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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 09-20-08, 07:34 PM (EST) "The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" Another season, more twists, a new setting and all brand new players. I do not know whether the tribes have been identified yet to determine who is with who so if anyone has read more indepth information, please feel free to post the tribe formations. Those of you who pop into this thread and read know that I enjoy and value the editing process of Survivor as I have always believed that Survivor attempts to create a story with the contestants playing roles. Like all stories, there is an introduction, storylines, a plot and naturally, a conclusion. When one reads a novel, there is a concerted effort by the author to lay a foundation and build characters in order to reach a conclusion that fits with the storylines. With that said, I attempt to determine the long term players, the "characters" (editing used solely for "good television") and short term players who do not have an investment toward the end result. Further, I have (over the seasons) identified clinical players, emotional players, head of household players and under the radar players. My definition of these types of players may not always be parallel though to the general consensus. Sometimes the end game players' edits are very subtle and other times it is as simple as the proverbial "hitting the nail on the head." However, my ultimate goal is never truly the satisfaction of being right in determining who the winner may be but rather test my insight on reading the story correctly. As I normally do, I will post the information Jeff has stated pre-season about those who won. It appears the prevalent theme this season is good vs. evil This will be very interesting to watch and I would like to assume that the character enhancement will certainly indicate which contestant fits which mold. The true riddle may then just be does evil conquer or good prevail? Jeff's "take" on prior winners: "To me Parvati is this season's Amber. Last time, Parvati used her flirting, and it got her a long way. But we didn't really see her do a whole lot more than that, and the question was, what if underneath that she's got a strategy? What if she's figured out how to play this game- could she last long enough to become a threat? Parvati's a question mark." "Todd is a Survivor super fan who's wanted to be on since he was 14. Next to Courtney, he's probably the smallest person here. He's what you look for — a great personality who knows how to play this game." and "This kid couldn't drive when we started. He did know the game. It's because he's been watching since he was a kid. I'll tell ya, in his case, it pays off. He knew going in how to start the game. He had a game plan how an alliance best worked and how you worked people" "Yul could absolutely win this game; I'd be delighted if he did; a super likeable guy" and "Yul is a player. You underestimate Yul, you'll be going home before he will... He studied the show. As somebody who wants to play this game and have a shot at winning he's studied the show" "I'm not sure what he's (Aras) bringing. He's bringing a lot of talk. Does he know how to play Survivor? We'll find out. That's all I've got on Aras." "Danni is someone that I think people are probably going to get behind. She's in great shape. She's tall and she's got a competition background" "Tom is salt-of-the-earth guy. A father. A firefighter. There's no chance of this guy being a villain. You hope he lasts long enough in the game to be a hero. If he does last for a while, he's the kind of guy who could win it, because people are going to look at him and say, You know what, why not him? Everything about him is good." "If Chris is everything he reports to be, he'll do just fine in the game, that's the question. Is he putting on a really this strong "I'll tackle anything bring it on, you can't beat me kind of guy? I don't know. I think he's one of the guys that could either emerge as really strong or fade fast" Also, a guy you know will play the game like Mariano; super exciting to us....." (Recall this is coming off from All Stars) In looking over Jeff's statements, obviously they are very diverse statements; interestingly enough they do really encapsulate the person and the season and Jeff's mindset on how he felt about each winner and the season en masse. It stands to reason that although Jeff's opinion about each winner are not consistent, we may wish to look over what he says about the contestants and perhaps form an idea of how they wanted the season to unfold. Jeff hones right in on showing us Parvati took a much more strategic approach; Todd's super fan knowledge of the game and joy of playing was an advantage; Yul's quiet approach may be deceiving but his incredible analysis of this show worked in his favor; Aras appeared all over the place which seems to have befuddled Jeff a bit (this is also a great descriptor as Jeff is showing us that the winner is NOT necessarily someone he likes. I would fathom that there was disappointment that Terri was not the winner); Danni's commentary is very reflective in that she was in an underdog situation with the demise of her group and in the same token, since she played such a quiet game, Jeff's commentary could only appear generic at best; Tom was shown to be this larger than life type hero who was very successful with the tribe and challenges and it was obvious he was a favorite of the producers; Chris did encompass the "emerge or fade fast" showing since it appeared to many viewers that his ship was sunk with the women's alliance looming large; his "shtick" was also quite apparent as well. With that.... Ace Jeff says: "You would expect him to be like a villain in a Bond movie who dies a horrible death at the end. It's almost like a blind arrogance, and he's really fun to watch. And I think his accent could work for him or against him, but there is something about the accent that makes everything he says seem smarter.'' Ace appears someone who may fit the type of the "character" mode who will be highlighted regardless of his standing. I do note that Jeff really gives no indication on his shot at winning (interestingly enough, Jeff's commentary about all the cast members seem a bit lukewarm at best) however there may something about Ace that keeps him in the game for awhile which will be better appreciated after the first episode. A contestant who may be evil hidden under a cloak of sophistication may be something to keep an eye on. Another gentleman such as this is Marcus. Bob Jeff says: "He's the oldest guy out there. And unfortunately, that works against people all the time, even though there's probably nobody better equipped for this game. He's probably the guy who will be the biggest asset, if they don't get foolish and vote him out." This is certainly not the high praise lavished on those like Yau Man where Jeff who Jeff indicated he was really pulling for in Fiji. Jeff's description of Bob sounds all too familiar with the contestants who are older — he feels it is unfortunate that it happens but the older ones are usually one of the first to leave. This is a very generic description and it does not sound like Bob may even be around long enough where the viewers are rooting for him BECAUSE he is older. Probably on the "good" side; we may have to adhere by the saying "good guys finish last" (or close thereto) Charlie Jeff says: "Charlie prides himself on being very bright and educated. And the question I'd say for Charlie is, 'Can he stand up for himself? Does he really have a voice?' Or is he just going to look for somebody to hang on to and see how far they'll pull him along." I truly believe, in reviewing Jeff's prior commentary that he tells a piece of a story of each contestant; this appears to be a somewhat precise description so we may in fact see this occurring (Charlie latching on to someone to be pulled along) Whether this is a good strategy remains to be seen but I would suspect that Charlie may be with us a bit. Dependent upon who Charlie "latches" onto may determine if he falls on the side of good or evil - however, at this juncture, I don't see any reason why he wouldn't last a bit Corrine Jeff says: "Corinne is a self-proclaimed über-#####, and she owns it. I think the meanest thing you could say to Corinne would be to say, 'You're very pleasant.' She would take that as an insult of the highest order." I suspect we may have another "evil" candidate but whether or not it works for her is another story. Yet again, there seems to be no indication from Jeff of any long term standing; he doesn't state that it works for her - where she places remains to be seen but this bit description leaves me questioning how long she stays in this game. There weren't many "bitches" who were able to last a long time on this show and I highly doubt after this many seasons, this particular one will be allowed to last the duration." Crystal Jeff says: "I think Crystal's big dilemma is going to be, 'What does she say that she does? Who does she say she is?' Because it's obvious she's an athlete. Crystal has a mouth on her. She does not edit. That makes her great at Tribal Council, but a liability in the game." The perpetual stereotype rears its ugly head again. A verbal, strong woman and Survivor usually end up at a cross roads. I would hazard a guess that we may see her last a few episodes if her strength helps her tribe to win but unfortunately for strong, opinionated women... they do not fare well at this game. They cut a man's ego and tend to annoy the "softer" women. I do not have the tribe breakdowns (if someone knows them, please feel free to let me know as I don't consider that letting any cats out of the bag) but if Crystal is on a tribe with some ego filled men and some younger women, she may not be viewed very kindly. As we all know there is a double standard in society; a big, strapping man can go a long way on Survivor, a strong, strapping women....?? Dan Jeff says: "He's earnest, but he is his own worst enemy. He means well and does not know when to shut up. He's like a cocker spaniel, charming and annoying at the same time." While the description does not give any true insight on Jeff's opinion of longevity, Dan may not have to worry about anything for awhile - we all know that younger men generally do decently and then merge comes whereupon people start viewing them as threats. Considering he is labeled "earnest" I would assume he fares on the side of good over evil if one wants to take this theme to its word. I cannot find anything potentially harmful for Dan at the onset - it will be fun to watch whether his mouth ultimately gets him in trouble; however Jeff's commentary is one of the more positive ones but as the theme is good vs. evil and we aren't quite sure which sides proves successful, an earnest player may be in trouble Danny Jeff says: "G.C. is a fish out of water. Does he have the fortitude to really do this? Because when I talked to him before the show it seemed like a lot of nervous energy masquerading as confidence. But it was, really, I felt, fear, like 'What am I getting into?' And that's not a good place to be because what you're getting into is a big ol' headache." It appears that this cast certainly has garnered some insight from Jeff that collectively is not all that positive; Danny (I would hazard a guess he would fall in the "good" category) may be one that stumbles through the show and perhaps an easy boot at some point. I believe he was the one discussing what an honor it was to be in Gabon or something to that effect - so Danny may be one of the more journey like characters where he ends up learning a lot about himself and taking things away from his stay. How does that play into his longevity? Journey characters don't end up in a terrible position but they are not winners. Gillian Jeff says: "Charm is her strength because she's likable in doses, and that's her liability. Does she know when enough is enough? You can only hear someone say 'I'm from South Africa' so many times before you want to say, 'Why don't you go back to South Africa!" Like the eldest male, Gillian, being the oldest woman is in a situation that does not bode well for her and I think it is fairly obvious, barring a miracle, that she would more than likely be one of the first (if not the first) to be booted from her tribe dependent only upon if there is a bigger fish to fry. This is not to say that NO elders make it long term but there is usually a more positive response from Jeff (again see Yau Man) Statistics are reliable and it is a safe bet that Gillian won't be in Gabon for long. Jacque Jeff says: "I think Jacque will be a bit of a dark horse. I don't think she'll be a leader. I think she'll use her looks and her charm to get in with the right guy and hope that she can ride with that guy as far as she can. If Jacque gets deep into the show I think she's a legitimate threat at the challenges. She's pretty fit." A bit more fleshed out than some prior contestant summaries, Jeff appears to be a bit more forthcoming with how Jacque may move through the season. I would say by his description as compared to some other descriptions, Jacque may have some "legs" in this horse race (far be it from me to not use a description parallel to Jeff's "dark horse" comment) and I would not be surprised if she is a longer term player; not being a leader and getting in with the "right" people can take someone a long way. The issue then would be will Jacque step up to the plate to move from long term to end game player. Jessica Jeff says: "She makes every decision from her heart and not her head. She's very emotional, somewhat naïve, and I think when you first look at her, the question is going to be, 'Can she hack it out here? Does she have what it takes?' It doesn't take much for Sugar to break into tears" Perhaps a sweetheart mold for the season, another question mark put forth by Jeff on whether this individual can weather this game. Considering he does say that she makes every decision..... it may stand to reason that she will be here long enough to make a few decisions. She may be another one "highlighted" in light of her look and what appears to be her penchant for some emotional moments. Young women generally do well at the onset UNLESS they are horrific in competition, completely annoying or do not contribute at camp so I would suggest that Jessica may be there for a bit. Kelly Jeff says "The way I would describe Kelly is that she is part of the Text Message Generation. And she speaks that way, she'll say 'OMG!' for 'Oh my God!' That's Kelly. And just as a grown man looking at her I could say, 'That's charming, she's young and has her whole life ahead of her.' But as a tribemate I'd probably say, 'If she says OMG, I'll probably say GTFOH." Again, with a few younger women this season, unless there are bigger fish to fry, most will last a bit unless (see Jessica). Jeff's commentary could easily be from only the first episode which does not gives us any real indication of how well Kelly may do. However, I do note that Jeff does not talk about Kelly at all in a game aspect which makes me question if all there was to her was how she spoke as opposed to any insight on her game play which may suggest Kelly is a short term player. Ken Jeff says "Ken the gamer is one of my favorite people who has been on the show in a long time. He is convinced his gaming expertise is absolutely in line with what it takes to win, that he knows this game backward and forward simply because he's a gamer. But Ken is a true nerd. I think when the show began he weighed less than Courtney did." One of the few positive takes on a contestant, Jeff certainly praises Ken and in comparison to other contestants his praise is very high. Considering how highly he does speak of Ken (for Jeff to comment that Ken is one of his favorite people in a long time says quite a bit) and does indeed discuss the gaming aspect, we may see Ken for awhile however, I do find it interesting that Jeff points out that KEN is convinced he knows this game simply because he is a gamer. Jeff does not state he believes this to be true though. However, as one of the males who doesn't appear to be all about ego, he may slide nicely through the game before someone wakes up and realizes what a threat he is Marcus Jeff says "Marcus is a physician, as he likes to remind people. And he is a true leader, an extremely bright guy. He's a hero. He is a huge threat to win the game, for sure. He has looks, he's got smarts, he's probably the fittest guy out there, so he's got a lot of things going for him." Possibly one of the more emphatic endorsement of a player's chances this season, Marcus appears to have the ingredients for a long term player and possibly end game. Strong males normally do very well and leaders can be a good place to be IF you know how to lead. Jeff's comment that he is a hero was a bit curious to me as I am not sure as to the context of it. At the onset, Marcus may be a possible candidate for victory and I find it interesting that Jeff's commentary almost has a contradictory feel to it. He hints to a certain level of braggart in Marcus but then goes on to say very positive items. Marcus may have some layers which would then bode well for his chances. Matty Jeff says "I think Matty will be one of the favorites this season, someone people will absolutely love. I find him to be one of the most endearing guys we've ever had on the show to the point where it could work against him because he can't hide anything. If he's confused, he says 'I'm confused.' If he's happy, he's smiling. If he's sad, he's crying." A young, strong emotional man? The ladies would probably want to keep him around and the men won't be threatened by him. Jeff's commentary on Matty possibly being a favorite seems to bode well for Matty's longevity as Jeff is usually on the money about well regarded contestants lasting awhile. I'm not sure how other tribe mates will handle it if Matty and Jessica are on the same tribe however . At this juncture, Matty appears to be someone who at the very least will be around for quite some time. Michelle Jeff says "Michelle is a wild card for me because I actually thought that Michelle had a good solid energy coming into the game. But she's very small and very young. I think her life experience is the big question mark. What will she do when the going gets tough?" From Jeff's commentary, Michelle appears to be there long enough that she possibly hits a crossroad. Jeff speaks of her in stages which seems to indicate some idea that she is there for a bit. Compared to some of the other younger women's personalities, Michelle may be a refreshing female but perhaps her youth causes a dilemma for her personally on playing a more cutthroat game. At this time, I see no reason that Michelle may not be there for quite some time though and I would hazard a guess she is on the "good" side. Paloma Jeff says "Paloma is sassy, cute. My question for her is, 'Is her attitude real, or is it a put on?' And if it is a put-on, how long will she be able to sustain it when she starts getting hungry? Paloma's going to have to pick the right alliance. Who you decide to team up with early on has such an impact on how you do in the game, because if you pick the wrong people, it can be hard to get out from under that." Another possible candidate for a dual personality of good and evil, we seem to have some indication of a possible storyline for Paloma which may bode well for her; Jeff puts forth that Paloma may fall in with the wrong alliance and she may have a featured role in the theme. Depending upon how Paloma comes out from this potential issue though may BE her storyline. Again, there is nothing to indicate at the onset that Paloma will be leaving early though. Randy Jeff says "Randy is crotchety and clever. He's the guy who will come to Tribal Council and try to challenge me, which is a huge mistake, because I'm not playing for a million dollars. But I don't think he's as evil as he wants you to think he is." Unfortunately, we did learn from last season that just because Jeff makes references to Tribal Council does not necessarily mean the player is around for any length of time. Mikey B. was noted by Jeff to make for interesting TC's and he was a fairly early casualty. Contestants like Randy are always a dilemma in that they are either booted very early or they are a contestant that others may be eyeing as going to the end with due to their abrasive personalities. The odds typically fall towards an earlier dismissal however although he may not be ousted immediately depending on what tribe he is on. Regardless another "character" he will be highlighted despite how long his stay is and seems to fall readily in the "evil" category although Jeff wants us to be aware that it may be somewhat of a put on. Susie Jeff says "Susie is a mom, and she likes to talk. That's definitely her biggest obstacle to overcome, that she can't shut up. If I went in and played this game and got teamed up with Susie, I would be wary of her hanging in there with me, because she seems to go with the wind and doesn't even seem like she's paying attention at times." Susie may just be what the two oldest people want out there. A contestant who make other people forget they are the eldest because this contestant is the "annoying one that must be voted off." Chatty women don't do very well on this show; nerves are frayed, people are hungry and tired and getting annoyed easily - in this case I'm not sure the adage "mom's do well" will apply with Susie. There is nothing to indicate to me that she is long term and quite a lot that deems her a short term player. As always, I welcome your comments, your insights and any new information that helps to assist in how the story will play out. I do not read sourced information and over the seasons, you have been very considerate and not posting that type of information directly. Certainly, I have always read thoughts and analysis from everyone regardless if they know something or not and I appreciate that those of you who do, don't let the proverbial "cat out of the bag." I do hope this season inspires contribution as I may decide to just read the insight and post my responses in kind this season   Top

Subject     Author     Message Date     ID    RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... tribephyl 09-21-08 1    words words words tribephyl 09-22-08 4        RE: words words words CTgirl 09-22-08 6            RE: words words words Brownroach 09-22-08 8                RE: words words words tribephyl 09-22-08 10                    RE: words words words SpotTheDifference 09-22-08 11                    RE: words words words Brownroach 09-23-08 12                        RE: words words words tribephyl 09-23-08 14  RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... Scarlett O Hara 09-21-08 2  RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... PepeLePew13 09-21-08 3  RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... redbeard103152 09-22-08 5    RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... flystorms 09-22-08 7  RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... emydi 09-22-08 9  RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... michel 09-23-08 13    RE: Episode One VerucaSalt 09-27-08 15        RE: Episode One michel 09-28-08 16        RE: Episode One suzzee 09-28-08 17        RE: Episode One speedstr 09-28-08 18            RE: Episode One PepeLePew13 09-29-08 19            RE: Episode One VerucaSalt 09-29-08 20            RE: Episode One michel 09-29-08 21                RE: Episode One flystorms 09-30-08 22                    RE: Episode One CTgirl 09-30-08 23    VIDCAPS - episode pre-episode 3 b1whois 09-30-08 24        RE: VIDCAPS - episode pre-episode 3 VerucaSalt 10-02-08 25            The Editing Episode 3 VerucaSalt 10-05-08 28  Week #2: Editing Thoughts michel 10-04-08 26    RE: Week #2: Editing Thoughts speedstr 10-05-08 27        RE: Week #2: Comments michel 10-05-08 29            Editing Episode 4 VerucaSalt 10-11-08 30                RE: Editing Episode 4 michel 10-11-08 31                    RE: Editing Episode 4 emydi 10-13-08 32                        RE: Editing Episode 4 VerucaSalt 10-14-08 33                    RE: Editing Episode 4 Georjanna 10-18-08 35                        RE: Editing Episode 4 michel 10-18-08 37  Hippos Electric Fish Elephants snak... emydi 10-18-08 34    Episode #5: Editing Thoughts michel 10-18-08 36        RE: Episode #5: Editing Thoughts suzzee 10-18-08 38        RE: Episode #5: Editing Thoughts Georjanna 10-19-08 39    RE: Hippos Electric Fish Elephants ... Flowerpower 10-19-08 40        RE: Episode Editing VerucaSalt 10-20-08 41            RE: Episode Editing martinigirl 10-20-08 42                RE: Episode Editing michel 10-21-08 43                RE: Episode Editing VerucaSalt 10-22-08 44  Episode #6 Editing Thoughts: michel 10-25-08 45    RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts: emydi 10-26-08 46        RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts: michel 10-28-08 49    RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts: suzzee 10-27-08 47    RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts: b1whois 10-27-08 48        Editing VerucaSalt 10-29-08 50  Episode #7 Editing Thoughts: michel 11-01-08 51    RE: Episode #7 Editing Thoughts: emydi 11-03-08 52  episode 8 - the "twilght zone episo... b1whois 11-07-08 53  RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... Flowerpower 11-08-08 54    RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... michel 11-09-08 55  Episode #9 Editing Thoughts: michel 11-15-08 56    RE: Episode #9 Editing Thoughts: flystorms 11-17-08 57        Editing VerucaSalt 11-17-08 58            RE: Editing speedstr 11-18-08 59                Emy! CTgirl 11-19-08 60                    Comments michel 11-19-08 61                        RE: Comments suzzee 11-20-08 62                        Elephants flystorms 11-20-08 63                            RE: Editing VerucaSalt 11-20-08 64                    RE: Emy! LadyInBlue 11-20-08 65  Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: michel 11-22-08 66    RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: LadyInBlue 11-22-08 67        RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: michel 11-25-08 68            RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: reggie 11-25-08 69                RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts: michel 11-25-08 70  Episode #11: Editing Thoughts michel 12-07-08 71    RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 12-08-08 72        RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts suzzee 12-08-08 75            RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts Flowerpower 12-08-08 76                RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts suzzee 12-08-08 77                    RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts CTgirl 12-10-08 87    RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts suzzee 12-08-08 73        RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts LFJ 12-08-08 74            Sinners? michel 12-09-08 78                RE: Sinners? LFJ 12-09-08 79                RE: Sinners? Flowerpower 12-09-08 80                RE: Sinners? citywitch 12-10-08 81                    RE: Sinners? EmeraldBrooch 12-10-08 82                        RE: Sinners? michel 12-10-08 85                RE: Sinners? suzzee 12-10-08 83                    RE: Sinners? NedraSue 12-10-08 84                    RE: Sinners? michel 12-10-08 86                    RE: Sinners? CTgirl 12-10-08 88  RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... BlueIris 12-11-08 89    RE: The Players, The Game, The Edit... suzzee 12-11-08 90  Heading into the Finale: michel 12-13-08 91    RE: Heading into the Finale: flystorms 12-14-08 92        Another season end VerucaSalt 12-14-08 93            RE: Another season end michel 12-14-08 94  Editing Hindsight? Outfrontgirl 12-15-08 95    RE: Editing Hindsight? suzzee 12-15-08 96        RE: Editing Hindsight? Flowerpower 12-16-08 98            RE: Editing Hindsight? Outfrontgirl 12-18-08 99    RE: Editing Hindsight? michel 12-15-08 97        RE: Editing Hindsight? Outfrontgirl 12-18-08 100        Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sin... Outfrontgirl 12-18-08 101            RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... suzzee 12-18-08 102                RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... Outfrontgirl 12-18-08 103                    RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... michel 12-18-08 104                        RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... Outfrontgirl 12-19-08 105                            RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... Georjanna 12-19-08 106                                RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... Outfrontgirl 12-19-08 107                                    RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... Georjanna 12-19-08 108                                RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... CTgirl 12-19-08 110            RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... CTgirl 12-19-08 109                RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly... sol 12-19-08 111

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tribephyl 12393 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-21-08, 06:28 AM (EST) 1. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" No cats were harmed... Fang Crystal ~ Dan ~ Danny "GC" ~ Gillian ~ Ken ~ Matty ~ Michelle ~ Randy ~ Susie Kota Ace ~ Bob ~ Charlie ~ Corrine ~ Jacque ~ Jessica "Sugar" ~ Kelly ~ Marcus ~ Paloma   Top

tribephyl 12393 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-22-08, 04:55 AM (EST) 4. "words words words" Thank you, VS. *bows* I am never worthy as a true spoiler as I do put a lot of gut into my thoughts. Add to that the fact it's preseason and all we have to go on are pictures and promos and nary a real plot line. AND that I've been proven wrong more than I have right. But it doesn't stop the fingers from moving... As "Temptation" seems to be the arc with which survivor is hoping to exploit the castaways, will it play the survivors or will the players play the game? Who is tempted? Will it pay off for them? Who is chaste? Do they suffer? Does it follow the horror genre of virgins surviving or is it the type where the bad guy lives on to wreek more havoc. Will there be consequences for actions? Survivor says there will be but will the audience be paid off for it? To me, it already feels like evil will win this season. With that in mind here are my... Tribal Breakdowns: Fang (Badass name.) Crystal ~ Dan ~ Danny "GC" ~ Gillian ~ Ken ~ Matty ~ Michelle ~ Randy ~ Susie Gillian, Randy and Susie all sit in the "oldster" spectrum on the fang tribe. (Possibly leading to the oldsters figuring out that they may need to stick together.) Of the others, GC, Chrystal and Dan all have negatives attached to their chances; fish out of water, mouth is a liability and own worst enemy, respectively, all stand as the worst of the JP comments given. Plus, GC's there for the journey of it all, the experience, while Crystal seems to be the type to play as an individual from the start and if her tribemates pick up on this her chances diminish the closer she gets to merge. Dan? Obviously suffers from "foot in mouth", at some point early on. Michelle is a wild card but does(?) make the mistake of choosing the wrong alliance. Is Dan part of her wrong alliance? Ken and Matty seem to be the only ones on Fang with any real staying power, according to the preseason thoughts. Game speculation might have it as the oldsters try to nab two votes in order to rule at tribal council. Who better than Ken and Matty, right? While Crystal, GC, Michelle and Dan make up the losing side of the votes initially. Okay, maybe this is a little bit of WWID? but truly I don't get a real "tribal" vibe from alot of them. On the other hand, I really do see Gillian and Susie both being proactive in finding/forming alliances early on. (Hopefully they are with each other or the two of them may have written their own exit votes.) Randy, from the promos, seems all inyerface takeitsucker takemywifeplease kind of guy but JP hints at layers. I'm guessing we'll get to see some of those layers. To me, the three of them seem a natural fit. From that vantage they may feel like the "outsiders" from the get-go but compared to what the tribe is left with after those three, we have a couple of loudmouths, a flirter, a fish out of water, the friendliest guy and the funny geeky guy. I don't see any real cohesion between them. So for the oldsters, funny-geeky and friendly seem like the ...again... natural fit. 5 makes a majority at TC. Is it possible Dan's big mouth gets him in trouble enough where he has to consider finding votes? Perhaps Michelle has been flirting with him (good there's one) He likes Matty, so possibly Matty. (two?) Crystal is annoying and strong (nah probably not) Uh the oldsters? (Nope. Dan's an agist and besides he's targetting Gillian/Susie to go.) Who's left? Hmm.... Oh the geek? Eh...if I have to. Does that make it five? You forgot GC, Dan. Oh well he's friends with Crystal, right? Okay. I'll go talk to Crystal. We'll see, Dan. Now, for the side that will, for me, probably contain the winner. Just a hunch though. On Kota Ace ~ Bob ~ Charlie ~ Corrine ~ Jacque ~ Jessica "Sugar" ~ Kelly ~ Marcus ~ Paloma On Kota it seems apparent on paper that Ace and/or Marcus will rule the tribe. Whether co-jointedly or as adversaries will be the interesting part. Sugar, Jacque and Kelly are the blonds and blondes love each other. Because, they all hate brunettes. Paloma, Corrine and Charlie are the brunettes. The gawky, misunderstood, always playing the hater card...ha joking. I actually see the six of them kind of quietly running the game behind the alpha-egos' backs. This sadly leaves... Bob is the sole Oldster on Kota and at the first tribal council he will probably be the one going. However, if the tribe goes on a winning streak early on, the dynamic may reach the "throw a challenge" level just to lose dead weight OR see a showdown of sorts happen. I'm hoping for a showdown.   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-22-08, 09:51 AM (EST) 6. "RE: words words words" My reaction to these tribes was the same as yours - Kota seems stronger; Fang could be a mess. I think the winner will come from Kota too and agree there is already an evil overtone to the season. From watching the videos, though, I didn't get the feeling that the oldsters would form an effective alliance on Fang. I think they're early boots. I think the young'uns will hang together until the good versus evil pulls them apart. Tribe's Perspective   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-22-08, 06:04 PM (EST) 8. "RE: words words words" On Fang the men are up 5/4 and I sense it will be arranged that their first boot is a woman. Susie and Gillian are most in danger there, imo. Surfkitten Summer Sigshop 2008   Top

tribephyl 12393 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-22-08, 09:28 PM (EST) 10. "RE: words words words" Really? Dan, Matty, Ken, GC and Randy are all together? Wow. Talk about misfits. Does that also mean that Michelle, Crystal, Susie and Gillian stick together as well? Or is it just everyone gang up on Gillian/Susie? Just interested in how the tribalcouncil dynamic will fall. I can't put my finger down on any of them yet so I was just thinking about the possible groupings within the tribe. A gender split wasn't one of the ones that I thought had real potential. Why is that?   Top

SpotTheDifference 949 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent" 09-22-08, 11:26 PM (EST) 11. "RE: words words words" I agree. I don't see a split between genders, if only because I don't think all people of the same gender will fit under either the "good" or "evil" category. Randy's definitely giving evil vibes on pre-show interviews, and I don't think Ken and Matty will fall under that category, given what Jeff has to say about them.   Top

Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-23-08, 11:10 AM (EST) 12. "RE: words words words" It wouldn't have to be a hard-core gender split. It could even go down that the particular female boot is suggested by one of the other women and the men all happily go along. I just sense that even if they have clashing personalties, the men on Fang would be happy to keep their numerical advantage at least for their first TC. Or do you see hard-core good and evil groups facing off immediately? Usually in Ep 1 no one really knows what to do and no one wants to stick out so everybody goes along with getting rid of the same person. Surfkitten Summer Sigshop 2008   Top

tribephyl 12393 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-23-08, 10:54 PM (EST) 14. "RE: words words words" I see your points and you're right, it would not have to be a hard-core split, in any direction. However, from current challenge photos it would seem that the three oldsters would have reason to be fearful at tribal council as the three of them will be at the final puzzle solving phase of the immunity challenge. Probably causing the loss as the tribes look fairly close at most of the previous obstacles. So by seperating them by age might still be the cause (or moreso challenge-impared) as to who to vote out. Randy may think he will last with the guys, and susie may flee a sinking ship, but I just think it would be sad for the oldsters to not try to get something going for themselves. Overall I do believe that we'll be seeing the evil versus good theme, but in this first week it looks like the semi-typical Sonja-boot. *sigh* I'm this close to making Michelle sick and having the tribe pity vote her out, just to save the oldsters. How's that for spot on spec?   Top

Scarlett O Hara 3439 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity" 09-21-08, 06:08 PM (EST) 2. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" Welcome back everyone! I'm going to try to jump in here from time to time this year. Here are my initial thoughts on our new season based on what I've read and the pre-season videos from CBS and TVGuide: First off, we have heard a lot from Jiffy in preparation for Season 17. Very dramatic landscape --- the wildlife! --- first time in high definition --- good v. evil theme --- no hot & heavy showmances --- elephant will visit one of the camp sites, etc. However, we must also listen to what we are not hearing from Jiffy. We are not hearing this: "best season ever" --- "most blindsides ever" --- "HII will come into play over and over again," or "most injuries ever," etc. Therefore, I am left to wonder if this will not be one of the better seasons of Survivor, and rank as rather ordinary and/or predictable. Just a hunch as Jiffy just doesn't show a lot of excitement over the cast and season to me. OK, here's my pre-show take on our cast of characters. Please note it is based on what I have seen and read recently as well as on my knowledge of seasons past: Tribe breakdowns: Fang: Crystal, Dan, Danny "GC", Gillian, Ken, Matty, Michelle, Randy, Susie. Kota: Ace, Bob, Charlie, Corrine, Jacque, Jessica "Sugar", Kelly, Marcus, Paloma Ace: He comes across as very arrogant to me and slightly pompous. Will he vie for a leadership position on his Kota tribe with Marcus? He's a big personality maybe even in a Robfadda kind of way (I wish). We can already see from the vidcaps that he has a soft spot for the ladies. In particular, Sugar! I get the feeling he's going to be a puppet master on his tribe. Or will he turn out to be more like a Jean Robert character who was a big disappointment? I think he's going to be fun to watch. I think if he makes it to the merge, he will be a real contender. Bob: This season's Yau man. We will all fall in love with him, but unfortunately, he will be voted out too early as a physical liability to his tribe. Charlie: This season's Todd -- the scrawny gay guy who knows how to play the game. I predict he'll go far and he'll be a fun one to watch!! He will align with (and have a man crush on) Marcus. Corrine: the b****h! Will she be this season's Jerri? I think this one will be a schemer and find herself in the majority alliance that may take her all the way to the jury. Like Amanda, I think she will be a player. Crystal: Like Jolanda, I think she will be an "alpha" female and will compete with Dan for the leadership position over at Fang. You don't become an Olympic Champion by sitting on the sidelines. If she makes it to the merge, she could be our merge boot. Otherwise, she could become our first woman challenge hog. Like VS said, strong verbal women do not fare well in this game. She will align with GC and Randy. Dan: A lawyer. A leader. He will challenge Crystal for the leadership role over at the Fang tribe. In his camp of supporters, he’ll have Gillian, Matty and possibly Susie. He may make it to the merge if he’s in the dominant alliance, but will not last long after that. Danny: "G.C.” is out of his element. He is a kinder, gentler “Dreamz”. I see him aligning with Crystal. His quiet disposition and athletic ability will get him all the way to the jury, but I do not see him in the F2 or F3 as he could really use the money and would be likely to win jury votes. Gillian: She is the oldest woman and as such, she is likely to go very early as she is a physical liability to her tribe. Her only hope is to work her way into a dominant alliance. I don’t think she will be the first boot, but she will be an early boot. Jacque: I predict that she will play this game and go to the very end game in the way that Becky Lee did. I think she will make the right alliances that will carry her through to the end. Possible F2 or 3? Jessica “Sugar”: She is cute and will endear herself to men such as Ace. This is her only hope of going far in this game. She has staying power and may possibly make the jury, but as mentioned in the media, she is not very athletic. Kelly: Very attractive but disposable. Too young to fit in with her more mature tribemates. I see her as an early boot for her tribe Kota. Ken: The young Asian Pro gamer will surprise everyone with his puzzle-solving ability and sweet disposition. I think he will start off on the outside of the two budding Kota alliances along with Michelle, but will go deep into the game by flying under the radar. Marcus: He will be the leader of the Kota tribe. Can he coexist with Ace? Time will tell. I see him as the “good” to Ace’s “evil.” I think he will prevail and go deep into the game. Could be the season’s Terry or Tom. Matty: He will align with Marcus. I think he’ll make it to the jury. Michelle: My pick for first boot over on the Fang tribe. She is the last to be picked in the tribal pick ‘em and won’t relate to the older members of her tribe. Paloma: She will fly under the radar if she can. She needs to align with the power alliance in her tribe. Randy: Seen in the vidcaps with Crystal. He won’t make it to the merge. He will be a physical liability and his mouth will get him in trouble. Susie: I think she’ll make it to the merge if there are no tribal switches before the merge. That’s my two cents. Most of these are my gut feelings. This is one of my first posts in this thread so I hope I am contributing something.   Top

PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-21-08, 08:29 PM (EST) 3. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" *pokes VS* Haven't had a chance to completely digest your post, but wanted to drop in and say 'welcome back' and look forward to another season of breaking down these loozers to come to some conclusions who's going to stick around a while.   Top

redbeard103152 466 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star" 09-22-08, 08:13 AM (EST) 5. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" Great to see all the regulars coming in with their guesses about what this season will bring. Looking forward as always to the new season and especially to VS's thread for the always important editing information   Top

flystorms 212 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 09-22-08, 01:52 PM (EST) 7. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" This is exciting! Thanks for the great opening analysis. I'm looking forward to more!   Top

emydi 13669 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-22-08, 07:24 PM (EST) 9. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" Hey sweetie nice to see you can't wait for your analysis again and I'm going to have a ball with the animals!   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-23-08, 09:25 PM (EST) 13. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" Thank you Veruca for starting this marvelous thread once more. Very interesting take on the contestants. I also enjoyed reading Scarlett, Tribe's, CTgirl and all the others view of the players. I’ll try to contribute my view of this season’s story and the theme of each episode. From there, I’ll be using the confessionals of each player to indentify the roles they are given. Reading and contributing to this thread has thought me that the usual roles seen on Survivor are: - The Tourists: Those players have very little connections to the game. A few have visibility but then, their narration is limited to the local customs and the surroundings. Their longevity can range from early boots (Cecilia) to end game players (Denise) but we know these characters can’t win. Their elimination received justification and therefore can give us clues to the identity of the winner. Yau Man was treated as a Tourist in Micronesia, his boot necessary to save the couples alliance. That was a big sign that the winner was in that alliance. - The Victims: They have much more visibility but rarely last to the merge. We get to know those players and like them or at least feel their pain. Think of Anthony in Fiji or Kathy in Micronesia. The victims are up against impossible odds and have no defense against what or who torments them. Since their elimination is almost unfair, usually the winner doesn’t get the stain of eliminating them. - The Villains: The antagonists in the story, these huge characters are often manipulated in such a way that their downfall is met with cheers from the viewers. There can be early game villains (Rocky, Joel) and end game ones (Mookie, Judd). - The Dumb Players: Coming in different forms, from lazy to loudmouth, we see them as being out of their elements. They are often used as comic relief. Their longevity can also vary but once a player has been repeatedly tagged as dumb in the early episodes (Boo, Erik R) then we know they can’t win. - The Hero: Larger than life, this character will fail if his story is limited to his exploits, if we don’t get insight into his game plan or see that his gameplan is seriously flawed. Think of Terry, Ozzy, Rupert and James. - The Players on a Journey: These players have longevity and are fan favorites but we are told that their goal is not necessarily to win the game. They want to make their family proud, to learn about themselves or have other such goal in mind. Yau Man in Fiji proved he was valuable, Cirie’s family was proud of her game. If players aren’t trapped into one role but we get to know many facets of their personality and learn their gameplan then we could be looking at a possible winner. It takes 3 or 4 episodes to identify all the roles so by then we should also be narrowing down the possible winner… Or have fun trying! What can we tell from the editing of the early promos. We know that these promos aren’t as revealing as what our newest Emmy winner says but it can tell us about some futures roles. Promos have featured Marcus, Ace and Crystal. Also seen were Gillian, Michelle, Matty, Bob, Ken and Jessica. Marcus was first seen even before the cast was revealed. His comments have been both thematic since he talked about being in Eden and wanting to find an Eve, about the game, forming alliance and about the location. Marcus could be around a while. Ace is already pictured as the villain who wants to “psych people out”. Crystal has been featured in many promos but that could be because she is the closest thing we have to a celebrity this season. Her fate could be that of China’s Ashley but her talk of being the first to win in the Olympics and on Survivor indicates she could be out of her element. She does seem to talk a lot. A Dumb Player? Matty had a thematic comment: “This is Earth's Last Eden and I can see why. It's untouched land and it's amazing.” Let's see wher eit leads him. Jessica and Michelle have been used as decoration while Kelly and Paloma were mainly hidden. It will be interesting to see how far apart their roles really turn out to be. Gillian being a victim wouldn’t be too surprising and the promos could have laid the groundwork Ken, Bob and Danny sounded a little out of their elements. It will be interesting to see how these players are portrayed.   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 09-27-08, 08:45 PM (EST) 15. "RE: Episode One " *poking back* Thrilled to see all of you and hoping and expecting that I can RESPOND to posts rather than just doing the posting I only did an indepth analysis on the first episode as I have always believed it is crucial in understanding what the editors plan for us. An absolutely beautiful opening in Gabon Africa as emydi must have been thrilled with all the animals shown. Our newest contestants are shown walking down a great hill with the camera closing in on Bob, Charlie then a threesome shot of Ace, Corrine and Crystal. On Jeff’s note of different backgrounds Crystal advises that she is an Olympic champion and what she will use in the game Bob tells us his profession with a bit of life background GC tells us he wasn’t the best kid but he is grown now and can’t believe he has a chance to win a million dollars Ace advises that he grew up wealthy and proceeds to give examples On Jeff’s note about battling the elements/each other Matty tells us this is Earth’s last Eden and he can see why Jeff advises only one will win claim the million dollar prize as a group shot is shown walking further Marcus advises it is amazing to be thrown into the world and "here we go." With our opening underway, can we ascertain those that were given opening confessionals will be central characters? It is quite a possibility - as we see later in the show, almost all those individuals (I would say Matty was a bit lower key in presentation but on this tribe, that is suggestive of his staying the course for the time being) were in a group of featured players. Crystal was quite visible (not only just her stature ) but central in tribe discussions and personal thoughts); Bob was seen and heard as well as discussed positively (a streamlined positive role model); GC was very prominent in his role (with some complexity and conflict developing); Ace was shown quite a bit and discussed ; (there appears to definitely be an arc with him) and Marcus was also shown quite a bit and also discussed (already involved in the formation of an alliance as well as being very well received by his tribe mates). While this is not a hard and fast rule, it stands to reason that EVERY contestant is asked to set forth their opening thoughts on the show yet only some are selected. We have to then decide if they are just good sound bites OR if the editors want them delivered us to right off the bat. Considering the comments put forth.... Crystal and Bob discussed their profession - possibly their professions are more important than they may be ultimately, GC and Ace discuss themselves and background which may have direct relevance to how they play the game as well as their potential downfall (or advantage) and Marcus and Matty discussed the setting.... Characters with generic commentary that anyone could have said may be ones to watch if only because anyone could have made that commentary. Consider that Marcus and Matty were generally well received (Marcus much more so) their initial presentation may be solely for the purposes for the audience to be able to identify them. For those who subscribe to wording and visuals, Jeff’s words of only one winning the million dollar prize was immediately followed by Marcus’s confessional Scene One - The Introduction Jeff has them make introductions for the basis of tribe selection: Danny (GC) "I’m a maintenance supervisor" Bob "I’m a physics teacher" Jacque: "I do medical device sales" Ken: "Professional video game player and college student" Ken (conf) "....I’m a huge time strategist but I am very shy and in the game of Survivor I am the underdog" Marcus: "I’m in the medical field.....good to see you Jeff" (Jeff replies it is good to see him also) Charlie: "I’m a management consultant" Matty: "I’m a personal trainer" Susie: "I’m a part time hairdresser AND a mom and a wife" (a nod of acknowledgment from Ace) Paloma: "I’m a student and a server?" Randy: "I’m a videographer" Randy (conf) "...I’m not the most positive person in the world; I’m not a big fan of marriage, I will never get married myself. I’m almost sure of it" Ace: "I’m a photographer" Crystal: "I’m a pre-school teacher and full time mom" Crystal (conf) "Even though I am an Olympic gold medalist in track and field.... will not tell anyone what my real occupation is" Kelly: "I’m an assistant manager and buyer for one of the high end retail stores" Corrine: "I do pharmaceutical sales" Corrine: (conf) "I’m going to be a total ##### and I’m going to get rid of who I want to get rid of and hurt people’s feelings and gonna laugh when people cry and gonna own it" Dan: "Five years being an attorney and currently finding myself" (Jeff replies he has 39 days to do this IF he is lucky) Michelle: "Michelle, hi, aka woman in the purple (reply to Jeff’s label) I work in film... (Ken shown for obvious reasons) Sugar: "Retro pin up model" Gillian: "I’m a wife, mother, grandmother of four and nurse" (Ace reaction) Another perhaps telling observation are those who were shown given confessionals during the introduction and what they possibly mean. These confessionals may have a direct correlation to how these contestants end up guiding their story. Ken, the underdog; Randy, crotchety with attitude; Crystal, hiding her profession may be a storyline; (note that Marcus was never featured with this particular issue); Corrine, a villain The Tribe Selection Bob chooses Ace Gillian chooses Crystal Ace chooses Sugar (with a glimpse of the younger men eyeing each other) Crystal chooses Susie due to the mom factor Charlie: (conf) "Okay now we are playing stupid Survivor...she clearly is not athletic, I am so confused, like don’t you want to win immunity?" Sugar chooses Marcus Susie chooses Matty who responds to Jeff that he has "three moms" Marcus chooses Charlie who is happy per Jeff Matt chooses Randy Charlie chooses Paloma Randy chooses Dan Paloma chooses her lady Kelly Dan chooses GC Kelly chooses Jacque because they need three blondes GC chooses Ken Jacque chooses Corrine Michelle is last chosen "I’ll learn to love you guys, maybe" while Dan exclaims they’ll take another hot girl over there Red Fang and Yellow Kota are now complete Charlie given the only confessional during the tribe selection and for all intents and purposes, this was just a gem of a confessional. It may also be telling regarding the state of Fang as well. At the very least, it was a perfect confessional in light of what happened in both these episodes Scene Two - Reward and Individual Immunity The first challenge ensues as noted that Matty and Dan choose to go back and help their stragglers GC and Marcus looking out for themselves "Big move to make early in the game" (camera hones in on Marcus) Bob helping out Paloma - Ace pushing her (Note that Ace was helping both Paloma and Sugar and only when Bob took Paloma’s hand did Ace "push her"; possibly nothing but for characterization even a subtle "helping" vs. "pushing" delineates characterization of types) Marcus first to the top (we cannot look into this as anything as he was first to the top) GC follows with Michelle "right on his tail" with the rest of Fang "lagging behind" Michelle (conf): "Fang tribe really isn’t that smart; I was last one picked and first girl up there so they can kiss my #####" Susie, Gillian and Crystal struggling for Fang "It isn’t even close" (foreshadowing?) Matty just trying to get his tribe to the top (more foreshadowing?) Matty confessional as to Gillian being a liability to them (visuals of Matty helping) Crystal: (conf) "I know I can run but climbing that hill was so hard - I had on a dress and my two shoes weigh 10 pounds" Jeff: "If this is any indicator, it’s gonna be a long run for you guys; it wasn’t even close" Crystal given a rationale excuse, Gillian does not get one - we saw what happened to Gillian. Little items like that.... Scene 3 - Kota Introduction Marcus: (conf) "Being out in this huge jungle...definitely an unnerving experience; you don’t know what’s around the next tree, it’s really really scary.........." (Marcus continues to give the introduction to Kota life confessional) ".......we could be eaten by a leopard and nobody would know the difference" (emydi, perhaps we have some animal foreshadowing - who is the leopard?) Sugar: (conf) "I’m excited....definitely wild animals here, this is Africa so I’m not going to get into the water right now...." Bob tends to the roof and while initially not thought to be a good idea climbing on top of it, opinions change in light of his talents Corrine: (conf) "I love Bob, he is like a forever boy scout....he’s awesome" Bob: (conf) "I got a lot of stuff running in camp; it’s common sense, I’m from Maine, that is what we do in Maine" Bob is then shown firmly established as the hope and the prayer for Kota (At this point, we see the initial dynamics over at Fang then back to Kota) Ace is shown directing the troops where a bit of a "moment" occurs in discussing the latrine as the focus is clearly on Paloma’s reaction Paloma: "Ace is getting on my nerves; like he does not shut up" (said to Charlie as they walked) This potentially may be the beginnings of the "set up" for when Kota does visit Tribal Council; since they were extremely successful this episode, discord shown was not exactly necessary unless to plant some seeds for the future. Should Kota have to visit TC perhaps Paloma and Ace are the ones being whispered about Ace (conf) "I’m the full package. I’m not just physical competitor, I’m a mental competitor. I have no fear of being the Sole Survivor. I have no fear standing in front of Jeff (an arbitrary shot of Paloma and Charlie with Paloma digging into the ground making a retching sound) and expecting my check for a million dollars" (Those who subscribe to the million dollar quote no doubt took heed of this - I have learned in the past that many types of these quotes may wax irony rather than prophecy) "What I’ve done at the moment is skew suggestions, let other people carry them out, take some of the benefit and then they go but you know who suggested that..... Ace." (With that said we immediately go to the following which may in turn relay a subtle suggestion that Ace’s thought process may be a bit of hot air) Marcus: "What do you think, day four or five it’s going to get really irritating" Charlie: "One" "Ace, he is like charismatic and he has a plan; like he’s here to play hard. I think the best strategy right now is to just lay low” Marcus: "Our best bet is to probably let Ace run the show for awhile; my prediction is that Ace is going to get obnoxious and if he can dig his own grave" (foreshadowing?) Charlie: "People say you don’t make friends here but if you can make a friend, someone you can trust it means a lot....." Marcus: "I didn’t have any doubt you weren’t a well balanced individual; I wouldn’t be talking to you if I did" (this statement comes after Charlie gushes over Marcus) Charlie: "It makes me feel good I can trust one person.." Charlie: "You’re a nice guy and you know it" Marcus: "Yea. I’m chilled, that’s all" Charlie (conf) "I feel that I have a special bond with Marcus. Ever since I saw him on the mat and he picked me I felt a connection with his deep blue beautiful eyes… Marcus (conf) "Thing with Charlie; I think he is attracted to me but you know I’ll be honest, I don’t see any romance with Charlie and I; he’s a great guy...but not really the way I roll. I’m straight. We’re in Eden but there’s no two Adams here" The seeds are being planted. Marcus gets the lay of the land confessional. Bob is everyone’s hero, the niggling of an alliance that we see fleshed out more later with Charlie and Marcus, Charlie clearly is enamored with Marcus which may be beneficial for Marcus, and Ace appears to be someone who may be woven through a few stories. Considering the second episode the alliance developed is obviously a stoyline in progression although I would be surprised if all four are at the end and we may see an interesting development with their "fifth" Scene 4 - Fang Introduction Gillian tells the group that apparently some thought they sucked today but proceeds to give a pep talk to her newly formed tribe. Gillian (conf) "I always try to maintain a positive attitude... maybe they’ll forget I was the old broad who fell off the hill" (alas they did not) As we see, Gillian announces her wish for elephant dung, Randy comments to GC, Gillian’s enthusiasm begins to feel slightly overbearing. Randy (conf) "This is our first day and I’ve come to the conclusion that Gillian is annoying. She is so busy just trying to look busy and she’s not accomplishing crap" (a nice segue to the dung) Ken and Michelle then shown developing their friendship as they go look for termites. It would have been apparent just by this scene that Ken would last longer than Michelle as Ken continued to be developed Ken: (conf) "As a professional gamer there is a stereotype that we are anti socials, nerds... of course, girls don’t dig that..." "Back home I am very shy with the girls that I like, the last girl I kissed was actually in high school...." "Being here in Gabon with a girl you are attracted to is a very special moment in life.... ....you never know, a romance could start" (As an added bonus, Ken trips while they both walk) It stands to reason that the editors would like us to "like" Ken. Goofy, inexperienced, has an immediate crush on Michelle - the perpetuated "underdog" as Ken even told us. To compound matters, his "crush" ultimately gets voted out. In a tribe that is fraught with dysfunction (as we see later) Ken would probably be one of the few on that tribe the editors want us to wish prevails. (The following scene at night time comes after the second scene at Kota) Matty: (conf) "The animals are starting to lurk around camp; there’s an elephant thirty yards from our hut.....it’s a little bit frightening" At this point, Randy injures himself which naturally has to be shown with Randy advising "As long as I stay in the game, I can handle a scar." Randy (conf) "Leaving this game is not an option and I’m petrified this injury could take me out of the game." Consider that Randy discusses the next day he feels better and there was no mention by Jeff about his injury when the two tribes came together, I highly doubt Randy’s injury becomes a further issue With that brief introduction the stage is already set with upcoming dynamics, Ken and Michelle are bonded, Randy already has issues with Gillian and sets the tone for his portrayal as a character – the other members at this time are generally not necessary to any unfolding for this episode Scene 5 - Fleshing Out Tribe Dynamics Fang dynamics are fleshed out further as Michelle is shown complaining and the opinion about this (notably Matty) Michelle (conf): "I keep thinking why I am stuck with these people when the other tribe has these smart, beautiful people and I’m stuck with these dorks" Certainly this was solely used for the set up for the upcoming Tribal Council; there was nothing positive coming from Michelle and while we may consider that Fang and their dynamics leave something to be desired; there was no real validation to Michelle’s words. We didn’t suddenly see a tribe member do something "dorkish" - this solely was to represent Michelle in a negative light and help further the plot Kota is now revisited with the treemail read (as Ace and Sugar bond as well) and a much different aura surrounds this tribe as Ace enlists Marcus, Charlie, Corrine, Sugar, Kelly and Jacque in yoga. Ace wants his tribe in sync for the challenge as Paloma watches on (again, another coupling of these two) Bob remarks he should be stretching as Paloma can’t contain her amusement over yoga in your underwear in the jungle continues. As noted before, these scenes with Kota are solely to tap into some dynamics as, at some point, they will visit Tribal Council (although one never knows if another Ulong may happen) At this time, Ace is being nicely set up as being on the "hot seat" and on two occasions Paloma has been shown having issue with him. Charlie and Marcus also mentioned Ace as well which all seems a bit heavy handed. Ergo, Ace may be our wonderful "decoy" for any upcoming Kota TC - again, it would not be surprising should Paloma and Ace be the opposing candidates with Ace staying since his characterization is being shown to us quite a bit with some underlying story. Scene 6 - The Immunity Challenge Paloma, Sugar and Bob are the designated puzzle assemblers as is Randy, Gillian and Susie. Of note: --Corrine and Kelly are stuck --A friendly exchange of dirt between Ace and Ken are shown --Fang falls behind during the digging as noted by Jeff --Bob mentions he was excited to do the puzzle (as a confessional - a new editing item I believe, i.e. showing confessionals during the challenge) --Jeff telling Gillian to put the shouts of encouragement in deep freeze with Randy’s confessional “I’m really tired of that accent, I understand never quit but dude we lost” --Marcus gets to kiss the flint --Jacque receives the slow motion fist in air and Paloma the thumbs up Jeff: “So far, three days in, this is not even close, two absolute blowouts” Scene 7 - The Aftermath Matty attempts to boost morale with hugs and words GC (conf) “We lost another challenge, we could have had fire tonight and most importantly we could have kept our tribe together” Randy: "We need somebody and nobody wants to, to say I’m going to be the leader” (to Dan) GC conf: “I’m the only one who is not worried about getting voted off because I won that first immunity challenge and it feels good but at the same time there’s nobody who stepped up as leader of this tribe so we got to have some kind of game plan This confessional was piece mealed together as he is shown in two different places notwithstanding his words about leadership were very random after discussing his having immunity - the context of this confessional worked better obviously at this time in light of the TC and all the discussion on leadership Randy: "You hearing anything" Matty: "Yeah Michelle" Dan: "Why is our team better without Michelle?" Matty: Because right now (Dan interrupts to say he isn’t arguing) we are down and out... we need positivity, she is negative..." Dan: "I’ll do whatever" Susie advises them to let her know where they are at and leaves the group but she "is in" Randy says it is early and Matty counters it’s not that early Randy (conf) "If I believed Michelle was getting 5, 6, 7, 8 votes tonight I have no problem voting for her, it’s just I don’t buy it yet" (a little doubt for good television) "I’d prefer Gillian to go tonight just because she is a 60 year old women, nothing against 60 year old women but don’t come to my camp" (All his confessionals were spliced together at different periods of time) "She cheer leads and blows sunshine thinking I’ll like her... it’s worthless..." Ken and Michelle have their own discussion with Ken advising that Gillian’s name is out there but so is Michelle’s whereupon Michelle advises Ken this would confirm that this tribe has the dumbest people on earth. Ken believes it will be a mixed vote. Ken (conf) "Gillian is our weakest member in like, everything... she’s a nice lady but I don’t think she is meant for this game" "I would really like to keep Michelle because I really do like Michelle and I really think she would be allied with me" Again yet another indicator that Michelle would leave as this scene involved Michelle’s vulnerability yet Ken was shown to us) Gillian and Dan now discuss the TC Gillian (conf) "I have absolutely no qualms about voting for Michelle.. she should go home for her sake and for our sake... ...I might be the naive woman...but I doubt it though..." Scene 8 - Tribal Council Our first Tribal Council was certainly a feisty one with the culmination of the potential victims… Dan advises Jeff they did okay which does not sit well with Jeff and Dan believes they can take those guys (Michelle’s face is notable) Jeff is amused then asks Michelle her opinion Michelle advises it took a long time and people like Ken and GC were taking breaks Negative push on Michelle with faces from Crystal, questioning look by Ken and defense by GC) At this juncture, Dan intervenes, Michelle argues and Susie can’t hold back her opinion, Crystal joins in and Jeff shakes his head. One validation for Michelle was Matty after she said she thought you don’t finish a race until it is done or you win. A shifting of music and a thoughtful look from Crystal complete the intention of the statement. Crystal advises they have no leader and Gillian furthers the point that it is thought to be the death knell. GC discusses the leadership issue with everyone joining together to announce they feel he could do it. GC grudgingly accepts the position Michelle advises she is close with Ken and she was not surprised she was last picked and proved herself in the first race. Her talk of dead weight was met by various reaction shots, some nods and not a positive look from Gillian Gillian acknowledges her lack of challenge skills but hopes they see more with her. The Vote Michelle and Gillian were shown voting which is of no surprise and as we have seen before, bad attitude sometimes overrides age though the age issue wasn’t far behind with the next episode. Jeff “Well you came in as a group of individuals and it seems that you found the necessary leadership to leave here as a tribe”   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-28-08, 03:08 AM (EST) 16. "RE: Episode One " Thanks, Veruca for getting us started and posting your analysis. I wanted to post my thought on the 2 hour premiere without too much outside influence so here goes: “You Need Someone to Step Up.” Without an opening surprise or big twist (except for the self-inflicted one by Fang), this season was off to a slow start, the pace set by the players simply walking up to Jeff. Crystal had the first confessional: “I’m a 2004 Olympic gold medalist…I’m gonna use my speed to win this game” Bob presented himself to us by saying: “I teach high school physics…” GC said: “I wasn’t the best kid… There was some things I’m not proud of but I’m grown now and I can’t believe that I actually have a chance to win a million dollars.” Ace followed, bragging “I grew up very well, visiting different countries…” Matty talked about the theme of the season: “This is Earth’s Last Eden and I can see why. It’s untouched land and it’s amazing.” Once Jeff said “…In the end, only one will remain to claim the million dollar prize” Marcus was shown, saying: “It’s completely awesome to be thrown into the world that is about to start. OK! Here we go!” (The opening credits had interesting animal imagery, an eagle was seen before Dan, a running pig before the running Crystal, a lurking Hippo before Bob, a Hyena before Jacque, one gorilla after Ken and another before Randy, a leopard stalking at night before Ace, a snake springing into action before Marcus and an elephant before Charlie.) As the players introduced themselves to each other (and apparently to Jeff who didn’t seem to know them), Ken had a confessional: “I’m #1 in the world at video games. I’m a big time strategist but I am very shy and in the game of Survivor, I am the underdog.” Randy told us: “I edit wedding videos for a living but I am not the most positive person in the world… I will not get married myself…” Introducing herself as a teacher and a mom, Crystal told us: “I have no intention of telling anyone what my real occupation is.” Her secret seems safe this season as many gold medalist are less memorable than your average NFL back-up QB! Corinne gave us quite a program: “I’m gonna be a total bitch and I’m gonna get rid of who I need to get rid of and I’m gonna hurt people’s feelings and I’m gonna laugh when people cry and I’m gonna own it.” As elders, Gillian and Bob were designated to make the first picks, which turned out to be Ace and Crystal. When Sugar and Susie were picked next, (to Jeff’s annoyed look) we had a confessional from Charlie: “OK! Now we’re playing “Stupid Survivor” cause this makes zero sense. She, clearly, is not an athletic person. I’m so confused, like; don’t you want to win immunities?!!” After Sugar picked Marcus, the rest of Kota were, in order, Charlie, Paloma, Kelly, Jacquie and Corinne. Fang chose Matty, Randy, Dan, GC, Ken and Michelle. With the introductions over, one has to consider that Dan, Sugar, Susie, Paloma, Kelly, Jacquie, Gillian and Michelle didn’t have a confessional. As the main character, the winner is usually introduced in the first chapter. By the way there’s 7 women in that group, two of which are already snuffed! During the challenge, GC and Marcus were said to be selfish by going for the immunity idol. Matty, Dan, Ace and Bob were pointed out as helping their tribe. We heard Gillian was bringing up the rear and Crystal was hilighted as finishing last. Being the first woman up the hill and third overall, Michelle had a confessional: “I don’t think the Fang tribe is that smart. I was the last one picked, I was the first woman up there so they can kiss my ass.” After the loss, Matty reflected: “I think we’re screwed in a lot of the physical challenges because Gillian is going to be a huge, huge load to carry.” Crystal said “Climbing that hill was so hard… my two shoes weighed at least 10 pounds.” Second scene: Arriving at camp, Kota was in a great mood, people laughing and cheering. Marcus took on the role of narrator: “Being… in the middle of this huge jungle, it’s definitely an unnerving experience. You don’t know what’s around the next tree. It’s really, really scary. We emerged from the jungle, we looked down and we saw the flag for Kota waiving in the breeze. There’s this beautiful lake and in front of it there’s a couple of broken down huts. It was a joy to see that there was shelter kind of established. It’s a wild, wild place and you don’t want to be out there, exposed to the animals. The rest of the tribe could be sitting there and we could be getting eaten by a leopard and no one would know the difference.” Remember that Ace was portrayed as the leopard in the intros! Sugar, giggling, told us: “I’m excited, this place looks beautiful. But there are wild animals out there. This is really Africa. So, I’m not going to get in the water right now and I’m not going to be bathing or swimming in the lake with my tribe mates.” When Bob climbed on top of the hut to fix the roof, Corinne said: “Oh! Bob! He’s just like the forever boy scout. He totally gets it together. He’s got the camp running really smoothly. He’s fifty seven years old and he’s awesome.” Bob, humbly: “I’ve done a lot of stuff around camp. To me, it’s common sense, I come from Maine. That’s what we do in Maine.” (As he made a bench, a woman was heard complimenting “you’re the coolest, Bob.”) Bob’s confessional continued: “I don’t like to spend money, so I tinker. If I don’t know how to do it, I go to the library… look it up and do it.” Fang’s arrival wasn’t as auspicious, Gillian trying to pump up her tribe: “According to some people, we sucked today. I thought we were awesome.” Gillian had a confessional: “I always try to have a positive attitude… The Fang tribe will remain positive.” She then went hunting for elephant dung, grabbed some and brought it to camp and wondered if there was something edible inside. (And she wasn’t the first voted out!!!) Randy commented: “This is our first day and I’ve come to the conclusion that Gillian is annoying… She’s not accomplishing crap.” Ken went out looking for termites with Michelle. Ken: “As a professional gamer, there is a stereotype that you’re anti-social, you’re a nerd, you’re in your basement all the time. Girls don’t dig that. Back home, I am very shy with the girls that I like. The last girl I kissed was in high school, four or five years ago, which is a long time. Being here in Gabon with a girl you are attracted to is a special moment in life. I’m single and she is single, you never know, a romance could start.” Back in Kota, we had one of the key scenes of the episode: It started with Ace distributing the chores, first concentrating on the latrines. His ideas didn’t sit well with Paloma who walked away with Charlie, saying: “Ace is getting on my nerves. He doesn’t shut up.” Ace: “I’m the full package. I’m not just a physical competitor, I’m a mental competitor. I have no fear of being the Sole Survivor, I have no fear of standing in front of Jeff and expecting my check for a million dollars. What I’ve done at the moment is give suggestions, let other people carry them out, take some of the benefits but you know who suggested that, right?! Ace!” Charlie then went with Marcus, asking him: “What do you think? Day 4 or 5, it’s gonna get irritating.” Marcus answered bluntly: “One.” Charlie added: “Ace, he’s charismatic and he’s got a plan. He’s here to play hard. I think our best strategy is just to lay low.” Marcus: “I think our best bet is to let Ace run the show. Ace is gonna get obnoxious. Let him dig his own grave.” Charlie then proposed an alliance. “People say you don’t need friends here but if you can find a friend or someone you trust, it means a lot. I was either going to play this game alone or find someone I have a connection with.” Charlie (solo): “I feel that I have a special connection to Marcus… He picked me and I felt a connection in his deep blue beautiful eyes.” Marcus (solo): “The thing with Charlie, I think he’s attracted to me but, you know… I think he’s smart… it isn’t the way I roll. I’m straight. We’re in Eden but there isn’t two Adams here.” At night, Fang had some visitors. Matty: “There’s an elephant 30 yards from our house, cruising through the forest behind our little hut. It’s just a little bit frightening.” Randy cut his forehead so the medical team also paid a visit. Randy: “I hit my head… I felt the blood running down my face. I don’t know how bad it is…” Once bandaged, he added: “Leaving this game is not an option. I’m petrified that this injury could take me out of the game.” Third Scene: Day 2 The sun rose over Fang who were looking at a succulent breakfast of crickets and grasshoppers. Randy: “The doctors were great… It will be fine in a couple of days.” Meanwhile, Michelle was miserable because she was freezing. As Dan tried to use a bone to start a fire, Michelle had a confessional: “I don’t think I got stuck with the brightest bunch, that’s for sure. The other team’s got all the smart, beautiful people and I’m with these dorks.” Day 3 (already) Jacquie, Paloma and Kelly brought back tree mail, announcing a challenge. That got Ace to gather his tribe to do yoga in preparation for the challenge. Marcus, Kelly, Jacquie, Corrine, Sugar and Charlie participated in the exercise. Ace: “Going into this challenge, I wanted us all to be really in sync so I felt a little yoga would clean out our humours, get our energy flowing… It would just get us excited and motivated for this next challenge.” Watching from the hut, Paloma once again didn’t approve, telling Bob: “I couldn’t do it. I would laugh the whole time. They’re like, doing it in, like, their underwear in the middle of the jungle.” For the obstacle course challenge, - Sugar and Paloma were among the puzzle solvers, indicating they are considered weak (Paloma also sat at the next challenge) while Ace took the lead position for Kota, Dan for Fang. - Ken and Ace threw dirt on the opposing sides which caused Jeff to comment “it’s not a playground, a million dollar game.” - GC and Matty were shown while they had quit digging. - Realizing the challenge was “an absolute blow-out”, Jeff told Gillian to stop cheering; “you might be out of it.” Randy told us how annoyed he was with Gillian (and she still wasn’t voted out first!!!) - Marcus was shown in close-up as Jeff mentioned there was flint to be won and he was shown kissing the flint after their victory. - Bob as he worked the puzzle: “It’s like working in the classroom.” Fourth Scene As they got back in camp, Matty and Dan hugged most of the team starting with Gillian and Susie but Michelle avoided them. GC: “We lost another challenge. We could have had fire but, more importantly, we could have kept our tribe together. I’m the only one that isn’t worried about getting voted off… No one wants to be the leader. We gotta to have some sort of gameplan.” Randy told the group: “We need somebody and none of us wants to step up and be our leader.” Matty told Dan, Susie and Randy that Michelle was the target because “we need positivity, she’s negative, she doesn’t want to be here, she’s miserable.” Susie and Dan were in agreement but Randy was seen hesitating. Randy who has become the Fang narrator: “If I believed that Michelle was getting 5, 6, 7 votes tonight, I’d have no problem voting for her. It’s just that I don’t buy it yet. I would prefer Gillian to go tonight. She’s a 60 year old woman. Nothing against the 60 year old women out there but; don’t come to my camp. She cheerleads… thinking they are going to like her but, to be honest, Gillian is worthless.” Ken had a ‘second date’ with Michelle. It was bitter sweet as he knew she was getting voted out. Ken: “Gillian is our weakest member and we need physical players. She’s a nice lady but I don’t think she’s meant for this game… I’d rather keep Michelle in the tribe. I really do like Michelle and I really think she would be allies with me.” He told Michelle “I think you’re on the outs right now.” Michelle thought it confirmed her impression that her tribe was retarded. At tribal council, Jeff gave out the theme of the first two episodes when he said: “you need somebody to step up and help avoid coming to tribal council.” Dan proved his delusion when he told Jeff the tribe did OK. Michelle complained that people were taking breaks. Susie and Matt took offense. Jeff was disturbed and he asked Crystal who was leading the tribe. Crystal said they didn’t have a leader. Gillian said they had many leader-types but that no one wanted to take the risk. GC said a leader would be a good idea so he was ‘volunteered’ as leader. Jeff was impressed “Fang has a leader and his name is GC” but GC was depressed! The Second Episode began with Fang’s return to camp. GC: “We had our first tribal council tonight and it sucked. We lost Michelle but we were lucky enough to get flint tonight. To my surprise my tribe picked me to be the leader. It feels good that people want me to be the leader but at the same time, I got a big target on my back because of the title.” (Poor GC was also ‘volunteered’ to make the fire with Randy adding jokingly “If you miss fire you’re getting voted out.”) His confessional went on: “It felt good that I was the one to get fire and that we can eat and be warm.” Day 4 in Kota started with Bob making a fire. Marcus: “Things are going well. I think the tribe settled down a lot after the great victory we had yesterday. We’re kinda doing the daily chores.” (Paloma was seen bringing firewood while Sugar was just sitting, saying she liked her team) As Marcus served rice pudding, Charlie had a confessional: “Marcus is my favorite person out here. He’s funny, he’s smart, he’s athletic, he’s the full package. (Ace bragged he was the full package while Marcus is called the total package. It’s always better to be talked about) I can’t understand why a million girls aren,t jumping all over him. I certainly would be if I could.” Marcus and Charlie then went on the lake for another key scene, the music changing from merry percussions to more serious, quieter notes. Charlie told Marcus: “I can’t stress enough how safe I feel because I have you… Someone is gonna back me up.” Marcus responded: “Every day it’s gonna get stronger, I see it sort of like layers, you know? Like, you’re in my inner circle. I’d like to have people like Jacquie close to that.” Marcus (solo): “I have this inner circle bond with Charlie. I look at it sort of like layers of an onion. Charlie’s the guy that’s in the innermost layer and then we are adding people as we go along.” After Marcus told Charlie that Jacquie was a really cool girl, Charlie added: “And I think Corinne. I actually really like her.” Marcus (solo) “At this point, it’s looking like the large onion alliance, as I like to call it, is going to be myself, Charlie, Jacquie and Corinne. It’s what we are shooting for. Jacquie’s an awesome girl and I think she’s also very intelligent and I think Corinne is probably the smartest woman around. I’m gonna talk to Corinne and get a vibe from her because no one has made an official pitch at this point.” GC began his reign in Fang by trying to distribute chores but got very little cooperation from Susie, Gillian, Crystal, Matty and Randy. Nevertheless, GC had a positive confessional: “Being the leader I think is working out OK. I’m just trying to get this camp put together. I’m a maintenance supervisor and it’s my job to build things… Lets get this ball rolling. So far, the ideas that I present to them, they think they are pretty good so we got a plan for the day.” (That’s not what we read from Crystal, Ken and Randy’s body language!) Randy (solo): “Our tribe has a leader, GC, but he’s too young and he doesn’t know squat about any of this. My new plan is called: Operation Let Other People Crash and Burn. My best plan right now is just to keep my mouth shut and watch us self-destruct.” Back in Kota, Marcus did what he had planned and talked to Corinne who said she had only talked to Jacquie. She added “I trust Jacquie whole-heartedly and I trust you… I’d like the alliance to be you, me and Jacquie really strong and have Charlie and then one looser person.” Corinne (solo): “When I first came in, I really liked Jacquie, I liked Marcus and Charlie because I really think they are trustworthy. I know that’s only 4 and that leaves 5 out but that just a short-term thing and we only need one extra person to be in the majority and Bob has really been good and I really like him.” The four came together with Jacquie saying “I think Bob is the best, right?” Marcus said: “I think we can convince Bob that going with Ace is not the right way to go.” Corinne said: “I could pull Bob in. The only problem is that I don’t want to give him too much information.” Charlie (solo): “When Corinne, Jacquie, Marcus and I were out in the forest, it was the first time that we ever talked strategy as a foursome. It was like magic, it was like one brain working as one. (sic) It was amazing. I really think we are on the same page here.” Night 4 in Fang featured snorers and GC having enough with the leadership role. It started with Gillian complaining about the people waking her up. GC retorted: “I’m a grown man and I don’t need anyone telling me what to do.” (Rory?) He added: “This whole leadership, you know, I’m pretty much done with that anyways. We don’t need a damn leader. I’m younger than all of you so why am I the leader for? I didn’t want to be the leader, you’re not going to force me to be the leader so I’m not going to.” Randy (solo) “GC, which stands for ‘Golden Child’, resigned as leader which was probably the best leadership call he’s made since he’s been leader because he hasn’t led anything.” Dan: “He’s a leader who quit this morning. It’s the complete opposite reaction that you’d want from any kind of leader. Everyone’s got their own management style. I know I’m highly emotional so I’m not sure my management style would be any better. I would like to be the silent leader. The silent leader is never the one that gets the blame but he gets to lead so that would be a great direction.” After Matty read tree mail, Dan went on: “I think we definitely have a chance but we’d have a better chance if we were unified. I had the idea of painting people’s face with charcoal and that seemed to bring the mood up a little bit.” At the challenge, Jeff mentioned that there was an hidden immunity idol while the camera focused on Marcus. Bob and Ken retrieved the keys for their respective tribes. Corinne announced that Dan would be sent to Exile Island but the camera showed the discussion being led by Bob and it looked like a group decision, everyone smiling. Returning to camp, Charlie had a confessional: “I was so excited when we won the fishing gear for our rerward. We are by far the stronger team in that we won 3 challenges and we just are getting stronger and stronger because of the rewards that we win. I was expecting the worst out here but this is like ten thousand times better than my normal life at home. I’m having a blast out here, this is totally fine.” Marcus led a celebration dance that Corinne, Jacquie and Sugar joined. As Bob and Marcus went out in the boat to catch fish, Jacquie had her first confessional: “Our moral is way up. Everybody is about team work and we have the most clever guys possible. They know how to put the net out. We have all of our fishing lines going. We are doing really well. I don’t envision us losing ever.” Since the first episodes have set up a confrontation between Marcus and Ace, I thought it very interesting that we were shown Marcus catching the first fish, having Corinne and Jacquie there to cheer him on and, even if Ace was shown catching a fish, Marcus got most of the praise…and a second fish Exile Island. Dan had a very unflattering scene on exile island. “I’m a pretty analytical thinker… so I can crack this clue” he said but we saw that he didn’t even get the meaning of “across the lake”. He wandered around the lake, never coming close to the sand crater. It ended with Dan saying: “Exile island is the worst place ever… I can’t possibly be this stupid that I’m missing something… I’m not having any luck. It sucks.” Back in Fang, GC was miserable even if Matty was trying to get the tribe’s spirits up. GC in confessional: “We lost another damn challenge today, for the third time in a row. It’s frustrating because we really needed it, especially the fishing gear. It’s tough, having to deal with the losses over and over again. It starts to make you feel like you may never win.” Ken (solo) “A lot of the challenges here have been physical and we haven’t been winning any challenges because we’re losers. So, you have to learn from your mistakes why we lost and the reason why we lost is Gillian.” He agreed with Crystal and Matty that Gillian should go. Gillian talked with Susie, saying: “They’re going to get rid of me first but you’re next.” Gillian’s confessional where she told us she knew she was in danger ended day 5. Day 6 started with GC in confessional: “Another tribal council tonight… We have a problem just pulling it together when it’s crunch time, when it’s time to go we just not making it happen… We need a boost, we’re a very needy tribe right now. We need some food more than anything.” Just then, Randy came up with the idea to use the metal in his glasses as fishing hooks. (Something new after 17 seasons!) GC went on: “Finally we came up with a group effort. Randy, he’s pretty good… he made a fishing hook… With his fishing hook and my shoestrings, it’s definitely a group effort. Like this morning Crystal, Susie and maybe even Gillian, they all went out to look for worms. They found 6 worms. Everybody’s helping and it’s working out for everybody.” With Ken, GC caught 5 fishes. He exclaimed: “Success! We caught some damn fish around this place. With reward, we were supposed to get fishing gear but we caught fish anyway, we don’t need that stuff… The Fang tribe has protein now after 6 days. It feels good.” Dan’s return led to suspicions that he had the immunity idol. GC (solo) “Dan’s back from Exile Island and he was acting real strange. I just don’t get this guy. I’m guessing he either knows where it is or Dan has the immunity idol.” Going out of camp to talk with Matty, Ken and Susie, GC added: “If Dan has the immunity idol, it affects my game because he would hold the power in the tribe.” Informed of the tribe’s suspicions, Randy defended Dan but Crystal wouldn’t let it go as she told Matty that Dan was smart. Matty agreed that he didn’t trust anyone in a suit. At Tribal, Jeff learned from Susie that Fang had lost its leader because of GC’s conflict with Gillian. GC gave his reasons. Randy said he understood while Dan and Crystal expressed frustrations at not having a leader. At least Jeff was happy to hear that Randy made fishing hooks. Asked about Exile Island and realizing Matty and Crystal’s suspicions, Dan emptied his bag to show he didn’t have the idol and pleaded not to be sent home by someone wanting to flush out the idol. Randy’s quote when voted to get rid of Gillian was surprising as he said “Sorry, I wish it wasn’t you”. What weren’t we shown? Jeff ended TC by telling Fang they can be successful when they work together. The Characters The outlook for Fang’s players isn’t good. We heard numerous times that the tribe wasn’t very smart. Their actions corroborated what we heard. Can they turn the corner as Jeff’s final words suggested? With leadership being a central theme of the first episode, I seriously doubt that a Fang alliance will make it to the end. Even individually, their chances are bleak: Susie, despite going twice to Tribal was relegated to the role of a Tourist. Her only positive contribution to the story was when she argued with Michelle during the first council. With Gillian’s warning that she could be next, Susie has reasons to worry eventhough we’ve seen her in many discussions with Matty, Crystal and GC who seem to hold power in the tribe. Dan’s only positive moment in the first episode was helping his tribe run up the hill. Besides that, his role also was mainly that of a Tourist. His attempt to make fire with bones and his stay at Exile Island didn’t help his portrayal at all. His role could evolve into being a “Dumb Player” especially since his big scene in episode #2, putting war paint on the players’ face, amounted to nothing. Crystal was portrayed mainly as a Dumb Player: She thinks “Outrun” is part of a winning Survivor strategy when she can’t even run up the first hill. We heard that picking Susie was playing “Stupid Survivor”. She was convinced that voting out your strongest player to flush out an idol is a good idea on day 6. Winners aren’t portrayed as dumb players. Matty had some presence, especially at the start of the episode when Jeff looked at Fang and asked him if he liked his tribe. Matty showed some social skills by saying it was good to have 3 mothers but that pick could become his story: The good guy who had no chance to win. Ken had two interesting episodes. He was shown finding the first source of protein and helping out GC catching fish. He made the first alliance in Fang but couldn’t help his ‘girlfriend’. He is a strategist in a team that lacks physical strength and that’s not very good. Portrayed from the start as the underdog, Ken’s role will either be that of someone who gets enough confidence to overcome of his shyness or he will play the role of a victim. Randy could be someone that makes it even if his tribe falters. Touted as the villain before the season started, he proved himself to be a snarky, witty narrator and a resourceful survivor. He has a future in this game but his ‘Jean Robert’ strategy is a failing one. He’ll be the antagonist, the one that will be taken down in the end. GC became the narrator for the good side of Fang. GC is completely out of his element as Randy pointed out numerous times. His story will probably show him on a Journey to Maturity. The winner seems destined to come from Kota who, despite not going to Tribal Council, showed much more interesting dynamics. With Jeff setting a theme straight out of Nash’s Game theory, you have to like the chance of a tribe that plays as a unit and is shown to play smartly. One example being the ‘Onion Alliance’ getting in on Ace’s yoga exercise program even if they are not completely behind him. With that said, Kota has quite a few Tourists: Kelly was completely forgotten by the editors. We only saw her during challenges and in meaningless camp scenes. Sugar was also ignored, her giggling confessional and her cheers not amounting to any substance. Paloma showed some antagonism towards Ace. Twice she complained about him yet she hasn’t been considered as a potential vote for the ‘onion alliance’. How her portrayal evolves could be key as she could very well be the first boot for Kota. The possibilities right now are ‘Dumb Player’, ‘Victim’ or simply ‘Tourists’. (If she becomes a Victim, someone with a manipulated edit to make the viewers like her, it will be interesting to see who gets blamed for voting her out.) Jacquie was mainly ignored even if she is a central figure in the ‘Onion Alliance’, the one linking Marcus to Corinne. Worse is that she was the one chosen to tell us about Kota’s feelings of invincibility. Either a twist will come to take her out of the game or she will be the one that makes it to the end but has no chance of winning. Certainly things can change in the next few episodes but I would be surprised if the winner doesn’t come out of the following group of 5 players: Corinne, Charlie, Ace, Bob and Marcus. Corinne is the only woman with a first episode edit that follows Survivor’s patterns for a winner. We were introduced to her right at the start, we heard her talk about her gameplan and she got positive comments from other players, Marcus calling her the smartest woman there. If she is the bitch she claims to be, she could seriously hurt the ‘Onion Alliance’ since she has gained their trust. She can also ride that strong alliance to the end and not be targeted from players outside of it. Corinne is in a nice position right now and her edit is solid. Charlie’s story will be important to what happens in Gabon. He has made many friends and, even if that fails, he won’t be targeted as a dangerous physical threat. If the big characters in Kota have a falling out, Charlie could profit from the situation. Ace has been the figurehead leader of Kota, the one the ‘Onion Alliance’ has decided to leave in charge to dig his own grave. Will Ace find a way out of it? On the positive side, we heard Marcus expressing fears of what lurks behind the trees and that a leopard could come out and eat them. Ace could be that leopard. Ace had what some consider the ‘Million dollar quote’ when he said he expected the check. Also, Bob picked Ace first and those two were often seen together yet the ‘Onion Alliance’ counts on Bob to overturn Ace. That could be a mistake. On the negative side, his style of leadership has already been put into question and been a source of mockery. More importantly we heard from Dan that the best type of leadership is the silent leader and Ace is not the silent type. At this time, his lack of presence in episode #2 and the treatment Marcus received makes me lean towards Ace failing. Bob was the star of the first hour but was relegated to the background in the second. He certainly could be that silent leader that is best suited for Survivor and we saw him taking over the shelter building chores, playing a key role in both challenges, first solving the puzzle and then retrieving the keys and we saw him putting out the fishing nets. Everybody loves Bob but that doesn’t mean they’ll let him have the check. There isn’t the sense that people are under-estimating Bob as they did with Yau Man. Bob could turn out to play the role of the Hero, the one the audience wants to see win but one that can’t win. Marcus has been given the main role in the tribe that appears to be the Tribe of Interest. He has had a lot of narration duty and he was given the chance to explain his game plan, things that are characteristics of many winners. We also saw his human side when he danced in camp to celebrate a challenge win. Mainly, in the confrontation with Ace, Marcus won the first battle when he was seen catching two fishes to the one for his rival and we heard people cheering him. While Bob could be the silent camp-life leader, Marcus is the silent vote-control leader and, in Survivor, the true leader is the one deciding on the votes.   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-28-08, 12:37 PM (EST) 17. "RE: Episode One " LAST EDITED ON 09-28-08 AT 12:46 PM (EST) First off VS so glad to see you in your usual great form for another season! On an aside, watching Survivor in HD is a treat for the scenery but poor Michelle looked completely bug bitten & miserable up close & personal in her TC performance. I'm not sure I want that much reality and by the end of the season these people may look like the living dead. Here's some things that caught my eye from your post: Marcus.......we could be eaten by a leopard and nobody would know the difference" (emydi, perhaps we have some animal foreshadowing - who is the leopard?) If you'll remember Sugar was dressed in a leopard print outfit and I wonder if at some point she does something "evil" or do her and Ace (he did pick her for his teammate) connect and at some point does she betray Ace and get away with it? Marcus: "Our best bet is to probably let Ace run the show for awhile; my prediction is that Ace is going to get obnoxious and if he can dig his own grave" (foreshadowing?) I cracked up reading this while remembering that Ace went to great lengths to describe how to dig a latrine, did he just dig his own grave or are Paloma and Charlie (maybe with Marcus involved)going to be the ones to put him in it? On Charlie's attraction to Marcus and Marcus's comment about there not being two Adams. His pre-season sound bite did involve wondering if there is an Eve out there. Jeff said something about two women going for him as well as the man. Who are the women? Jacque and Corrine since Marcus & Charlie want them as onion buddies? Does Marcus need for all his alliance mates being enamored with him? That sort of follows the arrogance Jeff spoke of when talking about him. Matty: (conf) "The animals are starting to lurk around camp; Some of the two legged variety as well.... Keep up the good insights, they're fun to read too A Tribal Sig   Top

speedstr 3 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson" 09-28-08, 11:48 PM (EST) 18. "RE: Episode One " Hello everyone, I`ve been a long time lurker, just thought I would pop in with my 2 cents. This is always my favorite thread to read, and I`m always amazed at the insights that VS and everyone else makes! I especially enjoy reading VS, as she always seems to come up with some reflections that I was already thinking, and then others that I just never even thought of! VS and Michel, you both did a great job with giving the play-by-play, but I`m just going to add on a few thoughts.. FANG I don`t think that FANG is as doomed as Michel thinks... it seemed more to me like they were being created to become the UNDERDOG tribe. Sometimes the underdog tribe tries its hardest, but loses (pagong), but sometimes, the underdog tribe figures out a way to get to the top 4 (cook islands)... if this tribe were to go the ULONG route and keep on losing, I don`t think Burnett would have portrayed so many of its tribe in a positive way, EVEN if there was a lot of conflict shown. In addition, Jeff said that they were pretty much pathetic during the first tribal council, BUT he then acknowledged how close they were in the second immunity challenge. And they also were able to create a fishing rod and caught some fish, which could have been seen in a dorky way (if the music was clown like), but it was actually portrayed as a positive thing. CRYSTAL The tribe member that I see as the MOST positively portrayed on FANG is.... Crystal! Remember Jeff said in the pre-interviews that Crystal had a big mouth and she had better watch out... we were shown a TON of visuals of her, and she was at the CENTRE of the action when it came to voting people off (she went to Ken to talk to him about voting off Gillian, and she was talking to people in regards to possibly voting off Dan). BUT, she did not come across as bossy, her tribemates obviously respect and like her (no negative comments from others, or even negative glares). AND... I remember Dan saying in one of his confessionals, that he wanted to try and be the SILENT leader, and that was the best way to lead. After watching the 2 episodes, I tried to picture him as the silent leader, and I just couldn`t. After a few minutes of thinking, I realized - Crystal could be FANG`s silent leader!! She had a few confessionals at the beginning, she gave a reasonable rationale for her poor performance during the first challenge (her damn shoes!), and she is in the centre of the alliance making and decision making... but NO ONE is mentioning her. I think she is DEFINITELY someone to watch out for, end game. As for other FANG members... KEN Ken got a really positive edit, seen visually with lots of tribe members, and was a challenge asset. He seemed to be fairly developed as a character... it makes me think that he is either a "character" that gets the boot quickly, or he makes it to the jury. DAN Dan is a bit harder to pin point - he is someone who seems destined for an early boot... the only thing that makes me hesitate is that... he had a REALLY really long time on screen, alone, trying to find the idol. Even though he wasn`t successful, it seems a bit weird that Burnett would choose to spend so much time on just him trying to find the idol, if he was going to be voted off right away. Plus, his confessionals seem to be really reflective, which means that he is being given a more complex edit. Right now, I`m kind of thinking that he makes it to just before jury, almost, but no cigar. Or maybe in the future, he gets into a position to win the game, but he messes it up somehow by not seeing a possible way to victory? Matty Matty, I think was also shown positively, even if he was UTR for the most part, he did have confessionals that described the state of the tribe as a whole, versus just tribe dynamics, which I think bodes well for him. Suzie Suzie was also UTR, but she did NOT have any confessionals related to what was happening with the tribe... not a good sign... Randy Randy, even though he was giving a lot of negative confessionals, they were also humourous, and he also saved the day when it came to finding fish. He may be another "character" edit, being showcased regardless of how long he makes it. All of his confessionals seem to be focused on comments about other people... not sure what to make of that. GC The last FANG member, GC, is probably the most intriguing for me. It seemed like he got the MOST airtime, when it came to who was being focused on... but... the viewers only got 2 negative confessionals about him (Randy and Dan when GC stepped down as leader) but these confessionals didn`t really ring negative to me. Randy actually said that it was smart of GC to step down. Within the first 2 episodes, we got to know lots about him (he came from a difficult past, and is looking to the future). We see him getting defensive in front of Gillian, and then we see him getting fish for his tribe. It seems to me that if he was an early boot, his tribemates would have had MUCH more negative confessionals about him, and GC would be seen in a dorky or clown-like way. But to me, it seems like he is being edited in a complex way, already, and we are only at episode 2! Hmmmm... My intuition is telling me that he makes it far... KOTA As for KOTA, its a bit harder for me to got through each of them because, after 2 episodes, it doesn`t seem to me that there has been a whole lot of character development from them. The MAIN crux of their edit seems to be centred around Marcus, Charlie and Ace. The alliance of Charlie, Marcus, Corinne, and Jacqui... it just seems TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE. How many times on survivor has Burnett shown us a tribe alliance, and that alliance has crumbled? This alliance just seems to be presented to us - too perfect - too quick. It`s almost in an arrogant way... almost... and we also know what happens when alliances or tribe members get too arrogant (for the most part). Marcus He seems to be a long-term player, he is getting general tribe confessionals, plus, he is being shown to be someone that EVERYONE is going to (charlie, paloma, michelle, jacqui, etc). There also seems to be a bit of an alpha-male tussle between him and Ace, except, we are only seeing Marcus strategizing, versus Ace is seen just talking about how great he is. He does a great job of describing his strategy... but there is something about his character development that just seems off. He has yet to become a multi-dimensional character... which may be become his tribe hasn`t yet gone to tribal council...my last concern is what Jeff said about him, that he was arrogant.. hmmm... Charlie Charlie seems to be figured in a BIG way the first couple of episodes... but there is just something about how he is trusting Marcus sooo much that seems like a big "edit" set up to me. Out of the 4 alliance members, Charlie seems to be the one that is the MOST sure... which makes me think that he may be the one that is either the most BETRAYED or he is the one that does the betraying! Remember how Jeff commented on Charlie in his pre-interviews? He seems to say that Charlie was playing UTR and following and the question would be if he could make decisions on his own or in a more assertive way. The way the editing is being set up, it sounds like Charlie may have to make this decision in the future... but I just don`t know if he will make the right decision. He is also another Kota member that just doesn`t seem to be developed. He is talking alot about other people, and alliances, but we have yet to hear any insight from him about himself and how he is in the game. ACE Ace seems to be a "character" edit. He has a big character, and it the most arrogant out of everyone, and there is already 5 people who either don`t like him, or definitely don`t want him in their alliance (the 4 alliance and Paloma). My intuition is telling me that he is not the first person voted out in his tribe, but he goes fairly soon, defintely before the jury. BOB, CORINNE, JACQUI These 3 seem to be UTR right now, other than Corinne entering into the alliance of 4, and Bob being considered as the fifth. Bob also did a lot of the making of the shelter, etc, which was seen positively as well. KELLY Kelly who? she is not just UTR, she is practically invisible! PALOMA The edit seems to be setting up a confrontation between ACE and Paloma. Unfortunately, this tribe seems to be more methodological than FANG, and at the beginning stage of the game, if its P versus A, Ace will win because KOTA will want to keep on winning challenging. If Kota loses 2 immunities in a row... ACE may be casualty number two. Overall, after 2 episodes, it just seems to me like even though FANG seems to have the most conflict, they are also a tribe FULL of COMPLEX edits (GC, Dan, Crystal, Ken), and as a viewer, I feel more invested in these characters because I know more about them. I know that this may largely be due to the fact that FANG has gone to tribal council twice in a row... BUT, just because they did, Burnett did not have to make sure that we KNEW more about the personalities AND HISTORIES of these tribe members. We know pre-survivor histories of Crystal, Ken, GC, Randy, Dan because ALL of them has confessionals where they provided insight on who they were as individuals. The only 2 tribe members from FANG that we didn`t get this kind of history and insight was Matty and Suzie. KOTA on the other hand... I know nothing about. I know ALL about their tribal dynamics, who is in whose alliance... BUT, we aren`t shown any insight, or any HISTORY pre-survivor. The only person on KOTA that provided this kind of insightful confessional was ACE, BUT his confessional seemed to come across as arrogant, and self-serving, NOT positive. What about Marcus and Charlie? They don`t have any confessionals where they talk about themselves and give insight into who they were, what they did pre-survivor. They mentioned their professions, but they didn`t REFLECT on this and how this might impact their game. The only relevant pre-survivor history that we seemed to get out of them was that Charlie is gay and Marcus is straight. And what about everyone else? The only person on this tribe that seemed to get a more complex edit, is Marcus. Charlie, Corinne, Bob, and Ace got some character development, but not a ton. For example, if this tribe was going to be the successful tribe and totally demolish FANG, why spend soooo much time with Dan at Exile? This time COULD have been better spent further developing KOTA tribe members, IF Dan was not going to survive longer in the game. PHew... this post is longer than I expected! Funny, I was planning not to be invested in Survivor this season, and here I am writing a lengthy post about its editing. Lol...   Top

PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-29-08, 06:46 AM (EST) 19. "RE: Episode One " Welcome, speedstr! Glad you decided to come out of lurkdom and post your thoughts here - they are great thoughts and it's great to have different viewpoints to ponder over. About this: Dan is a bit harder to pin point - he is someone who seems destined for an early boot... the only thing that makes me hesitate is that... he had a REALLY really long time on screen, alone, trying to find the idol. Even though he wasn`t successful, it seems a bit weird that Burnett would choose to spend so much time on just him trying to find the idol, if he was going to be voted off right away. I agree that Dan does not appear to be long for the game - probably a just-before-the-jury boot - but I think Burnett spent a lot of time with Dan because it was the first trip to Exile Island for anyone, so not only did they want to reveal Exile Island in its fullness but I think they also wanted to highlight Dan as a non-impact player in the overall picture of the game. Perhaps someone with a sharper memory could chime in with how Misty was portrayed as the first person on Exile Island before becoming an early boot on Survivor: Exile Island. Was she featured quite a bit? I vaguely remember her doing some searching around with the clue and going back-n-forth on the island?   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 09-29-08, 11:52 AM (EST) 20. "RE: Episode One " Perhaps someone with a sharper memory could chime in with how Misty was portrayed as the first person on Exile Island before becoming an early boot on Survivor: Exile Island. Was she featured quite a bit? I vaguely remember her doing some searching around with the clue and going back-n-forth on the island? Pepe, I did go back to note my thoughts on Misty as the first exiled and what I originally believed to be the edit surrounding someone who is exiled (bear in mind, this was the first season of doing this and like all other aspects of Survivor editing, over time, the editing of certain items will change) (My thoughts on Misty and the exiling) ....Misty good sport that she was, was indeed shown as a lone figure looking out to the boats, discussing that she feels vulnerable and her impending search for the idol. We then left her for some time for the development of the four tribes. Thereafter, we came back to Misty, being shown at night with the thunder and lightning and a nice shot of a snake slithering by quickly cutting to the morning. Misty “....worst nightmare.... My other tribemates are hopefully doing better... for immunity challenge... ...been digging for the idol. Huge advantage..... ....I’ll trick them into thinking I found the idol at the Immunity Challenge” Misty was given very obligatory face time within the context of her situation. She was shown bothered, she was shown searching, she was shown at night and shown during the day. I did not get a concrete feeling that Misty is important enough for the end game at this point. I choose to believe at this juncture that someone meant for end game would have been reflected more than the obvious events they were made to participate In my viewing of this show over the seasons, it would seem (to me) that with this brand new dynamic of the game and the dramatic presentation of same the person on Exile Island (especially if she/he were the FIRST person) there would have been a bit more. However, this is something that we can’t guarantee for a couple of reasons. 1. The person who actually ends up finding the idol will obviously be highlighted in some aspect since they found it. 2. I would hazard a guess that if the ultimate winner is exiled at some point there may be a concerted effort to focus on their stay as well. 3. I would think also that someone who ultimately precipitates a game changing moment and DIDN’T find the idol would get some extra depth to their face time on the island. With that said, Misty, being the first person exiled appeared to get obligatory due but without an unnecessary footage so this may be indicative she is not an end game player although she did come out of the situation established as someone who has her head into the game and all ended well. (Current thoughts) The first person exiled is a tough nut to crack as we have no one to compare it with at the present time. The NEXT person exiled should help shed some light. Be that as it may.... with respect to Dan - his footage at Exile Island seemed to be more about the AFTERMATH than Dan himself - With that, speedstr - it is very nice to have you on board and enjoyed your insights tremendously. You are correct - Dan was given a lengthy time at EI which no doubt established his character BUT I also believe the time spent on his trek at EI was to establish the characterization of his tribe as well. It seems that it was important to show the parallel of what we saw Dan doing (or not doing) at EI and how the tribe believed his trek occurred. A lot was invested by the tribe in discussing they believed he was acting funny and that he may have the idol which furthered the short term story of his possibly being a boot candidate. This also helped to throw in a "good television moment" with Dan emptying his bag at TC. I do think Dan's characterization was very firmly established - he admits to being an emotional person; he says he does not lie; he admits that this jaunt to EI messed with his head... all of which may be his downfall. There as actually no subtlety to his editing and that nags at me for longevity at this current moment. There are no secrets left with Dan - he wore it all on his sleeve and many times, the characters who have short term stories are laid out completely before us and then leave as there is nothing left to further examine. I don't necessarily believe he is leaving immediately but I have no questions about Dan. One interesting item which may have been noted (as I did not post about the second episode yet) was Matty's comment to Crystal that he doesn't trust anyone in a suit This was stated with words on screen as well. Incidental comment perhaps but considering Dan was solely a smokescreen and enough was stated about Gillian and Ken (and Dan for that matter) I found that eyebrow raising especially since we have some more "characters" in suits and we saw quite a bit of them the first night. I will be re-watching the second part again so I can be more equipped to discuss what has been posted   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-29-08, 06:41 PM (EST) 21. "RE: Episode One " Hello speedstr, welcome to the posting side of the boards. I enjoyed your impressions even if we are of different opinions. Time will tell which story the edit was trying to tell. I just can't agree with the following: "CRYSTAL... I see as the MOST positively portrayed on FANG." Upon rewatching, it really looks to me that Crystal must have been mortified to see her story unfold in the first episode. The editors set her up by letting her present herself as a very confident athlete and then we see: That image killed her story. She is then given an opportunity to explain herself: "wearing a dress... 10 pound shoes..." Viewers had to think: "Dumbass, maybe you should have thought of that beforehand." Remember, it was her choice of Susie that was termed playing "Stupid Survivor". Charlie's words could have been put after Ace picking Sugar, or when Randy was picked among the first guys but no, Crystal was the one that was called out on her pick. I see Crystal playing the role of "Dumb Survivor" and that isn't positive. In Fang, Ken, GC and especially Matty were portrayed more positively than her. The more I think about it, the more I like Matty's edit. We saw him acting like Fang's leader: He helped his tribe climbing up the hill, he hugged everyone after another tough loss and he decided the votes of Michelle and Gillian (in the last case Crystal was dumb to target Dan) yet he wasn't the one that got the blame for not stepping up. That blame was put by GC on Dan and Randy, not Matty. He'l be someone to watch in Fang as will be Randy because there has to be a switch coming soon. Thanks to warrior at Sucks for the vidcap   Top

flystorms 212 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 09-30-08, 01:38 PM (EST) 22. "RE: Episode One " LAST EDITED ON 09-30-08 AT 04:22 PM (EST) LAST EDITED ON 09-30-08 AT 04:22 PM (EST) LAST EDITED ON 09-30-08 AT 01:38 PM (EST) Hey all! Love the posts and analysis so far! Spot on! Question for you all...when is it that CBS went from the show title of Survivor:Gabon to Survivor:Gabon, The Last Eden? Was it before or after it was filmed. After I read Michel's commentary this morning, especially the breakdown of each character I wonder if the Last Eden (Adam and Eve) and Good vs. Evil context came down to the final two? If Corrine (Eve/Evil) and Marcus (Adam/"Good"- it's a relative term) make it to the end then maybe we have this whole thing playing out? They've really been playing up Corrine being the self-described beeyoch and Marcus being the "hero" doctor (other than Jiffy's comments about him being arrogant). By comparison to Marcus, Corrine is the evil one. Hmm... Thoughts? (edited to add a bit more clarification to my rambling thoughts)   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 09-30-08, 01:57 PM (EST) 23. "RE: Episode One " My gut feeling after reading/watching the pregame interviews was that it was going to be good Survivors versus evil survivors, not that one tribe was going to be good and the other evil. After watching the first two shows, I still think that. There are "good" and "evil" people on both tribes so I look forward to the dynamics between the individuals ~ and there are more good-evil duos than just Marcus and Corinne that could make the finals. I also didn't make the connection between evil, Eve and a female survivor until your post. That would really make the theme play out in a fun way! I thought of it as a more generic good versus evil.   Top

b1whois 126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 09-30-08, 06:14 PM (EST) 24. "VIDCAPS - episode pre-episode 3" as i posted in another thread, i noticed manipulation in the vidcaps for ep3 where fang is shown in warpaint, which indicates the ep2 IC. in the photos from the actual ep3 RC nobody is wearing face paint. why show this out-of-sequence? i post this here for analysis by the editing experts... i think it is shown to emphasize that this tribe really fights at RC. also notice that the three people shown in the manipulated warpaint scenes are the three that are shown in the actual challenge: crystal, randy, and dan.   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 10-02-08, 12:04 PM (EST) 25. "RE: VIDCAPS - episode pre-episode 3" michel thank you for your interpretation - it was very interesting to review. b1whois - manipulation is essential for Survivor and videocaps, confessionals, etc. are constantly manipulated for their own purposes. Your reference of the Fang tribe being shown with their warpaint on (which was from the prior episode) may be exactly the reason you have stated. They are down and out and doing very poorly (which was truly pushed upon us by Jeff to where it was not subtle) and any preview for this week may want to enforce a "warrior" side to them in light of their circumstances. CT - I agree that the thematic approach with respect to "good and evil" is not clearly delineated by Fang and Kota but rather, as you stated, individuals. I would suspect we are to see the unfolding of these character types to give us hints as to who may fit that mold which will then become more apparant as the season moves forward. It was very interesting to note Marcus's commentary of Eden not having two Adams which is directly correlated to the theme that Jeff put forth. flystorms you had an interesting take on how the theme may impact the final two. We do see very often the "final two foil" scenario where one candidate is more positively edited than another (Steph and Danni, Tom and Katie etc.) although with the final three scenario, it is never quite as clear cut (I am unaware if any announcement was made on how the finals are being presented) Since the storyline invests heavily in the theme and Jeff made a point of emphasizing good vs. evil (which by all accounts does occur in Survivor such as the impact of decisions, alliances, etc.) we should see the plot really focus on this but as Jeff stated about Randy and perhaps not being as evil as he wants us to think he is; there may be some interesting contradictions. In reviewing what Jeff stated, Gillian and Michelle were showcased much like he said. Things to possibly note gleaned from his opinions: Will Bob foolishly get voted off? (using the term foolishly does give me concern that it would happen as his opening was stellar) Ace being fun to watch (which I would state is occurring)- I would also suggest this blind arrogance may come to fruition since his confessionals touched on this while WE saw others discuss he will dig his own grave Will Charlie indeed allow someone(s) to pull him along and will this entail him getting only so far (we already saw the formation of his alliance and his almost blind adoration of Marcus and interestingly enough Jeff's comment on Jacque is similar but Jeff does not state that Charlie could be a legitimate threat thereafter which would indicate there is potential for longevity but he may fall short of end game) Does Corrine's horrific side come out full force (truly we saw nothing of this which tells me that there is much yet to come with her - I would suggest that there should be a distinct change in her edit considering it was rather benign) Crystal's profession has not yet been mentioned and does this, in fact, provide any dilemma - Jeff mentions her "mouth" and while Crystal did speak her mind it certainly was not to the degree that is inferred by Jeff. Crystal appears that she may have some legs and while it was noted by Michel that her words and actions did not bode all too well, I did not feel they overextended it where she was made to look extremely foolish. However, that is (as I always state) the beauty of this show and how it is viewed differently by individuals Dan has indicated he may be his own worst enemy through his edit and his time on Exile (while featured) was not necessarily good for his longevity - interestingly enough he does mention being the "silent leader" but it seems fairly impossible to imagine Dan being a silent anything Jacque already appears that she may "ride with a guy" as far as she can - Jeff notes she is a legitimate threat at that point which certainly may indicate longevity and end game. Sugar and her emotional well being - will it take its toll? I do not see anything currently to indicate she is in immediate trouble but we have only touched upon her characterization. I am waiting on Kelly's "texting" mouth since she was fairly invisible - the editors could have truly played up on that so I question if they do not feel she is worth investing in as a "character" Ken's "gamer" and "nerd" status was well edited (the tripping, the confessionals, etc.) A bit force fed for my own tastes which (as I stated already) appears a concerted effort that the audience is supposed to like him which may indicate some investment for Ken Jeff's note on Marcus being a physician which he likes to remind people - Marcus's profession was not stated publicly and it was not even mentioned as a possible issue (Crystal advised us she would hide hers) so I question which "people" Jeff refers to. He was given a huge bill from Jeff and from the first two episodes shown enough manipulation and storyline context for longevity and end game. Jeff indicates Matty may be a favorite this season - Matty was relatively quiet in the midst of the Fang chaos which in actuality may bode very well for him. He appeared central to a lot of discussion although not given an exhorbitant amount of feature time. He was shown in the opening and his statement to Crystal stuck with me and I question whether he has a future storyline against some "suits" Paloma has not been shown yet with respect to the context of Jeff's words in picking the right alliance/picking the wrong people. We saw the formation of an alliance which did not include her (could Jeff be inferring that the Marcus, Charlie, Jacque and Corrinne alliance meets with some success?) Since we have not seen Paloma choose anything this may unfold for her when the Kota tribe has to visit Tribal Council. The hints of animosity created between Ace and Paloma in an episode where they did not go to TC (as stated) may be ingredients for Kota's first Tribal Council and Paloma may be in dire straits. Jeff indicates Randy is challenging towards him so I would like to hazard a guess more of Randy at TC is to come. For Randy to be pegged as "evil" by Jeff (and not being as evil as he wants you to believe) I would suggest that Randy may be there enough for this to flesh out. Randy was very interesting to watch; he also was central in quite a lot of the dynamics and intriguing enough that he may have some legs as well. Susie's characterization of going with the wind by Jeff appears valid - I recall her being on the fringes of the discussion with the "let me know what you will do" phrase. While it stands to reason she appears short term (logistics) her "likes to talk" description has not reached that level so I would hazard a guess that it may have been kept under wraps for a bit to showcase the issues of Gillian and Michelle but if it is prevalent in an episode, it stands to reason she may be on the next hot seat.   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 10-05-08, 08:55 AM (EST) 28. "The Editing Episode 3" Previously Jeff Welcome to Gabon, Earth’s Last Eden (tight shot taken of Charlie, Ken, Marcus and Matty – would that not be ironic with Jeff announcing “Earth’s Last Eden” with four men) Jeff then goes on to point out some of the “diverse” group (high school physics teacher) Bob, (world champion video game player (Ken) and (Olympic athlete) Crystal Crystal confesses to be a gold medalist in the relay. Ace and Sugar connected right off the bat (The introductions have always been rather important with the editing but this season the introductions are outright showing the story unfolding. Regardless of the hints last week of a Paloma vs. Ace showdown, Paloma was even given a previously unseen confessional this week sowing the seeds for the show’s ending. With that said, we have a story building involving Ace and Sugar; clearly the good vs. evil may come into play with Sugar (good) being exploited by Ace (evil). Note is made of GC and Marcus having individual immunity – very glossed over which is interesting considering Jeff’s remark last week as both claimed their idol. Note is made of Fang losing the challenge by a landslide (a bit of humorous symbolism of Crystal sliding down the hill which was nice imagery to compound with the word “landslide”) Jeff “From the very beginning Kota was the tribe who could do no wrong” Jacque (conf) “Our moral is super high… we love our team” Jeff “The yellow tribe (Kelly) was in perfect harmony” (Marcus) Ace (conf) “I felt a little yoga could get our energy going….” Almost…. (Paloma laughing) Paloma (conf) “Ace is kinda getting on my nerves” Jeff Kota’s smallest tribe mate was making waves (Interesting description as while touched on mildly last week, I would hardly subscribe it to “making waves” yet the stage is set to add a tone of negativity to the person who ultimately gets booted that has not been edited for the viewers to feel bad about her demise) Kota’s problems insignificant compared to Fang’s. After six days, the Fang tribe was beginning to look like one of the worst tribes in Survivor history. Randy (conf) “This tribe is hopeless; they’re idiots” Michelle shown voted out and GC noted to be selected tribe leader and he “quit” the next day (I would add here that there could have been a concerted effort to “spin” the wording to emote a more positive tone for GC than using the term quit. Easily the editors could say that despite GC trying hard, no one cooperated therefore he chose not to be leader but instead they ascribed the word “quit” to him which may not bode well for his chances) Challenge shot with Jeff heard to say “Gillian not helping” and “Fang is falling behind” Emphasis made on Gillian as a cause which validates the boot selection Jeff “They did something completely out of character, they made a unified decision. They unanimously voted out their oldest and weakest player” With that said, clearly the introduction opened up the ending for Paloma leaving but also the introduction of a storyline involving Sugar and Ace which suggests they both should be here for some bit of time. Sugar was clearly made to look very positive this episode and it stands to reason Ace is shaping up to be a somewhat “villainous” character. The irony of “perfect” Kota in the opening and what followed was interesting and I do have to say that there also seemed to be some overkill with the description of Fang which may have solely been backdrop to showcase their latter victory. Randy’s derision about his tribe was again noted which continued (and appears to continue into next week setting up a possible arc for someone and other furthering stories were being laid out by episode’s end Scene One – Fang – Have They Learned Anything? Crystal (conf) “TC was a no brainer …. we got rid of a major physical weak link” (Randy shown breaking a stick) Ken “Tomorrow is gonna be a new day” Susie “We have to win tomorrow, we have to” GC “I don’t care if it’s physical or whatever (Randy shown while GC’s voice is heard) bring it on” (GC can’t break a stick – a little contradiction to his “tough” words) Randy (conf) “I would like to start winning but the tribe that I have (Crystal watching) I don’t believe it’s possible (GC working that stick, Ken laughing) the problem is they’re stupid (Susie) I really shouldn’t blame them for being complete idiots but they are; they don’t know it but they are” (GC is revisited still having issues with the stick) Randy (conf) “It’s day 7 and we are over ½ way done our rice…. this is Survivor…” Randy proceeds to let the group know they are running out of rice and asks if a compromise can be made with two meals a day. Agreement is heard except a notable lack of enthusiasm from GC (Again, this may tell us that there is an upcoming “battle” perhaps between those two since their friction is being shown notably) GC advises he threw away rice as people were wasting it and now he is suffering because of this when Randy says he isn’t suffering (this is accompanied by heavy music and tense faces) Randy (conf) “In my opinion, the cancer in the tribe is GC; he cannot be told anything and the tribe is going to continue to have problems until that cancer is excised” (More heavy music follows) GC “Randy are you like the leader of the tribe now?” Randy “We’re just sitting here talking dude!” “If you want to start …., we’ll start it” (Ken) GC “Seems like last couple of days you’ve been trying to step into the leadership (Dan shown) role; I don’t know if that is what you want to do but I’ll sure jump you about it” Randy “We decided this tribe didn’t need a leader. So what’s your point, are you asking me if I want to be leader?” (Dan) “Okay, the answer is no and I don’t want to talk about it anymore, drop it” (Dan, then Matty) GC “I don’t have to drop nothing man, I can ask you something if I want” Randy “Then I can just ignore you then” GC “You could do that if you want” This scene probably did not bode very well for GC. We heard earlier that GC “quit” his role as leader yet shows an almost immature attitude that Randy may be taking on the role. Randy’s request was a reasonable request with validation from other tribe mates whereas GC’s response was met with tense faces. Both characters have been given very prominent roles on their tribe so who would “win out” ultimately is not as easy as the Paloma vs. Ace scenario however AND skewing negative the way GC has does not mean he would go before Randy; it does, however, reflect that he probably would not make end game. My concern for both of these characters is that may pre merge characters who are integral to the earlier part of a story are featured quite a bit but that does not mean they have longevity. As we know, a textbook example is Austin who was involved heavily pre merge but left shortly after merger. One or both of these two may not make it very far as their story seems very contained Dan (conf) “I don’t think we pulled together as a team; we’d have a much better chance if we were more unified…. rather than fighting amongst each other” (cut immediately to Randy and GC which again leads me to believe that they may be more integral to a short term story than any long term one) Scene Two – Kota – Too Good To Be True? Kota opens with a manipulated scene as we saw the exact same scene in Episode One. Charlie is shown fishing in this one where Ace was shown last time however in BOTH scenes Marcus is shown catching a fish whereupon Jacque and Corrine applaud. It is little scenes like that where one questions the manipulation as to the necessity. Yes, we know they are doing well but this precedes Charlie discussing his alliance – Marcus, Charlie, Jacque and Corrine were manipulated and with their alliance being an meaty part of Kota, it suggests it is important Charlie (conf) “My alliance right now is with Marcus, Corrine and Jacque; beyond that I think Paloma and Kelly are really tight and Sugar is attached to Ace and I definitely think Bob is doable and can be used as a swing vote so there is always a concern the other five might bond together; I think the other five are so all over the place that we’ll be able to keep the four together” The above sounds more like a confessional for a situation as opposed to just a random one; i.e. more than likely this may have occurred after they had lost the IC and he was mulling over the tribe dynamics; it will be interesting to see if a partial story is “keeping the four together. My only disappointment with Charlie’s discussion is there wasn’t any individualization for him; it would have been nice to hear some personal strategy on his part so I do wonder if Jeff’s words prove prophetic” Paloma and Kelly are then shown together with Paloma expressing her dislike for Ace….”He’s like the King and everyone is bowing down to him.” (Less anyone forget, Marcus was shown discussing Ace with Charlie and how he felt that it was beneficial at this time to let Ace think he was running the show and then let him dig his own grave) Sugar and Ace are then shown with Sugar advising: “So they’re conniving over there right now” Ace then states: “Everybody is getting complicated now” Sugar then advises she doesn’t think they have to worry about anything for a little bit but knows who she likes the best” Again, another somewhat odd sequence; the reward challenge has not even been played yet but Charlie’s confessional, Kelly and Paloma’s talk and Ace and Sugar’s talk almost sound as if this is all closer to their upcoming Tribal Council which if edited out of sequence makes perfect sense since ultimately they do end up there and this sets the tone for later Sugar (conf) “For some reason, me and Ace decided we had some connection; I trust Ace and I believe (at this very moment, a strange musical tone enters which most definitely signals that Sugar should NOT trust Ace) that he’s going to take care of me as much as he can” (It would be of NO surprise that a betrayal occurs with this pairing) Treemail then arrives as a strategy is born….. Ace “Honestly as much as we want bedding it’s not that important” (Charlie shown with words onscreen) Sugar or Corrine? “Yeah I know it’s not immunity” (This is stated with Paloma shown) Ace “We’re sleeping, we got food, we got water” Paloma “I mean it’s still important, we want to win” (said with Ace shown) Ace “Obviously I’m not going to say let’s throw the challenge but I’m saying I’d rather put out people that are stronger today so we’d have people who are stronger for the immunity challenge cause I could live without bedding but I don’t want to go to Tribal” Bob (in voiceover with words on screen) “Good point” Paloma (conf) “Everyone seems to adore Ace at this point because everybody is just bowing down to him…but I can see through it. Just from talking to Kelly she has the same frustrations….” Scene 3 – The Reward Challenge Why Corrine would register any shock on Gillian’s departure is confusing to me but what an editor wants……… Ken, Jacque, Kelly and Corrine sit out for their respective Of note: Ace’s yawn (another clearly obvious visual tool) with Jeff making a point of noting it. Dan hanging on tight Ace proving very strong for Kota GC you got to dig deeper than that (Randy shown) “GC has given up” (Kota wins this round, GC bent over looks up with a shot to the group on the side) Ace telling Paloma she should go next Jeffp “This match looks a little more uneven” “This could be over quickly” Randy’s voiceover to Paloma “You’re done, you’re done” A shot of Charlie, Marcus and Ace after Paloma loses with Crystal notably fired up Jeff “Kota would like to make sure Fang does not taste victory. Fang is desperate for victory” Jeff “Ace trying to get away, a big takedown” (by Matty) Dan screaming at Crystal he can’t hold on much longer Crystal (after victory) “We had to go in and fight like warriors to get some blankets….but it was worth it” Ken (on the exile) “We’re gonna go with someone sweet, Sugar” Sugar “I knew that; I knew they were going to pick me cause they think I’m dumb (Ken) but they haven’t talked to me yet” Scene Four – The Taste Of Victory – More Fang Dynamic Crystal (conf) “That challenge felt so good; it felt good for the other tribe to feel the pain that we’ve been feeling” Dan advises he held on so long because he got his energy from Matty, Crystal Interesting enough, it appears that Dan’s words got cut off as he is immediately shown with arms wrapped around GC; it stands to reason Dan “may” have named GC as well but that would emote a positive for GC and the editors do not appear to want to do that Matty (conf) “We are finally feeling like a team…like creating a roll here” Scene Five – The Agony of Defeat? – More Kota Dynamic The group discusses the challenge with Ace noting it was not a loss but rather a “strategic withdrawal” Bob notes that they did take out their strongest girls (during this discussion validation is given by the group with nodding and words except by Paloma) Paloma (conf) “Crystal is huge, especially compared to me… I had no chance. It’s just weird that Ace decided to put me on the pole instead of Sugar but it’s kinda like his way or the highway” A group discussion with Ace, Charlie, Marcus, Jacque and Corrine Marcus “We should have put Kelly in instead of Paloma, I’m not sure why we sat the three of you guys out” Ace “Paloma had to go in” (Jacque shown) Marcus “Would have been fine to put her in a puzzle or something Charlie? “But what if it wasn’t a puzzle…” Corrine “She basically just sealed her fate so (Charlie shown) that’s fine” Marcus “It’s still frustrating” Corrine “We’re short two pillows, it’s fine” Ace “Sugar did well” Marcus “It’s not fine…. we’re just stuck with Paloma” Ace (conf) “It was hard watching Paloma just give up; I think her lack of motivation just sealed what we were all thinking already, sorta crossed her T’s on her contract of death” Scene Six – Exile Island – Finding The Idol And The Survivor Sweetheart A very nice showing for Sugar complete with a little creative animal editing by the staff. The question for Sugar’s edit would be does this stand alone as potential end game? Despite a very compelling scene, I think back to her first episode and how she reflected on her lack of skills outdoors and her notable comment about not going in that water anytime soon; Sugar showed quite a bit of conquering of those fears and her edit feels more of a journey. This is coupled with that her storyline (as later explored) seems directly tied to Ace’s story whereupon she may go down with his ship as clearly he is being sculpted as an antagonist. She proved the Fang tribe wrong, she proved something to herself and the idol she found…..seems more about how Ace may manipulate its use. Is she potentially a big character? I’d say the editors want her to like her and they succeeded. Is she standing alone on her own merits? At this time, I do not believe so. In fact, she probably summed up what the bane of her edit may be about: “I’m sure I’ll be a stronger person by the end of it all.” Scene Seven – Kota – The Pecking Order Bob is shown speaking with Ace “If you line everybody up, the two on the bottom are Paloma and Sugar and those are the two I’m flip flopping with and I know you like Sugar” Ace “I like Sugar’s person; she’s loyal and loyalty stands a lot for this game you know that. I think we can trust Sugar longer than we can Paloma” Bob (conf) “Ace was putting himself at risk by doing his manipulation; by calling out Paloma he is protecting Sugar… he wants to keep Sugar, I can see why; if she makes it to the jury she will vote for him but that can irritate people and worries people and that’s what worries me” (An interesting nugget as end game is being discussed with respect to Ace and the potential of a vote by Sugar – this may bode well for Ace in terms of longevity since it is question left up in the air that the editors may want to see the outcome) Bob “Ace is making me real nervous” Corrine “I’m pretty sure he wants Paloma out right?” Bob “Without a doubt; I really feel like Ace is talking about bringing Sugar right to the end” Corrine “It will definitely be Paloma then Sugar (Will it? We know that elimination lists discussed normally do not happen the way it is stated) or Sugar then Paloma, they’re going” “Ace is doing something very stupid; he is bringing Sugar to the end because she is weak; she needs him. I’ll tell you this much I have Jacque, Marcus, Charlie, we’re all in your boat, as long as you feel the same way we do, we’re all in it together and there’s five of us so we can pick whoever we want…” Corrine (conf) “I think Bob responds well to bold, confident moves; when I spoke to him I was like here’s the deal, these are the four, you’re the fifth, that’s all you need to know, we’re the majority, we’re getting rid of this one…” Corrine “It doesn’t really matter cause we’re five so lock it down, that’s it” Corrine (conf) “None of us are looking at Bob to take him to the end however we need him for numbers and I think we can trust him” An interesting exchange - again, these items at Kota seem out of sequence as they have not even played the immunity challenge yet – along with this, it was made very clear that Corrine established Bob is the “fifth” wheel – no insight from Bob on this? No confessional about Corrine approaching him and being told essentially he is the fifth in an established four person alliance and his thoughts on this matter? That does not bode well for Bob I would say Treemail for the immunity challenge is read Marcus (conf) “I think the next immunity challenge is the most crucial one we’ve had at this point; their one victory has given them some hope, crushing their hope is going to send them to another level of despair” An ironic confessional from Marcus considering the outcome – obviously a good confessional that helped showcase that irony as Kota lost Scene Eight – Immunity Challenge Sugar arrives with a big hug from Jacque as (as Jeff advised) Sugar waxes emotional with a grimace towards Jeff. Jeff “Don’t look at me, I didn’t send you” (In voiceover) “It’s the game” Paloma and Sugar sit out for Kota Of note: Crystal is tall enough to run for her first piece Ken “Run Crystal Run!” (and so she does……) Corrine making up a lot of time on Susie Ken “Come on Susie faster” (and their lead is lost) GC gets a better showing with Jeff shouting “That’s how you do it” Ace flips over twice what beautiful editing if Ace should indeed flip twice during the game Randy needs to pick it up Jeff “Got a physics teacher going head to head with a video game expert” Marcus “Pull the damn handle Bob!” Sugar stopped in mid bite as Ken solves the puzzle Bob “That’s simple math” (as spoken by a physics teacher) Jeff “This game’s a changing” Jeff asking if Fang will miss them – Crystal “You need to get to know them a little better” Of interest, no ramifications for Bob – a physics teacher – failing at a math puzzle – much could have been made by that failure but he was left unmarred by it – while this does not suggest end game material – he certainly is not someone the editors want to portray in a negative light Scene Nine – Kota Dynamics – Solely A Courtesy Sugar “plays dumb” in explaining her quest for the idol Sugar (conf) “…I don’t think anybody has a clue I’ve got it” “I’m not too bad at this; I’m a lot better than I thought for sure” This second portion is in the same spot used for a portion of her confessional at EI Sugar “I found it!” Ace “That’s great” Sugar “So I can hang onto this thing for awhile maybe?” Ace “Oh yeah, hang onto it obviously not bring it to tribal tonight but bring it to tribal generally” “This is ours” this portion said on screen – Ace has tied himself nicely to the idol “That just sets OUR game up so well until right to the end” (on screen as well) Sugar “WE’RE very happy” Ace (conf) “I had a very nice conversation in the canoe, being told Sugar has the immunity idol and we’re going to hopefully dominate this game” Ace receives a confessional about Sugar’s idol with a bit of hubris…… Sugar “It’s Paloma tonight?” Ace “Paloma’s going, Kelly is pretty dead after that” More elimination lists Ace (conf) “Now we’re all prepping for the coup de grace… and the dismissal of little Ms. Paloma” The group bathing about the Paloma plan with Ace, Charlie, Jacque and Corrine shown present Paloma (conf) “Strategically, I’m like the animal out in the wild, I just watch then I’ll pounce on someone….” Paloma “Has Ace made an alliance with you? He’s made an alliance with everyone else” Corinne "He has? He's not said one word to me." Paloma “He hasn’t said one word to me because he doesn’t like me. He’s trying everything he can to get rid of me; putting me on the pole instead of Sugar (a look from Corrine) he doesn’t want to get rid of Sugar… and Ace is pretty much running the game” Corinne "He's not running the show Paloma... Let me see what I can dig up; that’s not happening." Corrine (conf) “I really can’t stand Ace; I’m not sure if that accent is real; I think he is a con artist, I’d like to see him go home sooner rather than later, I’m afraid if Ace goes with us to the merge he’d be the first to flip because he’s on the outskirts of our alliance” More future game talk from Kota which does perhaps solidify a future storyline. Perhaps Jeff’s comment about Ace “flipping twice” may indeed happen Corrine “I just went on a walk with Paloma and she tried to get me in an alliance with her; she was like Ace is really dangerous; she goes the reason why he’s made a point to force me to go on the post is so that everyone could see how bad I was” Charlie “I think that could be probably true” Corrine “…I know it’s true because afterwards Ace was like did you see how good Sugar was?” “It’s a problem, he needs to get out of here before the merge because we can’t have that” Charlie “You’re smart at this game” Charlie (conf) “There definitely is a short term benefit getting rid of our weakest players (Sugar and Paloma shown) because then we can trounce the other team and not have to vote out other people but Ace is the biggest concern because (Sugar scratching Ace’s head) Ace has been playing Sugar as a pawn” Corrine “The thing is like we have to trust, beyond everything else that our alliance is our alliance. It’s the five of us, that’s that” (said on screen) “Because Ace told Bob he wants to take Sugar to the end no matter what. He’s like I’m taking her to the end because she is easy, she follows what I say” Charlie “They’re gonna pull out all the stops at the end” Corrine (conf) “Getting rid of Paloma, whatever, that can be done later; you wanna get rid of Ace earlier before he gains momentum before the merge, that’s more important…it’s hard to say. I dislike so many people on this damn tribe (Ace, Sugar are shown) it’s a toss up” More future game talk involving this alliance and the danger of Ace which I find hard to believe won’t come to fruition in some fashion. While the four are established with Bob as a fifth we may see a portion of this alliance dismantled perhaps by Ace. Obviously a lot of this talk was smokescreen to add some element of surprise to the Tribal Council. It is noteworthy how Fang’s talk was all about the here and now and the issues within the tribe even among those characters that may have some legs. Kota has well advanced in future game talk; the crux of the future storylines may be more about a good portion of them Scene Ten – Tribal Council Jeff asks Corrine what she bases her vote on Corrine “Everybody has their own opinion of who (Paloma) should be voted out but the idea is (Ace) you want one opinion together (Jacque) so that you have as little dissension (Charlie) among the group as possible” (Marcus) Jeff notes to Ace the “pie in the sky” mentality Ace “I think this early in the game is what strengthens the tribe (Marcus reacts) and makes us strong for challenges” (Paloma followed by a change in the music to Corrine) Jeff asks Sugar about Exile Island Sugar “I thought about my dad (she tears up with a reaction from Corrine) just because I lost my dad recently (Charlie then Ace) and …” “I missed everyone” (Corrine shown again) Jeff asks Marcus about the two ways to play the idol Marcus “I think Sugar’s choosing, if she does have it (Ace with a cymbal) let her outside reflect something completely different (Paloma) and if that’s the case (Sugar) then more power to her; it’s probably the way I’d play it myself” Jeff continues with Marcus asking him who jumped out as “interesting” Marcus “Um I think our tribe has a lot of those people but Ace was a really interesting guy (Ace shrugging/smiling with another cymbal) from the start and he and I seemed to work well together; we have a lot of similar ideas” An interesting confessional from Marcus on his relationship with Ace Jeff asks Paloma about Ace Paloma “Ace is like the head honcho at our camp” (more cymbals crash with Ace shown) “I mean, he can be the big guy all he wants (Marcus shown smiling over at Ace) I could care less (Ace’s reaction then Corrine shown) but as far as I’m concerned I’m not even gonna go there….like do the whole Ace is my hero” Jeff pushes this further establishing Ace is NOT her hero (Kelly shown) then asks Ace is this surprises him Ace “Not particularly (Paloma smiles) we have the capacity to rub each other the wrong way” Jeff asks Kelly if Ace is an asset Kelly “In some cases because he’s almost condescending in a way” (Jeff is not quite sure what she means as yet another cymbal crashes for Ace) Kelly “It’s not a good thing at all sometimes” (Sugar looks a bit amazed and confused at Kelly) “Say we’re cooking rice or something (Jacque now looks perplexed at Kelly) he’ll be like (Marcus now shares in this with a smile) oh I thought we were going to make water; if someone wants to make rice, let us make rice, we don’t necessarily need water right now” (Ace’s reaction to that interesting statement) Jeff asks Ace if he is concerned with respect to the two Ace “Of course, you can never walk into Tribal Council without being scared” Paloma “He doesn’t have his bag with him so he can’t be that worried” Ace “There’s nothing I wanted to take from camp” Jeff asks if they may have been brother/sister in another life Paloma “Maybe in another world, a thousand years from now (Ace laughing) when I’m dead” (Sugar taken aback, more crash) Jeff is wowed, Ace is shown then Paloma with a “ding” sound The votes are read with Paloma booted and an interesting visual of Marcus with somewhat of a smirk wiping a “tear” and looking presumably over to Ace who appears to be looking back. Jeff “Fang clearly has momentum, the question is can you get it back” Poor Bob – he was never even shown much less received a question – I had to check twice to make sure he was actually at Tribal Council which could only be proven as he voted and was seen at the very end in a group shot and Kelly….the first real showing and the editing was not favorable   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-04-08, 06:33 PM (EST) 26. "Week #2: Editing Thoughts" LAST EDITED ON 10-04-08 AT 07:05 PM (EST) The recap gave us new scenes from the premiere, reshaping it. First thing to note, Jeff pointed out Bob, Ken and Crystal when he talked about the cast’s diversity. Those three would have key roles in the upcoming challenges but was there more to Jeff’s singling them out? Crystal’s opening confessional was even replayed. Ace and Sugar’s initial connection was featured. Again, that would be important in the upcoming episode and could become an important story arc. Marcus and GC winning individual immunity was shown and, when Jeff said “Fang lost the challenge in a landslide”, we had a new image; Crystal sliding down the hill. Kota was described as “a tribe that could do no wrong”. Jacquie was seen talking about the love she has for her team. We saw Ace leading the yoga exercise and then Jeff pointed to the false note in Kota’s perfect harmony, a previously unseen confessional from Paloma where she made waves by stating “Ace is getting on my nerves.” Then we went to Fang, Jeff qualifying them as possibly being “one of the worst tribe in Survivor history.” Randy told us that his tribe was hopeless. Jeff even pointed out how, after losing a challenge, they voted out one of their best athletes without a single reference to Michelle’s negativity. GC quitting his leadership position was recalled. Voting out their weakest member in a unified decision was described as “something completely out of character”. I think a lot can be made from the recap but, before analyzing it, lets look at the first scene: Fang Night 6 Upon the tribe’s return from TC, Crystal had the first confessional: “Tribal council was a no-brainer; Gillian, you got to go. We got rid of a major physical weak link.” Randy observed his tribe, Susie and GC in particular, as they said they’d have to win the next day. Randy (solo): “I would like to start winning but, the tribe that I have, (Crystal now shown on screen) I still don’t believe it’s possible. (Ken, GC and Susie on screen, GC unable to break a thin branch) The problem is that they’re stupid. I should really not blame them for being complete idiots but they are. They don’t know it, but they are.” (The branch seemed to win over GC!) The first three episodes have presented Randy as the narrator for Fang. So, if we consider what he said to be the “truth” of the story of Gabon, blend in the recap and add our knowledge that Kota got rid of their threat to perfect harmony, then we can predict that Fang’s momentum will end after this episode and that Kota will resume its domination. Even the opening credits were reshaped. For one thing, it said “16 castaways”, Michelle and Gillian erased from the montage and the leopard, that seemed associated with Ace, had inexplicably disappearred. Fang Day 7 Randy realized that the rations of rice had reached a critical level. Randy, again, gave us his thoughts: “It’s day 7 and we’re over half-way finished with our rice. Someone (GC on screen) had the bright idea of 3 meals a day. You know, this is Survivor (this seems intended to reinforce our impression that Randy speaks the truth) 3 meals a day, it’s ridiculous.” Randy tried to get the tribe to agree to 2 meals a day but GC didn’t want to be suffering. Randy’s confessional went on: “In my opinion, the cancer in the tribe is GC. He cannot be told anything and our tribe is going to continue to have problems until that cancer is excised.” An out-of-sequence scene, with GC asking Randy if he was the new leader of the tribe, was presented. It was easy to see that it was out-of-sequence because we saw the blankets and the hammock that Fang was about to win! Why show it now? It served to reinforce the conflict between Randy and GC and, since it was a time favorable to Randy, it helped to get the viewers on Randy’s side. The likely outcome of this conflict is that Randy outlasts GC. Matty and Dan looked uncomfortable as they observed the scene. Dan (solo): “I don’t think that we’ve pulled together as a team. We’d have a much better chance if we were more unified and thinking of this as a team rather than fighting amongst each other.” Kota Day 7 As a leopard roamed, Marcus, Corinne and Charlie were out fishing and Marcus caught the first fish. Jacquie and Corinne (now without a rod) were again shown clapping. Charlie gave us a rundown of Kota’s dynamics: “My alliance right now is with Marcus, Corinne and Jacquie. Beyond that, I think Paloma and Kelly are really tight and Sugar is attached to Ace and I definitely think that Bob is wooable and can be used as a swing vote.” (Interestingly, while the 4 and Bob were shown at work, the other 4 were shown sitting down or sleeping. Again, it isn’t hard to see which side the audience is encouraged to wish comes out victorious) Charlie went on: “There’s always a concern that the other 5 might bond together but, I think, the other 5 are so all over the place that we’ll be able to keep the 4 together.” To alleviate any fears that the 4 may fail, Kelly was immediately heard on screen telling Paloma: “I don’t like Ace”. Paloma answered: “Right now, he is the king. Everybody is like bowing down to him. I want to gag every time he opens his mouth.” As Ace and Sugar observed the two girls, Sugar had a confessional: “For some reason, me and Ace decided we had some kind of connection. I trust Ace and I believe he is going to take care of me as much as he can.” As Corinne brought in tree mail, Ace decided on a strategy: “Obvioulsly, as much as we want bedding, it’s not that important… I’m not going to say lets throw the challenge but I’d rather we put out people who are stronger today so that we have those people for the immunity challenge. I can live without bedding but I’d rather not go to tribal.” “Good point” someone answered. Paloma told us in confessional that she wasn’t too happy: “Everybody seems to adore Ace at this point because everybody is bowing down to him. They think he’s the king. But I can see through it so I’m not blinded by it. So, just talking to Kelly, I know she has the same frustrations. Like, we’re both over him.” Arriving at the challenge, Corinne, inexplicably, looked shocked by the news of Gillian’s boot. Despite their strategy, the challenge format prevented Kota from sitting down their stronger member. Still, Ace managed to get the little Paloma to hold the pole in the second round. The challenge gave us interesting quotes as Jeff described the action: - “A big battle between Ace and Matty and GC”, “Ace proving very strong for Kota.” but “GC is giving up.” - “Dan is hanging on tight”, “Marcus and Charlie are making their way little by little.” - “This match looks a little more uneven. With Crystal and Randy on the very small Paloma, this could be over quickly.” - “Kota doesn’t want Fang to taste victory (no one informed Jeff of Ace’s idea), Fang is desperate for victory.” - “Ace trying to get away. A big take down.” After the victory, an emotional Crystal said, in tears: “We had to fight like warriors in order to get some blankets but it was worth it.” Sugar knew she was going to get picked because, as she told Jeff: “They think I’m dumb but they haven’t talked to me yet.” Returning to camp, Crystal spoke: “That challenge felt so good. It felt good for the other tribe to feel the pain that we have been feeling. To walk away with your head down.” Matty had a confessional of his own: “Coming back into camp, we’re feeling like a team. We’re finally feeling like we are going to create a little of a roll here.” Kota’s mood wasn’t down. Ace explained it as a strategic retreat but Bob wasn’t happy with their choices, Paloma agreeing she didn’t stand a chance. Paloma (solo) “Crystal, on their team, is huge. Expecially compared to me, like I’m the shortest person alive. So, compared to Crystal, I just had no chance. It was kinda weird that Ace decided to put me on the pole instead of Sugar. But, with Ace it’s his way or the highway.” Then, with his alliance present, Marcus discussed the choices with Ace, first saying that Kelly should have been in the challenge but, in the end, agreeing that they sucked with Paloma . Ace (solo) “It was kinda hard watching Paloma just give up. Her lack of motivation just sort of sealed what we were all thinking already. Sort of crossed and dotted the “T”s on her contract of death. Whatever.” Exile Island It was a very nice segment, a breath of fresh air in what had been a very stale season up to this point. It started with a nondescript melody, the music editor not yet giving us a clue to the outcome of the search. Sugar said: “Getting in that cage and having comfort, it would have been nice but it would also have been really stupid because I’m pretty sure, since I’m only the second person sent to Exile Island, that the idol is still out there… I have to go through a jungle… No Problem! (said with slight irony and we saw her struggles, particularly with what looked like fire ants) This is not my normal thing obviously, I’m not a camper, I don’t like to be dirty… I’m lost. But I did Survivor because I thought it might help me grow up a little bit and get a thicker skin and get over, not get over, but deal with my father’s death… My father passed away 7 months ago and I’m trying to keep it together because when I stay in Survival mode then I don’t get like this. I’m sure I’ll be a stronger person by the end of it all. Playing this game will help me at this time in my life.” The music started to pick up in intensity when she found the sandy crater, now preparing us for the outcome of her trek. Sugar’s confessional continued after finding the first clue: “I don’t really know how to play this game but I’m learning really quick. My confidence is built up a little bit more with each new thing that I do. I’m a lot tougher than I thought I was.” The last clue brought her to a creek which she’d have to cross: “This is scary cause there’s giant lizards or something in there”. (shot of a croc, of Sugar losing her balance in the water and repeating “Lordy, Lordy” but then… the idol!) “When Fang sent me to Exile, I thought maybe they thought I was dumb and that I wouldn’t find the idol, no way. I can’t believe I found the idol and the lawyer didn’t! Ha! Ha! Ha! How funny is that! My dad’s been with me this whole time, I feel like he’s helping me. (pointing to her heart) He’s here.” Kota Day 8 It was time for more strategy, as Bob was telling Ace that Paloma and Sugar were the two at the bottom of the tribe. He added “I know you like Sugar”. Ace responded: “She’s loyal and loyalty stands for a lot in this game.” Bob (solo): “Ace is putting himself at risk by doing his manipulations. By calling out Paloma, he’s protecting Sugar big time. He wants to keep Sugar and I can see why. If she makes it to the jury, she will vote for him. That can irritate people, worry people, it worries me.” Bob then went off to talk with Corinne, telling her “Ace is making me real nervous.” Corinne reassured Bob: “It definitely will be Paloma and then Sugar or Sugar and then Paloma, they’re going. He’s doing something very stupid, he’s bringing Sugar to the end because she’s weak, she needs him.” (Corinne could also be underestimating Sugar from what we have just seen) Corinne went on “I’ll tell you this much: I have Jacquie, Marcus, Charlie we’re all… and there’s your vote, as long as you feel the same way we do, we’re all in this together, there’s 5 of us and we can pick whoever we want, we’re in the majority.” Corinne in confessional: “I think Bob responds really well to bold, confident moves. When I was speaking to him it was; here’s the deal, there’s the 4, you’re the 5th, that’s all you need to know, we’re the majority, we’re getting rid of this one. That’s it… None of us are looking to take Bob to the end. However, we need him for numbers and I think that we can trust him.” After reading tree mail and distributing bathing suits to everyone, Marcus had a confessional: “I think the next immunity challenge is the most crucial one we’ve had at this point. Their one victory has given them some hope, crushing that hope is going to send them to another level of despair.” At the challenge, Sugar returned to a hug from Jacquie and she gave a look to Jeff that made him respond: “Don’t look at me. I didn’t send you!” During the challenge, we heard: “Kelly does it perfectly, Crystal takes a hard hit.” “Ace flips over twice!” “Randy needs to pick it up.” “Bob, you can do it!” As Ken opened his safe, Sugar’s surprised look at seeing Bob lose a “simple math” problem equaled that of the audience! After Jeff said “This game is changing” and asked Fang: “Are you gonna miss me a tribal council?” Crystal answered: “You need to get to know them a little bit better.” Final Scene: Kota Day 9 Sugar told everyone she had read the map to the idol wrong. Sugar (solo): “I think I may have played off the fact that I won the idol pretty well. I don’t think that anybody has a clue that I’ve got it. I’m not too bad at this. I’m a lot better than I thought for sure.” She then told Ace: “I found it!” Ace thought it was great: “That is ours. That just sets our game up so well until right to the end.” Ace reflecting: “I just had a very nice conversation in the canoe being told that Sugar has the immunity idol and we are, hopefully, going to dominate this game… Now, we are all ready for the coup de gra ” (sic) being tribal council and the dismissal of little Miss Paloma.” As the members of the ‘onion alliance’ confered with Ace about the vote, Paloma watched on. Paloma in confessional: “Strategically, I’m like the animals out in the wild, I just watch and then I’m going to pounce on someone and eat him up.” (but the little insect was shown being eaten by a big spider.) Paloma tried to get Corinne on her side by telling her Ace had tried to make alliances with everyone, that he wants to keep Sugar, that he is running the game and that he is sneaky. Paloma’s confessional went on about voting out Ace. Corinne told Paloma that Ace wasn’t running the show. Corinne gave us her thoughts on Ace: “I really can’t stand Ace. I’m not sure that his accent is real, I think he’s a con artist. I’d like to see him go home, sooner rather than later. I’m afraid that if Ace goes with us to the merge, then he’ll be the first to flip because he’s on the outskirts of our alliance.” Corinne talked to Charlie telling him that Ace had to leave before the merge. Charlie was impressed: “You’re smart! You get this game!” Charlie: (solo) “There’s definitely a short term benefit to getting rid of our weakest players (Paloma and Kelly shown on screen) because now we can trounce the other team and not have to vote off other people but Ace is the biggest concern. Ace has been playing Sugar like a pawn.” Corinne: (solo) “Getting rid of Paloma, whatever, that can be done later. You want to get rid of Ace earlier before he gains momentum, before we merge. That’s more important. I don’t know, it’s hard to say. I dislike so many people in this damn tribe that it’s a toss up.” Tribal: Corinne told Jeff that she wanted one opinion together to decide the vote, wanting as little dissension among the group as possible. Ace responded to Jeff’s comment that Corrine’s view could be naïve by saying that, early in the game, the tribe had to be strong. Marcus and Paloma were shown, only Marcus apparently approving. Sugar explained that she got through Exile Island by thinking about her dad. Her tears didn’t seem to impress Corinne. Marcus explained that, if Sugar has the idol, she isn’t letting on and that would be the way he’d play it himself. He went on to say that the tribe has a lot of interesting people. He added: “Ace was a really interesting guy from the start and he and I work well together and have a lot of similar ideas.” Paloma, with spunk, said: “Ace is like the head honcho at our campsite. He can be the big guy all he wants, I could care less. I’m not going to go there… say like Ace is my hero.” Ace answered: “We have the capacity to rub each other the wrong way.” Asked if Ace was an asset to the tribe, Kelly said: “In some cases because he’s almost condescending in a way” confusing Jeff who didn’t understand how condescending could be a good thing. “It isn’t a good thing at all sometimes” answered Kelly. Marcus admitted he was concerned: “You can never walk into Tribal Council without being scared.” Paloma said Ace couldn’t be that concerned since he hadn’t brought his bag. Jeff found that ribbing almost like siblings fighting. Paloma, with a great big smile, seemed to prefer being dead than envisioning that possibility. Later, she drew a big mouth on her ballot when she voted against Ace, saying it was self-explanatory! As Paloma was listening to the votes, the camera often panned to Corinne and Charlie, the only ones featured who had no immediate interest in this result. Bob, Jacquie and Marcus were completely ignored during the reading of the vote. Was it to indicate this vote would have significant repercussions for Corinne and Charlie? After Paloma left, Marcus was shown shedding a fake tear but unable to hide a smile as he shared a glance with Ace. The Characters After 3 episodes, the dust is starting to settle a little. The Players in Danger: The first three may not all leave soon but leave they will because they are The Tourists: Susie, Kelly and Jacquie haven’t been given significant roles to play. Without a single confessional and very little to go on about her place in Fang’s dynamics, Susie is still a complete unknown. She doesn’t have an immediate target on her but, of course, her weakness can be brought up at any time to explain her boot. Kelly is in more immediate danger. Not having a story to tell, she has been clearly defined by the camera and by other players as a weak link and she is now out of the loop, an isolated voter against Ace. Jacquie does play a small role in the ‘Onion Alliance’ but we barely got to know her point of view other than she likes her team. What happens if that team gets switched? Jacquie would be left defenseless but, more importantly editing-wise, without a single storyline. Being ignored at her first tribal isn’t a good sign either. The next 5 could be leaving soon: Ken saw his airtime significantly reduced. More importantly, he was featured during Randy’s rant about his idiotic tribe. Certainly, beating Bob in solving the simple math problem was something but, to this point, it’s insignificant in discussing editing. Granted, it didn’t have much of a chance to receive any reinforcing from his own team but it wasn’t noted by Kota either. I mean, no one was heard saying “Ken is smart”. Ken could still be on a journey to gain confidence and the challenge was enough… especially if it is a short journey. GC was called a cancer by our narrator. Another one who is playing dumb survivor by insisting to eat 3 meals a day. Fang did win despite his presence so not everything Randy says immediately comes to fruition but Jeff reinforced how GC was hurting his team during the recap. That can’t be ignored. The camera shot of GC unable to break a small branch is an indication that his role isn’t that of someone on a journey to gain maturity but that of the “Dumb Player”. We are meant to laugh at his inadequacies and that isn’t a winner’s role. Crystal: There’s two school of thoughts regarding Crystal’s edit: - On the first level, one can say that, by allowing us to see her crying after a challenge win, the editors fleshed out her character. Fang’s comeback and her own strong challenge performance could point to a bright future for the Olympic “star”. - One could say that, by showing her crying over something as unimportant as blankets hurt the image of the tough competitor. One would then add that we would not have been shown how Kota wasn’t really interested in winning that reward, that their strategy was only foiled by the challenge’s format. More importantly, one would point to Sugar having a much more personal reason for shedding tears to say that Crystal’s own scene wasn’t that important. Which view is right? Time will tell but I still lean for the second option, that Crystal’s role will be very limited for the end game because of two reasons: When Crystal rejoiced after Gillian’s boot, we heard nothing about Gillian being nice, or Crystal having a thought about Gillian picking her first. More importantly, while Matty and Dan were nowhere to be seen when Randy said he was in a tribe of idiots, Crystal was front and center on our screen. I put her in the endagered players section also because we know the “game is about to change” and she certainly won’t find any friends in the members of Kota. She has to be one of their first target. Bob isn’t presented as Yau Man. OK, Yau Man also lost a mental challenge when his memory failed him but YM got a chance to explain how Ravu’s dire conditions messed with his head. No one blamed Bob for losing the challenge but Bob wasn’t given a chance to tell us where he went wrong and how he hopes it doesn’t come back to bite him. That tells me we aren’t supposed to see him as a target yet when, in fact, he may already be one. Telling Ace he wants to vote out Sugar can be seen as playing “Dumb Survivor”. As with Jacquie, whatever Bob had to say at Tribal was left out of the episode. Ace, speaking of the king, he can’t be sitting on a very comfortable throne. His arrogance is really coming through and the full blame of voting out the somewhat likeable Paloma was put on his shoulders. We were told, by many sources that the way he did it was unfair, a way to protect his Sugar. Ace will not dominate this game for much longer unless he is able to flip over a few times. It would make for an interesting season but I doubt it happens. The Mid-Game Players The following 4 players look like they’ll have a role to play this season but will stay short of reaching the end-game. Dan and Matty had nothing new added to the portrayal they had been given during the premiere. Dan, I felt, was a “Dumb Player” after the premiere. Nothing this week happened to change that opinion except that Randy wasn’t talking about him. We’ll put him on hold since he probably isn’t leaving soon. Matty still looks like a good guy without much impact on the game. His edit is still very thin for someone we’re supposed to find endearing. His story arc has time to grow but it doesn’t have the substance we have seen in previous winners. Randy continued to play the snarky narrator, the one that sees what’s wrong but does nothing about it but complain. I feel that his role will be fully revealed only once he gets to meet members of Kota, a tribe that isn’t full of idiots. Sugar, after a nondescript premiere, had one of the strongest episodes for someone who wasn’t eliminated. Her Exile Island portrayal hit all the right notes: It was touching, she revealed a lot of her feelings and her thoughts about the game, she demonstrated awareness of her shortcomings but proved that she can learn quickly and was stronger than we thought. She became a target during the episode but displayed flashes of strategy. There is no question however that finding the idol played a big role in Sugar’s airtime. Had we spent all this time with her even if she hadn’t found the idol and we’d have our winner. As it stands, we have what appears to be a “Player on a Journey to Prove her strength”. She will face more challenges but she will get a chance to show personal growth and display a thicker skin. The Contenders For now, I see 3: Marcus had a slow episode which isn’t completely bad for his outcome since it was a negative episode for Kota. Important for that outcome was Paloma’s portrayal. From the little we saw of Paloma, she seemed like a funny and likeable player. The way she discussed the game with Corinne and the spunk she displayed at tribal showed she had determination. If the premiere had featured her in any way, Paloma could have been considered a victim. We know that Corinne and Charlie considered voting out Ace instead of Paloma and we heard Marcus telling Jeff that he got along with Ace. In other words, Marcus probably was the one that made the decision to stay with the plan to vote out Paloma. If Paloma had been more developed as the sweet girl that got unfairly voted out and if we had seen Marcus pushing for her exit, then his chances of winning would be gone. As is, the fake tear he shed while smiling to Ace didn’t endear him to the audience and is the first big sign of the arrogance Jeff mentioned. The only redeeming value of that scene was that Marcus told us he was playing to let Ace direct things for the time being so that he could dig his own grave. This episode proved that the plan Marcus outlined is in full action. Charlie gave us a rundown of Kota’s dynamics at the start of the episode and, later, he explained the whole strategy behind Kota’s vote. He also displayed some empathy for Paloma, especially during the reading of the votes. However, he was another player who wasn’t shown intervening during Tribal. Charlie’s edit has substance but we aren’t hearing anyone talking about his qualities. Corinne is becoming a very important player. Again, we are reminded that she is smart, Charlie adding that she gets this game. During the premiere, she had told us that she could reel in Bob and we did see her convincing Bob to join their alliance. Maybe her confessional about not having to tell Bob more than what he needed to know was a way to set her up for a blindside. She could also be under-estimating Sugar and could fall victim of the idol. That means there is doubt surrounding Corinne’s future and doubt always accompanies the winner. Corinne has to be considered a front-runner for the win. She has been fleshed out as someone who will have no remorse to play this game hard. She is central to the main alliance. She has been featured in confessionals in each episode and in her first tribal council. She has been talked about by her fellow players as someone that can be trusted and that is smart. Those are the two main qualities of the Sole Survivor.   Top

speedstr 3 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson" 10-05-08, 03:30 AM (EST) 27. "RE: Week #2: Editing Thoughts" Hello everyone, I seriously can`t believe I`m getting sucked into thinking so much about the editing of this season's survivor - lol... but this is definitely my favorite thread, and I`m enjoying reading everyone's posts! Thanks VS, Pepe and Michel for your responses to my initial post! Here are my thoughts.... Long Term Players... There are a few players on both tribes that seem to be getting a longer term edit. Corinne I definitely agree with you here, Michel, Corinne seems to have been edited really well this episode. She was seen as directing much of the strategy at Kota, EVEN if she wasn`t really the one moving things. Burnett could have chosen to have shown Marcus or Charlie in this role, but it was Corinne, it her confessionals AND her interactions with all the players. There is definitely a lot more to her, that we still don`t know yet... Crystal Thanks VS and Michel for your insights on Crystal pre-episode 3. It has really gotten me thinking about how she is being edited. The only "negative" aspect to her edit, was the first challenge, where she was the last up the hill, but since then, it appears as if she has been edited very similarly to Corinne, in that, she is in the middle of the fray when it comes to strategy and how people are voting. And yet, she is not an overt leader. I really think that she is what Dan wants to be - a "silent" leader. It was really interesting that at the beginning of episode 3, we were REMINDED of her first confessional where she states that she is an olympic athlete. It was relevant to how well she did during the challenge, but I'm really not sure how this is supposed to impact her longevity. She could definitely be a target if there is a tribal swap (which seems to be possible based on the preview for this week)... unless she ends up on a weak tribe, who absolutely needs her strength, if this happens, she should be good until the merge. I guess it also depends on who her fellow tribe-mates are after the switch. Basically, as long as she is NOT with Randy, I think she and any other 2 tribe-mates would stick together. This bodes well for her too... hmmm... Marcus While Marcus faded a bit to the backgroud this episode (just in comparing from the 2nd episode and his creation of the "onion" alliance), he is still very visually present, and while Corinne was seen taking charge (not necessarily what actually happened, just how it was edited), Marcus was still seen voicing some very intelligent and aware remarks that influenced who got voted out (need to vote out Paloma, etc)... While I don`t think his personality got fleshed out that much, he was even in the radar for us as viewers to remember him and be intrigued by him... Matty I know that this may be my most controversial choice as a possible long term player, but here is a point where I disagree with you Michel. I don`t think that Randy is Fang's narrator. I think that the narration duties of Fang is being shared by Dan, and Matty right now. Fairly consistently, Matty is visually being portrayed as always positive (high fiving people after challenges, doing well in challenges, etc), and while he doesn`t have a lot of confessionals, his confessions are more reflective of the state of the tribe as a whole, versus focusing on how he feels about one person in the tribe. And VS, I think it was astute of you to notice how Matt said that he didn`t trust "suits". I wouldn`t be surprised if there is some kind of showdown between him and Dan, in some way. "Character" edits... Ken Ken, right now, I am waffling between whether or not he is getting a longer term edit or a "character" edit. He definitely slipped UTR this episode, which is not necessarily a bad thing, as he did help win the final challenge, so visually, he was still present during the episode. But is that enough? I'm not sure yet, still trying to figure this one out! Charlie Charlie, it seems to me, is Kota's narrator. He was the one who described how the onion alliance started, he was been quite consistent in being quite present, visually and in confessionals. But there are a couple of things that seem lacking in his edit, that makes me think, right now, that while he may make the jury, he is not getting a super long term edit. First off, he is just TOO trusting. While this may not be the case, he is being edited as 100% trusting Marcus and his alliance, and his confidence in his alliance seems almost borderline arrogant... not quite, but almost. And his character and storyline seems to be too attached to the onion alliance. What happens if this alliance breaks down, as it HAS too (we almost never are told of a FULL alliance until the end). Even, for fans vs favorites, while we saw amanda, parvarti, and Cirie together within the first few episodes, they were NOT identified as an alliance, it was the "couples" alliance that the editors wanted to make sure was acknowledged). Randy I think Randy is most definitely getting a "character" edit. He seems to be getting a ton of confessionals because he seems to be in the centre of most of the conflict AND he has really sarcastic, and great confessionals. Is he the centre of the story though? I don`t think so. I`ve noticed that when Randy was being negative about GC, there wasn`t another confessional from someone else to back this up. Dan mentioned there was conflict within the group, but he didn`t mention anyone in particular. In the editing process, I think if Burnett wanted us to sympathize fully with Randy and see the game from his perspective and agree with him, we would have heard other folks being negative about GC too...like we did before Gillian and Michelle were booted. But we didn`t... there is definitely going to be a story arc between him and GC, though I`m not convinced that Randy will win that battle. GC GC definitely got a bit more of a negative edit this time around, but I don`t know if it is completely un-redeemable. It was clear that Jeff called him out for giving up during one of the challenges, and then there was the conflict with Randy and Randy`s confessionals... but I think that GC has been edited with enough depth, that he will at least make jury. He kind of reminds me of Ozzy actually. A bit impetuous, but at the same time, excels being out in the wilderness. Dan Pepe and VS, after reading your posts and watching episode 3, it definitely appears that Dan is a short term player. I agree with your assessents of him, it does seem like he will be voted out pre-merge. I don`t think he is serving a bit of a narration role, but something that he is sharing with Matty and Crystal. Ace and Sugar I think there is without a doubt that both of these two are "characters". Ace with his arrogance and pride before the fall... he is being edited as waaaay too cocky to win. And Sugar is definitely a journey character, someone who was able to overcome her father`s death and actually play the game. I`m just not sure if they are "second half" players. I have a feeling they will be on their way out pre-jury. The Invisibles... Bob and Jacquie were definitely UTR, and while Corinne did approach Bob regarding an alliance, we unfortunately didn`t hear how he felt about it, we only got Corinne`s half of the story. He unfortunately didn`t pull it through for the immunity challenge. Jacquie is okay for now because of her role in the onion alliance, but doesn`t really seem to be getting a whole lot of air time. Kelly and Susie.... unfortunately, these two characters just seem waaaay to UTR, to the point of being invisible! Susie was clearly a challenge liability, and if there is a tribal swap, if she is not with the right mix of people from her tribe, she could get thrown under the bus... Kelly, could have had an edited role in trying to help her friend Paloma stay, but unfortunately, she didn`t have any confessionals and when she spoke during tribal council, she didn`t really make much sense. My guess is that they will probably end up on separate tribes, if there is a tribal swap, and they will respectively be the next 2 boots.... just a guess....   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-05-08, 02:56 PM (EST) 29. "RE: Week #2: Comments" I liked your comments, speedstr. It's always fun to hear other opinions. I do have some questions though, especially regarding: "Crystal... at the beginning of episode 3, we were REMINDED of her first confessional where she states that she is an olympic athlete. Are we reminded of her Olympic status for storyline reasons or for Marketing reasons? Crystal is this season's celebrity, a marketing tool to get new viewers to watch. That's what I read into it, nothing more. I won't get into the discussion whether or not Crystal is being edited positively or not except for saying that being the leader of a "Tribe of Idiots" is hardly positive. This also caught my eye: "here is a point where I disagree with you Michel. I don`t think that Randy is Fang's narrator... I think if Burnett wanted us to sympathize fully with Randy and see the game from his perspective and agree with him, we would have heard other folks being negative about GC too." The main Narrator for Survivor is and always will be Jeff. Randy's narration coincides exactly with what Jeff's telling us is the "real" story. So, we have heard others being negative about GC: Jeff himself. BTW: Dan was also negative about GC last week when GC quit. And Veruca, I loved your analysis as always. I applaud your clarity because the following paragraph summarizes what has been the story thus far: "It is noteworthy how Fang’s talk was all about the here and now and the issues within the tribe even among those characters that may have some legs. Kota has well advanced in future game talk; the crux of the future storylines may be more about a good portion of them." Also, I certainly hope that you are right when you give Ace a bigger role than the one I have seen because seeing Ace flipping and flopping would make for a much better season.   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 10-11-08, 06:17 PM (EST) 30. "Editing Episode 4" I found this episode rather interesting; a switch can normally do that as can a merger. At this time, if we are to make the theme mean anything and some of the soft pedaling of some and the overkill of others; I think it may be clear as to how the end stories will be written. The Recap Despite having three of the strongest players in the game (Matty, Dan and Crystal) including a former Olympic athlete (yet another reminder to us of her former accomplishment) the Fang tribe lost three challenges in a row (We are again being reminded of the ineptness of Fang which naturally helped to set up the ending in this episode. Less we forget, Jeff reminds of "Fang is walking...") They thought they could turn things around by picking GC as their leader but he quit after one day (Again, this truly was not necessary except perhaps to show the shades of GC that formed the reasoning behind his low ranking and the trouble with Randy later. Again the term "quit" is used and, as I stated before, they could have cushioned what he did but chose not to do so. This indicates that the editing has no desire to paint GC for end game - quitting is absolutely taboo with Survivor; using THAT term is not good for GC's chances despite his probably being involved in a "juicy" storyline) The Kota tribe was on a roll, they were hardworking.... (Jacquie advises she does not envision them ever losing) It was a shock to everyone (Matty and Crystal pulling hard) when Fang finally won a challenge. They sent Sugar to EI thinking she was so weak, she'd never find the HII. (Sugar on EI) Sugar kept her secret from everyone except her closest ally, Ace (With the scenes that occurred last week revolving around Sugar, the HII, Ace and their relationship discussed by everyone, this helped to also re-establish that connection considering discussion held by the new Fang tribe - it also stands to reason this may be a prominent storyline and may be even sooner than we expect) At the next IC, Fang won again (Not surprising, no blame laid at Bob's feet for Kota's loss despite it being a math puzzle; he did not receive any blame after the IC as well. Considering Jeff's words at the switch this episode, despite Bob's chances, his edit is very positive and the editors favor him - as a future potential clue, the person (or people) responsible for Bob's exit may be in trouble for end game; at this time we can only conjecture but the editors have given Bob a stellar edit) In their first trip to TC, Kota demonstrated their tribe unity (A bit of overkill there as well - many tribes have voted together for someone but did not receive a description such as this. However, this may very well be solely for the purposes of showcasing the vast differences between Kota and Fang which have now been ripped apart in light of the switch) by voting their smallest and weakest player in a landslide (Note that Jeff's voice over validates their selection by describing Paloma as their smallest and weakest. I think it will be very interesting to see how Jeff describes Jacquie's elimination in the recap which could reflect on what opinion the editors want formed over that decision) Paloma's lone ally was Kelly who voted for Ace (A small but effective sentence to establish Kelly and Ace's relationship and the upcoming discord) Scene One - Post Tribal Council Kelly (conf) "We just got back from Tribal Council, Paloma got voted off; I definitely lost a partner in the game who I could talk to about things and now I'm worried about the chopping block but things can change all the time" (A nicely done foreshadowing confession) "My strategy right now is (I want Ace off)" (Note that the portion in parenthesis sounded inserted; perhaps she even said this after the switch when she saw that she would be with Ace) The group discusses how TC went Ace (conf) "Tribal Council for me was one of the most unpleasurable experiences I've done in recent history; it was right there with my wisdom teeth being pulled" Ace (voiceover with Sugar shown) "I like Kel's second vote towards me. I didn't know she had that much pent up animosity" (Sugar heard saying she didn't either) Ace (conf) "I think Kelly voted for me and she will be the next lamb to the slaughter" (Irony at its best) The only insight given after this Tribal Council was from Kelly and Ace which makes sense since they were direct participants in the latter storyline. There truly was no reason to hear anyone else's thoughts because the tribes end up no longer existing as they were not too mention that at this point, no future storylines by those with longevity were affected with Paloma gone. Marcus, Corrine, Charlie and Jacquie have no need to reflect on Paloma leaving - it did not affect their alliance; Bob and Sugar went with the vote told to them to do. Kelly and Ace (for this present episode) were the most affected in light of the switch and their animosity towards each other Scene Two - More Kang Discord Truly, the intent of this scene was to reflect the discord on the Kang tribe and the lines drawn among the participants and naturally how this will affect each one later one. The scene itself is not immensely important other than to identify the groupings (perhaps some ingredient for merger). What perhaps is more telling is WHO is focused upon after the switch and how the switch impacted this scene. Ken questions if he can cook some rice which Randy is not in agreement. A shot of the others are thrown in for good measure as Randy tells the group they need to eat only one meal a day hence this is why "it is called Survivor" Randy (conf) "The rice quite simply is running out; basically I know Crystal, Kenny and GC are not with me; they haven't listened to a word I said...." (Randy then calls Dan, Matty and Susie in for a discussion) "Matty, Susie and Dan, they're not my allies but they're my friends and I'm not sure how to play it right now" Crystal "I've never seen Dan go pick fruit since we've been out here and all of a sudden he is going to pick some fruit" GC "They're going to talk right now, they got four and three of us here... so they could be trying to do something right now" GC "All I know is the tightest three are right here" (This could be an interesting sentence to file away) Dan "Those three alienated me from the beginning" (Matty nodding) Randy "They've alienated everybody" Discussion ensues over the three how GC argues, Dan mentions Crystal's problems with Susie and himself and Matty states he has problems about her also as Randy describes Ken as GC's "mini me" Matty "GC is given and accepts the role as leader then he flails and gives it back" Randy "We have a cancer and the cancer's name is GC and at the right time this cancer is going to have to be cut out; we are all totally on the same page with this?" (Agreement made with Matty's confessional then shown) Randy "We don't need to talk about this anymore" Matty "All that matters is four of us" (an alliance hand shake) Matty (conf) "I finally feel like I solidified my four with Dan, Randy and Susie and I really truly feel this alliance we created is going to be solid for awhile. I think it's going to carry me pretty far" Obviously the irony is not lost that this firmly established foursome would get broken up only after we finally see where the lines are drawn with the Fang members. However, what may occur is what happens when all are back together - IF they are, much like how Corrine, Marcus and Charlie will handle their fourth member being eliminated Scene Three - Shake Up Jeff instructs the contestants that they will rank their own tribe mates in order of importance (as always "pecking orders" are very revealing) Kota Ranking Marcus Ace Bob Charlie Jacquie Corrine Sugar Kelly Fang Ranking Matty Dan Randy Crystal Ken GC Susie Marcus (conf) "I'm totally shocked I was ranked number one. I was just happy they felt that way about me but on the other hand are they going to start thinking that's a threat that's going to need to be moved off to the side as quickly as possible" (Insight on situations that may cause ramifications later on is always good for the person stating them. Discussing game activity is also a positive as well. This always could give the audience food for thought as it may be something that is on the contestants' minds later and has a built in future story) Jeff asks Kelly how it felt to be ranked the lowest Kelly "It's interesting being the last one. I've never been the last picked ever..." Ace (conf) "Kelly was devastated... (mimics Kelly) because you are a whiny little cow and you don't do anything" Interesting to note is Ace receives a confessional about Kelly being last but Kelly receives no confessional about being picked last. This tends not to bode well for Kelly despite the reprieve. We barely got into her head over her feelings about this selection; we only heard from Ace. If we were meant, as an audience, to root for Kelly (underdog persona by not "being included" in her tribe) her edit would pull at us. We do not know her and what we know, do we even care? What we do know of her is from others which is negative and for the most part was validated through visuals and a lot of commentary by Jeff. Kelly was very useful this episode but we can't confuse a pawn on someone's else's chess board as being in the game. This small battle with her and Ace should probably resolve shortly and like Paloma, I believe Kelly will be on the short end of that stick Crystal (conf) "What the hell, I'm out there busting my butt, they gonna rank me number four after someone who can barely walk...and sit around and fuss and curse everyone (Randy shown) I was very insulted" First and foremost, it was a good sound bite reflecting the discord on the tribe. The statement itself though can be taken with a grain of salt perhaps because later on Randy is the star of the immunity challenge. I don't necessarily believe this confessional reflects on either too much negatively or positively although Crystal is tinged with "sour grapes" which doesn't get better when she is defensive at Tribal Council. While Crystal did falter at the first challenge, it was not emphasized to the degree that we have seen with other people not doing well. In the same token, Randy - while not necessarily a likeable person does make statements that have authenticity so I would more or less attribute this statement to being primarily one that is good television GC (conf) "Wow, Kenny got picked before me, damn this is not looking too good..." (For GC to not be ranked last and get this confessional is suspicious. One could perhaps understand Crystal's confessional but there doesn't seem to be a really sound reason to show GC since, after all, it is no secret that GC had some issues with members of his tribe. GC is having an interesting arc but I would have to say - with this confessional alone, I would not be surprised if his story ends halfway through the season although I would not be surprised if GC and Randy need to meet again) Along with the above, Susie not receiving a confessional on being last picked as well as Kelly does not bode well long term for either of them I would believe. Being last picked is very relevant and if they would indeed be end game, I would hasten a guess a confessional would be shown Jeff asks both Marcus and Randy their thoughts on the ranking Marcus "I'm surprised Randy is up as high as he is; I really thought there would be a girl in the top two or three" This may be that little validation that Crystal always seems to get to offset some of the less than stellar performance she has) Randy tells Jeff this ranking of Kota "I really don't think anything; this shows friendliness, this shows physicality at challenges but it doesn't show a thing about who is hooking up with who" (A subtle visual then shown of Ace then Sugar who are indeed joined together at the hip. Randy again demonstrates a persona that, while abrasive, speaks very true words and as a viewer, he just takes the edge off being an unlikeable person. I go back to Jeff's words that Randy may not be as evil as he wants you to believe. While I don't believe under that rough exterior, he is a sweet man, I do believe that to date, the editing has reflected that Randy speaks the truth) Jeff announces the switch and many choruses of "no" is heard as we see Dan give Matty a hug Matty (conf) "I had it all perfect; Dan, Randy, Susie and I solidified our foursome; I was super content with it.... ...then I was like oh no this is such a buzzkill" Marcus and Matty start the pick Marcus chooses Dan (no surprise) Matty chooses Ace (no surprise) Dan chooses Charlie (no real surprise with all females left and Charlie is only one rank away from Bob) Charlie (conf) "I am thrilled... being separated from Marcus was one of my biggest fears because we have each other's backs, I just love Marcus" (Charlie's story is Marcus but his confessionals feel so much out of the game as he truly seems to be in awe of him; the perception of hero worship limits Charlie as a game player and perhaps is being helped to inflate Marcus' edit. I do find it quite unconventional how highly Marcus's is looked upon (words from Charlie, tribe ranking...) and yet I feel like we have only begun to scratch his surface) Ace selects Crystal (no surprise there either considering GC, Ken and Randy are left) Charlie selects Randy (leaving the last three ranked up there) Crystal selects Jacquie (first ranked woman in her tribe. Crystal skips Bob who unfortunately has his age immediately working against him despite the fact he is a very valuable member of his Kota tribe which Kota obviously SHOWED Fang but Fang skipped over that nugget) Randy selects Corrine (the next ranked female) Jacquie selects Ken (next ranked on the Fang tribe) Corrine, et al is told by Randy "GC is just playing his own game" Dan adds: "We've seen him slack in three out of the four challenges" Randy: "He is so negative, he will rip that tribe apart" (Foreshadowing?) (Nice move by both of them to get Susie, who is in their alliance, on their tribe notwithstanding they do not like GC) Corrine "I don't want to be the only girl so we're going to take Susie" Jeff "GC, nobody chose you" GC "Well, it's cool; it doesn't feel good but the last few days have been pretty hard for me and I think I probably rubbed a few people the wrong way" (Randy) Ken asks his group about Kelly and is told by Ace: "I don't know Kelly" then Jeff interrupts to almost (it seems) campaign for Bob. Jeff "Bob's still up there. Bob you were ranked so high by your own tribe and still nobody has chosen you. Are you a diamond in the rough, are they missing some gold here?" (A little more love for Bob) Bob "I think so but time will tell" Ken "What do you think?" Matty "Bob" Ken "Bob's going to go with Ace and Jacquie if we do vote someone out" Matty "Not necessarily" Ken "Jeff for myself, I've always been last picked sometimes so I'm going to go with Kelly....and she's hot" (Ace is shown glancing down at Jacquie) Jeff believes that to be the most surprising decision in 10 days out there.. (Possibly the first hint that the editors may not have been happy with the TC outcome) Susie selects Bob which elicits a smile from Corrine Kelly has to take CG Sugar is left but gets a free pass and goes to EI (a glance between Ace and Sugar is shown when Jeff announces she will join the losing tribe) Jeff "For some a brand new start, for others, the end of your game" (GC) Scene - Four - New Dynamics The new Kota arrives and the old Fang members see the difference Dan "This tribe has a completely different personality; if Matty was here this would be like the perfect tribe" Randy (conf) "The new Kota tribe is four Kota members, Bob, Marcus, Corrine and Charlie to three old Fang members...if Kota loses the next challenge I do think the original Kota will stick together and pick one of the three Fang members off. If it's not me, I'll go along with it. If it is me, I'll burn the camp down" (Discussing camp dynamics help sets up a possible future story on Kota) The group admire the bench Bob built and advise them how Bob even wakes up and works in the middle of the night (Again, some more camera love given to Bob) Susie (conf) "Kota tribe has it together; they're just functioning really well. I see Bob is their worker and I think Marcus, Corrine and Charlie really appreciate that so my strategy right now with Kota is just to keep working hard... and I hope they see that as a positive...." (Again, more discussion) Randy and Susie get the opening confessionals of their new "life" - Susie's strategy clearly outlined and Randy's as well. I do question the state of Dan's longevity for end game that he did not receive an important confessional such as this; he lost Matty and he is now in a minority. Does that necessarily mean Susie and Randy are long term players though? No. Susie's strategy could potentially be the start of her arc and I would say her fate would have been more positive for me IF Marcus's confessional later about determining if Randy or Susie should go first was then met with Randy doing exactly what Marcus would probably need to make his decision. Marcus acknowledged Susie's strategy but Randy then proved himself immensely at the challenge which one automatically thought "Ahhhh, Randy kicked some butt; he'll stay" - that is clear editing intent Scene five - Exile Island Sugar arrives again and the editing motto for Sugar is "She is cute!" Involved in a storyline? Absolutely - we have an idol involved her story, we have Ace and Sugar in her story, we have Ace, Sugar and the idol in her story and we now have (after this episode) a group of Fang's worried about her possibly having the idol. With that, I don't know how much of Sugar as a player is the end game story but certainly Sugar as an individual who is darling and inexperienced grew infinitely as a person during her stay here as evidenced by her comfort level at EI. She went from being afraid of going in the water to being shown jumping right into it. Sugar "...I don't know what team I'm going to be on. I'm hoping to go back to Fang so that I can be with Ace and hopefully they'll vote off Kelly so I can take her spot. I'm sure they will, they're not idiots" The beauty of simple sentences. In one fell swoop, Sugar tied her story to Ace and even implanted in the viewer's minds that this tribe is not idiotic enough to keep Kelly. What happened? They did not vote Kelly off. While the Fang tribe's rationale to vote Kelly off was understandable, this confessional's intent was clear and coming from a very likeable individual. We waited to see if Fang would be idiotic. If we are to believe what is put on camera is intended for a reason, then her confessional is meant to broadcast what they did may not be the smartest move even if "on paper" it may have been. We will know for sure at end game Scene Six - New Dynamics The old Kota members are introduced to their new home as GC starts us off GC (conf) "This tribe switch is great for me. I still have four people of my original tribe and I think it is great; couldn't be in a better position right now" With that, the next episode that Fang visits TC may revolve around GC and he may possibly be a boot candidate (although my sense of finality would only allow that when he can meet up with Randy again ). Now, Susie and Randy's confessional make complete sense since they are in the minority and are concerned about their fate and more likely than not the smattering we saw involving them is setting the tone for when Kota goes to TC. In this case though, on paper, the old Fang are in the majority - realistically none of them should truly be concerned THIS TC as GC, Matty, Kenny and Crystal would have the numbers but we are shown that GC feels much better now - I find it difficult to believe that GC is safe - there would be no reason to show this particular confessional as it would be obvious so I would not be surprised if Fang goes to TC again then he may be the victim Ace proceeds to tell the group how to find ginger as old Fang does not know where it is which leads to their excitement. Ken "You guys looked like you guys really got along well though after you guys won those challenges against us" (Jacquie on screen) Kelly "Well yeah because we were on our honeymoon so..." Jacquie "Like we always did, don't you think so Kelly" Kelly "I felt like everyone was super close. It was always me and Paloma but that didn't bother me" "But I didn't think there was any rift you guys were just closer cause you guys didn't really invite anybody else with you guys" Crystal shown observing Crystal (conf) "Listening to Kelly talk, she felt like an outcast, she felt she needed to belong somewhere and maybe she really does belong with Fang" (Some time later) Kelly "I was starting to count down the days and the hours" GC "Not much we can do but ...." (Conversation switches to Crystal and Ken) Crystal "Trust me she does not like Jacquie. She does not like Ace. She can't stand them. I already know all of this" Ken "Gotcha" (Conversation moves back) Kelly "It's so weird, they were just so fake... I can analyze people, I can get along with all personalities and even my change my personality, you know act like something but to them, I would just sit there and listen to them..." (Kelly's confessional is shown here) Crystal "What's the deal with Jacquie" Kelly "What you see, (mimics) cool, awesome, like cool!" Crystal "It seems like her and Ace have some type of friendship" Kelly "Hello, at night they sleep together but he also sleeps with Sugar" GC "He got two!" Crystal "Aww he pimping" Kelly "You'll see how they are" Crystal "We're cool right?" Kelly "Yeah. Duh, you're my girl" GC "Seriously? Cha ching" Crystal "Okay. Numbers right here" (Ken's confessional is shown here) Ken "Kelly you stick with us, we'll take care of you" Kelly "I'm so happy I get to talk and you guys like talk back" (More of Ken's confessiona) Kelly (conf) "I would definitely rather jump ship and go with Fang rather than old Kota... they didn't even give me a chance and I think Crystal, GC and Ken have something going on so I definitely want to be a part of that so I definitely want to be a part of that cause they overrule all this vote" Ken (conf) "When I saw Kelly on that mat and she was last one picked I knew I could sway her to my side because she does not get along with Kota; oh yeah, she's also hot" and "Right now I'm only using her for a vote" Quite a lot going on at the Fang tribe - obviously in light of their going to TC, all of this needed to be laid out. Interesting to note and how editing works, we never saw a hint that Jacquie and Ace were that close - obviously because it never amounted to anything. The fact that we saw clearly a relationship with Sugar and Ace should tell us there is something that develops from that. Much like the relationship we saw among the four Kota's (Charlie, Marcus, Corrine and Jacquie) only Jacquie remained underutilized whereas Marcus and Charlie's relationship was outlined, Corrine's opinion was shown and her discussions with Marcus and Charlie - the old adage "Alliances revealed do not succeed" has been adjusted along the way. I would suggest that alliances revealed do not always remain intact is more appropriate however IF alliances are revealed, there is usually a purpose. Kelly unfortunately does not seem to indicate any longevity despite her safety net. Her story is the here and now and it isn't her story; it is everyone else's story; she is solely a pawn to be played - we have no deeper insight from her and the editing has not painted her as someone who is valuable to keep for anything other than a vote. Keeping someone for a vote AND having them edited as the way Kelly has been (her rambling TC statement at Kota, her simple confessionals, etc.) are much worse for her then if they kept her "hidden" And with the scene ending with a final gong (so to speak) following Ken's admission, it doesn't bode well for Kelly. Scene Seven -Kota developing Treemail arrives and the only reason for Kota to be shown at all in a rather benign scene (reading treemail) is to set up future dynamics; in this case establishing how Kota's next Tribal Council may play out Susie (conf) "I really am trying physically to try my best - man this game takes a toll on a 47 year old woman..." Marcus (conf) "I don't know that Randy or Susie can really pull their weight when it comes to challenges so I think it would be really hard to put Randy out before Susie but it's certainly not out of the question, Susie's doing a great job around camp and if Randy has a poor performance in a challenge and doesn't do much around camp, shoot I'd rather keep Susie around. The question will really be how does Randy perform when it comes time to do the challenges" Randy "I will do my best despite hating each and everyone of you" (Laughter) And that, my fellow editing buffs, is called clear editing foreshadowing. They won the immunity challenge, they were not going to Tribal Council, there was absolutely no reason for this to be shown except for one, perhaps two, reasons. This sets up Kota's next immediate storyline and Marcus clearly laid out the criteria - Susie received her dues from Marcus by acknowledging what she has attempted to do strategically but Randy received the execution of that confessional by being showcased in being instrumental in winning that challenge. Along with that, consider that only Marcus (as an original Kota) received camera time (aside from Charlie establishing again his awe of Marcus) in an episode where Kota did not require much fleshing out; it stands to reason that Marcus is being utilized just for camera's sake. I have a hard time fathoming that Corrine and Charlie did not have better sound bites. No thoughts from Bob being picked much lower than his rank? Jeff certainly made a big deal of that Scene Eight - Immunity Challenge Of note: "Nobody even attacking Marcus" "Crystal just watching" "Kelly not doing anything" "Kenny can't do anything" Kelly complains she can't move with an Ace reaction "Kelly making no progress" "Marcus like he's done this before" Shouts to Kelly which proved ineffective "Kelly not doing much" "Fang could not make that easier" Crystal: "I can't control the boat" "Kelly just hanging back" Clear negative editing on this as literally during this shot, only Marcus and Ace were fighting over the ball and nobody was around, not just Kelly. "Kenny virtually useless in this challenge" Charlie: "Watch out Ace is behind you" "One of the most lopsided challenges thus far" "Fang, without question one of the worst performances I've seen at a challenge" Bob gives Randy a congratulatory grasp on the shoulders The end of the scene shows Randy then Corrine then Marcus in various shots of excitement. (Why not Bob or Susie or Dan or Charlie? Randy would be an obvious choice but the other two were random and frankly I would suspect Randy should be the closing shot but Marcus was. Small visuals such as this always make my eyebrow raise but we can only know at the end whether it truly meant anything or not) Kelly clearly received a lot of negative attention during this challenge despite the ineptness of the majority of the tribe. Ace was left completely untouched as was Matty, Jacquie and GC (yet GC is not named by Jeff at TC). Crystal was given a tad of negativity but (even if a weak excuse) received the time to give a statement she couldn't control the boat. Ken was also given some negative attention but the statements made by Jeff were heavily towards Kelly - again should this reflect on the final decision the former Fang members made? Scene Nine - Prelude to a Tribal Council GC "The first glimpse of the new Fang tribe wasn't looking that great" (Ace shown during the statement as Kelly brought into focus at the end of the statement) Ace (conf) "The immunity challenge was so much fun, it was like we were legless chickens racing against sleek weasels and losing badly along the way" GC "Seemed like the plan failed from the very start" (shots of Jacquie, Crystal and Ken) Matty "Kenny you okay" Kenny "Yeah, I was" GC "Kenny you sucked out there" (laughs) Kenny "I didn't understand how that worked" Matty "You were pretty good Jacquie" Jacquie "It's hard to play defense in that game" GC (conf) "We were thinking about voting for Ace or Jacquie tonight but judging by the way Kelly performed, Kelly's going home tonight is what I'm thinking, I'm going to talk to the others, I'm going to talk to Kenny, Crystal and I'm sure everyone will be fine with voting out Kelly tonight" (No mention of Matty made, I believe his name was cut out) Ken "So G what do you think?" GC "I don't know, I think we need to keep Ace. Maybe we should switch it to Kelly; she's got a bad attitude and Jacquie at least did alright today. Ya'll cool with that?" Ken "I'm good with Kelly" GC "I don't want to lose no more" Ken "You okay with Kelly, Crystal?" Crystal "I'm fine with whatever the group goes with" GC "The dangerous thing about that is, if Sugar has the HII, I think she'd be more likely to give it to Ace or to Jacquie; she won't give it to Kelly" Ken "She can use it to protect any one of the three of them" Crystal "That's the only flip side" GC "Who knows if she even has it?" Ken "I know but if we vote out Kelly tonight it will be a risk" (Crystal agrees) (GC's confessional shown) Matty (comes to them) "So what's the deal? Kelly?" GC "No. Not Kelly? Jacquie?" Ken "If Sugar comes with the idol..." Crystal "She'll share... she's close to Jacquie and Ace..." GC "Even though it's not outnumbering us, we don't want him to have any kind of power, not even three; the closest he'll have is two" Matty "I don't care, I'll do it" "I think Kelly is the weakest link..." Crystal "The difference is Sugar may have the immunity idol. Ace, Sugar and Jacquie, those three right now is deadly" Matty "Alright" GC (conf) "The deal was, whoever lost the IC, ends up with Sugar and unfortunately that's us; she could have the immunity idol and the last thing we want is for Ace, Sugar and Jacquie to become the power in this tribe" Matty "I was talking to Crystal, GC and Kenny, so I go, you can't get rid of the strong.., no way and they started to believe me and then they were talking about taking out you and I was like no no no...but they are worried you and Ace are aligned so when what's her face comes back you and him are aligned..." (Jacquie's confessional shown) Jacquie "You have to convince them Kelly sucks" Matty "I know!" Jacquie (conf) "Matty told me that everybody assumes Sugar will have the idol when she comes back... and they all want to vote me out; I'm feeling totally on the outs right now...." Jacquie "Matty told me that they want me off or something" Ken "People are scared.... you came from Kota and nobody really knows you" Jacquie "But why is Kelly like..." Ken "Because Kelly was ranked eighth in that thing and everybody feels she was the outsider" "I know I don't want to see you leave but if I did vote with you then it wouldn't have mattered anyways" (By my calculations it would have mattered) "My vote will not count; I'll still be outnumbered" (Leading to the conclusion that Ken and Matty should have had a little talk) Jacquie "I want to be with you guys; I'm on the outskirts..if I even try with Ace and Sugar they wouldn't bring me to the end" (Ken's confessional shown) Ken "I don't have any power. I can try to vote for Kelly tonight but it's not going to do anything. You really need to talk to Crystal" (Crystal? The woman in charge eh? Ken (conf) "Jacquie seems very genuine, after I had a talk with Jacquie I kinda wanted to take out Kelly - if we make the wrong choice right now it will hurt really bad later so my mind is not made up right now" It will be interesting to see how prophetic Ken's words are. Again, we understand why Fang would choose to keep Kelly. Did the editing support it? With Ken's words, "their" success in this game ultimately may have everything to do with this decision Jacquie "It sucks. I was like is there any way I could get into a tight alliance with you guys" Crystal "We thought you and Ace were fairly close" Jacquie "I never had an alliance" Crystal "You did a hell of a job today" Jacquie "I worked my ##### off, I actually want to be here" (Crystal's confessional) Jacquie "Are you close with GC and Kenny" Crystal "Yeah I am" Jacquie "Cause you guys need a fourth? I want to be the fourth so badly!" (More Crystal confessional) Jacquie says she would be with them to the end Crystal (conf) "...Jacquie was pretty much begging and pleading..." and "The whole time she's talking to me, she's welling up, she's pulling on my heart strings and I'm like damn this girl played her ##### off today and maybe she really does want to be here" and "As of right now I don't know what to do because I need someone on my team who's gonna fight and is gonna work hard and that's what she is" (Crystal makes a very convincing confessional - she then votes off the person who she needed on her team) Obviously necessary to build up the tension for Tribal but again we have another small nag at the viewers as to whether or not ultimately this was the best decision for the Fang tribe - it does NOT matter whether we understand the nooks and crannies of this show - the editing is for the average viewer; Kelly is deemed useless, Fang keeps losing, Jacquie performed well, a discussion is heard that Jacquie is more valuable than Kelly and they keep Kelly. The sequence of events, the editing surrounding them and the tone emitted seems to skew negative for those who kept Kelly. Also VERY interesting was absolutely NO insight coming from Ace. Nothing about who he thinks is being voted, nothing about his own perceived vulnerability, nothing about what would happen should Jacquie go before Kelly, nothing about any potential discussions with any of the former Fang, nothing even about Ace knowing that he will at least have Sugar on his tribe.... why? This is extremely important that he was not showcased at all. I have my own thoughts but would love another's thoughts on this Scene Ten - Tribal Council Jeff "Welcome to another TC, starring the Fang tribe" (Again I must say the Fang tribe is receiving quite a bit of over the top negativity that I can't recall being done in quite some time and I do wonder how this plays out as it appears a concerted effort is being made to show how this tribe is causing its own demise) Jeff notes to GC that this is gotta be getting old GC "Nice to see you Jeff but I don't like seeing you under these circumstance. It's good to have a strongest team as possible (Crystal then Kenny) any time we lose somebody it hurts your team more" (shades of Jacquie) Jeff asks Matty if that is the criteria for this tribe right now Matty "Yeah. According to Matty that is" (shades of Kelly) "After today's performance I was completely embarrassed" (Ken then GC) "So yeah I want to keep this tribe as strong as possible" (Jacquie) Jeff talks to Kenny about the switch and they lost Dan, Randy and Susie (Matty shown) but gained the other three, can he trust them? Ken "Right now, in three days, it's really hard to trust anybody Jeff (Jacquie) you have to build trust from the beginning (Crystal) and see who they really are..." Jeff asks Matty if he trusts Ace now as a Fang member Matty "I don't know if I trust Ace but I want Ace on my side" (Interesting to file away) "He's a power contributor and I want him on my team right now" (Crystal shown nodding that she can't disagree with this) Jeff asks Ace if they should trust them Ace "Ken's completely right, until we prove ourselves it's hard to be like trust me, trust me (Jacquie) even if we are telling the complete truth" (Jacquie shown to be appearing to look at Crystal who appears to look back) "Right now you go and try to make us as (Kelly) strong as possible and just do what's best for the tribe" Jeff asks Jacquie how frustrating it is to come from a tribe who really had it together to come to this tribe (Ken, Crystal) where it's almost like there is something in the water" (Matty) "You just dissolve" (Again a bit of overkill) Jacquie "When I came to the tribe I thought we would have awesome teamwork (Ken) I thought for sure we were gonna win...(Matty) I was working my butt off (Crystal nods) I was hoping we would win, I definitely don't want to be here" Jeff asks Kelly if she is concerned tonight Kelly "I'm definitely concerned but (Jacquie) there were other Fang members who clearly were weak today" (Crystal) Jeff "Who weaker than you?" (ouch!) Kelly "Kenny was weaker than me today (Kenny's eyes go up) and Crystal was weaker than me today" (Crystal not happy then shot moves to Jacquie) Crystal "This was one challenge..." Kelly "Exactly. I ‘m just saying I was moving in the situation and going after it" Crystal "I didn't just sit and watch, I tried to move that rowboat as fast and as best as I could (Ace) but it wasn't moving" (Jacquie) "So I was in the game, I just wasn't participating as much as I normally do; that just wasn't my cup of tea today" (Shades of negative have to be attributed on Crystal here although she was allowed an onscreen "can't move the boat" blurb but her attitude was certainly defensive and Kelly is not lying stating others did not do well in the challenge either plus Jeff essentially states that all but three did not do well) Jeff "It was clear only three people contributed today, Jacquie, Ace and Matty" (Of note here is that GC did not get "called out" at the challenge but he did not get a thumbs up here by Jeff. Matty is further removed from that trio which may be a bit of saving grace for Matty) Jeff questions Ace if this tribe is really trying to keep strong even though he is former Kota, does he feel safe Ace "No but I don't think it would be the best strategic move (Ken) on their part to knock me out now (Kelly) just because I can help physically and mentally (Jacquie) as possible. Jeff asks Jacquie if the tribe wants strength she is "arguably on the most strong male or female" (Another subtle push this tribe made a mistake or no?) Jacquie "I know but I am so nervous (Ken) I don't feel safe at all... there's only three of us (Ace nods) and I feel like I can easily just get picked off" Jeff asks Kenny if the four Fang vote together who should be most worried Ken "I would say Kelly or Jacquie...because we do need physical players to start winning these challenges so one of them" Jacquie is voted out and we even here GC state during his vote that it was probably not the right thing to do and I normally put Jeff's little nuggets at the end and all he told them was that the only thing for sure was that Sugar was going to be a member of their team. No words about the decision? In light of this very indepth TC with all the discussion on the challenge and contributing and strength and value, Jeff has NOTHING to say? Very interesting   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-11-08, 07:08 PM (EST) 31. "RE: Editing Episode 4" LAST EDITED ON 10-11-08 AT 08:06 PM (EST) Veruca, as always, a nice analysis. I really like the details you give of every scene. I kept the transcripts I had made of the confessionals to underline the way I feel the story is going. The recap reshaped the previous episode once again. To Veruca's notes on it, I wanted to stress a few points: Jeff repeated that: “The Kota tribe was on a roll, they were hard working and upbeat soit was a shock to everyone when Fung won a challenge” Sending Sugar to Exile Island was also presented as a Fang mistake since they thought she was too weak to find the idol. We saw Sugar telling Ace about the idol. Jeff concluded: “In their first trip to tribal council, Kota demonstrated their tribe unity by voting out their smallest and weakest player in a landslide. Paloma’s lone ally was Kelly who voted for Ace.” Even in their best episode, Jeff still berated Fang and told us that their win was a shock. In Kota, the conflict between Marcus and Ace regarding the choice of RC players was ignored so that they could still be presented as the ideal tribe even if they had to go to tribal. The recap told the viewers two things: - They aren’t meant to root for Fang. - The upcoming episode would be a face-off between Kelly and Ace. Opening Scene: Kota’s return from Tribal on Night 9 Kelly (solo): “We just got back from Tribal Council, Paloma got voted off. I definitely lost a partner in the game, someone that I could talk to about things. Now, I’m worried about the chopping block but things could change all the time. My strategy right now: I want Ace off. I just don’t like Ace.” Ace: “Tribal Council was probably one of the most unpleasurable things I have ever done in recent history. It was right there with my wisdom teeth being pulled. I think Kelly voted for me and she will be the next lamb sent to the slaughter.” (the last said as we saw the tribe talking about it with Ace while Kelly was off walking alone, the camera suggesting that she was doomed) Second Scene Fang, Day 10 The mood was still negative, Randy telling his tribe that they have to ration the rice. This time, the camera didn’t spare a single member of Fang, even Matty and Dan were shown when Randy said: “That’s why it’s called Survivor”. Randy (solo) “The rice, quite simply, is running out. Strategically, I know that Crystal, Kenny and GC are not with me. They haven’t listened to a word I’ve said since I’ve been here. Matty, Susie and Dan, they’re not my allies but they’re my friends and I’m just not sure how to play it right now.” The four “friends” went off into the woods to discuss strategy under the guise of looking for fruits. Crystal, GC and Ken weren’t duped. GC said that their 3 were the tightest of the group. Matty, Dan, Randy and Susie made the pact that GC, the tribe’s cancer, had to be the first one voted out. Matty (solo): “I finally feel that I have solidified my 4 with Dan, Randy and Susie and I truly feel that this alliance that we’ve created is going to be solid for a while, that it’s going to carry me pretty far.” Quite an Ozzy in Micronesia moment, wouldn’t you say?! We saw them holding hands and saying all that matters is the four… and then we had the switch! Rank Your Mates! It was a fun new twist that revealed the pecking order in each tribe. We had a few comments: Marcus (Kota’s MVP solo) : “I am totally shocked to be ranked #1. I was just happy that they felt that way about me. On the other hand, are they going to start thinking that it’s a threat that needs to be moved off to the side as quickly as possible?” Kelly (Kota’s least valuable member answered Jeff): “It’s interesting being the last one. I’ve never been the last one, ever, so it’s kinda different.” Ace (in confessional, reacting to Kelly’s comment): “Kelly’s devastated! Why am I picked last? Why is everyone not kissing my ass? Because you are a whiny little cow and you don’t do anything.” Crystal (in confessional): “What the hell? I’m out there busting my butt and they are going to rank me #4 after someone who can barely walk and do anything, when all he does is sit and cuss at everyone. I was very insulted when I saw that.” GC (in confessional) “Well, Kenny got picked before me! Damn… This is not looking too good for a pimp out here.” Asked by Jeff if he was surprised by any of the Fang rankings, Marcus said he was surprised to see Randy higher than Crystal. Asked if he got some insight into the Kota tribe, Randy smartly answered: “I really don’t think anything. This shows friendliness, this shows physicallity in challenges but it doesn’t show a thing about who is hooking up with who.” (Ace and Sugar shown) Told about having to pick new tribes, the cameras gave us Crystal and Corinne’s reactions first. Preparing us for what was to come we had Matty’s confessional: “I had it all perfect: Dan, Randy, Susie and I solidified our foursome and I was super content with it. I was happy, I was comfortable with that foursome and then Jeff was like we’re going to switch teams and I was like: OH! No, that was such a buzz kill. I didn’t want to hear that.” Marcus chose Dan. Matty picked Ace. Dan chose Charlie who gave us a confessional: “I am thrilled to be with Marcus. My biggest fear in this game is that Marcus and I will be separated because we have each other’s back, like, I just love Marcus.” Ace chose Crystal. Charlie went with Randy Crystal opted for Jacquie. Randy picked Corinne. Jacquie went with Ken. Corinne turned to her tribe before chosing. Randy told her that GC is playing his own game and that he is so negative that he will rip that tribe apart. Corinne said she didn’t want to be the only girl so she picked Susie. Ken turned to his tribe for information. Ace told him “Not Kelly.” Matty told him to pick Bob but, fearing that Bob would go with Ace and Jacquie and since “she’s hot”, Ken picked Kelly, earning the comment from Jeff of the most surprising decision. Is it the first time that we were shown players able to discuss their picks? We had often wondered if they were allowed to consult and figured that many choices had indicated they could. Now we know. We also had a very interesting contrast between the tribes and between Corinne and Ken themselves: Both players asked for advice. Corinne went with the advice and turned it into a positive for herself (creating a bond with Susie) while Ken made up his own mind and turned it into a negative for his tribe. Susie picked Bob. So, GC wound up in Fang and Sugar went to EI until after the next Tribal (which made the switch completely unfair for Kota because it cost them the numerical lead they had won but that is for another thread). As Jeff said “for some, this is a brand new start (we saw Corinne jumping for joy)… for others, it could be the end of your game” (we saw Randy and GC). Third Scene: Kota, Day 10 The new tribe arrived in camp, Dan told everyone: “If Matty was here, it would be the perfect tribe.” Randy (solo): “The new Kota tribe is four Kota members… to three old Fang members… If Kota loses the next challenge, I do think the original Kota will stick together and pick one of the three Fang members off. If it’s not me, I will go along with it. If it is me, I’ll burn the camp down.” Charlie and Corinne were heard praising Bob’s work ethic. It led to Susie’s first confessional of the season: “The Kota tribe has it together. They’re just functionning really well. I see Bob is their worker and I think Marcus and Corinne and Charlie, they really appreciate that. So, my strategy right now at Kota, is to just continue working hard at camp and I’m hoping they see that as a positive and say she’s worth keeping.” Exile Island: After chosing comfort, Sugar told us: “I walked up to my Sugar shack (!) it was like Christmas morning…This game is so crazy because I don’t know what team I’m going to be on when I get back. I’m hoping that I go back to Fang so that I can be with Ace and, hopefully, they will vote off Kelly so that I can take her place. I’m sure they will, they are not idiots”(!!) Fang, Day 10 GC: (solo): “This tribe switch was great for me. I still got 4 people from my original tribe. I don’t think I could be in a better position right now.” In front of the tribe, Kelly started acting up, saying to Jacquie that she “didn’t invite anybody else with you wherever you went.” Crystal in confessional: “Listening to Kelly talk, she felt like an outcast. She felt like she needed to belong somewhere and maybe she does belong with Fang.” Crystal told Ken that Kelly did not like Ace and Jacquie. Kelly (solo): “I definitely would rather jump ship and go with Fang than go with old Kota because they didn’t even give me a chance and I think Crystal, GSizzle, and Ken have something going on. So, I definitely want to be a part of that because they overrule all this vote.” Asked what was the deal with Jacquie, Kelly told them that Jacquie had a friendship with Ace, that, “at night, they sleep together but he also sleeps with Sugar.” (Ken looked SO envious) Crystal called Ace “Pimp Daddy”. When Kelly told them she was with them, GC reacted with a fist pump and a chi-ching! Ken: “When I saw Kelly on that mat and that she was the last one picked, I knew I could sway her to my side because she does not get along with Kota. Oh! Yeah, she’s also hot. There you go… Right now, I am only using her for a vote.” Fourth Scene Kota, Day 12 (Apparently only the animals played on day 11) After bringing in tree mail, Susie had another confessional: “I am really trying, physically, to do my best but, man, this game takes a toll on a 47 year old woman like me.” Marcus gave lessons on handling the paddle-LaCrosse stick. Marcus (solo): “I don’t know that Randy and Susie can really pull their weight when it comes to challenges themselves. I think it would be really hard to put Randy out before Susie but it’s certainly not out of the question. Susie is doing a great job around camp and, if Randy has a poor performance on challenge and he’s not doing that much around camp, shoot! I’d rather keep Susie around. The question will really be: How does Randy perform when it comes to do the challenges?” Randy amused the tribe by telling them: “I will do my best despite hating each and every one of you.” The Immunity Challenge: The comments that stood out for me: Round 1 - “Jacquie, going to get to the ball first for Fang, Jacquie has it, loses it quickly. Jacquie struggling now to get back to it.” That, in a nutshell, was pretty much what was going to happen later. - “Marcus, taking his time, scoops it up easily… Marcus, just moving it down, nobody even attacking Marcus.” - “Crystal just watching, Kelly not doing anything, Kenny can’t do anything.” Round 2 - “Marcus fighting hard to get there first… Marcus with a nice little pass to himself… Marcus, like he’s done this before… Marcus passes down to Randy, he’s got a free goal if he can get to it!” - “Kelly making no progress... Kelly not doing much.” - “Nobody on the Fang goal. How does that happen?” Round 3 started off with Bob giving a nice push to Marcus. - “Marcus passes it between Kenny and Crystal and now Marcus is going to pass Kenny. Kenny virtually useless in this challenge.” - From Charlie to Marcus: “Watch out, Ace is behind you.” As Kota was heading back to camp, unsurprisingly we saw replays of Randy (the Wayne Gretzky of Water Polo-Lacrosse with 3 goals) and Marcus (3 assists) celebrating but we also had an unwarranted shot of Corinne joyfully raising her arms in victory. Final Scene Fang, Day 12 Arriving in camp, GC said: “The first glimpse of the new Fang tribe wasn’t looking so great.” Ace “The immunity challenge was so much fun. It was like we were legless chicken racing against sleak weasels and losing badly along the way.” GC: “Originally, we were thinking about voting for Ace or Jacquie tonight but, the way Kelly performed today, Kelly is going home tonight is what I’m thinking. I’m going to talk to the others, I’m going to talk to Kenny and Crystal and I think everybody will be fine voting out Kelly tonight.” As the three discussed voting Kelly out, GC realized: “The dangerous thing about that is, if Sugar has the immunity idol, she’d be more likely to give it to Ace or Jacquie. She won’t give it to Kelly.” GC “The deal was, whoever lost the immunity challenge ends up picking up Sugar and, unfortunately, that’s us. She could have the immunity idol and the last thing we want is for Ace, Jacquie and Sugar to become the power in this tribe.” Matty was shocked that the vote was going to be Jacquie. “We were going to vote out Sue next. What’s the difference between Sue and Kelly? Not a damn thing.” Matty told Jacquie that she was in danger. Jacquie: “Matty told me that everybody assumes that Sugar is going to have the idol coming back because she has been out for 4 days now and they all want to vote me out. I feel totally on the outs right now. I’m really, really nervous.” Jacquie tried to plead her case to Kenny and Crystal, telling them she was on the outskirts of everything, that she didn’t have an alliance with Ace. Ken: “Jacquie seems very genuine. After I had a talk with Jacquie, I kinda want to go take out Kelly before Jacquie. If we make the wrong choice right now, it will hurt really bad later so my mind is not made up right now.” Crystal: “Jacquie is a nervous wreck. Jacquie was pretty much just begging and pleading: “Please Crystal, keep me in this game… I try so hard, I want to be here.” The whole time she is talking to me, she is welling up and she is pulling at my heart strings and I’m thinking this girl played her ass off today and maybe she really does want to be here… As of right now, I don’t know what to do because I need someone on my team that is going to fight and that’s going to work hard and that is what she is.” Tribal Council - GC started it off by saying he liked to see Jeff but not under these circumstances. - Matty said he was embarrassed by the performance and wanted to keep the tribe as strong as possible, bringing a smile to Jacquie’s face. - Ken, asked about the twist, said it was hard to trust anybody after 3 days. - Matty said he didn’t know if he trusted Ace but he wanted him on his side. Crystal was nodding. - Ace said Ken was right, that they couldn’t prove they could be trusted but they would work hard. - Jacquie said she was working her butt off to beat Kota. - Asked if she was concerned, Kelly said she was but that other Fang members were weak today, naming Crystal and Kenny, the people she needed to vote with her. Crystal wasn’t pleased and fought back - Jeff noted that Jacquie, Ace and Matty were the ones that clearly contributed. Ace reacted by saying he was still scared even if it wasn’t the best move on their part to vote him out because he could help. - Jacquie was still nervous and felt in the minority. - Kenny said Kelly and Jacquie had to be worried. Jacquie was voted out even if, as GC said while voting, it would have been smarter to keep her. Jacquie’s final words, saying she will be waiting to see them voted off, sounded prophetic. The Characters The trend of voting out women who have been portrayed as Tourists is continuing. Two remain: Susie was finally given an opportunity to talk directly to us but it was all about Kota and how well the tribe is working together. In fact, Susie, as a character, was born on Kota and hearing Matty say “Sue was going to be voted out next” indicates that her story will die in Kota. It won’t be a dramatic death, she won’t be seen as a victim because we already know that this game is taking a toll on a 47 year old woman who may try to do her best but simply won’t be able to do it. Kelly, by making the move to jump ship, survived what had been set up as her showdown with Ace. Since we heard Ace call her a cow and compared her to a lamb being led to slaughter, it wouldn’t surprise me if Kelly stays a little bit longer to get some revenge. However, we didn’t sense that Kelly was more valuable to Fang than she was to Kota so she still looks like someone who will be voted out soon. As for the other characters, I think we have to note that NuKota retained the edit of the perfect tribe. Fang was a tribe that was born with an original sin, their weird picks, and NuFang isn’t different. Just when they had finally started to look towards the end game, the twist returned them to the immediate concerns that come when a tribe doesn’t have a pecking order. For Fang, the line of the evening was delivered by Sugar when she said she was sure Fang would vote out Kelly because “they are not idiots.” The Idiots GC has been a huge negative character. I thought his concerns about Sugar passing the idol were smart but they were presented in a negative way. GC’s remark made it look like Jacquie was unfairly treated, that she had no chance to save herself because of Sugar’s idol when we had never been shown an alliance between her and Sugar. In fact, it seems that the episode was edited differently than originally planned because we had seen Jacquie and Sugar talking in the previews: Here, Sugar had apparently just told Jacquie about her idol but that scene was never presented in the episode. If it had been then we would have said that GC was a genius. That’s not his edit. GC is doomed and his character is so huge (think of Dave in China) that it should happen soon. Ken probably made a very smart individual move when he picked Kelly. Had he picked Bob, his poor challenge performance would have probably caused his immediate ejection. Not only is Kelly a voter at his disposal but she will always be seen as the weak link. However, we were given the opportunity to hear Matty tell Ken that he should pick Bob for the good of the tribe. Picking Kelly, who had been seen as lazy and a trouble-maker, was presented as the most surprising decision of the game. Jeff’s tone implied that it was not a positive surprise. Ken’s last minute indecision about the vote didn’t improve his portrayal. We can’t help but think that he made the wrong vote and that it will come back to hurt him. Crystal told us that she wanted fighters on her team yet she continued to side with the ones that don’t fight. However, she’s in a good position in Fang and should make it to the merge unless the idol comes into play. All her reflections are about the immediate situation giving her story no hooks for the end game. Trapped Players Matty told us he had solidified his alliance and felt good about it just before the game turned on him. Matty tried to save Jacquie just before she was eliminated at Tribal Council. Matty is portrayed as the good guy that could have done well if only he had a bit more luck on his side. That is typical of the “Victim” edit, reminding me somewhat of Sarge and Aaron. I don’t know how it will happen but his fall could be as painful as those two previous players. Dan’s story is still put on hold and he’s looking more and more like a Tourist, memorable only because of his trip to Exile Island. The editors didn’t make any effort to show him except for that scene with the 4 Fang members making an alliance and even that was more about Randy and Matty. We even heard Randy say that he wouldn’t object if Kota proposed voting him or Susie out. The Villains Ace continued to lead personal attacks on other players, using animal imagery in the most unflattering manner. Even if Paloma and Kelly weren’t shown as Survivors, his words are often over the line. What’s important for his future is that he’s been portrayed as an individual player and the three days in Fang were evidence of that. Besides his recipe for rice with ginger, Ace had to talk with other players, most probably with Matty who picked him, but we weren’t meant to see Ace in discussions with the others. Combining the isolation of his character with the negative words we heard from others (Pimp Daddy Ace, Con Artist, etc…) makes me think he does something spectacular to switch this game around… or that he falls soon, the editors using his character for all its worth right now. I’m still leaning towards the early fall. Randy is another player that likes to bash the other castaways but his words seem more deserved. He didn’t use words like cow and weasels. We saw the box of rice half empty. We heard GC criticizing him even if Randy was only saying what Survivors should do. We heard Crystal say he couldn’t do anything just before Randy became the most prolific scorer in the history of Water Polo-LaCrosse! That was also right after Marcus said Randy needed to prove himself in challenges. His answer to Jeff about Kota’s ranking was completely noncommital so why include it unless it served to underline Randy’s ability to hide his game and to answer tough questions. Randy definitely has a future in this game and the insertion of Corinne in Kota’s IC celebration replay makes me wonder if the editors weren’t pointing us in the direction of the Final 3. Should Randy be considered a contender? His negativity would make us think that he’d be the perfect foil if he made it that far but that was what many said of Parvati last season! On a side note, two of his lines reminded me strongly of previous reality TV winners: Sandra had also threatened to tear down the camp if the vote had turned against her and, for those who watched Big Brother All-Star, Dr Will said he hated everybody. Hummmm! The Good Ones Sugar had a short but nice portrayal on Exile Island. Since she was the first to enter what she christened the “Sugar Shack”, it served to show us what was implied by “Comfort” but there was a little more to it than that. She reflected on her alliance with Ace and her new tribe. She told us that Fang would be idiots if they didn’t vote out Kelly. What I really enjoyed out of her little scene was that, despite all the other fruits available to her, we saw her biting the apple. THAT was the theme of the season. What could it mean for Sugar’s future? Until that scene, I was thinking that Sugar would fall victim of her blind trust in Ace but she could have a story that goes on after Ace leaves. Will the sweetheart turn into the unexpected evil temptress? Veruca smartly reminded us that Sugar was afraid of the water at first but that we new see her diving in. Her character is evolving. Bob was greatly underestimated by Fang. The praise he received from Charlie and Corinne as soon as NuKota returned to camp underlined Fang’s stupidity as much as any words from Jeff and Randy. Bob is a Survivor but he can’t be the Sole Survivor since everyone loves him. We’ve practically been told already to expect his elimination because he’d be too much of a jury threat. But, having survived the switch unscathed, Bob is almost certainly making the merge. With Fang’s division, Bob could then easily reach Final 5 or 6 but, since we don’t hear him talk about his gameplan, that’s where his story most likely ends. Charlie, at least momentarily, lost his role as narrator in Kota to Randy and Marcus. After a promising show of strategy last week, Charlie’s story returned to be only about his love for Marcus who assumed complete leadership of Kota. That leadership was demonstrated by the LaCrosse lessons but it’s also evident just by tribe composition. That means that Kota won’t have the internal battle for leadership that could have brewed between Marcus and Ace. Battles for leadership often profit followers and Charlie has been portrayed as the “Good Follower”. He doesn’t seem to have what it takes to overturn Marcus and he already lost a vote to Marcus. I think that Charlie can be taken off the list of contenders. The Contenders Corinne didn’t have the strategic episode she had last week either. In fact, Corinne didn’t have a single confessional but we saw her on screen at key moments, keeping her chances of victory alive. She was shown reacting to the announcement of new tribes. Jumping for joy, she was the one that stood out when Kota was putting on new buffs while Jeff talked about a “brand new start”. She was the one that was included between the 2 challenge stars, Randy and Marcus, even if she didn’t play a role in that challenge. It isn’t much but it makes me think that Corinne could play Randy against Marcus or sit between them at the end. Marcus had another stellar episode. He was given the opportunity to reflect on being named Kota’s MVP in both a humble and insightful manner. It was his analysis of the distribution of the Fang players that was shown on TV. Then, back in Kota, he explained what the tribe thought of their new members. Add all the positive comments from Jeff during the challenge and it really seems that no one will attack Marcus. Afterall, last season proved how experience is key to winning this game and “Marcus looks like he’s done this before”. So, Marcus or Corinne? Right now, I'd say Marcus has taken the lead but it could depend on who gets to comment on Jacquie's exit. I wonder if Corinne's surprising reaction to Gillian's exit was actually taken from the footage of next week's episode. If so, it could be a bad sign for her as Marcus would most likely get the reaction shot and the comments.   Top

emydi 13669 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-13-08, 08:21 AM (EST) 32. "RE: Editing Episode 4" I've noticed that the wildebeests (??) are always running before we see Kotex and always laying down before we see Thong. Also, the gorilla pounding his chest is before Kotex, not sure if before Marcus or not. I'll keep my eye out. Great analysis VS and michel   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 10-14-08, 10:40 AM (EST) 33. "RE: Editing Episode 4" emydi it is comments such as Kotex and Thong that make you sorely missing - please use that analytical animalistic brain and post again   Top

Georjanna 1316 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson" 10-18-08, 05:08 PM (EST) 35. "RE: Editing Episode 4" So, Marcus or Corinne? Right now, I'd say Marcus has taken the lead but it could depend on who gets to comment on Jacquie's exit. I wonder if Corinne's surprising reaction to Gillian's exit was actually taken from the footage of next week's episode. If so, it could be a bad sign for her as Marcus would most likely get the reaction shot and the comments. My impression (after watching the segment three times) is that Corrine got both the first close-up reaction and the first close-up/on-camera comment. Am I right? Wrong? Confused ...   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-18-08, 07:32 PM (EST) 37. "RE: Editing Episode 4" You are not wrong: Corinne had the reaction shots, Marcus had the comment to Jeff but no one had the confessional about how it affected their game. It almost became a non-event, part of Kota losing its story.   Top

emydi 13669 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-18-08, 12:33 PM (EST) 34. "Hippos Electric Fish Elephants snakes and birds OMY" Ok we start out at NuKotex with a hippo just coming out of the water. Esp. after seeing the whole show, I definitely associate this hippo, just on the surface, checking things out as Randy. He even looked exactly like the hippo when he was in the water and the rest of the tribe was eating bananas. The music was light and fun. Randy is in a much better place at least for a while. Randy has adapted his game as a minority oldThong on NuKotex. The electric fish was just an interesting thing from the interesting Bob. I'm not sure about Bob I just see him being the provider/UTR edit. But from reading VS previous posts and my own thoughts, I don't see Bob as the winner. BUT THE ANIMAL of the episode was the Uthong bull elephant. We see the elephant first through the "wide-eyed" Matty. We hear his loud grunts and Matty excitedly calls the rest of them to watch. Matty is smiling. Then Ace gets into the spirit and he and Matty go in the kayak. Matty gets the confession about hearing but not seeing the elephant and finally putting the face to the noises. He and Ace in the kayak are investigating and GC tells the watchers to leave them alone..that's how people get hurt. I found the juxtaposition btw Matty/Ace doing and the others watching hesitantly very interesting. A/M are facing the danger the others aren't playing. Matty could be the "wow what a journey" survivor this time. He gets another confessional about stepping out of the game and really appreciating Gabon (which is very remote not like Kenya safari land...see Jiffy's blog this week). I remember reading that Maty is the trust fund kid, so this is probably his story, a nice edit, but not a winning edit. If we see the bull elephant through Matty's eyes, I think it symbolizes Ace the alpha male of nUthong. The soaring eagle is shown before we see a dancing Sugar being happy and alive at the Sugar Shack on EI. Sugar is getting a great edit. We then see a lone hawk on a perch that flies away and we go to the discord of Uthong and the words btw Crystal and GC. Then GC goes off on his own. the lone hawk. Then after GC tells the tribe he wants to go we see a little quick monkey running through the trees and we see "little" Kenny talking to Kelly his new girl about voting out GC. I'm going to keep my eye on the monkey to see if it continues to be shown with Kenny. An agile utr player? The snake is again shown during TC voting after Sugar gets up to vote, but immediately after we see Crystal, GC's closest ally. I had no doubt at that point that GC was going. And by the way Ace isn't it Coupd'etat not coup d'gras?   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-18-08, 07:26 PM (EST) 36. "Episode #5: Editing Thoughts" Thanks Emy for that look into the animal imagery. I also saw Randy has the hippo. I had missed the little monkey associated with Kenny. I'll have to look again into it. As far as "coup de grâce", it would apply if Ace thinks Thong is dying already but you're right that, first, he needed a "coup d'état". Here are my thoughts: Jeff reminded us that “the fiercest competitor in Gabon was the yellow tribe who systematically devoured the weak and struggling red tribe”. (Matty and Crystal shown) GC’s confessional about feeling like he’d never win was replayed. Jeff added: “On day 10, a tribe swap gave Fang an opportunity to improve themselves but they continued to be their own worst ennemy (Kenny’s “most surprising decision” to pick Kelly) by foolishly picking weak players over strong ones.” (Bob) We saw Sugar in her sugar shack. At the immunity challenge “Randy… made every point in a 3-nothing blow-out of his old tribe. By day 12, Fang had reached an all-time low” We hear Ace saying “we were like legless chicken.” “Faced with a choice to vote out a strong member (Jacquie) or a weak one, Kelly, they acted as though they had a death wish and weakened their tribe yet again and Ace lost one of his closest allies.” The recap was all about Fang and it wasn’t pretty. With adjectives such as weak, struggling and foolish, I’d say that Fang is destined for extinction. The question is whether or not Ace is associated with Fang or not. Replaying his confessional after their IC loss would indicate that he was but then, Jeff pointing out an alliance that we hadn’t been shown, Ace was separated from Fang’s ineptness, giving him an underdog status. Fang, Night 12 We see the tribe trying to make fire while GC asked Ken if he wanted some rice. Kelly was happy to be around still. Ace in confessional: “Tribal didn’t pan out the way that I had expected… now I’m sitting a little high and dry. I think they were scared of me having any strength in my alliance with Jackie. Maybe now I will be able to pull off some sort of coup de grâce once again with Sugar… One of Sugar biggest plusses is the fact that she has the immunity idol tucked up her sleeve and I’ve got Sugar in my pocket.” Sugar had a confessional immediately after walking into camp: “My very first thought when I saw the new Fang tribe was yeah! I get to see Jacquie and Ace but, instead, I saw Kelly and that was a big surprise… Luckily, it was dark so maybe I hid some of my dissappointment.” Sugar told the tribe that she had given up trying to find the immunity idol. Crystal reflected: “Sugar, Sugar, Sugar! She’s been out to exile island the longest and she’s had plenty of time to look for the idol. I feel, in my heart, that she has the idol so I gotta get rid of her.” Not even a thought of aligning with her? If she did express any, it wasn’t shown. Second Scene Kota, Day 13: African Interlude Bob and Marcus returned to camp with a net full of fish. (a miraculous catch. Another biblical reference?) Marcus “Bob checked the nets and he had a shocking surprise. This little fish… every time you pick him up, he sends an electric charge through your hand.” As he walked into camp, Randy admired the catch. Randy (solo): “Dan, myself and Susie got picked to be in this new Kota tribe. It’s wonderful… Way, way better than Fang. I have no complaints. Kota welcomed the 3 Fang members very fast into the tribe but, if they had to vote somebody out right now, they’d vote the old Fang people out. But, you know, I’ll work on ‘em and they say to adapt they mean to adapt and this crusty old man can do it.” (During this confessional, we had a shot of Randy being hand fed some fish, a shot that was underlined by a weird sound effect.) Fang Day 13 We heard strange animal sounds. Matty went to investigate and rushed back in camp to tell his tribe that an elephant was nearby. The whole scene was amazing. Ace and Matty went to get a closer look, Sugar advising them not to get killed since they were needed. Matty (solo): This freaking elephant, in the jungle, is among us all day because we hear him all day but you can’t necessarily see him all the time… To actually see one…It’s magnificent. Seeing that elephant, today, made me step out of the game for a second. It makes you appreciate the simplicity of life and the pure things. It makes you appreciate Gabon.” Note that, during this interlude, the editors still took a shot at GC, letting us hear him commenting from a safe distance: “Brave boys…Leave the elephant alone, that’s how people get hurt.” The Challenge As Jeff anounced that Jacquie had been voted off, we saw Corinne’s disbelief and Charlie’s shock. We heard Marcus saying: “Lets focus on the challenge. We’ll talk about it later.” Corinne and Charlie still couldn’t believe it so Jeff asked “Surprised?” Marcus answered “Definitely. Especially after her performance yesterday. So, pretty shocking.” From Jeff’s comments, “Kota has got to figure how to get by Ace to score. Different story for Fang, another big Matty to Kenny connection”, it seemed that Fang was doing fine but Kota still won. Sugar was sent to Exile Island, Dan explaining: “No strategy, purely comedy. No, no because we figure that if she finds the idol, she’d have to play it before the merge and we’d like it to get back into circulation.” Third Scene Kota, Day 13 The victors returned to camp accompanied by a festive melody. Charlie in confessional: “We just got back from our reward challenge… spirits are high around here but I feel bad for the Fang members who have to eat rice with no flavor. We have tons of food here at Kota. The rich are definitely getting richer here at Kota.” Dan rallied the Kota tribe, calling Fang the “Evil Empire” and saying that Kota had to keep their numbers “and stick together once the merge comes”. Dan in confessional (with the shirt he usually wears at TC): “I’m an outspoken person and I tend to want to get people’s adrenaline going. It’s a game where you light fire under people. Going up against someone you can coin the “evil empire” absolutely gives us more motivation so we can go in there and win and not just win by a little but win by a lot.” Marcus wasn’t impressed: Marcus (solo) “I think the biggest issue with Dan is he is so eager to express his undying, complete and total devotion to the new Kota tribe that no one believes him. On the flip side Susie (shown yawning which tells us all we need to know about her future) is the opposite of Dan. She is so quiet that it makes you think that she isn’t quite as on board about stuff that we’ve been talking about. I don’t have the confidence that we get to the merge and these people have got my back.” While the tribe prepared a feast, (the talk about Jacquie was left out of the episode) Marcus was heard asking: “Where’s Randy?” A sound effect ressembling that of a snake hissing answered him before Corinne said that the old guy was in the water. Randy (solo): “The challenge today was fun. Once again, Kota won and did I kick ass or what? My plan right now is just to continue winning challenges and not rock the boat and I will be Kota yellow to the end.” The scene ended with Randy dissapearing under water just like a hippo. Is it a sign of danger lurking?! Exile Island, Day 13 Sugar was dancing on her way to her sugar shack: Sugar: “When Kota sent me to exile, they said it was for pure comedy sake which is hilarious because I was thinking the joke’s on you. Everybody else in the game is tired and starving and strinky and dirty. I am living high on the hog and eating all by myself… I’m a very happy camper, I have the idol and I’d have to be really dumb to get sent home next.” Fang Day 13 The rice rations started a fight between Crystal and GC. It set up the end for GC who told us it was way more difficult than he had imagined. We heard him say: “She is so annoying.” Kelly worried about GC while Ace observed. Ace: “They are cracking at the edges. The seams are going. These arguments come out of nowhere, it was brilliant. I couldn’t have planned it better. These people are going to implode. I was sitting back and enjoying it. Finally something is going to happen.” Crystal went to GC saying: “you know I was just joking when I was like, “Eat your rice”?” GC ended the scene by saying that the game was changing him and not for the better, that he had to “figure some things out.” Fourth Scene Fang, Day 15(!!) Seeing tree mail, Kenny said: “It doesn’t look so fun.” Matty: “Today, in the challenge, I think our chances are slim. This tribe is floating, this tribe is all over the place. People are starting to become affected big time by the elements out here. GC’s losing it, Crystal is bugging out. It’s all over the place, it’s a bunch of insanity.” Even if they had to leave soo, GC went out on a canoe ride. Kenny: “We were about to go to the challenge and we couldn’t find GC. Everybody is looking for him because we needed our team there and he was off on his own… Hopefully, he will be back in time but he doesn’t like being told what to do. That’s just how he rolls.” Crystal: “I am personnaly getting fed up with GC. He just throws these tantrums and it is just upsetting to me.” GC returned saying that, had they left without him, it would have been cool with him. The Challenge Ace and Sugar played the key roles for Fang while Dan and Randy did the same for Kota. I noted Ace asking Sugar: “Are you going to lead me back? I can’t see anything, you have to talk.” Randy telling Dan: “You did that pefectly.” When Dan stopped the ball that Marcus had thrown, Jeff commented: “Poor communication for Kota.” On the last ball, Randy yelled: “Freeze Ace, freeze!” Ace stopped just short of blocking Kota’s ball as Jeff commented: “Randy pulls a fast one on Ace.” Hmmmm! Final Scene GC told Matty: “I feel like I’m ready to leave the game.” Matty reflected: “You ask to leave this game and people pounce on that.” He told Crystal who didn’t want to hear it but it got a smile from Ace. Crystal: “I’m voting for GC, hands down. We elected him the leader and he quit at that. He’s quit at the challenges and now he’s going to quit this game. To me, he’s a loser. I have no respect for people like that, that’s just gonna quit.” She told Ken and Ace: “I’m too ___ hungry for the mind games. Being out here alone and starving is a mind game in itself. If he wants to go home, then let it be. That’s where I stand.” Ace joined Sugar by the lake: “We are putting out GC. We are going to make it to the merge, in a tribe where we were dead. Letting them destroy themselves is very pleasurable to watch.” They figured they didn’t need to use the idol this time. Sugar telling Ace that the idol was in her bag, naively adding that “nobody will go in there.” Crystal did go in there and found the idol. Kelly, Kenny and Crystal agreed that this was the only chance they had to blindside her. Kenny: “So now, we all know that Sugar has the hidden immunity idol. It really changes things because nobody really wants to keep GC here longer but right now, everybody’s scared of that idol.” Kelly said she didn’t have time for quitters but that idol was more intense. Matty said they had to vote G. Tribal Council Ace said he noticed the wear and tear by people running out of belt loops. GC said it was hard, but it was harder thinking of being with family. Sugar said that GC wanted to go soon which got Jeff asking if he wanted to quit. GC said he had suffered growing up and that he was done suffering. That got tears from Sugar who said they all felt that way. That no one liked turning on people. Matty said there was no quitting, that you couldn’t allow yourself that option. Crystal nodded her approval. Jeff went back to Sugar, noting she could be going home because she didn’t know anybody. Kenny said Sugar could have the idol. Asked about her idol strategy, Sugar, smiling, said: “Nobody asked me if I have the idol…Considering that you can go through people’s bags (Crystal shown) it doesn’t surprise me.” Crystal said it was crazy to leave your bag out. Asked if she didn’t care if people knew, Sugar, acting like a poker player, said that there was a sense of power with people knowing you have the idol and not voting you out.” Kenny, the gamer, looked like he wasn’t sure of anything. After the last vote was read Ace and Sugar exchanged a pleased glance, Ace smiling, probably realizing that it was incredible to see a Fang member leave and still have the idol. The Characters Fang Kelly managed to become so insignificant that she wasn’t even a boot mis-direction. Her story isn’t growing even if she was used to tie some scenes together. She was the first to suggest that it was the best opportunity to blindside Sugar and she was the one that said the idol was “more intense”. Does that mean she has become the voice of reason in the crumbling alliance of “Idiots”? Yikes! Crystal is quickly losing it. We’ve been told that she can’t play “the ___ mind games” but Survivor is a mind game. We saw that it was her pride that prevented her from seeing the bigger picture. She even knew that the idol made the elimination of Sugar more important than GC but she still voted against him. We heard her telling Ace that her vote was decided, leading to the comment that it was pleasurable to see Fang self-destruct. We heard GC telling Fang that Crystal was annoying. How many shared his feelings? Maybe Crystal felt others agreeing with GC and that’s why we heard her say that she was only joking with GC about the rice. Before the challenge, Crystal thought that the players would be standing inside the big ball going downhill but we see that it’s her story that’s in a big ball going downhill. Kenny was pointed out by Jeff during the recap as the one responsible for bringing down Fang. With rice rations being so vital, it wasn’t good that the first thing we heard was Kenny being offered a portion. Almost invisible during this episode, Kenny was the one chosen to explain Fang’s thinking going into the vote. If strategy is this gamer’s strong suit, we were meant to see that he doesn’t have what it takes to win this game. Knowing that Sugar had the idol put him in the position of a poker player knowing the opponent’s cards. He had all the information he needed and he had the winning hand: All Fang had to do was vote Sugar and they either blindsided her or got rid of GC and the idol. Instead, we saw his defeated look at TC when Sugar made her bluff. Contrary to Crystal, Kenny may not be in immediate danger but he can’t win with such a negative edit. He’s a smart guy but we’re shown a “Dumb Player”. Matty had a strong episode. Shown through his eyes, the elephant scene reminded us that Matty was the “good guy” who, despite noble intentions (helping Gillian and Crystal up the hill), was powerless to save Fang. He knows his tribe is hopeless and recognized that GC and Crystal were responsible for it: “GC’s losing it and Crystal is bugging out.” We heard him saying that GC’s words were something to pounce on, making me wonder if, before GC’s announcement, Matty was going to vote out Crystal. Maybe he had already decided to join Ace because we know he had problems with Crystal and that he wanted Ace on his side. Note that it was Matty that had the last words before going to TC, saying they had to vote G. Why? It really only served to protect Sugar AND the idol. Remember that Sugar asked Ace if he had told anyone that she had it. Ace said he hadn’t but what if he had told Matty? It wouldn’t be the first time that the editors cut such important information out. If Matty trusts Ace, that spells the end for Crystal… and for Matty! If Matty is playing Ace, that spells the end for our Villain. Usually, the powerless “Good Guy” falls victim to the “Villain”, not the other way around. Sugar’s role of the “Sweetheart” grows each week. Even if this episode was all about GC being a quitter and about the demise of Fang, tribal council was all about Sugar. She dominated the discussion just as her expressions dominated the screen. Sweethearts usually go deep into the game because the editors want the audience to fall in love. It would suggest that Sugar makes the merge, that Sugar even outlasts the “Villain” who thinks he has her in his pocket. Ace exudes confidence. The episode answered the recap question: Shown observing them and laughing at them, Ace isn’t really part of Fang. He has Sugar in his pocket, he even thinks he makes the merge despite being in an impossible situation. Survivor has often used hubris to set up someone’s fall and Ace could certainly be next on the boot list. However, I’ve been very ambivalent about his story and it still seems to need time before reaching completion. After all, he’s right when he says that Fang’s demise is pleasurable. If Ace leaves, Sugar would be next and that doesn’t sound right. Mostly, Kota had been the tribe looking at the end game before the switch but now they are stuck in the moment. Ace needs to join Kota once more to re-start their story. If he makes the merge, Corinne’s words have to be remembered. “We can’t make the merge with Ace” she said as if warning of dangers to come. Kota: Susie made me yawn! It seems that her plan to stay quiet and work hard has its limitations. Now that we have dealt with the Kota player that has no story, lets look at a tribe that’s losing its story. For 5 episodes now, Kota has been the perfect tribe while Fang are “Idiots”. For the first 3 episodes, Kota was the tribe that had the strategy discussions, indicating that their players went deep into the game. For the last 2 however, we haven’t seen players sharing strategy discussions. That tells me that the season will play in 2 acts and the real game will start after the merge. How does that impact our previous impressions? Marcus is the only original Kota member that has maintained his story, the only one telling us how the alliance would vote if they had to. Still, there are some contradictions in his story. Maybe it’s simply over-analyzing, but this is what I saw: - Marcus wanted to let Ace runs things but then he argued about the reward challenge strategy regarding Paloma. - He said that Randy and Susie were the next to go but, with a simple challenge win, Randy got off his radar, replaced by Dan as a target. - He told his tribe to wait until later to talk about Jacquie’s elimination but then he told Jeff exactly how he felt. There is something missing in Marcus’ story: Doubt. Doubt surrounds the winner’s story from the start and I see none surrounding Marcus. For example: - Chris was surrounded by doubt, from being unable to keep his balance to being the last man standing. - Tom was on a tribe that looked weaker, Coby had him in his sights, Gregg had a plan to turn the game and then the women had the numbers to take over. - Yul had Cao Boi turning against his ally, the mutiny, a numbers disadvantage and then Ozzy who appeared unbeatable. - Earl had doubts in his story with his tribe losing all the challenges, losing one ally after the other, the Horsemen having the plan to change the game and finally, Yau Man looking unbeatable in front of the jury. - Todd had Jean Robert threatening him on day 1, he had Zhan Hu threatening to take over the game by losing challenges and voting out a strong ally, James getting 2 idols and, finally, Amanda appearing to be the strongest jury threat. - Doubt usually starts very early and accompanies the winner’s journey. So, where is the doubt surrounding Marcus? Marcus has the strongest tribe and the strongest alliance. Ace would be a threat but we heard that Marcus had a plan to neutralize him, not the other way around. Randy seems like a threat and Marcus asking “where is Randy?” could be the first indication that Marcus will lose sight of the crusty old man but Randy doesn’t threaten Marcus, he says he will be yellow Kota to the end. I’m not ready to give Marcus the check just yet! With a season playing out in 2 acts, it’s possible that the winner’s story hasn’t been told yet. So if it isn’t Marcus, who then? Dan? He had more presence during this episode, trying to convince NuKota to stick together. Judging from the reactions we saw around him, he didn’t fool too many people. His own confessional about motivating people goes against his desire to be a silent leader. Charlie? He finally had a confessional about someone else than Marcus but it was mainly to describe the reward. It was more a nod to his previous role as narrator than to start a new page in his story. Bob? He is a silent leader and doubts surround his story ever since Corinne said no one wanted to take him to the end. We’ve had Susie, Randy and Gillian refer to their age as an handicap so, Bob being the eldest, we should doubt his chances yet his age is never brought up. What Bob lacks is a game plan since we haven’t heard him talk about his end game. Corinne? Her story has been neglected for two episodes in a row and that is rare for a winner but it could resume any time since we know she is a smart player. We noted that her position in the alliance (the 4th layer) and her strategy created doubt around her. Randy? He is becoming very important to the story and it couldn’t have been a coincidence that, during the African Interlude when no one was thinking about the game, Randy had the kind of confessional that is typical of winners: “I’ll work on ‘em and they say to adapt they mean to adapt and this crusty old man can do it.” When Dan was putting a target on himself, Randy had another important confessional: “My plan right now is just to continue winning challenges and not rock the boat.” A story, a plan and doubt just by his position in the tribe: Randy has everything needed for a winner. The next episode will be key.   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-18-08, 09:21 PM (EST) 38. "RE: Episode #5: Editing Thoughts" Ah yes, Randy. He says he hates everybody but he has more people skills then the rest of them put together. He went swimming and told the rest of them to help themselves to his share of the banana treat. No one commented negatively on his wandering off. I think he subtly makes them feel taken care of yet at one point he's told them that he "hates them all". He's the cantankerous uncle that slips money to the kiddies to go get ice cream. His manipulation is so gentle that nobody sees it. He kills on the challenges yet no one has talked about him as a physical threat. I think Randy could very easily slip into the number 2 spot next to Marcus. Charlie might find himself demoted but never see it coming. Agman camouflaged me for S17   Top

Georjanna 1316 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson" 10-19-08, 06:12 AM (EST) 39. "RE: Episode #5: Editing Thoughts" LAST EDITED ON 10-19-08 AT 08:51 AM (EST) I apologize. Upon reflection - meaning after I became fully awake - I decided that the content of this post was very probably inappropriate to this thread. Hopefully, everyone else overslept this morning.   Top

Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-19-08, 09:45 AM (EST) 40. "RE: Hippos Electric Fish Elephants snakes and birds OMY" The snake is again shown during TC voting after Sugar gets up to vote, but immediately after we see Crystal, GC's closest ally. FYI, in the preview promo this week, a snake is shown and immediately there is the vidcap of Cyrstal with Kelly...   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 10-20-08, 07:34 AM (EST) 41. "RE: Episode Editing" So nice to see other faces in here emydi, I've been anxiously awaiting your animal symbolism and in this season, there is QUITE a lot! Recap I assume they no longer needed to enforce the word "quit" with reference to GC; after so many weeks of slamming it home to us, they no longer needed to do so 18 castaways cut off from the world (Already reflecting on the beginning again?) The fiercest competitor was the yellow tribe (only notes them as yellow – a bit curious since the “red tribe” is identified as Fang) who systematically defeated the weak and struggling (Matty to Crystal) red tribe, Fang (makes sure to label them with their name) GC "....starts to make you feel like you may never win" The switch shown hoping it would afford Fang an opportunity to get in shape. They continued to be their own worst enemy (Ken choosing Kelly) foolishly picking weak players over strong ones (Bob then shown) Note then made again by Jeff about this being the most surprising decision out here in this time. Sugar sent to EI choosing her comfort At the IC, Randy scored every point in a 3-0 blow out. Fang hit an all time low and faced with a choice to vote out a strong member (Jacquie) or a weak one (Kelly) they acted as if they had a death wish (More overkill for the Fang tribe) to weaken their tribe yet again. And Ace lost one of his closest allies (Obviously we were never meant to see this relationship as it did not come to fruition which then begs the question for editing purposes... the relationships of Ace/Sugar, Charlie/Marcus, Charlie/Marcus/Corrine/Jacquie with Bob as the fifth, Matty/Randy/Dan/Susie were all shown to some degree with some members more featured which indicate potential plot points. Marcus receives arbitrary face time that has no value to keep him on screen, Charlie narrates his admiration for Marcus and his glee over being in an alliance with him, Corrine was shown involved in that alliance and recruiting Bob though she has not been given obligatory face time as Marcus has had, Bob is herald but not significant as far as game play. Ace and Sugar developed a potentially meaty storyline which does seem to mainly involve the idol however it also seems to involve what Ace may do at Sugar’s expense and there is still a potential tie with old Kota members in that regard. Randy’s individual storyline has been played up so much more than other former Fang at Kota and the entire grouping of former Fang members have been dictated through the visualization of Marcus Scene One - Tribal Council Aftermath Ace (conf) "Tribal didn’t pan out the way I expected... now I am sitting a little high and dry..." "I think they were scared of having any strength in my alliance with Jacquie; maybe now I will be able to pull off some coup de grace once again with Sugar..." Ace (conf - note this was spliced with the above confessional) "...she has the immunity idol tucked up her sleeve and I got Sugar in my pocket" (Possibly an out of sequence confessional as it was spliced with the above one - this portion literally could be from another segment upcoming) Sugar arrives back and notes this means Jacquie’s gone "That sucks" Sugar (conf) "My first thought was... yay, I get to see Jacquie and Ace but instead I saw Kelly and that was a big surprise. Luckily it was dark so I could have hidden some of my disappointment" (Questions regarding EI and her idol quest) Crystal (conf) "Sugar, Sugar, Sugar, she’s been out to Exile the longest and had plenty of time to look for the idol and I feel in my heart she has the idol so I got to get rid of her" Obviously meant for future storyline purposes in last night episode, this segment was all about the "power" of the hidden idol, Ace (and Sugar’s) predicament with Jacquie gone and how Fang will once again choose their boot. No reflection by anyone regarding the Tribal Council except Ace who interestingly was barely seen the last episode which we know was impossible. The threat of the idol was fearsome enough but what does Crystal, Matty and Ken and Kelly do now knowing she has it - this is a big storyline considering next week’s preview which is solely contained within Fang which does not bode too well for the original Fang members in terms of longevity, Matty being somewhat different though. This may set the entire tone for the Fang tribe for the rest of their game. Fang has not received any editing love whatsoever. They did keep Matty out of the onslaught with his questioning of decisions and never giving him negativity at challenges, etc. and his opening confessional but editing has hounded them on their losses and their decisions such as choosing Kelly and then keeping Kelly. Ace and Sugar have their own separate storyline and the questions for them are does Ace do what everyone at the original Kota tribe believe he would do with Sugar and does their story evolve back with Kota once again? The "set up" is will Ace betray Sugar ultimately. Considering that Ace does have quite a bit of potential for long term, it is quite possible and while Sugar has all the elements of a character the audience is meant to enjoy, her story seems more about what will Ace do with her? She achieved her goal at Gabon in terms of growth but is she a player? The stories involving Crystal, Ken and GC are so very linear – where have they’ve gone outside Fang? Matty, however, has ties to those Fang members now with Kota AND we see a budding relationship with Ace. Out of any original Fang still on Fang, Matty seems to be the only candidate to progress further in the editing although Matty is tending to get the reflective edit which involves journey and thought provoking confessionals which tend to lend itself to doing well but not quite end game. Ken may have some legs but I don't sense end game stories with him. Scene Two - Kota The scene was purely designed for twofold. Kota is happy in direct contrast to Fang and a bit of strategy and dynamic is pursued as the editors also noted in the prior episode - we may potentially see (finally) Kota going to Tribal Council again prior to any merger where their story will be solely for which of the three former Fang members will be eliminated. Last week Susie and Randy were addressed (by Marcus) and Randy gave Marcus and the audience confirmation he proved his worth. This week Dan and Susie are observed (again by Marcus) and now the seeds are planted for the "which one will they choose" storyline. Considering their edits to date, Randy seems the only one who will win out and Randy also seems like a very solid candidate for end game. Susie never had a storyline other than "the older lady who will work hard and hope they will notice" and her ties to future storylines are along the lines of Jacquie - in an alliance but not the meat of one. Dan is one of the difficult edits that have always plagued Survivor - a strong male with an edit that does not reflect end game. A good example would be Adam from CI. Adam had truly nothing in his edit to establish a good end game but he lasted. Dan may get by for awhile solely based upon his physicality but he is not being established to be at end game - his gaff on EI, his loose mouth, Marcus’s "take" all are problematic for him (his own worst enemy) BUT one may ask if Kota’s choice of boot will be in direct contrast of the "poor" choices Fang had made as the editors are going to great lengths to reflect their differences. Does Kota boot the "weak" (Susie) to keep their tribe "strong" (Dan) as opposed to what Fang did with booting a "strong" member (Jacquie) over a "weak" member (Kelly). Marcus receives a "fluff" confessional describing how Bob caught an electric fish Randy "Dan, myself and Susie got to be picked in this new Kota tribe, it’s wonderful. Fish, beans, corn... I have no complaints. Kota welcomed the three Fang members very fast... but if they had to vote somebody out right now, it’d be old Fang people but I’ll work on them, when they say to adapt they mean to adapt and this crusty old man can do it" (Randy gave us key insight into dynamics and his own strategy – the editors are taking the trouble for us to know him and his insight and I daresay that was a meaty confessional - Randy truly has "legs" in this game and I still go back to Jeff's statement that he is not as evil as he wants you to believe which I found and still find very interesting) Truly there is no reason to show Randy’s confessional much like the confessionals last week from Randy, Susie and Marcus on their standing unless a Kota visit to Tribal Council is imminent. Last week and this week Kota won immunity, they are happy and there is no discord but we are being given throwaway hints of dynamics now for two weeks in a row. It would be very surprising if Kota does not visit Tribal Council soon (despite the state of Fang) considering the editors have shown these Kota’s dynamics two weeks straight. Is it possible this is being established for when a merger happens? Yes, it is always a possibility which would then lead us to believe Randy may have turned his back on Fang Red for Yellow Kota but there has been too much emphasis on establishing Marcus’s thought process on Susie, Randy and Dan in Kota for me not to question that this comes to play shortly. Scene Three - Fang Much like we have seen before, some scenes just have to be shown purely due to the brilliance of the scene. Fang’s encounter with an elephant is simple beautiful television and I hope everyone was in as much awe as I was during it. However, a scene like this may reveal some subtle hints - who gets gratuitous face time when one has to assume ALL of them most likely reflected on the encounter with the elephant Matty "There’s an elephant in our camp, you hear him all day but you don’t necessarily see him and to actually put a face to the noise, it’s magnificent...." "Seeing that elephant today really made me step out of the game for a second; it just makes you appreciate the simplicity of life. and the pure things; makes you appreciate Gabon" On that note, Matty was the only one to reflect on that encounter - his opening confessional and this one were directly correlated as well. With a tribe that is truly in need of a more positive edit, only Matty (I exclude Sugar and Ace as they have been developed outside of current events) received a confessional. Surely, Crystal, Kelly and Ken said something (I exclude GC as he left) that not only would have given them unnecessary face time but would have softened the blow they are receiving. Matty is the voice of Gabon for us - does this bode well for him? I would say Matty may have some legs (as he is potentially part of some plot development) but he shows all the signs of someone who falls short and is used more so than others because the editors generally like him and would like him to receive a decent portrayal while he is there Scene Four - The Reward Challenge More than the challenge itself, the announcement of Jacquie leaving was the true "scene" in this segment. Over the seasons, announcements of the boot have met with very different portrayals - some with nary a blip and others a collective gasp or a subtle look; this obviously was a collective "gasp." Naturally it could not be hidden but it was fleshed out more by Jeff coupled with Marcus’s comment. In addition, Marcus’s whisper is bound by intrigue as the audience is being left with a dangling issue on what this Kota alliance will do now although it was curious that we never saw a true aftermath of this revelation at the challenge - did they not talk about it? I find that hard to believe - however, we were meant to hear those words so I would think it was stated for a purpose. This "purpose" may not be relevant now however so no reason to show it. Susie (to Corrine) "They got rid of Jacquie?" Corrine exclaims, Charlie is open mouthed, Marcus whispers low that they need to talk about it later as they have to focus on the challenge, followed by more Charlie and Corrine reactions Jeff "A lot of reaction, especially from Kota. Surprised?" Chorus of yes Marcus "Especially because of her performance yesterday" (Kelly nicely noted) "So, pretty shocking" (Interesting that although Marcus advised his group that they will talk later he announced to the cast reasoning about it) Jeff advises Fang is once again a new tribe as Sugar joined and the numbers are now even. Fun stuff: Kota has to figure out how to get by Ace... (With the season progressing as such, this "quip" seems extremely relevant) Matty fakes out Charlie twice and is "working" Charlie (Matty receives more positives and this would be fun should Matty attempt to fake out Charlie during the game as well) Big reception by Randy (Another "thumbs up" on Randy in the challenge) Ken receives some positive commentary (Crystal and GC receive no positive reinforcement from Jeff even when Crystal is shown swatting down a throw by Marcus on two occasions and consequently Bob receives no negative commentary for allowing fruit to get by him) Susie notes the value of tossing two at a time which Marcus was responsible for in asserting A very obvious cut to Marcus and Charlie after the challenge showing Marcus playfully biting into Charlie’s shoulder (A completely unnecessary shot but going back to the opening episodes with Marcus’s and Charlie’s relationship defined by both of them and Charlie expanding on his almost worship like opinion of Marcus, it may also be a subtle indicator of Marcus’s knowledge of manipulation - much like the Tribal Council where Marcus is shown wiping a non existent tear after Paloma was booted - Marcus is shown in a rather positive light but there is subtle hints that he is utilizing some devious behavior) Dan "Might as well have her mail forwarded again because Sugar is going again" Dan then quips to Jeff about their reasoning resulting in a long look from Susie to which he expands that their wish is for Sugar to play the idol before the merge so it would come back into circulation (Foreshadowing?) Sugar takes it in stride and we are left with a slow shot of Marcus and Charlie in a victorious hug. Scene Five - Kota Charlie (conf) "We just got back from our reward challenge... I feel bad for those Fang members because I know all they are eating is rice... the rich are definitely getting richer at Kota" (Charlie provides this tribe with nice generic narration which he has done in the past) Dan "So instead of the Axis of Evil we have the Evil Empire; we need to keep our numbers and stay together when the merge comes. (Randy) I’m gonna need all seven of you guys; our first couple of votes after the merge are going to have to be unanimous" (confessional shown) "And once we get one or two of them out they are going to crumble” (The first hint of good vs. evil?) Marcus replies that the next immunity challenge is the most important one of the game and he everyone is on the same page about that. Dan (conf) "I’m an outspoken person and I tend to want to keep people’s adrenaline going... going up against someone you can coin the Evil Empire absolutely gives us more motivation to go in there and win but not just win by a little but win by a lot" (Note during this confessional, the group scene is shown that has shots of Charlie and Marcus and then of Corrine not looking especially enthusiastic) Marcus (conf) "I think the biggest issue with Dan is that he is so eager to express his undying, complete and total devotion to the new Kota tribe that no one believes him" Dan "All seven...as long as we win the immunity challenges, then us seven, as long as we stick together, we’re always gonna have the numbers..." Marcus (conf) "On the flip side, Susie is the opposite of Dan (Susie yawns) she is so quiet that it makes you think she is not quite as on board about stuff that we’ve been talking about" Marcus "We’re now focused on the next 48 hours which is..." Dan "Crucial" Susie "Crucial" Marcus "..which is the most important part of the game right now" Marcus (conf) "I don’t have the confidence once we get to the merge and these people got my back" (A nice bit of possible foreshadowing – and not in the least bad for Marcus’s editing chances – as potential storylines are being built around his future in the game - showing this the audience is "supposed" to ask if this might be the case which can help evolve into a future storyline) A notable musical change up occurs as Randy is shown diving in to the water - life is nice for Randy at Kota Randy (conf) "Once again, Kota won, did I kick ##### or what? My plan right now is to keep winning challenges and not rock the boat and I will be Kota yellow to the end" Oh what an interesting and completely unnecessary segment unless it is completely relevant later - we have merger talk - ties into future story lines for Kota members -Randy is again given development on his strategy that is so much more relevant than anything Dan or Susie has given - Marcus given extensive face time full of tribe dynamics and his own vulnerability - we have a holding pattern with an existing alliance and gratuitous scenes of a very happy Kota in general... there is a alot of meat at Kota that plays into the future. At this juncture, Randy and Marcus are sitting very pretty with the editing. Randy is getting a nicely done characterization that keeps climbing and Marcus is getting manipulation in his character when he may very well be a somewhat mundane character right now. As insignificant as Randy jumping into the water with Marcus asking where is Randy there may be quite a bit of significance to it - Randy apparently has earned his stay with Kota - Marcus is not shown questioning his merit with the tribe any longer - Randy may be the ingredient to add to the existing alliance with original Kota. This is not to say that others such as Charlie and Corrine and Bob won't go long but there has been no manipulation with them or story pushing. At the very least, Randy is heavily involved with a plot line and Marcus is being manipulated too much for a "winning" tribe to not be involved either. Scene Six - Exile The light hearted music continues as the almost now comical stay at EI is shown again. Sugar (conf) "When Kota sent me to EI, they said it was for pure comedy sake which I was thinking was hilarious..." "I am living high on the hog..." "I have the idol now and I’d have to be really dumb to get voted out next with the idol." (Foreshadowing? Ties with Ace and how she is in his pocket and his regulations on when to have it and the like?) Scene Seven - Fang GC "There’s about 13 grains of rice, we can all get about two of them" Crystal "Eat your rice" GC "Don’t tell me to do nothing" Crystal "Eat your rice" (This continues) GC "Shut your mouth. Playing with me won’t be funny for too long" GC (conf) "Been out here a couple of weeks and it is way more difficult than I ever expected...you gotta deal with these people 24/7... I do question what am I doing?" Ace (conf) "They’re cracking at the edges, the seams are going; this argument comes out of nowhere, it was brilliant, I couldn’t have planned it better, I’m like these people are going to implode... finally something is going to happen" Crystal then tells GC that she was only joking about the rice GC (conf) "I’ve kinda had it with these people; I want to get back to real life... I feel like this game is changing me and it’s not for the better" (And thus, GC’s journey is over) One now understands the heavy hand the past recaps have shown noting "GC quit as leader" and interestingly it was not stated this recap as it finally led up to his giving up. Scene Eight - More of Fang Matty (conf) "Today at challenge I think are chances are slim; this tribe’s floating, this tribe is all over the place, people are starting to become affected big time by the elements out here; GC’s losing it, Crystal is bugging out all over the place, it’s a bunch of insanity" The remainder of the scene was obviously GC leaving on his own accord with everyone wondering where he went just prior to a challenge with Matty, Kelly and Ken yelling for him. Crystal is annoyed they are using their energy and Ace agrees with her Ken (conf) "We’re about to go to challenge... everyone is looking for him.. He doesn’t like to be told what to do, that’s just how he rolls" Crystal (conf) "I am getting fed up with GC, he throws these tantrums and it personally upsetting to me...I’m just getting fed up..." GC comes back and essentially states he did not care if everyone left for the challenge without him Scene Nine - The Immunity Challenge Dan and Randy and Ace and Sugar play the roles of defender and caller. Of note: Ace clearly frustrated as he asks Sugar what is happening and you have to call - Sugar indicates she will talk more (the next round they do succeed) Sugar does remain calm through Ace’s tirade Dan stops his own ball! (Dan is his own worst enemy?) Jeff “Poor communication for Kota?” (Possible plot point?) Randy tells Dan he did that perfectly Ace gets yet another challenge apparatus in his face Jeff "This challenge is coming down to a single throw" Randy "Freeze Ace, freeze Ace, freeze" Jeff "Randy pulls a fast one on Ace" (Commentary appropriate for an excellent move by Randy? Indeed. Potential for a lovely bit of foreshadowing - that would be beautiful. Should Randy indeed "pull a fast one" on Ace in terms of the game, comments like this should never be taken for granted) Dan and Randy celebrate and Sugar attempts to comfort Ace Dan passes the immunity idol back to Marcus Jeff "This will be the fifth Tribal Council, you have been my guest at four of them" Marcus playfully rubs Dan's head as they walk off Sugar while apparently doing a less than stellar job in her role receives NO backlash in the editing on the poor performance - nothing stated by Jeff during the challenge and nothing stated by the tribe later. Compare that to the "beating" others have taken (prime example Kelly) and it is clear that the editing wants to continue positive for Sugar regardless of her standing. Many times those who emote positive in the editing do not get to end game; we are more or less meant to then get "angry" with the person who caused their demise. One can't hide certain things completely (Ace's frustration with her) but one can soften the blow and that was done (echoing the softening of Bob's loss) Scene Ten - Fang Defeated GC notes this is the fourth time going to Tribal Council as a dejected Crystal is shown Matty "I haven’t even had the energy to smile in the last couple of days" GC "I feel like I am doing and saying things that aren’t me..." "I’m ready to leave the game" Matty "Dude I think you are going to regret it man" Matty (conf) “You asked to leave this game man and it’s…people pounce on that!” Matty “GC is quitting” Crystal “I don’t want to hear it” (clearly agitated as the shot moves to Ace smiling) Crystal “See everyone’s gonna be like, please stay, please stay; if you want to (expletive) go, go!” Matty “I know” Crystal “I’m not kissing his a--; oh please stay” Matty “What do we do now?” Crystal “If that’s what he wants, that’s what he wants” Crystal (conf) “I’m voting for GC, hands down. We elected him leader, he quit at that, he’s quit at the challenges and now he wants to quit the game; he’s a loser, I have no respect for people like that…” Crystal “I’m too hungry for the mind games, if he wants to go, then let it be, so that’s where I stand” (Addresses this to Ken and Ace who are in the hut) Ken “Put down GC” Kelly “Is that what he wants?” Ken “Yes. Whatever. He’s going home tonight” In another area Sugar “So what’s happening?” Ace “We’re voting out GC” Sugar “Okay, I trust you” (I fear that her blind trust will not bode well for Sugar Ace “We’re working on making it to merge…” …”letting them destroy themselves has been pleasurable to watch” “Not this time but at a certain time I might call upon you to use the idol.” Sugar “You haven’t told anybody right?” Ace “No, nobody knows” “Have you hid the idol?” Sugar “It’s in my bag but nobody’s going in there” In a different location Matty “So what happens if she does have the idol” Crystal “I think that’s it. Keep a lookout please” (Ken and Kelly are also there with Matty and Crystal) Crystal “What’s this? What’s that?” “That’s the idol?” “She got it” Kelly “Let me see. It can’t be that small” (Matty watching) Crystal “Keep looking!! Keep a lookout before we get in trouble” Kelly “I knew she had it” Crystal “That’s why she’s so confident” Kelly “I feel like tonight’s the only night to blindside her” Ken “Tonight’s the only night” Crystal “Tonight is the only night!” Ken “Having that is powerful” Crystal “She’s the most dangerous person right now in this game” Very emphatic about that night being the ONLY night to do it and yet they don’t – do we again leave our televisions stating Fang made yet another poor decision? Was this stated emphatically because they chose NOT to do it the ONE night they deemed that they should, i.e. it backfires on this group should they try to do it another night? Ken (conf) “We all know Sugar has the HII and it really changes things cause nobody really wants to keep GC here but right now everyone’s scared of that idol” Kelly “Dude I don’t have time for quitters but the idol that’s like more intense” Matty “But we got to vote G” Scene Eleven – Tribal Council Jeff asks Ace about the wear and tear of being here for 15 days. Ace “I can see it when people are running out of belt loops… you can notice it really” Jeff notes to GC that the belt loops refer to him GC “…definitely takes a toll physically and mentally…what’s more important is it staying out here and starving and miss family and friends and take it for granted” Jeff asks Sugar if she has heard GC talk about home Sugar “..I know he feels like he wants to go soon and..” Jeff “Like he wants to go home?” Sugar “Yeah.” Jeff asks GC if he has talked about going home GC “I haven’t had the easiest life man, I’ve suffered all growing up and being out here it’s like I’m kinda done suffering…” Jeff notes right on cue Sugar crying. Sugar “I think we all feel this way, we all miss home and everything…it’s weird turning on people and I don’t think anyone likes that…” Jeff asks Matty if it was tough to hear a tribe mate talk about wanting to go home. Matty “There’s no quitting, you can’t give yourself that option…” (Always nice for an edit to refute quitting in Survivor which we know is a big no no) Jeff asks Sugar how concerned she is since she really does not know anyone Sugar “I kinda feel like it could be me….so I brought my bag” Jeff asks Ken if it is frustrating that Sugar keeps being sent to EI Ken “I’m sure it comes to everybody’s mind she found it but nobody knows unless she’s told people; it is very frustrating” Jeff asks Sugar what kind of strategy goes through her mind with respect on how to use the idol Sugar “Nobody really asked me if I had the idol actually” Jeff asks is that is odd they haven’t Sugar “No, considering you are allowed to go through people’s bags” Jeff asks if she thinks her bag has been gone through” Sugar “I don’t know.” (Says no to keeping her bag with her) “I keep it out where anybody could go through it” Jeff asks Crystal if that is crazy or crazy smart Crystal “Crazy to leave your bag out” Jeff asks Sugar if she cares if people know or not Sugar “Maybe there’s a sense of power knowing somebody has the idol and maybe you don’t want to vote against them because they might use it to vote you out” Of note, everyone except Kelly received questioning – as we have figured out already, Kelly is a non entity in this game and has been negatively portrayed by the editors as well Unlike last week, Jeff now has parting words for Fang: Jeff “You have endured a lot, one thing is for certain, you will have to dig deep (Sugar shown) if you’re going to last in this game” (Is this directed right to Sugar?)   Top

martinigirl 71 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square" 10-20-08, 04:33 PM (EST) 42. "RE: Episode Editing" I am not sure if anyone noticed something very weird from last weeks episode. After everyone voted and they were showing Jeff walking with the votes, the chanting music in the back sounded very much like "ace, ace, ace..." Maybe I am hearing things but I have replayed it a few times and it sounds very clear to me. I have no idea what it means or if I should have even posted that here. (if I am in the wrong thread, please delete) But, it could be an important clue. ??   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-21-08, 06:26 PM (EST) 43. "RE: Episode Editing" Hello Martinigirl and welcome to the boards. Your post is indeed in the right thread as music editing is very important and can tell the story just like the images can. Your post intrigued me so I listened to TC again but I hear a Hey! Hey! Hey! tribal chant. I'm not sure what that chant could mean. Maybe they were telling us that Fang needs a wake-up call!   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 10-22-08, 08:33 AM (EST) 44. "RE: Episode Editing" Hi martinigirl thank you for posting. I have noted that particular musical passage before and I believe (applejack would be able to confirm this or not) that this particular passage is almost always used when the hidden idol is part of the Tribal Council plot. I first noticed it in Fiji (obviously due to what impact the idol had that season) and have haphazardly heard it every time since. It DOES sound like Ace Someone other than myself may have paid closer attention to this than I but I do believe that melody is utilized when the hidden idol is part of the plot device at Tribal Council.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-25-08, 09:13 PM (EST) 45. "Episode #6 Editing Thoughts:" LAST EDITED ON 10-26-08 AT 03:13 AM (EST) This episode used a new editing pattern by showing confessionals during the challenge celebrations. There were also more new snipets of confessionals during the recap than usual: It started with a replay of the canoe challenge with Jeff screaming: “Nobody on the Fang goal”. (More evidence of Fang’s stupidity) We saw Kota living “very well” and Charlie telling us that “the rich keep getting richer.” When Jeff said that Fang had squandered most of their food, we had a new comment from Matty: “It’s the goof troop. It’s ridiculous”. Jeff presented Ace and Sugar as loners on Fang. Once more, we heard Sugar saying she trusted Ace. When “the rest of Fang found her Hidden Immunity Idol”, they agreed she would be next. Then, we heard a new comment from Kelly: “See ya, beyotch!” (That was the kiss of death for Kelly.) Jeff went on saying: “The two outsiders got a temporary reprieve when GC got tired of the game.” We had a new portion of Matty’s confessional where he stated: “He came up to me and said he’s done with this. He’s had enough.” Jeff ended by asking the questions: “Can Fang turn it around and can Ace and Sugar survive another tribal council?” The recap prepared us for another episode that would center on Fang. With Crystal and Ken reduced to being “the rest of Fang”, Jeff told us that Sugar and Ace were the stars of Fang. These two could outlast them all even if Matty was nicely separated from the goofiness. Fang Night 15 It started well for Fang, Matty making fire and Kelly talking about positive energy. Ace in confessional: “Tribal council was sad but not unexpected. GC had to go. I got Sugar in my pocket and I need to arrange something that I can save myself until merge. I don’t know who will be my potential Benedict Arnold?” Fang Day 16 It wasn’t a pleasant morning. We heard a first mention of Matty’s girlfriend. Matty (solo): “This is by far the hardest thing I’ve ever done but my whole driving force out here is Jaime, my girfriend. I’m trying to make a sort of ring-type thing. It’s just something to keep myself reminded of her. Because of her, I want to finish this out to the end. I’m in a terrible position and I feel like I’ve been in a bad position the moment this game started with Fang. Somebody would approach me with a legitimate, logical, reasonable plan that might work, for sure I’m on board, I’d jump on board and I’m flying with it.” More separation from Fang for Matty but, unfortunately, the indication of how his story will end. That plan soon took shape but it looked like a pact with the devil as Ace was the one to approach him. Ace was cautious in feeling out which of Crystal or Ken was Matty’s true ally. When told it was Ken, Ace proposed a pact: “You’ve got your Kenny, I’ve got my Sugar… Till merge, you’re on your girl that you’re not going to stab me in the back.” After hesitating, Ace swore on his mother’s life that he would get Matty to the merge. Matty (solo): “I think Ace and I are probably some of the top competitors out here, physically. I do like him on my side and I made a pact with Ace that I can’t break. I promised on my girfriend… I’m not going to break that promise for a million dollars, not even for 5 million dollars.” Second Segment Kota, Day 16 The tribe is sitting down to eat. We see a close-up of Dan helping himself to a healthy portion. It didn’t go unnoticed: Bob: “We’ve been eating very well… But Dan is shoveling it all with a spoon. I realized that… I put the same number of scoops on my plate for Susie and I to share as Dan put on for himself.” Corinne: It doesn’t matter if you weigh a 100 pounds more than me, you still get the same proportions of food. Dan decided that he derserves 4th and 5th servings of food. So now we are going through food at an alarming rate and he takes multiple servings. I’m sick about how much food we are wasting, on him. (eye roll) Ughhh!” A very interesting snipet. Of course, on the first level, it sets up Dan to be booted. More importantly, we saw everyone staring at Dan, presumably agreeing with Bob and Corinne that Dan was a problem. Therefore, Dan will not be a “Victim”. Even if he was somewhat likeable, his demise will not make those executing him look bad. That is important in Survivor’s way of portraying the winner. Meanwhile, at Fang, the food situation was much worse. Ken: “Starting on day 1, I was talking about how everybody wasn’t conserving the rice… and now, of course, we have a shortage of rice… If we don’t have rice, we’re dead… It’s hard for our tribe now, it’s like we’re at rock bottom.” Ace joined Sugar inside the hut. Ace told her: “I think everyone knows you have the idol.” Sugar: “I was trying to hold on to my idol as long as possible but Ace came and told me that he thinks they went through my bag and found it. So, I gave it to Ace for safe keeping. Ace is now in possession of the idol. He’s got it in his pocket. I’m putting a lot of faith in Ace right now. Ace is kind of a snake but he’s my snake and I’m glad to have him.” As careless as that confessional sounded, it was the first indication Sugar has given us that she’s aware of Ace’s deviousness. Letting us hear that she considers him her snake is another indication that Sugar has learned just enough about this game to outlast Ace. Wouldn’t that be a nice twist to their story? Ace reacted to that move with this confessional: “It’s been a crazy couple of days: It went from me being in a position of no power to a postion of supremacy. Having the immunity idol in my pocket, I have Matty’s word, I have Sugar. I feel like I have put myself in a very good position coming into a tribe that I didn’t have any alliance with and now, suddenly I’ve got people there… (In a very Greg Buis-like moment, Ace interrupted his confessional to look at a creature in the water. It was larger than a flying fish!) There’s an elephant swimming in the lake… I guess that’s one way to make from one side to the other.” The Challenge When Kota had their first look at the new Fang tribe, Randy couldn’t hide his satisfaction. As Jeff said “GC voted out” the crusty old man made a fist pump and, with an emphatic thumbs up, he told Fang that they had made the right decision! If you watch again this segment, I’d suggest you look at Corinne: Whenever Jeff made one of his patented comments (ready for today’s challenge? Want to know what you’re playing for?) we had group shots of some players and then a close-up of Corinne. I counted 3 of those close-ups which has to mean something in a challenge that she sat out. Notes from the challenge: Corinne cheerleading: “Come on Kota, you’ve got this. Jeff pointing out: - “Kelly barely moving (said even if Fang was in the early lead and she was setting their pace!) - “Fang gaining some distance now on Kota now that they’ve lost Kenny and Sugar and Kelly.” - “Crystal starting to drag now.” Very interesting that Jeff never said she was the last woman left. Compare that to the praise he had given to Stephenie and Rebecca in the same type of pursuit challenge. Instead, we had: “Matty… frustrated.” - “It’s all on Matty and Ace.” Matty urging Ace to: “Come aside of me.” - Corinne: Yeah! You’ve got this!” (Applauding and blowing kisses as they passed by!) - Jeff always talked about Kota. We never heard him singling out anyone for stepping up and leading them to victory. Marcus was in the lead position so it’s very interesting that an occasion to draw a parallel to Tom wasn’t used. The only praise was from Dan to a winded Bob as he said: “If I could do it at your age…” Never missing an opportunity to rub it in, Jeff offered the pastry tray to Kota to sample one in front of Fang since they’d still “have plenty to take back to camp”. Hearing Kelly asking “Can you share?” and Ken pleading “Can we have one?”, Randy decided he’d rub it in also by telling them “No” and then savoring a strawberry shortcake. The camera focused on his delight and Fang’s despair until Crystal broke down in tears. Saying she wasn’t used to “losing over and over” we heard Randy go “Woin, Woin Woin” and, after they had sent Sugar to Exile Island, he saluted Fang’s departure. Randy, in a Survivor first, had a confessional during the challenge segment: “I love winning challenges. More importantly than winning challenges, I absolutely love watching them lose.” Crystal responded in her own confessional: “Randy, to me, he’s a troll. He’s a troll that’s just mean and angry with the world. I won’t play like that. Do not disrespect me like that. (Here the audio quality changed, suggesting this part was spliced in). I have a feeling that, if there is a merge, old Fang and new Fang won’t get along.” Third Segment Kota Marcus (Solo): “Today’s challenge just showed that Kota is a strong and unified team and I’m so excited to see that. When it works like a charm in the challenges, there’s just no better feeling.” The question of portions reappeared when Dan talked about dividing the bounty. We heard a discordant metallic sound that highlighted Corinne’s disapproval. Corinne: “If it wasn’t for Dan, we wouldn’t have rationing laws. When the pastries came back, the old Kotas, like me, Marcus and Charlie were already like, how are we going to divide this? So, we try to make it as fair as possible.” Randy: “Dan has annoyed everybody. He’s even annoyed me a little bit. My best move might be to slowly distance myself from Dan as I bring myself closer to the original Kota.” Showing he knows how to create conflicts, we then heard Randy telling Dan: “Go for it. It’s a reward, there’s no rationning” !! Exile Island Sugar was feeling guilty: “Why do I get to come back here and eat fruit when everybody is starving in my tribe? I already have the idol. Actually, I gave Ace the idol in case he needs it…We’ll see if that happens.” Fang Matty was trying to divide the chores but Crystal said he was stressing out. Kelly (solo): “Fang lost another challenge. We needed that food because I’m withering away… Crystal’s reaction to our loss was huge. She just broke down in tears. Personally, I think that her personallity sucks.” She took a walk with Ace who told her Crystal was “going the same way as GC.” Crystal sat in camp telling Matty: “Don’t view my tears as a sign of weakness.” Crystal: “I hope they don’t put me in the same category as GC, someone that wants to give up because, as soon as I got back to camp, I snapped out of my funk. Kelly didn’t have two words to say to me so now, she’s going to feel the wrath of Crystal.” Crystal explained herself to Kelly and Ace but Kelly wasn’t impressed. Fourth Segment Kota, Day 17 Randy caught a turtle. Marcus (solo): “I was so excited because it was like winning a reward challenge except we did it ourselves so it had that extra bit of joy to it.” Susie: “I was excited. I think it’s gonna taste good. Have you ever had gumbo turtle soup in the jungle of Africa? How cool is that? Marcus: “Now, I think the Kota tribe is probably at our highest high… Fang better watch out. The Challenge I noted: - “Randy dragging it for Kota” - “Lets go girls! What are you doing? Fang is slowing down.” - “Matty and Kenny have overtaken Marcus and Dan. Matty and Kenny unbelievable in this leg. Get back, Kenny, you gotta get back.” - “Kota working together very well… Ace not wanting help from anyone… Ace still struggling to make sense of this.” - We didn’t see a single shot of Susie cheerleading which adds even more importance to showing Corinne in the previous challenge. In this challenge, Corinne received the idol with a smile and we saw her patting its head. We also saw a close-up of her as Jeff said: “Kota, you continue to dominate in this game.” - Jeff telling Fang: “If you continue to play like individuals (Ace and Crystal on screen), you’ll be there every time.” Crystal in confessional: “Ace is a tyrant and a bully. A lot of people see Ace as a strong competitor but he’s been in our tribe for 3 or 4 challenges now and we haven’t won anything. So, how is he benefitting me?” Final Segment Fang, Day 18 Ace : “The challenge was challenging. There were a couple of people who died right at the end (Kelly and Sugar on screen) I was expecting more of Kelly and she just petered out. If she goes, it strenghtens the team and I think she’s just irritating and really dumb. Kelly is going home tonight. It would be really dumb not to send her.” Matty told Ace he was worried that Sugar would play the idol if Fang got down to Ace, Sugar and himself. “I think we should flush the idol tonight.” Ace told Matty to trust him. Ace: “Matty wanted to get the idol out and I tried to convey to him that he doesn’t really have to worry about it to that extent because, although I don’t want to tell him I have the idol, obviously I do… The alliance is sound. I would hope to trust Matty, Sugar I trust completely. I don’t see any reason why Kenny would not to go with what it is and I think it makes sense to get rid of Kelly.” Crystal told Matty: “I’m thinking of blindsiding Sugar tonight.” Matty said it wouldn’t work because he had talked to Ace about it. Crystal: “I don’t know what is going through Matty’s head. He’s running and telling Ace everything and Ace ain’t telling him anything… I’m still very leary of Ace and Sugar. They are in an alliance and Kenny, myself and Matty, we have to be leary of everything that’s going on around us.” Kenny told Crystal something was up and that the safest bet was to vote Kelly but that he didn’t trust Ace. Kenny: “Crystal knows something is up, she does not trust Matty. Crystal is on to something.” We had just heard that Crystal knew Matty was writing Kelly’s name so why doesn’t she trust him… unless Kenny’s confessional is from next week when Matty could be going after Crystal. Ken talked with Matty, saying that Crystal was worried that he was flipping. Ken proposed blindsiding Ace since he couldn’t be trusted. Matty told him he had made a promise to Ace. Ken said he couldn’t take anybody’s word and that they needed to blindside Ace to assure they would make the merge. Kenny: “I don’t trust Ace at all. I know he’s sneaky and that he has alliances back in the Kota tribe and Sugar is gonna go with Ace no matter what. I had to talk to Sugar on a 1 on 1 basis.” Ken told Sugar that “people who are nice get their head chopped of by people like…” “Ace” she completed. She then went on to ask: “Do you think I should get the idol back from Ace?” Ken could only say: “You gave Ace the idol? Are you crazy?” Ken: “I was so shocked today when Sugar told me she had given the idol to Ace. I was like wait…What?” We saw Sugar telling Ace she had taken the idol back from his jacket even if she didn’t think she’d have to play it. Ace was cool with it. Kenny’s confessional continued: “I told Sugar to always have the idol with her in case something happens. I made sure it wasn’t in the snake’s hand, in Ace’s hands and back in Sugar’s hands.” As they left for Tribal Council, Ace had a last confessional: “The deal with Sugar and the idol is that she has it. It’s possible that Sugar thinks ‘I’ve used Ace to the extent that I can’. I’m not particularly concerned in relation to my own regard at the moment. I’m going in confident. That could be the worst thing possible” Tribal Council Jeff started by pointing that Fang had won 2 out of 10 challenges. We heard a gong as the camera showed Crystal. Matty said “We are cursed…” (Ken and Crystal shown with an uneasy smile) Kelly said the problem was that they couldn’t work as a team. Jeff approved and Crystal nodded. Crystal put the blame on Ace from trying to do everything. Ace said he deserved a large portion of the blame for how it went in the end. He wasn’t surprised that Crystal would vote for him simply because of that. Crystal was asked about her tears and said she was concerned that people saw it as weakness. Kelly nodded agreement and Jeff caught her, attracting a reaction from Crystal. Kelly said it made it seem as somebody who “is not stable.” Crystal took offense, Ace smiled! Crystal wanted to go to the next question but Jeff added: “Kelly didn’t say you were weak, she said you were unstable.” That really riled the Olympic champion as she tore into Kelly. Ace and Sugar were now openly laughing. Kelly said: “I’m not the only one talking about it, Ace talked about it.” Ace wasn’t ready to take that portion of the blame! He warned: “Before you start throwing people under the bus for no apparent reason, the only thing I said about Crystal is that I understood it was frustrating…” Kelly said he was “100% double talking and so annoying” she didn’t “even know how to explain it.” Ace countered with: “Honestly Kelly, I would be impressed if you understood what I was saying half the time.” That whole exchange was nicely underlined by Sugar’s amused expression. Jeff told Matty he was probably one of the few that had a reason not to worry. Matty answered: “there’s no sense of logic in this tribe though.” Jeff noted that it had to be maddening that so many people were on the chopping block. “It could be anyone of us” agreed Matty. As Kelly was voted out, Kenny didn’t look pleased, Crystal had a smug look while Ace and Sugar laughed. Jeff noted that they had showed passion for the first time. The Characters The story of Good vs Evil is really starting to take shape and that story involves only 7 characters. Lets start with the characters that aren’t really part of that story. Susie’s contribution was limited to a confessional that is typical of “Tourists”: She was going to enjoy a nice meal in the middle of the jungle. We don’t even have images of Susie working which would indicate that she’s still trying. Dan was seen as a “Dumb Player” as soon as he went on his Exile Island expedition and seeing him continue to be his own worst enemy reinforces that. As I wrote above, showing an unimportant scene just to explain why Dan would need to go is another reason to see the winner in Kota. Crystal continues to see things go poorly for her. She was lumped in with the “rest of Fang” during the recap and she didn’t get any positive comment despite being the last woman standing in the reward challenge. She singled out Ace for not benefitting her in the last 3 challenges even if, as Kelly pointed out, Crystal herself didn’t do anything in half the challenges and Jeff pointed out her tribe had lost 8 challenges. It wasn’t a good sign that Crystal was heard saying her alliance needed to keep their eyes open for what Ace was doing while she had no idea what Matty had already done. It was worse that she wanted to boot Sugar then Ace but settled on Sugar. The responsibility for having so many people on the chopping block, a maddening situation according to Jeff, was put on her shoulders. Ken was shown trying his best to make the right move but once more it turned out to be bad for him. By losing first GC and now Kelly, he went from being in the alliance of the “three tighest members of Fang” with “someone to use for a vote” into the number 4 slot in an alliance led by the snake. From what we saw during his exchange with Sugar, his game strategy could help the pin-up model more than himself. Charlie seems to have only one role and that is singing the praise of Kota in general and Marcus in particular. Besides that, he has nothing else to contribute to the story. The Good Ones: Bob has enough presence in each episode to be put in the category of main characters but his story has little to do with winning the game. As Dan pointed out, his story is to prove that one can do well in this game even at that age. Matty’s demise was practically spelled out in this episode. He shouldn’t trust Ace who, afterall, only promised to take him to the merge. Ironic that Ken pointed out that voting out Ace would have assured Matty of making that merge. Matty is the good guy that will fall victim to the snake. Hearing Matty pleading for Ace to be at his side during the pursuit challenge seemed to foreshadow that Ace will not be there when it really counts. I wouldn’t be surprised if that happens right after the family visit. We should be allowed to meet Jaime, the girl who is so important to Matty. Sugar is showing some self-awareness and more game than most people had expected. She has learned from Ken to keep her idol so it wouldn’t surprise me if she’d keep it even after Ace finally asks for it to save himself. Unfortunately, Sugar will probably find out that there are more than 1 snake and that they are not all on her side. Marcus is the face of Kota, the tribe that Jeff continues to praise as a unit. Even Marcus considers the game from a team perspective. Of the “Good Ones”, Marcus continues to be presented as someone who could win. He has vital game confessionals that lead him to the end game and he has fluff confessionals that could have been given to anyone. We are meant to remember Marcus and appreciate his demeanor as a player if not an entertainer. The Evil Ones Ace is a snake who baited Kelly into a session of bashing Crystal only to let her hang herself at tribal council. Saying he has Sugar in his pocket and insisting that Matty swears on his girlfriend is preparing us to see him try to use both. Talk of reigning supreme and saying that he trusts Sugar completely prepare us to see him fail at some point. But he could still surprise us. Randy really stepped up the negativity in this episode. A winner has never been called a troll so, if we go by Crystal’s words, he shouldn’t stand a chance. Such a character has been seen before and he would nicely distract us from the winner’s story and entertain us at the same time. Finishing as the goat that loses in front of the jury could be his role. However, three things make me keep him as a contender: 1- Jeff’s own behavior. Our host is snarkier than he has ever been and nothing that Randy has said or done is different to what Jeff has said or done to Fang. Jeff’s remark: “You can sample one here and have plenty to take back to camp” told us that rubbing it in was acceptable. I remember that Jeff had chastised Boo for rubbing it in to Ravu. Not so this time. 2- Randy’s gameplan. We hear a progression on his strategy. He went from being ready to see Fang self-destroy, to setting up an alliance to get rid of its cancer, to doing whatever he could to be accepted by Kota, to being ready to distance himself from Dan. He IS adapting which was his key to survival. The next step would be seeing him setting up an alliance within the layers of the onion. 3- The precedent of season 1 when Colleen called Hatch useless and undeserving. The Undeclared One Corinne said she’s a bitch and would own up to it but we haven’t seen any of that… yet. Her role is still very limited but she’s given unnecessary screen shots which raise interesting questions regarding her future. Her presentation as Kota’s cheerleader could be a hint into her future game plan: She’ll enjoy riding the Kota train as far as it will take her and then will betray them at just the right moment. The way women have been voted out this season and seeing that Crystal, Susie and Sugar are already on the chopping block, Corinne could very well end up as the only woman left even if she didn’t want to be in that position. That quote from the pick ‘em would take on a whole new meaning if she does wind up alone with 6 or 7 guys. If she is the smartest one, she may very well realize that her best chance of winning isn’t by sitting next to Marcus. She’d be extremely dangerous if she were to opt for the “dark side”. So, which side will win? This season’s theme is “Earth’s last Eden”. The first Eden wasn’t a story that ended up with everyone “Living Happily Ever After”. Consider that Charlie practically sees Marcus as God’s perfect creation and I’m expecting him to fall just like that first guy. That would open the door for either Randy or Corinne to claim the prize...or will the snake have the last laugh again?   Top

emydi 13669 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-26-08, 12:50 PM (EST) 46. "RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts:" Nice thoughts michel Animals At beginning big ape growling and cheetah running fast with immediate downplaying of Uthong. Running animals are Kota related so is that ape. Back at Uthong scrambling termites near the fire in the morning. Uthongs are litle bugs! Then Ace is talking about how he has worked his way into Nuthong and sees the bull elephant getting from one side to the other. I think he makes merge. That poor turtle!! I hope they all got diarrhea!! Lone bird as Uthong returns after losing TC Bull Elephant before Matty and Crystal talk at the river with fly buzzing sounds. Hippos in the water going under the water (or utr) and then Kenny is shown talking to Crystal in the woods about Matty and Ace. I think Kenny has more play in him than you do michel! And again the monkey is shown b4 Kenny talks to Sugar about Ace and the HI. Cute little standing Wildebeest before Sugar tells Ace that she took back the idol. After this little talk the wildebeest shakes his its head to get rid of a bird off of its head and the bird flies back onto its back. No animals during the voting. Just a mask before Ace voted. I noticed the Ace Ace Ace in the music at TC   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-28-08, 10:00 PM (EST) 49. "RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts:" "I think Kenny has more play in him than you do michel!" Well, Kenny does have game and an interesting edit. It reminds me a lot of Alex and Peih Gee actually, the last member standing of their respective tribe. Like Kenny, those two had games but were just one step behind, one dollar short, tripping over their own feet...   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 10-27-08, 03:58 PM (EST) 47. "RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts:" Corinne said she’s a ##### and would own up to it but we haven’t seen any of that… yet. On the insider video when Marcus & Charlie were discussing who could help them bring Matty in Marcus also discussed their final alliance. He made the comment that Corrine would be a good F2 partner alluding to her attitude. Makes me think that editing is hiding her (she's been fairly hidden these past few weeks)because her biotchiness has come out and soon we'll see it. Agman camouflaged me for S17   Top

b1whois 126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 10-27-08, 06:30 PM (EST) 48. "RE: Episode #6 Editing Thoughts:" >Never missing an opportunity to rub >it in, Jeff offered the >pastry tray to Kota to >sample one in front of >Fang since they’d still “have >plenty to take back to >camp”. >Hearing Kelly asking “Can you share?” >and Ken pleading “Can we >have one?”, Randy decided he’d >rub it in also by >telling them “No” and then >savoring a strawberry shortcake. The >camera focused on his delight >and Fang’s despair until Crystal >broke down in tears. Saying >she wasn’t used to “losing >over and over” we heard >Randy go “Woin, Woin Woin” >and, after they had sent >Sugar to Exile Island, he >saluted Fang’s departure. > >Randy, in a Survivor first, had >a confessional during the challenge >segment: “I love winning challenges. >More importantly than winning challenges, >I absolutely love watching them >lose.” > >Crystal responded in her own confessional: >“Randy, to me, he’s a >troll. He’s a troll that’s >just mean and angry with >the world. I won’t play >like that. Do not disrespect >me like that. (Here the >audio quality changed, suggesting this >part was spliced in). I >have a feeling that, if >there is a merge, old >Fang and new Fang won’t >get along.” i think that this indicates that these two are safe from being voted out this week, as they have business to settle!   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 10-29-08, 07:52 AM (EST) 50. "Editing" Glad to see some postings in here I very much enjoyed this episode but did not bother with my usual long winded activity Michel, they actually did do a confessional during a challenge in the first episode but it is certainly new to Survivor THIS season. I recall watching the premiere and commenting on that. A rather strange tactic in my opinion and while probably done for benign reasons, I am not very fond of it - it tends to take the momentum away from the scene for me. b1 - that was certainly an interesting confessional from Crystal with respect to Randy and I would tend to agree that there may have to be a "meeting of the minds" with Crystal and Randy for prophetic purposes. I'm more of a fan of end game speculation as quite often there have been indicators that two people should reach some conclusion with each other and it doesn't occur despite the suggestion they will. So I tend to reserve judgment on those types of statements as Survivor has tricked me before. This confessional may mean there is some type of squaring off where the two will meet again OR it was put there to solely flesh out Randy. It may have nothing to do with Crystal per se other than the fact she was the mouthpiece and the editors want to start really set a tone about what happens with Randy and the "old Fang" (though not necessarily Crystal) However, since I tend not to do any "research" in between episodes (other than seeing the previews) there may be a merge that I am not aware. A pattern has been established by the editors that when a merge is around the corner, references are made about it so I would imagine it is forthcoming. Generally speaking, the stage is again set with Kota dynamics that did not have to be shown since they have been on the winning side but the Kota inserts have definitely shown us that Dan and Susie are two most in danger - Dan was certainly showcased last episode and it will be interesting to see if Kota decides to go by the way of Fang (booting strength first) Randy's character is taking a slight turn where we may now start seeing more of the overall theme that was presented to us in the beginning - unlike prior episodes, Randy's edit, while "crusty" was always validated and factual. One may not like him but we certainly could not argue with what he said especially in light of the clearly obvious edit Fang is getting which may be the strongest edit I've ever seen of a tribe negatively. Kota obviously is utilized only to a degree but we have seeds planted of who is in immediate danger and those who are being seen and heard when not necessary (visuals and confessionals of players who are not in the "thick of things" at present are generally done to keep them on screen) Matty certainly is getting a very lovely edit with confessionals and voice overs that have him removed from the negative tinge over Fang which should bode well for him and while he is a textbook example of someone in a minority that would be deemed as a physical threat to be booted; at this time I am of the mindset he may be able to circumvent any immediate danger and it will be very interesting to see how the "promise" that was made with Ace and Matty plays out. Sugar and Ace again are receiving very intriguing and substantive edits. Are they simply good characters? Absolutely! There are stories surrounding them however that I don't quite feel they are being showcased solely for their dynamic characterization. It will certainly be interesting to watch how the "on hold" alliances play out when both tribes converge. The Kota alliance of Marcus, Corrine, Charlie with Bob as their add on, the Fang alliance of Matty, Randy, Susie and Dan, the foursome of Matty, Ken, Ace and Sugar all may be compromised to a degree. I agree that the comments made about Corrine prior to the season have not "quite" met up to her present edit. Consider that Jeff's commentary about Corrine is accurate yet we've only seen very minute hints of it suggests quite a bit of manipulation and manipulation is normally a positive. Recall the outrageous edit of Steph (in both seasons) - we were meant to root for her in one and meant to see her with some disdain in the other. She was always the same person however. Corrine has been shown twice in confessionals airing her opinion; I doubt that is all she said yet the editors do not want to flood our television sets with it when they probably could. Where she may end up remains to be seen but there is very heavy handed manipulation this season with respect to a few players and she is one of them. Jeff's pre season commentary has always been very insightful and very accurate in character assessment - it would be an immense contradiction between his commentary and her portrayal unless the editors are working her edit.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-01-08, 06:34 PM (EST) 51. "Episode #7 Editing Thoughts:" During the recap, Jeff told us that Kota was the “King of the Jungle. The entire tribe was united except for Dan and Susie.” We saw the confessional where Marcus wondered if those two would have his back. Jeff went on: “The Red tribe consistently made questionable moves.” We heard Matty’s confessional about “being stuck in a tribe that has no skills.” Ace was said to have made a “heads-up play when he pulled in Matty in an alliance with his long time ally, Sugar.” Sugar said she relied on Ace the whole time and we had a repeat of Ace saying that Sugar was a plus because she had the immunity idol and that he had Sugar in his pocket. Finally, Jeff said “their first move was to vote out Ace’s biggest enemy, Kelly.” The recap put Ace front and center on the Fang tribe and it’s interesting that his actions were presented positively by Jeff who used words like “Heads-Up” and “First Move.” It’s somewhat inconsistant with his words to Fang at the end of their upcoming Tribal Council. Fang, Day 19 Matty had the first confessional: “This is a tough game. We’re starving… I’m starting to lose my spirit, I’m starting to lose my hope… I’m hopeless about Fang.” Then Crystal spilled part of their precious reserves of rice. Matty went on: “Rice is more valuable than gold and she just clumsily trips over it and spills it. I wanted to just lay into her and chew her out but it’s pointless. You can’t cry over spilt milk, it’s just too late.” Ken cooked some rice and Crystal refused to eat, the others telling her she should eat the rice (reminding us of the scene where she had told GC to eat.) Ken: (solo)“This tribe… we’re not working together. Everybody has a grudge against each other. Matty and Ace are basically going against Crystal. These guys are trying to call the shots and I don’t like that. I don’t like that at all.” Ace: “Crystal did me a favor; she’ll be the next lamb to the slaughter.” Second Segment Kota, Day 20 The tribe was sitting around the fire as Corinne said: “My parents said not to curse so much so that you don’t look too trashy.” Marcus and Corinne laughed at that while Dan observed Dan: “I think that Charlie, Marcus and Corinne seem very, very tight and, at times, exclusive. I’m the type of person who is always going to feel vulnerable, a little bit insecure.” We saw Dan talking to Corinne and Marcus, explaining how he felt. In response, Corinne had a confessional: “I would say that Dan is socially inept in many ways. I don’t know if he is a former fatty or why he wasn’t liked as a child but deep down inside, he’s a little kid that’s seeking approval.” Marcus had a confessional that supported Corinne’s: “Dan is the ultimate paranoïd human being. At some point, Dan is going to be a huge liability. Unfortunately, there’s nothing I can do to save him from himself at this point.” After setting up the upcoming boots very nicely, we went directly to The Reward Challenge: When Jeff told Kota that Kelly had been voted out, we heard a “Yeah” coming from the background chant. Not a very subtle way of reminding us how we were supposed to feel about Kelly and a way to continue the story that Fang had finally done something right. Once more, it was Corinne who had the close-up saying “hell yeah” when Jeff asked if they wanted to know what they were playing for. She then told Jeff that “Charlie and I would like to be the cheerleaders today.” Interesting comments: “Randy, very aggressive in the Fang ring.” As he scored, we heard Randy saying; “It’s over.” As Sugar prepared to be Fang’s attacker, Randy made some animal noises which caused Sugar to comment: “He’s such an ugly person, he’s mean.” Jeff simply answered: “This should be fun” and Randy pretended to be kissing her! It started out well for her: “Sugar being aggressive, giving everything she’s got, trying to score for Fang” but “Stay after him Suger, be a hero… Sugar, you need to pick it up… Sugar, doing nothing, absolutely nothing.” (We saw Crystal observing and heard Matty urging her on.) “Bob takes Kenny out, doesn’t help, Fang still alive… Bob takes a hard fall. Bob takes him down.” (We saw Corinne and Charlie doing a happy dance) As Jeff told Sugar that it was unprecedented to be sent to Exile Island 5 times in a row, Sugar said she was there to break records. Matty commented in confessional: “Sugar is a pin-up model. She is completely worthless when it comes to challenges. When it comes to Sugar in this game, I would really, really desire her to go. We lost the biggest reward yet. It’s hard when you see them walking away. They have everything and we have nothing. We see Kota in their chopper… it’s madness.” Third Segment – The Reward Bob: “The reward was a helicopter ride and I was lucky to get a front row seat. To see that incredible crater, it made my trip to Africa…” We heard Randy saying: “Stay away from the edge” but saw Marcus walking right to the limit of the crater. Was that presented so that we could see a sign of carelessness? Susie: “That beautiful scenery was awesome. It was something that I thought I’d never experience. It just gives you more incentive, more power, more strength that I can get through this, no matter what, so it was very surreal for me.” During the picnic, the helicopter pilot brought Kota a package containing letters from home. Bob reacted to the letters by stepping away from the group and breaking down in tears. Corinne came to give him a hug, saying: “Your family loves you, Bob.” Bob (solo): “I’m close to the people here but these are the people that are closest to my heart. Life is good, I realize how lucky I am. I’m here and I can’t wait to get home to them. Life doesn’t get better than this.” Meanwhile, the Fang tribe had returned to camp, where Matty expressed his frustrations and told the tribe: “Sugar, she can’t do a thing.” Matty and Ace went on a boat ride where Matty tried to get Ace to agree to let Sugar go. Ace countered with: “We have the idol in her pocket. It’s in our possession.” Matty saw that logic and they shifted the vote to Crystal. Kenny and Crystal, watching from a distance, knew what they were up to. They agreed to blindside Ace. Crystal (solo): “I can feel Ace right now, strategically, wanting to get rid of me. The way that he’s manipulating Matty, he’s the devil and he has to go.” Sugar Shack Sugar:: “…I don’t know what is really happening in this game. I’m just trying to survive. Thank god for Ace. It’s funny that I’m pretty sure we’re using each other. My tribe thinks I’m naïve for sticking with him out of stupidity but I’m sticking with him because he is the strongest player at this point. (Isn’t that a perfect Game Theory plan!) I just hope they aren’t all screwing me around.” The Challenge Sugar returned and received a hug from Ken. Hearing that both tribes would go to TC, Dan had a confessional: “I think that I may have a target on my back. So, I think it’s very important for me to go in and win, and not just win by a little but win by a lot.” (Dan would be the first one eliminated) When Jeff pulled out a parchment, Sugar reacted: “Another twist?!!” Bob, still wearing his buff as a bow-tie said: “I won the lumberjack log roll when I was in college.” Corinne responded with a resigned laugh: “Of course he did.” And, of course Bob won easily, doing a back-flip in celebration. However, Sugar beat him in the next round. As Ace got on the log for the final round, he had a confessional: “I feel this win is enormous…” Marcus had to assign immunity to a member of the other tribe. Despite Crystal’s plea, he chose Sugar who thanked him with a kiss. Marcus explained in confessional: “My hope is that Sugar is smart enough to keep the immunity idol to herself and that might actually end up giving us one of our biggest surprises which would be losing a big power player from the Fang tribe in Ace, Matty or Crystal.” Very important to Marcus’ story: He was given credit for playing a big role in Ace’s eviction. Had we not heard this confessional, we may have wondered if Ace leaving over Matty or Crystal was something Marcus really wanted. This way, we know that things are continuing to go as planned for our Resident Physician. Crystal reacted in confessional: “When I saw Sugar with the immunity necklace around her neck, I said “Damn!” This girl has 2 idols. She is now the most powerful player in this game.” Fourth Segment Fang, Day 21 The first shot we had was of Sugar walking back alone to camp, an image that was followed by that of a snake and then we saw the rest of the Fang tribe through what appeared to be posts of a fence but which gave an impression of seeing them through the scope of a rifle. Sugar is now the Hunter! Ken: “Matty and Ace, they are thinking of getting rid of Crystal so it all depends on the pin-up girl, Sugar. I will lie in this game, I will do everything in my power to get her to vote with me because my life and Crystal’s life rests upon her.” Again we saw the snake (which we now know is Sugar!) circling the Fang camp and a monkey (Emy told us that Kenny was the little monkey) playing in a tree. Saying it was the “Honest to God truth”, Kenny lied to (or smartly arranged the truth for) Sugar by saying that Ace was planning her eviction in a way to get her idol. Interestingly that, as he said that Ace called her good for nothing, the camera was on Sugar observing and judging, not on Ken spinning this story. Even if Kenny said his life depended on it, it was presented as her struggle, not his. Sugar: “I don’t trust Kenny. He might have been lying to me but I’ve been trusting the biggest snake in the game so far and I’ve known that. I really don’t know who to trust at any point in this game.” They agreed to blinside Ace, Kenny adding: “We don’t have to worry about the snake ever again.” Kenny doesn’t realize that he has just created a much more dangerous snake! Kenny:“I trust Sugar and I trust that she will go along with the plan and vote out Ace. She may be the pin-up girl,but she is very smart.” Kenny hasn’t had much luck with cute girls in this game! Crystal: “Kenny has reassured me that all is well. I will truly believe Sugar when she writes Ace’s name down. Either she’s gonna write my name or she’s gonna write Ace’s name.” Then, Ace, fearing a double-cross, made the fatal mistake of asking Sugar for her immunity idol. He walked right into the trap set up by Kenny. Sugar: “When Ace asked me for the idol, it made me think maybe Kenny was telling me the truth. Ace definitely knows how to finagle people much more than I’ve ever seen anybody do probably in my life but he’s definitely had my back. Crystal is supposed to go home next but plans can change. Ace could be turning on me now, I have no idea.” I smiled as she said that because we saw Ace through the flames of the camp’s fire as if he was already burning in hell. Sugar went on: “Oooh! God! What am I going to do with this thing?” After she said that, we saw her opening her eyes as if coming to a realization and then a snake preceded Fang into Tribal Council. First Tribal: Sugar told Jeff they were very low on rice and that Crystal knocked some over. Ken told Jeff that they had about 7 days of rice and that Crystal scooped some of the rice back. Matty said that rice was the most valuable thing they have, that they live on 8 spoons of rice a day and that no one said: “God! Crystal, what are you doing?” Crystal got defensive saying his face said it all, that it was an accident. Matty said they went passed it. Ace said Crystal made a mistake and that the impression that they were angry at her was sort of concocted in her own head. Crystal said: “Great, so now you think I’m delusional… I spilled some of the rice so I will go without.” Ace: “Nobody asked you to, Crystal” Crystal: “It’s not as if you saved me any anyways. You still ate it.” Ace: “I asked you 3 times.” Crystal: “If you cared enough you would have saved me some anyways.” Matty and Ace’s expression told us they couldn’t believe it but as Jeff said: “Sugar, you have this perfect seat in this Shakespearian drama. Your eyes are like saucers.” Sugar: “It sounds like such petty bullcrap to me but I think we can get passed our issues better than this and this is why we haven’t been winning…” The snake was seen during Ace’s and Matty’s vote, telling us who would get bitten. We also saw numerous glances from Sugar to Crystal and Ace. To prepare us for his isolation, we heard Matty’s vote: “Crystal, I’ve been waiting for this day for so long and I’m so happy it’s here.” As Jeff returned with the votes, we saw tears in Sugar’s eyes as she looked to Ace for what she knew were his last moments in the game. After Ace was voted off, Jeff said: “I’d say that was a blindside. 21 days in and Fang is finally starting to play this game.” Hadn’t they already made a first move last week according to Jeff’s recap? It’ll be interesting to see how this TC is spun next week, but it seemed like, except for Kenny, Fang doing what Fang is famous for and that’s making bad choices. If bullcrap was why they had been losing, shouldn’t the person presented as saying the bullcrap been the right choice? If not, why edit it in such a way to make Crystal appear that dumb? Final Segment – Kota, Day 21 late afternoon Fire ants were seen carrying a prey while Marcus walked off with Dan, telling him that he wasn’t going home since everybody was voting Susie. Dan (solo): “Now would be an optimal time to get me out as a strong player. So, this is a huge vote for me because I’m either going to come back here and trust everyone or I’m going to be at home eating a pizza.” With Bob sleeping in the hut, Marcus, Charlie and Corinne were talking with Randy who was saying: “I know I gotta trust somebody.” Corinne said: “Please trust us.” Randy agreed: “I’m trusting this group.” Marcus: “Randy’s replaced Bob in a final four situation because I think Randy is willing to cast his lot in with a good group of people and he’s found that and, as long as he keeps his end of the bargain, he’s got a great run for this game.” Randy told them that Susie was liable to jump ship, adding: “As annoying as Bob is (interesting!!) I see him as being loyal and trustworthy as the day is long.” Charlie: “Dan is super vulnerable tonight and the only thing Dan has going for him is that he should cross his fingers that Susie is gonna blow up and do some crazy stuff.” On cue, Susie was talking to Corinne. Corinne said she really liked Susie and wasn’t writing her name down. She added: “I think it’s gonna be Dan. We don’t want to take somebody that’s going to flip. I feel really good about the fact that you wouldn’t.” Susie told Corinne that she appreciated being told what the group was doing because: “I was going to vote for you.” Corinne kept a straight face in front of Susie, who was committing “social suicide” as Jeff called it, but in confessional: “So this moron decided that she’d like me to go…Really?!! I hate her… I hate her, hate her, hate her. Like I want to stab her in the face and, if you’ve p*ssed me off, you’ve p*ssed off my alliance.” Interestingly, the first person in “her alliance” that we saw Corinne telling someone about Susie was… Randy!! Randy told her she was nuts. Randy: “Susie’s game is no game. The problem with no game is her vote can be bought.” Corinne told Randy she didn’t want to go home so she asked: “Dan doesn’t have the idol, does he? What if Dan and Susie are together, Dan has the idol and they both vote Corinne.” Randy replied: “Then you’re gone.” Randy: “Susie needs to go. She’s annoying. I want her to go home and soon” Charlie, Marcus and Corinne talked it over. Corinne said: “My entire plan hinged on the fact that Susie was easy, she trusts us and she’s never going to win individual immunity so we could get rid of her whenever we want. I didn’t realize she was loco… What do you think is the safer bet because I’m a little concerned?” Marcus answered: “Thank God we have a 2 person advantage at this point. (how is he counting because I see it either 5 against 2 or 4 against 3) Dan could have the immunity idol.” Charlie’s head dropped in frustration. Marcus: “We’re worried that Dan has the immunity idol because he spent a couple of days on exile island. Dan may need to go so, unfortunately, it isn’t who is the best asset, it’s who is the least risky which stinks because we still don’t know who we are going to be better off with.” Kota’s TC featured African masks instead of snakes which could be a way to present people playing with pokerfaces rather than emotions. Marcus told Jeff they were basing their decision on what they were expecting to come in the next few days. When he mentioned that hhe wanted the most powerful people in order to survive the onslaught from Fang, we saw Dan smiling. Asked if she was the weakest, Susie said she didn’t think so because: “There are certain skills I may be weaker but… I think upper body strength, I’m stronger than Corinne.” As Jeff said, Corinne’s expression showed she wasn’t buying that at all. Corinne diplomatically said: “I don’t want to insult her, I think she is very skilled and has athletic talents.” Jeff wanted a cat fight: “She just insulted you.” Not biting, Corinne replied: “Yeah and that’s why I’m telling you that I don’t agree.” (Dan liked that!) “I have a lot to offer, I have upper body strength, I’ve got a lot of things.” Susie conceded. Jeff asked if Corinne had seen Susie letting loose. Corinne answered: “I’ve operated for so many years without a filter that I totally respect when people come out of their shell and say just whatever it is they are thinking. I would encourage more of that. Maybe you should blow up once in a while and then I’ll know you better.” Jeff asked Randy where he was regarding being himself or holding it in. (Charlie and Corinne’s smile told us they knew the answer!) Randy said: “I’m about 8 on a scale of 10 and that’s good and bad” Jeff asked what was good about it. Randy said: “I don’t have to pretend and people pretty much know where I stand most of the time.” Jeff asked what was bad, so Randy said: “I don’t have to pretend and people pretty much know where I stand most of the time.” Dan said he was worried and that prevented him from being himself. Charlie said trust was huge because: “We intend to go into the merge as a powerful group. If someone splinters, our numbers will dwindle before the Fang numbers dwindle.” Asked if this vote could be a mistake, Corinne answered: “Damn, yeah! I don’t know if I’m making the right decision. I hope that I am.” Jeff left Kota with his impression that “despite being very successful, this isn’t one big happy family.” The Characters Crystal, who was supposedly fighting for her life, was more often than not shown lying down in her hut. I haven’t seen any attempt by the editors to present her as a player and now it seems that every opportunity is used to drag her through the mud. The rice incident portrayed her in GC’s role by being told to eat. Her TC comments explained Kelly’s accusation of instability. Her end is near and letting us hear Matty expressing his rancor proved it. Susie commited social suicide in the latter part of the episode but her reward confessional reminded us that her story was already dead since it was only about visiting Africa, not playing Survivor. Bob is another “Tourist” in Africa and his reward confessional showed that once more. Not all tourist are treated equally and we are supposed to like Bob. The time spent on him reading his letter served that goal. Interesting that we heard Randy saying that Bob was annoying. What did Bob do? We haven’t seen anything but I could guess that it’s his habit of getting up in the middle of the night to work. For the second time in two councils, Bob was completely ignored by Jeff. Charlie didn’t have much to do for another episode. His expressions were used a few times to support our reactions at the events surrounding Kota’s situation but we learned nothing from him personally. Matty had finally found a way out of his miserable situation only to be pushed right back down by the new snake, Sugar. I still don’t understand Jeff’s final TC words because, by saying that Fang had finally started playing, Jeff let Matty’s story blowing in the wind. This charismatic character had started playing but, now that his life is in danger, his isolation is presented as the first positive move by Fang. Unless Matty isn’t isolated, that he somehow works his way back in the loop. Still, every episode has reinforced our impression that Matty’s role is to play the “Victim”. Ken, with a masterful lie, proved that he was a player. For the first time, his plan worked but we heard that he now trusts Sugar. After his lack of success with his previous cute allies, why would Sugar be different? Hearing him say that “We don’t have to worry about the snake ever again” is a clue that he will fall to the new snake that already expressed doubts about his honesty. Sugar, our sweetheart, suddenly becoming a snake made this episode highly enjoyable. We had seen clues that Sugar would survive the villain who claimed to have her in his pocket but it wasn’t clear that Ace would fall because of Sugar. Her confessional about following Ace because he was the one in power is perfect Game Theory strategy and we know how Burnett loves Game Theory. That opens up new perspectives to her story. Will she really turn out to be the most powerful player in Gabon? If Gabon turns out to be Sugar’s story, I don’t want to spoil it because it would simply be too incredibly pleasurable. So, that leaves our 3 contenders: Marcus still seems to have the story revolving around him. As in every previous episode, Marcus has been involved in all the moves that Kota makes. In the first segment, he told us why Dan was on the chopping block. We heard why he gave the immunity necklace to Sugar which hasn’t always been ther editor’s choice. What’s more, his confessional told us he was hoping for the big move, for the elimination of Ace even if he had “worked well with Ace” when they were together. If this season’s main theme wasn’t Good vs Evil, we could have handed Marcus the check back in episode #3. There are some hints that he doesn’t win however: - His confessionals told us that voting out Dan was “unfortunately” the thing to do. - He was presented as being careless by walking to the edge of the crater and he may have been careless in letting Randy enter his final 4 in place of the totally loyal Bob. - There’s still no doubts casted against his victory. Even the preview segment we had seen last week where Dan tried to rally votes against Marcus was dropped from the episode. Marcus winning would therefore be the story of the “Golden Boy” walking to an easy victory in the “Earth’s Last Eden”. That doesn’t sound like the biblical story I know. Randy continues to progress in this story. I had written last week that, in order to show his capacity to adapt, we’d have to see him entering into the onion alliance and, on cue, Randy took over Bob’s spot. As Jeff said, Randy was very aggressive against Fang and he antagonized Sugar. Their confrontation “should be fun” as Jeff also said. Randy also has a score to settle with Crystal and next week seems to be a little bit too much about Randy. That’s a lot of doubt in Randy’s story and he may be the next villain to fall. But Marcus having so much faith in Randy’s ability to have a great run in this game makes me think he will have a role to play in the onion’s final showdown (or peeling if you will) Corinne is finally starting to show us her b*tchy side. Her confessionals were always against other players: Dan, who she called socially inept and probably a former fatty, and Susie, who she dubbed a moron. She told us that her parents even thought she could be seen as trashy and she said that she often operated without a filter. Importantly for her chances, all those comments were presented either positively, everyone laughing at her self-deprecating revelations or they were backed by what we saw: Dan was paranoïd and Susie was extremely dumb. I found this episode to be very interesting for Corinne and to explain it, I want to bring back 4 key scenes: - When Bob burst out crying, we saw Corinne go to him so, if Marcus and Charlie had already put Bob in 5th place, Corinne may still have use for the old guy who has done everything in his life. She was the one that brought him in the alliance afterall. - When Randy said he wanted to trust a group of people, it was Corinne who said that he could trust them. We can say that she got credit for getting him in the alliance, especially since Randy was the first one she went to when she found out that Susie was loco. Could she use Bob AND Randy against Marcus and Charlie. Why not? She’s ready to get rid of anyone and own it, isn’t she? - When the onions talked about their predicament, we heard her saying that it was “MY entire plan” that was decideing the next vote because they could get rid of Susie “whenever” they wanted. Since no one was given credit for splitting the tribe’s vote, we can assume that it was also her plan to get Dan or flush the idol without any risks. Will it be a mistake? It could, because Susie could be even more tempted to flip. On the other hand, Susie may now think she’s in the tribe’s majority!! - Corinne was the star of Kota’s TC (and, just for Emy, if Kota are like ants, they should be ruled by a queen, shouldn’t they?!) We have one snake that can use her charms to lure people to their demise and maybe Corinne doesn’t become the b*tch that she claimed she would be. However, the snake was in Eden right? Fang is closer to hell than Eden, so maybe we will have another snake, one that has learned to use a filter and mask her emotions. I’m ready to see another “Golden Boy” win Survivor, I’m ready to be pleasantly surprised by a Randy win or even Sugar's but I think Corinne will be our winner.   Top

emydi 13669 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-03-08, 12:29 PM (EST) 52. "RE: Episode #7 Editing Thoughts:" Lots of animals!! The Snake is definitely now the Uthong women Sugar and to lesser degree Crystal. Again the little monkey was seen traveling through the trees when Ken and Sugar were talking about the Ace blindside. And the monkey even made a cameo appearance on the utility pole in India on TAR last nite...Ken is a world traveler!! Randy is the rising out of the water Hippo which is more dramatically set forth in the preview for this coming week. He does the Hippo growl. We again saw the RUNNING wildebeasts before going to Kotex. We see sitting animals associated with Uthong.   Top

b1whois 126 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 11-07-08, 02:04 AM (EST) 53. "episode 8 - the "twilght zone episode"" ookayyy....what was that and who where those people? some i recognized, but others where completely revamped. crystal was the major changling. i see her as having had a consistent edit through out the first 7 episodes. to quote matty from a insider clip: "Her whole attitude, her whole aura is negative..." then tonite the pages of the playbook were ripped out, crumpled and thrown away. tonite i saw crystal's edit completely disconnected from that of previous episodes. there was no continuity between tonight's cyrstal and last weeks. the glower was replaced with a glow - her whole attitude, her whole aura got a major revamp. i have heard peeps here say that there is a shift in the edit around the time of the merge but i do not ever remember seeing such a break from the previous character. and i do not like it. i feel adrift without boundries - who are these people, where are they coming from, how can we expect them to act? to a lessor degree i felt the same thing happened with suzie: from dumb, disconnected player to player with a capitol P...anyway these are my gut reactions...   Top

Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-08-08, 11:50 AM (EST) 54. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" LAST EDITED ON 11-08-08 AT 11:53 AM (EST) Well, just because I don't get in here to post too often doesn't mean I am not following along...I love you guys! Hey, I can't help but notice that this season is REFRESHING, and that there is more beneath the surface than in previous episodes. The producers are editing like mad this year and I love it. WE can narrow our options but it is far more challenging, add to the fact that we have no boot list and GAME ON! Anyway, I am noticing a clear shift in the powers that be. This season Matty has appeared as the "victim" edit, but time after time has escaped the boot, as many of our previous WINNERS have done. I am beginning to think he indeed will be an end game player. Last week in the vidcaps we had these pictures... I think the lone bird represents Matty. He is the one that has seemed the most vulnerable in his tribe, the underdog, so to speak. He managed to stay alive by his own resources, winning the IC. This taking control into his own hands, imo, could take Matty a long way perhaps. This week, with the vidcaps we have these: At the beginning of the promo you have a flock of white birds that transpose over the lone bird. I think the flock of white birds represents all of the other players in the game, and this week they will all vie for Matty's vote...I think he will be the power player this week and the swing voter. Last week or so Veruca had an interesting quote regarding Matty... Matty certainly is getting a very lovely edit with confessionals and voice overs that have him removed from the negative tinge over Fang which should bode well for him and while he is a textbook example of someone in a minority that would be deemed as a physical threat to be booted; at this time I am of the mindset he may be able to circumvent any immediate danger and it will be very interesting to see how the "promise" that was made with Ace and Matty plays out. This week her question was answered. While alot of us emotional people would think that Matty would be devastated that his alliance mate was blindsided without his knowledge and thus react in a very angry way, we see Matty adapting to the change in a very positive way. He didn't blow up at all nor did he attack Sugar or anyone else. He seems to be playing with a VERY level head. He noted that he was kind of glad that Ace left and that he didn't break his promise, and he's learned now, never to make a pact regarding his loved ones again...in other words, don't make a promise that you may have to break later. This is a very positive advancement for Matty in the game, imo. He was able to take a huge twist in his plans and spin it positively, not only with his plan with Sugar should Fang go to TC, but with his ability to outlast and ENDURE in the IC. With his win, he trumped the Randy/Corrine/Charlie plan to throw the challenge...is this foreshadowing? We heard Jiffy warn him in the challenge, don't lose focus, tune everyone out, including me...will Matty heed Jeff's advice and WIN this game? Matty had a quote at the beginning of the game. It seemed as the journey quote, but as time goes on, I see him as the lone bird, underdog, as another serious end-game player in the game of Survivor was, Ozzy. But, different than Ozzy, Matty is shown ADAPTING to the misfortune that befalls him and learning/growing from his early mistakes in the game. I am seeing Matty more and more as a very central figure now in this game. Will the lone bird, Matty, represent the lone survivor as well??? ps. GO Matty, Go!   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-09-08, 02:22 PM (EST) 55. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" LAST EDITED ON 11-09-08 AT 02:31 PM (EST) Great analysis, FP and good use of the promo vidcaps. I wish I knew how to vidcap the episode to use in my analysis. Matty has a compelling story and seeing him win would be a great outcome but, this is what I see: Recapping the story, Jeff said: “Kota won a staggering 9 out of 11 challenges against a rapidly dwindling Fang tribe… …Both tribes were sent to Tribal Council. At the Kota Tribal Council, Susie dissed Corinne and narrowly avoided getting voted out... At the Fang Tribal Council, Sugar (winking and blowing a kiss) surprised everyone by stabbing her closest ally in the back. With physical force Ace, out of the game, Fang needs a miracle to turn the game around. Note that the credit for Ace’s blindside was entirely given to Sugar. Ken’s role was completely ignored. In Kota, Susie was made to look socially inept. Kota Night 21 Randy said that the last tribal Council was not fun while the others had been easy. Susie laughed which Randy didn’t appreciate. He told her: “Think of what I say before you instantly start laughing because I’m not always trying to be funny.” Randy in confessional: “We voted Dan off… I voted Susie just in case Dan had the hidden immunity idol and he could have taken anybody he wanted out. He was my friend but he had to go.” While Corinne observed, Marcus wanted to analyze the weaknesses of the tribe since he felt “like a merge was coming in the next couple of days.” Randy wanted to do “operation clean sweep” Marcus was all for it but he told Susie she couldn’t be talking of voting Corinne out. Corinne told Susie she took note of her comments about working in camp but didn’t appreciate being called out at TC. Corinne: “Susie told me that she was voting for me based on the fact that I didn’t work around camp. Then we get to tribal and who is the weakest player in the game. (imitating Susie) “I think Corinne is weaker than me. I think I swim better than Corinne, I think I have more upper-body strength than Corinne.” The woman is 47 years old, what could she possibly have over me?” Susie: “Right now, they have me in their alliance of 6. They may think they have all the power but I’m feeling that, my vote, I have the power.” The tribe continued to make Susie look socially inept and her confessional made her look delusional, at least while still in this alliance. Fang Night 21 Insects were fighting as the tribe arrived in camp. Sugar was laughing. Sugar said to Matty: “Sorry to surprise you like that” as she raised both arms and started a victory dance. Matty (solo): “That was a textbook blindside for Ace. I am so glad that I stuck to my promise and didn’t vote him out but I’m not gonna corner myself with any pacts on my girlfriend again.” Sugar: “I trust Kenny a lot more than I trust Ace. Kenny’s completely honest with me and he told me Ace was trying to throw me under the bus so I figured I better take him out as soon as I can.” Matty said he was afraid that Crystal would be gunning for him. Crystal offered to start from a clean slate. Matty in confessional: “I’m a little concerned that Crystal is upset with me because I voted Crystal. I had no options, I couldn’t break that promise to Ace. I’m praying for a merge, I’m praying for this game to change and, if it doesn’t, I’m in deep trouble.” Fang started looking forward to the merge, Kenny saying they would be final 4 and adding: “Sugar has the immunity idol.” Sugar warned them not to tell anyone about her idol and that they were starting over. Crystal (solo): “Hopes are high right now for the current Fang members and, if there is going to be a merge, hopefully we can outwit, outplay and outlast the remaining Kota members so we can go as far as possible.” Matty told them: “You guys are all Survivors” which got Sugar to respond with a “Welcome to the game!” Kota Day 22 Dangerous reptiles lurked as Corinne and Marcus went to pick up tree mail. Corinne was still upset with Susie. Corinne (solo): “After what Susie said at last night’s Tribal, I plan on burying her as soon as possible…alive. I’m an extremely vindictive person and I will get my revenge.” Corinne and Marcus did a little production for their tribe as they read tree mail. It ended with Corinne doing another happy dance. Randy: “Tree mail’s got merge written all over it. It’s talking about a feast, it’s talking about fun and, most importantly, it’s talking about moving to the beach. New tribe of the 10 of us remaining, Kota 6 to the end. Fang 4 goodbye.” (Susie was shown standing away from the group and she didn’t look happy) The Feast Matty and Corinne were first to comment on the spread and were first to hug. Matty: “My heart was pounding because I couldn’t tell you the feeling of seeing an endless amount of food, it was soooo nice…” Matty read the message about opening the box after the feast. Randy: “There is a big box that says do not open until after everybody’s done eating… I don’t know what’s in the box. I know, whatever it is, it ends the fun and starts the game play again and I am gonna prolong that as much as I can.” Ken saw a note under a plate. He whispered to Matty: “I see the clue for immunity.” Ken (solo): “I saw the hidden immunity idol note on the table and the note was more tempting than the food. I tried to read it to see what it was but, by then, Charlie had already reached over and started reading it too. I read it and it said you could either share it or keep it to yourself. I wanted to keep it to myself but then, OK! I guess my cover is blown. Damnit, damnit! There was my chance to find an immunity idol for myself and Charlie blew it for me.” Marcus read the clue out loud and Randy figured it immediately. Marcus: “It occurred to me that if everyone was going to act so casual about not really wanting an immunity idol that’s hidden just a few feet away from the table then, fine, I’ll call all of your bluffs and I’ll force you to get rid of it.” Randy said they should find it and set it asail. Corinne agreed. Marcus went on: “Randy caught my drift immediately and became the champion of this idea.” Randy (solo): “I didn’t even need to see a note. I knew the weird shaped tree on the beach was significant it was like pointing into the sand and it seemed obvious. I’m sorry if I’m sounding arrogant but it was a joke. I gave myself 20 seconds and it took me 7. I am King of Gabon.” Randy put it on the table saying he didn’t want it but if anyone wanted it, they could have it. Ken said: “If you touch that, it’s game over for you.” Ken: “Immunity, the most important thing in the game but if I were to take it, I’d look like a snake. I can’t take that chance.” Sugar asked: “Do you want the apple, Matty?” The cymbals crashed as Matty took a step back and asked Crystal if she wanted it. Crystal: “I wanted that immunity idol. I’m not going to sit here and lie. I wanted that immunity idol because that’s pretty much your protection in the game. Matty (solo): “That idol represented the apple in Eden. If you grabbed that idol, you were biting into that apple and you’d be exiled from Eden and nobody wants to be thrown out of Eden.” The tribe went to the ocean, Randy carrying the idol wrapped around a bottle. Randy: “I’m the King of Gabon. Sorry, but I rule. This ocean, it’s mine. All those Fang and Kota members work for me. I’m king! Cheers!” After throwing the idol out to see, Marcus had a confessional: “These people are too stupid. I got 10 people to throw out an immunity idol in the ocean. It’s never been done. It was a perfect way to make the situation easier for the Kota 6 to gain control of the game because there’s no extra idol floating around to screw up any votes.” Sugar: “Throwing out the idol to sea, it was a beautiful, lovely thought and everything but it’s a very prized possession in this game. Luckily, I have one.” They proceeded to open the box which contained instructions to pick rocks and divide into new tribes. Charlie (solo) : “I thought there was going to be 10 new buffs in the box and we’d be a merged tribe. I would have never, in a million years, predicted this.” Sugar: (solo) “Not again, damn.” Wearing his new buff, Randy gave us the new line-ups, adding: “Charlie, Corinne and myself have a deal so we are safe. I am worried about Marcus. I just don’t trust Susie. Susie is crazy, Susie is stupid and that’s just a horrible combination.” Marcus: “We got lucky and there is a majority of the Kota 6 in each of the 2 tribes. I don’t need the immunity idol. I have great relationships in this game and that is, honestly, what I am banking on. I know that, at the end of the day, no immunity idol gets me to the finals.” Susie: “I feel like I have a lot more power right now because I can, if I want to, swing with Kenny and Crystal and take the power away from Marcus and Bob.” Crystal: “I’m still the enemy eventhough I have a yellow bandana. I don’t feel very hopeful right now as far as me lasting in this game.” Kota Day 22 We see that the Fang snake has migrated to the Kota tribe. Kenny and Crystal are impressed with the accomodations. Marcus was welcoming everyone, telling them they needed to stay out of the council. Ken gave us his thoughts: “Everybody thought it was gonna be the merge but now, I’m Kota. Over here, all I have is Crystal. I feel like I don’t have the numbers so I feel like I could be the next to go but, hopefully that’s not the case.” Crystal realized that Marcus knew her cousin who was his best friend. Bob made the “small world” comment. Marcus: “…It’s a really strange situation. I feel a little torn. I’m in a situation where I calculated voting her out… I don’t know if that’s still the case.” Marcus told Crystal he wanted to keep good people around. Crystal said: “That’s how I am and I think that was Kenny’s concern too.” Marcus added: “Crystal is really a cool girl. This is a person I can be upfront with, this is a person I can talk to. So, this is me crumbling up my playbook and throwing it out the window.” Crystal gave him her word: “In the unlikely event we have to go to tribal, I’m not writing your name down, I’m not writing Kenny’s name down, I’m not writing Bob’s name down.” Crystal wasn’t being honest: “Marcus and I now have a link and, hopefully, I can use that link to my advantage. But me, telling Marcus that I won’t write his name down, that’s me playing the game because I also told Ace I wouldn’t write his name down and Ace got blindsided.” (Very interesting new information) Fang Day 22 The elephants stayed at the Fang camp. Charlie: “The Kota 6, before the switch-up, decided that we were all going to stick together going into the hypothetical merge. But now, we have been split up into 2 tribes. The Kota 6, luckily, we’re up 3-2 in both tribes so we can still execute our plan and stay together. I need to make sure that, here in Fang, Corinne, Randy and I stick together.” Charlie went to the pier with Corinne, worried that Randy would spill things to Matty or that Sugar had the idol and that Randy wouldn’t want to get rid of Matty before Sugar. Corinne explained her plan: “We can tell Matty we are voting for Sugar, we tell Sugar we are voting for Matty so, if Sugar has the idol, Matty goes.” Corinne (solo): “If we go to tribal, I would vote for Matty. He doesn’t have the immunity idol and he’s too much of a threat for me in individual immunity and he’s threatening to Marcus and Marcus is my alliance. So, he will go home as soon as we vote.” Randy told Matty that Charlie was “awesome, my first gay friend” and Corinne is “cool too.” Matty (solo): “Randy is a great dude. I love having him around but I don’t trust him. He went to Kota, he found a home at Kota and that’s his new family.” The Star of David made a new appearance over the African set of Survivor as Matty appeared on our screen. We know what that Star meant for Ethan. Does it have the same meaning for Matty? Matty told Sugar he wasn’t unpleased that Ace was voted out but he was upset that she “went along with Crystal like that.” He told her that Ace was covering her the whole time. Sugar realized Kenny hadn’t been honest with her. Sugar: “I think Kenny and Crystal duped me. I feel awful that I got rid of Ace. I think I may have made a big mistake and I feel really bad.” Matty told Sugar that they had to work together: “If I hear you’re going to be voted out, I’ll tell you and you gotta use the idol. If you hear I’m going out, you have to tell me so I can try to maneuver something.” He learned from Ace’s mistake and didn’t ask for her idol Matty: “Me and Sugar have each other’s back. Sugar has the idol so I think we can help each other.” Kota Day 23 Susie and Crystal were out collecting wood as Marcus and Bob spoke about their situation. Marcus: “Bob gives me a lot of confidence that he’s not going to budge on the situation but Susie always made me a bit nervous. I think, given the opportunity, she’d sell me down the river in a second… Susie’s in the middle, spinning around in circles, playing dizzy bat, and where is she going to stop, I have no idea.” Susie asked Marcus: “We can make it to the top 6, that’s our goal, right? But then, where does that put me? I’m always gonna be 6. I need to be in the top 3.” Susie: “Marcus is basically the king but I have the power right now to just cut his head off. If I do switch, it’s his own fault because he didn’t give me a clear statement.” As she said that, Marcus was seen with his head down, effectively not giving Susie any reassurances. Fang Day 24 Matty and Sugar went to collect tree mail. Corinne, Charlie and Randy were in the hut, Corinne saying: “My only concern is that crazy b*tch Susie could flip to get rid of Bob or Marcus.” Randy responded: “I was thinking of losing and get rid of Matty. That is a ‘save Marcus’ move more than anything and then, it doesn’t matter what crazy Susie does.” Corinne (solo): “I was really pleased with the conversation I had with Randy this morning regarding Matty. Because we have to get rid of him first if we have to go to tribal and he is on board. 100%” Randy: “There is a 1 in a billion chances that Sugar is like a rocket scientist and she is hiding the idol.” (Matty and Sugar were once more shown walking alone in the empty vastness of Eden!) At the challenge, Jeff asked Marcus how he felt about not being in complete control Corinne told him the new pronunciation of Fang while Matty said he just wanted to get out of the ghetto, no matter how it’s called. Jeff pointed out that someone would be the hero. It wouldn’t be Crystal or Sugar, the first two out. When it was down to Matty and Bob, Matty started taunting Bob. Jeff warned him: “Don’t get foolish, don’t lose your concentration. Don’t listen to anybody, including me… Matty is gonna be laughing his way right to tribal council. That pole is right on the edge. You need to stop jabbering and start concentrating… Matty, flirting with disaster.” As Jeff said: “Matty, single-handedly, wins immunity for the Fong tribe…” Corinne corrected him with a smile: “It’s Fang.” Jeff conceded with a “Don’t forget your flag, Fang” Randy who has been getting the bulk of the post challenge confessionals: “It’s good to win but it really didn’t matter. In fact, if we had lost, I am absolutely sure that Matty would have been going home.” Matty: “I’m pretty happy with myself that I managed to pull that off. Now, the curiosity is killing me what’s going to happen in Kota. It’s totally up in the air.” As Kota left, Susie told us: “I would like to see either Kenny or Crystal going home. The big question for me is; can I get to the final 3 by trusting Marcus? We’ll see where that’ll get me. I have to get to that top 3, I have to.” Kota Marcus in confessional: “We just got back from our first challenge as Kota part 3 and it was less than an ideal result… Unfortunately, it’s going to be either Kenny or Crystal. I would like it to be Kenny because I have a good relationship with Crystal at this point.” Marcus told Crystal that Kenny should leave and THEN they would be good and would let Susie go next. Marcus said: “Ken the first round, Susie the next round.” Crystal responded: “Marcus and I have a solid relationship but when you start talking about knocking off my #1 ally just so you can get further in the game, I am not pleased, at all. Marcus is playing the nice guy but he is a schemer. I am playing the nice girl, liar AND schemer. The game is outwit, outlast. You can’t outwit Crystal Cox, baby.” Marcus then talked to Susie, telling her that Crystal was the least threatening because she couldn’t outrun, outswim or outbalance anyone, adding “You beat her, she’s atrocious in challenges.” Susie: “Marcus has a lot of control over who should be voted off and Bob is just going to follow what he says. I feel safer at this point to stay with Marcus on which way we are going to vote. I feel I can use Marcus to get to the top three and then I have a chance at least at 1” Kenny learned from Crystal that Marcus was targeting him. Crystal: “Kenny, being safe tonight, is riding 100% on Sue…” Crystal talked with Susie, telling her they could write Marcus’ name. Susie believed Marcus was getting her to the final 3 but Crystal replied: “Marcus promised you final 3? He can’t promise that… Randy doesn’t like you, Corinne doesn’t like you, he can’t promise final 3.” Susie: “I don’t feel super comfortable if I was to vote with Crystal and Kenny and vote out Marcus because I don’t know if Crystal and Kenny can help me get to the top 3… I have a huge decision to make tonight… I don’t know how I feel right now. It’s scary and that’s the truth.” Tribal Council Jeff asked Crystal what Kota was like. Crystal said: “Kota is like corporate espionage where you wear the suit but what’s going on in your head. At Fang, it’s like the projects, we need some rice, we’re angry, let’s go to war while over there, I wear my suit.” Bob said that his last voting decision was based on a merge being imminent and that he made a mistake. Asked if he would have voted differently, Bob said: “Had I known it was going to go this way, yes, I might have done something different. Susie didn’t look very pleased to hear that. To add to Susie’s displeasure, Marcus said: “I think it’s important to keep the tribe physically strong and ready for challenges.” To Susie’s delight, Kenny objected: “I think this is total BS what he said in his mouth. He’s definitely looking for a merge around the corner and have the numbers to take out Fang.” Asked if it was an easy decision for her, Susie said: “I’ve made my decision.” Her last words contradicted her final confessional so we are left to wonder what was the intent of presenting it this way. Did the editors want the viewers to think that Marcus didn’t stand a chance with this twist? Did they want us to think he fumbled the ball with his answers at Tribal? To a smiling Crystal, Jeff concluded the council by saying: “Just when you think you are in control of this game: Blindside.” (Now, was he talking past or future tense?!) The characters Bob, despite his role at the challenge, was relegated to a secondary role once more. We didn’t see him once talking to Susie even if he could have influenced her more than Marcus. His first ever intervention at Tribal Council wasn’t much better. Hearing him say that his vote at the previous council was a mistake helped Susie decide to vote against Marcus. At least, that’s what the camera led us to believe. Susie spoke of reaching the final 3 to have a chance to win. She played a big role in turning the game around. Is this the start of a growing arc for our “Tourist”? Remember that Susie was presented negatively in the recap, that she thought she had power even when she was still with Kota 6. The intent seemed more to make her look delusional rather than an underdog. In an episode where we heard Sugar realize that she had been duped by Crystal and Kenny, Susie’s hesitations made her look like a tool rather than an emerging force in this game. Charlie is limited to the role of narrator. He voiced the players’ surprise at the message in the box and he told us what his alliance needed to do. There wasn’t any personal insight into his own story. Kenny is the little guy who has mowed down 2 major forces in the game but he hasn’t received much credit from the editors. His role in voting out Ace was ignored in the recap and in the original scene. We heard him confidently making a Final 4 deal with Crystal, Matty and Sugar but we had no confessionals from him to explain how that could happen. It was therefore more boasting that planning. We saw his frustration when he missed an opportunity to get the immunity idol. We even heard that “Charlie blew it for me” which could foreshadow what happens when Kenny tries to make a move after the merge. Jeff said that Fang needed a miracle to turn the game around but a miracle didn’t seem to be enough for Ken: “I feel like I could be the next to go but, hopefully that’s not the case.” That short confessional didn’t make him sound like a good strategist since he could only hope. We also had evidence that he was unaware of what was going on when Crystal told him that he was a target. As Crystal said: “Kenny, being safe tonight, is riding 100% on Sue”, not on Ken himself. There is enough in Ken’s story to make viewers appreciate his fighting attitude but the editors don’t reinforce his story. Instead, he continues to be put down. His edit is typical of the last player standing in a dying tribe. The question is; which tribe?! I’m guessing that it’s reduced to his trio with Crystal and Susie. Crystal was much more active in a week when Kenny’s life was on the line than last week when we saw her constantly lying down in the hut when her life was threatened. It can give the impression that she’s an opportunistic player, seizing on a surprise connection with Marcus to change the game around. Unfortunately, opportunities like that don’t present themselves very often. Was this turn of events enough to make her a force in the game? From a game perspective, maybe. From an editing perspective, I don’t see it. Letting us hear Marcus saying he was ready to change his playbook to include Crystal and immediately following that by Crystal saying she was playing Marcus, showed that she missed an opportunity just as much as she seized one. More importantly, it contributed to define Marcus’ role as the “Victim”, a player treated unfairly by events and opponents. Voting out “Victims” isn’t the role of winners but of “Villains”. Less we are to see a new Crystal, the snake followed her to Kota. telling us that she is still in the camp of the evil ones. For that, it was interesting to hear that she had given her word to Ace, saying she wouldn’t write his name down. In a game of trust, we were reminded that Crystal isn’t to be trusted. Another interesting point is that Crystal had a confessional regretting the sacrifice of the idol. She said it was her protection in the game but we know that, like Marcus said, “no idol can bring (someone) to the finals.” I think someone will outwit Crystal Cox, baby. As Jeff said: “Just when you think you are in control of this game: Blindside.” She seemed to take it as a compliment but I heard it as a warning. Sugar started the episode on the side of evil, rejoicing at the elimination of her closest ally. With the realignement of the tribes, she was given an opportunity at redemption. Admitting her mistake and saying she was sorry for what she did to Ace sounded like asking forgiveness for her sins. No doubt that many viewers granted her wish. The editors continue to give us hints that Sugar has a chance at winning. Adding to Jeff’s comments in previous episodes that were directed at her: “You have to dig deep” “Be a Hero”, etc… we now had Matty saying: “You guys are Survivor”. It was addressed at all the Fangs but the editors gave the nod to Sugar since she was on screen at the time and she had the reply: “Welcome to the game.” Randy is underestimating her, thinking she couldn’t be hiding the idol. Also, the way the camera framed her and Matty during their walk in the African savanna showed which pair was really our “Adam and Eve”. If Sugar has a future, we have to remember she was also used to underline the players’ surprise at the twist and the sacrifice of the idol. Having an idol in pocket, did we need to hear her displeasure at throwing the idol away? Sugar still looks like a player trying to figure out how to play the game rather than a winner. Matty traded his “Victim” edit to Marcus for his role as “Adam” or so we were meant to believe by the “miracle” that happened. Matty always had a great edit which is trademark for “Victims”. We have to feel their pain and know that they don’t stand a chance, so we can hope beyond hope. Matty was always separated from the goof tribe in “Fong” so now the viewers can hope he’ll thrive in Fang. As FP noted, the editors chose a strong image to portray Matty as the lone white bird. The “Star of David” had accompanied Ethan’s journey as “Jesus” in Africa and now, it made an appearance during Matty’s journey as “Adam”. Hints that he’s the victor or simply teasers? To answer that, we have to look at his highlites in the episode: Matty continued his “Good Guy” role when he calmly talked about the Ace vote. He learned not to make deals that he’ll have to break later on. We saw and tasted the feast through his eyes. He resisted Sugar-Eve’s temptation of grabbing the idol and we heard him say: “That idol represented the apple in Eden. If you grabbed that idol, you were biting into that apple and you’d be exiled from Eden and nobody wants to be thrown out of Eden.” He doesn’t trust Randy even if he likes him. He made a deal with Sugar, so they can watch out for each other. He won the challenge singlehandedly for Fang and he wanted to know what was going to happen in Kota. We still see the same Matty. The one that unselfishly helped his tribe up the hill in the first challenge. Whereas Marcus had no doubts surrounding his journey in Paradise, Matty has always been forced to fight against impossible odds. Matty wished for a miracle to get out of trouble. He was granted reprieve only to be thrown with the biggest strategists in the game. Matty is still trapped in the present, having to rely on Sugar’s idol instead of making inroads with the New Fang members. Having learned not to make deals he’ll want to break, he could fall because of a deal he’ll want to keep. A player that suddenly becomes very attractive as winner in the middle of the season is usually just to tease the viewers. (Using the “Star of David” would make this tease particularly evil but he is EPMB isn’t he?) So, maybe more by stubborness than science, I am now left with 2 contenders: Randy had a huge episode and before analyzing it, I want to attract your attention at my impressions of the last time Survivor tricked players at the merge. It was in Fiji and the players had just returned from Exile Island to find a barren Moto, the luxury camp gone: “It was the original Moto players and Mookie that we heard expressing their surprise and displeasure. They were not portrayed as Survivors. We didn’t see Yau Man’s reaction while Earl said: “This is real Survivor. We have a cave…We already have been trained for this. We had…Nothing. I felt OK with that. I kinda laughed, I had a smirk on my face. I’ve already been trained. Being at the old Ravu for 13 days. Hey! I’m just back home again.” Later he added: “There’s a core group. There’s a tribe within a tribe and the tribe within the tribe is myself, Michelle, Cassandra and Yau. Now, it’s just divide and conquer. We gotta divide the old Moto. We gotta get them one by one, we gotta knock’em out.” This time, which players reacted negatively to the twist? Charlie, Sugar, Ken, Crystal and Matty expressed their surprise and displeasure about the idol being thrown out or about the new tribe division. There are some similarities between Randy’s and Earl’s confessionals. Both “kings” laughed at the situation and both described their core alliance within the tribe. Later on both worried about an ally that had been left out to dry. Randy worried about Marcus while Earl was troubled when Michelle had to go to TC. From the start, we had placed Randy on the side of evil but that isn’t how he is edited. For now, we are meant to see him through Matty’s eyes: “Randy is a great dude. I love having him around”. Even the Onions thought he was better to have around than the annoying Bob. Sure, Randy can’t be trusted and he got rid of one of his friends but this is Survivor and allies are more important than friends to Randy. His arrogance would be difficult to accept in a winner but he wouldn’t be the first arrogant winner… or the worst! Alas, I think that the allusion to being “King of Gabon” is another tease, a wink in the direction of Earl. That leaves Corinne who is stepping up her role as the b*tch but she’s presented as a cool girl by Randy. Normally, when someone says what Corinne said about Susie, you would expect that Susie would outlast Corinne but I don’t think that will happen this time. Jeff reminded us that Susie dissed Corinne before we heard all the vindictiveness come out. We also had Susie described as crazy and a “dizzy bat” by Randy and Marcus. Corinne’s anger was kept for her confessionals because, in camp, she’s still the clinical player who puts her mask on to deal with the 47 year old woman, who plans ahead with Randy, and tells Charlie how to flush out the idol. After showing once more her enthusiasm for the game when she read tree mail, Corinne remained on the periphery of the action at the feast rather than expressing her surprise. If the portrayal of the players indeed parallel the choices made in Fiji, that bodes well for Corinne. The first hug we saw at that feast was between Matty and Corinne and now, despite her talks of getting Matty out, she will need Matty to replace Marcus. We will know after the next episode if Corinne is indeed the “Clinical Player”.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-15-08, 04:38 PM (EST) 56. "Episode #9 Editing Thoughts:" For the first time, Jeff noted during the recap that some of the Kotas (Randy savoring his pastry) have not been gracious winners. We heard Crystal saying: “Randy, to me, he’s a troll.” “On day 22, both tribes shared a feast where Charlie robbed (?) Kenny of a clue to a hidden immunity idol.” We had a repeat of Kenny’s “Charlie blew it for me.” We saw Marcus convincing “everyone to toss it away.” Kenny on screen as Marcus was heard saying: “These people are so stupid…” “At the end of the feast, the tribes were reshuffled… Crystal and Kenny were swapped to the yellow tribe were they were outnumbered but not outplayed. Cleverly, they convinced Susie to take out Marcus. In one swift move, Kenny and Crystal had knocked out one of their biggest rivals. After enduring 24 days of grief, life is looking pretty good for the underdogs.” Why the use of the word “robbed” for Charlie? Wasn’t the clue left there for everyone? Why no mention that Susie had been with Fang originally and didn’t need that much convincing? So now, Jeff’s taking OldFang’s side?! Kota Night 24 Bob walked in alone while Crystal and Susie hug. Kenny in confessional: “Tonight was a huge night for me because it could have been me. I’ve been under the radar at Fang in the beginning… but the last two tribals have been blindsides because of me… The next one to go is Bob, so Bob should be worried.” After saying that he knows he’s toast Bob had a confessional: “If I’m to last, I need a merge. If we’re not in a merge, I think I’m history… even if I teach science(!)” Last week, the blindside had been said to depend 100% on Susie yet no mention was made this week of her role. That tells us that Susie already had her 15 minutes of glory. Fang Day 25 Preparing us for the outcome of the upcoming immunity challenge, we saw Matty unable to make fire at Fang. Matty (solo): “25 days and we can’t even make fire… I’m hoping for a merge. The longer I stay on this tribe, the closer I am to going home.” After Charlie read treemail, Corinne had a confessional: “I was really hoping it was going to be merge… so that I could see Marcus again. The Kota alliance, from the get-go was me, Charlie and Marcus. So long as that’s intact, I don’t care who goes home.” Arriving at the challenge, Jeff noted her reaction when she realized Marcus was gone. Sugar had an equaly shocked reaction while Matty was smiling from ear to ear. Matty winked at Kenny has Kota stepped on their mat. Corinne said: “I’m pissed, yes, he didn’t deserve to leave the game.” Kenny replied: “Then who does?” Susie adding: “It’s a game, we all deserve it.” Charlie answered: “I know it’s a game but I’m sad. I think a lot of people here complain a lot (Crystal on screen) Marcus never did that. He enjoyed every second out here.” Kenny pushed his point: “I don’t understand why he didn’t deserve to leave the game.” Corinne ended it by saying: “It’s not that anyone deserves it, it’s just that he earned to stay longer, I guess.” The Challenge Sling-shot Golf looked fun for everyone except Sugar who only played the caddie. The only notable event was Matty and Randy disagreeing vehemently on the right putting technique! (I wonder if Jeff was auditioning to be a CBS analyst at the next Masters) Corinne told Jeff that they were sending Bob to exile Island: “I know he can find the idol and I wish him the best of luck.” Sugar in confessional: “Bob’s never going to find that idol because nobody has it but me… The only 3 people that know are Matty, Kenny and Crystal.” No mention that Bob could find out she has it. If she didn’t realize it, that means she wasn’t thinking ahead. If she did realize it but it was cut out, that means the editors want us to see her surprise later on. Either way, it's not a good sign for her. Matty (solo): “That was the most anxiety ridden challenge I’ve had in this whole competition. I had like 3 or 4 heart attacks.” Randy: “I don’t know what got over Matty because what he pulled was ugly. He would not listen, it was like the outer-limits.” The only ugliness we were allowed to see came from Randy. The Reward Matty told us: “Arriving to this African village, it was a surreal feeling. I am the only Fang member that has been trapped there from the beginning. To finally get a reward, the man upstairs was looking out because I needed it.” Everyone enjoyed a ceremonial bath while Corinne said: “All we were thinking was food but instead they started beating us with leaves that are covered in water and stripping our clothes off of us to wash us down. You felt like a human being again. It was nice. Then, we went to the next tribal ceremony and this little girl, she was very, very cute but she was too small to follow everybody around so I paid her a little attention and then she was glued to me. It was very cute but I’d be the last person people would think would chum up to a 2 year old.” Matty said he was glad Marcus was gone which led Charlie to comment that 3 power players had left in succession. Charlie told us how bad he felt that Marcus was gone. He ended by saying: “With him gone, who do we turn to because he did a lot of thinking for us.” They started dancing which gave us Randy’s amusing comment: “The dancers were great. I have a feeling that one of them liked me. I haven’t had a girl come on to me in about 20 years. I hate to dance… my feet hurt but hell, I danced with her.” Matty: “I don’t know what came in to me but I was feeling it… It was like the two cultures colliding with their styles of dance. It was so cool. I might be voted out next but I needed a break from the game and it gave me the relief that I needed desperately.” Kota, Day 26 Ken was having trouble with the pirogue: “Oh! No, not stuck again.” With special effects and funny music, we saw him turning around the piece of wood that had him trapped. “All I’m doing is running around in circles like an idiot.” In confessional, he told us: “I’m not an outdoors type of guy. At home, I play video games but I’m feeling like I’m getting to know how to play this game… I’m the only man at Kota with 2 very beautiful woman. Who would have thought the littlest guy in this game would be the provider? I’m very proud of what I’ve done in this game and, if people want to take me out, I will take them out before, anyway I can. I know for a fact that I can win this game.” Exile Island Bob had an interesting story: “I went for the clue and that’s a very clear choice for me because I’m in deep doodoo back at camp” Arriving at the end of the search, Bob realized: “This would be the perfect location… I am very frustrated. Maybe Sugar found the idol… but I gotta do something. My plan is to make something that looks like an idol… I have an idol that could potentially threaten someone in the tribe…If they think you have a gun, they might leave you alone.” The clip ended on a close-up of the fake idol which looked better than all the real ones! The focus put on it leads me to believe that it will come into play somehow. Fang Day 27 Randy read treemail which lead Charlie to comment: “It’s individual.” Matty told everyone to shut up since they didn’t know what was coming. He went on to say that Crystal, Susie and Kenny couldn’t start fires. Randy agreed that Crystal would need matches and gasoline to start a fire. Randy (solo): “We don’t know if it’s tribe versus tribe or individual immunity but, if there’s a merge and I see Crystal again, I’ll puke.” He compared her to sasquatch and T-Rex which made Charlie and Corinne smile. Randy added: “I’ve hated Crystal from the beginning, everybody knows that. She made her bed in the old Fang and I still hold a major grudge.” The Challenge : With news of the merge, Bob had a confessional: “The merge is a new lease on life for me… I’m the luckiest guy in Gabon.” During the challenge, Jeff underlined how Bob was “really trying to get something started”, how “Randy’s just starting over” and “Matty with a little injury, making no progress at all.” (sign that he will hurt himself in this game?) Matty was the one on screen as Jeff mentioned: “Nobody else even in it.” With Sugar as her only rival, Susie won immunity but no one commented and she had no confessional to express her happiness at showing everyone what she could do. Randy, again, had the post challenge confessional: “Finally we merged… but I hated Fang from the beginning. There’s no way I’m coming back to camp tonight with Crystal. She’ll be gone or I’ll be gone.” Final Segment Matty (solo): “The merge totally changed the game…but as soon as that little, brief gratitude session ended, people bounced into the jungle and started their strategy.” We saw Corinne heading out with Sugar and Randy joining Charlie, telling him Crystal was the way to go. Charlie had a confessional telling us that Sugar was in the middle, adding: “Sugar has ties to both sides. Sugar has a mind of her own and is playing the game differently than all of us.” Charlie told Randy it was “a war for Sugar” while the camera showed Susie serving Sugar some tea. It told us how this battle would be won! Sugar told Corinne: “I can’t live with him anymore, Randy, I can’t live with him.” Corinne answered: “I feel you on this but I feel we could be shooting ourselves in the foot. After this vote, we would be even… We could get rid of him on the next vote.” Charlie walked in, saying they needed Randy. Corinne ended: “I care about your opinion. I’ll do what you want to do.” Corinne (solo): “My whole plan is to stay on Sugar because she is the swing vote. Not only do I have to look interested in what Sugar has to say but I have to look like I care. Sugar is so weak and naïve and gullible. I’ve been nasty to her for 25 days, I was nice to her 1 day and she’s sold. It doesn’t even makes sense but she buys it. She’s such a moron.” Susie was telling Matty that Charlie and Corinne were the alliance that had to be broken. After saying that she and Ken “we’re home” Crystal agreed. Susie added that Corinne was hurtling herself with her own personality. Matty understood that: “Yeah! She’s horrendous. I can’t handle her, she’s awful.” Susie laughed and gave him a high five! Ken made his move: “We got to blindside Charlie because he’s the brains behind everything.” (the title quote of the episode) Kenny had a confessional to explain: “I have a personal grudge against Charlie. At that feast, freaking Charlie took that paper and he made me share with everybody. I could have gotten an immunity idol and no one would have known, but no. So I made up this little lie: I said Charlie is behind the scene of Kota, he’s telling people what to do. I made it up and everybody listened to me. I’ll trade that idol for his life, serves him right. I’m the little rat that goes gna-gna-gna-gna in the corner and nobody knows that. You mess with me and you’re gone in this game.” Kenny raced off to sell his lie to Sugar. Sugar: “I think I’m the lady of the hour because everybody’s telling me who to vote for.” (the Star of David reappeared during a break in this confessional.) “The thing is that I don’t trust Kenny. He lied to me about Ace, so he could be some evil mastermind. I don’t trust Crystal at all. I certainly don’t have any alligience to Randy and Corinne. I guess I don’t trust any of these guys. Eventhough we’re one tribe, there’s definitely two sides to this tribe. Both sides of this blue tribe want my vote. I have no clue what to do but I don’t owe anything to anybody at all.” Nobag’s first Tribal Council (what an awful name, thanks Kenny) Jeff started with Randy’s outburst at the reward challenge” Randy said: “If everybody would have shut up and listened to what I was saying (Sugar didn’t like that) I had a shot that would have made it 10 times out of 10.” Chalie said he tried to calm both of them down, that they needed better communication. Randy agreed that he didn’t miss the old Fang which got Crystal to interject: “Since we’re putting stuff out, why do you have issues with me?” Randy asked: “Do you want a list?” We saw that this exchange made Sugar and Corinne uneasy. Randy: “The first 9 days of this game, you made Fang a living hell. You and your boy GC, you and your possee were running it like it was a gang. You were arrogant, you were hard to get along with. You were causing the division in our tribe and were the reason we lost all those times… Do you want more?” Crystal said she didn’t regret showing any of her emotions. Jeff asked Charlie (!) if he’d be concerned if he was Randy and Crystal. Charlie answered that “ saying something just to get it off your chest, that doesn’t make sense. I think you need to process what comes out of your mouth.” Kenny said his opinion of Charlie (!) changed: “Just talking to him, I know he’s a nice guy.” Charlie said he thought “Kenny was a great guy when I met him.” Randy said that Kenny changed: “He’s not a little kid anymore.” Sugar was asked if going to exile helped since she didn’t get to irritate people. She answered smartly: “I wouldn’t annoy everybody, I don’t hurt people’s feelings and I don’t talk crap about people behind their backs.” (Corinne and Kenny shown on screen!) Besides the players getting votes, the camera focused on Corinne and Sugar as Jeff read the results. Corinne started off smiling but ended in anguish while Sugar cried all along. Finally, Bob was shown equally disturbed while Kenny and Crystal smiled. Jeff concluded the episode by saying that “it should make for a crazy finish.” The characters Susie probably had the worst episode I can recall. For someone that was responsible for the biggest move so far in the game and was a most surprising challenge winner, she didn’t get a single confessional. It proves that she’s already returned to the insignificance that was her story in the first 7 episodes. Crystal jumps into the mess without any prompting. It was at least the third time that she picked a fight at Tribal even if Jeff wasn’t addressing her directly. Even in her shining moments, she is portrayed as a hot head when dealing with others. Outside of her poor TC display, Crystal Cox had very little impact in this episode. For someone who had finally received the “underdog” tag in the recap, it was like an aborted story. Kenny had a weird episode. Even if it was the time to show how this gamer indeed has game, we saw a completely unnecessary display of boating disaster. It was also quite unnecessary to give us Kenny’s petty reason for eliminating “Freaking Charlie”. It actually turned an insignificant player into a “Victim”. Charlie’s portrayal of peacekeeper, both in the challenge and at TC, reinforced Kenny’s evil mastermind status. Kenny, even if he believes otherwise and has some supporters, will not win this game. There has been too many snakes around for a rat to survive! Bob finally had an interesting episode even if once more his interventions at TC weren’t shown. The way the camera showed us his great artwork leads me to believe that the fake idol will come into play this time again. I don’t know if it will create another funny scene like “It’s just a stick” but it could have more impact in the game. Bob himself however, still has no storyline that looks into the end game, no reflexion of what he needs to do to get further down the line and no mention of what the others think of him and his jury appeal. Randy must be taken out of contention after this episode. Being first shown as an ungracious winner in the recap (where Jeff’s own role in that display was ignored) was very damning. His outburst at the reward may have been prompted by something ugly Matty did but we weren’t shown what that could have been. If Randy was our winner, we would have heard his rant against Crystal at TC but it would have been amputated of the “You and your boy GC… you and your possee were running it like it was a gang” sentence. That makes Randy someone that would be very tempting to drag along to the end… if Sugar can find a way to live with him! Randy could go next but I feel that he will lose the jury vote. Sugar was indeed the girl of the hour. Why did the editors kill Kenny’s chances? In other words, why was Kenny’s story killed by letting us hear that he lied about Charlie? So that we understand why Sugar finally turns against him. Her confessional about not trusting Kenny but having no alligience to Randy and Corinne had a seminal aspect to it. The war for Sugar isn’t over! Can she navigate her way to a win? It would make for a fun ride and winning would certainly be playing this game like nobody else. However, Sugar still looks like the one through which the events will occur, not the one that will profit from them. That was Eve’s story, wasn’t it? How I wish I hadn’t been fooled by Matty’s early confessionals about being hopeless and being doomed! I confidently gave him the role of a “Victim” in this story when he could actually be our winner. Last week, he traded his “victim” role to Marcus for what appears to be the “Leading Man” role. Matty has always been our connection to Gabon, from his first confessional, to his encounter with the elephant, his remark about not taking the apple and finally to his great confessional during the reward challenge. He has also often been shown like a good team player and seeing him hugging Randy after their win, even if Randy hadn’t cooled down yet, was another proof of that. Since I didn’t have him on my list of contenders, I can’t very well include him at this late date but I can still cheer for a Matty win! His story is the big story of Survivor Gabon, even eclipsing Sugar’s sweetheart story. Big stories don’t always equate to winning ones though because there are some hints that Matty may not be our winner: - Since Marcus fell victim to a twist last week, it seems damning that we saw Matty grinning from ear to ear and winking at Kenny when he realized that Marcus was “dead”. Some respect would have been in order and, if it wasn’t coming, the camera could have ignored him instead of underlining it. - Worse, we heard him rejoicing over Marcus’ demise during the reward, saying he would never have won if Marcus was still there. Shouldn’t a winner be portrayed as someone willing to fight it out on the battle field? If that wasn’t mentioned, why not ignore the reward comment? - Finally, something that could be trivial in all the bitterness flying around, but why did we have to hear Matty telling everyone to shush in camp? Could Matty’s mouth injure him in this game just like he injured himself at the challenge? Matty isn’t portrayed as a clinical player but a very emotional one. Corinne, on the other hand, is portrayed as a clinical player. Where we expected her to blow up at the reward challenge when she realized that Marcus had been voted out, she had a calm, rational explanation to her reaction. Even if it irritated Susie and Kenny, it felt that she explained herself well, the editors giving her the final word. At tribal council, we expected that Corinne would let Susie know how she felt about the previous vote, instead she was kept away from all the nastiness. Can she be a winner even if we heard her say that Sugar was a moron? I’ll admit that it’s very worrying but it was done in confessional. In camp, she tells Sugar that she cares for her opinion and want to do whatever Sugar wants. Can she be a winner even if she was called horrendous? Well, she has 2 sure votes on the jury so we need some doubts! What’s important is that we haven’t been shown any of her nastiness to Sugar or anyone else during the episodes. It’s all contained in her confessionals even if we know she can blow up at times. That’s manipulation and a winner’s edit always gets the most careful manipulation. I could be wrong in reading this story but Corinne winning would make for a crazy finish.   Top

flystorms 212 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 11-17-08, 12:46 PM (EST) 57. "RE: Episode #9 Editing Thoughts:" As always, I love your stuff, Michel! Thank you. This season is so difficult to pick out a true winner's edit. There are things we don't like about each person. I wonder though, if Sugar is being given an edit better than she deserves? In Charlie's interview, he tells us that she was actually a real pain around camp, tearing up other people's bags so she could dress herself, and doing other stuff. We haven't seen any of that in the editing. Do you think her bad side is being hidden in order to tell her winning story? I, like you, think that Corrinne will come back to win this whole game. We'll see.   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 11-17-08, 09:28 PM (EST) 58. "Editing" flystorms, I am glad to see you joining in again (I wanted to add that prior to what I wrote since you did post) I have always been one of the "others" who do not feel you can subscribe a "winner's edit" probably because it always felt to me that the winner of each season was more or less just the ending for a dramatic story being presented. In fact, it seems that when (at least I) try to force what a "winner" should be on this show, I find myself veering into what I want rather than what is the reality. While I was hoping there would be so much commentary that I would be dizzy from reading, it is nice to see that there are some contributions; I've left the nuances of the episodes to others who wanted to contribute; I felt I was hogging that area a bit lol I see some enjoy to "pick their winner" and it will be fun to see how you prevail at the end of the season. I love Survivor's editing story; the ultimate victor is just that last satisfying page but the reading the chapters usually gets me more excited I have always subscribed somewhat to the first episode giving the "lay of the land" and in hindsight look back to see if any of those shown in some degree helped to sculpt the end game. The first episode showed Crystal, Bob, GC, Ace, Matty and Marcus in the first introductory spots. Ken, Randy, Crystal again then Corrinne are given confessional spots. The game begins and confessionals are set forth thereafter. As time has gone on, we saw story lines involving the alliance surrounding the "onion" faction, the demoralization of Fang, the finding of Sugar's idol with a nod from Jeff that "good vs. evil" will be an overall thematic approach to this season and this has been touched upon. However, good vs. evil is never black and white and should not be pigeon holed as such. At this particular time, certain roles appear to be fulfilled. I have noted that there are clinical players, emotional players, UTR players and head of household players though I do hate subjecting every person with every season in a single slot. Editing changes and editing is 50% foresight and a very important 50% hindsight. Looking into the future as the tables will now be turning and we have yet another contestant... the jury; how would we view those remaining in terms of how the jury will view them and their game. We have seen Sugar embark on a novel journey and being labeled as one who essentially is seen by a puppet by everyone else yet one can't forget Ken acknowledging that Sugar is a lot smarter than it appears. From the onset, even Sugar has noted that others think she is "dumb" but "they haven't talked to me yet." There has been quite a bit said about this young lady and while she certainly plays with her heart on her sleeve, we are well aware of her insight on who she may trust and not trust. Sugar is also still in possession of a very valuable hidden idol that has been the subject of many an episode. We have seen Ken fumbling alongside his crush Michelle, dropping his pen at Tribal Council and calling himself an underdog in the first episode by sheer virtue of who he is. What a long way he has come as even acknowledged by a surly Randy. Matty who has been the "voice" of Gabon throughout the season has had an extremely emotional journey and on paper, probably the toughest time in Gabon. He was also one of the few who was never quite tainted with the Fang stain of loss. He needed a miracle and momentarily has found one. Crystal has been a very abrasive personality as Randy has had. One might note how the tide has changed a bit though. Randy's thought process while on Fang was succinct - as I said once earlier, we may not be meant to like him but we certainly can't say we don't agree with him. Crystal, on the other hand, seemed a bit overbearing and antagonistic during these times and when Susie, Randy, Dan and Matty discussed their grouping, the editing appeared to lean more in their favor. The tenor has changed a bit now. Randy changed to "yellow forever" and there he should stay. His attitude now moved from a curmudgeon with valid reason to just being nasty for his own personal agenda. On the other hand, one cannot discount how the editing has attempted to nudge Crystal from surly, non contributing and defensive to a bit more articulate in showing the audience directly her way of thinking. This is NOT to say in the least that Crystal is suddenly redeemed in our eyes and is a lovely person to watch because she is still combative and abrasive but if one watches the earlier shows and compares to latter ones, there is a difference, subtle but there. While Susie was pivotal in recent events, I fail to see any true evolution to her whatsoever. One can't change the fact she won immunity but it certainly was not a highlighted event and her participation in Marcus' eviction was more about Ken and Crystal than Susie. I would hazard a guess that our dearly departed Charlie's words of playing Stupid Survivor when Crystal picked Susie was indeed irony at its best Corrinne has certainly been living up to the "hype" that Jeff offered to us pre-season and if one enjoys the symbolic Adam and Eve scenarios as I note Michel does, it does appear that Corrine and Sugar have an invisible duel as to who the real Eve should be. However, that will be as far as *I* go with that story but suffice it to say, Corrinne feels Sugar is a moron and I will always appreciate Survivor's love of irony; i.e. those who tend to dismiss another may find themselves on the short end of the stick. Then we have Bob, the man that Corrine stated that none of them were looking to take him to the end but was valued for the number factor. A quiet presence on the fringe of a now peeling onion (forgive my imagery) The merge (as with Matty) gave him a lifeline (albeit a seemingly short one with his former original Kota being trimmed weekly) yet he most certainly is edited as a positive force out there. Let's not forget this is not a group of people who the audience can count on as staying the course necessarily. Sugar does not excactly trust Kenny or Crystal. Matty and Sugar may have their own understanding. Sugar is not fond of Randy or Corrinne. Matty had a previously decent relationship with Randy and while close with Ken, Matty was not necessarily happy with Crystal in the Fang days. Susie flies by the seat of her pants and not necessarily will fly with the same birds as previously and Bob feels he is the luckiest man in Gabon and I am not in the position to argue against him yet.   Top

speedstr 3 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson" 11-18-08, 03:43 AM (EST) 59. "RE: Editing" hello everyone! As always Michel - your input is always interesting and makes me think twice about my own thoughts on the editing process. And I was waiting for you to write down your thoughts Veruca Salt - I quite enjoyed your editing analysis, as always! And interesting contributions flystorms... This is going to be my last time writing, as I have gotten really busy lately which is why I haven't been able to get to writing in this thread since weeks ago... but I am definitely going to continue to enjoying lurking and reading everyone's analysis as the season reaches its climax! I have to say before I continue... is it just me or is the editing this season been, just a little bit different from past seasons? I wonder if Burnett decided to get himself a different set of editors this season... because I do feel that some of our competitors have gotten some really unique edits this season. Who knows? Anywho... here goes... over all, when it comes to good versus evil, it is definitely hasn't been easy trying to figure out who was seen as good and who was seen as evil. I think that definitely fang was seen as the bad tribe and Kota was edited as the good tribe - but what I was really really interesting was that this seemed to hold, even AFTER the tribe swaps! For example, Crystal was meant to be seen as negative while she was at fang, but as VS mentioned, her edit has shifted as of late, and I think that shift began when she got swapped to Kota. Another example is Randy, who received a positive edit while at Kota, but then was definitely edited as negative since being swapped to Fang. Another aspect of good versus evil... so far, I think the people in the running as being edited as "good" are matty, sugar, and bob, and the people being edited as "evil" are randy, and crystal. The people I haven't quite figured out yet are Corinne, Kenny and Susie. Susie seems to be a non-entity, thus not deserving to be edited in either camp. Corrinne and Kenny, I think are both kind of being edited more on the "evil" side than anything, with Corinne being negative about Sugar, and Kenny being negative about Charlie. I don't think there is anyone that has gotten an incredibly horrific "villain" edit, as even Randy has given the audience insight into his personality and crystal has been shown in a more positive light... Okay, so here is the run down of where I think people get in the game... No Impact Players Susie - most definitely susie...as everyone else mentioned, she could have and should have gotten a better edit during the previous episode when she won immunity, but there was no confessional from her about winning, and no confessional from her leading up to tribal council. I don't know if this means that she will still be around for a few more episodes though or will be going next... not sure... Mid-Range Players Corinne - she is a tough one to figure out... I think there has definitely been manipulation with her edit, as Michel stated, but I'm just not sure if its a winner's edit, or if its ultimately a "good" edit. She was seen as being really negative towards Sugar last episode, and Sugar ended up doing the opposite of what Corinne said she was and would do. And Sugar mentioned that she was aware of who everyone was and has been shown to play to game well, even if a bit emotional. And in comparing Corinne and Sugar, Sugar has definitely seemed to have gotten an even more manipulated edit than Corinne (as Flystorms seems to suggest regarding what Charlie said). I was also trying to figure out why Corinne got 2 confessionals during the reward they won, and how they were positive confessionals... but VS - you make a great point about how Matty REALLY got the best confessionals (regarding pointing to possible end game). Corinne, got a "softening" of her character... but if even she acknowledges her surprise of being able to relate to a child, what does that say about any possibly crankyness that may occur in the future? I fear that she may in fact go in the next couple of weeks, as often times, though characters who are "softened" up, but don't have end game edits go fairly quickly afterwards. Bob - while Bob has gotten a "good" edit, his editing seems to indicate an arc in his storyline that just started recently. Unfortunately, he was nearly invisible for almost the entire season, and that overall editing does not bode well for end game. I wonder if anything that happens with his fake immunity idol may result in his eventual ouster. If people don't believe him, they may try to get him out quickly to be certain. If people do believe him, it may save him at a couple of tribals, but as soon as the cat is out of the bag, everyone will know how smart he is and will probably see him as a threat. Crystal - As much as her edit has definitely been on the rise the past few episodes, I do have to agree with VS and say that I don't think it is enough to save her. Even though her and Randy are on opposite teams, I think that they are both receiving the "evil" edit. I do have to say that I like her strong personality, even though I see that from her edit, that many people probably don't like her. I was also not impressed with Randy's comment about Crystal being bigfoot and being in a gang with GC. I interpreted that as a racist comment from Randy, as why would you describe the two black people out of everyone as the "gang"? Why not include Kenny? I know that Crystal called Randy a troll, but its not like she said he was some hick country boy from red-neck ville... Top 4 Kenny I think that the editing has shown kenny to be at the centre of death of the onion alliance. But is it enough to win? I think that there are definite differences between his edit and let's say Matty... and this may be the difference between winning and almost winning. There has definitely been some negatively from his time on Fang that stuck with him, and it's difficult to imagine someone who would call himself a rat as someone who will eventually win the game. I do see a heavy investment in his edit though, and I do see him as relatively protected within his alliance and people on his tribe dislike Susie and Crystal more than they do him. The fact that Sugar and Matty are aware of his sneakyness, and the audience was shown this revelation, I think will have an impact on the sugar vs kenny storyline down the line. Randy Randy randy randy. I really don't like Randy's personality and I've admittedly had a difficult time separating my own opinions from what the editting may be telling us. I be-grudging admit that I agree with Michel when he says that Randy has been given a lot of depth to his edit. Even though he his edit has turned downward, there has yet to be a massive amount of negative confessional about him from other people, other than crystal. I think that when you start to have 2 or more people start to go negative on you in the confessionals - that is a sign that you will not win this game. So... while I think he may go far, I don't think his edit is a winner's edit. Sugar Sugar's edit has been interesting to me. I noticed that at the beginning, when she was constantly going to exile, that she had a confessional every single time she went... even though she did nothing while she was there after finding the idol. There must be something to that. Her ability to learn about the game as she's playing it is being shown in her ability to vote independantly, and take out players like Ace and Charlie and realize that Kenny may not be someone she can trust. Her decision to trust matty, even though she was emotional when she made it, is a good one and we clearly see that he is trustworthy, as he didn't go against his word when voting with Ace. I also think that her "good" to the "evil" that will be Randy, Corinne, and Crystal will be interesting and she her dis like of all three of these characters has either been seen on the show, or has been foreshadowed... there was definitely manipulation in the editing when corinne's confessional stating sugar's stupidity was NOT confirmed, while Sugar stated her awareness of others in the game at tribal. I think that Corinne will continue to ##### and complain about Sugar and Sugar will end up bringing the end of Corinne. Matty Matty has been getting an amazingly strong edit... he was the SOLE Fang who was edited positively during his entire time on the Fang tribe. He got the best confessionals during his time at the reward. He is linked in a positive way with almost everyone left in the game, except for corinne and bob (and he is not linked with them just because he didn't spend alot of time with them). He has lots of options to choose from and everyone around him seems to be hating each other, but he is out of the drama. I do think that there is a little storyline with Crystal that will come up, as I do see Matty as playing a role in voting Crystal out of the game. He has also been Fang's narrator as well, and I wonder if his consistently positive edit is because the editors figured that nobody would believe that this positive of an edit on a losing tribe would result in people seeing him as the winners. So they were visible about his winner's edit... maybe? I do think that normally, a winner's edit does tend to be multi-dimensional and there does tend to be some level of questioning whether or not this person will eventually be the winner or not... so... I can't say for certain that I think he for sure will be the winner... but I do think he ends up very far in the game... phew! I'm done! So... bonne chance to the rest of you and I look forward to lurking and reading all of your posts!!! I definitely am enjoying this season, as much as I'm thoroughly annoyed with Randy...   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-19-08, 09:50 PM (EST) 60. "Emy!" Emy – Now that you’ve written your SOTS, let’s talk about a little elephant imagery! I never got a chance to reply to FloPo’s lone bird vidcaps, but I did post this in michel’s SOTS. These vidcaps are from episode 8 (two weeks ago). They were the first and last image of the PIP promo. The swirl was only on those two images. It’s the first time I connected Matty with the elephant, but if you go back to the first episode, he talked about hearing an elephant right outside of their camp . Then he had that wondrous look on his face when he saw an elephant up close. This past week the show started with a shot of the elephants and then we heard Matty saying, “The longer I stay in this tribe, the closer I am to going home.” We then get another shot of some elephants. The show moves on to the reward challenge and then the merge. Matty has been given a new life; between the reward food and the merge, Matty is strong again. As the newly merged tribe is walking back to Fang camp, we see more elephants, and then Matty gets the first confessional in camp of the new Nobag tribe. Elephants are known for their longevity and strength… The elephant represents the Fang tribe in general and Matty in particular. He has been connected to the elephants on numerous occasions. It’s not enough imagery to say that Matty wins (unless of course he does ), but I think it indicates that Fang has a (surprising) longevity in Gabon.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-19-08, 10:53 PM (EST) 61. "Comments" Interesting post CTgirl. Matty has the elephants, the white bird and the Star of David going for him! With all that, he has to last a long time! But, isn't it just too much ? It could be used to tease us. Thank you Flystorm for the nice comments. As far as your question regarding Sugar's edit, I'm not sure what to make of Charlie's interview but I do know that every "Sweetheart" edit involves painting a rosier picture than what is "real". Speedstr, very interersting comment and we'll have to wait to see which way the story goes. What I can write is that I don't see Sugar and Matty both making it to the jury. What would justify one winning over the other? We always know why the jury votes one way or the other. Even when both had positive roles like Yul and Ozzy, we knew that Yul was the mastermind while Ozzy the provider. Here, Matty is the "Good Guy" while Sugar is the "Sweetheart". Neither has been strategic, Sugar having a slight advantage even if she was fooled by Kenny. Neither has been a provider. Neither has done well enough in challenges to claim victory even if Matty has the advantage here. One of the two should have something negative that we could point to and say: "That's why they lost." Which one will outlast the other? Sugar has been deadly to her protectors so I'd be worried if I were Matty! Veruca, I always enjoy your posts. I agree with you that there isn't a "winner edit" because each winner had a different story but there are hints in each player's story arc. You know that I admire your ability to let the story unfold before your eyes. Me, when I get a "whodunnit?" book in my hands, an Agatha Christie for example, I always try to figure out the killer before reaching that last page. There's joy in being wrong just as much as in being right. Corinne is certainly set-up for a fall to either Sugar or Susie. That's the usual Survivor pattern. But, it would also force her to own up to her actions. That was her initial confessional, the start of her story arc. The fact that they haven't shown her doing anything directly to others, the fact that they didn't even hint at her flirting with Marcus (even if Charlie told us any women should be all over him), makes me think that there is a lot of manipulation that went into her story.   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-20-08, 08:59 AM (EST) 62. "RE: Comments" makes me think that there is a lot of manipulation that went into her story. I think there has been a lot of manipulation to everyone's story, Bob may be the exception. That may be why there is so much difficulty in editing analysis this season. I'm sure the reality (using the term loosely here) may come out in final vote TC of who did what to whom. Agman camouflaged me for S17   Top

flystorms 212 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 11-20-08, 09:06 AM (EST) 63. "Elephants" You know, the whole elephant imagery has been making me wonder through the whole thing about how they will come into play with some of the characters. I did a bit of research about both the males and females of elephant herds. As most people know, a female elephant usually dominates the herd and males are sent off on their own to live as bachelors or within a male group nearby. Knowing this, I thought early on that if the animal imagery focused primarily on the elephants this season, that it would signify a female winning the show (matriarchal society). But in reading some of the commentary here, I'm starting to lean towards maybe a lone male might just pull it out in the end after all. I dunno, but it may be worth watching and rehashing as the finale gets closer.   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 11-20-08, 03:28 PM (EST) 64. "RE: Editing" I love everyone's responses I really do like how the animal imagery is getting juices flowing in here as well. The elephant certainly has been related to Matty, I agree. How that is being articulated through his edit I will leave that up to the experts who follow the animal imagery as I am hopeless in that regard. Michel, I've been known to want to peek at the end as well when reading novels; interestingly enough I've found over the years that I've actually enjoyed moreso going back and re-reading what I've already read It's all a matter of taste and why this show has so many fans. With respect to the players left, I agree that manipulation is being utilized on all of them this season and many times that happens when the editors need to really force certain storylines to have a beginning, middle and end. Certain people are being discounted at end game and I would caution against that as editing is tinkered with and we can't know for sure why a player is edited how they are until the conclusion. In this season, I'm not so sure that when the words about a "clean slate" were presented coupled with Sugar stating "welcome to the game" we may, in fact, from that moment BE looking at a new game. At this time, I do have to say that I would not discount Bob just yet despite the earlier lack of fleshing out as other characters and stories were being promoted - he did not receive certain "tweaks" earlier but he also was positively reinforced through the editing in a tribe that has now taken a turn. He was on the outskirts of an alliance that is slowly being taken down so perhaps he was somewhat removed from them for that purpose. Was he neglected? Neglect is touchy in editing but as an example - Susie wins the immunity challenge yet there is no propoganda surrounding her when there could have been. Bob lost a challenge against Kenny - a challenge that Bob would be expected to win but there wasn't any negativity surrounding that loss. Both were neglected but who was truly neglected? Naturally that is a very simple example and Bob most certainly was not thrown into the mix of intrigue at Kota but perhaps there was a reason for that; he certainly was showcased as a gift to Kota in all other regards. Perhaps he also has a clean slate. However, as always, hindsight is 20/20. At this time, with the good vs. evil promotion, I do entertain a huge possibility those at the mercy of the jury will be judged in this regard; we may see quite a bit referenced by the jury on those at the end were bad/evil/mean as opposed to a "clean" player. I won't drone on about the other remaining characters at this time since I did so already and some do still emote a certain characterization that we have seen in the past. There are dangling threads that I am waiting on - Sugar's trust issues with Kenny, Randy and Crystal's animosity, Corrine and Susie and Corrine and Sugar as well. Sugar and how her idol impacts, Kenny's newly found confidence equated with a rat (with all the snake imagery one may ask if the rat gets eaten by the snake ) and as some of you know, I am ALWAYS curious when I see a wink and Matty most definitely winked   Top

LadyInBlue 11 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson" 11-20-08, 06:27 PM (EST) 65. "RE: Emy!" LAST EDITED ON 11-20-08 AT 07:42 PM (EST) Isnt there an old joke about elephants (Matty??) being scared of mice (Kenny the rat )!! According to Richard O'Grady, Director-Secretary of Glasgow Zoopark: My practical experience is that elephants are not frightened of mice or rats. In fact, if there is an infestation of hundreds of rats, as I once saw in an old zoo down in England, the rats will even nibble at the elephant's feet when it is lying down sleeping, causing significant injuries. He goes on to say that this commonly held belief probably stems from the fact that elephants are frightened by sudden, unexpected movements. And, as we all know, "A bolting rat moves like greased lightning, and this would make anything rear up." Is Matty worried about Kenny's nibbling? Will we see Kenny just bolt? Or will Matty (in the end) just step on Kenny? Long time lurker here. I just thought that the Elephant-Rat imagery was too good to miss making a comment about.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-22-08, 06:25 PM (EST) 66. "Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:" LAST EDITED ON 11-22-08 AT 06:42 PM (EST) The recap told us that Kenny engineered three blindsides in a row; Ace, Marcus and Kenny, creating the most powerful alliance in the game. His smartest play was in convincing Susie to join him. The only potential roadblocks on his road to the finals were the 2 idols, one real and Bob’s amazing fake one. “If either idol comes into play, the game changes and Kenny’s plan could go up in smoke.” Bob’s confessional about having a gun was replayed. Previous recaps had designated Sugar as the one responsible for Ace’s demise and Crystal had dealt with Susie. Jeff is either trying to make us see Kenny as the hero or he’s setting him up for a fall. Nobag Night 27 Randy in confessional: “Kenny and Crystal know exactly what is going on in camp. They know the power is shifting. I thought I was the target…They made a smart choice. Charlie’s got a lot of friends, I don’t.” Corinne (solo): “I’m going to do whatever I think I can do. When I wake up tomorrow morning, I’m going to re-evaluate the situation and hope to come out with something. I mean, Kenny and Crystal are taking out my entire alliance. My chances are very slim. Most likely, me, Bob and Randy, we’re gonna go home, we don’t know in what order but we’re gonna go home.” Did this confessional remind you of a notable one from a previous season? Second Segment Randy saw Sugar and Bob going out into the jungle. Sugar told Bob she wanted Randy out. Bob told her he didn’t find the idol but that he had a fake one. He said: “I think it might fool somebody in the future but I’m only gonna tell you.” Sugar: “Everybody besides Randy, Corinne and Bob know that I have the idol. Bob still thinks the idol is out there. I kinda feel bad about it but it is hilarious… Bob made himself a fake idol. Maybe he has somekind of strategy for showing me that idol. Maybe he’s the evil genius.” Randy and Corinne went for tree mail where Corinne told him that Kenny, Crystal and Susie were the planned final 3 and had sold their story to Matty and Sugar who were so stupid to buy it: “Don’t they realize there’s 5 of them? They can’t be all final 3.” Randy: “Corinne is still an ally but what can you do with 2 people?” Randy and Corinne agreed they hated everyone. Corinne told Randy to ignore Sugar and to convince Matty to be final 3 with them. With a smile, Corinne told the tribe that mail was individual envelopes for everyone. Corinne: “I don’t know if I’m going to spend a dime in the auction unless I get something that’s going to help me stay in this game. I mean, that is worth every penny of 500 dollars. Nothing tastes better than 500 dollars, except a million dollars.” The Auction Kenny bid on a message that enabled him to take Bob’s money and send him to Exile Island. Kenny’s explanation sounded cruel: “Bob doesn’t know the idol’s not there, that Sugar has it. Bob couldn’t find it last time so he needs another shot to find it.” Hearing Sugar laughing as Bob left added to the cruelty. Despite having more money than anyone, Kenny wasn’t shown using it to win a single item after that. We often saw him saying “Let him/her have it”. Susie won a warm bath but seemed to waste it, as Sugar said: “Don’t get out… That’s coockoo. I would have been there the whole time.” Even Jeff was surprised. Sugar got just what she wanted, peanut butter and chocolate for $340. Matty got the much coveted burger and fries for $400. Jeff noted that Kenny passed it up even if he had more money. The auction was mainly the “Randy and Sugar” show: When Randy won beer and peanuts, we heard Sugar, laughing and saying she didn’t like beer that much but only wanted to up the ante. Randy also won spaghetti and wine for $280 after Jeff noted that Kenny was giving it up again. Finally, the cookies were an occasion to show the bitterness between Randy and Sugar. In confessional, Randy told us that Sugar could kiss his ass. As she had told us, Corinne only bid on something that was going to give her an advantage in the next immunity challenge. She bid $500 right away, Jeff noting that only Kenny could outbid her. Again, he let the occasion slip. We didn’t see Crystal win any item. Nobag, Day 28 They got back to camp with Matty saying: “Corinne, I must say, good things will come to those who wait. I thought you were blowing it but you made the right decision.” (That would be nice foreshadowing.) Randy had to explain to Matty that the cookie wasn’t a gift from Sugar and then added in confessional: “I left the auction broke, full, half-drunk and pissed off. I’m gonna burn this house down the next day or so.” Sugar (solo): “Have you ever seen a grown man get so mad over a chocolate chip cookie? The only reason I took his damn cookie was because he didn’t want to give me a cookie… He didn’t want to give Sugar a cookie because Sugar is evil.” (That was followed by fire ants carrying a dead carcass.) Randy, Corinne and Matty had a talk. Matty told Randy (but with Corinne shown on screen): “You have to drop the attitude and just be cool.” Corinne said: “We’re obviously in a desperate position… If you have any ideas, if you would like to work with us in any way, we’re certainly open to it.” Randy stressed the point by adding: “You’re on the outs. The final 3 in this game is Kenny, Susie and Crystal.” Randy explained Matty’s options: “He can stay with the original Fang or he can come with me, Corinne and Bob and have a shot at winning.” Exile Island Bob: “The next couple of tribals, there’s a very tight group that are going to vote Randy, Corinne and myself off.” He went for the clue again but realized it was a clue he had already found, so he went on an African safari. The scenery was magnificient and Bob’s portrayal was very reminiscent to Earl’s “king of Fiji” scenes atop the mountain. Bob told us why he came to Africa: “I came here to experience, not only Survivor, but to learn about myself…” He ended his journey by saying: “I see why they call it the garden of Eden.” Nobag Day 28 The alliance was holding a strategy session, Kenny saying that Randy would be next. Matty joined in, saying: “We’re getting down to a point where it’s pretty dicey for us. We have to keep the 5 of us strong. Randy… he’s made his own coffin. Bob should go next to get him out of the loop…” Sugar: “I’m noticing now that Matty is really playing the game. He is trying to take control and he is a physical threat and he’s trying to get rid of Bob who is the other physical threat and hang on to Randy for some reason. Is he going to join up with Randy cause he’s wisening up because it’s smart to have a jerk at the end?” Sugar told Matty that his pecking order of Bob, Randy, Corinne sucked. Matty said: “I know it sucks but tough! We have to worry about us and this fivesome getting to the final 5.” To very tense music, Randy arrived to end that little discussion. Fire ants had found an even bigger carcass. Nobag Day 30 Randy had a diabolical plan: “Corinne, myself and Bob are on the outside. Our only chance is to shake things up. The plan for me is to continue to be nasty… The old Fang people are gonna vote for me… We get the feeling that Bob probably found the immunity idol. The plan is to convince Bob to give me the hidden immunity idol. I play the idol, voilà Susie, the jokes on you, you’re going home.” Corinne obviously loved the plan. Matty talked with Matty about how stupid Susie was. He added: “There isn’t a normal person among them except you and you even whored yourself out.” Matty (solo): “Randy just sealed his faith, you know. I did what I can but if you’re not going to listen to what I say or take my advice, then there’s nothing I can do. It’s a no-brainer that Randy has to go now and he’s going out with a bang.” Makes me think that Matty would have flipped the game after getting Bob out. Going over once more the argument about cookies, Randy ended it by telling Susie to shut up. Crystal had a confessional: “Randy needs to go. He’s a troll. He’s wreaking havoc in the Nobag tribe.” Randy: “The more they freak out, the more paranoïa sets in, the better operation strong-arm can be effective.” The Immunity Challenge Corinne, pleading for something magical, got something good. She sat out the first round, moving directly to the finals. These were the fun quotes from Jeff during the first round: Matty doesn’t hesitate Sugar, no good, had to go back. Bob falls off, no good, gotta go back. Sugar falls off, Crystal falls. “Matty is moving on. There’s was one spot open for the final round. Who is going to get it? Kenny, with a big leap, Kenny moves on to the final.” In that final round: Corinne was “making good progress” Matty had “the early lead” “Kenny may have made it more difficult by starting at the end.” Matty was “very close to knocking everything over.” Kenny was seen “picking up his fallen pieces.” “Matty has two blocks left. If he’s wrong, it’s a lot of work for nothing.” “Kenny’s coming on strong now.” “Corinne now looking good. Corinne, by being calm, has kept herself in this challenge.” “Million dollars on the line. Does it go, Corinne? No, Corinne’s stopped short.” “Kenny looking good. Kenny wins immunity.” Corinne: “Randy and I needed to win. Now, I’m going on a wing and a prayer that Bob has the hidden immunity idol. I have to figure out if he has it or not. I was so close.” Final Scene Randy: “I’m 75% sure I need the idol tonight because they are going to vote for me.” Talking to Corinne, Randy said: “I would feel guilty if he was sent home and I stayed but, if he offers it, I’m going to take it.” Sugar and Bob arranged a cruelly hilarious plan. Sugar: “Randy is an ass and I loathe him with every inch of my being. The guy is a bigot and he offends everyone. Maybe that’s his game but I’m not even going to bother with that because Randy’s gone.” Bob: “Sugar wants to play the joke on Randy. My life expectancy is a little better off allowing her to have the satisfaction of me giving Randy the idol. I’ve got nothing to lose because it’s not a real idol. I can’t save myself with it. The only way I can save myself for another tribal council is by convincing somebody else to use it and I think it should do the trick.” Corinne talked to Bob: “The only hail Mary we have is the idol, which I assume you found. You can’t tell anybody you’ve found it except for me and Randy. You can’t trust anybody especially not Sugar… The smartest strategy would be to give it to Randy if you thought Randy would be voted off because it would save us.” In the hut, Bob showed Randy the idol. Randy told him: “It’s your call, it’s your idol.” Randy: “I am thrilled that Bob found the idol. I am especially thrilled that he’s willing to give it over to me. The hit is on me tonight, so Bob did one of the most selfless acts I’ve ever seen which was to give me the idol.” Randy told Bob: “If you’re in the final and I’m not, you have my vote for a million.” Sugar told Bob: ‘You are a genius… I cannot wait to see this.” Sugar told her alliance: “Tonight is going to be the funkiest night of your life.” Tribal Council or rather Randy’s Execution So often, they try to hide the boot but some of the most memorable councils have been when we knew the outcome. Roger in the Amazon, Billy in Cook Islands were very funny exits. This one delivered the laughs but it was also very cruel. Sugar was seen mouthing the words “I’m sorry” as Charlie settled on his seat in the jury. Jeff first asked about the auction. Sugar said: “Randy offered me his last cookie which I didn’t think was his last cookie (Corinne was surprised by that point of view) I thought it was for the tribe so I gave it to Matty and we heard it for 3 days.” Randy answered: “I was testing her. I could have thrown them on the ground if I wanted to (Sugar and Crystal shown in disagreement) or I could have been generous which I was.” Susie said: “You’re really getting to know people’s true colors… Is Randy really like this? He’s probably a person that’s really hurting cause he’s probably very sad.” Crystal nodded in agreement. Randy didn’t like hearing that: “Saying you’re sorry for someone is another way of saying; how pathetic.” Asked about Randy’s blow-up in camp, Corinne said: “I don’t even know what started it (Crystal wasn’t buying that) but, all of a sudden, I hear shut up directed from Randy to Susie. It’s a very ackward thing to be sitting through.” Crystal said she could feel the tension building up and that it turned into disrespect for one woman. She added “To me, in any other circumstances, that’s hands down for a slap. If this is him, he’s giving it to me wrong.” Asked about Exile Island, Bob said that he didn’t let anyone know whether he had the idol or not. Randy said he was worried about the vote. As they voted, we heard Corinne saying that her vote for Susie was because “payback’s a b*tch.” Sugar voted Randy, saying: “You are a disgusting, old, hot-headed, chauvinistic, alcoholic bigot and you need to grow up before you die alone and a loser.” We also heard Crystal and saw that everyone else heard her voting out Randy, saying “You have made my life hell from day one. Go Home. Goodbye.” As Jeff asked if anyone wanted to play and idol, Randy and Corinne looked confident even if most players couldn’t contain their laughter. Corinne winked at the jury, Randy smiled while Sugar and Crystal were having a hard time holding it in. After Randy’s exit, Jeff said this game was coming down to one thing; trust. As he said it, we saw Sugar throwing a defiant look over at Corinne who kept her eyes on Jeff. We know who Sugar’s next target will be. The Characters Susie was the target of Randy’s plan but we didn’t hear her thoughts about it before Tribal Council. There, her intervention sounded condescending. What we heard from Sugar and Jeff as she got out of the bath, the only item we saw her win during the auction, was another hint that Susie is supposed to be seen as a “Dumb Player”. Despite being in the most powerful alliance, I don’t see Susie winning with such a poor role to play. Crystal saw her role in this episode once more confined to Tribal Council. Since the merge, she has disappeared from any meaningful scenes in camp. From previous seasons, we know that there are always many more items put up for bid than what is shown. It wouldn’t surprise me at all that Crystal did get something but we were meant to see her as someone who missed out on her chance, hinting that it will be her outcome in the game also. Kenny’s portrayal at the auction was even worse than Crystal’s. The only item he won was used to show he can have a cruel side. It wasn’t the fact that he sent Bob to Exile Island that was damning. That had to be reported. When the editors decided to let us hear his reason for sending him, they showed us once more the pettiness of his actions. They also allowed us to hear his condescending comments of “he can have it” as if the items were his to give. Despite his challenge win, this episode left me feeling that Kenny is set-up for a fall, that he will not be the rich man that Sugar will want to cuddle. Sugar had a radical change of role this week. Trading her cute sweetheart role, she became a player with a cruel plan. As much as Randy deserved it and as funny as it was twhen it worked so well, one cannot forget the cruelty of her actions. Granted, whether she wins or not, that had to be shown, but her voting confessional didn’t. Even Bob didn’t look too happy to be part of that execution. He had told us that it was done only to satisfy her need for revenge. Sweetheart Sugar couldn’t win but Evil Sugar can’t either. I wouldn’t be surprised that we were allowed to see her laugh so much at Randy’s expense only because Randy will get the last laugh when her idol doesn’t save her either. Bob, the likeable fisherman from Maine that we had seen for the first 9 episodes reached his goal when he saw the magnificient “garden of Eden” below him. Family, personal understanding and the beauty of the land were his reasons for going to Africa. That ended his journey. The man who came down from that mountain wasn’t the Bob that everybody loved but a Survivor player who would do anything to increase his life expectancy. I’m not sure if he was happy with what he saw as he watched the episode because I don’t think that Bob has what it takes to make it to the end in such a cruel environment. This isn’t a season were “Good People Deserve to Go to the End.” Matty, once more, had the best portrayal of anyone in his alliance. Where Susie, Crystal and Kenny were mainly inactive in the strategy of the game, we saw Matty actively talking to all sides. Some of his words even indicate that he was ready to flip the game if only Randy would drop the attitude and cool down. We also saw that he didn’t miss his opportunity during the auction, winning the prize that Jeff said everyone would want. He wasn’t part of the planning of Sugar’s cruel joke and he wasn’t seen in the hut when Sugar told everyone to expect the funkiest night of their lifes. He did, however, share a big laugh with Kenny in the end. Matty has been hitting all the right notes for the role of Sole Survivor but there’s still an impression that he isn’t fully aware of what’s going on around him and that he has no plan to make it passed Final 5. That number was mentioned often enough in relation to Matty that I think he could wind up right there. Corinne’s plans always fall apart. Whatever she does, it doesn’t work. Whatever she thinks about others, she is wrong. That could very well be how her story ends but there are still enough pointers to show that she’ll be there at the end. The confessional I was refering to after her initial scene was this one: “There’s 3 outsiders and that’s Gary and myself and Lydia but we need to bring in a 4th so we are going to try and talk to Rafe and see what plan of action we can take. Hopefully, it will work out otherwise I got to look at who’s in control of the game and play up to it. You just got to keep trying until you find something that works because I’m not gonna go home” In an episode where, like Danni, Corinne bought an advantage for the immunity challenge, I thought it was interesting that we heard such a similar confessional. It didn’t work out immediately for Danni just as it didn’t work out immediately for Corinne. It’s strange to compare Danni, a player most opponents liked, to Corinne who has been called horrendous but they are in very similar positions. Danni defeated the “Axis of Evil” so one can assume Corinne can beat the “Evil Empire”! Despite her failures, I found it interesting that the editors bothered to show us her confessional about bidding only for something that would help her in the game, that would be better than $500. In a challenge where so many players missed their opportunity and in an episode where so many forgot about the game to settle scores, it was a good sign. Afterall, she needs only one plan to work and both Jeff and Matty praised her patience!   Top

LadyInBlue 11 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson" 11-22-08, 09:49 PM (EST) 67. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:" LAST EDITED ON 11-23-08 AT 03:15 AM (EST) Hello, I am a very longtime lurker and would like to add my 2 cents worth here. regarding Kenny: he is a vidoegame player. Whenever I watch my son playing games, i notice that he bypasses goodies and I ask him why - he says, he doesnt need them but needs to get to the end as fast/strong as he can. He checks whatever power (notice i am not a player) icon which tells him if he is about to die before he grabs things. He basically chooses what he wants to get. That maybe Kenny's strategy. He doesnt need anything in the auction. Him letting everyone get what they want/need is a good ploy - at least he doesnt offend anyone. Him sending Bob to Exile island is more smokescreen. His alliance knows sugar has the icon, why give someone else opportunity to look for it, or even opportunity to create a fake one. Also, Corinne was “making good progress” Matty had “the early lead” “Kenny may have made it more difficult by starting at the end.” Matty was “very close to knocking everything over.” Kenny was seen “picking up his fallen pieces.” “Matty has two blocks left . If he’s wrong, it’s a lot of work for nothing.” “Kenny’s coming on strong now.” “Corinne now looking good. Corinne, by being calm, has kept herself in this challenge.” “Million dollars on the line. Does it go, Corinne? No, Corinne’s stopped short.” “Kenny looking good. Kenny wins immunity.” Looks like comments for the final 3   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-25-08, 06:22 PM (EST) 68. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:" Hello LadyInBlue and welcome to our little corner of the board. It's usually busier than this. Where is everyone? Anyway, I wanted to say I appreciated your insight into the gamer's way of thinking. As far as explaining Kenny's very poor edit in the episode, I have two objections: - We did see Kenny biding on many items so it wasn't as if he didn't care about them. You could say he was driving the price up but, in an auction, you have to be ready to pay for what you bid. - If that was his thinking, why not give us his thoughts in a confessional? Every player had to give a confessional about that auction so it would have been an occasion to let us know a bit more about Kenny's game.   Top

reggie 5 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson" 11-25-08, 08:31 PM (EST) 69. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:" Michel, they did not show Kenny's thoughts on the auction in a confessional but they did show them on the insider clips at cbs. Does that go into the making of a winner and explaining his thoughts if they put them there instead of the show? Just wondering?   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 11-25-08, 09:56 PM (EST) 70. "RE: Episode #10 Editing Thoughts:" Only the people who decided to leave it in Insider could give you that answer but I believe that the story of the winner is contained in the show as presented on TV. What percentage of viewers go to CBS.com to watch those videos? I'd think < 1%. One could argue that it's even worst if there was a confessional with a good explanation but they decided it wasn't worth showing everyone.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-07-08, 10:16 PM (EST) 71. "Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" I don't know if I should still write in this thread after last week's debacle but I'll go ahead anyway. Thank you for not flaming my previous posts even if I deserve it! I wrote the summary for this week's episode. You can find that here. So I'll go directly to my perception of the players: Susie : She may be in a very good position, not having any targets on her back, but she has been ignored too often by the editors to have any chance of winning. Susie is there, her vote is important but when do we hear what she has in mind for it? She looks like the contestant that sits in front of the jury with nothing to show. Crystal has practically disappeared since the merge. This week, she had a short confessional about Andre but nothing else until after the immunity challenge. Then, her confessional went: “If their idol is real, Matty’s going home but if they have a fake idol, Corinne is going home. I’ve been weighing who is better to take out and my heart tells me to take Matty out. Corinne isn’t a threat to me in any shape or form. This is my only chance to get him out and this is wrecking my brain. The mental part of this game is kicking my ass.” It served to show that she didn’t follow through on her plan which would have actually saved her alliance. Now, Matty is still in the game and her ally revealed his hand. Crystal even said she missed her only chance of getting rid of him (just like she missed her only chance of getting rid of Sugar’s idol during their Fang days). Now, it would make sense that Sugar and Matty get rid of her. Kenny really had an episode that showed his shortcomings. Looking at the progression of his scenes is interesting: - He was part of the celebrations for kicking out Randy that offended Bob. In that scene, Bob served as the audience’s conscience. - Kenny then had a great scene catching fish but he soon spoiled it. When Sugar said that Bob was smart, here’s what we saw on screen: Just like Alexis saying that Ozzy was the best competitor killed Erik’s story, this quote kills Kenny’s story because, immediately after that scene, we had Kenny’s confessional about wanting to eliminate Bob. He wants to pull power into his hands as if he was jealous of the attention paid to Bob. - Next, the reward challenge was a showdown between Bob and Kenny as they tried to solve a puzzle. Bob won that handily and again we heard Kenny saying that he wanted to eliminate the player who had bettered him. - Next, we had the family visit and suddenly Kenny told his sister that he wanted to eliminate Matty. What happened? Kenny, the guy who had been trying to “get the girl” ever since episode #1, saw Matty propose to his girlfriend while he was left alone with his sister. It leads me to believe that the editors wanted to show Kenny acting once more out of jealousy. - Finally, if you combine Kenny’s last confessional (“It’s a win-win situation for me… I’ll be the biggest strategist in Survivor history”) with his expressions at tribal council, especially when he encouraged Corinne to play the idol, you see that Kenny was outwitted. That’s not how Survivor portrays the scheming winners. In that sense, showing the audience that Kenny used big block letters to write Matty’s name served the purpose of painting Kenny as a failed strategist. Kenny will have a lot of damage control to do and he knows it. The last time we saw him during tribal, he was rubbing Matty’s shoulder as if he was happy to see him safe. Bob wasn’t kidding when he said that he was starting to play the game. His story has picked up but, when you consider its lack of substance before the merge, he looks more like the character that the audience would like to see win rather than the winner. His story is too centered on the immunity idols. What happens when there aren’t anymore idol tricks to play? What he does have is many players talking positively about him. Matty even said that having Bob in the Final 6 was nerve-wracking. I’ll go with the theory that the player who suddenly looks good late in the game is not the winner. Sugar lost a lot of her sweetheart role in the last two episodes which isn’t a bad thing at all for her chances but I feel it came too late. Of course, we have to consider Corinne’s talk that Sugar will never get the jury’s votes as perfect irony if Sugar was the winner. We had Fairplay and Christy promising that Sandra and Jenna would never win. This could be more of the same. Sugar had a very complex story built around her but she was ignored in certain key occasions: Episode #1’s introduction sequence, the episodes before she went to Exile Island, the reward in the local village. Matty, as noted after the episode that saw Marcus get eliminated, has stepped up his game. This is an underdog story and, early on, no one looked to be in a more hopeless situation than Matty. In this episode, all the drama was between Corinne, Bob, Sugar and Kenny. Matty became a target only after the family visit and he was saved only by Crystal and Kenny’s miscalculation. He could have been ignored but we still saw him trying to hold his group together and telling us he was aware of the dangers that Bob presented. His proposal was a good TV moment and had to be shown but his confessionals about personal growth and digging deep built up nicely his character. Matty certainly looks like our winner. (I just hope I don't go 0 for 2!)   Top

Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-08-08, 09:49 AM (EST) 72. "RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" Ah michel! No worries, you are one of the best at observing the editing, and as the seasons go by, we do look for common threads to it. This season has been a bit more challenging for all of us as they do seem to really be making an effort to mix it up. Our boots are not always so obvious, yet sometimes they are. Corrine was indeed an end-game player. We love that you commit to a player at an earlier stage! I wanted to jump in and note some personal opinions regarding the remainder of the cast... Susie: Susie is someone that does seem to be just there. Her climax to her story was the Marcus boot episode where she turned on Marcus and foreshadowed that she indeed wanted him to promise F3. This was her entire story. While it was her decision to go with Crystal and Kenny, I do feel that it was because of Crystal and Kenny that she did it. In other words, I don't feel as though Susie can solely "own" making the choice that led to the demise of the entire Onion alliance. I see her more as a pawn. By betraying the Kota's, she can not win this game. She is a great choice to take with you to the F3. Kenny: Kenny has shown growth throughout the series. He started as a shy, smitten, little gamer. He seems to indeed play the meek role. He came into the game when he lied to Sugar about Ace which led to the demise of Ace...he started playing the game when he lied. Therefore his game play is based on deceipt. He has appeared extremely arrogant at every step of the way, since his manipulation of Sugar. He considers himself above the people that he is playing with. This in turn, makes me, the viewer, think of him as "bad". While an underdog he may have been, his arrogance and discounting of others, along with his jealousy, as michel notes, makes me not root for him as I would for an Ozzy type underdog that depended on his sole efforts to make his way in the game. He seems like an immature egotist that discounted the others with him so much that it led to a major mistake in the game. With the last episode, we have the start of the demise of Kenny. Crystal: I agree, Crystal has pretty much been seriously under the radar since they have merged. I don't really know what to make of her. She was annoying at Fang but she has been playing the game. I have been severely disappointed in her stamina and athleticsm in the challenges. She's no threat, whatsoever. I related to her tears at losing, I admired her for her sincere desire to win. She did perservere through the dark days at Fang. I think she called alot of the early boots. She, imo, is the one that really set up the demise of the Onions. She made the bond with Marcus, and it was she that talked Susie into going with them. Crystal has not received the credit for this in the editing, it's given to Kenny and even to Susie. Not a good sign for Crystal. I think the Marcus episode was the climax in her story as well. As Matty noted, Crystal is viewed as the muscle, and I don't see her winning. Bob: Bob did get some nods and kudos at the beginning of the show. HE was the outdoorsman that used his skills to keep himself in good favor in his tribe, despite his age. He was pulled into the onions as an afterthought. At this point, he kept his nose clean and out of the drama and flew under the radar, which, btw, was a good strategy for him. THen with the Marcus boot, Bob noted that Susie was playing the game, maybe it was time that he did too...wise move, Bob! We are meant to like Bob and to relate to him. He had a spotlight on him when they had the picnic, and then again when he went to exile for his second time, and he chose to go on Safari. His wife told us, Bob is here solely for the adventure...he, imo, is the journey player. He has remained in the game at a vulnerable point by using the fake idols, and he continues to remain by winning challenges. If Bob can keep winning challenges, he'll win this game. But, because I view him as the journey player, I don't have much faith that he will survive. I feel like the pinnacle of his arc was the African Safari. Bob, no doubt, has a few more challenges to win... Sugar: Sugar has been given alot of attention this season. She is the one that is ALWAYS underestimated and she has shown real growth as well. She is the real "player" in this game, that all of the onions underestimated, as well as the players that she aligned with, Kenny and Crystal. Many of the players have tried to manipulate her, and have been successful, but at what price? No one thought the cupie doll model could ever find the HII, and she was the very last one standing when the tribes were rated, and no one picked her. She has managed to keep her options open, noting last week that she could go to the F3 two different ways, one with Kenny/Crystal, the other with Matty/Susie. I think in the past episode, it becomes clear to her where and who she will align with to get to the F3. I can not help but to wonder if Sugar may have been privy to the plot that Kenny and Crystal were in on at all? Regardless, Sugar has been shown as a multidimensional character who started out in this outdoor adventure in a naiive way, but has grown and proven to herself that she is quite capable. She was shown to orchestrate a very nasty display with the Randy Boot. She did get some closure with her father and his ashes. She is emotional, yet calculating, and she does show remorse. She could be the winner, and in many ways, I think she deserves to win. I don't think she is arrogant at all, however. I don't think she will win, because of the vindictive onions on the jury. Corrine, Randy, Charlie can not stand her, and if they vote as a block, like Corrine insinuates, I just don't know. I think Kenny and Crystal may vote for her. She could, probably should, be the winner. Matty: Matty has been shown from the very first episode as the nice, "good" one as he tryed to help his teammates get to their destination together. He was edited as trying to stay removed from the drama that was Fang. He aligned with Dan, Randy, and Susie, but then through one of the many twists of the game, came up short. He then aligned with Ace, only to be blindsided when his ally was booted. He would have been toast had he not won that endurance challenge, saving himself, as well as his tribe. He is associated with the free bird that takes flight over head. When the tribes merged he aligned with the prevailing group, the Fangs, to take out the remaining onions. He has always had very positive quotes throughout the entire series. We have heard other players comment on his game play, as Sugar did when Matty wanted to boot Bob, Randy, Corrine, and when Crystal constantly names him as the physical threat. He seems to stay upbeat and focused, with the last episode, the bird was shown flying overhead preceeding the scene where he proposed to his girlfriend, and Matty spoke about his personal growth while in Africa. Matty knows that he is in trouble, and it will be interesting how this next week unfolds. Despite everyone after Matty, with all of the plotting of Bob,Corrine, KEnny and Crystal, we heard NOTHING from Matty. Was this to create drama and get our collective dander up that the unsuspecting "Adam" of Eden could be gone? I don't know, but I was very surprised that Matty did not speak once at TC. He is edited as the "good" one, imo, with his positive confessionals, with his taking the "high" road and not lying and bad mouthing everyone. Regardless, if he doesn't win the last IC, he'll be toast. I believe that Matty will be the winner, sitting beside Sugar and Susie. Just my 2 cents....fwiw   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-08-08, 03:45 PM (EST) 75. "RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" Hi FP you underestimate the value of your two cents! I'm with you on a lot of this, you have good insights. ...the Marcus boot episode where she turned on Marcus and foreshadowed that she indeed wanted him to promise F3. This was her entire story. Now that we've had Covis over in the End Game thread tell us that it is a F2 facing the jury I am so wondering what will happen during the regular episode & the finale. I know they've done both 2 and 3 for the jury but I'm wondering now if it is truly a good & evil set up. There has been so little with Susie all season I don't think they've shown us enough to sustain a Q & A session unless the only question was, why do they deserve the money. snore. Perhaps F3 she is. whoa, who would Susie vote for? As an F2 and a 8 person jury that is full of emotion voters I'd have to balance who I'd made mad and who she didn't to take her along. As Matty noted, Crystal is viewed as the muscle, and I don't see her winning. That line is also confirmed by Sugar calling her a bully, ok that's from Sugar I know. Anyway they've given her those descriptions and I haven't seen it enough to agree completely. Kenny (da brains) & she (da muscle) kept their alliance very quiet from everyone so how Crystal showed those traits I'm not sure, what did I miss? I do agree about her poor showing athletically and unless I missed something like her saying she was holding back her pre-season bio said her strengths were having brains, beauty & blazing speed. um, what? (on a side note she claims to "be the glue holding her family together" thought that was coincidental to Kenny's claim of that same thing relating to their alliance. You're right though, her story has played out. Bob...is the journey player Yup he is but could this be the story of Eden? Bob is hardly a portrayal of an Adam but that whole aspect hasn't been brought back up lately and is thankfully forgotten. I like him and unless he wins a crucial immunity I would not want him sitting next to me at F2. Sugar, Kenny, Matty, and Bob are all on journeys of a sort Sugar, Kenny, & Matty for growth & maturity, Bob for a once in a lifetime opportunity. She (Sugar) is emotional, yet calculating, and she does show remorse. She did with the Ace boot and I don't think has forgiven Kenny for that one but she sure didn't with Randy's boot. The difference is on Ace she was duped. With Randy's she was feeling powerful regardless of Randy being the main reason for his own boot, everyone had a hand on the gun for that one. Her gloating and over the top behavior along with her confessional (after Bob scolded her) told of her lack of remorse. Matty is a naturally upbeat kind of guy and I'm probably in the minority but the whole proposal thing sort of gagged me. OK I'm a Scrooge. It showed his mooshy side and was touching (most endearing moment, meh, I'm not into that I like Survivor for what it is and that belongs on the Bachelor or something)(OMG I am such a Scrooge). Regardless he has a good shot if he wins some immunities. Back to the good/evil since we've been beaten over the head with it. As of F6 I feel it this way: Good: Bob, Matty, Susie, Crystal Evil: Kenny, Sugar my F2 Bets Bob or Matty and Kenny or Sugar See what happens when I'm on vacation? I sit at the computer and ramble on and on.......... A Tribal Sig   Top

Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-08-08, 05:56 PM (EST) 76. "RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" Thanks for the response, suzzee! I have to say I have enjoyed your commentary and your 2 cents, all over our boards! Your observations are usually right on the mark as is your timing! I agree with what you say as well, and indeed, Sugar showed absolutely no remorse where Randy was concerned! I do associate Crystal with Kenny so closely, that I would tend to look at her as bad, especially pitted aganist the "good" Matty. I do like Matty as well, and he is my choice for winner, but I have been severely disappointed with his game play, but hopefully with the end game and the numbers that have dwindled, we will get to see some serious game play from him. You have raised a great point with your post.... the Marcus boot episode where she turned on Marcus and foreshadowed that she indeed wanted him to promise F3. This was her entire story. Now that we've had Covis over in the End Game thread tell us that it is a F2 facing the jury I am so wondering what will happen during the regular episode & the finale. I know they've done both 2 and 3 for the jury but I'm wondering now if it is truly a good & evil set up. There has been so little with Susie all season I don't think they've shown us enough to sustain a Q & A session unless the only question was, why do they deserve the money. snore. Perhaps F3 she is. whoa, who would Susie vote for? As an F2 and a 8 person jury that is full of emotion voters I'd have to balance who I'd made mad and who she didn't to take her along. Usually when there is an F2, there is a final endurance type challenge at F3, and the winner gets to vote for who they want to take to the F2. In other words, it is totally up to the winner of the last challenge. Because of the editing, in my mind I have Susie as the F3, because she told us that that was her sole intent, to make it to the F3. I think Matty would be the most likely to win an endurance challenge at F3, but WHO would he choose? I think he would choose Susie...he has been aligned with Susie LONGER than he's been aligned with Sugar...would Sugar hold a grudge and not vote for him, I don't know....since she said that she would be happy with second in the insider clips...hmmmm? If Sugar were to win the challenge, I'd bet that she would take Matty, and I think if Susie won she would take Matty as well....could Matty be a lock at F3?   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-08-08, 06:49 PM (EST) 77. "RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" Bob has shown some chops in endurance and against Matty too. Will there be a rematch and will Matty crack under pressure? He doesn't seem to have the focus that Bob does and Bob is well, Bob. They haven't been doing the marathon endurances (the 10 hour kind)and correct me if I've forgotten but lately they're usually over fairly quickly and Matty might have the advantage there. Sugar hasn't shown any skills as far as I remember she's been confident of her safety and either hasn't felt the need to try or is just not got the ability it's always looked like she bailed out pretty quickly. Chrystal, enough said on her skills unless she's been sand-bagging. Kenny, don't gamers play for hours although usually it's in a relatively comfortable chair. I hope he's long gone before this anyway. Susie, I just get the feeling when it's do or die she's got some reserves I think much of her real life has been endurance, I relate and if push comes to shove I can be one tough mama. OK, posting because DH has been out of town for a week, I'm on vacation, kids are working or goofing off. I have a bunch of things I'm not doing >snort< so here I am, running my mouth or fingertips as it is.   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-10-08, 08:23 PM (EST) 87. "RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" Sugar did really well in the balance/log rolling challenge. IF the final endurance was lower body specific and/or balance related, she might win (assuming Bob is no longer around!)   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-08-08, 10:41 AM (EST) 73. "RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" Hi Michel, you're summary was excellent as are your player reviews. Slowly but surely I'm starting to pick up on some of the finer aspects of editing but my learning curve is s-l-o-w , ya'll are much better, thanks for the lesson in observation. He was part of the celebrations for kicking out Randy that offended Bob. In that scene, Bob served as the audience’s conscience. - Kenny then had a great scene catching fish but he soon spoiled it. When Sugar said that Bob was smart.... This is so right on! Bob voiced exactly how I felt as well. I saw no reason for the over the top reactions, Randy was toast without all that planning. It did help flesh out Bob a bit more and that's why I'd like to think it was all shown. I did enjoy Randy who voiced many of the same snarky feelings I felt over the season but he did sort of go into overkill mode and that was a bit much too. Same way with Kenny, my gut reaction to him isn't favorable regardless of his actions. He's been someone I hope will go soon. Matty as a winner is a pretty good possibility especially if the only story Burnett could salvage is a personal growth/self realization one. He just doesn't do it for me, I find him a bit lame. Bob's story is about the adventure of a lifetime and as opposed to a "it's time for me to grow up" Matty story, I like Bob's better. Again I qualify that as a rank beginner in the editing category so it's a bit hard for me to be objective only. A Tribal Sig   Top

LFJ 363 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host" 12-08-08, 12:10 PM (EST) 74. "RE: Episode #11: Editing Thoughts" Hey Suzzee, I have only watched 3 seasons of Survivor, and have no clue as to how the editing, number and type of confessionals, etc. effect the game. So, I just react to the players' personalities and how much effort they appear to be putting into the game, mental and physical. I agree with your assessment of Bob, Matty and Kenny. Kenny is a "Rat", in the sense that he is sly, and a bit sneaky. He is also very young and without the advantage of wisdom. He doesn't make me want to see him win. Matty, who has the advantage of great physical performance skills and a trust fund (which he reportedly inherited from his grandfather, but squandered) seems all soft and gooey on the inside. He reminds me of a "Golden Retriever". The person that seems to have the total package is Bob, surprisingly. When I saw him for the first time with his shirt off, I didn't think he would make it for 2 episodes, but he has been the most interesting of the players for me. He uses his intelligence, not to instruct so much, but to contribute. He is genuine, and a stabilizing force. Incredibly, he has a great deal more physicality than one would guess. He reminds me of an "Owl". They sit quietly, observing. They are kinda cute, but they are fierce predators. I realize there is another poster that uses the animal analogies beautifully, so I promise, I won't do this again, and hope I didn't use any of hir analagies. If Bob doesn't win, I hope he will win something like "America's favorite player" (if that exists in Survivor). He has made the Season for me. And, Michel, if you read this - I always look for your posts. They are very insightful. I like the tone you set.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-09-08, 07:04 PM (EST) 78. "Sinners?" Thank you Suzzee and LFJ for the nice comments and the feedback. LFJ, can I ask you which seasons you've watched? If it's the last three and you want to learn more about editing (and have a lot of leisure time!), I could suggest you search for Veruca Salt's editing thread for those seasons and you could compare our comments with what you saw then. If you really like Survivor, you could get S8: All-Star, S9: Vanuatu and S10: Palau on DVD and search our archives. Veruca started her editing analysis during All-Star and it would be a very fun way to watch those seasons. If you need help searching the archives let me know and I'll point you to the pages where those threads can be found. (unfortunately, S11 to S16 aren't available on DVD) Now, I want to get to an observation I made while going over some notes I had taken over the season. I do want to preface it by saying that I'm not judging people, only looking at the way the characters were portrayed on television. I don't know these people, I believe in "live and let live" and I even enjoyed their antics on TV. My observation came in the form of a question: Could Burnett be portraying the losers as Sinners? Sinners would have no right winning in Eden. The 7 deadly sins have various definitions but are usually termed: Pride, Envy, Wrath, Greed, Gluttony, Lust and Sloth. (The latter is also often referred to as Despair or Sadness and described as a "Failure to Love, to Enjoy Life") It was Dan's edit that attracted my attention. Why did we need to hear so much references to his glutonny? He was an outsider to NuKota, a strong challenge performer and had revealed strong ties to Matty who was now on the opposite team. His boot was clearly justified yet we had confessionals by Corinne and Bob about Dan eating everything in sight. It was as if "Glutonny" was Dan's demise. From there, it was evident that: - Marcus was guilty of "Pride". - Randy was guilty of "Wrath". - Corinne fit perfectly the "Failure to Love, to Enjoy Life" definition of Sloth (If that isn't enough, we heard Susie say she didn't work in camp). - I hate to say it but the reason why we heard Charlie mention his admiration for Marcus could have been so we saw him being guilty of "Lust". - If my interpretation of Kenny's portrayal for last week is accurate, that his theme for the week was jealousy, then we know who will be eliminated by being guilty of "Envy". That leaves us with "Greed". Unfortunately, I don't really remember someone saying that they'll do anything for the money. What we did have however were some very big betrayals, players stabbing friends in the back to have a chance at that money: - Sugar stabbing Ace even if we knew he wanted to take her to the end. - Crystal backstabbing Marcus who had established a personal connection with her through his friendship with her cousin. - Susie turning her back on her alliance because she "had to make that final three, to have a chance at #1." That leaves Bob and Matty. Maybe the reason why we didn't hear those two making strategic decisions was to preserve their "purity". If my interpretation is right, one of Bob or Matty will leave during the Final episode as the nice guy who couldn't make it while the other one will be our winner. I'd put my money on Matty, the one that Jeff said acted selflessly by helping his team during that first challenge.   Top

LFJ 363 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host" 12-09-08, 08:21 PM (EST) 79. "RE: Sinners?" Hey Michel, I love an allegory!! The Seven Deadly Sins - 7 Jurors or 8? - in the Garden of Eden. Thanks for the suggestions on getting up to speed with the editing, and the kind offer of help. Back to the allegory - A-M-A-Z-I-N-G!!!   Top

Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-09-08, 08:32 PM (EST) 80. "RE: Sinners?" Way to go, michel! I love the employment of the 7 deadly sins and they sure do fit nicely into our Eden setting. I think that you are right. Bob and Matty are the good guys, but there can not be 2 Adam's in Eden, as we have already heard! And, I do agree with your thoughts! I also reviewed the show tape recently for the games, and I made a few more interesting observations. In particular in regard to Kenny. When he and Ken had that nice scene in the boat when they caught the two fish, and then Michel noted that Bob was so smart, as the camera panned to the vidcap that he posted of Crystal and Kenny...then we had the jealousy confessional about Bob from Kenny. But, it really was Kenny being quite nasty. He stated, "He doesn't look out for himself at all, He's not here to play the game, he's not very good at it, he's just stupid." With Kenny berating Bob, when we see Bob being smart and crafty, makes Kenny look like the stupid one. This scene screamed to me that Kenny will indeed be booted before Bob. Kenny is in competition with Bob, and he will lose. Another scene I noticed was when Crystal remarked about who was more threatening to her, Matty or Corrine, and she acknowledged that Matty was, and Corrine was absolutely no threat to her in no way, shape, or form. SO, she totally trusted Kenny on this call, when she should have trusted her own instincts....She noted that "the mental part of this game is killing my a$$"...and thus, the story of Crystal. It's done, the end. The mental part of this game kicks her a$$ right out of the show. I also wanted to comment on the scene that was preceded by the sun as the Star of David, that michel noted right before the scene where Matty and Sugar were walking and Matty assured Sugar that Ace was not gunning for her and that he had her back...where she realized that Kenny was duping her. They made a pact to look out for each other. I think this scene was highlighted because their agreement would come into play later in the game. Well, I think that pact is going to come into play this week, when we know that while some are away at reward(as we see in the promos), Sugar tells Matty that he's not gonna go, and they most likely hatch the simple plan that involves the idol. In other words, she is good for her word, and indeed will watch Matty's back and help him devise a plan to stay in the game.   Top

citywitch 250 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 12-10-08, 07:32 AM (EST) 81. "RE: Sinners?" another great interpretation I have always liked Sugar, and her story could fit in as one of "redemption". Like Eve, she was tempted (by Kennys' lies). We saw the power sort of go to her head, and her less than appealing behavior when voting Randy out, but I still always felt that she was basically a good-hearted person. Now she gives the episodes quote that "the good guys should win" and it looks as though she will be willing to provide her HII to make sure of that.   Top

EmeraldBrooch 95 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square" 12-10-08, 10:18 AM (EST) 82. "RE: Sinners?" Wow, that is an amazing correlation to make. I can see it immediately - do the editors normally go this indepth to make the story interesting to those who dare look into it? This points easily to Matty as the winner. If we're looking at more analogies and things said earlier in the show, Bob would be a good guy but a serpent at the same time. His fake immunity idols are his apples and he's getting people to buy in and bite. Matty's the only one who hasn't had anything to do with the idols and his comment about the idol being the "apple in eden". And interesting F2 would be Matty and Sugar with this set up. Good vs Evil, Adam vs Eve, Matty vs Sugar.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-10-08, 08:20 PM (EST) 85. "RE: Sinners?" Thank you, FP, LFJ, Citywitch, Suzzee and EmeraldBrooch for the nice comments. EmeraldBrooch asked: "do the editors normally go this indepth to make the story interesting to those who dare look into it?" I believe they do. For example: - Guatemala was edited as "The Fall of the Mayan Empire". - Exile Island looked like an adaptation of "Lords of the Rings". - China seemed to be edited as if every episode was a chapter from the "Art of War". - Fiji was a story of "Rags to Riches". Then again, it could all be my imagination.   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-10-08, 12:11 PM (EST) 83. "RE: Sinners?" I can't find anything about your Deadly sins observations I could argue with in fact it's amazing that you came up with this, sweet. So you've left greed to play with a bit: Maybe we can look for degrees of greed to help us along. Susie: Coveting the F3 spot. Her motive is the money, others have said she is playing the game for the win. All greedy reasons in the sense she wants it all. She really didn't flip as much as she could have. She seems to have shown patience & persistence but we never heard much from her on this. It is in the category of greed but her motive is to help her family and that seems to take the harshness off the greed label. Crystal: She might fall into the pride category a bit as well with her statements pre-season she bragged about her winning this season for her brains, beauty & blazing speed. Maybe she and Marcus can share pride, there's enough to go around. Her brains are fading per her own words "the mental game is kicking my a$$" (nod to FP on this), strike one. Her beauty, well they're all grubby and I don't expect a pure fit for these ideas so I'm going to take some wiggle room on this, strike two. Her blazing speed, not in evidence physically or mentally, and she's never talked about hiding her athleticism I think she's a bit surprised how lame she's been, strike three. Sugar: I see a touch of pride along with the greed . She lectured Corinne on how to be nice, like her, not talk about others, like her and then she did the opposite when it came to Randy and TC. Her Ace betrayal (Kenny in the roll of the snake ) was greed, pure & simple, Matty told her Ace had her back but she got tempted or greedy if you will. Redemption by saving the next one to have her back, ok but it's going to cost her the win and she's already said she wouldn't mind 2nd. Bob is God in Eden, he's Kenny's teacher, our conscience (thank you Michel), he was the creator of all things provided in Eden the benches, fire tripod, frying pan, sundial, idols etc. Sugar was sorry she offended Bob, not for her actions or Randy's boot (making Randy the Devil lol). Bob, in the roll of God, had a hand in Randy's banishment from Eden by creating the fake HII. Kenny & Crystal probably out next (F6 & F5) leaving Susie her wish of F3. A slightly soiled Sugar for F2 and Matty the Pure as the winner. I don't know, I sorta want Bob to win but he has never mentioned winning or money all season besides God isn't the star of Eden. I see him going out F4 his work being done. A Tribal Sig   Top

NedraSue 109 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 12-10-08, 02:05 PM (EST) 84. "RE: Sinners?" We also saw a picture, of what appeared to be Matty & Sugar, 'buring the place down', didn't we? I don't think we have yet seen that scene in an episode, have we?   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-10-08, 08:22 PM (EST) 86. "RE: Sinners?" Bob as God!! LOL! He would be resting in the Ponderosa on the last day.   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-10-08, 09:06 PM (EST) 88. "RE: Sinners?" Everyone has made great observations on this past episode. Here are some bits and pieces in response to everyone (I wasn't sure who to respond to, but I think this will end up as the last post.) Matty as the underdog and potential winner: Matty was an underdog during his days as a Fang, but since the merge he has been in the majority. We haven’t seen him strategizing though so he still seems to be an underdog. But we can assume he is playing the game - we’ve heard Sugar saying that he is and we’ve seen bits in the Insider that he has built close relationships with Susie and Sugar. Michel commented that maybe we haven’t seen him strategize because they’re keeping him “pure.” But it’s also (as Michel has said in previous seasons) that the editing is keeping Matty’s “hands clean” on who’s getting booted. The jury (specifically the Kotas) can focus on the finalists they hate the most and vote for Matty, the least offensive of the F2 or F3. Emeraldbrooch compared Matty to Adam and Sugar to Eve and we all know how many times we saw Sugar eating an apple sitting in her hut on Exile! FloPo – I just rewatched the last episode and I am quite sure that Sugar knew what was going on. She talked about believing lies, being gullible and duped. I think Crystal told her and she in turn told Matty. Matty looked extremely nervous during the tribal questioning like he knew what people were talking around. I also think Kenny gave it away to Matty when he said, “You think you can trust somebody and then you see the votes, and you say ‘whoa.’” If Matty didn’t know what was going on, he did then. I also agree with your take on Kenny and Crystal. In between the family visit, the two stories that stood out to me were that Kenny the mastermind has been outwitted and that Crystal Cox outwitted herself in not voting for Matty. Their demise is around the corner. We saw the lone boat at sunset again this week. I am looking forward to seeing if it does in fact signify the end of the road for Kenny. I’m still watching the elephants, but I’m not so sure that it represents Matty specifically. In episode 10, there was only one elephant shown and that was just after Sugar and Bob walk into the woods to discuss the fake immunity idol. After watching the recap and looking for elephants, I think it represents power or a power move. A few weeks ago, elephants surrounded Matty because he had gained strength with the merge. In the recap we saw an elephant in between Corinne approaching Bob to be in the onion alliance and Jeff exclaiming “Kota wins again,” and again just after Ace finds out Sugar found the HII and says, “Hopefully we’ll dominate this game.” At this point both Corinne and Sugar have been power players. This past week there was an elephant (and a gorilla!) just before we saw Bob and Kenny fishing. We can see when and if elephants appear in the future, but it does seem to be a general theme representing power. At this point I think the biblical references are more apt. I love the sinners aspect that you pointed out Michel. I think it fits the theme really well (and it's not your imagination!). Dash Away by Agman   Top

BlueIris 161 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson" 12-11-08, 03:12 PM (EST) 89. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" Before the season ends, I want thank everyone who posts here. I've enjoyed reading your posts each week.   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-11-08, 03:28 PM (EST) 90. "RE: The Players, The Game, The Editing - Survivor Gabon" Throw in you 2 cents anytime the water is fine and everyone is very nice here. Welcome! Here comes suzzee snowflake thanks Tribey   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-08, 06:10 PM (EST) 91. "Heading into the Finale:" The recap told us that Corinne and Bob hatched a plan: - Step 1: Bob made a fake idol - Step 2: Corinne convinced Ken to flip against Matty - Step 3: Bob showed Crystal the idol and got her to agree to vote out Matty. But, “Kenny changed the plan by ordering Crystal to vote for Corinne.” We heard once more Kenny boasting that he’d be “the biggest strategist in Survivor history.” Jeff told us that “Matty received 3 votes and was fuming” and asked whether Kenny’s latest move would come back to bite him. The editors answered that immediately: Kenny’s face faded into the image of a snake ready to bite! First Scene Nobag, Night 33 Everyone was uncomfortable around Matty. Matty in confessional: “I believe I got a vote from Kenny and he wants me out of the game. Sugar, Matty, Crystal and Kenny went for a walk. Matty told Kenny he knew he was lying. Ken : “Matty was super mad at me. I wrote down his name and that was a strategy move to gain the jury votes in the final 3. I have been calling the shots since day 1 out here and I’m the mastermind behind every thing going on.” Matty (solo): “I started getting an ear-load of crap from Kenny... Kenny’s playing a game. He’s a mastermind and I’m on to him.” Sugar appeased Kenny and Crystal once Matty left by saying he’d be gone next. Sugar (solo): “I really like Matty but he’s a huge physical threat. I have a strong alliance with Crystal and Kenny and that’s the best alliance I’ve had in the entire game.” Crystal : “I’m really regretting not writing Matty’s name down. It’s the stupidest move that I’ve made in this game so far.” Second Scene Bob told Kenny that the reason Corinne didn’t play the idol was because it was faked. Kenny wasn’t happy. He accused Bob: “I trusted you and Corinne and you lied to me and now, my game is messed up.” Bob: “I felt horrible about pulling in Kenny. Now, he’s in a real predicament and it’s my fault... I owe him something and I want to be a man of my word.” Bob promised to give Kenny the immunity idol if he won it again. Kenny (solo): “Bob offered to give me the immunity necklace. I made him feel sorry for me. That was a huge power-play.” The Challenge Fun comments: Jeff: “Bob, not rushing, not panicking” J: “Kenny just misses, Matty just misses, Bob SCORES!” In frustration, Crystal went to the net to slam-dunk her ball... and missed. That sort of summed up her whole story. Bob chose to share the reward with Crystal and then, emphatically, we saw him choose Kenny. Bob : “I need Crystal and Kenny to work with me because I am trying to play for all the marbles in the pot.” Bob decided to send Susie to Exile Island. Heading back to camp, Matty had a confessional: “Kenny and Crystal drive me nuts. They’ve spent way too long in this game. My goal with Sugar is to get her to align with me and vote Kenny and Crystal out.” Fourth scene The Reward Kenny: “It was my first time in an helicopter... It really is Eden out here.” Crystal: “The first thing we see is food.” Kenny and Crystal started talking about voting out Matty. Bob: “It would be nice if we could take Matty out. It’s nice that I think I have won the confidence of Crystal and Kenny. I think my integrity is working. Kenny believes I will give him the immunity if I win it and the reason he believes is because I do have integrity.” Kenny wanted more: “If you win immunity, I can take a risk. You don’t need to give it to me the first time.” Bob said: “If you want to take me off the hook... you make the decision.” Ken: “I’ll say either you should keep it tonight Bob or I’ll say that I’m in danger.” Bob in confessional: “This is the plan... If Kenny feels that he needs it... I’ll give it to him. If he thinks it’s better protecting me, he’ll say keep it.” After they had changed, Kenny told Bob: “Green looks good on you.” Kenny said: “They are baby orphan gorillas and they have no where to go.” Which is a lot like Kenny in the game now, isn’t it?! Bob : “...I’m not usually spiritual but there was a feeling that there was a connection between these great apes and myself... It did sort of rocked my soul.” Exile Island Day 35 Susie: “I took comfort just to get away from the whole game.” Nobag Matty was telling Sugar he wanted Kenny and Crystal out of the game. Sugar : “I wouldn’t want to be Matty right now ‘cause he knows he’s next. If it’s not Bob, who is it?” Sugar told Matty that Kenny and Crystal were her allies. Matty replied: “Brilliant thinking. You’re the evil three... Kenny is taking you for a ride.” Sugar : “Kenny is probably lying to me but Matty is the stronger physical threat. I don’t know who to believe, I don’t know who to turn to.” Then Matty said: “You have the idol... Nobody is going to vote for you. You should give it to me.” Sugar: “I’m certainly not going to give Matty my idol. Screw that! I’m using the idol to make sure I’m in the final 5.” Matty: “My status now is that I’m basically on my own and I’m not getting help from anybody.” Nobag, day 36 Matty: “It’s cool that Bob went on the experience but he chose Kenny and Crystal which is so annoying and frustrating. I’m having a hard time with those two.” Kenny and Crystal did give Matty a hard time about previous votes. Kenny: “Matty is super paranoid... It’s a game, people write down names.” Crystal was happy that it was time to write Matty’s name. The two argued about how Matty had changed. The camera showed us how that argument was giving Sugar a headache. Also interesting is that the Star of David appeared once more behind Matty as Crystal was letting him have it. Sugar : “I have no idea what is going on right now. Crystal is going off on Matty for no reason and I’ve already seen Kenny go off on Matty and Matty doesn’t deserve to be yelled at. Matty is right I think that Kenny and Crystal have been in this together and they take out whoever they want. Kenny acts like he’s this sweet little meager guy and he spins all these lies and Crystal is just a big bully.” Sugar joined Matty on the pier: “...You’re not going to go, ok? You, me, Bob and Sue. I have to talk to Bob because I know him better than anybody else.” Matty: “If Sugar is telling me the truth, then I have hope and I can play this game. I might have to go to the end with Bob and Bob will dominate but, at least, “Good” will prevail. This is just intense. I am just praying that I can find the strength to finish.” Sugar told him that it had to be Crystal leaving first. The Immunity Challenge Kenny told Jeff that the winner would have a 1 in 5 shot at winning the million. Jeff told a blindfolded Sugar: “Other side, Sugar, other side” (!!) “Crystal, you are off the course. You are in the wrong lane, you are off the track.” “Kenny takes a header into a poll. Even the King can get injured in this challenge.” “Susie is off the course... Susie trying to find the course.” Bob : “Four challenges in a row. I’m 57 years old. It felt real good.” Kenny: “Bob promised me that if he won the immunity necklace, he would give it to me. Now, it’s up to Bob. Actions speak louder than words and I can only wait to see what he does tonight.” Back in camp, Kenny was quick to pull in Crystal, telling her that he’d try to get Bob to give him immunity so that they could vote him out. Kenny: “Who would have thought that Bob would win all these challenges. We should have gotten rid of Bob when we had the chance but we kept him in because everybody hated Randy and, now, we’re paying for it.” Crystal was fine with that idea: “As long as it’s not Crystal.” Kenny started his “I’m in danger” act to Bob. Kenny: “Bob made a deal with me... If he doesn’t give me the necklace, he’ll look really bad in front of the jury. If he gives it to me, he’ll look good in front of everybody and he’ll go home. It’s a “lose/lose situation for him.” Kenny and Crystal made sure everyone would tell Bob that Kenny was the target. Sugar: “Kenny has come up with this elaborate plan to trick Bob out of his necklace... I don’t want to be aligned with all those guys. I want to be aligned with the good guys.” She raced to Bob to tell him what was up. “If you give Kenny the necklace, they are going to blindside you.” Bob : “Sugar said to me there was a blindside coming which is an interesting thing because she hasn’t done anything to show me I can trust her but she hasn’t done anything to show me I can’t trust her. I want to believe her but she is playing the game.” Sugar ended by saying: “I know you’re the biggest threat but I don’t care. I just think that the good guys should win in the end.” Sugar came back to the camp saying that she thought Bob might give up his immunity. Kenny: “Hopefully he gives me the necklace and he’s going home tonight. If not, Matty’s going home instead.” Matty had his doubts about Sugar’s plan but she told him: “Let me do the thinking. You don’t. I just talked to him. Just vote for Crystal.” Before leaving for the council, Sugar decided to wear her immunity idol, saying: “I feel safe today.” Sugar: “It’s the last day to use it. Maybe I should give it to Matty to save him but I don’t want anybody to blindside me. As long as Matty listens to me and Bob knows to trust me, every thing will be fine.” Tribal Council Bob acknowledged that he was a threat. Kenny said he was amazed by Bob. Matty was happy that it was Bob who was dominating the game: “Better him than someone of less caliber.” Kenny said that Bob chose him for the reward because he had flopped at the last TC and Bob wanted to make it up to him. Kenny told Jeff about the promise. (The jury and Sugar weren’t pleased by that.) Bob told Jeff it was true but “since then, we’ve renegotiated things. I told him that if I felt he was going home tonight, I’d give him the necklace.” (Crystal wasn’t too happy at that) Kenny continued to plead for the necklace. The drums started rolling when Jeff mentioned it was the last night to play the not-so-hidden idol that Sugar had around her neck. Bob told Jeff he hadn’t made that one which made Randy cringe. When asked for his decision about immunity, Bob faked Kenny and Crystal by grabbing his necklace but said: “I’m gonna keep it because I don’t believe he is going home.” Sugar and the jury were really pleased at that. When Jeff asked if anyone wanted to play the hidden immunity idol, Sugar handed it off to Matty, saying: “Matty, take this cursed thing away.” It brought smiles to everyone except Crystal and Kenny. Corinne even gave a fist pump! The Characters Susie: It was nice to see her get a break from the game after being so active. Kenny: What Kenny considered good strategy, Crystal called her stupidest move. It may have served to show how vulnerable Kenny was but, because Jeff told us that Kenny ordered Crystal to vote Corinne, we can assume the editors wanted us to know that Kenny isn’t that good a strategist. If you look back at the most important episode of the season, the fake-merge episode, Kenny said that grabbing that immunity idol would kill his game. It was his need to trick Bob out of his idol, one could say his greed, that put him in danger and should cause his elimination. Bob: He looks impressive, doesn’t he? We hear that Bob will dominate the game if he makes it to the end, we hear that Bob looks good in green, the color of money, we hear that the good guys should win. All things that give hope to Bob’s numerous fans. I would be very happy with Bob winning this season but that’s the way the editors portray the player they would like to see win, not the winner. Bob serves to create doubt for our eventual winner. Will that be Sugar ? The one that was called the sweet strategist has received a very interesting story. The enthusiastic reactions from the jurors could have been shown so that we see why they would vote for Sugar despite Corinne’s vow. Sugar has always been the enabler this season. She gave Kenny the power over Ace, then gave OldFang the power over OldKota. Sugar made many moves but we were never sure if any of them actually improved her own position. (How good would she be sitting at F5 with Ace, Randy, Corinne and Susie for example?!) Now that she seems to have chosen sides (which was the other side as Jeff said!) we hear that she doesn’t care going to the end with big jury threats as long as the good guys win. Sugar will be the King-Maker, not the King. Matty displayed a lot of rancor against Kenny and Crystal which kind of tarnishes his “pure”, “saintly” image. Shouldn’t that hurt him if the season’s theme is indeed “Saints” vs Sinners”? Maybe, but Jeff told us in the recap that Matty had reason to be fuming. Hearing Sugar telling him that he should let her do the thinking would have been damning if his edit was about being a strong game player but that isn’t his story. Also note that we had heard Matty expose Kenny’s duplicity before Sugar realized it. He thought of the plan before Sugar put it in motion. His confessional about having to find strength to finish the game also connects well to his previous episode when he talked about digging deep to find gold. At the fake-merge feast Sugar asked Matty if he wanted the idol that Randy had left on the table. Just like Kenny, Matty knew that idol was poisoned. Contrary to Kenny, Matty didn’t make a deal and he didn’t plead for an idol. He only suggested that Sugar could give it to him because she didn’t need it. In the end, Matty didn’t get to wear the idol but, instead, he took that cursed thing away. Matty should receive the title of Sole Survivor.   Top

flystorms 212 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 12-14-08, 11:03 AM (EST) 92. "RE: Heading into the Finale:" Thanks for a wonderful season of trying to interpret the clues here folks. With two jobs and a lot going on this time around, I didn't really have the time to chime in, but I was a regular lurker. I think the editors have gotten a bump in pay or something because they were merciless with the clues this time around. They'd lead us down a rabbit trail only to find a snake at the end. I love it! Again, thanks for a wonderful, spoiler-free season. The regulars in here do such a fantastic job of breaking down the scenes. Merry Christmas everyone and we'll "see" y'all in about 8 weeks.   Top

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall" 12-14-08, 11:59 AM (EST) 93. "Another season end" I had opted to do more reading than contributing since I felt that perhaps I post too much; therefore this would enable those who don't post very often to jump in more. Since I refrain from reading sourced information, I do not know the level of information out there but I had hoped this thread would reach the level of participation it used to. I am glad to see some new faces and glad that you, flower, joined in more this season As I don't really like to guess the winner just the stories towards the end, I hope everyone who picked someone along the way is correct as I know that the most fun is guessing the winner. My final thoughts? I do believe editing trends attempt to justify storylines and visa versa though perhaps in "looser" terms but editing is looked upon in many different ways to many different people. I have found it hard in the past to remember that it is very easy to fit a person to a storyline or a storyline to a person; sometimes a rose is just a rose or sometimes an apple is just an apple The editing this season was extremely heavy handed. My last couple of posts touched on a few items but I won't repeat them For as much as MY opinion is worth... perhaps this is more or less how I want the story of Earth's Last Eden to end.... The phrase that Marcus utilized of not having two Adams is still one that resonates and from what I am reading, it appears the consensus believes that as well which leaves us with three men and two women left. Sugar will face this jury - there is no doubt that is meant to happen. Michel, I recall when you felt Corrine was the winner - you felt her to be the Eve (I believe? I have not had enough time to find that particular post of yours...) There is no doubt in my mind that Sugar needs to face certain people in that jury - she was given incredible doubt in her relationships with some of them and I had stated perhaps she was the Eve Susie as the other female - well we often see in the final three who simply just "exists" as the third person (reference Cassandra and Becky) Susie appears to be that person. In my "wishful thinking" Kenny would be in that final three - he went from a nerdy video gamer to a self proclaimed mastermind. There has been quite a progression for this contestant and I can envision quite a few conversations from the jury as well. After all, what fun would it be if there wasn't a scolding from a jury member on what a "rat" Kenny is But our little Sugar.... Corrine has told us emphatically she has the jury and they pick the winner and that won't be Sugar. Sugar proclaimed at one point welcome to the game and that is when I believe the stories truly started Sugar (as Jeff stated) was in her own private Eden and even bit into the apple of Eden. She stood on that rank the tribe mates pedestal and everyone was picked leaving her left standing. By Sugar's own admission everyone thought she was dumb but they underestimated the will of the pin up model. I guess in my version of Earth's Last Eden, the transformation of the inexperienced girl to a power player sounds quite nice. Interestingly enough, the recap showcased that it was HER vote that sealed the deal where the "early underdogs" became the "front runners" I don't delve into the details as deeply as some so my ending is more or less a nice, neat little package of a girl who, as it turns out, "is not too bad at this." But again, I don't proclaim to be guessing any winner - this is just my nice little visual of Sugar and Kenny reaching their conclusion as a lot was built around these two as well as being the two who truly were edited as showing a metamorphosis from when they first stepped foot into this game. In loose terms, there is a certain good vs. evil edited around them. I imagine that I envision that Sugar was left standing twice - once as being underestimated and disregarded and the second time as the winner. Happy Holidays everyone and hopefully I will see you next season   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-14-08, 05:16 PM (EST) 94. "RE: Another season end" Hello Veruca. You always have an interesting perspective and I have to admit that Kenny could very well win this. He had the strongest opening confessional in episode #1 and all the focus since the merge has been on whether he can pull it out. A lot of doubt has surrounded Kenny and he's still here. That has to mean something. He's also the only one that has told us exactly what his gameplan was. Did Matty even have a strategy? If he did, we didn't hear it. I've stated reasons why I think Kenny won't win but I could add: - Along with GC, he was called a quitter by Michelle during Fang's first tribal council. Later, Matty had a confessional about quitting not being an option. - The recap where Jeff said: "If either of the immunity idols, one real and one fake, come into play, Kenny's plans go up in smoke." The idols have come into play and we saw how they messed up Kenny's game. Granted, he isn't eliminated so that could be a good sign but on the other hand, a mastermind without a working plan is only a target. The editors like to portray the winner being in danger but sometimes the danger is real. Kenny looks a lot like Ami in Vanuatu after the Leann boot. We've been told why he could, should, be the next boot. Sugar winning would make a fun story. But Eve (yes, I've seen her as Eve since the Ace boot) was the one responsible for events in the first Eden, not the one that profited from them. We'll see how it turns out. It has been a lot of fun to participate in your thread once more.   Top

Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-15-08, 05:09 PM (EST) 95. "Editing Hindsight?" Hi everyone! Veruca, how can you say you post too much? Your posts are amazing ... please don't hang back. I apologize for showing up after the party, but I think it would be interesting to revisit our "tenets" of editing now it's all done. This is what I came up with off the top of my head. 1) Episode 1 continues to highlight the winner even if the winner will be hidden for a stretch as Bob was. Bob's scene where he was elevated to the height of the shelter roof and praised turns out to be key. 2) Game opening confessionals: (this was about the only thing I got right on this season, so I am not crowing ... on other topics, I said numerous times during the season that I was on the same page with Flowerpower that we should look at the first six confessionals, which were before the credits rolled. There was something about the way they were separated from the in-game confessionals. Crystal, Bob, GC, Ace, Matty, Marcus were the six. While the first four presented as "look at the diverse range of characters we've cast" and the last two were comments about the location and game beginning, narrator comments, the winner was included, and the other two of the F3 who were not. Five men were shown, and one tomboy, and a man won. Each season has its own opening structure of course. The hard part is to figure out each one. 3) if the winner happens to have a long stretch of game where PLAYING is not necessary, the editors don't necessarily feel obligated to include gratuitous footage. I personally wrote off Bob as the winner because he wasn't given any narration during the first half of the game. But I was wrong. The editors chose to showcase the players who were playing hard while they were in the game. Bob had a major part to play that began after Marcus was booted and he observed that Susie was playing and maybe he should play too ... and that's where his story arc began in the real game and in the editing - when he was first in some danger. As the oldest man, he would normally have had to prove himself early on to avoid early bootage, but as one of the tribe that couldn't seem to lose, he was never remotely at risk. (As opposed to Kim Johnson, who was in the core alliance at Boran in S3, but nearly got booted because they were losing due to her. See also Scout.) 4) Sometimes the editors do hide the negative side of the winner. It's only from the Video Clips (Insider) online that we heard how Bob was driving everyone nuts. Dan and Randy didn't enjoy Bob at all. His repetitive stories drove them bonkers. But that was never said on the show. The editing went with pumping Bob up as craftsman and challenge ho survivalist and eschewed his personality flaws -- such that we all thought he was a shoe-in to win as the lovable guy even though he was also tedious old fart to the people who lived with him. 5) I believe that the lack of source spoilers encouraged the editors to play more tricks with hiding stuff this season. From my POV, they fooled me about the strength and nature of a few key relationships. I was not aware that Sugar and Crystal were super close F3 allies until Crystal's boot. I thought Sugar was closer to Matty and was surprised when she flat out told him he was going that same episode. I didn't see the Matty/Sue alliance, and then when it was shown they were tight, I was surprised that Matty told Sue she was gone at F5. (I guess he really had no spine.) But he voted for her to win. Point being, we were shown various conversations that served to make us think people were closer to each other than they were, and not shown any number of conversations that would have made relationships more clear. The result for me was that the Fang people seemed all over the map other than Kenny and Crystal's bond. I'm not sure that made for a better story, but it made it harder to guess how people would vote and whom they would target. 6) Which brings me to ... there is a tug with editing between STORY and MISDIRECTION, and we have gotten used to seeing less misdirection of late, possibly because there have been boot lists all over the net. This was more like back to S2. The editors hid the Tina/Colby bond and as a result the ending was a surprise, but what was sacrificed was we were not shown how Tina was running the strategy during the latter half of the show. A lot of people complained that they didn't like the hidden winner ... and again when Danni won. 7) In sum, winner hiding happens, and they did it again with Bob, by making him seem he was a character that wouldn't make it to the end due to lack of consistent story. Reminds me of both Danni and Chris (and Vecepia). Jenna as well, who had a personality story but not so much of a game story until very late. 8) A trip to the mountain doesn't make you just a journey player. Before Earl, there was Ethan and the Boran shot on the mountain. 9) A journey player just won. Other winners are the type of players who think almost constantly about the game and little else. So perhaps we should rethink the premise that an edit as a journey players is not a winning edit. Maybe it depends on whether this is one of the rare times that someone like that wins. Very rare ... all the other winners I can think of with the exception of Aras, who did play to win but was also wrapped up in personal growth, were hard core playing the game from Day One. (Maybe not Jenna) And Bob would not have won if Sugar hadn't been an emotional player and given him the chance to win the tie-breaker. He got a very lucky break there that was not brought into being by his working her ... she brought it to him and he ran with it. 10) Jiffy is full of BS with his themes. The Final TC was not a contest between good and evil at all. It was the same old "I hate the person who I think screwed me over by not letting me win" party as it ever was. To give the jury a smidge of credit, most of them wanted to hear from a player who played strategically throughout and could present that case, but not one of the three were able to make the case articulately, so it came down to personal likes and dislikes. The end of the show totally dropped the Eve, snake, temptation, apple references, at least I didn't see it. Yes, Sugar made it to the end, yes she was edited as Eve, but where did that story really go? At some point it just didn't fit Sugar's end game any more, to play Eve. Although Eve was strong-minded and did what she wanted to do with not too much reflection on the consequences, so it still works. But she was not punished, exiled, blamed for eating the apple; instead she masterminded a feel good ending for the father figure that was more about her personal story than some epic story line. Moral to me - contrived themes only go for as long as they somewhat fit what actually happened, if we're lucky, and the editors know when to give it a rest. And forget consistency, the designations of good and evil were pretty fluid throughout except for Randy and Corinne. Kenny and Crystal were edited as good at times and bad at others. Very postmodern. 11) The million dollar quote As noted, Bob had one of the first six confessionals, BUT the quote was not an obvious winner quote. Which makes sense when you think about how not all winners come into the game believing they have a shot. Bob's odds of winning, as the oldest player, were extremely low. His strategy was to use his skills to make himself useful around camp, a strategy that hasn't worked as well as it did for Hatch for some time now. But his first confessional did let us know that he is a seasonal lobster fisherman, and basically announced his approach. So maybe we can say that sometimes the eventual winner will indulge in making flashy statements full of determination to win, even arrogance, and others will start out with more humility about their chances. That's all I have for now, and more than enough. Thanks you guys for the GREAT analysis you do every season. "Better to reign in Hell with the kool kids than to make nice in Heaven with mutants." I think Corinne said that.   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-15-08, 07:59 PM (EST) 96. "RE: Editing Hindsight?" Million dollar quote for Bob was the "I'm the luckiest man in Gabon" which he and I believe his wife might have too. I think he said it a few times and that turned out to be true. His win involved a lot of lucky breaks. Not knocking his win at all but had he not started on Kota or had Kota lost a couple of early immunities he would have gone out much sooner. He then, like Susie benefited from such over the top, self destructive types. GC, Randy, Corinne, Marcus all took themselves out by making UTR play so workable this season. Great hind site post by the way OFG, I agree with the "themed" stories, they just don't do anything but misdirect. Here comes suzzee snowflake thanks Tribey   Top

Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-16-08, 08:29 AM (EST) 98. "RE: Editing Hindsight?" LAST EDITED ON 12-16-08 AT 08:32 AM (EST) Excellent, excellent observations and points, OFG and suzzee! I am really left scratching my head with this finale...what else is new!? I agree with suzzee, that Bob was the luckiest man in Gabon, and that that, in and of itself, was his story. I really didn't peg him as the winner, because he (and his wife), both told us that the reason he was there was to go on an adventure of a lifetime...I believed him. But, I am not too hard on myself, because as the challenge hog of the season, I knew that if he continued his winning ways and indeed were to make it to F3, that he would win, regardless of who he was up against. I was also right in the spec that I really thought that Susie would be in the F3 because like Bob, she told us that...why was her foreshadowning correct, and NOT Bob's? We also predicted Sugar to make the F3. I also really thought that WHOEVER sat next to Sugar and Susie would be the winner...which would have been true. The scene that really floored me was when Sugar complained in confessional that Matty was like her brother and Bob was like her father. She really was the ruthless player this season(arguably the REAL player). If she had really wanted to force a tie and let them decide via the challenge who should advance, then she should have clued Matty in as well, so that they were on a level playing field. As I stated in the East-Coast Update thread, I almost felt as though Bob cheated, with the unfair advantage of knowing what was going to happen and practicing. While I know that this is not cheating and that deception is part of the game, I felt if he was so much the man of his word and a man of integrity than he should have clued him in...I know this was an emotional reaction, and to tell you the truth, I am not really much of a Matty fan...the man did not show me any gamesmenship whatsoever...and like Jiffy said, if you are going to be on Survivor you better know how to make a fire with flint, and in a hurry! So, deservedly, his fate was in his hands and he was clueless. Also, Bob clearly won challenge after challenge and came up with ways that did indeed save him! No doubt, he deserved to win this season. Regarding what VS had noted in that her personal preference would have been Kenny and Sugar as they were the two that indeed had a metamorphosis throughout the show. But, is a metamorphosis necessary to win the game? No, but it sure could be present. I think the biggest thing to note regarding the editing is that it is fluid indeed, and kudos to the editors of this season for mixing it up. But, I think alot of the credit indeed should go to the cast this season. Let's face it, boot decisions seemed to be based on who was in favor at the MOMENT, and not due to logical strategy. While many of us on these boards base our predictions on logic. This season was far more illogical, than say others, imo. I did not think Kenny could win because I saw him as the "evil mastermind", (he hit us over and over the head with the, "I am the mastermind"), and as he told us "the rat", and as the rat/villain, I did not think that he would win...but can the evil villain be the winner for the season as well? So, for future note, we cannot rule out the winner with the "journey player". We cannot rule out the winner with the under the radar strategy, nor with being hidden for a significant portion of the show. AS others have noted, if the player is not calling undue attention to themselves and it's working, it's a good sign...We can not rule out the winner when other players speak poorly of the winner in confessionals, re: Marcus, noting that Bob was just not playing the game, and Kenny noting that Bob was a terrible player and was just there to build or fix things...(and the insider videos that pointed out that Randy and Dan both found Bob to be an incredible boar and noted that he tended to talk down to others as well, in a condescending fashion). I was also surprised in the final episode when he seemed to lash out at Susie...but let's face it, Susie was annoying as well....Bob's reaction seemed poor however, as he had won challenge, after challenge and finally someone else won it... Definately, as OFG noted, I was misled by the theme that Jeff identified for us, the good vs. evil theme. Clearly, Matty was the one that mentioned this theme the most. But, they kept trying to polarize us into labeling them as good or evil...to me, this was total misdirection, especially with the Ace boot. They kept trying to label Ace as evil, when I never saw it...in the end, I would have to say that Sugar would have been the queen of evil, for she was the one that cut every close tie she had in the game, and for what...to hand over the million to her father figure, Bob? Definately we need to pay attention to the videos that CBS provides, as Sugar herself said that she didn't mind playing for second. To me, that was very telling. If she gave that vibe off to people, and clearly she did not consider the jury members feelings regarding her as she booted them, she was not playing to win. This was crystal clear, imo. All in all a great season, with alot of surprises and suspence. While I wasn't too fond of the characters this season, I really enjoyed the season, thanks to the editing! WELL done, EPMB, I hope you continue this trend. Looking forward to S18, and HAPPY HOLIDAYS to ALL!   Top

Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-18-08, 05:21 PM (EST) 99. "RE: Editing Hindsight?" Thanks suzzee and Flowerpower! Great summing up, FP, I sure enjoyed all your additional thoughts on this, such as "players speak poorly of winner in confessional" examples. You are very right this wasn't a logical season. Perhaps due to all the water signs cast, as Georjanna has pointed out, water ruling emotion. Sugar, Bob, and Susie, the F3, were all water signs. Sugar's birthday is Feb 22 and Bob is Feb 25th. Pisces men can be very passive, go with the flow, opportunistic, as the Sign of the Fish. Pisces women often seem soft and easy to control but are capable of being devious and deceptive. Re that fire challenge, the post-ouster interview from Sugar explains that Crystal did warn Matty that Sugar could force a tie breaker and he might want to go practice making fire ... and Matty blew off the practice idea and put his faith in Sugar. So that puts his "homework" comment in context. He did have warning, but not from Sugar. It appears from Sugar's interview that some of her actions were to make things more interesting. In other words, she was more focused on being an actress in a production that she could somewhat direct than winning the million. She said for the fire challenge to be good drama that someone needed to be surprised, so if she had told both Matty and Bob it would have been less so. I think she was looking for notice from Hollywood and not the million. Always a factor when they insist on casting SAG members (like Sugar and Shane) or wannabes. Jonathan was an exception, an actor who truly wanted to play the game of Survivor and did not need to use the show as an audition. "Better to reign in Hell with the kool kids than to make nice in Heaven with mutants." I think Corinne said that.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-15-08, 10:33 PM (EST) 97. "RE: Editing Hindsight?" Very nice post OFG. I'd just like to say that, in the end, the theme of "Good vs Evil" and Sugar being portrayed as Eve are the only things that made sense this season. Did you reads my "Sinners" post? - Marcus and Kenny had great edits but they were too arrogant to win. - Crystal, Corinne and Randy also had huge stories but had too much anger to win. Those sinners didn't deserve to stay in Eden. Sugar/Eve made sure they fell from grace. The winner had to be a "Good Guy". Only Matty and Bob were consistently shown as "Good Guys".   Top

Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-18-08, 06:10 PM (EST) 100. "RE: Editing Hindsight?" Hi again Michel! Sorry I took days to answer but I wanted to find time to read the Sinner posts! I do think you nailed it that the editors were playing with how sins brought people down this season. It surely is possible to loosely assign the array of deadly sins to the jurors. Of course the editors are hampered by the reality to some extent, that a group of people doesn't neatly and truly play out with one to one correspondences, But select editing can surely help it appear so. Did you read that Sugar said Bob had a pervy side? That was clearly omitted. I think Bob did have some sins, and so did Sugar, yet their image came through very well. When I said the theme didn't play out through the Finale, I meant that the overt symbolism got dropped. What you are talking about is the underlying theme that was set up strongly and did find a fitting conclusion. What I meant by dropping it was that Jeff let the Eve and Apple references go as the show went into its last lap and began its transition from symbolic morality play back to a game and its players. The last challenges also had moral overtones. Blindfolds and mazes are old friends in Survivor, but they also have connotations that fit with spiritual quest themes. Proceeding blind, and wandering the labyrinth, are both metaphors for life on earth. The House of Cards was perhaps evocative of the Tower of Babel and also had moral overtones as it is a metaphor for a structure that is flimsy and without foundation, a plan that is poorly thought out and likely to fail, a situation our of control - much like the strategies the endgame players worked with this season. "Better to reign in Hell with the kool kids than to make nice in Heaven with mutants." I think Corinne said that.   Top

Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-18-08, 07:21 PM (EST) 101. "Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" LAST EDITED ON 12-18-08 AT 07:25 PM (EST) Boring side note (unless you're a literature geek like me), so am putting in separate post. It's fascinating to me to watch a season playing on the Garden of Eden, because this story is many things to many people. The story in Genesis 2-3 is relatively simple ... here is a link to the text for those who want to refresh; it's too long to post. http://av1611.com/kjbp/kjv-bible-text/Ge-3.html Essentially it says that Adam and Eve were given everything except the fruit that teaches the knowledge between good and evil; they were to remain in a state of innocence and virtue was a derivative of obedience. Satan convinces Eve that the Lord is trying to keep her from being wise and godlike, i.e. for his own benefit and not out of benevolence. Eve looks at the fruit and sees nothing bad about it, wants to become wise, and eats it. Talks Adam into trying it. They gain knowledge of good and evil and realize they were BAD. God confronts them, Adam blames Eve, Eve blames the serpent. This part is like Survivor, lol, always try to shift the blame. They are cursed and exiled. Both Adam and Eve are good before the Fall; neither is "good" after, but they are not evil -- now they are flawed human beings. So what I ask is how this really works with Survivor Gabon. I think the premise of Gabon and Eden is that Gabon is a natural area untouched by man (mostly), where the animals play in nature. Really it isn't an old testament Biblical Eden at all, because in Eden Adam was given control over all the animals. This is more like some more recent ideas of Eden as living in a state of Nature. SEG plants human in its midst, and brings all sorts of discord and corruption in the form of this game. No one really plays the part of the serpent. The serpent talked Eve into seeking her own knowledge and not following what she was commanded to do. That is NOT Kenny, because Kenny wanted to be in control. If anything, Kenny takes the role of "god" (no offense meant, just discussing the role in the story) - because he tries to be the puppetmaster. But he is serpentlike because he tells lies. Sugar is like Eve because she doesn't do what she's told, ultimately. She plays her own game. I think this makes her a good fit for Eve in that sense. Does she corrupt anyone as Eve does Adam? Well, perhaps going to Bob and getting him to trick Randy would count. The producers tried to set up a "temptation" scenario with Exile Island, and Jeff even blatantly LIED to us that some players would choose comfort and regret it, which NEVER happened! The only players who chose comfort were Sugar, who had no reason to follow the clue, and Susie, who knew Sugar had the idol. No one gave up a chance at the idol because they were weak and hungry! Liar Jeff ... So biting the apple, at the Sugar Shack, didn't work out ... The "apple" they put into play at the feast was more interesting. Kenny desired it, and Marcus perceived that no one could openly go for it without painting a target on his own back, and that this apple should be eschewed, not chewed. The editors turned that into arrogance, that was a very successful manipulation on their part ... so now to the Deadly Sins. The Deadly Sins don't connect to the Eden story historically. The "list" was compiled circa 4th-5th century and it related to "how to be a good monk" not life in general. I used to teach a course in Chaucer/Spenser/Milton. Spenser's Faerie Queane, Book 1, Canto 4, takes place in the House of Pride in which live the 7 Deadly Sins. The hero is a knight of the cross who is trying to be pure. In the same course I taught Paradise Lost, the story of the Fall, so it's fun for me to see the two concepts brought together. (There's a Garden of Eden in Spenser as well). In Milton's poem, the morality is much more complicated. I wonder where we as a group get our idea of the Eden story, mostly from Genesis, somewhat from Milton, or from some concept floating around in our culture? From that one Star Trek episode where the hippie cult was on a quest, and all the fruit was poisonous? In Milton, there are so many BIG questions. Predestination vs free will or in Survivor speak, is the game outcome manipulated by the Producers? Blind Obedience vs Using the brains God gave you ... Whether a wife should always be subordinate to her husband... I think in Gabon that Ace and Sugar started out as the "couple" who would go to the end, and they would do it by Sugar letting Ace make the decisions. But that Sugar was a boring weak person. She could only come into her own by striking out on her own, and she did. That's very Miltonian Eve. I have a feeling that the producers would have loved to see the Ace Sugar story play on into the endgame as an Adam/Machiavelli and Eve, but it was not to be. I agree with Flowerpower that Ace was not evil. Sugar was the betrayer, but that IS the character of Eve. Above all, the story of the Fall comes down on the side that it was ALL EVE'S FAULT. Without her deciding to exercise her free will, nothing would have happened. She has been blamed for every bad thing that happened to the human race for millennia ... no wonder she didn't get any votes. "Better to reign in Hell with the kool kids than to make nice in Heaven with mutants." I think Corinne said that.   Top

suzzee 5961 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-18-08, 07:39 PM (EST) 102. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" The simplest explanation of the whole seasons billing as Eden could be that the Adam and Eve story is fairly well known so half their press job was done by labeling it as such. Man (Adam), woman (Eve), betrayal, snakes, good & evil in conflict might as well cover most seasons. It was just a good hook. Here we were looking for the commonly understood by the general public version of the story to fit Survivor and it did to the extent that any season might have. The biblical story, not so much. It was fun though :p and I enjoyed your delving into the bible version as well as the references to literature. I wonder if you would have posted this early or mid season how it would have effected opinion/speculation? Here comes suzzee snowflake thanks Tribey   Top

Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-18-08, 08:59 PM (EST) 103. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" thanks for saying it was fun, suzzee, and I think you said very well what the broad sweep of the theme was about. I wouldn't expect it to get much more specific, but you never know, if an editing person has a solid background in literature, for example, as so many people out there interested in story-telling do have English degrees. The course I taught was a requirement for the English major B.A. (at Berkeley). I took the class as a student twice (once just for fun), before I taught it. Many regard it as the class from hell ... Rambling aside, I liked Michel's take about the sinners and a good person winning ... We went into the Finale firmly on Bob's side. Bob couldn't lose ... but ultimately the jury dredged up enough to put Bob in the light of just another lucky sinner, not so much better than anyone else, not pure. I will always love Bob for telling Kenny he might think about getting his own idol. I was sooo tired of Kenny's twisted argument that he somehow deserved an immunity he didn't win.   Top

michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-18-08, 09:42 PM (EST) 104. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" Funny all the things we don't know about each other! I wish I had taken that course. Wasn't in "Paradise Lost" that Adam was told he had a treasure inside of him? I really thought Matty had it when we heard his quote about finding gold if you dig inside. Thank you for your comments on the "Sinners" post.   Top

Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-19-08, 00:18 AM (EST) 105. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" It is some of the best writing ever! But not so accessible these days ... Michel, I could never remember all of Paradise Lost and it's not fresh with me, but what you quoted sounds like the end of the poem. Adam has been listening to the Archangel Michael tell him what will happen on earth due to the Fall, and he makes a submissive speech that includes "with good still overcoming evil." To which the angel tells him that better than if he had all the knowledge, power, secrets, and riches in the world, if he can add faith, virtue, patience, temperance, charity to his stock "then wilt thou not be loath to leave this Paradise, but shalt possess a paradise within thee, happier far." Is that the treasure within that you remember? Adam does get to leave with his partner and a fresh start in life with her by his side, and Matty gets engaged; he is a winner by Eden standards, of growth more important than money. Matty said he had to dig deep, but he didn't want to go practice how to make fire when Crystal told him Sugar might force a tie ... he took a million dollar nap or something instead! Darned misdirection. "Let us descend now from this top of speculation" ~ Paradise Lost, XII   Top

Georjanna 1316 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson" 12-19-08, 02:02 PM (EST) 106. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" "Let us descend now from this top of speculation" ~ Paradise Lost, XII Noted ... But may I ask one question? I have, stupidly, deleted my recordings of all of this Season's installments with the exception of the last. So, does anyone remember if Bob, on his last visit to Exile and before he began his trek, chose "comfort" in the form of its fruit? G   Top

Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-19-08, 02:15 PM (EST) 107. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" Hi Georjanna! Kudos to you for saying a water sign would win! All the episodes are online at cbs.com, so if you can play videos on your computer you can see them again. I think it was clear to Bob that the idol was in Sugar's hands, so there was no point in following the clues. He had already done it. Jeff described a situation where someone would regret not having tried for an immunity idol and instead took the fruit. The only situation vaguely like that was the fake merge feast idol. but Jeff was specifically telling us about the Exile Island temptation. Aha, you noticed the sigline I found looking for Michel's remembered quote.   Top

Georjanna 1316 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson" 12-19-08, 04:17 PM (EST) 108. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" LAST EDITED ON 12-19-08 AT 04:19 PM (EST) Hi! I wish I could take credit for saying that a "water sign" would win. But the fact is that I said that an Earth or Water Sign would win. And about that I was, fortunately, right. So now, in the thirteen Seasons that have been cast with a numerical advantage to either the Earth and Water Signs or Fire and Air Signs, a member of the majority group has been the Sole Survivor of 85% (eleven) of those Games. And that is a pretty authoritative statistic. But, given the casting schemes used during those Seasons, at best that only allows us to confidently eliminate 44% of the players in any given Game. And, unfortunately, the pattern that I thought reliable enough to allow us to eliminate those Earth and Water Signs who most naturally play Subordinate (supporting/specialized) roles in social groups (Pisces, Taurus and Virgo) wasn't. So, my 'short list' of players most likely to become the Sole Survivor of Gabon - Corinne (Superior - Capricorn), Dan (Superior - Cancer), GC (Superior - Cancer) and Susie (Superior - Scorpio) - wasn't either: a pox on Randy's ornery Aries hide! Note: I do ... still ... intend to post a recap of the Season (and lessons learned) in Signs sometime after Christmas. It's all sitting in my computer waiting to be sorted into a semi-organized state. If nothing else, it will keep me out of mischief until the Tocantins' cast is revealed in mid-January. Tease: Jeff didn't fib to us only about the fruit. In the meantme ... Thanks for answering. Yes, my new computer does play videos (without developing seizures after the first thirty seconds). However, I sometimes forget that. But then, living-room-to-refrigerator is becoming an adventure too. And thank you - and Veruca, Flowerpower, Suzzee, Flystorms and Michel - for all of your posts entered here during this past week. This is, as it is for so many, my favorite thread. And I have never been more fascinated and informed by it than I have been since the 14th. G PS: I loved your sigline. And, if you'll post it once more, I promise I won't spoil it with a reply ...   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-19-08, 04:57 PM (EST) 110. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" LAST EDITED ON 12-19-08 AT 05:06 PM (EST) Bob didn't choose "fruit." He took the clue, realized that he had already figured that clue out the visit before, and then set off on his trek. ETA: We didn't know at the time that Bob thought that the idol was out there because Matty and Sugar told them they'd used it to boot Kelly. We assumed he thought Sugar had it.   Top

CTgirl 8013 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-19-08, 04:53 PM (EST) 109. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" OFG - I love "literature geeks" being on myself I never studied Spencer or Milton so I enjoyed your insight into how those poets took the Adam and Eve story and embellished it. (My Chaucer course covered the entire semester...) A lot of good literature builds on something that came before it. I wonder when EPMB named Survivor: Gabon "The Garden of Eden?" I can't remember if they called it that at the Micronesia finale or not. Did they take the nature and Eden setting as a basis for the show and then hit pay dirt, or did they decide to manipulate the edits to fit their theme? It makes you wonder if they "cast" Sugar to be Eve! Bob as a winner was "good," but he was also flawed; a character from Genesis. I totally agree with your feelings on Kenny. I think if he had won, he would have been edited as the serpent and not as a rat. (Well, you could make the case that Jeff was the serpent, or he'd like to think he was one! ) Just as annoying as Jeff lying were the vidcaps that mislead us (especially the ones of Sugar and Matty in a burning camp - Matty wasn't even there when they burned the camp). Misdirection is good; misleading us isn't. Dash Away by Agman - bobbled by Tribe   Top

sol 219 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star" 12-19-08, 11:54 PM (EST) 111. "RE: Garden of Eden and Seven Deadly Sins" Yes, S17 was introduced as Survivor: Gabon ... Earths Last Eden, so we can assume that they hadn't even finished casting it before the reunion at Micronesia, let alone known how it would play out. I also agree that Jiffy was misleading, and I did NOT appreciate it. I almost stopped watching since he was so misleading, but after six days of cooling off I decided to watch the night Crystal was voted off, and stuck around for the final night. I also found his blog annoyingly misleading, and didn't bother reading after the first couple entries. I don't agree with him on many things, it's obvious I don't look at things the same way he does; and when that happens I don't waste my time. Jeez, I feel a bit like Corrine with that attitude. Earlier in the season I thought this was an interesting season because it was less predictable, but on second thought it was painfully predictable. So many of the cast didn't really seem to know how to play the Survivor game. The way the teams were chosen at the start was obvious that Fang was going on a losing streak. Interesting how Fang rhymes with Pagong and Ulong. The players on Fang only had one chance, and that was a shake-up, and 2 shake-ups would be even better. After the second shake-up it was obvious that Susie would switch from an alliance with Marcus to an alliance with her original Fangs: Crystal, Kenny and Matty, with Sugar as the wild card - a person who was essentially unattached because of the frequency she visited exile. Those five then had the numbers, and there was no need to betray, back-stab or blindside until the last remnants of Kota were showered, shaved, fed and fat at Ponderosa. Bobs ability at the challenges shouldn't have been any surprise, he would have beaten Matty at the first endurance challenge if Jiffy hadn't told Matty to concentrate. There are many times I just wish that Jiffy would keep his mouth shut; he can influence the game, but isn't playing the game. Bob is a physics teacher, does that give him any insights into puzzle/problem solving? ;) I found myself so detached from this seasons cast that I only watched when Marcus was sequestered at the Ponderosa. The rest I never looked at. Gabon, on the other hand, was beautiful. Thank you to all those who post on this thread, your insights and intelligence are remarkable ... the antithesis of the average fan who only watches for entertainment and doesn't even want to read a speculation on whose fire is going to be snuffed next.   Top

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