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"After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
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10-30-06, 03:33 PM (EST)
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"After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"

I wanted to start the new thread upon merger but the recap is probably a nice place to begin anew since we did get to see a bit of new and a lot of old and despite only a few of us discussing the editing, the thread has still gotten somewhat big


Our prior thread..

http://community.realitytvworld.com/boards/DCForumID2/6427.shtml#29

I’ve always been of the mindset that the recap is essentially just to encompass the bigger moments of the show despite if the person is still there or not. There also may be the intent to secure new viewers so they may promote certain people or instances to lure new viewers and again, regardless if the person wins the game. It is more of the subtle scenes that catch my eye since a new viewer may not “get” them or they are gearing up to set into motion a plot design or it may be me reading too much into them (wink)

For example, we saw Cowboy privately discuss with Yul the Asians should stick together and how THAT will be the difference between their culture and the other three. In fact, seemed to be quite an emphasis on the Asians in that regard which leads me to believe that this is important (at least with respect to the Asian contestants)

Jonathan does mention it will be interesting to see if there is cultural bias referencing the Asians as coming from various countries and that he is white but also a Jew;

Cowboy talks about the wall and how we don’t let it down to interact with others

Rebecca cites it is uncomfortable for her; trying to change the world in 39 days and that just made the game harder.

Flica gets her soundbite about the tribal breakdown and that it is strange and doesn’t really like it.

Nathan mentions he won’t be the token black. We hear Cowboy state: “The Asian Invasion” (from the opening with them on the boat) again with the shot immediately progressing to Yul in their boat and Yul advising about presumptions made about him growing up citing his experience with Christmas (as a new scene from a prior confessional). We then hear Billy saying his culture means “squat” but rather the “content of the character” is what matters.

At Aitu, JP was shown repeating how Ozzy would be pretty good at this game.

At Puka, Cowboy shown curing bad wind with the others laughing at him describing how he has never fit in and that it is a dangerous position to be in.

At Hiki, the “natural” living was highlighted as being out of their realm showcasing their ineptitude with the boat with Sundra advising this was attributed to their geographical status as opposed to any racial issue.

At Raro, a lengthy scene involving Candice and Adam’s boat was shown which surprisingly was not utilized during the actual show as it was certainly full of drama. In this instance Pavarti was shown discussing the situation (as opposed to the other viewer, Flica) with Candice tearfully saying she hates “giving up”

Back at Aitu, we saw Billy making numerous deals (interestingly enough no deal with Ozzy was shown provided that one ever was anyway. But I found it curious then since Billy was shown going to absolutely everyone and I believe he mentioned JP as someone that couldn’t be beat when talking to the women yet the viewers know that Billy voted for Ozzy at TC) Billy’s post TC statement was also quite good stating “that if you rely on only one alliance or one person when it gets to the end, you are not going to make it” (a hint of foreshadowing with this?)

We then see Hiki lose their first challenge with the men selecting Jonathan as their victim to EI.

Hiki discusses their misfortune (or rather Nathan, Sundra and Rebecca sensibly since they are the three left)

Sundra advises she doesn’t like to be on a “losing team” but they are sticking together and keeping their spirits.

Rebecca says she gave it her all and that should be enough but because of the race division it is not enough and the three again talking with Rebecca saying “it has nothing to do with race (should they lose) it’s about all people trying to succeed in a game”

Rebecca then advises the person going had to do with personality and the women of Hiki chose Sekou. Sekou was warned “the sisters would stick together” (shots of Sundra and Rebecca)

At Puka, we revisited the bonding of Becky and Yul and how they trust each other which has been a overriding aura that has been cemented. Yul then tells us later how Asians are a big community and they are NOT all alike. Cowboy advises Yul they are each an Ambassador of their race and should play for their team and upon merger to “keep an eye out for each other”

Ozzy’s “bold” plan was again shown to cut their losses and get on with the game with the amusing TC held later. Interestingly, the hand gesture that Billy and Ozzy made to each other was shown despite what we saw as an episode that showed Ozzy in not the best light and a boot target as well. There was also essentially no emphasis on Ozzy during that TC despite the narration and visuals of Ozzy wanting to throw the challenge. For the commentary that this was Ozzy’s plan with the events culminating, they certainly watered down any repercussions at the TC with Ozzy’s involvement. We also never saw any ridiculing shown by Ozzy with respect to Billy’s admission of love. The hand gesture really almost belied the fact that Ozzy was supposedly the predominant cause of getting rid of Billy.

Also interesting was Billy’s after elimination talk where he stated he was not motivated by money and this game “definitely favors those who are willing to stoop (camera rolls to Ozzy shown) that part of the game”

The idol naturally was shown being found by Yul (with a bit of savvy play by Yul in getting rid of the evidence) with Jonathan, Candice and Adam shown futilely trying to find it. While KO would certainly lend a better hand to the music, I do have to say there was a notable difference in the music while Jonathan was trying to find it as opposed to the music surrounding Adam and Candice upon their stay at Exile Island. Adam and Candice’s surrounding music was almost as if a joke was being played on them and they appeared to be silly. I liked the added touch of Jonathan wanting a toothbrush

The tribes shown merging to two with Brad advising again how you are out to play for yourself and that it is about cold hard cash yet a big statement such as this left the scene to continue it over at Aitu with Jonathan and Becky organizing their alliance as they “understood” this. Alas for Brad, a big comment from him was not important enough for him but lended its importance to the happenings at Aitu. Brad was never one that I felt would be long term and his absence in the recap is just further proof.

The alliance of Jonathan, Candice, Becky and Yul was shown which no doubt was shown as this story needs to be furthered and most likely not staying intact and we again see Yul telling Becky he found the idol. Really no reason to show this again; it had already been shown that Yul found the idol earlier and we already saw Yul and Becky bond so I do question the emphasis that was made to extend upon their relationship.

Prolonged emphasis shown on Pavarti’s flirting skills and that is “what she does best” Rebecca tells us that Pavarti feels safe because the boys love her and there was nothing in Rebecca’s discussion that would shed a negativity on Pavarti or that Pavarti should watch herself and there could have been. We are then shown various scenes involving the men’s views and Pavarti advising that “it is all a game, the dating game, the game of survival, it’s all the same.” There has been undue emphasis on Pavarti’s skills on the show and this recap that it is suggestive that her strategy involving same must have some significance; whether it will be of success or failure only time will tell but despite that a viewer may just not like this type of strategy or female, we haven’t heard anyone on the show itself condemning her for it and I have to take that into consideration. My only problem that lies within this edit of Pavarti is that she may be in danger of becoming a one note character. The editing is certainly favoring showcasing her but are they pigeon holing her? I’ve no doubt Pavarti is here for awhile as there IS emphasis on her and this type of “strategy” could easily be highlighted as negative by those around her but I am concerned that this is the bane of her edit. That is not to suggest that we haven’t heard from Pavarti in other areas, we certainly have but the emphasis is being placed very heavily on this particular aspect of Pavarti. Interestingly enough, the recap did NOT show the private alliance of Nathan and Pavarti amidst the other “alliances” shown. I do not recall that Cerie and Aras’ alliance was shown through the recap (it certainly was not shown to us even at the level of Nathan and Pavarti’s at that point in time) so I am questioning if this is being held at bay for something later but I don’t want to delve too much into a recap.

After Aitu’s loss with the weight walking challenge we hear Ozzy reminding us (to the women on Aitu) that Becky is seriously plotting with Cecelia ultimately leaving showcasing again that she was Ozzy’s original tribemate. I also did question the rationale for showing Ozzy stating that Becky is seriously plotting although Becky was not a heavy feature of the recap. However, the recap could have simply indicated (as they did) that Becky found herself in danger with her alliance in danger as well due to Candice being exiled. Sundra and Ozzy (both potential boot candidates had no emphasis put on them when revisiting their Tribal Councils and in their original episodes Sundra herself never discussed the fact herself; we only heard a brief mention by Stephannie. Ozzy certainly had doubt surrounding him on Billy’s episode boot with the two women talking and Ozzy’s confessional yet this was not shown either.) I’m only hazarding a guess that Becky and plotting may wanted to be emphasized although a casual viewer may not have even had a second thought about it.

We were treated to a lovely rendition of Amazing Grace by Stephannie which then moved into the “rainbow” at Aitu and the boobie scene shown again.

JP’s demise was being set up with Aitu showcasing Ozzy bringing in the big haul and “raising his stock” some more at the challenge. I’m sure everyone noticed the heavy emphasis on Ozzy and all his talents.

Rebecca and Jenny shown again confirming the “women should stick together” to vote out JP with Rebecca citing it is 5 women and 4 men and the women need to do something to stay in the game. The new scene of Stephannie playing her role to JP focused quite a bit on Rebecca’s reactions moreso than anyone else even though Jenny was mentioned as being 50% of the plan. We then found an answer to editing with Brad being approached and unbeknownst to us at the time Pavarti was sitting with the women as they talked to Brad although during the actual episode she was edited out of the scene. She was also shown this time that she wasn’t sure this was the way to go and Nathan flat out telling Rebecca it was stupid when Rebecca confided to him the plan. Pavarti being included in the scene during the recap as opposed to the actual episode (I feel) really only suggested they wanted Pavarti to be the doubt placed for the boot. Yet, curiously Nathan being told by Rebecca was withheld which certainly would have put more emphasis on the doubt at TC especially since Nathan told Rebecca it was a stupid move to make. There lies a possible question then why was this situation created to show Pavarti in this light and Nathan as seemingly left out of the loop?

Although we may find irony in hearing Rebecca telling Nathan they’ll still be strong and are strong than the other team (as we know they have not been faring well) the very next scene actually proved Rebecca correct as it showed Raro winning the weight holding challenge and their ensuing celebration.

Stephannie was then shown enjoying her wine a bit too much with Nathan and Pavarti narrating with Rebecca then shown helping Stephannie to the tent to rest.

The arc setting up Cristina leaving was shown as told by Jenny (again, like Brad, Jenny was virtually non existent to the recap not that I had any hopes to see Jenny stay that much longer) segueing to the “armpit” scene and introducing Ozzy being shown having a hard time getting them motivated. Candice was the only verbal reason heard for not going out in the boat with Ozzy feeling less than motivated himself for people “less than deserving” and an immediate shot to the three women. The women are then shown eating with the others and Cowboy telling them to essentially watch out as a "knife was poised at their back at all times" (foreshadowing?)

We were not privy to Ozzy’s thoughts during the actual episode; only Cowboy but that is sensible in light of Cowboy then leaving us. The recap showcasing the three women in that scenario does not lead me to believe any good ultimately will come for these three. However, it is possible that there is a potential final two foil involved. Candice was the most focused upon as she spoke to Ozzy and her rationale was overwhelmingly ridiculous. I doubt anyone watching for the first time would nod their heads in agreement with Candice (or the other two women) with how this was portrayed on our screen so I then wonder if Candice's verbal response along with the boat mishap would see her leave before the other two in this "armpit" trio.

Ozzy, Cowboy and Flica shown infiltrating Raro again with Rebecca’s “and it is the three we can’t stand” again shown along with Cowboy repeating Pavarti’s name. Raro then shown losing their challenge with Stephannie then leaving.

Interestingly enough, Nathan was not shown in the recap as the main force in her leaving and a “sympathetic” shot was even included of him at TC as Stephannie left which really took a lot of focus on any of the hardness he displayed during the actual episode.

Cristina’s arc continues as she is shown with her troubles focusing on Adam’s talk and the new scene continues this with Adam and Jenny there although Jenny was more or less just in the way of the visual moreso than anything else. Adam certainly did not receive a stellar recap between these scenes and his prior scene with Candice in leaving their boat and Candice’s “stock” (to coin a phrase) did not go up either with her focused scenes.

At the challenge, Jonathan and Yul cited as taking on Nate (foreshadowing perhaps?) and there was no emphasis though on how the ladies essentially helped to win that challenge.

Plan Voodoo was revisited which seemed a bit lopsided as there was no emphasis on the “shady” side of Jonathan whatsoever much to my surprise considering how it felt forced during the actual episode. Yul did indicate the plan was ingenious though it did not come to fruition. Cowboy advises us post TC it was the “human element” he overlooked and the Puka tribe caught him by surprised and he thought their parents would have taught them what is right and what is wrong. (Certainly much emphasis has been brought upon their culture, I found, involving aspects of integrity) Cristina also leaves with Nathan being kidnapped as announced by Ozzy with Jeff advising what he may learn.

Jeff also indicates what future twists may impact the game with an immediate show of Yul again kissing the idol and Nathan and Rebecca close the recap with more sea adventures and I won't begin to delve into all the items shown that my fellow posters with much more talent can figure out

I have no real memory of past recaps including last season but I do recall that the alliances that ultimately did not work out in their entirety were noted (i.e. Terry and Dan; Shane setting up his alliance with Courtney, Danielle and Aras, Terry establishing a relationship with Nick and Austin, Dan bringing Ruth Marie into the fold) Therefore, the alliances that we were shown of Yul and Becky as well as Yul, Becky, Jonathan and Candice will need to bear out somehow and most likely not succeeding. Again, I do not want to read too much into the editing of the recap other than what I have already mentioned and I probably have already read too much into it anyway but at this juncture I did find myself very curious over Ozzy’s portrayal along with what appeared to be some emphasis surrounding the nature of the Asian culture that seemed to tie into integrity and trust, Pavarti’s overextended (another pun not intended) scene involving her strategy, and a somewhat unusual display of face time for Rebecca. The scene devoted to showcasing the three women with a knife poised at their backs I found interesting since Cowboy uttered these words and Cowboy is no longer with us so I do question if a remaining player will carry this out against them (or one) and only because of Ozzy’s uttering of Becky’s “plotting” the brief thought of those two facing off came to mind. Jonathan was low key in light of the focus we have seen on him and especially the last episode of showcasing him in a different light so perhaps that situation touched upon is something "back burnered" until the appropriate time. Flica probably could have used a bit more enhancement in the recap considering she herself is quite a character but her edit never subscribed end game to me anyway. Yul could be a wonderful outcome to this season in what the season is about but I am nagged on that idol and the trust situation surrounding him and again, while I do not necessarily believe Becky may betray him, I could see Yul “looking out” for his own at his own expense but I dislike wrapping myself up in my own penchant for drama since I do not write the script!

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  Table of Contents

  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
 RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... Outfrontgirl 10-31-06 1
   RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... architecturegirl 10-31-06 2
       RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... Brownroach 10-31-06 3
           RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... emydi 10-31-06 4
           RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... architecturegirl 10-31-06 5
           RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... Outfrontgirl 10-31-06 6
               RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... Brownroach 11-01-06 7
 the editing cqvenus 11-03-06 8
   RE: the editing emydi 11-03-06 9
       RE: the editing Brownroach 11-03-06 10
       dammit cqvenus 11-03-06 11
 Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidden im... KObrien_fan 11-03-06 12
   RE: Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidde... emydi 11-03-06 14
       RE: Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidde... Flowerpower 11-04-06 15
           RE: Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidde... CattyChat 11-05-06 18
   Episode #7: The Players, The Game, ... michel 11-04-06 16
       Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MON... emydi 11-05-06 17
           RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... Flowerpower 11-05-06 19
               RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... LionChow 11-07-06 20
               RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... Brownroach 11-07-06 21
                   RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... KObrien_fan 11-07-06 22
                   RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... emydi 11-07-06 23
                       RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... KObrien_fan 11-07-06 25
                       RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... Brownroach 11-07-06 27
                   RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... emydi 11-07-06 24
                       RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... magilla 11-07-06 26
                   RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... Flowerpower 11-07-06 28
                       RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... Brownroach 11-07-06 29
                           RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a... Flowerpower 11-07-06 30
 RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... Chez 11-03-06 13
 Episode #8 The Mutiny michel 11-11-06 31
   RE: Episode #8 The Mutiny Flowerpower 11-12-06 32
       RE: Episode 8 Thoughts VerucaSalt 11-13-06 33
           RE: Episode 8 Thoughts someclevernameusuallygoeshere 11-14-06 34
           RE: Episode 8 Thoughts michel 11-14-06 35
               RE: Episode 8 Thoughts Brownroach 11-14-06 36
                   RE: Episode 8 Thoughts mysticjay 11-15-06 41
           RE: Episode 8 Thoughts architecturegirl 11-14-06 37
               RE: Episode 8 Thoughts VerucaSalt 11-14-06 38
                   RE: Episode 8 Thoughts Scuba 11-15-06 39
                       RE: Episode 8 Thoughts architecturegirl 11-15-06 40
                       RE: Episode 8 Thoughts LionChow 11-17-06 42
 Episode #9: The Players, The Game, ... michel 11-18-06 43
   RE: Episode 9 Thoughts VerucaSalt 11-19-06 44
   RE: Editing VerucaSalt 11-22-06 45
       RE: Editing cantstandsya 11-22-06 46
       RE: Editing michel 11-22-06 47
           Episode 10 Thoughts VerucaSalt 11-25-06 51
               RE: Episode 10 Thoughts Brownroach 11-27-06 54
 RE: After The Recap-The Players, Th... Scuba 11-24-06 48
 Oh where oh where has my centipede ... emydi 11-24-06 49
   Episode 10 Thoughts michel 11-25-06 50
       RE: Episode 10 Thoughts mavs_fan 11-27-06 52
           RE: Episode 10 Thoughts chessmaster 11-27-06 53
 Becky's Edit Bravehart 12-01-06 55
   RE: Episode 11 thoughts VerucaSalt 12-01-06 56
       RE: Episode 11 thoughts michel 12-01-06 57
           RE: Episode 11 thoughts Brownroach 12-01-06 58
       RE: Episode 11 thoughts CutsyTootsy 12-01-06 59
       RE: Episode 11 thoughts michel 12-02-06 61
           Puking fish? emydi 12-03-06 70
       RE: Episode 11 thoughts mysticjay 12-04-06 72
   RE: Becky's Edit architecturegirl 12-02-06 60
       RE: Becky's Edit Chez 12-02-06 63
       RE: Becky's Edit cantstandsya 12-03-06 71
   From the vidcap thread... PepeLePew13 12-02-06 62
       RE: From the vidcap thread... VerucaSalt 12-02-06 65
       RE: From the vidcap thread... Loree 12-03-06 69
   RE: Becky's Edit DRONES 12-05-06 78
 Is there any possibility? KObrien_fan 12-02-06 64
   RE: Is there any possibility? cantstandsya 12-02-06 66
       New here.. a quote that I can't get... rose1974 12-03-06 67
           RE: New here.. a quote that I can't... KObrien_fan 12-03-06 68
               RE: New here.. a quote that I can't... VerucaSalt 12-04-06 73
                   RE: New here.. a quote that I can't... tornadoM 12-04-06 74
 Episode(s) Thoughts Velcrohead 12-04-06 75
   RE: Episode(s) Thoughts architecturegirl 12-04-06 76
       RE: Episode(s) Thoughts michel 12-04-06 77
           RE: Episode(s) Thoughts Flowerpower 12-05-06 79
               RE: Episode(s) Thoughts VerucaSalt 12-05-06 80
                   RE: Episode(s) Thoughts Flowerpower 12-05-06 81
                       RE: Episode(s) Thoughts architecturegirl 12-05-06 82
                           RE: Episode(s) Thoughts architecturegirl 12-06-06 83
                           RE: Episode(s) Thoughts Brownroach 12-06-06 85
                   RE: Episode(s) Thoughts DRONES 12-06-06 84
                       RE: Episode(s) Thoughts VerucaSalt 12-06-06 86
                           RE: Episode(s) Thoughts DRONES 12-06-06 87
 Episode # 12 Thoughts michel 12-10-06 88
   RE: Episode # 12 Thoughts mysticjay 12-11-06 89
       RE: Episode # 12 Thoughts DRONES 12-12-06 90
           RE: Episode # 12 Thoughts CTgirl 12-12-06 91
               The Jonathan Point of View michel 12-13-06 92
                   RE: The Jonathan Point of View DRONES 12-14-06 93
 Thoughts before the Finale michel 12-16-06 94
   RE: Thoughts before the Finale cantstandsya 12-16-06 95
   RE: Thoughts before the Finale Flowerpower 12-16-06 96
   RE: Thoughts before the Finale forehead 12-16-06 97
 The black and yellow bird Chez 12-18-06 98
   RE: The black and yellow bird VerucaSalt 12-18-06 99
       A question of edit michel 12-18-06 100
           RE: A question of edit Flowerpower 12-18-06 101
               RE: A question of edit emydi 12-18-06 103
           RE: A question of edit mavs_fan 12-19-06 104
       RE: The black and yellow bird VolcanicGlass 12-18-06 102
           RE: The black and yellow bird cantstandsya 12-19-06 106
           RE: The black and yellow bird Flowerpower 12-19-06 108
       RE: The black and yellow bird DRONES 12-19-06 105
   The seasons edit KObrien_fan 12-19-06 107
       RE: The seasons edit VerucaSalt 12-19-06 109

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Outfrontgirl 6830 desperate attention whore postings
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10-31-06, 05:59 AM (EST)
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1. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
LAST EDITED ON 10-31-06 AT 06:44 AM (EST)

LAST EDITED ON 10-31-06 AT 06:29 AM (EST)

That was lovely, VS ...
the emphasis on Ozzy is striking. When the game began it looked like Yul was the new Terry, but he has been much more background recently with Ozzy coming into his own. After a rocky start, I can't help but root for Ozzy and I feel I'm meant to.

Yul dazzles me with his brilliance and I hope to see him really playing later on ... right now he's in a solid position whereas Ozzy is at risk so I suppose he has little to do. I also get the feeling Sundra will emerge. She has not had to do anything yet except stay off the boot radar and I get a Danni feel from her (not a winner edit, but an adaptor like Danni).

Whenever we see Sundra talk about the game we see her reflecting on her strategy of keeping her eyes open and being aware how changeable the game is. I think this is very positive, as the players who get blindsided are the cocky ones. She's not cocky or clueless or spouting off about integrity; she is just looking for a path in a game where she was not favored by luck of the draw with a good alliance position.

I think that Nate and Rebecca represent the black tribe, by their speech. They are upholding Hiki or what's left of it, but Sundra shook off the ethnic tribal identity at the swap and is now just a player, similar to her own statements that they're all human beings out there. I have this feeling we'll be rooting for Nate until he goes down and we'll be sad, kind of like when Brandon went down, or Austen. That's my sense of him.

Jonathan I would love to see go far but I can't read what will become of him. He's just such a good narrator he would get face time no matter how far he went. He's that rare "character" who isn't just an oddball; he's funny and intelligent and strategic and cynical (like Jeff Varner). Due to the emphasis on trust with Jonathan, I expect one of two things to happen with him. Either he will dump his alliance to join the underdogs or he will stay in a majority alliance but get dumped prematurely due to lack of trust (like Judd). Although I suppose he could end up like Gary Hogeboom, not trusted and in an alliance that ends up without the numbers, so picked off when he fails to win Ic.

Parvati -- I think we have to consider the "eye candy" factor. There is one in every season the camera loves to track in a bikini, and this season it's Parvati. Honestly I think she would get attention no matter how long term she is so long as she makes the jury. It used to be the sweetheart place was F6, but they were always seen a lot of on the show despite not getting to F4. Parvati has managed to position herself pretty well, but I think ultimately her fate will be tied to the Caucasian tribe, because of her bond to Candice and Adam that we've been shown. I feel it's hammered in that Candice is NOT happy or secure in her alliance with Jonathan and only wants to make the merge with it although she and Becky and Sundra are now pretty tight.

Aitu is done for as a tribe; Hiki is not shown as a force due to nothing said about getting Sundra back and Sundra showing no concern about getting back to Rebecca her first ally. Puka has been shown to break down into the separate nationalities, which is a good thing for Becky/Yul but not working with Brad/Jenny who have instead pursued gender alliances. And CB was just alone.

The Caucasian tribe, however, is still shown as a force although Jessica is not playing along, and I expect to see something there when the merge comes, something that will make Yul and Becky go uh-oh and pull in Sundra and Ozzy. I definitely feel that the Asian-Caucasian alliance is the thing revealed that will not last, as it's not to their benefit to get too bloated with numbers by adding Adam and Parvati, Candice's buddies.

The Caucasian tribe is the only one where they aren't talking about representing (understandably), and if they continue on the editing has made it clear that it's not about ethnicity, but rather Adam/Parvati/Candice had the good fortune of being put with original tribesmates they genuinely clicked with, whereas Jessica did not feel the love in her tribe. She felt she didn't belong, and in the other tribes we were shown pretty honestly that the alignments by ethnicity were not enough to weld everyone together automatically.

Pairs:
Adam/Candice: I think we'll seen them become a Gregg/Jenn.

Sundra/Rebecca: This pair seems doomed and I wonder why we were shown it other than to explain the first vote of the season. All I can think of was to highlight Sundra's ability to gravitate towards an ally. The recap didn't bother to show this bond, but we had a whole scene with Adam/Candice and the Yul/Becky bonding was repeated, as VS noted, even though it was 100% old footage.

Yul/Becky:
For some reason I believe in the Yul/Becky alliance although others think she has to betray him.

But if we recall our Survivor history, we have had 2-person alliances such as Neleh/Paschal and Rodger/Lis, Jenna/Heidi, Varner/Alicia, Tom/Ian, Terry/Dan, Rafe/Steph, and Rob/Amber, that were set up right at the beginning of the season as a specially trusting relationship, and remained in place until the players were booted. (Terry/Dan is questionable whether Terry ditched Dan; he did not turn against Dan, but he did write his name down).

So I can't agree that when a Power of Two is revealed early on that this means we can expect a betrayal. In fact I think the statistics support that more of these highlighted pairs stay loyal and have an impact on the endgame.

ETA
RARO
I didn't write anything really about Jenny, Brad, or Rebecca because I don't feel anything about them as players, nothing shown in the way of a strategy other than keeping tribe on track and trying not to lose IC's. With Adam/Pavarti/Nate I feel they are in the game and big presences.

AITU
I also couldn't get too worked up about Jessica because her whole story has been interesting person, strong challenge competitor, zero strategy. And zero strategy surrounded by players is not a sign of survival ... her fate was shown linked to Cao Boi and she should follow him out, and as I would be surprised if all the current Aitu make the merge, I'm not thinking she has a future, unlike Courtney who solidified an alliance. Although she has certainly been a highlighted personality who would not be an unknown quantity on the jury if she had the luck to squeak through.

Candice's story seems to be about reuniting with Adam.
I haven't seen any there there with Becky other than her tie to Yul, but I believe she could be hidden and brought out later when her time comes to scheme again.

In other words, I don't think it's a bad sign when people are low on story in early--mid game, so long as they were introduced in Ep 1 and 2, AND if they are not in any danger due to having a winning tribe or a dominant alliance. With 20 people there are a lot of stories to tell and these people will re-emerge when it comes time in the game for them to play harder.

However, with a losing tribe like Raro, it does not bode well for players who are not given much strategy or much focus on personality either, as there's no reason for them to be edited UTR unless their stories are limited to their boot arc.

With Adam and Nate both we've seen a whole lot of personality and so I do see them as jurors and the same applies to Parvati.


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10-31-06, 02:35 PM (EST)
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2. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
LAST EDITED ON 10-31-06 AT 02:36 PM (EST)

OFG - While something has to come of all this trust between Becky and Yul being banged into our head - I dont necessarily think it means that one of them betrays the other, but it could still pan out badly for one of them.
A few options:
Say Yul saves Becky at a vote and then goes home the next vote?
Yul could think she's safe one night and elect to not give her the idol and she goes home.
Yul could give her the idol thinking she's going home, and instead he goes home because he doesnt have it at TC?

Personally I think the story we're being prepped for is that its going to come down to Yul, Becky, and probably Ozzy as the final three (perhaps Becky is there because Yul saved her with the HII?). If Becky wins immunity, I just cant see her taking Yul over Ozzy - loyalty or not. No one could win against Yul. But against Ozzy? You've got decent odds. I think that she's very loyal to him - but not to the point of handing him the money over herself. Only Colby was that stupid.

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10-31-06, 02:59 PM (EST)
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3. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
A few options:
Say Yul saves Becky at a vote and then goes home the next vote?
Yul could think she's safe one night and elect to not give her the idol and she goes home.
Yul could give her the idol thinking she's going home, and instead he goes home because he doesnt have it at TC?

Possibility #4: Yul knows that Becky is on the chopping block but elects not to give her the idol and she gets voted out.

I think Yul probably seriously reconsidered after he came perilously close to having to save Becky in Ep 3. He won't give her the idol now unless it absolutely doesn't put him at any current or future risk. If it does, he'll let her get voted out, imo. (So there you'd have a betrayal of sorts.)


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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10-31-06, 03:28 PM (EST)
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4. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
LAST EDITED ON 10-31-06 AT 03:29 PM (EST)

I agree BR...this is getting scary. I don't think Yul will use it to Becky's benefit. It also could bring to forefront Yul's "oath" to play as honorably as he can...he may end up with a HUGE ulcer!

The only thing I came up with after the recrap about animals is that I think the hermit crab may deal with "trust" issues. It's always showing up around Yul and he talks of trusting and not trusting people.

So we "know"

Rainbow=end of an arc of a "nice" person (CB and Steph)
centipede=twist in the game as to how people are voting?
hermit crab= trust?
White bird soaring=Ozzy

The only new animal I saw in the recrap was a little spider dangling in front of the Raro flag.


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10-31-06, 04:37 PM (EST)
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5. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
I'm beginning to wonder if we may see a conflict of interest at some point between Becky and the girls and Yul and the guys - and will this have an affect on Yul and Becky's relationship?

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10-31-06, 07:24 PM (EST)
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6. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
My take on Yul's reveal to Becky is not that he assured her he'll keep her safe ...

but he will think more strategically than Terry and if an opportunity presents where the game could be changed by putting the idol in play he would be open to it. Terry could probably have used the idol to get the numbers back on his side. I'm guessing that's what Yul has in mind. Engineer it so the idol sends one of the opposition home if the numbers are right.

Of course he had no way of seeing into the future of the game when he said all that. This was before the reshuffle even.

My take on why it was shown -- to tease the viewers with the idea that the idol gets played this season. It doesn't matter one bit whether it ever gets played. Just dangle that in front of us in Ep 2 so we'll keep watching.

I would never accuse the editing team of having so much integrity about only using relevant material that they would not edit in anything and everything that could entice viewers. Ratings are everything.


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11-01-06, 10:40 AM (EST)
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7. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
My take on why it was shown -- to tease the viewers with the idea that the idol gets played this season. It doesn't matter one bit whether it ever gets played. Just dangle that in front of us in Ep 2 so we'll keep watching.

I agree. To make the idol relevant to the show, they almost *have* to show any nugget that pertains to what might happen with it down the line -- especially if nothing happens for a long time (or ever).


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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11-03-06, 10:22 AM (EST)
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8. "the editing"
i wasn't sure where this post belonged, so i figured i'd throw it in here, because it's about the editing.

i think perhaps this season is being edited to show the audience that the winner can win without ever breaking honesty.

i think that was confirmed last night when they showed that yul voted jonathan. so he WASN'T lying when he said it's good to have someone like flicka stick around.

interesting.

~ cqc

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11-03-06, 10:31 AM (EST)
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9. "RE: the editing"
Yul voted for Jessica

http://www.cbs.com/primetime/survivor13/show/vh.shtml

We'll see how long his speech to the camera was (they are getting longer and longer, right BR?!?) from Insider


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11-03-06, 11:15 AM (EST)
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10. "RE: the editing"
Thanks for the reminder, emy, I'll post the Yul word count later. This should be another long one, I think.

cq scared me there for a minute, because I didn't really pay attention when they showed the votes during the credits. I assumed they all voted for Flicka.



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11-03-06, 11:44 AM (EST)
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11. "dammit"

my freakin husband is FIRED. he SWORE yul voted jonathan...

(i missed it cuz i was putting the baby to bed)

~ cqc

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11-03-06, 11:49 AM (EST)
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12. "Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidden immunity idol"
Ozzy continues to get the Terry type edit, very strong and god like. He is out F3 or F4. (Sorry Emy)

Parvati impressed me with her strength at the RC, she was right there with Adam while Rebecca lay there exhausted.

Funny how Ozzy was the one at the beginning that Christina didn't trust, and now wholly we see that nobody trusts Jonathan, not even Candace (unless she is acting which could be quite possible) Ozzy as a strong threat it makes sense for him to want to get rid of the people that are planning and scheming.

Regarding Sundra, man she isn't even getting as much air time as Vecepia did, I cringe to think of her in the F2, if she makes it there.


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11-03-06, 05:43 PM (EST)
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14. "RE: Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidden immunity idol"
You HUSH!!! Me and FP know that Ozzy wins!!

I really don't see Ozzy as a Terry edit. He's more of the young buck Colby but Ozzy's not that stupid

Although when they ate that bird last nite....EEK!

MOre later on my animals GREAT WEEK FOR ANIMALS!



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11-04-06, 08:14 AM (EST)
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15. "RE: Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidden immunity idol"
I still believe, emy! This season's theme is indeed MINORITIES. Minorities together, and underdogs...who was the ultimate minority...Ozzy, when all of his original tribemates were picked off, who was the ultimate underdog in his tribe, Ozzy, ...it will end with the ultimate underdog winning the ultimate prize!


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11-05-06, 12:47 PM (EST)
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18. "RE: Ozzy = The new Terry sans hidden immunity idol"
While I see Ozzy definitely F4 & very likely F2, because others will see him as beatable, because he's not well liked among the rest . . . I DO NOT see Ozzy as an underdog & he's definitely not getting a Terry edit, because Ozzy is much more shrewd.

Reason's Ozzy is not the underdog (IMO):

#1 It's partially his fault he's the only Orig. Aitu left, since he decided to throw a challenge & eat one of their numbers.

#2 He's too dominating to be an underdog.

#3 His edit has shown that the others don't really like him, trust him & feel threatened by him; additionally, he's too cocky to be an underdog -- no humility.

He's a force in this game & after the "mutiny" he will be 1/4 of the underdog tribe, mostly by default.


Kind Creation of ARNutz

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11-04-06, 09:35 PM (EST)
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16. "Episode #7: The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
I see the discussion has started and Ozzy is the hot topic!
Like Terry, Ozzy does everything for the tribe but his deals fail and his allies keep falling. He has been given more development to his character than Terry did. Can he go further? It is possible. Here's what I saw in this episode which made me think it was all about:

Deal or No Deal:

It has been a recurring theme this season, the tribes have constantly been portrayed as complete opposites. Strangely enough, they’ve kept the numbers even. Aitu is a tribe of strategic thinkers, who kidnapped Nathan only to frustrate Raro’s challenge strategy. They think ahead and constantly analyze their standing in the game. Raro is an emotional tribe that reacts to each outburst caused by the difficult conditions or the challenge performances. The strategizing is minimal, tribal harmony is favored but is never attained. Even the reward catalogue caused an argument in Raro. Aitu found the catalogue “awesome” and we heard Jonathan, the leader, say: “You guys vote for what you want, it’s a democracy.” The members of Raro that make waves get stabbed in the back or smacked in the face.

The Dealers: Aitu

Ozzy was a target right from the start with the conversation Yul, Becky and Candice shared. They were rethinking Jonathan’s position but Ozzy seemed destined to be next. What did he do? He turned the episode into OzFest once more. He was the star of the first challenge. It was smart to throw the stick and be free to swim as fast as possible. He also performed well in the second competition.

He knows that Candice needs to have someone providing food. After catching the bird and getting coconuts, we heard Candice telling us: “Ozzy is amazing…He’s jungle-boy.” He used the good provider angle to talk to her about booting Jonathan. It was funny to see Jon looking for food on the beach but not finding anything during Ozzy’s talk. Did he think tag-teaming with Flica was going to help? It was a mistake because there was no bond between the ex-Raro girls. His approach with Yul was much smarter. Yul had told us that, “The guy is surprising, I underestimated him…we should get rid of him while we still have the control rather than wait for the merge and the individual challenges.” Ozzy didn’t just say, “I don’t trust Jon” he told Yul, “Jonathan is always plotting and scheming. He never gives information, he’s always the one to ask.” That is something Yul can observe for himself and make up his own mind.

Ozzy was honest in TC, openly admitting he could be a target, explaining he wanted to make them all fat and that they can ride along with him. He figures that if he leaves because he is strong then that is the best way to go. There wasn’t any dramatic pleading, just sensible reminders which should work well with his intended ally, the rational Yul.

Candice had a very good episode. She got a feel of what everyone was thinking because everyone came to her: Yul and Becky have made her their favored discussion partner. They took the chance of telling her that they’d like to replace Jon by Sundra in the booting order. That was risky but it shows they trust her. She didn’t give anything away by agreeing. Flica and Ozzy revealed their plan to get rid of Jonathan. Sundra and Jonathan followed her to her refuge on the beach to get away from “The funky vibe in camp.”

She had two good challenge performances, the first of which was underlined by a touching scene of Yul comforting her after a tough swim and then Becky jumping in her arms that was presented also in a slow-motion replay for good measure.

She was the one that told us how the vote was breaking down: “There’s been a debate; Ozzy brings a lot of food home and he is good in challenges…Jessica is driving people crazy with her paranoia…Jonathan is on the cusp of our alliance since from the beginning, people have a hard time trusting him.” The only negativity came at TC where any interaction she could’ve had with Jeff was ignored.

During The Peanut Butter scene, we heard her saying: “I’m in love with everybody that I can see right now.” Could that be the zenith of the “Everybody Loves Candice” story? We have to see some hate soon!

Yul once more, tells us how his alliance stacks up. If the alliance is going to fail, one would expect the player telling us about the alliance, to be among the victims. He got another earful of how very few people trust his ally, Jonathan. He is being careful but still defends his co-leader, not yet distrusting him.

His words at TC about Flica, being a nice person that doesn’t scheme or undermine others, was used as a dig against Jonathan by the editors, showing us a quick glimpse of the worried author underlined by a dramatic cymbal sound. Flica had almost single-handedly ruined Yul’s plans in the first Aitu boot. His words show he has a forgiving disposition. In Survivor, it makes him sound a little naïve. Not everyone plays like Flica but he seemed to wish they did.

Becky remained the silent one. She was seen in some crucial strategy scenes. She was smart to ask Candice, (“Who do you want to compete against in individual immunity, Jonathan or Sundra?”) instead of telling her what she thought. Yul proposed Jonathan to which Candice agreed. The new pecking order was then settled. She’s an enthusiastic player, clapping after placing each piece in its proper position and then embracing Candice after the win.

She had an important confessional after saying Jessica made a good point about a Jonathan boot: “Ozzy, he’s is awesome in challenges. Today was an important indicator, the fact that Jonathan sat out today. We lost but we didn’t really need him, per se. If none of us trust him, why is he still here?” She is a cold, calculating player. Jeff appears to have forgotten her when she’s at TC. She still is well placed to go far but it cannot be good for winning it all.

Jonathan was the ugliest cheerleader I’ve ever seen during both challenges! He had an unusual number of scenes where he was fishing alone on the beach. He had been with Ozzy in the boat but now King Neptune has deserted him. Many bootees have been shown to go on their own but he’s still standing.

His talk on the beach with Candice and Sundra was very analytical. He agreed they needed Ozzy and “maybe the choice is Flica”. He had a great confessional: “My over-thinking can bite me in the butt…people say that I’m thinking too much…I’m trying to choose my battles carefully and stay one step ahead of the competition. I may trip because I’m running too far, too fast ahead. If I thought of it, someone else has thought of it also.” He followed that with a summit conference with Yul on the beach where he told him the girls agreed on Flica. It helped secure his position for now.

At TC, He had a theme oriented answer where he said it was not surprising that ethnicity played no part in how the game was played. He should survive well after the merge but it should catch up to him before the end.

Sundra climbed into fourth place in the alliance by just staying quiet. Listening is a strategy that few employ, most like to talk. There was no malice in her voice when she said about Ozzy catching a bird: “He is a crazy man.” After the IC loss, she confided, “Jessica is just covering her @ss, she is like the mosquito that won’t die.” It wasn’t the nicest send-off, was it? Later at TC, she also had a theme answer, that the bonds aren’t planned. It is about chemistry and finding common ground.

With everyone having glowing comments, Aitu is turning into the Ozzy fan club. He has a long way to go but it could be his story to the end. Yul is the only one that could stop the ride everyone is enjoying on Ozzy’s crazy train! Yul hasn’t acted like a Survivor yet, will he do it in time?

Raro: Where they don’t make deals, they smack them in the face!

We never had comments about Cristina’s boot. Jeff didn’t even mention the new look of Raro when they entered the challenge arena. We can take that to mean Cristina’s exit has no influence on future events even for Ozzy, her last original tribe mate.

Adam isn’t a subtle player. He let Brad know he couldn’t go against the majority of the tribe. Showing his arrogance with this quote on EI, “I’m starting to doubt my tribe… It’s hard to soar like an eagle when you are surrounded by turkeys.” We saw him on the island because of the storm he had to endure, not to show any character development. Adam is Raro’s bully. We hear him berating Brad during the staircase-building to which Jeff adds; “The women are doing a lot of the work for Raro while the guys are debating which one is longest!” What was he doing putting the puzzle together in the second challenge? Does he also have “good spatial vision.” Good thing Jenny wrestled all the pieces from his clumsy paws!

Nathan was honored to have been picked by Aitu but it was so he could warm the bench for them instead of playing against them. He did get some notes to put in his pad about Aitu’s divisions. He wants to use it to make the right moves but he needed to notice how that tribe works. Aitu’s planning and strategizing are what wins them their share of challenges. Nathan is emulating Adam instead, calling out Brad during the challenge for not swimming. The argument continued at camp: “I needed you swimming, brother.” Then he confesses, “Today’s challenge, it frustrated me that I couldn’t compete, I’m a good swimmer…Brad took a back-seat today and it pissed me off…I don’t know what the deal with Brad was…Maybe he didn’t want to be cold…We needed him there, I don’t care about a stupid puzzle.” The nice guy has his limits and that “Welcome Home” wasn’t what he expected.

Parvati exchanged a smile with Nate when they arrived at the challenge. She was quick to let him know that nothing had changed by saying it was “awesome” when Jeff said he’d be rejoining Raro after the RC. She did her best to shoulder the burden with Adam in the first challenge but being one person short while competing in a water challenge against Ozzy’s team was too big a task. She added her view on how miserable the challenge was and how angry she was with Brad. “I wanted to punch him in the mouth” she told Jenny, knowing that there is no more any ‘Puka-connection’ there. A fourth emotional boot is being set up in Raro, Parvati hasn’t taken the blame for any but she has profited from each one. She once more went in the water for the second challenge and even if it wasn’t as convincing, she kept it close enough so that her team mates could come from behind.

Jenny had a quiet episode. We never saw her trying to find out who voted for her which probably means it won’t be an issue. For her trust in the tribe not to be an issue could mean she remains a target. Her performance in the second puzzle might give her more time than expected. She completed the whole thing while Rebecca and Adam watched.

Rebecca tried but she lacked the stamina. We heard Nathan tell her, “You still gave what you got. You still stepped up to the plate” and he hugged her. Since it wasn’t a lack of will, what else could be said? It might come down to who can help the tribe more and her admission of “My body is just done” could force the tribe to sacrifice her. We didn’t hear from her, so the recap wasn’t the start of a new arc.

Brad just had to get along with everyone until the merge. His vote against Jenny was never brought up, that keeps him as an outsider. He then got into it about the reward catalogue. Adam and Parvati were the ones the cameras focused on going against “The voice of reason.” Jenny silently agreed with the pair and Adam said; “It’s 3 against 2 though” to end the argument. The one voting with Brad, Rebecca, wasn’t mentioned so we were meant to only see Brad as the outsider. Trying to be the voice of reason against some cravings tells us he never watched Survivor Amazon! Later, his lame excuse for refusing to swim sealed his fate.

If tribal unity is the theme for Raro, then the one that is in the best position to represent that is Parvati who gets along with both the women and the men and hasn’t created any waves…yet! Nate also needs to be considered.


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11-05-06, 12:20 PM (EST)
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17. "Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
FOR OUR WONDER TWINS???

Happy Birthday FP and SCAR!!!


But there are a lot of other interesting animals this week!!

We first have our BROWN stork in the water trying to get fish....next shot OZZY hacking a coconut with the machete.
The brown birds I see as being the "also rans" with the white bird...well more about the white bird later!

After the RC we see a bunch of hermit crabs all munching on what look likes some big insect but I could really tell what exactly it was--next shot all of Aitu were eating their peanut butter and Candice saying "I love everyone right now" The crabs continue to me represent trust and at that point in the game everyone on Aitu was happy together eating...just like the hermit crabs.

Well the next animal scene starts with a lot of cooing--it seemed like the editors heightened that sound..and we see of all people Ozzy coming in with a WHITE bird which he caught while going to the bathroom!!! Jon and Becky are seen at the fire and I think I heard Jon say something about letting it go and then you hear a woman's voice (I think it was Flica of all people the veg.--see her insider Day After speech) from the tent saying EAT it for dinner. Becky stays quiet but she was licking her chops!! After Yul the butcher comes out to kill it..Jon says...ok lets RESPECT it and eat it and use it for nourishment. We then see Candice Sundra Becky and Yul gnawing on the bones of the bird using every last bit of that bird...interestingly Jon was not focused on..I really think he didn't want to kill it. Ozzy wasn't even shown eating his own catch. Yul talks about how nutritious the liver is!

Now, my first thought was OMH they are eating Ozzy--as that white bird has been inextricably linked to Ozzy from the beginning...even in the opening sequence--and he can't win this game. But I think it was added the way it was because first it was an interesting tidbit to add to show (catching food is always that in survivor) and also to show how everyone is going to use Ozzy for his providing nourishment til there is nothing left (that's why they showed them picking the bones and not chomping into the full meat of Ozzythe white bird.) That sequence showed to me that he Ozzy is going to be around for a long time...til there's nothing left to get from Ozzy. Now whether by this point the others have waited too long...bc Ozzy has entrenched himself in the game and with others, I don't know; but the eating of the white bird is not fatal to Ozzy's chances imho.

Now the next animals we see are the birds overhead(look all to be white) flying above in between when Flica was talking to Candice and when she was talking to Sundra. The birds flying overhead was seen in Ep 6 when Cristina was scrambling..so I think if you see birds flying above...look to see if someone is trying to save themselves (from the vultures ) and likely that person does not.

Now the next animals was very interesting. It was a live hermit Crab out of its shell with flies on top of the white "meat" of the crab with the flies picking on the crab for what it could get. We then see Ozzy and Yul talking about not trusting Jonathan. (interestingly the flies were also shown right after Sundra talked about Flica being another insect a mosqito)

We then get a very important confessional for Jonathan. He says he has to watch and not get too far ahead of himself and if I thought of it so did someone else. It shows that he is being careful about his own game play. We then see a RAT eating a little something and then we go back to Ozzy telling Yul that Jon is always plotting and scheming.

At TC no twisty centipede is seen this week; rather we see a really really UGLY WET RAT right after Jon votes and before Candice does.

Jon Candice and Ozzy were the stars of this ep. I really think we are not seeing the real story of Ozzy and Jon--just hints of it. I am thinking they may have a secret F2 pact. Jon was the only one that really didn't want to eat the white bird and was not shown gnawing on its carcass.

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11-05-06, 12:52 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
Thanks for the bday greetings, emy! Right back attcha, belatedly!

I think your assessments with the white bird are indeed on the right track. I don't see it as the end of Ozzy, of course one could argue that in the end he'll be eaten up. But, I do think they will get everything from him that he has to offer. I do not see an F2 pact between Jonathan and Ozzy, however. I think Jonathan is the rat. I would love it if they did.

I do agree with michel, when he notes that Ozzy has received alot more character development than Terry every did, and that gives me great hope. As I said up above, in a season of underdogs, Ozzy is the ultimate. I don't know what to make of Ozzy trying to align with others in his tribe, but seemingly always picking the wrong members to align with....as his effort to align with Flicka and Candice, and then we have Flicka booted. Is this just editing, to make him appear more vulnerable to the viewer. We know he has an agreement with Yul.(At least those of us that read the insider do). He is being edited as the real underdog most at risk with no hidden II to protect him, I take this editing as a very positive sign...

I also see Adam as a big, dumb bully who does play an emotional game, and therefore will fall quite short, thankfully. Jenny and Rebecca are fringe players and not central to the tribe at all and I suspect will be gone soon as will Brad. There is quite alot of anymosity toward Brad, and I don't know if he can save himself. Voting against the majority in the last 2 TC's could be fatal.

Parvati showed some real fortitude in the challenge I thought...but she is seemingly going under the radar, imo. Nate is becoming a central character, and continues to be a narrator...

I can not wait for ep 8! Should be facinating! Thanks for your insight michel and emy!


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11-07-06, 09:04 AM (EST)
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20. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
When I watched the white bird scene, I was shocked that Ozzy was the one to capture the bird and offer it up for sacrifice. The editors have tied Ozzy to the bird for a reason and I would have expected anyone else to have been the one to "capture Ozzy" and have him for dinner.

The supposed Ozzy-Jonathon link seems plausible in that Jon was the tribemate most hesitant to kill the bird and eat it. Jon wants to save his alliance partner, but knows it will isolate him from the rest of the tribe. So he waits to hear what everyone else wants to do. When no one steps up, Yul is called on to make the decision.

Along comes Yul and does what no one else is willing to do. He knows killing the white bird and eating it makes the tribe stronger, i.e. he knows that voting off Ozzy is necessary to protect his alliance and make it stronger.

Does Ozzy pull some stunt later on that forces his tribemates to vote him off?


Another VS thread rookie poster (but longtime reader)

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11-07-06, 10:53 AM (EST)
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21. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
Is this just editing, to make him appear more vulnerable to the viewer...He is being edited as the real underdog most at risk with no hidden II to protect him...

I agree with CattyChat up above -- I really don't see Ozzy as an underdog at all, despite all the lukewarm attempts to paint him as such. It's clear he has never seriously been in danger of being voted out (not least because Aitu's hardly ever had to attend TC).

The editing has its clunky qualities this season, as usual. We keep hearing everyone say how Jonathan is sneaky and untrustworthy, but we never see Jonathan *do* anything that supports those statements. Similarly we've heard people say they don't trust Ozzy but we don't know exactly why they don't. They are telling us things rather than showing us things and it makes for a poor presentation.

As for the bird -- does anyone know what kind of bird that was? And how did they know they could eat it? (I was reminded of the infamous unshown penguin sequence with Rupert and Christa on PI.)


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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11-07-06, 11:10 AM (EST)
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22. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
And how did they know they could eat it?

I can answer this one. Before the filming kicks off each season they prep the survivors on the native flora and fauna, what is edible and what is not. What animals are protected and which ones are not. So that bird was not only edible, it wasn't a native protected species.


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11-07-06, 11:31 AM (EST)
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23. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
unshown penguin sequence

Survivor Antartica!!

and they said they'd never go to a cold climate!!



Handcrafted by RollDdice

Or I guess it could be Survivor Pittsburgh with all the winners, contestants from around here!


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11-07-06, 11:34 AM (EST)
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25. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
Survivor Pittsburgh

Isn't that what Ben Rothliesberger is playing this season?


KO scurries away like a Jonathan rat...

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27. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
Did I say penguin? LOL. I meant pelican. (If Mistofleas were here she would have corrected me.)


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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24. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
I think it was an adult booby like CB knocked out of her nest...
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26. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
It seems like since ozzy is so strongly linked to the white bird that him catching and eating it could mean that he does something later to cause his own death in the game. Even if that doesn't happen until the f2 it sure makes it look like he ends up being the cause of his own downfall.

Johnathan wasn't the one that didn't want to eat the bird. When it was brought into camp flicka asked something about is the bird hurt. Ozzy said no he was just holding it and johnathan said that if he were to let it go it could just fly away. I think that is what is being misunderstood as him not wanting to eat it because he was all for it from the beginning. He then called yuls name to come out so he could give his idea what they should do with it. From off camera yul said he wasn't going to eat it but yet he ended up doing just that. He was also the only one that had what it took to kill pluck and gut it too.

Which reminds me of something else. I saw all the discussion in another thread about the survivors that were being carried on the litters and who was in the green shirt. When yul came out to get the bird he was wearing the green shirt that cowboy had. Apparently he left it there and yul has been wearing it. There was also a glimpse of him in the green shirt at another point in that episode too.

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11-07-06, 02:44 PM (EST)
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28. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
Is this just editing, to make him appear more vulnerable to the viewer...He is being edited as the real underdog most at risk with no hidden II to protect him...

Since Mistofleas is not here to correct you, then I will. That is me who you are quoting, not Catty Chat!, LOL

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11-07-06, 02:57 PM (EST)
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29. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
Ahem, that was not a mistake -- I knew I was quoting you, I responded to your post. *Then* I referred to CattyChat's post.


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30. "RE: Ep 7 ANIMALS--Why isn't there a MONKEY?"
Oh, alright! Sorry, nevermind, my bad...


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11-03-06, 04:22 PM (EST)
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13. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
I always read this thread but have never posted here before, as my posts are not nearly as in-depth or insightful as "the regulars". (Thank you all especially VS for starting and developing the editing analysis thread).

I did notice the narrator for Aitu seemed to change last night. For the most part, it has been Jonathan for Aitu in prior episodes. But last night Joanthan seemed to be squeezed out of this role by Ozzy.

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31. "Episode #8 The Mutiny"
LAST EDITED ON 11-11-06 AT 09:17 PM (EST)

For once, I didn’t have to look for this episode’s theme. It has to be one of the best ever. The Mutiny played in four acts:

All Quiet on the Aitu Front
Aitu is a team that has gone over their plans together and, after a difficult first boot, they have been on the same page to boot the Outsiders. Again, we hear the alliance of 5 using Ozzy’s nap time to solidify their pact.
-Jonathan tells all of them, “Listen, we’re in a good place. We’ve really done well, us five…We continue to stay tight and we know what the next move is if we have an elimination. The most solid thing is, if we go in with 6 and they have 4, we keep Ozzy around for at least one vote and vote somebody off and then vote Ozzy off. Then the five of us can go to town.”

Everyone nods and smiles at the plan while Ozzy sleeps, oblivious to his planned doom. Yul agrees that “Our interests are advanced if we stay tight. If we break up now, we’re going to be toast.” There are no worries on this front…or is there?

The scheming Jonathan tells us that everybody is a little antsy with a merge coming in a few days but reiterates that Ozzy is next to leave. He adds, “No matter how tight your five is, things are going to change.” No kidding!!

Candice confides, “I don’t want to keep this 6 through the merge.” We hear a simulated thunder clap in the back-ground and we see her talking with Jonathan while the confessional goes on. “I want to get back together with Adam and Parvati,” she tell us. “I want to see some movement, get some people out of here. I’m nervous because I feel it is the calm before the storm and that stuff’s about to start moving.”

Jonathan did have a talk with Candice before the mutiny: “You and I are tight. We’re gonna make this work. You set something up with Parvati lets hope we can do that. It will be us 4 Caucasians in the final 4. At that point, we have the numbers and we have to be the ones that flop before they do. I’m determined not to be the guy that made the move too late.” He goes on to add, “I trusted you all along and you trusted me. It got us this far and I think it’s gonna get us much further. Only two people can sit at the final 2 and I want it to be you and me. I swear to God” He even had that talk underlined by a confessional telling us how Candice is the person he is closest to.

Candice tells us that, “Jonathan’s got this new plan but I don’t think Jonathan has any allegiance. I’d like to see Jonathan go” She soon would force him to act quickly not to be that guy that took too much time to make his move. 3 seconds she’ll give him and now he depends on her instead of the other way around!


Trouble in Paradise
The “We are Family” tribe keeps finding targets. It started with a simple fireside discussion, Nate saying: “We’re going to merge soon.”
Parvati, among others, answered, “We have nothing to worry about. We’re 6-6.”
Brad concluded, “And then, it’s like, every man for himself,” and left camp to go fishing.

Nathan couldn’t believe what he just heard.
Parvati points out, “He’s digging a hole. It infuriates me that he said that. It’s not an individual game yet. We don’t need him after the merge anyway”
Jenny and Rebecca agree, with Rebecca saying: “You need people you can trust in the merge.”
The scene ended with Nate in confessional telling us, “Brad…has done questionable things. He is slim-shady. I lost my trust in Brad which sucks because I really like the guy…There is no I in the team for him right now”

Reaction to the Mutiny
Even before the Mutiny, both Adam and Parvati were shown smiling at the approaching Aitu. The smiles were directed at their OldRaro friend, Candice.

The first reaction to the mutiny was Parvati’s, her smile underlined Jeff’s words of “Candice has mutinied.” Ozzy shook his head, seeing the last second decision by Jonathan. Before we see the greetings, the camera lingered on the 4 Aitu looking dejected and fragile. Parvati is heard with a “Welcome back” while hugging Jonathan.

Aitu is looking at each other when Jeff points out: “Yul, you don’t look happy.”
“I’m stunned,” he told Jeff. “I thought we had a good thing planned. I’m very surprised.”
Ozzy is asked for his reaction. “I’m not surprised,” he answers. “If they don’t have the backbone to stick it out with their tribe, then it’s fine. I’m sure they’ll get their fate sooner or later”

The description of the reward was greeted by Parvati jumping up and down, Jenny covering her face in amazement and Raro hugging each other in anticipation. Aitu’s reaction was much more restrained. We were meant to see them as focusing on the challenge not the reward.

After the challenge, Ozzy’s reaction told it all. He pumped his fist in a taunting move to Raro’s bloated bench. “Mutineers are the first people to die” he exclaimed twice. He enjoyed sending Candice to Exile Island. She waved at Aitu but didn’t get a wave back.

Sundra’s emotional reaction underlined Jeff’s words that the game took a dramatic turn. She cried when she said: “I wanted to stay true to my guys. We worked well together, it felt good.” Later, in confessional she expressed the mood of the tribe: “When I saw the mutiny in its completion, the numbers were scary. Standing there and feeling so small and pityful. You look over there, to the Raro side, they look so big and triumphant. When we won the challenge, I cried. I don’t think I’ve ever been so happy in my life.”
Yul, always the diplomat, said: “I’m so amazingly proud. I’m honored to be sharing this with you.”

The reward was an occasion not only to savor but to focus the tribe on their new goal: Making the Final 4 together. Now Aitu is a family as Ozzy points out: “We’re a team to the end.”

In Raro, Nate told us “ I knew Candice was going to come over here…Brad is safe for the vote if it comes to that because he stood with us. The first one is definitely Jonathan, there is no question about that. If you think we’re going to have your back after we just saw you sell out your other tribe, are you dumb?”
The camera had lingered on Rebecca’s scowl when Jonathan started explaining his reasoning. This family is too large.

Making Connections
Jonathan had a pivotal talk with Adam. Adam says he is glad both came over. Jonathan worries about the next two votes but “Candice and I wanted to come back here with you and Parvati all along.” They reached an agreement that they could go to an all Caucasian Final 4. Adam confides that it is good to have someone want him for the ride to the final 4.

After the challenge, Parvati takes Candice aside and asks: “So, what’s going on? Jonathan’s like ‘me and Candice are super tight…How tight?”
“Not tight”, answers Candice, Not too tight at all. I was shocked. He’s had long talks with Yul all the time. He only came back to try and solidify something with me in the past few days. He’s doing whatever’s best for him, working everybody all the time. You know what I mean?”
Parvati is shown in a close-up nodding her understanding and analyzing the situation. A spider appears from the side of the screen where Parvati had been and scurries across its web to eat a captured insect. That imagery is clear: Parvati is the one that attracts people in her web. Candice is in her camp now.

Nathan walked into the shelter to have a talk with Adam. Nathan jokes about Jonathan looking for clams: “Feed us while you’re still here.”
Adam proposes: “Maybe we should keep him a while.” He makes a good point after Nate’s original refusal: “After the merge, Jonathan can’t go back to them now, but Brad can. Jonathan is stuck with us.” Nathan agrees and they both promise that Jon and Brad are the next two to go anyway.

Candice then talked with Adam in the presence of most of the tribe “Every day, I wished I could get over here. I couldn’t argue about sending you to Exile Island…Mister Man was running his mouth”…“Jonathan…It was his suggestion to begin with.”
“Why would he do that?” asked a puzzled Adam.
“I don’t know. I could never figure it out,” she answers. “I think he was threatened. He didn’t want to compete with you…He wanted to break you”
Adam explodes about that information. He confesses that “Jonathan has been talking trash…He can kiss our butt because we are going to vote him out.”
Adam is still fuming about that and calls Jonathan a punk in a talk with Nathan who lets us know: “Adam wants to take a brick and beat Jonathan over the head with it. But, we have to think smart. The game isn’t over yet.”

As far as the players of this story:

Candice exposed the situation clearly in that early confessional. She made a very risky move that puts her fate in this game in her hands rather than simply following Yul’s lead. It is a very dangerous road to get to the end but it made us take notice that she is a gambler. She knows that: “There are 4 people on the Aitutaki tribe that are very mad at me now. They’ll be gunning for me.”

There is Nathan’s comment, knowing Candice was going to come over, that has to be considered a key to her future. How did he know that? There had to have been an exchange at some point where Adam or Parvati assured Nathan they could count on her in a tribal switch or the merge. Nathan accepting her like that means she didn’t move only to be with Adam. She knew what to expect.

The editors haven’t shown her as a smart player. Her Exile Island showing in the recap and again in this episode, where she was still looking for the idol, have made her look dumb. Her “I love you” to Adam in the joint TC hasn’t been brought up by anyone but we saw her as stupid to reveal her alliance and suggesting she would flip after merge. (I guess she took a short-cut). If such a daring move were to be successful, I doubt it would have been played by someone who was portrayed as a poor player. We would have been given reason to see her as a good player. As such, Jonathan somehow, may have a better chance than her.

At TC, she was called a “gutsy girl” by Brad. Nathan added: “The girl…is lethal. The only female to have been to Exile Island… She is a super copmpetitor. The girl came here to play.” Her comment about moving because “This tribe has a good time” surprised Jeff. She said it was only one of the reasons for her move, “This tribe wins when it counts.” Was it the only comments the editors had to show us? If so, she’s playing dumb again which cannot be the winning strategy.

Jonathan has been portrayed as a player. Did he go too far, too fast as he feared he might? It is possible, but his standing in Aitu was tenuous at best. The images we had last week of him trying to find food alone on the beach were put in to have us think he was isolated. The recap revealed he wasn’t alone, Becky was shown walking on the reef in front of him.

He did have the right attitude once he joined Aitu and the first boot was the critical one. He sat with the tribe and exposed his thoughts on following Candice. It was a crazy thing to do, a jump in the unknown. “I don’t know how tight you guys are,” he tells them. He told us his game plan: “I’m in the danger seat now… My game plan is to earn their trust and the only way to do that is to be totally non-threatening and anxious to help.” He ended the fireside chat by saying: “I hope it doesn’t bite me in the butt.” Now the original Raro are up 4-3 and that is an advantage that will be hard to pass up. His TC speech was to the point: “I do want to fit in. I tried not to step on anybody’s toes, I try to provide.” He shared a surprised “We made it” expression with Candice after the vote.

Yul was taken totally by surprise. His constant alliance talk had to contribute to Candice’s feelings that Aitu wasn’t a fun tribe. He’ll have to rethink his game but Jeff warned us not to under-estimate him. For the first time during reward, Aitu didn’t have to think about the game and are now meshing as a family. The trauma has forced him to depend on his whole tribe.

Becky continues to be ignored. She is right there in every tribal talks. She had been Candice’s closest ally but we didn’t hear how it affected her. Her only role in this episode was to tell Yul to keep his trick of targetting the cannonball through the chute quiet so Raro couldn’t copy him.

Sundra has become the emotional narrator of the small tribe. Her tears expressed better than any words the feeling of abandonment and the relief of overcoming the larger army. The lesson that she thought her son: “Winners never quit and quitters never win,” could serve her well in this game.

Ozzy, to get back to the “Bird scene” from last week. I think it could either be meant to show that the tribe feeds off Ozzy or that Yul eliminates Ozzy as he killed the bird. We saw there were more white birds, so I tend to see it as the tribe feeding off his prowess.

He has suddenly turned from the tribe’s provider to the tribe’s best hope. His skills were once more in evidence when he pulled on the rope to drag the barrel while Raro was drifting off with the current. He is in fighting mode and his enthusiasm will be essential to get this tribe to the merge without collapsing.

Parvati again was the one we saw saying “Yes” to Jeff’s question of “Want to know what you’re playing for?” She also guided the tribe during the IC to an early lead until Yul found a better way to aim. She was heard expressing the tribe’s reaction: “Are you kidding me?” after Aitu’s win.

She has rarely been shown talking about the final decision before the TC. We’ve mainly seen her questioning the pertinence of a boot. We haven’t seen her discussing any boots alone with either Adam or Nate, who are her allies. Booting Brad was to her advantage. Jonathan can be dealt with later and she was the only meaningful voice that we didn’t hear wavering from the original choice.

Adam has the biggest target out there, so he needed the numbers for the merge more than anyone else. The mutiny was to his advantage but he continues to be ruled by his humor. He’s not a strategist, he is a bouncer that throws out the ones he perceives as trouble-makers. He is now in a position where strategy could give him the win. It seems more likely he will continue his impetuous ways rather than listening to the ones that have a plan.

Nathan is the emotional narrator of Raro. He does have some ideas of how the game should be played but he relies too much on Adam. His derision was addressed at the defector: “Jonathan must be smoking some good stuff to think he can come in our crib and stir the water.” Also he said that Raro wasn’t a refugee camp for knuckleheads and traitors like Jonathan. He had a stern warning to Jonathan at TC: “Maybe he has a tendency to be too much of a leader. We don’t dig that over here. We find that you’re leading over here and we’ll cut you up.”

Rebecca and Jenny are again returning to anonymity . Rebecca had a scowl when Jonathan pleaded for acceptance. Jenny could still have wanted to eliminate Brad but keeping Jonathan doesn’t favor neither women. Jenny’s comment about getting rid of zits shows a lack of respect that real competitors should always have for their opponents. Her excuse is that she's been around Nate too long, my take is that she won't be allowed to prove her point and outlast any of the ones she disrespected!

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11-12-06, 09:04 AM (EST)
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32. "RE: Episode #8 The Mutiny"
Excellent summary of the episode, "Mutiny", michel! I thoroughly agree with your astute assessments! Wow, you really rock! I was busy typing away for the East Coast update Thread, and I missed alot of the great quotes that you included. This year, I think I have stated, that I am only watching the episode as it airs and then noting my thoughts on the daws.

At the very beginning of the show, Candice was seen in confessional, and right after her confessional, was the spider in the web....again the spider was shown when she and Parv were talking, I'm inclined to believe that the spider is symbolic of Candice...

The entire season has really played up, or capitalized on Ozzy as the underdog, the misfit, the minority. Even the start of this episode, he was indeed the odd man out. Now, with the mutiny, the Aitu tribe is suddenly placed in his shoes, and with it, they embrace Ozzy and each other. It's a beautiful moment, that does change the game in "a beautiful way". They all will focus on themselves, and what they have to do together, to the end. I agree with the theory that Aitu will feed off of Ozzy to the end. Sundra, what an eloquent narrator she is indeed!

As for the Raro's, I just see them as a bunch of people that are too focused on themselves, far too impulsive, to focused on having a good time, on anything but focusing on playing the game to win. I know that you and VS have indeed equated Adam to a bully, and I still see him this way. What a jerk, and I think Candice and Jonathan will get what they deserve. Nate is appearing as an idiot to me, pointing out that they are a leaderless tribe and they like it that way, yet he always goes to Adam and defers to him. I don't think the Raro's are very smart. I can see why Candice jumped, she's got the hot's for Adam, but Jonathan, putting all his faith in Candice, what is wrong with him? Granted, he was on the fringe, but come on, why wouldn't he appeal to the serious player Ozzy, who was also on the fringe....

At any rate, I am 100% behind the Aitu's. I am so excited that we will not have an arrogant tribe controlling the game and I am very eager to see how this all plays out!


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11-13-06, 08:03 PM (EST)
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33. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
I see that Michel and Flowerpower already have done a wonderful job in their observations which again I may be repeating so my apologies as it also appears Michel has included some statements made by the players as well. I may just resign myself to being a reader instead of a contributor at this juncture as I have been late to the party and am enjoying the readings very much

I did want to go back to the first few episodes as I like to do from time to time of some items that we took note of (or I may have and if, naturally, they are just ideas of my whimsy, I won't hold anyone else responsible )

Jeff's words upon the introduction of this particular season "It is the impressions you make on the other castaways that determine your fate"

This statement had struck me upon Jeff uttering it as you may recall if you were nice enough to read my lengthy post that regardless of the racial aspect and the different comments provided by some members this season THIS commentary is slightly different than Jeff's usual fare so I took note of this; perhaps the biggest theme of all is the impressions that one made/makes is the ultimate indicator of the winner; I would say that should narrow down the lot a bit

More "notables" that I/we paid mind:

Ozzy, Yul, Sundra and Pavarti's had the opening remarks on this racial divide

Cowboy's remark about people underestimating the Asians

Jonathan's remark about "cultural similarities will not make the groups more cohesive and someone will have to cut the throat of the guy next to him at some point." (This could also infer a more personal aspect whether Jonathan does the slitting or the slitting is done to him, more on Jonathan later)

Also noted we saw some negativity that could have beenemphasized with Ozzy throwing the challenge, Sundra almost being voted out, Becky almost being voted out AND being designated a princess were not dealt with in the fashion they could have been and this always raises eyebrows since it is remniscient of Katie and Rafe where both could have been shown in a less than stellar light for challenge performances it was not done. The three women (Candice, Becky and Sundra) also shown caring more about their armpits also never had any ramifications (although en masse, Candice is not being displayed very kindly which includes the recap episode and Becky and Sundra have not received any further negative attention) Ozzy's throwing the challenge was solely a blip on the radar and in Survivor's past, throwing a challenge is something that is never glossed over, Sundra's potential vote out was never addressed by anyone including herself and Becky's vulnerability almost came and went.


Also noted is that the Raro tribe was never shown in their drunken and partying glory as it occurred and many, if not all of the times, on occasions such as this and that tribe contained the winner, it is a great way to embellish that winner especially if it shows a different side to that person. Obviously those like Judd and Jan were shown embellished in a character already containing over the top qualities and it just helped to solidify the brashness of Judd (a notable aspect to Guatemala) and the nuttiness of Jan (also notable to Thailand) Brian and Tom, however, both very controlled characters were shown on a flip side which added dimension. Brian's drinking involved both tribes so it needed to be shown more than if only his tribe won but Brian (and Jan) were featured quite nicely (recall how Brian still was playing the game while drunk) and Tom certainly was featured out of character which helped to perhaps soften that dangerously close one dimensional hero edit he was getting. I would suspect should the winner be a member of the second generation of Raro, we may have seen the frivolity and we did not.

Also noted was Jonathan on EI stating it was a million dollar sandbox (fuel for a Yul victory?) along with that notion I had expressed that Jonathan may have some tie to the idol as Jonathan was the only one shown on EI (of himself, Candice and Adam) to state that it is assumed the idol was found OR he is a complete moron and then questioned by Jeff with Jonathan outing that the idol is no longer there.

We also saw hints of connections that may or may not be important in the long term in some aspect (then again this may be a wink and a prayer)

Adam/Candice at this juncture, the connection has now come to fruition so I have no issue with either of them not making end game and both these characters seemed to have been tweaked more on a negative scale and not very substantive in nature solidifying that to me

Becky and Yul and their united partnership which I am still going to question that they both will not be together at the very end but again, I must emphasize that I never felt it would necessarily be one of betrayal but along the lines of Terry and Dan, circumstances dictate where one may need to be "let go" and, in fact, it still would not surprise me if Yul should at least want to attempt to save Becky with the idol (and while I feel there may be a tie to the idol by Jonathan in my flight of fancy, perhaps Becky is saved by the idol which costs Jonathan)

Sundra and Rebecca's connection noted by the Hiki tribe although I am disappointed by Rebecca being taken away completely this past episode although her visuals are still noted to me. This may be a "Brandon occurrence" as I had said before as it seems that quite a lot of Rebecca's take on matters come to fruition. Her last notable comment in this episode may dictate future events to come.

Later connections of Nathan and Pavarti which was swept under the rug rather quickly and I question if their relationship comes into play at some point.

Let's not forget Yul and the HII and my questioning on the difference made between the HII edit of last season and this season.

Since we now see that Jonathan and Candice have met back up with Adam, this fragmented discussion from early on may also bear out especially since this conversation really was not necessary after the brief argument that Jonathan had with Adam about working (where the support seem to favor Jonathan)

Candice: "You gotta be careful"
Adam: "Who? Me?"
Candice: "Don't make him the enemy"
Adam: "Oh I won't"
Candice: "Or it will be rough"
Adam: "I won't, I won't"

As Jonathan has for quite some time appeared very important to this season, I would suspect that this little conversation may bear some fruit as I think the investment that has been in Jonathan (and highly manipulated at that) is important but almost too inflated for him to be the ultimate victor.

Recap

Aitu was uneasy with kidnapped Raro member
Yul stating he is bothered by Flica speaking in front of Nate
At RC Rebecca falling quickly behind
Aitu forced Nate to sit out
Nate: "Brad, why aren't you swimming?
Nate watched helplessly as his Raro tribe (Rebecca) fell behind and never recovered (Ozzy)
When Nate returned (Jenny about Brad with Pavarti) the tribe questioned Brad's decision
Nathan: "Brad pissed me off… I don't care about puzzles"

Two white birds, one flies away
At Aitu Ozzy's role as provider was a mixed blessing
Yul "I underestimated him, we should get rid of him while we still have control rather than wait for a merge and potentially have him dominate individual challenges" (I do want to mention that I do not necessarily believe this confessional was about Ozzy; his name was never mentioned and curiously enough he was making this statement in the exact position of where he was shown to discuss Jonathan in the previous episode where we heard “(Jonathan) he'd be a tough person to go up against in an individual competition” I am of the suspicion that this confessional was about Jonathan but made to appear it was about Ozzy; the question then is why?)
At IC Raro made a comeback (Jonathan reaction, Ozzy reaction)
Jeff "One of you going home (Flica) See you at Tribal (Jonathan)
At Aitu, Jonathan targeted Flica (shown with Candice and Sundra)
Jonathan: "I'm trying to stay one step ahead of the competition"
While Flica tried to target Jonathan
Flica: "Jonathan is the biggest threat (to Sundra) I think the smartest decision (Jonathan shown) get rid of (Becky shown) Jonathan" (words shown on screen)
But her scrambling pestered some of the girls (Sundra/Candice)
Sundra: "She was like a mosquito that won't die"
Ozzy: (to Yul) "He's always plotting and scheming" (again words on screen)
Ozzy was worried about his own vulnerability and agreed that Jonathan was a threat
Ozzy: (to Yul) "I just don't trust him because he doesn't give any information" (Jonathan) (again words on screen)
Yul: "Jonathan inspires some level of mistrust pretty much among everybody (Ozzy) I haven't seen it (Becky) but because (Flica) everyone else is suspicious of it , it can't help but rub off on me a little bit"
In the end, Flica's scrambling became her downfall and she was voted off (Jonathan)

The Calm Before The Storm

We open this scene with Ozzy shown sleeping while the alliance we knew that wasn't built to last (Becky, Yul, Candice and Jonathan and Sundra) are talking
Jonathan: "We are in a good place, we've really done well and we'll continue to stay tight, we know what the next move is if we have an elimination right. The most solid thing is if we go in with six and they have four and we keep Ozzy around for at least one vote and we vote somebody off then vote Ozzy off , the five of us can go to town"

Jonathan: (conf) "People are a little antsy as we are what people think are approaching a merge in the next couple of days, we have five strong now I assume if there is one more immunity challenge and we lose it we will get rid of Ozzy. I don't care how tight you think your fivesome is things are gonna change"
Candice: "Anything can happen at this point"
Yul: "Our interests are advanced by sticking tight together no matter what happens if we break up now then we are going to be toast" (shot to Candice)
Candice: (conf): "I don't want to keep this six through the merge I want to get back with Adam and Pavarti so I'm just ready to get some people outta here, I'm nervous because it is like the calm before the storm, stuff is about to start moving"

(Nothing from Sundra nor Becky in the midst of the conversation or the confessional)

An Aitu, A Rainbow, A Goodbye (emydi, keep track of those rainbows)

Naturally a large spider web is shown.... and a bit of confusion. Candice seemed somewhat happily situated with her alliance. Her closeness with Sundra was apparent; she, Yul and Becky had conversations with even Sundra not present and while we knew that Adam and Candice required a union of sorts the editing of this sudden turnaround for Candice was a bit perplexing as is the push that Jonathan has received to be portrayed as something that, frankly, the audience has been left a little questionable as to where it is all coming from. I'll be interested after show is over what was NOT shared to us as Candice jump to Raro after appearing nicely insulated was a little questionable. Jonathan's edit has been ridiculously built to show all this sudden heap of mistrust placed on him; HIS jumping would not seem as surprising. Generally speaking, I get a feeling we missed a chunk of something as this group declared a union to Candice and Jonathan speaking privately to Candice advising she wants no part of this six and especially Jonathan.

Candice: "As much as everyone is saying let's stay together with the six it's going to get to the point where somebody is gonna get greedy, you know what I mean and its gonna get ugly and I don't you know..."
Jonathan: "I don't want them doing it to me"
Candice: "Right I don't want to be the one left out to dry"
Jonathan: "You and me are tight, we're gonna make this work, we'll set something up with Pavarti let's hope we can do that , then it'll be us, four Caucasions in the final four, me, you, Adam and Pavarti …. we have to be the ones to make the block before they do. I am determined to not be the guy who made the move too late. You know, I've trusted you all along, (Candice agreeing ) you've trusted me, and it's gotten us a long way, and it's going to get us a long way farther. (Jonathan confessional now shown) Only two people can sit as the final two and I want it to be you and me, I swear to God" (now Candice confessional shown)

Jonathan: (conf) "Candice and I talked that eventually we'll have to do some kind of flop; she's the one person I'm tightest with"

Candice: (conf) "Jonathan's got this new plan… I'm not sure that Jonathan has really any allegiance, I'll think he'll do whatever he needs to to get by so I'd like to see Jonathan go" (this was the same position as her earlier confessional stating she didn't want this six at the merge)

Merge and More Merge Talk

Again, as I do not follow information that some of you may be privy to, I only note what the story is telling. I noted about two episodes ago the merge talk started which then lends to the belief that merger would be around the corner as once the talk begins, we find ourselves seeing this particular occasion occurring soon enough where these conversations are able to be remember.

Raro mentions merger with all discussing that even if they merge now, they are still strong and tied up which is good.

Pavarti: "We got nothing to worry about we are six - six"
Brad: "Then it's like every man for himself"
Nathan then mentions Brad's comment with Pavarti's (obvious foreshadowing that "he is digging a hole")
Nathan: "…he has done questionable things, you know, he is slim shady right now…."
Pavarti: "...that irritates me, it is not an individual game right now"
Jenny jumps in about playing for the team
Pavarti: "We don't need him after the merge away"
Rebecca softly: "No"
Rebecca (in voice over with Pavarti shown: "You need everyone you can trust in the merge" (Adam shown then the shot moves to Nathan)

It was a bit strange that scene and I could not provide a reasonable explanation as to why. Rebecca was not at all part of this episode and normally she is quite central to the ultimate dynamics and who was leaving on Raro. While many did not see perhaps the level of existence Rebecca showed, I felt her presence during most of the episodes; this episode however, she seemed very far removed yet she provided a very powerful comment above although Pavarti was the person featured during the comment which then makes one wonder if this ultimately may have to do with Pavarti. After this comment, you see her getting up and then the shot moves to Nathan and this is accompanied by some strange music which is why I feel something prophetic may happen with her words and/or assigned to the people who were featured during her words)

Nathan: (conf) "I lost my trust with him and it sucks because I like the guy a lot. There's still a team, there's no I in that team right now for him so I'm like yeah I got your back…. sucker"

(Like what they have done with Jonathan, the audience really has not been given much information other than Brad voting for Jenny to merit this type of fury from Nathan. Frankly, Jenny's editing has left much to be desired, so Brad's vote really did not assign that much negativity. The overdone plot of his wanting to do a puzzle was also crammed down our throats in an attempt to assign negativity to Brad which I thought fell short. I'm again inclined to believe there is quite a lot we are not being shown this season)

A Little Reward, A Little Mutiny

The introduction of new Aitu not surprisingly did not elicit any key reactions with the news that Flica was voted off. (Taking mental note that of the three who entered Raro's domain uninvited, Cowboy and Flica are now gone. Whether that scene has any ultimate impact on Ozzy's fate, time will tell)

Jeff: "We're gonna do something a little different (Brad) (Candice) (Jonathan) I'm offering each of you the opportunity to mutiny and join the other tribe (Nathan shocked, Rebecca shocked, Brad smiling then Yul, Sundra Becky and then back to Nathan) I'll give you ten seconds to decide if you want to change things up (Adam looking over to Candice smiling) and maybe change your fate in this game (Jonathan) If you want to move step off your mat and join the other tribe; the clock is ticking (pans on Aitu, slows on Jonathan and Candice, obviously, moves to Raro as a group)
Jeff: 5 (Ozzy) 4, 3, (Candice) 2 "Candice has mutineed" (Parvarti and Brad smiling and surprised and a bit surprised) 1, Jonathan steps up (a little awkward I might add which lends to the fact that I do believe he did this in a momentary panic of Candice leaving) "Jonathan mutinies at the last second, that is it!"

Ozzy shown with a small smirk shaking his head.

Jeff: "Jonathan, Candice you are Aitu no more join Rarotonga"

Parvarti heard saying welcome back to Jonathan

Jeff: "So Aitu you just had two members of your tribe mutinee" (Ozzy) Yul, you don't look happy"
Yul: "I'm stunned (Jonathan) we had a pretty good thing planned and I'm (Candice) very surprised"
Jeff:"Ozzy what's your reaction?"
Ozzy: "Doesn't really surprise me, they don't have the backbone to stick with their tribe (Jonathan shown) that's fine I'm sure (Candice now being shown) they are going to get their fate sooner or later" (Ah, such shades of potential foreshadowing)

Aitu wins reward and quite tremendously with Ozzy making sure he cheers in front of those on Raro's bench with "Mutineers are the first people to die man" with Jonathan attempting to shrug it off, Ozzy repeats it and spits on the ground.

Jeff: "It would be an underestimate to say that this game has taken a dramatic turn (Ozzy) Aitu, you are sending somebody to Exile Island: (Ozzy shown appearing to have to think hard and all stating "Candice" with Candice nodding)

Jeff: "Candice, big signal coming from your old tribe"

Some smirks/smiles from Ozzy, Becky, then shot to Yul serious, Candice walks by them and waves; Sundra does acknowledge her out of the four of them.

Sundra is crying and states: "I wanted to stay true to my guys and we work well together and it feels good"
Jeff: "Well in this case it certainly paid off to stick together" (another hint of foreshadowing?)

A Bit Of Character Development

Smiles all around upon seeing the reward
Yul: "I just want you to know I am so amazingly proud of all of you and I'm totally honored to be sharing this experience; this is like the best feeling I've had since I could ever recall"

Sundra: "Me too! I don't know when I've ever felt like this" (Sundra's confessional then shown as pieced together in its entirety below)

A toast to Aitu and being calm, cool collected and working together....

Ozzy: "This will take us to the end guys" (Oh, I never like commentary like that so I will just presume that not every member is in the "final four". Yes, I know there are those naysayers who do send me back to reality that not every statement is symbolic but I do enjoy living in my fantasy :smile)

Ozzy (conf) "The reward was beautiful.. ..it was like a recharge, I feel like brand new, I feel like I am ready to do anything" (Now this statement I did enjoy) and "We are stronger than we've ever been; the mutiny solidified our commitment and dedication to each other, I mean we're a team to the end now (this portion was stated after Yul told everyone they were a family; Ozzy is in the same location however and probably a continuation. Again, I'm not overly optimistic that these four will comprise the last four as his statements make me wary which is what is known to happen to me)

The photographs come out and we hear Sundra seeming to be the narrator of the photos with "Sexy Becky," noting Yul's glasses photo and Ozzy as a cute child.

Yul: "I'm feeling really good about my tribe… ….it just really hits you that these are real people that you are interacting with; people with hopes, dreams, aspirations…" (Of the four, only Becky was ignored in her discussion of the reward. Thus, it would be my inclination to assume this would not bode well for her especially in light of Ozzy's remark and my penchant for taking these remarks quite literally)

Yul shown very emotional over the communications from home. Sundra as well with her confessional which I put in its entirety below, Ozzy also choked up with Sundra, then Becky, then Yul coming over to hug him (this conversation below)

Sundra (conf) "When I saw the mutiny in it's completion the numbers were scary; standing there and you feeling so small and pitiful and you look over to the Raro side and they look so big and triumphant and when we won the challenge I cried; I don't think I've been as happy in my life" and after looking at her son and sweetly signing to him "I have a great little boy; I'm realizing what the hell am I doing here but I always teach my son winners never quit and quitters never win so I can't teach him that and come out here and quit" (Obviously a notable statement by Sundra and as the last couple of episodes have shown, she has emerged nicely in front of the camera. I have already been somewhat committed to a perceived victor but I would say that Sundra did step forth in the editing and, as we know, someone who slowly emerges is quite acceptable in terms of longevity and she was given a first episode observation about the game)

Yul: "We're a family out here guys" (the remainder of Ozzy's confessional shown)

The Exiled One

Candice "I've been waiting the whole time to get back with my friends Adam and Pavarti so I made a decision to mutiny; you know it's four people on the old Aitu tribe that are really mad at me right now; obviously they are going to have it out for me. I was surprised that Jonathan stepped out right behind me he's been saying that we're really close… but I haven't really trusted Jonathan to begin with now I'm here sitting at EI by myself while Jonathan is bonding and having a good time and I'm out of the game" (I do hope that Jonathan is exiled next week as some of the hints this episode seem to imply as I would like to see what he says. My inclination with the visuals and conversations and so forth has me believing Jonathan will surpass Candice but having Jonathan back on Exile Island would certainly shed more light)

New New Raro?

Jonathan:"Wow here I am!"
Pavarti "You're back!"

Jonathan "I took a step into the unknown guys; I wanted to be here to meet some of you folks (focus on Rebecca's face though Adam in foreground, his face is a bit blurred, Rebecca shown not entirely happy about these turn of events) so were you guys totally shocked… ....I mean it was a crazy thing to do (Nathan shown not happy) and Candice and I are the last two in here. I don't know how tight you guys are but it seemed like the right thing to do you know"

Jonathan (conf) "If I made a mistake, it was trusting Candice too much and she made an impulsive move and I followed her so I'm in the danger seat now; I'm the eighth man in; (scene below now shown) my game plan is to earn their trust and the only way I can do that right now is being totally non threatening and anxious to help"

Jonathan (to group): "I consider myself a loyal person (musical shift which someone with more talent can assist on) and ummm (Pavarti yawns) and Candice and I have been together thru the whole thing (Rebecca nodding) you know I saw her do it and I thought okay let's go" (more confessional then shown) I hope it doesn't bite me in the butt but… (he then receives a voice over welcome by either Jenny or Rebecca)
Nathan: (conf) "I knew Candice was gonna come over here but my man Jonathan rode over to with her; he must be smoking some good stuff if you think you're gonna roll up in our crib and start stirring waters you know (Brad) Brad's gonna be safe for a vote if it comes to that because he at least stood with us and said I'm not budging so the first one definitely is Jonathan; there was no question about that. You really think we have your back after we just saw you sell out your other tribe? Are you dumb?" (shot of Jonathan taking a deep breath)

Jonathan then shown doing a lot of work around camp and the ladies and Brad sunning themselves....

Adam "You are good around camp, you are a work horse"
Jonathan: "I'm out here to do this you know, we could get voted off tomorrow I don't know what's gonna happen you know what I mean, sometimes opportunity knocks on the door and you gotta walk through it"
Adam: "Glad you guys did"
Jonathan "So for me and Candice the risky time is the next two votes"
Adam "I know"
Jonathan "I don't know what's going on around here just so you know she and I wanted to come back here and deal with you and Pavarti only"
Adam: "That's cool with me, Ill do that; it's our original tribe man"

Adam: (conf) "Jonathan wants myself, him, Candice and Pavarti to be the final four. You know just to have someone there that wants that and wants to include me it's good to have a long the ride"
Jonathan "This game is all about trust" (this statement shown on screen)

The IC

A bit of an awkward arrival for Candice as Jonathan waves a greeting and she comes back to hugs from them with Ozzy and company looking on....

Jeff "First tribe to solve it correctly wins immunity guaranteed a one (Jenny, Jonathan, Candice with a hint of Adam) in 11 shot (Ozzy) of a million bucks, losers go to TC tonight (Yul) somebody will be voted out (Becky)" (make of that what you will)

The most interesting part to this challenge was what appeared to be a big visual competition that mostly emanated from Jonathan; he appeared to constantly be looking over at Aitu, and, in fact, Pavarti calls him on this. When Aitu would succeed he glanced over, when Raro succeeded the camera honed in on Jonathan. At one point there was an edited glancing from Jonathan to Yul. There are unfinished stories or some unfinished business with Jonathan and his former tribe although it may not be the entire Aitu tribe. Of course Yul figuring out what to do with shushing from his tribe was also comical.

Jeff: "Raro wasted a cannonball they weren't paying attention"
Jonathan: "Oh please Jeff"
Jeff: "What's that?"
Jonathan: "I said Oh please"
Jeff: "Jonathan getting frustrated by me" (Of note, very benign remark from Jeff considering the comment by Jonathan could have been taken as rather snide)
Jonathan watching Aitu on the beach
Pavarti " Jonathan paddle for us, Jonathan dont watch them, look at what we're doing"
Aitu wins with Pavarti: "Are you kidding me, son of a …….."

Yul takes idol from Jeff and walks back and poor and while Yul, Sundra and Ozzy were shown full camera touching the idol, Becky's arm is only shown.

IC Aftermath

After the challenge, the tribe gathers, Candice is asked how she made out at Exile with Jonathan advising that at least it was only one night and it wasn't raining (this only made me pause because of the music I'm now more attuned to thanks to applejack and now KO. There was a cymbal crash which made me question how the next person may fare at EI and whether it would be Candice again or the speaker, Jonathan)

Jonathan (conf) "Glad to have Candice back from EI, it takes a little bit of the onus off of me, being the only new guy, they can see that the two of us are and that she and I trusted each other"

Candice now holds court with Pavarti as Jonathan is shown attempting to provide again

Pavarti "So what's going on, Jonathan's like me and Candice are super tight like, how tight?"
Candice "Not tight... not tight at all, I was shocked. He had long talks with Yul all the time and he only came back and tried to solidify something with me in the past few days; he's just doing whatever is best for him and working everybody at the same time you know what I mean"

A spider a web.....

Nathan goes into the tent with Adam

Adam: "I think Jonathan's going to try and head out and get some stuff...."
Nathan: "Good, feed us while you're here. Does he really think we're going to keep him around?"
Adam: "Maybe we should keep him a little while just cause he thinks that"
Nate disagrees:
Adam: "Because I think when we do merge Jonathan can't go back to them but Brad can, Jonathan can't go anywhere, he's stuck with us so we might want to get rid of Brad first"
Nathan: "I feel what you are saying too; Brad didn't leave when he had the chance so that makes me have an ounce of faith in him"
Adam: "It's not a big deal, as long as they're the next two I don't really care "(which will not play out as intended in my world!)

Nathan (conf) "Jonathan aka Lord knows what he is thinking knucklehead to leave his tribe is working really hard around here (Jonathan again shown fishing) so right now we're going to do away with Brad because we are scared that if we go to a merge (Brad will join back up with Becky and Yul) I gotta put on a Denzel today and play Brad like it is all good...."

Nathan and Brad are then shown with Nate playing his role. (Really this was unnecessary to show, they did not show the actual footage when Stephannie "played" JP (as we saw in the recap) so I question why this was shown at all and it would seem perhaps this is more about Nathan and his character than for any other reason. Nathan has essentially been quite a good narrator thus far which established some of his longevity however his edit was a little too much fluff (for lack of a better word) In other words, he was always upbeat, provided good story, showed us what was going on but we never really received much depth to him. Although his words and actions for the most part have been relatively benign even if somewhat opinionated at times I don't believe there was any intent for this little scene to bode positive for Nathan so I do wonder whether this slight turn is to signal some type of "arc" for Nathan)

Candice holds more court, with Brad, Rebecca, Adam, Pavarti, Jenny
Candice: “You just don't know, all day, every day I was like I wish I was over there”
Adam “I know you were struggling”
Candice: “I couldn't really argue when they were saying to send you to EI cuz everybody else was jumping on the bandwagon”
Adam “You knew I was going right?”
Candice: “Oh I knew; once we hit the beach Mr. Man was running his mouth”
Adam: “Who?”
Candice: “Jonathan. It was his suggestion to begin with” (The audience was never meant to believe that Jonathan initiated this at the time, this along with Candice’s “trash talking” of Jonathan while we hear Jonathan appear duped by Candice with all his referencing of trusting her seems to place more favor upon Jonathan. No doubt Candice is writing her own insurance policy to ensure that she is safer than Jonathan but I’d be curious to hear from anyone who truly felt that Candice came off positive this episode)
Adam: “Why would he do that?”
Candice: “I don't know I couldn't figure it out, I think he was just threatened; he wanted to target you so he wouldn't have to compete against you and he said that you were scared to go so they thought it would like break you or something“ (Adam's confessional shown now)
Adam: “I appreciate it, that pisses me off; I wanna go and beat his a.s.s right now”
Candice: “He's threatened that ‘s all you should take it as a compliment”

Adam (conf): “Candice informed me that Jonathan's been running his mouth... just talking trash which I think is funny cuz now he is kissing my butt along with everyone else's butt so he can just kiss our butts and we'll go ahead and vote him off after that” (Obviously all of this was shown to infer doubt on who leaves at Tribal Council but again like Flica’s episode where she left, I almost felt as if they were forcing Jonathan as the potential boot; it somehow just did not ring true; the doubt placed upon Jonathan both episodes felt very out of context to what we have seen and this makes me question why the editors are attempting so hard to make Jonathan into this character that the audience really has not seen as much as they (editors) are implying)

Adam “I want to get rid of that kid...”
Nate: “I told you he's a punk #####.”
Adam: “I know he's a punk but.... we can't switch now, wanna beat his #####”
Nate: “He's a punk…”

Nate (conf): “My man Adam wants to take a brick and beat Jonathan in the head with it but we gotta think smart, the game's not over yet so it's fair playing ground..”

Tribal Council

Jeff: “Looks like it's gonna be a wet night” (Jonathan - foreshadowing coupled above with the talk of Candice at EI and it didn't rain, perhaps Jonathan is sent to EI shortly) Nate looks over in presumably Jonathan's direction

Jeff asks Brad his thoughts on Candice and Jonathan and their mutiny
Brad: “My initial thought was wow that was one gutsy girl (Candice) because here she now has four vying against her” (yet the shot goes to Jonathan at this with a thoughtful look on his face)

Jeff asks Jenny if a part of her thinks that it doesn't matter because they (Jonathan and Candice)
are at the bottom of the totem pole, they need to know that (Jonathan again)
Jenny: “Even though they are at the bottom of the totem pole (more of Jonathan) we have an advantage compared to Aitu and if we merge we are just going to pick them off like zits” Laughter from Nate, Jonathan and Pavarti shown with Jenny saying she has been hanging around Nate too long (Sadly, this and her dislike of Brad’s comment earlier in the episode were all that was left of Jenny)

Jeff asks Candice about the joking and laughter though someone is being voted off
Candice : “That is what is great about this tribe and this is one of the reasons why I stepped out on the mat, I felt like this tribe has a good time”
Jeff calls Candice on that she stepped off because Raro has a good time?
Candice: “I didn't say that was the only reason, that is one of the reasons, I mean, they win when it counts” (I don’t think anyone watching was very accepting of that answer!)

Jeff asks Jonathan if he is concerned he could be an easy guy to get rid of
Jonathan: “Of course I am concerned I was the last guy off the mat, maybe it was a second later (Candice with a somewhat derisive look) but somebody's gonna go home tonight and I'd be silly if I didn't think it could be me”

Jeff asks Nate what his take is on this tribe right now
Nate: “I was all good with it, the other two coming in, Candice and Jonathan, they seem very nice so you know we're still adapting to them, I can't give you a fair honest answer about them (Adam)

Jeff asks about the concern about Candice
Nate: “...girl’s a threat, she's pretty lethal (Candice smiles) only girl who's been to Exile... she's a very strong competitor; girl came to play”

Jeff asks Nathan about concerns about Jonathan coming over
Nate: “Maybe he has a tendency of being too much of a leader (Jonathan) we don't dig that over here (Jonathan looks down) we find out you're leading over here, we'll cut you up you know?” (Adam nodding)

Jeff asks Jonathan if this is a fair assessment:
Jonathan: “Yes I know I'm an odd man out at this point but I do want to fit in (Adam) and in the last 24 hours I think I tried to certainly not step on anybody's toes and try to provide”

Jeff asks Brad if he sensed any tension in the tribe
Brad: “I liked Jonathan and Candice from the six hours that I know them (Jonathan/Candice with Jonathan glancing over at Candice and smiling with Candice giving a perfunctory smile) the only thing is that it is late in the ball game...“ (Nate nodding)

Jeff asks Brad if he trusts these people
Brad: No (Rebecca)

Jeff: “Wow (Jenny) you don't trust this big happy family” (Pavarti)
Brad: “Do I trust the entire tribe, absolutely not, uh uh (Jonathan nods) it's been 21 days (Jonathan and Adam appearing to glance at each other) trust is a big word and no I don't trust everyone on this tribe”

The vote commences, if of any interest a rat was shown after Pavarti's voting and before Nathan got up to vote (I'm more inclined to subscribe this rat to Nathan since we saw his shenanigans with Brad earlier)

A twist at TC with Jeff announcing Brad first member of the jury as Brad appears to glance back at Jonathan with Jonathan a little surprised. Candice shown with a little smile and Jenny/Nate glance at each other with smiles. Jonathan expresses a sigh of relief with Adam grinning in the direction of Candice (and Jonathan)

Brad leaves with an exchange of glances supposedly between Candice and Jonathan ending with Jonathan smiling.

Jeff: “Well I can tell by the looks on your faces you are a little surprised to see the jury started with tonight's vote (Candice, Jonathan, Rebecca, Pavarti) ; this game is all about surprises” (Adam smiling)


Of note:

I’d be curious to find out what the RC treemail said, they have read treemail quite often this episode but none last episode. Candice’s confessional sounded almost like she had an indication of what may happen instead of it being a huge announcement at RC.

I found throughout this episode that many segments involving Jonathan (i.e. thoughts about him) were made sure to be noted by the audience by putting it on the screen as if to make sure there was no mistaking what was being said. Whether this matters, I do not know but Jonathan certainly has received an extraordinary edit for someone that as a viewer, is not really seeing what is being told about him. We are being forced to eat, live and breathe the "shady" side of Jonathan when, in fact, there has really been no evidence to support this type of "villain" edit. In fact, I’d be curious to hear from anyone to tell me who was found to be more sinister, Candice or Jonathan! Ironically, the moments where Jonathan could indeed be portrayed negatively, he really wasn't (The Flica/chicken incident, the tiff between Adam and Jonathan, the tiff between Cowboy and Jonathan; even when Ozzy brought the bird back, Jonathan appeared sympathetic even though eating it was the sensible thing to do) Again, I found myself nodding with Yul as he tells us that "he hasn't seen it personally but with all this being felt by everyone, he almost has no choice to feel it himself.“ Something is brewing with Jonathan by the editors and I sense much more to come.

The Aitu tribe is certainly harmonious and it is a nice feel that reminds me of how I felt watching LaMina despite their trouble. Again, I have trouble with the way I pounce on items believing that all four will result the way Ozzy proclaims but considering the difference of the way the HII was edited from last season to this season, Yul’s fortune may certainly assist him. I still have an inkling that Jonathan is somehow related to the idol but again, my speculations on the show sometime take off into nonsensical direction

Interesting also how Pavarti was held at bay essentially this episode despite a lot of talk involving her as a part of a foursome of the former Caucasian tribe; she was very removed by it and we did not hear one word from her with respect to Jonathan and Candice coming over to her tribe? I found that very curious especially in light of the fact that for a while she was a strong narrator at her tribe; these events could directly impact her yet we hear nothing from her about it. I was not prepared to crown Pavarti the winner this season regardless in light of the editing surrounding her (albeit a very nicely done one) but I did expect her to fare rather well so my only assumption is that they are removing her from this mini chapter of a potential conflict to come amongst the four who were in original Raro.

Jenny and Rebecca unfortunately were sorely neglected but Rebecca’s words should be something I will keep note of especially with respect to who they were surrounding when said. Nathan seems to have caught an “edge” that I question is a signal for him to take a turn for the worse and twice we have heard Jeff state “Yul and Jonathan taking on Nate” While that seems impossible with what Jonathan did, stranger things have happened and if I did not look so obsessively at every nook and cranny, then there would not be any sighs upon seeing my lengthy posts!


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someclevernameusuallygoeshere 12 desperate attention whore postings
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11-14-06, 09:37 AM (EST)
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34. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
Veruca Salt~
I just wanted to let you know how much I enjoy reading your posts and please, please, please don't be satisfied with just reading others point of view. I, and many others I'm sure, wait anxiously for your posts every week. I feel that you alone are totally impartial with your take and don't let your opinion of the survivors skew the way you see the editors telling the story.
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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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11-14-06, 10:23 AM (EST)
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35. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
Hi Veruca, I’m happy to read your post this week. This had to be a typo:

>”If I did not look so obsessively at every nook and cranny, then there would not be any sighs upon seeing my lengthy posts!”

Reading your posts brings smiles , not sighs. You never have to apologize to me. I’m the one that should apologize since I stepped on your turf by using many quotes. This episode was so centered on the mutiny that it seemed all interconnected. The player’s words were the best way to relate this 4-act play.

Since you invited reactions, here are a few points I wanted to bring up. First, you write:

>“Jonathan's edit has been ridiculously built to show all this sudden heap of mistrust placed on him"

And later, add:

>”Jonathan certainly has received an extraordinary edit for someone that as a viewer, is not really seeing what is being told about him. We are being forced to eat, live and breathe the "shady" side of Jonathan when, in fact, there has really been no evidence to support this type of "villain" edit. In fact, I’d be curious to hear from anyone to tell me who was found to be more sinister, Candice or Jonathan! Something is brewing with Jonathan by the editors and I sense much more to come."

Jonathan’s villain edit came from the arm-twisting he did to “I just want to have fun” Jessica. He told her:

-“If you want to be here in 30 days, you have to start thinking now.”

-“You don’t want to vote for Becky and then find yourself on the wrong side of a 5-3 vote because you could be next.”

-He added the extremely patronizing: “I’ll do the thinking for you.”

Cao Boi in one of his nuggets of wisdom was talking about Jonathan when he said “I don’t like the manipulation of man.” After that, Jon’s villain side was amplified by being one of the first to say: “Maybe Flica is the choice.” We cannot forget that while he was helping Ozzy getting some fish, being a friend and calling him a “mad fisherman”, Jonathan was also hypocritically the one pushing to eliminate King Neptune. It isn’t a typical villain edit but certainly that of a dangerous player. He is a great character but could the respect of being an Oscar nominee explain part of this complex edit as well as the benign remark Jeff had when Jonathan got irritated with him during the challenge.

>”The conversation… has me believing Jonathan will surpass Candice.”

We reach the same conclusion from a different angle. Candice hasn’t been portrayed as the smart player to pull off such a grand move. She isn’t sinister only dumb. Being able to portray a medical student who knows the game as dumb proves the power of editing. Granted, she helps by using the dumb blonde as part of her strategy!

>Adam: "Because I think when we do merge Jonathan can't go back to them but Brad can, Jonathan can't go anywhere, he's stuck with us so we might want to get rid of Brad first"

I’m glad you underlined that. Jonathan is resourceful enough to find a way to go back and Adam wouldn’t see it.

>” I’d be curious to hear from anyone who truly felt that Candice came off positive this episode”

I’m probably the only one that will come close to admitting that I did! We had a big discussion in Fanatics and not many shared my view that her risky move should be applauded. I used a poker analogy: She had a straight in Aitu but probably saw Yul with a Full House. She decided to reshuffle the deck and while she may only have a pair right now, Yul doesn’t have a Full House anymore. You can lose a hand with a straight and win another with only a pair. Anyway what I couldn’t bring in Fanatics is that both you and I know that she cannot win with the portrayal she has been given. Still, it was very positive to see a player take a chance and not just let Yul win like in Thailand where everyone stayed put and practically let Brian win. In that sense, I saw her as the “gutsy girl” and the “lethal player that came to play” that Brad and Nathan talked about.

Another point that caught my eye was this:
>”Adam (conf): “Candice informed me that Jonathan's been running his mouth... just talking trash which I think is funny cuz now he is kissing my butt along with everyone else's butt so he can just kiss our butts and we'll go ahead and vote him off after that” (Obviously all of this was shown to infer doubt on who leaves at Tribal Council but again like Flica’s episode where she left, I almost felt as if they were forcing Jonathan as the potential boot; it somehow just did not ring true; the doubt placed upon Jonathan both episodes felt very out of context to what we have seen and this makes me question why the editors are attempting so hard to make Jonathan into this character that the audience really has not seen as much as the editors are implying)

It was curious to see Candice talk to Adam in front of everyone of something that could’ve been private alliance talk. Could it have been to refute thoughts that there was a Caucasian alliance? They could’ve had a 4-4 vote. Adam was mad at Jonathan but his confessional of voting him off after that doesn’t mean he was talking about this vote. After that could be after pagonging Aitu.

And the final point:

>"Sundra, as the last couple of episodes have shown, she has emerged nicely in front of the camera. I have already been somewhat committed to a perceived victor but I would say that Sundra did step forth in the editing and, as we know, someone who slowly emerges is quite acceptable in terms of longevity

I've read all your post attentively but still don't know who is your "perceived victor"! Ozzy, Parvati and Sundra have all been close but haven't been "the one".

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Brownroach 15340 desperate attention whore postings
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11-14-06, 11:34 AM (EST)
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36. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 11-14-06 AT 03:55 PM (EST)

I think what VS means about Jonathan is what I was getting at in post 21 up above. For example, in the Plan Voodoo episode, both Becky and Sundra were heard to say they were suspicious of Jonathan and that he seemed sneaky, yet at the time we'd never (and still haven't) seen Jonathan have a conversation with either of them. Similarly in the Flicka boot episode Ozzy talked to Yul about Jonathan being sneaky and "not giving out much information" yet we hadn't seen any conversations between Ozzy and Jonathan to support that either.

Like VS, I feel Jonathan's footage has shown him as sympathetic on many occasions, or, at worst, as merely sensible, but not really shifty. Jonathan wanting to get Ozzy out was perfectly logical -- Ozzy was not part of the Yul/Becky/Jonathan/Candice/Sundra alliance, and he's strong to boot. It may seem "villainous" because we are supposed to like Ozzy, but again to me it didn't illustrate that Jonathan was being sneaky; he was trying to solidify his original alliance -- logically they should all have agreed Ozzy would need to go. Similarly his trying to persuade Flicka was in the service of keeping his alliance in control. Yet all of his alliance mates have told us they are suspicious of him. (Yul in the sense that he wondered *if* he should be suspicious of Jonathan because everyone else was). Why?

I think last week we did get a little bit more of a sense that Jonathan runs his mouth around camp a lot, as evidenced by his fervid attempts to fit in and talk to everyone once he got to Raro. That may have been what the Aitu's were referring to -- that he doesn't let things lie still, he is forever discussing situations and what will need to happen, which may have made some of the more laid-back people uncomfortable. That's all I can come up with, anyway.

ETA: as for Candice, I agree with VS that she came off negatively: she didn't *seem* to be switching for any reason other than that she didn't like Aitu and she wanted to get back with her friends Adam and Parvati. And instead of badmouthing Jonathan as soon as she got to Raro she might have been more cautious in case she and Adam and Parvati really do need Jonathan's support later. There wasn't any need for her to emphasize the target on him.


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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mysticjay 28 desperate attention whore postings
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11-15-06, 12:32 PM (EST)
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41. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
I am also new to posting here, but have been reading this thread for several years and love it.

On the Jonathan front, so often when numbers are mentioned, as you all point out, they do not hold up. It occurred to me that Adam saying Jonathan "can't go back to them" might fall into the same category. If Aitu made it to the merge, and needed a vote and Jonathan found himself out in the cold with Raro, why wouldn't they use him and his vote?

Jonathan has said he wants to stay one step ahead, so that might be a way for his words to become reality.

Kudos to all for the best thread in the forum. Thanks for letting me share this bit of speculation.

mysticjay

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architecturegirl 227 desperate attention whore postings
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11-14-06, 11:51 AM (EST)
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37. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
I'm going to chime in here and also plead - VS please dont go! I completely understand that its tough when you're so busy that you cant get to the game until late after everyone has posted - but we all truly look forward to them, and as said above - you are much better at not allowing your player preferences to color your editing analysis than most of us. This is YOUR thread, we all just enjoy the chance to chime in.


That said, I just have to say - that was just one of the BEST Survivor episodes ever - I LOVE it when we get great episodes like that!

Interestingly, Jonathan and Candice made a move that is just as much folly in Survivor on the level of what Ozzy did with sacrificing one of his own - yet we saw these two moves portrayed very differently. Ozzy's was fairly glossed over, but the mutiny was not at all - it has and will continue to be a huge deal. Obviously much would be made of this being what it was - but I bring it up because of the contrast to how little was really made of Ozzy's move. That bodes well for Ozzy I think.

The mutiny certainly was the best thing that ever could have happened to Ozzy. His very, very tenous position is now a thing of the past. They are a "family" now. I found this to be the most interesting thing from this whole episode - the emphasis on them being a team, a family, etc. I will venture to offer a difference of opinion VS - I think that being a "family", and a strong foursome, having an unbreakable bond created - I think that the way this has been presented, along with the way the two tribes have been edited surrounding this means that these four very well could be a tight-knit group that will go to the final four. Its not an "alliance" - its a family with bonds formed under adversity. This is very different than anything we've ever seen before, and truly, they have to be shown as a group now, so I dont see how that could have been edited out. Its so improbable that they could overcome the odds and conquer, that likely the editors dont feel they're giving anything away - the misdirection is built-in.

I would also like to bring up the theme of trust related to Yul that we have all discussed ad-infinitum. We certainly saw a betrayal of huge proportions occur. This, and its subsequent fallout may be where our trust theme enters in - it may have absolutely nothing to do with Yul/Becky turning on each other, although that cant really be ruled out. We may also from this mutiny come to see the use of the HII. I believe that this tight little group will become insular with an understandable "us against all of them" mentality - at some point after the merge it will either be them vs. all of Raro, or them vs. the original caucasian Raros. I think at one of these pivotal junctures we may see Yul use the HII to save one of his "family" - thus saving all of them and giving them the numbers advantage. This would make the HII a HUGE factor in this season. It certainly would bring the trust and idol themes together nicely. This of course rests on them all making the merge, but I think the editing points to them doing that.

I also think that the emphasis placed on "Ozzy the Provider" is now going to be understandable as well - he is Aitu's ace in the hole. He'll keep them all strong and well fed, and they'll only have to feed four people. Raro does not have Ozzy the amazing provider, and they have to feed eight people, so I think the disadvantage of Aitu's members having to compete in every challenge will be more than negated by them having more energy due to their great provider.

Sundra certainly emerged to the point of almost being the star of this episode. She was the one to express the emotionality of this new tribe, and to express their thanks for the reward. This is an important thing, since we usually see the winner being very appreciative of rewards and the experiences that come with them.

Becky's lack of airtime really bothers me - yet Yul went fairly into the background this episode as well. I think perhaps this is because while the underdog tribe triumphed - this completely changed the game for Ozzy and Sundra - it was their moment to turn the game around to their advantage even though they're the underdogs still. Becky and Yul already had the advantage, and lost that, but will they still come out on top with this new group? Truly it was Sundra and Ozzy's moment in the sun though, more than Yul and Becky's. They've conquered even greater odds. I'm not ready to write Becky off as the winner though, I just have an inexplicable gut feeling about her. If this group goes to the final four - she's the one being hidden from us of all of them. Why, why, why?

As usual Jeff's commentary from the challenges proves very interesting. Since I didnt comment on last week's episode I'm going to include some of his comments from last week that stood out to me as well as from this week's.

From last week's reward challenge:

"Rebecca quickly falling behind"
-she was a front-runner in her tribe, involved in everything. Does she quickly fall off signaling that we'll see her leave soon?

"Adam's got a lot of time to make up"
- interesting, but I'm not sure quite what to make of it.

"Jonathan and Becky not finding it as easy as they had hoped"
- VERY interesting comment. These are our two players that have been called out for playing the game too hard. They're the schemers - something happens to screw up their plans, make life difficult for them? Well, we certainly saw what that was for Becky. Who adapts better?

"You gotta keep moving Parvati!"
- This one really stood out to me - because she WAS kicking butt, and made up a LOT of time for her team - so to me this was out of place a bit. Perhaps Parvati will need to keep her head up, options open, and not get too comfortable? Looks like she's going to have to learn to scramble before the end.

"Becky excited. She's figured out a piece of the puzzle."
- Could be nothing, could be that Becky (and Yul?) figure out how to overcome the numbers puzzle they now face?

From this week's reward challenge:

"Aitu off an running"
- Are we seeing the beginning of their sprint to the finish?

"Its not going to be a comfortable ride"
- Just an interesting nugget

"Two new tribes battling it out. Who made the right move? Who made the wrong move?
- Well thats just obvious what its pertaining to.

"Raro still struggling". "Raro can not get there." "Raro is floating away". "Raro cannot fight the current." "Raro no chance of getting back."
- This literally got beaten over our heads. Raro has NO chance. They have a huge advantage, but they're just not competent enough. They just cant do it.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
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11-14-06, 02:40 PM (EST)
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38. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
Oh my goodness, sometimes (though you would never guess) I dislike the written word; I am certainly not going anywhere I am always looking forward to reading what everyone has to say and there are not many individuals who would be patient enough to read what I say

someclevernameusuallygoeshere - Welcome into our little (big) thread and hopefully you will post your own thoughts. I might add that your name *is* very clever; I tried to shorten it but found it was too entertaining to do that.

Michel my dear, you most certainly did not step on any such turf; I have no turf; this is OUR thread, I only thought up the clever title I am very glad you wanted to bring in statements you thought important, that is what this is all about and I certainly never want anyone to feel that I need to initiate anything or have "first dibs" on quotes/statements and so forth; sometimes I feel that I am being repetitive so I hope all of you forgive me if I mention something already stated. I love everyone's perspective; as I said before, it keeps me grounded

Your points on my question about Jonathan are valid. I won't repeat what BR had stated because that essentially are my thoughts as well. This is why I enjoy everyone's opinion as people view items in different ways (I recall the long debates over Tom's persona) You bring up Jonathan's patronizing manner towards Flica which, I am sure, others may agree with your assessment. Interestingly, I did not find it patronizing and that may be because Flica's actions and speak appeared so "flighty" that I found Jonathan's actions to be more of a teacher attempting to educate a somewhat slower student. I *felt* the editing was attempting for us to want to literally hit Flica over the head so I found myself actually more in agreement with Jonathan. In a nutshell (so I don't repeat what BR has stated) I have often said when no real villain exists, often times there is a concerted effort to create one because, as we all know, what story is not complete without a villain!

In a proverbial nutshell, see BR's summation as this is essentially what I am feeling with his character. We are seeing quite a bit of hearsay regarding Jonathan but unlike Fairplay who laughed in confessionals over his deeds, Brian who smugly told us about women being in the kitchen, we are only hearing conversations of his being such a cad. I really haven't even seen any demonstrative evidence of this. In other words, I recall in Australia how we would hear how Michael was behaving very arrogant and some of his actions proved that (naturally he then regrouped with his tribe to then have a melancholy send off) The edit feels pushed; therefore I am suspicious lol

With respect to Candice... her move in the game was a move; I have no opinion of her actions as to any negativity or positivity with respect to her actions per se. Far be it for any of us to question why someone makes decisions the way they do in this game; I can't fathom the mental and physical toll this show takes on these contestants. If her reasons were solely to be with those she really connected it, so be it. However, there is a perception that if that was really her only reason, she left at least three Aitu members feeling very betrayed. She was shown to be rather close to them and only that "morning" she was part of a group stating they will stick together. Candice may have felt very vulnerable but the episode really didn't support this; if anything, the episode supported more reason for Jonathan to leave as we heard Candice specifically state she wanted Jonathan to leave and we have heard over the past couple of episodes how Jonathan may be in danger.

We obviously do not know everything Candice said with respect to her "mutiny" I would state that if she expressed some remorse over disappointing people she did get close to or had the editing supported that she was, in fact, in trouble then I think she would have came off slightly better. She really only states she has been waiting to get back with her friends.

I am blathering again Suffice it to say, should we find out after the show that Candice felt extremely vulnerable and felt she would be leaving or there was a hint of "not all is right" in her alliance, then it is obvious the editing wanted to portray Candice's move as being somewhat shallow and somewhat selfish. Candice was exiled, not Jonathan (despite the negativity surrounding Jonathan over Candice at Aitu) which would lend to Aitu feeling betrayed by Candice as opposed to Jonathan. Again, this is the beauty of this show and how the characters and the story is perceived

I absolutely believe that Candice talked about Jonathan with more ears around on purpose but I am more of the mindset that it was to ensure that Jonathan would leave before she would. I would be more inclined to agree with your assessment (regarding refuting thoughts of a Caucasian alliance) IF we did not hear from Candice herself about Jonathan and her private discussion with Pavarti.

ag this is OUR thread. As stated I only hold claim to the title of it. I just hope I have the pleasure of coming here to read the contributions and while we appear to have dwindled in numbers, the postings are still as wonderful as ever You also may be 100% correct regarding the Aitu "family" and again you are correct it was not stated as an established "alliance" and there are no hard and fast rules of Survivor editing. It would be a pleasure to see these four "Davids" outlast the other "Goliaths" but in my own suspicious way I can only be pleasantly surprised should it happen; I'm too much of a cynic

Becky is indeed a strange one isn't she? I do not overlook the fact that Cowboy advised how she is a princess, Ozzy advised she is seriously plotting yet these attributions have been very cloak and dagger. Cowboy's description may have been one of just a general attitude he perceived from Becky and Ozzy may have simply exaggerated a detail to attempt to save Cecelia but she certainly does have some power in some regard. Yul no doubt listens to her, Becky went right to Jonathan to commence alliance talks, etc. I do think there is more to her than meets the eye despite the attempts to show otherwise.

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Scuba 2 desperate attention whore postings
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11-15-06, 08:51 AM (EST)
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39. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 11-19-06 AT 03:33 AM (EST)

Few quick (actually, incredibly long-winded) thoughts from a first-time poster...this is the only thread I make the time to read in any detail so if I unwittingly plagiarise something someone's written on another thread, I'm sorry...

I don't quite get all the love for the Aitu 4 - maybe this is because the editing has been manipulated so much in their favour that I'm trying to rebel against it (not that many people on the Raro tribe are remotely likeable), but the "hero" edit that the Aitus are getting is a bit misplaced to me. The seasons I enjoy are when someone with some reasonable concept of strategy wins - if they're likeable and/or good at challenges as well, even better, but neither of those makes (for me) a satisfying victory on their own without a strategic element.

Becky - clearly the most strategic player on Aitu, and was shown as the catalyst for both the Yul/Becky and the Yul/Becky/Jonathan/Candice/Sundra alliance. Strange then that we have hardly seen her all season (but in a tribe of 4, her face time must necessarily go up now).

Ozzy - while he's a challenge demon and a great provider, his social/strategic game is sorely lacking. Has sort of tried to play the "Rupert/provider" strategy, but that's a bit of a waste on a season where there doesn't seem much likelihood of anyone on any tribe going hungry. He would need a major attitude adjustment to win - we've seen that he spits the dummy when things don't go his way (such as his confessional after Cecilia's boot) and his comments about the mutineers, while making for great TV, could cost him two votes if Candice and Jonathan survive to the jury.

Sundra - a complete non-entity in the game since being the alternate boot in ep 1. Smart enough to take the opportunity to join the then majority alliance in Aitu, but has not shown any tendency to be proactive strategically. Her face time and edit improved post-mutiny (about the only thing I can remember before that is the unwarranted eye-rolling while sitting in on the Raro TC), but again, it had to with only 4 in the tribe, and everyone gets a nice edit about the family letters/visits (even Judd, as I recall).

Yul - I hope he wins. He's been a major part of strong alliances in the various tribal makeups, but he'll have to make a very smart play with the II, and win some immunities towards the end to win, because no one will want to oppose him at F2.

A few other random thoughts...

Raro's team choice at the RC was bewildering strategically, and showed little game sense - at the end of the day, while the reward would have been nice, the players have only been away from family for a month, and you can buy a lot of coffee and muffins with $1mil. Given that ICs have generally involved a physical element and a puzzle, to put arguably the two strongest guys, and the smartest woman in the RC was just stupid. A more optimal strategy would have been for Jonathan to swap with one of Adam/Nate for the RC, and for Rebecca (logistics of the barrel allowing) to swap for Jenny. Since they can't sit out the same people for two challenges in a row, they've doomed themselves to a sub-optimal team in the IC this week too (which is why they'll lose).

A bit's been made of the fact that Brad, as a jury member, has had, and will have had when voting, no direct interaction with at least two potential F2 players in Ozzy and Sundra. Depending on the outcome this week, this problem could become much worse, because with the exception of the mutineers (who will have lived with everyone), to a lesser extent Nate (based on his 1 day at Aitu) and to a far lesser extent Ozzy (based on his few Cao Boi dominated hours during the invasion of Raro), each of the other remaining players has never met at least three of the others...

We've certainly not been shown much in the way of strategy from the remaining Raros for me to really support any of them. Jonathan is unlucky to have been dropped into a series of strategically dimwitted recruits, where actually trying to play the game is seen a hanging offence - I'd still like to see him go far. While the flirting strategy has been derided, at least Parvati has some sort of strategy and it seems to be working so far (I'll admit to being biased because I think she's pretty - she's Shallow by name and I'm shallow by nature). Like VS, I found it interesting that the concept of the original Raro F4 was never seen being discussed with her (although you'd have to think from her discussions with Candice about the Candice/Jonathan bond that it was). Since that potential F4 is being edited in a bad light, Parvati's apparent lack of active involvement in it might be a good sign for her.

My final comment (as all the readers cheer) is directed at Candice - whose bio did yours get mixed up with on CBS, because I haven't seen much evidence of intellect so far!

Will try to keep it shorter in the future,

Scuba.

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architecturegirl 227 desperate attention whore postings
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11-15-06, 10:25 AM (EST)
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40. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 11-15-06 AT 10:29 AM (EST)

Welcome Scuba! Very interesting insights, your insights definitely add a more rounded out view to our discussion since as you've noticed many of us do have the Aitu 4 love, so comments from someone who doesn't "feel the love" is very welcome. My favorite winner was Chris, for just the reasons you mentioned - he played strategically and overcame huge odds. And he had the cahones to go along with Twila and split up the powerful ones.

Your theory on Adam is interesting. He certainly went from being almost non-existent to being in our faces a lot lately. Its not in a positive light though, to me he comes off as a goon. Poor wording perhaps, but its the best one I could come up with. I just dont see him getting farther than Parvati, although I could see him outlasting the other Raros. He of course will have to overcome the target of being an immunity challenge threat once the game becomes individual. Perhaps someone could be exiled (or on a reward?) during the F6 vote though, and therefore he could go at F6 with a 3-2 vote? Its possible. Numbers are often significant in the editing. More significant to his story though I think will be his rematch with Jonathan - who will prevail in that? First Candice warned him not to make an enemy of Jonathan and now she's stoking his fires against Jonathan. Will her original words of wisdom be the wiser ones? And what will Adam do?

Your comments about Ozzy's sulkiness and sore winner comments are interesting too. I had not thought about it in that light. We've all looked at Candice and Jonathan making enemies, but has Ozzy? Hmm. My feeling on him is that he's being set up to be what people will consider a F2 foil, but he could be one thats strong enough that could win due to his abilities which we've been just absolutely clubbed over the head with.

Yul - with a jury starting at twelve, there is the outside chance that we could have a surprise F3 vote instead of F2, and if thats the case - Yul could easily win it I think, because normally he would be a classic F3, last member of the jury because no one would want to go up against him in the finals. But if we end up with a final three vote, he would likely still be there and could easily take it. Honestly, thats the only way I see him winning. Otherwise someone would have to pull a Colby for him to make it to the Final two.

You're absolutely right about Raro's team choice for Immunity and Reward challenges. Another thing I hadnt looked at, and I can 100% get on board with you on that one - stupid, stupid move to put your weakest players in the immunity challenge portion consistently.

Finally, I had neglected commenting about Candice in my last post. I admire her guts to make a bold move, but I just absolutely do not see how that was even remotely intelligent unless somehow we were not shown something that made her think she was in danger. The time for a merge was just too close for jumping tribes and alienating people to be a good move. Why not wait a few days? She must have had her reasons, but to me it seems like the saltwater and starvation got to her brain. No one would have held not flipping against her. I just do not get it. And god, stupid move Jonathan! If she's willing to check out on you - DONT FOLLOW HER! She just proved herself to not be loyal to you!

Edited to add: My apologies VS, you are right, this is our thread. I was just trying to emphasize that your posts are a vital and much looked-forward to portion of this thread.

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LionChow 2033 desperate attention whore postings
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11-17-06, 01:33 PM (EST)
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42. "RE: Episode 8 Thoughts"
Using a totally non-threatening, non-flame-ish tone...

Hi Scuba,

Thank you for a really strong post, with a well thought out analysis. Just one thing worth noting though...

Despite it's being created in the Spoiler section of the web site, this thread has traditionally been as Spoiler-free as is possible.

Every season, it is the goal of this thread to spot who the long-and short-range players are, the potential winners and the themes of the season. Most of the people who post or lurk in the "Veruca Salt thread" try as hard as they can to turn a blind eye to true spoiler information.

In that spirit, would you mind going back into your post and editing out the two mentions of rumored info above? There are probably still several people that have not read it yet.

Thank you and, I promise, welcome to the thread!

LC

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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11-18-06, 05:10 PM (EST)
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43. "Episode #9: The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"

Did you enjoy that episode? It had it's funny moments!

In the recap, Jeff called Aitu the underdogs and qualified their IC win as an upset. Was he trying to influence the viewers, getting them to care for their plight? Of course he was, they have a story to sell! Jeff’s comments during the challenges underlined the story they are telling. It turned into:

The Avengers vs the Keystone Cops!

The RC: “Digging in the Dirt”
-“North by NorthEast” said Jon, racing to the compass rose. “North by North West” corrected Candice. Jeff noted the dispute.
-“Man…come on guys” said a frustrated Adam. “Why are they digging like that” asked Candice.
-“Ozzy and Becky have their second chess” said Jeff while Candice and Adam were walking around their rose. “Adam and Candice are confused…losing time” was the commentary.
-“Raro has lost all momentum” while Nate is seen suffering on the bench.
-Ozzy ran to the right spot while Jonathan and Jenny left too early and then still didn’t know their South from their North!
-“They are on their last chess, we only have two…I’m going back to Exile” recognized a dejected Candice.
-“Jenny pushing sand back into the hole” commented Jeff while Adam couldn’t understand.
-“Why do we keep doing this” asked Parvati. “I don’t believe it” chimed in Rebecca. Nate wasn’t looking anymore.
-Losing a bit of his diplomacy, Yul looks at Raro after it is over and says: “They don’t even have their 4th box!”

The IC: The Ozfest tour

-“I have faith that you studied it (the Island map)” said Jeff while a determind Aitu was on our screen.
-“Ozzy already up…Raro quickly falling behind” were the first comments from our host.
-Raro will have to make up some time. Nate is exhausted.”
-Adam is sulking on the bench while Aitu cheers all their swimmers.
-“Jonathan coming back quickly, Becky slowing down…Parvati, a strong swimmer trying to make up time. Raro catching up!” These were the only positive comments for Raro. You have to have some suspense!

After all that, it was surprising that the funniest sequence was provided by Yul and his team mates during the reward!

What about the players? Lets start with The disorganized Bunch:

Jonathan is proud of being able to climb trees and get coconuts. Did you smile when his “climbing” skills consisted of leaning a box against the tree’s trunk and getting on top of it?!! He called himself “a wandering Jew without a tribe.” “I regret jumping,” he let us know but he still had hope it could be a good thing.

His plan was to become indispensable to the survival of the tribe. He said the tribe’s losses are due to not working together: “If it is ever going to work, slowly but surely, give them an example of another way to be in the tribe. That is: You have to work your @ss off all the time.” Before leaving for TC, he thinks he has earned 1 more day. He did provide 22 fish in two days which he was quick to let us know at TC, reminding his tribe mates at the same time. He put Raro in trouble during the RC but we didn’t hear any recriminations in camp.

Candice started by telling us another reason for her mutiny. She trusts Adam and their talks show that this alliance is in it together to the end. During the challenge, we hear her admonishing Jonathan for not following the right direction. She knew a loss in the RC meant another trip to the isolation of Exile Island. Aitu even made sure to say her name in unison!

Her “Character building experience” was nicely presented. It started with her slow walk through the surf, viewed from far away, giving us the impression that she had been abandoned even by the boat’s crew. Once on the Island, she tells us: “It’s not fun to know that people that you like want to see you suffer.” The food she had to content herself with was disgusting and her tears were touching but viewers had to be saying “you should have thought of that before stepping off the mat.” She probably remembered Nate’s words at the last TC because, when she walked back on the challenge beach, she had recovered her smile. “I stayed strong out there” she assured her tribe at Jeff’s prodding. Strangely, we didn’t hear her speak once at TC.

She has provided the editors with a lot of material. She started in relative obscurity, another girl who looks for romance rather than play the game. She then starred in the “Everybody Loves Candice” comedy that ended with the “Peanut Butter Kiss”. By the end of the recap, she had replaced Parvati as the CBS Poll’s most popular woman of the show. She then made one of the most audacious moves in Survivor history and now is paying for it. It would seem that you would want players to make bold moves so I doubt that she gets booted before we have a chance to say that it had a chance to work if…

Parvati was first seen with Jenny, getting a feel of what she thought of the Candice-Adam affair. While Jenny worried about what they were talking about, Parvati joked and said, “They’re talking about making babies…They’re the All-American couple.” How much did that deflect Jenny’s suspicions? Parvati had both Adam and Nathan for a while but she didn’t seem concerned about Candice moving in. What is her plan? A couple needs to be split but since they are her allies, she could wait until F5 to do so.

Again, it was her that the camera showed when Jeff asked, “Want to know what you are playing for?” It has happened way too often for it not to be planned by the ones choosing the shots. It certainly isn’t because she has enjoyed many of those rewards because we hear her say: “Why do we keep doing this” after another loss. She showed her team spirit by helping Rebecca study for the Island map. Jeff said she was a strong swimmer and was making up time for Raro. She did run out of steam at the end.

When Adam said in camp: “We are leaning towards Rebecca,” Candice, Jonathan and Jenny were sitting with him. Parvati and Nathan didn’t get the editor’s blame for booting this nice player. In fact, throughout, it was Jenny that told us Rebecca couldn’t go any further. Jenny’s own fate was sealed by Adam’s words to Candice about Jenny being by herself and wasn’t a real threat. Parvati then talked with Nathan to check if Jonathan had a side deal that the team may have had to worry about. All that could have been manipulated so that Nathan showed some compassion for his Hiki sister and Parvati didn’t backstab her friends.

At TC, Parvati was the only one to openly say that Jonathan had contributed enough to make him a big part of the tribe. It was probably because she would be reading the message, but after Candice had given her opinion that the bottle twist had to be bad, Parvati was shown looking at the bottle. “That’s not fun…that’s not cool and definitely not a merge” was her reaction after reading the message. Indeed, the game has become quite serious. Her smiles had told us it had been mainly fun for her up to now. Will she adapt? The number of times we’ve seen her on camera when it could have been anyone else plus the shroud that has covered her talks before TC still have me believing in her chances. She’s had the only consistently positive story on the current Raro.

Adam started by telling Candice that Jenny is the one they had to worry about. She confirmed his suspicions by telling us she wants to keep her 5 strong. That alliance was dead but they managed to keep Jenny unaware of that. For a moment we were made to think Adam may have a grasp of the game. Then we saw him in the shelter, kissing Candice. The illusion was gone.

If he is in charge of the challenge strategy, he isn’t doing a good job. Twice, he has sat out of the immunity challenge and the tribe left Rebecca on the bench during a land challenge forcing her to swim. At TC, he spoke of being tired of losing and that they had to look for productive players. It is more the utilization of those players that is lacking.

Nathan’s role in this episode was very secondary. He didn’t take part in the early scene before the opening credit which has set the tone for every episode since they’ve started doing that. His facial expressions during the RC were as good as any commentary an analyst gives during a game. He couldn’t keep up with Ozzy in the IC but who could?

His talk with Parvati after the challenge was one of the few we’ve been privvy to between these two allies. It wasn’t so much a strategy discussion on who to boot so much as Parvati assuring herself that Jonathan hadn’t been making different deals with different members of the tribe and a chance for Nate to vent. At TC, he doesn’t speak until after the message in the bottle was revealed and that is when he realizes Aitu would be down to 2 members had they lost.

His story has been positive for the most part but his actions against Stephannie added to his unnecessary “Denzel” act on Brad and all the smack talk shows us a negative side. With the quantity af material he has provided, it seems the goal is more to make his elimination acceptable rather than showing many facets to his character.

The Fearsome Foursome

Ozzy was first seen filling his “King Neptune” role. That scene featured a large fish that was only revealed when it moved. Before then, it looked like a rock. (Emy, help! Ozzy isn’t hidding) Then he narrates the story line for the evening: “We’re three people behind. We’re being tested as few survivors have…It is an incredible opportunity. I’m totally happy to be the underdogs.” He didn’t do anything special during the reward challenge but stayed focused like his team mates. His little jump of joy at the end of the challenge was showed in slow motion to let us savor it.

At the reward, he had a few confessionals: “It was a Warrior’s welcome. It’s part of their culture. We were warriors that just came out of a fierce (!) battle. It was incredible.” Later he added: “We were separated in our same ethnicity and have now all come together to experience this totally new culture. We carry a piece of their spirit with us into the next challenge. Raro doesn’t know what’s coming.”

What was coming was more of Poseidon’s prowess. He got a big lead that Raro never quite recovered. Can he swim away with the big prize? You have to say that his chances are starting to compare with the heroic story he has had since JP told us he is good at this.

Yul told us earnestly before the RC that their strategy is simple, that winning is the only strategy: “We have to work together, we have to be a team or else we’re screwed.” We were shown his reaction at seeing his former Puka ally eliminated. We even heard him let out an “OH man!” to underline his disappointment. The numbers had suddenly looked even worse.

The victory at RC enabled us to see a different side of Yul. The “very complex, very intellectual” player came out of his shell and had fun during his dance with the native women. The “Yul-Sandwich” had me laughing out loud. Wasn’t that also the intent of Tom’s drunken scene in Palau? The double-boot has suddenly returned the numbers to a manageable deficit.

Becky if she is “The One” ( ) needed to come back on our screens again. She did it in a restrained but efficient manner. She was the one seen cramming for the reward, memorizing the flag code. With Sundra, she then took charge of the puzzle after putting a lot of effort in retrieving what to her were huge boxes. By comparison, the camera shot had just shown Jonathan not using his legs and having more problems than her!! We heard her telling everyone that “This is the ‘R’,” then looking over the solution while Jeff made sure they had it. Her scream of joy was also shown in a replay to make the viewers share her success.

The camera soon focused on her as Aitu approached the tribal chief very cautiously. She told us about that greeting: “At first, this very dignified man…comes out and starts yelling as if we had done something wrong. He had this commanding voice…There was nothing we could do but stand and wait.” After that momentary doubt, she showed her enthusiasm again by laughing and clapping during the parade. She was then first with Sundra to get into it, dancing with the locals. Even the “Rain Gods” were happy and showed it with a thunder clap.

The IC was another good showing. She lost ground to Parvati during the swim but kept the team’s lead. She again was seen handling most of the Island Tiles to solve the map’s legend. This time her scream of celebration was replayed in a close-up.


Sundra was again the emotional narrator of Aitu. She was right there with Becky placing the flags in order. Her take on the reward covered what everyone had to be thinking: “It was magnificient…How we felt after winning the challenge. You know, the 4 orphans that have to stick together and we triumphed once again. I can’t describe how that felt.” She was often seen standing close to Ozzy. A bond seems to have formed around these two. We know that a bond exists between the other pair. Is it how it would split if it comes down to it?

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
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11-19-06, 08:37 PM (EST)
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44. "RE: Episode 9 Thoughts"
What another interesting episode and certainly the editing is honing in on the “little tribe that could” along with squeezing every fresh drop of Jonathan as they can as well

The Recap

Brad’s comments made Raro suspicious
Nate: “…I lost my trust with him”

At Aitu….

Candice “…it’s gonna get ugly”
Candice and Jonathan conspired to turn against their alliance at the first sign of a merge
Jonathan: “I am determined to not be the guy who made the move too late” (foreshadowing?)

At the RC Candice and Jonathan betrayed Aitu, leaving them with only four members, but in a dramatic twist the underdog Aitu tribe claimed victory (no verbal from Ozzy with “death….” only visual) and sent a message to Candice by sending her to Exile Island.

The reward brought the Aitu closer together
Yul: “We’re a family out here guys”

Ozzy (conf “The mutiny solidified our commitment to each other” (voiceover as Sundra/Ozzy hug)

Ozzy conf: We’re a team to the end now (as pointed out, this yes, does not reflect “alliance”)

At Raro (Jonathan’s “step into the unknown”) Jonathan tried to fit in with his tribe (Rebecca/Adam) but quickly became the outsider

Nate: (conf “You really think we’ll have your back after we saw you sell out your other tribe? Are you dumb?” (notice this is Jonathan again and shown but not Candice)

At IC, the “Aitu Four” sank Raro in another upset win.

Jeff: “On the other side of the coin, Raro TC tonight” (Jonathan)

Before TC, Jonathan tried to prove his worth by working hard and Candice reconnected with Adam and tried to distance herself from Jonathan

Candice” “…I wish I was over there”

But at TC, Brad dug his own grave… ……first member of jury (Jonathan surprised then breathing sigh of relief) and the jury has its first member

Building Ties at Raro

We see Jonathan continuing his strategy as provider using all that Ozzy may have taught him (except Jonathan had to use a crate to get up in that tree )

Jonathan (conf “Who knew a Jew could climb a tree and get coconuts… ...alone in the wilderness; I’m the wandering Jew without a tribe (nice pun) I’m living a mutineers life; I’m on the outside, I made the game much harder for myself. I regret jumping, I mean it was an impulsive thing but I hope in the long run it turns out to be a good thing (last part shown with him passing out nuts to Nathan, Rebecca, Jenny and Pavarti)

Again, we hear a bit of insight from Jonathan. Unlike Candice, Jonathan is letting us know there is regret on his part when he probably had the most reason to jump; for what it is worth, Jonathan is meant to be a very well rounded character and I do believe that if he wasn’t integral to the events that impact this game, he could have been shown as more one dimensional

Candice and Adam

Adam: “Are you excited to be back?”
Candice: “So excited. You know I trust you”
Adam: “Yeah, I’m the same way, you’ve been my biggest ally since the beginning. We got to keep that cuz you and I are gonna be the end; that’s what we’re doing” (I need not remind anyone how I feel about that statement especially in light of Adam and Candice are now at any point ready to leave; the crux of their edit set at the beginning has now been formed, there is no other point to either of their stories; IF Candice showed more dimension in a HUGE storyline she was directly involved, it would be one thing but everything has been, “I’ve jumped, I’m with Adam, I’ve been the target of the Aitu tribe” There has been no depth to her reflection or really her thought process on what she did may entail)
Candice: “Good”

Candice(conf) “I took a big step to switch tribes and I’m completely out of everything that’s going on. (Adam is now shown below) From the very beginning I feel that Adam is very straightforward person so I do feel lucky to have somebody in the game that I can trust right now” (more conversation shown)

Adam: “You and I are going to the end” (he winks and makes a noise and if you listen closely you can hear what almost sounds like a duck quack and that my friends was only more confirmation that Adam and Candice’s edit is to appear more foolish than of any success)

Adam: “Everyone knows that you and I are real close and Jenny is the only issue with that; she’s probably worried that I am going to be with you which I am and we got to not let her think that”

Jenny and Pavarti

Jenny: “I want to know what they’re talking about”
Pavarti: “Probably want to make babies and have a house with a white picket fence; they are like the All American couple”

Jenny (conf) “We stick to our five Nate, Parvarti, Rebecca, Adam and myself and we’ll get far in this game; Candice I’m a bit wary about because I know in the original Raro tribe that Candice and Adam had a little attraction so I’m a little worried about that because we don’t’ want Adam to falter and make sure he stays secure with our group of five alliance.”

Under the tent Adam and Candice further their relationship as their edit furthers them out of the end game…

(Adam has yet to tell us the dilemma HE is in having Candice back but being aligned with the others from Raro; no introspection whatsoever on his thoughts/feelings. Candice and Adam have a very bland presence on the screen when their situations COULD have so much more)

A Visit To The “Underdogs”

Ozzy (conf) “We’re deep inside of a hole (seen fishing) we’re three people behind at this point and we’re being tested in a way that few Survivors have been able to come out of. (nice visual with a huge wave crashing down behind him) It’s an incredible opportunity; to be the underdog is amazing and I’m happy, I’m totally happy to be the underdog”

The Aitu “Four” group together for tree mail

Yul(conf)“Tree mail was basically a code (Becky shown being tested) so we’re fiercely cramming" (Ozzy now shown)

Note that in the prior portion of his confessional, Yul was wearing his green shirt and obviously it was during this episode as he specifically discusses this challenge

Yul(conf)“For us, we don’t really have any strategic options other than to win…”

(In this portion he is sitting with no shirt on and in a different setting. More than likely this little blurb had nothing to do with winning a REWARD challenge; Yul is a very articulate individual; for him to discuss “strategic options” really makes no sense as they are two tribes, there IS no other option but to win. For Yul to comment like this for a reward challenge also seems a bit nonsensical as well. Considering we see that Ozzy tells Yul about the idol in the upcoming episode, I would hazard a guess that Yul’s confessional is probably from this upcoming week as it makes more sense that he would say that his group of four there is no other option but to win)

Ozzy to group: “We are the underdogs, all we have to do is our best”

Yul(conf) “We have to work together, we have to be a team, if we’re not, we’re screwed”

Again, this seems more of a confessional for the upcoming week as opposed to a reward challenge where they obviously ARE working well as a team since the editors are determined to drill that into the audience; I imagine none of this was used because other options where they won’t be screwed became available OR we will see other portions of this confessional this upcoming week

The RC

Jeff: “Brad voted out at the last TC” (Yul: “Aww, man”) note nothing from Becky who, also, was with Brad on Puka

Jeff: “One bit of news that I need to share with Aitu (group) when Brad became the ninth person voted out he also became the first member (Ozzy with a very dramatic shift in music) of the jury” (Ozzy making a “whoa” face then shot goes to Sundra biting her lip; make of that what you will with Yul then shown “Whoa!”)

Rebecca, Nathan and Pavarti sit out the challenge and then it begins and just to make sure that the audience knows that Jonathan was wrong the coordinates are on the screen.

Candice immediately corrects Jonathan and the “Dissension of Raro” soon begins.

Jeff: “Adam and Candice confused” (more of their “edit?”) and “They’ve been at this chest a long time!” and “They’ve lost all momentum”

When Jenny and Jonathan go for their chest though, you hear commentary from Candice and Adam but nothing coming from Jeff which was very interesting. I also noted that Jonathan could have received a verbal “slam” from Jeff as well when he did not know the coordinate and was having trouble with Jenny digging up the box and using one hand. (Jeff only mentioned there was little sand coming up) There was MUCH more emphasis by Jeff on Candice and Adam’s inabilities as mentioned above, than Jonathan. Make of that what you will but again, it appears that quite often Jonathan is receiving a softer touch where Candice and Adam have been receiving a somewhat harsher edit (let’s not even forget their recap on EI and how ludicrous they were attempted to appear and that is only one incident I am mentioning.)

Candice: “Come on, I’m going to go to Exile” (thank you for foreshadowing that)

And more from Jeff on Candice and Adam when they go for the next chest..

Jeff: :Adam and Candice, like slow motion over there”

Pavarti: “Oh My God, how do they keep doing this” (about Aitu)
Rebecca: “I don’t believe it”

Jeff: The “new” Aitu tribe wins third in a row (they have been this tribe now since last RC but still Jeff made sure to mention the “new” Aitu tribe)

Yul checks over at Raro and notes where they were in the race.

Jeff: “You must send one person from Raro to EI”
Yul “1, 2, 3, (all say) Candice”
Jeff: “Is this from the same betrayal?”
Yul: “Betrayal, strategy, at this point, same thing”
Jeff: “You just got back from Exile, you’re heading right back there”

(Candice is not shown as he states you’re heading right back there but rather, Pavarti, Rebecca and Nathan with Parvarti sadly shaking her head)

Yul and Becky shown in slow motion very happy with the last shot of Ozzy kicking up his heels.

The Exiled One

Candice: “Today I did not want to be sent back to Exile Island but I know it will be okay; it’s not fun to know that people that you like want to see you suffer. I can survive out here, it’s tough but hopefully it’s a character building experience”

I will state the music was sympathetic in nature so the editing is not entirely attempting to make her “the bad one” probably just foolish. But her words and actions enforce to me how flat her edit is. She wanted to be with Adam, she succeeded and she is thinking that it isn’t fun FOR HER that people she likes want to hurt her. Should she have mentioned she regretted her jump or understood how they are feeling perhaps I would lend more credit to her standing but she falls flat and I do think Adam and Candice will leave soon after the other and probably pretty shortly since their arc has essentially concluded

More Aitu Four

The plane is flying with Ozzzy/Sundra holding hands excited

Ozzy:(conf) “I really believe our tribe deserved this adventure cause we are up against these amazing odds and we come into the challenges humble knowing that we can only try our hardest and that’s all we can do”

Becky:(conf) “At first this great dignified man… comes out and starts yelling… the most we could do was stand and wait”

Ozzy:(conf) “Basically it was a warrior’s welcome… and we were warriors that just came out of a fierce battle; it was incredible and it was nothing we ever expected in our imaginations”

Sundra:(conf) “I didn’t know I would ever be a part of something this beautiful in my life; it was magnificent, the people welcoming us; how we felt after winning the challenge; you know the four orphans who have to stick together and triumphed once again. I can’t even describe how that felt!”

Yul(conf) “I was incredibly grateful for the islanders reaching out and being such wonderful hosts, it was fun. I gotta say it’s the first time since I’ve been here that I really felt carefree and just enjoyed myself"

Ozzy(conf) “Yul’s a very complex, very intellectual guy; to see him coming out of his shell was amazing. Man, that guy can dance! I didn’t know he had it in him (shots of Yul with his dancing) You know at this point in the game we’ve gone from being separated into all our ethnicities now we’re able to come together and experience a totally new culture and we carry a piece of their spirit with us to the next challenge. (Sundra shown dancing ) Raro doesn’t know what’s coming!” (Ozzy shown very happy with his two lady islanders)

Not very hard to include everyone with their thoughts about the reward since their were only four of them. Becky, obviously had the least to say which does not necessarily mean anything. One can sometimes be mislead by confessionals and where the person ends up because of same. Some contestants have amazing confessionals but they are part of that journey like arc they are being edited for. I am glad to see that something had been stated about Yul though since Yul has never been discussed as a member of this game other than Becky and their relationship which has been something already discussed. End game players talk AND are talked about so Yul’s added “dimension” by Ozzy would only serve him better


Back At Raro

Jonathan(conf) “My tribe mates all want to chill… ...whatever they’re doing isn’t working, maybe they’re demoralized… but the reason that we’ve been losing… …they’ve have not been a tribe yet, they have not worked together and I realized that if it was ever gonna work, slowly but surely give them an example of another way to be in the tribe and that is you work your ##### off all the time”

(slightly sliced up confessional as portions of the above and portions below, Jonathan is in different settings and with different clothing)

Adam and Jonathan meet up with Jonathan showcasing all the fish he caught also showing Nathan with Jenny’s commentary at some point since Nathan is suddenly right next to her.

Jonathan(conf) “These folks need to trust me I need to help them out. I can continue to try and do what I am doing and have them say oh at least somebody’s working; can’t get rid of him because at least I’m working… I don’t know, we’ll see”

(again this confessional in its entirety was spliced up from at least two different confessionals some of which may probably be from the next episode)

Tree Mail arrives with Jenny narrating the lack of drive by Rebecca

Adam tells Rebecca that she really needs to learn it with a slight nod from Rebecca and Jenny continuing to tell us how Rebecca has not been up to snuff in the challenges. Pavarti in the positive way she has been shown offered to help Rebecca with a halfhearted effort by Rebecca obviously paving the way for her demise.

The IC

Candice gets welcomed back from EI; specifically Jonathan and Adam shown.

Jeff: “…the isolation must be having some impact on you?”

Candice: “Well I’d rather be with my tribe but I trust that they know that I’m staying strong out there and they’re staying strong for me back at camp” (glimpse to Ozzy)

Jeff advises on the mysterious bottle and the Raro members to compete are selected

Raro again noted to fall quickly behind as Ozzy immediately again shown to be successful in the water, Nathan tired, Yul successful, Jonathan quickly back, Becky slowing down, Pavarti a strong swimmer trying to make up time, Pavarti worn out (Jonathan shown cheering and encouraging her and Rebecca) Rebecca does not come up with the bundle. Aitu shown starting their puzzle and Rebecca arriving on shore but Aitu solves the puzzle shortly thereafter

Jeff: “Congrats Aitu on your fourth straight win” (Yul appears to be the designated II holder)

Last bit shown of Becky yelling in victory and Yul expressing his delight

Pre TC Dynamic

The mysterious bottle elicits a lot of conversation

Candice: “I think individual challenges but no merge or we have to live on the same beach (to Pavarti and Jenny) but no merge” (oddly placed shot of Nathan thrown in)

Candice:(conf) “Once we lost immunity there was a little twist that whoever went to Tribal tonight would get this bottle with a message in it and we couldn’t open it until after the vote. (group then shown discussing) I have this feeling of like dread like I don’t want to open it, I don’t want to know cause it’s gonna be something really bad but who knows”

Jonathan, Jenny, Adam and Candice sit around discussing the vote

Adam: “Were leaning to Rebecca (shot of Rebecca by herself at the shoreline) I mean there’s nothing around the challenges, nothing here”

Jenny(conf) “Based on overall performance… we’re gonna have to break up our five team alliance and send Rebecca home today”

A crab, Adam, Candice

Adam: “I think it’s good we’re sending Rebecca home today” (Candice agrees) and then after that I don’t know; Jenny’s gonna want you or Jonathan after that but that’s alright”
Candice: “Do you think she can get that to happen?”
Adam: “Well I mean she’s by herself “

Adam(conf) “Jenny becomes a threat and we really have to worry about Jenny after this vote; at that point she’s really gonna try to get Candice off. She’s worried that I wouldn’t vote Candice out which is true so Jenny might be the next one to go”

Adam’s arc is increasing but again, no depth. While both he and Candice are increasing in visibility, all there is, is Candice and Adam and what the initial editing told us; that these two needed to be back together. This has occurred but look at the circumstances in which they reunited. What fun that could provide; what great commentary and nothing. There is no branching out for either of them. Accordingly, I only see the beginning of the end for both.

The nasty multi legged bug appears as we see Pavarti and Nathan talk.

Pavarti: “Has Jonathan tried to talk to you about, like, anything?“

(Interesting question since Pavarti would be considered one to be in the Caucasian alliance yet we are being shown that she is somewhat removed from it and, in fact, Pavarti seems ALWAYS to be shown as the person mulling what to do. We know she and Nathan are close so either Pavarti IS removed from the Caucasian alliance or she is trying to seek information where Nathan is at knowing what is going on with Jonathan yet on the surface the audience is NOT meant to think that about her since we saw nothing in follow up about it such as her discussing how she feels or why she asked Nathan the question she did)

Nathan: “No. He’s a cool guy but I wouldn’t turn on anyone of our original members for him; that’s not fair, we’ve gone through too much together you know (I found Pavarti’s face curious when they showed her reaction; she almost seemed a bit tortured or upset in hearing his words) even though there are times where I wonder about certain individuals” (shot shown on Pavarti while he is saying this and some eerie music after; shot then goes to Nathan)

Nathan (conf) “Tribe’s consensus is to vote for Rebecca; she’s our weakest link but I would say maybe Jonathan right now just because of the fact that he’s not family” (Jonathan shown with Pavarti and Jenny walking behind him which somewhat negates what Nathan states ) “You know we want to keep it Rarotonga as much as we can so it’s kind of a, it’s a weird vote tonight.” (again that strange music)

Jonathan and Rebeca shown near the fire as Jonathan puts fish in….

Jonathan (conf) “I believe they are going to vote Rebecca out, I believe; I hope and through a lot of frickin hard word on my part the last couple of days I think I have earned at least the right to one more night.”

More note discussion with the sun setting with Adam’s face in the shot

Tribal Council

Smiles as Brad arrives with Nathan “supposedly” winking at Brad, Adam smiling huge, Candice shown looking over at smiling.

Jeff asks Jenny that as a tribe they have only won three challenges and what can she do to change something within the tribe
Jenny: “I wish I knew the answer, I still can’t pinpoint it (Jonathan shown probably because Jonathan did pinpoint earlier to us in his confessional) I think it goes back to analyzing our strengths (Nathan) and weaknesses (Nathan) I guess we are going to have to wait and see.”

Jeff asks Rebecca what goes on at camp
Rebecca: “We know we have to move forward and stay as positive as we possibly can, everyone goes out, clamming, crabbing, octopussing, ummmm…”

Jonathan “appears” to interrupt “and also I got some fish and some trokus…”

Jeff: “How many fish?”
Jonathan: “Today and yesterday I went crazy with the spear and I caught like 20, 22 fish in the last two days”

Jeff: “22 fish in the last two days??” (even Brad give us a shocked expression)
Jonathan (smiles): “Yeah” (note that both Jenny and Rebecca validate this with smiles and nods, we have nothing to negate this or have it meant to look like Jonathan is a buffoon in this regard)

Jeff asks Pavarti now that Jonathan is here and catching the fish…
Pavarti: ‘He is blending in; yeah definitely, Jonathan is a big part of this tribe and he has been basically nourishing us (shot of Candice looking down) so that we could have the energy to perform today and it’s cool to have him around”

(Jonathan happy to hear this and again more validation for Jonathan and which also begs the question how much Pavarti really did know when speaking to Nathan as it appears that Pavarti may still be in a loop with him, Candice and Adam)

Jeff asks Adam about the dilemma of keeping people you need or people you trust
Adam: “Jeff I’m tired of losing and it’s all about productivity for me (Jonathan) there’s been other reasons before; (Rebecca) tonight is about productivity. I don’t like losing and I’m tired of it” (crash)

Jeff announces that you can’t get much clearer than that and then brings up the bottle. Rebecca subsequently voted out and noted to be second member of the jury.

Parvarti announced the consensus was a merge right guys (Jonathan smiling/nodding) but we don’t know or roll out a whole buffet for us (Jonathan shown yet again then Candice) Parvarti begins to open it (again shot of Jonathan)

Pavarti: “You just voted out a member of your tribe, you will now vote out another. That’s not fun.” (Nathan opened mouth, Jonathan rubbing his head)
Jeff: “Definitely not a merge” (Brad looking surprised)
Pavarti “Not a merge and definitely not very cool”

Jeff asks Nathan his reaction
Nathan “This is definitely wacked… and now I’m thinking if we had this win today they would be down to two, should have, could have, would have (Adam head in hands) spilled milk” (Candice)

Jeff: “There is no sign of a merge, it could be tomorrow, it could never come (Nate’s head in hands) now you’re down to five (Jenny), they’re at four (Adam) so Adam, criteria now”

Adam: (shot of Jonathan first) “You know I think Rebecca stood out as one who wasn’t productive and there’s no one else of those so this is gonna be much tougher.”

Voting commences Nate shown quite frequently looking tortured and Jonathan introspective. I believe we saw the same shot of Pavarti at TC some time ago as well when Jeff announced he was ready to read the votes; the shot was identical to when (I believe) Jeff announced the votes at the JP boot.

Jenny is announced (much to her chagrin) with the final shot of Pavarti as Jenny is told it is time to go with Jenny sending her own parting gift on the way out

Jeff: “Well tonight you lose two more members, you’re now down to five. Maybe this (Adam) is the wake up call (Nathan) this tribe needs in order to get it together” (Jonathan)

As we see, Jonathan next week is aggravated because he’s not going to lose because “you kids can’t get their asses out of bed” (I believe more than likely this is part of a confessional; Jonathan is actually too smart to confront them directly and I do believe some of his confessionals from this last episode may have been taken from the upcoming episode)

Yul shares his secret with Ozzy “I know a way to change the game” (ironically he uses the same term as he did about the HII before “changing the course of the game”)

Candice and Adam’s edit furthered along but static as it has been.

I won’t reiterate past commentary I made but the connection of Jonathan along with his former mates is again noted. You will be forced to look back at other analysis I made for any other storyline purposes

Needless to say, I do wish to also point out (in order to further the commentary I made between Candice and Jonathan) that Candice has yet to build on any remorse or prior relationship to her Aitu tribe; ironically Candice was closest to them while Jonathan was in danger. Jonathan DOES express his thoughts about it which only leads me to believe his “story” and the members of Aitu still are intertwined. Candice’s story? From early on the connection with Adam seemed to be what was honed in on and that is being served now. Remember again, the words I posted last week with respect to them that Candice warned Adam about Jonathan in a situation that this little conversation really did not seem entirely necessary. We may see this come into play. Pavarti again is rather removed from the Caucasian dynamic which may serve her well for the time being but as I feared, her entire story where she shined was about her flirtation which also seemed to have boxed her in a corner. This has now fell by the wayside and they are giving us very little now with Pavarti except that she is being untainted by any dirty work. This is not bad for Pavarti per se but it certainly does not have me optimistic that she would be there at the very end. Nathan yet again voted solely on his own wants and wishes and with the turning of his arc last week along with another “me” vote this week, his fun nature seems to not so fun any longer and a very narrow minded view which serves no purpose in this game. Again, I do not want to go back and reiterate all the nuances that the episodes have thrown us but Yul and Jonathan taking on Nate could very well be prophetic as it was stated on two occasions and that would raise my eyebrow. Jonathan’s story is still building, Yul’s obviously as well and Nathan’s has been boxed; it has been essentially the same story, just a different episode; therefore there may indeed be payoff in that regard. The Aitu Four has naturally been highlighted as this is Survivor’s editing dream; the fact that this “underdog” scenario seems almost forced (much like Jonathan’s evil persona) lends to the belief that it is integral to the outcome of the game as there has been an embellishment. If these stories did not merit towards the story that is being told, it certainly would not be exaggerated in the regard it is. Aitu is only down in numbers, but we hear of “underdogs” “orphans” “Aitu Four” and so forth to a degree that clearly we are NOT meant to forget how they are fighting against many odds. Sundra and Ozzy have shown a nice consistency and I would be hard pressed to find a "normal" viewer out there who probably easily forgot that Ozzy was not exactly the nicest contestant in the beginning.

We are also not meant to forget how Jonathan is sneaky and suspicious and untrustworthy when we know there really hasn’t been any direct evidence to support it. In fact, Candice being sent to EI twice would support Aitu feeling Candice is the one who did more “evil” than Jonathan did. I would have liked to hear more about the actual mutiny from the Aitu tribe and their thoughts and feelings about Jonathan and Candice and the situation a little more closely but I think the editing wanted the audience to see the situation as simply as possible. “Aitu good, Jonathan and Candice bad” and “Root Aitu, laugh at Raro” and naturally the David and Goliath comparison.

Ironically, a similar situation with completely different circumstances happened last season. Terry was Aitu with Raro being Casaya. Terry was at a disadvantage as is Aitu but kept rallying back (and really both Terry and Aitu are extremely capable regardless that they were down in "numbers" Terry being MUCH moreso) and winning while Casaya and Raro self destructed. However, Terry was also meant to look very inept in every OTHER area whereas Aitu is shown to be succeeding IN every area. Would it not be ironic if a Raro ended up in the final four with three Aitus in contrast to Terry ending up being in the final four with three Casayas? (again my penchant for the dramatic flair

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11-22-06, 12:01 PM (EST)
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45. "RE: Editing"
Michel, I normally go straight to the bottom of the page and post my own thoughts then work my way back up so I would obviously be remiss in my last post to not compliment you on your observations I won't reiterate all the blather I did below as some of my observations would respond to yours and I certainly agreed that Aitu is getting a shining edit (what a complete contrast to Casaya of last season yes?) that is as blatantly positive as Casaya was blatantly dysfunctional. The four Aitus are certainly honing in on a big portion of how this season probably wants to be perceived, that is, among this racial divide, individuals of different cultures, etc. can strive together. My perception of the outcome does encompass this along with some items that struck me that were stated by contestants and so forth.

ag I see you are already viewing potential final two foils One item that I sometimes need to remind myself of is that the final two foil doesn't necessarily have to be someone who is edited worse (so to speak) than the winner but rather the audience should only feel that the winner was justified in that win. At this juncture, there are viable candidates but a merger certainly may change things.

I was determined to keep my thoughts brief (believe it or not) but would naturally want to wish everyone a wonderful holiday

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11-22-06, 03:04 PM (EST)
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46. "RE: Editing"
Great post Veruca Salt! Was I the only one who thought the editors were especially mocking of Candice when she came back from EI. There is a close up of Ozzy looking off camera (supposedly at Candice talking) then you see him turn to look at the camera (completely dismissing her with a bemused smile on his face). The audience knows that Candice wasn't staying tough on EI, Ozzy not buying it seemed like a shared laugh the editors have with the audience.

Think it's quite clear what we are supposed to think of Candice.

Also just a thought but the eerie music could be due to the original Rarotonga tribe. The irony that Nate who wants to keep original members due to loyalty and after that night it does look like it happened. Just not what Nate meant!

I feel kind of bad for Adam (not that he himself isn't responsible for his frat boy image) he never gets to say anything smart really. Or if he does he is instantly contradicted. Constant shots of him grinning mutely for a dumb reaction shot. And even when he talks about Jenny being suspicious we get a scene afterward of Jenny looking at the two canoodling.

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11-22-06, 05:34 PM (EST)
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47. "RE: Editing"
VS: The parallel you brought up in your analysis is brilliant:

"A similar situation...happened last season. Terry was Aitu with Raro being Casaya. Terry was at a disadvantage as is Aitu but kept rallying back...and winning while Casaya and Raro self destructed... Would it not be ironic if a Raro ended up in the final four with three Aitus in contrast to Terry ending up being in the final four with three Casayas?"

Will Aitu also ultimately fail as did Terry?

In your reply post, you add:

"Aitu is getting a shining edit that is as blatantly positive as Casaya was blatantly dysfunctional."

The main difference I see is that Casaya had the entertaining characters while La Mina was fairly bland. Aitu only has Ozzy to add spice. Jonathan, the Adam-Candice love affair and the smack-talking Nathan give more flavor to Raro. That, and their trips to TC!

Last season's edit was to have fun with the odd situation of the dysfunctional tribe still coming through. This season is more serious and favors showing Yul, a wonderful person but, like the diplomat he appears to be, not someone you'd ask to star in a sit-com. The scene with the dancing locals was out of character.

I see we agree that Parvati is treated with some care by the editors. That is positive but what worries me is that she hasn't had a confessional in a long time.

Cantstandya: You're right regarding the intention behind showing Ozzy grimacing as Candice spoke. Do they want to discourage future players from making bold moves?


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11-25-06, 07:36 PM (EST)
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51. "Episode 10 Thoughts "
I hope everyone who celebrates Thanksgiving had a lovely and relaxing day. The Survivors obviously had quite an exciting time last night and I must say this was one of the more entertaining merge episodes in my years of viewing this show. I guess Yul and Jonathan taking on Nate did, in fact, pay off :smile

The Recap

Our game changing two boots bottle is shown…..

At Raro Adam and Candice reconnected
At the RC (Jonathan shown incorrect with Candice correcting him) Raro lost their bearings (unusual they show this part since the fault was directed towards Jonathan yet we saw that really did not cause their loss, and, in fact, Adam and Candice were edited much worse during that challenge)
Jeff: “Aitu wins their third challenge in a row!”
And Candice was banished to EI again
Candice: “Hopefully this is a character building experience (as stated before, this type of commentary that is repeated is not usually one attributed to that end game player. Additionally, with her edit essentially consisting of her tie with Adam there is nothing else of for Candice)
At the reward, Aitu felt like champions
Ozzy: “It was a warrior’s welcome…. and we were warriors that just came out of a fierce battle”
At the IC, a mysterious bottle promised a twist to the game (Rebecca)
Jonathan: Go Rebecca!!!
The two tribes battled it out
Jeff: Sundra has the fourth bundle for Aitu (Rebecca struggles) and Aitu was victorious once again
Back at Raro, Rebecca blamed for loss while Jonathan hoped his hard work earned him a spot within the tribe
Jonathan: “I think I earned the right to one more night”
At Tribal, Jonathan was spared then the mystery of the bottle was revealed (Pavarti reads) so Jonathan was back in the hot seat but at the end of the second vote it was Jenny who took the fall (Adam shown)

Jeff: Nine are left (Pavarti) who will be voted out tonight (Jonathan)

Scene One – Stage Set

This was certainly a telling of a story within a story. Jonathan disillusioned with the outcome of the event precipitated by his mutiny. An opportunity is given to him, a struggle ensues over the decision and the outcome results.

Jonathan informs the Raro members that the fish are awake and he is off; we see him speak at one point how the fish are skittish with Pavarti rolling her eyes (Now an eye roll is shown at Jonathan yet we were shown just the night before Pavarti singing Jonathan’s praises, this, like Nathan in the last two episodes, showed a slight shifting in Pavarti’s arc which may signal the beginning of the end. I had written previously that Pavarti’s edit was sadly boxed in and recently Michel you noted that you had issue with her lack of confessionals; I don’t necessarily her lack of confessionals (or anyone’s confessionals necessarily at being an issue (she still received very nice air time otherwise) BUT her character has solely embodied her strategy of flirtation. This has never been furthered. This was how she was expanded to a huge degree and it was deflated. Pavarti’s edit was a big colorful balloon expanding greatly only for an invisible pinprick to deflate her. There is nothing else to Pavarti but her edit was emphasized because it was successful unlike Misty’s whose methods actually caused her demise. We now see an eyeroll from a rather nice, bubbly person who thought Jonathan’s providing was wonderful and then later in this episode we see almost a caricature of what was an edit that was shown quite positively for her)

Jonathan (conf) “The way the votes came down last night they could have gotten rid of me at any point; whether that mutiny was a good idea or not I can’t even really worry about it; it worked out my way at least at this point it’s gone the way I want it to go, three people from this tribe have been eliminated before Candice and I and now I’m in a powerful position in a smaller tribe and that’s a good place to be (Jonathan gets wonderful confessionals and insights. I would love to speak to the editors and find out if they had a close relationship with Jonathan as he is one of the more involved edits I have observed. There is a concerted effort to not let Jonathan appear too negative despite the fact that there is enough “material” for them to do so) and after the below scene

Jonathan (conf) “I’m a little disappointed this morning, I know these are young people who like to sleep in but they’re gonna have to listen to me now and they’re gonna see my way is a good way” and after Nathan’s confessional

Jonathan (conf) “We need to win challenges, we need to work hard around camp we need to turn things around” (Pavarti then shown walking with Jonathan asking Candice where she was going now)

Adam: “The least we can do if he comes back with 25 fish is start a fire or we could just have him come back and start the fire” (laughs with Candice)

Candice shown making the fire with Adam chopping, Pavarti is overheard stating Jonathan was back. We hear nice comical music as Jonathan asks about the fire with Candice stating she was working on it . Jonathan shown directing the Raro “kids” at their jobs.

Nathan (conf) “… coming around and barking orders…. It’s like shut up fool; first we all know what we’re doing we aren’t knuckleheads around here (yet the shot immediately shows Candice NOT being able to get the fire started which completely negated what Nathan stated and reinforced Jonathan’s position)

Jonathan: “It’s like a dorm or something (to Candice, note that he is still showing that he feels close to Candice by saying this to her)

Jonathan (conf) “ I really got so close to balling them out (Pavarti rubbing her, Nathan laying down ) and I almost said do I have to be your father or your boss; is that how you need to be treated (Nathan and Pavarti shown again relaxing) to do anything in an organization? Cuz I’m not going to lose cause you kids can’t get your asses out of bed” (Nathan and Pavarti shown again and ironically only Pavarti and Nathan were featured during this tirade; both Adam and Candice were not visually shown whatsoever)

The Toll Of Being An Underdog

A nice close up shot of the idol with Sundra in the background with Yul then sharing with Ozzy that he is feeling physically under the weather. Sundra offers a suggestion then Ozzy viewing Sundra’s physical issues as well. Whether the focus on Yul’s ailments have any foreshadowing remains to be seen or it may just be some added color thrown onto Yul’s canvas

Yul (conf) “We’ve been having challenge after challenge… ...not getting a lot of downtime… I’m getting a little worried especially going forward is going to be a problem” (A little doubt is always good to infuse in our heroes)

Sundra (conf) “We are still the underdogs, I mean they still have the numbers over us; we still have to prove ourselves every day, every challenge, that’s all we can do…

Again, Sundra gets a lovely edit being the reflection of their status and fulfilling the role of narrating the Aitu Four and their plight and efforts to strive. What happens when this is no longer necessary however? While I have seen some of you seeing a victory by Sundra, she has not given me much other than she is the voice of Aitu’s plight. I had felt that way when those of you felt you saw a Danielle win last season. Longevity? Yes. But I do find something lacking in an end game edit for Sundra, as I did with Danielle. For Sundra, there has been (for me) no visible means shown that she is showing any other angles to her. I have read some of you feeling that her earlier confessional is significant of a potential winner; some of you know I am not one to rely on “winners quotes” but rather certain statements have BEARING on the outcome. I have no sense of Sundra other than she is an “Aitu Four” Her first episode confessional WAS important but I don’t attribute that confessional being her property yet part of the story much like some of the other statements and confessionals we have heard. Sundra is one that (to me) is edited as shown being the player who made it much further than she should have; a journey character, if you will. Frankly the only item that would have me question otherwise was Rebecca and Sundra’s relationship highlighted on Hiki. It never had an outcome and usually relationships featured tend to have a payoff in some degree.


A Mess Of A Merger!

The tribes arrive at the beach and Jeff mentions that both Rebecca and Jenny got voted out. Sundra was never shown in reaction to Rebecca’s vote. Yul was shown shocked yet again when Jenny’s name was mentioned and stating “Two?” with Sundra and Becky looking at each other with Yul heard saying “Whoa”

Jeff “This last challenge you win is enormous.” (yes he said it like that in a voicover as the words were heard while Yul and Ozzy were shown with Yul saying “Yeah”) “Had Aitu lost that challenge it would be 7 –2.” “Sundra what is the feeling now with Raro walking in a tribe of five?”

Sundra “It’s a mixture of things I think we’re getting very even (Yul and Ozzy) it just makes you (Candice) think you can’t get comfortable at any point”

Jeff “The game is clearly up for grabs” (Yul nods and shot moves over to Adam and Jonathan)

Jeff announces a merger with a chorus of surprise……

Adam (conf) “We always wanted a merge before we lost our numbers… …future’s looking bright” (never a good statement lol)

Sundra (conf) “Wow is the correct word, it’s a much different game; we as the “Aitu Four” definitely have some maneuvering to do; there’s still only four of us, we’re still “underdogs” but “winners never quit” (I believe this last portion was dubbed in from her earlier “winners never quit” that she mentioned at the reward in discussing her son which lends to the fact that the editing is certainly pushing all her statements of striving forward which does bode well for her but moreso, she is speaking as the voice for the Aitu Four as opposed to solely herself)

Jeff asks where they will live
Nathan “We’ve got more coconuts, trust us get over here”
Pavarti “No rats”
Yul “Jonathan and Candice have seen both camps so what do you guys prefer?”
Jonathan “There is definitely more coconuts, there are no rats”
Nathan “Leave the ghetto!”
Pavarti: “Come on over guys!”
Yul “I think we’re all cool going over to their camp”

The merge is official as the new AituTonga eat and drink and in case we were not entirely sure that Pavarti employs flirting, a little shimmy was shown by Pavarti and some lovely smiles I might add, of Becky!

Yul “I know this is a game but I’m really looking forward to getting to know the people on the other side that I never got to know” (Pavarti interjects with “seriously!”)
Nathan “Hey man you know what you got class brother!” (this is shown on screen)
Pavarti “Yeah you do!”
Jonathan “He does!”

Again, I had mentioned some posts previously, would it not be lovely that the winner this season with the overriding theme being what it is, to encompass a winner that represents probably what Mark Burnett intended as well as Jeff’s words "It is the impressions you make on the other castaways that determine your fate"

Yul (conf) “We have a new identity now… ….but the fact of the matter remains that we’re still divided into two tribes and as Aitu came in (Yul with Becky and Pavarti on either side at table) with fewer numbers things looked pretty bleak” (Nathan) Yul then mentions to the group of Aitu’s circumstance and the fact they are even still here

Yul (conf) “We’re trying to figure out if there is any chink in the armor in Rarotonga; (Candice) we desperately need to convince someone (Adam) to come over to our side”

Jonathan “Let the games begin; one on one, it’s gonna be fun”

Pavarti “Carry me off to bed tonight” (as the drinking commences in earnest)

Jonathan (conf) “The Raro kids, all they wanted to do was to get faded; that’s not what we used to call it” (Nathan shown tipsily asking Ozzy how he was doing and Ozzy states he is doing really well, next shot of Yul watching then Sundra watching then Adam getting sick with Jonathan watching, Adam then shown with his drunken comment on his girl’s figure, Nathan laughing, Pavarti smiling and essentially this scene was NOT meant to show these “kids” positively at all) “These kids are vomiting, the are eating and drinking so much” (Candice/Nathan with arms around each other, Adam laying on ground) “Is that how you compete in a competition? I’m here to win a million; a million dollars; that’s a one with six zeros on the other end, okay? They’re psychos I don’t understand it!” (Jonathan, as always, a good narrator for this season summed up the “kids” well; what ARE they doing? Again, I don’t hold much with “million dollar quotes but rather, how this is integral to the story, he IS trying to win a million while the “kids” are not)

Things To Ponder

The following scene was not very necessary en masse. Nathan, of course, being the victim of the last show, needed this confessional to help establish how safe he feels but the scene with Ozzy and Nathan was actually not very necessary. Ozzy did not end up voting out someone other than Nathan so it had little bearing on the outcome. However, relationships shown, especially at this point in time, can be important. I am “backburning” this as it may have relevance for Ozzy

Nathan: “AituTonga is our new little snap. I feel we have cool numbers because we have 5-4 merger and everyone on my previous tribe is sticking together regardless. Pavarti, Adam and I are very close, Jonathan and Candice can’t really swing because they sold out them out in a mutiny so I’m feeling really good but it’s also good to read the other tribe mates because you (at this point the confessional is spliced as he is wearing different items with a new setting) gotta keep your enemies close you know” Par of conversation of Ozzy/Nathan now shown and “Ozzy’s a good captain; he’s real mellow, down to earth homey. I see Ozzy and I clicking nice so keeping my eyes on him in case things get ugly” (Always good, as we know, to hear players being talked about by others)

Nathan “All right dog we gotta new game to play”
Ozzy “Yeah”
Nathan “Tap dance”
Ozzy “Yeah cuz we’re both on both sides”
Nathan “Pavarti’s gold. Got that luck”
Ozzy “Yeah so is Sundra” Not Becky, not Yul, but Sundra. Another backburner since we are well aware of the closeness of Becky and Yul. Within the Aitu Four, we still do have divisions as noted by Ozzy as well.
Ozzy “Yul and Becky, they’re solid”
Nate “Yul’s gonna get cut off though cuz my five are gonna wanna cut off your strong points”

Ozzy (conf) “I’ve always know that I might have an ally with Nate just from the time we kidnapped him over to our side. I took advantage of that right away and as soon as possible started talking to him about what can we possibly do” Interesting that the audience was never shown Ozzy moving and shaking with Nathan at the time Nathan was kidnapped yet we are being told now? Is this important for us even to know this? The editors seem to think so.

Nathan “We gotta come out sneaky in the beginning like a snake and then we’re straight. One love brother, let’s do this”

We then move to Pavarti and Adam

Pavarti “I’m so happy how today turned out; really good day” (Adam gets familiar with Pavarti)
Pavarti “Don’t even start with me”
Adam “Why?”
Pavarti “Because. I can tell what’s on your mind”
Adam “Can read me like a book huh”

Adam (conf) “Boozing a bit today… I partaked a little bit; it’s good to sit back and relax, not have to worry about challenges or Tribal Council (Pavarti tells him: “Dirty bird”) it’s been a great day, been the best day since I’ve been here”

Candice and Becky briefly shown
Pavarti “What happened to Candice?”
Adam: “You both can appreciate me”

This may very well be one of those scenes that has no bearing on anything but to titillate the audience. Two girls, one guy which also was expanded at the Tribal Council that episode.

Scene Two – The Plan Unfolds

Jonathan is shown walking with Yul and Becky’s scene then shown and again, even a novice like myself could hear the change in the music.

Yul “I’m trying to think, what’s the danger of them knowing I have the idol. (these words shown on screen) I don’t know that there is a whole lot of danger, they don’t have the numbers to arrange a split vote” Yul’s confessional now shown
Yul “Jonathan I know more than anything he is rational player”
Becky “ I agree”
Yul “He’s gonna put planning over personal consideration, I don’t that the other people would do that. Jonathan if I can convince him…. … we have the numbers I have the idol”
Becky “It sounds like he is the best player to do that”
Yul “Alright I’m gonna go look for him”


Yul (conf) “Our backs are against the wall; we need someone to flip (this is voiceover) we’ve kinda come up with a desperate plan based on the fact that I have the HII and it could change hopefully the whole flow of the game”
(Yul in green shirt, rocks behind him with idol)

Scene Three – The Bait is Hooked

Yul and Jonathan shown

Yul “So let’s just talk strategy, does it make sense under any scenario for us to work together again?”
Jonathan “At this point I could not entertain what you’re talking about at all. I do not believe Ozzy would trust me. I’m not sure why you would trust me”

Yul’s confessional shown at this point which is below

Jonathan “Let’s say I did what you are proposing which I am actually not entertaining (dramatic music at this point) but I’ll play the scenario. I don’t believe you can get to the final four unless you’re aligned with the person who has the HII because let’s say you have the idol and we vote for you, three of you vote for me okay, boom I ‘m out” (change in music again)
Yul “Right”
Jonathan “So I would have to align with you because otherwise I’m gonna get my ##### booted out before the final four” (Foreshadowing? If so, perhaps by the one who does not trust him as said by Jonathan?)

Jonathan’s confessional shown at this point which is below

Yul “Hypothetically say I have the idol. How would I know that if I tell you I have the idol you wouldn’t just turn around and tell your tribe?”
Jonathan “Hypothetically you… we would have to learn to trust each other again. What am I gonna say? I promise? Okay I promise. What’s that worth to you? You know what I mean? I’d have to think long and hard about my reaction if you even implied that you could show me the idol. If you don’t have it, unfortunately right now I have where I can say that you’re just gonna have to sit and let me figure out what I want to do”
Yul “Alright, to be continued”
Jonathan “Alright?”

They shake and agree on a good discussion with a rattle of music heard

Yul (conf) “Jonathan deserted us; we had an alliance going and he turned his back on the alliance; basically left us for dead but at the same time I don’t really have an option here I gotta figure out something that is gonna work; this might work”

Jonathan (conf) “If I flip again the Raro people are going to go mental. Mental! (Nathan) Right now they (Candice) trust but there’s no way that the Aitu (Pavarti) people would trust me (Adam) or that I would ever go back to them” and “If Yul has the idol I have to consider flipping. I made a very impetuous move once. It worked out in my favor; I have the numbers but if I was with the guy who had the idol all along and I have to flip back that’s a fantastic twist!” For the record, the remainder of Jonathan’s confessional appeared to all be in the same spot so this portion of his confessional is a rather long one that continues throughout until the beginning of Tribal Council.

Scene Four – The Small Reveal to The Bigger Climax

Yul is first seen with Sundra
Yul “The reason I haven’t said anything till now is I want to make sure the four of us were tight. That there’s no way any of us would flip, and we’re gonna go all the way so I think I know a way to change the game”
Sundra “How?”
Yul “I have the idol (Sundra very happily hugs Yul) and I think I can use it to get Jonathan (confessional of Sundra now shown) If this works out all four of us are in the final four” (Becky had danced her way over)
Becky “It’s awesome! We deserve it right?”

A group hug ensues What a complete contrast to last season and the HII. Terry’s “ace in the hole” was solely kept for Terry as the individual whereas we see how the HII is being utilized by Yul to further his group)

Sundra (conf) “Yul pulled ME aside this morning and said that he, in fact, has the idol (Becky prances over and she and Sundra are joyfully bouncing around) and that he’s been talking to Jonathan to come to our side (Becky and Sundra hug then more talk) so that was pretty exciting to hear. It’s definitely a nice little wild card you know”

Ozzy and Yul now shown Interesting that Yul shared with Sundra with Becky arriving and Ozzy at a different time. This was a different time period as Yul’s back had a thick bare tree branch behind him with Sundra and did not have the large bare branch with Ozzy

Ozzy “You found it? That’s great!”
Yul “I wanted to tell you guys but I wanted to wait for a moment where it could change the game and I feel like this is it”

Ozzy’s confessional now shown

Yul “This could take all four of us all the way and I’m like that’s how it should be played. Alright buddy”

They hug and shake as only two men can do.

Ozzy (conf) “Yul has the idol and as long as Yul can convince Jonathan to flip sides we’re gonna be okay. The only thing I’m worried about is what to do with Nate because he’s a really cool guy. I enjoy hanging out with him but (at this point we have a different confessional shown spliced together) I still feel like I gotta be true to Yul (right at this point is a voice over) and my tribe (this last part of “and my tribe” sounded edited in so I think perhaps since there were two confessionals cut together, Ozzy may have been discussing staying true to YUL with reference to Nathan advising him how old Raro wanted to get rid of Yul. His statement would not have made sense, however, if “and my tribe” was not included)

A definite change in the music as Pavarti and Candice are walking with a shot going to Ozzy.

Pavarti “What if Ozzy wins immunity? Yul has to go before Becky or Sundra. He’s really intelligent and a good competitor”
Candice “Yeah. What do you think Nate thinks about it”
Pavarti “I know Nate would do whatever we wanted”
Candice “I want Yul gone simply because I don’t like the way he and Jonathan talk”
Pavarti “It’s like stirring up trouble”

More music change up as we now see Jonathan and Candice

Candice “I know you guys always talk; what has he been saying?” (this part said onscreen)
Jonathan “He’s feeling around you know”
Candice “What is he saying?”
Jonathan “He’s saying come over, deal with us and I’m like are you crazy. Ozzy is going to vote me out in one second”
Candice “Because we mutinied. Who do you think goes first?”
Jonathan “Ozzy, for sure”
Candice “I think Pavarti and Nate want Yul”
Jonathan “Why? I mean that’s just stupid!”
Candice “I know…”
(Jonathan’s confessional now shown)
Jonathan “Somebody has the idol, if it’s someone on our side, we’re golden, it doesn’t matter. But I don’t have it you don’t have it”
Candice “Yeah”
Jonathan “If we vote for Yul and Yul has it we’re gonna find ourselves going home for no good reason”

Jonathan (conf) “Raro. They want to vote for Yul right now; they think he’s the mastermind but if Yul has the idol it’s gonna be me that goes home (shot of Becky, interestingly enough with Sundra walking in background as opposed to Yul being shown) because they’re all gonna vote for me (Yul shown) Yul will play the idol, I’ll have the second highest votes and I’m gonna get sent home All this is hypothetical because I told Yul until you show me the idol (shots of Yul) I can’t make a decision. If he doesn’t show it to me, then he’s just blowing smoke up my ##### and there’s no reason for me to flip.”

The IC

The necklace is revealed with a smile from Ozzy, reaction shots with Nate and Yul then Sundra

Jeff “When you have the immunity necklace around your neck (Jonathan) you are safe (Yul) and cannot be voted out (Becky nodding) Immunity is the single most (Pavarti) important element in this game (Adam, Jon, Yul then Ozzy alone)

Adam drops rather quickly, Candice shown to be quite comfortable up there. Jonathan mentions his feet being bigger may cause a problem and Yul chimes in that Jonathan may have a point due to the mass and surface area. Yul states he’ll never get a date again and Pavarti advises that smart equals sexy. Jonathan drops soon after with Jeff mentioning that two guys are the first out of the challenge. Nathan dropping a bit more with Pavarti shown observing and Sundra the first woman to loose a foothold. Nathan drops with four women and two men left. Sundra “takes herself back into the zone” Yul adjusts and Sundra drops. Candice shows off (not a good thing to do) and Pavarti chimes in on Candice “getting wild” on the new tribe. Jeff chimes in he likes the new name. Yul can’t hang on and he slides leaving Ozzy the remaining man with three women left. Becky slides and Pavarti on her last foothold and she drops. Jeff shows them the necklace, advising Ozzy it is unisex. Becky loses her footing suddenly and down to the final two, Ozzy and Candice. The rain gets worse as Nathan advised “they could be out there till next morning with these two.” Candice finally drops and Ozzy wins. I’d be curious to know the elapsed time between Candice dropping and Ozzy winning as it was raining then overcast then it seemed suddenly sunny when Ozzy went to retrieve the necklace “feeling like an old man” Candice said he did a good job and shots of Candice, Pavarti and Jonathan with Ozzy leaving us with the necklace.

I did again find it curious that the brief commentary by Yul followed by Pavarti’s opinion of Yul was mentioned. Good television? Probably, considering how absurd it sounded in the situation they were in. The question then is could Yul’s statement be met with ridiculous music and edited eye rolls? Yes. Instead though, we get Pavarti telling us that smart is sexy. So in that essence, there was manipulation.

IC Aftermath

Ozzy asks if Candice’s feet hurt and that it was amazing she stayed up so long (Becky shown)
Candice “I was like this is my only chance!” (a shot of Jonathan looking a bit sinister shown)
Ozzy “After the first hour, I was like, this is gonna suck” (this comment was shown on screen)
Candice “How much longer could you have stayed up there?”
Ozzy “I think I could have kept going”

(Nathan’s then Adams’s confessional now shown)

Pavarti “Yul you were up there awhile”
Yul “I was looking over and I was like I’m not gonna win this (this part shown on screen)

(Pavarti’s confessional shown)

Nathan (conf) “I’m happy Ozzy got the immunity necklace cause I respect him as a competitor; at least he’s safe for another couple of days because I like the cat (Ozzy smiling) and if there’s a way I can work with him I’m definitely down” (Again, not very necessary to show; perhaps to throw some doubt on how the vote will progress but I would say this is more about Ozzy than Nathan’s demise as furthered by Adam’s confessional)

Adam (conf) “Ozzy, him winning the challenge today is a perfect example of why we should get rid of him as soon as possible. He’s the biggest threat but right now he’s got immunity so tonight our tribe is sticking together and we’re all gonna vote out Yul.” (Again, discussion of players by others is actually a good signal)

Pavarti (conf) “Yul is the choice because he is brilliant; he’s like Mr. Harvard, Yale, Stanford guy and he’s also really really strong so we just want to get him out as quickly as possible” (As with Ozzy, speaking about another is normally a good signal for them)

Scene Five – The BIG Reveal

Jonathan gathers more fish with Yul there to greet him

Yul “So my hypothetical is a reality; this is the idol”
Jonathan “Holy…”
Yul “And I’m asking you for both of our sakes to become my ally again”

(Jonathan’s first part of his confessional now shown here and again, most likely a continuation from his earlier confessional and pieced together with later ones; I felt for continuity purposes to show it all together at the end of all the conversations)

Yul “This is the only chance we got, everyone recognizes that; this is the only way this is going to work. I thought about it though, I want to go to the final two with you because honestly I think my chances with you are better than with Becky or Sundra because they haven’t made any enemies. Right? You have made enemies (portion of this statement is on screen)
Jonathan “I appreciate your showing that to me; if.. I have to think about it; I really do”
Yul “Alright, (pats Jonathan on back) to be continued”

Interesting that Ozzy was never mentioned by Yul, only Sundra or Becky; would not Ozzy be someone that Yul would also mention as a final two candidate to Jonathan. Ozzy is with the “Aitu Four”, it would stand to reason that Yul would consider going with him as well?

Now Jonathan is with former Raro with the exception of Nathan

Jonathan “My only concern with Yul is he’s the only other guy whose been to Exile”
Adam “He doesn’t’ have the idol” ( this is shown on screen)
Jonathan “Do you have the idol?”
Adam “No”
Pavarti “Yul was there for like a day, there’s no way he has it (very bad editing job done here. Pavarti actually did not say this in this conversation, it was probably her confessional when discussing voting out Yul. As the words were said, the camera went to Pavarti and her mouth was not even open)

Second part of Jonathan’s confessional shown now

Jonathan (conf) “I was not that surprised when Yul showed me the idol. After our conversation yesterday it made perfect sense and now I have a lot to think about and a huge decision to make because basically Yul said vote with us tonight or you’re going home tonight” and “I floated this idea to them, I said what if Yul has the idol and they were like he doesn’t have it, he’s gotta go. (Adam and Candice) These people aren’t thinking. I don’t believe they’re smart enough to put the mental energy into even running the scenario of what if Yul actually has it and if I can’t convince them Yul will play the idol and bounce back and I will be going home very early”

Adam “You want to vote Yul right?”
Nathan “Yeah”
Candice “Jonathan refuses to vote Yul off”
Adam “The other option is to let Jonathan have his way this one and next time he’ll go” (this portion said onscreen)
Nathan “He can’t come in our game and tell us what to do…you and I call the shots”
Adam “Okay”
Nathan “He’s lucky he’s still alive right now” (said onscreen)
Adam “I know but we need five votes”
Nathan “You don’t’ want Yul in the challenges” (said onscreen)
Adam “Okay, I mean I agree I just” (Candice shown)
Nathan “Yul is intelligent, I don’t want that boy thinking anymore (said onscreen) you don’t want that clock tickin” (More discussion made of Yul. Ozzy and Yul both got very ample conversation made about them in this episode)

Adam (conf) “Nate’s convinced we should get rid of Yul and I’m fine with that but I’m concerned about Nate because he is acting differently recently; he’s not his usual self he’s been hanging around Ozzy a lot and that concerns me” (Again, some spin for the element of surprise at Tribal Council? Perhaps)

Adam “I don’t know what the hell’s going on with him”
Candice “Nate just needs to chill out”
Adam “He’s just thinking too much”
Candice “We are good and Jonathan’s good”
Adam “I don’t know; this game’s crazy. Bananas. Makes you think all the time. Bananas”

Well I will leave that scene where I ended it as I need not embellish since the music and the scene did that already.

Scene Six – The Sting

Jonathan “Please you have to understand I have to think about this; it’s an extraordinarily big thing to do. (Adam and Candice shown) Adam and Candice did keep me alive in this game (this was shown onscreen)
(Jonathan’s first portion of his confessional now shown)

Jonathan “I’d rather it was personally Nate before Adam (shown on screen)
Yul “If it matters to you (shown onscreen) I’m happy to accommodate” (Becky smiles over at Sundra)
Jonathan “You guys have to think about that “ Second portion of confessional of Jonathan shown

Again, interesting that Ozzy was not here for the pow wow Jonathan had with the three members of Aitu. We heard specifically that Jonathan feels Ozzy does not trust him and Ozzy would want him gone but we also heard Ozzy tell us this plan hinges on getting Jonathan over. Yul tells Sundra with Becky arriving about the HII but Ozzy is told on a separate occasion. Ozzy played his own social game with Nathan when Nathan was kidnapped and even upon the merger. We heard Yul personally tell Jonathan that he would want to go with Jonathan to final two as Becky and Sundra have not made any enemies but Ozzy is not mentioned in that equation. Sundra and Ozzy are noted to be close by Ozzy and Becky and Yul are close as noted by Ozzy (and later at the TC) There is something that is not entirely being shown clearly; there is some cloak and dagger effect being implemented in terms of Aitu

Yul to Becky “I hope Jonathan’s not playing us, there’s always a possibility he’s doing it just to throw his name off our target” (said onscreen)

Yul (conf) “It’s entirely possible Jonathan’s pretending to go along with our plan in order to direct the vote away from him onto Nate and if he doesn’t vote with us tonight I’m gonna play the idol and once it’s played I’m vulnerable. I don’t want to do that so I dunno. I’m hoping somehow all this clicks together”

Candice “Nate is gung ho on Yul” (said onscreen)
Jonathan “On Yul? All right. Well listen, I’m down”
Candice “Has Yul even tried to say anything?”
Jonathan “Nope”
Candice “I can’t believe they haven’t said a single thing to anybody”
Jonathan “Been weird” (Remainder of Jonathan’s confessional shown)

Jonathan (conf) “It’s very appealing to jump over to them. On the other hand (Adam shown) Adam and Candice did welcome me to this tribe and really helped me out and kept me alive here. (Adam shown again) I would hate to betray them cause if I do that it makes me the guy who betrayed every single person in the game at one time or another” and “Basically Yul said pick whoever you want to go and since I feel some loyalty to Adam, I said Nate who I trust the least because I know him the least” and “Either way people are going to be pissed; either I will have betrayed the Raro people and I’m a complete bastard or I didn’t jump over to the Aitu people and I’m a complete bastard who screwed them twice. I don’t know what I’m gonna do, I wish I knew”

Tribal Council

The jury is brought in and Sundra is shown winking in that direction (connection with Rebecca?) with a small crash sounding

Jeff asks Jonathan how the merge changed the game
Jonathan “The least of it is the sleeping accommodations (Yul smiling) have been hard (Candice) there’s nine in a tent and we all had to get used to living together after so many week of vying with each other..”

Jeff asks Sundra how the game changed for her
Sundra “Well the game (Pavarti) changed in that we have to start thinking individually as well as well as still thinking (Yul) within your alliances, your former tribemates. There’s a lot of time with these people so you can’t help but be bonded (Becky)

Jeff asks Nathan if tribal alliances still in play
Nathan “Yeah (Jonathan) definitely; we’ve all made it to a certain point where we’re starting all over so you’re definitely going to stick to what you’re comfortable with (Adam) and those who know you and those who you know (Yul)

Jeff asks Yul is that is the case then Aitu is down in numbers
Yul “The likelihood that all four of us are here at all (Ozzy) is very low but we stuck together (Sundra) and prevailed the odds but the fact remains both tribes are tight (Nathan) and so we came at a huge disadvantage and the odds are still stacked against us (Becky) so I don’t know what our fate is gonna be; I feel like tonight is gonna be pivotal” (Jonathan)

Jeff asks Becky about bonds she notices
Becky “I definitely felt bonds between those two (referring to Candice and Adam) they’re very close (Adam nodding/smiling) body language so when we came over here we sorta saw that”
Adam “The closest bond out here is those two (Becky/Yul) –Laughter
Nathan “Becky, you and Yul, ya’ll come on!” – Laughter
Becky “But it was different. I don’t lie on his lap; it’s just a different bond, different body language”

Jeff matter of factly asks Pavarti what is going on with Adam and Candice
Pavarti “They love each other, they want to make babies… I got booted out of my spot”
Candice “You told me he left because he wasn’t snuggly; he wasn’t paying enough attention to you”
Jeff is amused
Adam “There’s two sides of me, they both can snuggle up with me if they like”

Jeff asks Jonathan if this pairing concerns him than say him and Ozzy becoming friends - laughter
Jonathan “Certainly different than me and Ozzy. I think they are really enjoying each other’s company but honestly I do not see that it has moved into some kind of romantic situation (Candice nodding) and to answer, no, it doesn’t concern me” (Adam smiling)

Jeff asks Ozzy how the game will be different after tonight’s vote
Ozzy “I think it will definitely set something in motion (Yul) either it’s gonna go downhill for Aitu (Becky) or something crazy (Jonathan) could happen; at this point I definitely think we are at a pivotal moment”

Jeff asks Nathan if the dynamic will be different back at camp (Jonathan)
Nathan: “Yep, it’s definitely gonna stir up the waters (Adam) if someone from Raro decides (Yul) to jump over; the cat’s gonna be out of the bag or if someone from Aitu because it’s pretty much both tribes are sticking together (Jonathan) Let’s keep it real you know it’s tribe against tribe so if there’s a leak definitely the moods gonna flip”

Jeff asks Jonathan how the game has changed him
Jonathan “I have enjoyed every second of it (Nathan) I’ve bonded with people younger than me in a way that I haven’t in years (Yul) I have tried to drink in every minute of it because I know that I will never have an experience like this again and it has been a profound and wonderful experience for me”

Nate is then voted out with obvious reaction shots from Adam, Pavarti and Candice looking over at Jonathan and Jonathan avoiding her look Nathan is completely stymied leaving with “one love” and a glance between Jonathan and Yul with Yul nodded at him and Candice looking up with Adam seemingly looking back at her.

Jeff “Well there was a lot of talk tonight about how pivotal tonight’s vote was (Yul) and judging from Nate’s reaction (Candice) and the looks on many of your faces I’d say the impact (Pavarti) was significant”

A most “pivotal” episode indeed with some eyebrow raising instances. Again, Ozzy and Nathan’s relationship broadened a bit too much to be just some sprinkling for this episode. Interestingly it brought me back to the invasion made by Flica, Cowboy and Ozzy where we all recall Rebecca stating it was “three they didn’t like.” Noted also was the references we heard about Ozzy and Yul by others. Aside from Jonathan, we have never really heard much about contestants by others UNLESS that person was getting booted or the relationship was clearly and cleanly established (Becky calling Yul a brother, Candice and Adam admiring each other, etc.) Yul and Ozzy both mentioning how this vote was pivotal which, indeed, it was. I also feel there is a slight cloak and dagger feel to the “Aitu Four” though my opinion of each feels they are established in their roles for this group of four. We also now got to see Becky and Yul’s relationship thrown out in the open where before it was extremely low key. Pavarti has fell even further down and more than likely should be leaving shortly. Sundra’s enhanced wink at Rebecca was definitely noted(those winks will do me every time lol) Candice's challenge prowess duly noted along with Ozzy’s matter of fact opinion how well he could have done also noted. These instances are fluff and they didn’t have to be shown; I tend to back burner them. Yul’s absurd and funny remark at the IC which was also not necessary but then reinforced by Pavarti’s commentary and later Nathan’s commentary about his intelligence. No depth to any discussion whatsoever about ANYONE on Raro other than Jonathan how they would fare at end game. As Jonathan stated, are Raro even playing? Adam, Candice and Pavarti have yet to tell us anything about end game and their strategy except Adam telling Candice he wants them as final two. Considering the aura surrounding their relationship, this is more about their personal relationship then game relationship. The Aitu Four have more or less been relegated as a "group all the way" or "team to the end" but we would perhaps received a hint that Ozzy and Sundra and Becky and Yul are pairs that are tighter. And what of Yul telling Sundra and Ozzy separately? What of the emphasis of Ozzy and Jonathan. Perhaps Ozzy will be Jonathan's downfall since Jonathan did utter he didn't want to be the guy who made the move too late? There is no question Jonathan is heading for the explosion to his arc. He has now officially betrayed both tribes; interestingly enough the editing is not making his Raro tribe sympathetic to the plight; it practically showed justification for Jonathan TO jump unlike the heavy handed sympathetic edit Aitu received. I had felt Jonathan was somehow important to the story this season; whether THIS episode was it remains to be seen. If so, Jonathan's decision set the ending in motion. It would also be no surprise to me that Ozzy is "pivotal" in Jonathan's exit. Adam received some spike in his face time and confessional status. Funny enough, he was shown more indepth than Pavarti who we know was a huge presence on our screen. Pavarti seems to be going out with a whimper as opposed to a bang. I will be interested also in hearing HER thoughts AND Ozzy's thoughts on Nathan's leaving also. Becky was actually a bit more visible than the norm but again, it seems mostly by extension of Yul than any individuality. It would have been nice to hear Becky speak of the idol, thoughts on pulling in Jonathan, her relationship with the Aitu Four. One can do well by virtue of the company one keeps and this seems to be the case with Becky. Sundra, a lovely woman, appears to me to be relegated as the voice of the underdogs. Once they are no longer underdogs is her story done? Ozzy, a physical force to be reckoned with as showcased consistently and constantly in challenges is noted to be a threat and now suddenly a quite likeable one. Drastic change from the arrogant, challenge throwing man who boasted how many fish he caught and therefore is needed no? And Yul, highlighted by his intelligence quite emphatically in the last episode is shown vastly different than the keeper of the LAST HII. I said last season that the idol seemed the bigger story with Terry mainly being the vehicle used to tell it. Yul certainly appears to be the contrast. The idol is merely a supporting character; it is Yul that is the driving force behind it.


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11-27-06, 12:03 PM (EST)
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54. "RE: Episode 10 Thoughts "
Interesting that Ozzy was never mentioned by Yul, only Sundra or Becky; would not Ozzy be someone that Yul would also mention as a final two candidate to Jonathan. Ozzy is with the “Aitu Four”, it would stand to reason that Yul would consider going with him as well?

Yul played it very smart by not mentioning Ozzy. Ozzy wasn't part of the old Aitu alliance of Yul/Becky/Sundra/Jonathan/Candice. They had discussed voting Ozzy out. Omitting Ozzy from the discussion made it appear that Jonathan would be reclaiming his old position in the alliance (and moving up to final 2, no less) and Ozzy was still somewhat on the outside.

Of course, it's very likely that Yul doesn't want to be in a final 2 with Ozzy, but Yul was clever not to mention him at all. Same thing with Ozzy not being in the discussion about voting out Nate later on; whether Yul planned that I don't know, but it brought Jonathan back into a foursome.

And Ozzy's own conversations with Nate set him apart from the Aitu 4 as the only one who would entertain other possibilities, which I think was the intent of showing that.


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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11-24-06, 10:13 AM (EST)
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48. "RE: After The Recap-The Players, The Game, The Editing-Cook Islands"
I'll be shorter this time and jump in faster - I only have 1 player to comment on... as much as I dislike bad strategy, I despise it when it comes from someone who otherwise strikes me as smart (ie I don't jump up and down when Nate or Adam do something that's not very clever because I don't expect any different, whereas Jonathan, well, I'll go on below)

Jonathan - no doubt the general population loves you now for joining the Fantastic Four of Aitu (I'm not there yet - I haven't yet been lured by the siren song to love old Aitu... actually scratch that, bad metaphor - it's more like being smashed over the head with the editing sledgehammer rather than a siren song) - but I think Jon's played his cards very badly... he's gone from being the fifth wheel at old Raro (with old Aitu not trusting him) to being the fifth wheel at old Aitu (with no-one trusting him), which is no improvement at all...unless he's playing for second prize...but which won't work now that he can be sacrificed at the next vote.

Jonathan's play should have been to go to old Raro and, rather than hinting at Yul having the HII (as he did), laying it on the line and saying Yul had the HII (although I'm rebelling against the blatant production bias and cheering for old Raro, I'll be the first to admit they're not the sharpest tools in the shed - Adam's definitely a tool, but not a sharp one) and pulling for a Sundra vote (the least likely person Yul would have given the HII to) - it would have given old Raro a 5-3 advantage and Jonathan could, after thereby gaining old Raro's trust, THEN have gone to Yul and a) coerced him into an alliance to force the HII to be played at the next TC when Yul was targeted and then b) flip to make a 4-3 vote afterwards when the HII was out of the way - I still don't think it would be a winning move, but Jon would be a better chance at being taken to F2 - but with the number of strategic simpletons on the jury no matter how it plays out, I couldn't see enough people rewarding strategic play to give him the victory.

Jon, I've realised in the last couple of weeks that you're playing hard, but not playing well - you're now dispensable to everyone and I reckon you'll be on the jury very soon...

Scuba.

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11-24-06, 08:49 PM (EST)
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49. "Oh where oh where has my centipede gone? Ep 10"
Sorry I haven't posted for a while but some things irl and not a lot of animal imagery for a while...

I'd have to say that I thought the spider and web were for Jon and Candice..."oh what a tangled web we weave.....

Last nite I wish the centipede had shown up bc as Jon said himself it was a "FANTASTIC TWIST" him reflipping back to Aitu!!

But we start out with a HUGE crab crawling on the Raro shore before Jon gives the younguns a "stern talking to"

They're going to have to see my way is the good way

I'm not going to lose because of these kids

After the break we come back to a single white bird soaring and of course we go to Aitu and we first see SUNDRA in the background and the tribal immunity idol in the forefront.
Talk of how Aitu 4 is hurting but still there...

We see two separate white birds soaring and we're off to RC?? nope it's the merge and Sundra says you can't get comfortable (and in another confessional--winners never quit)

Aitutonga pick the Raro beach to live because THERE ARE NO RATS!!! (at the suggestion of C and J) Oh the irony..it's what for EPMB's Thanksgiving dinner!

Jon once again tells us that he is going for a MILLION DOLLARS and calls the Raro younguns psychos for puking up all the food.

We see Ozzy and Nate talk (why if Nate left..to put a little doubt about Ozzy voting for him?) Nate says Parv is cool and Ozzy say so is Sundra Nate's old Supreme...not a single word about that though.

We then see Yul and Becky talking about how Jon is the best choice to flip bc he plays the most rational...actually with Raro..he actually plays with some brain cells which are clearly lacking else where. 'Bananas'

Then we see not a RAT but a Lizard a cold blooded animal and Yul and Jon have their "hypothetical talk" which leaves Jon saying Yul will have to start trusting him again bc his "I promise" doesn't mean a thing. Then Jon says if Yul does have the HI him flipping back would be a fantastic twist

He really appreciates the game itself (like Rob C) and the editors want us to know that as evidenced by including his speech at TC about "loving every minute of it"

We then see HUGE waves and my friends the WHALES are back..so we know something big is about to happen and the editors don't disappoint. Yul tells Sundra about the HI and Becky joins them...Ozzy is not seen. Yul says he wants to use it to get all 4 of us to the F4. Now initially I thought no doubt he means the Aitu 4 but could Yul be keeping options open and he really meant him BS and Jon?

The next scene we see him telling Ozzy about HI in the same shirt and near the same spot...no Becky no Sundra seen..he tells Ozzy its F4...does he mean Aitu 4 or YOJon and Sundra/Becky? I don't know but this was a heavily edited section. I will wait to see what VS et al have to say about it.

We then hear what Raro is thinking ---now that's an oxymoronic sentence!! with Parv and Candice in shallow water (we also see Ozzy with the Hawaiian sling catching fish here) talking about Yul as a threat...we see Yul washing himself in shallow water then we see a crab sort of lunge at a fish in the shallow water...

Candice and Jon are next seen talking about who should go first and C tells J that N and P want Yul..and Jon says it's stupid

We're off to IC where Ozzy the Monkey wins the IC handily and we return to Aitutonga beach and now we see a bunch of hermit crabs scampering off in all directions with their shells on...as opposed to the big CRAB at the beginning on Raro beach...any trust there was in Raro is breaking up (remember I think anyway crab symbolizes trust this Survivor)

We then see some storks on the rocks on water's edge not white but brown and we get the "reality" talk btw Yul and Jon with Yul showing the HI to Jon...he says

I'd want to go to F2 with you bc you've made enemies..

So Yul is putting the F2 in Jon's head without actually promising it...I'm sure Jon will go to the other 3 Aitu now with promises to go to F2...who takes the bait..or will Aitu4 just use Jon until they no longer need his vote?

At the end when Jon gets them to vote Nate instead of Adum or Candice only Yul Sundra and Becky are there... where was Ozzy and who told him about Nate..probably Yul..we heard him in a conf say he liked Nate but would stay true to Yul. I would have loved to see that conversation though.. maybe it will be in Insider???

No animals at TC..no rats until next week when CAP goes 'Bananas' on Jon!

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11-25-06, 06:33 PM (EST)
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50. "Episode 10 Thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 11-25-06 AT 06:36 PM (EST)

Hello Scuba, it's nice to read from new posters, especially since I'm also in the minority that thinks Jonathan made his move too early.
Like Emy said those whales were fascinating and the episode was also. Here's how I saw it:

Back in episode # 5 the story became one of Turf War and it showed the players as Planners, Warriors, Soldiers, Spies and Victims. It made we wonder if we had double agents or sleepers?

This episode answered that question. It was all about the

Secret Agent Man

-The first act showed the birth of a double agent:
Jonathan was dissatisfied with the politics of his tribe. “The way the votes came down last night, they could’ve gotten rid of me at any point…It worked out my way at least at this point…3 people have been eliminated before Candice and I. I’m in a powerful position in a smaller tribe.”

However, it is a hedonistic tribe that has no drive, no goals and does nothing to be winners. They couldn’t even make fire or get water.

“They’re gonna have to listen to me now. They’re going to see my way is a good way.”

They never listened.

Nate prefers to have no leaders, “Jonathan must slow his roll. You can’t come around barking orders. Shut up, fool…We’re not knuckleheads around here.”

Parvati prefers to stretch and enjoy the sun alongside Nate.

Candice and Adam prefer Adam.

Jonathan had a disgusted look when we heard his last comment of the opening sequence: “Do I have to be your father or your boss? I’m not going to lose because you kids can’t get your a$$ out of bed.”

-The second act happened after the merge when we saw Yul courting Jonathan. It was like a pavane:

Compared to Raro’s immaturity, Jonathan is reminded how classy Yul is. He sees that his tribe has no idea of what it takes to win the “M I L L I O N”. A secret meeting was organized.

Yul asked Jonathan: “Does it make any sense…for us to work together again?”

Jonathan stated that: “At this point, I could not entertain what you are talking about. I do not believe that Ozzy would trust me. I’m not sure why you would trust me.”

Yul told us it was because he had no other options. Jonathan went on to say: “I don’t believe you can get to the Final 4 unless you’re aligned with the person with the idol.” (He didn’t watch Exile Island!)

Yul had a bite! The possibility of flipping made Jonathan realize how Raro would react: “The Raro people are gonna go mental.” We saw them in camp laughing, unaware of the danger looming. Jonathan and Yul agreed that they have to learn to trust each other again. “I have the numbers” Jonathan reflected, “but if I was with the guy who had the idol all along and I have to flip back, it’s a fantastic twist!” The grin he displayed as he struted back in camp made us think that seeing that happen may be worth as much as the million.

-The third act was one of hesitation: Before turning on his own people, a double agent always has doubts:

Jonathan tested the waters with the other Raros to see if they would vote for someone else than Yul who could have the idol. He told Candice he didn’t have it and she confirmed she didn’t have it either so Yul could get them both. “He doesn’t have the idol” said Adam, certain of himself. Obstinately, Raro only saw Yul as the target after Ozzy had won immunity. They fear such a smart player. If they knew he's smart, why were they sure he didn’t have the idol? It seemed they figured that if Candice couldn’t find it, how could he? Jonathan had enough of this.

-A funny Interlude: Where were the counter-intelligence forces in Raro? They had another Communication Breakdown:

As with problems between different security agencies, Adam and Nathan didn’t work together. Nate, as a CIA agent would, tried to recruit a foreign agent, Ozzy. He told him Parvati was gold. Ozzy said Sundra was also. Nate saw the opening and maybe even a chance to hook up with an ex-Hiki sister later. Yul became his target. Adam, the homeland security bully, saw the immediate danger of “Challenge Champ” Ozzy. His over-confidence made him neglect homeland security, “playing house” with both Candice and Parvati rather than keeping his radar on alert. Adam wasn’t on the same page as Nate. Hasn’t that been the story of their challenge losses?

-Act 4: The Deal

Yul showed the Idol to Jonathan, giving him proof of his sincerity. Jonathan wasn’t surprised that Yul had the idol. He even heard Yul admit: “I want to be with you in the final two since Becky and Sundra haven’t made enemies. You have made enemies.” Jonathan owed Adam and Candice so he requested that Nathan be the target. Yul was happy to accommodate him. Sundra and Becky exchanged a glance that told us they knew that once the first domino fell, the rest would follow.

-The Final Act: The Betrayal

The TC had mainly a pleasant tone...The vote would change that. Parvati said Adam and Candice wanted to make babies and pushed her out of her spot. Adam said he had two sides to snuggle. Nate said Becky and Yul were the tightest bond and Jonathan joked that he’d never be close to Ozzy the way Adam was to Candice. Jonathan reflected that it was a profound experience that he enjoyed every minute. Sundra, Yul, Ozzy and Nathan had the serious game play answers. It left little doubt about the outcome even if no votes were shown. Jon kept his cards hidden to the end. His vote was devastating. Nathan was visibly crushed on his way out. From being down 8-4, Aitu is now up 5-3.

If Jonathan made his move to win the game, he made it almost impossible because he has betrayed everyone at one point in the game. Did Jonathan settle for a Final two foil role that Yul has no need to honor? Jon could’ve at least voted for Sundra to force Yul to use the idol. Now Jon wanders no more, he has a tribe but he lost all power. In Aitu, Yul has the power and one more boot will enable him to extend his power to the whole Aitutonga. Many defectors regret their decisions. At least the actor/author had top billing in a great episode. I think that makes 3 in a row…This season isn’t bad at all!

Yul had a strong supporting actor performance. It started with his battle injuries, how all the challenges were taking their toll on his body. He worried about moving forward but soon had good news. He’s the one that was shown reacting to Raro’s loss of two players.

He didn’t see any danger in letting the others know he had the idol since Raro didn’t have the numbers to split their votes. Not now, but after a few boots they would have had them. He was smart to tell Sundra and Ozzy before he made the final offer to Jonathan since it got them on board. He not only got away with his risky plan, he also grabbed all the power that Jonathan’s actions unleashed. He has his 4 and he could call the shots soon. “He is brilliant” as Parvati said. This strategist shouldn’t make the mistakes that prevented Raro from keeping their numbers.

Ozzy still had some surprises in store. Many things had been left out, such as how he had talked with Nate during the kidnapping. The alliance talks he had with Nathan weren’t very important to the whole story yet we saw it exposed in quite some details.

Ozzy was on board with Yul’s idea to try to get Jonathan to flip even if that killed his deal with Nathan. He assured us he had to be true to Yul and the tribe. He didn’t say it but it felt like he was thinking of adding: “for now” As during the TC where Cecilia was eliminated, he was asked how will the game be different after this vote. “It will definitely set something in motion. Either it will go downhill for Aitu or something crazy can happen. At this point, I think we’re definitely at a pivotal moment.” The Cecilia elimination marked a change that eventually benefitted Ozzy, this one could also be in his favor.

Ozzy’s knowledge of the HII could be the last hope for us to get to see it played finally. Yul will soon become Ozzy’s main obstacle to victory. Maybe reminding us of Ozzy’s devious ways was the intent of the scene with Nathan and the subsequent confessionals. That could be were Nathan’s comment that: “Parvati is gold, she’s a lock” could come into play. Will it be like Gary telling Rafe that Danni was strong? It seemed more to indicate how Ozzy could use her rather than how she can go forward. He couldn’t be happy that Jonathan chose the one to be booted. We didn’t see the conversation when he was told to vote against Nathan but it could have repercussions.

Sundra was first seen in a camera angle that showed her in the distance with the immunity idol in the foreground. Her game doesn’t depend on winning individual immunity until maybe the final one. Did that shot foreshadow something like that happening? She continued to tell us how it felt to be part of this little team. “We’re still the underdogs. We have to prove ourselves day after day…That’s all we can do.” We also saw her “war injuries.” The editors counted on us reacting to Aitu’s plight and they’ve chosen Sundra’s words to express how “WE” feel. That is a very strong indicator. She even got to answer Jeff at immunity about the teams feelings: “We’re getting pretty even but we can’t get comfortable at any point.

She was thrilled to hear that Yul had the idol and hugged both Yul and Becky before telling us again how it felt: “It was exciting to hear that we have a nice little wild card.”

Her “winners never quit” quote was repeated. Some players don’t get confessionals yet she gets to repeat hers. Her story could be only about Aitu since we practically hadn’t heard from her before the tribe’s roles were established. She could be the first victim when comes the time to pick each other off or make side deals to get a better position. She could also be the winner that never quit.

Speaking of players that don’t have confessionals, Becky at least was shown discussing the key strategic move of the evening. Her reasoning solidified Yul in his intentions. She confirmed that Jonathan was the right choice of player to get on their side. When Yul told the secret to Sundra, she was seen approaching while doing a happy dance and enjoying a beautiful morning. Becky was aware of what was happening. “How awesome, we deserve it, right?” she told Sundra as she hugged her. That scene was meant to indicate it was also her strategy. Even Yul told us it was their plan. It would be nice to hear from her.

Parvati’s story had been put on hold for a few weeks. Her return wasn’t that of a player that will have an impact on how the story evolves. She had to act last night. Instead, she was shown to be as bad a strategist and as poor a player as the other Raros. Those scenes of her cuddling with Nathan, stretching on the beach and later with Adam weren’t to remind us of her powers to infiltrate alliances but to show her as a clueless participant. She had a great position but she had to continue making alliances rather than settling for the one she had. All she had to do was to listen to Papa Bear, he loves an audience. It was all a wasted opportunity.

It is evident now that the reward of the bold move was given editorially to Jonathan. Candice who instigated the mutiny, is pictured as a dumb player who stumbled into a good twist. She hasn’t been given a single strategic confessional since.

Adam said during Day 26: “It is the best day since we’ve been here.” Day 27 wasn’t.

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11-27-06, 00:10 AM (EST)
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52. "RE: Episode 10 Thoughts"
I want to talk a moment or two about what we WEREN'T shown last episode.

We weren't shown Nate/Parvatti (N/P) and their crew doing ANY strategic planning. Why? Do we really believe that they were unable to fathom the POSSIBILITY that Yul had the Idol? I just don't believe that could be the case.

We saw Jonathan going to his tribemates and trying to get them to vote for Someone, Anyone, other than Yul - And they blew Jonathan off. Why? I think it's because they were willing to use Jonathan as the throw away tribe memeber to flush out the II. I think they refused to listen to Jonathan because they had already concluded that he was expendable, so any further discussion with him about alternate vote possibilities met with a disingenuous "Naw he couldn't have it". (Remember Candice returning from Exile Island?). N/P were too confident that Jonathan had no options but to vote with the tribe against Yul and hope for the best. I think N/P tribe planned a scenario where TC came down to 5 votes Yul, 4 votes Jonathan. If Yul doesn't have II he goes home. If Yul DOES have the II Jonathan goes home and II is out of play. But what about numbers at this stage? That could leave N/P's Tribe with 4 against Yul's tribe of 4 - But, I think N/P had an ace up their sleave. N/P planned on Ozzy flipping to their side. But we were shown none of that - or anything else that would pass for strategy. Why?

If Parvatti, Adam, Candice were going to be playing a roll in determining who makes the finals, I think we would have seen some indication of strategy - unless the utter lack of a strategic thought was intended to validate Jonathans flip. We were given hints that something might have been afoot with Ozzy and Nate, but nothing nearly as firm as what I'm suggesting was left on the editing room floor. The closest we saw to strategy from N/P team MIGHT be Parvatti playing with Adam. She said flirting was a strategy. Did she forget that or was it actually part of her plan?

Currently we see a sub alliance of Yul/Becky on one side and Ozzy/Sundra on the other side of their tribe. Both pairs need to pull in a 3rd wheel. Who will do it first? On the face of it we see Yul trying to draw Jonathan back in - Maybe more than as a 5th vote to break N/P's 5-4 edge, Maybe as a 3rd member to break Ozzy/Sundra? Or is the ground work being laid for Parvatti to worm her way into a three way with Yul/Becky? Why were we shown the comment from Yul about elephants not running up trees, and his comment about never getting a date again - Only to have Parvatti comment on smart being sexy? Adam/Candice appear tight, but that didn't stop Parvatti from flirting with Adam. What would stop her from trying to slip between Yul/Becky - We've been told at least twice that their relatioinship is like a big brother/little sister (And how did that work out with Julie Berry and Chris from Survivor Amazon?) Having said that, I don't think Yul is getting Chris's edit - so maybe the big brother stands by his little sister this time, or maybe this time SHE's the one to cut the legs out from under him.

Alternatively, maybe Parvatti joins Ozzy/Sundra. Ozzy/Sundra need a 3rd just as surely as Yul/Becky do. So, maybe is comes down to Yul/Becky/Jonathan vs Ozzy/Sundra/Parvatti, and Jonathan flips yet again? It would certainly be in character. We've had enough Idol discussion that I believe it has to be played sooner or later, and Yul using it to save Becky, maybe at the expense of Jonathan, would tie up some lose ends nicely.

I know this thread is more about what the editors show us, and what it means, but I think It's also interesting what they don't show us. I certainly don't have any inside info, But I just can't believe N/P would be so blind as to have NOT EVEN CONSIDERED the possibility that Yul had II. So, I think there may be some merit to consider Why they didn't show the strategy conversation that had to have taken place.

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11-27-06, 01:16 AM (EST)
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53. "RE: Episode 10 Thoughts"
If N/P had suspected Yul had the idol, the best move would have been to try to vote off Becky or Sundra.
They could then sacrifice Jonathan by getting Yul to play his immunity idol, leaving 4 vs. 3.

Tossing out Jonathan immediately would leave them with a 4-4 tie in the following tribal council ... which would leave it in the fate of which player would be the worst fire-starter (assuming these guys would be smart enough to know to vote against the WEAKEST player into a tie-vote, rather than the strongest.)
Actually next week would have been very interesting had Jonathan cast his vote against Yul this week ...
Could have come down to a tie between Ozzy and Candice (assuming Aitu's were smart and Raro non-strategic once again) .. and things would have played out pretty much the same, minus Yul's immunity idol.

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12-01-06, 03:22 AM (EST)
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55. "Becky's Edit"
I'm a little nervous posting here but here goes: First of all, great thread Veruca Salt! You way have the details down pat! Took me awhile to read this much analyzed thread but definately worth it!

I'm concerned about Becky's edit or lack there of. Is this misdirection, or is she being set up with Yul in the final 2?

I can't shake the fact that EPMB is downplaying Yul's and Becky's alliance. I said so since ep 2 BTW. There are pics I posted earlier in the game showing the 2 of them together...

Tonight when Yul said something like: "I don't want anyone pissed off at me when we get to the final 2"...and lo and behold the next shot was of Becky's reaction.

I think my money is going on a Yul/Becky final 2. He'll take Becky because of their alliance plus he feels the jury will vote for him. I'm not too sure of that now....could be a Becky win?

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12-01-06, 03:22 PM (EST)
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56. "RE: Episode 11 thoughts"
I seem to contradict myself every time I say an episode was the most enjoyable. This one was amazingly entertaining and I suspect that some of us certainly noted the changes in some contestant’s edit. I am curious for those who want to answer how you felt watching Yul tonight and your opinion of him as well as your position on Jonathan vs. The Raro Three as you know I often asks viewing questions. I am also looking forward to the wonderful assessments everyone makes and I see some new names popping in (Braveheart you only need to be nervous about your eyes failing with all the words!) and hope you continue to post as it seems that a lot of posters have taken off for parts unknown. Chessmaster, mavs, cantstandsya, scuba, LionChow, mysticjay, I hope we see more of your posts and ag, Michel, emydi, BR, as always, your comments are very much appreciated

The Recap
At Raro, Jonathan’s behavior turned some people off
(Nathan’s rant is shown)

Raro and Aitu became one. The outnumbered Aitu Four (shot of Yul) felt outnumbered.
Yul: “Our backs are up against the wall; we need someone to flip”

Yul formulated a plan to use the HII as leverage
Yul (to Sundra) “I think I can get it to use Jonathan”

Yul (conf) “If it works out, it’ll change the course of the game”
(Yul and Jonathan speaking)

At the IC, Jeff “We are down to the final two” Candice and Ozzy battled it out but in the end Candice dropped out.

Yul tried to seal the deal with Jonathan

Jonathan (conf) “Basically Yul said vote with us or you are going home tonight”

While Candice and Adam were playing their own game

With TC looming, Jonathan was the swing vote that would make all the difference
Jonathan (conf) “Either way people are going to pissed....”

But at TC, when it came time for his decision Jonathan betrayed his former Raro tribe (Pavarti) and joined the Aitu Four (Yul nods to Jonathan) in voting out Nate

Interesting to note that the recap did not exactly show Jonathan as positively as he had been recapped before

Post Tribal Council Fall Out

The rats are increasing at Raro although it was told to Yul that there were not rats there! emy I wait anxiously for your animal report (the regurgitating fish was not very pleasant but very symbolically appropriate!)

Jonathan (to Candice) "All I can tell you is this... if it wasn't going to be me tonight, it was going to be you"
Candice “Okay, I know”
Jonathan “He was going to play the idol tonight, you understand that”
Candice “I know, I can. Definitely”

Jonathan “I was not going to play that game because the next time the four of them are gunning for me and I'm in a tiebreaker situation so I have either a 100% chance of going home tonight or a 50% chance of going home the next time”

Jonathan (conf) “Because I wanted to swing the vote, split the game, I voted for Nate and the truth is I would rather play with the Aitu people (The shot pans to the “Aitu’s” walking back; Sundra first, Ozzy then Yul) I would rather seem them win (at this point Ozzy is shown approaching in the shot) if I don't win (and moving onto Yul walking into the shot further) I was in the position to make that choice and I did (confessional still post TC) and I believe I made the right choice” (Jonathan has been our consistent narrator and much like narrators of the past, paying attention to his words should be noted. Many times, the narrator is literally telling the story and Jonathan has certainly been advising us as to the progression of events)

Yul, Sundra and Ozzy Perhaps others were curious as I was as to the absence of Becky in this meeting

Sundra: “Did you see their faces?” “They were shocked!”
Sundra (voiceover, camera on Ozzy) “It took everything out of me to contain myself”
Yul (to both) “Congrats. Congrats. We worked for it”
Yul (voiceover with shot on Ozzy) "We're golden guys" (the shot then reverts back to Yul making a noise of relief and happiness)

Yul(conf) “At Tribal Council I think everyone was holding their breath; I believed Jonathan; I believed he was sincere in switching over but I wasn't sure (Yul and Sundra now shown as noted below) and "It was a huge risk that we took but this is how I wanted to play the idol (Yul, Sundra, Ozzy shown again) I wanted to play it at a point in time where it reset the game in your favor and it worked”

Sundra: “Oh baby, oh my god (head rests on Yul's shoulder) My heart was in my throat”
Yul: “I know, me too, I was so scared”

More conversation continued as you can see Ozzy speaking and Yul replying but obviously the conversation that sealed up their feelings was shown. I do find it noteworthy again that Becky is not in this conversation and that Ozzy (like the rest of the episode) was never heard from. Yul essentially “owned” this scene which may solely be as he was the perpetrator of the outcome. Yul is an interesting one to watch as his words at times through the episode may seem a bit “entitled” (for lack of a word) but I don’t necessarily feel that the EDIT intends that; I think Yul’s voice and speech tend to make it seem that way. His actions and the edit surrounding him however are not attempting to reinforce any type of arrogance (an edited smirk or basking can do wonders to sway the audience)

The Raro “kids” are not receiving the kindest edit they could nor have they for quite some time therefore they had been written “off my list” (so to speak) for some time. I would state that the level of contrast that has been designed to show the differences between the “Aitu Four” and those from that “other tribe” have been palpable. I had noted in one of my last posts that it is fascinating to see how last season’s dysfunction of Casaya ended up serving them well while LaMina sunk to oblivion. This season the dysfunction of “Raro” is not as successful. There is a core difference; despite Casaya’s internal conflict, they were sharp in the game collectively. We saw strategy, we saw challenge workings whereas Raro had no real internal conflict; they had fun together, they “partied” but were and are woefully inept in what it takes to succeed in the game itself

Pavarti “You pissed everyone in the game off (everyone?) I hope you're happy with second place" (Adam and Candice shown here; Candice noticeably quiet in light of the conversation she and Jonathan) “...I am so disappointed; it's vile to me; I feel sick to my stomach" (Pavarti’s confessional now shown which I posted after)

Pavarti: “You weren't going home tonight”
Jonathan “I could have been going home tonight”
Pavarti “No you couldn't have” (Candice and Adam again choose to remain silent)
Jonathan: “If I didn't go in with them they would have all voted for me. You would have voted for Yul and it would have bounced off Yul and hit me”
Pavarti “Yul doesn't have the idol” (Candice then chimes in “not if Jonathan had told them about the idol at the same time as Pavarti insisting Yul doesn’t have the idol)
Jonathan: “Yul DOES have the idol; he showed me the idol” (A very funny moment and one that is emphasized by the music that KO and applejack are so talented at showing. Adam's head comes up very quickly when Jonathan states that Yul showed it to him and there is a twinkle of music that suddenly appears. If it were possible, I’m sure the editors would have loved to place a lightbulb above Adam’s head. Candice's head (obviously) did not pop up in surprise) “I don't know what you think you are talking about” (Jonathan's voice gets a hard edge to it as the culmination of his believing these "kids" are completely without any intelligence has reached a new level as the twinkle of music continues with all three staring at him)
Jonathan “And even with me saying that you don't trust that I am telling the truth”
Pavarti: “I don't; I absolutely don't trust a word that comes out of your mouth”
Jonathan: “Right, fair enough so guess there's nothing to say tonight; we can talk tomorrow if you want” (at this point the remainder of Pavarti's confessional is shown)

Pavarti (conf) "After Tribal I felt like this nausea... ...wanted to take Jonathan's face and throw up on it" and "I couldn't control myself; I snapped on him and told him how I felt about him and called him out and I think that he's a filthy miserable rat"

This particular scene obviously was twofold. The “kids” at Raro were not exactly meant to appear very astute and the fissure between Jonathan and the three was set up for the remainder of the episode. Adam was noticeably quiet during the exchange and perhaps someone who knows information can advise if there was something that I am missing. It appeared that Pavarti was not on the same page as the other two. She was certainly vocal and adamant that Jonathan did not have the idol but Adam and Candice were noticeably quiet. Obviously Candice heard from Jonathan that Yul had the idol but unless she rushed quickly back and only told Adam, it appeared very strange that Adam did not berate Jonathan as well and call him a liar as Pavarti did. Adam has not shown us to be subdued; he has no problem with confrontation. He certainly was surprised that Yul HAD the idol but he also did not support Pavarti that Jonathan may be lying

Just Another Day at Aitu - Tonga

The scene showcasing Sundra and Pavarti was essentially a “fluff” scene that helped to reinforce certain dynamics that would have bearing for the rest of the episode. It certainly was NOT meant to support Pavarti. Pavarti’s edit (as Nathan’s had done) has now been given an edge to it. This also occurred in heavy doses with Jonathan as well (more later) While Pavarti was once the “cute girl” who flirted her way, fun loving and so forth; the last episode and this episode curved her edit into a more negative tone. We saw her highlighted while Jonathan asked Candice what she was doing “is this a dorm” we saw her eye roll at Jonathan while he was working at camp; we saw her enjoying the attentions of Adam and even commenting “what about Candice” (obviously this is not a love triangle show but in my questioning people they questioned why she would even do that knowing Candice “liked” Adam) This week the tone got heavier. Her facial reactions (not just to Jonathan) were highlighted, her lack of worth ethic (along with Candice and Adam) was shown yet again and the bubbly disposition normally shown seemed to appear almost as being utterly clueless

Jonathan (conf) “...she’s a selfish girl; a million dollars to her would not help her in her life, it would screw her life up!” Although Jonathan was the main protagonist in the conversation then shown with Yul, Sundra and Ozzy present, Yul was shown nodding and Sundra reinforced Jonathan’s words by her own words of having to teach Pavarti about cleaning fish after all these days. Jonathan has had the least amount of interaction with Pavarti out of Candice, Adam and Pavarti and this episode certainly highlighted their squaring off

Adam “This game is not as fun in this position” (a brief interlude of Adam and Pavarti busily chewing with that musical tone that has highlighted many Raro members over the course of the game) “Jonathan sucks at life”
Pavarti “Makes me want to throw up!”

Jonathan “It’s a social game, I love playing with you guys (Sundra and Yul shown) I love hanging out with you; we all work well together... (Ozzy shown then Becky) I come over here and I’m in the clown house!” (The “clown” music then envelops the other tribe members laughing and joking around. Again, the editors are not making any subtle attempts to elicit any contradiction to the words spoken about them”)

Bidding Wars

The contestants shown obviously very happy with the “RC” that day with Jeff making sure to note that sharing money is acceptable; sharing food is not (Let’s not forget he made this comment. Jonathan’s edit certainly has escalated and what is interesting is that I had observed (and BR you noted this as well) Jonathan has been manipulated to a great degree to be the “villain” despite the fact that there was not much “backing it up” The culmination is coming for Jonathan as THIS particular episode was heavily emphasized to portray Jonathan negatively (but curiously still managing to reflect some audience understanding by the negativity of Candice, Adam and Pavarti.) This time, however, we were reinforced by the “Aitu Four” who have been portrayed as wonderfully positive. The manipulation of Jonathan’s edit in the past was building for this moment. Obviously there is dislike for Jonathan, it had been stated and one can’t manipulate to that degree but there also appeared questions from the viewers as to where it was coming from; Jonathan still had some support; the effort was there to slightly tone down pure evil behavior but the edit this particular episode DID shift for Jonathan as it did for Pavarti. The hints have now become full blown announcements. There will always be a difference of opinion by a viewer, however. This show causes subjectivity based on gender, age, etc. Someone who is an older viewer may commiserate with Jonathan completely while a younger viewer may think he is an overbearing and pompous dictator; this show elicits that type of opinion. The “editing” in it of itself however was not meant to show Jonathan completely negative but it certainly shifted by having the Aitu Four support Raro’s feelings along with the belching and so forth

Of note:

Pavarti “We don’t know what it is” with Jeff “No, you don’t” (That tidbit easily could have been left out; the item was covered, Jeff explained the rules, this is slight manipulation to again emphasis that Pavarti is just not the brightest person)

Jonathan gets his first item (Jeff: “Thank you sir” Pavarti: “Snap” Jonathan clumsily spills his beer; Pavarti “Party foul” - little attempts that do not need to be shown)

Pavarti gets his first item (Pavarti: “I’m in it, I’m in this game” and Jonathan needlessly bidding and Jeff: “Does Jonathan really want it or does he want you to spend all your money” ; the clearly intended showcase of Pavarti getting into the bath; Jonathan: “She’s in her element” - more stand off with Jonathan and Pavarti? Candice wanting to move along as she is hungry and another blatant showcase of Pavarti enjoying her bath)

The Exile Bid (Pavarti shown immediately shaking her head after Jonathan bids; Jonathan then Yul signaling Becky they would lend her money; Pavarti: “Why do you need that Becky? You have the numbers” Becky checking with Yul who nods as she increases her bid. Becky reads with reaction from others; Jonathan “Snap” Becky turns around and Yul advises they (Candice/Adam) both have $500.00 and with a dramatic flair of music Becky: “Candice” very matter of factly and Yul shown grimacing of sorts; Candice: “It’s just some food” with game face on)

Candice “I think I know where it is”
Yul “I can end the suspense” (Pavarti shown) “I have it”
Jeff “You have the idol?” “Bring it with you?”
Yul “Uh, yeah, it’s in my bag”
Jeff “You want everyone to know might as well make sure”
Pavarti “Looks authentic” (Another attempt that didn’t have to be shown but mainly to negate the post TC conversation that Jonathan was not lying)

Yul “I wanted to play it at a critical moment in the game; that opportunity came up, we were down... we had to make someone switch (Jonathan) and at that point it felt like it was the right moment (Pavarti with fork in her mouth) If I play this right it could change the entire ending of this adventure (Adam smirking) fortunately it did”

Candice leaves and Adam shakes his head and Pavarti pouts while scrubbing her back

Ozzy wins the next item (Jeff: “Sold to Dolphin Boy” (less we forget?) )

Jonathan wins the next item (Jonathan: “No sharing right?” Pavarti rolls her eyes; Jonathan suddenly appears back in his seat so we are able to see Sundra glance back at him with Jonathan licking the crust and Adam not happy)

Sundra wins the next item which unfortunately is not appetizing (Sundra: “My stomach’s churning” - sympathy elicited. I’m not entirely sure when this bid happened; Pavarti is suddenly there and doesn’t appear wet)

Jonathan wins the next item (Yul mentions something about Jonathan jumping off a bridge; a fun moment with Jonathan giving Jeff a tip, Becky appearing to look up as Jonathan belched)

The auction is done with Ozzy eating ice cream, Adam disgusted as Jonathan gargling his mouthwash (which did not appear exactly at that time; there was a flag behind him while gargling that was not at the auction where they were stationed)

Clearly an attempt to show Jonathan gluttonous. Those of us who watch the show avidly do realize that the others should have and could have bid however.

The Doubt Is Planted

Our symbolically regurgitating fish is shown as they are back at camp.

Pavarti (voiceover) “Jonathan cleaned up on that one”
Yul expresses that it is painful when one is eating while others watch with Jonathan “Of course” with obvious reaction shots to his discussion about his eating. He then belches with Becky citing she could smell the pepperoni

The following said onscreen with spurts of Pavarti and Adam thrown in

Sundra “He’s an obnoxious force” “He came here and gave this really obnoxious burp”
Yul “I was really getting annoyed with him”
Sundra “And every time we get into a challenge....”
Yul “Yes”
Sundra “He is obnoxious”
Yul “He was obnoxious today”
Sundra “I would hate to see Jonathan in the final four”
Yul then asks if they want to reconsider what they are doing with both ladies shown to put thought into that.

Pavarti and Adam then shown with Pavarti and her telling Adam that the group was not happy with Jonathan’s display (I’m of the mindset that she learned this firsthand as opposed to any observations but we are meant to see Pavarti’s “wheels turning”) First portion of her confessional shown

Becky “Today’s show was very”
Pavarti “Revealing!”
Becky “We were all surprised; that was the first thing on people’s minds when we came back. I think his true personality is coming out” (Sundra and Adam now shown in the shot)
Pavarti “If he gets to the final four, I will shoot myself” (Adam advises he will go get octopus now) (Next portion of confessional shown)
Becky “Wow, they really dislike him a lot”
Sundra “It’s something that they’ve seen; it’s like, just seeing the wrong person get ahead” (Sundra’s confessional now shown)

Pavarti (conf) “A little hostility... a little resentment” and “....it all hangs on other people right now (Becky, Sundra) so the best I can do is be as persuasive as I can and try not to be pushy”

Sundra (conf) “I think Jonathan was a little too arrogant, a little too cocky at the food auction and it just shows maybe what his true character is in life” More emphasis from Aitu on Jonathan’s negativity. If actions cannot be shown then hearing from people who are “positively” portrayed would lend confirmation that Jonathan IS supposed to be negative

Yul “After today, I do feel that his true personality is coming out....” (then instills doubt of Jonathan’s status in talking about spending the last days with him would not be very pleasant)
Becky “I agree” (Jonathan approaching)
Jonathan “I was worried about you guys. I saw the water wasn’t back on the fire” (Yul covers by telling him they were discussing the order)

Jonathan (conf) “Something is up; I think Pavarti and Adam have gotten in the girls’ ear and I just don’t know to what degree that it really worked. Clearly, the energy has shifted” More than likely, this is a later confessional but needed to be put here due to what they have shown us thus far

The Exiled One

Candice again was sent to Exile Island and her spirits have taken a beating. Again, although Candice was not meant to be sympathetic over the past few episodes nor this one as well, however, the music did elicit a sympathetic nature so I do think that the editors attempted to elicit some level of at least appreciating how often she has had to spend there. Note also they included a portion of one of her prior exiles; perhaps she shed more tears the prior time.

Candice “I think I’m next on the chopping block so I need this immunity” (This was in voice over and sounded inserted into the running dialogue of how emotionally spent she felt)

The Immunity Challenge

Adam (conf) “The immunity challenge is very important for me personally. I don’t like what Jonathan stands for; I don’t like having Jonathan around. He’s just a dirty dirty rat and uh I would love to get some revenge against Jonathan and continue to be in this game so I need to win this one”

I am of the mindset that Adam's confessional may not have occurred THIS week; but rather it is from a future episode. Adam citing “revenge” sounds as if this involves perhaps Candice leaving and while this particular immunity was important for Adam to win; his words and tone seem to imply it is crucial he wins. It would not surprise me that this confessional was used here solely for dramatic purposes since he did, in fact, win this.

Candice returns and Adam is grinning and Jonathan smiles. Becky pats her on the back. Ozzy waves goodbye to the necklace.

Jeff “The winner gets immunity. Guaranteed a one in seven shot (Yul and Ozzy shown) at a million bucks (Sundra, Candice and Becky shown) (make of that what you will )

The challenge starts with Pavarti, Jonathan and Adam advancing. Adam runs away with it as he deliberately and casually raises his victory flag.

More “Edited” Doubt

Jonathan is heard telling Candice “Welcome Back” with a “Thank you”

Candice (conf) “Adam won immunity; so tonight we’re going to Tribal Council (Sundra) and it’s looking like (Pavarti who ducks with Ozzy and Yul shown) my numbers up. It’s upsetting to think that Jonathan might get farther than me in this game and upsetting to think that someone, who everyone feels, everyone; even the people in his alliance feels that Jonathan is a snake” (I thought he was a rat!)

Adam “Jonathan’s just a slimeball (Sundra) and he needs to be voted out (Becky, Candice) (All done in voiceover, this may have been from a confessional inserted into conversation)

Interesting to note that Ozzy is supposed to be missing from this entire conversation, BOTH versions (noted below). He shows up quite magically at the very end when Jonathan advises he would get firewood (which interestingly he is shown to do in the middle of the scene where it seems that Yul is alone with Pavarti, Candice and Adam.) Ozzy had also been “missing” from last episode’s conversation among the Aitu Four and Jonathan in discussing the vote along with the powwow that Sundra, Yul and Becky had this episode. Ozzy was curiously removed from the “dirty dynamics” progressing and Yul was obviously pushed into the thick of it. I had indicated in my last post that there appeared to be some cloak and dagger feel to the dynamics of the “Aitu Four” (and Jonathan) We see multiple conversations with someone obviously “left out” We hear strategic discussions yet some are removed from them. There is obviously an attempt to give this grouping a slight air of mystery; perhaps to help elevate some semblance of a surprise since this group was shown to be so close in light of their “underdog” arc

Yul “I understand you don’t like Jonathan (Sundra standing behind Yul) but how does this help you?”
Adam “I don’t care”
Pavarti “It doesn’t help us...”
Adam “I’ll be at peace with myself if he’s voted out before...”
Pavarti “Honestly, I feel like I have won if he’s voted out before I am”
Adam “You’re an upstanding guy...”

(Jonathan then shown approaching the first time advising he caught a flounder then Yul’s confessional shown. Please note that the remainder of this conversation below appears to be heavily edit. The first portion Sundra and Becky were there as noted above. This next portion they are nowhere in the scene which may be confirmed by the fact ALL the commentary is directed solely to Yul and about Yul. Yul tells us in his confessional they “approached me” A little bit later when Jonathan begins to eat the coconut, Sundra and Becky are suddenly right in the shot. I assume we had two conversations, one with Yul only; the other with Sundra and Becky present but spliced together for the obvious effect. The first conversation may have had Ozzy there as magically he is there at the very end during the coconut portion of the scene)

Yul “Jonathan is not my first choice to uh, welcome him back; he’s not my first choice. He is what he is”
Pavarti “I think you’re underestimating....”
Yul “Let me finish” (Pavarti shown rolling her eyes)
Yul “I understand how he thinks. The guy is selfish (Pavarti shown) and is rational (Adam shown) right so I can (Candice) predict basically what he is going to go for and what makes sense to him.....”
Adam “There’s still a fact that the way the three of us vote on the jury too cause you’re the ringleader in this; it’s not gonna change anything for you and your three people who vote too. If you get rid of Jonathan first, we’ll vote for you; you’re the ringleader and you’re in charge” (This was done in voice over and obviously a big gauntlet thrown down. Candice is also overheard stating “and Nate too”)
Yul “I’m not the ringleader” (appears to be glancing over where Candice is)
Candice (voiceover) “You are ....”
Adam (voiceover) “and you have the power to do that right now and it won’t affect anything with your....before tribal”
Yul “It’s not that simple; if we try to change it right now, it will have other ramifications” “I can’t really talk about that stuff”

(Jonathan comes back for the second time)
Yul “You know, they’re doing, you know, obviously what they should be doing” (directed to Jonathan)
Yul “I’m really sorry guys; I’m just trying to be honest with you. Not blow smoke... it would be a lie”
Pavarti interrupts to advise Jonathan that Adam was eating the coconut that Jonathan took (Sundra and Becky are now in the scene again)
Jonathan “I didn’t realize this was your coconut; you eat it”
Adam “No I don’t want it”
Jonathan “So what’s the problem? All I did was pick it up so I could share it, that’s all”
Adam “Eat it”
Jonathan “Thank you”
Adam “It’s not that complicated”
Jonathan “I’ll go get some firewood, so we can make some fish” (Ozzy suddenly appears in the scene)

Obviously designed to show the building tension and a little irony thrown in with respect to sharing in light of the fish sharing issue later

Yul (conf) “Adam, Pavarti and Candice approached me today; they really want Jonathan out... tried to appeal to my sense of justice, integrity to please vote him off first”

Jonathan “Things finally came to a head, they’ve been percolating, brewing, a lot of silence, a lot of glares (shown with Jonathan walking alone in the rain-a little visual sympathy just to “mellow” out this eruption put forth on him this episode? His hat hanging also shown) and I’m getting a little mad...” (Scene goes to Pavarti, Adam and Candice in the tent)

Jonathan (to Aitu) “Do we have to feed them this fish?” (Yul with a small smile, Becky leans forward as if she did not hear him correctly) “Let’s talk about the ethical...”
Ozzy “I say.... no. I don’t really think there’s an ethical question because (Sundra) there ain’t no such thing as a free lunch as they say” (Ozzy reinforces Jonathan's question but it is glossed over as nothing was ever said that Ozzy had no issue with this nor the others for that matter)

The scene then moves forward a bit since they are no longer by the fire and now sitting on a log together

Jonathan is thanked by them for the fish with the three noting they are eating and Candice advising that is wrong and would come out at Tribal.

Candice “Since when don’t we share food” “So arrogant, so rude, I can’t believe this” (that part may have been a confessional spliced in)
Jonathan “Weren’t you the one who called me, never mind”
Candice “...called you a what?”
Jonathan “I was told you called me, that I was a disgusting rat....”
Candice “Well Jonathan you are a rat because you betrayed everybody in this game”
Jonathan “Okay and yet...”
Candice “And everybody knows that you only care about yourself. Yul said it this afternoon; that he can predict your behavior because you’re selfish and (Yul interrupts to look at Jonathan and say “self interested” - it was actually quite a comical moment) and that he knows what moves you are going to make cause you make selfish decisions”
Yul “Candice...”
Candice “Everybody knows that and everybody ......”
Yul “Don’t speak for me, I can speak for myself”
Candice “Then what did you say”
Yul “This isn’t how, this is not how...” (Becky) “Look I said he was a self interested, rational player right? To that extent (Candice interrupts that he said “selfish” which we know he did ) I have certainty at how, that I can predict his behavior because I know what’s gonna like...
Candice “and you don’t like Jonathan and you said that too” (Yul is silent) “and all these people have said that; that they don’t like you”
Jonathan “Let’s talk about this meal...”
Candice “Everybody has their day....”
Jonathan “That’s bullocks and you know it, the rest of us do not choose our days to lay down in the tent. I work my a.s.s. every single day..”
Candice “Cause you’re trying to weasel your way in somehow”
Jonathan “But luckily you’re not name calling; appreciate that”
Candice “I’m not, I’m saying you’re trying to weasel your way in...”
Jonathan “How dare you imply that I’m behaving differently today (Yul) than I have for the last thirty days; you cannot say that that’s true, it’s not true” (Candice is silent and one has to agree with Jonathan’s assessment who watched the show as he has worked since the onset) “I don’t want talk about this, you said more than enough but thank you” (Silence then Yul as the conversation ends abruptly and still uncomfortably)

A Storm Is Coming

Yul “I’m trying to figure out how I can insulate myself from the jury if they get upset”
Becky “Is that what you’re worried about that they are going to get upset and be mad at you for not changing the vote”
Yul “They’re saying I’m the ringleader; they’re going to hold me responsible” (further indication that Yul was alone with the three before since Becky would have known this already)
Becky “Do it again” (hold out fingers)
Yul “Well, we’re 5-3 right now; we could get rid of Jonathan and still be 4-3 and just eliminate them”
Becky “My question to you is there is three of them; you’re going to wait until each one gets voted off then vote Jonathan...”
Yul “No, no so what I’m saying is I vote off Jonathan now, we still retain control and we can vote them all off but then I’ll have victory votes on the jury or at least I won’t have them hating me so that they won’t vote against whoever I go up against”

The shot reverts back to Becky and holds there with a change in music and obviously this is meant to elicit our feelings of Becky, i.e. Yul is discussing jury votes with Becky and does he not realize she is playing the game and why did he not mention Becky as the person he would be going up against?

I would like to address how ethnicity does play a role and how the editing may still attempt to manipulate it. The groundwork was laid for perhaps twofold. First, I had waited for some chink in Yul’s armor and over the last two episodes am pleased that has happened. This scene was definitely intended to shed doubt for Yul and also shed doubt on Becky and Yul. It is quite possible they know more than we do and were not privy to the entire conversation but we were meant to believe that Yul is making great assumptions together with "overlooking" he is speaking with someone also in the game reinforced by the “shot” of Becky appearing to look at Yul as probably most of the viewers did. We have been told by Yul and Becky they have a bond, we have been told by Cowboy their culture is what sets them apart from the others. In other words, we can’t know that this conversation was how it was meant to “appear” and I found it highly manipulated.

Tribal Council

The jury arrives with much focus on Nathan receiving smiles from Adam and Parvarti. Jeff announces they are here to observe to make a “million dollar decision” (Nathan shown then winking over to Pavarti and Pavarti winking back with the cymbal crash much like Sundra and Rebecca had last time)

Jeff asks Becky about exiling Candice
Becky “I think just seeing her strength and endurance, she was probably the fiercest competitor; she was the obvious choice”

Jeff questions Candice about being exiled but always smiling
Candice “I’m out here cause I love this game (Ozzy) and it’s been rough, there’s been some low points (Pavarti) .....”

Jeff asks Ozzy about what happened at camp after the challenge
Ozzy”I spent a good amount of time looking for firewood (so THAT is where he was ) Jonathan went out fishing; Candice, Pavarti and Adam went into the tent basically. It later on caused a huge ordeal with us five eating fish and three not eating fish” (For what it is worth; this lends more support to Jonathan than the other three)
Candice “Not sharing the fish” (Nathan)
Jeff “You say not eating the fish, you say not sharing the fish”
Pavarti “Inviting us to dinner” (Jonathan shown)
Jeff “Okay, Pavarti tell me your story”
Pavarti “Basically the three of us know we’re on the outside (Sundra) they have their five; we have our three. We’re in tent (Becky) spending time with each other; apparently it pissed some people off we weren’t helping around camp (Yul) so Jonathan gets back and decides he doesn’t want to share the fish that he caught (jury shot of Jenny looking back at Rebecca with Jenny smiling and Rebecca going “ooh”)
Adam “Everybody but Jonathan I think was cool with us working together; I haven’t talked to Jonathan so I don’t know what his thoughts are”
Jeff “Are you and Jonathan not speaking to each other?”
Adam “I don’t really care for Jonathan at this point” (Jury shown again with Nathan pumping his fist, some smiles from the two women and Brad watching)
Pavarti “It’s just interesting the more comfortable he gets with his position in this game (Ozzy shown) the more his true colors shown and it just (Jonathan) shows the level of maturity. I’m sorry, I’m half his age and I’m twice as mature as he is” (Nathan nodding vigorously but I’ll be hard pressed to believe that this was not meant to be an ironic statement on her part)
Adam “I agree” (Adam would not necessarily be support for her statement either)
Jonathan “Now it’s all starting to come out. I understand if you guys are hurt or disappointed or whatever but you have five people working and three people who don’t want to work. At what point does the five people working and the three people who are basically waiting for the dinner bell so that they can get fed, you know, when is that not appropriate?”
Candice “I think it’s an arrogance thing; we got the numbers, you’re going down, you’re on a sinking ship, you know, we got the food, we don’t have to feed you” (Ozzy shown with a look that does not agree with this assessment) “All of them have said they don’t like Jonathan (little cymbal and Jonathan)
Adam “Everyone knows how you are” (Jury shot again with Nathan laughing along with Jenny, Rebecca and Brad smiling and laughing. Most likely edited in at this point; frankly I didn’t think that particular comment was overly funny but editing is “funny” that way) “It’s not a secret”
Jonathan “And that’s a fact that I’m a rat; I don’t even know what that means!” (Ozzy shown pumping his fist now and more argument with Jonathan reiterating sarcastically he is a rat and a cancer) “That’s enough out of you” (cymbal crash and Nathan taken aback)
Adam “There’s no reason for you to be around now though”
Jonathan “Says you, jack, says you. I earned my place...”
Pavarti “Jonathan you have, you have outwitted...”
Jonathan “Come on”
Adam “The truth hurts doesn’t it”
Jonathan “That I’m a rat and a cancer?”
Yul “Come on...” (more bickering)

Jeff “It seems to me that rather than a tribe of five and a tribe of three, there’s a tribe of three of Pavarti, Candice, Adam and foursome with Ozzy, Sundra, Becky, Yul (only Ozzy shown) and there’s Jonathan on the other”
Yul “I would disagree”
Jeff “Well you would, you’re the UN, I am expecting you to come in and (makes hand gesture and chuckles are heard) make everything nice”
Yul “Look obviously when we tell them things we’re going to do it in a way that is going to serve (Pavarti) our own interests (Candice) so I wouldn’t take them at their word. The way they’re painting the picture is not accurate” (Candice not happy) “I’ll leave it at that” (Again, for what this is worth, Jonathan is receiving support which bodes worse for the editing portrayal of the three from Raro)
Pavarti “He’s the puppet master; we’re all puppets in his little play”
Yul “Come on, what do you expect me to do? (Candice) Look (jury shown with all but Rebecca laughing) we’re all here trying to win, you can’t fault me for that”
Pavarti “I do not at all, I respect you completely, all four of you”
Adam “And I’d have a lot more respect and so would the people on the jury if they cut loose their cancer (Jenny shown) that they got..”
Candice “Even if all three of us are the next to go”
Adam “Yeah, 123 after that”
Pavarti “Boom, boom boom sitting ducks” (Jonathan shown looking up into the air)

Jeff asks Jonathan how he feels after everything said
Jonathan “I feel fine. One never wants to hear some of the names I’ve been called (Adam) but gonna move on with the game. Luckily for me, right now, I’m in a better position than I was when I was with them” (Jonathan appeared very secure in his statement thus lending to the potential fact that he did receive assurances nothing would happen to him)

Jeff asks Candice what she is basing her vote upon
Candice “We tried everything but they’re gonna vote how they’re gonna vote and maybe they’re gonna vote with us (Ozzy) or maybe they’re not. (Becky) I just wanna sya this is a decision the jury’s gonna make (jury shot) they need to know what’s really going on around camp cause it’s been kind of ugly” (Jonathan shakes his head and smiles and quick shot to Yul)

Jeff confirms with Adam he is keeping the necklace and “There is also the HII; you all know that Yul found it...” (shot of jury, Nathan again shows great expression)

Sundra not posed any questions and Ozzy and Becky low key during this Tribal Council. Naturally Raro and Jonathan claim the most commentary, Yul was also in focus along with specific visuals and the jury was very noticeable as well for obvious reasons

Jonathan “I’m not going to sacrifice myself, for you; showed me your true colors”
Candice “Wow! Piece of work”

Jeff announces Candice leaving and we see a final display of affection with Nathan obviously enjoying same. Jeff “Well a kiss is nice; maybe if it were love, he would have given you the necklace” Candice exits with a kiss and “still smiling” which was a refreshing exit considering everything that occurred

Jeff “Well I think tonight’s Tribal Council speaks for itself”

”It is the impressions that you make...”

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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12-01-06, 05:39 PM (EST)
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57. "RE: Episode 11 thoughts"
Great post Veruca. You've given me a lot to think about as I watch the tape. For now, I wanted to give you this Insider confessional from Parvati in the previous episode:

"There's tons of talk about who has the immunity idol. I'm pretty - I'm 100% sure that Adam has the hidden immunity idol. He's not very slick about being slick. Every time you ask him about it, he gets this goofy grin on his face like, 'I don't know who has it.' 'Oh, I know Yul doesn't have it, I know Jonathan doesn't have it, I know Candice doesn't have it. I don't know who has it.' I'm like, Adam, you're ridiculous. Just admit it. But he won't. He won't admit it."

In effect, Adam was bluffing he had the idol, thinking no one had it. Parvati couldn't see that Adam was not playing dumb but really is dumb.


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12-01-06, 06:07 PM (EST)
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58. "RE: Episode 11 thoughts"
Right -- I was going to mention that too, michel. That's why Adam was quiet when Parvati was telling Jonathan she didn't believe that Yul showed him the idol. Adam had Parvati and Nate convinced that he (Adam) had it. Now the jig was up. And Candice had also known that Adam didn't really have the idol, but had played along with him to some degree, that's why she kept her mouth shut as well.


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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12-01-06, 07:20 PM (EST)
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59. "RE: Episode 11 thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 12-01-06 AT 07:21 PM (EST)

Great post VS and thanks to everyone who is posting in this thread!

What really stuck out to me last night was the Yul and Becky conversation about votes. I really think we're only getting a part of the story- like you said- to make us think that maybe there is some dissonance in their relationship to further the storyline. When she say's "do it again" it implies that this has been gone over before. I think this is a situation where what we didn't get to see in this conversation is as important as what we did.


Phoenixmon's work!
edited for speeling

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12-02-06, 05:40 PM (EST)
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61. "RE: Episode 11 thoughts"
Regarding your questions, Veruca, you'll see in my post that the smart Yul as shown flaws that suggest that he isn't thinking clearly. Jonathan is still the fun villain that does anything to win as we saw when he stole the chicken. For the rest:

Last episode was fun for the survivors. They enjoyed a merge feast and they had a nice chat on the tribal council set. The vote killed the mood and this week is one of confrontations. In this fight:

The Rat has the last laugh.

Has there ever been a castaway like Jonathan? After only hinting that Yul had the idol last time, now he convinces Candice that he didn’t have a choice but to flip or go home. When he was cornered by Parvati back in camp, he tells her that he had seen the idol. He didn’t convince Parvati but he did get a surprised look from Adam who saw his bluff being called. Jon told us he prefered to play with the Aitu people and see them win if he doesn’t win. How can he win?! Speaking to Parvati, he explained how the vote would’ve bounced to him because of the idol. We hear Parvati say that: “Yul doesn’t have the idol” but in a low voice we also hear Candice say that: “Not if you had told us.” He could have tried harder to convince them because the light bulb did pop up over Adam’s head as Veruca so nicely imagined.

“It is a social game” he told all the Aitu to solidify the alliance. “I love playing with you guys, I love hanging out with you, we all work well together…I come over here and I see I’m in a Clown House.” To support that point, we see the three Raros goofing off, laughing seemingly without a care.

He had a great time at the auction, not only getting the best deals but also forcing the bidding up on the items Parvati and Ozzy sought. Cleaning up at the auction soon turned against him as we were shown that his attitude was irritating everyone else. (At least, Cindy had a car to boast about, not only a hot-dog and a pizza, yet he carried on just as she had!) Becky was first of the Aitus to comment on it. Sundra said he is an obnoxious force and “I would hate to see Jonathan in the Final 4” Wasn’t that Ozzy’s place? Even Yul joined in and agreed that he was starting to be annoyed with Jonathan and wanted to “reconsider the order.”

Jonathan sensed the energy in camp had shifted. He thought Parvati could’ve gotten in the girls’ ears. It put him on the defensive for the rest of the episode, forcing him to focus his efforts into regaining an alliance of 5. He used every opportunity to attack the lazy trio. He suggested that they don’t wait and should keep the food. His rebuttal of the arguments presented by Candice must have frustrated her. Every comment she made was deflected by Yul and Jonathan. When Jonathan took over the discussion, claiming that she cannot say that he is playing differently than he has done from the first day, the camera angle changed. We had been looking from Candice’s point of view but has she started to lose the argument, the camera angle made us look up to Candice as if we were sitting with the Aitus. That, even more than what we heard, was designed so we would take Aitu’s side of the argument.

In Jonathan’s case, I feel his game plan was too ambitious. If I can step into Emy’s territory, it seems just like the dreadful image of the fish regurgitating its meal, Jonathan tried to take on too much.

Despite his comments that “We are golden” and that his huge risk worked, we saw the first weaknesses in Yul’s game. Revealing the idol to everyone can be even riskier than using it to flip Jonathan. After the auction, he appeared to be unable to resolve the conflict caused by the word he had given to the disliked Jonathan. The Raros tried to plead with his sense of justice and he was being honest about his feelings when he entertained the idea because Jonathan is selfish. Once Jonathan overheard him, he had to retreat with a flimsy excuse that Raro was trying their best to stay in the game.

The confrontation with Candice caused more problems for Yul as it forced him to silence her. “Don’t speak for me” he admonished her but she was airing out some shared secrets. She was saying it as it is yet it was shown in such a way that the audience could disagree with her.

We have learned that Yul had told her that she was going next by that time. The Raros were in the tent, sharing last moments together when Aitus decision to eat alone was taken. It was shown this way to keep the suspense but it also served to perpetuate the image that Raro are fumbling, bumbling idiots while Aitu is the “Golden Tribe.” Does anyone see arrogance in that group? Becky’s comment in the previous episode: “We deserve this” was the first indication that peaked through their polished edited image. For this to be swept away is a sure sign that the winner is in this group…if there were any doubts left!

What could be his fatal weakness was shown in his talk with Becky: “I want to insulate myself to the jury, in case they get upset” he told her. “They’re saying I’m the ringleader, I’m the one responsible…We could get rid of Jonathan and still be ahead 4-3…We retain control and I have their victory votes on the jury…or at least I don’t have them hating me.” It was strange that we never heard her response. Every vote that Yul saves is a vote that she could be losing. Can we look at the fact that Jonathan is still there as a sign that Yul didn’t have the last word? Did she force Yul to keep Jonathan for now to irritate Raro? She will need to boot Jonathan at some point so that Yul doesn’t have is dream Final 2 opponent, but this vote was to her advantage. Can she be pulling the strings on the puppet master?

As Veruca noted, the opening sequence when Yul was hugging Sundra and Ozzy, congratulating each other for turning the 8-4 deficit into a 5-3 lead was strange. Where was Becky?

Later, she was right there when everyone noticed how obnoxious Jonathan really was. It was to her that Parvati turned to see if a deal could be made. She was also the one that Yul gave money to, so she could have the power that the small envelop was said to hold. It appeared that she was the one that the Aitus trusted with what could’ve been a strategic decision. “ Why do you want it?” asked a short-sighted Parvati, “you have the numbers” (?) Thinking a few moves in advance is the only way to stay ahead. She also seemed to be thinking ahead when Yul was trying to save jury votes!

Becky seems to be the one that plans the alliances and then lets Yul cultivate them. For Becky and Yul to reach F2 they’ll have to get rid of these players. If she keeps some distance, Yul would get most of the blame for an elimination vote. Could that be the reason we didn’t see her celebrating during the opening sequence?

Sundra again told us about her and her tribe's feelings. Speaking of the Raros after the vote, she told Yul: “They were shocked. I could hardly contain myself…My heart was in my throat.” She told Becky that it would be bad to see Jonathan, the wrong person advance in the game. She told us: “Today, Jonathan was a little too arrogant…It showed a little bit what his true character is like.”

Ozzy’s main contribution was to set the mood for the boot. We know that he never liked or trusted Jonathan but his facial expression and his “no free lunch” comment showed that the “kids” were even worse than Jonathan in his eyes.

At TC, he first talked of the ordeal caused by the Raros about not eating the food. “Not sharing’ corrected Candice.

Now that Yul unveiled the idol to everyone, it could help Ozzy set another Voodoo plan in motion. Oscar would have started planning it but Oscar played only during the first half of the season. Since the mutiny, Ozzy has been a team player and could have found the patience to wait for a Final 3 showdown with Yul. Ozzy’s facial expressions show the arrogance that has gained Aitu since their take over. Is that the reason he has been hidden so much in the last two episode? If it is because they couldn’t keep the clean image of the tribe if they showed him more, it could be an indication that he is the winner.

Parvati didn’t waste time getting in Jonathan’s face after he had betrayed her dum-dum. Her relentless accusations forced Jonathan to admit that he had seen the idol. She still wasn’t convinced because she doesn’t trust anything that comes out of his mouth. “He’s a filthy, miserable rat” was the last comment of the opening sequence. The stage was set for the episode!

We had visual proof of her inability to play the survival part of the game when she learned how to gut a fish from Sundra who isn’t a survivor “extraordinaire” herself! The demonstration was grossing her out. Jonathan used that to his advantage. “After 28 days, she hasn’t gutted a fish. She’s a lazy girl” he told us. He also made the point to Yul, Sundra and Ozzy. Jonathan is a survivor, it told Aitu (and us), Parvati isn’t. Who could argue?

She got the reward she wanted at the auction but it symbolized just how much she wasn’t made for the survival part of this game. Saying: “I’m in it” and wooing at the view of the bath made it easy for Jonathan to up the bids. “She is in her element, she’s happy” said Jonathan with just a hint of perfidy. The idol revelation surprised her and none of the other prizes in the auction went in favor of anyone she was close to. By the end, she was pouting while scrubbing her back in the tub!

What she is good at is making alliances and she noted that Jonathan behavior exposed a crack in the alliance that there was “a little resentment, a little hostility brewing.” She goes to the beach to join Becky who agrees that Jonathan’s true personality is coming out. Parvati answers: “If he is in the Final 4, I will shoot myself.” She told us she was going to try to be "persuasive but not be pushy.” It was good to leave right after to go fishing with Adam as it let Becky and Sundra free to talk about it. She was hoping and praying that the game could flip on its head once more. Her attempts failed for now but there was something strange about what she said. How did she know the plan had been for Jonathan to be in Final 4? She could have figured out that Ozzy’s position isn’t that solid in the Aitu alliance.

I usually let Jeff’s challenge comments to Veruca but something funny happened in the immunity challenge. Jeff was looking at Jonathan, Yul and Ozzy as the first to look for their key. He never saw Parvati opening her box, finding the key and releasing her flag. She had time to jump up and down and rejoice before Jeff finally turned around, realizing she was first to advance. We didn’t expect it either!

She focused the jury talk on Jonathan and showed Jeff that there was a tribe of 3, a foursome and Jonathan. Telling Yul that she respects him for being the puppet master could show which side she would take if her vote is used to split the Aitus but Yul didn’t like hearing that.

Adam’s idol bluff came back to haunt him when Jonathan said he had seen the idol. “It sucks to be in this position” so why did he shake his head at Candice, refusing to go higher in the bidding for some power. It didn’t have any power in the vote, but he didn’t know that.

I’m impressed with Veruca’s comment that his confessional about needing the immunity could have been taken from another episode. I figured that his need for revenge was for Nate’s boot but now, with the Candice boot, it has been exacerbated. Also, he is in more danger with Candice gone. If it was pulled from a future episode, I’d expect he doesn’t win the next one when he really needs it.

After the challenge, he tried to sway the vote away from Candice. He tried pleading with Yul to boot Jonathan, the rat, first. He then threatened Yul with the three jury votes he’d lose since he is the ringleader. “I don’t care for Jonathan” he commented at TC. That got Nathan smiling.

The jury was part of this TC as very few juries have been. They did more than just listen, they could be showing Yul that Jonathan is dangerous to keep unless you can bring him all the way.

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12-03-06, 07:44 PM (EST)
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70. "Puking fish?"
michel, I love your analysis of Ozzy not being shown the last few eps bc it would throw a kink the "harmonious Aitu4" and this could be good for Ozzy bc a fracture of the tight knit group will happen

I think Ozzy is definitely up to something and he was seen agreeing with Jon about no free lunch and at TC when Adum and Jon were arguing over getting rid of cancer..I saw that as him supporting..I don't know if it will work (prob not bc of Jon's editing) but I think Ozzy may have made a f2 pact with Jon. When that doesn't work, he may use the remaining Raro (Adum and/or Parv) to try to shake things up but I think it will come down to Yul and Ozzy (whether there is another person involved, I'm not sure)

Well there sure was a lot of nausea and vomit in the show. Parv said she had nausea at TC and wanted to puke on Jon's face...Jon goes to the auction and pigs out and before the "burp" scene we see a fish or eel puking up a fish. Overindulgence or people disgusted by Jon. It's funny--Jon didn't get all the food, there are pix of Adum eating a huge breakfast he won at auction..so they wanted to hide that to make it look like Jon was only one to really eat. Again to push his villainess.

Immediately after the puking fish we again see a hermit crab crawling in its shell on the Aitutonga beach...continuing to show that Jon is not to be trusted?

Again we see brown birds one after the first break on the beach and one flying away after Candice talks to Aitu4 plus Jon about not sharing food. Brown birds have been linked to the boot many times before.

We saw a lot of rats after the TC and then one again when they were walking into Ep 11 TC.

But the most interesting animal imagery for me this week was when Yul was talking to Raro and they were trying to get him to vote Jon out first and Jon walked up...Yul says to Jon...oh a FLOUNDER...and Jon says yes..it's my first one. I think that scene and the later scene with Candice calling Yul out is the first time we've really seen Yul "flounder" in the game. I don't know if this is a chink in his armor bc he's the ultimate winner or we are now seeing how he loses the jury vote...I do think Yul will definitely be there...but who will be there with him...I'm not sure if it will be Becky..I found that discussion they had about F2 votes very odd. They def. wanted to show that Becky was not thrilled with Yul talking about how he keeps F2 votes...does she start to think how she can cut him out...I don't know..the imagery with the machete is interesting Pepe and also the two white birds with one flying away...white bird may be linked to good and a pair would seem to me to signify Yul and Becky...does one fly away from the other next week or at least start to think about it?

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12-04-06, 09:29 AM (EST)
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72. "RE: Episode 11 thoughts"
<i>Verusa Salt asked: I am curious for those who want to answer how you felt watching Yul tonight and your opinion of him as well as your position on Jonathan vs. The Raro Three as you know I often asks viewing questions."</i>
<p>
I felt conflict in Yul - perhaps his Achilles heel revealed. He's been exposed as the ringleader, the idol-holder. The Raro 3 came to him to offer jury votes in exchange for a favor. And he does not seem comfortable in this role. He is too forthcoming, being too honest with the Raro 3 so that Candice could then use his words against him with Jonathan. That showed the disconnect between his ability to plan and manipulate the game, and his comfort, or rather discomfort, with living the real world consequences of his scheming.
<p>
The edit showed Yul repeating this with Becky, being too honest with her, and not seeming to realize that he was talking about final 2 and not making that be him and her. Yul reminded me of Lex in Africa, and Becky of Natahn - the "assistant coach" approach. Becky is on the inside, knows everything Yul is thinking and planning, but won't be splattered with the effects because Yul is the ring-leader.
<p>
This episode set up the preview for next time, when Yul is shown to be facing even more conflict about his 'top of the heap' position.
<p>
I was left still liking Yul, respecting him as a person and as a player of the game, but wondering if he is opening himself up to betrayal down the road.
<p>
Jonathan's conflict with the Raro 3 has been highlighted and underscored so much, that it feels almost like too much. Yes, they are idiots. We get that. It made me feel like there is more to it than was needed to show his contempt for them and their ineptitude. That had already been done.

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12-02-06, 12:15 PM (EST)
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60. "RE: Becky's Edit"
Braveheart, you're not alone. My gut goes against the grain as well and I really think that Becky is in the final two or three depending on how that goes down. I think that this is an instance in which what we're not being shown is more important.

I too noticed the scene you mentioned - BUT - what Yul actually said was "Whoever I'm in the F2 with" - and Becky's reaction looked sort of shocked - like she was surprised that he wasnt a lock on being in the F2 with HER. My gut was that this was trying to make us wonder if they'll take each other to the final two - perhaps in hearing this Becky realized that their allegiance to each other only goes so far, and perhaps SHE wont take him to the final two? We've also been steadily set up over the last two episodes with Yul expressing concern to Jonathan that he couldnt win in the final two against Becky or Sundra (Becky was the one pictured when he said this though), and this episode we were shown the girls making inroads relationship-wise with the Raro people, while the Raros were very argumentative toward Yul.
Either this is the point where we're being shown the struggles Yul overcomes to win, and they're trying to give his character some negativity as they usually do, or we're being shown the emergence of the girls and their not alienating the jury as why one of them wins. Ozzy has been almost non-existent the last episode or two.


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12-02-06, 07:21 PM (EST)
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63. "RE: Becky's Edit"
It's interesting that Ozzy has been somewhat invisible the last episode or two, but I'm remembering back to several episodes ago when Ozzy was a central character and Yul seemed invisible.

This makes me wonder whether the editing is purposely setting up a sort of "wave", where focus switches back and forth periodically from one to the other of Ozzy and Yul, perhaps in fact setting the two of them up for the final two.

Which would be awesome.

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12-03-06, 08:00 PM (EST)
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71. "RE: Becky's Edit"
Becky's reaction shot is a cut and paste of the same shot before they strategize. Think they want to instill some doubt in that alliance not sure if it's foreshadowing or trying to build some suspense that isn't there.

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12-02-06, 05:52 PM (EST)
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62. "From the vidcap thread..."
I commented on it over in the vidcap preview thread but I thought I'd bring these vidcaps over here after reading your post, brave... I found these to be rather intriguing in trying to figure out the editing intent of these caps of Becky being figuratively chopped in half by a machete (being held by Parvati).

Anyone care to take a crack at figuring out why we're being given a camera angle shot of a machete coming down with Becky in the background?







Is this a subtle editing hint to tell us that Becky will get chopped at F3, or perhaps she gets chopped in F2 with Parvati being the deciding vote? Or even that she gets chopped real soon in the game?



A Tribe siggie
"Tsk, tsk. Pepe's messing with the newbies again." Spidey, 3/30/05

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12-02-06, 09:45 PM (EST)
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65. "RE: From the vidcap thread..."
PepeLePew13, interesting that you brought this particular image as it immediately made me recall the other machete involving Becky scene from way back when which I had commented on as interesting. This was the episode when Cecelia was booted. As to what extent your picture and my thoughts in this earlier episode have any connection, I cannot say since Pavarti is in THIS picture but it brought it to mind immediately. Thank you for sharing

From September 30, 2006

Ozzy gets wonderful enhancement to his edit so he most certainly appears to be one for long term. He also was deemed to give a confessional over the makeup of the alliance made with the girls and Cowboy when we could have heard about this from Cecelia the actual boot! Sundra could have been this designated person as well ESPECIALLY in light of the fact that she has no past relationships to count on but the editing still wants us to recognize Ozzy. His visual of watching Becky, machete in hand, whistling with that devious sounding music culminating in a nice "thwack" with the machete also reeks of foreshadowing. We may see ultimately Ozzy seal Becky's fate at some point

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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
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12-03-06, 11:45 AM (EST)
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69. "RE: From the vidcap thread..."
I wonder if this could be showing that Parvati is the one that chops Becky out of the F4. We have been shown/heard several times that Aitu plans to be the F4. But there is always that chance that at F5 the wrong person wins Immunity. Could Parvati be the last Raro left with Aitu at F5? If Parvati were to win Immunity then one of the Aitu 4 would have to be sacrificed. Parvati's Immunity win would force the severing of the F4 alliance. Could Becky be the one Chopped Out by Parvati's II win?
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12-05-06, 02:17 AM (EST)
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78. "RE: Becky's Edit"
At this point I can't just imagine a scenerio where Jonathan isn't in the f2. There has just been to much time invested in him. He seems to be the center of almost everything that is happening and is constantly being talked about. The jury reactions only reinforces to me that he is going to be in the f2. He is one of those unforgettable characters from shows past like Richard, Brian and Chris, three men who were viewed as either love them or hate them but you can't take your eyes off of them. This is not meant as a slight to some of the outstanding women who have won this game in the past. IMO, there has always been a difference in the editing of women winners vs men winners, this is why I compare Jonathan to previous male winners.The real question is who is going to be there with him.

The obvious person to put next to Jonathan is Yul, who himself was the center of a lot of what was going on during the last two episodes. I'm given pause about him as he is hardly ever talked about, but rather talked to. We hear his thoughts on game strategy and, of course, Jonathan. We know that he envisions himself in the f2, but with who? His talk with Becky was revealing but as was noted by VS and others that it was heavily edited. Yul was shown to be in control of strategy but lacking in the social aspect of this game. His bumbling words through out the episode belied the impression we have been given thus far. As I watched Yul try to explain his words when confronted by Candice I had the impression of what it would be like for him having to answer to the the jury. I'm also very interested to see what happens with that HII and if might still come into play. We must remember that he can give it away to someone, and wouldn't it be delicious to see Becky or Ozzy get turned on only to seee them pull out the HII at TC.

Yul's partner, or as he refered to her early on as being like his sister, is a very intriguing character but I have a hard time believing she is going to last to the end. She just hasn't gotten enough face time for me to be convinced of her beyound f4. Her conversation with Yul about f2 had no scenerio shown with her being there in the end. IMO, that convo with Yul was shown to highlight his delima about losing jury votes if he doesn't get rid of Jonathan, thus it had to be greatly edited.

I like Sundra and she certainly has great reactions but once again, like Becky, I'm just not that invested in her. Not enought talk about her or by her. Both Sundra and Becky were a part of the fish eating blow out. They didn't seem to bothered by what P/C/A thought. Why didn't we hear from them during any of these pivitol moments? Could it be that we aren't meant to get very invested in these two?

Adam gets his fair share of visuals, his relationship with Candice and outbursts against, of course Jonathan. No strategy talk from him or are people talking about him. None of that bodes well for him. My most memorable moment about Adam from this past ep. was not of him calling Jonathan every name in the book, but rather what happened to him at TC. A lol moment of Jeff saying, after the long kiss b/t he an Candice, that if it was love, or something to that effect, he would have given her the immunity necklace. That really took a lot of bite off of all of Adams, and to a lesser extent Candice and Parvatis, self rightous whinning about Yul doing the right thing.

Parviti sure didn't come off looking to bright did she? Not a lot of talk about her but she was the only one from her group that was trying to work the obvious Jonathan angle from behind the scenes. Was she the only one from her group that tried to do this? I doubt it. I think Parviti is going to survive the pagonging of her group. It was mentioned by someone else in this thread how Jeff almost missed her being the first one to raise her flag during the immunity challenge. Her edit has the sort of depth that could put her in the f4.

Last but by no means least is Ozzy. Since I haven't made my way to posting in the editing threads until now I want to go back a ways with Ozzy to the beginning. Has anyone forgotten how he was willing to throw a challenge to get rid of one his own tribe members? I haven't. I'm not sure if this will come into play again but it does show why he, right behind Jonathan, is probably the least liked and still not very trusted even by his own tight fouresome. He is definately capable of going on an immunity run but he certainly can be beaten, especially when the challenge doesn't involve water. We heard his thoughts about the the fish eating blow up at TC. What we haven't heard have been his thoughts about the game or others talking about him.

DRONES

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12-02-06, 08:18 PM (EST)
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64. "Is there any possibility?"
Is there any possibility that we were shown Yul's strategy of keeping Jonathan because he is "selfish and therefore his actions are predictable" because he is about to give in to Parvati's reasoning that they should boot the cancer?

If Yul feels sorry for Parvati and Adam and goes ahead and boots Jonathan this week, then boots Adam after that, this would leave 3 women versus 2 men. Becky has got to realize that she can't beat Ozzy or Yul in an F2, same with Sundra. The way that Yul was talking to Becky about jury votes, she has got to realize that he might not really be planning to take her to the final 2 either.

There were some foreshadowing moments in this episode that I don't think we can be blind to. Parvati saying she would vomit if Jonathan lasted longer in the game than her. Jonathan saying that Parvati doesn't need a million dollars, that it would mess her life up. Nate winking at Parvati at tribal council just at the moment that Jeff said "million dollar decision".

Parvati has had the lion's share of million dollar references that started in episode 1. True that her edit went silent for several middle episodes, but was revived again here. Also, she might have been whiny to Jonathan, but she was listening attentively when Becky, Sundra and the others were saying how displeased they were with Jonathan. She took Adam aside and told him a crack may be available, she was very analytical of the situation. She also told the camera that maybe the game was going to get one more shake up.

The first merge episode IC Jeff made the comment "it is down to Ozzy and 3 women" I wondered if that was a premonition of what the future might hold. Plus the fact that Aitu has been shown as getting a little cocky and so much emphasis on them as the final 4.

I still think Parvati might weasel her way in there to win this thing. All it will take is for Yul to let his guard down.


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cantstandsya 48 desperate attention whore postings
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12-02-06, 11:37 PM (EST)
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66. "RE: Is there any possibility?"
Great posts guys. I think Yul's reasoning here is atm the only way he can get into the F2 is if he wins immunity. I think he's keeping Jonathan for a few boots longer to actually gain some enemies so that he actually is a good choice to take to F2 if he doesn't win immunity thereby hoping that he can out debate his F2 partner. Which I still think is Becky btw since he can't be that much of a dolt as to talk about F2 strategies to Becky without meaning her to be with him. He never mentions of taking Jonathan to F2 for instance in that conversation. So he seems still solid for an all Aitu F4. Becky and Yul talk about booting Jonathan either before or after the 3 Raros making me believe that the earlier mention of Jonathan in an F4 was a smokescreen. Pretty easy for them to dub in four from Sundra since the Aitu which happens to be 4 in number was probably mentioned by Sundra countless times.

The strange thing about this episode is everyone looked slightly bad this episode. Which seems to indicate to me a very heavy edit. Interestingly enough we don't see any input from Becky, Yul and Sundra about eating without the Raros. Is that because they would come out looking even more negative? Or is it because they would ruin the neutral/negative tone the editors are implying.

Seems like deliberate obfuscation so we don't know who the clear winner is anymore.


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rose1974 11 desperate attention whore postings
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12-03-06, 01:36 AM (EST)
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67. "New here.. a quote that I can't get out of my head..."
Long time lurker and you have such a wonderful thread. I would like to comment on a few of my observations since the merge adn a qoute that I think is very important to this season.

When the first member of the jury was announced, Jeff Probst said "from here on out, it is about the impressions you make on (these) people" . I think that the whole premise of the show (divisions based on race) really goes back to this idea and I definitely do think that this will indeed predict the winner. Also, some of you have been noting the camera angle (from whose perspective?) or asking, "why did they leave that out" when something that explains a situation is shown in the insider footage. For example, the reason behind the threesome being in the tent while the Aitu's cooked and ate the food. The viewers and (seemingly most of) Aitu's perception was "lazy", when the reality was something more innocent (wanting to have their last goodbyes). It doesn't matter b/c past experience w/ this group has said "lazy", etc. PERCEPTIONS!! I love the role the camera angle is playing b/c ultimately like the viewer there is so much going on behind the scenes that they aren't privy too and miss, and ultimately they base their votes on perceptions. Also by starting the jury earlier, "firs timpressions" will become more important. You were evaluated before you realized you were being evaluated (by juror) kind of thing.

In the larger scope... racial stereotypes are perceptions that people often have b/c the interactions with or impressions made by some members of that group. We generalize that all ___________ (race) have A, B and C qualities but surely not all members of that group have those characteristics. Look at how the hispanics and Asians dealt with there culture... The asians said we fly under the radar, tend not to make waves (nonthreatening), intelligent, etc. I hope I can get past that stereotype Yul commented. The latinos said we are used to working hard, we are work horses. Billy was seen as both lazy and conniving (though the conniving wasn't shown to us) and had to go. The players in their opening confessions repeated, "it is not about "race" but more about you as a person/your qualities (thus your impression on others)"/ "what is your character". Every player voted off so far has made a negative impression on others (none of the "we respect your prowess votes", yet!) - Billy as untrustworthy, Christina and JP too bossy, Sekou as lazy, Jenny as threatening an alliance, Rebecca and Stephanie as checked out/weak, Cowboy as annoying and a wildcard, Flica as too noncommital and there for the adventure not the game, etc. Brad's comment on every man for himself, gave the impression that he was flipping soon. Jonathan and Candice's mutiny left a very bad impression on the 4 aitu who labeled them as traitors, rats and untrustworthy, etc. This game is going to come down to a tribal council where the members of jury feel as if they were misunderstood, cheated, etc. The editing for the most part has shown the aitu four very positively/likeable to television viewing audiences, but the jury members who were slighted, most likely have a different impression of these players. Brad, Jenny and Rebecca may not see the aitu four horribly and may respect the challenge power of these members. Jenny and Rebecca may even remember an air of cockiness. The one thing that most of jurors have noticed is Jonathan's abrasive personality (which is what makes him the perfect final two canidate... if anyone in the aitu four is gutsy enough to make that move).

Examining the impressions made by the most probable final four (as given by the editing)...

We are seeing a little bit of anger towards Yul b/c he was shown to be a very logical, honest and trustworthy player. We envisioned the Asian stereotype and the other players have talked up his honesty and intelligence. Now, we are seeing him "play the game" even out in the open (so not so under the radar) and he's been caught fibbing/manipultating. This bothers the Raros b/c they didn't expect this from him. Their earlier perceptions of him had placed him on a moral highground so it hurts when they are hurt by Yul doing these things. Ultimatley his perception as a puppet master and somewhat dishonest (telling Jonathan what other people are saying about him but pretending as if he likes him,etc. ) may hurt him in the end. It is possible that he wasn't truly the puppet master, but in reality Becky, etc, was but if the impression is given that he is, then he will be held accountable (lose votes). The editing shows Yul is strategizing about how he can change that impression right now, isn't he??

In regards to Ozzy.. the others' impression of him is that he is a great provider, awesome in challenges, and untrustworthy (though we can't really say we've seen why, except for his working w/ Nate). They do respect him b/c of his work ethic and the fact that he has really helped bring his team to many victories. Because these are the perceptions they had of him going into the merge then his manipulations will not sting as much, they expected him to do that as an underdog to get ahead. Also, the respecting of his prowess may help him to swing votes. Since no one has completely said they trust him, then they shouldn't be surprised if he writes their name down (unlike Yul.. who built up an alliance/family, etc), ultimately when a final 4 show down occurs, the four will understand that eliminating someone is what has to be done. He come to Yul and Jonathan as a free agent and ultimately he will stay that way until the end (hopefully the very end!!).

Sundra's edit has been as someone who is loyal and appreciative. She developed a very strong bond on the Hiki tribe w/ Rebecca, etc. She has commented on what a wonderful experience this has been. She has been the emotional lense for the Aitu tribe (their wins, fears, etc). She was called "golden" by Ozzy. We know from insider though that Candice expected her to jump too. We know that Ozzy perceives his relationship with her tighter than her relationship w/ Yul/Becky and we also know that she did NOT spare her old Hiki friends when she could have. Her edit though did not make her out to be a villian for these things. Knowing that she is not as strong in challenges and that she is not masterminding the votes (though she may have more pull than we've realized) will allow her to do well w/ jaded jurors.

Becky- Becky's first impression (after the tribal mix up) was told to us by Ozzy and then Cowboy. Ozzy described her as a princess, didn't take the time to get to know me, etc. Cowboy saw her as lazy, etc. Becky spends much of her time w/ her alliance.... so is she making impressions on jury members or not? Can she escape the tie to Yul and the impression that "they" took each one down, or did she do it covertly enough that it did not taint her impression... she will be judged by challenges, etc. Ozzy's impression did change after they won their first new aitu reward and spent time together. (she hugged him, etc)

Also I think that showing the jury's reactions is to remind us of the impressions that were made on these people (these are more emotional voters than logical voters so far on the jury) and the feelings (good or bad) that they are holding towards each individual. 3 of the 4 jurors wore their hearts on their sleeve and continue to still be doing so now.


Sorry if this full of typos!! It is late!

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KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings
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12-03-06, 03:33 AM (EST)
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68. "RE: New here.. a quote that I can't get out of my head..."
An excellent well thought out post Rose, welcome to Blows!


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12-04-06, 09:36 AM (EST)
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73. "RE: New here.. a quote that I can't get out of my head..."

rose1974 it is always nice to see people join in with their thoughts and I am looking forward to hearing from you again. I would most certainly agree with your post as interestingly enough, Jeff uttered those words on the very first episode which I found curious at the time since that was not his normal “speak” and they stuck with me. So I agree with your assessment completely as I found what he said “It’s the impressions you make on the other castaways that determine your fate…” on the boat somewhat integral to the outcome.

cantstandsaya - this episode probably was a week where negativity reared its head on virtually every member out there in some fashion although some were clearly negative and others were more or less in support of it. Becky, Yul and Sundra were not shown their opinion with respect to not sharing the fish and although I think that scene may have been more about Jonathan’s edit than anything else, there was a big change in how they reflected Jonathan this past episode. Ozzy’s statement about the fish may have only been included more or less to at least support Jonathan’s rationale especially since Candice WAS the one who left but we can also recall Ozzy’s past “gripe” that he was the provider but there were some people there who did not “deserve” to eat. In any event, the three who did not speak were not tainted with any words as far as that issue.

KO, I’m glad to see you in here I’ve missed reading your thoughts on the musical aspect. You are absolutely correct in being suspicious of Pavarti and, in fact, many of the items you mentioned that involved Pavarti in the past is part and parcel to why I had felt she did have longevity. However, my one sticking point with Pavarti had always been that in light of theme(s) this season, I was not of the mindset that someone whose strategy (so clearly stated also ) was such would be the victor of THIS particular season although her edit did appear to show her much more successful with it than Misty (as the example.) Her “tone” has also been tweaked a bit over the last two episodes and this (as Nathan’s was and as Jonathan’s is presently) has made me suspicious that she may be arriving at her “conclusion” but as Loree suggested, Pavarti could, in fact, be the last of her original tribe which in a sense is a victory of sorts but I do not delve into that as much as those of you who are much better at weekly bootings.

Chez, yes; it is notable that Ozzy’s edit has been lower key of late while Yul’s presence has increased. In light of our past views of screen time, neither of these differences in their face time signal immediate danger. Someone who is “invisible” then gets a disproportionate amount of screen time is suspicious along with the reverse of that. Yul’s editing “turn” is reasonable in light of the events that happened; a lot of it HAD to be shown because of his involvement; other items were certainly manipulated for a reason and Yul has never been that far off our "radar". Ozzy has been highly manipulated throughout this season as well just by sheer virtue of the fact that the less than stellar event of throwing a challenge was very glossed over for Ozzy and, in fact, almost was made to appear as justified.

ag, you make very astute points about Becky and you and I agree that Becky is an intriguing contestant. Again, my thoughts on the scene between her and Yul were that it was certainly intended to cause a reaction by the viewers but I felt it was highly manipulated and therefore what the scene intended may not have been what actually transpired. CutsyTootsy makes a valid point that Becky’s words of “let’s do it again” belies that there may be discord in their relationship. In any event, I have issue with that scene as it was presented. There had been a very heavy emphasis on the Asian culture and “looking out for one another” and so forth that I am hard pressed to not believe there is some impact. I had thought that in some fashion, Becky and Yul would not be able to stay together although I didn’t feel it was necessarily a betrayal of sorts; I had actually questioned whether one of them would fall victim to the idol being used (i.e. perhaps Yul would use it to actually save Becky or need to use it for himself and Becky would be the recieptient of the second highest votes, etc. ) My issue with Becky is that if she is as strategic as it would appear (with the hints dispersed, i.e. “Becky is seriously plotting” along with her very matter of fact announcement that Candice would be exiled coupled with her talk with Yul) I would hope that we would have seen this more if she was the winner. I know that there is argument to be made that this may be another “Danni” scenario but Danni’s edit was quite prominent to me in other aspects and I do not see that with Becky. I had questioned whether Becky may be an extension of Yul’s edit and thus far, I still believe that may be the case.

BR and Michel, thank you for enlightening me with respect to the Insider discussion; the scene makes quite a bit more sense now!

Michel, I enjoyed reading your assessment on the episode as always. I strictly tend to view each episode as what the intent may be so I always enjoy reading those who have opinions on those playing it along with how they feel the players will fare in light of their decisions and I appreciate your response to my question.

emydi, I was looking forward to your assessment on the animal imagery and very much like your take on the flounder! I see you also found the Becky and Yul scene very odd as many have which again, only solidifies for me that this was a very important scene although I am not quite sure it wasn’t for manipulated doubt only.


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tornadoM 1 desperate attention whore postings
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12-04-06, 12:22 PM (EST)
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74. "RE: New here.. a quote that I can't get out of my head..."
Thank you everyone for this wonderful thread.

I'm not a detail-oriented person, so your insights have been invaluable.

With regards to the manipulation of the scene between Becky and Yul running the numbers, it seems to add to doubt about the bond that they have, and tries to get the viewer speculating as to whether one will 'betray' the other. My money's on Becky. Of course, I do also think that Yul is beginning to slip in terms of word-use, starting to make mistakes.

On the other hand, it is a highly manipulated scene. I'd speculate that it was cut out of a longer discussion where they both ran their scenarios, one scenario Becky in F2 while the other scenario with Yul in F2.They could be talking about the possiblity of only one of them going to the final 2, if they factored in the contingency of Ozzy winning the final 3 immunity challenge. The look of 'dawning' on Becky's face is highly telling though. She has been associated with the words Alpha female before...so i think the girl's here to win.

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Velcrohead 33 desperate attention whore postings
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12-04-06, 06:06 PM (EST)
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75. "Episode(s) Thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 12-04-06 AT 06:10 PM (EST)

Real life unfortunately has to intrude from time to time so please forgive my bout of silence. Not that I’ve been slacking off in reading the terrific insights in the interim, so thanks to everyone and an extremely belated well done to michel and emydi for the SOTS as well! And because it cannot be said enough: VS, your blow-by-blow commentary and analysis is a treat.

Since I watched six hours worth in a single sitting, apologies if the content of my ramblings extends beyond the latest episode and ends up an unseemly mishmash of them all.

Beginning at the end, Candice’s boot was largely predictable given the rather transparent attempts to manufacture excitement in the buildup by marking Jonathan as a viable alternative. However, I do think the sentiment of the editing was probably fair, that is to say from Yul’s perspective there was a certain amount of ambivalence as to who should go. Whilst he could readily dismiss the pleas of old Raro on the grounds of their resentment towards Jonathan, he had to give some consideration to murmurs of dissent within his own alliance who weren’t exactly enamoured with his attitude during and after the reward challenge. As we know, in fact, the dislike of Jonathan has been a recurring theme. Previously, the women expressed concerns to the extent Yul himself remarked a few episodes back that though he hadn’t seen any real evidence of Jonathan being untrustworthy, he had to give some credence to the claims of his tribemates.

Given how he was forced on the defensive by Candice at camp and TC when she called him out when attacking Jonathan, I tend to agree that he is showing signs of buckling under the weight of his own expectations. It’s almost as if he’s finding it increasingly difficult to reconcile how he wants to play the game with integrity against the apparent contradiction of needing to practice the darker arts in reality to succeed. I might even say the decision to reveal the hidden immunity idol wasn’t so much strategy as a matter of conscience. Candice, Adam and Parvati appealed to Yul to get rid of Jonathan on those terms - a form of emotional blackmail, if you will - trusting that he, more than anyone else, would “do the right thing.” The subsequent concerns raised by Yul with Becky that he might lose their votes in a final jury vote suggests that his main concern has more to do with the bottom line, yet I wouldn’t be surprised if, on another level, he feels that he’s let those three down, in this particular instance, for a course of action unbecoming of the good guy everybody knows him to be. He’s conflicted and may be unravelling. Another thought: How ironic, then, if Yul loses out in the end, it was because he wasn’t selfish and/or ruthless enough.

Which leads me on to Jonathan. Likening him to a rat is entirely apt – all that scurrying, a creature of opportunity with a spectacular survival rate despite many a fallout. I’ve read with interest the discussion from earlier in the thread as to actual evidence or lack thereof of his untrustworthiness. I’d submit we’ve now reached the point, however manipulated the editing, where it ceases to be relevant. On the back of Jeff Probst’s pre-game comments and continually noted with such prescience from VS, perception can make or break you. In other words, it’s not who you are but who people think you are. So whether it is real or imagined, and whatever his other qualities, Jonathan has become a duplicitous person to those around him. A mere suggestion is often enough in the game, after all, the upshot being that Jonathan won’t win the game based on his edit and can’t because there is no head-to-head vote that could conceivably see him come out on top. It does make him a perfect final two foil, though.

In Becky’s case, I’m still finding it hard to envisage a win if only because of a distinct lack of ‘warmth’ to her edit. It’s not as if she smiles that often, anyway, which makes it all the more surprising that no real effort has been made to soften her up. For example, she was glossed over with the family letters, leaving us with Sundra, Ozzy and Yul to convey the emotions that you’d expect from winning such a challenge. Same thing again in the subsequent local feast reward where we didn’t really get to share in her delight anywhere near as much as the others who won. Any respect the audience may garner for her professional attitude, all-business approach to the game can only be fleeting with such inadequate compensation of her social side – no fun quotient, too few light-hearted moments, no dropping of the guard. As michel noted before, clinical, yes, which may indeed see her last to the end, but without seeing Becky on a more human level that has to be a concern.

I like how Ozzy is at once part of the (erstwhile) Aitu four, but by definition is exclusive. Indeed, be it by design or accident, a lot of what happens with Ozzy at camp is dealt in isolation, as if he’s a willing bedfellow as circumstances demand but is actually very much on his own, waiting for the right time to strike. (that, or we're getting our money shots, an indivdual enhancement of a final triumph) It’s rather odd that any personal conversations he’s had has been with Yul; I don’t recall any alone time with Becky, Sundra or Jonathan, which rather reinforces the previous point. Does this also mean that any allegiance Ozzy has is only to Yul? Also, lest we get the impression everything is sweetness and light with him, one wonders if his snarky tone at TC is a subtle throwback to earlier in the game when he was painted in more irreverent terms?

Sundra has become a wildcard edit. We’ve had troughs and peaks with virtually everyone else in the game, but her character depiction has remained constant – placid, unobtrusive, relatively drama-free but nevertheless there. Is she the game's late bloomer?

I’ll give Adam credit for speaking his mind. (or should that be allowing Candice to articulate his thoughts for him ) ) Though he has shown himself to be confrontational and occasionally brash, there doesn’t to seem be a overwhelmingly negative vibe attached to him that you might expect. He is/was well-liked in his own tribe and the opposition haven’t gone out of their way to bad-mouth him, either. Candice’s departure probably signals Adam’s end in the game by extension. To be scrupulously fair, he has had his moments and wasn’t a bad player overall. Who knows, an immunity run could prolong his stay a bit further yet.

Parvati’s time is almost up, as well. She must feel all her wily charms are for nought. Her allies, or, rather, those ducks (guys ) that she had lined up in a row, are being picked off! Her disgust at Jonathan is as much a manifestation at losing control of a solid position she had created for herself as his apparent betrayal. Maybe she overestimated her allure to all things male. That’s the trouble with adopting a flirting strategy, I suppose - not everyone is going to fall for it.


VH

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architecturegirl 227 desperate attention whore postings
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12-04-06, 09:37 PM (EST)
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76. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 12-04-06 AT 09:58 PM (EST)

Ok, so being an infrequent visitor these last few weeks is going to culminate in one heck of a post here - bear with me guys, I'm going to just put it all out there in one post...

VH - welome back! Its certainly interesting to see what impression the last six weeks leaves as a whole as opposed to separated out. I cant agree to give Adam any credit though, sorry.

VS - I completely agree with you - that scene with Yul and Becky was heavily edited. Honestly, I cant imagine that Yul was actually that stupid, I think it was understood between them that he was simply referring to the fact that you cant 100% determine who you go up against in the final. And well, it would have been FAR more stupid to be prefacing the conversation as figuring out how he could get votes away from HER. But, the important part as we've all noted is what we were intended to take from this conversation - not necessarily how it actually transpired, or how Becky took it in reality. Because how we were intended to view things as opposed to what it was in reality is what these threads are all about analyzing, right.

I'm going to spend quite a bit of time analyzing Yul/Becky since this seems to be the pivotal relationship of the season. What hit me most about that scene was that the editing that we had all been focusing on about "trust" with Yul and Becky has come back. We had sort of left it behind thinking that the mutiny may have resolved that issue (granted, for many of us may not have, but it hasn't really been discussed much since then, so I feel safe saying that it got relegated to a back burner). Obviously based on this scene, the Yul/Becky trust issue has yet to be resolved. I'll reword that, it has yet to materialize in a way that affects the game. What is interesting about the scene is that it is shown as a slip-up on Yul's part with Becky perceiving it, and him not realizing what he said. This is the important part I think.

This leads me to believe that Becky makes a move against Yul. That scene certainly gave an understandable reasoning for that if it happens. If that scene had not happened, we would have a hard time understanding her motive for turning on him, and accepting it (other than those of us that are willing to accept nasty moves because they HAVE to be made to win). Most viewers want a good reason like what was shown. Yul has not been given a reason to turn on Becky - so if he's the one to turn, he'd be a villain. It feels to me like the editors intended for the average viewer to be saying "Oh my god girl, he's not going to take you all the way - do something about that!" Either way - she wins out from that scene. This is interesting since from the beginning Yul has been presented as the survivor "hero".

I like that this could be the devoloping of the chink in Yul's armor - making him a more rounded character, and increasing his winner edit - but I do not like what I stated above that he cant really win from that scene, can he?

Personally, I dont see how Becky could pull off a win if Yul or Ozzy are who she goes up against in the end. There is something about her that really resonates with me though and I do really like her, but I cant figure out a Becky win. Yet I cant dispose of her because in spite of her lack of air time she just seems pivotal to the outcome to me. If she is so pivotal in this game - WHY arent we being shown more of her outside of Yul? Will we see this emerge now after that comment by Yul?

I'm going to put this forward - more than a Danni edit, if Becky wins, its a Tina-type win. She has been subtly shown cultivating relationships while Yul has been the obvious face of the twosome, making all the obvious moves (like Colby was). He gets the game-play respect, but also the flack for any bad moves. Becky is fairly impervious to the flack - yet gets some of the credit for the gameplay since she is obviously right there with him - and several people (Ozzy and Jonathan) have recognized her as a player and the person that they needed to go to to get "in". She would get credit for her strategy - yet win because of her relationships and because she wasn't the face of the dirty work.

I want to go back to the opening credits briefly since their sort of my personal editing niche, and might be beneficial to reference right now. Most of the people that were ruled out by the opening credits have left the game by now. Based on the credits, from the beginning I stated that Ozzy and Becky had the best shot - Ozzy more than Becky. Personally, thats still my feel from the edit of the show.
Sundra is part of the large group still shot-wise (not good), AND Hiki is the tribe shown paddling after the marooning. Both of these are usually fatal.
Jonathan couldnt have been ruled out opeining credits-wise, but I think we all agree he couldnt possibly win against anyone now, could he?
Yul was shown swimming in the opening credits. Opening-credits-wise that is literally the kiss of death. The only argument in his favor here is that of all the survivors, he is the only one shown swimming, and mabye after all these seasons the editors decided to turn that on its head and really screw with us (as we all know, thats ENTIRELY possible). BUT - in survivor water has always been deadly because it puts out your fire - which represents your life. Becky and Ozzy's (and Jonathan's) still shots are on fire. And all survivors shown in the water at the marooning have been chopped, so sorry guys - I dont think Yul wins. I cant see water winning out over fire.
Yul the perfect F3 that we all love, but is too nice to win. Even if its a three person final, I think he loses out - because we have been shown clearly this is a very immature, emotional jury (even if they actually arent, its how they've been portrayed). While some juries may have voted in favor of gameplay, a point has been made to show that this one is far more emotional than logical. If that is how they have been in voting people out, why wouldn't it be how they vote FOR a winner?

Yet, I would bet every penny I own that a strategic player wins this season because the editing has really made fun of the emotional Raros players, and we are being led to root for "gameplay" this season. That leaves us with Jonathan, Yul, Ozzy, and Becky. I've reasoned Yul and Becky to death. Sundra has been shown to be the heart of the Aitu four, but she has not had one moment of true gameplay airtime. Correct me if I'm wrong here. Any time she's been given has been in relation to the excitement for the foursome. We know from Survivor Insider that she had a close relationship and did some scheming with Candice - but on the show we were shown none of that.

Ozzy. Hmmm. We have seen strategy and gameplay from Ozzy, yet we haven't seen too much lately (although we did see the Nathan converstaion). His edit benefited the most from the underdog status. If we look closely at this last episode - Ozzy seems uncomfortable and sort of distant in many of the Aitu 4 scenes. Something is going on here, and I think we're specifically not being shown what. I want to see more strategy from him - but there is a LOT of game left to play.

I also think "the women" play a big role this season. Not an obvious womens alliance necessarily like we've seen before (you know, those ones that always fail), but something is there. I cant quite decide how it will play out - but comments like "its Ozzy and the three women" are worth noting. I dont think it will be a final four of Ozzy, Becky, Sundra, and Parvati, but the women will play a hand, or try to before its all over - and it will be important. Whether it succeeds or backfires on them, we'll see. Based on what we have seen so far, Yul and Ozzy have been made into nearly unbeatable opponents should they make the finals. As I've said in a previous post - the girls have to realize this. Even if Sundra doesnt, Becky CERTAINLY does - have we been given the seeds of her being willing to make a move against Yul now? I could really see those two bonding together to oust the men (this is the best move for both of them).
Plus, we have been shown the girls cultivating relationships with the Raros whereas the men have not. Yes, we HAVE been shown this. It has been subtle - but its definitely there. Especially with Becky. She's been shown quite often with "the girls". In spite of sending her to exile Becky was also shown leaning in toward Candice at camp while the Raros were all talking to Yul (positive body language indicating a good relationship between the two), and we saw her give Candice an affectionate touch of encouragement to the arm as she left for exile (even though SHE sent her there). Adam and Parvati were having a positive conversation with - Becky and Sundra. Becky and Sundra made NO COMMENT about the fish (even if we were made to see Jonathan's side of the argument - there's no way being intimately involved in that whole debacle was good - and Becky and Sundra are the only ones completely untainted by that incident). Ozzy full on egged Jonathan on. That could have been edited out. Becky actually made a little shocked "Oh" face when Jonathan asked "Do I really have to share this fish with them?"
Finally, I think we did see the dreaded confirmation scene that is the editing equivalent of "Not gonna happen" - and that was this episode when they went one step too far with the Aitu affirmation of their being "golden" at the beginning of the episode. Becky was not involved in this conversation, but Ozzy, Sundra and Yul were. One of them isnt "golden". At the least, they're not the final three. All conversation so far has been about the final four though, so I think perhaps one of them doesnt actually make the final four?

Ok, so I'm realizing as I'm going on and on that everything I write is actually giving the reasons for a Becky win that I said I couldn't see. Still, I cant see her not making the final, but my gut says that she cant beat Ozzy or Yul in spite of everything I write.
If I had to lay it all down now, I'd say Becky turns on Yul (yet we've been shown why it would be understandable). Whether it works out in her favor we'll see. If Yul becomes a jury member we've been shown that he can put respect for strategy over emotion, so I think she'd still have his vote. But, I think Ozzy also makes it to the end, and who can beat King Neptune? No one. He is the king after all - and the challenge god.

Finally, a good bye note to Candace. Based on the Early Show, Survivor Insider and Survivor Live - you were apparently a much, much smarter player than the editors led us to believe. But in the end, Survivor is not a dating game. Absolutely fatal move. Romance has no place on survivor. None.

I must say though I LOVED one of things she had to say about Adam (they're not dating now) on Survivor Live "Well, we cant really accuse Adam of thinking, can we? Oh! I didnt mean it that way! I mean, he's a simple guy. Oh, that didnt come out right either". LOL - it came out perfectly Candace.

- Truth be told, I'm not a gambler at all so that "bet every penny I have" comment is not really true if anyone wanted to actually bet me all my money. Not that I have any to begin with.

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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12-04-06, 10:50 PM (EST)
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77. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
First I'd like to welcome to the boards Rose and Tornado. Those were very interesting points you both made. Veruca brings the best out of the show and the best out of posters.

I think there is a correlation between the great opinions expressed and the quality of the episodes lately. The players and the editors leave us a lot to ponder. In that respect, it is great to have you back VH. The women have taken more place in the game but our two seeded players are getting close to the semis!

AG, nice to see your opening credits comments and how they tie to Ozzy and Becky who are still very much in it. (Don't worry if a non-strategic player wins, you bet your pennies not your bills! Anyway, I think you are safe with that bet)

Thank you Emy and Veruca for your kind words. Emy, let me return the compliment and say I loved your "Yul is floundering" comment. Time will tell but I hope Oscar comes back to give us more sparks before the end.

One question: Does that idol ever get played at TC?


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12-05-06, 09:05 AM (EST)
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79. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
Great, great posts and observations by everyone! It's almost too intimidating for me to post my simplistic take on things at this point. As I've noted, I am just watching the show once at face value and going on my gut. To me, it is really getting down to the push comes to shove part of the show. The Raro's are on the defense and are grasping at straws.

In contrast to Ag, I did not see how smart a player Candice really was post game. If she had been patient, she could have outed Ozzy and even perhaps Jonathan, and then teamed back up with the old Raro's after the merge and taken someone out in a real blindside. Just don't see how she could rationalize her actions at all other than for motives that were not related to winning a million dollars....stupid. Her fury at Jonathan to me was more tantrum like...he did not do anything that she had not already done in the game, and he was at a lot less stable place with Aitu than she was...She also knew that Adam did not have the idol but played along with him to the other Raro's that he did...why, oh why, would she do that...she was deferential to a big stupid lump of a guy...just so stupid in my opinion and she had to clearly have been led by her attractions than by any real motivation to win the game, imo.

As for the Raro's, I see them as a bunch of selfish, spoiled brats, that are not there to win the game. I do feel their attempt to blackmail(If you don't get Jonathan out now, we will not vote for you later) Yul is a clever last ditch effort though, as it will certainly influence Yul, and we have seen that it is.

AT this point in the show it seems as if there is alot of speculation regarding winners. Many are dissecting personal edits, but I choose to stick with the theme of the show to make my final predictions. All of the clues that players give in post game interviews are one thing, but I still am sticking with how the producers choose to edit the show. I like sticking with the theme, that I have perceived to be about "the underdog" or "being in the minority". To me the show has edited Ozzy to be their ultimate underdog. We saw how he lost his entire tribe, we saw time and time again how those he chose to align with proceeded to get booted...Cecelia, Cowboy, Flicka, Nathan. He has also shown to be a hero in that he was able to survive elegantly in the wild, climb trees, get coconuts, fish to abundance, and then single handedly win challenges for his tribe. I definately think Ozzy time is coming very shortly and I can't wait to see it.

I think Becky and Yul's alliance does see them through to the end, but in the end, since there will now be three, I think many on the jury may split their votes between them, allowing for the third in the group to win it. Perhaps Becky will turn on Yul, but it will be in her plea to the jury. I do think based on the individuals this game, it could be next to impossible to predict the winner...they are just too darn emotional, immature, and egocentric to appreciate or even recognize great game play when they see it...

I love how Ag brought back the opening credits...definately Yul is in the water and we have never had a winner that was seen in their opening shot in the water...so, if Yul doesn't/can't win, then it must be Ozzy...can not rationalize Becky winning over Yul at this point....my 2 cents.

As to michel's question, I don't think that Yul will use the idol at this point, and it will see him to the F4...

One last thing that I wanted to respond to Ag about was that opening scene that showed Sundra, Yul, and Ozzy hugging after the TC where Nate went, and Yul was stating that they were golden and congrats...to me, Ozzy was so removed from that sentiment...he was there, but clearly he was not on board with Yul and Sundra at that point, imo. Red flags definately came up for me from Ozzy...I do foresee some kind of foreshadowing here where Ozzy will break away some how.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
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12-05-06, 10:31 AM (EST)
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80. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
DRONES! I have missed seeing you in here; so glad you rejoined us I do understand your point of view with respect to Jonathan; the editors have certainly invested so much time into him as someone who would easily be the final two foil for just about anyone there! I then go back to a character like Rupert who took up so much of our camera time and simply then question whether Jonathan is simply a contestant that is too good NOT to be heavily edited. We have talked before about how Jonathan received such a “heavy” villain edit when there was really nothing concrete to establish that, even Jonathan’s confessionals negated that he is dastardly. The turn in his editing last episode I could not ignore as this episode “pushed” the negativity we were supposed to see before where it was finally visible. The emphasis at the auction with his bids and the belching, the commentary made by Yul, Sundra and Becky (the “good” tribe) about Jonathan (we’ve had a few sparse comments made by them before but this was much more enforced) and so forth.

I do at times attempt to be logical (not very often as my flair for the illogical shows) but sometimes I will concede logic dictates and that Yul IS a logical player so I question the emphasis on his discussion with Pavarti, Adam and Candice and their strong arming him about their jury votes coupled with Yul and Becky’s conversation about the potential repercussions of keeping Jonathan over the former Raro that it would not surprise me in the slightest should Yul feel the need to let Jonathan leave.

As for my being “illogical” with my penchant for the dramatic flair, I recall the episode where we had the "boot feast" where the winning tribe watched the second TC. Jeff's words stated "you'll then move to the jury section..." I had noted Jonathan was then shown and questioned if this was prophetic as I believe the word "jury" was mentioned for the first time this season at that time. Couple that with how prophetic Jonathan’s first episode words may be ”....this is Survivor and someone is gonna win a million dollars and they are gonna have to "...cut the throat of the guy next to him at some point” perhaps coming to fruition on the episode that we see Yul talk about having to “play Godfather?” Again, I am not one for weekly eliminations but I could not resist in light of the parallels of these statements (Yul and Jonathan “taking on Nate” certainly was prophetic!)

VH, I have also missed you here as well There is still a lot to talk about so better late than never I agree with your statement regarding Jonathan that we are now at the point that it would appear this “villain focus’ is no longer relevant hence my response to DRONES commentary. As much as I would enjoy seeing Jonathan in the final two (if only because the edit for him in the game itself has been entertaining; one can only imagine the fireworks if he had to face the jury) I also agree with Becky’s assessment as I also felt something was a bit lacking for her.

ag - I completely see how the comparison of Tina may be made to Becky with respect to a low key strategy but I still find something “off” with her edit in this particular season. However, I certainly have had “radar” issues and as stubborn as I am, once my hooks get into something, I am much like a dog with a bone Your opening credit analysis is always a treat to read and one never knows what clues are utilized to tell the outcome. I see your point with respect to the conversation Yul and Becky had; the aura of “trust” has been prevalent for these two although this may end up being what Cowboy offered about this culture “look out for each other” We will see if this is irony or prophetic as it is stated.

tornadoM, thank you for posting your thoughts. I see that this scene with Yul and Becky is certainly cause for water cooler talk Only in hindsight will we truly know the reason why this season was featured. My own opinion is that the scene has done what it was intended to do; instill doubt in Becky and Yul along with questioning Yul’s rationale for speaking about jury votes to someone who is also playing the game. As to whether this is a smokescreen effect solely to create a doubt or it is foreshadowing, we will find out at some point regardless. I’m of the mind set right now that this was the former but I’ve been known to be wrong

FP, I always enjoy your commentary and by no means is it “simplistic” and I agree with you one hundred percent that the ultimate outcome revolves around the themes as I tend to select the long term players by that same notion so I’m happy to be in good company “Underdog” is most definitely a theme of this show although I am still debating if that would not just be a sub theme for the progression of the show itself yet it certainly was one of the most important ones there was! You have very valid points in your choice. I note you said “three” at the end; I may have overlooked a post in that regard and I don’t keep up with articles and the like. I take it that there will be three sitting at the end in this particular season? Interesting idea and I can understand the rationale behind in light of the season’s makeup. Ah, Raro has certainly elicited a response from you; the editing has done a wonderful job. Eliciting strong opinions is the basis for this show to help understand the outcome. I note your observation about Ozzy’s removal in that particular scene with Yul and Sundra and potential foreshadowing of his “breaking away” Perhaps the “machete” chop featuring Becky earlier on may come to fruition (I can never quite let go of those visuals can I?) I see we have a true fan of Ozzy in your posting; the show is always that much better when there are contestants that *we* truly root for the victory

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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12-05-06, 12:36 PM (EST)
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81. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
I'm sorry, VS, I should have noted my reference of the F3. I do not consider it to be "spoiler information" as it is now confirmed. Mark Burnett was quoted in an article in TV Guide regarding the final episode and ending of Survivor. I think it is on news stands now, as it is the TV Guide issue for next week. (Thus moving into the common knowledge realm) Mark Burnett noted in his interview that there will be an F3, and thus a possibility of a three way tie, and instead of the usual jury of seven, there will be a jury of 9. We do have a thread on it here in Spoilers at Blows titled, F3 Confirmed, by our dear forehead.

So, I do think that an F3 instead of the usual F2 certainly changes the game in a big way! To me it's a way that EPMB can get the popular, often most deserving from his vantage point, or perhaps the audience's vantage point, to have another chance at actually winning the game. It will be interesting to see how they choose to end S14.


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architecturegirl 227 desperate attention whore postings
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12-05-06, 11:49 PM (EST)
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82. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
LAST EDITED ON 12-05-06 AT 11:59 PM (EST)

LAST EDITED ON 12-05-06 AT 11:56 PM (EST)

Thanks FP - I had been hesitant to say anything about the F3 even though Mark Burnett confirmed it - but thats the main reason I just cant see Becky winning this season. I could see scenarios of her winning at F2, but not with three. Up against Ozzy I cant see her winning - and if Yul is there, they'll share votes no matter who else is there. So her odds of winning are greatly reduced with a final three. One note though - I think they find out at F5, not F4 - Burnett said "Three are exited about it because it gives them more chances. Two are not." Becky is definitely one of those "two are not". I think the other one is either Yul or Sundra. I put Sundra here because - both becky and sundra's best chances are against each other or Jonathan. If Adam is one of those F5 - he has a LOT of friends on the jury, so you just cant go up against him - and Yul and Ozzy are hard to beat.
Its probably Yul and Becky that are upset, but Sundra should be upset about it in my mind. But hey, thats in my mind - and its an odd place. ;oP
VS - you're likely right when it comes to Becky. Honestly as sad as it is - my stubbornly liking a character has not come to any fruition since Chris of Vanuatu - and I was just an "average viewer" back then. My liking a character could actually be a bit of a jinon amazing race as well sadly...). Sorry Cindy, Sally kneesocks, Dustin & Kandice, and MOJO...and maybe sorry to Becky?

ETA - FP, we're on exactly the same page with Ozzy in that opening scene, thats and one or two other scenes this episode are what I was referring to about Ozzy being "distant". His facial expressions and body language just seemed REALLY uncomfortable. Like he was there, but didnt really want to be. Perhaps Yul has some serious troubles coming his way from Ozzy and Becky, neither of which are going to simply sit back and let Yul win, no matter what he thinks.

OH! And I almost forgot - Yul's "godfather" reference - no one has talked about that yet! (that I've noticed) who else compared his time on survivor with the godfather? Rob Mariano. Who won? Not him - his "girl". I get qualms for Yul with that comment - it screams "Overconfident". And well, it didnt turn out too well for Boston Rob. Maybe it will for a nicer godfather.

ETA2: Too funny, had to add - Who ever expected that the same player would be dubbed "The UN" and "The Godfather" in the same episode? LOL! Ok, I'll admit, its been a LONG day...I'm somewhat delirious and enjoying some wine whilst posting.

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architecturegirl 227 desperate attention whore postings
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12-06-06, 00:03 AM (EST)
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83. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
Ok, no more combining wine and posting for me - apparently it results in many typos and an extreme overuse of happy faces. Sorry guys...

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12-06-06, 11:37 AM (EST)
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85. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
I think they find out at F5, not F4 - Burnett said "Three are exited about it because it gives them more chances. Two are not." Becky is definitely one of those "two are not".

AG, this is the quote from the TV Guide article:

So how do the surviving quartet react to the news that three will be headed to the final tribal council? "The reaction is mixed," says host Jeff Probst. "A couple are excited because it gives them an extra shot, but for the other two, there is a sense of dread--they realize their strategy won't work."


Blowin' the blues away, courtesy of tribephyl

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DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings
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12-06-06, 02:19 AM (EST)
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84. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
It's good to be back. I haven't had the time to post but have been keeping up with this thread, and this thread only, here at SB.

I see that FP mentioned an underdog theme and that has been one that has stuck with me as well, althoug it might be a sub theme, though it is hard to tell as Jeff highlighted Jonathan as the underdog at TC. Not an exact quote from Jeff but the general gist, "So let me get this straight, there seems to be 3 groups here C/A/P, Y/B/O/S and Jonathan is on his own.

VS, you mention Rupert, and I did consider him as I viewed him as more of a character edit rather than a player edit, along the lines of Cowboy. I mostly based my observation on how he is the topic of much conversation in regards to game play. Most of the negative talk about Jonathan has been about how he is playing the game and can't be trusted, not that he isn't trustworthy person.

Ozzy is the type of player that is meant for the survival part of this game. My question is can he play the social part. He seems to constantly be aligning himself with the wrong people when given a choice. He made a huge mistake early in this game when his tribe(his idea) threw an IC in order to go to TC to get rid of a member. This sort of move has never set well with me and for some reason I can't seem to forget this act. He has redeemed himself, but is it enough?

The sub-plot of trust between Becky and Yul is an interesting dynamic and one that was emphasized as cultural by Cowboy. Like you VS, I'm not sure if that statement will come to fruition or is irony.


DRONES

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
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12-06-06, 11:52 AM (EST)
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86. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
ag - you sound like you had a very nice time while you were writing lol. Regardless if with drink or not your posts are entertaining and informative. Thank you and FP for the explanation regarding the three contestant scenario. It has no bearing on how I watch the show (as does the Insider commentary) so please don't feel any concern about posting it. Long term players and end game players have been *determined* long before this information and my thoughts on the end game would not change regardless.

I assume there was not much discussion regarding Yul's feelings of playing Godfather in light of the fact that it would be the upcoming episode he utters it. ag you have an interesting take on that scenario as perhaps encompassing what happens with Yul in his overall standing. I was more or less considering it to be a situational outcome (in light of how some statements made by contestants and/or Jeff end up to be true) and since Jonathan uttered a very memorable confessional in the first episode about (paraphrased) "someone will have to cut another's throat" it came to mind with Yul's reference to playing Godfather but as you know I try not to delve into weekly eliminations. It IS quite funny also to hear this and also be referred to as the UN

DRONES, any additions from you are a pleasure I understand your thoughts on Jonathan; he has been a very contradictory edit. Many items told to us do not necessarily get backed up. Whether Jonathan is simply an individual that Mark Burnett and company enjoyed tremendously and doing a service to him with his edit OR it is meant for something else, we will know later.

It is interesting to note that although Ozzy was heard from BEFORE mentioning Jonathan's negativity (in the conversation with Yul prior to the merger) we didn't hear anything from him this past episode about Jonathan and his feelings about him on the negative side when pretty much everyone joined in on the fun. Yul was probably the lesser of the rest but we did hear him agree with Becky and Sundra on Jonathan's personality (Frankly I discount anything he said to Pavarti, Adam and Candice as it would have been less than sensible if he DIDN'T agree with them) and we also did see Yul supporting Jonathan in advising us that he believed Jonathan to be sincere when he told him he would vote with them. Jonathan also mentioned "Something is up; I think Pavarti and Adam have gotten in the girls’ ear and I just don’t know to what degree that it really worked." I can understand his not including Yul as his belief in Yul appears firm but nothing about Ozzy's ear?

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DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings
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12-06-06, 11:21 PM (EST)
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87. "RE: Episode(s) Thoughts"
Excellent VS. I forgot about Jonathans comment in regards to C/A/P talking to the girls. Ozzy being left out is curious, although may have been already answered when he, along with Flicka and Cowboy ended up on the Aitu beach when they went exploring several episodes back. The general concensous was that these were the last three they wanted to see wander onto their beach, with an emphasis on Ozzy. It's those statements that give me pause about Ozzy's place in his tribe. I think to the spoiling community it is no secret that Ozzy's place in his tribe is flimsy at best, but maybe not so obvious to the general viewing audiance.

This whole Becky, Yul relationship has me very intrigued. It's even more titilating when you add in the Asian cultural refrence by Cowboy. Yul has already told us that their relationship is one of brother and sister. We know, from shows past, that these relationships don't last when they are so well defined. I think the set up is for one of our classic "shocking moments" that we always are given in the previews. Not really a matter of if, but when is it going to happen, and who is going to do the dirty deed. My money is on Yul. He made the brother sister comment. Jeff refered to him as the UN. He's also been called the puppet master and the peacemaker. EPMB likes to set these things up such that it is a shocking move. Fun, fun, fun.

DRONES

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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12-10-06, 02:54 PM (EST)
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88. "Episode # 12 Thoughts"
Lets get "Survivor Week" started:

The full moon rises to fill the orbit of the skull’s empty eye, the crabs are crawling on the beach, Yul is patting Jonathan on the back as they returned from Tribal Council. That told us we were in for a strange episode, one in which we saw:
The man left out in the Cold

The fall of Jonathan had been set in motion during the last episode when Parvati noticed a crack in the alliance. It had been clearly stated by Jeff that we now had a twosome, a foursome and Jonathan.

The sequence at the start of Day 31 was important. It was about Parvati’s injury but it served to make her more friendly to the viewers now that the episodes had to be edited from a different point of view. Her reply to Jeff about her injury was: “Thumb’s up! I pulled the old ‘use the machete to slice you thumb’ trick.” It served as introduction to the challenge. For the first time since we had the two tribes of 9, Jonathan wasn’t our eyes anymore. Raro’s lazyness and Aitu’s golden image were no longer necessary to the story and the change started by Parvati’s clumsy work injury! This episode had a more balanced point of view, many players acting as narrators rather than Jonathan getting to tell the story as he saw it.

The reward challenge was Parvati’s moment to shine. It gave her an occasion to get revenge on Jonathan. She sent him to Exile Island without hesitation, seemingly surprising Stacy with her rancor. The twist of having her father pick the ones to share the reward could have been designed to protect feelings in the game but it deprived us of seeing her strategizing. Who would she have picked besides Adam? As it was, maybe her father made the best choices!

Parvati had a confessional to tell us that: “I needed it…It showed me that I’m still in this game and I still have a fighting chance.” She proceeded to give her father a tour of the camp, their “living room” she said.

During the Mitiaro celebration, which was “Incredible…Fabulous”, we saw Parvati and Sundra bonding but with very little strategy talk. Either it was hidden and that would be a good sign (We saw Dave’s, Amy’s and Gary’s failed attempts at using a reward to make progress as examples) or Parvati was true to her word of not being pushy. All we heard about the game were these words: “We have to beat Jonathan tomorrow. That is our goal for the rest of the time we’re here. We just have to beat him” As she spoke, Sundra was shown agreeing and she said: “Without Jonathan, Adam and Parvati are much more chilled out.” Deals aren’t always hard to make!

Parvati had a nice confessional during the excursion: “The religious ceremony…I was so grateful that it was part of the reward. It was a once in a lifetime thing that happened.”

Aitu’s arrogance had been revealed a little more before the trio returned as Ozzy, Becky and Yul hurried to hide the food from “the enemy.” I don’t know who had the idea to bring bagfuls of food but Adam and Parvati had the bags while Sundra wasn’t seen with a bag. It changed the mood in camp. That scene proved once more that the way to a Survivor’s vote is through his stomach. Parvati and Adam won some points with the meatloaf, chicken and corn!

Parvati was shown to be hesitant in the immunity challenge, only taking the risk to run over the barrels after Jeff told them to attack the course. She was the first woman back with a bundle if that matters at this point. Along with Adam, she raised her hand when Jeff asked who felt concerned by the vote. Jonathan was shown smiling at the question. Back from the challenge, she wasn’t in danger and not really shown having to negotiate. We only saw her smiling to Yul. She had infiltrated the outer core of the alliance without being pushy.

She was the one to tell Jeff about their reward and she talked of spending time with her father, how she felt the parents’ pride at what they were doing and the warmth of the celebration by the villagers. She was given airtime to explain that the decision of sending Jonathan to exile Island was part of her strategy. It was “to keep myself in the game as long as possible. I’m hoping they’ll see how life is better without him and keep me and Adam.” All the viewers knew at once she’d be sending him but it is always better for the player’s outcome to have a chance to explain an action.

It is also a good sign when a player is shown to be successful in their planned moves. Winning the reward was key to making inroads but the editors had showed her talking about the crack in the alliance and how she would proceed from there. Even if it was a shared decision, Parvati was given more of the credit for the “kill”. Is her improved showing enough to say it is an investment in her future? I don’t have enough confidence to say that she has a shot at the final win despite the good visual indications we’ve had throughout the season. Still, she only needs one more boot to go her way to have a chance

Ozzy returned to our screen to be seen as having a good time trying to win the challenge with his mom. Back in camp, we saw him and Becky standing back during the visitors’ tour.
-“It’s kind of annoying to have the camp overun by the competitors’ family. Parvati and Adam depend on the food that we provide them. So I feel responsible for helping them be strong so that they could win the challenge” he confided. He wasn’t in a happy mood as his expression revealed.

Once alone in camp with Yul and Becky, he first proposed to force “the enemy”, which included Jonathan, to work for their meals: “If you can’t get your own food, maybe you don’t deserve to be here” he rationalized. The problem could be that what they showed was them throwing away coconuts after we had seen Parvati painfully doing her share of the work with those coconuts. Seeing them hiding fish would have been more forgivable somehow.

The immunity challenge was right up his alley and the smile we saw on his face as the rules were explained showed his confidence. Yul gave him some opposition but it was never really close. With immunity in their camp, Aitu was free to consider all options. He was only shown to agree with Yul about the booting strategy. At TC Jeff asked him if life at camp was nicer without Jonathan. “Sure” was his quick reply which drew a smile from Nathan. He added that “Jonathan has a strong personality and sometimes it’s hard to be around.” That pleased Candice immensely.

Ozzy has played his role, now the mischievous Oscar seems to be returning to the scene for the stretch run.We could be in for more excitement! Ozzy seems destined to face the jury but we can’t determine yet if he will be perceived as King Neptune, the hero of the season, or Oscar, the miscreant! It is an indication of the richness of his story that he can still be both.

Yul continued to get some negative points from the editors: In the recap, Jeff said: “In the end Yul stuck with Jonathan even if all Aitu voted Candice. In the opening sequence, he was shown patting Jonathan on the back, unknowingly setting the double agent’s fall for all the student of “EPMB’s Theories in Irony”. He was Jonathan’s only ally, only hope in the game. The unceremonious way Jonathan was ditched in this episode cannot reflect too well on the diplomat’s image.

He was left out of Parvati’s injury scene, not heard expressing any compassion or seen offering help even if he was right next to her when the medics arrived. His moment with his brother was reduced to a minimum. Jeff only once mentioned that they were having no luck. The embrace he gave Jonathan before the author left for exile probably showed Parvati’s father who not to choose.

Once the winners had left for the reward, Yul said he was happy to be alone in camp with Becky and Ozzy and “Imagine how it’s going to be in the final couple of days.” “Exactly” answered Becky. Will these three only be able to imagine being together? It would fit long established editing patterns that at least one of them woul not be there. He agreed with Becky and Ozzy, saying: “Maybe we should just hide the food for a couple of days.” He then calmly explained why starving the opposition could be an acceptable strategy. We are used to Ozzy’s impetuous ways and probably can forgive them. For Yul, it is a new blemish on a record that was spotless 2 episodes ago.

Not needing immunity as they had enough targets to go around, his challenge performance seemed to be a way to gauge Ozzy’s abilities. Yul didn’t look completely over-matched but it is another challenge that showed the problems caused by “Dolphin Boy.”

Back in camp, Yul felt like “The Godfather, arranging a hit on someone.” He still had to appease a worried Jonathan. He told Jonathan that he’d do everything he could to save him yet we saw no effort at all. All we saw was Yul talking with Ozzy about needing to take Jon and Adam out before Final 5, that the girls are still strong and that the four is set.

At TC, he corrected Jeff’s comment that Jonathan saved the Aitu4: “We saved each other. We had to make moves because we were desperate. Now the Aitutaki4 are in control.” He then voted against Jonathan where many players had thrown votes away in respect of an ally.

Is the change in edit for Yul a way to make us doubt and to add dimensions to his story? Since this elimination wasn’t to his advantage, it puts more in doubt his role as the puppetmaster. However, we cannot forget that he would be a formidable opponent in front of a jury and very little time remains to deprive him of the opportunity. Final 6 is almost the last occasion for a variation of “Plan Voodoo.” Strangely, a plan to get rid of the idol is harder with two allies in the minority. Yul may have been saved by having booted Jonathan.

In a change of roles, Becky was the one that told us about the feelings in the Aitu camp. It wasn’t all smiles and camaraderie as it was when Sundra gave her sugar-coated confessionals. However, it did start with a positive image as she showed compassion for the wounded Parvati and took charge of the situation before the medical team arrived.

The reward challenge didn’t show us anything new, Jeff let us know that she was trailing and she never came close to winning. Back in camp, she enthusiastically agreed with Ozzy’s plan to hide the food and later was the one that told us how poorly they felt when the winners, like “Santa Claus”, returned with food for everyone. “The original plan with Ozzy and myself and obviously Yul was…to hide the food for later. Seeing Adam and Parvati bring back so much food, we felt bad. The hiding plan is on the outs.” She added: “We are more chilled out with us 6 without Jonathan. It’s nice that he is on exile right now.”

After the challenge, she was the one that showed how everyone felt about the double agent. The 6 had been laughing and eating coconuts when Jonathan walked in. The music changed, became ominous while the cameras showed all 6 players falling silent. When Jonathan asked Becky: “How’s your sister?” She barely answered him, only slightly nodding. She also ignored him when Jonathan followed her and Sundra in the jungle to see if the plan had changed. Something was afoot! The cold breeze that hit Jonathan was illustrated by Becky’s cold demeanor .

We had rarely seen emotions from her outside of the challenge wins and the respect she has for Yul so this is a positive sign. Once more however, she didn’t figure in the TC discussion. We still have reasons to see her reaching the end but not winning.

Sundra let Becky tell us how it felt in Aitutonga’s camp but she didn’t completely lose her narrator’s role. She had a very emotional moment with her mother after Jeff had commented that she was so anxious, she was running.

She was seen working with her mother, retrieving wood. “I could get into this” said Janet. “Yes…for a day” joked Sundra. They had a good time together, something that Sundra said her mother would never have had in her life and something that couldn’t be described.

Later, she told us how the excursion to Mitiaro went: “It was amazing…It was like a little piece of heaven dropped just by the side of the road”…“The world is getting much smaller, it would benefit us if we take the time to learn about somebody else.” Those were powerful statements in this social experiment that is Survivor 13.

She was walking behind Becky as Jonathan tried to get an answer about the “plan.” His words of people being “terrible liars” had to apply to her and Becky as she answered his “Is it Adam tonight?” with a terse “Isn’t that what we said?”

It was day 33 and we still haven’t had a negative word said about her. On the other hand, we haven’t heard a single individual strategy talk from her either. Can a Survivor be shown winning without using any strategy? I’d be very surprised if she were to win without being shown to make a single move.

Adam first talked about how the sight of Parvati’s injury made him feel uncomfortable. He also told us that, “Now, it is Parvati and me against the world” changing perhaps who should be viewed as the underdogs.

At the Reward, he didn’t quite obey Jeff’s order that the Survivors couldn’t help Mike in choosing the parents to share the reward. He was practically jumping out of his sneakers with his arms wrapped over his head, “not” trying to attract attention! He then had a nice confessional explaining his close friendship with his father. We then heard George telling Adam how proud he was.

For a guy who will need some challenge wins to stay in the game, his IC showing had to be troubling. He was nowhere near Ozzy and Yul in this water challenge. Luckily, this time, the only defense he needed to stay was to tell Yul had used great strategy to get Jonathan’s vote but he doesn’t need to be there anymore.

At TC, he showed the venom he has for the double agent, repeating that Jonathan didn’t deserve to be there, forcing an angry reply from Jonathan. In the end, the strategy worked as Aitutonga voted to keep the harmony that the camp had experienced while the author was in exile. Adam received a silent “Good Job” from his Survivor girlfriend.

In Insider,Yul said he learned to appreciate Adam and Parvati and that all the negative things he thought about them had been influenced by what Jonathan had told him. This shows just how much the season had been edited from Jonathan’s point of view. Even if the point of view is now alternating between different players , it seems a little late to rehabilitate Adam. He had much further to go than Parvati who had a much better showing before the mutiny. Remember his shelter comments at the start!

Jonathan monopolized the discussion and the strategy this season. His histrionics made for many fun episodes even if he had painted himself in a corner. Episodes 3 to 12 of Survivor 13 were heavily portrayed as Jonathan’s adventures!

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mysticjay 28 desperate attention whore postings
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12-11-06, 10:54 AM (EST)
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89. "RE: Episode # 12 Thoughts"
I wrote up the following before I read your thoughts, having gleaned from long time posters here that the impressions we are left with from the show should be recorded, before letting the thughts of others come into play. So here goes what I saw and felt from the editing of the show...

The phrase that came to mind after watching this episode is the emergence of Ozzie and a spike for Parvati so I think she is next to go. We saw and heard a lot about her. She got what she wanted with Jonathan’s ouster. She had the reward that was an opportunity of a lifetime, and her story is probably done.

Ozzie, on the other hand, is having his role expand. He has been coming forward in recent weeks. I’ve noticed him in the background a lot, often with Sundra. Holding her hand. His big issue seems to be food and competition. Who gets to eat what he catches. Not wanting to feed people so they are strong in challenges and beat him. Hiding the coconuts.

When Parvati cut her finger, we heard someone say “we have an issue guys” referring to the cut, but the visual was only of Ozzie coming back to camp with fish.

Ozzie was also featured prominently in the RC, shown several times as the loved ones of others were brought in. And when his mother came, there was a very emotional close-up and we could hear him saying “it’s so good to see you.” We are supposed to like him, and the scenes of him smiling, seeming vulnerable, are meant to temper some of his more ruthless scenes.

There was a long scene showing Ozzie & Becky standing watching the three survivors and their loved ones at camp. He looked sad, but in his confessional he is saying “It’s kind of annoying to have the camp being overrun with competitor’s family. Paverti & Adam depend upon the food we provide them, so I almost feel responsible for helping them be strong enough to win that challenge.

We see a shot of camp & boat is coming. I noticed the first time I watched that the camera angle showed that there were a lot of coconuts in camp.

The editing made it seem like the talk about camp food began before the boat was pulling away. We see Ozzie in foreground, facing camera, w/Yul, talking about what food they have. Ozzie looking like he is watching the boat leave. Ozzie says he’ll go fishing. Another shot of boat pulling away.

Ozzie is shown, then camera pans to Yul saying “I’m glad we have this day together.,.. Imagine what this would be like in the final couple of days. “

The reward itself gave me two impressions. Parvati was shown alot, often leading the group. And we saw no talk among the three of strategy, just the comment by Sundra that Adam and Parvarti were more relaxed without Jonathan around. That supported what happened at Tribal Council, and made me think that Sundra squandered an opportunity to sow seeds for the future, and that A & P either didn’t take the time to try to talk strategy with her, or it comes to nothing so not worth showing.

Back at Aitutonga – a gull shown flying. Ozzie brings up to Yul & Becky what should we do about the food. I think we should do something. Yul says you mean hide it? Ozzie says he can’t keep feeding Adam & Parvati and have them win.

Becky says something about feeding your enemies

Ozzie says it’s like digging your own grave and Becky says oh I understand. Ozzie is eating all during this. The impression I had was that he is always thinking. That Becky has a streak of the mercenary as well, and that Yul goes along to keep the peace.

Yuls says maybe we should just hide the food for a couple of days. Yul has a confessional that Ozzie catches most of their food. A & P keep wining these challenges. At this point they have tentatively decided to keep on catching food but maybe hide some of it from A. & P.

Ozzie says throw the coconuts in the woods. Becky agrees.

Ozzie voiceover “Now is a key, pivotal moment, and I don’t want to feed people that beat me.” For A, P, & J, no more coconuts. They can go get their own.” Final scene of him tossing coconuts into the woods.

Boat returns. Nice greeting.

Ozzie voice over “ This is a survival game. The issue is having an upper edge in the game. And not feeding someone so that they can beat me. Adam is the biggest guy and he eats the most.”. Cut to confessional – “So the less food he eats the more drained he gets”.

Scene of Yul talking to Adam, with Ozzie looking on and voiceover. “If you can’t get your own food at this point, maybe you shouldn’t be in the game.”

Ozzie is playing a different game on the inside than he has shown on the outside. It is now coming out..

Adam asked if they ate anything today. Yul, with Ozzie shown smiling, says Ozzie tried to go out but the currents were rough.

Adam said we have extra food and pulls out corn, biscuits, etc.

Becky narrates that the original plan for “Ozzie and myself, and also Yul”, was to hide the coconuts, hide the food, save it for later. But after we saw that A & P brought back so much food, we felt sort of bad, so I think the food-hiding plan is on the outs.”

We do not hear Ozzie say that.

At the IC, as Jeff talks about 1 in 6 chance, Adam is shown, and when Jeff says of ‘winning the million dollar check” Ozzie is shown bouncing up and down with excitement.

“Ozzie leading the pack”, he’s first to the platform. Long visuals of Ozzie “making quick work of this course. Not hesitating. “

Shot of Ozzie going back, meeting Yul, then moving past him. More Ozzie getting past people.

‘Ozzie having no trouble”. Jeff describes how each is doing, while “Ozzie is getting ready to lap them”.

Down to Ozzie and Yule. Who will get their pole together first. Whose will be strong enough to work.

Ozzie with his first ring. Ozzie doing it all with the pole. Ozzie very close. Ozzie wins immunity. Jonathan clapping as Ozzie gets necklace, smiling.

One of the most telling scenes was of Yul & Ozzie talking strategy, Ozzie is facing camera. “Once we get down to 5, I don’t’ want Jonathan or Adam there. Because they could win.”

Ozzie confessional. It’s either J or A, because they seem to be the biggest competitors right now. It’s really hard to pick which one is worse.

Ozzie says as long as the girls will stay cool.
Yul says the girls will stay strong.
Ozzie – I think they will
Yul – I think we are set
O – we are set, we just have to
Y – I think the final 4 is, pretty much, as long as nobody does something crazy, we are there.

Ozzie looks away. We are meant to wonder if Ozzie will “do something crazy”.

We saw Ozzie come forward, about the food, scheming to deprive those who don’t work for it, telling Yul who he wanted gone and when. He is now in a much stronger position, and we were told that visually in this episode.

I was left feeling, as I was meant to, that Ozzie could make a move against Yul, that he isn’t going to settle for 4th or 3rd if he can help it.

Yul is being shown deferring to others, taking the appeals from P & A, and Jonathan, but letting Ozzie and Becky dictate the decisions. I hope the last episodes bear out the story being told. This is one of the most interesting seasons in recent years!

Mysticjay

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DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings
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12-12-06, 00:10 AM (EST)
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90. "RE: Episode # 12 Thoughts"
I sure did mess up on that one I truely believed that Jonathan was destined for f3. In the end, as was mentioned by VS, he was more of a character who's face time was dictated by circumstances ie the extreme dislike that many had for him.

The editing from the very beginning of this episode told us that Jonathan was going home. Everyone wanted him gone and the tension was palpable, even when Jonathan was talking to Becky and Sundra. The only person who shown with trepidation
was Yul. The visuals of Yul and Jonathan at RC where put there for two reason. 1. To show that Yul was still close to Jonathan. Was Yul the Godfather? He hugs Jonathan and then later votes him out. I always had my doubts that Yul would be able to do the dirty work that is involved in this game. Was this move a prelude of what is to come between Yul and Becky? 2. To soften up Jonathan for his eventual ouster. This is typical of EPMB editing when a player is about to get booted, especially when the player is universally disliked.

We got a full dose of Ozzy for the first time in a long time. He didn't care who was going this episode, so long as it was either J or A, because they are threats. Finally a little look into his thought process. It was enough to tease up without revealing how he wanted the end game to play out. I didn't find it hard to believe that it was Ozzy's idea to hide food, but I did find it odd that he would include Jonathan along with the obvious J/A. From everything we have seen Jonathan was a hard worker who helped provide his fair share of food for the group. I'm really not sure why EPMB choose to show this and would be interested to read others thoughts. Perhaps it was meant to show the type of cutthroat game Ozzy was willing to play.

Parvati was shown enjoying her reward and talking about how much better things would be w/o Jonathan. Other than that there was nothing much else to her story besides fluff. She's lazy and that was again put out there, perhaps to justify her boot. We have been shown that she is developing a relationship with Sundra and Ozzy(remember that Ozzy mentioned J and A as the next 2 that need to go but no mention of her). She is shown to be a more dangerous player than Adam. I'm still not sure where she will end up in this game but her relationship building could not have been lost on Yul and Becky.

Sundra and Becky continue to be largely UTR. They both have been non factors in individual reward and immunity challenges. Obviously they both have something going for them to be in the game this long. For Becky it's Yul. What about Sundra? They both have yet to play a role, but will that be as fodder, pawns or will they have a bigger role. IMO, Becky's role will have more of an impact than that of Sundra.

Last but not least is Yul. His edit continues to be steady. To me that is one of the hallmarks of a winners edit. If he has made any mistakes it may have been this week when he got rid of Jonathan. Voting out Jonathan was not his decision. This is one of those time in the game when the decision was taken out of his hands due to circumstances. Although he was conflicted he didn't seem overly broken up about the decision.

DRONES

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CTgirl 7907 desperate attention whore postings
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12-12-06, 07:20 AM (EST)
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91. "RE: Episode # 12 Thoughts"
The Survivor editing thread is my favorite read here. I enjoy reading what everyone has to say about the editing and I look forward each week to Veruca’s and Michel’s in-depth analysis. After watching the last episode, something struck me about the editing. Because Jonathan has had the lion’s share of attention for so long and it was finally his boot episode, everyone else was edited very evenly. I didn’t “love” or “hate” any of them. We saw new sides to several of the players. Usually one player’s edit changes for better or for worse depending on their story arc. This time 3 of the 4 Aitus were featured differently. I was a bit disappointed in Yul and Ozzy this week (they have been two of my favorites this season); we saw a softer side to Becky and Adam was shown in the most positive light all season. Parvati’s editing returned to her upbeat and friendly side and Sundra’s remained the same. Usually at this point in the game, I have clear favorites and/or dislikes (and I still do), but in this episode, they struck me differently.

We see that Yul is a nice guy. He hugged Jonathan at the reward challenge, he hugged Ozzy after he won immunity, but all his spoken words were analytical and wooden. He commented to Ozzy and Becky that this is “what it would be like in the final…couple of days.” (I thought he was going to say final three but then amended it.) I was shocked that he thought hiding the food was a good idea (not what a diplomat would do!) At tribal when he said,” Aitutaki4 are in control of the game, to the extent that I have the HII. I have a lot of influence with that.” Yul is getting overconfident. All I could think of was the proverb, “pride goeth before a fall.”

Ozzy is getting an incredibly positive edit considering he has a brash, arrogant, in-your-face side. We rarely see it. I love his challenge skills, he’s a beautiful swimmer and you have to love a guy who starts to cry at the thought of seeing a family member. But he was the instigator behind not feeding Adam and Parvati. He was obnoxious talking about the IC, “it was hilarious, some people just eating it all over the place.” I like Michel’s observation that it’s “Ozzy versus Oscar,” and mysticjay outlined how Ozzy’s character is emerging. He definitely has two sides to him (but that also means he is the most developed character out there). He is a fascinating character.

Becky has been shown to be ruthless and unemotional. She is always stone-faced at tribal council, and she agreed they shouldn’t “feed the enemy.” But she was the one who took control when Parvati cut her hand and kept her calm, stroking her head. She also told her sister not to make her cry, and she got a “I feel bad about hiding the food” confessional after the reward winner brought back food. This is a side to Becky we haven’t seen before.

Sundra is the emotional Aitu. She showed us the emotional side of Parvati’s injury and she was very emotional seeing her Mom. She had a nice quote about the world getting smaller and it would be nice to all get along. But we still haven’t seen any strategy from her. If one were in the "Sundra wins" camp, the visual of her at the immunity challenge says it all. The camera stayed with her through all her attempts to cross the barrels. She took an incredibly nasty fall between the barrels and the raft and then got up on the raft, limped and grimaced once and kept going showing us “Winners never quit.” In comparison, Becky was barely shown competing in the challenge.

Parvati was back to being her usual bubbly self after last week’s “Jonathan makes me sick to my stomach” antics. Adam was a surprise. He told us how close he is to his father and we saw his joy at being picked for the reward. He also took part in a mature strategy talk with Yul. I was impressed with him until he started to badmouth Jonathan at tribal council and we saw the Adam we’ve come to know.

Parvati’s and Adam’s changes could be explained if they are to be pagonged next – edits often change before they get booted. There are some very interesting things going on with the Aitu 4. There has been mention here that things are being hidden from the viewer. An established foursome going to the end together is unique to Survivor. If the Aitu 4 makes it to the final four, how each one handles the maneuvering and strategy necessary will answer some secrets!

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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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12-13-06, 06:49 PM (EST)
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92. "The Jonathan Point of View"
LAST EDITED ON 12-13-06 AT 06:51 PM (EST)

I see Misticjay, Drones and CTGirl are impressed with Ozzy and don't hold much hope (!) for Parvati's success. I enjoyed reading your posts. Where is everyone else?

I looked at the episode again and what struck me is the variety of narrators we had. I wish Corvis had done his confessional count but it seemed very balanced for once. Why the change?

Jonathan was one of Jeff’s and probably Burnett’s favorite. The amount of airtime he was given, Yul’s word that he had misjudged Adam and Parvati because of his talks with Jonathan, Sundra and Becky’s word that Adam and Parvati are nice when Jonathan isn’t around and Jonathan’s own admission that he was fairly edited made me think that the season was edited as if we saw it through the “Jonathan Camera”. I pushed that thought a little further:

-Cao Boi didn’t have many nuggets of knowledge while in Aitu. After leaving Puka, he was a bumbling fool who only was seen playing the game when he proposed the failed plan Voodoo. There was a difference between the Puka Cao Boi who talked to everyone and the Aitu Cao Boi who was almost only seen with Flicka. Was the difference due to the fact that Jonathan chose to ignore the hippy?

-Flicka was seen as someone who only wanted to enjoy the camplife and had no strategy. Jonathan saw her as a child who didn’t know what was best for her. It rarely happened but she did play the game: We did see that she was aware of her predicament in Raro and that she put some efforts to make ties with the leader. Once that failed she went behind his back! We did see her talking about booting Becky and then later with Candice strategizing to boot Jonathan himself. How much of what we remember of the fire dancer was due to what Jonathan saw?

-Nathan was a jovial nice guy before Jonathan met him. The editors were even careful not to have us blame him when he decided to boot Stephannie. As soon as Jonathan arrived, Nathan changed. He became mean and even pulled a “Denzel” act on Brad. That was the first time Jonathan saw him operating and suddenly the smack-talking, disrespectful man was all we saw of Nathan.

If this makes sense, then wouldn’t it also apply to the present players?

-Jonathan communicated on an equal terms with Yul. It isn’t surprising that Yul had a well rounded story. Still, Yul was a provider in Puka and he seemed to be a very decisive leader. In Aitu, we only saw his scheming side and the boot order he developed kept changing. After Jonathan’s mutiny, he took back control of the situation but as Jonathan’s exit approached, Yul started to be seen with faults. Was it a coincidence? With Jonathan gone, he should return to his Puka stature for the finale but it is possible that he continues downhill.

-Sundra and Becky have been underdeveloped as characters and, maybe not surprisingly, Jonathan had very little to do with both of them. Most of his communications went through Yul. Where does that leave them now that he is gone? It is late to develop a character.

-Jonathan saw Adam as a lazy big guy who was too dumb to even realize they needed a shelter. Alone in Raro, our impressions didn’t change much, we saw he had influence on the tribe but he wasn’t doing much work or strategizing. The mutiny gave us back the obnoxious hunk but as soon as Jonathan’s influence over the edit was reduced (and also Candice’s departure for sure!), Adam wasn’t as bad. We heard players say it and CTGirl noted the difference. In my oipinion, this is the story that is reaching its end.

-Ozzy gives us a nice case to analyze. Jonathan claimed that his happiest moments were when he went fishing alone on the reef. He also thanked Ozzy “The Mad Fisherman” for teaching him his tricks. Jonathan kept saying that Ozzy had to go. With this dichotomy, is it surprising that Ozzy got so much of a story early on? Jonathan was his biggest enemy but he was also his biggest (and ugliest) cheerleader. Ozzy showed many dimensions.
Ozzy’s airtime was reduced for a few episodes after the merge. It seemed a good sign because his arrogant attitude couldn’t match with the clean image the producers wanted to give of the Aitu4 but it could be a good sign under this angle also: Jonathan’s point of view wasn’t allowed to have an effect on Ozzy, we could keep the earlier impressions we had of him.

-Jonathan probably didn’t form much of an opinion on Parvati in the first few days. He went to exile and on his return, he was more concerned with Adam and Candice than her. She was able to develop her own character, make her own first impressions on us until the mutiny. Many of us hated her flirtation tactic but most thought she was making alliances and staying safe. Suddenly, Jonathan arrives and he sees her as lazy and the camera shows her as a weak, clueless player. As soon as the “Jonathan Camera” was turned off, she became a better player!!

Yul, because the “Jonathan Camera” gave us the right image, Ozzy, because he wasn’t touched by Jonathan’s opinion and Parvati because we were shown that Jonathan was partly wrong could profit from the way a balanced edit will portray the final players.

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12-14-06, 02:01 AM (EST)
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93. "RE: The Jonathan Point of View"
I really like the "Jonathan Camera" angle you presented.

When I get bamboozled by an edit like I have with the Jonathan edit I try to go back to the beginning of the show and evaluate each persons edit from the beginning until now.

It is one of the well established, at leastin the spoiling community, that the winner generally gets a fairly even straightforward edit with a slight downward dip towards the end. The downward dip is of course used to show the cracks in their armour.

Taking a closer look at the remaining players edit to date

Adam- Initially he was shown as a strong player and fairly well liked. After the 4 tribes merged into one we saw a shift in his edit. This new tribe was portrayed as lazy, and this was highlighted several times. Images of them laying around and not doing much. We also saw a shift of the nice guy Adam. His comments about Cowboy, Flicka and Ozzy when they wandered onto their beach showed a harsher side to him.

Parviti- Her edit, I would argue has been negative from the beginning. Her comments about flirting to get farther in the game. She was portrayed as lazy from the beginning with the biggest moment happening when Sundra had to show her how to gut a fish.

Ozzy- From the start we were shown that Ozzy is a hard worker and provider, no matter what tribe he is on. We also saw that he is very good at challanges and is an excellent swimmer. We also saw that he can be ruthless. This was highlighted when he was portrayed as the instigator for throwing a challenge in order to have one of his own tribe members voted out. From that point until just a couple of episodes he was largely a non factor on the editing front. Recently we have started to hear more from him and his thoughts on the game, and it's players. We are again seeing the ruthless Ozzy. This isn't necessarily a negative edit. We are shown that in his alliance of 4 he is #4 and he realizes this. He will do what he has to move himself forward in the game.

Sundra- She has been an non factor on the editing front. Except for an occasional confessional here and there she is largely invisible. Even when inVEEsible won she was still highlighted more than Sundra has been thus far.

Becky- Her edit has been more along the lines of behind the scenes, and some what sneaky. We haven't heard a lot from her or about her but she is always there during key scenes and conversations. She is UTR, and I just don't know if she is more like Tina and Vee or Kim J. and Jan.

Yul- His edit from the very beginning has been very straight forward. Except for controversy involving Jonathan there has been nothing negative about him. He has not been viewed as a boot candidate, and now that it is known he has the HII he has smooth sailing to f3, baring a sucessful voodo plan part deux.
(As a side note I'd like to say that this HII experiment has not delivered. Hopefully this will change in the next installment of Survivor.) His edit to me is that of Tom, Dique or Ethan.

DRONES

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12-16-06, 07:05 PM (EST)
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94. "Thoughts before the Finale"
The phantom of Jonathan loomed as his hat was shown in the opening sequence to remind us of the influence the author had on the season. That old hat was going to wreak havoc at TC!

Becky’s extended airtime shows how much more balanced the player’s edits have become. It is a good idea to show her strategizing if they want to promote her as the crafty one before the final.

The return from IC with Sundra told us immediately what her main concern was: Ozzy is a great competitor, he is here to win everything. They need to get rid of him sooner rather than later. “It would be foolish to keep him…I can’t risk having him win every immunity.”

Her nervousness was evident and Yul wanted to discus the situation at the first occasion. She told him about her fears of seeing Ozzy running away with all the challenge wins. He tells her that they could do the honorable thing of going to the final 4 together or get rid of Ozzy as soon as they can. From the start, we’ve seen that their method is to make decisions together but, by neglecting to show her confessionals, Yul was attributed the credit for most of the moves.

For a rare occasion, Jeff talked to her at TC but it was only to see if Yul was playing for a vote by returning Jonathan’s hat. She told Jeff Yul had announced his intention and that he must have had the idea to regain sympathy in the back of his mind. Who will vote for Becky if she does face the Jury? Maybe she wanted to eliminate Yul at F3 if the occasion presented itself but that won’t work now. Yul has made mistakes but not enough to lose 5 jury votes to her.

Sundra had a confessional to tell us she wanted to be at the reward but that she was happy to be alone with Becky since they had “rolled with the punches together.”

Sundra wasn’t impressed with Parvati: “She sleeping. She’s had a hard day getting a massage.” When Yul said she had flirted with Ozzy at the resort, she answered: “She flirts with everyone, that’s her M.O.” (Sundra really speaks for the viewers, she sounds like some posters!) She was worried Ozzy could be going with Parvati and that they had to cover all the bases.

For the second time she was a secondary target and again she didn’t do much to save herself. The Manihiki vote went her way with Stephannie coming to her defense and now Yul Intervened to stop a change in plan. It seems she won’t have a say either when it is her time to go.

The “Heart” has had great confessionals but there has been very little substance to Sundra’s game. If Survivor is to be viewed as a strategic game, the editors couldn’t have decided to show her not making any moves.

Yul was a stick-in-the-mud (!) during the reward. For half a pound of mud, he ruined Parvati’s occasion to strategize with Ozzy.

His discussions with a nervous Becky about Ozzy’s competitiveness had him concerned. His confessional showed what he thought of Ozzy: “I would not happy going to the final 2 with Ozzy. Anyone of us going against Ozzy would likely lose to the jury. Ozzy has been getting a lot of favors from the members of the old Raro tribe because they perceive him as a pure player. He’s doing his own thing, he’s not strategizing, he’s not building coalitions, he’s playing a straight-up game and doing a heluva good job of it.” During that confessional, Ozzy had time to build a fire and get an edited smile from Parvati! Dangerous player, Indeed! To Yul it was a question of “Taking the High road or really playing the game to the end.” Ozzy would force him to remain on the high road for now!

Yul brought up Parvati’s influence on the dominator and how she has performed well in challenges. After having underestimated her, she became his target. Yul continued to be concerned with her infiltration abilities, twice we heard him ask where Parvati and Ozzy were in camp. The second time he even intervened, admonishing Adam for talking with Ozzy to try to flip him.

We saw that Yul extended an olive branch to Adam after the challenge since Parvati had him worried. The scene with Parvati’s attempt to save herself served to show he is the ringleader but it revealed an hypocritical side. He didn’t need to tell her he’d try to save her. He also seemed clumsy in his explanation: Parvati was a bigger threat because she is coordinated but with Ozzy and himself, he’s not worried about her as a threat so she isn’t the biggest threat.

His TC performance was weak. For an attorney, he seemed to be surprised by Jeff’s line of questioning and it took him some time to recover. Jeff saw it as “The boldest move ever to gain a vote.” Parvati and Adam took shots at Yul. The camera cut to the jury as if to tell us they didn’t appreciate. Yul could only come up with “I was trying to appease him. It served both purposes.” The feel of the scene was that it didn’t go over well. If Yul saw it as a mock-jury that lawyers use to prepare their cases, he had to notice that his answers had a negative effect on the jurors. This wasn’t a mock jury, they will be the ones awarding the million as Jeff reminded the players.

Now that the HII almost assures him of a Final 3 appearance, how many votes does Yul have on that jury? It could come down to judging strategy against challenge abilities. Exploits on the playing field are often applauded by opponents. The winning athlete doesn’t need forgiveness as much as a scheming ringleader does. The “Brain” should be able to figure out his story is continuing to show some negative points.

Adam knew from the start that he and Parvati were the underdogs. They both talked of flipping someone but Parvati told him the Aitu 4 were fiercely loyal to each other. Their conversation continued after reading tree mail. They had to win the challenge or one of them would be sent to “Candice” Island.

What to make of his portrayal on exile island? He was shown as almost helpless and suffering from the harsh conditions. His challenge performance showed he wasn’t kidding about fearing what Exile Island could do to his abilities. (If he hadn’t been exiled, maybe he would have made it across once!)

He asked Yul to stay longer but the scene made him look pathetic. “Yul is the puppetmaster…as long as it’s benefiting me, I’m fine with it” he said, employing Sandra’s strategy. For her, it was understanble but this strong guy could have done more to save himself. “When it’s down to 5, I think my best shot is to win challenges.” That isn’t a bad idea but why do I think Jenna had more chances?! At least Parvati was reluctant to plead with Yul. She started by saying she didn’t want to pit herself against Adam because she cares about him.

At the last hour, Adam talked with Ozzy and Parvati in the shelter. Right away Adam said: “I’m going to vote for Sundra.” Ozzy’s eyes lit up, knowing that booting Sundra couldn’t help him. Parvati was the one to ask Ozzy: “Could you vote for someone on that side?” Was it a surprise that Ozzy answered: “I don’t know yet.” Adam asked: “Is there anyway you could vote for one of them. Becky and Sundra have only been going along for the ride.” Was that the best argument to make for someone seen as lazy? Why didn’t Adam ask who Ozzy could vote for before setting the target? Wasn’t Becky the obvious choice? If that wasn’t enough, Adam then sheepishly had to explain himself for talking behind Yul’s back to Ozzy.

The TC wasn’t better for the hunk. After recognizing that Yul could be playing to the jury, he lets everyone see that he knows his place is at the bottom of the totem pole and that is heart and his mind aren’t in it anymore. Becky and Yul were right, the “Outsider” isn’t dangerous.

Ozzy ran away with both challenges. He enjoyed the reward and Parvati’s attention. He was honest with her: “you’re in the position I used to be in: You have to win everything.” As if to show his dominance at the survival game, when the lights went out at the resort, Yul joked: “Make a fire, Ozzy.” Yul was concerned that Parvati could be making a connection with Ozzy who tells us: “I’m looking out for myself. I’ve been playing this game on an individual level since I got here and I’m playing it now more than ever. I might play the game with Parvati while there’s still an opportunity.”

He listened to Adam’s proposal but Sundra’s elimination wasn’t going to help him. Telling Adam that “I don’t know yet” who he was voting for was another way of declining the offer. His confessional told us he considered booting Sundra but that couldn’t be his final word on the subject. It was cut like that to give some suspense for the end.

This episode was all about “The Dominator.” Will it be the story of the season? As he told us, Ozzy has been a loner since Cecilia’s boot. His agreement with Yul was to be honest with him and, from what we have seen, he has held his part of the deal while Yul hasn’t. Ozzy hasn’t broken any promises because he hasn’t had to make many promises. Everyone is against him, even Sundra. He couldn’t act behind Yul’s back because he had to defend himself. It is surprising that no one has made a final 2 deal with someone that has to be considered as a favorite to win the final challenge. Terry’s prowess was recognized at one point and players started lining up to make deals with him. As with last season, this season has players focused on booting 1 person and even without the HII, they can’t do it!

Congratulations to everyone that voted for Parvati to be booted. I couldn’t pull the upset two weeks in a row! Parvati, with Ozzy, Yul and Sundra had told us what it meant to have the tribes separated along racial lines in Episode #1. She is the first to leave and I was stubbornly thinking she had to outlast Adam.

Ozzy has hurdles before reaching the jury but "King Neptune" is the story of the season. He has been presented as the Sole Survivor of the Cook Islands"

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12-16-06, 07:45 PM (EST)
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95. "RE: Thoughts before the Finale"
I think Ozzy has been very UTR in terms of editing. We barely get to see him unless it's about challenges or confessionals about challenges. The only strategy we get from him is how he has to win and how he is on the outside. The story of the season to me has been Yul and Jonathan why they both lost. In Yul's case he may still win due to the editing need to instill some doubt in any kind of story arc of the hero. Ozzy has not been getting the traditional hero arc from Campbell's 'Mythology of a Hero'.

Ozzy expresses no doubt in himself, Yul expresses tons. That's essential in any classic hero story.


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12-16-06, 08:05 PM (EST)
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96. "RE: Thoughts before the Finale"
Wow! You totally ROCK at all of this stuff, michel, and I just throroughly enjoy every word you have to say on it! Thanks so mcuh!

Ozzy has hurdles before reaching the jury but "King Neptune" is the story of the season. He has been presented as the Sole Survivor of the Cook Islands"

I have to tell you, I read your entire post with the hopes that you would indeed state the winner...after all it is the last chance we have to "nail" the winner through the editing! That statement was worth the wait!

I am in total agreement. Ozzy once again dominated the RC and what a reward it was, and boy did he revel in it! Yul, otoh, looked as though he were about to pass out! Who knows what could have happened between Parv and Ozzy had that happened! Yikes!

Once again this episode underlined the word "underdog" to me. While Ozzy continues his challenge prowess we find out that his supposedly loyal Aitu 4 are secretly against him as well...so, if he doesn't win 100% of the challenges left...he's toast. Of course I rooting for him...big time! Go Ozzy!

Becky told us the first chance she got that Ozzy is way too good for them, he not only beats them, he kills them, and the challenges are not even close. He needs to go sooner rather than later. Sundra, who we think is in good stead with the ultimate underdog, agrees! Then Yul returns and he even agrees...so once again, Ozzy stands alone.

Thankfully he wins the challenge yet again and the disloyal group choose to knock out Parvati. I feel that the Ozzy has epitomized the essence of this show this season. Against all odds, or shall I say, Against all, Ozzy! He has perserved as Yul said, “I would not be happy going to the final 2 with Ozzy. Anyone of us going against Ozzy would likely lose to the jury. Ozzy has been getting a lot of favors from the members of the old Raro tribe because they perceive him as a pure player. He’s doing his own thing, he’s not strategizing, he’s not building coalitions, he’s playing a straight-up game and doing a heluva good job of it.” As michel posted up above. Yul spells it out for us...anyone going up against Ozzy would lose. So there you have it.

S13, Ultimate Survivor, Ozzy. He clearly was the survivor in the group and did it on his own terms, with no luck, no help. Yul had Becky and he had the luck to get exiled in the first place and than to find the hidden II. That is what gave him his power.

I do think that it will be a very close game between Yul and Ozzy. I could really see either winning....Yul for outwitting, Ozzy for outplaying and outlasting. I could see Becky receive no votes, when up against Yul and Ozzy. With the whacko Raro's on the jury it will be a very hard game to predict. My gut and feel of the season tells me it's Ozzy!

Thanks everyone for another wonderful season, and especially to Veruca who is the master to us students! Thanks!

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12-16-06, 08:06 PM (EST)
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97. "RE: Thoughts before the Finale"
LAST EDITED ON 12-16-06 AT 08:07 PM (EST)

lol @ "Candice" Island!

Michel, VS et al., thank you for your terrific posts during the season. I don't post here (much) because I don't have anything to add to your wonderful insights.

But with one day left, I'll share a few observations

Before the final 6 ep, I thought it was all Yul. This ep really turned the editing take for me. (I know, VS, you look for winners with a multi-dimensional edit, but this time Yul was taken down many notches.)

Yul "threatening" Adam to not try and turn Ozzy??? Everybody has a right to play the game as long as they haven't been voted out yet. Granted, there may be more to this interaction (as Adam didn't show any outrage about it in a confessional), but I viewed it as a very poor showing for Yul.

Jeff emphasizing that Yul got the puzzle wrong, and the camera showing it in close-up. Ozzy had the lead anyway - they could have just shown Ozzy winning without "rubbing it in" that Ozzy is better at puzzles than Yul. (Clear foreshadowing that Ozzy could well beat Yul at the puzzle of all puzzles.)

CBS posts several photos from the prior ep on its website. One of these photos clearly shows that there was a tie-breaker between Adam and Yul in the mud RC (thanks VG for pointing this out elsewhere). They edited this out of the show! The only time they could have shown Yul "winning" something in an individual challenge!

Michel, I think you nailed it - this season is all about King Neptune. For the number 2 or 3, you can easily edit throwing a challenge to boot Billy as a major, major Survivor sin. Not for the sole survivor.

Michel, yes I got the Parv is the bigger threat, but you've been right more often on the "tougher calls" - hats of to you for a splendid season.

If this season is about underdogs - Ozzy has been the underdog of the underdogs. And the waiter could well beat the consultant, the lawyer, and anybody else.....

forehead

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12-18-06, 05:50 AM (EST)
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98. "The black and yellow bird"
LAST EDITED ON 12-18-06 AT 05:50 AM (EST)

I am not good at the lengthy discussions on editing that I admire so much in many of the posters on this thread, but hope I am not out of place in offering an occasional tidbit that I think is noteworthy. Having said that..

After reading so much all season about the symbolism of the white bird (Ozzy) soaring, I was stunned when I saw the black and yellow bird near the end of last night's final episode. I wondered if this was the editors' final joke on all of us by shoving Yul (the black and yellow bird) in our face after all the speculation about Ozzy winning.

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12-18-06, 02:33 PM (EST)
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99. "RE: The black and yellow bird"
I've read all your post attentively but still don't know who is your "perceived victor"! Ozzy, Parvati and Sundra have all been close but haven't been "the one".

That would be true Michel I'm just pleasantly surprised you were able to stay attentive considering their length lol

I had intended to post again but I was unable to do so in any timely fashion and when able, it did not appear necessary to do so at that point and I am only now reading these last observations which I find so interesting how quite different perceptions are by each individual.

Before the final 6 ep, I thought it was all Yul. This ep really turned the editing take for me. (I know, VS, you look for winners with a multi-dimensional edit, but this time Yul was taken down many notches.)

forehead, it is not often I "see" you in here; always a pleasure for me. What you state about my thought process is very true (you know me that well ) Interestingly enough the last few episodes were exactly what I had been looking for in Yul's edit. I'd never subject anyone to reviewing my old commentary but my issue with Yul was that his edit had been too pristine (for lack of a better word) The "chinks" I waited for made their appearance and in fact, the edit was so ridiculously manipulated that my eyebrow went up as it often does. Interestingly enough, it seems that very same editing turn caused a problem for some which is understandable to say the least.

I also see the "underdog" theme was embraced by some as potentially the overriding theme this season which, again, is extremely reasonable as it was force fed to us although my opinion on that equated it more or less to the "Aitu Four" as opposed to one individual since it was forced upon us at every viewing for these four and never subscribed to any of them individually PRIOR to them being labeled the "underdogs". Once they gained the upper hand, any mention of an "underdog" status was almost cursory at best and even Adam, the final member not belonging to the Aitu Four was described as the "outsider" NOT an "underdog" But this thematic storyline was INTEGRAL in paving the way for this foursome's outcome so the relevance of this underdog "aura" was immensely important to how the finale was dictated.

I had held on stubbornly like a dog with a bone that the overriding theme went back to what Jeff stated in the very first episode that gnawed at me and "you" had to see repeated by me quite often.

"It is the impressions you make on the other castaways that determine your fate" and I daresay regardless who people perceived as this season's victor, the final two (at the very least) certainly created an impression (alas I have problems including Becky along with the final three concept regardless and it almost appeared the finale felt this as well; indeed she was an extension of Yul's story)

Nevertheless, my post now means nothing since the show has reached its conclusion

On that note, thank you for a lovely season and my heartfelt wishes for a Happy and Healthy New Year.


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michel 10958 desperate attention whore postings
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12-18-06, 06:27 PM (EST)
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100. "A question of edit"
LAST EDITED ON 12-18-06 AT 06:31 PM (EST)

Hello Veruca, now you bring up my episode #8 question! Don't you know that without your guidance, I drown.

Way back then, we had established that the 4 original narrators of the "racial divide" theme would have to be seriously considered as the winner. Being circumspect, you hadn't named Yul as your "perceived victor", so my statement was a bit of a fishing expedition. I should've stayed on that track!

I think this season was edited to reflect the fact that both Yul and Ozzy were worthy of the title of Sole Survivor. There wasn't the need to justify a winner's edit by opposition to a final 2 foil as there is when a "Jenna" faces a "Matt". Ozzy cannot win if Yul doesn't get Jonathan back but Yul cannot win if Ozzy doesn't win the last tribal challenges. The villains were Raro, the heros were the AiTWO! Yul's class and Ozzy's youthful arrogance were visible, they didn't need embellishing. I stumbled over the compliments all the players gave Ozzy and his pure game.

At least, Yul and Ozzy were my 2 seeded single players back in episode #1! We had a Federer-Nadal final and the Spanish player lost.

Happy Holidays everyone!

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12-18-06, 07:28 PM (EST)
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101. "RE: A question of edit"
LAST EDITED ON 12-19-06 AT 07:18 AM (EST)

Well, I do feel many of us were fooled as to the winner with the editing. I definately feel like michel with his I think this season was edited to reflect the fact that both Yul and Ozzy were worthy of the title of Sole Survivor. quote. But I also question if the editors would have chosen their Survivor favorite in how they edited Ozzy. I give you VG's stellar argument in her Case for Ozzy. To me he was definately given a great nod with the editing! The bird, the shots of him when he was not critical to the scene, the shot of him at the waters edge when "Sole Survivor" was said in the voice over, just to name a very few. Is it possible they edited Ozzy as the winner as he was their choice?


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12-18-06, 08:45 PM (EST)
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103. "RE: A question of edit"
I agree it was a different edit this year with the f3 and how close the final vote was and how good Yul and Ozzy were..

I remember someone, very wise I'm sure, posting this way back after ep 2...

Again we are back to AITU at nite as they are talking about throwing the challenge at Ozzy's suggestion. Two times a rat is shown while Ozzy is talking/first seen after rat. Then JP talks about trust...

Ok the WHITE bird (like the darker one on AITU) is shown soaring as Yul goes to EI (which I thought was just so beautiful..I really think he has a great chance of not just coming in 3rd but winning it (he will not be F2 foil I think that is Ozzy )

well almost...it was right after he threw a challenge!!! Remember Billy decided that Yul should go bc he hoped he would find HI...as KT said in another thread...karma is a bizzle--

I remember that scene of Yul going to EI as one of the most powerful in recent Survivor history...and the HI is what won it for Yul..

The white bird was not just Ozzy but of the purity of the Aitu4's game

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mavs_fan 299 desperate attention whore postings
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12-19-06, 01:46 AM (EST)
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104. "RE: A question of edit"
Michel -

I'm reminded of your episode 2 analysis - very interesting stuff all things considered. I've bolded the parts I found most interesting. Maybe next time I will go back and reread some of the early analysis. While the OZZY train was picking up speed down the stretch, it seems we were given an early look at how it would come down in the end:

Michel 1363 desperate attention whore postings
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09-23-06, 02:51 PM (EST)

Ozzy is very strong at survival but maybe not so much at “Survivor”. He had said he didn’t want the lead but he doesn’t seem to be able to restrain himself. We start by seeing him working with his tribe and catching fish and chicken. JP again comments on how good Ozzy is at this. Throwing a challenge is something the editors have treated very carefully in the past. He was given the best possible edit under the circumstances. Without all the corroboration from Billy himself, Ozzy’s character would have been unsalvageable. Since he won’t need complete redemption, it is a good sign. However, I FEEL HIS STORY IS MOIRE ABOUT ADVENTURE AND LIVING IN NATURE. He is well equiped for that. THE ARROGANCE DISPLAYED IN HIS CONFESSIONALS IS NOT SO GOOD FOR THE SOCIAL ASPECTS OF THE GAME AND IT DOES COME OUT WHEN HE SPEAKS TO HIS TEAM MATES.

Yul HAD A TREMENDOUS EPISODE. UNTIL THE CHALLENGE, EVERYTHING OZZY DID, YUL ALSO DID BUT IN A MUCH CLASSIER WAY. They both start trapping chickens but his method was completely different than Ozzy’s and every member of his tribe stood behind him. He only received approval for his capture, whereas Cristina remained upset after, complaining that Ozzy had to have things done his way. When Yul talked with Becky, we saw the mutual respect and understanding. In contrast, Cristina reached the point that she couldn’t trust Oscar anymore. Yul has an outsider in his tribe but he finds an accomodation so that the team can be the well-oiled machine VS mentioned. Ozzy used the easy way out.

Even the challenge gave contrasting results, Ozzy lost dead weight as he wanted, Yul gained the idol he wasn’t expecting. I DON'T KNOW IF YUL HAS THE WINNING EDIT BUT RIGHT NOW I WOULD SAY HE OUT LASTS OZZY. His EI edit was powerful. I loved the camera angles that showed the A formed by the masts and the island and how the Southern Island slowly vanished. We solved the clue through his eyes and we knew he was bound to find it even before he started digging.


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VolcanicGlass 428 desperate attention whore postings
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12-18-06, 08:28 PM (EST)
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102. "RE: The black and yellow bird"
Thanks all for the kind words.

I think the F3 scenario allowed for a different edit of the show this season. I still maintain that Ozzy was given what in most other seasons would have been a winner's edit. The last episode was almost a love letter to Ozzy in the way it embraced him.

In hindsight, I think that having two worthy finalists, either one of which was deemed "worthy of winning" (whatever that means), made it possible to elevate the runner-up to the level of winner, within the confines of the story. It was the second best thing to actually becoming the Ultimate Survivor and was a way to honor Ozzy.

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cantstandsya 48 desperate attention whore postings
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12-19-06, 04:19 AM (EST)
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106. "RE: The black and yellow bird"
This is a very good point and needs to be reiterated. I think just looking at the percentages of people who thought who won (which seemed to be split pretty evenly), even the spoiler sites, and the contestants themselves. It was a stellar edit all considered because even though it created two main camps of believers in a particular edit everyone would've been satisfied with whoever won.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
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12-19-06, 07:26 AM (EST)
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108. "RE: The black and yellow bird"
VG...so nice to see you in here! I could not agree more with everything that you just stated. Your "Case for Ozzy" was incredible, and I too believe Ozzy indeed received the winners edit this season. Thanks so much.


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DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings
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12-19-06, 03:37 AM (EST)
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105. "RE: The black and yellow bird"
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you VS, and all the other outstanding posters from this thread.

All the different perspectives to this game from imagery, animals, music, quotes and perception helps me to form my own ideas. I'm not as skilled at interpreting imagery, music and animals as others, so I tend use quotes(the players words) and most importantly my perception, based on past shows and what I see and hear.

As I look back this season was very different from those past as there was not a classic f2 foil. I, wrongly, perceived Jonathan to be the perfect f2 foil based on past seasons. The thought never crossed my mind that the f2 wouldn't be a bad guy in the traditional sense of the show. I believe that EPMB put Jonathan front and center for two reasons 1.) he was the most controversial person out there. Seasons past have usually had a couple of bad guys, but as I look back I can't think of one other person who was as caustic as Jonathan. As michael pointed out, players like Candice and Jonathan were only harsh towards Jonathan and no one else. 2.) Jonathan was used by EPMB to flip the scrip and throw people off the scent about how this season was going to play out. In the end Jonathan was a distraction.

Even with the Jonathan show I just couldn't keep my eyes off of Yul and to a lesser extent Ozzy and Parvati . I just go back to the editing standard of who has had the cleanest edit from the beginning and that was Yul.


DRONES

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KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings
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12-19-06, 05:05 AM (EST)
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107. "The seasons edit"
I think that the main reason the editing was so different this year is because MB and company wanted to make sure that we as viewers would be satisfied with the new F3 format. If the contestants knew ahead of time that there was an F3 instead of an F2, then maybe Ozzy gets voted out the only chance they get to which was when Adam won immunity. Maybe Yul still finds a way to get to the F3 but with Sundra and Becky as opponents. How satisfied would we have been if Yul had won vs Becky and Sundra in the finale?

So rather than villianize Ozzy, which they easily could have (his arrogance, his throwing the challenge, his untrustworthiness etc.), they built him up as a very likeable candidate for the win (which also wasn't too much of a stretch) just to make sure that the viewing audience came away as happy as I believe they are. Those that like the mastermind got their capable and honest integrity man in Yul, those that like the challenge hound lone wolf, got to bask in Ozzy's glory. Either one would have been a satisfying ending to the Cook Island story.

Imagine if the mutiny did not occur and Jonathan and Yul had continued to work together and they had gotten rid of Ozzy soon after the merge as planned, the editing of both Ozzy and Jonathan would have been completely different. Ozzy would have had the villian edit and Jonathan would have been shown in a much better light. I always thought Jonathan's villian edit was contrived, he played a great game.


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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
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12-19-06, 07:32 AM (EST)
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109. "RE: The seasons edit"
Very true words KO. This was an important season for this show; it took a concept that caused quite a bit of controversy and it required a fine hand to have it be successful. Imagine the other side of the spectrum and the potential fall out. Indeed KO, as it has often been discussed when there are no real villains, they must be "created" and time and time again, Jonathan's edit reeked of manipulation to create that persona which was evidenced by the lack of support that the audience saw. His last episode was almost cartoonish in nature.

DRONES, the final two "foil" is often a quandry and I always try to remind myself that the final two "foil" does not necessarily have to be "not worthy"; only that the winner is justified in their win. This is not to say Ozzy (in this case) does not merit being the winner but I think that most people have no issue in the justification for Yul's win. It is often a circular debate that I try not to get too involved in; these players bring out a multitude of thoughts and feelings when we view them.

FlowerPower thank you for bringing to my attention VG's analysis which I have not yet read but with pleasure I will.

VG it is always nice to see you in here! There is no doubt that we have seen over the seasons that if a character or contestant is well regarded by the creators and staff of this show, they will herald that person. It was clear that Ozzy was well regarded as he should be; he was a wonder to watch in certain aspects of this show. As a sidenote, you and other websites that provide information to those who love to crack the mystery of this show provide wonderful resources. With that I do appreciate everyone here that keeps this thread as speculative as possible; it is a courtesy that you need not do.

As with Ozzy, Jonathan was another such "character" that I felt was very well regarded as more times than not, his "evil persona" was coupled with very insightful confessionals and warm moments. This was not a Jonny Fairplay edit or even a Robb of Thailand edit. Jonathan was also shown to be compassionate and very insightful but the editors also needed to allow him to exit with acceptance. We have seen this in the past as well. I have no doubt that Terry was well regarded and we know that Rupert was a crowning casting achievement for this show as well.

As KO points out in her post, Ozzy's less than "stellar" moments were softened. I recall how Ozzy's plan to oust Billy was given a very gentle touch. Challenge throwing is NOT positive but even at that Tribal Council, Ozzy was practically insulated amongst the tirade that ensued and Billy was a laughing stock.

emydi, I wish to thank you for including me in your thanks to the SOTS writers as it is an arduous job and all of you who do them deserve the utmost of credit. It would also be remiss of me to not tell you that your animal imagery analysis and KO's music analysis was a pure pleasure to read

I have already taken up more space than necessary (as I have been guilty of doing) but I have immensely enjoyed (again) everyone's thoughts this season and I have learned a lot.

The editing of this show has always been a passion of mine and I come away every season more educated. Every season is unique, the players are different and the game concepts change. In any event, should I start a Survivor Fiji thread, there is no doubt with the latest twists Jeff spoke about the editing will be fine tuned as well.

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