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PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 10:09 AM (EST) "S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" So, what can we take from this season in hindsight that can maybe help us spoil future editions of Survivor? One thing: The key quote of the season, IMHO, was from Chris where he talked about his balance problems in the first episode that caused his team to lose the first IC. He won the final IC that not only had strength and willpower but also a balance part that was key to winning and allowing him to go to the F2. ©Slice & Dice Chop Shop 2004 Scratch and sniff   Top

Subject     Author     Message Date     ID    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight dabo 12-13-04 1  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight CantStandToLook 12-13-04 2  Recycled Vidcaps Krautboy 12-13-04 3    RE: Recycled Vidcaps kingfish 12-13-04 14  Hindsight- opening credits lilRED 12-13-04 4  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight Bebo 12-13-04 5  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight KObrien_fan 12-13-04 6    Nash theory lilRED 12-13-04 11        RE: Nash theory KObrien_fan 12-13-04 12            RE: Nash theory lilRED 12-13-04 20    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight kingfish 12-13-04 15        RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight KObrien_fan 12-13-04 16            RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight kingfish 12-13-04 29                RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight KObrien_fan 12-14-04 32                    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight kingfish 12-14-04 34                        RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight KObrien_fan 12-14-04 35    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight PepeLePew13 12-13-04 21        RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight KObrien_fan 12-13-04 23  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight Pretty_Kitty 12-13-04 7  Merge Boot Krautboy 12-13-04 8    RE: Merge Boot idiotcowboy 12-13-04 9    RE: Merge Boot KObrien_fan 12-13-04 10  Weight Loss Spoilers Krautboy 12-13-04 13    RE: Weight Loss Spoilers kingfish 12-13-04 17        QQQ ? Krautboy 12-13-04 19            RE: QQQ ? kingfish 12-13-04 26  Snewser's List Krautboy 12-13-04 18  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight chaipo 12-13-04 22    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight Krautboy 12-13-04 24  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight Jims02 12-13-04 25    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight kingfish 12-13-04 27  We have learned Loquatrix 12-13-04 28  The masters spew their wisdom Capn2patch 12-13-04 30  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight DRONES 12-14-04 31    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight PepeLePew13 12-14-04 33        RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight Capn2patch 12-14-04 36            RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight RyrieRae 12-14-04 37                RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight Krautboy 12-14-04 38                    RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight RyrieRae 12-14-04 39  RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight JohnMc 12-15-04 40  Strategies Revealed... Krautboy 12-17-04 41    RE: Strategies Revealed... Loquatrix 12-17-04 42

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dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 10:28 AM (EST) 1. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" He'd lost a ton of weight by day 38. At the start he also talked about being happy to be in a tribe of all men, he felt his chances were better to manipulate the guys. He ended up as the last man with a tribe of all women and mainly took advantage of them tearing their tribe apart. "If all machines were to be annihilated at one moment, so that not a knife nor lever nor rag of clothing nor anything whatsoever were left to man but his bare body alone that he was born with, and if all knowledge of mechanical laws were taken from him so that he could make no more machines, and all machine-made food destroyed so that the race of man should be left as it were naked upon a desert island, we should become extinct in six weeks." (Samuel Butler, "Erewhon")   Top

CantStandToLook 6254 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 10:50 AM (EST) 2. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" I thought the key quote also came from that first episode in the same vein of him talking about it being easier to manipulate men than women. However what I thought was key was how he mentioned that if you attack a women, she'll cut you down, but if you show some weakness, she'll embrace you and let you in some. That is apparently what occurred after the loved one challenge. His weakness opened the door for them to allow him to stay 3 more days which was all he needed to get his foot in the door on his way to F2 and winning the whole thing. "It's a retro WinterSlice sig"   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-13-04, 11:22 AM (EST) 3. "Recycled Vidcaps" Recycled vidcaps were used throughout the episodes to hide or misdirect...the previews for the Finale included vidcaps from TC and featured each of the final four, but the TC shot of Chris was recycled from a previous episode. This was done to hide the fact Chris won the F4 IC and had the Immunity Necklace around his neck. The lesson we learned was to pay close attention when vidcaps are recycled...there's probably a good reason for it Krautboy   Top

kingfish 20752 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 01:37 PM (EST) 14. "RE: Recycled Vidcaps" Very good idea, even though we knew this before, it really stands out in hindsight. I hope you are writing these things down somewhere. And will share when the time comes. THe best part is that you could get a manual named after you; "Krautboy's Survivors Spoiler Manual (or how to ruin Mar Burnett's day)"   Top

lilRED 37 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge" 12-13-04, 11:26 AM (EST) 4. "Hindsight- opening credits" Does anyone have vidcaps from opening credits on S9... Im curious if there were any clues pointing to chris as winner that wasnt noticed in the intro...   Top

Bebo 21083 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 11:31 AM (EST) 5. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Pay attention to what isn't shown as much as what is shown. We were shown Chris making a F2 alliance with each of his Lopevi tribemates except one...Twila. At the time, I suggested that this meant the two of them would be the F2. Too bad I backed off of that prediction by the end. You know the difference between you and me? I make this look good.   Top

KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 12:23 PM (EST) 6. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" #1- The key quotes did indeed belong to Chris. #2- The editing of the winner has always been very consistant for every season, no winner has ever been shown with a dramatic strategy or behavior shift. This season Chris and Eliza were the only 2 with consistant editing from start to finish. Kudos to VerucaSalt for her editing threads which keep us all looking at the whole picture. In the end in Vanuatu the spirits of the island did deliver a male victor as is the custom of the culture. #3- Confessional count usually does indicate who will be the boot. At the merge this season it became "hide them the episode before the boot and then spike them the next episode in which they are booted" Kudos to KB for keeping the count for us each season. #4- One thing that really helped me this season (as I have never been able to forecast the winner after watching just the first episode) was a combination of the editing and John Nash' theory of equilibrium. After about 3-4 episodes I wrote an analysis using his theory and who I thought had the best chance to win the game, and the answer I came up with is Chris. I will be happy to do another Nash analysis next season as I think it helps by trying to figure out the kind of game and strategy that each player is trying to employ. #5- OFG theory held up this season, especially premerge. #6- As Bebo stated above, what is shown is important, but what isn't being shown is of equal importance. Many of us had guessed that Twila had made an F2 pact at Lopevi, but did lose sight of that in the waning moments. #7- Recycled caps are thrown in for a reason so the analysis of them is just as important as the ones they do show. What are the recycled caps trying to misdirect? #8- Vidcaps are best seen when they can be colorized and portions can be blown up, so Cat and SamB please make sure to come back next season to give us a hand! Many minds make light work, so the more opinions we have on the vidcaps and analysis, the better. Looking forward to seeing you all again for S10. For those diehards that can't get enough, we have the confirmator to work on the names of teh 20 DAWs that will be featured and then we have some detective work to see if we can find info on each. 2004 ASS Trivia Champ   Top

lilRED 37 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge" 12-13-04, 01:17 PM (EST) 11. "Nash theory" Is there a link to your analysis anywhere? I would be very interested in that. I'm fairly new watcher of the game and never thought before about how that would apply. It makes wonderful sense though.   Top

KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 01:37 PM (EST) 12. "RE: Nash theory" Here you go LilRed- The link to that thread, it was post #76. In that post I also link back to analysis done on other survivor seasons (but was done after the respective seasons in hindsight) which is helpful. This is the first season I tried to use Nash' theory during a season to figure out the winner, and well it worked! 2004 ASS Trivia Champ   Top

lilRED 37 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge" 12-13-04, 02:24 PM (EST) 20. "RE: Nash theory" Thanks. Im sure that will make for some interesting reading!!   Top

kingfish 20752 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 01:44 PM (EST) 15. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" LAST EDITED ON 12-13-04 AT 01:45 PM (EST) Apologies, K O'B, I responded to Krautboys post before reading yours. You already started the Spoilers manual. It should include titular (I like that word for some reason, can't think why) credit for you also. In fact (Duh, to myself)) this whole thread will become a sort of spoilers manual. Titular credit could be quite extensive. BTW the Nash spoiler thread idea is an excellent one.   Top

KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 02:04 PM (EST) 16. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Thanks King, and btw your posts are nekkid, would you like a siggie to cover up? 2004 ASS Trivia Champ   Top

kingfish 20752 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 08:16 PM (EST) 29. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Shore. I can't resist when you use those words. Do your worst (by that I mean best, I make up my slang as I go). Occasionally I'll have a stray thought along the sig pic line, Stephen king face on a fish body? on a hook? stuffed on the wall? Frying in a pan? I don't know how extensive the resources are that you draw from. Or just anything would be cool. A Kingfish banner would be cool. I was kind of a K O'B fan myself.   Top

KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-14-04, 04:36 AM (EST) 32. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Hows this? S9 LOTD Champion   Top

kingfish 20752 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-14-04, 02:00 PM (EST) 34. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" That's great. You are very resourceful. Can I just take it, C& P the URL? Thanks KO Brien Fan. You're a mighty fine person, and I am now a KOBrien_Fan fan. When I get home tonite I may just have to post some erudite blather on all the threads just to spread the sig pic around. Thanks Again. (What is LOTD champion?)   Top

KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-14-04, 02:18 PM (EST) 35. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" PMS had a great and fun game on Survivor Fanatics called Luck of the Draw and in it's premiere edition I outlasted all the others to become it's first champ. You should play next season, lots of fun! There are lots of other fun games in Fanatics as well, Tribe hosts the ABC (Anti-Bootee contest) and Loser Lodge, and I host the PTB (Pick the Bootee) game. They are all fun and can use some fresh faces. And yes, just copy the URL into your posts or into your signature file under preferences. Glad you liked it! S9 LOTD Champion   Top

PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 02:48 PM (EST) 21. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Your Nash theory was a great find this year, KOB! I had wondered what happened to ivoryElephant's first episode analysis as I remembered he used it to predict Brian's win in Thailand. If we could get both you and iE to post your theories after the first episode of S10, that would be great! ©Slice & Dice Chop Shop 2004 Scratch and sniff   Top

KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 02:56 PM (EST) 23. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Actually I will post it around the 3rd or fourth episode so that I have had time to get a feeling for each persons strategy within the tribal makeup. But yes, I will surely bring Nash to S10. 2004 ASS Trivia Champ   Top

Pretty_Kitty 536 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 12-13-04, 12:56 PM (EST) 7. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" I honestly had no clue who would win lasrt night or even be the final two but when they were doing a recap of the season and they showed Chris hugging his wife at the IC and saying "Im sorry I didnt win" I just had a feeling. I read the analysis of the shows and the editing and I find it all facinating becasue of the spoiler board I have really enjoyed the season despite the lame people so keep it coming!!!   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-13-04, 12:59 PM (EST) 8. "Merge Boot" The merge boot profile has been fairly well estabished over the past seasons...usually a strong leader or individual challenge threat is eliminated at the merge. This season there were "sourced spoilers" that had us considering Julie (who did not fit the profile), but in the end it was Sarge, a stereotypical merge boot, who was voted out after all. Krautboy   Top

idiotcowboy 1135 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Politically Incorrect Guest" 12-13-04, 01:09 PM (EST) 9. "RE: Merge Boot" Actually it was Rory. Sarge won the first II, and Rory was the next biggest II threat. Your point is still correct though as Rory fits the profile too. -ICB   Top

KObrien_fan 8360 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 01:10 PM (EST) 10. "RE: Merge Boot" Great point, and as a general note and I know this has been said before, but let's try to forget the sourced spoilers and go by what we see...easier said than done. 2004 ASS Trivia Champ   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-13-04, 01:37 PM (EST) 13. "Weight Loss Spoilers" Weight Loss Spoilers once again proved to be a good tool to use in determining who will be safe pre-merge. If they come from a reliable source and the weight loss reported is "significant", then the weight loss spoilers should not be ignored. While we didn't have as many reports as in past editions of Survivor, those we had proved to be reliable. Chris was rumored to have lost a significant amount of weight and now we know why... Krautboy   Top

kingfish 20752 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 02:06 PM (EST) 17. "RE: Weight Loss Spoilers" One possible insight to the Key Quote spoiler analysis. According to this season, instead of figuring out who had The key quote, one could have figured out who had the most possible key quotes and determined First and even second place. It's really impossible to use Key Quotes as a spoiler tool until afterward when you can go back look at the season and say "Oh Yeah, That was key quote" because there were a lot of players making a lot of quality Key Quotes. So what about the quanity? By just counting all of the possible key remarks and sorting by key remark originator, one might be able to at least narrow the field down early in the game. I'd be interested to see how this would apply to this season, because while I'm pretty sure (Lex's gut feeling? Oh No!) that Chris had the most key quotes (Possiblities, that is), and I feel Twila had a number of them also. It might indicate who goes to the F6, F5, F4, and beyond.   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-13-04, 02:21 PM (EST) 19. "QQQ ?" Kingfish, sounds like you might be on to something...the "Quote Quantity Quotient". I think you just created a project for yourself during S10. It would be a very useful contribution to Veruca's Editng thread each week... Krautboy   Top

kingfish 20752 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 04:38 PM (EST) 26. "RE: QQQ ?" You Mean, Like...Work? Actually it sounds like a good idea. And an easy enough to keep up with the running totals, Using VS quotes (always the best) and related observations, and discussions as to what are the key quotes. Be happy to.   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-13-04, 02:16 PM (EST) 18. "Snewser's List" Snewser has provided the spoiling community with a boot list each of the last two seasons. They have proven to be a reliable list of premerge boots provided in alphabetical order. While he hasn't provided boot order, it has been a good tool to quickly narrow down the list of boot candidates in the early episodes. While we don't yet know if Snewser will once again provide a list, the reappearance of his "Confirmator" does suggest he already has a list of contestants and probably will once again have access to some information about the premerge boots. Some people like having the list, others do not, but it can't be ignored if our objective is to spoil the game and predict the outcome. Krautboy   Top

chaipo 11 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson" 12-13-04, 02:51 PM (EST) 22. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Hello -- First post here ;) Two things I will take away from this season: 1) Alliance Management: Brilliant move by Chris to agree to both sides at F5. This prevented T/S and E/J from getting together and kicking out Chris. This is much more effective than the "I don't know who I want to vote for" strategy that backfires. In the future, I think alliances will have second thoughts about swing vote situations. 2) Assumptions. Twila and Scout were not tight past final four, although I think they would have taken each other if they could. Scout might have been swayed to vote out Twila at F4 if there was any compelling argument, but of course it was to her advantage to vote for Eliza. Lesson here is not to assume that someone cannot be swayed, or assume that all paired alliances are final 2. 3) Jury management: Suprisingly the "at the time, I believed what I was saying to you, sorry but things changed" argument won out with the jury. That is so lame that the jury ate that up, once again proving that for some reason the jury doesn't vote with their minds. Anyways, great season! chaipo   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-13-04, 03:12 PM (EST) 24. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Welcome Chaipo! Very good insights...hope you come back and join us here for S10! Krautboy   Top

Jims02 7407 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 03:39 PM (EST) 25. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" 1. Vidcap analysis proved to be very useful once again. Specifically, I am thinking about the Finale. As some pointed out, we had a couple new pictures of Eliza and Twila, neither with the the Immunity Necklace. Using these clips, we can use logic to determine the outcome of the Immunity or Reward win. 2. Game logic is useful, but complicated. Going into the Final Four, we had a lot of different ideas about how Eliza, Chris, Twila, and Scout would play the Final Four. Clearly, one could argue most any bootee, when looking at game logic. However, coupled with vidcaps (Chris wins Immunity?), the answer may become a little more clear. 3. Invisible players don't necessarily go far. I remember Chris, Twila, and Eliza were some of the main characters in the first episode of the season, along with Sarge. During this season, MB spent much less time on some of the pre-merge boots, and focused on other "star" characters more. Players like Brook, John K, John P, and Brady didn't get much of a storyline at all. It wasn't that MB was going to reveal more story as the show went on; they didn't have much of one. Julie and Scout, on the other hand, were somewhat invisible throughout, and still made the Final Five. 4. The simplest explanation is often the best one. Avoid those smokescreens. Clearly, we saw MB play up the Chris/Eliza relationship, even though we saw him vote out Julie last week. Sometimes, the simplest solution (Chris is playing Eliza, just like Julie) is the best one. A 2004 holiday treat from Mon Cherie. Jims' Random Thoughts   Top

kingfish 20752 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-13-04, 04:44 PM (EST) 27. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Excellent observations. In regard to #4 (and I guess the others too), sometimes the simplest explainations (etc) go in contradiction of Snewser. Thus leading to an off the boards finish for any unwary spoiler (names not disclosed. OK it was me!)   Top

Loquatrix 640 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 12-13-04, 05:15 PM (EST) 28. "We have learned" that when EPMB wants a male winner, the F3 "endurance" challenge is actually an upper-body strength challenge! As soon as I heard the other day that there was a bow and arrow involved in the F3 challenge, I knew it was designed for Chris to win. A vertical maze that you have to climb ten times, for the F4 challenge... also something you'd typically expect an able-bodied youngish man to win over pretty much any woman. Fine with me, anyway! Chris was my pick from Ep1 and I am pleased for the overall balance of things that we had a male winner this time.   Top

Capn2patch 2785 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-13-04, 11:53 PM (EST) 30. "The masters spew their wisdom" I'll be sure to 'bookmark' this thread.   Top

DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 12-14-04, 03:14 AM (EST) 31. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Key quotes have to be taken in the context of do they stand the test of time. Chris's quote in the first episode was about his failure in the first IC, but it spoke to the broader implications of HOW the game is won. Most key quotes have to do with the demise of a player involving irony. Ami's quote of not finishing second to a man in the 1st episode comes to mind. Confessional analysis was extremly helpful. When snewser makes a pick several weeks early you can bank on that outcome. VS, editing thread is important in fleshing out MB theme for the season. He is always trying to tell a story using these people. DRONES   Top

PepeLePew13 26134 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 12-14-04, 06:07 AM (EST) 33. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" >Most key quotes have to do >with the demise of a >player involving irony. Ami's quote >of not finishing second to >a man in the 1st >episode comes to mind. The impact of this quote was somewhat tempered by her 6th place boot - I think it would have meant a lot more if, for example, she was in the F2 with Chris and lost. >Confessional analysis was extremly helpful. It sure was, a good year for confessional analysis >When snewser makes a pick several >weeks early you can bank >on that outcome. Actually, there was the one time when Snewser had Julie up as his post-merge boot pick two weeks in advance, then he pulled it a few days before the episode. This was an "off year" for Snewser, in my opinion. ©Slice & Dice Chop Shop 2004 Scratch and sniff   Top

Capn2patch 2785 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-14-04, 04:22 PM (EST) 36. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" To boot, Snewser never posted the F4.   Top

RyrieRae 416 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star" 12-14-04, 07:30 PM (EST) 37. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Can someone help... What do "EPMB", and "OFG Theory" stand for?   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-14-04, 07:40 PM (EST) 38. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" "Evil Prick Mark Burnett" and "OutFrontGirl" "EPMB" is self explanatory. "OFG Theory" was coined by me as an easier to type name for Outfrontgirl's Theory relating to the appearance of each week's boot in the "next week on Survivor" promo. Krautboy   Top

RyrieRae 416 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star" 12-14-04, 07:42 PM (EST) 39. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Thanks KB (that stands for Krautboy)   Top

JohnMc 2679 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Survivor-themed Cruise Spokesperson" 12-15-04, 02:42 PM (EST) 40. "RE: S9 Vanuatu - Hindsight" Lesson one: The car curse is still in effect. The winner of the reward challenge with the car will not win the game. Lesson two: If you win the final 2 challenges, you stand an even chance of winning. 1 - Kelly - lost 2 - Colby - lost 3 - Kim - lost 4 - different winners (Vee/Neleh) 5 - Brian - won 6 - Jenna - won 7 - different winners (jury/Lil) 8 - different winners (Amber/Rob) 9 - Chris - won Sublesson 2a - If you win the final immunity but lose the F4 immunity, you will lose.   Top

Krautboy 2750 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 12-17-04, 10:36 AM (EST) 41. "Strategies Revealed..." "Strategies Revealed Do Not Succeed" is a spoiling theorem that has proven to be fairly reliable, with the occasional exception, depending on the time frame considered. In S9 we were made privy to various alliances and plots, as MB's editing encouraged the audience to believe they might succeed...but in the end they didn't, and the final two were nothing more than a strategic move on Chris's part, a strategy we assumed but never saw. The women's plan to be the final 4, Rory's plan to reunite with the men at merge and vote off the women, Leann and Julie's alliance plan to replace Scout, Chris'a F2 alliances with everyone except Twila...were all revealed to us, and in the end, all failed to succeed. Krautboy   Top

Loquatrix 640 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 12-17-04, 01:39 PM (EST) 42. "RE: Strategies Revealed..." Good point, KB, though I think the phrase may need to be, "Long Term Strategies Revealed Do Not Succeed." Not to be overly lawyerish or anything. ::grin:: The reason I propose the inclusion of 'Long Term" is that we did see a successful medium term strategy play out, as well as plenty of the usual short-term, "this boot only" strategies. In my view, a successful medium term strategy was initiated at the point where Chris gets on board with Twila's suggestion to bring Eliza into their alliance. This propelled all four of Chris, Twila, Scout and Eliza to the final four from -- what was it, seven players left, when Leann's boot was engineered? For me, a Long Term Strategy is one initiated pre-merge and before the Jury Boots commence. A Medium Term strategy is one initiated once the Jury Boots have started. A Short Term strategy is one initiated to manage a particular, immediate set of circumstances (also known as "scrambling"). Short Term Strategies either fail gloriously and result in the boot of the person attempting the strategy, or they succeed but don't lead to any longer-term alliances -- they're to solve an immediate problem, and aren't part of some bigger picture. Long Term Strategies, such as those KB mentions, always seem to get submerged in short term strategies and then, eventually, a medium term strategy. Medium Term Strategies gain their power from being the result of a period of gameplay in which chips have started falling, and in which players have had a chance to make certain key observations. This leads to a likelihood of ultimate success that the other two types of strategy rarely, if ever, bring about.   Top

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