hidden.
I also liked Natalie's confessional as well, right after Rob said he was going to carry her all the way to the end. It gives me hope, IF she gets there, doesn't it stand to reason at this point that Rob will be there too?
Grant seemed like a GREAT presence in the challenge.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-01-11, 03:07 PM (EST)

12. "RE: Episode #2: Editing Thoughts"

To some extent I believe CBS/SEG are trying to recapture some of the season 1 sense of the game, which the Redemption Island twist permits in that it is a genuine game changing twist. That makes for difficulty trying to get a real handle on what we are being shown as the familiar comfortable is getting shaken up.
Factionalization is the focus in these early episodes, though, that is still a normal in the game. People naturally form into factions in real life, how they do it in the game is no different except that it is amplified, intensified, within the parameters of the game.
On Zapatera the factionalization has occured along Russell's "you're either with me or against me" approach, it was virtually built in given his history and the familiarity the players do have with him. (Intrinsically each player is actually for him or herself, Russell's game approach merely simplifies the process for himself and, consequently, the other players as well.) We've seen a Pro-Russell faction develope and an anti-Russell faction develop, but some of the pieces have been left as unknowns. Which faction will emerge dominant will remain unknown until Zapatera has their first Tribal.
On Ometepe Rob was able to create a strong faction, his Solid Six, and emerge dominant over the anti-Rob faction of Kristina, Francesca and Phillip on the fence. But then he turned around and dismantled that Solid Six, fearing Matt's long game would work against him. He now has a Solid Four, enough to remain dominant in Ometepe short term. Andrea may still make it a Solid Five, her options are limited. Phillip has been positioned to move into a vacated spot in Rob's faction but Rob really doesn't know what to make of the guy. Kristina was left entirely out instead of being cultivated to add herself and the HII to the group, played the HII instead, so now it just has to be found again. Natalie is really the only player Rob has secured, the others may start to question Rob's leadership and motives if they don't start winning.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-01-11, 07:24 PM (EST)

13. "RE: Episode #2: Editing Thoughts"

FP, you are right, I was hearing a lot of echo in here. Glad you and Dabo joined in. Nice job noting those mentioned when Jeff talked about RI again. I copy/pasted my episode #1 remark of RI and your recent addition:
"it was Matthew’s surprised reaction that we heard first... The camera also panned to Kristina, Krista, Ashley, Francesca and David while Jeff explained the living conditions on the island... Russell was the one shown when Jeff explained the duels. After that the cameras showed Mike, Grant, Steve, Boston Rob before we went back to Russell when Jeff said the words “out of the game for good."

"Someone will be going to Redemption Island, zoom in on RUSSHELL, with DAVID on one side of him, and ROOSTER on the other side of him, all three in the frame. ...and will have to face off, zoom in on STEVE alone, against Francesca, after he says this the camera zooms in on KRISTINA then JULIE, in a duel."
Now, noting that Matt and Francesca were seen during the first talk of RI, it gives importance to those shown. I especially consider those shown both times because they include Kristina and she just HAS to go there soon, no?! The others with double appearances are David, Steve, Ralph and Russell.
As for Rob's decision, I'm starting to reconsider my first reaction. I still think it would have been better to vote Andrea but Phillip is a really big guy that could be helpful in brute strength challenges. And, for Rob, he is a very loyal vote. While Phillip's mouth is dangerous, I don't see him as a loose canon as far as the vote goes. The move to get rid of Matt is bad for Grant and Ashley because now Rob has 2 closer allies if it comes to those 5...as long as they don't go down to 5 as quickly as Ulong...or Mara'amu!!

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-05-11, 06:26 PM (EST)

14. "Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

Jeff told us that “18 people entered the game but 2 had played before…
…At the Zapatera tribe, Russell told everyone that he had changed…”
<We hear a new confessional by Russell where he swears he is trying to gain trust only to stab them in the back>
“He lied. Then he made an alliance with the two youngest women on the beach and went hunting for the hidden immunity idol.
But it was Ralph who found it.
Despite the loss, Rob was still in control…
<We hear Matt saying he is amazed at how well Rob plays the game>
But then Rob took his game to an even higher level so he convinced Phillip to be a decoy and pretend he was being voted out…
…and he let Kristina think that, if she didn’t play her immunity idol, she would go home.
At tribal council, everything went as planned…
…allowing Rob to break up a potentially powerful alliance between Andrea and Matt.
Matt was completely blindsided. Now he heads to Redemption Island to take on Francesca in a duel, leaving Andrea wondering where she stands with Rob.
Jeff was already telling us that Rob is a much better player than Russell. Russell couldn’t change his game but Rob was able to take his to a higher level and there isn’t even a question whether or not he made the right choice in voting out a strong player. From this interpretation, we can deduce that Ometepe will flourish under Rob’s leadership.
This episode could have been titled:
Cutting Out the Cancer

Redemption Island
Night 5
Francesca: “Matt got blindsided. I thought that seeing any part of Rob’s alliance tonight was an impossibility.”
Matt: “I feel sick to my stomach right now…I guess I just trusted Boston too soon. It’s brutal…but, at the same time, what an opportunity: To be the underdog and come back from Redemption Island and finish this game with a million dollars.”
Ometepe
Rob: “Tonight couldn’t have gone any better. Not only do we blindside Matt, we were able to get Kristina to get rid of her idol and Phillip was a loyal soldier. Tonight, I’m sitting in a good spot on this tribe but tomorrow, when I get up, I need to get Andrea feeling OK about everything because she is smart enough to know that we double-crossed her and she will definitely hold that resentment.”
We went back to Redemption Island to see Matt and Francesca reading tree mail telling them to get ready for battle.
Zapatera
Day 6
David: “Tree mail today, basically said that 2 people from the tribe were going to go to Redemption Island. Steve and I ended up to be the two to go to the duel. I’m not exactly sure what to expect but I’m glad that Russell, Stephanie and Krista didn’t have the opportunity to go so they don’t have an idea of what’s there.”
Ometepe
Andrea: “We picked marbles and Ashley and I get to go and watch the duel between Fran and Matt so I’m pretty excited. It’s probably more about seeing Matt because we were really close. I think that if he realizes that I wasn’t the one that voted him out, he can come back and be an asset for me to have.”
Rob: “We had to send two people to what we think is Redemption island. We’ve got Andrea and Ashley both going over there. What I don’t want is Andrea getting smart and talking to Matt, her island boyfriend. I just don’t want her getting any ideas.”
Note the obvious cut during Rob’s words of “Andrea getting smart” {cut} “and talking to Matt”. Was there something else that Rob didn’t want, like Andrea talking to Ashley? Whatever it was, this confessional was placed after we heard Andrea saying she wanted to do exactly what Rob feared. It’s uncertain whether that means the couple will eventually get their revenge on Rob or if he will be able to come out on top again. Either way, I see it as a sign that there will be a showdown between Rob and Andrea. If Matt is part of that showdown as he appears to be, then that can only happen well down the road because I don’t think anyone will be returning from RI before the merge. The camera angle gave Rob an air of superiority, maybe even arrogance, which wasn’t necessarily to his advantage.
The Duel.
We only had a raised eyebrow from Steve when Jeff mentioned that Matt was the second competitor.
Andrea said: “I didn’t vote for either of them.”
Matt mentioned he would have a great underdog story if he came back and made it all the way to the end.
Steve (after the challenge): “Going to Redemption Island was an eye-opener, there might be an opportunity here. There might be a curveball for Russell to tell him that Francesca won the challenge and sent Matt home.”
Ometepe
Ashley told everyone that Matt was pissed and wanted to come back to get his revenge which got a surprised look from Grant.
Rob: “Redemption island is real. I mean, there’s a chance that Matt could run the gamut over there and get back into this game. Andrea will go back to Matt before she’ll stay with me. I know that. So, I got my work cut out for me with Andrea.”
We next heard their conversation, Rob telling Andrea that it wasn’t only his decision, that all 4 voted for Matt. He assured her that Kristina and Phillip were going before her. She mostly stared at him with sad eyes.
Andrea: “I talked to Rob and he assured me that I’m still part of their five even though I’m probably in a very sticky position. Right now, strategically, it’s smart to stay with them and make sure they don’t think that I’m scheming but I just don’t believe them. So, I need some way I can mix things up because, deep down, I am still really pissed about what they did, that they took my good friend away.”
Rob better be careful not to believe the sad woman behind blue eyes.
A shark accompanied us to Zapatera where Steve was telling Russell, Sarita, Mike and Julie that “the black chick ended up pulling the thing off, the blond guy, he’s gone.”
Steve: “We came back from Redemption Island and we told Russell that Matt was sent home. So, whenever we vote Russell out, he’s going to see Matt who could be quite a challenge for him and, hopefully, we will never see Russell again.”
As soon as Russell walked away, Steve told his group that Matt had won and they made a 6 way pact.
Russell: “I know it is 6 to 3 so right now the most important thing is finding the idol…”
Ralph: “Russell and them is looking for the idol as hard as they can look but he’s not going to get it because I’ve got it. I ain’t saying nothing about it. It’s not Russell’s game anymore, it’s my game.”
Stephanie came up with the idea of making a fake idol.
Stephanie: “The great thing with Russell is that he has a great résumé with immunity idols that he’s found on his own. So, we are going to fake that we have an idol and I’m hoping that people believe that I am protecting the idol but right now it’s just a blank check with no money in the bank account.”
Steve noticed that she seemed to be holding gold in her bag.
Steve: “We knew that Russell and his little harem got the first immunity idol clue. Stephanie is carrying her bag around acting like she has the idol in there. Russell is always plotting and scheming. You just don’t want the guy around. He’s going to do everything he can to backstab you so, we have to got to sure we do everything that we can to stay on our toes until the cancer is cut out.”
Zapatera
Day 8
Mike: “Russell has got some funk going on with his armpits. He shaved them up and now he has pus filled rash…He sits in the tent with his concubines and does nothing. He’s like a black hole.”
Steve mentioned that they could throw a challenge even if it hasn’t been a very successful move.
Steve: “There isn’t anything bigger at this point than getting rid of Russell. He’s an irritant and we cannot have him laying around and potentially biting anyone of us.”
Steve made his proposal to the rest of the group. David was hesitant, Julie hated the fact that it could get Ometepe on a roll.
Julie: “They are thinking of throwing our next challenge. I am just torn about that because I like to compete and I can deal with Russell.”
The group finally agreed to wait for the challenge and give a thumb’s up to signal they were throwing it.
The Challenge
Despite the comfort items, Sarita immediately gave the signal: Thumb’s up!
David: “There’s definitely a big trade-up between keeping Russell around and getting a tarp but the plan right now is to throw the challenge. Hopefully the end result is worth it.”
Ralph and Sarita sat out.
Rob told his tribe he’d do the puzzle.
Julie was told to miss the bucket.
Julie: “It’s a decision I am not really feeling right with.”
Jeff noticed that Julie missed the bucket while Zapatera was slowing down, Steve apparently wearing out.
Rob had a big head start and David didn’t come close, Russell and Jeff noticing he was barely working.
Russell : “If I didn’t know any better, I’d say they threw the challenge…I’m dealing with a bunch of bitches.”
Somewhere, Marisa must have been smiling, asking “how dare they sabotage the tribe?!”
Ometepe
Day 8
Rob: “We won today’s immunity and reward challenge and, normally, that would put me through the roof happy, but now, we have those little things called hidden immunity idols. Now, I know enough that there’s probably a clue to that hidden immunity idol somewhere hidden within our reward. It’s almost as if there was no time to celebrate because everybody is looking for where the clue could be. The game is always on. In the past, I ignored the hidden immunity idol. Well, that didn’t turn out too good for me. This time around, I decided: Maybe I could learn something too. So, I’m starting to look for them and I’m starting to be diligent about it. I went through everything and it was nowhere. I look over and I see Phillip’s fat ass bending the chair, about to break it. I looked down and the hidden immunity idol clue was right underneath his ass. It’s sown inside the fabric of the chair. How lucky was that? Had Phillip not been so fat, that chair wouldn’t have been bending as much and I wouldn’t have told him to move. The clue basically could have read: “The hidden immunity idol is somewhere.” It could be anywhere. I’m happy I found the clue because I know nobody else found the clue but I don’t plan on telling anybody about the clue ‘cause I want the idol for me.”
Zapatera
Day 8
Ralph: “Well, it was a thrown challenge because we do got to get Russell out, quick as possible. Russell thinks he runs the show and he don’t. He’s not my boss and he’s not bossing me.”
Mike was shown saying they had to stick to the plan.
David: “The plan tonight is to give three votes to Russell and three votes to Stephanie in the absolutely remote event that Russell did find the idol. If things work as planned, tonight Russell will go home.”
At that instant, the camera focused on Russell’s “Keep Hope Alive” tattoo. He was telling his girls that it was dumb to throw a challenge when you are only 2 up.
Russell : “I think they threw the challenge. It makes me sick to my stomach because you have to win right now. You can’t give Boston Rob momentum, not in this game.”
I noted that this was quite a reasonable confessional. Russell, undoubtedly had some personal resentments towards being the target to the point of having a challenge thrown but the words we heard weren’t about his personal plight, only the tribe’s. I think this tells us that the audience should not consider this a good move; that Zapatera will not come out of this well.
Stephanie: “At tonight’s tribal council, we were thinking that the votes will be split 3, 3 and 3 because they would want to flush out the idol and get rid of one of us. All it would take is for one of their six to flip on them and vote with us so we would get the majority of the votes.”
This is also a well thought out confessional, Stephanie not making any emotional outbursts. It’s not hard to imagine that the editors had the material to show her angry side at this time but we only saw her calculating side. Again, that is not good for the story of the Zapatera 6.
Russell ordered Stephanie to go talk to “the old lady.” Stephanie made a very compelling argument.
Julie: “This is a game turner right here, this vote. So, it’s a lot of pressure. I have thought it out both ways. Should I go with Russell? Should I trust him because I know how good he is? ”
Stephanie confidently reported to Russell that Julie was on their side, that they were about to do the biggest blindside ever.
Russell decided it was time to talk to Julie himself. He told her he’d have her back and that the vote should go against Ralph.
Julie seemed surprised that Ralph was the target. Did this change her mind? I know that, when you are asking for someone to flip, you should at least ask how they want to vote. Simple courtesy, simple logic. But, just like he did with Laura, Russell had to impose his will.
Russell: “If this happens: Game on! This will be the biggest move, bigger than any move I ever made. It will be a shocker.”
Tribal Council
Asked about coming to TC, Ralph said: “It’s good and it’s bad. I was told we had two parts in our game…We got two teams in the same team.”
Steve: “There are six of us that are pretty rock solid and then there is another three led by Russell.”
Sarita: “It has a lot to do with Russell and his legacy. Russell had given this great speech how he was going to play differently, but that turned out not to be the case so there was a huge fissure in the tribe.”
Russell: “The problem is that everybody perceives me as that legacy where I would try to lose by burning socks, pouring water. I am not playing that game. I came to win challenges, not to lose challenges. From where I stood, it felt to me that a lot of people gave up on the challenge. It felt that they threw the challenge.”
<Steve was shown shaking his head in faked disbelief.>
Mike: “I’d say today we didn’t go 100%. We definitely wanted to win but, if we lost, we got some fat on this tribe that we need to trim off.”
Julie: “Personally, I would like to merge with as many people as possible, weak or strong, whether we get along or not. I think we need to go into the merge with numbers.”
Stephanie: “I think the majority of the tribe forgets that we are in the game of Survivor. This is Russell. He’s played the game. He would be a huge part of moving forward. He’s done it, twice. One way or another, there are going to be back-stabbings made so, if you want to become best friends right now, that’s fine, but your best friend, to the left of you or to the right of you, is going to turn around and stab you in the back…”
David interjected: “What she fails to realize is that we came back and told the group…”
Stephanie: “I’m still talking, thank you.”
David: “Ooh! Feisty!”
Stephanie: “Having numbers in the merge is what you need to take over the other tribe. We were two people above them so, throwing the challenge today wasn’t strategy, it was plain stupidity. That’s all.”
Jeff told Steve that an incohesive group of 9 is an advantage over a tight 6 that is down at the merge.
Steve: “It stunk not winning today.”
Jeff: “So, you are saying, absolutely not, you guys didn’t throw the challenge.”
Steve: “We did not throw the challenge. I worked my tail off and I think everybody else did too.”
Jeff turned to David: “So, you got your ass kicked by Rob.”
David: “Rob beat me.”
Stephanie: “Really?”
David: “Just because the hands aren’t moving, doesn’t mean the mind isn’t working.”
Asked what was scary about Russell, Sarita said: “It’s a sickness almost. It’s a huge black cloud over everything that we do. He does nothing at camp…”
Stephanie interrupted by saying: “Oh, my God. I’m going to lose my ___. I can’t hear HER saying that Russell doesn’t do anything. He gets firewood. Don’t say he doesn’t do anything. Wake up.”
Jeff turned to Ralph who, apparently, said: “She doesn’t do anything at all to help catch fish but she’s eating it.”
Jeff made a big prediction: “You are so divided that you are in trouble come the merge.”
Before the vote, Russell said he still had hope, that “it never is what it seems.”
We heard Sarita’s confessional as she voted against Stephanie: “You are so misguided and so rude.”
It took two votes before finishing the job but Russell was sent to Redemption Island.
As he grabbed his torch, Russell said: “I’ll be back. Be ready.”
Ralph rejoined: “I’ll be ready.”
Stephanie, glaring at Julie, menaced: “Storm’s a coming.”
Jeff left them with these final words: “You just voted out one of the most successful players in the history of Survivor. The question is: Will this decision come back to haunt you?”
The Story
This episode showed us a tribe in division going against one that is much more united. Even if Zapatera cut out its cancerous cell, we can already see that the disease has spread. They couldn’t admit that they threw the challenge which could irritate Julie. Ralph put a lot on the line by keeping his idol a secret and they still have a feisty competitor causing some worries. In comparison, Ometepe’s own problems are much more benign. Certainly, if they don’t take care of them, they could infect the whole body of the tribe but it seems that Andrea and Kristina are staying quiet. In short, it seems that the edit is favoring Ometepe over Zapatera, Jeff telling us that they are led by Rob at the top of his game while Zapatera is in trouble. I will be very curious to see what next week’s recap will tell us about Zapatera’s decision. I expect it will be presented very negatively. Of special interest was the fact that Zapatera’s move was mostly presented by players we hadn’t met: Steve and David presented the move, Julie was the key while Sarita was their voice at Tribal Council. They were much more in evidence than Mike and even Ralph.
The Characters

On Redemption Island
Russell : We know the promos will feature his battle on Redemption Island and his final words match with his opening episode confessional that RI would be a vacation but it feels like the end for Russell because of…
Matt: He has what feels like a long term story. He told us that he is looking forward to the role of underdog; that he wants the comeback story and he seems to be on a journey story since his opening confessional. We even heard him say how terrible the living conditions were on the island, how it was tough to be alone which makes the audience feel for this good guy’s story. Of course, Matt could be part of the attempt to sell the concept of Redemption Island to the viewers but, if he goes on a winning streak, he has all the right winning quotes.
The Outsiders
Kristina: It seems her story was simply that of holder of the idol. We had no comments from her after a tribal council where she thought she’d get votes and must be questioning her position in the tribe. To me, that means she will be Ometepe’s next vote, doubts centering only on whether or not she can find a second idol. In that sense, we‘ve already seen her digging around camp.
Krista: Her thoughts don’t seem important.
Stephanie: Before her outburst after Sarita’s words at TC, Stephanie’s portrayal was quite positive in this episode. She defended her leader but she went about it in a clinical fashion. What she said “made sense” as Julie admitted. She seems to be Zapatera’s next vote but there might be something else to her story. She could outlast one of the Zapatera 6.
Andrea: Of the 4 outsiders, Andrea offers the best long term prospects. Her future may require a winning streak or a tribal switch but she does seem to have legs. Her presentation could simply be to sell the concept of Redemption Island, giving it more potential than what we actually get to witness, but it sounds that she will reunite with Matt and cause Rob some problems.
The Followers
Sarita: On the surface she appears to be safe and she was well-spoken at TC so why haven’t we heard more from her? I think what we saw is troubling for her future. She was the one that was shown raising her thumb to throw the challenge and what she said at Tribal Council must have irritated all those that are of the opinion that Russell is “a huge part of moving forward”. Note that we’ve heard that she was weak in challenges last weak while, this week, Stephanie implied that Sarita doesn’t work in camp.
Julie: She was key in voting out Russell yet we hadn’t met her and we barely got to hear her thoughts on this most crucial vote. It told me that Julie’s role was confined to give us a bit of suspense for this episode. We weren’t told what could possibly have made her change her mind. Was it that she didn’t want to target Ralph? I doubt she will get a bigger episode than this one before it’s her time to go.
Ashley: She went to Redemption Island with someone that had been her ally but whom she had betrayed just the night before but we heard nothing from Ashley except when she told the tribe that Matt was pissed and was seeking revenge. She seems safely within Ometepe’s core alliance so she should go far. Far enough to fall when the vengeful Matt returns? Maybe.
Grant: He had even less airtime, his only close-up was to show his surprise that Matt wanted vengeance. It gave me the feeling that he will also suffer Matt’s wrath. Will it be at Redemption Island or after Matt returns?
Phillip: Regarding strategy, many say it is dumb to accept the fifth spot in an alliance but I always say that, this early, it is only important to be in the alliance. Numbers can always shift and a fifth could suddenly become the swing vote. All this to say that I do not know exactly what the editors were telling us when Phillip gave his word of honor to Rob who was only offering him the fifth spot. It could be to tell us that Phillip doesn’t understand the game but I think it bodes very well for him. In a season where the amateurs have to learn not to give up too much, he has regained his cool.
David: By choosing to let us hear his confessional at the challenge, saying he was throwing it, the editors told us that he openly lied at Tribal Council and didn’t do it very well because no one believed him. That isn’t the way the eventual winner would have been portrayed. He has received a more consistent character development than Sarita, Julie and Steve but there is something lacking in David’s portrayal and that is a personal touch.
Mike: There are two schools of thought on Mike’s edit in this episode: On one hand, he was sparred the blame of getting rid of Russell who is a very popular player (in certain circles!) and he wasn’t mentioned as doing anything to throw the challenge. The audience could almost believe he was simply not giving his 100% which would be excusable if everyone else was giving zero effort. On the other hand, Mike is being confined to the role of narrator of Zapatera, his confessional this time centering on Russell’s rotting flesh. I’m not ready to choose which side I think his story will go, therefore I see him as the only Zapatera with a shot to pull off the win.
Natalie : Rob’s perfect partner was ignored in this episode but since she wasn’t chosen to go to Redemption Island and this was the episode where a huge character on the opposite tribe was being voted out, I don’t think it matters to her long term prospects. It was probably sufficient that she was shown doing her job in the challenge.
The Leaders
Steve: From the role of an extra, used only to cheer for Zapatera, Steve was pushed into the role of mastermind, getting the first confessional about throwing the challenge, denying it at TC, even showing complete disbelief at the mere thought. If Steve was going to get to the end playing such a devious game, we would have gotten to know him. It takes time for the audience to appreciate a puppet-master and Steve is still an unknown character that simply couldn’t stand Russell. His role in throwing the challenge was underlined by Jeff’s words: “Steve is “wearing out.”
Ralph: Did Ralph talk to Julie before Tribal Council? If he was aware that Russell had made an offer to Julie that she wasn’t intending to take, then it would explain why Ralph didn’t play his idol. But, whether or not he knew how close he came of being voted out, the audience had to see him as a dumb player who didn’t see it coming. That’s not good for a potential winner.
Rob: I don’t want to raise the hopes of his fans too early but this could finally be Rob’s season. Jeff’s comment that he “took his game to a higher level” was a great endorsement but Rob wasn’t done yet: He elevated it again by finding the clue in what was the funniest scene of the episode. He also showed that he was aware of the needs of others, solidifying his deal with Phillip and reassuring Andrea. The cute girl with the sad blue eyes could derail Rob’s train but he seems to be on top of that, already preparing to deal with her revenge. It is good that Rob was shown always playing the game. No time to joke on the beach with Sandra this time: He didn’t rest on his laurels after TC, he understood the dangers of sending Andrea to observe the events on RI, he was on top of the challenge, he didn’t waste time celebrating. It wasn’t only the game that didn’t stop, it was HIS game that didn’t stop… and it didn’t stop improving.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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03-05-11, 07:21 PM (EST)

15. "RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 03-05-11 AT 07:22 PM (EST)
Great observations, as usual, michel! I love reading your take on things, mine is a little different in areas. Just wanted to jump in here and ask if you noticed the "Happy Chappy" music that played when "Camp Ometepe" was featured.....I love that happy music...
ETA: I will be back to post all my observations soon!

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-05-11, 09:36 PM (EST)

17. "RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

While I certainly remember the "Happy Chappies" (that scene in the boat with Kathy was TV gold) I don't remember the melody itself. I did recognize that Ometepe was portrayed as a happy tribe though. If they are bringing out an All-Star musical theme, that's even better for Rob's future.

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Belle Book 3613 desperate attention whore postings
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03-05-11, 09:07 PM (EST)

16. "RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

Some of what you said, I agree with -- especially the part about the Troll's duel with Matt being the end of the Troll! I won't be able to watch right away thanks to American Idol but when it comes out on YouTube, I'll watch!
I still think Boston Rob will still be sent to the jury before the finals, but this could be his season. At the very least, I think Andrea and Matt will give him problems.

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03-06-11, 10:46 AM (EST)

18. "RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 03-06-11 AT 10:51 AM (EST)
As I noted above, michel, I love your posts and your take on things. You are so thorough and you do try to see the end game through the weekly episodes. With so much that is foreshadowing and misdirection, I feel like I am a little lamb being led to the slaughter....so hard to decipher which is which. I felt good about last week because, all things considered, RussHell, Stephanie, and Rooster were all valid boot candidates. RussHell and I am sure Rob were and will be hard to nail down as to their boots because they are the "stars". In RussHell's seasons I recall him having SO many confessionals, so disproprotional to everyone else, so it's hard to use what he says as evidence for anything. I suppose to a lesser degree Coach, and now Phillip will fall into a similar category.
Anyway, right off the bat, with Jiffy's introduction, it was clear to me that RussHell was being snuffed that night. Jeff compared the 2 that had played before, Russell said he would play a more trustworthy game, "he LIED". He got the 2 little girls and he started out searching for his idol. But, we already knew the idol would never fall into his greedy little hands, so therefore he would be unable to wield its power. Toast.
On the other hand, there is the opposite, Boston Rob. Despite the loss, Rob was still in control.... This was huge, because we have seen all over the promos things like this...
We also hear how Rob took his game to the higher level...everything went as planned....broke up a powerful alliance...As michel noted, while RussHell did not change his game, Rob did and took it to the higher level.
Jeff spelled out the episode in his intro to the episode. Now we just got to sit back and watch his demise happen, savoring every minute...
The episode starts out with Matt heading to RI, telling us how he trusted Rob, but at the same time, now he has an opportunity to finish this game with a million dollars. As everyone has noted, that's what we call a winning quote! Who knows, he is getting the Jesus edit this season....I'd say bodes pretty darn well for Matt...as Veruca would say, he's got some legs...
Then we see Rob giving kudos to the academy award winner, Phillip, along with Grant and he tells him he's 5th? I agree, I wouldn't have spelled it out that way to Phillip, but again I don't know if he is the sharpest tool in the shed....but it did raise a flag for me. Rob also tells us he has to do his damage control and talk to Andrea, "who's gonna feel like we double crossed her, she's gonna have resentment...I need to get Andrea feeling ok about everything..."
I agree, Boston Rob is in this game 100%. No time to relax on the laurels yet, he's got alot of work ahead of him.
Then we see the tribes get their stones to pick who gets to go to RI and observe the RI duel. Steve and David, Andrea(who cannot hide her elation), and Ashley. Andrea told us why she was excited....it's probably more about seeing Matt. If he realizes I wasn't the one that voted him out ....if he can come back and be an asset for me to have... Then, as michel noted, immediately after Andrea's confessional about Matt down the road, we have Rob's confessional...We had to send 2 people ....I don't want her talking to Matt, her Island boyfriend, I don't want her getting any ideas. I thought this was significant.....as soon as Andrea divulges her ideas, we get Rob noting that he is totally aware of her ideas...I'd say this bodes better for Rob than Andrea....If Rob had never commented on it, as if he was in the dark, it would have boded better for Andrea and Matt.
They go and see the RI duel and return to report the news. Andrea's comments throughout the RI experience..."I didn't vote for either of them" were telling to the other tribe....
Steve got the first confessional regarding RI for his tribe, and he noted that it was an eye-opener, a curveball, an opportunity....definitely think we will be seeing Steve at RI at some point.... Interesting that Steve tells RussHell that Francesca won, then tells everyone the truth as soon as RussHell leaves. Seems like Steve is emerging as the leader over at Camp Zap...?
Over at Ometepe, Andrea reports Matt's success and Ashley tells the tribe like it is....so he can come back and get his revenge....shot to a surprised Grant. I, too, found that reaction shot of Grant may have some significance down the road should he and Andrea meet up again, could they take Grant out....?
Then we hear Rob, identifying the problem very astutely...Andrea will go back to Matt before she’ll stay with me. I know that. So, I got my work cut out for me with Andrea.”
Then we see Rob taking care of business. I thought this scene was the climax of the drama over at Ometepe...Rob and Andrea. When Rob spoke to Andrea, the little doe-eyed spurned woman, there was the sound of a rattlesnake....and to me, it was as though Rob WAS the rattlesnake, and he would strike the little doe down...He was trying to soothe her, she asked if she was still in their group, and Rob couldn't say the word alliance to her....he stopped short. Then she asked if Kristina and Phillip were before her and he reassured her. I get the feeling that these two will clash in the future, but I feel like Andrea is the one not to be trusted, that she is the wolf in sheeps clothing....she wants back in, but she'll turn on Rob and company as soon as her boyfriend returns, or perhaps find another path to redemption...BUT, I feel that Rob is smart, he's bigger, he's more experienced, and he has some sharp fangs...we'll see. I would be interested to hear what anyone else thought of the rattlesnake percussion and what they thought it meant. Maybe it was just to intensify this scene?
The rest of the drama at Zapatera played out. Steve deceives, doing what he said he hated about RussHell. Don't think that bodes well for him. Then RussHell tells it like it is, he knows how this game works....off to find the idol, desparately. Rooster tells us he ain't gonna find it because he has it....so Stephanie hatches another plan. I agree, Stephanie is a little player. Her only downfall is that she may be a bit too much in your face.
Confessional by Mike was just to support the polarized team. Then Steve suggests throwing the challenge, Julie is dubious. To cut out the cancer, the irritant....clearly, I don't think throwing a challenge is ever the best thing. And I feel like this may be no different. RussHell is what holds the Zaps together in my opinion. He creates unity in the Zap 6. There are alot of alphas at Zap....I think Steve is, Rooster is, Mike is, David probably is in a subtle way, Julie is probably as well, Stephanie is...Once RussHell is gone, they will start at each other. But, will they lose anymore IC's? They are clearly one strong tribe.
At the challenge they indeed threw it. David was called out, and had to defend himself, and I don't think he was happy about that, but he did it anyway. Julie expressed doubt, and then we saw later she was the one singled out by RussHell to try and flip. In the end, she stayed true. We were never shown, but I wonder if Rooster confided in anyone at all....Julie, maybe? I don't know. Clearly, he kept it to himself as they indeed split the vote. But, Rooster appeared quite confident.
After the challenge at Ometepe, happy music, Rob narrates that they had won the RC/IC challenge but now we have the HII somewhere in our reward. He notes accurately that the game is always on. He is seen SEARCHING everywhere, and then notes Phillip, gets the sleeping lion out of his chair, and finds the clue! Rob says, "I want the idol for ME!" Rob is in the game, 100%, and he is indeed giving this final chance all that he has. In the last season he played, he disregarded the clues and the idol....not anymore. Again, Rob is shown to have lived and learned.
I do think Zap has alot of problems ahead....they look very united now that the cancer is gone, but something is going to upset the apple cart and I hope that it's sooner rather than later. I love David. He seems like he could definitely be one to watch. I like Julie as well. I still stand firm, in a tribe with alot of Alphas, the follower will persevere...Sarita....I dunno.
In the end Jeff told them they were in trouble because they are so divided, come the merge. Stephanie told them a storm was coming....hmmmm. The way Stephanie is star struck, even though she is on the outer periphery of the Zap tribe, I wouldn't be surprised if she survives to the merge, that she jumps right onto Rob's coattails.
As for Ometepe, yes, there WAS happy music when they cut to Ometepe. Just as there was at Chapera when Rob was there, the happy Chappy's, just as there was when Ozzy was in charge at the Favorites tribe in Micronesia. Perhaps it signifies more tribal unity or harmony as Matt pointed out. But, frankly, I see some very complex problems brewing at Ometepe. Andrea is indeed a woman scorned and she's going to try her best to survive till Matt can return so they can meet their revenge. Phillip is a horse's patoot and a real wildcard. Sure, he promised Rob his vote but he's a loose canon. Kristina is on a rampage to get that hidden idol once again, and offers Andrea another path to strike at Rob and company. Also, it appears to me that Ometepe is indeed the weaker tribe. I can't help but to get a feeling, a vib like the Aitu Four- Ozzy, Yul, Sundra, and Becky with Rob, Grant, Ashley, and Natalie...It seems like they have ALOT to overcome. But, clearly Rob is fighting with all that he has, his past experience, his might, his extra weight, everything to be the leader of his tribe....and so far, it's working.
It will be very interesting to see what unfolds post RussHell at Team Zap. Regarding RI, clearly Matt will shine. RussHell is toast. Nice homage to Survivor tatoos in one of the promos this week...RussHell's will notably be added....Keep Hope Alive.
ETA: I wanted to comment on Andrea's edit. I feel really torn about it. I almost feel like this is her peak to her story arc...I feel like she and Matt will indeed be reunited again, but could it be at RI? I could easily see her out soon, where she must duel her Island boyfriend. That is one way to get rid of at least one of the two people that are gunning for you. Rob has told us over and over that he knows she can't be trusted, so I can not think of one reason that he wouldn't be gunning for her sooner rather than later.
I also like the way Rob addresses the outliers in his tribe...Kristina, Phillip, and Andrea. He is covering all bases. I think he will survive to meet the Zaps up close and personal. I do think, however, that at this vantage point, the cards are certainly stacked against him....

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-06-11, 01:25 PM (EST)

19. "RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

I enjoyed reading your observations, FP. Thank you for the nice words and all I can say regarding the foreshadowing and the misdirections is that I don’t look at anything else but the episode until I finish making my post. I participate in the ECST to see what the initial reactions are and if they correspond to mine. Then I slowly rewatch the episode, scene by scene, looking for tie-ins to previous episodes. Promos and Insider clips only come after I post my observations. Less clutter!
Since there aren’t many people joining in, permit me to come back on certain points and explain further my own. First you write:
“…immediately after Andrea's confessional about Matt down the road, we have Rob's confessional...We had to send 2 people ....I don't want her talking to Matt, her Island boyfriend, I don't want her getting any ideas. I thought this was significant.....as soon as Andrea divulges her ideas, we get Rob noting that he is totally aware of her ideas...I'd say this bodes better for Rob than Andrea....If Rob had never commented on it, as if he was in the dark, it would have boded better for Andrea and Matt.”
I really cannot predict what that tells us because Andrea’s two confessionals ran too long, contradicting each other as far as enabling us to decipher her role. To explain what I mean, I’ll copy both next to each other:
Confessional #1: “We picked marbles and Ashley and I get to go and watch the duel between Fran and Matt so I’m pretty excited. It’s probably more about seeing Matt because we were really close. I think that if he realizes that I wasn’t the one that voted him out, he can come back and be an asset for me to have.”
Confessional #2: “I talked to Rob and he assured me that I’m still part of their five even though I’m probably in a very sticky position. Right now, strategically, it’s smart to stay with them and make sure they don’t think that I’m scheming but I just don’t believe them. So, I need some way I can mix things up because, deep down, I am still really pissed about what they did, that they took my good friend away.”
Look at the 2 end sentences that I bolded. Agreed that editors could have easily chopped off both those endings? Now, if they chopped off the one from confessional #1, I’d say Andrea isn’t a real player, she is just there to make friends and Stephanie told us that Survivor isn’t a game to make friends. Conclusion: Rob will eat her alive. If they had chopped off the end of confessional #2, I’d say Andrea is quite the calculating player and she is thinking far down the road: Conclusion: Rob is in trouble. But we have both endings. It gives a lot more depth to her character but it leaves us with an insoluble question at this time: Which one will prevail? Did I tell you that I prefer to have questions than have the answers given to me?!
Then, I am not sure what you meant by the following:
“Andrea's comments throughout the RI experience..."I didn't vote for either of them" were telling to the other tribe....”
I’d agree with you if we had heard Steve or David saying: “That Blonde girl isn’t in their alliance so we can use her” but we heard nothing of the sort. I looked at the scene again and, after Andrea said those words, the camera went directly to Matt. We didn’t get to see a knowing glance, a nod of approval from Zapatera’s side of the bleachers. To me, that means the comment was strictly part of the Andrea-Matt-Rob story and we can’t make any assumption that Zap will use this information. I know there is an Insider clip from Ashley where she says Andrea threw them under the bus but that wasn’t part of the edited story. Integrating it just adds confusion, I think, because Ashley’s invisibility tells us that what she thinks is not relevant to the story.
Good catch on Rob being unable to say the word “alliance” to Andrea. I had missed that. Andrea told us she didn’t believe him so was that what gave it away? Did Rob make a rookie mistake? All I can say is that the rattlesnake you heard was, in my opinion, Rob himself. The sound is heard just as he’s saying I’m sorry to Andrea therefore I felt the scene was telling us that Rob accomplished what he set out to do. Andrea didn’t completely believe him but he has brought her back in the fold of the tribe...for now.
You wrote:
“Rooster appeared quite confident.”
I do wish we knew more about this but, as they say, ignorance is bliss. It could be that simple and I think that’s what the audience was meant to see. If I am wrong and it was strictly for the suspense of the episode then we will need a scene or a confessional from Julie or Ralph telling us that they had talked, that Ralph knew what was going down. Even Fabio got to tell us he wasn’t that dumb and the story tried very hard to make him look smarter than he was. Ralph still looks dumb and his unnecessary intervention at TC didn’t help his case.
“I see some very complex problems brewing at Ometepe.”
That is precisely why I see them as the end-game tribe. I only find troubling that Grant, Ashley and Natalie are so invisible but I’m still counting on them emerging now that the Rob vs Russell story is ending. And, btw, I don’t see Phillip as a loose canon where his vote his concerned. He may say the wrong thing but he will vote as he promised. Code of honor. I’d think that, whenever Phillip’s odd behavior is featured, it will be to make us think that he will be the next to go, hiding what will be the obvious choice. I’m voting Kristina as the next boot from Ometepe!
As for Andrea’s story arc, maybe it will end soon but I feel she has legs. It’s a story that began in episode #1 when we saw Andrea praying to get Rob on her tribe and when Matt told us about Rob’s amazing skills. It wouldn’t feel right to end in such an odd way as having both competing against each other on RI. Although if it does go that way and one of them eventually returns to the game then Rob is toast, editing-wise. Rob, to win, needs to be shown has having the characteristics of both a Hero and a Villain which he is having right now. Booting the sweet Andrea at this stage would be hard to edit as anything but pure evil.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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03-06-11, 01:51 PM (EST)

20. "RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 03-06-11 AT 01:52 PM (EST)
Wow, michel, you are amazing with your take on things. I know I am somewhat of an emotional arm chair watcher. You are probably right with Andrea...I just get this survivor vibe from Matt, and if he comes back into the game with Andrea there, it could spell real trouble for Boston Rob and gang. If Matt is defeated at RI, and doesn't make it back into the game, then Andrea would do well to keep the peace with Rob and gang at Ometepe. But to hear her plotting to get back with Matt somehow really makes me look at her as I noted, the doe-eyed, wolf in sheeps clothing. To me, she's just using her feminine ways to communicate with Matt and then to fool the Ometepe's into believing that she's with them...granted, she was blindsided as well, she is allowed to feel betrayed. Definitely she has a story at Ometepe but I don't know if she has one with the Zaps...If Andrea is not out next, I agree, Kristina is not long for the show. Her only development in the story is tied to finding the idol. It saved her the first show, but if she doesn't find it now, she's toast.
Great point with Rooster...don't know how to read him yet. And, you make a great point with Insider clips, Jiffy's blog, etc....so many factors to consider. It's hard to just stick to the episode info. Rooster told us that "this ole boy knows how to play this game too", and by gosh, he did best RussHell. At this point I feel like I have to give him the benefit of the doubt. So, I am leaning toward him to not quite be the dumb a$$ that he professes he is....time will tell. Is he really ignorant, or is he confident?

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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03-06-11, 05:25 PM (EST)

21. "RE: Episode #3: Editing Thoughts"

It's been fun reading all of these posts.
The one thing with Rooster I keep coming back to is his confessional in episode 1 where he said maybe it's time for a dumba** to win Survivor. That would be a heckuva winning quote.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 00:47 AM (EST)

22. "Um, michel? "

You promised to post your thoughts on the confessional from last night that clued you into the F3 -- not to be a you-know-what, but I'm dying here!!

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 01:03 AM (EST)

23. "RE: Um, michel? "

I'm betting it is a Rob confessional. No reason, he just had the most of them and the longest ones as well.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 01:16 AM (EST)

24. "RE: Um, michel? "

LAST EDITED ON 03-11-11 AT 01:20 AM (EST)
That's a good bet, dabo. Also, FloPo mentioned the picture of Rob/Natalie/Philip on the TC bridge as "maybe having some legs" in the episode spoilers thread last night, so I'm thinking we (as in you & FloPo) may have it.
I just want to say to michel: you don't have to wait until your entire editing post is ready (which I realize involves a lot of work & I do appreciate) -- you can spill now in this thread if dabo & FloPo have it right.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 01:25 AM (EST)

25. "RE: Um, michel? "

So true.
michel, we don't mind if you do it in installments.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 03:39 AM (EST)

26. "Next time on...The editing thread:"

Ometepe
Day 9
Natalie: “This morning, while everybody was trying to sleep, Phillip was up at the crack of dawn, sweeping. He’s just a pain in the butt. He is so annoying and he’s so weird.
This confessional, coming immediately after the repeat of Natalie’s confessional that Rob was amazing, reminded me of one from episode #1 of Survivor: China: “I seem to be marooned in a land of flight attendants and Sunday school teachers. Like, come on! I live in the city. People who live in New-York don’t act like this. This is like my own private hell. It’s exactly the kind of people who I don’t like…”
Todd and Amanda had been the ones shown on screen when Courtney was delivering this rant so she was giving us China’s final 3. Similarly, I felt that Natalie was telling us who would be there with her all the way to the end: Rob, who says he wants to drag her there, and Phillip whom she will have to endure all the way! Phillip? Is it possible? The episode will give more hints that tell me it is!
Promos don't always make it on the show but this is the first draft

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 03:57 AM (EST)

27. "RE: Next time on...The editing thread:"

XOXO michel -- thanks for the "sneak peak." Seriously, I was dying here!
So, dabo got the Rob confessional part wrong, but FloPo got the Natalie/Phillip/Rob picture on the TC bridge "having legs" right.

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Travel_Queen 138 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 06:49 PM (EST)

30. "RE: Next time on...The editing thread:"

LAST EDITED ON 03-11-11 AT 06:49 PM (EST)
I very rarely comment on this thread because I don't have the same insight into editing as the experts here...which I throughly enjoy btw. I could feel your anticipation of Michel's reveal..and I thought I knew the confessional, but I was at home off for a few days, and my password was at the office..so I couldn't comment!
Okay, so here is the confessional that I thought he meant.
Rob: and I'm paraphrasing because I don't know the exact quote
"everyone wants Phillip gone, but maybe that's exactly why he should stay" ..with a classic Boston Rob smirk.
Along with the skinny Phillip I saw on TMZ..I think that Rob and Phillip go all the way. Not sure of the third person..maybe Matt.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 07:35 AM (EST)

28. "RE: Next time on...The editing thread:"

LAST EDITED ON 03-11-11 AT 07:35 AM (EST)
Just for you, michel...
This picture was squeezed in the middle of a Redemption Island Montage....so, are these the three that send them ALL to RI? Time will tell...See Phillip in his shirt to the left of the frame, Boston Rob with his wife-beater and hat in the middle, Natalie, with her long brown hair on the right...food for thought. This cap came out in promos for ep 3.

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 02:34 PM (EST)

29. "RE: Next time on...The editing thread:"

I definitely think Phillip is a good bet to go all the way.
Rob I feel is getting the same edit as in All Stars -- and I think his head is into playing it the same way, with all the references to how he got there with Amber. So will he make the endgame again? Maybe, but I don't feel quite as sure.
Natalie at this point is one of those contestants who could leave next or could go all the way. She needs to be fleshed out a little more.
Matt is someone else I think from his edit could get to the end, depending on how RI pans out.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-11-11, 11:25 PM (EST)

31. "Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

Previously, on Survivor, Ometepe was doing fine because of Boston Rob
<Natalie: “I’m so glad we have Boston Rob. He is amazing.”>
Rob found a clue to the hidden immunity idol.
The only speed bumps on his road to the end were Phillip, who was unpredictable…
…and Kristina, who was a clear threat.
Meanwhile, at Zapatera, Russell was playing a familiar game. He searched for an immunity idol and he formed an alliance of three…
…But Ralph had him beat on all fronts.
He found the hidden immunity idol and he got himself into an alliance of 6.
Ralph’s crew was so determined to get Russell out; they actually threw the immunity challenge.
<David was the one that we heard Jeff calling out as “really slowing down”
Russell told us he was dealing with a bunch of bitches.>
At Tribal Council, the Zapateras did what no other tribe had ever done before: They voted out Russell.
His allies are left to fend for themselves while Russell’s life in the game hangs by a thread…
The recap was more neutral than I expected towards Zapatera but it ignored most of their members. Ralph was the one named as a real player so we have to consider that he is the only one that matters in the group of 6. In particular, David’s future looks bleak, being named as the one responsible for losing the challenge. Jeff didn’t need to remind us that Stephanie and Kristina were on the block but he presented their plight in a slightly positive manner. We didn’t hear that they were lost without Russell, we heard that they were forced to fend for themselves which opens the door to the possibility that they just might succeed.
On Ometepe, I found two very important clues:
- Rob seems almost certain to get to the end because those speed bumps aren’t truly worrisome.
- Andrea wasn’t presented as a threat. Why the omission? Was it simply that Andrea wouldn’t be a boot target in this episode? Does it mean that Andrea will never really amount to a threat? Or, more interestingly for her, does it mean that the showdown we were told to expect last week will unfold at a much later date?
Redemption Island
Matt: “Russell Hantz walked into my camp. I figured I’d see him sooner or later but first off? It’s a bit of a surprise.”
Russell: “This is the first time I’ve ever been voted off. I was pissed off, I wanted to b*tch-slap every single one of them. The whole time they were lying to me…He’s a rookie so he’s going to be nervous as hell doing the challenge against me.”
I noted that the words that we heard from Matt were signs of calm confidence. It’s his camp and he expected to stay long enough to see Hantz sooner or later. We also heard Russell telling Matt that the tribe threw a challenge so the editors are using Russell’s point of view to underline Zapatera’s negativity.
Ometepe
Day 9
Natalie: “This morning, while everybody was trying to sleep, Phillip was up at the crack of dawn, sweeping. He’s just a pain in the butt. He is so annoying and he’s so weird.
This confessional seemed very important to me. Normally, we would have gone to Zapatera after the first commercial break, to see the aftermath of their history-making decision but we had to get a character story on Ometepe instead. That is very enlightening editing manipulation.
Natalie’s confessional, coming immediately after the repeat of her original comment where she said that Rob was amazing, reminded me of one from Survivor: China: “I seem to be marooned in a land of flight attendants and Sunday school teachers. Like, come on! I live in the city. People who live in New-York don’t act like this. This is like my own private hell. It’s exactly the kind of people who I don’t like…”
Todd and Amanda had been the ones shown on screen when Courtney was delivering this rant so she was giving us China’s final 3. Similarly, I felt that Natalie just told us who would be there with her all the way to the end: Rob, who says he wants to drag her there, and Phillip whom she will have to endure all the way! Phillip? Is it possible? The episode will give more hints that tell me it is!
Then it was Rob’s turn to comment on Phillip: “Saggy-bottom panties. I could go 39 days without seeing that.”
Just the first of the hints that we will indeed see Phillip for 39 days!
Rob: “Phil is a piece of work. I mean, who comes on Survivor and wears pink tighty-whities with the stuff just hanging out and flopping around everywhere. It’s not only disturbing, it’s actually disgusting. It’s like your dad should have bought a new pair months ago; you don’t want your friends to come over to play and seeing that.”
We saw Phillip in action, hunting crabs while Ashley and Natalie looked on, disgusted in one scene, laughing in the next.
Phillip: “These young people out here, they don’t understand me. They don’t know if I’m a criminal or a school teacher, they don’t know how to take me so I’m a little frustrated out here. Given that this is a social game, it’s a huge disadvantage for me. So, there has to be another side of me that emerges, the guy that is undercover because I’ll tell you this much: I’m prepared to do what I need to do to win a million dollars.”
So, now we not only hear that Phillip can last to the end, he’s actually giving us winning quotes! He’s right about one thing; I don’t know how to take him but seeing him win would be disturbing and weird! Emerging from the fog of editing we see someone, used for comic relief and shown both as a “Dumb Player” and a “Heroic” figure that is allowed to deliver some very insightful views on his position in the game. On the level of complexity, I think Phillip goes further than even Coach who never considered what could hurt him in the game as clearly as we just heard from Phillip.
Zapatera
Day 9
Stephanie: “Last night, Russell went to Redemption Island so now, Krista and I are here, stuck with all these gubbers and not really having any fun.”
Krista: “At this point, I’m bummed but I got to put my game face on because one of us is going home unless we find the immunity idol.”
Interesting that the editors decided to stop by Stephanie and Krista’s portion of the beach rather than go directly to the shelter where resided the players that had just accomplished what no other tribe had ever done. I take it has another clue that the girls will not be the next two voted out of Zapatera but will find a way to fend for themselves. Of course, it would have been much better to show them being more active than just sun tanning. However, in a game where paranoia is so high, maybe being relaxed is what will pierce the Zapatera6’s armor.
Ralph: “When I found the immunity idol, I was planning on nobody knowing. When Stephanie and Krista left the camp, I thought; shoot! Right now is a fine time to let them all know.” <We see him digging out the idol, to show everyone and Sarita can’t help but jump for joy> “Man! They all was tickled to death so now I think I have got them all captured to take me and them buggers the game (?). I didn’t want to see them stray off from me. When you got a catch, you hang on to it.”
Mike: “We have the power right now. We are controlling this tribe but I would not be surprised if we saw Russell back in this game. Now that we have the idol, if he comes back, it will be very difficult for him to go deep into this game.”
Things are looking very good for Ralph’s crew, aren’t they? Well, this is Survivor so something bad is about to happen. When or how? That cannot be answered yet but Ralph revealed more than he wanted already, simply because the girls, sun tanning, had them worried. “Giving Away Too Much”, the rookie mistake, is the theme we have been working around since episode #1 so it isn’t a good sign for Ralph that he opened his mouth and went against his own plan. As for a tribe having long term connections, we had Mike focusing on something that will not materialize.
Ometepe
Day 10
Ralph read tree mail and said he’d like to go see the duel, asking if Kristina wanted to go along. Everyone agreed.
Phillip: “I definitely want to visit Redemption Island because of my background {cut}as a special agent with the US government, {cut} I’m looking for a little intel to help me {cut} to win this game.”
Did the tribe, meaning Rob, make a mistake by allowing Phillip to go on his recognizance mission and letting him do it with the other outsider, Kristina? We will get the answer later but now, we have to note that we received another winning quote from Phillip. What is interesting is that the confessional seemed fabricated: The sound quality varied and Phillip was only on screen during the “federal agent” and the “help me to win this game” parts so, it leads me to believe that it wasn’t the trip to Redemption Island that he said was going to help him win this game or get far into it but that it might very well turn out to be how the editors present it.
Zapatera
Sarita: (in interview after we heard her say that Ralph had to go to RI and he suggested she should go also) “I am so excited to watch this especially with Ralph by my side. If I am able to watch Russell walk off and go home, that would be my million dollars almost.”
Isn’t it convenient when players eliminate themselves? This tells me that Sarita will not see the actual million but will have to be content with this small victory. I noted that Stephanie and Krista were shown not complaining , Stephanie even biting her lip, when they certainly wanted to go encourage Russell. I saw it as a sign that they didn’t give away too much.
The Duel
Russell: “This duel is going to be… Good versus Evil type thing… If this was the real world, I’d be rooting for Matt…”
This means that we, in the real world, should root for Matt.
Matt: “Russell Hantz is definitely the biggest villain in Survivor history, hands down but I am fighting to honor my God and, because I want it so deeply and so truly, I think I’m gonna come out on top..”
Somewhat surprisingly, we didn’t get any reaction shots from Ometepe as they saw Russell was the second “gladiator”. They didn’t give anything away to Zapatera.
We heard Sarita saying “Come on, Matt” and, when he took the lead, Ralph gave her a thumb’s up sign. When his first attempt fell short, we saw their distress.
Matt won what Jeff described as a million dollar duel, giving us pause to consider just how much foreshadowing this will be. Since we are encouraged to root for him I’d say that Matt will return to the game. Will that be the extent of his victory? That is the big speed bump on Rob’s road to the end.
As everyone clapped and Russell was gracious enough to shake Matt’s hand, Kristina gave the comment that most of the audience was thinking: “Holy mackerel.”
As Jeff said: “Russell, brand new for you, you are out of this game”, we saw a tear roll down the villains cheek, humanizing him more than ever before in 30 episodes. Even the cold-hearted Sarita (as she had been presented) was touched.
The scene lingered, letting us hear his final comments which I think could be very important: “I respect this game too much to go out this way. You know, people like my tribe that throws a challenge just to get rid of me just because I’m Russell, not even worried about Boston Rob and his team and numbers. It’s hard to be a professional quarterback and have pee-wee leaguers on your team because I have to run the ball, to catch the ball and to throw the ball and do everything.”
Ralph interjected: “I don’t think so. We done great and Russell wouldn’t show us the clue to the hidden immunity idol but that’s beside the point. I’d already found it fifteen seconds at the game.”
Russell: “That’s dumb talking. He says he found it fifteen seconds in the game, can you show me the idol?”
Ralph started going through his back but Sarita stopped him by whispering: “Don’t do this, Ralph.”
Ralph, wizening up a little too late, dropped his bag and said: “I faked ya!”
Jeff was amazed but Russell was laughing as he addressed Ometepe: “He has the idol. He is such a good player he is telling you everything he has right now. Take him out, it will be easy.”
Jeff asked: “So, you’re saying your story about finding it fifteen seconds in was a lie.”
Ralph, thinking he was smart, answered: “Could be, could not be.”
The Federal Agent (?) knew better: “It was not a lie. I earn my living discerning whether or not someone is telling the truth or not and you have an idol. You will probably have an opportunity to use it if I have anything to do with it.”
As if that wasn’t enough intel, Russell told Phillip that Sarita was in charge while Mike and Steve were a team as well.
Phillip was glad he came.
Russell added: “See Jeff, I had to stay in this game somehow. Through these two, I am staying in this game. Now if their tribe wins and take out these dummies, more power to me.”
Russell in his final confessional which was addressed directly to Sarita and Ralph as the camera indicated: “It’s just terrible when you come here with people that didn’t come here to play the game. They were here maybe for fame or just for the money…Matt, I give him props: He beat me and I hope he goes all the way.”
Now we know why the recap was so neutral towards Zapatera’s decision: Russell would deliver himself the message of negativity that the audience should feel for this tribe. We got to hear plenty about their poor game strategy and how they didn’t come to play the game. The audience was meant to be touched by his words because even Sarita felt sympathy for the villain. If we thought that Ralph had given away too much before by revealing his idol to his allies, what should we think now that his opponents know? And, think about Russell living Survivor vicariously through Phillip. That is another hint that Phillip goes far, that Ometepe will answer Russell wishes and take out these dummies. The editing certainly established an upcoming conflict between Phillip and Ralph, the two atypical characters of the season. Now, will Matt also answer Russell’s wishes and go all the way?!
Phillip: “Thanks to Russell, I learned some very interesting things today. I’m going to use that to help me. After all, it is the game of Survivor: Outlast, Outwit, Outplay. That is what I am here to try to do.”
I’ve lost count on the number of winning quotes that Phillip delivered in the first half of this episode alone!
Ometepe
Rob was organizing a beach day, inventing a “little royal treatment game”.
Rob: “While Phillip and Kristina were away at the duel today, I started thinking that I need to find the hidden immunity idol before Kristina finds it again. I already have the clue and I had a good idea it was on this side of camp, I needed to get everybody out of camp for the day. So, I created this game called royal treatment where the winner gets whatever they want.
I’m trying to think how I’m going to get away from everybody after I’m the one that planned this whole beach day? So, I tell ‘em I’m having a little trouble moving things down in that area and it feels like something might be happening.
I bring them to the nice part of the beach, where the sand is really nice and immediately Grant heads into the ocean. Perfect! I don’t even have to look Grant in the eye, I don’t have to make an excuse, they will cover for me. So, I tell them it’s time; that I have to relieve myself.
I knew I had a limited amount of time so I high-tailed it back to camp. It’s like: Game on! Where is this thing? The clue basically told me it’s somewhere on the island. What a great clue! I’m looking everywhere…At this point, I’ve already been gone for fifteen minutes, I need to get back to the beach, otherwise it is going to look suspicious. You know, there are about 40 trees in our immediate area and, after looking at maybe 38 or 39, I finally looked up: Bingo! We have a winner. Maybe I learned something since last time! As for my plans for it? Right now, I’m not sure. One thing I do know is that, with this immunity idol, this time I’m going to make it 39 days and win!”
As for the Royal treatment game, we saw Rob’s last shot just miss the target.
Grant: “You blew it!
Rob: “I was going for the win.”
Phillip isn’t the only one with winning quotes which makes this episode so much fun. Rob tells us that we have a winner, that with the HII he will last 39 days and win. The two big characters on Ometepe serve as distraction for each other! Now, the results of the Royal Treatment game will surely give pause to many editing analyst. Rob was said to have blown it and we saw Andrea raising her arms in victory. So is she going to sneak in at the last minute and seize victory from the two big guys? My answer later in the Character analysis.
Zapatera
Sarita and Ralph returned to camp, telling everyone that Matt won. She would also tell them that Russell found his “Russellness”!
Steve, with his “see ya, punk!” was shown as the one most happy at the news.
Julie: “I am stoked that Russell is out of the game. I still can’t believe it. Our plan worked. I am so relieved that he isn’t going to come back and get me. Yay! He’s gone.”
Julie is also shown to be stuck in the moment, looking back rather than looking forward. Is she the one that Russell’s concubine will use as target when they try to crack the alliance? Julie’s relief seems to have come too early. Stephanie’s “storm’s a coming” sounded like pretentious bravado but I still think something will develop.
David: “Stephanie and Krista showed some emotions that indicated they were still in camp Russell, which I can understand. I think the fact that everybody else dancing on Russell’s grave added insult to injury.”
Mike reflected that Matt sounded like he was tough, wondering why Ometepe got rid of him.
Stephanie, amusingly, replied: “People do dumb stuff like throw challenges when they are ahead.”
Krista and he got into a discussion about synergy and chemistry, Mike ending it by saying; “You got to lose one at one point to get rid of the plague.”
The camera was on Stephanie as he said that, which, in light of Zapatera winning this challenge, makes me think Mike will regret not getting rid if her! Although, the editors could be simply telling us that Stephanie will be the next boot. Things could be that boring but I still hold hope!
Ometepe
Phillip was building his scenario, telling Kristina that their intel could be good enough to move her up the totem pole.
Phillip: “Rob told me we were in an alliance but I have a feeling that he told Matt the same thing. I’m like the odd man out so, is it better for me to have Kristina stay in the game? If I can pull one other person, then she would be very valuable to me.”
Kristina (who had told Phillip she would let him use his experience in covert matters, told us): “Phil told me that he will withhold the names of the people until Rob took us to the merge and then he will reveal the names kind of like blackmail. The specialist thinks he is running the show but the specialist is just one big wind bag. I’m going to sit back and let him dig his own grave.”
Phil told everyone that Russell was sent packing and had a meltdown.
Natalie, maybe to let us know her head was in the game or simply as a background voice, asked if Russell mentioned anything about idols.
Phil said no.
Once more we get mixed signals for Phillip. On one hand, he’s aware that Rob lied to Matt so that he could be lying to him also but then Kristina tells us what we know; he is a big wind bag. Did anyone notice that Rob, although shown, didn’t comment at all when he heard the news that Russell was gone? We only had the smallest of smiles. Rob is playing the game, not wasting time dancing on Russell’s grave
Walking on the beach, Phil told Rob and Grant that he hadn’t told the real story. He said that he could tell Rob who had an idol and that Russell revealed the alliances on the other side. In return, he wanted Rob to do something for Kristina.
Rob replied that he should give the information anyway because they were in an alliance.
Rob: “Phillip starts lobbying for Kristina all of a sudden. I’m like: “Hey! Dumbass, aren’t you in my alliance? Aren’t you working for me? Now, you’re telling me who I grant favors to. Big mistake Phillip.”
I’d say that’s why the mafia is always ahead of the federal agents! You can’t blackmail the Robfadda!
Phillip told them of Sarita’s role (at least how Russell presented it) and that Ralph had the idol.
Rob: “If he felt secure why would he ever want to keep Kristina? So, Phillip knows where he’s standing.”
Grant: “As far as Phillip goes, after this, there is no trust whatsoever. I don’t know how long it’s going to take but this can’t go on much longer.”
Grant and Rob agreed they had to get rid of Phillip who was shown sleeping as innocently as a child.
Zapatera
Krista read tree mail which included: “Sending a tribe mate away is never in your plan.”
Now, was that message written especially for the viewers, telling them once more that throwing challenges is not a good plan?
Steve was confident that Ralph, the master builder, would bring them to victory.
Julie: “I am a little superstitious and I do believe in Karma so it is so important for us to win this one. We threw that last challenge and I hope it doesn’t come back to bite us. We have to win this today.”
The Challenge
Krista was the player that officially sat out the challenge but, in effect, David, Natalie and Andrea didn’t participate, the guys handling more than one task.
Note that Julie was chosen in a very athletic task, holding her own against Grant and that Stephanie was allowed to work on two task: Assembling the planks and untying the knots. Ashley untied the knots for Ometepe.
Ralph, the star of the challenge, got on top of the table to crow in victory.
Zapatera
Mike: “This victory truly was exponential. I’ve never been this hungry in my life. I haven’t thought about sex in two weeks. All I’m thinking about is food.”
Ralph: “It was wonderful…I sucked stuff out of my fingernails even if they haven’t been cleaned since I got here…”
Sarita and Mike agreed they had the stronger team.
David: “There definitely is a good mood rolling through the camp. We got food in our bellies. I don’t wish ill upon the other tribe but I’m glad we’re not sitting in their shoes, trying to figure out what we are going to do about tribal Council tonight.”
Maybe it was just a figure of speech but why would David think Zapatera would have problems figuring out what to do about tribal Council. Isn’t it decided already?
Ometepe
We heard musicians imitating the sounds of crickets after Phillip finished his “good effort” speech and asked if anyone had something to add.
Rob: “We can’t win a challenge. It’s tough already and Phillip? He never wants to shy away from a moment in the sun. At this point, there is an utter malice towards him that is palpable.”
Next, we saw Phillip instructing Natalie and Ashley on the proper way to pour water.
Ashley (her first confessional of the season): “Phillip, I cannot stand him. I can’t even look at him, that’s how bad I can’t stand him. I think we are all on the same page but, we got to go to Tribal tonight so may as well make the best of it. I just hope Phillip goes home!”
You may ask why was Natalie’s earlier confessional a clue to the final 3 and not this one? The answer, at least in my opinion, is that Ashley has no end game connection. This confessional was chosen simply to create suspense for this episode. Natalie’s earlier one wasn’t necessary to the story.
Kristina: “Going to Tribal Council tonight, I feel it’s either me or Phillip…”
Natalie: “Kristina is kind of acting weird. She isn’t frantically searching for the idol which is very strange. It could mean that she has it, it could mean that she hasn’t. I don’t know.”
Natalie told the group about her suspicions concerning Kristina. A discussion ensued which Rob fueled.
Rob: “Apparently, Kristina has been snooping around about the idol. She is dangerous. As much as everybody else hates Phillip and doesn’t trust Phillip, he’s less of a threat to me than Kristina…I don’t want to give away that I have the idol so I let them think that Kristina has it so we are going to split the votes: 3 votes on Kristina, 2 votes on Phillip and, if everybody do as they are told, Kristina will be voted out.”
Ashley and Grant were afraid that Phillip was a ticking time bomb.
Grant: “The plan is that, at Tribal Council, we get rid of Kristina but I think it’s a mistake. Phillip is such a loose cannon, we just don’t know what he is going to do.”
Rob: “Grant, he wants to get rid of Phillip tonight and those girls are obsessed with getting Phillip out. It quite conceivably could be that somebody within my alliance might be willing to flip and vote out Phillip.” Showing us whom he trusted, we immediately had a scene of Rob talking to Natalie telling her that, if Ashley and Grant stay on board, they have nothing to fear. Rob’s confessional continued: “Hopefully, these guys <Ashley and Andrea shown> get nice in line like they should and do as they are told. If not, then I’m not in control of my tribe after all.”
Rob told Phillip that they would be voting Kristina.
Phillip: “Sure enough, Rob wants to vote Kristina. Clearly, he’s not a man of his word. I need to take control of my own fate and, at tribal council be ready to make the moves that you need to survive. Who knows? I could be the real target. Everything can happen in the game of Survivor.”
Tribal Council
Kristina said she still felt on the hot seat: “I started out on the wring side of the numbers…I’m a fighter… I want to stay.”
Natalie was asked how she felt about second chances which will be important down the line this season.
She said: “Second chances are great. I think Kristina is a really nice person.”
Grant said everybody was pretty laid back so you could get a second chance.
Rob said: “To be fair, I think Kristina just joined this tribe. For the first 8 days, she wasn’t a part of us.”
Kristina said “the tribe should vote out who they consider to be the weakest link. I think weak in this case might be disruptiveness…I think Phil’s a little disruptive.” (her only potential ally!)
Phillip: “I’m actually a doer. If you don’t do your share and show up just before dinner time, I’m going to be a little disruptive to you.”
Kristina: “I do a lot of stuff around camp.”
Phillip: “I have a history with the tribe. They know what I am about. It’s what I call the Sheppard stamp. And the Sheppard stamp is, being one of twelve, having my mother pass at a very early age, having to work through High School, deciding I was going to join the US army and getting an honorable discharge, receiving the second highest medal you could get in peace time. Doing what? Doing field sanitation. What a glorious job but, you know what? I did it to the best of my abilities…I think, between Kristina and I, I earned the right and respect of my tribe members.”
This could have been a “heroic” send-off to an ex-soldier, giving him his dues but we know Phillip wasn’t being sent home, it wasn’t his honorable discharge from Survivor. That puts a lot of weight on the argument that he will go all the way. It was, in fact, a very dangerous jury plea! Marty would say that he has as great a story of human drama as Jane.
Kristina asked for the opportunity to show she could be trusted and help the tribe.
As Kristina walked off, the camera showed us three players; Natalie, Phillip and then Rob.
Jeff concluded the evening’s festivities by saying: “Running out of time was clearly a theme for this tribal council and, if you don’t start winning, time is going to run out for this tribe.
The Story
There are no certainty in editing but I strongly feel that the so called stronger tribe will not succeed. Mostly because of what Russell told us about this group and the fact that they were ignored at the start of the episode. A conflict was set up between the two big new characters and it seems that Phillip was favored over Ralph who “Gave Away Too Much”. The question is whether or not Stephanie and Krista can crack the Zapatera 6. I think we received enough hints that they won’t be the next two to go but will they both survive?
On Ometepe, I would think that the 6 remaining players all make the merge. Andrea and Phillip are the most at risk, game-wise but both have stories that could carry them further. Ashley and Grant are at risk, editing-wise, neither allowed making a big connection with the audience but they are safely inside Rob’s alliance. Of course, a flip could explain why either one gets voted out.
The Characters
Krista: Hearing her interview makes us hesitate between which one of Russell’s ex-allies would go first but Krista has been much less developed than Stephanie so, if Krista stays, she won’t make an impact down the road.
Ashley: I’m not sure why she didn’t have a confessional before this episode but her first one was only about the immediate situation. It’s good though that someone inside Rob’s alliance isn’t an invisible character anymore.
Grant: Grant seems to be very close to Rob, being always there when Rob talks to Phillip. Rob thought that Grant would be harder to fool than the girls but then Grant wasn’t aware of what was going on while he played in the ocean. Grant is simply a member of the alliance but now everyone has a role which is good for the whole alliance.
Julie: She was stuck in the moment, her story confined to Russell’s elimination just as it had been from the start.
Steve: Despite being the one pushing to throw the challenge, Steve was completely ignored throughout the episode, reduced to an unnamed member of Ralph’s crew, the one that called Russell a punk even if the audience had been reminded how much Russell respected the game. If anyone was meant to receive the epithet of dummy, it was Steve and nothing in the editing seemed to redeem him.
Sarita: Her words about wanting, hoping to see Russell sent packing turned against her when she was seen touched by Russell’s profound deception. Anyway, Sarita has already received her million and they don’t give two.
David: There are some indications that he could be Zapatera’s Shambo or their Eliza. Twice he hasn’t participated in a challenge but we haven’t heard any reasoning behind it. In a tribe that values strength, which Zapatera obviously does despite their decision to throw a challenge, David must feel uncomfortable to see that they count more on Julie and even Stephanie in challenges. So, like Shambo, will he simply decide to join the other side or, like Eliza, will he become his alliance’s own target. His words about not liking to see his tribe dancing on Russell’s grave indicates that he will talk to Stephanie and Krista but will the girls use him or report back on him? Either way, I don’t see a nice ending to David’s story.
Stephanie: She certainly could be the next one voted out of Zapatera but she could also be the last one standing from that tribe. There was always some care given to her edit and seeing her biting her lips when Sarita decided to go to Redemption Island to witness the duel, tells me that Stephanie can play the game without giving away too much. That would be quite a feat considering she was introduced to us as someone that couldn’t control her mouth.
Mike: I still can’t completely rule out all of Zapatera. Mike, for one, was mostly spared the blame of throwing the challenge. He is the tribe’s narrator so we can figure he will last a long time. With his talk of synergy, he could be the one that emerges if I’m reading this story wrong and Zapatera manages to keep their control on the game.
Ralph: After a brilliant opening summary, Ralph seemed to go against the main theme of the season, revealing much more than he should have. Ralph still has some great editing characteristics but I’m leaning in the opposite direction.
The Theme Players
Matt: I imagine that Russell would be as happy to see Matt win it all as he would seeing Phillip using the intel he provided. That said, I think Matt’s victory will simply be to return to the game, make it to his promised land. We had to be connected to Matt to accept that he could defeat a character that was liked by many, respected by many more.
Andrea: I found it interesting that Andrea wasn’t mentioned as a threat to Rob or even as a boot option. Did she manage to get under the radar? There is a possibility that she becomes the one person that Phillip turns. The other possibility is that her character fades away, only to return to the forefront when it’s her time to be eliminated. The camera showed her on screen when Rob was saying his allies had to fall nicely in line and she did. She didn’t give anything away to Rob but she didn’t give us any reason to think she will find a way to get revenge.
Phillip: Phillip gives away so much that it's like he isn't giving anything away! The secret agent man seems destined to last the 39 days, whether his underwear hold up or not. Can he win? I think we will hear many quotes telling us he is doing his best to win, we will get mis-directions that will lead us to believe that he could get the jury vote but I think all will be mirages, tricks to make us fear that he could just pull it off.
Natalie: As stated above, it felt like Natalie told us who would join her on the long road to the finale. With just enough character development and even a chance to expose her strategy, her story could carry her to the win. Judging by the way the votes have gone over the lest few seasons, we will probably think she will get the majority of the votes but I think that’s why she was partly hidden up to now: We, the ones addicted to analyzing editing details, are meant to see her as a potential winner and, later, the audience will start thinking she could win it all. Leaving her in the background of the action could make her the surprise winner but, judging by the lack of connection we’ve had with her, I see her as coming up a vote or two short, to the relief of all those that don’t appreciate coat-tail riders.
Rob: So, despite all his other winner’s quotes, did Rob tell us he would be coming up short in this game as he did in his “Royal Treatment” game? I think that we, as viewers, weren’t supposed to take that game seriously: It didn’t matter that Rob came short because we never even heard who actually won. We had an indication that Andrea might have won but no one said she did.
More importantly, in all my years of analyzing editing I have not witnessed as heavy a manipulation as not showing Rob’s interview, reacting to the news that his nemesis had fallen. Rob had to gloat, had to say something that would have been mean to Russell in an episode where the viewers were suppose to understand Russell. Instead, we had a quiet Boston Rob who didn’t give away anything on this matter to his tribe or the viewers. This, along with everything we have seen so far, tells me that Boston Rob will be the Sole Survivor of Redemption Island.

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tmontgomery71 7 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
03-12-11, 02:13 AM (EST)

32. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

>Boston Rob will be the
>Sole Survivor of Redemption Island.
>
>
Thus the ultimate "Redemption" after having tried and lost 3 times before. I could live with that (his comments keep me laughing). I actually like him now.
There have been Survivor series before that pretty much spoon fed us the winner...usually when it is someone the viewers can root for. Right from the beginning when they exited the helicopter...everyone was thrilled to see Rob. Russle...not so much. We were told that Rob is an okay guy, someone you would want on your team.
While some of his decisions are questionable (Matt?), he is very attune to everything around him in this game. He is using everything he learned in prior series to make sure he doesn't make a mistake. He is redeeming himself by realizing the value of the idol, and keeping it to himself once he found it(something we all know a smart player should do). He is trying to make Kristina and Andrea feel better about their place in the tribe. He works hard around camp, but does not claim leadership, a change from his first series as a survivor.
Does anyone else on the show have this kind of subtle but revealing edit? The only one that comes close is Matt (who seems to be on a journey). The others are really just supporting characters.
Of course, what do I know...he might reveal the idol next week, and then I will know he is doomed.<G>

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-12-11, 09:58 AM (EST)

33. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

michel: Of course I LOVED your assessments! Just don't know if I can call a winner at this point, but, no doubt about it, I LOVE your take! I wanted to also note that when you watch the video on the insider clips at the CBS website, the one of Rob when he searches and finds the idol, located here.
The clip goes through his entire beach plan, royal treatment game, then him high-tailing it to find the idol, and it ends with his throw to the target, landing square in the bullseye and then abruptly stops with his shell in the bullseye....with him saying, One thing I do know is that, with this immunity idol, this time I’m going to make it 39 days and win!
I agree, this was a very important quote from Boston Rob, maybe I did learn something from last time! One thing he does know is that this time he's going to make it 39 days and WIN!
Love it! I'll be back for more later, thanks so much...

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-12-11, 12:11 PM (EST)

34. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

The problem with clips on CBS is that, for the last few seasons, they make them unavailable to Canadians. (They must think we aren't good enough to watch their site.)
So, you mean to say that, on first cut, they wanted to have the image stop with Rob making the winning throw and then decided to show it bouncing out? Doesn't that tell you that, in the end, it would have been too much of a clue?! Yes, it could go the other way, it always does, but I'll stick with my version... for now.

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Belle Book 3613 desperate attention whore postings
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03-12-11, 01:37 PM (EST)

35. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

Well, it's certainly possible and I wouldn't be upset to have Boston Rob win as he's nicer than he was in Marquesas and he certainly learns from his mistakes! But I think we should wait and see until we reach the merge, at least.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-12-11, 01:50 PM (EST)

36. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

Belle, I agree that waiting for the merge is a more prudent choice.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-12-11, 10:15 PM (EST)

37. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 03-13-11 AT 10:29 AM (EST)
Michel, as always, I really enjoy reading your interpretation of the editing. It is amazing what you underlined this episode, especially your comments on the editing of Rob. You noted specifically about the lack of response from Rob regarding the boot of Russell, especially that the Zapatera tribe had made him their first boot. Clearly, whether Rob was happy, sad, worried, etc, we know he must have had a reaction....I can't help but wonder if we will hear something in regard to it in a future confessional. I agree, however, that the omission of any such reaction makes me feel that Rob is out to win this game and is focused on that one goal.
First off with the intro, Jiffy underlines for us again...BR was the undisputed leader, found the clue to idol...Kristina is desperate to find it... Right off the bat, in retrospect Jiffy summed up the entire episode, right here in the intro....BR was the leader, had the clue, the 2 speed bumps are Phillip, unpredictable, and Kristina who is a clear threat...I don't want to have Rob stick around that long. Jiffy gave us the boot and the boot decoy....we need to pay attention in the future to his intros!
Meanwhile at Zapatera, Russell was playing a familiar game, made an alliance of 3, and looked for the HII. But Rooster found the idol, this is not his game, it's my game, he formed an alliance of 6, and Ralph's crew was so determined to get Russell out, they threw the challenge...Jeff calling out, "David really slowing down". At TC, the Zapatera's had done what no other tribe had ever done before...and voted out Russell. I agree with michel, it was encouraging for Stephanie and Krista, his allies, that they are left to fend for themselves. Interesting the Jeff appoints the Zap6 as "Ralph's crew". Now it's do or die time for Russell at RI....at night see shots of Russell walking up to the RI shelter and Matt. I think it was CTGirl that these vidcaps in the promos of RussHell in the dark did not bode well for him, and they were right. Russell was in the dark, and we know what happened...the good, light, triumphed over the evil black.
Russell enters and Matt is surprised, he tells Matt how they lied to him about the girl beating Matt, and his whole tribe threw the challenge just to get him out. Clearly this is a crux of what is to come....foreshadowing, imo. Russell's words on RI may become a prophetic...we all know that throwing challenges never amounts to anything good...I loved when Matt ended their first conversation...."Blindsided by Rob, now bunking with Russell!" As us seasoned veterans know, we have to always expect the unexpected with Survivor....a possible theme this season as well...spoken by the naive "rookie", who is figuring it out as he goes along.
Cut to Camp Ometepe, and I agree, usually we get a scene from the camp that has just booted someone off at TC, so this is interesting that we start with the Omes..."At the crack of dawn we are awakened to the sound of Phillip sweeping, he's so annoying, and he's so weird"....I absolutely love how you sandwiched this confessional in with the praise of Rob, and then Natalie commenting on the Phillip who may indeed be sticking around for a long time to come...great insight there, Michel! I love it, that the one she finds the most annoying could be riding Rob's back the whole way through as well.
Then we get a shot of Rob, and he and Grant laugh at Phillips saggy bottoms...interesting that Rob said he could go 39 days with out seeing that....same holds true for Rob....he may just go the whole 39 days SEEING that! Then Rob has a confessional regarding Phillip....Who comes on Survivors with his pink tighty-whiteys, with his stuff hanging out, it's disturbing, it's disgusting, ...Notable that Natalie and Rob were the two commenting on how annoying and disturbing Phillip is, which could foreshadow that they'll be annoyed for the entire time...
Then Phillip's confessional which shows Phil has an accurate assessment...These young people out here, they don't understand me, they don't know if I'm a criminal or a school teacher, the don't know how to take me. So, I'm a little frustrated out here. Given that this is a social game,it's a huge disadvantage for me, so, there has to be another side of me that emerges, the guy that's undercover. Because, I will tell you this much, I'm prepared to do what I need to do to win a million dollars. Definitely, a winning quote from Phillip, as well as the accurate assessment...
Cut to Camp Zap, at dawn, and the girls are laying at the beach, Stephanie and Krista....talking about how Russhell is going to kill it at the RI Challenge. Stephanie has a confessional how they are now stuck there with all these goobers, having no fun. At this point Krista is bummed, because one of them is going home unless they find the HII....Interesting that Krista says one of them is going without the HII.
Rooster and Steve are walking and Rooster says them girls are deadly, Steve says let's just keep our eye on them, Rooster tells him he has it under control. He was going to keep it a secret, but when Stephanie and Krista left the camp, it was a fine time to tell everyone...I think, how deadly are they with only 2 of them...or those girls are deadly, is that foreshadowing?
Ralph says, "Right here, it is"....gets it out, Sarita jumps for joy, Ralph says, They all was tickled to death, so now, I think I've got 'em captured, to take me and them further into the game.... We see Mike hug Rooster. Interesting that then Rooster says, They wanted to stray off from me, when you've got a catch, you gotta hang on to it. See Rooster with the Zap 6, points at David, "David, I told you all I had it under control", David nods, then we get a confessional from Mike, "We have the power right now...but I would not be surprised if we saw Russell back in this game. However, now that we have the idol, if and when he comes back, it's going to be very very difficult for him to go deep in this game." I also get narrator vibes from Mike, which could infer he may get into trouble come merge time.
Cut to Sunrise, Ometepe, day 10, we see Phillip getting mail..."The early bird gets the worm, in this case he gets the mail. He would like to go and asks, "how about you, Kristina, would you like to go?", and she says if everyone wouldn't mind, I'd like to go. *I can't help but wonder if Robfadda set this up....gave Phillip some directions, a task...wake up early and get that mail, then come back and run reconnaissance for me at the RI, and TAKE Kristina with you! Or, perhaps this was all Phillip's idea, as he told us he was looking for "one other", and perhaps he targeted Kristina to go with him...I dunno.
Confessional with Phillip saying he definitely wants to go to RI, he's looking for a little intel, to help him to win this game...another winning quote. Then we see camp Zap, and a big hairy turantula is climbing around which has got to be an ominous sign, as Sarita says to Ralph, "you're going!" and he tells her she needs to go to, and she agrees. As Steve turns his back on the camera, I notice that he has a bandage on his back!? Sarita claps that she's so excited, and we see Steph and Krista looking solumn in the foreground...Sarita tells us witnessing Russhell going home would be her million dollars almost....clearly Sarita is not winning this game. Off they go.
Cut to RI and Russhell tells us about how Matt is a good kid, but right now, it's not the real world, it's Survivor. Matt says Russell is the biggest villain, but he's fighting to honor his God, so he thinks he'll come out on top....foreshadowing. Jeff tells us the challenge, it plays out, "Matt stays alive", and Russell is overwhelmed with emotion. I thought CBS certainly gave him a stellar ending. And to his credit, after the emotion he rallied to plant a few more Russell seeds...called out that Rooster has the idol, "she's in charge", and Mike and Steve are tight. He will live on through them (Phillip and Kristina). Tells them that Rooster is dumb and to take him out. Phillip tells them that he knows he has it, "You'll probably have an opportunity to use it if I have anything to do with it." Phillip was glad he came, thanks for the info! Russhell thinks that his tribe didn't come to play the game, but to find fame or money. Matt's journey to get back in this game continues...Phillip has the last confessional, "Russhell gave him some interesting info, and he's going to try to outwit, outlast, outplay, it's Survivor, and that's what I'm here to do"....another winning quote for Phillip!
Meanwhile, back at BR, let's just have a beach day today, some targets on the beach, a little royal treatment, the winner gets what ever they want. He has the clue he needs to find the idol, how will he get away, he tells them he has constipation, takes them way down the beach, sets up camp, Grant goes into the ocean so he doesn't have to look him in the eye, the girls will cover for him, runs back to camp, the clue says it's somewhere on the island, in a tree, under a rock, in the sand or in a log....what a great clue! Searches everywhere and the last tree he comes to, he looks up, and ding ding ding, we have a winner, maybe I learned something since last time, as for my plans for it, i'm not sure, one thing I do know is that with this II, this time, I'm going to make it 39 days and WIN!....then we see him on the beach playing in the target game and his stone lands directly in the bullseye and then bounces out, and he tells them...."I'm going for the win". I feel like they should pay attention to Boston Rob! He's going for the win!
Camp Zap, they return...Sarita says, "that was crazy" and Steph and Krista are there...first they start the challenge, Matt won, Julie confessional that she's thrilled "stoked" that Russ is out of the game, their plan worked and he can't come back and get her....Sarita continues that it was sad then he found his Russellness and just basically threw back the covers on everything about our camp, we see Steve kiss his thumb and say "see ya punk!", and Steph and Krista defend him, "now you've gone too far". David says he understands, everybody else was dancing on his grave, and that they added insult to injury....showing that he is sympathetic to them. I can not help but feel David will join in with Steph and Krista at some point. And, if they are to survive, it needs to be sooner than later! The editing just has me associating David with the harem girls...?
Then we see Mike, Krista and Steph talking later about Russhell...Mike says that Matt was tough, and he was amazed they got rid of him, Steph notes that people do dumb stuff when they are ahead, Matt argues that the tribe is much stronger because he was breaking down the synergy in our tribe, Krista says, synergy is the last thing you should worry about in a game of numbers, Mike disagrees, when you are battling the other team, you have to do something to get rid of the plague...thinks it's the most important thing. Sounds like Mike is drinking the Ralph and Steve kool-aid.
Meanwhile, cut to Ometepe and Phillip and Kristina are approaching camp and tells her that this is good enough intel to move Kristina from last to 4th...let me go to Rob. Rob, told me we are in an alliance. I have a feeling that he told Matt the same thing. if I can pull in one other person, it would be very valuable to me. Kristina is going to sit back and let the specialist dig his own grave, he's just a big windbag....
Phillip says you missed a doozy, Russell went home, he cried, it was really weird and you do hear Natalie ask, "he didn't say anything about idols, like if he had one or anything?". Then we have Phillip, Rob and Grant walking down the beach...Phillip will tell them what happened, Russell had such a meltdown that he named who the leader is over there, Rob: Who's the leader? Phillip:I'm gonna run through the list, Rob: Huh?, Phillip: Just listen! Let me tell the story, Rob: tell the story, Phillip: He started naming who had an idol, then Russell named two alliances, Now, do you think if I reveal all that information to you by name, that you would be able to do something for Kristina? Rob: I think you should tell it to us anyway because we are in an alliance, I don't know what Kristina has to do with this?
Confessional, Rob: Phillip's lobbying for Kristina all of a sudden, I'm like, hey, dumb #####, aren't you in my alliance, don't you work for me? Now you are telling me who I should grant favors to? Big mistake, Phillip. Totally get that Rob is in control and he will make sure people do what he wants them to do, make no mistake...as michel noted, you cannot blackmail the Robfadda!
Phillip: If you have this information at your hands, would it help her chances...
Perceptive of Rob to note that Phillip must be feeling insecure in order to go to bat for Kristina...so Phillip knows where he is standing....and Rob is accurately assessing everything. Grant then has a confessional that notes Phillip has to go, we can't trust him. Grant and Ashley are just there to communicate the drama that develops as time goes by at Ometepe. In the alliance, but not the major players...the accessory players.
With the challenge news, Ralph gets a nod from Mike, as the master builder.Julie then has a confessional underlining Karma, and what goes around comes around, so she really want to win this challenge today....with the mention of Karma, I think we have more foreshadowing....maybe not today, but definitely coming.
At the challenge, Jeff explains it and Krista sits out. The most notable thing for me at the challenge is that once again, as michel pointed out, David did nothing. They didn't use his mind or his body, in a physical challenge Julie is higher up than he is, and so is Stephanie. This, imo, does not bode well for David within the Zap 6. At the end of the challenge it seemed that Steve or Mike prompted Rooster to "get up there and crow!" Jeff gave the idol to Stephanie and she gave it to Rooster, who kissed it. She gives it to the new leader in their tribe? A self proclaimed dumb a$$? And, I agree, crowing after the win is definitely going to come back in bite you in your dumb a$$. As soon as they lost the camera panned to Kristina, but when Jeff told them to head back to camp, I've got nothing for you, it showed the other boot choice, Phillip.
Mike and Rooster got the confessionals and told us about the reward. Again, narrator vibes for Mike. Then David had another sympathetic confessional: I don’t wish ill upon the other tribe but I’m glad we’re not sitting in their shoes, trying to figure out what we are going to do about tribal Council tonight.” This is the second sympathetic confessional for David...couple this with him either being passed over in challenges completely, or told to throw the challenge altogether, and I can't help but question whether David is the one that will figure out something to nip the alpha Zaps in the bud, and he'll do it enlisting Stephanie and Krista....I may be wrong, I just think there is more here than meets the eye. Soon he will be sitting there trying to figure out what to do about TC tonight...
At Ometepe, there is more "Phillip is annoying" confessionals and scenes. Ashley's first confessional, also underlines Phillip being weird and annoying, really nothing of substance. There are back and forth confessionals about what to do, and what they want to do, Rob wants them to split the vote because they don't know if Kristina has the idol or not, so 3/2 Kristina/Phillip.
At TC the only notable thing for me was Rob underlining that Kristina is the one to go, not Phillip, and we saw the votes go the way he told them to go...in other words he's in control.
Kristina is voted out as planned. I agree, this episode showed progression at Ometepe and it underlined that Rob is playing the game 100%. He's working his plan and planning his work. No time to lose sleep over RussHell, who is out of the game. We see him be successful at what he sets out to do as well, whether it's finding the hidden HII, or controlling the vote. In contrast, Rooster seems to be the new leader of the Zap tribe and apparently Zapatera is comfortable and happy just to get rid of RussHell. The dumb a$$ thinks he's in control, it's his game, and he's shown us that he is living up to his moniker when he exposed to the Ometepe's that he indeed has the idol. "I have it under control", because he's confided in his tribe that he has the idol. For me, this whole episode underlined that the leader of Ometepe was in firm control, while the self proclaimed person in control at Zapatera is clearly not. And, I think we'll soon see how he loses control...
I do see Phillip as Michel and Brownroach, as a long term player, annoying but long term. I also think that the harem girls could last longer, but if one were to go first, I'd bet on Krista as I think Stephanie has more to offer....we'll see. I also think if they are integral to upsetting the apple cart that they could do it in cahoots with David. We'll see! I also want to add that the editing is making me think that something David will do down the road is significant to the story...will he conspire with the harem girls to switch things up in the hierarchy there, OR, will he choose another option down the road when and if they merge?
ETA: I also wanted to note that it was very interesting how Andrea completely disappeared this episode! I would say that this could mean one of two things...1. She will last much longer to be reunited with Matt, perhaps...her story will pick up later and so for now she has some lasting power, or, 2. Her story is really over, and it was completely wrapped up in Matt and him being voted out.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-13-11, 02:45 PM (EST)

38. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 03-13-11 AT 03:19 PM (EST)

Nice post, FP. It appears we see it mostly the same way. There are support out there for Matt, Andrea, Natalie, Mike, David and Sarita so we still need to be open to all possibilities even if I feel strongly for Rob's story.
It strange to think of Russell has receiving a Victim's edit because that usually goes to likable characters but Russell does have numerous fans, just not on this board. I've always said that players that vote Victims do not win the game so that would doom the Zap 6. I totally agree with your view on their Karma. It didn't hurt them this time but there is still more TCs before the merge.
I just finished watching the episode once more, not writing as I watch, just looking for connections. I think I found two interesting ones:
1- When Ralph says: "You have a catch you need to hold on to it", the camera gives us a close-up of David. That's even before Ralph addresses him and says "See, I told you I had it under control."
This tells me that, indeed the fracture comes from David. Does he organize a successful coup or does he get booted for it? I know that in the vidcap thread, I was leaning for his boot but his sympathy towards the Omies connects him with them and maybe was the start of a post-merge story. If his coup isn't successful, that only gives the concubines 1 week's respite but they'd still be 2 against 5. On the other hand, remove David this week, Krista the next (Zap goes down 6-6 and need the better challenge competitor in case there's another tribal immunity) and we could merge at 12. Steph, Russell's minion, becomes Rob's tool. THAT? Would be quite a story.
2- What was the first creature seen in the Omies' opening sequence? A Holler monkey, woken up by Phillip's sweeping. What did we see on our screen when Rob said: "we have a winner"? The Holler monkey who had been observing him on his search. Now, whom does that monkey represent? Phillip? Natalie? The audience? The monkey was looking for intel just like Phillip but Natalie was the one asking if Russell mentioned anything about idols so she is curious also. The monkey was trying to sleep just like Natalie but I'd find it strange to associate a young girl with a monkey...Guatemala's Holler Monkey represented Judd but sometimes a monkey's just a monkey.
If Rob keeps his idol a secret between himself and the monkey (the audience) then he is our winner. If he reveals it to either Natalie or Phillip, it will be food for thought. If Rob reveals it to everyone or simply wasstes it, then I have nothing!

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-13-11, 07:18 PM (EST)

39. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

Nice response there, michel. I agree, David's arc is growing, imo. Whether it be now to conspire with the harem girls, or perhaps for later, when he may consider throwing in with the Ometepe's...With all of the mistakes Rooster is making, I expect him to go down sooner rather than later. The harem girls offer numbers to any that may want to shake up the hierarchy. That's why I wouldn't be surprised to see something happen in this up and coming episode.
The promos are hyping all about control this season. We saw that the word control was stamped over the pic of Rob/Matt falling in to the pool/Russell, implying who had control, Rob or Russell? Now we hear Rob talk about, if they voted the way I want them to then I have control of my tribe, if they didn't then I no longer have control....as it turned out, the vote went as he planned, he has control. Rooster is the contrasting leader that is telling everyone he's had it under control, but we know he doesn't....that's why I get an ominous feeling toward the Zap 6, not the harem girls.
And, I also have associated the howler monkeys with the Ometepe tribe, I love that you think it may represent the audience. With the way Rob has been playing, I expect he will hold the HII close to the vest, as he would his beloved poker hand.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-13-11, 09:27 PM (EST)

40. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

I haven't considered control as a theme but I agree there has been enough mention to consider it as a recurring theme. How would you phrase it? How has it been presented?
Last season, those in charge were shown making mistakes and I took that as a big indication that Fabio, mostly being out of the loop, would win.
This season, it's been a positive thing to have. Zap is divided, Rob keeps his tribe in line. I'd phrase the Theme: You have to control the vote.
Going from that, Rob owning Phillip's vote is pretty big, as is the fact that he told us his group is better at following instructions than Tyson.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-14-11, 07:56 AM (EST)

41. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

Well, I don't know if it's going to be a recurring theme through the entire season, but they sure have hit us over the head with it through the beginning of the season. Clearly, they use it to contrast the two leaders of the tribe...

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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03-17-11, 09:04 PM (EST)

46. "note"

Forgive me please for making a correction on a small point, but it was repeated three times ...
>>> A Holler monkey
They are howler monkeys.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howler_monkey

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suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings
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03-15-11, 01:47 PM (EST)

42. "Sweet!"

Michel and FloPo your comments and observations are A#1+++. Outstanding. I just don't have time to make a lot of comments but on the whole you've given me some great tips about what I see and what I really should see .
Anyway I always stop by to read this thread by the next episode.
Bravo!

A Tribe masterpiece

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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03-17-11, 09:30 PM (EST)

47. "RE: Episode #4: Editing Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 03-17-11 AT 09:38 PM (EST)
This has given me a lot to think about.
I am trying to look at it neutrally in so far as emotional attachment goes. The only ones where I can't succeed are Philip and Rooster. I don't like to think of either one winning; they are too extreme.
On Boston Rob -- I would be happy if he won. I would love to see him sustain this level of play. OTOH, it is in the post-merge that someone like Rob is going to be in big trouble if he cannot run the immunities.
Amber had a great position with Rob, because Rob was BAD to people in All Stars. Rob has now turned his edit around, so it is no longer a good way to win, riding his coattails. If Rob makes it to F3, he has a great chance of winning. Therefore if any of these people are there to play, they will get him out prior to F3 so that they can argue "I am the one who made the move to take out Boston Rob."
Winning quotes and quotes of longevity -- I really don't take any stock in these. Ten years ago, Richard's statement was an anomaly. Now, everyone pumps themselves up by saying they will win. The fact the quotes exist is meaningless. The question is whether the editors have a reason to use the quotes.
Remember that Burnett thought it was risky to use Hatch's quote, as a giveaway, but he decided it was safe because it was so unlikely that Richard would win. Point being, it was never considered a great idea to show the actual winner stating "I will win." It has been done a number of times now, but we also see people make these statements who fall short.
Likewise, when Rob or Philip says "39 days" that is a great indicator of a positive mindset, but not an indication to me that it comes to pass. I think there is no question that Rob has been edited as someone who could win, deservedly. Because of Rob's history with the game, and his status with this season, I think that he is going to get that edit as long as he lasts (unless he does something terrible).
Phillip is going to get a ton of attention because Jeff loves him. He is Jeff's Coach this season. He's what i call the "use him for all the entertainment value he's worth" character, as is Rooster. So ... it's hard for me to read that in terms of longevity.
If Phillip gets to the merge intact, then I absolutely can see him getting dragged to the end as the goat, as he CANNOT win this game. More than likely, those girls will be on the jury, and they will never vote for him to win. Won't happen. Looneytunes players do not win Survivor.
Right now, I cannot tell whether all this Philip footage is there to milk him because he goes out in Ep 6, or because he has longevity. On Wednesday that will be clear.
I do think that an Ometepe will win, and most likely they will dominate the post-merge.
Krista's statement that she doubts any of the Zaps will make it to the end sounded like a prediction we should take to heart, along with all the other ominous signs for Zapatera.
If Rob does not win, it truly is hard to find a candidate this season. Grant is the type who could win, but his lack of confessionals early on are not a good sign.
Ashley and Natalie are both shown in quite a negative light.
Phillip is deluded. He can strategize all he wants, but he's not realistic about how much he's not embraced. He only gets it a little bit, but they are in your face with how they feel about him.
That leaves Andrea, Matt, Rob as the best contenders.
I had discounted Matt's chances to win if he were to come in near the Finale, as just too absent from the game, but if they do a return soon, then he would be in the game for a long time ...
What a golden moment for Matt, that he gave Rob the chance to state his case for booting Matt ... what did Matt say, while I'm working? He did not supplicate to Rob to be given another chance with the alliance. He said, to paraphrase, look, I was loyal, you had me, and you cut me. Now explain yourself, and I'll forgive you.
Rob did not shine at that moment, in the face of Matt's amazing directness. He dodged the question. He should have said something like, I saw you with Andrea, and that alliance threatened me because of what Amber and I did together. But he didn't.
Matt was way superior to Rob there. Matt was like the exiled king giving Rob the backstabbing prime minister a chance to explain his wicked deeds.
I choose MATT ... (subject to revision)

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
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03-17-11, 04:54 AM (EST)

43. "Episode 5 Thoughts..."

LAST EDITED ON 03-17-11 AT 12:04 PM (EST)
There were several things that immediately jumped out at me from an editing POV in this episode.
- Andrea had a *huge* jump as a player in this game, she looks like she could be a serious endgame player. It wasn't just her bit with Special Agent Magenta Butt that highlighted her ability to break down the game but also we were shown a big contrast between her and the other two girls (Natalie and Ashley).
- Several interesting wildlife imagery here in this episode, particularly with the frog twirling around and then showing a big jump while Stephanie was talking about what to tell the other tribe when she and Krista got to RI and being willing to flip sides. At the IC, while the tribe was criticizing Sarita's decision to put Stephanie as the caller/puzzle solver instead of David, we saw a vulture picking at a carcass. We also saw a tortoise covering up eggs while keeping the buzzards at bay right before the Zapatera pre-TC scrum started up.
- Another bit of interesting imagery - there was a small piece of rope hanging over the edge of the Zapatera hut but the way the camera was placed, the rope appeared to be like a hangman's noose superimposed on David's face. Not a good sign for him at all!
Edited to add these images: For the second one, you decide if the editors are trying to hang David or if they're just showing what David thinks of the shenanigans within his own tribe...

By contrast, we saw Steve several times with the noose off to his side and Mike once with it off to the side, again. But for David, it's directly on top of his face.
- Julie talked repeatedly about hoping the decision to throw the challenge to boot Russhole doesn't come back to hurt the tribe, and we saw Mike accidentally drop a pot of water on the fire immediately after Julie said the word "karma". ... "You put the fire out!" = Zapatera being put out of the game as a tribe?
- Sarita might be headed for a fall, soon. We saw the tribe repeatedly saying "David should have been the one to call" instead of Stephanie. But nobody stood up to contradict Sarita before the challenge started (other than David), only deciding to play Monday Morning Quarterback after midway through the challenge. We already got an inkling that Sarita might have gone as far as she needs to in this game with her million dollars being watching Russhole leave the game. We saw Ralph sidling up to Sarita during the puzzle portion and saying "That's why we needed David". The expression on Rooster's face as he said this to the back of Sarita's head said it all for me - it seemed to be a contemptuous expression.
- IC was a bit like the ole coconut chop in revealing the totem pole pecking order within the tribes. Grant was leading the way for the Ometepes, then Ashley, Andrea, Natalie and there was Phillip bringing up the rear (surprised Rob didn't have Natalie second behind Grant), while Rooster led the way with Sarita behind him, then Mike and David before Krista brought up the rear.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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03-17-11, 11:18 AM (EST)

44. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

Rob is really having a lot of fun with diversionary tactics, big part of his game to keep the heat off himself, and now he sees value in keeping Phillip the Annoyance around as a diversion. Misdirection, as long as they are annoyed with Phillip they aren't paying attention to other things.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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03-17-11, 08:45 PM (EST)

45. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

Terrific comments, Pepe! A lot to think about, thanks.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-18-11, 09:45 PM (EST)

48. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

It's nice to see other posters here. Pepe, I see you also caught that noose in front of David. I liked your interpretation of the story.
Here's how I saw things:
“Previously, on Survivor, by day 10, the two big dogs, Russell and Rob, were running in opposite directions:
- Rob found a hidden immunity idol and, even though they had lost 3 out of 4 challenges, he held blind allegiance over everyone in the Ometepe tribe except Kristina and Phillip. <We hear Phillip saying: “I need to get rid of him now. Goodbye Rob”>
- Russell could only muster loyalty from two on his tribe, Krista and Stephanie, and he couldn’t even come close to finding an idol. The rest of the Zapatera tribe was so down on Russell, they agreed to throw a challenge so they could send him to Redemption Island where he faced Matt in a duel.
Matt not only defeated Russell, he reduced him to tears. Suddenly Russell was out for good.
At the last Tribal Council, Rob’s position kept getting better as he got his tribe to vote out his biggest opposition.
Now, Kristina heads to Redemption Island where she’ll face Matt to see who stays alive.”
Obviously, there are two ways to look at this recap: Jeff is setting up Rob for a big fall or he is telling us just how successful Rob will be. Both are valid alternatives but I continue to favor the path that leads to Rob’s victory. For one thing, Russell was an early boot so, running in the opposite direction could mean making the finale. Did Jeff give it away? For Rob to be our winner, we’d need to see some obstacles set in his path, some doubts in the viewers’ mind. The insertion of Phillip’s confessional accomplished that. The episode would give more.
Ready To Flip
Ometepe
Night 11
Last week, after starting on Redemption Island, we had visited Ometepe instead of Zapatera. This week, it’s very noteworthy that we didn’t even go to RI but visited Ometepe once more. I don’t think there is any question left that the winner is on this tribe.
Phillip: “Tonight, Kristina went home after a 4-3 vote; 3 for me, 4 for her. It’s not too surprising; I expected it because there’s a very close alliance with Boston Rob and several others in the group. They’ve been running the show from the get-go. I’m kinda like the odd man out over here even though I bring a lot to this tribe. A couple of people are going to have to wake up and realize that.”
Rob, after telling Grant and the audience about the bad night he had sleeping next to Phil: “Tribal Council is always a miserable night. On top of it, Phillip is bugging everyone, including myself. He is completely off his rockers, walking around in his pink panties. Nobody trusts him. As long as Phillip is aggravating everybody so much, it takes all the heat off of me so, in a way, maybe he needs to stay.”
Zapatera
Steve: “Day 12. The spirits of the tribe are high. As long as we keep excelling in the challenges, everything is coming along as planned. Our 6 is rock solid and my vision would be to try to reach out to those two girls. There’s always hope to bring Krista and Stephanie in. If we can show them that we are a solid family, that there’s no back-stabbing and it’s a safe place to be, I think they would want to hang tight with us going into a merge.”
Mike read tree mail and decided it would be one of the 4 that hadn’t already gone that would make the trip this time. That led to Stephanie and Krista picking the right numbers to go together.
Julie: “Now that Russell is gone, Krista and Stephanie are not even a threat. They can go do whatever they want, they can talk about whatever they want, we really don’t care. There are just pawns in this big game. They can’t do any damage to us.”
Those three little scenes showed a very naïve group of players. Steve still has hope to get close to Russell’s girls, Mike gives them a chance to go to Redemption Island even if it was obvious that precious intel could be gained there and Julie was so short-sighted that she couldn’t imagine the girls causing trouble. The Zapatera 6 are toast.
On cue, Stephanie told Krista her plan to reveal that they hate their tribe.
Stephanie: “We are hoping to send the message to the other tribe that there are two girls ready to flip. We can cause havoc and chaos and all sort of craziness at the merge.”
With this confessional, Stephanie punched her ticket to the merge…and maybe well beyond.
The Duel
While working on his puzzle, Matt asked Rob why he had been voted out, calling him a rascal in the process.
Rob said it took more than 1 person to vote someone out.
As we had been prepared to see, Matt won and eliminated Kristina.
Rob gave him a thumb’s up.
Then we had another interesting exchange:
Matt: “I told both of those guys that I wanted to go with them to the top three…Hopefully, I’ll hop back up on the Ometepe tribe.”
Stephanie: “I like that he says he would stick with his tribe. I wish I felt the same he did because there’s still a clear division.”
Jeff: “You mean in your tribe?”
Krista: “Yes, us two on the bottom.”
Stephanie: “They may think they have the numbers but I think yellow might look good on me.”
Jeff: “Wow! Rob, Grant: That never hurts to have two people saying: Listen, we might be willing to merge with you.”
Rob: “Doesn’t hurt if they are telling the truth.”
Stephanie: “I’m telling the truth.” She then gave Rob her best smile.
Rob answered with another thumb’s up.
After Kristina’s tearful departure and Matt’s goodbye wave to his old tribe mates, we saw Rob apparently telling the girls: “Hang in there.”
I say apparently because we never heard those words as they were captioned on screen at the same time as Stephanie’s upcoming confessional began. The editors wanted us to connect him to Stephanie and her survival. As for Matt being an asset to Andrea, we have to wonder if Matt won’t try to get back with Rob instead.
Stephanie: “I didn’t just plant a seed in Rob’s mind, it’s more like I took a sequoia tree and put it in his brain. This is the only thing I have to hold on to stay in this game.”
Ometepe
Day 12
Phillip: “Rob and Grant stepped away to go watch the duel at RI so I had a funny kind of day. For me, it’s like I can’t make an impression on these ladies. It’s frustrating for me. These girls remind me of crabs, particularly Natalie and Ashley. I have a very difficult time trying to approach them. They are quick to move away. They see me coming and they don’t want to have a conversation with me. They definitely remind me of crabs. Andrea is a little bit more approachable but she is cautious. She doesn’t want Rob or Grant to know that she is talking to me even though they’re the ones that sent her closest ally, Matt, to Redemption Island.”
Interesting that this confessional had to occur after Phillip had talked to Andrea because, how else would he know she was cautious and didn’t want Rob and Grant to know about their conversation. These talks are either the basis of the vote that will defeat Rob or they are more doubts as to his chances of success. I noted that we had a shot of Andrea chopping something and looking like she could chop her thumb instead. That’s twice now that we’ve seen something like this. Could it be to foreshadow Andrea getting injured and being medevaced?
(If not then all I can say is: Kids, do not hold your thumb out like that when chopping with a knife!)
Ashley: “We miss the boys. Rob and Grant are like our big brothers so it’s weird not having them around. We have to fake it to make Phillip feel as part of the group, we have to fake it so Andrea feels comfortable. There’s a lot of faking going on but it’s the name of the game.”
Andrea: “My relationship with the girls? There’s a level of frustration that’s growing a little bit because they don’t do that much. It’s a little agitating to me because I want to keep going but I also have to hang out with them so it feels like us three girls are together. They are sweet girls but, the girls, their conversation goes to superficial stuff, like “How’s my hair? Talking about stuff like that. Right now, I don’t feel safe. Oh! We have our five, we have our five but, if I had it my way, I would want to get rid of Natalie and Ashley before Phillip but I can’t really bring that up without putting myself on the chopping block.”
With Andrea seen working before this scene and throughout this confessional, tending fire and picking up branches while the two other girls were sun bathing, we were told which one was the better survivor. Ashley already had too thin a story but Natalie suffered from this direct comparison. If Ashley and Natalie think they are faking it we heard that Andrea also knows she has to hide her frustrations and hang out with the girls for appearances.
Phillip and Andrea had a moment, the Federal agent saying: “I like you a lot. I feel you are the best female worker here.”
Andrea: “You can’t forget the social game so you can’t be working the entire time. You have to socialize too.”
Phillip: “I haven’t connected with the younger ladies except you a little bit…”
Andrea: “Tell me: As there been any point in the game where you tried to throw me under the bus?”
Phillip assured her: “Never.”
They continued confiding but at one point, Andrea said: “Matt is long gone.”
What could that mean?
Despite this, Phillip added: “If Matt comes back, I can see you, me and Matt being in an alliance. Rob back-stabbed Matt and I’m just waiting for my time. That’s what is frustrating for me: They don’t realize that this guy has a history of throwing people under the bus when it suits his needs.”
Phillip: “I made some real synergy with Andrea today and I think that, in the future that would hold something both for she as well as I. To fully understand my relationship with Rob is: The king is a dictator and I’m a lord and I’m waiting for my opportunity to replace the king.”
In the middle of this confessional, we saw Rob and Grant returning, Rob saying that Kristina had won before confessing that he was only kidding. Andrea couldn’t hide her reaction: “Don’t do that.”
So, is Matt-Andrea-Phillip the alliance that will overturn Rob? We know what happened to Phillip’s first alliance of three so let’s wait before crowning one of them king of Nicaragua. For now, we simply note that it makes another end-game connection for Phillip and doubts for Rob.
On the way back to Zapatera
Day 12
Stephanie: “Redemption Island was beautiful because we got to speak and Boston Rob heard us loud and clear unless for some reason he lost his hearing because before leaving, he told us to hang on and that’s what we are going to do: We are going to hang on. This is our objective right now and hopefully things go our way that’s the only thing I can do right now because my head’s on the chopping block and I don’t want my head to go rolling.”
As she said this, we saw a little frog perilously trying to hang on to a branch as it crossed from one side of our screen to the other, obviously symbolizing Stephanie’s attempt to cross from one tribe to the other. The frog made it.
Zapatera
Day 13
Krista (after listening to Steve speak in sports clichés): “Since Russell has left, there’s been zero talk of strategy. Everything has been: We did awesome at this challenge. You did great. It was all you” I mean, that’s all anyone’s talked about. They just aren’t playing the game. When the game makes them play it, they are going to be very disappointed.”
Just then, with Krista in the foreground, Sarita in the back, David was seen using a machete to chop some wood. Now that Krista is gone does that mean that Sarita is next? It could very well be. That’s the one player David would like to chop as we were soon to discover.
Mike: “Krista and Stephanie, they are kind of on the outskirts of our tribe. They are definitely conspiring together. They were part of Russell’s alliance and they’ve remained very tight. There definitely are some risks but I don’t see it playing into the game too much at this point.”
That’s a fourth “we are naïve” comment from a member of the Zap 6. Then, as the tribe talked about going for the victory, we had an image of David with a piece of string hanging in front of his face. It looked like a hangman’s noose. So, is David victim or executioner? Both?
Julie: “I feel that the tribe is a little overconfident right now. There’s reasons for it but we threw that challenge and I hope it doesn’t come back to bite us. Once you start winning, you get on a roll and, to stop that roll, I’m a little superstitious when it comes to that. I want to keep everyone in check until actually we win. Then we could be cocky or whatever but right now it’s kind of bad Karma.”
Two things to note: The editors obviously used a confessional from Julie that was given before the last Tribal Council because Zapatera already won a challenge after throwing the challenge. The bad Karma will stick to this tribe because, just when Julie’s interview ended, we saw Mike dropping the pot of water on the fire, Ralph even noting: “You put our fire out!” Will Zapatera fall because of a stupid move by Mike?
The Challenge
Steve and Julie sat out the challenge.
Rob was Ometepe’s caller and puzzle solver.
Stephanie, as designated by Sarita, did the same for Zapatera.
Sarita: “If you were calling out the directions, you were also the puzzle maker and Stephanie is good. She’s a linguist, you could tell. I knew she was going to be great to call things out. She’s bossy as all heck so that was definitely the job for her.”
David: “I’m not God’s gift to puzzle world but I am certainly more qualified to be doing a word puzzle than Stephanie. Sarita’s trying to be fair, Sarita is letting everybody have a chance, everybody’s playing but this isn’t a pee-wee soccer league.”
Rob: “I’m good at puzzles so this could be a turning point for this tribe. There’s no way they can take this win from us.”
I don’t think Rob’s words were meant to apply to only this challenge.
During the challenge, Ralph, who had never shut up, confusing Stephanie, finally was given instructions to get Zapatera’s last bag only to get the traditional: “No, your other left!”
Rob was given an early lead but he wasted time opening his bags.
Stephanie didn’t mess around untying the knots.
The camera showed us a letter that had fallen to the ground, making us think Rob would come one short but he noticed it in time and completed the puzzle first.
Before that, Jeff made a comment that really had me thinking: “This is a Hero or a Goat role. When you put yourself as the caller and the puzzle solver, you better be right.”
Did Jeff just tell us that Stephanie will indeed join Rob only to become his goat? Or maybe the goat will be Natalie because the camera went looking for her when Jeff said the word goat.
The sideline discussion from Zapatera was also interesting:
Sarita, looking very worried: “She’s got it. I’m not even worried about her.”
Later, as Stephanie slowed down, Steve said: “I wish David had been caller. I don’t think she’s smart enough for this.”
Ralph, directly to Sarita: “That’s why we needed David.”
Mike, to David after Rob had tasted victory: “Should’ve had you do that puzzle.”
Ralph: “Yep, David should have been there.”
As Ometepe carried off their tray of pastry, I was reminded of Randy but no one decided to mock the other team this time.

Julie: “Even though we lost today in the challenge, we really won. It’s going to be between Krista and Stephanie. Those two are on the chopping block tonight.”
Note Julie’s departure from her bad Karma line. It makes us think she is forgetting something here which isn’t a good sign for her and her tribe.
Ometepe
Everyone was eating: The monkey, the crab, the vulture (a lot of those this season), the grasshopper and, of course, the castaways who were savoring their pastries.
Ashley: “Oh! My God! The chocolate donuts! I can’t even choose a favorite. Like, I love muffins and those muffins were apple cinnamon or something and they were sooo good!”
Hearing Ashley’s Oh! My God! Reminded me of someone: Amber in Australia of course. So, is Ashley the new Amber? No but a confessional by Natalie about those donuts could have made that connection. Natalie was once more ignored. A little vignette from her would have been a nice touch to give to a potential winner.
Phillip: “We got a win today! You get to see my beautiful whites more often.”
Ashley: “Phillip was like: “I’ll trade a donut if someone gives me a massage. I wouldn’t give you a massage for a dozen donuts, buddy.”
Grant: “I pick up the coffee after everybody is distracted by the food. I swirl it around a little bit, I smell it and I see what could be a little roll of paper. Sure enough, Rob saw the same thing. What do you do? You got all your tribe hanging around but nobody caught it, I don’t think.”
Grant handed the bottle to Boston Rob.
Rob: “Grant set a block up for me. I was going to take it out and put it down my pants but if I do that it would be too obvious that I have it on me. How can I get that whole thing over there, so that I can make him come back to the camp? So, when Grant turned the other way, that set a pick for me and I went around the outside. It was like a well choreographed football play!
I’m going to switch this with the clue that I already have. I’ll give them the clue I already have and keep this one. We have to move.
Today is a good day. What can I say?! Not only did we win immunity and reward but I got very lucky and had someone hand me the clue to the hidden immunity idol and I went to hide it for him. Unbeknownst to Grant, I ran to the stash that had my original clue that I had buried and switched it with the one we had in our coffee. That first clue was so ridiculous! Something about the idol being in the sand, under a rock, in a tree! There’s no way to find anything with it…
When Grant first came up to me, I wasn’t sure if he had seen me in the woods so I had to pretend like I was nervous. I mean, this is really all for nothing because I already have the immunity idol but it’s fun for me. I have to entertain myself out here. I had to hustle but you got to hustle if you want to make a dollar! Everybody knows that.”
Zapatera
Sarita tried to defend her rationale, explaining that David stresses out under pressure.
That just ignited David’s fury. He freaked out saying he doesn’t freak out.
Steven: “It’s absurd for Sarita to go with her decision that Stephanie was the right person. Everybody knows that we have a very strong attorney that he lives doing puzzles. That’s his thing. I’m more disappointed in the whole team than at Stephanie, for a couple of strong personalities not to step up.”
Mike: “Stephanie and Krista made their bed on day one, literally and metaphorically, right next to Russell. So, I can’t see either of them as someone that I can trust. With Stephanie’s floundering today at the puzzle, I might put her on the chopping block number one.”
Julie and Sarita went for a walk. They agreed they didn’t trust Stephanie but Julie added that Stephanie could turn around while: “With Krista, I don’t even want to waste my breath. I don’t like her.”
Sarita agreed.
Julie: “I’m hoping that we can still reel Stephanie in but Krista? Nah! They both have targets but Krista has the bull’s eye on her.”
Sarita added that she didn’t trust Stephanie, Julie and David because he is a lawyer.
Sarita: “If it was entirely up to me, David would be going home tonight but Stephanie and Krista? They played their hands early on so now they are two dead ducks sitting on a lake, waiting for the gunshot.”
Stephanie and Krista were talking to each other.
Stephanie said that she didn’t understand why they wouldn’t keep a healthy person in place of Steve.
Krista added that they had to continue to fight both at camp and on Redemption Island because the others weren’t playing the game and it would come back to bite them in the end.
That certainly sounded like a prophecy.
Krista: “The sad thing is that there’s really no scrambling… It’s either me or Stephanie going home. They are so locked tight <Mike shown yawning> in their comfort of: “Let’s just get through this one and then we know we’re safe.” They don’t think about what if, after this vote, everyone makes it to the merge? They are not thinking about that and who is going to stick around to the end… If I had to put money on it, I’d say that none of them are going to make it to the end. I just wish I was going to be around to see it.”
Tribal Council
Krista: “After Russell left, it seems like there’s been no game playing. It’s like the Brady bunch went camping and they invited the two neglected step-children to come along.”
Sarita: “I think it’s funny because we have been playing it so fast and furious that we unseated one of the best players in survivor history. We want to stick and see if we can take it all the way.”
Krista: “But playing the game means you don’t stick with six through the entire game. You go down to 5, to 4. then 3.and then 2 and then you have to play.”
Mike: “You haven’t played that strategic game because you haven’t had those conversations…You have been abrasive this entire time to everybody.”
Jeff: “You are implying there are no sub-alliances within this group.”
Krista: “I think if there are any, it is in pairs. You obviously have Mike and Steve who have been tight from the beginning. Then you have Julie who has become comfortable with Steve. You have Sarita and Ralph and they seem to be together. I don’t know where that leaves Dave but it seems to be twos so with me and Stephanie here; that could be a big four. If I was in that six, I would be jumping on one of us.”
Mike: “What she doesn’t know is that in our six, there’s been lots of talks of strategy.”
Steve: “I would have preferred somebody else making the calls today. I wasn’t able to say anything but I would have thrown down to have David make the calls and do the puzzle.”
Asked if it would be fair to vote her out since she failed, Stephanie said: “I just have to rely on my record with them. I did my best in every other challenge. I know I have. I just have to make sure that they realize it.”
Stephanie added that, with Redemption Island, they still had to keep the faith in each other alive.
As Jeff went to tally the votes, the two girls held hands, obviously unsure what the tribe had decided.
After sharing a hug, Stephanie told Krista to hang in there.
Jeff sent them back to camp by saying: “The good news tonight is that you had an easy vote. The bad news is that Krista didn’t go quietly. The question is: What kind of damage did she do to the alliances within this tribe?”

The Story
It is quite noticeable that everyone in Ometepe is getting more airtime, something that was an early worry for Rob’s success. With the way the scenes always seem to be cut by going to Ometepe first, even ignoring Redemption Island, the winner most likely resides on that beach.
After being portrayed as a tribe that didn’t respect the game, Zapatera was now seen as a naïve tribe, one that didn’t see that the girls could cause damage. As for the vote itself, was it edited that way to keep a surprise or did no one approach Stephanie to tell her she was safe and start building a bridge? The two girls really looked surprised when the first vote was read so, unless Stephanie is a good actress, she didn’t know. Jeff, wicked as ever, was sure to use the plural when talking about alliances in the tribe. Something will break within the Zapatera 6. After naiveté, we should see paranoia.
The Characters
At Redemption Island
Krista: Her last words in camp and her interventions at Tribal Council sounded prophetic and told us of Zapatera’s fall but she also said: “I wish I would be around to see it.” That could have been left in to hint that she will return from RI and make the jury. Let’s wait until she beats Matt first.

Matt: I still see Matt returning to the game, the doubts we saw in the preview could be a way to connect him even more to the audience. However, for the first time, I am not so sure. Despite calling Rob a rascal the two seemed to come to terms, Matt apparently making his peace with the vote that sent him to RI so his story could be getting to an end. Even if he returns, Matt sounded more like he’d rejoin Rob instead of plotting against him.

The Doomed Tribe
Julie: One of the featured “Naïve Players”, Julie forgot about her fear of bad Karma when she said that losing a challenge was like a win. She doesn’t think that Stephanie is a threat, even hopes to bring her back in the fold. Julie will pay for her loss of focus.
Mike: This other Naïve Player was the one that put out the tribe’s fire and he stood up to Krista at TC. It seems that his episode #1 weird comments were really to tell us that this guy doesn’t get it.
Steven: Is Steve in trouble physically? We heard Stephanie saying that they should keep a healthy person instead of him but we haven’t seen anything besides his decision to sit out the challenge. Steve also showed that he is one step behind the action when he borrowed the slogan “We are Family”. He also seemed to have been outvoted by Julie and Sarita when it came to deciding between Stephanie and Krista.
Ralph: Now that his conflict with Russell has been resolved, Ralph disappeared only to be shown complaining about Sarita’s decision. A dumb##### could win the game but, with the “No, your other left” comment, Ralph became a Dumb Player and those never win.

Sarita: Has there ever been so much indications to the next person voted out? Sarita’s story is over. We saw David chopping wood immediately after her face had been shown on screen. The whole tribe complained about her decision and she was the one that had a confessional targeting David, a member of the Zapatera 6.
David: He could be the alternate boot target and the imagery of the hangman’s noose in front of his face doesn’t exactly bode well for him. The executioner could be executed himself shortly after getting Sarita’s head.
The Flipper
Stephanie: Her words before, during and after the duel gives her a direct connection to Rob so I feel she punched her ticket to the merge. With his own girls having lacklustre stories, could Rob pick her as his goat? That’s what Jeff’s words about the role of Heroes and Goats hinted. It would be quite a story if, after relying on Russell, Stephanie made the end game by riding on Rob’s back. Is it too good to be true? Probably but she should make the merge and outlast the rest of her tribe.
The Good Beach
Ashley: Even if she received more airtime, Ashley still remains a character without a plan or a personal story. All we know is that her life would be perfect if it wasn’t for Phillip.

Grant: He is finally shown as Rob’s right hand man but he is also clearly one step behind. He is more a source of entertainment for Rob than a competitor. Outside of that, we haven’t really been introduced to Grant as an individual.

Natalie: Her story is either on hold until she makes a move with Rob or it is regressing to the point that the camera looked for her when Jeff was talking about a goat. She could make the F3 if she doesn’t let Stephanie steal her spot but hearing Andrea saying that she should be voted out before Phillip wasn’t a good sign. Andrea also called her lazy, saying she didn’t do much which often is a death-kiss on Survivor.
Phillip: He continues to create doubts around his plans and those doubts serve much more to make us fear for Rob’s future than for Phillip’s success.
Andrea: Andrea is shown as a smart, cautious player that was clearly separated from the vapid girls on her tribe. Does she have enough dimensions as a character to represent a worthwhile winner? If she makes it to the end and organizes Rob’s dismissal, I’d say she certainly does. On the other hand, we have seen what happens to likable women that make deals with Phillip. Or will Andrea get injured and have to leave the game? Despite her earlier claim, she doesn’t appear to know how to handle a hatchet or a knife. If I could make a quinella bet, she’d be on the ticket.

Rob: If hustling is the way to make a dollar, Rob hustles about a million times more than anyone else so that should be enough to claim the final prize! Kidding aside, this episode showed us that Rob has doubts surrounding his chances to make it to the end. The lack of doubt was what had told us that Marcus couldn’t win.
More importantly, Rob isn’t portrayed as a one-dimensional Hero because some of his actions are presented negatively, like his refusal to explain himself to Matt and his lie to Grant.
With doubts surrounding his road to the end, the possibility that he will wind up sitting next to someone nice which would create doubt around his ability to get the votes, I still see Redemption Island as the story of Rob winning. The Sweet Taste of Victory would be overdue as he himself said after winning Ometepe’s first immunity challenge.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
03-19-11, 00:10 AM (EST)

49. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

LAST EDITED ON 03-19-11 AT 00:14 AM (EST)
Thanks, michel! I'm on the same page as you with all of it, for the most part, especially Matt coming back from RI. And, even though he's a tad too "religious" for my taste (I don't like it when people pray for victory on a game show) he is such a sweet kid that I think his coming back will bolster Jeff's claims that we will love the RI twist -- I see the public being happy that Matt comes back in. As to Stephanie -- I do see her making it to merge, but after she teams up with Rob to scr@w Zap, I think her story is over. She might outlast the rest of the Zaps, but only if Rob lets her. I definitely don't see him allowing her to make it to F3 (as there will be more Zaps on the jury than Ometepes & I don't see Rob taking that chance with the jury).
One thing I wanted to remind you of -- when Rob said he had to "hustle to make a dollar" it immediately reminded me of Sandra -- she used that exact word both times she was on Survivor (about how she is coming on Survivor to "hustle and make my money"). And of course, she won both times. *Might* be a good sign for Rob.

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Belle Book 3613 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Thong Contest Judge"
03-19-11, 03:21 PM (EST)

51. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

I'm still cautious about Boston Rob winning. As I said, the merge will tell the tale -- or maybe even the next vote if his tribe has to go to TC again.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-20-11, 12:11 PM (EST)

56. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

LAST EDITED ON 03-20-11 AT 01:06 PM (EST)
Here are some points I saw...The introduction by Jiffy highlighted the two different directions that the "stars", Russell and Rob, were taking. Nice shot of Rob running... Regarding Phillip, we got this: Phillip in confessional...”I need to get rid of him now, CLAP, good-bye Rob” Then we see an immediate picture of a little tree frog who is ready to jump. This is symbolic that Phillip is going to “jump”
I see the introduction this time as a way to highlight the different directions....they appear to be polar opposites. Rob is running toward the end game, and Russell just ran right out of the game. I think it was indeed a positive introduction for Robfadda. He has two that are not aligned with him, he took out Kristina, now, is it time to deal with Phillip? It's the next big conflict for Robfadda to meet...
With michel's astute observation...Last week, after starting on Redemption Island, we had visited Ometepe instead of Zapatera. This week, it’s very noteworthy that we didn’t even go to RI but visited Ometepe once more. I don’t think there is any question left that the winner is on this tribe....at this point, I have to agree. I do indeed believe the winner is at camp Ometepe.

Confessional - Phillip: Tonight Kristina went home after a 4-3 vote, her and me. Not too surprising, I suspected it. There is a very close alliance with Rob and several others in the group, they have been running the show from the get-go. I’m kind of like the odd man out, even though I think I bring alot to this tribe. And, soon, a couple of people are going to have to wake up and realize that. (See Phillip working to stoke and revitalize the fire as the others are going to bed).
This scenario sets up episode 6 nicely. Phillip knows that he is the “odd man out”, and that he needs to MAKE some others see that he is valuable to the tribe. How does he go about doing it, by the looks of it, he’s going to call out the lazy spa girls. It appears that he is going to hit his tribemates over the head that he is a harder worker at camp than the girls. But, is this what they value? Hard work at camp vs. challenge worth.
Then we see a bucket of crabs (this is what Phillip will later compare the girls to!), and Phillip going to lay down in the shelter, where Rob asks him if he’s wearing his underwear. And, Phillip gives Rob a little pat on the back...(Would he like to be giving him a little "stab" in the back?)
Cut to Morning of Day 12, and Ashley is carving the mark in the tree to count off the days they have been there, with Andrea looking over her shoulder...(is this symbolic? Would Andrea like to replace Ashley?)
Then we cut to Phillip stretching his legs in his underwear, with “kooky” music in the background and Rob is talking-complaining about him to Grant...”Phillip stuck his freakin’ leg, like his knee, in my back, like just to be an a$$ last night, as they are taking the laundry off the clothesline. Grant asks Rob, “do you think he’s a little upset about TC last night?” “I don’t know”
Let's examine this kooky music that surrounds Phillip. For me, it does work to diffuse the threat that we are being led to believe that Phillip is for Rob by the editing. Is it misdirection?
Confessional - Rob: TC is always a miserable night, all around. On top of it, Phillip is bugging everyone, including myself. He’s COMPLETELY off his rocker, walking around in his pink panties, (note the kooky music in the background again), nobody trusts him. As long as Phillip is aggravating everyone so much, it takes all the heat off of me. So, in a way, maybe he needs to stay!
With this profound statement, as long as Phillip is around, people have a greater target than me to aim for....very, very profound observation by Rob, and it's the next question to settle at Ometepe. This observation is underlined by them cutting here to go to the Survivor Intro and theme song...
After the Intro, there are beautiful shots of sea life, fish and rays, then we get Steve's insight in confessional: “Day 12, the spirits in the tribe are high, as long as we keep excelling in the challenges, everything is going along as plannned.”
We see happy family life at Zap with the Zap 6 all fishing together, Julie kisses Ralph, and Steve continues...“our six is extremely rock solid and my vision would be to try to reach out to those 2 girls, (see Steph and Krista going in to the surf), there’s always hope to bring Krista and Stephanie in.” See them cooking 2 fish on their bar-b-que.
Steve continues, “If we can show them that we are a solid family and that there’s no back stabbing (see Krista and Steph eating the fish as he says backstabbing), and that it’s a safe place to be, I would think that they would want to hang tight with us, going into the merge. (We hear Steph saying that it’s the best tasting one yet!) Also, note that the tribes are thinking ahead to the merge.
Steve is looking at Survivor through rose-colored glasses, is it a safe place to be? Isn't the object to outwit and outplay to outlast? We also hear that he is looking forward to the merge. Steve is very naiive. Will he be blindsided because of his naiive assessment?
Immediately after Steve is done with his confessional, we see the little green tree frog again, noting to us viewers that someone IS going to jump....specifically it followed a shot of Krista and Stephanie, and the confessional from Steve that they need to stay in the “solid family”.
Next Mike reads tree mail regarding sending 2 to RI, Stephanie and Krista get to go, and Julie tells us her thoughts on that...Julie: “Now that Russell is gone, S and K are not even a threat. They can go do whatever they want, they can talk about whatever they want, we really don’t care, they’re just pawns in this big game”....This is a very negative confessional, in that Julie is totally discounting them, and I might add that she is probably speaking for the tribe. So the tribe is discounting them....doesn’t bode well, imo, for Julie and Zaps. Never discount anyone in a game, especially when they have already mentioned the merge.
They pack to leave, Ralph yells, have fun, and Julie finishes her confessional...”they can’t do any damage to us.” I say, famous last words....that is just what they are setting out to do, do you damage.
Cut to the tree frog climbing up, preparing to launch! And we see K and S, “what are we going to tell them? That we are Russell’s girls and that we hate our tribe?”
Stephanie utters the title of the episode....We hate our tribe. This is the highlighted event of this episode, they hate their tribe and they are going to make like a tree frog and jump, and RI is going to be the vehicle that lets them deliver their message, get the ball rolling, or as Russell has told us, planting the "Russell seed".
Steph: I am hoping to send the other tribe a message, that they have 2 girls that are ready to flip, so we are ready to cause havoc and chaos, and cause craziness at the merge....cut in the tree frog as he LEAPS, jumps...foreshadowing the jumping of these girls.
RI Duel: K and S seat themselves, then Rob and Grant, then the competitors arrive, Matt battles against Kristina. Welcome...Matt has won both duels, do or die situation, have to win, loser goes home...race to collect pieces, use them to complete puzzle in a shape of a cube...one shot...starts...winner stays, loser goes home....3x3 cube, get all cubes up here then work on it...Matt has his pieces, Kristina now has hers, pieces are not light...Kristina makes progress, Matt makes progress, Matt is very close but wrong, starting over completely, now Kristina is like a true gladiator...
Matt addresses Rob...”Rob, you rascal! Why’d you vote me out for no reason? I still don’t know why, it might calm me down if I knew why?"...Jiffy asks, “Rob, why did you vote him out?” “It doesn’t take one person to vote someone out, Jeff, you know that." Rob's answer was edited...in that I think more was said, but the editing led us to believe that Rob answered another question without showing his hand, as the experienced gambler that we've known him to be. The editing is showing Rob is really SMART.
The RI challenge continues...Kristina has new energy....Matt thinks he may be closer, has it, out of nowhere, Matt stays alive! Matt goes immediately to face Rob and Grant...”I told you!” and Rob/Grant clap and give him the thumbs up...then he hugs Kristina.
“Matt, congrats, you are still in this game! As he shakes his head yes...Jeff: “alot going on at the end of that challenge as you are talking to Rob and Grant about why they voted you out (this confirms that dialogue that happened between Rob, Grant, and Matt was indeed edited out, something is covered up that we don't know about)...did you learn anything? Matt says that he told both of those guys that he would, that he wanted to go with them to the top 3, I wanted you two guys to win (?), so hopefully I’ll hop back up to the Ometepe tribe.” It sounds like maybe Matt was bargaining with them, noting his plans to come back to Ometepe, pledging something to them, perhaps? Insightful, or, has Matt learned from a prior mistake...is he now playing the seasoned veteran? Time will tell. I thought this was a good sign for Matt and his longevity in the game.
Matt turned to tell Rob and Grant, “I told you!...What did Matt tell them? Was a deal struck right here between Rob, Grant and Matt? I don’t know, but I do feel there was editing here.
...then Steph says, “I kind of like that he says he would stick to his tribe...I wish I felt the same he did, there is still a clear division. Jeff says, “in your tribe”, and Krista continues, “us two together, on the bottom”. Steph says they may think that they have the numbers, but I say, yellow might look good on me, K says , “me, too.” Jiffy notes, “Wow, Rob, Grant, it never hurts to have 2 people say, we might be willing to merge with you.” Rob replies, “It doesn’t hurt if they are telling the truth”. Stephanie or Krista reply, “I’m telling the truth”, Rob and Grant both look over at them, and Rob gives them a thumbs up. And to punctuate the pact, we get a symbol type percussion sound. Then Jeff says so long Kristina, who wants to keep her buff, but has to throw it in the fire. The spectators applaud her, sad music, and she is gone....
Jeff says, Matt, for the third time, you have seized the moment in the your quest to grab the million dollars, and a chance to get even or rejoin. Grab your stuff and head back and await your next opponent. Jeff tells the spectators to head out. Rob comes down the steps and tells them to “hang in there”. Steph has a confessional, “I didn’t even plant a seed, it’s like I took a sequoia tree and I put it in his brain. This is the only thing I have to hang on to to stay in this game...see them leave. Dramatic music plays as the camera zooms out of the arena. Cut to commercial.
Notice that Steph is getting all the important confessionals, clearly she's the one that will indeed jump from Zap to Rob at the merge and everything is in place. Krista is the doomed one, imo.
Cut to Ometepe in the AM, Phillip, watching the girls who are talking about rice, how they don’t usually eat rice...Ashley and Natalie, they talk about making it in the microwave in 90 seconds, as they are talking we see Andrea working and chopping something...
Phillip in confessional: Rob and Grant stepped away to go watch the duel at RI. For me, I can’t make an impression on these ladies, it’s frustrating for me.” Then we see a monkey looking down from the tree. Then we see Phillip out crab hunting and his confessional continues...”these girls remind me of crabs, particularly Natalie and Ashley. I have a very difficult time trying to approach them. They are quick to move away....we see a crab go back into his hole as Phillip approaches with his spear...when they see me coming, and they don’t want to have a conversation with me about it....see him throw the spear. They definitely remind me of crabs. Andrea is a little more approachable. She’s cautious, she doesn’t want Rob or Grant to know that she’s talking to me, even though they are the ones that sent her closest ally, Matt, to RI.
Then we see Andrea and Phillip at the fire, she’s commenting on wet wood, and Phillip says it’s going to be okay.
Ashley in confessional: “We miss the boys. Rob and Grant are like our big brothers. We have to fake it to make Phillip feel like part of the group, We have to fake it so Andrea feels comfortable. There’s alot of faking going on, but that’s the name of the game...Clearly, Ashley feels quite secure in her alliance of 4, which excludes Phillip and Andrea. With this confessional, I can see Ashley voting for either Phillip or Andrea, albeit she can't stand Phillip.
Then around the fire, Ashley says, “the sun is coming out, it’s almost time for our beach day! We see Andrea there too with Nat as well.
Andrea tells us in confessional: “My relationship with the girls, there is some frustration there, because they just don’t do that much. Then we see Andrea and Ashley under the waterfall shower...with Nat. She continues with confessional, “it’s a little aggravating to me because I want to get stuff done and keep going. I kind of have to keep hanging out with them, so us three girls are together. They are sweet girls, but the conversations usually go to superficial stuff, like, oh, how’s my hair, then we see Nat and Ashley lying on a blanket in the sand on the beach talking about nothing really, as we see Andrea collecting firewood. She says that on Ometepe, they say we have our five....but if I had it my way, I’d like to get rid of Natalie and Ashley before Phillip. (This tells us that Andrea is being told that she is part of the alliance of 5 by the four). “But, I can’t really bring that up without putting myself on the chopping block.
So, Andrea is still an outsider, she would like to move up the hierarchy by replacing Ash and Nat before Phillip, because she discounts Phillip. This sets up another option for Andrea...as Phillip has hinted at also, that Andrea and Phillip could align to target Ash or Nat.
Then we see Andrea in her bathing suit at the fire, with Phillip sitting next to her...he tells her, To win Survivor, I think you got a good shot. *Even though Phillip speaks this and he's "kooky", I still think it's very positive for Andrea...she has a good shot to win this, and we all know it's a positive when others talk about you....but, otoh, is Phillip just buttering her up to make a move to gain an ally...sure looks like it. She says, “thank-you”. Phillip continues, “I like you alot, you are the best female worker here”.
Andrea says, “I appreciate that, it’s a little frustrating being here when there’s like stuff to always be done, you still have to play the social game, so you can’t be working the entire time, you still have to socialize too...Phillip says, “well, look at me, I’m stuck, I’m so frustrated in this game because I haven’t connected with any of you younger ladies, you, I’m having a tiny bit of a conversation, but, the other two, they can’t engage me.” Andrea says, “so, can I ask you something?” “Sure”, “There hasn’t been any point in this game that you didn’t throw me under the bus or do anything against me? Phillip looks her in the eye and states, “Never”, she says, “Never?”, he replies, ‘Never”.
Andrea says, “OK, I wasn’t like suspicious, I’m just curious, but it’s hard to trust anyone out here”. (Andrea is accurately assessing things and as Phillip notes later, she's very cautious) Phillip says that, “Only Rob and Grant, and you guys are pulling all the strings. I sleep by myself, nobody snuggles up with me, and I get to have that shayshshsh”...she says, “what’s that?”, “I’m sure you and Matt talk about shshshshsh,” She says that Matt’s long gone, “I know but at one point you used to talk with him about the game, strategy, whatever, I’ve never done that with anyone in the game. I’m going to put this out there. How about you, me, and Matt form an alliance. Cause I felt like Rob backstabbed Matt and I am just waiting for my time. It’s just frustrating for me, they don’t realize that this guy has a history of throwing people under the bus when it suits his needs. (Phillip doesn't sound so kooky now, does he?) This could be ominous for Phillip...as long as he was kooky he wasn't threatening, but if he can make some headway with allies, I'd say he won't be so kooky anymore and could then be considered threatening.
Later, Phillip in confessional: I made some real synergy with Andrea today...and, I think that maybe, in the future, that will hold something for both she, and I. Immediately after his mention of the future hope we see Grant and Rob returning from RI...they walked up smiling and Rob teased, “Kristina won”, and they said, WHAT?

With a reaction shot from Andrea, and then he said, "no, just kidding, Matt won"....and Andrea said, “Don’t do that!”
This was a very subtle insertion of something that didn't have to be shown, but I think was because it underlines to Rob that Andrea is still very much emotionally tied to her island boyfriend and will definitely reunite with him, should he be returned to the game....I have no doubt that Rob is foreseeing this as a real possibility at this point. He definitely sees Andrea as a threat to HIS future...imo.
Phillip then continues with the confessional. "Rob is a dictator, and I am a lord, and I am waiting for my opportunity to replace the king.” And, he smiles. This is a direct threat, he notes that he's WAITING for his opportunity, he's waiting for Matt to get back as well, he's also noting this future possibility, just as Rob is. Who is the bigger threat to tie up with Matt....Subtle Andrea, or Lord Phillip?
Cut to day 12 at Zap, and Steph gets more juicy confessionals about jumping to Rob, they are going to heed his advice, and "hang on". Note: Steph was doing most of the talking, planning, and she told us their ideas and the events in confessional, not Krista.
Then we cut to Steve giving them advice as there is no "I" in team, I note that there is a shot of the "noose" rope with Steve also...Then we get Krista's vantage point, that since RussHell left there is no talk of strategy....then to highlight this point we hear Steve and Mike talking about how things must suck at the other camp now...Krista continues... "Everything has been you did really awesome in the challenge. No, you did...No, it was all you (See Rooster and David talking and smiling now), or, that’s all that everyone’s just talking about, OR, (see Julie sleeping when she says,) they are just not playing the game." This was a very telling confessional highlighted with the visuals of the Zap 6 members....sounds like Krista is indeed being prophetic.
"And, when the game makes them play it (see Sarita in the background now), they’re going to be very disappointed". See David chopping and hear Steph say, would you like some fresh tortillas today, sir? She says this to K, to avoid hanging out with the tribe, excuse yourself by making a meal...then you don’t have to hear all the boring stories you’ve already heard 95 times.
Confessional from Narrator Mike: K and S, they’re kinda on the outskirts of our tribe, I know that they are definitely conspiring together, they were part of Russell’s alliance. They’ve remained pretty tight from there, so, there definitely are some risks, but he doesn’t see it playing into the game too much at this point.
Cut to the fire and shot of David with the noose rope right over his face, as we hear Steve say in the background, “We’re gonna go hard, there’s only victory today, guys”. The noose over David’s face says that David is going to hang...hmmmm? We saw later that David was hung out to dry by Sarita, who assinged the Challenge tasks.
Only victory.
Julie confessional: I feel like the tribe is a little over-confident right now, and there’s reason for it. But, we threw that challenge and I hope it doesn’t come back to bite us. Once you start winning, you get on a roll and it kinda (shot of David) and once you stop that roll, I’m a little superstitious when it comes to that stuff...so I want everybody to keep things in check...see the fire burning....until we actually win, then we can be cocky or whatever, but right now, (she makes a face), it’s bad karma....then immediately we see Mike trying to put the pot of rice and water over the fire, and he spills it and it burns him and puts the fire out! Rooster screams, “he’s put the fire out!“ The scene ends with a shot of the doused fire...and you see the black clouds a coming, I’m reminded of “a storm’s a coming!” A very ominous sign for Zapatera.
Clearly, Karma will come back to bite them...for throwing the challenge to boot the experienced RussHell...a very very ominous prediction for Camp Zap.
Cut to the Challenge, where the tribes are now assigning the tribemates...Sarita, as RussHell noted before, seems to be the one in charge. She makes the assignments, and no one but David questions her at the time...
See Sarita assign Stephanie the caller and puzzle solver, David in confessional says, "I’m more qualified, this isn’t like a peewee soccer league", he had questioned this assignment right off the bat. While the Zaps are questioning, we see the contrast, that Rob is confident, “I’m good at puzzles, there is no way they can take this away from us”....It seems to me that whenever Rob makes a statement like this, and it’s shown to the audience, it’s pure gold - you can take it to the bank. Rob is shown, once again, at being a great leader and confident in his own game, and able to quide his tribe.
We see the challenge, and it seems that Rob and Steph are both doing pretty well, Ralph says, hey what about me...Ralph stop talking...Grant gets two bags, Ashley has one, “Ralph stop till I address you, move to your left, your other left"...Grant has the last bag, Andrea and Phillip were totally ignored and didn’t get any bags...very telling. They are the low men on the totem pole. Grant is Rob's right hand man, Ash got one, and Nat was'nt involved either, but Rob's carrying her on his back.
Rob works on bags first, Jeff notes that he’s one of the best puzzle solvers...BR and Stephanie, both volunteered for this job, Steph has all her bags open, Sarita’s not worried. Jeff notes that this is a hero or a goat role, you better be right....Steph and Rob, Rob had a missing peice...Rob seems to be flying through it...hear STeph tell her tribe to shut up, Steve whispers to Julie, “I wish David had done this, I don’t think Stephanie is smart enough for this”, then we hear Rooster whisper something similar to Sarita...Rob wins reward and immunity...first person he hugs is Grant...then Phillip comes up to hug him with the others...
Then we see the black chicken of death chewing on a carcus as Krista walks by in the frame, followed by Rooster. Krista is toast, imo. Congrats Ometepe, and he hands the idol to Andrea...interesting. Is this foreshadowing for life for Andrea?
“TC tonight, someone will be voted out”. Zoom in on Krista as Jeff notes, “And, will be sent to RI, where they will have to duel.”..Before they have even cleared the Challenge area we hear a confessional from Julie: Well, even though we lost today in the challenge, we really won. This is going to be between K and St. Those two are on the chopping block tonight. As we see them walking away....cut to commercial. Another ominous confessional for Julie. I get the impression that they are way too cocky and over-confident, and we all know that when you think you are in charge and confident, that it will definitely come back to bite you...remember, it's called "Karma".
Back at Ometepe:
At Ometepe: We see a bird - a crane, a white headed monkey, a crab, and a cricket and they are ALL eating....then we see the Ome’s stuffing their faces with the donuts...they are so happy, Phillip is screaming, YUMMY! Phillip is happy in confessional, Ashley is happy, and wouldn't give Phillip a backrub for a dozen donuts...it does appear that a nice little conflict between Ashley and Phillip is brewing...note that Ashley is really the one seen complaining the most about him.
Then we get the action at Ometepe...
We see Grant lift up the coffee, open the jar, and say, “that’s coffee, smell that”...Grant in confessional: Sure enough, I pick up the coffee after everyone is distracted by the food, I swirl it around a little bit and I see a little piece of paper, Rob saw the same thing, as Rob grabs the coffee from him...., Grant continues in confessional..."But what do you do, you have all of your tribe around you...but nobody saw it, I don’t think"...
Then, Rob starts with his confessional..."then Grant set a block for me, I was gonna put it down my pants...but if I do that, it’s too obvious, I have it on me"...Grant says, “let’s head for the well”, Rob continues: "so, when Grant turned around he set a pick for me and I went around the outside"...Ashley is watching him go though...
We see Rob then relaxing on the beach in confessional saying, “just like a well choreographed football player!" Then we see Rob and Grant heading to the well, Grant opens the coffee and hands Rob the clue, he puts it in his pocket in his pant leg...
Then Grant gives Rob another canteen, and Rob says, "They think I’m going to get water...it’ll seem sneaky", as Grant takes back the coffee container. He tells Grant he’s going to go hide it...Grant comes back with the open coffee container and tells them to smell this, dude...cut to Rob who has opened the new clue and read it, looking behind him...and he says that he is going to go switch this with the clue that he already has, then he tells the camera man, “that we gotta move” as he takes off running...In confessional he says, “Today is a good day, not only did we win immunity, and reward, but I got very lucky and had someone hand me the clue to the HII, and I just went to go hide it from him...unbeknownst to Grant." We see Rob dig up the old clue, he swaps them out, as the white headed monkey looks down on him. "That first clue was so ridiculous, it says something about looking in the sand, and under a rock, maybe in a tree, dig for it, climb for it, who knows? There’s no way they are finding anything with it"...
Then we see Grant back with Rob...he shows Grant the clue and Rob notes, "when Grant first came up to me, I wasn’t sure if he saw me up in the woods", they decide to bury it and start running..."so, I had to pretend like I was nervous....I mean this is really all for nothing, because I already have (we see them bury it and step on it) the HII, but it’s fun for me, I have to entertain myself somehow...I had to hustle...but, you have to hustle if you want to make a dollar...everybody knows that!" I think, you have to hustle if you want to make a million dollars! This, too, could be considered a WINNING QUOTE! Another very positive sign for Robfadda....not only is he good but he is LUCKY. He also is clearly the one survivor out of all of these folks here, at Ometepe, and at Zap, that is shown HUSTLING. I do believe that Robfadda has a valid shot to win this game, and I am getting more confident that he will make the final 3.
Then we cut to Zapatera, and a buzzard flying overhead as a mother sea turtle is burying her eggs in the sand...trying to protect "her family". The buzzards are surrounding her and trying to get them....then we see the Zap 6...Steve says, this is the puzzle guy, as he untangles the net, Stephanie did a great job, but it just wasn’t her position...Sarita says, “I think, in her defense, and this was my rationale, obviously David is the puzzle guy, but David under pressure is really stressful, and David snaps back...”don’t even go there with that...me under pressure, as Sarita tries to interrupt, but David says, shhhh, just let me finish, just let me speak...me under pressure may not be the way you want it to be handled, but I don’t freak out, I do very well under pressure, my entire life is based on being under pressure...it just doesn’t jive well with your personality, maybe? That may be...then Sarita defends, “I’m just saying my perspective on the her, because normally I would’ve given the puzzle to you....but then, maybe in the future...and David interrupts, “there are no buts, I am the only one doing puzzles from here on out, period, point blank, no question.
Steve confessional: It’s absurd for Sarita to go with her decision that Stephanie’s the right person...everybody knows that we have an attorney that lives for doing puzzles, that’s his thing. I’m more disappointed in the whole team than in Stephanie. For a couple of strong personalities not to step up - I hope he includes himself in those strong personalities...then the dark chicken of death buzzard flies away...Could this be the downfall of Zapatera...none of their strong personalities are going to step up when they need to?
Back at the shelter area...I think I hear Mike say, “here’s the problem, we are one up at this point (first focused on Sarita), then he’s seen talking to Steve and Julie, “we need to string a couple victories together...we need to be really really smart about who we put where.This was just a personnel problem. Then Mike in confessional: "S and K made their bed, literally and figuratively on day one, right next to Russell. So, I don’t see either of them as someone I can trust. You know with Stephanie...she’s floundering today at the puzzle. I might put her on the chopping block, number one...then we see the buzzards taking flight..." Mike is the narrator...building suspense for TC.
Then we see Julie and Sarita on the beach walking. Julie asks Sarita, “so, what do you think, do you think Stephanie can come around?” Sarita says, “No, I don’t trust her one bit.” Julie says, “I don’t want to give up hope on her, but Krista, I don’t even want to waste my breath. Yeah, I don’t like her...”
Julie in confessional: I’m hoping that we can reel S in, but Krista, they both have targets, but Krista has the bullseye on her.
Then Sarita continues....”I mean her and Krista, and then David...I mean even if I could try to trust David, he is a lawyer, at his very core, he’s so out for himself."

In confessional: Sarita: If it was entirely up to me, David would be going home tonight - see David collecting firewood. But, S and K, they played their hand so early on so now it’s like they are 2 dead ducks, sitting on a lake, waiting for the gunshot...she a white headed monkey jump up and leave....
Then we see K ask S if there is any way, any thing that they can do, Steph replies...”with these dumb a$$ people? No.” I just don’t understand why they would get rid of a perfectly healthy person to like continue with Steve. Steve’s not beneficial around camp, Steve’s not a good athlete.” this is very telling, a ex-pro Football player is not a good athlete...well, what good is he to the tribe if he is poor at the challenges...dead weight? Ominous for Steve, imo.
Krista says that she believes there is a will and a plan and if it’s to be one of them tonight, then there’s nothing we can do about it, so we have to continue to fight on RI and continue to fight here, because they’re not playing the game. So, eventually it’s all gonna come back and bite them in the end....see a tarantula crawling around...that definitely can’t be a good sign...Krista's words are prophetic.
Michel had great notes at TC, Krista was spot on, my favorite quote of hers was that she predicted that none of them (Zap 6) would be there at the end, she only wishes she could be there to see it....WOW! Also loved that she called out the sub-sets in Zap and David was the odd man out! It seemed like everything she said in this episode was prophetic, will this statement be as well...I think it might.
My take on this episode:
1. Zapatera is WAY too cocky and confident, setting them up for a very big fall. I think it will start with Sarita, who already won her prize...seeing RussHell voted out was like her million dollars.
2. The next conflict to be resolved, one way or the other, at Ometepe is Phillip. We were shown that he and Kristina were the only ones not pledging their "allegiance" to Rob. He took care of Kristina, will he take care of Phillip? Or, will it be Andrea, who is poised to be reunited with her island boyfriend? If Phillip goes, I think this will bode well especially for Andrea. If Andrea goes, then Phillip as a threat is weakened.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-20-11, 08:04 PM (EST)

57. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

Nice post, FP. I wanted to point out though that Phillip doesn't say: "To win Survivor, I think you got a good shot." I'm not sure exactly what he says but I think it's "for you to stay alive, I think you got a good shot." I listened to it 5 or 6 times but can't make it out. If it was a big clue, I'd think the words would have been captioned on screen. Now that would have been a "Woh! Andrea!" moment.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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03-20-11, 09:28 PM (EST)

58. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts..."

I could've been mistaken, michel. I'll go back and listen to it as well...and yes, when there is mumbling and it's important, I think they do caption it on screen....like they did when Rob said Kristina won...no, just kidding! Ha!

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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03-22-11, 00:06 AM (EST)

59. "RE: Episode 5 Thoughts... Philip"

LAST EDITED ON 03-22-11 AT 00:07 AM (EST)
Philip
My musnings on why Philip appears to have so much story -- I think it's because Jeff loved the character and wanted to play it for all it was worth while it was around. In Rob's first season, there was a big promo about Rob's use of the Godfather techniques just before he went out, 7th boot. This had been building for several episodes. The promotion and focus did not mean he had a big season long story -- rather that Rob was almost gone and they needed to milk him to the max.
I notice that Rooster is also a larger than life character, but they backed off on the constant focus after setting him up. I think they have a little more time to develop him. Philip's story has been in our face every week. so my guess is that he is out of here next, plus only has one round at RI. As we saw with Jimmy J's facetime overdose last season -- so Philip has literally been in our faces, and his tribesmates, such that it has seemed like the Former Federal Agent? show.

Once Philip is gone we will start to get to know some of the other characters.
Coach was another larger than life favorite, but he did last until the penultimate episode, and I seem to remember we got a little Coach downtime along the way, which then went full tint for his boot.
With Philip, there's been no rest. Intensity like that has to burn out.
Robfaddah
As for Rob, I think he will have a good run, but if he did win, I think they could have and would have made it a bit more subtle. My guess is that the winner is not all that thrilling, and they will keep us enthralled with Rob as long as they can. Unless the winner is Matt, Rooster, Stephanie or Philip, I don't see this season focusing on the winner as the protagonist.
My speculation is that the winner profits from all the work of Boston Rob.
Although we see that Rob has learned a lot from past mistakes, he still repeated the old move of taking out an alpha male or strategic rival -- first Hunter (breaking up Hunter and Gina), and then Rob Cesternino. In HvV, he attempted to take out Russell, and that failure ended his game.
He took out Matt prematurely. He could have let Matt alone until Matt actually contemplated making a move against Rob. Matt was completely innocent, and Rob made a mistake. As with his original tribe of Mara'amu, the loss of a strong fit male led to a tribe of dwindling numbers.
Whatever Rob may say about how a group took out Matt, the deed rests on Rob, as we saw in the arena. Matt getting the Chosen One edit, that can't bode well for the chances of the guy who betrayed his trust, can it?
Re Matt and Rob's conversation at RI, we know from Jeff's blog that it was a long conversation, but they only left in the one line from Rob. Personally I did not admire the line they used. They showed Rob sidestepping the question. That might fly with some questioners, but Matt is clearly a direct guy who would appreciate a very forthright answer.
Rob chose to gloss over rather than accept his responsibility, and to me I think we are meant to see Rob losing the opportunity to bring Matt back into the fold. I think that Matt will eventually take Rob down. Whether Matt will do more than that I don't know, but I think he'll be the end of Rob, quite likely assisted by Andrea.
ETA for typo

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
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03-19-11, 08:43 AM (EST)

50. "Rob vs. Rooster"

LAST EDITED ON 03-19-11 AT 09:04 AM (EST)
On another site, someone postulated that Rob would be the winner and his "proof" was that it goes full circle from Rob's first season that he will beat Rooster in the final 2 this time around. I'm certainly not ready to go *that* far as it's a preposterous theory, but am filing this editing idea away for after the merge/tribal swap, just in case.
In Mario Lanza's original Funny 115, we have this entry Rob Mariano, the Rooster Hunter where he fell flat on his face trying to hunt down a rooster on Day 1 of the Marquesas season.
Now, fast forward to this season. While I'm not ready to jump on michel's theory that Rob wins this season, I can imagine the editors having a little fun with this one and angling for a way for Rob to have a "showdown" with Rooster and defeat him at some point to neatly wrap up a 9-year editing storyline. We saw the same type of thing happen in HvH with Scerri saying "hi Colby!" out of the blue during a challenge.
Just thought it'd be worth keeping an eye on in case the editors have a sense of humour and there might be something to come in terms of that storyline.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-19-11, 06:12 PM (EST)

52. "RE: Rob vs. Rooster"

Thanks for bringing this over Pepe. I always enjoy to read parallels between old seasons and the current one. One thing's for sure, this season's Rooster can't fly!
There are connections already between Rob and Rooster: Both have HII, both talked about controlling their tribe. Rob got info at RI, Ralph gave info. I wouldn't be surprised if Rob got rid of Ralph right after the merge. That would be a great parallel because that's where Rob himself fell in Marquesas. I simply don't see a Rob-Rooster F2.
BTW, you're generous calling my impressions a theory.

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
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03-19-11, 06:36 PM (EST)

53. "RE: Rob vs. Rooster"

Heh... Theory, impression, idea, guess, crystal-balling - any of them would work here.
Agreed that I can see Rob gunning for Rooster after the merge because Rooster spilled the beans on the HII. Idiot.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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03-19-11, 06:43 PM (EST)

54. "RE: Rob vs. Rooster"

Rob may not have known chickens can fly but...
I'm pretty sure both Rob and Ralph know there can only be one rooster in the henhouse.

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
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03-19-11, 06:52 PM (EST)

55. "RE: Rob vs. Rooster"

All this talk... I just had to head over to Youtube and watch the WKRP episode for the umpteenth time -- "As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly!"
Maybe Rob will pick Rooster up during a challenge soon and test to see if he can fly...

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-22-11, 08:06 PM (EST)

60. "A Look Back"

I always find it interesting to look back at episode #1 after we've gotten to know these players a little more and one thing stood out. Russell's first confessional: “Redemption Island does not scare me one bit, it’s a vacation. Yeah! Put me on that island and see what happens. I’m gonna win the challenges and come back and take some heads off.”
We know that this turned out to be completely wrong. It got me thinking: What if all the strategy talks were meant to be ironic? This one certainly fits the bill:
Matthew: “Things are going really well right now. It is such a blessing to have Rob here."
As did Francesca's: "It didn't occur to me that I could be the first one voted out. I was thinking the person I vote out would come back..."
So, looking at the other strategy confessionals:

Ralph: “They will call me a redneck. One crazy, stupid bastard! We never had a dumbass win the game, have we? Maybe it’s my turn.”
It doesn't look like it will be his turn, but we've had many dumbasses lose the game.
David: “I think that anybody who doesn’t think Russell is dangerous is foolish. He played the game twice and ended up in the finals twice. He hasn’t won and it’s no mystery why he hasn’t won, it’s the way he chose to play the game both times. He’s too aggressive; he wants the blood on his hands.”
What if David gets voted out because he aggressively targets Sarita? The pressure is certainly building.
Mike: “My first impressions? Very good impression. I think we’ve got a bunch of worker bees which is good. As long as we can win and stay away from the immunity challenges, we will do damn well.”
They threw a challenge so there's already irony in this but what if Zapatera gains the numbers advantage at the merge and still goes down?
Natalie: “I’m so glad that we have Boston Rob. He is amazing!
If this hypothesis has merit then she'll regret having said that before the end.
Phillip: “...Rob is sizing me up. I like to think we are two male lions that are checking each other out. We’re doing a little dance but there will come a point where that is going to take over.”
Despite the continuing rivalry, it seems that Phillip and Rob will remain close to the end.
Stephanie : “OMG! It’s Russell. I don’t even know on which team he’s going to be but I’ll stare down Russell. When I stare down Russell, he’ll know that “she’s got a little evil inside of her” because if I’m not the one person that he picks to take to the end then, no matter what, I’m going to be out. I’m going to be out.”
Interesting that Stephanie has been given the first touch of longevity now that Russell is gone. She wanted Russell on her side but I think she'll go far with Rob instead! She won't be going out soon.
Of our present top two contenders, it's interesting that neither Andrea nor Rob gave us confessionals that looked too far ahead. Nothing that could be looked as ironic ...unless Andrea does hurt herself with her poor chopping technique.
Then there's this:
When Jeff explained the Redemption Island twist, it was Matthew’s surprised reaction that we heard first. Will he the one coming back from the island? The camera also panned to Kristina, Krista, Ashley, Francesca and David while Jeff explained the living conditions on the island...Russell was the one shown when Jeff explained the duels
In those 7 players, 5 have already been sent to RI. It suggests that Ashley and David will make the trip there soon.
During the opening helicopter scene, I wrote that the camera didn't give us any hints when Jeff mentioned that there will be 1 sole survivor winning the money. Could it be because the winner wasn't in that chopper?

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HitmanPayne 54 desperate attention whore postings
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03-22-11, 08:10 PM (EST)

61. "RE: A Look Back"

Lurking around numerous boards, People seem to believe that Phillip will be the actual boot with Ashley/Nat as the Decoy boot. I seriously hope this board is correct and Ashley is gone. Phillip makes the show more exciting to watch!

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Travel_Queen 138 desperate attention whore postings
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03-22-11, 09:41 PM (EST)

62. "RE: A Look Back"

I agree, Phillip is fun to watch. I also think that Rob finds him entertaining as well and not as annoying as the others might. Rob is on a quest, he is not going to let a little annoyance of a middle aged delusional pink panty wearing man derail that.

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HitmanPayne 54 desperate attention whore postings
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03-22-11, 09:47 PM (EST)

63. "RE: A Look Back"

Besides, Rob knows he has Phillip's vote, and from what we have seen on the show, he hasn't spoken to Ashley that much. (Or the editors refuse to show us whenever he has spoken to her.

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Chillicrab 50 desperate attention whore postings
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03-25-11, 10:47 AM (EST)

64. "Eagerly awaiting your insights"

Love the way you guys break down and analyse the show's editing and eagerly waiting.
Michel, I am really hoping that you are right and Boston Rob wins this time. Rooting for him even though did not like him in previous seasons and during amazing race cuz this time he has been very focused and playing very hard and is still very entertaining, but feel very guarded about his prognosis. His hard work might get him to the end and he might end up doing what he said Russel did twice, just get to the end and someone else collected the million.
Reason from this recent episode's editing:
1. Jeff's commentary:
"Rob just misses the winning point for Ometepe" when he only going for the steal of the purple ball, when there was actually no similar comment when Grant just missed the orange winning ball just before that which would actually seem more pertinent, notwithstanding the fact that he did get 4 of the 5 balls(all orange) while the only one Rob got was the one he "steals from Zapertera".
Then Grant misses again, Rob is commented to have the purple ball "got in and out".
2.Rob and Grant feeling that they have been "busted by the principal" ?? all his devious play gets busted??
Please tell me if I off base and I will happily return to lurking and rooting for a Rob win.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-26-11, 05:45 PM (EST)

68. "RE: Eagerly awaiting your insights"

Hi Chillicrab and thanks for the nice words. I do address your points in the post below but I really can't say that you are off base. Editing is all about creating impressions so the impressions you got were real. I just interpret them differently but only the votes will tell us if my interpretation is right.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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03-25-11, 12:09 PM (EST)

65. "Post episode 6..."

Sorry, michel, I had a little time off today, so I got this done...
Notes on Episode 6 that caught my attention
Previously, Matt is the only one to find redemption at RI. At Ometepe, Phillip is driving everyone crazy, so Rob wants to keep him, he needs to stay! Since throwing the challenge to get rid of Russell, the Zaps are losing their mojo, the bigger targets are Krista and Steph. Now Steph has to scramble to avoid being the next one sent to RI. Start at RI and we see Krista...they pray, you’re not sneaking under the radar, blondie, you aren’t either, Blondie!
At Camp Zap...it sucks that Steph and Krista wrote your name down, Steve. Steve narrates, to his surprise, a cold slap of reality, he discusses this with Steph. He’s the one that was digging deep...she doesn’t want to bash people, and she’s aware that she’s at the bottom. Steve says, it’s a gut check...he’ll vote her out next. Cut to Intro.
Cut to happy music and the girls talking about another beach day, Ash has another appt. with Natalie, they have a spa day, clipping leg hairs and fixing eyebrows. Rob’s making a day bed, Andrea’s helping, Phillip is fixing the fire...they aren’t lazy, why not be more comfortable...then we hear Andrea ask for a “braidy braid”, and then Grant teases he needs some french braids for his dreads...and Rob teases, I’ll take care of those braids, pass me the scissors!, Grant tells him, he’s not touching these babies, and Rob teases, I’m going to get you while your sleeping! This scene shows us that they have fun in their down time...the only stick in the mud is Crazy Phillip...he’s the odd man out.
Matt on RI in competing in the duel....some of Jiffy’s comments:
Matt gets by one of the tougher spots, he gets by another one! Matt, has a tough spot to navigate, CLOSE to the finish, Matt very close, Matt stays alive! This narration of events by Jiffy is interesting. Could this be some foreshadowing...Matt gets "close to the finish", he'll "stay alive" when he re-enters the game, perhaps...
Andrea’s confessional post RI, regarding her observations of Matt....EXTREMELY important confessional. This shows that Andrea is not set on one track to the end, she’s adapting her game....
Krista, gave him her luxury item, a bible, on her way out, and they were so close. And then, my, like, whole image of Matt like changed...I had a really good bond with him, but obviously, he bonded with Krista just as well. So, even though initially I wanted Matt to stay in this game as long as possible, he could be very dangerous as well.
You know, I was not sold on Andrea making it to end game. I thought she could indeed be one of the likely ones voted out, especially if Ome’s were to lose in this mid game point. But, with this confessional, I’m sold. Andrea’s game is looking better and better. She’s shown us that she can adapt. First, with her ally getting the boot, she assimilated in the best way possible. She put on a strong, happy face, she worked hard, she competed hard, and she layed low, while plotting ways to get further....Matt returning, ?Phillip...But, her observation here tells me that she is really working on more than one path to the end, all her eggs are NOT in Matt’s basket. She’s really being developed and I think it bodes well for her to be in the circle of end game players. Well done, Andrea, keeping the open mind!

Then cut to zap and the little turtle scrambling to the water for his life...then we see Sarita, with her toothache and Julie's thoughts on her, “drama queen princess”. Rooster talking about Sarita....gouged her gum, “who in god’s name would be worrying about your back teeth? Why can't Jiffy show ROOSTER the love, he's a riot! LOL.
David, if it’s me and the 5 of them, I’ll shoot myself, Sarita is the weakest, and will try his best to save Steph, to sacrifice Sarita...tells her to talk to everyone individually in the tribe to save herself...has to suck up to people she hates...
Cut to Phillip, gathering wood and walking past the relaxing 3 girls on the blanket, and Grant in the chair, while Rob is stretched out on his new “day bed”....ranting ensues, regarding the clouds a coming. The calm before the storm. Notice there are parallels with the storm clouds, too. Steph noted at Zap TC after Russell that the storms a coming, now we hear Phillip noting that the storms a coming!
Ash doesn’t like how he dictates, Phillip notes that they don’t give him any credit, he’s not going to kiss their butts, Rob says to Grant, they are 19/20 year old girls, they aren’t going to do anything! Grant gets it, and he’s not going to tell them what to do.
The boys pull their weight, Andrea makes the rice, she goes gets water, girls get off your butts and get working, get used to it beauty queens....Ashley will walk away, so Phillip will follow her....Ash says someone needs to diagnose him, it’s just annoying, I’m done with him....foreshadowing. Is Ash speaking for the entire tribe here, are they all done with him? We hear Ash say, “your’e not my dad, Phillip!”
Rob, the leader of the tribe, and perhaps Ash's surrogate dad here, needs to take immediate action. He thinks this fracture is going to end up splitting this tribe...The best thing we need to do is to keep winning and not get rid of anyone (We will hear someone on the Zap tribe utter these same sentiments later!)...he goes and talks to Phillip, he needs to squash this thing...he understands that he doesn’t want to take it anymore, he’s been in that position, he gets it...but, at this point I think the most important thing has to be team unity. Rob in confessional tells us he had to play Arafat in like a peace process, to bring the tribe back together again. Phillip was right, I mean, the girls weren’t doing anything, but, the less they do, the happier I am. I don’t want them to be working hard and giving us a reason to write their name down to win a million dollars at the end of this thing. I want them to annoy the crap out of everyone as much as possible.
Then there is a shot of the fire getting low and we hear Rob, “who’s in charge of the fire? It’s not the way I like it...as he mocks Phillip! Guysssss, he’s not gonna be very happy...! As he smiles...and, we see Phillip heading down the beach. Rob really has a great sense of this game....he seems to be doing everything right...
Then we hear the rattlesnake noise and they are back at Zap and Steph is telling us her point of view, she has to suck it up to Steve, but we hear the rattle snake again. I wonder if the rattle snake means that whatever you see on the screen, it’s not happening....Steve telling her it’s ok, but really it’s not, he’ll vote her out. What ever is appearing to happen on the screen, isn’t?
Steph plants the seed of Sarita as the weakest.
The Challenge:
Anyone notice how Ashley is the one to bring the idol in, and the one to collect it?
When Jeff asks Mike about the animosity, when he gives his answer we see a zoom in of Natalie and Andrea perking their heads up and paying attention....a nod to these 2 ladies that “are paying attention” to what’s going on in, and being said about the game.
Interesting to note that while Ashley and Phillip were not paying attention to the other tribe, Rob and Grant were as well, but Nat and Andrea got the zoom in.
This picture tells us who is paying attention and who isn't...telling?
Then Phil tells Jiffy that he’s using both animals today, and then asks Steve what he thinks of that, FOREARM and he just flips him off....LOVED that reaction! Football players are great at talking smack!
The challenge is about launching and catching balls. Clearly, the Ometepe’s had the strategy in this game. They placed Grant at the closest mark to the launcher, and then most likely told Nat to fire SHORT, and Grant would run up to get the ball....it worked! Rob got one that went far, but Grant got 4 shallow shots. Once again, the Ometepe’s show that they can FOLLOW directions...notice that Rob wasn’t given credit for being the strategizer, but neither was anyone else. It would have boded well to have seen Grant come up with that strategy and then execute it as well, but we didn’t see that. It boded well for Rob, if he indeed didn’t come up with that strategy...Regardless, it showed me that the Ome’s are on the same page, following one leader, where the Zaps have too many opinions...to many cooks in the kitchen and therefore can’t unify.
I think I noted this in the very beginning of the season. Rob is an alpha and has to take the drivers seat. The one that keeps bucking that system is Phillip...but, we’ve been shown Rob’s rationale to keep him, and he has been edited to be somewhat...crazy, crazy, crazy....so we don’t take him too seriously. But, Jeff warned us in his tweets, if we don’t watch out for him later, he could screw up somebody’s game....will Rob start to take him seriously? Seems that is what could be decided next episode.
Rob is likely to be the one leader in a tribe full of followers, while at Zapatera, there are too many leaders and not enough followers...spells disaster for the Zapatera tribe. Rob, if he can control Phillip, could well outlast the Ometepe’s, if one believes in game theory. And, somewhere in the pre-game press, Jiffy noted that Rob understands game theory...hmmm?
Also, at the challenge, when Jiffy noted, “First tribe to 5, wins immunity”, the camera was panning over the Ometepe tribe. When he said, “Losers, (now panning over the Zaps, specifically Julie, Steve and ending with Steph), I will go to TC, someone will be voted out of this game, and go to RI”, see Steph, “where someone will be going home....”
When Jeff asked “who will sit out?”, Sarita raised her hand, Jeff said, “didn’t even think about it”, underlining that Sarita is the weakest one in the tribe.
Some of Jiffy’s dialog from the challenge:
Natalie goes short and Grant connects
Julie in and out...
David’s in the air, Andrea makes a dive for it
Natalie goes short, Grant connects
Natalie Grant connection is working
David is deep to Ralph, no point
Mike is trying to hold Grant, he can’t do it
Natalie goes short to Grant, he connects again!
Good strategy between Natalie and Grant...
Mike ripping shirt off, Nat short to Grant, in and out, misses
Stephanie goes deep, Rob right there for another point, Rob steals one...
Mike trying to slow Grant down, not particularly successful...
Grant rips off what’s left of his shirt...
Natalie goes short, no, in and out
Rob just misses the winning point for Ometepe
David tells his tribe to keep your eyes open...
Steph goes deep, Boston Rob, in and out
Natalie goes short, Grant wins the fifth and final point!
Can't help but to ponder...Will Natalie be short of the win? Will Julie be in the game, then out? Will Andrea make a dive for the win? Nat and Grant will have a good strategy to get to the end? Will Nat be out just before Grant? Will ROB STEAL ONE and finally win, or will he just miss the win? Will Steph go deep, on RI, or will she dig deep to stay in the game? Will Grant be out at F5? Lots of fun things to ponder with Jiffy dialog at challenges!
Phillip is the first to hug Grant, then Nat, but it’s like the hug that counts is the hug from a big, proud, Boston Rob, who thumps him on the back...their leader, their surrogate dad.
When Jeff says that, “someone will be voted out of this game”, Sarita seen, “and be sent to RI”, then Stephanie seen. The 2 boot candidates. Steve narrates the challenge...what they need, not lip service, like Steph, or uptown girl, like Sarita...there lies the choice for the night.
The Reward:
Happy, hungry Ometepe’s...the food, the best reward that Ashley tells us about...San Juan del Sur. Rob sees the clue, decides to let someone else find it....he gets the confessional, and tells his vantage point. So, Grant sticks his hand under and grabs the note and gives it to him...they check out the view, Phillip sees it, the principal caught them...Rob tells Phillip that they can look at it “back at camp”
Phillip tells us that he’s been in an alliance with Rob and Grant for some time, he calls them “Stealth R Us”, Rob’s the Mentalist, I’m the Specialist, and Grant is the Assasin....Remember boys, “Stealth”. But in confessional he talks about how he caught Rob and Grant trying to hide the clue, hell has no fury from a gorilla and a lion, when he thinks he’s been provoked...and we hear the lion’s roar...If you are going to make an alliance with me, than you better adhere to it, because I’m all about integrity...I served my country for duty, honor, country...and, when you try to trash on that, me and the US have got something for you...I could dwell on a place of negativity right now, based on what I just saw, but, I’m not gonna do that. I’m going to smile, and when the time comes, I’m going to kick a little a$$ around here... It ends with the lions roar. Phillip is shown to be ridiculous, imo, CRAZY.
Back at Zap: David confessional about the loss, he’s lobbying for Steph, Sarita is the team mom, we need a contributer...Mike says that we just were not meant to win....Steve and David talking about putting the best six to win. Sarita sees what’s going on, she’s not going to campaign, because she’s the most loyal and they all know that....
Steph is scrambling, creating doubt. Julie tells her the guys like her better than Sarita...but Sarita is loyal. Steph is a strong woman in a little body.
Steph notes, “They will lose every single challenge if they don’t keep me! “ Wow, what foreshadowing!???
Then we have David, I mean Charlie Sheen, as he says...I’m sick of losing, there is only ONE thing that we need to focus on....WINNING....d’uh!
Trust comes later...Steve thinks they are both very weak, both get a 1 out of 10...David, I mean Charlie says, fundamentally, I disagree....All I care about is winning, like seriously, all I care about is WINNING...d’uh.
Dark clouds swirling..., just like at Ometepe, clouds/storms a coming. What a contrast between the 2 tribes. Rob has seen it all before and the seasoned veteran takes it all in stride. Laziness, craziness, it's all good....for me. Where as the Zaps have no idea, how to handle the losses, the craziness, or the storm...We see them all have differing opinions, they are melting down, and starting to oppose each other. Their true "Russellness" is rearing it's head!
Then, narrator Mike, gives us the options, he’s not totally opposed to keep her around, if she can show them that they can trust her....
Cut to TC: See the tarantula...David starts with the throwing the challenge, hows the regret, we are paying the price...Ralph...I think I could’a done better if I had been shooting. Sarita, would like to have participated, Steph said she was shaking in her boots about having to get in that physical challenge...she didn’t want to be able to get in there and not be able to follow through....So, you didn’t want to get in there so you couldn’t be a goat....she argues she would have been fine, Steph says, BS...Steph isn’t buying it, she’s a complainer, she doesn’t want to be here, Sarita tells her you are way off base. Steve...maybe Steph’s spunk alone is worth staying here? Steve notes that Steph is a warrier, does alot around camp, Steve says that Sarita is trustworthy, but she’s an uptown girl, I’d like to see her do better in challenges and more work around camp....Charlie, I mean David says, right now we need to focus on WINNING! D'uh! Interesting that Rob also noted that they need to focus on winning. Because Rob is the leader and has gotten rid of the other alpha threats, and is containing the only one left, Phillip, he has harmony. David, otoh, also processes like Rob and correctly identifies that they need to win, but he has too many other alphas that think they know best...trouble?
The vote....2 votes Sarita, rest for Stephanie. Steph says she’ll kick your ##### on RI. David is hopeful, but Steph is toast and we hear thunder....and a snake....Well, I think that this TC exposes David as the ODD MAN OUT....d’uh, winning....In a tribe where happy family is valued, clearly, loyalty is more valued. On that note, it sure is looking like David will be the next man down at camp Zap.
So, in sum, I think Rob, Andrea, Natalie, and Grant are going very deep in this game, together. They are the ones that are paying attention. Each tribe is shown to have an odd man out. Crazy Phillip, who is a real spoiler when it comes to spa days, and David, I mean crazy Charlie, who was the only one that didn’t go along with the group consensus at TC. I do think this episode would set up a very nice double boot, next week. We’ll see.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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03-25-11, 01:10 PM (EST)

66. "RE: Post episode 6..."

Andrea's confessional is critically important. Even though it plays on the surface as a juvenile boyfriend/girlfriend piece of Disney movie nonsense, the wheels are turning. We don't really know everything she is thinking, but she is processing where Matt stands and we should as well. All of Matt's information about Zapatera comes from the sour grapes of the boots, he may have critical information. He may know who to go to over there if a misfit alliance is possible, he may want Andrea in on that. He may come back in on Ometepe's side, which wouldn't be a problem for Ometepe only a problem for Rob if Matt wants to unseat Rob. Wheels turning.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-26-11, 05:31 PM (EST)

67. "RE: Post episode 6..."

FP, nice of you to have us started this week. Sorry if I repeat anything you said but as I told you, I like to write fresh.
This is what I saw:
The recap, this week was more a season’s recap than just about the previous episode. They usually do this after their annual hiatus but I don’t know why Probst had to do it this time.
I noted Probst saying that Matt was the only person finding redemption at Redemption Island and the focus on Zapatera’s negativity following the thrown challenge.

Interesting that Matt is said to have already been redeemed. Shouldn’t that have come from a successful sojourn on the island and a return to the game? Probst made it sound like Redemption was simply a way to stay in the story a little longer. Therefore, it sounded like the end of Matt’s story could be approaching.
Redemption Island
Matt and Krista started talking about God.
Krista (in confessional about Matt but really about Zapatera): “He has such a positive attitude; refreshing you could say. I feel he has more substance than half the people on my tribe…”
Zapatera
Day 14
Steve: “To my surprise, Krista and Stephanie both voted for me.”
He asked her why and she told him he wasn’t contributing enough to the tribe.
Stephanie: “I was trying to be delicate…cause I don’t want to be sent to Redemption but right now I’m at the bottom. I hate sucking it up with people who are complete *bleep*.”
Steve: “It’s crazy because I come from 13 seasons in the NFL but it’s a gut check…Her vote last night, I consider stupid…She’s basically tying the noose around her neck. If we end up going to tribal, she’s out.”
On screen we saw that Steve told Stephanie: “I think it was another poor move you’ve made in alliances.”
Very interesting development: Steve was right; what he said about Stephanie is true. She has made poor moves in choosing her alliances but her story doesn’t seem to be ending with the upcoming vote. The recap told us that Zapatera was the negative tribe and Krista’s confessional corroborated it. Then we hear that Stephanie will need to redeem herself. That perfectly ties her into the Theme of the Season and we already know which path she would choose. She should find a smarter way to bring Zapatera down.
Ometepe
Day 14
Ashley: “Natalie and I started a little spa day…Rob is building stuff, Andrea is pretending to help…I’ve worked hard all my life…”
Soon everyone joined in the spa day…everyone except Phillip of course.
He wanted the girls to stop and go check on the fire every 30 minutes or so.
Andrea quickly said that she always checked the fire.
Phillip knew that but the others had to contribute also.
Phillip: “If I go to Redemption Island before Natalie and Ashley, there’s something wrong with the game because those two girls are on a beauty pageant. They don’t get off their butts and they don’t give me any real credit. It’s like when somebody who don’t like dogs pets a dog...I’m their red-haired step-child. These two girls must go…the pageant is over.”
We heard Natalie saying she had a headache while Ashley said she had a stomachache.
This sequence makes it very hard for the outcome to be anything but Phillip outlasting at least one of the girls and then maybe the other’s story can be redeemed. The editors wouldn’t have let us hear that there was something wrong with the game if he went out before both. Or, if they had, they wouldn’t have given us corroboration by showing just how weak the girls truly were. There would have been a hint that Phillip was wrong.
Redemption Island
The two Blondes went to their tree mail and found Krista’s luxury item. It was her Bible and the two bonded over prayers.
Matt: “Krista is different from the other competitors I’ve faced. We both have been struggling from not having a faith community…It makes it tough to compete against her.”
This confessional completes Krista’s redemption and puts further negativity on her old tribe. She’s definitely not the abrasive girl we were told. As for Matt, I see another warning sign: If he thinks this firecracker is a tough competitor wait until he goes up against the strong woman in a small package.
The Duel
Andrea and Natalie were the observers for Ometepe, Julie and Mike represented Zapatera.
Krista started off quickly, retrieving her bags first but Matt didn’t panic, telling Probst to be quiet and, when Krista lost her ball, he completed the maze first.
Before she left, Krista gave her Bible to Matt. He thanked her with a big hug while Andrea looked on, a hint of jealousy in her eyes.
Matt: “Krista gave her Bible to me…That book breathes life…I can never thank her enough.”
Since Matt told us that he was on a Journey to be closer to his Savior, are we to infer that he has come as close as he possibly can now that he has His words? I think that was the symbolism behind his original confessional and I really think his journey is over.
Andrea (with a touch of bitterness in her tone, especially in the way she pronounced Krista): “Krrista gave him her luxury item, a Bible, on her way out and they were so close that my whole image of Matt changed. I really had a good bond with him but obviously he bonded with Krista just as well. Even though I was initially thinking that I want Matt to stay in this game as long as possible, he could be very dangerous as well.”
Unfortunately for Andrea, if Matt’s story is over, a big part of hers also ends. For one thing, her words about Matt resonate clearly with what Rob told us about him: Matt’s ability to make friends makes him dangerous. Could Andrea help Rob eliminate Matt if he returns? Or does that simply make her understand, even trust, Rob a little more?
Zapatera
Day 15
Sarita had a toothache.
Julie: “Poor Sarita…She’s kind of a drama queen princess.”
Ralph: “Sarita is too fancy of a girl to play this game. By cleaning her teeth with a piece of dirty stick she gauged her gum. That’s really a good way to get out of the game on your own.”
Julie told Mike that Sarita was driving her nuts because she was too high maintenance.
David wanted to find a way to unseat Sarita in the alliance and replace her with Stephanie. He said: “If it’s me and the five of them, I’m gonna shoot myself.”
David: “Stephanie is a capable competitor in the challenges…If there is a way for me to get Stephanie to be more part of the group and ultimately keep her, I would do that to sacrifice Sarita.”
Stephanie : “How do I suck up to people I hate? Why didn’t I learn this in school?”
Even if trust is the only way to play this game, the editors tried very hard to make us believe that keeping Sarita over Stephanie was a bad decision. That must mean something. To me it means, once more, that Zapatera is doomed.
Ometepe
With a storm approaching, Phillip was collecting more wood. He expressed his frustrations that Natalie and Ashley hadn’t given him the assistance he had asked for. Ashley didn’t like the way he had asked. She thought he was dictating.
Since he wasn’t going to get the love he so clearly wanted, Phillip decided that he was finished playing Mr. Nice Guy.
Rob couldn’t understand why Phillip was getting so angry.
Ashley told Phillip about the problem she was having with his attitude: “Why do you talk to the girls a certain way but you don’t say anything to the guys.”
Phillip replied: “The boys pull their weight and so does Andréa.”
“Andrea” Ashley corrected him.
Phillip threatened: “You’re going to see a new attitude from me.”
Ashley, not backing down: “New attitude? We’ve seen it.”
The Gorilla: “Well, get used to it, beauty queens.”
Miss Maine: “Thank you Phillip. That’s a compliment.”
The Lion: “You don’t do anything.”
Miss Maine: “I’ll walk away.”
The Step-Child: “Walk away and I’ll follow you. You want me to follow you, I’ll follow you.”
Natalie was surprised by these words, suddenly realizing she wasn’t the youngest kid anymore!
Ashley gave us a confessional, saying that someone needed to diagnose Phillip because she thought he was mental.
Phillip was still going at her, as if interrupting her confessional.
Rob: “I think this fracture is going to end up splitting this tribe. The best thing for us to do is to keep winning challenges and not get rid of anyone. I need to take Phillip aside and I need to squash this thing right away. I have to play Arafat in the peace process to bring the tribe back together. Phillip was right; the girls weren’t doing anything but, the less they do, the happier I am. I don’t want them to be working hard and giving us a reason to write your name down to win a million dollars at the end of this thing. I want you to annoy the crap out of everyone as much as possible.”
If you break this scene down, it really tells us why Rob would, could, win the million dollars at the end. With all three girls shown as he told us that the girls weren’t working, Andrea was lumped back together even if Phillip tried to separate her. The obvious focus however was Natalie as she was the one shown when Rob said “annoy the crap”. Rob was shown working, we know he helps them win the challenges that they need to win and he’s also the diplomat (although comparing himself to Arafat wasn’t necessarily the best choice).
Zapatera
Having thought about the best way to proceed, Stephanie finally decided to simply apologize to Steve for voting for him.
Steve didn’t know if she was playing the game or if the apology was really coming from her heart which is another example of the naiveté that surrounds this tribe.
The two agreed that Sarita was the weakest of the tribe.
Stephanie: “I would love to go into a challenge where I could show off everything I’ve got and Sarita is slacking, I pick up her slack and we win and everybody is happy. I need to drag her down and bring me up”
What was Sarita doing at this time? Still worrying about her teeth.

The Challenge:
West-Coast Offense
Despite the hype from Probst and all the pre-game boasting by macho men Mike, Phillip and Steve, this challenge turned out to be a dud.
For Zapatera, Sarita immediately raised her hand to sit this one out.
Natalie was the hot quarterback with a 67% completion percentage including 4 touchdown passes and no interceptions.
Boston Rob, like a great defensive back, knocked down many passes and even had an interception for a score.
Grant caught all 4 TD passes and was the game MVP.
It was a massacre but we did hear one interesting comment from Jeff: “Rob just misses the winning point for Ometepe.”
Just like the ending of Rob’s Royal Treatment game, this was a blatant hint that Rob will come up short. So blatant that I see it as misdirection, another doubt put in Rob’s winning story. Rob isn’t playing to win a royal treatment or even playing for Ometepe. He is playing to win the game and every episode shows that he is raising his game. The upcoming reward challenge would show us that once more.
The Reward
We joined the winning tribe as they celebrated their victory.
Ashley was again chosen to give the obligatory confessional about the feast which is puzzling. Why go to her once more and neglect both Natalie and Andrea?
Rob: “Right away, I spot the clue underneath the lobster tails. At this point there are not really any reasons for me to get it so I realize that if I can’t get it without anybody else seeing that I got it, I’m going to let one of them get it. So, Grant sticks his hand in there and grabs the note.”
Rob smartly suggested that they check out the view but Phillip noticed that something was fishy.
As soon as they are away from the table, Rob told Grant to look at the clue so they could make sure that the idol wasn’t at the reward location.
That’s when Phillip walked up and asked: “What do you got there boys?”
Rob: “Phillip sees the note and there was a little bit as if Grant and I were back in school and we get busted by the principal.”
Rob told Phillip that the idol was back at camp.
Phillip: “I have been in an alliance with Rob, Grant and myself. In fact, I call ourselves Stealth. I’m the specialist, Rob is the mentalist and Grant is the assassin. And, yet, today when Rob and Grant found a clue for an idol, they tried to hide it. Well, hell hath no fury like a lion and a gorilla when he thinks he’s been provoked. If you plan to make an alliance with me, you better adhere to it because I’m all about integrity. I served my country…When you try to trash on that, me and the United States got something for you when you try that. I could dwell in a place of negativity based on what I saw but I’m not going to do that. I’m going to smile and, when the time comes, I’m going to kick a little ass around here.”
With the accompanying growling Lion sound effect, that was a great confessional by Phillip and more doubts in Rob’s chances but we just saw that, even when Phillip brings out the Gorilla and the Lion, he can still remain on the bench and do nothing like he did in the challenge. Sound effects are just a lot of air.
Zapatera
Returning from a crushing defeat, the vote was going to be between Stephanie who, according to Steve, gave too much lip service and Sarita who was too much of an uptown girl.
David told us he didn’t want to have a team mom playing the game so he would lobby for Stephanie.
Mike, talking to the tribe, said that they had to win but that they got smoked.
Interesting that, as Mike spoke about being smoked, the camera angle showed the tribe sitting in a cloud of smoke from their fire. It suggested that Zapatera will get smoked again.
Sarita: “I’m not going campaigning because I’m the most loyal person my tribe will ever see and they all know that.”
Stephanie decided she’d better scramble so she told Julie that the weakest player was Sarita.
Julie gave Stephanie a hug, saying: “You are a strong woman in a little package.”
Stephanie: “If they don’t keep me, they are going to lose every single challenge.”
The 5 discussed the vote:
David: “We have to focus on winning. Trust comes later.”
Julie: “Stephanie is stronger in the challenges, Sarita I have more trust in, so, it goes either way with me.”
Steve: “They are both really weak; I give them both a 1 out of 10.”
David countered: “I disagree. All I care about is winning.”
Mike: “If Stephanie goes, we know we will have to put Sarita. Sarita has been cruising. Stephanie has more fight in her.”
Tribal Council
David started by saying that they regretted throwing a challenge and giving Ometepe momentum.
Ralph: “The problem with the challenge was that we had men open but the ball wasn’t coming our way. If I had been shooting, we could have done better.”
Sarita said she would have liked to have been in the field catching.
Stephanie didn’t let that go by without intervening: “She was shaking in her boots when she found out that we were going to do a contact sport. But I’m fine with her sitting out because I don’t think she’s that great during challenges.”
Sarita said that at least she didn’t say she could do it and then not being able to follow through.
Probst replied: “So what you’re saying is that you were glad to sit because then you couldn’t be a goat.”
David agreed: “She knew she was the worst but she knew she wouldn’t play any part in the failure.”
Sarita denied this, saying she would have been fine to be out there.
Stephanie told it like it is: “Bull___. She is the biggest complainer. She doesn’t want to be here.”
Sarita said Stephanie couldn’t be more wrong.
Steve analyzed the two women, saying Stephanie was a warrior at heart and works around camp while Sarita, even if she was a trusted confidante, was an uptown girl who hadn’t gotten her footing yet in the wilderness.
Probst sent them to the voting booth saying this was a big vote.
Stephanie was sent to Redemption Island, promising she would see Sarita there and kick her butt.
Probst sent them back to camp to reflect on whether or not they had made the right choice.
The Story
This episode showed us that Zapatera wasn’t about to live down the stigma of throwing that challenge. The editors want us to believe that they are having bad Karma and the images showed that they were under a cloud of smoke. This team also has very few long range stories. Everything was about this episode and winning challenges.
Ometepe, while being seen as a tribe that has problems with unity all centerimg around Phillip, does have those long range stories.
The Characters
On Redemption Island
Matt: There has been so much investment made in Matt that it’s difficult to say that his story is over but that’s the impression we got when we saw his happiness after receiving Krista’s Bible. It did bring him closer to his Savior. Can he continue or find another story? Certainly but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him failing in the next challenge. If Matt returns, it seems everyone sees just how dangerous he’d be. Being that much of an underdog is bad for his chances in the game but would be great for his story.
Stephanie: The reason I wouldn’t be surprised to see Matt fail is that Stephanie also received a lot of investment and now she has the long term stories of wanting to flip to Rob and defeat Zapatera, Sarita in particular. Of course, just like Krista, her role could be limited to convince Matt to stay with Ometepe. That duel will be interesting. However, contrary to Matt, if Stephanie returns, we’ve heard enough that she’s made bad choices and has a poor social game that it would be doubtful she could win. But she could cause damages which is another of her hooks into the future.
The Failures - These Players have shown serious flaws when it comes to a winning edit:
Sarita: This high maintenance, uptown girl still hasn’t found her footing in the wilderness. Rarely has an episode been so awful on a player.
Julie: We once more had a glimpse into Julie’s indecisiveness when she didn’t know which way to go.
Mike: His story got smoked.
Steve: He received a gut check but we saw that he really doesn’t do much for this tribe.
Ralph: It’s possible that Ralph learned a lesson at Redemption Island and decided to keep quiet but that can’t explain why his story’s been dropped like this. We still hear him but every thing is short-sighted. His story was strictly connected to Russell and his Hidden Immunity Idol. It will pick up again after the merge when his rookie mistake of giving more information then he had to will come to bite him.
David: His contribution to the episode was much more to serve Stephanie’s story and to manipulate the viewer into thinking that trust wasn’t the most important thing. He has been too neglected in the first 5 episodes to suddenly become the underdog we are supposed to root for. Maybe just enough that we’d want to see him outlast Sarita but not much after that. His position on the candidates’ leader board looks untenable.
Ashley: Despite Phillip’s disdain being equally spread to both Natalie and Ashley, we see the editors piling all the negativity in Ashley’s corner. That tells us that Ashley cannot last very long. On the other side, she gets a very nice treatment, especially during rewards when she gets confessional that could help the edits of players that appear to have more longevity. As a hypothesis, I suggests that the editors learned something and they didn’t want to destroy Ashley’s character the way they did to many young women. If things go as expected, there would be time to redeem Natalie later on.
Grant: Rob’s story always overshadows his.
Natalie: Seeing her on screen when Rob said he didn’t want the girls to work, he wanted them to annoy everyone certainly killed her winning chances. We should see her story pick up towards the end of the season just in time for viewers to say: Here we go again. Someone that didn’t do a thing will win. But that should be the misdirection. Not enough was said about her performance at the challenge to warrant saving her from the failed stories.
Phillip: Twice in this episode, Phillip brought out the Gorilla and the Lion, both times he went quietly along. Like Gregg in Palau, his threats against Rob will come to nothing. Unlike Gregg, he will make us laugh and cringe all the time. Until when? Can Rob carry him to the F3? That would be a truly stealth maneuver.
In Contention:
Andrea: She told us that she wanted to pretend to be with the girls but her hair-braiding scene made her look much closer than what is really healthy for her story. Being included in the non-workers during Rob’s key confessional isn’t good either but Andrea is separated from the lazy girls and she has a long term hook. However, if Matt falls where does that leave Andrea’s story. And did she fall in line with Rob when she told us that Matt would be dangerous.
The Leading Candidate:
Rob: Phillip and the girls argue, Rob ties it in to his winning strategy. Grant finds a clue to the idol; Rob tells us that he let him have it. Phillip threatens to bring him down, Rob tells us he’s ready to play peace keeper and bring the tribe together. Someone with too much of a story makes people think he can’t possibly win but this makes us realize that a good way to hide something is often to put it in plain sight.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-26-11, 10:23 PM (EST)

69. "RE: Post episode 6..."

Someone with too much of a story makes people think he can’t possibly win but this makes us realize that a good way to hide something is often to put it in plain sight.
2 words, michel...Wooooo Hooooo! Loved this statement, and I am beginning to whole-heartedly agree! And, don't forget the title of the season...Survivor: Redemption Island!
I agree, I had been considering Grant as a possible winner. But, it does seem that Rob is often 2 steps or more in front of him. I would love for Rob to take Grant to the end, however, and have Rob win it on his argument. If Grant is later edited as learning from the master, Rob, than uh-oh. But, so far, I just don't see it. I also think Andrea is end game as well...I am, at this point, favoring Matt to come back into the game, but you could be onto something regarding he and Stephanie.
Great read, michel! Thanks...

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parathor 250 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-27-11, 05:52 PM (EST)

74. "RE: Post episode 6..."

A point (pit?) to ponder:
Ashley, lounging around (not doing work) with a blonde and a brunette... Ashley said she was getting a spa treatment with her legs and eyebrows, but we're only shown her armpit getting plucked.
Flash back a few episodes to Russell, laying around (not doing work) with a blonde and brunette, and his infected armpit needing some attention.
That can't be a coincidence, can it?

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HitmanPayne 54 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
03-27-11, 05:54 PM (EST)

75. "RE: Post episode 6..."

I pondered the same thing on the Sucks board, but they just brushed it aside as nothing.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-28-11, 08:00 PM (EST)

77. "RE: Post episode 6..."

Hi guys. That observation made me smile. I don't know if it points to an Ashley boot or not but if it does, I'll remember this comment. I'm sure Ashley would not appreciate being compared to Russell!!

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suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings
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03-30-11, 11:12 AM (EST)

80. "RE: Post episode 6..."

ewww, the season of the armpit close-up. Where's the blur

A Tribe masterpiece

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suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-30-11, 11:10 AM (EST)

79. "RE: Post episode 6..."

That was really some well thought out observations michel. I think I'm going to agree with you about Matt and his redemption story. After the episode I "felt" that his story is complete. I don't have the feeling of waiting for his next chapter to begin. Yup, could be wrong but I don't think I'll miss any more of Matt this season.
If he were to win at RI then I'd feel that he would have to had some sort of reawakening to plan what he had to do after RI ended. I think if he would end up rejoining then Andrea's confessional about him and Krrrista wouldn't have been shown. Matt has never had any confessionals about what he was going to do after RI. Stephanie has plenty.
Ohhhhhh Robbbbb! He directs Omatepe like a symphony conductor, genius. He's got my vote this time around.
Again, nicely done michel, so enjoyed it.

agman makes me hot

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suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings
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03-30-11, 10:51 AM (EST)

78. "RE: Post episode 6..."

Bravo! Nice job FP, you got a little psychic in ya? Seriously you've made a logical leap from the editing, I can see all those points coming to fruition as we move along to the merge. Good read for a morning cup of coffee. thanks

A Tribe masterpiece

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KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings
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03-27-11, 08:41 AM (EST)

70. "Nash Theory as applied to Redemption Island editing"

I haven't had nearly the time to post much lately, but there is too much going on with this season for me not to get in here and write some thoughts down. I wanted to wait til this point in the season also to see how the RI twist would affect the editing.
This season has several key themes, Rob vs Russell and Redemption Island are the 2 major ones. You think Rob vs Russell is over? It's not, Rob is continuing to employ strategies that Russell could not execute.
Nash theory of equilibrium condensed: if 4 men in a bar are all interested in the one woman in the bar but only one man makes a play on her, she will end up with that man, because he was the leader by making the first move. If 3 out of 4 men hit on her they are all leaders and cancel each others moves out, she is most likely to end up with the one guy who waits his turn patiently and didn't do anything but sit there.
Jeff has said that Nash theory of equilibrium plays an important role in survivor. Rob, a student of the game, knows that if he is the lone leader with all followers, he has the best shot at winning the game. Ometepe has one leader, Boston Rob, the rest are all loyal followers. This tribe is considered an "N" tribe by Nash, it has the perfect balance and is in equilibrium.
Zapatera is an "L" tribe, leaderless since they banished Russell who would have gladly led them if they allowed it. The consensus was to overthrow their leader early and they are now paying for that decision, they are a tribe in chaos.
Vecepia is a perfect example of a follower in a season of leaders who was loyal to her leader at the time they were in charge. She followed the lead of Hunter, then Rob, then John, then Kathy, until it was time to overthrow Kathy herself for the win.
In this season so far as edited, we hear Phillip say he is biding his time til he can overthrow Rob, we see Andrea actually biding her time patiently, we see Grant and Natalie trusting and following Rob blindly, we get the sense that Ometepe will pick Zapatera apart one by one until they are gone after the merge.
At that point Rob is left standing with his loyal followers and he keeps making the calls to eliminate them one by one. I see Rob as having the best shot to win this season. All the themes point to it.
Let's look back at some of the earlier episodes with more depth to support this. In Episode 1 we get the players reactions when Rob and Russell step off the helicopter, most were happy to see Rob including a very jubilant Matt. Lot's of sour reactions to Russell, only Stephanie seemed to be happy to see him and we hear her say in confessional that she wants to align with him.
When Jeff is describing Robs bio of survivor history, the music has a bell ringing in the background to highlight key points, the words "proven" and "played the game 3 times". We are shown Matt nodding in agreement when Jeff says that Rob can be helpful in challenges and in camp life. Jeff is basically telling them that Rob is a leader. Russell doesn't get the dinging of the bell to note any of his bio, nor the nods of approval from his tribe.
Francesca states "they are sizing us up as if we were prey" and "they weren't brought back here just to help us out", Rob takes note of this statement, he knows he will need to get rid of her early. We should take note too, they weren't brought back here just to help their tribe, one of them was brought back to win the game, ie: personal redemption.
After introducing the redemption island twist Matt is shown as incredulous and states "what?" and then Russell has his confessional about RI being a vacation and to put him on that island, he welcomes it. Francesca's next confessional is her reaction to the twist, "even if we vote Rob or Russell out of the game they could come back". Both statements will end up ironic if Rob never spends a day on RI.
Next scene is at Zap's beach and Russell explains in confessional that the first 2 times he played he was a school boy and that this time he was going to be the leader of his tribe, he would set them down and work with them. Then he is shown giving a leader type speech to pump up his tribe, we see David in confessional not buying it for a minute.
Rob takes the leader role in an unassuming laid back fashion, partly because his tribe is elated to have him there. Matt says that having Rob's experience is a blessing, Natalie is thankful to have Rob as the leader, others are shown with their body language to accept him in that position. Ironic again in that Russell says he will do it but Rob actually does it.
Of note early on also was the theme of aggressive vs being laid back. David mentioned that Russell didn't win either season because he was too aggressive and turned people off, Francesca regarded Philip as too aggressive around camp and that it was going to turn people off, Kristina commented after Rob saw her looking for the clue to the idol that she didn't want to come off as this aggressive strategizer and turn people off, Matt spoke of Rob and said that he loved his laid back attitude.
Rob didn't win his all star season because his game play was too aggressive and he turned people off, even though his camp life at Chapera was very laid back. This season we are seeing a very strategic Rob who is making all the right moves, yet not using that gruff aggressiveness that we saw in his past. In Episode 2 Matt was in awe of how skilled Rob was at telling people exactly what they needed to hear, not just what a person wanted to hear, but delivering it in a manner that they needed to hear it in.
Rob sized his tribe up and knew that Francesca and Kristina were going to be threats to his leadership, he needed and wanted loyal followers. When Matt went to the other tribe and shook hands, to Rob that was a big sign of disloyalty. When Matt was voted out, he wasn't pissed at the blindside, he applauded it as great game play, if anything I think it made him respect Rob even more. I truly believe that if Matt comes back in the game he will come back and rejoin Rob and Ometepe, he will show his loyalty this time. I also think that when Matt gets voted out again it is because Rob gets Andrea on board with the vote, the premonition came from Andrea witnessing Matt bonding with Krista.
Further proof is Rob's only confessional of episode 1 “Originally, I wanted to vote Francesca off because the very first time I met her, she stood up on the mat, looked at Jeff and said: “I don’t want to play with him because he’s too sneaky.” She knows my game so I don’t want someone like that on my tribe. After thinking about it some more, the second we landed on our beach, Kristina was the one looking through all the supplies, looking for the immunity idol. She’s dangerous. She knows strategy and she knows to go out there and to work for it. To me, I don’t need somebody like that with me.”
Zapatera wanted to get rid of Russell at the first possible chance. They struggled with tribe strength vs taking Russell out, but when they saw that he had his hooks in Stephanie, they knew it had to be done. When the first possible opportunity to get rid of Russell didn't materialize, they threw a challenge in order to speed up the process. Ironically enough, this will be their downfall as a tribe.
In Episode 1, Kristina wanted to get rid of Rob knowing what a threat he was to her. Philip also stated that in the best interest of the tribe they should keep Rob but in Philip's own best interest he knew he needed to get rid of him. He said "the longer Rob is around and has time to solidify those girls and that whole thing, I'm weakening, so I need to get rid of him now. Goodbye Rob, and you're looking at the new leader of your tribe."
Ometepe had one chance to get rid of Rob and they couldn't execute. Ever since that time, Rob has been gaining strength as a leader while neutralizing his opponents and drawing in his loyal followers to make them even more loyal. He has been playing a strategic yet laid back, not overly aggressive game. In true Nash fashion, Rob is the sole leader of his tribe. At the merge, I don't see anybody that has the charisma or leadership to execute a coup d'état. Rob will have his minions work for him to keep him in power, and he will keep that power right to the end.
And in the end, Rob will have executed the strategy that Russell himself proclaimed he would use, he will have found his own redemption without ever having to visit redemption island, Survivor sure loves its irony.

I'm not sure who came first hosting games, you or Tribe, but you are both nefarious! - CTGirl

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-27-11, 11:46 AM (EST)

71. "RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redemption Island editing"

Well hello, KOB! It has been a long time.
I enjoyed reading your thoughts on the season. Game theory has always been a favortie way of mine to look at Survivor and you certainly nailed Rob's gameplay.
The one thing I would say however is that Zapatera has more of a M-tribe feel than a L-Tribe. Russell wanted to be leader but Ralph seized it immediately. His repeated: "I have it under control" confirms that he sees himself as leader. Next, Russell himself designated Sarita as leader and we saw her leadership when she decided Stephanie would make the throws. The editing has also shown us that Steve thinks of himself as leader. It was under his influence that Zapatera threw the challenge. Finally, David would like to be the leader because he thinks he's the only one to understand what Zap needs. Julie and Mike are their only followers.
Really, L-Tribe or M-Tribe doesn't change much, both being doomed to fail. The problem could come after the merge if Rob has to work too hard to get rid of the remaining Zap leaders. If he has to become too aggressive, he could open the door for a follower to earn the votes in the end.
My biggest fear regarding Rob's edit is that Matt could be seen as a Victim. Winners don't eliminate Victims, they eliminate threats and dumb players. Jeff did present Rob's move as elevating his game but, with each win at RI, Matt becomes more likable and, in retrospect, Rob could be viewed as having bullied him out of the game. If you read my posts, you know I don't think that's the way the story will go because I also see Rob as the winner but who knows?
As for theme, what do you think of Rob's voting confessional in episode #1? "I love playing with you amateurs. You give away so much" sounds, to me like the best way to judge a player's winning chances. It certainly has played with the RI revelations. Andrea doesn't give away much. As far as I'm concerned, she's the one that could upset Rob.

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KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings
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03-27-11, 12:13 PM (EST)

72. "RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redemption Island editing"

Hi Michael-
Yes I considered calling them an M tribe but didn't only because while they all say they want to be leader or declared as leader by themselves or by someone else, the editing is that they are a consensus type group, sort of like the way the womens Yasur tribe was in Vanuatu. Ami, Twila, Eliza, Scout all could have been seen as leaders in the early going, but they were voting as a consensus to rid the tribe of drama and "appeared" to be leaderless. And like you pointed out, M or L it makes no difference because both tribe types are chaotic by nature.
I have read many of your posts/thoughts and you do a great job of mixing in animal imagery, music, and all types of editing to draw your conclusions, good stuff. I do also like Rob's quote from Episode 1 about playing with amateurs.
I think that at some point Matt will come back from RI but that he will rejoin the Ometepe core, Rob will have that loyalty talk with Matt and tell him what he wants to hear to get drawn back in. Having secured Matt, plus I believe that the numbers will be in Rob's favor at the merge, plus he has a hidden idol that nobody but him knows about, it all bodes well.
Being a leader in Survivor by the Nash definition is as much to do with the charisma to get people to follow you when it comes time to make a big move. Philip has been shown to fail at his attempt to oust Rob, partly because of his supposed past as a man of his word. Philip will want to get rid of the Zapatera core before going after Rob, in order to take over the helm and realistically giving himself a chance to win, but by then it will be too late.
I think Andrea will be instrumental in getting Matt booted the 2nd time when the time comes. I think Rob has had more of a winning edit than Andrea, she will be important to helping him stay at the top, and you are right if Rob starts getting overly aggressive it would lead to his downfall. I just don't see it happening.

I'm not sure who came first hosting games, you or Tribe, but you are both nefarious! - CTGirl

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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03-27-11, 01:51 PM (EST)

73. "RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redemption Island editing"

I just wanted to add that, according to Chris, Leann was the leader of Yasur. It certainly wasn't edited that way! The edit is what we have to go by but if we only knew what was really going on out there.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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03-27-11, 08:37 PM (EST)

76. "RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redemption Island editing"

LAST EDITED ON 03-27-11 AT 08:40 PM (EST)

KO'brien! GREAT to see you back here and especially in the editing thread. I could not agree with your assessments more, and WOW, you really know how to explain it all! What an awesome presentation, and I think you have nailed it, as michel has as well. All along I have noted the comments regarding leaders and followers and game theory, yet I am not nearly as versed in it as you are. Rob even stated in his assessment of himself, pre-game, that his only problem was that he was a leader, if he's in the car, he has to do the driving...it's him, and that's the way it is. Rob definitely handled the 2 people that stuck out to him as bucking his style and got rid of them. I thoroughly agree with your assessment of Matt as well, and I would love to see it all come to fruition as you note. I agree that the confessional Andrea had the last episode was huge, in regard to seeing Matt in a different light, perhaps.
The seasoned veteran has played his tribe like a well tuned violin. I can't wait to see them pull together, under his guidance and direction, once they merge. I look so forward to it. I agree also that Zap has too many chefs in the kitchen....having Russell there unified their group. With him gone they are in deep trouble. Too many folks with their own opinions on how to fix things...they are in serious trouble.
Thanks so much for the fantastic assessments and for your very thorough and eloquent post....I admire your grasp of it all! Great to see you, stick around!
PS. ETA: I also wanted to mention that at one point in the game, perhaps in the introduction, Jiffy noted that Rob was a master at game theory...so far, I'd have to agree with him, and on my final note...GO ROBFADDA, GO!

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CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings
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04-04-11, 08:01 PM (EST)

106. "RE: Nash Theory as applied to Redemption Island editing"

Hi KOB! I'm so glad you're back this season!
I was catching up on the editing thread today and was thrilled to see your post especially because you mentioned game theory. I had been out walking my dog recently and thought to myself, I wish someone would post about Nash and how they see this season. I had ESP, I just didn't know to look for it!
Rob certainly is looking good at this point in the game (which would make me very happy!). Andrea is the only one who could give him a run for his money. My impressions of Matt might change if they start fleshing him out. He's rather one-dimensional right now and I would not be surprised if Andrea helps Rob vote him out again.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-02-11, 03:40 PM (EST)

81. "Episode #7: Thoughts"

During the recap, we heard that Zapatera’s lone night of pleasure after throwing a challenge to get rid of Russell turned into days of misery: Tribe unity crumbled.
David’s relationship with Sarita got so bad that he joined forces with Stephanie to try to vote Sarita out.
At Ometepe, Rob had an Immunity Idol in his pocket along with most of his tribe but Phillip had a love/hate relationship with Rob. When Rob tried to hide a clue to the Hidden Immunity Idol, it was all out war.
The Ometepes won their third out of the last four challenges.
The Zapateras went to Tribal Council where David and Stephanie voted for Sarita but everyone else voted for Stephanie.
We heard Jeff’s final words of the last TC: “You made the decision to go with someone you could trust instead of someone that might have done better at challenges. We’ll know soon enough if you made the right call.”

We continue to hear the danger that Phillip represents for Rob but repeating it makes it sound even more like a false alarm. There has to be some doubt placed in Rob’s winning chances so the editors manufacture that doubt through Phillip. As for the other tribe, the repetition of Jeff’s admonishment after the last TC was telling us that they would indeed regret to have kept the weaker Sarita. Right then, we knew they had reserved their seats for the upcoming TC.
Zapatera
David: “I didn’t want to make any bones about where I stood. I did what I had to do and I wanted to let my position known. If it’s the end of me then, so be it.”
Sarita: “Tribal is never good but tonight was especially bad. I found out our gang of six did have a major hole in it. As I suspected, David had gone over to the dark side.”
Steve: “This is the six we wanted back in day 1 but there is a big rift between Sarita and David. Dave is showing that he can be a bit of an antagonist. If David can be man enough and put his ego and pride and emotions aside for the bigger cause of the team. If not, there could be problems.”
Redemption Island
Matt: “Stephanie came in and her mouth has been going a mile a minute. I want to go to the duel and win this one. I told God that I would be out here as long as he wants me to be out here. I’m here for the long haul.”
Finally we hear something from Matt that looks ahead to the future of the game.
Ometepe
Day 17
Phillip: “There’s another duel. Rob and I are going to go. I just don’t trust Rob anymore… Miyamoto Musashi, a very famous Japanese horseman, once wrote a book called the “Book of 5 Rings”. In that book, he says that what you want to do, which is so difficult, is let your enemy move first. Rob’s weakness is that he likes to be extremely controlling and he wants to control me and all the other players but nobody’s controlling me.”
In China, Todd was edited as following the teachings of Sun Tzu’s “Art of War”. Could we be seeing where Phillip’s edit is headed? Musashi was a samurai who often fought with swords of wood. Phillip uses wooden spears to hunt crabs. Musashi was said not to worry about his appearance, never taking baths in case he’d be caught without his weapons. His appearance was uncouth and wretched. Doesn’t he sound a bit, a lot, like our Phillip? We have been so busy laughing at Phillip; did we miss the warrior inside? Maybe Jeff’s warnings aren’t false alarms after all.
Rob: “Phillip wanted to go to the duel but he isn’t allowed to go without a chaperone so I got to baby-sit his ass for the day. Phillip has a big mouth, he likes to talk and he can’t be trusted. He’s dangerous because of his stupidity. He’s probably the most unaware person I’ve ever met in my entire life.”
Coming after a confessional where Phillip sounded very aware, especially about Rob’s game, this confessional should concern us about Rob’s future.
The Duel – Mental Fatigue
When Matt immediately flipped two “Skulls”, Stephanie was heard calling him “Golden Boy”.
After Matt won, Stephanie said: “I feel like there are people here that don’t deserve to be here. Sarita is one of them. Ralph, if you want to play the game, you have to get rid of her because she is your weakest link. I know you’re think David because he was the only one that voted with me against Sarita, but he’s the only guy that can do puzzles. Do you want to take that responsibility? Rob: Look out because they are going to try to take you out just like they took out Russell. Watch your back and I wouldn’t trust anyone on their tribe. Try to get this guy (Matt) back but good luck because he’s been here a long time”
Clearly, we had overestimated Stephanie’s long term possibilities but, like Krista, her words resonate with foreshadowing. She seems to have laid out how the game will unfold even without her.
Phillip, responding to Jeff: “I am very impressed with Matt.” Turning to Matt, he added: “In the old days of the samurai they had something called the Bushidu code. It’s what the samurai lived by. What I have seen in you; you are truly a samurai warrior.”
Rob: “Little Phillip couldn’t keep his mouth shut. I’m telling you; when the merge comes, Phillip is ready to make a big move and, by big moves, he means: Let’s get Rob out.”
This latest confessional is better for Rob because he is showing awareness. As for Phillip, he seems to have already given the samurai edit to Matt. The samurai is very loyal to his Shogun, his leader. Rob, by making the first move (remember what we learned from the book of 5 rings) and sending Matt to Redemption Island, could have turned his former loyal soldier into a ronin. Can he win Matt back? Suddenly, that seems to be the crux of the season.
On the way back to Ometepe
Rob: “We were on the beach and Phillip asked me how much if any I wanted to tell the tribe what went on. I wasn’t upset that Phillip suggested we don’t say anything to the tribe… I was hoping for it, actually praying for him to say something like that to me so I can use it as ammunition. An opportunity presented itself for me to throw Phillip further under the bus.”
When they did arrive, Rob told them it had been crazy, crazy, crazy and that Stephanie told him they were gunning for him.
Rob: “I took all this information and relayed it all to the tribe because I wanted everybody on the same page. I wanted everybody to know that the target’s on me so that they feel safe, number one and, number two, I need to keep everybody else against Phillip.”
Rob then told the tribe that Phillip had wanted to withhold some information and that he would be flipping at the first opportunity. As he said this, the camera focused on Andrea, showing us that she was with Rob on this, smiling and nodding just as much as Grant, Rob’s number one ally.
Rob: “With all the attention focused on Phillip and everybody using him as a punching bag, I’m free to maneuver and do what I need to do. If we lose, there won’t be any blindside. I’ll go right up to Phillip and when he asks who we are voting for, I’ll say: “You know Phillip, you are going home.” I’ll frontside him!”
Just then, our aspiring samurai fell from a tree, not a very positive way to picture him!
Including this scene seems to indicate further that Matt is the Samurai, not the bumbling Phillip.
Zapatera
Returning to the shelter, Ralph and David disagreed when it came to talking about Stephanie’s rant, David saying it wasn’t done in an egregious manner as Ralph was indicating.
When David walked away, Ralph said that Matt would stay with the other side and he added that David would go the same way.
Ralph: “I think Dave will float anyway. If we merge, he will go just like that (snaps his fingers). He’s a lawyer and lawyers; you gotta look at ‘em that way. They think they’re a lot better than everybody else.”
Steve: “The 30 year old attorney, David, is telling the 45 year old Ralph, Mr Outdoorsman, that we should go fishing. David is getting tough to stomach.”
Sarita: “David…I find him selfish and egotistical.”
Ralph: “David, he might be smart but it doesn’t take smart to win this game. It just takes somebody who knows to runeuver around and play the ball. In the world of Survivor, he’s got to go.”
Ometepe
Day 18
The girls, Natalie in particular but Andrea and Ashley as well, were defending Rob’s share of crispy rice that Phillip coveted.
Phillip: “Everybody likes the brown crispy rice but Rob likes it in particular. I asked if I could have a little scoop, a teaspoonful of the crispy. “No, no, no, you can’t it’s all for Rob…How asinine is that? I’m sick and tired of the fact that Boston Rob, because he is Boston Rob, he gets deference to every thing. Just because they sleep in his underwear every night…and that’s not speaking figuratively. They are sharing his underwear, his socks, his bed, so they want to pay him deference on every thing. Let it be known that the first opportunity I have to eliminate him, I will. With all due respect, I’m a 52 year old man and the senior member of this tribe. I don’t know which world they come from but in every other world; I would be given the deference just because of my age. I’m certainly entitled to it if we are going to call this a tribe. I get the red-headed step-child treatment. Am I feeling part of this tribe? Hell, no! Am I giving 100%, 110% to this tribe? Hell yeah! I’m sick of it. I’m not quitting, I’m here to stay but I want to be on record that there is a division in this tribe, not of my making, of their making.”
Natalie was shown at the end of this, a hint that Phillip was mainly talking about her. It really sounded like a childish argument though, not Samurai-like.
BTW: If you wanted Rob’s portion of rice, you should have put fafaru on it!
The Challenge
Ralph and Julie were a little too anxious to know what would be the reward.
Jeff told Natalie that the reward would include non-alcoholic beverages, reminding us just how young she is.
Jeff also pointed out that no one would sit out since the tribes were even.
Rob found a neat trick to get the bag out of the corkscrew whereas Sarita had problems. Unfortunately, the trick didn’t work so well after the first time, the thrown bag getting tangled rather than swinging through. Zapatera took a lead at the second station mostly due to Phillip having problems with obstacles and David taking over for Sarita.
Jeff said: “Rob was going the wrong way with the bag, he was hung up.”
We didn’t hear that Rob was helping Phillip to get to the end.
We heard Sarita asking for help to untie bags (Stephanie’s specialty!)
Grant, the football player, showed that he was good at Basketball also, sinking all of Ometepe’s six shots.
Jeff pointed out that things were going from bad to worse for Zapatera.
As the helicopter approached, Phillip gave us a confessional: “Some tribes advance boldly, weak tribes grow agitated but superior tribes like ours: We find a way to win! And we did.”
He kissed the idol.
Rob as the chopper circled the volcano: “This is my fourth time on Survivor and I’ve been on a lot of rewards but I’ll tell you what I’ve never done is landed on top of an active volcano. Definitely one of the coolest experiences I’ve ever had.”
Grant: “I’m sitting on the edge of a volcano, bro’. I could fall in and never be heard from again! What is special about it is that we get to do it as a tribe together and just enjoy it.”
Phillip: “I’m actually having an incredible day today. We have a numbers advantage and for me, I haven’t always felt that I was totally inclusive with the group but today, having a wonderful meal and surviving with the tribe, I find it hard not to be tribal in my thinking, community in my thinking. Right now, I’m on top of the Earth.”
Rob: “I’ve been on enough rewards to know that whenever you win one, there’s going to be a clue. It hit me: The cookies are cylindrical shaped; the clue’s got to be in there. Sure enough, in the center, there’s a clue wrapped up like a cookie. It really doesn’t matter what it says because I already have the idol. I might as well just throw it away in the volcano. Bye-bye!”
The reward was very interesting in what it didn’t show: The girls’ confessionals about the view and the food and the players’ thoughts on the clue. Is anyone looking besides Rob? I’m sure they are so the question becomes: Are those confessionals hidden to make us see them as Dump players or are they starting to figure out that Rob has the clues and the idol?
Zapatera
Mike: “Today was an awesome challenge but the outcome completely sucked. That’s 3 losses in a row; all three for food. We are starving out here. We are tired of going to Tribal. After tonight, it’s going to be 6 of them and 5 of us. Not a good situation with a looming merge.”
The vultures were already feeding on the carcass of Zapatera’s turtle.
For some reason, Sarita praised David’s puzzle-making abilities even if she said that she thought she was as good as he was.
Sarita: “…David is a loose canon…I feel Dave could do well on Redemption Island against “Boy Wonder” which means he would come back like a hell-on-wheels after me...”
David: “I feel like more nervous than I have in the past primarily because I don’t know if the tribe has seen the light in terms of keeping strength. Last time, no one was interested in focusing on strength; they were focusing on trust…”
Mike: “Initially, we were going to target David but Sarita struggled at the challenge. David… he is a little harder to trust and, if we are merging any time soon; who do we want to be with us at the merge? We’re in a little bit of a tail-spin. We have a couple thousand feet before we crash and burn but we have to figure a way out of this tail-spin.”
Tribal Council
Ralph: “It was pretty close today.”
Jeff: “Can I pipe in? David; complete this sentence: Excuses are for…”
David: “Losers.”
Ralph: “I’m a loser then.”
Reminded of their record since throwing a challenge, Julie said: “It is bad Karma. At the time, we thought our tribe was way stronger than the other tribe and we thought we could spare throwing one challenge. We still think we are stronger than the other tribe.”
Jeff: “…Maybe the problem is you are not as cohesive.”
David: “That’s exactly what the problem is. It’s a lack of unity here. When we were banded together against Russell it was something we had a similar goal. The other tribe; it looks like they are all friends…”
Ralph: “I don’t know what cohesive means.”
Put in a hypothetical situation by Jeff, Ralph added: “I’d rather have the ones that work harder and don’t get along because they others that do get along, all you have is yak-yak-yak.”
Steve: “I respectfully disagree. I believe any coach would rather have a group that gets along…That’s why Krista and Stephanie are gone: They were the dissenters among the group.”
David said he had given his word to Stephanie so he knew he had a target on his back.
Sarita said she trusted in the six and was surprised David voted for her.
David: “I did what I thought was best for the tribe.”
When Jeff went to collect the urn, we had a shot of Steve shaking his head, telling us that the tribe was already regretting the decision.
When Jeff read the 6th vote, we heard Sarita saying: “I wish I’d brought my stuff.”
David answered: “Don’t get too confident.”
Sarita left the TC area with a bag that looked full so which stuff was she talking about?
Jeff: “If there was any question about whether or not this was one cohesive group, tonight’s tribal council certainly answered it: No!”
The Story
With all this talk of the merge and questions of cohesiveness, we heard all we needed to know that Zapatera’s tail-spin will indeed result in the crash and burn of their tribe.
The introduction of the Book of 5 rings into the story might be only a one-time deal and could have no consequences down the road but I prefer to keep it on the back-burner and look at what will happen when Matt the Samurai will rejoin Rob who, as leader, is like the Shogun. It will also be interesting to see if anymore parallels are made between Phillip and the Japanese warrior Musashi.
The Characters

Sarita: We heard often enough that she was weak in challenges so it would be extremely doubtful that she could beat Matt. Her story has always been too thin to expect that she would have any impact down the line.
Mike: As narrator, Mike told us the choice facing the group and how they were in a tail-spin. Therefore, the decision was put on his shoulder and we cannot help but question its validity. Now is the time a tribe needs loyalty and, if you are going to eliminate a loyal player, don’t blindside her. Redemption Island means that she could return so why anger her? With the coming merge, Mike will be a big target as he is the strongest man without an Immunity Idol on the minority tribe.

Steve: Steve is still presented as the tribe’s diplomat but being the shooter during the last challenge could have put a target on his back if Ometepe noticed and decides he needs to go. Nothing in Steve’s confessionals ties him to any future story-line.
Julie: Her story is still restricted to Russell, the thrown challenge and the Bad Karma it brought the tribe.
Ralph: He told us he was a loser.
David: Did anyone get too confident about David’s future possibilities and his possible flip to the other tribe? I certainly didn’t. David’s confessionals and his interventions to the tribe have always told us that he is still a Zapatera even after all this. No matter what, he was still only thinking about the good of the tribe, not about what would be good for David. If he does make a move, it will not profit him. That is what we have seen up to now.

Ashley: She didn’t get any confessionals during the reward, proving that the story of the season is between the Ometepe men.

Natalie: She was front and center during the rice incident and that squarely portrayed her as loyal to Rob. If this turns out to be edited as a Japanese saga then Natalie will die for her leader.
Grant: He had a short confessional during the reward but I would rather have heard someone mentioning that Ometepe’s recovery was because of his exploits. He has been as valuable to the Ome’s victories as Tom was for Koror but he certainly doesn’t have Tom’s edit. No one has mentioned that Grant was a man’s man, the editors haven’t given us any signs of the respect he should be getting. In fact, Zapatera’s TC gave more credit to Ometepe’s easy going nature which was much more a sign of respect for Rob because of the obvious reminder of the Happy Chappies.

Andrea: This time, the cameras didn’t separate her from the other women of Ometepe. I’d suggest that all we saw as her story, the hints she would use Matt to get even with Rob or her comment that he was long gone, were part of Matt’s story, not hers. Now that Matt is on the brink of returning, she has faded in the background, leaving center stage for the true warriors to do battle. It will be interesting to see her merge episode but, right now, Andrea’s story has fallen off the pace of the leading peleton.

The Case for Phillip: Is he a true warrior? That is the biggest question I have. All the jokes about his underwear and his appearance are now not only comic relief but a parallel to the great Japanese warrior himself! All our editing experience tells us that Phillip cannot win but his dual edit: Gigantic farce / heroic patriot could be immediately redeemed if, at the reunion show, Jeff simply tells us: “Look at where he is sitting now!” This is the season of redemption, we heard that it could be time for a dumbass to win and Phillip himself told us he would outlast every man on Zapatera. Can he outlast them all? I’d really enjoy seeing that ending and there are slight indications that we could see it. There certainly are enough doubts surrounding his chances!
The Case for Matt: In episode #1 with Matt’s reaction shown front and center when Jeff mentioned the season’s twist and theme, we had an indication that Matt would not only go to Redemption Island but could be the one returning from the ordeal. Over the weeks, our impressions grew as we saw a good guy, confronted by tremendous odds, survive one challenge after the other. The editors, to their credit, gave us doubts when they made him cross swords with Stephanie, another player that appeared to have hooks to the post-merge game.
Not only did his latest victory restore our confidence in his return but it could have opened up a new story line for him. His victory over Stephanie showed us that praying was indeed a winning strategy. “Golden Boy”, “Boy Wonder” we heard him called by others just as he told us he was there for the long run. Then, Phillip gave him an introduction to a new story, that of a Japanese Warrior. Will Matt’s return show him as a true samurai, loyal to the death to his leader or did Rob’s first move against him turn him into a ronin?
The Case for Rob: We have seen the editors building the case for a Rob win since the beginning of the season. Even this episode showed us his maestria of the game, not giving anything away at Redemption Island when Stephanie told him they would be gunning for him. We did get some warning signs when he didn’t seem to realize that there was more to Phillip than plain stupidity.
Also of concern is the fact that we haven’t heard any Ometepe member asking about the whereabouts of their idol. There has to have been discussions about it but none were heard except where Kristina was concerned. It is impossible from where we sit to know if that manipulation is to show just how much Rob controls his troops or to hide a fomenting revolt. The decision to hide those discussions could have been made because the talks come to nothing or to prepare a huge blindside.
As of now, the solidity of Rob’s edit is in its balance. Rob isn’t presented as an over-confident player headed for a fall because we hear his worries. He clearly knows that the target is on his back so that separates him from those failed front-runners. He isn’t shown as being detestable to others in camp so we aren’t being given any reasons why he would lose a final vote. He now must deal with a player returning from Redemption Island and this is the only thing that could bring his downfall. He has never before been confronted with a situation like this and neither have we: How does a likable Outcast fare in this game?
The key to deciphering the season’s outcome will come from Rob’s interaction with Matt. During his boot episode, I didn’t get the impression that Matt was portrayed as a Victim which is one of the big reasons I think Rob wins. However, Matt’s sojourn on Redemption Island has gained him many fans, people who could now see that he was a Victim and deserves reparation. If Matt forgives Rob then we will know Rob wins. If we hear that Matt needed to redeem himself then it still looks good for Rob. If we hear that Matt feels wronged by Rob; that he sees through Rob’s appeasement tactics, we will have to revise our position.
For now, the Book of 5 Rings is about finding the Way of Strategy and only Rob’s strategy has been shown as an effective way to play the game.

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parathor 250 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
04-02-11, 07:29 PM (EST)

82. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Awesomeness as usual, Michel!
What are we to make of Steve mentioning the age/respect connection between David (30) & Ralph (45)? ...(in conjunction with Phillip's similar issue about the girls not respecting his age).
Phillip was redeemed later in the episode (by his own admission)... and David ended up victorious by outlasting Sarita. Is this just a coincidence, or something we should look out for? Respect your elders, like, seriously? Or move aside, old people (Rob?), because the new kids know more than the elders?
This is the first episode in a while that has given me concern for Rob's chances.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-02-11, 08:56 PM (EST)

84. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

"What are we to make of Steve mentioning the age/respect connection between David (30) & Ralph (45)? ...(in conjunction with Phillip's similar issue about the girls not respecting his age)."
I don't know because I hadn't made that connection. One thing I wouldn't say though is that Phillip was redeemed. That word, this season, is too important. Phillip was simply assuaged by the victory, an angry lion that was finally fed. Maybe that tells us once more that his roar is worse than his bite.
Rob didn't have the best episode. His confessional about Phillip's stupidity isn't very good for his chances and Jeff not mentioning that Rob was helping Phillip get to the end (how loaded would that have been?) during the challenge was an opportunity missed to make Rob look like a team player. The viewers did get to see it but usually it's reinforced by the narration.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-02-11, 09:26 PM (EST)

86. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

I don't know, parathor....I had quite a different take. I tend to agree with michel who noted perhaps Phillip's bark is worse than his bite. For me, he seems so petty and juvenile even. Plain and simple he's jealous. He's seen as complaining about what the others are doing in the name of Rob....saving the crusty rice for Rob, and not letting him have any...and Rob wasn't even there. His bone to pick at that moment was with the girls. We know that he wants Rob out. Then, when it's time for RI, Rob asks to go. And, we are shown that Rob doesn't trust Phillip to not do what Steph and Krista both did....This action, and the confessional tell me that Rob is worried, and judging from Phillip's confessionals, I'd say that Rob is dead on smart.
Then Phillip suggests to Rob that they deceive the rest regarding what was said at RI...Rob was smart in that regard as well....keeping it all above board. What Rob turned around and did to Phillip, by telling the others that Phillip wanted to withhold the info from them is more than likely exactly what Phillip would have done to Rob, if Rob had agreed with him...Again, I saw Rob was a step ahead.
Then Phillip complains about being the elder in the tribe, which he thinks is more deserving...I see Phillip as petty and complaining and jealous. Then, at the challenge, we see Phillip lagging behind, and it's Rob that stays to help him finish hard. At the Reward, Phillip was so happy with the experience that he was pacified. To me, he's all mouth. And, I think one of these days, his mouth will be his demise.
Personally, I found Rob to be at the top of his game with the merge looming. But, we all know that there are many, many hurdles to jump if Rob is to make it to the end.
Interesting to note that the season is really turning out nicely with Rob in control of his tribe, and Matt, the RI returnee, heading back into the game. Wouldn't the producers be thrilled if these two could indeed make it to the end and find real redemption!

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-02-11, 07:40 PM (EST)

83. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Excellent assessments, michel. You raised alot of good points. Clearly, there are things that go on in both tribes that are edited out...their omission is to help tell the story. I agree, Grant and the girls must have talks about the idol at Camp Ometepe, and yet we don't get to hear it....Rob is being edited as the master manipulator...he's effectively hid the idol, or has he? How would we know if he's even mentioned it to any of them, if it's not shown to us? Right now, all we can assume is that he's kept it secret. Also, with the merge on the forefront, I can't help but to wonder what they all talk about in relation to mixing...
So much of this show is hype and misdirection as well. We get the Andrea is mad stuff, and we are shown it...with the time that's passed is she still harboring resentment...she seems very meek to me and I don't know if she's capable of making big moves, unless she throws in with someone else that sticks their neck out...
Regarding Matt, Jeff has hyped if he gets back in the game, despite his religion, I think he'll want to get redemption and gun for Rob....but I don't know if I buy it. It will be very interesting to see how Matt assimilates back into this game. Especially after hearing all of the carp that Kristina and the girls from Zap must have given him. I would think that he'd lean heavily on Andrea's assessments.
We have also heard from Rob, that he was born at night, but not last night....he doesn't trust Matt one iota...I did get a feeling that Rob had made a bad move, and I was sad...but, I recall that he gave the others, Grant, Ashley, and Natalie the choice of Andrea or Matt, and Grant said specifically that Andrea was good in challenges, and he said it should be Matt...I am sure that Matt will go back with the Ome's for now, but I certainly expect to hear confessionals from him regarding how he can't trust him...
This merge should be good!

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-02-11, 09:09 PM (EST)

85. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Thank you FP.
I had been seeing (or maybe hoping to see) Andrea as a wolf in sheep's clothing but she seems to really be a sheep. There's still hope but she's had some very weak episodes and is totally dismissed from the recaps.
As for Matt, my impression of him is that he will want to forgive Rob, will be inclined to fall back in line. Remember how he praised Rob for knowing exactly what to say to everyone: What if it turns against Matt and he falls for Rob's lines just long enough to be voted out again?
I sure hope the merge is good because this season, outside of Phillip and Rob, has really been boring, so much so that it was the theme of my episode 6 summary.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-03-11, 11:17 AM (EST)

92. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 04-03-11 AT 11:18 AM (EST)
Michel, I agree. When Matt was voted out and we heard reaction confessionals from Andrea, and from Rob as well, I, too, looked at Andrea as the wolf in sheeps clothing, and I was afraid that Rob would grow complacent and ignore her. I looked at her as quite dangerous. But, with time, I think that Andrea was just as blindsided as Matt, clearly, and those were reaction shots. With time, and her re-assimilation back into the tribe, she's definitely gained favor. I wouldn't put her as Rob's number two, but she has gained more than Phillip.
I think Andrea had put most of her marbles in Matt's basket, and when he was out, she was lost. But, with time she is more secure with Rob. I don't think, at this point, she would choose Phillip over Rob. And, I think this is what she'll convey to Matt, on his return. I agree with you as well on what your ultimate prediction of Matt's return will be as well. I think he will want to forgive Rob too...it may take a little more time for him to reach that point, but, nevertheless, I think he will.
However, all of this serves to create doubt as to Rob eventually winning this season, and as we all know, the winner has to be able to perservere all obstacles and hurdles to make it to the end!

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-04-11, 04:14 AM (EST)

95. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

This seems right on about Andrea, FP.
I do not think that Matt will be Rob's man again. He is Christian, and forgiveness is good, but he's also a young guy who is very bright (pre-med), social, knows his way around the block, has watched the game.
Rob blindsided him successfully because by all normal strategy a hunky guy in Rob's core alliance should have been safe at the second TC. I think Matt will be more like "fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. I doubt he will ever trust Rob again. Will he sell Rob on his loyalty, I believe so. It's Matt's best move.
If Rob loses this game, I think it will be Grant or Matt or both who take him down (possibly with Phillip), and not a Zapatera. Definitely with Matt there was a theme with his RI stay that he would get back in and have revenge on Rob.'
If he tried to do it now he would be used for that and then disposed of, as everyone on Ometepe but Andrea and Phillip would be mad, and maybe Andrea as well, and Zapatera's would find him dangerous.
It will be interesting to see if any of the players get over the tribal division this season. Last season they intermingled and it changed the game, but there was a swap. With no swap, it's less likely they will forget the rivalry. Because of that division, Matt is pretty much homeless other than with Rob. I expect he will bide his time.
Rob is playing a great game, but also using people and conniving, and I don't for a minute think that Matt will be oblivious the way Grant and the girls seem to be.

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Georjanna 1316 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
04-02-11, 10:25 PM (EST)

87. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Michel,
Redemption Island, in several ways, reminds me a great deal of Gabon.
One of those ways is (to use David's word) the "groupthink" of the Zapatera Six. Their method of non-leadership reminds me of the Onions. And of Marcus' hilarious attempt to instruct a very hierarchy-minded Susie in the finer points of Hydra-dynamics.
Another is what I think is a growing similarity - not in their detail but in their direction - of the portrayals of Phillip and ... Bob. Although we did have an 'I'm on top of the world' moment from Phillip in the last Episode.
Note: The aftermath of Wednesday's IC also produced two other scraps of dialogue that I really enjoyed.
One was Phillip's amusing 'way to help out' to Rob and the other was Rob's thought-provoking quip - 'We almost lost you, Phillip' - as Ometepe made room for the red-headed stepchild in the center of their victory tableau.
Anyway ...
Please believe me when I say that I'm not suggesting that Phillip was the Sole Survivor of Redemption Island. At least not yet. And probably never. But I do wonder if you also see (hear or feel ... ) a bit of a connection between the edits of the two Seasons or between the edits of the two characters.

As always, with my thanks for yet another great read.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-03-11, 02:31 AM (EST)

89. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

That's a nice point about the top of the world, Georjanna. Phillip isn't going to win, though. He couldn't in any universe get the votes for Sole Survivor. They think he's crazy. Jurors don't like to vote for crazy.
As for Andrea -- as you mentioned, a Taurus. Not an impulsive sign.
Taureans are faithful friends but staunch enemies if you make them go there. They prefer stable strong alliances.
People have been talking about Andrea jumping around, but Taureans don't jump. Like bulls, they might charge, but normally they like to graze placidly in the field. They do get jealous easily, but they don't really like to be seething with emotion.
I see Andrea as someone who was looking for a strong alliance, but then got shaken up when Matt got booted. Ultimately she didn't want to make a move with Francesca, Kristina, Phillip. Look how the first two ended up.
If she stops feeling safe, then she will probably regroup, but it takes something substantial to upset a Taurus. They have a great liking for the status quo. Why would she get mixed up with Zapatera right now? There is no reason. Better for her to strengthen her sub-alliances and bide her time.
I'm sure she wants to get out from under Rob's dominance at some point, but I expect she'll wait until it makes sense or until such time that she senses the knife is hovering over her back from the core Ometepe alliance.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-03-11, 10:53 AM (EST)

90. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 04-03-11 AT 10:55 AM (EST)
Georgianna, I'd need you to explain further your comparison between Bob and Phillip because I can't think of two more opposite stories. Bob received complete respect from everyone. He was given the 5th spot in the alliance and was so happy with it that he'd go take a nap when the Onions were planning. He won because everyone liked him. I have a hard time seeing a parallel with our secret agent!
As for Marcus, he was leading effectively but Gabon was messed up by one tribal switch after another. Remember, they were letting Ace think he was in charge but they had their core alliance and even the outsiders, Paloma and Kelly were against Ace, not Marcus and the Onions.
What killed Marcus' edit was that Jeff was always praising the Kotas, not Marcus individually. Even in this challenge where Marcus was in Tom's role:
The only praise was given to Bob when Dan said: "I wish I could do that when I'm 57."
Jeff has given all the praise possible to Rob so again, I'm not sure I see a parallel between the two seasons.
I'll have to listen again to the end of the challenge because those are two interesting nuggets that I didn't hear. "We almost lost Phillip" surely hints that Rob will keep him around!

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Chillicrab 50 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
04-02-11, 11:35 PM (EST)

88. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 04-04-11 AT 04:06 AM (EST)
(Edited because I somehow mess up the bold and the 2nd half of the post did not show. Forgive this amateur)
Wow Michel, excellent.
A couple of things stood out for me that I was hoping to see if what others think.
The summary at the beginning, Rob says, “By me having this, I know nobody else has this” and not with the, “I want this for me” we heard previously. Is this the extent that Rob is going to use it effectively?
After
Phillip: “There’s another duel. Rob and I are going to go. I just don’t trust Rob anymore… Miyamoto Musashi, a very famous Japanese horseman, once wrote a book called the “Book of 5 Rings”. In that book, he says that what you want to do, which is so difficult, is let your enemy move first. Rob’s weakness is that he likes to be extremely controlling and he wants to control me and all the other players but nobody’s controlling me.”
Immediately thereafter, Rob tells Phillip, “You’ve got to bring your shirt” for the RI duel, Phillip asked, "I do?", then obediently stops unbuttoning his shirt and walks behind Rob. Reminded me of an old man I knew with Alzheimers who kept saying he was the head of the family, was in charge but would obediently follow the caretaker. That along with the seemingly childish outbursts with the brown crispies , should Phillip really get the Emmy or Oscar that Rob and Mike wanted to hand him in Episode 2. Is he for real?
Phillip is
a. a loose cannon as Rob makes him out to be
b. pretending to be a loose cannon
c. a loose cannon trying not to be and trying to apply strategies not really managing to?
Grumpy childish old man vs learned old man biding his time then forgetting what he wanted to do when the time comes?’
Agree the falling off the tree does not bode well for him, perfect goat if you can control and drag him to the end without being kicked. Just wondering how much of his presence is for entertainment and how much going to affect the endgame of the real contenders? Was watching it with someone who does not read these boards, after the challenge, she commented that Phillip was an ungrateful grump who talks big. He didn’t know which way was forward was until Rob yelled, “Behind you Phillip” and he goes, “oh this way”. Rob had to drag him through the string maze and push his ##### over to help to him complete the course.
“Some tribes advance boldly, weak tribes grow agitated, superior tribe like ours, we find a way to win, and we did.” Ometepe carried Phillip, the least he could do is return to the fold.
Another thing, after the challenge, as they were walking back to the mat, there were some jubilant remarks that couldn’t really made out exactly, then a very distinct voice of Rob was heard saying, "I thought we lost you there". Is that a hint? Rob and followers do not lose Phillip as Phillip will ultimately not make the big move he talked about all this time?

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-03-11, 11:10 AM (EST)

91. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Thank you Chillicrab.
You bring a nice point about Phillip's dual edit with that "bring your shirt" comment. I had noticed that; when he told Ashley he would follow her, Natalie's reaction was telling us: "My gosh! I'm not the child here after all!"
As for your question, I'd say C) is closest: I see Phillip as a loose canon but not realizing he is. He's failing at strategy but stumbles into a fall-back position not always of his making.
You know, if the stars align properly, he could get votes in the end if he doesn't step on too many Zapatera toes and if he faces the spa girls. Faced with choosing between those lazy beauty queens and a hard worker, the jury would always give him votes. With 3 Omes at the end, the Zaps would be in the jury's majority. Even Rob could be faced with a "it's not his game" rebellion.
How will Phillip get there? He is on a very lucky streak already!

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-04-11, 02:02 AM (EST)

93. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

>>> Faced with choosing between those lazy beauty queens and a hard worker, the jury would always give him votes.
Model Jenna Morasca beats great survivor skills Matt 6-1. Only Butch votes for Matt.
Matt was not nearly as crazy and he didn't wear baggy salmon undies, and he wasn't twice as old as the jury age average like Phillip would be.
They edited out most all the complaints in Gabon about how Bob was tedious around camp. Phillip's annoying traits are being magnified. He won't win the jury.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-04-11, 08:05 AM (EST)

97. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

There are many differences between the two situations (if we have a Nat/Ash/Phil F3):
1- Ashley and Natalie could split the votes from their friends.
2- Zapatera hasn't been kind to young girls.
3- Jenna had mingled with most of the jury BEFORE the merge and she knew to get rid of Rodger before he poisoned the jury. (BTW, Butch was the only one she hadn't met!)
4- Phillip hasn't annoyed ANY of the Zaps yet.
5- Phillip is likely to say bad things about his tribe which could be music to the Zapateras like Sandra bashing Russell was for the Heroes.
6- People out there thought Matt was about to kill them.
7- Matt was Rob Cesternino's puppet. If Phillip orchestrates a move against Boston Rob, that could greatly impress the Zaps.
8- With Zap making up majority of the jury, I suggest you check your math regarding the average age of potential votes for Phillip. Phil wouldn't get votes from Grant and Rob but he could get the votes of the elders from Zap. Maybe that's why we heard his rant about age deserving respect. That was how Zapatera operated.
Phillip isn't likely to win the jury vote but we do not KNOW that he doesn't. Redemption Island could possibly see the biggest redemption story! That's the beauty of not being spoiled, the only saving grace of this season.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
04-04-11, 10:00 AM (EST)

98. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

I don't think Phillip has a prayer of getting the jury votes, but then stranger things have happened.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-04-11, 06:16 PM (EST)

103. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 04-04-11 AT 06:39 PM (EST)
I'm certainly not saying he's a sure winner in that F3 but I don't see Steve, Julie, Ralph and Mike voting for the spa girls over someone who works.
Other differences between Jenna and the spa girls:
9- Jenna won 2 crucial immunities to get herself to the end, gaining some respect in the process. If Natalie and Ashley both make the F3, one for sure, maybe both, will have coasted to the end.
10- Jenna used strategy:
a) when she picked her tribe, using what Dave told her to pick the 3 guys that hated Rodger.
b) Convincing Deena to vote out Rodger before jury duty started.
c) Going with Alex instead of Deena which weakened Rob until Alex opened his trap.
d) Giving up her immunity necklace to Heidi, making sure Christy would be voted out.
e) Making a F2 deal with Matt, thus making the cweepy guy so sure he'd be in the F2 that he didn't compete for immunity. Jenna only had Rob to beat.
We haven't seen anything yet from Natalie and Ashley.
11- Jenna only had problems with Jeanne, Joanne, Rodger and Christy. Only Christy made jury. Natalie and Ashley have been called lazy by Phillip, Andrea and Rob all of which would either be on the jury or using the girls' laziness to build his case.
12- Season's 6 main theme was: "Beautiful girls rule the Amazon". (Remember how all the guys, including Rob, where shown salivating at the thought of being with the cute women and Jenna had the quote about wanting to beat the men) This season is mostly about Redemption and who needs it most?!!

ETA: In Gabon, the main theme was "Good vs Evil" so they had to hide Bob's annoying traits to make him look like the good guy. Redemption needs one to be seen poorly first, good later. Different seasons, different themes.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
04-06-11, 09:16 AM (EST)

107. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

You have made the most compelling case for Jenna, one of the least deserving winners ever, that I have ever seen.
However, I think much of what you attribute to her as strategy was simply luck. I don't think she did much of anything out of strategy - mostly what she did was out of bitchiness.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-06-11, 07:33 PM (EST)

108. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 04-06-11 AT 07:33 PM (EST)
Luck, certainly, every winner gets some. Jenna did know what she was doing out there which is a lot more than we can say about Fabio!

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-04-11, 02:12 AM (EST)

94. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 04-04-11 AT 02:12 AM (EST)
Chillicrab ...
I like your list of possibilities.
I see Phillip as a guy who is attuned with all the concepts of strategy, communications, and the game. Problem is, the guy who markets hyper-awareness is a walking parody, because he has no self-awareness of how he fits into the picture.
He is simply unable to see himself through the eyes of the others. He imagines others seeing him as he pictures himself. He is not unobservant. Rob is wrong to think so. Phillip has a blind spot when it comes to his own social game, and he has a blind spot when it comes to understanding why Rob and Grant value and tolerate the girls.
You ask whether he is entertainment or has a meaningful role? Hard to tell, but Coach had both. (I didn't find him entertaining, but Jeff did.) Coach was full of hot air, but Coach DID change the outcome of Tocantins. Coach's odd philosophy is what saved JT from being toast as soon as Joe left, barring immunity.
Phillip could change the game, but like Coach, he has little or no shot at becoming respected by the other players. They will all try to use him. Unless, there are people on Zapatera who feel simpatico with him -- Julie or Ralph or even Steve.
I look forward to seeing whether Zapatera starts pissing and moaning now that Phillip is their tribemate. Lol, they thought David was annoying!
"Sometimes it's not enough to know what things mean, sometimes you have to know what things don't mean." — Bob Dylan

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-04-11, 12:59 PM (EST)

100. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Well, they get along with Rooster. For all the behind the back garbage we've seen at Zapatera, Russell was the only one who took a shot at Ralph (breaking his own vow to keep that sort of nastiness out of his game from now on).
I keep coming back to Rooster because he was one of the three stories presented at the beginning of the premiere (Matt and Phillip being the other two) prior to Rob and Russell being introduced to the game. But since Russell was voted out Ralph's story seems to have gone missing. He's now on the outs with the rest of his tribe, and not the forgiving kind. Will he find a ready friend in Phillip?

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suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings
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04-04-11, 01:44 PM (EST)

101. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Phillip = Rupert (in Rupert's later appearances)
He seems to need acknowledgment and validation to the extreme and really gets pissy when he doesn't get what he needs from his tribemates.

A Tribe masterpiece

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-04-11, 06:23 PM (EST)

104. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Nice comparison, Suzzee. Even in his first appearance, Rupert had a lot of "my island", "my dream" quotes to make us realize he had some problems with reality! Or remember his tantrum when Shawn lost "HIS" spear! A very favorable edit hid some of his weirder traits in S7 and entitlement only made them grow in S8 and S20. Yet, Rupert wins jury votes in each of his seasons if he gets to the end.

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Chillicrab 50 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
04-04-11, 04:17 AM (EST)

96. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

My burning questions that was supposed to be in 2nd part of the my questions from my post earlier is:
Will Golden Boy Matt on his Saviour's Will will turn the other cheek and forgive Rob?
After the duel, Matt was captioned saying(? to Boston Rob) , " Yeah I won another one."
How do you interpret this?
Winning quote?
Thumbing his nose at Rob? Hence Phillip's use of the Book of 5 Rings used to justify Matt becoming a ronin and turn on Rob as Rob had made the first move?

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-04-11, 12:35 PM (EST)

99. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Random thought here: Matt has now been edited into filling the vacant spot Russell held at the outset, Rob v Russell has now become Rob v Matt. Rob won that already by outlasting Russell, but that was a default win that Rob had little to do with, just surviving within his own tribe. In this contest between Rob and Matt it isn't a matter of whether one of them wins Survivor, just which one can outlive the other. (It would, of course be a great dramatic dynamic to take to Final Tribal, but for production if it simply lasts awhile it is good story.)

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-04-11, 05:55 PM (EST)

102. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

dabo, I agree it should be Rob vs Matt but it hasn't been mentioned once yet. The story is Rob vs Phillip and the question that the editing has suggested is: Which side will Matt choose? Not between Ometepid or Crapatera. No, that seems to have been determined already. It's whether Matt goes to Rob or Phillip that is the question. And Matt's Christian edit could be to prepare us to see him forgive Rob.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-04-11, 07:15 PM (EST)

105. "RE: Episode #7: Thoughts"

Subtext, it has been building. There is no Rob v Phillip in the rivalry sense of Rob v Russell (which Rob has won). There is a Phillip against Rob, which may as well be Phillip against the world because Phillip is completely marginalized in Ometepe.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-09-11, 05:03 PM (EST)

109. "The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

Previously, on Survivor, at Ometepe, Matt and Andrea formed a tight bond right from the start and Boston Rob saw them as a threat…
…So he sent Matt to Redemption Island but Matt refused to go away, defeating everyone he faced, waiting for his shot to reenter the game.
Under Rob’s leadership, the Ometepe was flying high…
…Even his old nemesis, Phillip was beginning to feel like part of the team…
<We hear Phillip’s confessional when he says he’s “on top of the Earth.”>
…And Rob had another ace up his sleeve.
<We heard Rob telling us he already has the idol as he throws the clue in the volcano.>
On the Zapatera tribe, Ralph also had a hidden immunity idol…
..But his tribe was already in trouble: At the last Immunity Challenge…Ometepe beat Zapatera for the third time in a row.
At tribal council, it came down to Sarita, who was loyal, and Dave, who was better at challenges.
With Sarita heading for Redemption Island, the Zapatera 5 are hoping for a little redemption of their own.
Note that Jeff told us that it was under Boston Rob’s leadership that Ometepe was flying high when he could easily have said that it was because of Grant’s exploits in the challenges. Interesting also that we heard about the threat that Matt represents just at the time when Phillip’s threat level had diminished. The editors don’t want to let up on the dangers that Rob faces.
On a side note, it wasn’t necessary to tell us that David was good in challenges because tribal challenges are finished. Could it be to hint that David will be the one to eventually return from Redemption Island? Let’s keep that as an Easter egg for now.
I would have titled this episode:
Cohesiveness
Zapatera
Night 18
As the tribe entered camp, we heard Steve saying: “We sure blindsided her.”
Interesting in that we’d also hear Steve’s reaction to another, bigger blindside at the end of the episode.
Julie: “Tonight we voted Sarita off because we figured she was the weakest link…We have to win the next two challenges.”
David told Ralph that he understood why his name was written down.
This and his play later on, confirmed that David, despite what some were hoping, wasn’t thinking of flipping but was still loyal to the Zapateras.
The scene ended with Steve saying: “no one likes a landslide.”
That also was interesting because it was as if he was talking as a viewer that doesn’t like to see pagongings. We weren’t about to see that in this episode!
Redemption Island
Matt: “Sarita arrived at mi casa…She doesn’t appear to be too incredibly tough.”
He told Sarita that he had heard horror stories about Zapatera and Sarita told him that her tribe was great.
Sarita: “I loved that I got to share the good parts about Zapatera with him…here’s who you should stick with…”
That certainly sounded as if Sarita was giving up because she was encouraging Matt to join her old tribe.
Matt: “I think that Sarita might be the last of the duelers before the merge. I trust the information that she has given me about the Zapatera tribe. Up until this point, I was saying that it would better for me to hop back on the train with Ometepe but if all goes as planned, I could go with Zapatera.”
Ometepe
Day 19
Phillip: Today we got tree mail that indicated we get to go see the duel at Redemption Island with both tribes fully present. So we suspect that it’s going to be a merge.”
There was an exchange where Rob said it would be foolish to leave their stuff in camp but Phillip said he was a gambling man. In the end, he went along with Rob.
Phillip: “I went through a, you know: “I’m sick and tired of being the red-headed step-child but I learned a lot playing the game with Rob. It’s a whole new game now, we got the numbers and, if it is a merge, I’m very comfortable staying with the Ometepe tribe.”
Isn’t Phillip, like Matt before him and in his own way, saying that Rob knew to tell him exactly what he needed to hear?
Zapatera
Mike: “My personal hope is that we get to a merge. I’m ready to sink my teeth into some of the other members of the Ometepe tribe. Rob is the obvious target, he’s a master at this game but I’m ready to get into the ring and go toe-to-toe with that guy.”
If this episode was going to be the first round in a boxing match, Rob has already sent Mike to the mat…or should I write to the Matt! The KO shouldn’t be too far off.
Redemption Island
Matt: “I’m really nervous because I cut my foot pretty bad...If it’s one of those endurance challenges, it’s going to be really difficult. God gave me this platform and I’ll do the best I can and hopefully come out with a victory.”
A little doubt is always a nice way to build a story.
The Duel
Jeff told everyone that the winner of the duel would be going back in the game
Rob: “If Matt wins, it’s no good for me personally because I’m the one that sent him to Redemption Island. So, I’m figuring he’s holding that against me and there is a possibility that he might defect to the other team. That’s what I would do!”
For a tribe that would soon want to make a deal with Matt, it was strange to see Zapatera cheering so much for Sarita. I took it as another example of amateurs giving away too much because, in contrast, Ometepe was quiet towards the competitors, even Andrea. Only Phillip spoke up and that scene was hilarious: The editors used fast forward on the clouds and fade out, fade in on Phillip’s voice to show that he was carrying on and on. They had used the same mechanism to mock Cao Boi so, seeing this associated to Phillip’s code of honor tells us we shouldn’t have taken it seriously.
Jeff told them they were merging to a new beach and that Redemption Island was starting again.
Again, it was Matt’s reaction that we saw as Jeff said this. We know now why it was edited that way. And the irony of his: “Guys, please, give me a minute.” A minute was all he’d receive.
Matt: “I’m absolutely stoked to be back in the game and I definitely think my time on RI gives me an advantage because I had 6 people break down exactly what was going on in each tribe. I have a couple of options: I could go with Ometepe, I could go with Zapatera but I have to be careful because one slip out here and you’re gone.”
Merged tribe
Julie: “Walking up and seeing all that food was like a dream come through…”
Is Julie becoming the narrator for Zapatera? If so, it could signal that she’ll be the last one standing…and that Mike will be getting voted out soon! Note that it was an occasion missed for Ometepe’s girls.
Steve: “We sat down and had a great picnic…”
Rob after suggesting the name Murlonio for the merged tribe: “Murlonio doesn’t mean anything. It’s just an inside joke between Amber and I. She has a bunch of stuffed animals and Murlonio is like the ringleader. So, that’s the name of our new tribe”
I guess Amber will now have to bring her stuffed animal to the reunion! The thing to note is that Julie was the one shown reacting to the name, saying it was beautiful. If things are like in Micronesia where Jason and Eliza were the ones marveling at Erik’s Dabo, then we know that, even if she stays a while, Julie isn’t portrayed as a smart player. Rob, on the other hand, is still shown has having fun with the game.
Grant: “The first thing on my mind when I found that we had to build a new shelter was: Gosh! We have to do this again but I think it was important that we actually had to build a shelter all together because that’s like the ice-breaker.”
Matt asked why he had been voted out and Grant told him it was because they thought he was going to vote with Kristina. We were meant to think that Matt bought the excuse because the scene changed immediately.
Mike: “Matt is the key linchpin to this whole deal. He was voted out by the Ometepe tribe and I think that, at this point, he doesn’t have a huge amount of loyalty towards them. Looks like Matt and Andrea are very tight so this is where I’ve got to go for broke and try to make as big a move I can because I don’t want to just sit back and be dealt with when it’s my time at the hands of Boston Rob. ”
As if it was on steroids, we saw a spider spinning a web in record time as Mike talked things over with Matt. Mike promised F4 to Matt.
Matt: “I want to be in this game as long as I can so I’m trying to figure out what’s best for me and which route to take because last time I was coasting and waiting to play the game This time, I can’t let that happen because I’ll be back to Redemption Island in a jiffy.”
Mike added that he could give the idol to Matt. Matt said he’d have to talk with Andrea.
Murlonio
Night 20
Steve: “It’s really a miserable night. The shelter was never finished and it’s leaking in the back half, the half where Zapatera is. Ometepe, they’re all underneath the tarp so there’s a division between us and it’s pretty tough being on the downside of a 7-5 tribe. Andrea and Matt will have to switch sides, otherwise we’re dead.”
The couple was sitting alone by the beach when Matt told Andrea: “I want to take out the Ometepe tribe…This game respects big moves”
She was shocked.
Andrea: “I really like Matt but he has this idea that he wants to blindside the Ometepe tribe. I was thinking this could be bad. It’s extremely risky for me to jump ship at this point but I’m definitely keeping my options open.”1
Murlonio
Day 21
Mike was reading Krista’s bible, telling Ashley and Matt that Jesus fasted for 40 days and 40 nights which is about the time of Survivor.
Rob and Natalie were watching.
Matt: “I really believe I was put here for a reason and that reason was to honor my God. I’m really morally conflicted here because I genuinely care for everyone on the Ometepe tribe. I want to do the big Survivor move but right now, my heart is telling me no and to stick with Ometepe.”
Rob joked with Natalie about what he was hearing.
Rob in confessional: “There’s like a Christian coalition brewing here in Nicaragua. I got nothing against God. I mean, I go to church on Sunday but any time a group of individuals likes the same thing, I don’t like that. It could be romantic comedies, it could be oreo cookies, if they are all liking it together, I want that broken up. Who knows? Maybe Mike thinks he can grab one or two of them. I can’t let that happen. If Mike doesn’t win individual immunity, I feel Mike should be the first sent to Redemption Island.”1
1Rob voting out Matt could have been an editor’s nightmare if he was going to win because you don’t want winners to vote out good guys. Winners should always have a reason to eliminate someone: Either they are a threat, a dumb player or a villain. The two confessionals, first Andrea’s and now this one by Rob tells us that great care was taken to take the blame away from Rob, put some on Andrea but mostly present Matt as a dumb player. Even Christians can realize that Rob put religion in its proper perspective.
The Challenge
The order of elimination: Julie, Ashley, David, Andrea, Grant (“Don’t lose it now”), Matt, Rob, Phillip, Ralph and Steve leaving Mike and Natalie as Final 2. Mike who had been like a statue, saw a fly land on his ball and he lost his balance.
Natalie received nice hugs from Ashley and Rob.
Jeff put the necklace around her neck and she gave a little dance to a round of applause.
Natalie was speechless.
Was all this a prelude to Finale night? Will it be a Rob, Ashley and Natalie F3 with her coming out on top? Natalie’s fans will hope so.
Murlonio
Natalie received more congratulations as Mike told Rob: “Natalie was a champ.”
Mike: “The challenge today was quite a battle…I was in the zone… I was thinking I was coming back with the immunity necklace around my neck but it didn’t come out right. The first vote between the tribes is a big one and I might be on the chopping block.”
Mike’s plan included getting Ralph’s idol, targeting Grant and reeling in Matt but Rob was already talking to Matt. That scene, filmed by helicopter, had quite striking visuals.
Matt: “This is a game but my heart is telling me: “Don’t change…I’ve decided that I don’t want to flip and I’m just going to have peace with whatever happens.”
He told Rob of Mike’s plans but that he wanted to “continue building relationships with our tribe.”
Rob shook his hand, saying “That means a lot.”
Rob in confessional told us what it really meant: “Matt just told me he was thinking about flipping and going with Zapatera. First of all, he has the audacity to think that he is going to come up with a plan to vote me out then the stupidity to tell me that. He can’t be trusted so, because of that, I’m going to give him a one way ticket back to Redemption Island.”
Andrea joined the two and Matt told her he had come clean with Rob.
Andrea: “Yesterday, Matt and I said we were not going to tell anybody what we were planning and now he’s like throwing me under the bus to Rob. It’s so stupid because that could have sabotaged my plan to get to the final three completely.”
All of Andrea’s plans to get to the Final three included Matt so are we to conclude that, indeed her plans are dead? I would be inclined to say yes unless we hear about her new plans.
Rob went to Natalie, telling her it had to be Matt.
True to her episode #2 confessional, Natalie was making big moves with Rob but that’s the bane of her story.
Rob also talked with Grant and Ashley who both agreed.
Mike: “Looking at Matt, I see paranoia getting to him which is a beautiful thing at this point. I think he knows he could potentially be on the chopping block with the Ometepe tribe.”
Next, Rob told Phillip what he was doing tonight.
Then Rob asked Matty to join him on the shelter repairs, separating him from Mike. That prompted the Iraq veteran tom write a note to Matt, telling him to vote Grant. Matt showed the note to Andrea, telling us he was at a cross-road between keeping his word and breaking his word.
Rob: “Tonight’s vote is monumental. If things go down the way they are supposed to go down then Matty is going home. If Matt and Andrea are with them, then I’m going to be in a world of hurt.”
Rob told Andrea that Matt had to go.
Andrea: “Rob wants me to vote for Matt but, I’ve trusted Rob once before and I got royally screwed over. So, it might be a wisest move to flip with Matt because I could be the next to go. On the other hand, Matt is just sketchy; he’s flighty so I don’t know what to do.”
It surely sounds like Andrea didn’t do what will prove to be the wisest move down the road. Nothing here told us about her replacement plan, her alternate storyline. This confessional, besides building suspense, mostly served to explain Rob’s move, telling us that Rob isn’t a villain but is still playing a good game.
Tribal Council
Ralph said it was “rough. It was like two teams…They go their way and we go ours.”
Rob: “It’s pretty crazy what’s going on Jeff. Nobody is saying anything to each other. I’ve never seen anything like that.”
Coming from a veteran like Rob, this should tell us that the others aren’t playing the right way.
David: “It is really odd. We got the really bad side of the shelter last night. They were under the tarp…”
Ashley interjected: “Well, we won the tarp so if we choose to sleep under the tarp...”
David interrupted: “I would like to add the little asterisk to the win that I really didn’t try too hard.”
The thrown challenge resurfaces after the merge and in a very odd way: David telling the majority alliance that he could be deceitful. Pretty dumb but it is another sign of amateurs giving away too much information.
Jeff: “So Zapatera did throw a challenge.”
Rob was shown laughing while Phillip had to comment: “Jeff, that is the distinction between the two tribes…We would never not try…There are some in that tribe that deceive which can be beautiful and glorious but, when it recedes outwards, it leaves a stench so great that it is probably carrying something parasitic and therefore you don’t want to approach it.”
It’s nice of Phillip to tell us he will never flip to Zapatera! That was quite a nice way to introduce himself to Zapatera. Natalie, Rob, Ashley and Andrea enjoyed it.
Asked why they were laughing, Andrea and Ashley could only point at Phillip.
Andrea: “What Phillip just said is funny.”
Ashley commented: “Honestly, it’s two different tribes but I don’t dislike them as people. I think we’re both being loyal to the tribes we originated in. That’s all it comes down to.”
Matt: “It was so much easier on Redemption Island not having those people around. I had some pretty wild Tribal Council so far. I’m starting to have a funny feeling about this place.”
Mike: “Matt is the man in the middle…We are going to find out where everybody stands.”
Ralph: “We tell him we can take him further in the game. They already canned him once so they’ll probably do it again.”
Matt: “They continued to grow in their relationships and got closer together. It looks like I’m at the bottom of the alliance here. I struggled today but I’m starting to see the whole picture.”
When Jeff returned with the votes, Ralph stood up and played the idol for Mike.
The camera didn’t even hint that Rob could play his.
Grant received the 5 votes against him very stoically, a small smile even appearing on his face.
We saw some surprised looks when Jeff read one vote for Steve but shock when Matt’s name came next. Steve was even seen mouthing: “Wow”.
As Matt grabbed his torch, we saw Steve saying “Let the fireworks begin” and David commenting: “Genius is what that was.”
Right then, the camera showed us the genius behind the move: Rob with an impassive look.
Julie was heard saying: “My God! That poor kid.”
David was shown once more turning with an admiring look on his face towards Boston Rob.
Jeff told us the immediate concern: “Matt is heading to Redemption Island where one of you will have to face him in a duel and I have a feeling forgiveness won’t be on his mind.”
On Redemption Island we heard a defeated Matt saying: “Today, God’s will was contradictory to what I wanted…Apparently, I’m not so good at this game of Survivor.”
The Story
With the recap reminding us that Zapatera wasn’t a cohesive tribe and the beginning of the episode telling us they considered voting out Sarita a big blindside, this episode showcased Rob’s game and it showed the difference between the two tribes.
The Characters
Matt: With even God having apparently deserted Matt, it seems his story has reached its conclusion. He even told us that he isn’t a very good player at this game.
Mike: His confessionals about strategy and his role in the discussion with his alliance show that Mike is now the leader of Zapatera just at the time when it isn’t good to have that role!
Steve: He continues to have a small narration role but he’s mostly telling us the difference between the two tribes.
Ralph: Once more, the episode showed him as a Dumb player, talking to his balls as if they were his pets, hoping they would remain on his tray and, later, playing his idol for the wrong person even if Zapatera had been given indications that Matt was on the block.
Julie: Her story still has no substance and giving us her impression of the merge feast isn’t going to change that.
David: When David reached an understanding with Ralph and later admitted that he threw a challenge, we saw that he was never going to flip to Ometepe. That leaves him with very little story to hold on to. He seems to be just one of Zapatera’s doomed members. Let’s keep in mind that we often heard he was good in challenges as if to prepare us for his return from RI.

Ashley: Her Bible discussion with Mike and her intervention at TC where she said she liked the members of Zapatera, could serve as build-up for Ashley receiving votes in the Final Council. It’s something to keep in mind but the Zapateras do have time to notice that she doesn’t do much but talk.
Grant: Jeff’s “don’t lose it now” comment during the challenge could be a prelude that Grant loses the immunity when he needs it most. F4? Maybe.
Phillip: Tree mail and the merge discussion that ensued showed us that, despite every thing, Phillip will follow Rob. His TC intervention certainly told us he wouldn’t approach Zapatera with a 10 foot pole which kinda limits his options! Even his code of Honor was turned into ridicule by the editors.
Andrea: Although she had a strong merge episode, a sine qua non condition for a winning story in many people’s mind, I saw this episode as killing all the end-game ties that had been built in her story. Phillip is a happy Ometepe camper, she renounced Matt, she trusts Rob and she hasn’t given us her replacement strategy. End of Story? Quite possibly but let’s wait to see how she reacts in the next episode before we say so conclusively. I now see her as sitting on the little bike, pedaling fast to catch up but, unfortunately for her, Marinoni (probably Rob's distant cousins!) builds great bicycles.
Natalie: She continues to be shown as being really close to Rob. She’s the one he went to first about wanting to vote out Matt and she was there when he joked about the Christian coalition. That ties in to her confessional about sticking with Rob. If Natalie wins a few more challenges that could be enough to make her case to the jury and the viewers. If that is where her story is leading then we saw which two players will be sitting with her on Finale night, the camera showing Rob and Ashley hugging her before Jeff congratulated her. It seemed like a rehearsal for the reunion especially with Mike saying: “Natalie was a champ.”
However, I don’t see it that way. I see Natalie edited as the coattail-rider that everyone will think, even fear in some cases, is going to win the vote but she is on a Journey to prove she can handle Survivor, a message served to all the Purple Kellys of the world. For that, her smile and her little wiggle of the hips is enough. To be a winner, it isn’t, not unless she would be up against a player that others hated.
Rob: I still see as this being edited as Rob’s redemption season. Just like when Ometepe won their first challenge, he could tell Jeff at the reunion that it was way overdue. I still always go back to when he heard that Russell was voted out; he kept quiet. In this episode, when he heard that Zapatera had thrown a challenge to get rid of his enemy, once more he just smiled.
This is how you portray a manipulator winning Survivor: You show his moves, share in his fun and throw in doubts that it can last. I know many think that Rob is headed for a fall but the cohesiveness of his tribe shows no one will have the audacity to plan voting him out until it is too late. As for losing the vote, there is nothing to make us think that he isn’t appreciated by his opponents. What we did see was David calling him a genius.

In Guatemala, there was a huge theme regarding deserving players which told us that season wasn’t going to be Stephenie’s to win. There hasn’t been a single word about that this season. If it surfaces now, I would think it would come from only one or two players, adding more doubts in the viewers’ mind but not becoming the theme of the season. This is the season of Redemption and Rob seems headed for victory.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-10-11, 00:14 AM (EST)

110. "RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

I apologize to those of you who write full recaps, but I simply don't have time to read that much, so I only read the bold parts and the summary. I realize I will miss things that way.
Mike -- my emotional reception of this episode was to love Mike and really want him to dodge the bullet. He showed he had what it took to negotiate with a possible ally. Not his fault it didn't work. Who would expect that reading the Bible would send Matt back to Rob's camp due to conscience? Had an early confessional. I am hoping he goes farther in the game.
Rooster -- still not very bright, but entertaining. Not likely to mastermind any future big moves. If they let him get to the end he would get votes. Had a first confessional.
Steve, Dave, Julie -- depressed. Dave probably has some scrambling left in his story, but it's time has not yet come.
Ashley and Natalie-- my dislike was intensified, especially Ashley's remark about how they won the tarp. Clearly she doesn't get the concept of merge and is acting like she's in in high school. Blech. Natalie -- boring.
Andrea is the only one of the women who is really playing. She had a good story with being solicited by Matt to do something she hadn't planned, having the sense to say it couldn't be blabbed, and then having Matt let her down. We understood why she voted Matt out. We see her head is all in the game.
Andrea is the only female that I think could be the winner. I thought this in Episode 1 when she had that scene with Phillip telling her to chop, and then she faded away after the Matt boot. That can happen with winners.
Matt's story did seem to be over, and I have no expectations of it. OTOH, they could be showing him in the "dark night of the soul" so to speak, from which he could rise again with determination. It will be odd if Matt is not on the jury. There should be two more pre-jury boots. I would like to see Matt get revenge. He is not all turn the other cheek.
Grant -- is being shown as a nice guy and a true competitor. I like him very much, but they don't let us into his head much. I am not quite resigned to him having no story, although last season Benry got a similar treatment. I am hoping that Grant has some game in him that he hasn't needed to draw on as of yet.
Phillip -- Coach v. 2, still. Not nearly as entertaining as Jeff thinks. He's loyal again right now, but let Rob diss him again and he could vote Rob out. Phillip blows with the wind.
Rob -- I continue to resist that Rob wins. I like Rob, he's totally smart and entertaining. However, I think he lost his Hero persona this episode. He is heartless again. The mocker is back, the one who laughs at you while he cuts your throat.
Also, the promos are back to the Godfather ... I don't think that bodes well for Rob's Redemption theme. It is more -- back to the old Villain.
I think that some sub-group of Rob's Ometepes will eventually turn on him.
As for the theme of the show -- you know, they can name a season whatever they want, but no guarantees that the winner will uphold the theme.
Amber was not even All Star material. She was cast because Lis-lis refused.
In Gabon -- Bob had no real resonance with the Eden theme.
In Fans v. Faves, Parvati was no Fave from the Cook Islands. She was second tier, like Amber ... and the Fans bombed.
In HvV, Sandra really never made a move that worked, and she was a minority amongst the Villains.
In Redemption Island, if they get real lucky, the last returnee will have some big impact, maybe will make F3, could even win. But there is no mandate for Rob to win because he is the one who needs Redemption. Rob's character got redeemed in HvV. His reputation as a sharp player has already been redeemed in this season.
I do think that Rob has a good chance of becoming the immunity hog if he can succeed in banishing all the strong men. Rob is multi-talented and he is experienced in Survivor challenges. However, the exile island returnee could throw a monkey-wrench in that.
I would imagine that in the F5 the HII is expired, so it's do or die. There will be two F5's, the second one including the last returnee. This is where it gets tough for Rob to hold on to a winning streak, and I personally think it will be the end of the line for Rob. I kind of doubt he will ever go to Redemption Island. If he does go, and returns, then I think he will most likely win.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-10-11, 09:47 AM (EST)

112. "RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

Nice summary, OFP.
Most of Sucks is either on the "Andrea wins" or "Natalie wins" bandwagon. It's possible that Andrea wins, her story has received more care than the other spa girls, but it seems she killed her own story when we heard her say it could be wisest to go with Matt. Indeed!
As for Rob, you may be right but I could have avoided that long text and simply gone with the line: We heard that Rob had elevated his game to the next level now we are told he is a genius. That should tell us all we need to know.
We'll see but I like my bet.
Then there is this: "As for the theme of the show -- you know, they can name a season whatever they want, but no guarantees that the winner will uphold the theme."
I think you underestimate the power of editing and you don't have the proper theme for some seasons.
In Gabon, we heard from interviews that Bob was hard to live with but, on TV, we saw him as an endearing character, the only one that truly fit on the good side of Good vs Evil, the forced theme of the season.
In @ss, the theme was "players repeat the same mistakes" and in that sense, Amber stepped up. She wasn't just a sheep to a bad player, but collaborated with a strong one. In the end, most said Lamber grew up, thus fitting the theme.
In FvF, the theme was that the Favorites had to change their game because the Fans knew them. Parvati certainly did more than in CI.
In HvV we wrote that the theme was that some players didn't fit in their category. Therefore the winner couldn't be a heroic Hero or a villainous villain. For a villain, Sandra proved to be on the hero's side.
The editors try real hard for the winner to fit the theme even if it's a square peg in a round hole. Here, which player could be redeemed and get the win? Matt would indeed fit the bill but his story seemed to have reached its conclusion. The spa girls for sure still need redemption. Natalie's challenge win could be the first step in her evolution. Phillip also needs redemption but Phillip winning? I don't think so. Mike would need to shed the sin of throwing a challenge but it still keeps following him. Andrea was the nice, hard working girl so she wouldn't fit in at all unless she redeems herself for voting out Matt. That's why her next episode will be crucial.
So, with no character appearing to be manipulated into a redemption character then we can look at Rob and know that, if he indeed won, he would fit naturally into the theme without the editors forcing anything.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-10-11, 06:54 PM (EST)

116. "RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

>>> Most of Sucks is either on the "Andrea wins" or "Natalie wins" bandwagon.
Thanks for the info. My gag reflex isn't up to the job of wading through who Sucks thinks will win. There are some good posts there, but too much dreck and fan gushing.
I gather that Sucks as a group always wants a girl to win. Sounds like par for the course.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-10-11, 10:55 AM (EST)

114. "RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

LAST EDITED ON 04-10-11 AT 11:05 AM (EST)
Great reading michel and OFG! This was a great episode, and in the end, my gut feeling afterward was that Matt was far to naiive a player to even begin to play with Rob, the seasoned veteran. Rob knew exactly what needed to be done and he made a great assessment, acted on it, and carried it off. Signed, sealed, delivered. Matt, imo, sealed his own fate. I loved him, but as he stated in the end, he certainly isn't very good at Survivor.
Jeff told us about Rob's decision right at the start. He noted the Matt and Andrea bond, and he knows he strong a couple can be in this game. He handled it. The intro was favorable for Rob and Ometepe's. Then at Zap, we see that things are not so smooth. They chose to vote off Sarita, favoring challenge strength over loyalty....this shows me how naiive their entire tribe is. They are favoring someone that could possibly beat them in an individual game, for someone that wouldn't beat them, but would stay loyal to them. The continue to be a tribe that in over their head as well, and they look naiive to me, too. They have no idea what they are about to get into. Makes me think that Matt really does belong with the Zaps.
Cut to RI, and Sarita is shown coming to Swiss Family Matt. She tells Matt how the Zaps are all really good people, and that he should be open to Mike, he's her favorite player and Matt finishes with, "It could be an opportune moment to strike and take out the Ometepe tribe." Right there is the driving conflict of the entire episode. Will Matt align with Mike, Sarita's favorite, to take out the Ometepe tribe?
Then the Intro plays and we are back to Ometepe, where we see the green tree frogs. For me, they symbolize jumping, and specifically they hint that Phillip could jump to the Zaps. They create doubt. Rob talks about the tree mail, that they will all go to RI to see the duel and he suspects a merge. And, with an immediate answer to the question the frogs pose, will Phillip jump...Phillip tells us that he's happy staying with the Ometepe. He did go through a tough phase, but actually he's learned alot from Rob. This, for me, foreshadows that Rob will have his vote, should Phillip make the jury. He went through a tough time with Rob all the way, but in the end, he respects Rob, he taught him alot, and he will stick with him and vote for him to win....
At Zap, it's David that tells them it'll be a duel followed by a merge and we hear Mike say he's ready, Rob is the obvious target, he's a master at this game, he's ready to get in the ring and go toe to toe with him. So, this sets up that it will first be Mike vs. Rob. Mike has Sarita's vote, but will he get Matt's vote?
At RI, Matt tells us that he cut his foot, but he's still got God on his side...Matt wins, stays alive and will be returned to the game. As you noted, that Zaps cheered on Sarita, while the Ometepe's were quiet....except for Phillip who goes off on his code and strategy....and, it's all "up here"....Matt says, thanks Phillip.
The tribes merge, they mingle...merge. Then Jiffy says, one more thing, after the merge, beginning with the next TC, RI starts again...right when he says this we have this shot...
Well, we now know that Matt would indeed be heading right back to RI...but what is really interesting is that there are 2 people in the frame with him...and we know that there will be 2 booted out at the next challenge....talk about foreshadowing! Wow!
Then Jiffy notes, "Where once again, Matt, you could be voted out and sent right back out here", Matt says, "Guys, give me a minute!" Foreshadowing...
Matt talks about his options noting that one slip up out here and you're gone....once again, foreshadowing for our Matty...
Merged tribe, Day 19, feast....Julie tells us, it's a dream come true...I agree, will she start narrating things for the Zaps? She could be the last Zap standing. Then Steve's take, life is pretty good right now. Rob, then suggests Murlonio, from the sea, how beautiful, Rob gets a laugh!
Grant has a confessional about building the shelter, it's good, it's an icebreaker. Then we see Matt ask Grant why he got voted out....and Grant gives him an answer that wasn't true, "we were paranoid about Kristina, it gets skimmed over, and it is edited to appear that Matt is buying it....naiive Matt. What is so sad is that he is like a new little puppy, and he's SO eager to please. He has no idea still, who he is playing with.
Then a confessional from Mike, Matt is the key to this whole deal...He doesn't see Matt having a huge amount of loyalty toward the Ometepe tribe, and at this point he just doesn't want to wait and just bide his time till it's his turn to get voted out by Boston Rob....HMMMM? Who does that sound like? It sounds like EXACTLY what Phillip told Andrea, when he wanted to get her and Matt and takeover Rob. I can't help but to wonder if Phillip has been talking to Mike?
Then we see Mike and Matt walking and making a play for Andrea and Matt. He tells them we can go to the F4, and he does have access to the idol. Matt wants to do what's best for him, doesn't want to be passive, like he was before. He likes the sound of it, but has to talk to Andrea...
Hear the storm approaching, and Steve gives us his "death" confessional. It's pouring and there is sad music...
It's a miserable night, the shelter was never finished and it's leaking in the back half where Zapatera is, and Ome's are all underneath the tarp, there's a division between us...it's pretty tough being on the down side of a 7 - 5 tribe, hopefully Andrea and Matt (see them cuddling up together) will switch sides, because if not, we're dead...
WOW, this to me was a very bold video of the DEAD Zapatera tribe. They are indeed a sinking ship, dead in the water, or should I say, dead in the rain water...this was an "in your face" foreshadowing moment, imho...
Then we see the moon at night and Matt and Andrea have gone off to talk on the beach...Matt takes the lead, right now you are my closest ally, Andrea replies, "good, because I didn't know where we stood"...Matt, "OK, this is what I want, I want to take out the entire Ometepe tribe, because I am at the bottom of the alliance. So, first I want to vote out Steve, then Phillip out, Ometepe thinks everything is hunky-dory, and then that's when we blindside Rob", See Andrea's shocked reaction..., Matt tells her, "SHHHHH, just calm down, just hear me out....This game respects big moves, it does", Andrea notes right now I'm tight with Rob and Grant..", Matt notes, we can only talk to each other about this, and Andrea agrees don't say anything to any of them...she tells him she has no problem back stabbing the two of them because they backstabbed us in the beginning....
Then it cuts to a confessional from Andrea, she really likes Matt, but he wants to blindside the Ometepe tribe, and this could be bad as it's extremely risky for her to jump ship at this point, but she's definitely keeping her options open...So, Matt and Andrea have their reunion!
Also, we are shown them plotting, and that Matt wants to blindside Rob....which tells us in the end that Rob was quite wise to take out Matt again, because he was extremely threatening...
Then we have Matt and Mike discussing the bible, and the 40 days and 40 nights, like Survivor...Matt was put here for a reason to honor his God. He has a delimma, he really likes everyone on Ometepe and that his heart is telling him to stick with them...
Then we see Rob and Natalie noting them...there's like a Chrisitian Coalition brewing, Look it, I got nothing against God, I mean I go to church on Sunday. But, anytime a group of individuals like the same thing, and we see Matt, Mike and Ashley talking, but Ashley, the ultimate spa girl, is still worrying and fussing over her bikini line, which I think is really funny. It could be romantic comedies, it could be oreo cookies...If they're all liking it together, I want that broken up! Who knows, Mike, maybe he already thinking he's gonna grab one or two of them (see Matt and Ashley on the screen), I can't let that happen. With Rob noting and observing Mike in action with Matt, he states, if Mike doesn't win II, I feel like he should be the first to be sent to RI.
I think since we know that Mike wasn't sent to RI, now we clearly know who Rob's number one choice to go is...Mike. I look at Rob as the true veteran of the game and he plays it 24/7. He is observing EVERYTHING, and he's very perceptive and intuitive. His assessments are spot on, and I give him kudos for noting that any people that start to share a common ground of any kind will and could be threatening down the road. He is going to nip this threat off at the knees. I say, well done, Rob!
Cut to the IC:
Interesting to note the order. First out Julie, then Ashley, David, third and final ball....then Andrea, Grant, Matt, Rob, Phillip, Ralph, Steve, Mike, than Nat. I noted that Rob goes out right after Matt....did Rob just want to beat Matt?
Loved Natalie's little shaking of her hips with the donning of the necklace...
And, papa Rob looks proud...
Mike notes in confessional that he's working Matt, but if he decides to join Ometepe tribe, it could be me going to RI...
Day 21...
Rob tells Mike that he was like a statue out there, he notes how hard of a competitor that Mike will be. Mike asks Ralph if he'll play the idol for him, and Ralph notes that if he needs to he will. The Zaps plot to take out Rob's right hand man, Grant, they won't see that coming...they all agree it's a smart plan.
Then Rob is on the cliff over looking the sea, and notes the amazing beauty...Matt says he learned alot on RI... he was tough and wanted to honor his god, and he decided not to flip. He proceeds to tell Rob that they wnated him and he could have used Ralph's idol. But he wants to continue relationships with our tribe, and they shake. Rob is mortified that he was plotting and the stupidity to tell him about it, so he gets the one way ticket back to RI. Matt is glad they talked, and he came clean and tells Andrea. He tells them I told Rob everything, we are solid, we are not flipping, as we see a snake on the screen to promote doom. Andrea has a confessional that he gave her his word and said that they would'nt tell anybody, and then he disregarded it, it's so stupid, he's throwing me under the bus, he could have sabotaged her chance to get to the F3...then we hear Rob asking who they should vote for, Mike? And, Matt says, that's like swinging for the fences in the first inning, Steve, I don't think they'd give up the idol to him...
Then see the tree frog again, which makes us wonder if anyone will flip/jump.
Then we see Rob going to talk to his minions and interesting to note is the order that he did it....first Natalie, who he's carrying on his back, then Grant, then Ashley, then finally Phillip. Then Matt notes he's gone off without him, and Mike is there for him. Mike sees the beautiful paranoia setting in Matt.
Mike writes a note to Matt, Matt doesn't know what to do...he shows Andrea the note. Matt has the "golden ticket to the final three", he tells Andrea that he doesn't want to vote against Rob, but his is his final chance. Rob notes if Matty is with them, then I'm in a world of hurt.
Then we have the manipulated clip of Andrea, that was taken from when Matt was voted out post ep 2! So, it makes me think that this never happened in ep 8. Editing manipulation.
TC:
Once again, it looks incredibly hot. They have two teams, they go their way, we go ours. We were under the palm fronds, they were under the tarp. David says that he didn't try too hard, and Phillip notes the difference between their two tribes...I agree, not too bright on David's part to reveal this. The girls laugh at Phillip. Ashley says they are both being loyal to their original tribes. Matt notes it was easier on RI...foreshadowing AGAIN.
When Matt is voted out, the most significant thing of the TC was David's reaction..."Genius is what that was", and then ROB shown. See Matt go, and Jeff says he will not be looking to forgive, and David leans over again to look at the genius, Boston Rob....
Julie's reaction, "that poor kid", makes me think she is so not there either....she just doesn't get the game. I would say that this is the most naiive tribe I think I have ever seen. It is like Rob, the 4 time veteran, is just walking all over them all, and they have had the opportunity to see him play, to study his play, and yet they seem oblivious. It's not Rob's fault that they choose to be oblivious...as I noted in the East Coast Thread that Matt was truly out of his league. He should have plotted and planned just what he'd do the minute he got back in the game, to seek revenge or not. He had 20 days to figure this out, and he had all kinds of information to go with. Pathetic that he hemmed and hawed. He was a waffler, and he couldn't be trusted not to exact his revenge at some point, as we SAW. They showed us him verbalizing his plan to take out Rob for a reason. So that when we saw Rob take him out before he could take him out, it was a SMART move. Rob is shown to have it all under control, and he's NOT losing control no matter what the circumstance and despite all of the doubt that his being raised.
Mike, who had a confessional that he consider Rob to be the master of the game, and a worthy opponent, is given the kudos, because he's a man that is seeking out big moves.
I see Zap falling down one by one. But, will Phillip be the first Ometepe to go, as was noted in the RI screen cap that I posted above? Regarding the Ometepe and how they should go. Nat, I think will make it all the way to the end on Rob's coat tails and therefore will not win the game. I think Rob will have to beat Grant out for immunity, and thus Grant will be voted out before the F3. But, it could ensure Grant's vote, that Rob beat him at the challenge, and therefore he went....Rob, I don't think will turn against him. Grant will respect his game play, and admire him as he was beaten fair and square. They all know when they get down to the end, it's each man/woman for themselves.
Phillip as noted in the intro from Jiffy, will huff and puff about being booted, but in the end, he will have learned alot from Rob, and he'll vote for him. I think it could be Rob and the two girls in the end, but I don't know. David will vote for the genius, Rob as well. Mike could vote for the most worthy adversary as well. AS he told us in his first confessional, he was looking forward to getting in the ring with Rob, the master of the game. If Rob beats him when he had a chance, he'll most likely respect him.
AS for Andrea. She indeed could make the F3. But, I do not see Andrea as having any real game moves other than knowing when to be complacent and get along, try to favor and flatter Rob. She latched onto Matt at the beginning and that went bust. We heard her cry about it. Then she played the ONLY card she had, she got along and went under the radar again, trying to be helpful. With the merge, she was tempted to go with Matt, but she's very meek and afraid to make any bold moves, and as Matt told us, the game respects big moves. She even agreed, yet I do not see her capable of making any big moves. Therefore, because of her meek and tentative nature, I don't see her winning this game.
But, you never know. Maybe when the next RI'er comes back in the game she may be ready to make that big move....time will tell.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-10-11, 03:11 PM (EST)

115. "RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

I like your analysis, FP.
You wrote something that caught my attention. I saw it during the episode, noted and commented on it but it wasn't until I saw how you wrote about it that I saw a different angle to the story:
"She (Sarita) tells Matt how the Zaps are all really good people, and that he should be open to Mike, he's her favorite player."
I took it as showing that Sarita had given up and a way to make us think Matt would flip but it is a very great comment for Mike.
Mike and Matt will get another chance to bond on RI but Mike should come out on top this time. That would tie him in to the theme of redemption and he'd be a tough competitor to beat at the end but not someone that the Omes would vote with to flip the game. Rob will have to beat him in a head to head or rather toe-to-toe challenge.
We'll have to keep our eyes on Mike but I would suspect that some manipulations would have been made to remove him from the blame of throwing a challenge. Will he represent the last doubt before Rob's FTC appearance?

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Scarlett O Hara 3439 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
04-10-11, 09:04 AM (EST)

111. "RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

Hate to admit this, but, reading your analysis of the episodes Michel, is almost better than watching the real thing!

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-10-11, 09:50 AM (EST)

113. "RE: The Merge: Thoughts on the Story:"

Thank you Scarlett. As for the episode being boring, I certainly agree with you there. This season is bad: only Matt's boot have been surprising. That's what you get when tribes break up in groups of 6 on Day 1.

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Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest"
04-15-11, 06:06 PM (EST)

117. "EP9 Godfather edit"

Last night I rewatched EP9 because I remebered thinking the editing was foreshadowing a Phillip boot, just as FloPo and I had speculated...
The first confessional the morning after TC was David retelling the story of how Godfather Rob had welcomed Matt back into the tribe, shook his hand, patted him on the back, and then proceeded to take him out on the boat and kill him off Godfather style...the interesting thing was that David's narration of Matt's demise was a voiceover for footage showing Rob greeting Phillip as he returned to camp, shaking hands and patting him on the back...was this foreshadowing of a "kiss of death" for Phillip from the Godfather or just misdirection for last weeks show?

Krautboy

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-15-11, 09:31 PM (EST)

118. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

Krautboy, excellent observation. You would think that it would indeed be foreshadowing, just as the D#@$^**^&n tree frog is foreshadowing of someone jumping...but, it has still not come to fruition. I'm beginning to think that this whole series is nothing but smoke and mirrors.
But, clearly, it seems as though it should be blatant foreshadowing. The question is, will it be this week?

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Travel_Queen 138 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
04-15-11, 10:10 PM (EST)

119. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-15-11 AT 10:12 PM (EST)
I love your siggie!! And I wanted to add that BRob tweeted that it was "time for some crispy rice", he has such a great sense of humour. I still have a feeling that he gets to F3.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-16-11, 10:03 AM (EST)

120. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-16-11 AT 03:02 PM (EST)

This week my sentiment is....don't these "morons" know that they are on National Television???
All I can say is, who invited RussHell back? He got an early boot so they edit Rob as RussHell? Well, I don't like it one bit. But, it's not just Rob that I am not liking, it's all of them.
First of all, Rob is seen controlling everything, and these pawns are obedient. Like I have said all along, it's all about Rob maintaining control throughout the whole game, and we are privy to how he does it. Sure, he may not win jury votes, but no doubt, he is in control.
The first we have is the intro, and Jiffy stated:
Sarita drops out of duel, Matt seizes the moment and returns...Rob and the Ome's had a narrow advantage, 6-5, but Ralph had the HII. At the IC the situation improved for Rob when his closest ally won, Natalie wins. Matt doesn't want to flip, Matt trusted Rob again, a 2nd blindside, Matt is going to RI, forgiveness (Rob shown on screen) not on his mind...
Jeff points out again that it's all about Rob. Rob has a narrow advantage, things improve for Rob, and Rob blindsides Matt again, but forgiveness is not on his mind.
This pits Matt distinctly against Rob, again...and with that quote, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me....I can't help but to think if the third time will be the charm. Let's just say it raises a red flag.
I am beginning to think of all the religious symbols noted in this series....we just got another shot of the big Jesus, before Matt's confessional, and then when they had the reward at the giant Jesus "watching them".....the bible that Krista had, given to Matt, then read by Mike....hmmm?
Matt went on to say...I'm a moron, the biggest practical joke ever, God wants him to come back, so here he is, I trust you, if this is your will, you are using my stupidity, your glory, thank you for your glory and blessed be your name... The big question remains, will Matt outlast and be returned one more time. If he did it once, can he do it again?
Cut to Murlonio, Day 22. Around the campfire David corrects Steve, it wasn't their move, it was all Rob, and it was like a mob hit, it was pure genius. Rob comes up and Mike congratulates him, it was "brilliant". Then a confessional from Julie, who I think appears more and more out of touch with reality. She thinks that it was cold blooded, don't you have any feeling for another human being (as we see Rob and Grant being considerate and helping another human being, Andrea, up into the shelter)..blah, blah, blah....come on Julie, this is a GAME for 1 million dollars. Rob is just not helping the human being you think he should be helping... I think she clearly just doesn't get it. And, she has shown us that she too is capable of blindsiding someone, Sarita. What is the difference of you doing it, or Rob doing it. I think Julie is a waste of space as contestents go, give me a game player!!! As we see Andrea and Nat with Rob in the shelter, "superman!".
Next Rooster makes his move and asks Ashley if he is on the "chop block'...Natalie right there. "Hey, if you are in the top three, I'll definitely vote for you and not Boston Rob, Nat replies, "this game is hard". Rooster in confessional, notes "we have no control, don't know what's going on". This is monumental...Rob has complete control, and he's making it impossible for them to play. It is genius, if you want to win a million dollars....but we are getting the Zapatera reaction. And let's face it, it's not pretty when a tribe is cornered, left to be picked off one by one, and there seems there is nothing that you can do. One one hand we see that Rooster is frustrated because "they, Rob, won't tell them anything"...and in the very next scene we have Rob telling the Ometepe's everything....
We see how Rob does it....the Omes in the AM on the beach. (This scene probably occured before the Rooster approaches scene.) Rob has his group with him and he notes (cute little ghost crabs settle down to listen to what Boston Rob has to say)...From here on out, we don't decide who is going home until the very last minute. We are gonna do the buddy system. From here on out, nobody talks to any of them on their own, don't even friggin entertain any ? with them. We are guarenteed to go to the final six! One, two, three, Ometepe.
Then Rob in confessional. He tells us that one thing that voting Matty off last night did was to bring to old Ometepe tribe MUCH closer together...I have a whole vision that I am trying to put in to action here, to keep an us vs. them mentality. Thus, the separate shelter, the separate eating time. I want my group to hate Zapatera. It's us vs. them,(Phillip and Steve shown with the Us vs Them - foreshadowing), and we are better than them...and, we are going to be arrogant about it, I want them to show it. I'm not, because I want their votes at the end of the day...
Rob gives us his rationale, and it sounds like it WILL work to perfection. We may not like it, it is controlling, but it seems like it will be effective.
Then we have Nat ratting out Ashley, and Rob's response: Thank you for being honest, then he has a confessional...Laughing...You're not gonna vote for me, Ralph? Well, you are not gonna vote for Ashley, because she ain't gonna be there now, and it's your fault. Ashley, you coulda made it to the end, but you decided not to tell me anything. You have to tell me everything....it's my game, I'm in charge...smile... Wow! Edited with scarry godfatherish music in the background too... WOW. Rob is so serious and focused 100%, and he is willing to do anything, it seems, to win. He has loyal allies in the game as well, that could foil anyone else's plans. Rob seems to be covering all bases. Will he or won't he?
Cut to the challenge and dramatic music...Phillip and his meditation and the hawk feather...all things look good for the Otempo, Ometepe tribe...Jeff describes the rounds...go...Grant, Rob, Hello! Ralph, Mike, David, and Julie advance...Next round...Grant and Rob doing a very good job, Grant very fast in this challenge, Grant very close now, Mike very close, good job, keep it up Rob, Grant moving on! Comeon Rob, Mike moving on, dig let's go, David moving on to the final...(will David win on RI?)
Moving on, the puzzle you will recognize...funny that the self proclaimed puzzle genius comes in LAST! Ha! Grant doing a nice job, Mike on his tail, GRANT! Immediately goes to hug ROB....after he gets the IN, I note that he pats David on the back...
Mike confessional about how it will be one of them, unless they can pull off a hail mary....they are preparing to go to RI, they try to woo one, but Rob has them on lock down, he's like the prison guard. Then, they see them digging at the flag and David says, "let's screw with them"...they were just digging for rocks, and then Rob and Phillip start digging at the flag. David gets the confessional, maybe an idol has been placed, and they noted there was nothing there, which made the Ometepe's come running back, Rob may think we could have found it before they could get back with the shovels.
Here's the thing, I can't shake this idol paranoia. Idol's are what killed me last time and I'm still struggling with them. I know I have one idol, but, last night Ralph played his idol, so I believe another idol could be in play...(hear and see Mike, they are freaking out because they think we may have found another idol, we see Rob...) Rob continues with his confessional, Tonight, we have to make up a vote blind, that could potentially cost me my Survivor life, then we see Rob and the Ome's in their pre-TC pow wow....Rob says, let's go around, and asks who does everybody think? Phillip replies, I want to go with Ralph, but then Rob says, "but, who is our biggest threat? Grant replies, "I would either do Mike or David", as we heard the girls say, "Mike". Rob responds that "David, David is strategically smart"...um hum...agreement, then Rob continues, "but we also have to think about who is going to have the best chance to beat Matty...at Redemption?" We hear a collective, "Mike". Phillip disagrees, "no, no David". Then cut back to the confessional of Rob...we have to pick someone to vote out tonight, knowing the possiblity that that person may actually have an idol, or somebody else may have one and give it to that person. This is one of those times in Survivor where you have to gamble.
Then we see them leaving hand in hand, going with their buddy! Rob is covering all bases. He is not allowing a Zap to weasel in, and that my friends, is not a cult, that is executing a plan to get all 6 to the F6.
I think this confessional was very enlightening into how Rob thinks....he covers all bases. He was out last time because of an idol, and he has to consider the possibility that one could be in play again. We are seen his pow wow before the TC. This is where Rob has brilliant leadership skills. He poses the problem and then steers them to a collective decision. He empowers all of the members of the group, entitling them to their opinions, hearing them out, and then asking the critical questions that lead them to a consensus. I don't call that dictating. He has great powers of persuasion and he is great at manipulating events to his way of thinking. We have seen this time and again with his game play, right Lex?
He has a great perspective of the complete game and all that is involved. His followers trust him. Clearly, how he ends the game will spell win or lose for Rob. Will he throw his must trusted peeps away, or will he win on his own merits?
Then TC: Phillip and his Grandfather, Mike, they have no idea who is on the bottom of their tribe (as we see Mike), foreshadowing his boot, and David says that they think Phillip is on the bottom, and Phillip notes that he enjoys being on the bottom, because he can look up and see what's going on...he compares it to being one of 12, he's used to getting everything...this is his new family now...Julie notes Matt thought he was in the family too...he hugs Rob and Grant and everyone in the Old Omes pats him on the back and legs, he's smiling, front and center...Ralph says he's not going to give up, he may just get a feather tomorrow, but Phillip tells him it takes courage and determination...Mike thinks Phillip is insecure, he's struggling to find himself, he doesn't really know....then Phillip replies he's a man without a college degree that became a special agent blah, blah...David says "Give it up, you sound like a lunatic", and Phillip says, "you know what you sound like?" And David replies, an educated man..." Phillip says, "you sound like you are at the bottom of a cess pool, struggling to get out of it".
The Zaps vote for Phillip, and the Ometepe's vote for Mike, Mike is out, "Keep digging..."
When they return to camp, Rob shakes Phillips hand and tell him he was a "soldier" out there tonight, and then whispers to him...Let me tell you where you are....you ain't at the bottom, your'e at the top with me!"
Then Phillip whispers right back, "I know that"...and they shake at look at each other in the eye..."I know that".
Rob in confessional says the biggest thing that he took away is that Phillip is slowly becoming a very loyal soldier...which is good for me...(then we see Phillip talking to Rob as he is settling into bed with Andrea and Natalie..."I should probably join a theater company..." And, Rob continues, and even when faced with you are at the bottom of the pack comments, by the other tribe, he responded, I love being at the bottom, that's where I'm comfortable. I'm very happy that Phillip's obeying, and doing as he's told, and he'll be rewarded for it...
Then we see in the shelter Phillip rolling over and asking Rob, "What did you think of them voting for me...I didn't get that?" Phillip doesn't get how obnoxious he is at all...Rob responds, "just frustration, Phillip, because your'e getting the best of them..." Just like a son would ask his wise old father, or just like a grandson would ask his wise old grandfather, and the wise old grandfather reassures him...
Phillip's not really crazy, he's kind of playing crazy, but he is a little crazy...so even this early, i'm still thinking about my end game, and in the jury, so, as far as Phillip and I go...Phillip's at the top of my list, he's my number one, that's all he needs to know, so, Natalie and Phillip are coming to the final three with me. Then a distinct shot of lightening and a thunderclap...
I love this season because I feel like we are getting every perspective from a seasoned Survivor Veteran. He is revealing his final three. But, as we well know, alliances REVEALED will most likely NOT succeed....so, more than likely this will not end up being the final three...will Nat and Phillip be there without Rob, or will Rob and Nat be there without Phillip?
Then the next morning we see Phillip bringing everyone their morning coffee...and he's in confessional...
Everybody (Zaps shown) thinks that Phillip is naiive, Phillip is an idiot, Phillip is a crazy guy...this is a game! Everybody wants to stand at the finals with a guy like me, who's been polarizing, insulting, (see Phillip standing drinking his coffee with all of the Omes in the shelter), so, knowing Boston Rob, like I know him...he's thinking, who can I have stand next to me? (see Natalie), and who doesn't look so pretty? He replies confidently, Phil Sheppard! Smiling! But, I'm a smart guy, I'm a complex person, I gotta make something happen, but, as he puts his hand up, there's a time for that, and now isn't the time. Cut to a spider in his woven web....hmmm?
Then we have Ralph saying today's the day, have to do something and David warns him he has one shot...Interesting in writing on the screen, Ralph asks, "Who's gonna win the million? ROB." Hmmmm? Rooster wants to talk to all of them, but David tells him he won't accomplish anything if he talks to all of them...Tells Ralph, don't do something stupid...(dumba$$?)
Then we hear Phillip noting the tribe that sticks together, ends together...blah, blah...Rooster asks Phillip, do you want to win a million or are you gonna let Rob win it? As we hear dramatic music...Phillip replies he's really not concerned...Ralph just wants to talk, but there is nothing to talk about...David notes that it's not alot of fun when they are not willing to play it....I think, they are not willing to play it with "them". David notes he could be next on the list...cut to the challenge.
Phillip and Steve choose to feast on cheeseburgers, while the others "hang in there". Rob is first out...David and PHillip will be BFF's after Survivor....legs only, Julie out, Grant out, Ralph out, this is about will power and desire right now....Jeff says it all right there, the Zapatera tribe is weak and do they really want to even play this game? The Ometepe's REALLY want it...the perservere and win. Nat and Ash let Andrea win....
When David limps off, it's ROB that helps him to the bench...(caring for another human being, perhaps?)
Isn't it interesting....every time an Ometepe wins an IC, the first or only person we see them hugging or high fiving is ROB...Andrea high fives Rob after her reception of the necklace...
After the challenge we get a big fat rattle snake slithering....Then we see the tribe returning and it seems to focus on Andrea, then Andrea and Rob and we have the snake striking? Is Andrea the snake that will take out Rob? He's next with a confessional...We hear about the challenge from Rob...A win is always important, he never wants to lose, he's happy, he doesn't want the former Zaps to win, to get any momentum, he doesn't want them to feel like they have any power...So as long as someone from our side, wins....we SEE ANDREA crawling in next to Rob, I'm going to be happy at this point. Then we see them zoom in on the IN. Will Andrea win the final immunity? He just said he'd be happy as long as someone from his side wins....
Rooster then notices the fish net out and wonders if there are any fish in it...there are! They have all kinds of fish, hell, 50 fish, Ralph says very excitedly. Rob comes walking out of the shelter and asks, are they alive or dead? Ralph says, they are all dead and Rob tells him if they are dead, you can't eat them...Rob says that they are stiff, like rigormortis has already set in...and shows him...Then Julie, tells us that Rob is telling his people that the fish aren't any good, she notes that they are still soft, she just thinks that he doesn't want his people to get any because he doesn't want them to take anything from us...if he had caught them, they would have been feasting...
This scene, I felt was manipulated to make Rob appear like the villain. But, seriously, I had to agree with Rob....if those fish had been dead for a while, while they were at the challenge, in the hot sun as the tide went out? We have seen how hot it is there, and growing up on the coast, I was always taught that if it's not fresh and alive when you catch it, then don't eat it....I would also have had serious reservations regarding the fish too. Right or wrong as I may have been, that's the way I would have reacted. So, I don't fault Rob for feeling this way.
Clearly, however, it was edited to look like Rob was being very controlling and "Jim Jonesish"...Would the editors create this much doubt as to his chances of winning? I don't know...
Then Grant caves in, he's hungry, Bro...Rob doesn't want to let it affect their judgement...
Cut to Rob confessional...I'm running my tribe like the army. They are soldiers and I am the general. They are all doing as they are told...which is a wonderful thing...then see Grant going and tasting some fish...then a confessional from Grant...There's no food out here, no matter what Rob says, I'm making my own decisions, I'm my own man...he doesn't really think there is a dictatorship going on...as we hear Rob say, "Hey Grant"...
Then a confessional from David, Rob is keeping control of their diet, does he want them weak, or is it just to keep control over them...it's cult-like, he showed the power that he has over them by instilling fear in them...like the whole Matt situation, if you show any inclination that you are wavering in your loyalty, he'll just cut your head off then and there, so...nobody's gonna cross him...
This is all being manipulated, edited to look like Rob is a "Jim Jones" type cult leader...how low can you go?
Then right after the huge fish feast we have Steve complaining that he has to rest, "I'm living on a cup of rice and it's getting old".....didn't he just STUFF his face with cheeseburgers for lunch and then 50 fish for dinner? What the heck??? Complaining, complaining, complaining. That's all I see these Zaps doing...Steve says he's not gonna last much longer...
Then we have a confessional from Rob, it boils down to David or Steve...the biggest strategical threat in the game right now, or give the old dying T-Rex what he wants? If he gets rid of Steve it could buy him a jury vote...and with a straight face, "I've been known to have a mercy killing in me from time to time...haven't I???"
Cut to TC:
Dramatic music...Phillip...talks about meditations and feather, talks about Stealth r us...he is the specialist, Rob is the mentalist-strategies, Grant-the assissin, destoying any competitors, and the 3 degrees...focus their minds like they did today...Ralph, tough to beat, do you think his Grandfather told him to sit on the bench to eat hamburgers? Do they care?
Steve, you need immunity more than ever...
Phillip says they cannot break our strong alliance, they have a buddy system...Julie notes they are never alone, they are always with somebody else...Rob has complete control over them, as Rob looks on...it's not even a tribe, it's a cult...David, everyone has to be thinking one thing....as long as it isn't me tonight..."there's that, but with the numbers the way they are here, it's virtually insurmountable.(as a CHURCH bell rings...so, the other phase of the game, may be a better tactic to advance yourself that way. Can't vote for Andrea (zoom in on Andrea), then "everybody else is fair game(zoom in on David - foreshadowing).
AS Phillip walks up to vote he knocks down his feather, and he reaches up to smooth it, and the camera pans to Ashley who smiles and shakes her head. Clearly Ashley and Phillip are at odds, and one of them will be the UNDOING of the other....this conflict was set up by the red-headed step child drama and the spa girl. Wonder who will land on top?
Rob, Rob, Rob, Rob...David (David and Rob share a glimpse at each other...), David...David is voted out. Ashley turns to Rob and says, "and then there were three"... will she be in the F3? But, more importantly will she be turning to Rob and saying, and then there were three at the F3?
Zaps have to try and continue to crack the "stealth r us organization"...
So, as I noted above, the way THIS episode was edited was as if they brought back their great villain, RussHell. I hated it. I do not perceive Rob as an evil cult leader. I think of him as a man with a plan and a great leader, who covers all of his bases and sings songs all the way to the end. He's a fun loving guy, sure he's a bit cocky, but never the less a fun loving guy. I do not like this Rob at all. I feel as though it was heavy manipulation and it was set up with confessionals from alot of cornered animals...the sour grapes, Zapateras. So, I take it with a grain of salt.
There are 2 players however that give me pause, and they are Andrea and Matt. Andrea was zoomed in on alot, especially when they came back from the challenge and we had the image of the snake striking. Will Andrea lead the strike on Rob. If she does, I really feel that Matt will be with her...again. With Rob taking a huge nose dive into evil, than who better to end up with at the end of the show, than holy man, Matt. This is a big change for me as I thought with the confessional that Matt had at the end of the last show, about how he was no good at Survivor, and how he sounded like a defeatest, that he was doomed. But, with noting the religious symbols still in play, the down turn that Rob's edit has taken, and by noting that he was going to live with his shame...and live he will, I do believe, I think Matt has not seen the end of his Survivor life. (Have to remember how EPMB loves him some irony, and wouldn't it be funny if the one that is so bad at the game, could come back and win it? And, it would make Ralph's first confessional come to fruition as well....there's never been a dumb a$$ to win the game - not that I look at Matt as a dumb a$$, it's just he's calling himself dumb at Survivor...)
I see a foreshadowing of...Phillip vs. Ashley, Phillip vs. Steve, but most importantly Rob vs. Matt. I see Andrea as a tool for Matt to help take down Rob. I don't know if all of this editing is created to make us feel like Rob is in jeopardy of losing this game, or if it's misdirection, to create doubt that he can win. Time will tell.
I also want to say, we all know that I'm a big Robfadda fan. But, I have never been convinced 100% that he would win. I am open to others winning. But, let's face it, so far I haven't been sold on anyone rising to his level in this game. I am not convinced that they will, but I do see the editing manipulating some things, so the doubt can be cast...can't wait to see what everyone else thinks.
Rob's downfall in this game, if he has one, may be his severe focus on end game, just as it was RussHell's one achilles heel...
I agree with Krautboy, if Rob wants to win this game he needs to turn on the charm and wily, fun ways to endear those that will make up the jury....can he do it?

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-16-11, 11:57 AM (EST)

121. "Fantasy Games"

Something about Survivor does encourage players to play out fantasy analogy games as strategy. We see it this season as Rob is once again in Godfather mode (successfully this time, at least so far) and Phillip is in whatever Government Agent game he understands. We've seen this plenty of times, Coach in his Warrior game, Skupin the mighty Hunter. It's modus operandi that can win in the end, Fabio the surfer goofball made it work.
One thing about Godfather mode that may get overlooked, but I think Rob does get it, there is a certain charity or largesse that goes along with that. Gifts to good soldiers should be part of it, but generosity to unfortunates is there as well. So, if Grant wants to eat, he's a big boy and a good soldier. Julie has a tougher situation in real life than Ralph or Steve, maybe we can afford to let her have a bigger payday than Ralph or Steve.
If Rob is into Godfather mode simply as power structure he's doing the power trip alone, without the charity he's missing a key component.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-17-11, 06:23 PM (EST)

125. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

FP, I like that Rob is showing a bit of the Russell edit. I wrote in Fanatics that Rob is doing everything that Russell did well (ie controlling his tribe) but nothing that Russell did wrong. Galu hated Russell because he called himself a genius. Zapatera is calling Rob a genius. Huge difference. Even if he is not charming, he's already made a good impression on the jurors. More importantly, the edit has shown it.
Now, what I like the most about the Rob/Russell comparison is that, if Rob wins, especially if he beats his Natalie, it will shut up Russell forever about a flawed game. Of course, if the reverse is true, we'll never hear the end of it but I'm a gambling man and I like the odds!

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television 282 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
04-19-11, 11:56 AM (EST)

157. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

I'm not able to match the in-depth analysis of some of the incredible posters here, but I just wanted to say that I have the same impression as you about Rob's edit, Michel. The thing that's interesting to me about this season is that they seem to be sending mixed messages with regards to Rob, Phillip, and Matt especially.
In the last episode, as noted, Rob had the arrogant Godfather comments, which could lead to someone's downfall (Randy's 'I'm the king of Gabon' comes to mind among countless examples) or could foreshadow a victory (Brian, Earl, etc). What makes me think it's more the latter is that they put in that other confessional of Rob's, about wanting his tribe to be arrogant but not him, because he wants the jury votes. It showed the balance between behind the scenes manipulation and perception of the players/jury.
But Phillip is an interesting case. He put forth a few times that he's onto Rob, he wants to take Rob down, and in the last episode, suggested that it's not time to make his move yet. It was interesting that they let him have the 'last word' with this comment, as it came after Rob's confessional about being in control. That would normally make me think that Rob's up for a fall, but the way they've set up Phillip's character as a complete joke, ala Coach (with even more obvious mockery at the question mark around 'former federal agent') makes me think that his 'plan' is going to fall flat on it's face, and might consist of a rambling, amusing speech at FTC that convinces no one. Especially since the pre-merge story arc was Phillip being an outsider, a loose cannon, that Rob slowly worked on and then got into the fold, with the end of the last pre-merge episode showing him content with his tribe on the volcano.
Matt - I thought his story was over after the second vote-off, but I was perplexed by the heavy underdog edit he still got at RI. The next episode will say alot about him, but he seems like the only real threat right now, editing-wise, to Rob.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-19-11, 12:11 PM (EST)

159. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

Nice observations, television. Yes, we are getting mixed signals. It has been a very straightforward booting order but maybe we are in for a surprise or two down the road.
As for Matt, someone pointed to me that the sun was setting on the statue when we accompanied Matt to RI, meaning that it was the end of his story. That's a possibility but it could be simply because the setting sun makes for a nicer picture. We'll see.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-16-11, 06:29 PM (EST)

122. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

I see that Rob's style has attracted some comments. It's nice to see you in here Krauboy but I told you Phillip was here to stay!

Here are my thoughts on this episode.

Previously, on Survivor, we were told that Matt seized the moment and would re-enter the game.
As Matt’s stay on Redemption Island came to an end, the tribes were merged but Matt was unsure about sticking to the tribe that voted him out or making a brand new alliance.
Rob and the former Ometepe tribe had a narrow advantage at 6 to 5 but Ralph, from the former Zapatera tribe had a hidden immunity idol that could be used to even things out.
At the immunity challenge, the situation improved for Rob when his closest ally won.
< “Natalie wins the first individual immunity”>
When he finally got all the original Ometepe tribe members on his side, he was back in complete control.
<Matt told us he didn’t want to flip but relied on God’s will to go far>
At Tribal Council, Rob was thrilled when Ralph played an immunity idol he should have kept and Matt trusted Rob again and paid the price: A second blindside.
We heard once more Jeff saying that forgiveness wouldn’t be on Matt’s mind as the camera turned to Rob.
The recap turned the season almost completely into the story of Matt versus Rob and Jeff’s last words were a warning to Rob. Once more Ralph was shown making a mistake even if his move was the right thing to do. Natalie’s immunity win was turned mostly into a good thing for Rob as if it won’t help her down the line.
This episode could have been titled:
Instilling Fear
Redemption Island
As we moved to RI, we revisited the statue of Jesus on top of the hill. So, contrary to what we thought at the end of the previous episode, the editors are telling us that God is still on Matt’s side.
Matt: “First and foremost, I’d like to congratulate myself on being the most naïve person to ever play the game of Survivor. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me…I can’t believe I got blindsided twice by the same people. I feel like a moron. It feels like the biggest practical joke that is being played right now.”
Matt’s scene ended with his talk to God.
Murlonio
Day 22
Mike said that it was a very smart play by them.
David corrected him: “Don’t say them.”
Mike understood: “Yeah! By Rob…”
David: “It was straight mob-style.”
Mike: “He eliminated the wild-card.”
David: “I thought last night’s move by Rob was genius. This was like a hit straight out of mob movie: The guy comes back; there’s a little question about whether or not you can trust him but you just welcome him back in, you pat him on the back you sit down and have dinner with him then you go out to the fishing boat and you kill him.”
This said as everyone on Ometepe, Phillip in particular, showed they were happy to receive that pat on the back from Rob!
When Rob came by, Mike congratulated him.
Rob simply thanked him and walked away.
Mike then added it was part of the game.
Julie repeated: “Poor kid. That was cold-blooded, man.”
Julie: “For them to send Matt back to Redemption Island, that was cold-blooded. It’s a game but do you have any feelings at all for a human being? …So, with people like that playing the game, there’s no breaking that barrier. That’s how we feel right now: There’s no breaking their loyal shield.”
Note that Julie’s confessional started with an image of Andrea climbing in the shelter with Rob’s help and, as it went on, we had a shot of her sitting next to “Superman” Rob and Natalie. It told me that, if Rob received all the credit for the move, he shared a lot of the blame with Andrea.
The next scene showed Ralph asking Ashley if he was on the chop block.
At first, she didn’t understand him but then said she didn’t know.
Ralph said: “If you are in the top three, I’ll definitely vote for you and not Boston Rob.”
Ralph: “Since we merged, we have no control. It’s very aggravating. I have no clue what’s going on. How can we play a game when we don’t know where to start?”
In an episode that was supposed to be so full that we couldn’t waste time seeing the introductions, it was strange to have that little scene where Ralph promised his vote to Ashley. Unless he actually does vote for her in the end.
Rob told his group that they would do the “buddy system”: Nobody talks to anyone on their own.
Rob: “Voting Matty out last night accomplished one main goal: That was bringing the Ometepe tribe much closer together. I have a whole vision that I am trying to put into action here: Keep an “us versus them” mentality; the separate shelter, the separate eating times. I want my group to hate Zapatera. It’s us versus them and we are better than them and we are going to be arrogant about it and we are going to show it. I’m not but I want them to because I want their votes at the end of the day.”
Great plan but Rob would show his arrogance as the episode went on. His confessional reminded me that someone from his tribe already told us she liked the Zapateras as people: Ashley said so during the previous Tribal Council. Will that get her their votes at the end of the day?
We then had another quite superfluous scene: Natalie told Rob that Ralph had promised his vote to Ashley and that Ashley had told Natalie she wasn’t going to tell Rob about it.
Rob thanked Natalie for her honesty.
Rob (in confessional): “Natalie just told me that Ralph approached Ashley and said that, if she makes it to the top three, then he’s voting for her. He’s doing that so that Ashley makes a case for him tonight. He may have voted himself out anyway. “You ain’t going to vote for me Ralph? Well, you ain’t going to vote for Ashley ‘cause she ain’t going to be there now. It’s your fault, Ashley, you could have made it to the end but you decided not to tell me anything. You have to tell me everything. It’s my game; I’m in charge.”
This is another example of the mob style. Not only did it highlight Rob’s arrogance but it also portrayed Natalie as a snitch. Almost out of the blue, Ashley is portrayed as a player who is making jury connections. If something happens to rid her of the spa girl stigma, we may have to look at her differently…
The Challenge
There was something that I found extremely weird before the challenge started: When Phillip was talking about his meditation, we turn to Grant and we see and clearly hear (the sound had to have been amplified) a fly bothering Grant. I’m sure it was a wink at the fly that “eliminated” Mike from the previous challenge but why show it “attacking” Grant? Especially since Grant was going to win this challenge. Will a fly in the ointment derail Grant’s game?
Phillip explained his feather to Jeff and said things were “looking good for the “otempo” tribe.
(Phil does have rhythm!)
David and the other Zapateras rolled their eyes.
Jeff had a nice exchange with Natalie as he took back the necklace.
The camera was squarely on Rob as Jeff said that the person voted out would go to Redemption Island where Matt was anxiously waiting.
An interesting point to note is that we were never shown the players left out of the second round as if we weren’t supposed to see them as losers. Those players included all 3 Ometepe girls and Phillip.
Grant won all three rounds and went directly to Rob for the celebratory hug.
Murlonio
Day 22
Mike: “Today’s immunity challenge was so close…It’s going to be one of the five of us unless we can pull a miracle… We’ve tossed around the idea to see if we could woo some of the Ometepe tribe but Rob’s got them under such lockdown. He’s like the prison guard.”
To those that think Ometepe will eventually overturn Rob, I’d point to this scene where once again, Grant was the one pictured sharing congratulations with Rob and then the whole tribe joined in. The message was clear: Ometepe is a cohesive tribe.
While we heard his confessional, we saw Mike noticed that the tribe’s flagpole had been moved. Figuring it could be a clue to a Hidden Idol, he started digging with David.
Rob noticed the other faction digging so he assembled his troops and they started digging also while David said: “Let’s screw with them.”
David: “ …Mike and I decided to look under the flag. We thought that maybe an idol had been placed there but the Mariano crime syndicate decided to get shovels... By that point in time we had pretty much come to the conclusion that there was nothing there.”
Mike: “…I think that, to some degree, Rob thinks that we may have found it before they were able to get back with the shovels.”
Rob: “Here’s the thing: I still can’t shake this idol paranoia. Idols are what killed me last time around and I’m still struggling with them. I know I have one idol but last night at Tribal, Ralph played his idol so I believe another idol could be in play. Tonight, we have to make a vote blind that could potentially cost me my Survivor life…This is one of those times in Survivor where you have to gamble.”
I wonder how long it took Rob to figure that, even if they played their idol, he could still play his and void any votes against him. So, was this left in just to create some suspense? The episode certainly needed something. Or was this scene meant to show a crack in Rob’s armor? Despite being called clowns by Mike, Ometepe would soon be the tribe laughing so we saw that the gamble paid off.
Rob assembled his tribe and asked who should be the target, pointing out they needed to send somebody that could beat Matty. Everyone agreed on that but they didn’t agree on the identity of the person to boot. Phillip wanted Ralph, the girls wanted Mike while Rob pointed out David strategic skills. They each grabbed their buddy (Rob/Grant, Andrea/Phillip and Ashley/Natalie) but the two girls had to go to the bathroom!
That has to qualify as the weirdest comment heard just before leaving camp!
Tribal Council
Jeff went straight to Phillip and his feather which had brought good luck to Grant.
Phillip told the story about his great-great-Grand-father, a full-blooded Cherokee, coming to him and telling him that it would happen this way, adding that the Ometepes would live long in Survivor lore.
Now that’s a new source for a spoiler!
David rolled his eyes.
Mike said it wasn’t fun to have zero options.
Julie said it was obvious who was at the bottom of the Ometepe tribe but that he had no idea.
Phillip looked on with interest.
Jeff asked who was on the bottom and David answered: “We think it’s Phillip.”
Phillip responded: “I enjoy being on the bottom if that’s where I am…I have a new family right now.”
Julie countered: “Matt thought you guys were his family too.”
Jeff liked that.
Ralph said: “If I’m here in the morning, I’ll push like the dickens. I might get a feather tomorrow, you never know.”
Phillip interjected: “It takes courage and determination and knowing when to hold your tongue to get a feather.”
Ralph said a whole bird could come falling down and he’d have a whole bunch of feathers.
Mike said that he thought the feather was as sign on Phillip’s insecurities: “He’s struggling to find himself.”
Phillip answered by giving his full résumé.
David interrupted: “Just give it up. You sound like a lunatic.”
Phillip: “You sound like a guy at the bottom of a cesspool, trying to get out of it.”
A drum roll ended that argument.
Steve: “Phillip never ceases to amaze me.”
Phillip: “Keep being amazed when I see you sail away.”
After sending Mike to Redemption Island, Jeff could only offer that the Zapateras had to keep digging to find a way in.
Murlonio
Night 22
In what reminded me of the treatment received by Rebecca Borman, we never saw Mike arriving at Redemption Island.
Rob greeted Phillip with a pat on the back telling him: “You ain’t at the bottom. You’re at the top with me.”
Rob: “…What I took from it, (tribal council) is that Phillip is slowly becoming a loyal soldier which is good for me. Even when faced with “you’re at the bottom” comments from the other tribe, he responded: “I love being at the bottom. I’m comfortable there” I’m very happy that Phillip is obeying and doing as he’s told and he’ll be rewarded for it. Phillip is not really crazy. He’s kinda playing crazy but he is a little crazy. Even this early, I’m thinking about my end game and the jury so, as far as Phillip and I go, Phillip’s at the top of my list. He’s my number one and that’s all he needs to know. Natalie and Phillip are coming to the final three with me.”
During that scene we heard Rob explaining to Phillip that he received votes because of frustration, the other tribe seeing that he was getting the best of them.
Rob’s confessional was the first mention of the final 3 that we envisaged back in episode # 4 through Natalie’s words. Now that we explicitly heard it spelled out, it makes me wonder if it will happen but we have to consider that it could just as well be a prophecy.
This interview gave Rob another connection to the final tribal council but it opened the door for Phillip to earn the big reward. Rob just said he will be rewarded! Now wouldn’t that be something if, out of frustration, he received the Zapatera votes to win the game. We have seen a move to vote for the worst on other reality shows…
Phillip in confessional the next morning after serving his tribe: “Everybody thinks that Phillip is naïve, Phillip is an idiot, Phillip is a crazy guy. This is a game. Everybody wants to stand at finals with a guy like me who has been polarizing, insulting. So, knowing Boston Rob the way I know him; he’s thinking who could I have stand next to me and who doesn’t look so pretty?”<The camera showed Rob first and then quickly went to Natalie.> “Phil Sheppard! I’m a smart guy, I’m a complex person and I got to make something happen but there is a time for that and now isn’t the time.”
Coming immediately after Rob’s confessional and with the insertion of Natalie’s face at the crucial moment when Phillip asked who Rob would like to have in the finals, the Final 3 of Rob, Natalie and Phillip becomes a distinct possibility. For one thing, it shows that Phillip isn’t interested in eliminating Rob. But will they both make the mistake of carrying someone that does look pretty?
The next segment started, quite ironically after Phillip’s last sentence, with Ralph saying: “Today is the day. I have to do something… Who’s gonna win the million? Rob.”
I cringed when I saw that juxtaposition of Phillip saying “now is not the time” and Ralph saying “today is the day”. Why? Because Ralph was the dumbass that started with everything; he had an alliance, an idol and was praised by his tribe mates. Phillip was the dumbass that started with absolutely nothing. We heard that a dumbass could win this thing from Ralph at the beginning, now the other dumbass is considering his Final 3 speech!
Ralph in confessional after talking to David who told him not to do anything stupid. “I’ve got to get this game on the road. Time’s a ticking. We’ve got to make some moves.”
Phillip was with his buddy Andrea, saying that a tribe that sticks together, ends together.
Ralph wanted to talk to them before Rob won the million.
Phillip wasn’t concerned: “We’re not here to talk about the game with you.”
Andrea joined in, saying: “We’d love to talk to you about your home and stuff like that.”
Phillip ended this by turning to Andrea: “Anyway, back to our conversation…”
She smiled.
David who had been watching, had a confessional: “When no one’s willing to play the game, it’s not a lot of fun. We’re here trying to hang as long as we can but there is no guarantee that I’m not already the next on the list.”
At that time we saw an insect trapped in the web that the spider had been spinning for a couple of episodes now. It confirmed that David was next on the menu…I mean list.
The Challenge
As they walked in, we saw Ashley’s reaction to the hamburgers but it was Phillip who agreed with Jeff that they looked good.
Quite surprisingly, faced with the individual decision of either eating or competing, everyone except Phillip and Steve opted to compete. This tells us two things: First, Rob is really controlling his tribe because no one, except the “crazy” guy, ran the risk of upsetting him. Second, the spa girl edit got a little more removed from the Ometepe girls, especially in light of the result. Andrea, who was isolated at the end of the line, looked on with surprise, maybe even concern, on her face that her “friends”, her eventual rivals, had chosen to compete.
Rob, despite Phillip encouraging him with his mouth full, was the first to fall off.
We then saw that 20 minutes and 5 Burgers had elapsed.
(I love it when the editors show some humor!)
Julie, Grant and Ralph fell one after the other.
After 45 minutes, David had enough.
Andrea turned to the other two girls and said: “I’d really want this one. If there is another one…”
Natalie: “Do we let go, Ash?”
Ashley agreed and they both went in the pool.
Murlonio
Day 24
Rob: “A win is always important; I never want to lose. I always want to have an edge. I don’t want the Zapatera people to have immunity, to have any kind of momentum. I don’t want them to feel like they have any kind of power. So, as long as someone from our side wins, I’m going to be happy at this point.”
This ties in nicely to the respect of the game comment made by Russell and showed the difference between Rob and the Zapateras. I noted that Andrea wasn’t given the opportunity to tell us how she felt after winning the challenge. That makes it a win for Team-Rob.
Ralph then realized that the tide had brought in the net with all sorts of fish caught in it.
Rob walked after them, saying: “If they are dead, you can’t eat them.”
Julie: “Rob is telling his people that the fish isn’t any good. I think that Rob doesn’t want his people to take anything from us. Now, if Rob were to catch all that fish; that would have been a different story. They’d be feasting over there. ”
Just then we saw three baby birds, their beaks wide open, waiting to be fed but their mother didn’t give them anything. 3 little birds? 3 Ometepe girls? Rob not leaving them any votes?
Rob: “Here’s the thing: I’m running the tribe like the army. I’m the general, they are soldiers and they are all doing as they are told which is a wonderful thing.”
Grant after being lured into taking a piece of fish: “There’s no food here so I’ll eat anything no matter what Rob says. I’m my own man, I make my own decisions. I don’t think there’s a dictatorship going on.”
As far as Declarations of Independence go, we have heard better!
David: “The Ometepe tribe was told not to eat the fish. I don’t know if Rob wants to keep them weak or if he just wants to maintain control over them. It’s cult like. He showed the power that he has by just instilling fear into everyone over the whole Matt situation. If you show any inclination that you are wavering in your loyalty, he’ll just cut your head off, then and there. So nobody is going to cross him.”
This confessional sounded like the key moment of the episode. David laid it all in front of us, leaving us with only one question to answer: Will Rob maintain his control?
Rob: “What it comes down to tonight is David or Steve? Do I eliminate what I consider the biggest strategical threat in the game right now or I give the old guy what he wants. I think he wants to go home and getting rid of Steve, it might get me a jury vote. I’ve been known to have a mercy killing in me from time to time, haven’t I?”
Tribal Council
Phillip introduced us to a glorious operation called “Stealth R Us”.
Phillip went on: “I am known as the Specialist. My principal responsibilities: Infiltrate and supplant inceptions in the Zapatera tribe. We have here Boston Rob: The Mentalist. He develops strategies for challenges and to develop strategic alliances that are impervious. Where is Grant? He is The Destroyer of Aspirations, better known as The Assassin. Principal responsibilities: Go out and compete, destroying any competitor. And I forgot to mention the Three Degrees who are highly effective, formidable, agile and have supreme abilities to focus their mind like they did today.”
Jeff could only say: “Wow! Ralph, pretty tough to beat Stealth R Us.”
Ralph: “Did his grand-father tell him to sit on the bench and eat hamburgers today?”
Jeff turned it around: “The argument would be: Does Stealth R Us care?”
Phillip: “Yes, it was difficult for them to see me do that but they know where my heart is. Today, I ate. I make no apologies for that.”
Steve said he chose to eat because he knew the challenge wasn’t for him.
Phillip told Jeff: “We have the buddy system and it is highly effective.”
Julie explained: “They are never alone, ever. They’re always with somebody else. Rob has complete control over them. It’s not even a tribe, it’s a cult.”
David told Jeff that he didn’t really see it as anybody but me: “With the numbers as they are here, it’s virtually insurmountable. The other phase of the game, Redemption Island, may be a better tactic to try and advance yourself that way.”
When David walked away, Ashley turned to Rob and said: “And then there were three.” Then the camera showed her sitting in the middle of Natalie, Rob and Phillip.
That image certainly made me wonder: Of course she meant the 3 remaining Zapateras but were the editors already thinking ahead to the Final 3 instead?!
Game Analysis
At this stage of the story, we can start to make projections on what the players should do to get to the end but such an exercise is always perilous. This episode certainly brought Rob’s arrogance and the need to overturn him to the forefront. However, the two possible defectors, Phillip and Andrea, were shown totally embracing the buddy-system. With the numbers the way they are, two Ometepes could join the 3 Zapateras to change the game but that would leave them at the mercy of the trio once they eliminate their former tribe mates and it would kill their chances of earning votes. Three Ometepes could wait until there are 2 Zapateras left but here is where the fear that Rob instilled comes into play. Revealing a plan to overthrow Rob would most likely be brought to the “general’s” attention as we saw when Ashley didn’t tell him about her conversation with Ralph.
A Women’s Alliance could form if Julie is the last Zapatera standing. That Final 4 would certainly work well with Phillip’s comment that he would outlast any man on Zapatera but that the women would be for another day. However, Natalie seems the stumbling block here, being determined to make her moves with Rob and not against him as we saw in this episode.
The Assassin could show he is his own man by turning on Rob but we haven’t seen him talking to anyone else but Rob. He has no connection with the other players and, as far as showing free will, taking one bite of fish didn’t convince me that Grant will suddenly become an impact player.
The Specialist has cut his bridges with Zapatera. It took him over 21 days to be accepted into the Ometepe fold and it would need that much time to convince any remaining Zapatera to trust him especially after telling them his mission is to infiltrate them. Anyway, Phillip told us the time wasn’t right and he seems certain that Rob is his ticket to the end.
Editing Analysis
I much rather go with what we are shown and build on that. Luckily for us, the smart guy, David, told us exactly what could happen and what his thoughts on the situation are. It really all comes down to two options: Will Rob keep his tribe under control or is it a better tactic to advance by going to Redemption Island?
David himself, told us he didn’t think anyone would risk getting their head chopped off by turning on Rob so if we go with that, the question becomes: Who can beat him in a final vote? If there is something that is more perilous than doing game analysis it is trying to figure out how a jury would vote. For that, I also like to use what the editors told us because, in the end, the viewer will have to understand why the winner received the votes.
If it is better to advance by making the trip to Redemption Island who could return and win the game? Let’s look at these characters first.
Ralph, Julie and Steve: All three seem destined to go to RI soon and, to be honest, none have the story to impact the game. Ralph showed a lot of promise at first but that was all tied into his battle with Russell. There has been nothing for him since then. In fact, he has been continued to be portrayed as a Dumb Player, playing an idol he should have kept.
Grant: If he goes to RI, the Assassin would be a formidable opponent as we heard it was his principal responsibility to destroy the other competitors. For certain, if Grant makes it to the final 3, he would win. It’s almost impossible to consider that someone would team up with Grant to overthrow Rob and then have time to beat Grant before the Final 3. More importantly, Grant has no end-game connection and has very little substance outside of his assassin persona.
David: For a while, the repetition of the “David is good at puzzles” line made me think he could be the one that returns from Redemption Island but that story came to a halt when Grant destroyed him in the puzzle challenge. Also, the girls showed he could be beaten in endurance challenges. David was a character that was useful in telling us what was happening. He was smart enough to see the game but he wasn’t given enough substance in the early part of the season to compete with the big guys that are presently on Redemption Island.
Mike: He had substance from the start of the season but he evolved into a simple narrator for the most part of the season. We heard him say that he wanted to go toe-to-toe against Rob so that made me think that he’d be the one returning. If he does, he will be a formidable opponent to beat late in the game, when an immunity run is easier to accomplish. However, we didn’t see his arrival at Redemption Island and, even when David was shown arriving later on, we only really saw Matt. Ignoring Mike was very damaging for his chances.

Matt: When Matt returned, defeated, to Redemption Island, I thought he’d never bounce back but the editors re-connected him to his story of wanting to be closer to his Savior by showing us the giant Jesus statue at the start of the episode. I had to change my opinion. I think that Matt will return to the game and he could very well be our winner. We have been shown that Rob controls the game as well as anyone before but we heard that he has trouble with new twists so maybe that is the story of the season: Rob would have won if it hadn’t been for this new facet of the game. Matt certainly has the substance that makes a winner’s edit. He’d fit perfectly into the theme of the season, being the one that would have defeated both Russell and Rob.
The Loyal Soldiers
These players, most likely, would have to beat Rob during the final vote.
Andrea: She could reach the Final Tribal Council with Rob or by voting him out. However, the only way she told us about her end game was by going with Matt. So, if this is her story, to join Matt who, despite what Jeff said, would forgive her, then she would lose that vote to the “poor kid”.
With Rob, she has no connection to the jury. In fact, we saw her explicitly turning down Ralph’s offer to talk about the game and we know that Zapatera considered her close to Matt so, when she betrayed him, she betrayed them also. We didn’t hear anything from Andrea in an episode where she really needed a new chapter to her story. Winning the challenge was the only positive note that she received in this episode so I doubt that Andrea can win in the end.
Natalie: Of Rob’s soldiers, she seems to be the most devout follower. We heard her telling Rob about her best friend’s action, snitching to him what Ralph had told Ashley. Her challenge performances have compensated for the lazy girl edit and hearing Phillip say that Rob should want someone not so pretty to confront during the vote could be interpreted as a warning that Rob, like Russell with his Natalie, could underestimate her.
Ashley: For some reason, we had to hear her making a connection with Ralph for something as crucial as a jury vote. That was an odd editing decision to include in an episode where Ralph wasn’t voted out. More importantly, it was the third time that we saw Ashley making connections with the other side after being part of the Christian coalition with Mike and Matt and saying at Tribal Council that she liked the Zapateras. Her comment “then there was three” could also indicate that she is in the final three with Rob and either Natalie or Phillip. Her own challenge performance redeems partly her lazy girl edit. If she is in the Final 3 in Natalie’s place, it would explain why we heard her confessionals during rewards and why she complained so much about Phillip since she’d have to see him until day 39. Can Ashley win? This episode made a case for her which is really troubling for those that like consistent stories.
Phillip: It both scares me and makes me laugh to consider that Phillip could have a winner’s edit. Twice now we heard he could be an actor so why not show an academy award worthy performance at FTC? The reason why the editors made a medaled veteran look stupid could be because they knew he’d have the last laugh. There’s absolutely no way that Phillip was supposed to make the merge but he told us he’d outlast any man on Zapatera and he’s well on his way to do just that. So, when we say that there is absolutely no way Phillip could earn votes in the Final Tribal Council, we have to consider that he could get them out of frustration just like Rob explained why he received elimination votes. Voting for the worst? It could come down to that.
Rob: Normally, when we see this much arrogance, we know a player is about to take a big fall, that he cannot have a winning edit. However, I believe that there is no such thing as A winner’s edit. Winners have come in so many different forms, from the almost invisible to the hero-like figure that there isn’t a single recipe to create a winner’s story. Each season, the winner has to fit the themes of that particular season. And, if Matt fits in well, so does Rob.
If we look at Rob’s story, we can see that it is shaping up a lot like Russell’s in Samoa. We heard David saying that he controls his tribe by weakening it, we heard the same confidence in confessional that we heard from Russell. Of course, you will object that Russell didn’t win Samoa but I will counter that the editors still portrayed him as close to a winner as they could. They left very little to Natalie, only letting us hear that she planned on using Russell and showing her making connections with Galu. Here, who was heard saying they planned on using Rob? Natalie and Phillip but neither was making those jury connections. Ashley was the one making the connections but we’ve never heard her plan to use Rob.
In a sense, this season is edited as if many players could win. Some fit the Natalie White mold (Natalie and Ashley) some, the Sandra mold (Andrea), some fit JT’s mold of good guys making incredible come-backs (Mike and Matt) and one fits in the “I can’t believe this just happened” mold (Phillip) but only one fits in the mold of the leader that knows what it takes to get to the end. Game Theory tells us that a leader is likely to win when there are many followers and you can’t have a better situation for a leader than when a tribe is edited as being cult-like.
This season is coming down to a showdown between Rob and the Redemption Island Returnee which seems most likely to be Matt. Just re-watch the recap of this episode to be convinced. With God on his side, we should root for Matt as Russell told us to do but I’ll stick with Rob’s story being the winning one.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-16-11, 08:30 PM (EST)

123. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

Wow, michel. I am thrilled to see that you and I picked up on alot of the same things via the editing. I, too, felt Matt was destined to be outed after his boot episode, but, like you, felt strongly with the giant Jesus statue that was shown, and noting the down turn in Rob's edit, along with the continuing religious symbolism, that it will indeed be Matt and Rob at the end. So happy that you saw the same thing!
Also, I also feel that Andrea will not win. I also noted that "then there were three" quote from Ashley, as she sat next to Rob, but I did notice that Rob sat next to Natalie...Nat, Rob, Ash...? final three.
In the end, I also cannot see anyone's game rising to the level that Rob has played this one. And, SOOOO many tweets from Jiffy noting how Rob has played this game...still, with the editing, the casual viewer will believe Rob is doomed.
Thanks for an excellent take on the episode. I see alot of what you do, and, I might add, it makes me happy!
Geez....I sure hope that Phillip is not the dumba$$ that wins the game....eek!

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
04-17-11, 05:58 PM (EST)

124. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

I pretty much agree with your assessments michel.
One thing of note with Matt that didn't get mentioned after his second boot -- during the bible study with Mike, Mike talked about Jesus going by himself to the desert for 40 days. I think everyone familiar with that story knows that it includes the fact that Jesus was fasting & praying for those 40 days. He also defeated the devil during that time (by not giving in to temptation).
When Mike talked about that during the episode I didn't make any connection, but after Matt was booted again I did. Why include that part of the bible study talk between Matt & Mike if not to draw an analogy of RI to Jesus' foray into the desert? The shot of the statute of Jesus at the beginning of this last episode & then Matt "praying" isolated on RI reinforced that for me.
Thus, at this point, I think Matt is coming back (again) from his isolation at RI. He's probably going to win (defeat Rob as Jesus did the devil) too.
If, for some reason, I'm wrong about Matt & he gets eliminated from RI, then the *only* other possible winner based on the edit, IMO, is Rob. To me, no one but Rob & Matt have enough "story" to be the winner.

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Round Robin 2914 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest"
04-18-11, 02:45 AM (EST)

126. "RE: EP9 Godfather edit"

FloPo hit the nail right square on the head in talking about Rob getting the RussHell edit. The difference is that Rob is better at playing RussHell than RussHell himself was. Rob is every bit as arrogant as RussHell was, but the difference is that Rob is conscious of his own fallibility, whereas RussHell thought he could do no wrong. I think Rob is too endgame-focused as RussHell was, and I think he will lose because of it, but at least Rob has a chance and will probably get a couple votes if he makes final TC, and the little chrome dome gnome was lucky to get the 2 votes he got against his Natalie. If Rob continues to get this Godfather edit, I think it will foreshadow him getting "plugged in the barber's chair", not winning the game.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 11:37 AM (EST)

127. "Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-18-11 AT 11:41 AM (EST)
Andrea's edit, even if it is very thin, isn't bad but I don't think it is enough to lead her to victory. Her story is manipulated to make us think that she could eventually make a big move as Pepe, BrownRoach and Dabo suggested in the ECST

For big moves, we know what Andrea wants to do: ""The talk is 'Oh, we're 5, we're 5!', I'd really like to get rid of Natalie and Ashley before Phillip, but I can't line that up without putting myself on the chopping block."
Andrea wants to impress Rob, her island Daddy, and take the place of his other two daughters. If she's afraid to line that up, how will she line up a vote against Rob?
The thing is, Matt proposed to line it up for her in this scene:
Matt: "I'm going after Rob..."
Andrea, "OH! My God! Aba wabba wabba...!!!"
Matt, "Okay, just stop! Just calm down. This game respects big moves."
Then, for her big move, she sided with Rob.
Even in this episode we saw her reaction at the second challenge when Jeff asked the players to reveal their decision:
That worried look on her face clearly told us she was hoping to impress Rob by participating in the challenge but that she was sure the other two spa girls would choose to eat the burgers. She just realized she had missed an opportunity. The funniest thing is that she'd win a place in Rob's F3 by being lazy, not by winning challenges!
Why the manipulation? Two possible reasons:
- She could stumble into a coup d'état if Matt returns again but then doesn't that make Matt our winner?
- Her fighting spirit, as small as it is, was all they had to cast doubt on Rob's dominance.
Because I hate the RI twist, I'll stick with this season being Rob's redemption.

Thanks to fat little fingers at Sucks for the funny Andrea impersonation in transcription.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 12:06 PM (EST)

128. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-18-11 AT 01:16 PM (EST)
LOL on the "impersonation."
The point is that Andrea has kept her head in the game, is thinking strategy, and is in position where she might be able to do something to improve her position in the game. Or do nothing, or crash and burn.
Rob has made it clear to his troops that he doesn't care right now so much who wins immunity as long as Zapatera doesn't, this is part of the campaign to thoroughly demoralize the Zapatera. Anyway, Andrea incorporated herself into Rob's troops when it was advantageous for her to do so, that's where she is at the moment.
I have to take exception to the "interpretation" of that look as her looking for Daddy's approval or whatever. Amusing, but that is just your take on it, and I don't believe it is supported by her edit. There's a simpler explanation that does fit her head-in-the-game edit, assessing the competition.
ETA: You know, it's the funniest thing, she's on the end of the front row, Rob's on the same end of the back row behind her to her right, she's not even looking in his direction.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 02:08 PM (EST)

134. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-18-11 AT 02:33 PM (EST)
I know it is my interpretation but look at the scene again and you'll see it is supported by the edit: As soon as they arrive, the camera focuses on Natalie and Ashley as they see the burgers. Ashley's reaction in particular is equivalent to Lamber in Australia whenever someone gave her food: "OMG!"
Then, as soon as Jeff asks for the reveal of the stone, the camera, after showing Steve's surprise decision, focuses again on Natalie and Ashley who, also surprisingly, chose to compete. Then, immediately we see Andrea looking in their direction thus expressing the audience's surprise.
This gets confirmed in an Insider Clip where Andrea said she wanted to prove herself after her bad performances in earlier challenges.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:39 PM (EST)

139. "RE: Andrea's edit"

So I'm right, she was thinking of the competition, assessing her chances.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 02:47 PM (EST)

143. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Yes, but what I see as the important point was that she was sure she wouldn't have to compete against the lazy girls. Her case would have been so much easier if she could have said: "I was the only girl on your side to compete, Rob". Instead, she had to beg for the win thus diminishing the value of her victory.
OK, the word beg is provocative but I'm glad we have revitalized the discussion!

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-19-11, 11:37 AM (EST)

156. "RE: Andrea's edit"

A less tortuous view is that she wanted to win immunity not to impress Rob but to make sure he couldn't turn around and vote her out. She is after all aware that Matt dragged her into the picture when he was spilling his guts to Rob.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-19-11, 12:39 PM (EST)

161. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-19-11 AT 12:43 PM (EST)
Her Insider Clip tells us she wanted to prove herself because she had done poorly before. She doesn't mention she felt in danger.
ETA: James Barber's transcript of her clip:
"I could've been eating cheeseburgers today, but fortunately I decided to do the challenge, and then I won immunity, which feels awesome."
"I didn't go in thinking I needed to win, because I don't. I'm safe - I mean as safe as you can feel on Survivor. I also wanted to kind of prove myself because I did really bad on the first immunity challenge. As soon as I found out what it was, I got determined, like, you know what? I'm gonna win this."
"It was very much a group feeling too. I would have been happy if anyone from Ometepe won today. I'm really happy it was me, but I would have been just as happy if anyone else did."
"It's more that now Ometepe has complete control over the votes. We can decide who goes home and don't have to worry about David winning or someone else sneaking by."
"I was not surprised Phillip sat out and ate cheeseburgers. Later he said it was his knee problems and he didn't want to hang upside down, it wasn't about the food. But of course it was about the food for Phillip. I was not surprised."
"Steve sat out and ate cheeseburgers, and I actually wasn't surprised either, because he's suffering the most out here, because he's a big guy used to eating all these meals. You can tell the lack of nutrition is getting to him. So when I found out he was sitting out that kind of didn't surprise me either."
"I don't know where Steve's heart is in this game."
"Sitting out today was kind of like, OK, are you even playing? You could go home tonight. You need to get immunity more than anyone from Ometepe was. You kind of wonder if he was really into this game if he sat out.
"Ometepe hasn't discussed who we're voting out yet, but I think David should go, now that we have him without an immunity idol, and without individual immunity, because he's doing really well in the immunity challenges, he's smart, he's probably the most strategic player on their tribe. I would get David out, while we can."

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-19-11, 01:12 PM (EST)

165. "RE: Andrea's edit"

"It was very much a group feeling too. I would have been happy if anyone from Ometepe won today. I'm really happy it was me, but I would have been just as happy if anyone else did."
Well that makes the whole discussion of the vidcap kind of pointless, doesn't it?
In any case, nowhere does she say she wanted to win in order to impress Rob.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-19-11, 03:58 PM (EST)

169. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I guess you missed the part where she begged the other girls to let her win. That line is just another example that she's a good little soldier/daughter.
Who would she be proving herself to if not Rob? Herself? She doesn't mention that either but if it was, it's pretty stupid because most players want to appear weak at this stage. The only reason to prove yourself is in case they get down to a Samoa-type F5 where Natalie had to convince Russell that it was better to keep her instead of Jaison.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 05:01 PM (EST)

173. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I think she wanted to win just in case Rob decided to cut her loose. It shows she does not feel completely comfortable in the alliance which points to her jumping ship at some point. I can't understand how the other girls letting her win proves anything to Rob or anyone else. She wanted to be sure she was safe, that's all.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 05:44 PM (EST)

176. "RE: Andrea's edit"

That's not what she said in her Insider clip.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 06:01 PM (EST)

178. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Thanks for bringing that to my attention. I had not read that transcript (and as I looked back at this conversation I noticed that you edited in the transcript of it in a previous post - thanks!) Clearly, you are right in that she won in order to prove something. I still don't think she was trying to prove anything to Rob. I think she was trying to prove something to herself. Or even family back home.

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 12:21 PM (EST)

129. "RE: Andrea's edit"

What flavour of Koolaid do you have there? That is a rather harsh dismission of someone, wouldn't you say?
The funniest thing is that she'd win a place in Rob's F3 by being lazy, not by winning challenges!
But Natalie won a challenge as well...

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 02:13 PM (EST)

135. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Harsh dismission? I don't see it that way. I'm just looking at a very thin edit that many see as a winner's edit but I have doubts. That's all. I simply like to explain those doubts.
Rob told us he wants the 20-21 year olds to do nothing around camp and that's what he wants from the people who would sit next to him. Andrea wants to show she's a worker. Wrong plan. She'd win a vote over Natalie and Ashley but she needs to get there first.

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:31 PM (EST)

138. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I think it's worth remembering that there will be a lot of Zapateras on the jury -- and most of the Zaps would respect those who work hard instead of sitting around all day.
So, if (a big if) Andrea makes it along with one of the other Ometepe girls with Rob (and let's say, not with Matt) in the final vote, who do you think most of the jury is going to vote for? Would they respect the 'godfather' who is leading a cult in their own words, or a lazy-azz girl ... or a girl who works around camp and hasn't been shown on camera (yet) to have done a single thing to alienate a Zapatera member?

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:40 PM (EST)

140. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I don't see how she makes it to F3 with Rob because that isn't her story at all but, if she does, Zapatera will vote for the genius. Why? Contrary to Guatemala, we haven't heard a peep about returning players not deserving to win. It doesn't seem to be a factor this season.
I also don't agree that Andrea has done nothing to alienate the Zapateras. From their perspective, she's responsible for their fall: By betraying Matt, she betrayed them. Also, she told Ralph that she only wanted to talk about his family, not the game. Ashley is making jury connections, not Andrea.
And as far as not talking game, I just realized that the Zapatera's complaint about Ometepe not wanting to play the game is the exact complaint that Krista and Stephanie made against the Zaps. Bad Karma is still present!

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:44 PM (EST)

142. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-18-11 AT 02:45 PM (EST)
I kind of agree with that. In order to get to F3 with Rob she has to throw Ashley and Natalie under the bus.
David might vote for Rob in the end but otherwise I think the Zaps are going to have a lot of resentment to heap on Rob.

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 03:07 PM (EST)

146. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-18-11 AT 03:13 PM (EST)
Ashley is probably ahead of Andrea on Rob's hit list now, after the Ralph "incident."
But either way I don't see Andrea and Rob together in the Final 3. I think the Final 3 is most likely Matt, Phillip and Andrea.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 03:11 PM (EST)

147. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I could definitely see that F3. And I definitely agree that Andrea and Rob won't both make it to the F3. I think after this next episode, we'll have a better idea of which of the RI folks could make it to the end (if any). I wouldn't rule out any of them. Mike has had a good edit as a likable guy and he had that early confessional that suggested he had a good story. After David's comment about using RI to get to the end instead of staying in the game, they could be preparing us for his return. And of course, Matt has had a great story that could lead to his return again. I am hoping we'll get some good information next episode that will point to one of them returning. (And of course, one of them will be eliminated!)

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 08:30 PM (EST)

150. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Agreed.
Although I think Natalie will be in the F3.
As you say, Corvis, all three of the current RI people have indications that they could return, which makes it difficult to pick this week. If Matt can make it through this one, I will like his chances to go all the way much better.
I do not think Rob will be in the F3, but he will be in the Finale. His presence in every episode will justify this season being the Rob show.
In Stephanie's return season, she got a positive edit pre-merge, and a bad edit once her alliance had the game in its hands.
Stephanie got tons of facetime. Danni's game ended up on the Insider. There is more than one precedent for a very thin edit for the winner. The other season where returning players each led a tribe is one of them.
The return of the Godfather edit is preparing his fans to understand why he won't win this season. First the editiors built him up and got his fans hooked, and now they are turning him into a Russell, only with more charm and humor. (Yes, I know that Estee would point out that it's easy to have more than zero.)
The reason the editing is skewed this season is because it was conceptualized around Rob vs. Russell. Russell fell out of it; Rob remained, and Rob delivered the quality camera bytes. It was going to be about Rob either way.
In All Stars, Rob had a very positive edit as the leader of Chapera. He won challenges, built furniture, made it a fun and functional tribe. His edit turned dark when he booted Lex and Kathy, and from then on, we saw the more unkind side of his nature.
In HvV, he never got to the individual game, so there was no turning point, and he came out of it, in Jeff's words, a redeemed Hero. Well that is all over now.
The reason I think he won't be in the finals, is there is too much set-up for someone to take him out and too much energy invested in the RI returnee. Plus I actually think he would get the votes standing against Phillip and Natalie. Therefore as he would win if he got to the Finals, unless he had the misfortune to get there with Grant, he doesn't quite make it, IMHO.
It is still possible that one of the men who got early strong development could be the winner. Matt, Mike, Rooster could conceivably end up on top. Otherwise it's going to be one of the girls (but not Ashley). It could even be a Natalie White repeat and be a Natalie Tenerelli win. Jeff does that same thing of singling her out and mentioning how impressed he is with her (on very thin grounds).

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 09:08 PM (EST)

151. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-18-11 AT 09:16 PM (EST)
OFG, you could be right and Rob could miss the F3 but you are wrong on Stephenie's Guatemala edit. She was negative from the start:
- When they lost the trek, she blamed Lydia.
- When Brianna didn't know what a pick was we had a confessional from Stephenie saying she was on a tribe of losers again.
- She did the same after they lost the tug-o-war challenge.
- When BJ had fun winning a challenge, she called him gay and retarded.
- When Danni invited them to her party, Steph said it would be an occasion to eat their chocolate.
- When Judd went off on Margaret, Stephenie was shown agreeing, even laughing. That gave birth to the "Axis of Evil" alliance. You can't have more negative than that.

There were others but this is just off the top of my head.
As for Rob's fall in A$$, Lex, Tom and Alicia were shown clearly angry with him. The Zaps are mostly impressed. And, as I remember, most Survivor fans thought the jury was lame, blaming Lex and Tom.
As for Jeff's praise of Natalie, I think it's because of the disappointment left after seeing Purple Kelly and NaOnka quitting.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 09:19 PM (EST)

152. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I agree, Andrea is safer right now than Ashley in Rob's pecking order. And probably Grant also when they get to F6. But she may not know that, that's the sort of thing Rob is keeping to himself (and confessional). From her perspective she may think she's the sixth wheel, perhaps fifth if someone royally screws something up. In order to improve her position with Rob, if that's what she wants, she may think she has to find a way to throw Ashley and Natalie under the bus together, both at the same time.

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 12:00 PM (EST)

158. "RE: Andrea's edit"

But she may not know that
Agree, she has no reason to think that. Ashley and Andrea may actually be equally low in Rob's hierarchy at the moment.
I don't sense that Andrea expects to improve her position with Rob. As ofg said, she is being compliant to avoid negative attention, probably hoping Rob will just stay on track and continue voting out the rest of the Zaps for the time being.
I don't see her as being the one to instigate the revolt against Rob down the line, but I do think she is prepared to get on board for it, no question.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 12:33 PM (EST)

160. "RE: Andrea's edit"

>I don't sense that Andrea expects
>to improve her position with
>Rob.
Then why did she compete? To impress the jury? If she eliminates Rob, it would be impressive in itself. Refusing to talk to Ralph showed she wasn't thinking jury, she was thinking: "Rob told us to turn them down, I'm turning them down."

>I don't see her as being
>the one to instigate the
>revolt against Rob down the
>line, but I do think
>she is prepared to get
>on board for it, no
>question.
Well, there is the question that she didn't take Matt's train. I know, that was his fault for talking too much except we heard her say in an Insider Clip that her role was to keep both Matt and Phillip in line. That's being the good little soldier. The show doesn't explicitly show that she's following Rob so maybe your interpretation is right but maybe mine is also and they don't show too much of her obedience to leave doubt that Rob can succeed.
I have another question: If she doesn't instigate it, who does? Phillip?!! Even so, it's still only two votes and Phillip dealing with Zapatera? I don't see that happening. Anyway, they'd be dumb to include Zapateras because of the jury numbers. Grant? The edit has shown nothing to indicate Grant would follow but, if he does, he wins so that's not good for Andrea. Natalie? That's the best way to kill a revolt. Ashley? Joining Phil? I'm sure you'd agree the editing hasn't prepared us for that!

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 01:19 PM (EST)

166. "RE: Andrea's edit"

If she doesn't instigate it, who does? Phillip?!!
Um, yes. Why not? He's talked about it enough.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 04:01 PM (EST)

170. "RE: Andrea's edit"

That makes 2 votes against 4 for Rob + an HII.
And Phillip is now thinking of being Rob's goat.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 12:36 PM (EST)

130. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I gotta say, I completely disagree with you about Andrea's edit.
I think she is being shown as the only one of the three Ometepe women who is playing a really smart game. I don't see her sycophantically sucking up to Rob at all, but rather keeping her head down, being smart and waiting for her opportunity. She is the one of the Ometepe (besides Phillip) who is shown as not being under Rob's sway, but carefully considering her options. Her island daddy, really? No way. That's not her story at all.
She was willing to do the big move with Matt, but then he blew it and threw her under the bus by telling Rob all about it! She got a confessional where she explained quite clearly her take on Matt's stupidity; sticking with Rob was her only option after Matt messed it up. And she smartly did what she had to do keep the target off her back.
She's being edited as a smart player and the fact that we're seeing her strategy as opposed to Ashley and Natalie makes her more likely to make it to the end than them, in my opinion.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 01:02 PM (EST)

131. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Exactly. She just needs to figure out what to do and pick her moment. Her best game is to play on Rob right now. That doesn't mean she's backing him all the way, it only means she's playing him. Phillip is playing Rob as well. Natalie is playing Rob also, and may actually be backing him all the way.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:20 PM (EST)

136. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-18-11 AT 02:23 PM (EST)
The Daddy comment comes from the "Family Final 4" method of analysing Survivor.
http://survivorsucks.com/topic/2413/Family-Final-Four
Rob is the father figure of Ometepe without a doubt and this picture showed us that all 3 Ometepe girls are fighting for his attention in order to survive:

ETA: Also note that, in the shelter scenes, Andrea is always right there, next to Rob. Isn't that showing a little girl needing comforting?

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:26 PM (EST)

137. "RE: Andrea's edit"

>ETA: Also note that, in the
>shelter scenes, Andrea is always
>right there, next to Rob.
>Isn't that showing a little
>girl needing comforting?
Remember what Tina Wesson said? "Always look to see who's sitting with whom to figure out who's tight in the game." That often tells you more about who the true alliances are than what the editors want you to believe.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:52 PM (EST)

144. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Exactly and Rob said the same during HvV.
Andrea wants to be with Rob. It certainly isn't a sign of an upcoming revolt.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 03:01 PM (EST)

145. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Thanks for the link. It's an interesting theory but it falls apart if you look at it closely. For instance, in Survivor 2, while the mother-son alliance was clear with Colby and Tina, neither Liz or Keith played daughter or father roles respectively in that foursome. The only fact that suggests this idea is their ages. In S3, Lex was never Ethan's father figure - they were more brothers if you have to use a family analogy.
As for that image of the birds looking to Rob for food, I think that's more applicable to the two mall girls and Grant than Andrea, who has been consistently edited to show that she is not following Rob blindly but because it's in her own best interests.
"Also note that, in the shelter scenes, Andrea is always right there, next to Rob. Isn't that showing a little girl needing comforting?"
Not at all. Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer. The only thing that suggests what you're putting out there is their genders. Rob is a man and Andrea is a woman. He's 14 years older than her - not even old enough to really be her father. I can see what you're saying maybe applying to the other two, but not Andrea. (And really with the other two, I think the cult leader, not the father figure is a more apt metaphor.)

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 03:41 PM (EST)

148. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Agree that it's more likely that the three birds waiting for the mother is an analogy to the three Ometepe "chicks" kowtowing to Rob ... but what if we thought outside of the box a bit and it refers to the three guys (Rob, Grant, Phillip) instead, chirping for food but the female figure (one of Andrea/Nat/Ashley) doesn't give it to them and runs off to win the F3 with one of the other girls and Matt as the other finalists?
A reach, I'm sure, but perhaps worth keeping on the back-burner.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 05:40 PM (EST)

149. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Corvis, it isn't my theory but, if you look, that page started in 2004 and people are still contributing to it. I've barely read a few pages,haven't contributed but, as I understand it, the basic tenet is that, under stress, people will revert to the traditional family structure as the most comfortable one. It explains why, often, an older woman goes much further than what we'd expect judging by her contribution.
If I remember correctly their premise is that the parental figure usually wins over the children. The siblings fight against each other but need to go to the end together in order to win. It certainly doesn't have 100% accuracy but it isn't bad.
On S2, Rodger was the father and Lis certainly was his daughter so we had a reconstitued family. Keith was always what they called the eccentric family member, the outsider.
I don't know how they broke down Africa but Lex did play like a father. MamaKim losing was an exception.
You stopped at S3 but S4 had Paschal as father, Kathy as mother while Vee, Sean and Neleh were the kids.
In Palau, Tom was the father figure, Ian, Kathy and Jenn the children and Caryn the mother.
The rest, I'll leave to anyone who wants to read that thread.
Although age is a factor, the player's role is what matters. As far as Survivor goes, Rob is Ometepe's father, Phil its crazy uncle.
Regarding the "keep your friend close, your enemy closer", Andrea never said it. What she did say was that she wanted to get back in the fold. She may change up the whole game and win it but that's not what I see up to now. I was expecting something to explain her vote against Matt but, not only she didn't speak, the recap didn't even touch on her turmoil. It was all Matt vs Rob.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 11:35 PM (EST)

153. "RE: Andrea's edi"

Andrea's not fighting for Rob's attention and comfort. That's so denigrating of her and not what she's shown to be at all.
Rob is always paying attention. He's Corleone.
Andrea is staying close so as to keep Rob reassured that she is loyal now and not a threat. She wants to avoid NEGATIVE attention from Rob, because the Matt boot showed her how quickly he will turn on an ally who shows any sign of independent game play.
We had the scene where she talked about having to pretend interest in the spa girl socializing to fit in. It's all been about fitting in to avoid being voted out by her own.
Her position at Ometepe bore some resemblance to Fabio's or Alina's last season. Ep 2 blindside takes ally and leaves you suspect. Alina couldn't overcome it and Fabio did by embracing people he didn't care for.
She has always been separate from the spa girls. They were never this close to getting the axe from Rob. She made it through the merge with a stay of execution but not a full pardon.
She never had the courage or foolhardiness to try to take out Rob by jumping on a minority alliance. She chose the survive one more round or to F 6 approach. We have yet to see how that will work out for her.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 11:55 PM (EST)

154. "RE: Andrea's edi"

Ditto the denigrating thing. I know michel is just trying to express what he thinks is there, but I'm seeing an entirely different Andrea than he is.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 08:02 AM (EST)

155. "RE: Andrea's edi"

Denigrating?! Wasn't this place once called Survivor Blows? Don't we call them all Desperate Attention Whores? Why should I worry about HER feelings?
That being said, trying to fit in is the same as wanting approval. If you noticed, every challenge winner has gone directly to Rob for the celebration hug. If that isn't a sign that they want him to like them, what is?! As for comfort, look at the shelter scenes: Amber should start to be jealous. There was a reason why, when Julie said "poor kid" the camera showed Andrea climbing in the shelter next to Rob.
As for the comparison to Fabio and Alina, you have something there except Matt is Fabio and Andrea is Alina by Rob's own words. Matt was the puppy that she was leading around. Do you think Rob has forgotten?
I will agree that she didn't have the courage to take out Rob and, from that, I say she won't later on either unless Matt returns. And, if he returns and she votes with him, she's giving him the win.
And dabo, yes, she has a nice intro, too bad we don't see it anymore. BTW, the Omies lost that challenge. Those three little birds weren't shown simply because they were cute.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 05:03 PM (EST)

174. "RE: Andrea's edi"

There's a whole forum call Bashers, michel.
"That being said, trying to fit in is the same as wanting approval."
No, it's not in this case. In this case, she's trying to fit in so she doesn't get voted out.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 06:00 PM (EST)

177. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Yes, there is a basher forum but they are DAWS here also!
Who decides the votes? Rob. She needs his approval in order to avoid getting voted out.
The people out there, namely Julie, Steve and David, called them all cult-followers. That wasn't me. They didn't say "except Andrea", they included all of them.

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Corvis 3130 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 06:04 PM (EST)

180. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Well, at this point I find myself getting tired of going back and forth with you over the same points so I think I'll just stop now.

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parathor 250 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 01:24 PM (EST)

132. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I agree. It's definitely UTR, but she isn't so manipulative like Sandra, and isn't so coattail like Russell's Natalie, and isn't so dopey like Fabio, and isn't seen to be a silent co-conspirator like Amber. So yes, definitely not a winner's edit.
Andrea's edit is to show intellect but passiveness/timidness, similar to Amanda (to Todd & Parvati) or Stephen (to JT). Both thought about making big moves, but they were essentially just there as bring-alongs.
(and even then, at least Amanda & Stephen were Amber-like in helping to get their more-forward alliancemate to the finish line)
Thus, I suggest that Andrea is being given a 2nd (or 3rd) place edit. (and her edit seems to be more support-of-Matt's victory than support-of-Rob's victory)
...but that means that three from the Rob/Phillip/Ashley/Natalie/Matt group have to lose-lose... and I think there's a compelling storyline (maybe less so for Ashley and/or Natalie) for each of them to get to the final.
Maybe this season isn't so boring after all!

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 12:47 PM (EST)

162. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-19-11 AT 12:48 PM (EST)
This is the 32nd post in the Andrea's edit sub-section in which the majority of posters appreciate that Andrea is playing the game and not just trying to coattail.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 12:59 PM (EST)

163. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Which is absolutely great. I'm certainly aware that most people see her as the winner. Like I said, I wanted to revitalize the discussion and turn it back here instead of the ECST. I also said that her edit isn't bad but I wanted to point to its flaws.

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 01:20 PM (EST)

167. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I don't see Andrea as the winner. She isn't getting the edit of a winner, imo. I just don't see her as Rob's blind acolyte. She isn't getting that edit either.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 04:11 PM (EST)

171. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Then please tell me who do you see as winner. I'm guessing Matt which is a good pick. God's will vs Superman!
For the blind acolyte, I didn't see it either until this latest episode. I had high hopes for Andrea pre-merge but, since her visit to RI where we saw a bit of jealousy at seeing Matt with Krista, her personal story has been completely dropped and the only thing left was her role in Matt's story.

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 05:21 PM (EST)

175. "RE: Andrea's edit"

I'm guessing Matt which is a good pick
Well they wouldn't want to edit God as a loser, would they?

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 06:04 PM (EST)

179. "RE: Andrea's edit"

That's what worries me. Matt would be the worst winner ever (but that is for Bashers!)

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 01:21 PM (EST)

168. "RE: Andrea's edit"

LAST EDITED ON 04-19-11 AT 01:29 PM (EST)
It is wonderful, yes, but it also seems to be at stalemate in some ways, so I thought a bit of humor would help. One of the things I think is going on right now is three big individual edits are taking attention away from other players since they can fit only so much into each episode. Matt's story became the story of Redemption Island Part I, with a brief passage back into the game it has transitioned into Redemption Island Part II. His individual story could end at any time, it did the job for RI1.
Rob's Godfather edit and Phillip's Bigger Than Life edit have also dominated things, which the producers must love as it gives them something other than the boring Pagonging of Zapatera story. Either of these stories could transition over into RI2, though I really expect if Matt goes to the jury RI2 becomes either the Mike story or the Last Stand of Zapatera story. As for the Ometepes:
Rob: Godfather game
Phillip: Crazy Who Knows What's Next Game
Natalie: Coattailing Informant game
Andrea: Head In the Game/Underdog game
Ashley and Grant: Nothing Going on Upstairs Muscle/Challenge game
ETA: Hm... I suddenly find myself wondering whether it would help or hurt Andrea if Matt were to go to the jury.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 04:22 PM (EST)

172. "RE: Andrea's edit"

Stalemate? The discussion in itself is interesting.
I suddenly find myself wondering whether it would help or hurt Andrea if Matt were to go to the jury."
It certainly would depend how the editors would handle it but, a priori, I'd say it would be bad for her. Why? Most of her story dies with Matt but mostly, the only thing left of Matt's story would be Jeff's last words: "Forgiveness won't be on his mind." That was directed at Rob as the camera showed. If Matt's on the jury, it most likely means that he would indeed forgive Rob and vote for him to win.
Also, Andrea needs an instigator to overturn Rob.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-18-11, 01:59 PM (EST)

133. "Nietzche's Übermensch"

Getting Real at Sucks made a comment about Superman that made me want to explore the possibility that the inspiration for this season’s edit was Nietzsche’s Superman, Maybe that little shelter scene where Natalie curls Rob’s hair and he calls himself Superman wasn’t so meaningless.
I need to read Nietzsche again but, from what I remember, it strikes me that Nietzsche’s Übermensch was closely associated with the principle of Eternal Return. With 4 appearances, our superman certainly qualifies!
Then, consider the following: Nietzsche introduces the concept of the Übermensch in contrast to the other-worldliness of Christianity. Zarathustra proclaims the Übermensch to be the meaning of the earth and admonishes his audience to ignore those who promise other-worldly hopes in order to draw them away from the earth. The turn away from the earth is prompted, he says, by a dissatisfaction with life, a dissatisfaction that causes one to create another world in which those who made one unhappy in this life are tormented. The Übermensch is not driven into other worlds away from this one.
(Note: It does put a new perspective on the Rob versus Matt story. Matt is in that other-world of RI while Rob is still playing.)
Zarathustra ties the Übermensch to the death of God. While this God was the ultimate expression of other-worldly values and the instincts that gave birth to those values, belief in that God nevertheless did give life meaning for a time. God is dead means that the idea of God can no longer provide values. With the sole source of values no longer capable of providing those values, there is a real chance of nihilism.
Zarathustra presents the Übermensch as the creator of new values. In this way, it appears as a solution to the problem of the death of God and nihilism... The new values which the Übermensch will be responsible for will be life-affirming and creative. The Übermensch is driven to a goal
(Note: Is Phillip or Zapatera considered the agent of nihilism?! Wouldn’t Ometepe be dead if Phillip had succeeded in eliminating Rob? Isn't Zapatera in trouble because they killed their Superman? Loyalty is a positive value and the buddy-system is creative and we know that Rob wants to achieve his lifetime goal of being Sole Survivor.)
I don’t want to make too much of it but Getting Real's comment made me see an interesting philosophical angle that I thought I’d share.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-18-11, 02:42 PM (EST)

141. "RE: Nietzche's Übermensch"

Nietzche's superman or the misappropriated from Nietzche Nazi superman? There's no denying that the advanced specimen, in this case the vastly experienced player in with the noobs, plays with a strong advantage.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-19-11, 01:04 PM (EST)

164. "RE: Nietzsche's Übermensch"

Nietzsche didn't have a racist view of his superman. I really wanted to talk about the themes of eternal return, the opposition to the concept of God and the introduction of new values present in Nietzsche's work which seem to parallel the story of the season.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-22-11, 03:45 PM (EST)

181. "Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:"

Previously on… Survivor, before the merge both tribes were ripe with infighting…
But after the merge, the former Ometepe tribe and the former Zapatera tribe set aside their internal squabbles but stayed divided against each other…
<We heard Rob saying: “I want my group to hate Zapatera.”>
...And Matt was caught between the two, so Rob immediately took him out.
<Rob: “He can’t be trusted so, because of that, I give him a one way ticket back to Redemption Island.”>
Down 6 to 5, the former Zapatera hatched a desperate plan: At back-to-back Tribal Councils they tried to convince the Ometepe low-man to jump ship.
But Phillip wouldn’t budge and he played the honor and duty card.
So Mike was voted out and so was David.
Now Ralph, Julie and Steve face a united Ometepe tribe.
This recap seemed to tell us a lot of interesting details. The first thing that stood out was that Rob’s decision to vote out Matt was spun positively by Jeff. Matt, we heard, couldn’t be trusted so he had top be voted out. We could have heard that Matt had decided to go with Rob, we could have heard Julie’s poor kid comment but this indicated that Matt deserved his boot for playing both sides. If he deserved his boot (again!) then Jeff is implying that he does not deserve to win.
Also, Phillip was said to be playing the honor and duty card. After Jeff said that Zapatera tried to get him to jump ship, we could have heard Phil saying: “Now is not the time” which would lead us to believe he would try something later but now, he is duty bound to stay with Rob. We can deduce that he won’t make a move because his honor is at stake.
Finally, when Jeff mentioned a “united Ometepe Tribe” we saw Natalie standing in front of Rob and Phil, the announced final 3. So, are those 3 united until the end?
I would have paraphrased Jeff’s final words as episode title:
“Everything You Say Will Have an Impact”
Redemption Island
Night 24
Matt mixing prayer and confessional: “I’m putting my trust and my faith in you Lord Jesus, because you know how much I want out of this game. I want nothing to do with it, Lord, but if you want me to stay in it, God, I will fight.
I can’t sleep. I’m trying to figure out how I am going to pull myself up from my bootstraps and keep my sanity.
I’m such a broken man…I need you to protect my heart…I need you to protect my mind.
I licked my wounds, I was hurt but I was ready to get back in the mindset of Redemption Island, part 2. Let’s do it and then: Curveball!”
David walked in camp.
I’m not a religious man so I want to be careful here but it seems that Matt is testing God: He doesn’t want to continue but, if God wants him to stay, he will. Isn’t Matt saying he expects something in return?
Anyway, this is more for a theological debate than editing analysis so for our purposes; we know that Matt doesn’t really want to continue playing.
David: “Matt and Mike are both still here. I hope to make some noise here and get back into this game.”
Matt: “David shows up. My mind’s completely blown at this point. I don’t know what to think.”
They went to bed debating semantics and the weirdness of the situation.
(Maybe we should have gone to bed also)
What is obvious here is that Mike was ignored once again. We didn’t see him arrive during the last episode so he could have given us something about David’s arrival but it was all Matt. He’s the important one.
Murlonio
Day 25
Zapatera still had fish on the grill and big portions of rice to go with it.
Steve was happy it was David that left.
Steve: “Tribal Council was 6 to 4, now 6 to 3…we threw all our votes at Rob and waaah-waaah…I haven’t figured Phillip out. I can’t imagine someone always being that strange. Everything he does bugs us but the rest of Ometepe <the 3 girls shown> are sticking to him like glue. Boston Rob’s got them all very tight. I don’t know if Phillip’s a good guy at heart but he is doing his thing out here; surviving. I take my hat off to him. The only hope we could hang our hat on is that they could be irritated with Phillip. There’s always a chance.”
Throughout this confessional, Phillip was in a chair, seemingly reciting a prayer in a strange language, maybe Cherokee.
There wasn’t much here other than setting up the episode’s drama except that Steve doesn’t express anything negative or positive about Rob’s hold on his tribe. It is reported as simple fact; Steve’s negativity was addressed at the “rest of Ometepe” as a whole, the 3 Degrees in particular according to the camera.
Phillip who had moved his meditation to the big rock out on the ocean, receiving a nice 180° helicopter shot in the process: “When I got into Buddhism, one of the things that you learn, is that your spirit is interconnected to every single living thing including the Tathagata which you might call God, or Allah or Buddha. It will manifest itself in a number of different ways. You can feel it and you have to be willing to accept it for what it is and channel that. I did a meditation this morning and I was focusing on my ancestors; I had a premonition through my Grandfather…and I took that as an indication about my relationship with Rob. It has finally come to the full circle of trust. It doesn’t mean that I am not pursuing the million dollars because I will be here at the end of the game.”
Talk about animal imagery! Every animal could represent Phil from now on since he is connected to them all! The guy does deliver some nice confessionals. We can take from this that Phil’s role to put doubt on Rob’s future is over. Someone else will have to take up that role.
Back in camp, Zapatera was still eating.
Julie: “The food situation for the whole Zapatera tribe is great.”
Phillip: “The rice situation is pretty ugly: This morning, Julie was able to scoop 7 and a half scoops of rice out of that pot. In our old tribe, we would have two of those seashells.” He told Rob and Andrea about it. “I contend that they want to use up all the rice before they go. I plan on scooping quite a bit of rice out of their tin and putting it in ours. All rice here belongs to all of us. I’m now watching the Zapatera like a lion. Sadly, it is the state of the world today on the marleno tribe.”
As soon as Steve and Julie left camp, the camera showed him stealing rice.
Rob called him a rice police.
With a smile, Andrea agreed.
Steve and Julie went to tree mail, announcing that all would see the upcoming competition.
Redemption Island Arena
Jeff turned to Matt: “Back-to-back blindsides; where’s your emotional state of mind.”
Matt: “I never knew that strangers could hurt me so deeply. Shame on me for letting them fool me twice.”
The camera turned to Andrea who had nothing to say and then it went to Ashley and Rob.
As he explained the challenge, Jeff said the loser would become the first juror.
A woman, (Julie?) said “Whooo”. The camera showed Andrea again and then Grant.
When it turned to Matt again, he had a smile which led to a look of concern on Rob’s face.
Jeff’s was shown turning his head in Rob’s direction, underlining the consequences of his words.
After receiving encouragement from his old tribe and keeping some shaky tiles in balance, Mike finished first, followed soon by Matt.
Mike’s house of cards fell right after he had won but Matt’s stood until they turned around and started walking out of the arena.
David left with nice words about the experience, no trace of bitterness in his voice.
Rob: “David is going to be the first member of the jury. We try to send people to the duel to beat other people that are already there, namely Matt. We sent Mike, we sent David and David failed. So, Matt’s still in there. If he comes back and he beats me, it’s over.
Matt: “God continues to give me the strength day after day… If it’s His will, I will continue to win and try to take Rob out.”
Except for thanking Jeff and waving to his tribe, Mike was ignored again.
Could the collapse of Matt’s tower foreshadow that he will return again but that his house of cards won’t hold up? It was nice to see that, as soon as Phillip’s loose cannon role ended, Matt’s dangerousness increased.
Murlonio
Day 26 – The Rice Incident
It started nicely, with Rob singing about “Rice Wars” and Grant joining in. It reminded me a little of Mara’amu’s endearing morning radio shows.
That’s when Andrea noticed that their rice was contaminated.
Andrea: “I opened the rice and I saw that there were some maggots…We separated the good rice and we dumped the bad rice into the ocean. Now, we have no place to store our rice…all these bugs are getting into it.”
Andrea went over to Steve to ask if they could put the good rice in their container.
Steve refused.
Note that, even if he had good reasons to refuse, like cross-contamination or Ometepe’s own decision to keep things segregated, we didn’t hear why Steve refused. Cutting it like they did, it made Steve sound petty.
Phillip: “It is an eye-opener to see individuals behave in the way they are behaving even in a game of survivor environment. You can leave here with damages just seeing how bad human beings will conduct themselves.”
Phillip went over, saying they weren’t being reasonable and it degenerated.
I will skip this distasteful segment.
At the end, Steve told Rob that the Zapateras would be voting against Phillip.
Sitting next to Andrea, Rob said: “I don’t mind him picking on the other tribe but you can see that, once they are gone, the old Phillip’s coming back.
She agreed.
Rob: “What started as a friendly song between Grant and I, turned into an explosion. Phillip managed to make a war about white rice, racial. I don’t know where it came from but at the end of the day, Phillip will be public enemy number 1. I just have to figure out who to make public enemy number 2.”
Exactly on cue, the camera showed us Ashley! Ding! Ding! We have public enemy number 2!
She was saying: “I’d still rather die than keep him around, though”.
How ironic would it be if she has to keep him around? One could say her Survivor life will end when she tries to get rid of Phillip but I think Ashley and Phil could very well be the goats in the end.
To underline his future, we then saw Phillip running on the beach in his pink underwear, reminding us, somewhat disgustingly, that he has legs in this story.
Will Rob be the one to carry his goats to the end? We have seen goats being stolen before. The thing is; who would take those two besides Rob? We know, because his honor is involved, that Phil wouldn’t go against Rob. Grant wouldn’t need two goats. Natalie could but we still haven’t seen anything suggesting she would make a move without Rob. Matt would eliminate Rob but he wouldn’t choose Phil and Ashley to accompany him. The good guy would forgive Andrea and surely take her…unless he doesn’t have a choice.
The Challenge
When Jeff mentioned that the winner would be safe in this game, the camera showed Andrea making us think that she will win the necklace again but when?
We saw Ashley getting so dizzy that she fell to the ground and we heard her saying that she sucks.
In order, Rob, Julie, Ralph, Andrea, Steve and Grant moved to the second round.
In the final round, even if Andrea was originally in the lead, Rob beat Steve by a second, it seemed.
Steve: “The challenge was a close one for me but I dropped the ball. There’s three of us right now left in Zapatera and we are voting for Phil. If two of them would change their mind and vote for Phil; Bam! It’s the only shot we got.”
Murlonio
Day 26
The segment started with Natalie and Ashley scrapping some rice out of their pot, someone saying “that’s all of it”, while Zapatera were stuffing their face, Julie saying “I have never eaten so much rice in my life.”
Wasn’t that simply trying to show that Zapatera had been unreasonable during the previous argument? I didn’t appreciate that we had to return to a “rice” scene and that it was manufactured for us to pick sides.
Julie: “Tonight’s going to be an easy vote…The old Ometepe tribe have enough numbers that they could get rid of somebody so, it would be a good night to get rid of Phillip.”
We then saw Julie hiding Phillip’s bathing suit.
Ashley: “Everybody in camp is over Phillip.” <Andrea shown at this time, suggesting she agreed to that statement.> “Phillip says all the time that he was a special agent and that he knows how to read people.” <Ashley seen saying “Go away” while her confessional was heard in voice-over> “Crazy Phillip who wears feathers and pink underwear. I can’t wait to get rid of Phillip.”
Now, I know that Ashley will not get rid of Phillip. Will she “die” trying or will she have to endure seeing the pink underwear up to day 39 as an early season scene suggested?
Later, more rice was being cooked by Ralph as Phillip grabbed a machete.
Steve: “Phil made a total ##### out of himself, getting racial about rice and doing crazy stuff. I really think that, with any kind of dignity, he’d apologize for his asinine behavior but he hasn’t said a word. The Ometepe tribe, they don’t understand him either so maybe somebody might sway the vote and vote our way.”
Rob: “Tonight, it doesn’t matter who we target really. We got Ralph, we got Steve and Julie. I don’t know. I love Phillip but I don’t know where his head is. There is room to play but I don’t know where. One man should not have this much power on an island but I’m grateful that I do.”
The end of this confessional is another example of walking a tightrope between hubris leading to a fall and control leading to a win.
Tribal Council
Since it was all centered on Phillip’s missing clothes and the Rice Wars, I’ll go directly to the three comments that I feel are relevant to our purpose:
Jeff: “So, Rob, how do you go forward at Tribal Council when all of this is in the context of a million dollar prize? You are going to vote somebody out tonight. Is this going to factor in? I guess maybe on some level, conscious or subconscious.”
Rob: “It isn’t easy. Phillip is a grown man; he says and feels what he wants. Steve is a grown man; he says and feels what he wants. It’s problematic but it’s real. You have people that have disagreements about things but, at the same time, I can’t imagine that it will not factor into our decision.”
Asked how it impacted the game, Natalie said: “It’s really hard for me to sit here and listen because I feel for Steve because I don’t think that he has any prejudice in him and I feel for Phillip because I don’t know what it’s like to be an African American man.”
The rest, including Steve’s comment that he’d be happy to see Phillip leave but not as a black and white issue, Phillip’s own words that he’d consider his elimination as the way the tribe had spoken and including all three Zapatera voting comments served to defuse the issue that the episode had created.
The outcome of the vote was strange in the context that very little in the construction of the episode had painted the target on Julie but I guess that’s to expect when there isn’t much else to surprise the viewers.
The Story
Just as we speculated, the season is coming down to “Superman” Rob versus Matt with God on his side. Rob told us that he’s looking for 2 “public enemies” to go to the end with him. There are two inherent problems with that:
- Goats can be stolen and, if Rob loses the Final 4 IC, someone could be there to team up with the 2 goats.
- Keeping goats causes resentment and we saw that Yul had to let go of Jonathan.
We can focus our energy on trying to figure if anything indicates whether Rob can avoid those two traps or, if he falls, which player would benefit. The Theme of this episode told us we should be looking for a diplomat, someone that knows the importance of saying and doing the right thing.
The Characters
Grant, Julie, Mike, Ralph and Steve have no relevance to this story besides the way they will vote. This isn’t a thread dedicated to guess how jurors think but none of them (and we can add David in this) has shown any resentment towards Rob’s action in the game. What irritated them has always been the way the rest of Ometepe follow blindly.
For Grant, of course, we will need to see the way he is sent to that jury.
Andrea: Her three best episodes (her only 3 good ones?) happened when she went to visit Redemption Island but in this one, Matt’s darkest hour, she wasn’t given anything to say about him and their relation. She only had a narrative of the ugly rice wars. The camera even kept her in the scene after we had seen her leaving in the previous frame. She was shown agreeing with Rob when he talked about the old Phillip returning. Since she was most closely mixed up in the rice war than Natalie, a diplomatic comment from her would have been necessary but her TC intervention was, again, solely narrative. Fortunately for her and her fans, the previews for next week keep her hopes alive.
Phillip: He is still talking about the million and says he will fight for it in the end but he also says he can’t win a jury vote. What he has said and done has already impacted how his game will end. He seems well on his way to the Final Tribal Council. Strangely, he has outlasted all the Zapatera women before the men…unless Julie makes a run of her own on Redemption Island.

Ashley: The editors arranged the scenes to remind us that she was public enemy #2 for most of the pre-merge. Will she be Rob’s choice in the end? If she loses the final vote, it would certainly explain why we had to see so much negativity from her. Having her sitting with Phil, making the “Fallen Comrade” tribute by his side, would also perfectly fit in her hellish experience with the former Special Agent (?). But she could also “die” trying to get the votes against the “ideal” goat.
Natalie: Her words at tribal council were very diplomatic so she could be the one that the jury sees as having made the best impact of all. However, her story has lacked substance throughout the season to see her win as a satisfactory end to this season. Especially considering that Rob hasn’t received the amount of negativity he had in Panama or that Stephenie had in Guatemala. I don’t see Natalie being edited as beating Rob in front of the jury but, if the young woman’s only move happens to dethrone Rob, it would be sufficient to create the winning momentum both from the jury and the audience. Will Natalie make a move without Rob, to get rid of Rob? There hasn’t been the slightest indication that she would but we will keep looking for hints that she could.
Going with a “proof by contradiction”, I’d say that, in a season of Redemption, maybe the focus should have been a little more on Natalie when Phillip talked about the “spa girls”. What does Natalie really have to redeem? Rob said we shouldn’t have expected her to do a lot of work so her actions were “normal”.
Now, wouldn’t this train of thought lead to the conclusion that Ashley should win? To that, I’d say that Ashley would have been the one to talk at this Tribal Council because her redemption arc “sucks”…Ashley needs to “start digging”!

Matt: With Mike being ignored and the investment in Matt being doubled, it is natural to expect his return. There has to be another showdown between Rob and Matt. I don’t think it will be confined to his final vote. Hearing him say that he is broken and wants out of the game isn’t very good for his future however. We are well passed the redemption point in his edit; it seems to have become a struggle between him and God. Apparently, his story needs more of a coming-to-peace with everything than a million dollar prize. His story seem to point to a scene, after his return, where he’d sit with Rob, get a full explanation of why he was voted out both times, understanding Rob and even voting for him to win thus making his peace.
Rob: The return of the smiling man from Mara’amu was needed after such a dark episode. We see that, in the eventual jurors’ mind, Rob isn’t considered a villain. The recap explained his decision to eliminate Matt. The Tribal Council showed that he knew what to say to address a difficult situation.
It is interesting to see how the story has shown Rob redeeming himself from his previous mistakes:
Up to now, Rob has managed to keep his tribe in the majority, the thing that killed him in Marquesas.
He has managed to avoid turning it into the type of personal conflict that killed him in Panama.
He has been controlling the idol that killed him in Samoa.
In a season of Redemption, I still see Rob coming full circle and getting the title that, from his episode #3 words, is “overdue.”

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-22-11, 04:20 PM (EST)

182. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:"

I'll have to give this a closer reading when I have the time, but as for Matt expecting "something in return," -- No, that's not it. At least not in the sense of how well he does in Survivor, winning or losing, anything like that, that stuff doesn't matter.
Matthew is saying God is testing him, simply that and nothing more. His "reward" may be in what he learns, how he becomes a better Matthew for the rest of his life. It may in the end be nothing more complicated than it is time to grow up and put away childish things.
How the Survivor editors may be trying to spin it based on outcomes and whatever, they get a win somehow. They get a win if Matt has an epiphany, good story. They get a win if Matt and Rob face off mano-a-mano.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
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04-23-11, 01:09 AM (EST)

183. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:"

LAST EDITED ON 04-23-11 AT 01:19 AM (EST)
I’m not a religious man so I want to be careful here but it seems that Matt is testing God: He doesn’t want to continue but, if God wants him to stay, he will. Isn’t Matt saying he expects something in return?
Anyway, this is more for a theological debate than editing analysis so for our purposes; we know that Matt doesn’t really want to continue playing.
I agree with dabo 100% on her interpretation that Matt is saying that God is testing him, not the other way around. No religious person would ever think of "testing" God. Whatever you think of Matt, he is earnest in his belief, so he wouldn't think like that.
Because you admit you aren't religious, I am also going to add here what I said in the Episode 10 ECST because it may give you some insight into what Matt is talking about -- this prayer by Matt was strikingly similar to the prayer Jesus made on the eve of his crucifixion in the olive garden when he said ""My Father! If this cup cannot be taken away unless I drink it, your will be done." (Matthew 26:42). This tells Christians that as people with free will, it is reasonable for them to not want to do something that God has planned for them (Jesus himself asked God to excuse him from going on the cross), but what ultimately matters (for people of faith) is that despite what they personally want or how difficult the task may be, they do what God wants them to do (as Jesus did).
For me, Matt's prayer means that regardless of the fact that he is personally "over" this game, regardless of the odds against him, regardless of how difficult being on RI is for him, Matt is going to do what God wants of him. He will pull himself together & do his best in the challenges.
eta: one slight thing more re: Matt's tower --I thought that Matt knocked his tower over on his way out of the arena by holding out his hand & hitting it as he passed by. I'm not sure what the fallen tower means, but if it does mean something, I think it falling on its own v. Matt knocking it over is significant.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
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04-23-11, 02:08 AM (EST)

184. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:"

From Matthew's perspective, he has placed himself in God's hands. If he were to be sent to the jury that too might be part of his test. Rewards in this sort of test are internal not external, epiphany (realization). From the editors' POV this is a great story for as long as it lasts, but it does deserve an ending.
What I find interesting also is what isn't there. Matthew, in returning to Redemption Island, is now in the position of host. Did he not see that? He can help others who arrive there, teach and learn, and it seems that after Mike arrived Matthew no longer has to spend any of his time alone, in isolation. And if he were to fall there would always be someone remaining to pick up the torch.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
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04-23-11, 03:17 AM (EST)

185. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:"

Exactly dabo. Matt says he wants "out" of the game & he's over it -- but even as part of the jury he is in the game. What I meant to express is that despite his sadness/frustration about his situation, he isn't going to "quit" -- I'm not trying to imply what I think his ultimate outcome in the game (ie "God's plan" for him) is.
I like your idea about Matt being the host to the others -- I wonder if that is going to develop.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-23-11, 12:46 PM (EST)

186. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:"

Thank you Dabo and Kiki.
Since religion is a personal matter, I sent you PMs to explain my comments.
In this thread, I'd prefer to talk about the episode.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
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04-23-11, 01:17 PM (EST)

187. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:"

I got your PM & responded. Thank you.
I was not debating religion here, I'm reading the editing clues & IMO with someone like Matt you have to interpret his words with the accurate biblical parallel, which, IMO, is Jesus's prayer in the olive grove. I was merely trying to help you get an accurate read on it.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-24-11, 10:45 PM (EST)

188. "Matt's Edit"

I've been thinking a lot about Matt's edit and what the editing is telling us is that Matt lost his way:
His first confessional told us he was on a journey to be closer to his Savior.
Then, when he arrived at Redemption island, he told us that he wanted: "To be the underdog and come back from Redemption Island and finish this game with a million dollars".
For him, exceptionally, I think the million dollar quote is a losing one because that is not the way of his Savior.
When he did return to the game, he followed man's ways and tried to make big moves to win that million. It led to his perdition.
Now, he is troubled because he's still thinking about the game. But Matt is a spiritual man and his "win" will have to be spiritual.
In the end, I think he will have to render unto God the things that are God’s and unto Caesar (Rob) the things which are Caesar’s.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-30-11, 05:59 PM (EST)

189. "Episode #11 - Observations:"

LAST EDITED ON 04-30-11 AT 09:49 PM (EST)
Previously on…Survivor, Matt came back in the game at the merge and quickly rekindled his relationship with Andrea.
But Andrea answered to a higher power.
Rob was shown when Andrea said: I really like Matt but Rob is like the king and he is very smart.
She joined him in his second blindside of Matt.
At Redemption Island, Matt and Mike stayed alive.
Back at camp, the former Ometepe celebrated their numbers advantage.
Philip broke up the party by getting in a heated argument with Steve.
Steve's ally, Julie, retaliated by hiding Phillip's shorts.
At Tribal Council, it was clear that the former Zapatera tribe was in trouble.
Julie surprised everyone by coming clean about hiding the shorts but Julie got a bigger surprise when she was sent to RI.
The old Zapatera knew that their only hope was to find a crack in the Ometepe alliance.
The recap clearly blamed Andrea for blindsiding Matt. I thought it was very telling that we heard Andrea add that Rob was very smart. Had we only heard her say that Rob was like a king, we could assume she felt oppressed but, by adding that she thought he was smart, that showed that she was a willing follower, not that she didn't have a choice.
That made me think this episode should have been titled:
Ometepe!
Night 27
Phillip and Steve shook hands.
Phillip: I was approached by Steve. He was saying he wanted to bury the hatchet…I didn't feel it was totally ingenuous…It felt like it was a little self-serving. I feel that Steve will go next.
Steve: I hope any guy with maturity…and empathy…would have reached out. I reached out…and hopefully we put it to rest.
Rob: Phillip's not going anywhere. Phillip's under my protection. If he keeps up his crazy antics, he's coming with me all the way to the finals.
Day 28
Steve and Ralph were trying to keep their spirits up, hoping that Phillip would fall off the big rock.
Phillip: Yesterday, my trunks were hidden by Julie.
He then told us that his ancestor came to him in another vision and told him where were his shorts. Phillip started digging and he soon found them.
It was interesting how his search for his trunk paralleled a search for a Hidden Immunity Idol and Phil was even heard saying he found it without a clue. I felt the editors were telling us that Phillip should have put his talents to use when it mattered and found the idol.
Phillip told us: Here's to you Julie. You cannot mess with the Specialist. It is frutile (sic).
He was joyfully anticipating parading for Julie with his shorts.
Redemption Island
Mike: After Matt was blindsided a second time by the people he thought were his friends, he has been on a downward spiral.
To Julie, he said: Coming back here was really rough on him. I guess he was really close to Andrea and I guess she was sharing everything that he was telling her with her tribe.
Julie replied: I never did trust her.
Mike agreed: She is not to be trusted.
While this was going on, we saw Matt and heard a confessional where he said: I am wasting away… God wants me to be here…I am so over this game.
The point that Jeff made in the recap is being reinforced by this conversation: Andrea betrayed Matt and she is not trustworthy. The implication is that these two future jury members don't approve Andrea's actions. Note that the first confessional we've had from Mike since his boot was entirely centered on Matt. Proof again that Matt is the important one on RI, not Mike.
The Challenge:
Jeff addressed Matt: 21 days on Redemption Island, only 7 in the game.
Matt said he was ready to go home, that he had accomplished what he wanted.
During the challenge, Andrea smiled at Matt when he made a successful shot.
We clearly saw Matt looking in her direction and shaking his head disapprovingly.
Andrea: Matt is pissed at me. We made eye contact and he gave me a really dirty look. It is just a weird feeling.
Matt had another nice come-from-behind win.
Jeff said: God is not done talking to Matt.
We saw a concerned look on Rob's face.
Mike saved himself also.
Julie told Jeff that Matt inspired her.
Andrea had another confessional as the players walked off: I hope that Matt stays and even comes back…I would want to talk to him but I do not think that he can trust me in this game ever again. Why would he?
To those that like Matt (and the editors certainly wanted the majority of the audience to like Matt), the beginning of the episode really painted a negative picture of Andrea. There could have been a reminder that Matt had effectively thrown Andrea under the bus but that was not part of the reedition of the story. Andrea chose to play with Rob because he's smart, the potential jurors disapproved of the way Andrea betrayed Matt and he was still angry and hurt about it.
Day 28
Andrea was talking to Ashley and Natalie, telling them she felt bad about herself for playing Matt.
Andrea: Matt was like I don’t care if I’m out and I feel a little bad because I played him the hardest. I had these close conversations with him. He says he can forgive and stuff but I think he is pissed at me. I feel like I played a big part in breaking his spirits. I felt a little guilty on a human level, not on a game level.
Rob consoled her: We all put him there, you know.
Grant took a walk with Rob, telling him: When it comes time, we should get her out of here, like, first. Andrea.
Rob said: I was thinking the same thing.
Grant: I’ve been concerned about Andrea and Matt’s relationship if he comes back from Redemption Island. We got back from the challenge and she said she felt sorry for him. It’s things like that…I was shaking my head thinking I don’t know if you learned. I’ve considered getting rid of Andrea before we get rid of Steve and Ralph because that’s one less thing to worry about. Then again, timing is everything in this game: Knowing when to pull the trigger as far as voting people off is huge and it might come down to immunity challenges.
Grant’s words put Andrea in danger which could bode well for her chances to win it all but consider this: It came from Grant. So, really it served to convince us that he doesn’t have much say in the decisions, it also nicely kept Rob from being painted as bullying Andrea out of the game and, in the end, it only put doubt regarding Andrea’s stay for this episode. An episode with a double-boot where both ends of the votes are obvious needs to be spiced up somehow. Therefore, putting doubt on Andrea’s future didn’t necessarily have end-game implications. Thematically, we could say that if someone like Grant can see that Andrea’s relationship with Matt could be problematic then we can say that Andrea, like the amateur she is, revealed too much. At most, this sequence hints that Andrea could win the challenge in the next episode, forcing Grant out of the game. It would make for nice storytelling.
The Challenge
Showing the good footwork of a wide receiver, Grant won the challenge fairly easily, eliminating in order Rob, Ashley and Ralph.
He chose Rob and Andrea to join him in eating the chocolate cake, his decision obviously frustrating Natalie.
Jeff then tossed a package to Steve, telling them all about a twist at Tribal Council.
Grant: I chose Andrea as a strategic move. I wanted to make her feel comfortable in our alliance because, tonight at Tribal Council, if certain scenarios come up where we need to get rid of one our own, Andrea is going to be that member.
Seeing Andrea with a face full of chocolate at that moment, while certainly cute, didn’t show her as a cunning strategist that would foil Grant’s plan.
Day 30
Andrea: We got a mystery package that Jeff gave to us and told us to open at Tribal Council. It could be something where we go to tribal Council and we vote somebody out and then, there’s a twist and we vote another person out or something like crazy outlandish. (We hear her say to the tribe that it could be something like draw the wrong card and you’re out) She continued: The whole card thing kind of threw me off but right now everyone’s pretty comfortable because there are two easy votes, Ralph and Steve. Our six, having so much faith in each other, I think it would be silly to get rid of one of our own before the Zapatera people.
Ralph and Steve were sitting next to each other and Steve had to ask Ralph twice to repeat what he had said: There’s gonna be none telling what happens.
Ralph: One of us is on the chop block and it’s probably me.
Steve told Ralph that he was feeling weak.
Rob: This is what’s going on right now: Steve is thinking I’ve had it, I’m done so Steve is not going to do anything that is going to cause any trouble with anybody. Ralph, on the other hand, poses a threat because physically, he is capable and his head is still in the game so Ralph’s got to go next. Who knows what this twist is all about. Maybe somebody else has a chance to win immunity. Maybe it’s a situation where two people could go home but we only get to vote once. It could be anything so, we got to edge our bets, make sure we have back-up plans and know who we are voting for. Grant and I, we already talked about getting rid of Andrea before Zapatera so it leaves us other options.
Rob sat with Natalie and Ashley saying: Andrea made too much friends with the Zapatera people.
Ashley: Rob is very smart and he’s played this game before so we are taking our lead from him. We are voting for Ralph tonight. There’s also a twist though and we may have to vote out two people tonight in which case Andrea will go home. If Matt returns from Redemption Island, she’s still got a soft spot for Matt. It just makes sense to get her out.
Hearing Ashley joining the "Get Andrea Out of Here" bandwagon signals that we may have underestimated Andrea’s story line. Maybe timing is everything and Rob missed his only occasion to get rid of Andrea. Then again, we heard that Andrea has made friends with too many Zapatera and they will form the majority of the jury. The question becomes: Would the editors have sacrificed doubts over the season’s outcome just to create doubt in this one? I wouldn’t think so. Therefore, the conclusion can only be that Andrea was the misdirection boot for this episode, she may also prove Grant right and win a challenge that forces the vote to turn against the big guy but that should be the extent of her story.
The reunion with Matt is an obvious plot line but it would fit just as well if she reunites with him on Redemption Island. After all, we heard that she was only concerned about how her actions affected Matt on a human level, not on the game level. Doesn’t it mean that they need to resolve their problems outside of the game?
On a side note, at this point we saw a howler monkey sending out warning signals. Was it to tell Andrea to wake up or was it signaling for Rob to watch out for what was about to happen?
Steve walked up to Natalie and Ashley telling them that their two votes would go to Rob and that the three girls could turn the whole thing upside down because Rob was deciding who comes and who goes and he would take nimrod (Phillip) to the finals.
After he left, Ashley whispered to Natalie: That would work if we actually wanted Andrea in on it. But, we don’t.
Proving the utility of the buddy system, we saw Ashley and Natalie telling Rob about Steve’s plan.
Rob: It seems like Steve may have gotten his second wind. He’s going to members of my alliance behind my back, trying to come up with a plan to get me out of here. It makes me think that maybe, I should get rid of him first. What I was originally thinking about, I am thinking about not doing now. I may have to wait to get rid of Andrea.
Tribal Council – Part I
Rob said it would most likely be either Steve or Ralph.
Steve said they had tried to create havoc by telling different groups who they were voting for and that it could be huge if they jumped on board.
(we hadn’t been shown Steve talking to Andrea but he did mention different groups and, in addition to Natalie and Ashley, the camera showed Andrea.)
Jeff went directly to Andrea about Steve’s point.
Andrea: It does make sense strategically but I feel completely safe that we are rock solid and that we worked hard to get to the place that we are at.
(As she said this, the camera showed a silent but knowing Rob exchanging a look with the equally silent Grant. The rattling sound certainly showed that Andrea was being played.)
Both Ralph and Steve agreed that the vote would most likely be Ralph.
Rob said Steve was saying the right thing if he wanted to stay.
Grant chimed in saying Steve wasn’t a quitter because he played in the NFL.
Phillip added that Steve wasn’t as feeble as he was putting out there.
Steve reminded the girls that Boston Rob asked a guy to save his girlfriend, Amber, then cut him loose the first chance he had.
Jeff liked that but reminded everyone that, despite cutting Lex’s throat, Rob hadn’t betrayed Amber.
Amdrea: You can look at the flip side where if you have a good relationship with Rob and he gives you his word, he could take you all the way.
Rob just pointed out that he still has an alliance with Amber.
Natalie, Andrea and Grant liked hearing that but Ashley had a questioning look on her face. Will she be the one to cause trouble?
Despite Steve’s saying Let’s do it, the vote was uneventful and Ralph was voted out.
Jeff had to remind Ralph that he was still in this game.
(That could be something for Ralph’s fans to hold on to but it seemed more like one more joke at Ralph’s expense.)
Part II
Steve revealed the twist: There would be an Immunity challenge followed immediately by a vote.
Despite Jeff apparently flirting with Natalie (she’s 19, Jeff) Rob won the immunity challenge.
Before being called to vote, there were some glances exchanged between Rob and his crew and even a wink from Grant apparently directed at Andrea.
We heard her voting comment, a cheer for her tribe: "Ometepe!"
Jeff congratulated them: There are no more Zapatera left. That’s the good news, The bad news is that there’s no place left to hide.
The camera was squarely on Andrea when Jeff said this and it then moved to Rob.

The Story
This episode used Andrea’s unique position to create the only drama possible and it did show her as an interesting character with feelings and her head in the game. But, again, I saw that the episode really centered on the story between Matt and Rob with Andrea being placed at the intersection where their paths must cross. As much as her underdog status can draw the viewers to her cause, I saw that the underlying characteristics that the editors wanted to relay were that she betrayed Matt and that she was quite naïve about Rob’s intentions as her Ometepe cheer revealed. And, if that wasn’t enough, they made sure that Grant and Ashley would put the target on her back in place of Rob.
All this manipulation tells me that Rob is indeed the winner.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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04-30-11, 08:37 PM (EST)

190. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Well done, michel, well done! You are amazing at the editing and I sure love to sit down and sink my teeth into the comments you make week after week. I so wish that Veruca was here to comment as well....nothing would make my day more complete than to read what she would have to say as well.
First of all, I can't believe you left out Grant's comment, right after he beat him at the challenge log roll...I love you, Rob!
Emydi and I have been chuckling about that all week!
I agree with your assessments regarding Andrea. Her entire story has been wrapped up in Matt issues. Her confessionals pre-merge were all about Matt being blindsided, and then her little talk with maybe joining up with Phillip, and then merge, and her confessionals again took off, now this. I agree, she said it all, Rob is king, and he's smart too. So, we know the choice she made. It always bodes so well for one when the others talk about them...especially in a good way.
Regarding Grant. I do think that Andrea could beat him at say an endurance type of challenge, and wouldn't that be something if it did lead to his demise?
I am really enjoying this season because it's like we are getting an inside vantage point on how to play Survivor. While others don't appreciate the snark, I love it. Regarding Matt, I also believe that the editing is setting us up for a Rob vs. Matt scenario.
Thanks so much, michel.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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04-30-11, 09:46 PM (EST)

191. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Thank you FP. Coming from you, it means a lot.
As for Grant's comment, I didn't include it because I'm not sure what to make of it or if there is anything to make of it. What have you and Emydi been chuckling about? (Emydi is another one I miss in the editing thread.) I thought it was left in only to explain why he chose Rob to eat cake. After all, he told us his choice of Andrea was strategic so the viewers shouldn't be confused and think that his choice for Rob was also strategic.
The only smile it gave me was when, later, Rob mentioned being still with Amber and we saw Grant smiling as if he considered himself the next Amber! I love you Rob took on a different meaning then.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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05-01-11, 02:36 PM (EST)

194. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Emy and I were chuckling over it because it exemplified a delimma for Grant. On one hand he's playing for immunity, and on the other he's playing against Rob. He beat Rob but he seems so under Rob's spell that he didn't want to upset him....like a little boy going up against his father. He quickly blurted out, after beating him on the log roll, "I love you Rob"....to underline even though I beat you, I am with you....then when he got to eat the cake, the first one he asked to join him without hesitation was Rob. Grant is playing as Rob's Amber. But, we laugh because we believe that they all think they are Rob's Amber...
It didn't cross my mind at all that just as Grant chose Andrea to share the dessert to camoflage his intentions, wouldn't that be great if he did the same thing to Rob....however, I don't think so at this point.
You also make a great point about Andrea is the intersection between Rob and Matt, and while she was closest to Matt in the game, in the end she chose the king, and the smart one. I hope Andrea is symbolic of the jury....while they are closest to Matt and the Zaps, perhaps they will choose Boston Rob in the end....I don't know.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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05-01-11, 05:45 PM (EST)

195. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Yes, they all want to be Amber, but Rob's got his Amber and now he needs goats! I thought Grant's demolition as a player had been shown in the previous episode when, after saying he was his own man and eating some Zap fish, we heard Rob yelling his name and Grant obediently coming back to his side of the shelter. Poor Grant!

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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05-01-11, 01:12 AM (EST)

192. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

ANDREA
I agree that Andrea's gameplay did not show well in this episode. I personally am not rooting for her to win at this point. I only mention my personal inclinations because the editing affects me too, and it hasn't pulled me towards being in her camp.
She appears as an underdog, yet she is there because she made her bed by sticking with Rob. She has not succeeded in making Rob, Grant, Ashley, or Natalie want to play with her. That is a LARGE failure. Natalie and Ashley were explicit about not wanting to make a move because they have no wish to take Andrea with them.
Pretty much nobody likes Andrea, not the jury, not the Ometepe. The only person who liked her, she blindsided. Not good. (Phillip only wanted her help because she was on the fringe.)
IF Andrea were to win, I think it could only be against someone less liked.
Ashley, Natalie, Phillip -- she might have a chance. Still, she has been more developed than any other girl, so she should do something before she goes.
PHILLIP
F3 goat and supposed comic relief, what else to say about him?
GRANT
I know that Corvis' confessional theory has tribal dynamic rated higher than strategic confessionals, but I feel that is better for the pre-merge game. At this point of the game, we need some strategy from a potential winner, and Grant is way too silent about what he is doing other than playing Rob's best buddy.
I don't expect to see him in front of the jury.
ASHLEY
Everything about her is vapid and generally unpleasant, and no idea what is in her head.
NATALIE
Is playing to win, the best game she sees her way to play. I dislike her, but I'm not sure that editing could make me like her, as I don't care if she can wiggle her butt well. I think she is F3 and we will eventually get some more confessionals from her.
Thinking back to All Stars, we didn't get that much from Amber. I remember writing a summary and saying they were forced to give her confessionals the episode of the swap, because she was at the center of it all -- and she was still boring.
I like Amber now, but she gave really boring confessionals, and I think that's a problem with Ashley and Natalie, and was an issue with Natalie White too. Sometimes people who do well and even those who win are just not very interesting to listen to, and they get cut out in favor of those more colorful characters.
MIKE
I love Mike just like Julie does, but he only talks about Matt, not his own chances. In his Insider clip, he did say he would be more competitive if up against Rob or Grant. There is some wish for a grudge match there. I hope he gets it.
ROOSTER & STEVE
Toasty and fully toasted. Just put them on the jury already.
ROB
No question he has dominated this game and will forever be one of the greatest players, but I don't see him winning. By not showing us any serious discussions from the Ometepe about possibly dumping Rob, I feel that the editors are creating in the average viewer a desire to see Rob blindsided or taken down.
Rob was an underdog as a returning player, but now Matt and the Zapatera are the underdogs. Survivor loves an underdog. Fabio, Sandra, Natalie, JT, Bob, even Parvati -- they were all edited that way. Yul, Danni, Chris (Vanuatu), Sandra, Jenna (by the end).
Conceivably, they could have made us feel that Rob was in some real danger, but all we got was crazy Phillip making plans that were unlikely.
MATT
Had his dark night of the soul, and will rebound. Talked about his family, and opened up the future to being revitalized by seeing a family member. Pulled it together under pressure. Is not such a saint that he didn't give Andrea a dirty look, with which we sympathized.
When I look back at my comments in this topic, I see that I thought Matt had a winner's edit after Episode 1 (but hoped not), and that I picked him to win after Episode 4. I still think he will either win or will knock out Rob and then crash and burn and one of the two girls will win. (I hope not.)
Jeff said in his last VLOG that undeserving winners and bitter juries are an integral part of Survivor, as it's a social microcosm of the real world (as opposed to a place out of the real world where heroes win and bad guys get what's coming to them.)

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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05-01-11, 08:46 AM (EST)

193. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

All great observations, OFG. And, as I stated above, I do believe we are set up nicely for the Matt vs. Rob showdown. I don't like that Matt gets the white color... Like you, I would really be surprised if anyone else could possibly win at this point. The only other one that could possibly cause some conflict, imo, is surprisingly Phillip. He is the only Ome out there that has contemplated taking out Rob...will that come to fruition, and if it is orchestrated by Phillip, than by gosh, maybe he could swing it....?
Matt still strikes me as the journey player as well...this game has really been about following his God and about "soul searching" for him, as he just noted in the last episode, when he said that he's done with the game. Even his first confessional was noted as a journey to follow his God...to honor his God. It's always been about honoring his God, and NOT about playing a game to win a million dollars...just my 2 cents...We see Rob playing the game to the fullest extent, and we see Matt getting blindsided twice, and now suffering semi-alone(?) and soul searching.
But, I will say they are creating ALOT of doubt that Rob can't win....which, hopefully for me, will bode well for Rob...LOL! As Veruca and michel will say, it bodes well to cast doubt that the actual winner can indeed win.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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05-01-11, 06:06 PM (EST)

196. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

I like your take on the players, OFG, and agree with most points except of course Rob. All the players you listed were not, strictly speaking, edited as underdogs because they were truly underdogs at some point. Even Yul, despite his armor plated HII, was down 8-4 after the mutiny.
The only winner that was edited as an underdog when he really wasn't, was Earl. At the merge, he was up 7-3 in numbers but the edit made it look like it was Earl and Yau Man alone against everyone else. Besides trying to create drama in a very boring season, the editors had to hide Earl's alliances because they didn't want to show that, at it's core, it was an all-African-American alliance.
When they did have front-running leaders winning it all, Hatch, Brian, Tom, especially Tom, and Todd, the only doubt was whether or not they'd make it to the end. There's been that doubt on Rob but, with the way most votes have gone lately, the average viewer would now say: Here we go again! A do-nothing coat-tail rider like Natalie will win.
As for Matt, I think I know why they edited him that way, gave him his dark night of the soul as you aptly put it: Matt wanted to get closer to his savior. That was his journey. But, once he got on RI, we heard him say he'd come back and win the million. That isn't getting closer to God. Money is a vile goal; greed, one of the cardinal sins. Matt's journey will end, actually is ending, when he realizes that money isn't his reward.
As for Jeff's blog, I don't like to use it. Certainly, Jeff is an editor but, when he talks to fans, he's wearing his salesman's hat. A Natalie win has absolutely no basis as far as her edit is concerned. Only Jeff's nice words keep her fans dreaming. Maybe Jeff wants a 19 year old girlfriend for all we know but I simply think it is to say that Natalie isn't a Purple Kelly.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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05-01-11, 09:02 PM (EST)

197. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

That's a good point about true underdogs. That's what I was looking at. But there are a couple ways at least to edit true underdogs. One is as losers to the good players, the other is so we root for them or are on their side.
Zap's edit began as losers. We were to root for Ometepe. Recently though, after Buddy System and Rice Wars, the Zaps were portrayed sympathetically.
Although none of them are likely to make it back into the game, they will form the jury majority, so perhaps this favorable edit supports whatever choice they make as jurors. Their bias is going to be anti-Ometepe (with likely exception of David).
An example from the past of a bitter jury who were edited as bitter were the Rotu 4 in Marquesas. They dominated, then became underdogs and were taken out one after the other much like the Zaps, but they were not redeemed before they left or as jurors. They gave the win to Vee over Neleh (excepting Zoe), and that was not a popular choice.
My feeling is that Zapatera as jurors are getting a more positive treatment, and we have been shown exactly why they don't want to vote for an Ometepe. Rob's method of discouraging new alliances from forming post-merge was effective, but on a personal level it was harsh. Very harsh. Basically it was "you wait on this side until we execute you and we're not going to treat you well" -- until Ome's rice was spoiled and then it was "we're merged and we share."
I know that my feelings about Zapatera did a 180 after those two episodes, and last time as well.
While we have been shown Rob saying that the heat won't come back on him about Zapatera being ostracized, he is wrong about that. Zap holds him accountable for all of it. They know he is the boss.
We have been shown a Rob who is becoming more Russell like in that he is no longer good at gauging the impression he's making in his social game. If he wanted to get votes from these people, he should have allowed mingling and he should have turned on his charm. He made a poor choice. While they hate Phillip the most, they dislike Rob the most after that.
I suppose with that I am making more of an argument for Rob making it to F3 and a Day of Reckoning.
Re Natalie:
I do hope that Jeff was simply marketing Natalie by saying he is impressed with her. He kind of stopped talking her up, so that's a good sign.
Re Matt and the money:
I would have to disagree because we haven't been shown that Matt has any internal conflict about the money. Matt applied for this show; he's not a recruit. His reservations are about lying and breaking promises, not about winning. He wants to show it can be won playing a clean game.
He doesn't know that Fabio basically did that in Nicaragua.
I know we all have our ideas about what Christian values are, but I think it's important to look at what we've been shown of Matt's values, of his dilemma.
Basically, he wanted out of the game for three reasons.
1) the rice diet at RI is worse than at camp, and he's wasting away.
2) it was so lonely during the pre-merge. It's like he's been held in solitary confinement for a good part of the game.
He didn't want to face another long ordeal of the same to get back in. It took everything he had to make it through the first six duels, and it was for nothing. But now he does have company all the time. Before he was alone for 2 out of the 3 days.
3) He felt intensely foolish letting Rob pull the wool over his eyes a second time. He felt deeply how much he had failed, after getting a second chance. Wouldn't most people feel defeated? (Other than Russell.) He needed to work through it. He was broken by the way Andrea backstabbed him as well (per Mike).
Now he needs to get into Revenge mode, as Forgiveness bombed. I think that we will see him get his act together starting with the family visit, which was foreshadowed last time through his confessional -- and only his confessional.
If Matt is going to do nothing but cry and whine the rest of the time, then I don't think he is a winner at all. If he can find his strength again, then I think he will end up with a good story.
Before Matt pulled his Twitter, I was reading it (no spoilers), and he seems a solid guy with a sense of humor. He doesn't talk God all that much either. If he wins a million dollars he will be fine with it. He can give some of it to charity. Tina managed! Before coming on Survivor, Matt modeled his hunk figure to make money for college. He is not an extremist.
I think that the isolation of RI has put him through a whole lot, and the editing is showing that. Survivor is real, not a picnic, changes your life. The producers like to be able to show that.
In contrast to Matt's journey, we have Rob who has done this so many times that it is pure game to him.
Will this season go to the gamer or to the journey player is the question. Hoping it is not to coattail rider again.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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05-01-11, 09:55 PM (EST)

198. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

LAST EDITED ON 05-01-11 AT 10:05 PM (EST)
While what you say may be what happens, I like to go with what is edited on the show and, on the show, the Zaps have praised Rob. They have given us no indications that they don't like him. It seems even that they blame everyone else for being blind.
(And, on a sidenote, they would be complete hypocrites to deny Rob the win when they did the exact same thing to Krista and Stephanie...and would have done the same to the Omes if they had gained the numbers)
As for redeeming a jury, I don't remember that ever being considered here. Maybe you have something but most players get redeemed when they leave the game regardless of their vote. Anyway, the last two episodes have been bad for Phillip, Natalie and Ashley as far as the Zaps are concerned.
On Matt, you are talking about the real guy, I am talking about a character.
His first confessional, the one that gave him a good first episode, was about his faith and his Savior. Then, his first RI confessional concentrated on winning money. Sure Matt would like the money, that is not what I am saying at all. The character we had seen wanted only to be close to his savior but now, we have seen him questioning God's intentions for him. There is a contradiction in his edit that an epiphany would resolve much more nicely, story-wise, than a victory.
ETA: A funny example of a juror getting redeemed on the way out but not voting accordingly: Denise had a poor edit in China but a nice final episode in which Courtney told us that Denise sucks at life. Still, Denise voted for Courtney!!

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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05-02-11, 00:29 AM (EST)

199. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

The reason I am talking about Matt the real guy is that I am talking of what he is capable of showing us before the end of the show. I believe Matt has it in him to be different, and I'm not convinced he will stay exactly the same for the duration. I think he has been going through a reaction to getting tossed again, and that he will rise to the occasion, and the edit will portray that.
The point about his attitude towards money is he hasn't given any material for them to make it bad for him to win the million, bad in the sense of negating his spiritual edit.
I think the part about winning money isn't consistent with his edit is from your own read of the religious angle, but isn't accurate as to Matt. Christians are actually very good about accepting donations, winnings, and making it part of God's plans. Look at Billy Graham.
There are many ways of living with a strong faith. I personally think Matt can turn it around. If he doesn't turn his attitude around, then he is not a winner, but it's too soon to call. The Family Visit edit is crucial. Either he will be done with the game after he gets it, or he will be revitalized.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-02-11, 09:35 AM (EST)

200. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Yes, I see your point, OFG, and I am in agreement. I see Matt as being renewed, most likely especially with the family visit. He'll reaffirm his commitment to honor his God, who clearly guides him to win the duels right up until he has to face the Robfadda for one more time. But, can he beat the Robfadda at the challenges? That will be the question. If he wins individual immunity X2, he'll land in the F3. So the match up, Matt vs. Rob will play out either before the F3, or at F3 with the jury. One way or the other it will play out, as least that's what I get from the editing of the show so far....perfect for the theme of the show. Either Rob will receive redemption for all of his prior losses, OR, Matt the Redemption Islander will be redeemed when he takes down the master of the game, Rob....either way, EPMB wins!
Clearly, your statement about Christians are actually very good about accepting donations, winnings, and making it part of God's plans. Look at Billy Graham.
Look at all the Tela-evangilists, and look at the Catholic Church...

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-02-11, 06:19 PM (EST)

202. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

I'll discuss Billy Graham when he gets on the show. I prefer to talk about what we've seen: The game is making Matt miserable. We know what makes him happy. Simple as that.
Anyway, it is clear that Matt received a lot of care from the editors. The comparison with Mike is striking. Therefore, we expect to see him back but the question is whether or not his edit is a winning one. I say it isn't for 2 reasons:
1- As the representative of this season's twist (one for which Jeff put his head on the chopping block before chickening out) Matt was always going to get a good edit. However, we have no comparison point to relate his edit to prior winners. The closest I can think is Sugar who spent a lot of time in her Sugar Shack that was itself a twist, the temptation of the season. Sugar had a very positive edit but in the end she was the enabler, not the winner.
2- Both of Matt's eliminations were justified by the editors. First, it was an example of Rob elevating his game. Next, Matt couldn't be trusted because he was dealing with both sides. That is what we have been told. Rob could have been villified for those votes, he was praised instead.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-02-11, 06:28 PM (EST)

203. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

>>> 2- Both of Matt's eliminations were justified by the editors. First, it was an example of Rob elevating his game. Next, Matt couldn't be trusted because he was dealing with both sides. That is what we have been told. Rob could have been villified for those votes, he was praised instead.
boy, I don't know if this is a gender bias, but I totally disagree. The Matt boot was where Rob lost my sympathy. Of course Zapatera guys praised him. It was politic to do so, but Julie spoke for my feelings when she said "poor kid." Rob's same weakness he always had, playing the game so hard he fails to look at the actual cost to human beings.
What the editors showed us was that Matt was sincere and ready to be loyal, and that Rob didn't consider that possibility for a moment.
We'll have to agree to disagree on that one. Nothing you can say will make me feel like that boot showed Rob in a positive light.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-02-11, 09:01 PM (EST)

204. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Why do you disagree. The part about Rob elevating his game and Matt dealing with both sides isn't my POV, it's what was said by Jeff in recaps.

As for your points; David said it in confessional so that wasn't politics. Mike first said it was a great move to David so, in that moment, it wasn't politics. And Julie's "poor kid" was followed with a confessional where she said those people were cold-blooded. She didn't blame Rob individually and, in fact, the latest episode showed she blamed Andrea more than anyone else.
And you seem to forget that we are in the post-Russell era. Being the Robfadda is not as bad as being the devil yet even the devil was voted fan favorite. Jeff even said he deserved to win.
Rob did vote Matt out. That has nothing to do with his edit because that is a fact. The important thing is how that fact was treated: Rob was called a genius for doing it, Matt told us he was dumb and Zapatera told us Andrea was to blame. Nice manipulation of the fact when the story could have put all the blame on Rob.
You wrote that "What the editors showed us was that Matt was sincere and ready to be loyal."
I saw that Matt first wanted to go with Zapatera. His plan was to eliminate Steve first and then, with Andrea, they would target Ometepe. I saw Matt foolishly tell that to Rob. How could Rob trust that Matt was being sincere. In fact, when Mike gave Matt a note, Matt once more considered both options.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 00:33 AM (EST)

206. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

michel,
I think one of the reasons we argue so much is that you cannot accept that editing is a process for manipulating feelings, but that ALL responses are valid, because they are feelings.
You argue things along the line of it is set in stone.
Then you talk down to me about how I'm forgetting this and that. I'm not forgetting. I'm attaching different weight to some elements than you are.
The politic part I was referring to was when Rob got congratulated. Of course the Zaps are players enough to recognize a good play, and at that point they didn't know Matt very well. However, the viewers had been journeying with Matt.
I will agree though that the editing didn't completely turn on Rob and his Ometepe until The Buddy System and Rice Wars.
Figuring out how the jury will vote is not the same as interpreting editing, but I do think in terms of jury that it is clear that the Zapatera don't like Rob's game. The cult aspect was over the top. David is between a rock and a hard place because he wants to vote for good game play but would prefer not to vote for Rob, only there's no one else.
You and I don't see the same things in the editing. Neither of us is always right. I am willing to let you see it your way, but I would ask the same of you. It's one thing if I'm going to be shown something and change my mind, but I already told you I'm not changing my mind on this one, and you STILL try to get me to agree with you.
It's really tough posting in this topic, because you won't tolerate any diversity of interpretation.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 01:25 AM (EST)

207. "IMHO"

LAST EDITED ON 05-03-11 AT 01:34 AM (EST)
I think argument and debate have a valid place. How valid that place may be in a thread devoted simply to analyses, I don't know, but yes we are all affected by the editing.
And it is sometimes amusing to see the language we employ (perhaps involuntarily) to reflect how we are affected.
Case in point: Andrea. What I see in her is a kid who tried to play a social game, Rob put on her an Amber to Matt's Rob perspective early on, none of this came from Andrea or Matt themselves, and yet the editing has played on it ever since. Matt turned to her as his most likely ally at the merge when he returned to the game, blah blah blah. It is in the editing and it is important, but what it reveals about her game should be kept in perspective because Rob created it and she didn't ask for any of it.
As for Rob's game, I think the editing is showing us how he loses. For all his experience in the game, most of it comes from All-Stars and from Heroes v Villains, not Marquesas. He has totally forgotten what it is to be a first and probably only time player, how to play with first and probably only time players, the adventure which goes beyond the game -- and his cold calculations are really just, at the end of the day, mean and desperate.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 07:38 AM (EST)

209. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Debating a point isn't intolerance. You are the one that said I was biased because of my gender. I never said anything like that to you.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 08:21 AM (EST)

210. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

We all have some bias that comes from our gender, although it is not identical in all. It's a filter through which we see the world. I was referring as much to my own bias as anyone else's. Bias was not meant to be a bad word there. It doesn't mean the same thing as prejudice.
There's nothing wrong with a good debate on the merits, but you also need to accept that other people disagree and they have a right to disagree. It's not enjoyable for me debating with you michel, and it feels like you're acting as the gatekeeper on this topic. It seems to work for people who agree with your premises, but not for anyone else.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 06:33 PM (EST)

211. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Gatekeeper? LOL! I simply express and defend my point of view.
You wrote: "boy, I don't know if this is a gender bias, but I totally disagree."
The "boy" certainly denoted exasperation on your part so I do not think you meant we both have biases.
I wanted it noted that I started by writing: "As for Matt, I think I know why they edited him that way..."
I think I know does not, in any way, mean I see it written in stone. We simply do not know the intent of the editors but it is a possibility. You answered by saying that Christians like money which made me question what that had to do with editing.
Next, I wrote that Rob could have been edited much more harshly than he was during Matt's exit. You first wrote that it had to be because I was biased. Then you wrote: "I will agree though that the editing didn't completely turn on Rob and his Ometepe until The Buddy System and Rice Wars."
That leaves me puzzled: The Rice wars and the buddy system had nothing to do with Matt's exit. They happened after Matt left. So, why talk about bias when you agree with me? Besides that, Rob looked like he was back in his old Happy Chappy days when the rice war started so how did that reflect poorly on him? I know that people don't agree with me (debating shows that I actually appreciate exchanging ideas with them) but you have to realize that I'm not always wrong!
Then, to dismiss my point, you wrote: "Of course Zapatera guys praised him. It was politic to do so.."
I refuted that by saying most of the praise wasn't verbalized to Rob, that it was between them or in confessional so it couldn't have been only politics.
You wrote back: "The politic part I was referring to was when Rob got congratulated".
Doesn't that mean you choose the data that suits your argument and ignore the part that doesn't? That, I wouldn't find acceptable.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 07:28 PM (EST)

213. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

never mind, michel! I will leave you to it ...

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 07:39 PM (EST)

214. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

LAST EDITED ON 05-03-11 AT 08:58 PM (EST)
For what little my opinion's worth, OFG is correct. When others project an idea, you're aggressive in shooting it down and can be argumentative. When others disagree with an idea of yours, you're quick to go into enormous detail to try and "force" us to see things your way. I don't see the same tolerance of others' views from you that others give to your views.
I've learned long ago that it's not worth getting into a debate with you and that's why I stopped after a few posts above as I no longer felt that my opinions were being welcomed (aggressively shot down, even) -- and OFG appears to be feeling that here as well, judging from her replies. There's no need to be aggressive and there's plenty of room for everyone's opinions, interpretations and alternative theories. You've got a strong opinion on certain posters and got an outcome in mind - why not let that stand on its own and let other people come up with their ideas without fear of it being out-debated? If we're wrong, then we're wrong. You've been wrong before and I've certainly been wrong before more than a few times - but I'd still like to be able to freely express my ideas and have fun doing so.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
05-03-11, 08:21 PM (EST)

215. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

LAST EDITED ON 05-03-11 AT 08:26 PM (EST)
I'll co-sign everything OFG & PePe are saying.
I too get the impression that michel thinks he "owns" this thread & he is very aggressive & defensive if anyone even appears to be disagreeing with his take on things. Look at my post re: the religious imagery surrounding Matt's edit -- my merely pointing out that michel got the religious stuff incorrect resulted in a PM to me telling me he "wasn't going to debate religion in this thread." LOL -- First of all, if I wanted to "debate religion" (which I do not & did not) in this thread, michel isn't going to stop me. Second of all, correcting a misconception about religion (seriously, michel wrote Matt is "testing God" for the love of all that is good and holy!) isn't debating anything -- it is correcting a fundamental misunderstanding about Matt's religion.
But, OFG is right -- we really should just let michel "have" this thread because that is what he seems to want.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 09:12 PM (EST)

218. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

LAST EDITED ON 05-03-11 AT 09:18 PM (EST)
The PM I sent you was intended to be very friendly. When I wrote I was not going to debate religion, it was certainly not intended to prevent you from doing it but simply that I did not want to argue.
ETA: I just read our exchange again and I wrote that I was apologizing if I had offended you and you replied that I had not. I am very surprised that you use it as an example of aggressiveness.
The testing God statement was also discussed in detail by many on the POS board so I was not alone.
I do not want this thread but it is here for discussion so I use it.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
05-04-11, 00:52 AM (EST)

220. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

LAST EDITED ON 05-04-11 AT 00:52 AM (EST)
I didn't say your PM did offend me -- and I wasn't offended by it. But I did take it as you being a "gatekeeper" on what could or could not be discussed in this thread -- which is why I basically posted a reply on this thread similar to the one I PM'd back to you.
And let's be honest here -- what you meant when you said you hoped you hadn't offended me was that you hoped you hadn't offended my religious beliefs (which, btw, you don't know what my religious beliefs) and, in fact, you did not offend my religious beliefs. You certainly did not mean, as you are trying to imply now, that you hoped you were not offending me by telling me what was or was not "appropriate" to be debated in this thread. (And, btw, I wasn't offended by that either -- I was amused by it, but not offended by it).
Also, I don't care how many people "agreed" with you that Matt was "testing" God that is the WRONG READING OF THE SITUATION. Point.Blank.Period. You can think it all you want but it doesn't make it true. I usually would not say this because I don't want to be harsh, but I'm stating a fact here & you keep stating your (misguided) opinion on this topic.
I also should have made it clear that I was agreeing with PePe's assessment of your aggressiveness with others in general & not that I thought you were aggressive with me personally.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 08:37 PM (EST)

216. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Pepe, you expressed that perfectly.
I have done some thinking on why debating with you, michel, is not fun for me, whereas I engage in debates all the time and do enjoy it. Aside from the aggression that Pepe mentions, this is what I see.
There is a way to disagree where one says "I see your points, and I agree with X, but here is my take on Y and Z. Keeping the disagreeing part focused on your support for your own opinion, rather than attacking the other person's opinion.
Where you cross over is that your arguments are laced with "you" points. You missed that. You got that wrong. You forgot that. You are fudging this. You are having it both ways. I've noticed that I get sucked into coming back with a "you are doing this" reply, and I don't like it.
In your most recent comment to me:
Doesn't that mean you choose the data that suits your argument and ignore the part that doesn't? That, I wouldn't find acceptable.
That style of debate is OK if the purpose is to discredit the other person altogether, and there's a place for that, but on this board we try to encourage each other's thinking.
I do disagree with you a lot here, and I'll tell you why and then be done with it. When this topic was started by Veruca, she made statements that showing such and such MAY INDICATE something. Over the seasons here, people have gotten into the habit of making sweeping statements that such and such definitely means this, and this has to happen, this other thing cannot happen, winners are ALWAYS developed in a certain way, winners NEVER get treated this other way.
I don't agree with all these absolute statements because my 22 seasons of observation has not shown me that all these things are so definite. I would like to bring back Veruca's style of tentatively noting that something may be of future relevance.
I also dislike the focus on who will win. If it's not a winner's edit, it doesn't matter. I liked it when we worked on all the stories of the season.
Lastly, I don't appreciate all the comments about "this is not relevant to editing." There used to be a certain latitude when Veruca actively hosted this topic. That kind of response is an illustration of what I call playing "gatekeeper."
Because this topic matters to me, I have stepped into the personal realm in this bit of OT to try to frankly communicate the basis for my discontent about what this topic has become. Perhaps I am alone in feeling this way, but I feel like I needed to explain why I take on your statements. It's not because I care so much who is right about the edits. It is the absolutism of the present editing tenets that disturbs me.
In any event, I don't come to Blows to argue, but it seems like 9 times out of 10 when I do respond to something you say, the reply will be argumentative in a personal way.
btw, I was NOT saying you had a special gender bias. My saying "boy" was a throwaway word and not a sign of my exasperation ... if anything it is equivalent to my saying, I'm confused or hmm, just throat clearing. I was admitting that I may have a gender bias that gives me a "softer" reaction in empathy with Matt, and I was in no way attacking you. Then I said I didn't mean you, and you argued with me to support your interpretation of what I meant to say:
The "boy" certainly denoted exasperation on your part so I do not think you meant we both have biases.
When a debate deteriorates to the point where it's down to "I meant this" only to get denied with "no you didn't, you clearly meant this other thing" -- it's time to end it. If you wonder why I don't engage in future, refer back to the post where you told me what I meant by my own words.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 09:57 PM (EST)

219. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

>There is a way to disagree
>where one says "I see
>your points, and I agree
>with X, but here is
>my take on Y and
>Z. Keeping the disagreeing
>part focused on your
>support for your own opinion,
>rather than attacking the other
>person's opinion.
Look at my post 196 and that was exactly what I did.

>Where you cross over is that
>your arguments are laced with
>"you" points. You missed
>that. You got that
>wrong. You forgot that.
> You are fudging this.
You wrote that the rice wars affected how viewers felt about Rob voting out Matt so, yes that was wrong!

>In your most recent comment to
>me:
>Doesn't that mean you choose the
>data that suits your argument
>and ignore the part that
>doesn't? That, I wouldn't find
>acceptable.
>
>That style of debate is OK
>if the purpose is to
>discredit the other person altogether,
>and there's a place for
>that, but on this board
>we try to encourage each
>other's thinking.
No, that was discrediting your message just like when you wrote "Of course they did, it was only politics". The "of course" was a way to discredit my argument so I replied in kind.
>When
>this topic was started by
>Veruca, she made statements that
>showing such and such MAY
>INDICATE something. Over the
>seasons here, people have gotten
>into the habit of making
>sweeping statements that such and
>such definitely means this, and
>this has to happen, this
>other thing cannot happen, winners
>are ALWAYS developed in a
>certain way, winners NEVER get
>treated this other way.
You must not be talking about me because I always question my own points and I've always said that there is no such thing as a single type of winner's edit.

>I don't agree with all these
>absolute statements because my 22
>seasons of observation has not
>shown me that all these
>things are so definite.
>I would like to bring
>back Veruca's style of tentatively
>noting that something may be
>of future relevance.
I also know that nothing is definite and I would like to read Veruca's post but she isn't here.

>I also dislike the focus on
>who will win. If
>it's not a winner's edit,
>it doesn't matter. I
>liked it when we worked
>on all the stories of
>the season.
Nothing prevents you from doing that and I also enjoy other stories but, in the latest seasons, we only have 3 or 4 developped characters. There's just so much I feel like writing about Phillip or Shambo while Matt has only one story since day 1.

>Lastly, I don't appreciate all the
>comments about "this is not
>relevant to editing." There
>used to be a certain
>latitude when Veruca actively hosted
>this topic. That kind
>of response is an illustration
>of what I call playing
>"gatekeeper."
I remember Veruca saying that Insider clips weren't for her. Nowadays, Jeff's blogs often border on spoiling material and it isn't part of editing so why bring it here. There is a thread to discuss what Jeff writes. Editing analysis is looking at what goes on during the 44 minutes of showtime.

>btw, I was NOT saying you
>had a special gender bias.
> My saying "boy" was
>a throwaway word and not
>a sign of my exasperation

I felt offended. Gender bias is a loaded comment, bordering on calling someone a caveman.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 08:57 PM (EST)

217. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

I am sorry you feel that way but I don't attack the messenger like you just did. Even this discussion was a friendly debate (look at my post 196 for example) until it derailed when I was said to be biased in favor of Rob because I am a man.

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suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-02-11, 02:11 PM (EST)

201. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Interesting thoughts on Andrea/Matt/Rob michel. I'm not riding the Matt bandwagon, he's only got Redemption wins going for him, other then that I've yet to see any game play or serious plotting.

A Tribe masterpiece

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-02-11, 11:29 PM (EST)

205. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

You're right Suzzee. RI is a place to play little games but it is not THE Game.

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Round Robin 2914 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest"
05-03-11, 03:15 AM (EST)

208. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

LAST EDITED ON 05-03-11 AT 03:19 AM (EST)
Still seems to me that Rob is getting a very RussHell-like edit, but 2 questions arise here: A) Will he continue to get that edit now that the Zaps have been Pagonged and they are down to nothing but old Omes, and B) How does the jury see things? We'll get more answers to these as the remaining episodes are shown, but unless Rob does a masterful sales job at final TC, if he even makes it there, I think there's a hell of a good chance he suffers the same fate as RussHell.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-03-11, 06:57 PM (EST)

212. "RE: Episode #11 - Observations:"

Yes, part of Rob's edit is very Russell-like but none of the Ometepes are edited like Natalie White.
Andrea could be the new Sandra and get sympathy from the jurors just because she tried to get rid of Rob but Julie and Mike told us that they saw her as betraying Matt to Rob.
Matt wins if he makes the F3 but, like I said, I see him on a Journey to find himself, not to find riches and Matt would not make the F3 with Rob.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-04-11, 02:44 AM (EST)

221. "enough is enough"

LAST EDITED ON 05-04-11 AT 09:35 AM (EST)
nm

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-04-11, 04:33 PM (EST)

222. "carry on"

I would like to apoligize if I allowed my own personal preferences to intrude on a fun bunch of head-butting. Like most everyone, I have my own personal preferences, and when I encounter a long thread dedicated to a particular purpose going off topic for what I consider to be irrelevent fight, particularly late in the season, I get frustrated because I feel I am wasting my time even opening it up to read. My bad, maybe, but I would prefer that a thread dedicating to editing analyses contain, you know, editing analyses. To the extent that some people elect to employ outrageous langauge in some effort to influence how people think, I elect to ignore it, even sometimes laugh at it, but take it anything except serious enough to derale a thread to fight over it. My bad. Carry on.

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-05-11, 04:39 PM (EST)

224. "RE: carry on"

I've replied to your PM, dabo. The thread was going off topic because of what was happening before I posted, I don't need to explain any further other than what's there in my PM or above - other than to say that we want to have as many people as possible being encouraged to post their thoughts instead of being shouted down.
That's all I'm going to say on this issue from here on. I've made my views clear.

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Naked 887 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
05-05-11, 05:25 PM (EST)

225. "RE: carry on"

LAST EDITED ON 05-05-11 AT 05:28 PM (EST)
LAST EDITED ON 05-05-11 AT 05:27 PM (EST)
I find that the editing this season has been put in place by the Evil MB just to make us uber-fans on SB argue with one another. We have to stop it, or the terrorist wins !!!
I have been watching this season, (as I do all seasons) as attentively as I can, and I personally believe that Rob is being edited as the winner this year. I have suffered disappointment's before, but after 22 seasons watched, I think that I am glimpsing a bit of the story telling...
Oh... I have been lurking for the past 17 seasons or so... Still been around but haven't had anything to say
VOTE NAKED 2012

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-06-11, 01:48 AM (EST)

229. "RE: carry on"

Woo-Hoo, it's Naked! Great to see you, dude, how goes the music biz? Very well I hope.
Pepe, thank you for your PM, it has helped me focus my thoughts. These editing threads need diversity, something I have always valued. There is simply no telling where a telling observation may emerge, I've seen them on gufu threads, in lvoe lists, in snarky summaries, in simply tons of places where people have been encouraged to speak their minds. An editing analysis thread should be the place to find diversity.
Instead of fighting let us, if we can, simply encourage more diversity in the future.
Speak your minds, everyone, speak your minds. Don't be afraid of being wrong or anything, I'm wrong a lots and it doesn't stop me. I'm also a big ham but that's mainly for the fun of it.

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Naked 887 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
05-06-11, 04:48 AM (EST)

230. "RE: carry on"

Good to hear from you as well Dabo.. Today was the first time that I saw the signature pic that you made for me in years. I kind of missed it as well as all of you fine people over here in SB.I will try and post more often then every 8 years or so from now on
Now. As I read on this thread earlier I think that Rob's confessional during the family visit was key editing in this season. It pointed strongly to me that he was the winner, otherwise, I think that there would have been a different slant on it. He is obviously the guy that we are "supposed" to root for this season.
VOTE NAKED 2004

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-06-11, 07:19 AM (EST)

231. "RE: carry on"

Dood, it's been a long time! Hope you are well, and still traveling on tour?
You could be right that the family visit editing highlighted Rob as the heavy favourite to be the Sole Survivor this season, and elsewhere, the argument has also been made that this could be a set up for Rob to fail as well. I will be interested to see how things unfold in the next episode with his comment: "The one thing I didn't want to happen, happened..."

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Naked 887 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
05-06-11, 04:28 PM (EST)

234. "RE: carry on"

No more tours for me... I am enjoying the home life in Dallas again. I am still working in the industry, but I have found a way to make it work from the home base. It is really nice to see you still here Pepe.
I may be using my own fandom of the Robfather to see his edit through rose colored glasses, but it just seems that without a win by him, then this season turns into a HUGE disappointment. I also felt a little foreboding as well when the clip of him saying everything that he has worked for 32 days was destroyed last week, but that turned out to be taken completely out of context this week. I am hoping that this weeks teaser quote is as well.
Again... It is so good to see everyone here.
VOTE NAKED 2004

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-06-11, 07:32 AM (EST)

232. "RE: Enough"

Thanks Dabo for the intervention. Even if you edited it, it was appreciated.
I've always been for diversity of opinions. Just look how many people responded to my "Andrea's Edit" post. That was great.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-05-11, 09:38 AM (EST)

223. "Week 12"

LAST EDITED ON 05-05-11 AT 10:43 AM (EST)
LAST EDITED ON 05-05-11 AT 10:11 AM (EST)
Interesting week for character development.
Steve. Gone to the jury now, of course. But he was one of the masterminds of Zapatera throwing the challenge all the way back in week 3, and literally he threw the duel. Nice and full circle storytelling, that. He was ready to go, obviously.
Reduction Island comes to fruition this week as we see there the development of the RI nuclear family. Mike becomes the stalwart big brother, leading by example. Ralph becomes the grumpy but practical provider uncle-father figure. Matt is still the struggling younger brother trying to find his way. Andrea will be joining them as the kid sister sweetheart. Any of these four is in position now to return to the game carrying the torch of the fallen. Still a stupid twist because of how much of the actual game it destroys, but it seems it can now bear fruit, as it were. Not worth it for all the bad that goes along with the twist, but at least something good might come out of it late in the game, a heroic figure.
The chances for an Andrea win in Survivor improve greatly now that she has been voted out. (Nevermind that that would be a preposterous statement were they actually playing Survivor this season, they aren't.) She had struggled in Ometepe, kept attempting to play the game, and did reasonably well except that her game was constantly being blocked by others. She was branded the lover (unfairly) and the social player (which she actually tried to do but with only limited success), while Rob's leader game, Phillip's goat game, bad decisions by Matt, and bad (at least for Andrea) group decisions in Ometepe kept her from gaining much traction. If she can now get back in the game she will be in a much stronger position.
On the Murlonio (meaningless) Island Rob is obviously going all out to win. His character was softened a bit by the introduction of the family factor, he's doing it for the wife and kids. Yippee! On the other hand, which of them aren't also playing the game for the friends and family back home, they are all equals and it is a genuinely meaningless factor in the game, but it plays well on TV. And he went all out practically killing himself to win the immunity challenge. That was gallant and heroic and damn good TV. Take a step back a bit, though, and ask why he should push himself so hard, drive himself to death, for a TV show. Especially since he has the HII to fall back on. (And Russell might have pointed out that Rob is a media creation, been on Survivor four times now, TAR twice, had a wedding special, has all these other media opportunities, hasn't held a real job in ten years).
The Phillip goat game had a major development this week as it turns out he has been role-playing and has a plan to go for the win at Final. Whether or not he can get to Final, doesn't matter at the moment, this editing gives him an exit strategy (which is where most role-playing games fail in Survivor). He can now go to RI and on to the jury as a misunderstood figure, or make it to the end, good storytelling no matter what.
The minor players had some interesting developments also. Grant now gets a strong family factor, a pregnant wife (ETA, actually a pregnant sister it seems, but not very clear as presented)!* He's the younger, better looking, more physically powerful, less objectionable follower Rob. Natalie is fully revealed as the kid, making a valient effort though she is in way over her head in this game, no matter what happens her psyche should be protected, comforted. Ashley really had no interesting development at all, her position is simply relative to the other stories being told, a very minor but necessary figure.
*Grant was probably smart not having his wife show up, I gather she is a rather stunning model/actress or something. ETA II: Looked her up, Christina Cox, and a yes wow.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
05-05-11, 05:46 PM (EST)

226. "RE: Week 12"

LAST EDITED ON 05-05-11 AT 05:47 PM (EST)
OT: re: Grant's wife Christina Cox -- she was just on NCIS with a guest roll! I saw that episode ("Freedom") of course, because I love Mark Harmon and, thus, love NCIS.
Her imdb page says she is also a stunt woman, so yeah, it probably was Grant not wanting everyone jealous because she certainly wouldn't have been too "chicken" to go out there (as I would be -- notice to any of my family members who might want to go on Survivor -- I ain't coming out to visit you).

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-05-11, 05:55 PM (EST)

227. "RE: Week 12"

Stellar and even-handed summation, dabo!
Loved the RI family dynamic.
I will say more on your reading when I'm not pecking on a phone.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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05-05-11, 08:13 PM (EST)

228. "RE: Week 12"

LAST EDITED ON 05-05-11 AT 08:45 PM (EST)
Nice to hear your take in here, Dabo!
Agree with Steve, that's for sure. We could stick a fork in him and call him done. I agree, he didn't even really try. Sad. I found him disappointing...but then again, I suppose I have found the large majority of the Zapatera tribe very disappointing. The two that I do favor are David and Mike. David and Mike wanted to be there, and scrambled to do their very best. Rooster wants to be there. But, all of them, with the exception of David and Mike, I hope, don't acknowledge any accountability for the position that they are in. And, I have a big problem with that.
Definitely agree that Mike is the older brother, or even father, while Matt is the youthful younger brother. Matt definitely needs an elder to follow, to look up to, to validate himself. He tried with Rob, and ended up booted. Now he has Mike. And, I think that will be very good for him. We heard him admire Mike doing the "right" thing with the family visitors. I thought Mike was great, granting the love where it would help the largest number of people. Mike is a formidable leader and human being. I would love to see him come back and take on Rob mano y mano...but, I still feel that the editing is leading us to the Matt vs. Rob conflict. The whole scenario with Mike winning and Matt looking on and admiring, really made me feel like Matt was there to learn how it's done...Mike is serving as the role model for Matt at this point. Matt is definitely the journey player for me, and that is why I don't see him winning.
I am sorely disappointed in that the RI people, who have been ejected from the game, get to have a tribe now on RI....it leaves a bad taste in my mouth...all the losers together just bonding with each other and bad mouthing the ones that outplayed them...
Andrea. I see her as the little sister as well, but she's still older than Matt....at least she's not so naiive. Andrea tried to play, but she too was afraid to make too many waves. She was blindsided with Matt's boot and played the only card she had....to work hard and not make waves and get along. She did well. But, she had an option with Phillip that she never explored. She threw all of her cards in with Rob. But, I also feel that Andrea was to immature a player to keep up with the likes of the seasoned veteran...She will have her reunion with her Island boyfriend. They will make peace and then she'll have come full circle.
I thought Rob, the fox, had a great episode last night. But, it worries me a little bit. We may have heard his winning quote. While everyone else is distracted at the end game, thinking of family, I remain more focused....I have been trying to win this game for 10 years, and I am going to give it everything I've got. He's going to do it for his family, his wife and child. The LOVE is what drives him, and we all love the love.
I had to edit to add the exact quote:
"I feel that right now I'm playing my best game. But even every thing that's happened up until right now doesn't mean anything unless I can finish it. I need this. It's to make a better life for my wife and my kids. Even though, we're at a point now where some people might be taking a break from the game. They're thinking about home. It just makes me focus. I want to win Survivor. This is something I've been trying to do for 10 years now. I'm eight days away so there's nothing thats going to stop me."
Now, that's a winning quote if I ever heard one! Rob is speaking from his heart. There is nothing cocky about it.
Then we see Rob go to the IC and indeed give it everything he's got. This season is his to lose. I have never seen someone play the game with the intensity that Rob plays it. I feel like this season has been a lesson in how to win the game of Survivor. With every move he's made, we hear his rationale. I see him having two more big obstacles to overcome....one is the RI returnee, and the other is the bitter jury. At this point I am almost more worried about the jury than I am the returnee. The jury does serve to cast doubt on his win...
Regardless, Rob got a stellar edit in this episode. He's focused on the end, and he is counting down the days. Is it the beginning of his winning ending, OR, is it the softening of his character before he's booted? I don't know.
Grant: Color me very surprised that Grant didn't get the boot this week, being exposed without the IN. I was so happy that Rob didn't even campaign for it. He's saving Grant to hopefully beat the RI returnee? If Rob and Grant are 2 out of the 4 that are planned to be at the F4, what does that tell the spa girls and Phillip...2 of them will be there, and neither of them will be able to beat Rob or Grant in a challenge that will follow.
Grant, the bear, really hasn't gotten anything special in the editing. He's a great guy, a great character, and a real challenge threat. He's Rob's right hand man. Because of his stellar character, he could win if he gets to the F3. But, he is showing us no plan for him to win...His brother in law gave him a shining review in the insider clips...if he were to be the winner, wouldn't we be seeing some of this in the show? Wouldn't we hear some of the daws discussing Grant in the show? Nothing...so, I don't think that Grant can win. I think he'll be out before the F3, because if he were there, he indeed could win.
Natalie: Finally, she got a confessional last night....is it the beginning of any kind of arc for her, or, could it be a spike before the boot? Her confessional told us why they were voting out Andrea. It appears that Rob really is committed to her...is she as committed to Rob?
Ashley: The biggest thing I see with Ashley is the adversity she shares with Phillip towards each other. I feel like this is a conflict that will be resolved before the Final TC. One of them most likely will be there, one of them will be voted off before. At least that's what I think. Ashley, really doesn't have any story either. She's seen as lazy. Funny, in the preview vidcaps she was over by Rob with the scissors, trying to cut stray facial hairs...LOL! Pretty much sums up her game.
We have really not heard any inside information from either spa girl as to how they plan to get to the finals and how they plan to win it. We heard a bit from Ashley in the Insider clips, but again, why wasn't it shown in the episode. She plans on taking Rob to the finals as she thinks the jury will be partial to her as he's already played the game before....fancy that, Rob will be her goat! Natalie just may get there, but what would she say to convince anyone that she was playing the game. We all know Rob threw her on his back and carried her the whole way through!
Phillip, the goat. Phillip really has played the game to perfection. He's a phenomenal goat, so much so that I question if he could win over the jury with it. He's shown us he's had a plan all along, he's orchestrated it to perfection, the only one that questions him is Rob himself. There is indeed a red flag with Phillip. I wonder if Rob won't cut him loose soon. I know he's been the decoy boot in a record number of episodes, so when it's finally time, we may all miss it. I think Phillip has stepped on way too many toes to win...
What I expect. It will all boil down to Rob's whim. And, we all know that Rob can indeed get paranoid. I think it will be Rob, Grant, and two of Nat/Ash/Phillip when the RI'r returns, which I predict will indeed be Matt. I think Rob and Grant will win the IC, and I think the conflict between Rob and Matt will finally be put to rest. The Ometepe core will vote out Matt. No place for a RI'er in F3 when they have a jury full of ex-RI'ers.
I bet that Rob will play his HII at the last TC where he can, but I question whether he will even have needed to play it. F3 will most likely be Rob, Nat, Phillip/Ash. I think Grant is not likely to see the F3, because if he did, I think he'd win, and I don't see him with a winning edit.
Now, the only question left to ask is will Rob win his argument in front of the jury?

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-06-11, 11:37 AM (EST)

233. "RE: Week 12"

LAST EDITED ON 05-06-11 AT 11:41 AM (EST)
Now, that's a winning quote if I ever heard one!
I really hope it isn't. But sadly, you may be right.
<sigh> I will be sooo utterly disappointed if Rob wins this. I am sooo sick of him. All I can hope for is that some of jury will remember that, as Dabo put it in the editing thread, "Rob is a media creation, been on Survivor four times now, TAR twice, had a wedding special, has all these other media opportunities, hasn't held a real job in ten years," and give the money to someone else if Rob is in the F3.

ETA: Oh, this is the Editing Thread. For some reason I thought I was posting in a different thread.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-07-11, 03:50 PM (EST)

235. "RE: Week 12"

It's nice to see that the party started!
Here are my observations:
During the recap, we heard that, since the merge, the former Ometepe tribe has been unstoppable.
(Rob told his tribe that they were guaranteed Final 6 and we had a confessional from Andrea saying it made sense to take out the Zapatera people)
The irony of the night’s vote is already starting
They won challenge after challenge… (Natalie shown, Grant, Andrea and Rob named)
…and whittled the former Zapatera tribe down to 2.
The only crack in their alliance appeared when Phillip’s antics got to be too much.
Andrea also came under fire when she continued to show an attachment to Matt.
(Ashley, in confessional was heard saying it would make sense to get rid of Andrea)
But, at the last Tribal Council, they took out Ralph and, in a second, surprise vote, the Ometepe 6 did what few alliances have done before: Stick together from the beginning and decimate an entire tribe.
Now they face their fiercest enemy yet: Each other!
Note that the recap focused on Ometepe as a whole and it was quite a glowing endorsement of their play. I did not however give credit directly to Rob.
Also noteworthy; it’s rare that an upcoming vote is presented so directly in the recap. It showed that the theme of this episode, of most of the season in fact, was
Being in Control

Redemption Island
Mike: (in confessional after greeting Ralph and Steve): “Redemption Island keeps on getting crazier and crazier.”
Steve also had a confessional, saying it was nice to see the faces of his friends instead of the Ometepe tribe.
Ralph: “I see daylight ahead now. If one of us Zapatera guys makes it to the F3, we’ve got this thing won. I want to be that guy so I’m going to give it all I’ve got.”
It was interesting to hear Mike say that himself and the other 3 guys were going to be members of the jury even if they were not there yet. At least Ralph was a little less fatalistic. Unfortunately for them. Mike sounded prophetic.
Camp
Night 30
Andrea: “Tribal Council was pretty much amazing because, in one tribal Council, we got rid of the remaining two Zapatera members. So, now it’s just the Ometepe 6! It’s a little scary that we have to take out one of our own but it’s a little bit exciting because, for the last five votes, we have been on cruise control so now we can actually get back into game mode. I’m excited!”
This is a bit cruel. We noted in an earlier episode that Rob had never stopped playing the game so this confessional showed that the reason Andrea was voted out was because she had stopped being in game mode.
Natalie was having a difficult moment but she didn’t want anyone to think she was crying because she didn’t want to be there.
Natalie: “I think I started to get emotional because now we have to start knocking everybody off. From there, I started thinking about home and missing my family, missing my friends, missing regular life.”
Rob: “There has been times out here where Natalie has been mature beyond her years and then there’s been other times when her youth just shows through. She’s 19 and being out here for 30 days, it takes it’s toll on you. It’s critical for me, to comfort her. I mean, she’s my main alliance in this game and I want to make sure she’s alright. I’ve got 8 days left, 8 DAYS! I just have to keep everybody happy and, as long as they don’t start talking to each other and realize that I’m the one that should be going, I’ll be all set.”
For Natalie, that was a nice scene where we finally got to know something about her, connect with her but the main purpose was to introduce the family visit.
For Rob, it was an example of knowing what to say to people and always thinking about the game.
Then, as Rob said he feared they would talk to each other, we saw Phillip, the potential loose-cannon, sitting alone, as if to show he wasn’t about to start talking to anyone.
Sprint Mail
Ashley: “We got tree mail this morning and we got a box…We got a message about the duel that we sort of discarded because it also said: Check videos…Natalie was a little upset after we got out of Tribal so it was perfect timing for her and really for all of us. It’s day 31 and you feel exhausted but when you hear from home, it lifts your spirit so much and it was a really, really good surprise.”
Ashley keeps getting the nice confessionals that go with the rewards which doesn’t match with the negative way that she was portrayed most of the time. It seems to be an example of having to make sure she isn’t a fan favorite but not destroying her character either.
Redemption Island
Matt: “Tree mail today…We’re going to see videos from our loved ones.”
Mike: “I’ve never gone for 31 days without being able to speak to any of my family, even when I was in the Marine corps…”
Matt: “I just saw my brother…It makes every struggle I’ve gone through worth it. If there is a chance I can spend time with my brother, I will do anything I can today.”
The Challenge
Contrary to the previous episode, Matt waved to Andrea.
Mike was the first to break 4 tiles, Steve was eliminated.
Mike had a decision to make:
Mike: “…Jesus was asked: Of all the commandements what are the greatest and he responded: Love your brother like you would love yourself. I think if I give the most good to the most people and make friends from enemy, I think that’s the only play here.”
Jeff could hardly believe that Mike was giving it to the people who had decimated his tribe.
Mike’s mom wasn’t surprised by his decision and she was proud of him.
The tribe thanked Mike and he simply said: “Don’t vote me off again.”
Redemption Island
Ralph: “I would have accepted if Mike had kept his mother… No hard feelings whatsover. I’m sure he’s hoping to win the million dollars and pulling in more votes. He let the families with that 6. That really pissed me off. I think it was stupid…”
Matt told Mike that he couldn’t have done that. He added: “I wouldn’t have given them ___”
Mike replied: “I asked God to help me win and I think that’s what He asked of me.”
Mike: “The decision I made today was not a strategic one, it wasn’t to earn the good graces of the Ometepe tribe. It was just the right decision to make and the right thing to do. If I make it deep in this game and it earns me a vote or two on the jury, you know, that will be a great bonus. I feel bad for Matt… and for Ralph…but I’ve apologized to them for it and that’s the best I can do. It’s hard for me to know that I let my friends down but it is what it is.”
We then had a nice overhead shot of Mike standing alone on the beach, suggesting he was standing tall in the face of adversity, accepting the situation. It made me realize that he could be taking over Matt’s story by enabling the younger man to see what it really means to do good. According to Matt himself, Mike did more in that moment than he had done in the whole time he had been out there.
Camp
Ashley: “Walking into camp with our loved ones feels so surreal. I got to show my mom where I was living and it was everything I needed and so much more.”
We had snippets of Phillip with his sister and Andrea with her dad.
Grant: “It is so motivating…it’s priceless…”
Natalie: “I’ve never been away from home more than two weeks and I talk to my mom everyday. It was so good to see her and for her to tell me how she’s proud of me and how my family is doing back home. It made me feel like I can do it and I can push through the next 7 or 8 days.”
Phillip told his sister that what worked for him was to act crazy.
Phillip: “Just seeing my sister and seeing her confidence in me, empowered me and renewed me at another level to continue to dominate…continue to dominate, and be who I am.”
Just as he put his feather back on, we heard Rob telling his sister that “Phil is a nutjob but he is the biggest goat because he’s pissed everybody. But you have to adjust your strategy day by day. Grant thinks it’s me and him. Natalie thinks it’s me and her and all they have to do is talk to each other but they won’t.”
Rob: “I feel like right now, I’m playing my best game but even everything that’s happened up until right now, means nothing unless I can finish it. I need this. It’s to make a better life for my wife and my kids. Even though we are at a point now where some people might be taking a break from the game and thinking about home, it just makes me focus. I want to win Survivor. It’s something I’ve been trying to do for ten years now. I’m 8 days away so there’s nothing that’s going to stop me.”
This confessional clinches it in my mind. Some will say it sets him up for a fall but I am certain that isn’t the intent here. Jeff has been saying that Rob is playing a great game, now Rob says it’s his best ever and nothing in the edit contradicts that. Setting him up for a fall would mean that this confessional was all for irony but I think the editors, as much as they love irony, are showing respect for a player that has given them great material over the years. Letting us see him holding Amber’s picture, hearing him talk about his need to win this after trying for 10 years while others are clearly shown losing focus, is a sign that we are shown that this is the way to play this game.
Day 32
Andrea arrived with tree mail.
Rob: “This morning, we got tree mail. It looks like another immunity challenge. Tonight, I feel like it’s not going to be too difficult. The vote will probably go towards Andrea. She’s great at the challenges and strategically, she probably knows more about this game than everyone except Grant and I. Therefore, she’s got to go. My sister gave me a shirt with Amber and my daughter Lucia on it and I will work my ##### off to make sure Andrea doesn’t win immunity.”
The Challenge
Once again, we had a little exchange between Jeff and Natalie, this time about the apparent difficulty of the challenge.
Rob was shown when Jeff said they would need to use whatever they had in their tank.
When Jeff commented: “Rob is struggling up these steps. He is carrying his family on his back” and when we saw him collapsing after his win, it reminded me of his heroic challenge in Samoa where he carried heavy cubes on his back to lead his tribe to victory after passing out in camp.
With Phillip nowhere close to winning the challenge and no one telling her that they were voting against Grant, I wonder what Andrea was thinking when she saw Rob pushing himself so hard. Watching from home, she must have realized how determined he was to get her out and that would have made her feel better but wasn’t it evident that she was the target? As for Rob’s story, he didn’t let this tough challenge stop him. Coming right after that key confessional, we can say the last few days won’t be as easy as he thought but he will get to the end.
Camp
Rob: “Physically, the challenge; I had to litterally give everything I have. Afterwards, I thought I was going to die but I figured I am 7 days away and I’m giving everything I got. There are two main things I gained from winning immunity today. Number One: I’m not going home no matter what and, number Two: All my options are opened and I can decide who is going home.”
Natalie: “Tonight, we are going to vote out Andrea. She is one of the strongest competitors in the challenges plus, her relationship with Matt on Redemption Island is still a threat. It will be a shock to her, I think but there is no more Zapatera left at camp so she needs to go.”
Andrea was trying to see if everyone was on the same page and voting out Phillip.
After reassuring her that they were voting out Phillip, Grant told the tribe that “lovers are going to be reunited.”
Then, of course, Phillip had to create suspense! He started tearing down the Zapatera shelter to use it as firewood.
Rob told him: “Somebody’s gonna come back from Redemption and I don’t want them sleeping next to me.”
That tells us the kind of reception that awaits the returning player. Harsh but it probably has to be that way. Rob’s use of the word “them” also tells us that they think more than one player could be coming back.
Rob: “We are all set on voting off Andrea and then, all of a sudden, Phillip regains his spot in our tribe as annoyance number one! He makes everyone crazy.”
Phillip: “I could be wrong but I’m not concerned about going home tonight because early on in the game, I made myself the villain. Everyone in my tribe thinks that their best chance of winning against anybody is me! It’s brilliant strategy and I need to put salt on that wound every now and then to make sure people don’t forget that. I think that Rob feels very strongly that, if it’s him and I in the finals, that he can win the million dollars but I have an oral argument that nobody here on my tribe including him has thought of it. I know exactly what to say to make everybody think twice about voting for him. Regardless of everything else I’ve said. Honestly, I think I can defeat Rob”
That feeling Grant has had in his stomach since day one could be contagious and infect all the audience if Felipe wins but the thing I wrote above about irony? I think they wouldn’t use it on Rob but Felipe is fair game and then some! This confessional reminded me of Palau James’ unbreakable knot!
Grant and Rob where talking and Rob mentioned that he hadn’t trusted Phillip since day one.
Again with day one! Maybe the editors think we can fall for their cloud of smoke!
Rob: “To be honest with you; I’m having second thoughts about who I want to sit with at the end. If I were to keep Phillip around, he’s terrible in challenges, he’s a goat so he’s the perfect person to take to the end. At the same time, Phillip could be playing me. He’s pretty good with words, he’s a good speaker so, when it comes down to the jury, he could be a problem. Is he that good? I don’t know. On the other hand, Andrea’s a competitor. If she sits at the end, she could possibly beat me. If I make the wrong decision, 32 days of hard work could be gone just like that.”
Tribal Council
Jeff asked Andrea if she felt safe.
Andrea: “ I feel confident in the relationships that I’ve built within the Ometepe 6 so I feel safe tonight. You can never be certain but, as of now, I feel like I am trusting the right people.”
Asked if TC was frightening, Natalie said: “It’s a totally different Tribal Council tonight. It’s nervewracking, it’s scary and it’s definitely not fun tonight.”
When Jeff pointed out that he had done as poorly as Natalie in the last challenge, Phillip made excuses: “Clearly, in that event, I was out of my league. I’m hoping for something that would require upper body strength...”
Jeff interrupted him saying that a reason to keep him is that he isn’t a threat so he was surprised that Phillip was claiming to be a huge threat. With that, Jeff went back to Andrea, saying she had shown she was competitive and could be a target.
Still not seeing the warning signs, Andrea answered: “I realize it’s an individual game but we also want to keep our tribe strong because, whoever returns from Redemption, we need to beat them.”
Isn’t she a good little daughter, following Rob’s directives to the bitter end!
Grant went on about his true self and that some people put on fronts but you can tell they are being fakes just to win a million dollars.
Phillip said it was possible to make it to the end by being truthfull. He described himself as the senior statesman of the tribe which got amused reaction shots from Grant, Rob and David. He concluded by saying: “I don’t know for sure but I think I’m a guy you like to keep around.”
Jeff asked if anyone felt insecure at that moment.
Shockingly, no one raised their hand!
Jeff pointed out to Rob that the solidity of their alliance had enabled them to destroy the other tribe but it now meant someone would be blindsided.
Rob said: “It is a tough decision tonight but I feel a whole lot better with this around my neck. If Grant had won tonight or anybody else for that matter, I would be feeling it.”
That is a good argument right there to start building his case to the jury: The one in charge isn’t dumb enough to feel secure without immunity.
When the 3rd vote was revealed and it finally dawned on Andrea that she was going, the jury realized it and we heard Dave saying: “She got blindsided.”
As she reached for her torch, Andrea could only say: “Tricky, tricky.” Of course, the camera went to a smiling Rob.
Jeff left them saying he expected there would be other blindsides.
The Story

Andrea’s words in confessional on her way to Redemption Island summed up very well the story of this episode: “Obviously, I’m a little bitter. All of them, except for Phillip, looked me in the eye and said that they were voting for Phillip and then, somewhere during the day, they went behind my back and said they were voting for Andrea. It’s a little hard to be with these people for 32 days and have these relationships and what you think is trust only to find out that they have been lying to you the entire time.”
It tells us two things: First, she blamed the whole tribe, not just Rob. Second, it reminded us that, indeed the game is always on. It only takes a moment to go behind someone’s back and destroy the work of 32 days. Rob’s way is the right way and Andrea was unable to see it.

The Characters
Ralph: He is the one that had the best strategic confessional of the players on Redemption Island when he said he saw daylight and wanted to be the guy returning because that guy could easily win. So, he still has a chance to be that dumbass that finally wins this game.
Unfortunately, he also had the least redeeming confessional, being the one that called Mike’s decision stupid. Even if Mike’s decision was stupid, even if showing Ralph’s confessional has no effect on future challenges, I think the editors would portray the returning player as a “good guy”.
Andrea: I found it interesting that we had what amounted to last words from Andrea instead of the traditional “Hello!” to the Redemption Island crowd. Is it possibly because Andrea’s arrival will not go as expected? Grant said the lovers would be reunited, Matt was even showed waving at her during the latest challenge but Andrea could be angry at him. Matt, in effect, ruined her game so part of her bitterness could be directed towards him. She said he threw her under the bus to Rob so maybe she considers that is the only reason that she was blindsided.
Her portrayal from the merge on, showed someone that was totally dependant on Rob and it explains her every move. All the pre-merge hints that she would get revenge were fabrications, manipulations to put doubt on one player’s chances: Rob. In reality, her story ended when she saw Matt bonding with Krista, when she realized she couldn’t trust him and had to go with Rob.
Matt: It seemed that the scene on Redemption Island after the challenge, showed Matt what it was like to follow the words of Jesus. Now, facing Andrea, especially if she is angry, Matt will have to decide on his path: Continue striving to win a game or make good, love your neighbor like you would love yourself. Matt’s story could find its end on Redemption island after all.
Mike: He now looks like the powerhouse and the biggest character on Redemption Island. However, they had to give him airtime after making such a crucial decision. The true editing decisions were to ignore his arrival on RI and to make his earlier confessionals about Matt rather than himself. It’s possible that those choices were made so that the viewers don’t grow too attached to Mike when he does come back, loses immunity and gets voted right back out of the game. It could also be to show that Mike will be Matt’s guide, the one that, by example, leads him back on the right path to complete his journey.
At least, this episode made the game analysis very clear: No one will team up with the returnee. Andrea was planning on beating that person, apparently even if it had been Matt. No more talk of a possible Phillip, Andrea, Matt coup against Rob.
Phillip: So, the secret agent has a secret weapon! Despite the fact that he doesn’t have a chance of getting any votes, his words work nicely to the audience that thinks the jury almost always makes the wrong decision. Even if his argument could be delivered from the jury, Phillip’s story points him directly to the F3. He has already outlasted every man on Zapatera and he will (probably) not leave the game before both Ashley and Natalie. Some of his words have been prophetic, some utter garbage!
Ashley: Her negative game confessionals are balanced by positive reward narration. The reason for that is probably in response to the horrible edits some young women have received. Ashley has “played” a good game, at least she is in a solid position, and she hasn’t been complaining all the time so she is rewarded with some nice face time…but not too much since she doesn’t win. Going up against Phillip, Ashley could possibly have been edited as a sweetheart but then the audience would have been rooting for her. That tells us she either gets voted out by Rob or loses the final vote against him. I think the former is more likely.
Grant: Now, we hear that Grant knows how to play this game so he could have had a much more substantial edit, especially since he seems destined to make it through the next round. A player without a story, especially an apparently nice guy like Grant, will not make it to the F3. His edit really showed him as Rob’s Assassin as Phillip aptly named him. When his job is done, so will his story.
Natalie: She finally received a little more substance to her story and showing her emotional lapse was nicely treated, Rob’s confessional even made the audience realize it was normal. For someone that was given an end-game connection as far back as episode #2, she doesn’t have any jury connections. We simply haven’t heard any player except Rob and Phillip talk about her. Viewers scoring from home will have a blank scouting report about her possible votes. That in itself creates doubt but we usually hear other players talking about the future winner.
Rob: This season, the story showed us how to play the game. Rob was the obvious front-runner from the start and the editors were counting on 21 seasons of history and many less than good endings to create suspense. The emotional and personal confessional that we saw during the family visit looked like the ones reserved to winners like Tom, Yul, Todd and JT.
I remember writing that Kenny’s confessional during the family visit, being only about strategy, was bad for him so why wasn’t Rob’s? The themes of the seasons are different: In Gabon, “Good versus Evil” made it negative to plot someone’s demise during such an happy occasion. This season, one of the themes has been that the game is always on so Rob’s confessional fit perfectly in that theme.

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
05-07-11, 05:16 PM (EST)

237. "RE: Week 12"

Regardless of any disagreements, I do really appreciate the work you put into these, michel & I always find value in them.
One thing though -- I wouldn't put any stock in Rob using the word "them" in his statement: "Somebody's coming back from Redemption and I don't want to be sleeping next to them." The improper use of the plural pronoun "them" (in connection with the singular noun "somebody") is just lazy English that people use all the time & most don't even know they are wrong. Seriously, do you think Rob knows he should have said "Somebody's coming back from Redemption and I don't want to be sleeping next to him or her"?
If Rob (and the rest of the remaining players) actually thought there was a possibility that more than one person was coming back from RI, Rob would have said "People are coming back from Redemption" instead of "Somebody."

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
05-07-11, 04:32 PM (EST)

236. "RE: Week 12"

LAST EDITED ON 05-07-11 AT 04:56 PM (EST)
I love your take on Episode 12 dabo & I can't find any areas of disagreement. I especially love your RI nuclear family dynamic:
Reduction Island comes to fruition this week as we see there the development of the RI nuclear family. Mike becomes the stalwart big brother, leading by example. Ralph becomes the grumpy but practical provider uncle-father figure. Matt is still the struggling younger brother trying to find his way. Andrea will be joining them as the kid sister sweetheart. Any of these four is in position now to return to the game carrying the torch of the fallen. Still a stupid twist because of how much of the actual game it destroys, but it seems it can now bear fruit, as it were. Not worth it for all the bad that goes along with the twist, but at least something good might come out of it late in the game, a heroic figure.
I agree with FloPo, though -- that I definitely see Mike as being the mentor for Matt -- Matt's conflict has been his ability to play this game while staying true to his faith/character -- Mike is showing him how. Also agreeing with FloPo that Matt is the journey character, so I don't see him winning although I do think he is the one coming back (again) from RI.
It is kind of funny how all of the characters left on RI are being "redeemed" somehow -- we get to see what a strong, great, caring guy Mike is (instead of the non-entity he appeared to be on Zap); we have sympathy for Matt even after being booted twice (ie, we don't think it is because he is a dumb/bad player, we just think he is a naive, nice kid); we see Steve falling on his own sword in an ironic twist to his throwing the challenge with the Zaps because they were "so strong" (lesson in humility = redemption, IMO). I'm pretty sure Andrea will able to redeem herself for "betraying" Matt (even if she meets with resistance at first -- but redemption should never be easy). I don't know if we are really seeing Rooster "redeemed" though, which is making me think he is the next to go to the jury.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-07-11, 05:59 PM (EST)

238. "RE: Week 12"

Excellent assessments as always, michel!
Note that the recap focused on Ometepe as a whole and it was quite a glowing endorsement of their play. I did not however give credit directly to Rob.
Also noteworthy; it’s rare that an upcoming vote is presented so directly in the recap. It showed that the theme of this episode, of most of the season in fact, was
Being in Control
Well said. Ometepe was seen as the one in control and we know under Rob's guidance, they have managed to do what few tribes have done, and that was to decimate the entire other tribe. It spelled out the pecking order as well. Andrea was identified as being lowest on the pecking order, and indeed, they stuck to their plan. Sets up nicely if the next one to go is Phillip.
With the talk of Rob having second thoughts on who to take to the end, "Grant thinks it will be he and I, Natalie thinks it will be she and I, Phillip is the perfect goat to sit next to at the end"....all of this talk makes me wonder if Rob knows that it will be an F3 at the end, or does he think it's going to be an F2?
Once again, the only one who admitted that they would be indeed scared of the vote if they were not wearing the IN, was Rob. Everyone else there was not scared. Once again, it is underlined to us that this is a bunch of novices playing with the 4X veteran of the game. No contest...
I really agree with your assessments of Rob, but I am not as sure at all....this is Survivor, and there are more twists and turns to come. Clearly, Rob is the favored one in the editing. But, we all know that they love to cast doubt. Time will tell!
I wanted to add very astute observation about the daws on RI, Kiki! Indeed, you are right. I hadn't stopped to think about that. You also raise an interesting point regarding Ralph, the one that really has not gotten a redeeming edit there...could be next!

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-07-11, 09:50 PM (EST)

240. "RE: Week 12"

I see Ralph as the one who still has his head in the game instead of into Christianity. He probably is going first, but I don't think it is bad of him to be unforgiving.
Personally I was yelling at Mike when he decided to give Ometepe the visit. Well, mostly I was yelling at the producers for not letting him win a challenge and enjoy it, really making it impossible for him to reap the rewards, but secondarily I was aggravated with Mike.
I totally liked that Rooster said he wouldn't have given those guys squat. This is Survivor, not Church.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-07-11, 09:30 PM (EST)

239. "RE: Week 12"

Interesting read, Dabo.
First, since you address RI in terms of family, you may be interested in reading Lady V's thread at Sucks which I mentioned earlier. Here's a link:
http://survivorsucks.com/topic/2413/Family-Final-Four
(I only skimmed it so I'm not sure on what page RI starts)
From my understanding, they don't consider Ralph as a father. He had some traits of a father, being the provider, but he always talked in the first person singular. A father or a mother talks using "we".
Zapatera, as a tribe, was a failed family: David called Sarita the tribe mom but she was too prissy to be a true mom and she turned on her "daughters". Julie didn't have a family role and, since confusion of role seems to be deadly, she had to go.
Ometepe, despite lacking a mom, was a much more stable family with Rob as the single dad, Phillip as the eccentric relative and everyone else being siblings fighting for Rob's attention. Now the sibling war started.
You write: "Take a step back a bit, though, and ask why he should push himself so hard..."
Editing-wise, he told us why he was pushing himself so hard: He was going to work his @ss off to make sure Andrea wouldn't win it. Andrea was close to winning and Rob doesn't want to break-up his nice family order until he really has to. The siblings were in agreement to vote out Andrea, that was an incredible opportunity. Note that Grant didn't seem to agree with Rob when Phillip's name was mentioned as possible alternative boot. That told Rob that Grant feels safe for one more round. Feeling safe, Grant is even less likely to mount something against Rob.
As for Andrea being in a better position, she still has to win the RI challenge and then the immunity challenges. Would she have been edited as a lost child if she was going to make such an incredible comeback?

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-08-11, 02:05 AM (EST)

241. "RE: Week 12"

Editing-wise, I didn't see it as Rob needing to boot Andrea, he just wanted to. She had been set up in the previous episode as the contingency option, the preferable boot if an Ometepe had to go, which was smart planning. So, yes, she was obviously a preferable boot for the first Ometepe eating its own boot, though not the only one. There was really no reason for Rob to practically kill himself winning the II to prevent her from getting it, he has the HII to fall back on and had other options for an Ometepe boot.
As for Andrea being in a stronger position to win, of course it does depend on her winning RI to return to the game. Whoever returns to the game from RI will land in the middle of an Ometepe that has been eating its own, if it is Andrea she might actually find herself in a successful game position for a change.
For all the people who like Matt, well yes he is a likeable guy; but he's just a horrible player, he is almost practically guaranteed to mess it up again if he returns again.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-08-11, 02:10 AM (EST)

242. "RE: Week 12"

but the way the game played out, no one coming back from RI has a shot at any traction in the game. Back at the start, I envisioned there might be factions at the end, as in a normal game. One person who had been booted might then realign with a minority, presumably a minority looking to get Rob out.
However, it doesn't work like that with all the RI people getting to schmooze the jury. RI returnee is pure poison. Only way to get to end is win two immunities . Doesn't matter if it's Mike, Matt, or Andrea.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-08-11, 02:35 AM (EST)

243. "RE: Week 12"

LAST EDITED ON 05-08-11 AT 02:43 AM (EST)
Couldn't have said it better.
As for Rob's HII, he'd be much better not to use it. If he had used it, he would have shown he didn't trust his alliance, he would have shown he had been lying all along and, for one, Grant would have been pissed that he let him have 5 votes at the merge without giving him protection. The HII should be a last recourse because, if Rob uses it, he will need to win every immunity after that.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-08-11, 03:00 AM (EST)

244. "RE: Week 12"

Of course it is better to not use the HII if you can get away with not using it. But the whole point of RI is to send someone back into the game who can get to the end by winning the immunities. And have a big favorable with the jury.
Stupid stupid twist.

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parathor 250 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
05-08-11, 02:46 PM (EST)

245. "RE: Week 12"

An option for using the HII: F3, when Rob delivers his speech to the jury. "Hey, I've got the HII... found after one clue. Never used it - that's how good I am..."

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-08-11, 06:35 PM (EST)

246. "RE: Week 12"

I agree. And the only reason he would need to play it at F5 is if two of his former Ometepe were to gang up on him.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-14-11, 07:26 AM (EST)

247. "Week 13"

LAST EDITED ON 05-14-11 AT 07:30 AM (EST)
Week 13. The battle was only beginning for the 6 remaining Ometepe tribe once they defeated all of the Zapateras. Rob cut deals with everyone...as long as they all think they have a peice somewhere, he'll be all set...and they all believed him. Then we see Grant trusting Rob, and then the lazy spa girls shown together, pairing up, and Crazy Phillip thinks he's the best bet to take to the end. Despite their different strategies, they all felt that Andrea was the best bet to target first...they all banded to gether to blindside the first one of their alliance. At RI, she must face her former ally, Matt, to get back in the game. Back at Ometepe, the easiest vote is done and there is no place left to hide....
The thing I saw as telling in this episode was how Matt was edited when he was reunited with Andrea. He reacted horribly to her. Sure he was angry, but he only had himself to thank for that. Andrea was spot on in her comeback, if you ask me. Where is the accountability for getting yourself voted off again, Matt? And, is that how God would like you to receive your ex-tribe mate? Matt acted in an ungodly fashion, if you ask me....not very positively.
So, the Ome's are going to eat each other now. Sets up nicely that the one guy that is featured saying the only one he trusts out there is Rob, and he's the one blindsided. Is this a huge mistake for Rob? Or no?
Here is how I see the editing of this season. Clearly Rob was one of the stars of the season, and he was on fire. He played this game 100% from start to finish. This season was a lesson, an introspective, imo, on how to attack the game of Survivor. We were privy to Rob's thought processes throughout, and we saw him execute his plan to perfection. He plays the game as the producers of the show intended, but what still remains to be seen is can he win?
I feel like the only one that has close to a winning edit is Rob. For the life of me, I can't see any other edit as winning. The ONLY other character with some development, imo, is Phillip. Could Phillip pull it out? I don't think so, I think he crossed a line with the racial accusations, especially since who he accused is sitting on the jury...he may get Ralph's vote.
Ashley - no way - lazy spa girl, coat-tail rider
Natalie - no way - ditto with Ashley
Matt - don't think he will get to the finals.
Mike - no edit to support him getting back into the game
Andrea - her arc came full circle when she came face to face with Matt on RI, and we all know Matt showed his true colors at that point...
Several conflicts to still be resolved:
Ashley vs. Phillip: One will make it to F3, one will not, imo. Most likely Ashley will fall short
Rob vs. Matt: Will play out when Matt is returned to the game. Matt is the one that I perceive will be returned to the game as per the editing. Matt is the journey player and will be eliminated at the first opportunity. This reunion with Rob is one of the major conflicts of the entire season. But, Matt as the journey player, will find his match, and learn his lesson. It isn't a godly thing to use God to find a million dollars. I think he'll most likely be voted out at the very first opportunity. Conflict resolved.
Rob vs. Phillip: This is most likely the largest conflict of the show...it will be resolved at the final TC. We saw Phillip plan to take out Rob and be the leader in the first episode. We saw how Phillip "played" Rob. We heard his strategies as we went along, first with Andrea, then later with the crazy act. We know he thinks he can beat Rob on his argument in the Finals, and we have heard Rob say, is Phillip "that good"... As I noted above, however, I think Phillip will indeed fall short. I think Rob will finally win the prize and the title of sole survivor.
If Phillip is being tooted as the one that could land the biggest surprise ever at the final TC, then I think Rob's chances are stellar!

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kiki_k 1444 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
05-14-11, 12:16 PM (EST)

248. "RE: Week 13"

I agree with everything you write here & with your ultimate conclusions. I especially agree that Matt's reaction to Andrea was very, very wrong. However, I do need to point out that, although I agree with you about it, I think the average viewer is supposed to agree with Matt & empathize with him -- Andrea is the Judas character to his Jesus.*
It doesn't matter that Andrea is not, in fact, Judas (Matt betrayed her first by going to Rob) & it doesn't matter that Matt is not, in fact, Jesus (as you point out, his reaction to Andrea on RI was not Jesus-like). That is the edit they are getting -- Andrea betrayed Matt, she deserves no sympathy. And, although I think that edit is a bunch of b.s. & your take is more the "truth," I think that is how the average viewer will see it too. Even Ralph jumped on the bandwagon -- Andrea bad; Matt good. {rolls eyes}
*And, not to get into a religious discussion, Jesus didn't hate Judas as much as history does -- the name is now synonymous with "betrayal" -- Jesus knew that someone *had* to be his Judas or His entire purpose of coming would not have been fulfilled, but whatever. I don't expect TPTB at Survivor to be theologians -- their use of biblical analogy in the edits is skin-deep.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-14-11, 02:12 PM (EST)

249. "RE: Week 13"

I don't think the average viewer would have seen Andrea in a very bad light, really. She's guilty of her own decisions, certainly, but Matt was clearly shown to be pretty petty. The Ralph had grumpy Ralph things to say. Then they went to the duel, she was upset, but then she got her focus back and Ralph floundered. (And, gee, Jeff had a timely Dr. Phil moment there.)
Ralph couldn't win any public speakinfyin awards but if you go through it all he was disappointed in Andrea for not flipping to Zap even after Matt was gone.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-14-11, 10:43 PM (EST)

253. "RE: Week 13"

I guess I'm somewhat alone in this, but I was 100% on Matt's side when Andrea showed up. You've got three tired guys ready to sleep, and she shows up like someone who just drank a pot of coffee wanting to get into "looks" that were given at the duels.
Bad timing. I don't know one guy who would put up with me doing that, including husband and kids.
I enjoyed seeing Matt responding like a normal human being. I resist the idea that he's supposed to be Jesus in his edit. He's a young man of strong faith; that's all Jeff called him. He's trying to be worthy. It's all about aspiration. He is not perfect. His response to Andrea was not perfect. He was tired and grumpy and she was being both a jibber-jabber and making accusations.
I did not find Andrea that likable. She talks way too fast and she annoys me.
When Matt said "sorry I ruined your Survivor game" I had to laugh. That's exactly what DH does when he should (IMHO) apologize but doesn't want to. Matt's just being a normal guy who might be quite a lot nicer in the morning.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-15-11, 02:40 AM (EST)

254. "RE: Week 13"

Bad timing? Andrea didn't choose at which time she would arrive. The guys knew the arriving players always appear after sunset. They had to be very curious to see which Ometepe would be first so the little 2 minute scene was probably a summary of what happened over an hour if not more.
Taking that into account, I think the edit was very balanced, showing that both Andrea and Matt had their faults: Andrea never understood Matt while Matt never understood the game.
And it showed that Ralph was the biggest dumbass around.

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Round Robin 2914 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest"
05-15-11, 05:00 AM (EST)

255. "RE: Week 13"

Where Matt was incredibly stupid was in treating somebody badly who was guaranteed to be on the jury if he returned to the game. The edit didn't really reflect that, but as much as she might have rubbed him the wrong way, at that point Matt needed to swallow his pride and his tiredness and his normal human reactions and tolerate her and eat any $hit she wanted to feed him. Ralph needed to do the same, but as michel said, he's the biggest dumba$$ of all, so we can hardly expect better of him.

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-15-11, 08:40 AM (EST)

256. "RE: Week 13"

Well of course she didn't choose the timing, but she could choose to chill realizing that it was not the best time to call Matt out. Just my observation from many years of marriage and relationships that the mood the person is in and how tired has everything to do with how they react when they get hit with a criticism. Something men are not known to appreciate at the best of times.
Andrea was under the same social game constraint to be nice, as she too could have been the one needing jury votes.
MIKE played the game, far as I can tell. His Insider clip confirms she was annoying and wanted to keep them up, but it appears he didn't tell her off.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-15-11, 10:40 AM (EST)

257. "RE: Week 13"

I have no doubt that Andrea pushed it too far but Matt was unpleasant from the start.
Everyone arrives at about the same time and we saw some prolonged discussions before. They were still talking to Ralph by the time Steve came in which had to have been at least 30 minutes later. If, suddenly, they don't have 10 minutes to talk to her, that doesn't speak well for them either.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-14-11, 02:16 PM (EST)

250. "Thoughts on the Penultimate Episode"

Previously… The Ometepe 6 learned that once they defeated the Zapatera tribe, the battle was only beginning because now they had to face each other.
So Rob cut deals with everyone…and everyone believed him.
Grant: “The only person I really trust out here is Rob.”
Natalie and Ashley were pairing up.
Ashley: “Natalie and I, we’re hanging.”
And Phillip thought he was the best bet to take to the end.
Despite their different strategies, they all agreed that Andrea was the biggest threat.
At Tribal Council, the tribe banded together to blindside the first member of their alliance.
At Redemption Island, Andrea must face her former ally, Matt, for a chance to get back in the game.
As for the former Ometepe, the easiest vote is done. There’s nowhere left to hide.
Despite the wording that the tribe banded together, the focus of this recap was definitely on Rob’s game play. It once more framed the big question of the season (and maybe of the game itself): Can a player win by making all those deals and having to break them?
As for Mike’s fans, it should be noted that the story of Redemption Island still doesn’t include him. Jeff hasn’t mentioned once that Mike has dominated every challenge and now it seems that Andrea’s only real concern is Matt.
The Best Thing that could have Happened!
Camp
Night 32
Ashley: “Tribal was actually enjoyable. We blindsided Andrea. I love blindsides! In an evil way, it’s fun to see their reaction; how shocked they are. Andrea was definitely shocked. You could tell. I’m not going to lie: I’m glad to see Andrea gone. Natalie and I are like this (crosses fingers) and she was always on the out.”
We heard Ashley telling Natalie that she will watch her back if Natalie watches hers.
Rob was apparently keeping an eye on them.
Natalie: “I’m kinda stuck in a bad situation just because Ashley keeps bringing up: “You’re looking out for me” and I am looking out for her. I’m leaning towards sticking to Rob just because he has been there for me through all this but so has Ashley.”
When Ashley went to bed, Rob asked Natalie: “What were you and Ashley just talking about over there?”
Natalie answered: “She’s been saying it’s the two of us and “You’re going to stick by me, right?” And I’m like “Yeah”.”
Rob told Natalie to act as if she’s Ashley’s best friend adding: “There’s something about her that’s really sneaky.”
Rob: “Ashley is probably thinking of a way to turn the vote against me. I’ve been fighting ten years to get to this point, I’m seven days away. It might make sense to get rid of Ashley next. Things have to go just right. I’ve had control of this game. I just need to keep control.”
Redemption Island
Matt: “Andrea showed up at the Isle of Redemption. I was certainly most hurt by her because I was like “You’re my number one, I want to take you to the top” and then she turns around and writes my name down because she’s scared to make a move with me.”
After hugging Ralph, Andrea turned to Matt, telling him she knew he hated her and that he always gave her dirty looks at the duels.
Matt said he wasn’t giving her evil looks but she voted him out when he tried to get her to go with them (Ralph and Mike)
She replied: “You should have been more decisive. You came in and you were so wishy-washy. You went up and had a heart-to-heart with Rob: Hey! Andrea and I were planning on blindsiding you but we aren’t going to anymore”. That was throwing me under the bus. What is your deal with that?”
Matt could only say: “I’m sorry for ruining your Survivor game and throwing you under the bus.”
Andrea then asked if the shelter was big enough for 4 but Ralph told her she’d have to sleep on the ground. His confessional told us it was payback for the way Zapatera had been treated after the merge.
He concluded by saying: “Rob used you like toilet paper. Now he’s wiped his @ss and he’s done with.”
A tear seemed to appear on the corner of Andrea’s eye.
The Challenge
Jeff went directly to Andrea and how quickly the game changed for her.
Andrea said it was “amazing how you can look in people’s eyes and they can lie to you. Everyone of these people lied to me. It’s a really shocking and humbling experience.”
She was on the verge of crying when Jeff asked if she felt betrayed.
Jeff told them they were still in the game and that one person would get back in the game at some point.
Jeff’s theme for this puzzled was not to panic and, while Matt appeared very calm, we heard Andrea saying: “I’m like all frazzled.”
Ralph had a lead but he was putting his letters upside down!
Mike, Matt and Andrea stayed alive.
Ralph wasn’t given last words. He didn’t address the whole tribe and he didn't have a confessional. It could be a sign that Ralph did not vote the “appropriate” way. It couldn’t have been because he was that bad of a character or had nothing to say.
Rob: “I will never give up hope and I will never give up the fight because I have more heart than anyone out here. But this Redemption Island twist is making it even harder for me to make it to the end. I want Redemption Island to be done with so it isn’t a factor anymore.”
This confessional, in addition to being quite arrogant, puts Rob in direct conflict with the season’s twist. He will have to prove that he can beat the returning player, that he has more “heart” than his opponents or else this confessional will have told us why he lost.
Camp
Day 34 – Another Rice war!
A bird caught a fish but we saw its reflection in the eye of an alligator. When the alligator swam out, we could guess that it caught its prey despite the monkey’s warning screams. Who will be the prey in this episode?
The women wanted to ration the rice to make sure it lasted but Phillip reasoned that not everyone was going to be there at the end.
Rob: “Zapatera ate too much while they were here so now we don’t have much left. Everybody is exhausted, the days are long. We just try not to exert as much energy as we can.”
The situation led to a conversation between the two Bros: Grant told Rob that Ashley should go next and that “Natalie will never switch over after that.”
It also led to Phillip saying that the women didn’t need as much calories.
Natalie, who really looked frightened by the aggressive words, told Phillip to “get out of our faces” but he jumped in the shelter instead, forcing Natalie to jump out.
The women walked away screaming that Phillip was psycho.
Rob: “Phillip is crazy. Not the n-word crazy, just crazy! Ashley and Natalie are getting too close for comfort. The best thing for me to do is to split the two of them up but Phillip, instead of picking on one of them, he picks on both of them. So, instead of driving those two apart, he is driving them closer together. Phil: Stop making so much work for me!”
Rob had to go find Natalie to reassure her saying: “Don’t be scared, all you have to do is just do what I say. Keep Ashley happy and if you hear her mention some sort of plan that doesn’t involve getting rid of Phillip then we need to talk.”
Natalie said Ashley wanted to get Phillip out because she was afraid he’d go after her.
Rob replied: “We are going to go for her…maybe. I don’t know because Grant is very skeptical about Ashley’s actions and Grant wants to get Ashley out. It doesn’t make sense, I know but…”
Natalie was very surprised by that news.
Rob promised Natalie he was getting her to the end.
Ashley: “Natalie and I, you know, we stuck together since the beginning. The thing with Natalie is that she is really relying on Rob a lot. I rely on Rob but I know also that he is playing the game and I would bet my life that if it came down to Grant, Natalie, me and Rob in the 4 that Rob would vote one of us girls out in a heartbeat. I think the best play for me in this game is to just make a big move going here and get rid of a strong competitor.”
To make sure we understood, the camera showed Grant and then switched back to the alligator. Yes, we know who will be the next prey. I do want to point out that, even if it didn’t come into play, Rob was pretty savvy to place the impetus for the move against Ashley on Grant. But Ashley herself is smart enough to see the hold that Rob has on Natalie.
At night, with the alligator still lurking, we heard Ashley setting her plan in action, telling Rob that it would be smarter to send Grant to RI and only have one of the three strong guys return. She added: “If he’s (Grant) still here and Mike comes back, we have to worry about getting rid of Mike and Grant.”
When Rob asked her about dealing with Phillip, Ashley said she didn’t want to keep Phil around but wanted to do what was smarter to keep all three together.
Rob said he’d sleep on it.
Rob: “Ashley came to me with this genius plan: “Let’s get rid of Grant next.” I already run the numbers on this scenario weeks ago and it doesn’t make sense. All it does is give Ashley another way to squeeze herself into the finals.”
Instead of sleeping on it, Rob went to tell Grant about Ashley’s plan.
The Bros promised to win every single challenge to the end.
Grant: “Ashley is a dark individual and she’s ridden on coat-tails far enough. If Ashley doesn’t win immunity, she is out of this game and I will be happy to do it. Happy!”
After the break, Grant’s confessional continued as we saw the three guys going for tree mail: “The more than likely scenario that is going to be happening is for “Stealth R Us” sticking all the way to the end which, if you had told me was what was going to happen on day 19, I would have called you a liar.”
Rob: “Ashley actually came to me last night and said she wanted to get rid of Grant before Phillip. Ashley’s had a free ride for 35 days but her fairy tale is about to come to an end…real abruptly!”
Ashley (in confessional after telling Natalie that she felt she needed immunity): “Last night, Natalie and I approached Rob with an idea that we were going to blindside Grant. I thought Rob would be all about it but at first he was hesitant but then the more he thought about it and said it was a really good idea so we’ll see. I feel paranoid like if Grant wins immunity, I might be on the chopping block. But, I really trust Natalie and I feel she is 100% on my side so if anything is said, Natalie usually lets me know.”
As that was being said, Natalie was thanking Rob for giving her his socks which had saved her life.
Did she know back then that Rob was going to save her life once more at the next TC?!
Natalie joined Rob who was sitting on a swing.
She told him the vote would be hard.
Rob said he had her back all the way to the end, that he understood that she felt bad but that he didn’t like what Ashley was doing to her. (!!)
Just then he saw Ashley approaching so he switched the conversation to peanut butter.
Rob: “Natalie may not be the brightest player to ever play this game, we all know that, but Natalie is a sweetheart: She’s innocent and she’s pure. Ashley is trying to corrupt that. Ashley and Natalie, they have been close since the beginning of this game but it’s never been a strategic closeness. More and more, I see Ashley imposing her wisdom on Natalie. It’s not a good thing. You know what I’m excited about? It’s day 35 and, after 35 days of having this pain in my @ss, I think I am finally going to get some relief tonight.”
Just before the challenge, Ashley confidently told Rob: “I’m going to win.”
Rob sounded really hypocritical in that confessional because he has been the one “corrupting” Natalie. If this had aired sooner, if Ashley had been shown as a nice person, I would have said that she would outlast Rob and even win! She just had a winner’s quote! Now? There is a whole picture to consider. More on it later!
The Immunity Challenge
Of course, Ashley won the challenge and its reward.
She picked Natalie to share the 3-course meal because: “She didn’t get the chocolate cake reward and I draw a lot of strength from her being out here.”
There was nothing to say so we didn’t have any confessionals!
Camp
When they returned from the challenge, the camera shot was taken from behind Rob’s empty swing, maybe a hint that Rob will not be there when the last camera shot of camp is taken.
Rob: “Days like today, man! I wish I had stayed home. When there is one thing you don’t want to happen, it happens. Then, all of a sudden, Ashley is a freaking genius. This was all her plan, all along. Grant, when you watch this, you’re going realize that I never wanted to do it this way. Although I’d like to think of you as a friend, I didn’t come to this game to make friends. I came to this game to win so, even though it does break my heart but I have to vote your ##### off tonight.”
Ashley and Rob agreed that it was the best move and he told Natalie that, even if Grant would try to get her out, he wasn’t voting against her.
Rob then said he had to go play the bad guy.
Rob: “It seems that, no matter the situation on Survivor, I have to do the dirty work because everybody else is too stupid to do it. So, I had to go to Phillip and tell him we were voting for Grant…then I had to go to Grant to ask him which way he wanted to go; if he wanted to go with Phillip or if he wanted to go with Natalie. It’s a lot of work, it really is. It’s exhausting.”
Grant wanted to eliminate Natalie because, with Ashley, they were as strong as a couple.
The two guys shook hands.
Grant: “The worst case scenario happened at the challenge today but it’s ok, we have an escape hatch: Natalie is the one that is going home tonight. When you look somebody in the eye and shake their hand, you get a vibe from that person and I got a good one from Rob and we are sticking to our alliance. It’s going to be exciting: You will see my name written down twice and then here comes Natalie! The princess is going to have a red carpet straight to Redemption Island.”
Ashley: “Natalie and I were making rice for the boys and, all of a sudden, these little waiters show up and…they have our platters of food. We were like: See ya, boys! Honestly, if there was a challenge I needed to win, it was today. I feel like I am on top of the world right now. I can’t wipe the smile off of my face.”
Did Natalie tell Ashley that Grant was gunning for her or is Ashley only depending on her gut to be so certain that she needed immunity?
The girl made themselves sick!
Rob: “Ashley and Natalie are getting too close for comfort. It’s just like Amber and I, it’s just like Andrea and Matt were at the beginning of the season: A couple is powerful in this game even if it’s two girls. If they trust and believe in each other, it’s a very powerful thing.”
Ashley started talking to Natalie about teaming up with the person returning from Redemption island.
Natalie: “Part of me was hoping that Ashley wouldn’t pick me just because it kinda put me in a sucky position. I feel like I am stuck: I have Ashley on my side and I have Rob on my side. It’s really tough because both sides have pros and cons.”
Talking to Rob, Natalie said she was on his side.
Rob explained that if Ashley could turn on Grant so quickly, he’d be next.
Rob: “With Ashley and Natalie getting as close as they are getting, it could be a real problem if somebody were to come back and they were to decide to join up with that person and decide that they don’t need me anymore. In that situation, it would be more advantageous for me to break up Ashley and Natalie while I have the chance so that that doesn’t happen. I really think that Grant is a good guy. I have made a real friendship with him throughout this show. I still say I am in a pretty good spot eventhough I didn’t win immunity today. If I decide it’s going to be Grant, it’s Grant. And, if I decide it’s going to be Natalie, it’s Natalie. One man should not have this much power in this game. Luckily, I am not an ordinary man!”
The last was said with a smile but it still showed a lot of arrogance.
Tribal Council

Ashley told Jeff she felt like she needed to win immunity.
Grant thought it would have been crucial to win because he is a threat in challenges.
Rob felt that the only thing going for him was that Grant was a bigger threat.
Asked about choosing Natalie for reward, Ashley said it couldn’t have been a shock to see that the two were close.
Jeff remarked that saying it was alerting Grant, Rob and Phillip to the danger.
Phillip said: “We knew that she was going to pick Natalie.”
Natalie agreed that being close to Ashley could make her a target.
Grant said he was putting faith in the promises he had been given.
Rob said he didn’t know when Redemption was going to end, he thought it would be over by now.
Asked what gets him through this, Rob turned and showed the picture of Amber and his daughter that was on the back of his T-shirt.
He added: “You can try to do everything right the whole game and one little thing either here or there and then pouf! It’s all gone.”
Chocking up, Grant said his soon-to-be wife was helping him through the game.
Both Ashley and Rob patted him on the back.
Rob said it was the biggest vote so far, that everyone was on edge.
Jeff left them by saying there were still many obstacles in their way, the biggest being the player that would return to the game.

The Story
As expected in the last episode before the finale, doubt was put on Rob’s chances to win, including some very arrogant confessionals, as bad as the ones we had heard during the episode that followed the merge. With all the jury connections that center around Rob, the story seems to tell us he will be part of the F3. Of course, one little thing can go wrong here or there and pouf! It’s all gone so we have to consider that Ashley’s sudden genius plan, the returning player possibly going on an immunity run, the end of the Royal Treatment game and the empty swing were all hints that should make us question whether he can get to the end but the theme of the season has been about Rob’s control of the game. I would feel that an ending that wouldn’t include Rob would lack continuity much like what Samoa would feel like if it had been edited exactly the same way but with Russell missing the F3. At least Matt, Ashley and Natalie all have more substance than the CGI* that was Brett!
If we consider that Rob makes it to the end, the question then becomes whether or not he can win the jury vote. Looking at previous seasons, we find a pattern that, when the winner got the title because of a surprise vote, we had been told why a particular juror voted the way he did. Take Samoa, a season that many feel compares to this one. We had been shown that Natalie was close to Laura, Kelly and Monica, we also saw that she bonded with her fellow prayer warrior Brett, how Jaison had started to admire how much she had grown and we had also seen her as the one that attached herself to Danger Dave Ball during the merge feast. All her votes, except for Erik’s, had been fully explained. Another season that came down to doubt about the jury votes was Cook Islands and the key vote there also was explained: Adam voted for Yul to thank him for eliminating Jonathan. So, if Rob were to lose, which votes have been “revealed”?
The Characters
Grant: He is a player without any jury connection because all the doubt in his case, especially now, center on his ability to make it to the final. That doubt wasn’t manipulated, it is a direct result of the vote against him. Instead, the editors manipulated his airtime in such a way that he always lacked substance. Only in the latest episodes did we start seeing that he was a smart player. That is too late to build a winning arc but it was just enough to paint him as a victim. His final words tell us he has no bitterness against those that executed the Assassin so he would vote for Rob.
Andrea: Her only connection are with Matt and Phillip. In her present situation, those connections seem to tell us that she votes for Phillip in the end. That would explain why the editors chose to show us their conversation way back in the first half of the season. From him, she wanted to know if he had ever plotted behind her back and, in the end, she told us that everyone, except for Phillip had lied to her.
Mike: Of course, Mike has all the connections he needs already on the jury. His doubt centers on his ability to make it to the end. However, his early scene where he was shown accidently putting out Zapatera’s fire and the complete omission of his own story on Redemption Island tells us his story ends as a juror instead of facing them. He congratulated Rob on the brilliant move at the merge. That could very well be our clue that he votes for him in the end.
Matt: Many clues had pointed us to his return so we would have expected some doubt on his abilities to earn jury votes if he was going to make it all the way to the end. For a long time, I thought absence of such doubt meant he wouldn’t face the jury but Andrea’s words when she got to Redemption Island could serve not as doubt but to explain why he wouldn’t win that vote. Being wishy-washy is one of the worst sins in Survivor-land and many could share Andrea’s point of view. However, we have always seen Matt as being on a journey so an explanation with Rob should end it. Matt’s story could very well end with forgiveness. Mike showed him how to do the right thing.
Ashley: She has received the most confusing story this season. In fact, Ashley’s edit is one of the more puzzling ever. We have seen a lot of her, most of it intended to make the viewers dislike her. A lazy spa girl was her label. But she has been an enthusiastic spokesmodel during rewards so there was some care given to her story. Now, as I watched her winning the immunity challenge, I considered that her story could be redeemed if she manages to win all the immunities to the end, changing the lazy girl image into a strong competitor and a worthy winner much like Jenna. Stealing Rob’s goats, dragging both Phillip, whom she hated, and Natalie, whom she loved, would make for a great surprise story and would “fit” what we have been told.
But then, Ashley committed the biggest sin in Survivor editing: She got the full blame for eliminating a likable player. She turned Grant’s story into that of a Victim. Certainly, the move could have been presented as Rob’s decision but he was shown tormented about it, even disagreeing with it at first. Could she still steal Rob’s place in the F3 and lose the vote? I doubt it because she’d be the evil mastermind of the season and we would have heard her devious ideas before the next to last episode.
So, if she sits on the jury, it’s easy to see that her closeness to Natalie explains her vote.

The Probable Final 3
Phillip: The big distraction of the season has shown sufficient moments of lucidity to make us consider he could pull the biggest surprise (to put it politely) win ever. Phillip should get some votes in this scenario and Andrea comes to mind first. Ralph’s exclusion of the rice wars and his comment that it was time for a dumbass to win this thing are signs that Phil has a second vote in the bank. Maybe he could also get rewarded with a vote from Matt after all the encouraging words he gave him at the challenge arena but then we never saw Matt and Phil talking during the merge episode. No one else has been shown making a positive connection with him to set the stage for such a huge surprise. Still, 3 votes is a pretty solid base.
Natalie: She fits the Samoa parallels perfectly except that only Rob and Ashley have said positive things about her. In this episode, she was labeled as the “Princess” by Grant and that suggests others may see her that way also. If one player can be stigmatized by the “buddy system” it’s her because she was seen relying completely on Rob, doing everything he told her to do even telling him what her best friend was doing.
Rob: Can someone that played so hard, that had to do all the dirty work, win Survivor? Not if we believe what Russell said during the reunion show that sparked the idea for this season. Can a returning player be rewarded by players who feel it was their season, not his? Not if we remember what happened to Stephenie in Guatemala. Can Rob win? Can I wait for Sunday night to answer?!
This season started with Rob telling us that the rookie mistake is to reveal too many things. He also told us which kind of players he wanted to eliminate and which he wanted to keep. The whole season has been about his strategy…until it was derailed in the latest episode. Even with that, as he told us, he is still “in a pretty good spot eventhough (he) didn’t win immunity today.” In fact, eliminating Grant without leading the charge could be the best thing that could have happened for Rob. Editing-wise, it seemed to cement an important vote. With direct connections to Mike, David and Grant, the editors seem to have told us he has three solid votes. Just like with Phillip, Matt’s vote is a possibility but we still do not know what will be said when they meet yet again. Rob will need a very convincing argument to show that he is worthy of forgiveness.
That leaves Steve and Julie’s votes as undecided. They were the two protagonists on the Zapatera side during the Rice Wars and a truce was never truly reached on the show so seeing them reward Phillip would be a great surprise. Yes, Phillip worked hard in camp but we never heard anyone from Zapatera praising him for his efforts. Both Steve and Julie were victimized by the buddy system and Julie called Rob a cult leader but, faced with this decision, it seems the followers received the blame while the leader was grudgingly respected.
In a season void of much suspense and entertainment, following Rob’s story from the start was the most enjoyable part for me and I suppose many other viewers. Seeing that outlasting Russell didn’t even matter to Rob, hearing him saying that he played his best game ever and adding the family touch were the key moments that told me he would win this season. Phillip has always been the distraction, Natalie the decoration and Matt the illusion.
Rob should finally be the Sole Survivor
* The idea of a CGI Brett was inspired by Mario’s “Funny 115” list

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-14-11, 06:36 PM (EST)

251. "RE: Thoughts on the Penultimate Episode"

michel: I know that there are alot of folks on these boards that are not Rob Mariano fans. I am, however, a great fan of his. He is fun-loving, he has a great intensity that he brings to the show, he gives his all, but in the end, he knows he's playing a game and he's a graceful loser. I hope he can be a grateful winner as well. For making it the full 39 days, after already playing 3 seasons, he should be awarded the prize. He's had his chances and hats off to him for making the entire length of the show. He deserves it, more than ever, imo. I hope the jury can see that it was his game to lose. We'll see.
I think you've done a wonderful job with the editing this season. Your insight is amazing. Thanks for being so thorough week after week. It will be fun to explore a new season with all new contestants. My worst night mare is that they bring Phillip back....ARGH! Fingers crossed it's a brand new cast.
Great job, I loved your point of view!

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Scarlett O Hara 3439 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
05-14-11, 07:19 PM (EST)

252. "RE: Thoughts on the Penultimate Episode"

Nice thoughts Michel. I have enjoyed your commentary this season tremendously and often couldn't wait to read your thoughts on each episode. I do think it'll be Rob ~ Phillip ~ Natalie in the F3.
I see the votes going this way:
Natalie gets Ashley's Vote
Phillip gets Rooster's Vote and possibly Andrea's
Rob gets all of the rest. He deserves to win it hands down. Although bitter about being outwitted by the Ometepes, Julie and Steve will never vote for Phillip. David, as a logical person, will surely vote for Rob. Even Matt, IMHO, will vote Rob.
Thanks again for all of the fascinating commentary. You were among the first to pick out this season's winner. I for one am thrilled to see Rob win it outright on his own. He should have won All-Stars, except for once again, he ran into a bitter and vengeful jury.
Well done Michel!

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-15-11, 02:43 PM (EST)

258. "RE: Thoughts on the Penultimate Episode"

Thank you, FP and Scarlett. I've enjoyed reading your write-ups, FP. Participating in this thread has been the fun part of this season.
Now, I know how much you are fans of Rob so I hope we're not wrong. I have this feeling that Ashley could surprise us. If anyone can win this besides Rob according to the edit (Phillip's win would be off the charts), it's her.
"I'm going to win" she said before the last IC and that is pretty powerful foreshadowing if that was the intent. If we look at the season's pattern: Most votes were announced at the beginning of the episodes and this one seemed to be more of the same. "I love blindsides" we heard in last week's preview telling us that Ashley was doomed. Rob wanted to get relief for the pain in his @ss but then the pattern changed. Ashley said she'd win and she did. It was her genius plan that gave her another enjoyable blindside. Maybe she has another one in store for Rob.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-16-11, 09:06 PM (EST)

259. "A Few Observations"

There were a few details in the finale's editing that I found interesting.
First, the recap was totally about Rob. Even the move against Grant, which was Ashley's big move, was credited to Rob. The recap ended with a repeat of Rob's "Superman" moment which makes me think that the editors really had Nietzsche in mind. His Superman was a vision of man without God.
There was one quick moment during the last challenge that cracked me up: The challenge was down to Mike versus Andrea and Jeff said they needed to keep their focus. The camera gave us a close-up of Mike and we saw a fly go by right next to his eyes, leading to his loss of balance. Mike, again, was the victim of a bug!

Interesting that they kept secret the fact that Natalie and Ashley knew about the idol. Yes, it served to create suspense at F5 but it also contributed to the impression that Rob was playing better than everyone before him, being the only one to keep it completely secret. If we had seen him revealing his secret, it would have went against the Theme that only rookies give up too much information! The editors could have been working on the same theme we were! Nice!
I know I said this season was boring but we did witness a very strong strategic game. That is the way to play. Pagonging may be the equivalent to a pitchers' duel or a scoreless football game but it's how the game was designed. Jt's win was great but it only happened because Timbira was dumb.

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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 07:27 AM (EST)

260. "RE: A Few Observations"

What kind of twist do you think would help reduce Pagonging without resorting the show into a total gimmick?
Great job on the editing thread everyone! This was a really good year for editing analysis even if it was a pretty straightforward show on TV.

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Naked 887 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
05-17-11, 08:42 AM (EST)

261. "RE: A Few Observations"

What kind of twist do you think would help reduce Pagonging without resorting the show into a total gimmick?
Simple... Interaction between the tribes from the beginning of the game. There are several ways to accomplish this. The fist being have two tribes competing against one another, but living in one camp. Another would be a rotation that would send people to the other tribes camp to live temporarily. The idea is to find a way for these people to not establish an identity of us vs them from the very beginning of the game.
VOTE NAKED 2004

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parathor 250 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
05-17-11, 10:58 AM (EST)

262. "RE: A Few Observations"

Yes! That's my dream too, Naked! One camp, with rotating people with immunity/TC... although one camp with two tribes would also be acceptable.
Yes.

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Travel_Queen 138 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
05-17-11, 11:13 AM (EST)

263. "RE: A Few Observations"

Another way would be some sort of shared reward. The winners of one tribe get to pick one person from other tribe each time.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 11:58 AM (EST)

265. "RE: A Few Observations"

Tocantins was somewhat like that with players from both tribes joining on Exile Sand Dune and having the possibility to mutinee. Of course, no one did and the inter-tribal alliance was a big dud but maybe it should be tried again.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 11:55 AM (EST)

264. "RE: A Few Observations"

LAST EDITED ON 05-17-11 AT 01:38 PM (EST)
Maybe this should be a topic in Fanatics so that we could get more opinions but let's see:
"Interaction between the tribes from the beginning of the game"
They tried that twice: Palau and Fiji. In Palau, they didn't follow through with the idea because they didn't have a swap before Stephenie joined Koror but, of note, even if Stephenie had an alliance with Tom and Ian, it didn't help her much in the end.
Fiji was a pagonging. It wasn't edited that way but it really was. This is what the editors didn't reveal: Earl gathered the other 4 African Americans on the first night and told them to expect to be soon together on one tribe and that there would be 4 racially divided tribes. Even if the racial division didn't materialize, Earl kept his alliance with Dre and Cassandra throughout the game.
More importantly, a group went exploring during day 2 and decided that, if all 19 had to go to TC, they would vote out someone from the group that had stayed behind to build the shelter. Dre was with the explorers but he informed Earl, a shelter builder, about the alliance. Earl formed an alliance of shelter builders that included Anthony, Sylvia, Gary, Lisi, Boo, Yau Man, Cassandra, Michelle and Dre. The explorers forgot about their alliance once the group was divided in two tribes but Earl never forgot. Most of the early boots were "Explorers", most notably Lilianna and Rocky, their two leaders.
The swap was Earl's occasion to regroup his "Shelter Builders": The NuMoto was formed by Earl, Boo, Yau Man, Cassandra and Michelle. Because they were able to integrate Stacy, they eventually merged up 7-3 in numbers. The merge was a pagonging of the few remaining "Explorers", Edgardo, Mookie and Alex.
(The so-called 4 horsemen were only 3, kind of the opposite of the " Trois Mousquetaires" who were really 4!)
"have two tribes competing against one another, but living in one camp"
That was only done on Thailand and it was late in the game but we saw that it only increased animosity. Imagine two hockey teams sharing the same locker room and I can see more bad coming out of it than good. As a viewer, the dynamics could get difficult to follow. It would be worth a try because I've played on-line games where we were able to PM everyone and it did lead to many blindsides and changes in alliances but on-line games are like that no matter what.
"Another would be a rotation that would send people to the other tribes camp to live temporarily"
Then, I feel, we would have a pre-merge pagonging of the strong challenge players. The weak would have no reason to keep a Tom or a Rob if they are going to be on the opposing tribe the next day.
"The idea is to find a way for these people to not establish an identity of us vs them from the very beginning of the game."
Pirate Master was somewhat like that and it flopped. And Big Brother is like that and it still always evolves into one group against another unless you have a Dr Will or a Dan playing.
Anyway, "us versus them" is the basis of all sports, of all conflicts and you do want conflicts.

The season that saw the most beautiful swap and post-merge alliance switching was Amazon. The gender division had a lot to do with it, the guys wanting to join the women so much that it led to new groups. But, really, most of the dynamic game play was due to Cesternino because Vanuatu didn't have the same result.
I don't think a twist can prevent pagonging but the F3 and Redemption Island almost force one to happen. They have to cast players that know how to play. The only thing I'd suggest is to start with 3 tribes of 6. First, it solves the gender imbalance, next it gives them the possibility of melting the tribes into 2 or doing a pick 'em at one point. Also, the tribes being smaller, it would encourage each to think in terms of staying strong.

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CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 01:25 PM (EST)

266. "RE: A Few Observations"

The only thing I'd suggest is to start with 3 tribes of 6. First, it solves the gender imbalance, next it gives them the possibility of melting the tribes into 2 or doing a pick 'em at one point. Also, the tribes being smaller, it would encourage each to think in terms of staying strong.
I like this idea a lot. The only time it was done was for the first All-Stars. They even tried to include a tribal swap after the three teams became two. I love to see this with players that didn't know each other before the game (and without a Jenna Lewis trying to vote out the winners)!

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NedraSue 109 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
05-17-11, 02:07 PM (EST)

267. "RE: A Few Observations"

Why have teams? Why not start out with all 16 on one beach and at each challenge, then they draw for teams? White/Black rocks or oldest people get to pick 1st than so on...
It could change for each challenge. This would really throw off the whole us and them teams.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 03:37 PM (EST)

268. "RE: A Few Observations"

That would be a great way to go as long as they are insisting on doing Redemption Island. In a regular game that would screw up the camp rewards of the early game, why bother rewarding with tarps and fishing gear and so on if they're all living in the same camp, but RI sucks the show down into a deep boring hole. It would really make spoiling tough (but still fun!) as we'd have to try to figure out each week who is and who isn't going to Tribal, so let them try that!
That sort of game would also be maybe the one time I wouldn't mind seeing Russhole again. The stronger social games would be vital in that game, Russhole wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 04:24 PM (EST)

269. "RE: A Few Observations"

That's what they did on Pirate Master and it was a flop. If you change teams for every challenge, then the strong players get targeted first.

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Naked 887 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
05-17-11, 09:05 PM (EST)

270. "RE: A Few Observations"

That's what they did on Pirate Master and it was a flop. If you change teams for every challenge, then the strong players get targeted first.
My response to that is why would that be boring? If smarter players gain the advantage, then it can only make for a more interesting show. Pirate Master didn't work because the show was pigeonholed by a single concept, not because the framework of how challenges was established.
Three tribes of six sounds like a good idea on paper, but I believe that it would be too hard to edit to actually bring about good storyboarding of the characters, and would confuse your average audience.
VOTE NAKED 2004

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 09:26 PM (EST)

271. "RE: A Few Observations"

Isn't it a stereotype that a strong player cannot be smart?!

A Tom, a Yul, a Rob would all be early boots because, as much as they helped you today, they will be against you tomorrow.
Yes, editing around 3 tribes is the drawback of that format but much less than having people switching team every day.
Pirate Master failed because it was boring. Part of the reason was the challenge format. The strong players were booted first and they happened to be most of the big characters.

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-17-11, 11:34 PM (EST)

272. "RE: A Few Observations"

LAST EDITED ON 05-17-11 AT 11:35 PM (EST)
I never watched Pirate Master so I have no opinion about that. But I strongly suspect Jeff thinks Survivor works because... it has JEFF!
It does seem to be an ego thing, I'm not kidding. Nowhere else on the planet where they tried this RI nonsense did they ever bother to repeat it, they realized it was horrible and dropped it. But Jeff and Mark seem to think US Survivor is indestructible no matter what they do to destroy it.

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samboohoo 17173 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-18-11, 10:26 AM (EST)

273. "RE: A Few Observations"

1. Live together on the same beach the entire game. I think it may have been tried before, but it didn't last long enough or was started too late.
2. Draw new buffs at every challenge.

Samboobree, brought to life by Arkie

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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
05-18-11, 06:40 PM (EST)

274. "RE: A Few Observations"

LAST EDITED ON 05-18-11 AT 06:41 PM (EST)
Sorry. Terrible ideas, IMO. The tribal part of the game is often the much more interesting part (Thailand, PI, A$$, CI, EI, and RI). The tribal or team dynamic is a key part of the interest in this how. Make this a completely individual game or simply constantly switch teams, which would essentially do the same thing, and this show is DONE.
For me, you can have a great season with Zapping (the improved version of paggonging) as long as the right people get zapped.
>

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-18-11, 06:46 PM (EST)

275. "RE: A Few Observations"

I totally agree. Many viewers like certain tribes. It isn't really one person in that tribe but, as a group, they make it fun. Kucha, Mara'amu, Jaburu, Drake, Chapera, Yasur, Casaya, Fei Long and Timbira were much greater than the sum of their parts.
Also, changing teams every week would be very confusing.

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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
05-18-11, 07:04 PM (EST)

276. "RE: A Few Observations"

Holy crap! What is the date? Mark it down.

>

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
05-18-11, 09:05 PM (EST)

277. "RE: A Few Observations"

I'm sure we agree on more things than not. It's just that, when we disagree, we really disagree!

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
08-04-11, 02:27 PM (EST)

278. "Post-Mortem"

I was going to do a post-mortem of each character but, running down the list, I realized that most players had been portrayed as “Dumb Players”. For example: Matt had some characteristics of a Player on a Journey, namely his opening confessional where he told us that his goal was to be closer to his Savior but his story arc showed us a dumb player, one that didn’t learn from his blindside. Even his first exit gave us reasons to say that he had made a dumb move.
Why were so many players edited that way? The answer to that question led me to realize once more the importance of the role of the “Victim” in the world of Survivor editing.
I always thought that the editors realized the importance of “Victims” after Vanuatu. That season wasn’t well received by the audience because many early boots were likeable characters. The editors had given us the opportunity to know them, even care for many of them. The first people eliminated received airtime in order to develop the early theme to the season which was” “The Young are Sacrifices to the Island Gods.” ¹
It could be said that Dolly, John P, Brady, Mia, Bubba, Sarge and Chad were all “Victims”; players that were liked by the audience but didn’t stand a chance against their tormentors. Those tormentors were, in turn, Twila and Scout, the Flab 5 alliance and, finally Amy, the one many saw as an extreme feminist. The audience, looking for justice, received satisfaction only when Amy was eliminated but, since it was Twila, Scout and a member of the Flab 5 alliance that came out on top, it wasn’t enough.
Because the audience didn’t appreciate Vanuatu’s story, the editors changed the way the booted players would be portrayed: The ones that were eliminated by the eventual winner were never again portrayed as “Victims”. They would either receive no airtime, be seen as villains or, more often, “Dumb Players” that simply had to go. The “Victims” would be players eliminated by the season’s Villain.
I cannot stress strongly enough the importance of recognizing “Victims” in identifying the eventual winner and eliminating the others. In Redemption Island, the one true “Victim” was Russell Hantz. Some will say that the franchise’s biggest Villain, the one that had so many Victims on his own hands, deserved to be eliminated but the story wasn’t told that way at all. Instead Russell became the “Victim” of “Dumb Players” that threw a challenge to get rid of him. Dumb players that didn’t respect the game. Russell’s exit was treated with so much care that even his bashers were made to feel his pain as seen by Sarita’s reactions to his tears.
The Zapatera members that played a part in eliminating Russell could easily be eliminated from contention. What was more interesting was David’s quote where he said that he didn’t like seeing people dancing on Russell’s grave. Rob wasn’t given a confessional about Russell’s departure, wasn’t seen “dancing on his rival’s grave”. That was the biggest clue to our eventual winner.
With Rob deciding every vote, the editors made sure we saw that the others didn’t deserve to be Sole Survivor. Even Andrea and Grant were edited as “Dumb Players”: Andrea, unable to make a big move against the leader of her tribe, was more interested in gaining Rob’s approval than plotting against him. Grant didn’t even suspect that Rob had run circles around him with those idol clues and wasn’t bringing him to the F3.
Survivor is always more interesting when the cast has a wide variety of roles: The Sweetheart, the Hero, the Villain, the Victim, the Players on Journeys, the comedians, the Dumb Players and even the extras need to work together to form a story from which the winner will emerge. Redemption Island had 1 Superman, 1 Victim and a bunch of Dumb Players which made for an unsatisfying, one-dimensional story.

¹ From Veruca Salt’s episode #2 Analysis in Vanuatu:
"Sacrifice
Jeff in his interview that the strong alliances that happen begin to splinter could end up being construed as sacrifice; so who goes into this solid alliance may be sacrificed and by those closest to them.
In an almost over the top obvious way was shown our Dolly the sheep herder in the sacrifical context. Dolly, a young female who was “comfortable” with the initial ritual because she herself raises lambs for slaughter was our first “sacrifical lamb. “
More sacrificial commentary:
Lea : “The head chief took the blood of his sacrifice and went to each male member of Survivor, no females, and said, “you are now a warrior in Vanuatu. And I felt what he was doing is he was saying welcome.”
And Lisa’s observation that ”a pig is more honored than a woman” The irony that they end up slaughtering a pig which is held in high esteem didn’t go unnoticed."
http://community.realitytvworld.com/cgi-sys/cgiwrap/rtvw2/community/dcboard.cgi?az=show_thread&om=5313&forum=DCForumID2&archive=yes#19

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sportsjoe 61 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
08-08-11, 07:41 AM (EST)

279. "RE: Post-Mortem"

Well put, but I'm still sticking with the fact that you should eliminate any returning veteran as soon as possible. Why do you think they're coming back to play again. They're probably pretty good at playing and manipulating. If you think a veteran can take you to the end, it may be true. But in a final vote for the winner, whether it's Survivor, Big Brother etc. you will lose almost every time to the veteran. You really have to be stupid and ignorant if you think you can beat a smart veteran in the final vote. I guess for many of these people, just getting to the end is good enuff. Not for me, just like Rob or any of the smart ones who've played to the end. You get rid of the threats to your game early, and keep the weak mental people that you can manipulate to advance your position in the game. If you don't get rid of a smart veteran early on, it will be too late after they've bonded and manipulated other players. If they hadn't done that to Russell he would've gone pretty far until either him or Rob took each other out.

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