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"Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy"
Risti 190 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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01-15-05, 10:46 PM (EST)
 
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"Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
LAST EDITED ON 01-15-05 AT 10:53 PM (EST)LAST EDITED ON 01-15-05 AT 10:50 PM (EST) At first glance, the theme for this season seems obvious: prepare for battle. But is there something else going on? That question could be the real theme for this season. Ten seasons into the show, the editors might indeed be taking a more meta look at the show. Acknowledging that most people realize by now that while this may be a 'reality' show, the 'cast' still all have a role to play. That not only is a game is being played, a show is also being put on. It's showtime with the Survivors in the tropical paradise on Palau and there's someone for everyone. Notice the word showtime. No reference to it being a game, and even the way the sentence is structured - "Showtime with the Survivors" sounds like "the Survivors" could be replaced with "The Band/Celebrity Of Your Choice" What will they do when they discover they are lost for real? Despite pointing out that the Survivors are lost for real, what this line really does is draw attention to the idea that this show could be compared to the fictional (and popular) series 'Lost.' They are both tv shows. From what know of the series 'Lost,' it focuses on the drama and tension between the castaways over the actual physical needs just as Survivor does. Again based on my limited knowledge of Lost, however, it seems to me that that show takes the tensions to the next level. You could say it is more intense than Survivor is. Well, perhaps not for long, since we are told that this premiere is A premiere so intense 3 castaways will be going home before this night is over. So we will have an intense, more dramatic show than we have had before. Take this with a grain of salt, of course, since it's See BS talking, but the focus on this being a show over a game(which has been the focus in many previous seasons) continues. The Characters "I am a Vegas showgirl. A live one. I love performing. I loved performing on that stage."(Janu) A showgirl. Multiple models. Was there not an actor wannabe thrown in the group as well? See BS has downplayed the careers of the two male models so far, referring to them as waiters. It'll be something to watch to see if they continue doing this. Also, it's worth noting that there could be contractual reasons for them not to mention these careers, since they may already 'belong' to certain agencies (I don't really know exactly what I'm talking about here, so feel free to correct me). The typical Survivor DAW's perhaps, but it does seem like even the non-entertainment career contestants are ready to put on a show. "I'm going to be the first redneck to win a million dollars. I'm going to come here and steal the show. That's what I'm here to do. To make a million dollars and pay off some debts."(James) James isn't going to just win the game. He's going to Steal the show. How is he going to do it? He's going to play his part. His role. While he may not realize that even if he did win, he wouldn't be the first 'redneck' to do so, he is acknowledging the fact that he has been cast as a certain type of character. He's acknowledging what people have observed for a few seasons now - that one of the staples of Survivor is the redneck. He's not the only one to see his part. To show a few: I'm a strong Christian and alot of the things I do and alot of the ways I act are from the Bible. (Bobby-Jon) I have the freak factor working for me. (Angie) Then there are those who may not realize that they are playing a role, but are certainly edited that way. (sings) "Survivors and we can take the pain, Survivors in sunshine or in rain.... Survivors and we can find our food, Survivors that is our attitude..." (Wanda) Have we ever been shown a Survivor singing in the previews before? I know we've seen it in the show, but before the show even began? And not just singing, but singing about being on Survivor. It's Survivor: The Musical, and Wanda is the leading chorus girl. "And baby Jeff is 21 years young." (Voice Over) "I'll guarantee you I'm going to work harder for the money than anyone here." (Jeff) Jeff, on the other hand, is being edited against playing his supposed role. He is one of only a handful of survivors who seem to be looking at all of this with the more common, more 'realistic' viewpoint. "Ok, this is my message to everyone else: I'm not trying to win a million dollars, I'm just here to lose some weight." (Katie)
Katie, I'll admit, confuses me a bit. At first glance, it would seem that she too is focused on more of a 'real life' issue than playing a role. On the other hand, by stating that she's not there to win the million dollars, she goes along with the theme that the competition and winning isn't what is as important this season. Certainly weightloss is one of those things that has come to be associated with Survivor. So she too is in a way conscious of playing a role that Survivor hasn't really acknowledged up until this point. (But as someone who is heavier, it has certainly gone through my mind that this could be part of the incentive for some.) The question is, will she only get what she asks for - weight loss - and miss the million dollars, or will she be the Cinderella of this story and come out with more than she ever dreamed of?
These are the people, anyhow, who acknowledge that just by being who they are, they are playing a character role. The next level of cast members, however, are those who are coming to the show to consciously play a role with the intent on using that role to win. Strategy in a Show vs a Game? There is 'strategy-talk' in these previews compared to some years, at least, less talk using terms like 'strategy' and 'game.' These people aren't saying they're not afraid to lie/cheat/decieve for the sake of the game. No, instead they're talking about how they will talk or pursuade people to win. In other words, how they will build up their own 'character' through their words/actions. And three, count em, three lawyers. (Voice over) I've only lost two jury trials in my career, and I think I can be very pursuasive. (Caryn) If you get me in front of the jury, I'll win the million dollars. (Willard) I think I'm as good as anybody, and... that offends alot of people. (Jolanda) Lawyers are typically cast as the schmarmy, deceptive, lying and cheating type. These three seem nice enough, but to me, none of their confessionals bode well for them. Caryn mentions the trials that she's lost, rather than focusing on the cases that she's won. Will this be her third loss? Willard's quote is interesting in that he says he can win if he gets in front of the jury. For him, the key thing to do will be to note whether or not he makes it post-merge(or whenever the jury starts to be formed). If he does, than it foreshadows that he will go far. His other option, which is just as possible, however, is that he won't make it to the jury. Physically, this seems to be the more likely scenario, but you never know what could happen. Jolanda is interesting in that she's not shown displaying any 'lawyer' type traits, unless you count cockiness as one. Cockiness, however, is something she's not alone in having. But these three aren't the only ones who are confident in their ability to play the right role to pursuade people: I always said I could talk a fat man out of his last bag of doritos. (Ian) Ian joins the lawyers in talking about his ability to talk/pursuade people, but the rest of these players are also shown as playing a role for the sake of strategy: I became the funny guy out of sheer defense, because being the gawky gay kid on the playground you had to have something going your way. (Coby) People are very surprised when I tell them that I am a Mormon. My sexuality and being seen as a sex symbol... It's a good thing. (Ashlee) People think that I am the girl next door, which is a nice thing. I think that's a compliment. Then when they get to know me I think that they realize that I'm a little naughty. (Stephanie) Greg's an Ivy League grad (Voice Over) I'm a down to earth guy that's fun to just grab a beer with. (Greg) Coby, Ashlee, Stephanie, and Greg all talk about adapting a role different from what might be expected of them(or in Stephanie's case, playing up on the role people naturally give her), or who they perhaps really are. Out of them, Coby seems to be the most aware of strategy, actually using the term defense. Ashlee and Stephanie seem to want to use the assumptions people make of them as a strategy, but seem less sure of themselves(both hedge their words with alot of 'ums' and other signs that they aren't confident in the judgements they're making about themselves, or haven't thought it through alot). Greg seems to be unaware of his role playing into strategy completely, being edited into this dichotomy of expected behaviour and actual behaviour. This may be a sign that he's not going to be as involved in the strategy(and possibly not make it very far). More Characters: I'm thinking that being an attactive or good looking person can be good for you if you use it right. It's all about using it right. (Ibrehem) And unless I can get a boy to fall in love with me, and use that to my advantage...then...then my looks can play a factor, because there are some hot boys (Kim) "Being one of the more attractive people, I think it's uh...it's gonna be a challenge...to do just the right amount of flirting, and not stepping on other people's toes" (Jen) Ibrehem, Kim, and Jen are all acknowledging that their looks could play a factor, but as Ibrehem put it, 'it's all about using it right.' (Ibrehem was also edited to be a contradiction in that the voice over said he refers to himself as 'the silly one) They know that their looks, and the role they play around that could work to their advantage, but unlike Ashlee and Bobby-Jon ("These M60s I got right here, are waiting for everyone to come get a little piece of"), they are not depending on this strategy. Of all of them, again do to the way it was said, Ibrehem seems to be the one who has thought this out the most, and therefore is the most confident, and the one who is most likely to succeed in this strategy. His statement talks about what he needs to do, rather than what others might do around him. Of course, what would a show be without a hero? There are two contendors for the 'hero' role, Tom, a New York City Firefighter, which is about as close to a modern day Knight as you can get in today's culture, and Jonathon, a cancer survivor. Both talk about how they can apply lessons they've learnt from real life to the game. "I like my job. There are no two fires that are the same. There're no two circumstances in this game that are the same." (Tom) "That was a really challenging thing mentally. I think that's the biggest thing I've ever had to overcome in my whole life." (Jonathon) Is this show about RL lessons, though? These two join Jolanda and Jeff as being the few who don't seem to play up, or at least mention their role. If this season does indeed turn out to be about putting on a show, that puts these four in trouble. There are more quotes, but let's move on. A Narrative Theme Let's go back to the Voice Over/Description we've been given of this season. I searched through all the transcripts of the previews, looking for mentions of the war theme, but it was strangely absent (aside from one mention of a battlefield). From what I can see, it looks as if the producers set up this season with the hopes that they would find a war theme. The logo for the season is decked out in military style. There are military ads all over the CBS site(and we'll probably be inundated with them throughout the season). But as for how the storyline will end up being edited, I think we're going to see the producers become alot more open about the fact that this is a tv show. Over the years we've seen the evolution from 'this is reality' to 'this is a game.' Now it's time to take that one step further and say 'this is a tv drama.' "One Show, 20 spirited individuals. It's a battleground once again." (Voice Over) Notice that even in this one mention of it being a battle, there is talk about it being a show in the phrase where we might usually see 'one survivor.' The focus isn't on the game, but on the show. Not only that, but as I emphasized, the battleground referred to is something that we've seen before. This show is being talked up as a step away from what Survivor has been in the past. Why would they mention the battleground in relation to what has gone before? Why this change in focus? Well, if they've really done away with the idea of tribes, or at least made them less important, it takes away a certain element of the competitiveness. Could there be other twists perhaps which take away from the 'game' elements that we've come to associate with survivor. If indeed they are editing this as more of a typical, 'fictional' drama, then we might be able to predict a more standard storyline. Classic villains. Comic Relief. Dashing Heroes and Damsels in distress. In terms of plotlines, look for red herrings, a definable climax to the story, and of course, for certain themes to be built upon. ***** I wanted to make some predictions here as to how far certain characters would go, but I'm just not sure enough of myself. If this idea isn't completely shot down, I'll come back and try and sort them out. I've been lurking and occasionally posting since the seventh season, but this is the first time I've made such an indepth analysis (especially one based on such a small amount of information). I started off a new thread for this, because while people have talked a bit about editing/themes/characters on other threads, there isn't really a central one yet(well, there is for the war theme, but I figured this was something different). For now, though, I'm going to sign off before this becomes even longer. ~Risti
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biancaxxx 282 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
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01-16-05, 04:10 AM (EST)
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1. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
I thought that was a very good & insightful semiotic analysis.
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biancaxxx 282 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
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01-17-05, 01:14 AM (EST)
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7. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
is that supposed to be a joke? or are YOU the semi-idiot? lol
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biancaxxx 282 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
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01-18-05, 08:49 AM (EST)
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9. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
Thanks, I am happy to be here 
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Risti 190 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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02-21-05, 05:09 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
When I first posted this, I remember that you had only a handful of posts to your name. As I've mainly gone back to lurking over the past couple of weeks, I've noticed that you aren't, as I'd assumed, a passing newbie to the world of spoiling. So consider this a belated but very enthusiastic thanks, with, of course, the added question of whether your 'good' means it lines up with what you know...
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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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01-16-05, 01:39 PM (EST)
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3. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
Good analysis, Risti... it's hard to say how these people will unfold without having seen an episode as brief blurbs are all but impossible to get a good feel for these people. It's sure worth a good shot at analyzing these folks, though.Something that jumped out at me: > I'm a strong Christian and
>alot of the things I
>do and alot of the
>ways I act are from
>the Bible. (Bobby-Jon) >People are very surprised when I
>tell them that I am
>a Mormon. My sexuality and
>being seen as a sex
>symbol... It's a good thing.
>(Ashlee) I looked at the Early Show stuff earlier and I noticed not only was Ashlee leaning on Bobby Jon in the group picture that I thought was edited to add Ashlee in (but has probably been debunked by now) but also in Ashlee's introduction on the Early Show, she was joking around with Bobby Jon. These two have talked about their strong religious beliefs - even if they're of different religions - and they're both Southerners (BJ's from Alabama before recently moving to LA and Ashlee is in SC now), and Bobby Jon seems like a ladies guy judging from his flexing of muscle. Could this be an alliance in the works?
>Coby, Ashlee, Stephanie, and Greg all
>talk about adapting a role
>different from what might be
>expected of them(or in Stephanie's
>case, playing up on the
>role people naturally give her),
>or who they perhaps really
>are. Out of them, Coby
>seems to be the most
>aware of strategy, actually using
>the term defense. Ashlee and
>Stephanie seem to want to
>use the assumptions people make
>of them as a strategy,
>but seem less sure of
>themselves (both hedge their words with
>alot of 'ums' and other
>signs that they aren't confident
>in the judgements they're making
>about themselves, or haven't thought
>it through alot).
What if Coby, Stephenie and Greg were to join up with Bobby Jon and Ashlee in a young 'sexy' and misfit alliance (in terms of going against what people might expect from them)? Then again, over half of the cast is what people would consider young and sexy, so take what I said with a huge grain of salt.
  
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munson 1314 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
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01-16-05, 05:04 PM (EST)
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5. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
Outstanding post, Risti. I LOVE analysis, always have. Spoiling is wonderful, speculation is fun but analysis is the reason I keep coming back to the boards.And with that, a preliminary shout out to VerucaSalt! I'm really looking forward to the VS editing thread for S10. Good stuff! Just one comment, for now anyway, regarding Katie. It's not clear to me whether you believe her statement applies to her actual motives or, as I believe, is more of a statement of her strategy? "Ok, this is my message to everyone else: I'm not trying to win a million dollars, I'm just here to lose some weight." (Katie) Katie, I'll admit, confuses me a bit. At first glance, it would seem that she too is focused on more of a 'real life' issue than playing a role. On the other hand, by stating that she's not there to win the million dollars, she goes along with the theme that the competition and winning isn't what is as important this season. Certainly weightloss is one of those things that has come to be associated with Survivor. So she too is in a way conscious of playing a role that Survivor hasn't really acknowledged up until this point. (But as someone who is heavier, it has certainly gone through my mind that this could be part of the incentive for some.) The question is, will she only get what she asks for - weight loss - and miss the million dollars, or will she be the Cinderella of this story and come out with more than she ever dreamed of? I think the *everyone* she mentions are her fellow castaways. As in, "Let them think I'm only here to lose weight, not win the game, so they don't see me as a player, a threat." If that's indeed the case, I think she clearly intends to play to win!
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PinkPelican 4 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-18-05, 03:17 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
Rare poster, avid snooper (heaven knows I can’t match the speculation skills that abound here, but can only nod in amazed agreement). I have another (half baked) theory to add here. In various posts, they discuss the fact that Palauan villages were, and still are, organized around 10 clans reckoned matrilineal. A council of chiefs from the 10 ranking clans governed the village, and a parallel council of their female counterparts held a significant advisory role in the control and division of land and money. (Credit to PhoenixMons here). So, with MB’s flair for hanging with the native theories (male–vs- female last season), could there be some twist of fate if the survivors are somehow “paired” male/female in Palau? If one goes home, the other half has to somehow find another mate or risk…..something…..? Hence the need for 3 people to go in the first episode to give us an odd man out in order for there to be a spare ½ of a pair throughout the rest of the season? I’m not entirely sure myself how this plays out and/or what the damage is if ½ your pair is voted out and you can’t find another, but this would answer the reason why they are starting off as one tribe, why 3 HAD to go in the first episode, and give new meaning to the history of ‘battle’ on the island. This would lead to mega juggling of pairs throughout the game, wicked backstabbing at the shuffling of pairs (aka very emotional) and massive twists to alliances with sometimes only ½ the pair in one alliance and the other ½ in another. I’m not clever enough to figure out what the damage to the ½ of the pair that would remain when one gets voted out but what a twist to establish your pair and then ½ are one tribe and ½ are the other, splitting each pair. Do you tell who your pair is? Again, what would the benefits to having another half in another tribe? What is the advantage to being ‘true’ to your other half? I’m going off half baked with this twist theory, but as stated, MB likes to stick to native traditions and I was trying to come up with a darn good reason to start out with 20 survivors only to lose 3 first out of the gate, on purpose. Like Risti says, "something else is going on here". PinkPelican
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Smooth23 1244 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Politically Incorrect Guest"
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01-18-05, 07:16 PM (EST)
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14. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
Can I get the cliff-notes pleaes?
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cuon10 473 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
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01-24-05, 07:49 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
"I like my job. There are no two fires that are the same. There're no two circumstances in this game that are the same." (Tom)This calls it a game. I think that because this group is
"highly spirited" and possibly dramatic that there are problems and issues. They were also called "not the most even-keeled" group. If you read some of the bios, you can pick out a few that are on "overkill" and some that may be "overly vein." I can see a division amongst two types of groupings. There is:
Tom,Ashlee,Jonathon,Caryn,Bobby Jon,Wanda,Gregg,Kim, Katie" in the more family or goal-oriented group and "Angie,Jolanda,Stephanie,Jennifer,Ibrehem,Janu,Jeff,Coby,
being more independent and spirited. And Willard,James and
Ian harder to classify. I certainly believe that this season will change the game in the future. Just how we will have to wait and see.
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stonedog 2 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
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01-24-05, 10:39 PM (EST)
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20. "RE: Let the Show Begin... A Discussion of Theme, Characters, Editing, and Strategy" |
Hi...former lurker here and my first post on this site.Thanks for triggering me with your fab analysis, Risti! Agreeing with almost all you suggest. I would like to add about Katie...I do think she was joking with her weight loss comment, but I also think she is (as someone else suggested it) going to play the light-hearted joker around camp to fool her tribemates. Katie might just be the FEMALE ROB CESTERNINO!!
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Risti 190 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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02-21-05, 05:05 PM (EST)
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21. "Revisiting The Idea Post Episode 1" |
LAST EDITED ON 02-21-05 AT 05:52 PM (EST)It's been awhile since I posted about this theme of Survivor being a 'Show', but I haven't forgotten it. The choices we make is what VerucaSalt has speculated as the apparant theme over on her excellent thread. I'd agree. However, I believe I caught a quote somewhere(and I should have bookmarked it when I saw it, since I now can't remember it) that Jiffy said something about how this game comes down to people who choose to be themselves, and people who choose to be someone they're not(paraphrasing here, and probably making the quote more applicable than it actually was. If it rings a bell to anyone else, please point me in the right direction.) With that in mind, I keep thinking about the Strategy section of my post. Coby, the person who I think it is safe to say we have seen the most 'strategy'-talk from in the first episode, makes a very clear choice to perhaps not be entirely true to himself. He wants to fit in well on the 'playground' he's quoted as saying, and then in the Schoolyard style Pick 'em, he chooses the more mainstream Caryn over Angie. He's playing the right game for this season, that's for sure, but it's been proved over and over again that the best or smartest player doesn't always win. Is this show about RL lessons, though? These two(Jonathon and Tom) join Jolanda and Jeff as being the few who don't seem to play up, or at least mention their role. If this season does indeed turn out to be about putting on a show, that puts these four in trouble. When I read this again, my mind boggled, considering the first episode. Am I actually on to something here? Jolanda and Jonathon are already gone. Jeff is strongly rumoured to be gone in the next show. Let me bring up what I had said about Jeff again: "And baby Jeff is 21 years young." (Voice Over) "I'll guarantee you I'm going to work harder for the money than anyone here." (Jeff) Jeff, on the other hand, is being edited against playing his supposed role. He is one of only a handful of survivors who seem to be looking at all of this with the more common, more 'realistic' viewpoint. If Jeff decides to act on his 'real' feelings of love, it could place him in an awkward position for this game. After all, in Survivor, even love is supposed to take a backseat to strategy(I'd even argue that Romber, for all their smooches, knew this. Look at the final immunity challenge). Jeff's notion that he was going to 'work hard' will be especially ironic if Ulong continues their strategy of kicking off the strong members of their team with him. Somehow, I think this is going to be a season of irony. While we're on the topic, let's take another look at Kim's quote, shall we? And unless I can get a boy to fall in love with me, and use that to my advantage...then...then my looks can play a factor, because there are some hot boys (Kim) I think it's rather clear that she does get a boy to fall for her. Could it be that for Kim, this relationship is all strategy, while for Jeff, it's quite real? That would explain why he becomes the sacrificial lamb while she remains - Kim is only willing to allow a romance if it will advance her - not keep her safe. The fact that this quote is coming back to her so early in the game, however, suggests to me that this is the main focus of her storyline, which would suggest it ends soon after. On the other hand, she does use the word 'boys'. But going back to the grouping of Tom, Jolanda, Jeff, and Jonathon. Tom. Firefighter Tom who thinks that focusing on fire is a 'loser' job. Tom, who has been shown going back after the flint. "I like my job. There are no two fires that are the same. There're no two circumstances in this game that are the same." (Tom) Oh, the irony. I mentioned on the Koror Accident thread that I thought the time spent focusing on retrieving the flint could become a bone of contention to this tribe. I also mentioned that I thought Tom could very well take the brunt of this, given his quote from the episode. Adding in this pregame quote, and that prediction is pretty much sealed for me. The two fires are the same, and Tom should have stuck with his original assessment. My predictions, then, since I promised them after I had more time to think and a little more to go on. I always felt strong about Ian, Willard, Ibrehim, Katie, and Coby. If these five don't at least make it to the jury(except for Willard, whose quote I can see predicting his fall just short of it), I'll be shocked. If the final four is made up of at least two or three of them, I won't be surprised at all. I'd like to hope the winner is amoung them, but that person could still be hidden. On the other hand, as mentioned, I had doubts about Jeff, Jolanda, Jonathon, and Tom. As well, there was something about Caryn, Ashlee, Gregg and Jen made me thinkt hey wouldn't go far pre-show. Gregg and Caryn's editing so far, however, might change that, but not everyone on Koror can go far, especially since rumours are floating that that tribe is gutted(which would throw out my favourites list, come to think of it). Everyone else I'm still neutral on.
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Sn'DCS©MMIV
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DRONES
