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PLEASE NOTE: The Reality TV World Message Boards are filled with desperate
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"S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6"
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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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10-30-08, 00:34 AM (EST)
 
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4. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
If Apple refers to a "temptation" - this could be the merge, or it could be some variation of the mutiny they did in the Cooks. Impossible to know without more verbiage.My thinking being that a temptation would involve a shift in loyalties. Of course if JAMES had said it, a woman be involved, a temptress, and possibly a snake -- who could be female. Perhaps they think of a reason to bring James back as a special guest.  Re the ipods, we know from the CBS Fantasy point scoring that at some point they'll have a reward or challenge featuring NOW wireless devices. But an Apple product placement would have been a natural this season! 
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CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings
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11-02-08, 01:08 PM (EST)
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5. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
In an effort to leave no stone unturned this week, I am revisiting the title.I am thinking that it refers to the mystery box at the merge-feast-which-isn't-really-a-merge-feast. They are all drinking and cavorting and skinnydipping and having a grand old time thinking they are one tribe and then bam they bite the apple (open the box) and have to reform tribes again. Any other thoughts?  
surfkitty sig shop 2007
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suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings
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11-02-08, 01:51 PM (EST)
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6. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
I think if the box contains the choice or "apple" proposition, you're on the right track. I don't think it's merge buffs anyway, it's probably the tribe reshuffle or something that would lead to it. Perhaps the choice they make (and obviously they do) dictates that there is a tribe reshuffle leading to regrets and some wishing they hadn't chosen the "apple".If I remember the story of Eden, the apple was said to be the forbidden fruit. The residents of Eden could have anything they wanted but the apple. Maybe only some of the players chose the "apple" and they are the ones switched to the other tribe ultimately. No idea just shooting some ideas while avoiding raking leaves. ugh 
Agman camouflaged me for S17
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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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11-03-08, 10:10 AM (EST)
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7. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
Apple in the Garden of EdenThis could be referring to the feast that we know occurs, and which must happen by their collective choice....the feast is the temptation that they all "bit" into, without consideration of the conditions in the "box"....Temptations, actions, consequences. Or, this title could also be a reference to a person, such as Sugar, for example Matty could say it in regard to her buddy buddy relationship with Ace, and then she proceeds to throw him to the wolves without giving him the benefit of the doubt...ex: "Sugar is an apple in the garden of eden and I am not going to trust her for a second"...
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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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11-03-08, 04:58 PM (EST)
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8. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
So while revisiting the title, we may as well combine what we know from the teasers and the vidcaps.Teasers
-The tribes come together for a surfside feast with a tempting twist. -The castaways decide to make a shocking sacrifice that many regret. -One castaway takes the game into his own hands and lets the power go to his head. So the teaser tells us that the feast includes a "tempting twist." The feast comes with a box, and I think the temptation is probably offered in the box. I wrote in the teasers thread that the feast itself is probably not the temptation or choice. The producers want them to get full and drunk IMHO, and then open the box where they are tempted with a choice. Because based on the box label,
 there is no choice whether to feast. It doesn't say, for example, "as you have chosen to eat the apple instead of _____, enjoy, and when you're done you can look at the consequences of your choice." The only choice in that message is how long to go on with the feast, but that choice won't change whatever they find in the box, and there is no punishment that I can see for feasting more rather than less -- other than if they have to perform something after opening the box they may not be up to it. For example, if there was an endurance challenge following an opportunity to get good and drunk and stuffed, it would suck for the people who over-indulged. But that's not a "tempting twist." So the second clue says "the castaways" decide to make a "shocking sacrifice" - and that sounds like the Apple they choose to bite to me, and I think they make the choice after the feast. I started to talk about that here, but really it should be in the teaser thread. Flopo's idea of the apple as a person could well be a dual meaning. In the book of James Clement, the apple is always a woman ... and Sugar would be the most likely. Ever since her second trip to Exile, they've been figuring her as Eve, sitting and eating fruit in the garden of Eden (per her confessional, here I am in Eden) -- while her tribe is out in the cruel hungry world. Eve committed two major sins -- one was to eat the apple herself, and the second was to corrupt Adam. Again, we cannot expect that the contestants performed so as to make the analogies with the story as apt as the producers would have liked. That would have had to be scripted, and this is "reality." <cough>
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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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11-03-08, 06:04 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
LAST EDITED ON 11-03-08 AT 06:06 PM (EST)That certainly could be. Like I said, there could have been a choice prior to the feast that we aren't shown. I kind of don't think so, because I think the feast is a trick to lull them into a false belief, of merge, and what they expect to find in the box would then be their new buffs and information about where the merged tribe will live. For them to be lulled, it would work better if there were no choice beforehand. We see how carefree they are, skinnydipping, how relaxed. Having made some mystery choice, they would be more guarded I think. The point of the message that the feast is over once they open the box, may simply be that it defers their discovery of the true situation. Meanwhile, they drink and fraternize with the enemy, as at any merge feast, making plans for an individual game, no more tribes. None of which would happen if they let them discover what's in the box before the feast is over. As they are all deprived of food and confident there's a merge, they would naturally prolong the feast until they're stuffed. What would be funny in a sick way is if they were all immediately thrown into a challenge while drunk, but I don't think so. It would have to be the IC, and I think there is going to be a segment when they go back to the new camps, and give confessionals from both camps about how shocking and sucky it all is, before the IC. After which we will only be shown the losers as they figure out who to boot.
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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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11-04-08, 05:55 AM (EST)
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12. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
I don't see any evidence that they have the option to NOT open the box. The instructions say to open it.We aren't shown all the cues given these guys by production, but they are constantly telling the cast it's time to do this or that. They don't show up at challenges because they're wearing watches. They are told ... and when the feast is over, if they ignored the box, someone would tell them it's required that they open it (which we would not see), and they would open it. You cannot mutiny in this game unless the producers script an opportunity to mutiny. The message on the box doesn't offer them a choice ... but they may find a choice in the box after they open it.
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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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11-04-08, 12:28 PM (EST)
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13. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
LAST EDITED ON 11-04-08 AT 01:10 PM (EST)For one thing, they haven't been showing us any of the Tree Mails this season. Most likely the Tree Mail is the thing that convinces them there is a merge. So they are already expecting it when they arrive at the site and see the other tribe there. I don't think they will be asked if they want to merge; the possibility of an actual merge is not part of the equation, imo. But it's hard to say what will happen once they get there. It would be typical to allow them to just start feasting to make them feel comfortable about a merge. But I can't help thinking because of the message on the box that this time they get suckered into the feast when they didn't have to be and that eating the feast will have ramifications. Jeff says they "pulled one over on them", could they accomplish that with the exact same fake-merge trick as in any other installment? We know they make some sort of "sacrifice" (a SHOCKING one); when does that happen? That seems to be the main question to figure out.  Surfkitten Summer Sigshop 2008
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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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11-04-08, 03:51 PM (EST)
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14. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
What I'm trying to say about the message on the box, in re all the spec that it's a trick to partake in the feast, is it says:Open only after you are finished enjoying your feast ... The label assumes they are going to have the feast, no "if you choose to feast." So unless Jeff or the tree mail gives them some choice beforehand, the feast is given to them and there is no way they should be punished for eating it. In the Eden story, the punishment is for eating something they were told umpteen times - Do not eat, don't even think about it. by the way, there was feasting in Eden, plenty of it, everything but the one fruit on the one tree. There was no deprivation in Eden. Thus the punishment for not being able to accept on little "no" in the midst of plenty. How could it possibly be treated as a moral lapse to eat a feast that's set out for them when there is no warning whatsoever not to eat it? I feel like we're stuck on the idea that somehow they should not have eaten the feast and that means there will be a sacrifice. We are not even considering that the box itself might hold the temptation or choice.
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b1whois 126 desperate attention whore postings
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11-04-08, 06:38 PM (EST)
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15. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
i keep thinking that the "tempting twist" is some sort of choice between immunity and comfort. instead of immunity they could get some sort of a "pass" at the next TC they go to, like they did in the first ep with the race up the hill.
before the show started jeff said that some people definitely make a mistake when they chose comfort. we have not seen this yet so maybe this is the opportunity. the "shocking sacrifice" is that some chose comfort over immunity. and maybe the last clue is about someone who takes the game into their own hands by choosing immunity, and then they let the power go to their heads, maybe by gloating at the IC. (the comfort could be partaking in the feast, but since it looks like everyone participates, maybe the comfort is something else)
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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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11-05-08, 01:22 PM (EST)
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17. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
before the show started jeff said that some people definitely make a mistake when they chose comfort. we have not seen this yet so maybe this is the opportunity. the "shocking sacrifice" is that some chose comfort over immunity.I am thinking the same thing, this week looks very much like when this would happen, as it says some people will regret the decision they made. Plus Jeff says they really "pulled one over" on the players, so I find it hard to believe it's just the standard fake-merge where they all get to eat and hang out and then they get a message that says "sorry, no merge." I don't know if the choice would be comfort vs. immunity but you may be on the right track. Exile Island might also play into it. Surfkitten Summer Sigshop 2008
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gekidasa 5 desperate attention whore postings
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11-06-08, 05:34 PM (EST)
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18. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
What if 1. they think it's a merge, and 2. the choice/sacrifice refers to people (I'm thinking onion alliance) choosing to drop out of the inmunity challenge for extra food or whatever else is offered, because they are still under the assumption that there is ONE tribal council and that they have the majority and are safe... only to find out after they challenge that they are being split into new tribes and that some of them aren't really safe amont the people going to tribal?
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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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11-06-08, 08:06 PM (EST)
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23. "11th hour idea!!" |
Okay, b1 mentioned immmunity vs. comfort so it occurred to me it could go something like this:They get to the "merge" site, the feast is a given -- but Probst tells them before they eat they can choose rocks to send one of them to Exile Island. That person will not get to consume the feast but will be immune at the next tribal council. The Kotas think they have the numbers after merge so they aren't really interested. The Fangs are hungry. They vote down the idea so that they can all enjoy the feast together. Hence the sacrifice. Then when they open the box and find out not only is there no merge but the tribes have been reshuffled, some of them at least will rue not having opted for a chance to go to Exile Island and get the immunity. Or something along those lines.  We'll soon know. Surfkitten Summer Sigshop 2008
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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
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11-05-08, 01:15 PM (EST)
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16. "RE: S17 EP8: "Apple in the Garden of Eden" Air date Nov 6" |
The label assumes they are going to have the feast, no "if you choose to feast."The label assumes that they are already eating the feast; the box is placed in the middle of the food and they wouldn't see it unless they were eating. What I'm suggesting is, as you said, Jeff or the tree mail may have given them some choice beforehand between the feast and something else. If they chose the other option, they wouldn't see the box or have to deal with what's inside of it (maybe they'd get a different box, who knows). In that scenario the feast would likely be made to look much more tempting of the two choices, so they'd be gambling on the contestants going for the feast. Obviously it doesn't have to happen that way; yes the feast could be a given and the choice/sacrifice could come when they open the box. But I think it's possible we aren't being told the whole set-up. Surfkitten Summer Sigshop 2008
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