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"After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"	02-27-04, 08:35 AM (EST)
"After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"
LAST EDITED ON 02-27-04 AT 09:10 AM (EST) Quick impressions right after watching this but needing to go back. First thread here: http://community.realitytvworld.com/boards/DCForumID2/4813.shtml I'm more interested in the parallels of the two tribes now because I felt the dissolving of Saboga brought the tribes, not the individuals more into focus. Chapera WOW, their goal is TO WIN, period. Throughout the game, comments of kicking butt, even the way they built their shelter and boat (Taj Majal) all the way and to the hilt. The challenge was very indicative of their collective persona. Rob IMMEDIATELY planted himself ready to battle Ethan, ready to battle Colby. They are playing offense Whereas Mogo Mogo almost self admitted their skating their way, i.e. per Colby NOT TO LOSE. They are very content in coming in second which raised my eyebrow. Colby even said the raft they built was done based on laziness and exhaustion. At the challenge they changed courses, avoided the confrontation, Kathy plain SAT down (symbolism at its best) They are playing defense, pure and simple. That won't cut it in this game. Mark Burnett is not a big fan of playing NOT to LOSE, he wants you to PLAY to WIN. Some interesting observations. KO posted this is another thread (shame KO, it would have been perfect in here) which struck me as well with Jenna's forlorn shot by herself waiting to get selected last. Jenna is a little tigress; being picked last is only more "stuff" she needs to fight more. Her insight of how she worked very hard until now only for it to be for naught just tells me how she is very aware of what she needs to do. She is NOT living paranoid minute by minute (like prior winner Ethan) but contemplating her position. Another interesting observation was the lack of interaction between good friends from S3, Ethan and Lex. The fact that Colby has now FINALLY be shown playing this game only tells me that he is being set up for a fall; the fact that Lex was very quiet with regard to Ethan also tells me that there is something there. Colby's spike in face time (should he leave soon) will further my notion of this pattern that those who are not who they used to be are not being invested long by Mark Burnett. If this is the case, Colby (with his sudden overly confident gameplay) Ethan (with his 50/50 chances running low and prior winner status) and Jerri (her sympathetic edit but now a touch of the old Jerri flashing here and there) are not meant to stay and I have already posted ad nauseum that Sue's lack of story is indicative she is not being invested in as well. Tom and his (again) non threatening, seemingly hick act is covering for a very astute player. Interesting that Rob has it in for the "pretty boys" (watch the showdowns continue ) but I actually notice a chink in Tom's alcohol coated armor when Rupert arrived. If "pretty boys" are Rob's sore spot, Rupert will be Tom's. The BIG BOY battle may just be beginning Considering the blow up we now know for sure is Sue and the mere fact that her story has been invisible until this point does not bode well for her. With the addition of Rupert and Jenna, Sue is completely expendable and if I were Alicia I would also be careful where I tread as well. Jenna, while a big mouth, does have the methods to keep it under lock and key whereas Alicia? Not sure if she is capable plus she is a walking target just by her physical appearance. Tom, Rupert and Rob like their women pretty and sweet, Alicia needs to be careful as she is a dangling fourth and Rupert and/or Jenna are very willing and able to take over that spot. ETA: Rich's notable quote paid off Quote: So I’ve really got to push and probe and stir the pot a little. I’m a big ass target, but is doesn’t matter what I do. I’m just gonna keep shaking things up a little bit.”
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Table of Contents

  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... VerucaSalt 02-27-04 1

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... raidersfantom 02-27-04 2

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... true 02-27-04 3

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... wendyp 02-27-04 4

   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... VerucaSalt 02-27-04 5

       RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Blow by Blow 02-27-04 6

       RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Flowerpower 02-27-04 7

       RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... ADKer 02-27-04 11

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... managerr 02-27-04 8

   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... redbeard103152 02-27-04 17

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Brownroach 02-27-04 9

   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... JohnMc 02-27-04 12

   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... VerucaSalt 02-27-04 13

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... memacmur 02-27-04 10

few quick thoughts I_AM_HE 02-27-04 14

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... munson 02-27-04 15

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... bondt007 02-27-04 16

   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... VerucaSalt 02-28-04 18

       RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Chez 02-28-04 19

           RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... VerucaSalt 02-28-04 20

               RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... pinchy 02-28-04 21

                   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Cuauhtewatemoccajava 02-28-04 22

                       RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... udg 02-29-04 23

Players Vs. Drama Flowerpower 02-29-04 24

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Rothschild 02-29-04 25

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Flowerpower 03-04-04 26

Rupert SnowBunny 03-04-04 27

   RE: Rupert okaloosajohn 03-05-04 35

       RE: Rupert Loree 03-05-04 36

           RE: Rupert I_AM_HE 03-05-04 37

Narrators, Commentators, and Strate... Risti 03-05-04 28

   RE: Narrators, Commentators, and St... pinchy 03-05-04 29

       RE: Narrators, Commentators, and St... I_AM_HE 03-05-04 30

chapera and the reaction to sue badger 03-05-04 31

   RE: chapera and the reaction to sue raidersfantom 03-05-04 32

       RE: chapera and the reaction to sue spastiman 03-05-04 33

           RE: chapera and the reaction to sue Loree 03-05-04 34

RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... memacmur 03-05-04 38

   RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... I_AM_HE 03-05-04 39

       RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... memacmur 03-05-04 40

           RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... VerucaSalt 03-05-04 41

               RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... Flowerpower 03-06-04 42

                   RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... Loree 03-06-04 43

                       RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... VerucaSalt 03-07-04 44

                           RE: After Sue; The Players, The Gam... VerucaSalt 03-09-04 45

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Get Bent 03-10-04 46

The Robfadda Show Flowerpower 03-10-04 47

   RE: The Robfadda Show Brownroach 03-10-04 48

       RE: The Robfadda Show VerucaSalt 03-10-04 49

           RE: The Robfadda Show Brownroach 03-10-04 50

               RE: The Robfadda Show VerucaSalt 03-10-04 51

                   RE: The Robfadda Show redbeard103152 03-10-04 52

               RE: The Robfadda Show Get Bent 03-11-04 54

   RE: The Robfadda Show Brat2u 03-23-04 100

       RE: The Robfadda Show emydi 03-23-04 101

           RE: The Robfadda Show Brownroach 03-23-04 102

               RE: The Robfadda Show emydi 03-23-04 103

               RE: The Robfadda Show Brat2u 03-24-04 105

   RE: The Robfadda Show ManateeBob 03-26-04 120

Sue's Web Chat Get Bent 03-10-04 53

EP 7: Players, Game, Edit EMT135 03-12-04 55

   RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit Flowerpower 03-12-04 56

   RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit SouperStar 03-12-04 57

       RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit VerucaSalt 03-12-04 58

           Rupert... udg 03-12-04 59

           RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit EMT135 03-12-04 60

           RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit raidersfantom 03-12-04 61

               RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit ADKer 03-12-04 62

   RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit Brat2u 03-19-04 92

       RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit Brownroach 03-19-04 93

Tom buckeyegirl 03-12-04 63

   RE: Tom VerucaSalt 03-12-04 64

RE: Episode 7 editting and characte... memacmur 03-12-04 65

   RE: Episode 7 editting and characte... I_AM_HE 03-13-04 66

       RE: Episode 7 editting and characte... VerucaSalt 03-17-04 67

Episode 8 Updates Get Bent 03-17-04 68

   RE: Episode 8 Updates VerucaSalt 03-18-04 69

       RE: Episode 8 Updates badger 03-18-04 70

       RE: Episode 8 Updates a98c4fun 03-18-04 72

           RE: Episode 8 Updates Loquatrix 03-18-04 77

               RE: Episode 8 Updates Loree 03-18-04 79

                   RE: Episode 8 Updates Naked 03-19-04 82

       RE: Episode 8 Updates mtopaz 03-18-04 73

       RE: Episode 8 Updates Flowerpower 03-18-04 75

           RE: Episode 8 Updates Brownroach 03-18-04 76

               RE: Episode 8 Updates Flowerpower 03-18-04 80

   Rob & Rupert edit... udg 03-19-04 88

       RE: Rob & Rupert edit... Loree 03-19-04 89

       RE: Rob & Rupert edit... Get Bent 03-19-04 90

           RE: Rob & Rupert edit... Loquatrix 03-19-04 94

               RE: Rob & Rupert edit... I_AM_HE 03-19-04 95

The Amber edit Loree 03-18-04 71

   RE: The Amber edit pinchy 03-18-04 74

       RE: The Amber edit VerucaSalt 03-18-04 78

           RE: The Amber edit Flowerpower 03-18-04 81

               RE: The Amber edit VerucaSalt 03-19-04 83

                   RE: The Amber edit Flowerpower 03-19-04 84

                   RE: The Amber edit Loquatrix 03-19-04 85

Jerri Oscirus 03-19-04 86

   RE: Jerri VerucaSalt 03-19-04 87

   RE: Jerri I_AM_HE 03-19-04 91

       RE: Kathy ADKer 03-19-04 97

   RE: Jerri Oscirus 03-22-04 98

       RE: Jerri VerucaSalt 03-23-04 99

           RE: Jerri DRONES 03-24-04 104

Episode 8 memacmur 03-19-04 96

   Jerri stands a chance RyrieRae 03-24-04 106

       RE: Jerri stands a chance VerucaSalt 03-24-04 107

       RE: Jerri stands a chance memacmur 03-24-04 109

           Jerri=Neleh? I_AM_HE 03-24-04 110

               RE: Jerri=Neleh? Brownroach 03-24-04 111

                   RE: Jerri=Neleh? memacmur 03-24-04 112

   RE: Episode 8 popsicle 03-24-04 108

RE: After the recrap Flowerpower 03-24-04 113

   RE: After the recrap I_AM_HE 03-25-04 114

   RE: After the recrap DRONES 03-25-04 115

       RE: After the recrap VerucaSalt 03-25-04 116

           RE: After the recrap Brownroach 03-25-04 117

               RE: After the recrap Cuauhtewatemoccajava 03-25-04 118

                   RE: After the recrap VerucaSalt 03-26-04 119

           RE: After the recrap DRONES 03-29-04 121

           RE: After the recrap geg6 03-29-04 122

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... Flowerpower 03-29-04 123

   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... VerucaSalt 03-30-04 124

       RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... geg6 03-30-04 125

After the tribal swap: The Players,... Flowerpower 04-02-04 126

   RE: After the tribal swap: The Play... cdlafl 04-02-04 128

Jenna L. vote Simom72 04-02-04 127

   RE: Jenna L. vote bdemoney 04-02-04 129

RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... CRyanShort 04-02-04 130

   RE: After the Dissolve, The Players... fredscott 04-02-04 132

Amber's reaction buckeyegirl 04-02-04 131

   RE: Amber's reaction yensid 04-02-04 133

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Messages in this topic

VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
02-27-04, 10:12 AM (EST)

1. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Hey guys, two people are posting in the old thread. Here is a shiny new one

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raidersfantom 137 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
02-27-04, 10:24 AM (EST)

2. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

>WOW, their goal is TO
>WIN, period. Throughout the
>game, comments of kicking butt,
>even the way they built
>their shelter and boat (Taj
>Majal) all the way and
>to the hilt. The challenge
>was very indicative of their
>collective persona. Rob IMMEDIATELY
>planted himself ready to battle
>Ethan, ready to battle Colby.
> They are playing offense
Excellent analysis VS. I too agree that Chapera is in it to win it. Most likely IMHO because they were the only tribe, and are still the only tribe without any former winners.
>Whereas Mogo Mogo almost self admitted
>their skating their way, i.e.
>per Colby NOT TO LOSE.
>They are very content in
>coming in second which raised
>my eyebrow. Colby even
>said the raft they built
>was done based on laziness
>and exhaustion. At the
>challenge they changed courses, avoided
>the confrontation, Kathy plain SAT
>down (symbolism at its best)
> They are playing defense,
>pure and simple.
>
>That won't cut it in this
>game. Mark Burnett is
>not a big fan of
>playing NOT to LOSE, he
>wants you to PLAY to
>WIN.
OOOO you hit the proverbial nail on the head. Up until last night's RC, MogoMogo had not won a challenge. Sure they didn't "lose" any challenges, but they were always second place in every challenge up to that point.

> The fact that Colby
>has now FINALLY be shown
>playing this game only tells
>me that he is being
>set up for a fall
Umm, I like to think that the editing of players is sometimes not done as a tool to set them up for a fall, but it comes down to, who holds the power, and who provides the best soundbites. When editing the show, did MB have to give Richard as much face time as he had? If the positive editing theory holds true, Rich would have gone farther than 5, because he wasn't getting a ton of negative editing. I also think maybe Colby and the rest of MogoMogo finally have to "start playing the game" thus the reason for Colby's added face time.

I have already posted
>ad nauseum that Sue's lack
>of story is indicative she
>is not being invested in
>as well.
Maybe yes, and maybe no. I've watched the shows a few times, and Sue hasn't gotten as much time on the TV as the rest of her tribe, but they haven't been the arc that has been followed for the majority of the season so far. Saboga had been dominating the episodes because of the dynamics and the fact they were getting whomped in the IC's and RC's. The tribe that's voting someone out always gets the majority if not the full of the last segment so we can see the wheeling and dealing between the players as they prepare for TC. Just cuz Sue isn't getting tons of time, doesn't mean that she's not there for awhile. There's been positive editing of her within the tribe lately. Her holding hands with Rob as they walk to get treemail at the start of last night. Her peeing on the raft (note to self: never have a trucker present went Christening new boat), and I think what was a good edit was how she told Jiffy at TC that the loss was Chapera's wake up call.
I like to think that the editing has a lot to do with who goes in the earlier shows of course, yet I can't help think that the editing is more along the lines of who has the best lines.

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true 9689 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-27-04, 10:32 AM (EST)

3. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Great observations Veruca.
I'm thinking about how the alliances are working in MM. On the insider clips, Kathy commented, in her vote for Richard confessional, that he was playing both sides. I found it interesting that she didn't say all sides, meaning that there are two camps within MM. She then goes on to admit that she and Lex have a deal.
From what we've seen, it looks as though Kathy and Shii are together, and Lex and Colby are together. I would expect Jerri to try to hook on to the two other women, given her paranoia about Colby. Ethan looks to be teaming up with Colby and Lex. Richard was apparently floating between, but so are Kathy and Lex.
For that tribe to settle on a Richard boot, I figure they must not be to concerned about Colby, even though he came forth to instigate the switch from Ethan to Rich. It will be interesting to see how the tribe divides at their next TC.

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wendyp 2081 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Roller Coaster Inaugurator"
02-27-04, 10:48 AM (EST)

4. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Some of the clips thsi week and previews are interesting.
Shi ann not happy that the boys did not listen to her and Jenna in the shelter building. Did not like the boys picking who was beign voted out last night. And the preview clip of her Captain america with his good teeth.... I think Shi ann is out to prove somethign. LAst time it was all about I look different so they treat me different ~ isn't that the same thign with her comment about Colby.
Jenna ~ I was in cahrge, I said who was voted out, and not it is all for nothing. She does not want to be the one to sit back and be told who to vote for. However I think she will not show that she was in charge at the other tribe. This will help her get farther as she will not be seen as a threat during merge.
Jeri ~ i am so happy to be here I do not miss Saboga at all. Means she will plot against Ethan first chance. She said she wants Revenge ~ it was all Colby that did me in. She told everyone on Mogo that she will vote out Colby just tell her.
Rupert did not say much...I think he may lay low and be a provider.
Ethan ~ still paranoid. And was not to happy that Richard got fish. Well now he needs to step up to the plate!

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
02-27-04, 11:09 AM (EST)

5. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

LAST EDITED ON 02-27-04 AT 12:01 PM (EST)

Quote:
When editing the show, did MB have to give Richard as much face time as he had? If the positive editing theory holds true, Rich would have gone farther
While with any other player, I'd acquiesce but this is Richard Hatch we are talking about I don't think that MB would NOT have done this for anyone else. I don't know about anyone else but I fully expected the King of Survivor to get a special story/edit because he is the self touted and arguably the best player and the first winner. In fact, many believe he couldn't have gone last night because they felt MB would make sure his boot is solely about him and nothing else in that story. So I do believe MB "had" to give Richard that much face time. Let's face it ASS would not have been the same without Richard Hatch
As far as your thoughts on Colby, again, valid points BUT I do believe as I stated in the first post of the old thread that MB is going to do (I believe) a special job on the story and winner this time. It may not necessarily be all positive and golden but this is the winner of ASS! Now for me, if Colby was playing the game at all up until now (and from dribs and drabs I don't believe he was as invisible as MB showed us) then why are we suddenly getting feelers of a very different player? For some reason also, I feel a stage is being set for Colby that he bit off more than he could chew and the fact that we saw almost next to nothing of Ethan and Lex's relationship while Lex "allowed" Colby to basically usurp the strategy session makes me pause.
With regard to Sue, Chapera was doing a lot of victory dances yet we still saw quite a bit of activity there. Sue hasn't been portrayed as a worker or a team member. Though Sue's personality in S1 was abrasive, we saw her step up and work hard and take the reins in strategy discussion. I don't see that here. Mark Burnett picked the creme of his crop whether it was based on past win status, audience popularity or alpha personality. Sue was picked because of the impact she made on Survivor 1. I believe editing and story lines is very very important to Mark Burnett. In fact Jeff Probst indicated in an interview that tuning into the story is what makes Survivor great.
Naturally there are confessionals and blurbs that go in each week to entertain but as a whole, what we see of someone is IMO a message he is sending about the person and how they are involved in the game. But that is the beauty of this show, we don't all see the same thing. Sue, to me, is not the Sue of S1 therefore I feel that MB is only putting what he needs to show of Sue to keep the story smooth but her "character" if you will does not have any major impact on the outcome of the game.
true, nice call on the "both" sides. I think there are quite a few sides going on at MM. Lex and Kathy's friendship, boys vs. girls, Lex and Ethan's friendship, Jerri's preconceived negativism towards Colby (and I'm sure Colby's of Jerri's) the natural "pretty boy" competition between Colby/Ethan, etc.

Edited b/c of a typo

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Blow by Blow 895 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
02-27-04, 11:41 AM (EST)

6. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Coupla comments about Chapera and Sue --
I thought it was very interesting that the first shot we saw last night was Chapera skipping along the sand, singing, heading to get treemail together. That's kinda rare in this game. Usually one or two people get the mail and bring it back to camp. So the tribe was shown with a high amount of unity, and RobM was holding hands with Amber and Sue. Apparently Sue doesn't spend all her time alone. With that opening shot I thought we were certain to see Chapera heading to TC at the end and their unity dissolved. Interesting.
About Sue -- despite her apparent unity with the tribe, I think in the end they're going to be uncomfortable keeping someone around who has a screaming fit at Jeff. Maybe she quits and they don't go to TC, but if they lose IC I think she's the logical boot with RobM, Tom, Amber controlling the vote. There's no way Sue could rally Rupert, Jenna and Alicia to her side and I don't see why RobM would want Rupert or Jenna gone first.
-BbB

I do more to not work than actual work.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-27-04, 12:02 PM (EST)

7. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

LAST EDITED ON 02-27-04 AT 12:06 PM (EST)
LAST EDITED ON 02-27-04 AT 12:04 PM (EST)
You have raised some really interesting points. I totally agree with your assessment of the two tribes....Chapera...WIN at all costs!, play OFFENSE vs. Mogo Mogo playing more defensively. I agree that the story arcs that are peaking now and maybe descending are Sue, Colby, Jerri, and Ethan, in that order. I think the arcs that are just starting are Shii-devil, Kathy, Lex and perhaps Tom.
I disagree with you when you say that Robfadda's dislike of the "pretty boys" is like Tom's dislike of the other "big boys", re. Rupert. Personally I saw Rupert drawn to Tom. I thought Tom giving Rupert the Chapera flag to hold on the way home after the reward was like Tom passing him an olive branch. Rupert seemed to seek out his opinion, and was respectful of him...I look for these two to hit it off well together, perhaps that's how Rupert and Jenna gain entrance into the RobTomAmber alliance. I thought Rupert played his cards out beautifully last night...did'nt barge in and demand his island back....we shall see how he gets "in".
I do feel that Mogo Mogo is one fractured tribe. I think that it is Lex calling the shots over there...We all know that he was really after Rich to go, and I think he swayed Colby and got Colby to do all his dirty work, convincing the ladies, etc. That was great strategizing on Lex's part too, Colby comes across as the alpha male, do it my way....definately his days are numbered. Look how Shii is reacting to him.
I think Robfadda was very positively edited last night....he has one mission and that's the prize, shown to be very supportive of his tribe mates and thrilled with the way the dissolution turned out....and he's still got the girl! He's going to be around much longer.
Sue, her peak is about to happen, in her exit episode, IMO. She brought that entire conflict upon herself, choosing to wait for Rich, knowing that there is no way she's going to get around him without some kind of physical contact....what a loser, IMO. Very negative editing with the lashing out snakes and rats, finger wagging to Jiffy, I thought. Good riddence Survivor Sue!
Flowerpower

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ADKer 143 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
02-27-04, 01:06 PM (EST)

11. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

I disagree that there is a natural "pretty boy" competition between Colby and Ethan. If anything, there is a natural affinity because of common personality traits, i.e. both have an absolute trust of Tina and a "moral" approach to playing the game of Survivor. The natural affinity caused Colby to change the boot to Richard, which I think was a mistake. I believe that Colby could have trusted Richard, until the final 3 and booting Richard divided the tribe. Colby has too much in common with Ethan to boot him instead of the naked gay guy running around camp calling Colby "honey".
Also, you are not paranoid if they really are out to get you.

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managerr 1959 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
02-27-04, 12:12 PM (EST)

8. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

I thought Jerri's story was over as well, but it looks like she's been given a new one: Old Jerri is (sorta) back and is out to get revenge on Colby.
I think this puts her on the frontburner for a couple more weeks. The Black Widow will get her revenge--then Jerri, after getting back at Colby, surviving the elements, and being "successful" at redeeming herself, will leave the game.

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redbeard103152 466 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
02-27-04, 08:51 PM (EST)

17. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

I agree the editing that Jerri has been getting is alot like the editing Lil got. Her main goal is to get rid of Colby as Lils was to get rid of Burton her betrayer. After the goal is accomplished there will be no part to play for Jerri. And she will take the long walk soon after.RedBeard

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-27-04, 12:38 PM (EST)

9. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

LAST EDITED ON 02-27-04 AT 12:40 PM (EST)
Good thoughts, VS, as always.
Adding some comments about the Sabogas:
I sense Rupert is going to fade into the background for a bit now. His story started off the same as in S7, he wanted to be the leader and provider for his tribe, but whereas he succeeded in S7 he failed miserably this time. Given his gung-ho Drake attitude in S7, I think he will still feel loyalty to the other Sabogans for awhile, though I believe Jerri and Ethan have written him off completely now that they are in Mogo Mogo. Given his poor IC performance he will tread very lightly at Chapera at first, while making himself useful. He will try to remain close to Jenna, imo.
Jerri seems to have decided that she needs to take matters into her own hands now; she wasn't happy at Saboga (i.e. with Rupert controlling things), and her new camp environment has revitalized her into playing the game again. Unfortunately I see this as leading to her demise soon, as Colby is also starting to play hard, and he has to figure that someone tipped Hatch off to what was going on.
Your remarks about Jenna are spot-on, imo, I think while Rupert will try to remain close with her, she won't particularly feel the need to stick with him, though it may be necessary in the long run (if they both go far, as speculated).
As for Ethan, I'm sure he doesn't miss Saboga either. Each time he escapes at TC it gives him more hope, and he is being edited on an small upswing -- he is catching fish now (albeit he was still bested in that department by Rich this week) -- but the misdirection for next week suggests he is going to come into his own as a tribal provider (I believe that blurb refers to Ethan). Nevertheless, we know Colby wants him out sooner rather than later, and everyone at Mogo was agreeable to booting Ethan at first, so he needs a solid alliance to stay in the game, which I don't really see happening.

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JohnMc 2679 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Survivor-themed Cruise Spokesperson"
02-27-04, 01:16 PM (EST)

12. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

<<Jerri seems to have decided that she needs to take matters into her own hands now; she wasn't happy at Saboga (i.e. with Rupert controlling things), and her new camp environment has revitalized her into playing the game again. Unfortunately I see this as leading to her demise soon, as Colby is also starting to play hard, and he has to figure that someone tipped Hatch off to what was going on.>>
VERY valid points, BR. Though Colby won't go on a Lex witchhunt, he definitely will question why the vote didn't go to Ethan. Then again, Kathy knows that Rich was playing 2 sides, and no more than that.
The other thing we can see from this is that the remaining MM who are fairly safe right now are Lex, Shii, and Kathy. Maybe Jerri, but she is definitely on the outside with Ethan right now. Colby has a bigger target now than before. He will definitely be ditched before the jury.
Colby is also playing the same game as he played in S2. He barely made it past the merge because of an old, non-existant, prior-to-purple-rock rule that had ties broken by prior votes. Had Jeff V not gotten the prior vote, then Jeff could possibly have won S2 and been playing ASS!

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
02-27-04, 01:23 PM (EST)

13. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Agreed BR It is amazing how Jenna and Rupert who were pretty comfortable where they were ended up together and on a ballbusting team like Chapera whereas the two vulnerable feeling and not quite in control Jerri and Ethan ended up at Mogo Mogo where that tribe's direction doesn't appear quite as on course. I wonder how things would have played if J/R were on MM and visa versa
What I found also ironic about that is how Rupert and Jenna BEING with Chapera have to take it down a notch. Notice Rupert "asking" permission to sit on the swing; notice Jenna handing the idol right over to Rob M.? They now must take a more subservient role
On the flip side, Ethan and Jerri have stepped it up some. Jerri going for that rice and (dumping 1/2 out) working with Kathy, talking to Rich and being very integral in the boot session. Ethan GLORY BE CAUGHT A FISH THERE and while he was still feeling vulnerable mentions a new day. They have shifted positions now being in MM but are they capable of utilizing it?
Flower, my thoughts really aren't to agree with or disagree with merely just my observations and I enjoy seeing what others are observing as well. It is amazing that we can all watch the show and we all see different things; what one may consider a winner's edit, others don't.
I certainly don't see a huge battle like Rob and the pretty boys but Tom has a very comfortable spot and with no worries that Rob M. would feel like he is competing with him. While Tom and Rupert may get along quite well, I wonder if male human nature would dictate and there will be an element of some careful consideration from Tom that Rupert could fit in too nicely. This is where IMO, Rupert needs to hold back in his take charge actions that may appear that he wants to take over. Seeing that Rupert indicated he learned a lot from this trip and hopefully from his raft and shelter fiascos, this could be shot to lay low a bit and allow people like Sue and Alicia dig holes for themselves. But like what you said they could very well turn into great allies along the way.
What is going to be the most interesting is the merger when people who played and aligned together BEFORE have to make decisions about old loyalities/friendships, new ones and how badly they want to win.
Kathy said something interesting when she was saying that the prior game(s) were about friendships, loyalties, etc and now it is different and about playing the game.
In fact lots of MM talk about trusting your gut, trusting others, etc.
I think we are going to see some inner battles on how to separate the two and the repercussions of same based on new/old alliances, new/old friendships, should be very interesting

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memacmur 359 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host"
02-27-04, 01:06 PM (EST)

10. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Some more thoughts....
Mogo Mogo
Lex - Despite having seen him as an avid strategizer in Africa, we've seen very little of Lex plotting - and when it is there it is short and sweet. I think this means Lex and his gut are safe for quite a few TCs to come.
Ethan/Colby - I see this being an interesting battle -> if they go to TC before the merge, chances are one of these two is going to get the boot, unless...
Jerri - Shown as very, very eager to get rid of Colby. Granted, they explained it through editing as her simply not wanting to repeat the same mistake (a postive light), but still, such devious behaviour could set up a fall.
Kathy - Got to love the snake edit during voting at TC - Right before she voted MB showed us a friendly little snake. It obviously fit the episode, but how long with this snake slither about?
Shii-Ann - Almost forgot about her. Looks like she may have a story arc starting. Could be short, although I think she'll stick around while the Alpha males battle it out.
Chapera
Rawb - Still the dominant male force. Reminds me of Colby's editting in Australia, but with much more cockiness. How big will the bulls-eye be on his back when the tribes merge? Given the amount of time spent on him, I see it either as a sign he goes all the way, or he's being set up for a swift kick in the pants come the merge.
Amber - Baaa. Still seeing little to nothing. I don't see her disappearing anytime soon.
Tom - Here is where it gets interesting... We see his obvious dislike of Sue in a rather humorous manner, possibly setting up an ouster for the boy named sue. Also seemed to tease a potential conflict with Tom and Alicia - perhaps Tom setting up his targets, or could he actually be smart enough to fake conflict to hide an alliance?
Alicia - Yep, she's Alicia. Looks fairly safe by keeping close to Rawb and Amber. Not really getting too much more other than what I mentioned above.
Sue - Well, we know we get to see her go nuts next week. Could be a little too much for her tribemates. I think Chapera takes the Colby approach and 'cuts out the cancer' next time they go to TC
Rupert - Which bodes well for the big guy! The first few weeks we've watched the downfall of Rupert's tribe. The question I have is whether the story is that of the Phoenix rising from the ashes, or if will leave a humbled man...
Jenna - They paused so darn long when she was standing by herself I became convinced she's going places. I still think she's getting a very positive edit, and definitely has that 'underdog you want to cheer for' feel.

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-27-04, 01:34 PM (EST)

14. "few quick thoughts"

LAST EDITED ON 02-27-04 AT 01:38 PM (EST)
again, agree on the Jenna thing. cf. Clay's diamond in the rough. she's golden for now, and my pick to win the whole thing
re: chapera's "play to win" vs mogo mogo's "play for 2nd" - I tend to agree, but we need to be careful here. watch for "pride goeth before the fall" with chappy, whereas colby told us mogo mogo had been content with 2nd but NO LONGER. in addition, mogo finally had some complex strategy going on - may be too little, too late and only because it was their first vote, but it may bode well especially for JERRI (again, if she makes the merge, which I doubt, watch out for her)
re: ALICIA, i'm growing a bit more wary of her, as she's sunk into the background a lot the past couple episodes. there may be more here than meets the eye. she was almost playful with Tom. despite being almost invisible, she's still punching out the "we're gonna kick their ass" lines. as with chappy as a whole, is this merely hubris, or actual fact? and does it serve just for the team, or for her as an individual too?
also, TOM is still my #2 candidate (but if Jenna is the winner, I expect him to be 3rd or 4th, with amber or alicia in 2nd.

- RMMNW!!!

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munson 1314 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
02-27-04, 05:07 PM (EST)

15. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Very good analysis, as usual, in this thread. Must say that I agree with all the Jenna comments. To this point, it sure looks like she's getting a Winner's edit.
MB has shown us that she was "DA MAN" at Saboga, making the calls on who would be voted out. The others even commented that the Tina boot set the tone for the game. She's taken a bit of a back seat in E3 and E4 but there was no mistaking the impact of her editing in E5.
On the opposite end of the spectrum, Amber is still MIA. I keep waiting and waiting for something - anything - that will change my mind that she's getting a Darrah edit.
As for Rob, if Varner didn't tell us that everyone hated him at the end of the game, I'd think I was watching another Winner edit. I just don't believe that Rob can win if he goes ahead and pisses everyone off. I think this group is still very concerned about playing the game with a high moral standard and integrity. Explains why they're voting off those they say they can't trust. But that's pretty hypocritical when they all lied to Hatch, huh? "We think you'll lie to us in the future and that's awful so we'll lie to you now and get rid of you...just in case. See. We're justified."
If there's any difference in Big Tom's edit from Africa to ASS, I can't see it.

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bondt007 3413 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
02-27-04, 05:42 PM (EST)

16. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

It really is amazing how little we have heard from or seen of Lex. Has anyone done "quotable quotes" from the players yet ("...just write me a check..." and so on)? I only have the last two ep. on tape...

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
02-28-04, 07:56 AM (EST)

18. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Lex did not have any THERE IT IS quotes if you will but he did say, I believe in Episode 2 upon seeing Tina voted off that it set the tone for the game, it is business this time and in Ep. 1 he was quoted as saying that there hasn't been a moment since S3 that he hasn't thought about returning to the game.
This basically tells me two things about Lex which we pretty much know. He is an emotionally invested person and he was gunning for Richard Hatch, also a winner.
I fear that Lex, as before, and like Kathy, will make the same errors as last time and get too emotionally involved and allow that to take over objective game play. Some people, try as they might, can't separate the two.

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Chez 777 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
02-28-04, 10:57 AM (EST)

19. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Lex showed himself in Africa to be extremely loyal to his alliance (as well as paranoid). I would think he still feels that bond with Ethan. It would not surprise me if he helped to engineer the Ethan pick from dissolved Seboga, by suggesting E. could be booted first. But then afterwards he took the (invisible to us) lead in suggesting Ethan be left safe, while convincing Colby to go after someone else, like Rich. Lex is smart. Don't know how long E. will stick around anyway, though.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
02-28-04, 01:31 PM (EST)

20. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

I am more concerned about Lex and Tom's relationship. They are on different tribes but had a very tight alliance (until Tom got booted of course ) THIS is going to be interesting to watch and see how Lex handles Ethan (former alliance and S3), Tom (former alliance and S3)and Kathy (current friend) as well as Mogo Mogo (current tribe) in general and if he can emotionally detach himself

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pinchy 200 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
02-28-04, 10:05 PM (EST)

21. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

actully responding to someone's question about Tom's editing (different from Africa?) and the no Amber storyline bit.
I did see two things in the TC challenge beam exercise.
1)Amber's superwoman balance recovery (even Jeff commented on it)
2)Tom's amazingly resilient swing/near fall/recovery as well.
They were both spotlighted here individually (different from the other's one on one highlited encounters in this event).
Also, maybe Sue's storyline coming to the end is indicated by showing her perceptive strategy of falling purposefully off the beam to allow Rob M to get the remaining flag (and eveyone else followed suit, showing her leadership qualities, in spite of everything). I still can't see her going much farther.

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Cuauhtewatemoccajava 133 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
02-28-04, 10:59 PM (EST)

22. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

When we're commenting on performances in a single IC and relating that to the longevity of players in the game, you know people are really thinking outside the box (hehe).
Seriously though, I really wouldn't put that much weight into what happened at this IC unless you're going to do an analysis of all of them.

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udg 3381 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
02-29-04, 04:28 AM (EST)

23. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

LAST EDITED ON 02-29-04 AT 04:29 AM (EST)
Edited, because I'm a moron and posted in the wrong thread!
---
UDG

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
02-29-04, 08:58 AM (EST)

24. "Players Vs. Drama"

LAST EDITED ON 02-29-04 AT 09:32 AM (EST)
I just can not believe how much DRAMA is in this ASS show. It really seems that there are two "camps" of players. Those that really are there for the game and the money, and those there that are stirring the pot with all kinds of drama. For example, Colby really has been shown not getting along with the group that much....sleeps alone on the beach, does'nt play the little word games with the group, etc. But he's been keeping a low profile until now. But now he just seems to be making blatantly unwise choices. Perhaps on direction from Lex, he takes it upon himself to convince the other Mogo's that they should boot Dicque...thus setting himself up to look like "the boss"....then the comments at TC, regarding those that are coasting through, and then the previews with Shii-devil, telling her that she'll never have to lie the entire game, because she never has to make a decision....that is blatantly setting yourself up....could he sincerely be that stupid??? To me it looks as though he is just stirring the pot, creating drama, rather than really playing the game.
As for Sue, she just seems to capitalize on drama whereever she can find it....she is the ultimate drama queen. She got so much attention from her rats and snakes speech on S1, I think her entire reason for doing S8 was to call more attention to herself anyway she could, I don't think she intended to win the money at all. Now after making all the wrong choices, she'll have her rats and snakes melt down over the Dicquegate incident, so she's done...she'll quit, IMO, a serious loser.
I just want this game to be for the players, the drama mongers are pulling it down. Here's who I think are players vs. mongers?
Players: Kathy, Lex, Jenna L., Rob M., Rupert, Tom, Alicia, Amber, and even Ethan(has the most to overcome as a previous winner...to me, he is still desparately trying to play this game)
Drama Mongers: SUE-there to attract attention to herself only, Jerri-just there to try to change her image, and maybe to get some revenge, Colby-not as motivated as the first time, stirring the pot??, Shii-devil-so weak a player she's just happy to be included...not really there for the prize.
Edited to add that I do think that there is something to Varner's preS8 analysis, as he called this players vs. drama queens to the letter, IMO.

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Rothschild 496 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
02-29-04, 09:52 AM (EST)

25. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

Rob M Observations

Does anybody find his comment after the "beam game" --
(Speaking directly to the camera)
"Colby isn't that tough, LADIES" ... interesting ...?

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-04-04, 09:55 PM (EST)

26. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

>Chapera WOW, their goal is TO WIN, period.

After watching episode 6, this is an understatement! Serious foreshadowing going on tonight! "The six of us, let's stick together, NO MATTER WHAT!".....I predict a serious Pagonging of the Mogo's, the truely Happy Chappy's are sticking together no matter what, and I say they are on a roll. They are becoming a unified team! Look out Mogo's. Robfadda is still "the man" at Chappy. I thought it was positive editing of him and Amber going after another alliance with Rupert and Jenna L. Definately shows that he is trying to cover all bases. Definately see that Alicia is now lowest man on the Chappy totem pole.
Jenna L- again the editing is showing her to be the odd man out and a weak link in their challenge chain. She was the only one that did not want to do the RC, would have rather shared....she was the only one that did'nt want to play....hmmmm? Then, once again she single handedly blew that challenge....definately shown to be non-threatening....hmmmmm? Let's see how non threatening she'll be in the future!
Rupertlaying very level headedly....going with the Romber alliance but somewhat skeptical....smart thinking Rupie! Wants to be a provider, be a valued asset to the tribe....trying to assimilate into the tribe. Smart playing this week.
Tom: Perhaps VS called it, feeling a little rivalry with the other "big boy". Shows he's really thinking in this game and that the good ole drunk, dancing boy act may be just a screen. We know he's a serious playya! Showed little sensitivity for the Sue crisis....no surprise there.
Alicia: Low woman on the totem pole with Romber....not too fond of Tom's antics....a serious strength to the future challenges for Chappy, a committed playya.
Amber: Lucky to have hooked up with Robfadda, but who is playing who, maybe Amber will be deserving.....
The Mogo's are still one fractured tribe. Now, Lex thinks he's in control....and Colby seems onto him, but, Kathy thinks she's got the power... Jerri is sucking up to Lex, Ethan is letting Lex be the Alpha....looks like some posturing between 3 alpha's....Lex vs. Colby vs. Kathy. Let them have their "last supper" with the shish-k-bobs, and let's see what the remaining challenges bring. Above all to me it looks as if Lex is really starting to do some serious plotting/planning, playing the game hard. Positive editing with keeping quiet about his fishing skills while Rich was there, but now he's emerging. Colby definately feels threatened, I think. He knew Lex had him doing his dirty work last week. He's playing very defensively now.
Feel like Colby, Jerri, and Ethan are into their story arcs, Lex and Kathy's are just getting into gear. We shall see. I found this episode to be very enlightening into the tribe dynamics! Can't wait to see it unfold!
Flowerpower

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SnowBunny 79 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
03-04-04, 10:40 PM (EST)

27. "Rupert"

Rupert's face at the end of the show tonight, as he sat there giggling with his new "friends" bothered me a little. His eyes seemed to be sparkling, but I could practically see in there the little fat guy desperately trying to fit in with the cool boys in the schoolyard. He talks the talk in confessional about not knowing whether to trust them, but I have a feeling he will be hurt big-time by this bunch.

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okaloosajohn 1259 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
03-05-04, 11:58 AM (EST)

35. "RE: Rupert"

Am I the only one who heard him say he thought he could trust Jenna and Rob? I don't think the man learned a thing from S7...

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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-05-04, 12:53 PM (EST)

36. "RE: Rupert"

I guess he thinks Jenna and Rob are the popular kids and he wants to fit in.

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-05-04, 12:55 PM (EST)

37. "RE: Rupert"

that's exactly what i thought too. the idiot was practically wetting himself that RAWB and AMBER wanted HIM in an alliance. what a loser. i lost all respect for rupert last night.

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Risti 190 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
03-05-04, 01:07 AM (EST)

28. "Narrators, Commentators, and Strategists"

Perhaps I've been a bit blind the last couple challenges, but a few things struck me on this episode. The narrators of the group have changed, some on an extreme level, some more subtly. Some of the changes could have been due to the nature of this episode, but I thought I'd post what I was thinking.
Mogo Mogo
With the King gone, the role of primary narrator for this tribe is up for grabs. We already saw many perspectives last week with the scheming going on, but this week they seemed to settle. Shi Ann is giving us alot of commentary. (To much for my tastes...and I liked her back in Thailand!) Lex seems to have settled in as the main narrator, something that was starting in previous episodes already. Jerry is still a voice being heard alot for commentary, but often in dissention with the rest of the tribe. Kathy told us her role at the very beginning, but then either I tuned out, or we didn't see much of her after that, beyond the 'don't talk about food'. Ethan was there, but telling us his story, not the tribe's. Colby didn't say much, but what he did say was signficant, and usually relating to strategy theory.
Chapera
Sue obviously had alot to say this episode. However, her storyline was focused on herself, not the tribe. I found it interesting that on this new tribe, Rupert's role as narrator seems to be closer to what it was in S7 then it was back in Saboga. Whereas Rob was often giving us the play by play in the tribe before, his role has shifted to something I'll discuss in a second. Rupert, on the other hand, let us know how Sue was dealing, brought us up to speed on the food/provider issue, and even gave the details of who was talking to him and Jenna about alliances. Rob seemed to move from narrator to strategist. He was the one who brought up how Sue's incident would affect the tribe. We see his thoughts on the Romber/Saboga alliance. His only comment about Rupert providing is that he will decide how long Rupert is around.
Alicia and Tom provided contrasting commentary. Alicia's was generally sympathetic - she seemed the most on Sue's side, while Tom's seemed to sum up the voice of 'let's move on with the game'. Both spoke alot more then Jenna, who seemed to almost disapear this episode. Amber had a few nice speeches at the end, much the way Kathy was portrayed when Jenna quit.
So...I'm a rookie at this, and I'm going off of a memory from 4 hours ago now, but these are my thoughts. The strategist roles(Colby/Kathy for MM, Rob for Chapera) are often used as set up for a fall. When people discuss their brilliant strategy, it very rarely comes true for much longer. We're at the point now where 'second stage' narrators are being developped, and Ethan and Rupert, both being providers, seem to be falling into those roles. This probably guarantees them a spot well into the merge, but beyond that is questionable. I should really watch the show again to look closer at the 'commentators'. Shi Ann, as much as she was grating on my nerves, didn't really have a negative commentary. She seemed quite deluded at times, but that 'I can see what you can't' attitude is sometimes a sign that the character will outlast their tribemates(Sometimes it's a sign that they're just crazy and will be going soon). Jerry's was more negative, and combined with the previews for next week I see her going into the 'hated-one' role.
Tom and Alicia confuse me. They're neither under the radar nor in the spotlight. All and all, that seems to suggest they'll be around for awhile. Jenna's sudden drop was probably one of the biggest surprises for me. I mean, I think we had more confessionals for Amber.
Speaking of Amber. Whatever can you say about Amber.

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pinchy 200 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-05-04, 01:16 AM (EST)

29. "RE: Narrators, Commentators, and Strategists"

Well, last season the stategist role was played by Jonny Fairplay, and he made it to final 4 (3). So, I think Rob could make it that far.

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-05-04, 01:56 AM (EST)

30. "RE: Narrators, Commentators, and Strategists"

yeah, I could see Rob going about 4th or 5th, or 9th or 10th
also re: jenna disappearing, that just reinforces my opinion that she's the winner.
my rankings last week were
jenna 50%
tom 20%
jerri 20%
amber 10%
jenna and amber (for actually being shown to play the game/ strategize a bit) moved up some. jerri and tom dropped for some slightly negative editing (jerri talking avout food, annoying tribemates, tom for suegate - but N.B. that his commentary on sue was much different than Rawb's or Rupert's - those two emphasized how she was being greedy, etc. Tom's reaction was merely a personal dislike ala Keith's reaction to Jerri's boot in S2. i see Tom's commentary as less negative than R&R's)
so my rankings now:
jenna 55%
tom 17%
amber 15%
jerri 11%
and about 1% each for emerging darkhorses lex and alicia
may come back with more thoughts in the A.M.

- RMMNW!!!

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badger 1273 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
03-05-04, 09:32 AM (EST)

31. "chapera and the reaction to sue"

i thought it was quite interesting last night to watch chapera deal with sue.
of note:
alicia -- she seemed to be the most understanding, both in her interactions with sue, with other tribe members, and in her confessions. certainly the narrator for this event.
jenna -- where was jenna?!? she wanted to share the reward challenge with mogo mogo, but was shot down. hmmmm.
amber -- she hugged jenna m when hearing about her mother, but didn't quite generate the same "love" for sue. now, granted, sue might not have wanted a hug from anyone, let alone amber. but i don't think amber was portrayed as being as understanding about the situation as alicia. second only to alicia as narrator for this event.
rupert -- blamed sue for being greedy. sees the game as most important. certainly not a very understanding response for someone who works with at-risk youth, a group that in my experience has oftentimes suffered some sort of sexual abuse or assault.
rob -- what a jerk. narrator for his tribe, but totally self-centered.
tom -- has a moment of trying to understand, but once sue is gone, is a total *ss.
i also thought kathy and shii ann's responses were noteworthy. shii ann seemed sympathetic; kathy rather cold-hearted. shii ann is clearly the narrator for her tribe, an indication she'll do well.

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raidersfantom 137 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
03-05-04, 09:56 AM (EST)

32. "RE: chapera and the reaction to sue"

Before I go to far, I think what has to be considered is this: Chapera were probably planning on ousting Sue if they lost an IC, so she knew she was on the chopping block; Chapera looked like they had the wind taken out of their sails at the RC when she quit.
Robfaddah once again showed a slight bit of sensitivity when he did say that maybe she's playing the game and looking for a big payday, or maybe it really affects her, no one knows what Sue is really thinking.
These 18 people came to win a million bucks. If one of their own quits it doesn't matter, all that matters is the money to these guys or they wouldn't have come back. Sue's tribemates looked as though they were trying to bring back some positivity to the camp after one of the worst moments ever. Yes they were insensitive, but they're on some little island in the Pacific playing for a million bucks, with barely any food. What would you do?

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spastiman 47 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
03-05-04, 10:05 AM (EST)

33. "RE: chapera and the reaction to sue"

Well according to Sue (on TES today) food was not a problem. She says they had an abundance of it.

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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-05-04, 11:51 AM (EST)

34. "RE: chapera and the reaction to sue"

Also on The Early Show both Sue and Rich said that they understood how Chapera was feeling when Sue left. Sue didn't seem to hold any grudges about the others thinking of the game and doubting her intentions. Rich and Sue both understand that everyone has to be there to win, not make friends.

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memacmur 359 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host"
03-05-04, 01:10 PM (EST)

38. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

Very, very interesting tidbits in Mogo Mogo when they took the focus away from Sue. So lets start there, shall we (imagining chorus of yes, with one strange person saying no)?
Mogo Mogo
What a tangled web you weave, Mr Hatch! Richard leaves and it looks like the tribal alliances have gone to hell in a handbasket.
Kathy - Shown as being somewhat offended by the Sue incident (negative editting). Also clearly the woman in the tribe perceived to have the most power. I think Shii Ann may be doing well to hide behind Kathy in dealing with Lex and Colby.
Colby - I sense a showdown between Shii Ann and Colby - one will probably make it through (and do fairly well, possible Pagonging aside), the other will be one of the next 2 Mogo Mogo boots (Jerri/Ethan may mess things up some more). The one quote of his that made me take note was in his confessional when he admitted Shii Anns game could work, but he had no respect for it. That might be changing when she helps orchestrate the snuffing of you torch, Captain America (rolloing eyes).
Shii Ann - Suddenly giving a good amount of commentary. Also seen as the most sympathetic to Sue. All point to nice editting, i.e. I think she survives the battle with Colby.
Lex - His gut must be in knots trying to figure out what is going on. Ethan is playing nice, trying to work their Africa connection, Jerri is professing her trust, and Kathy seems to be working with him, while Colby is glancing every which way. His emergence as the new King Neptune was interesting, and the fact that he chose to hide his abilities seemed like a case of editting designed to demonstrate his smart gameplay (a la many of Rob C's edits in the Amazon). I think he's around as long as any of the Mogo Mogo tribe is left standing.
Jerri - She seems to just about be out of her story arc. Clearly seems to be trying too hard to fit in - this may lead to her going before Ethan, albeit all depends on how quickly the Colby-Shii Ann feud goes. If the previews showing Jerri riling up some anger with the Colbster, it could go either way - Colby's ire will be on Jerri, but if Lex is willing, it opens an avenue for getting rid of the biggest dog in the yard.
Ethan - Not much of him, except for the one confessional where he admitted trying to lay back in order to fit in. The dip in airtime may be the not-so-unfamiliar dip in airtime previous to a boot. I see him going soon.
Chapera
Sue is gone, which leaves a lot less Chapera behaviour to monitor
Tom - Clearly the least sympathetic towards Sue. However, I think his editting may have been used to try and brighten the demeanour of the episode (MB doesn't want depressed viewers, after all). Not much editting, seems a bit like the odd man out, but my guess is he will stick around.
Rawb - Seemed more like his arrogant cocky self than he has been seen most of ASS. Could be setting up his fall when the merge happens. Or setting up the chance his strategy actually works and takes him somewhere. Interesting
Amber - She was next to Rawb. Did speak for herself a couple of times. That's nice. She's still around for a while, or she'll disappear with us knowing less about her than in her pre-ASS appearance.
Alicia - Still seems to be on the outs. Unless she has a strong hidden alliance (Amber???), I don't see her doing to well in the tribal pecking order, especially since Rupert has started providing some fish
Rupert - Not seen the nicest light this episode. Not sure if this is showing he has grown since PI, and is ready to better at ASS, or if he's foreshadowing his own boot by stating his almost-trust of Ramber.
Jenna L - Little to go from other than her almost always being right next to Amber or Rupert. Rupert is obvious, but the closeness with Amber may take her somewhere. Still one of my picks for the final 2
Whew. Can't wait for some more boots so these ponderings take less time and space!
MEmacmur

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-05-04, 02:16 PM (EST)

39. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

disagree somewhat with your take on Tom - his editing was "I feel bad for Sue, BUT I still don't like her" - more along the lines of a Kathy edit IMO, although with the dance thrown in (still, it was Rawb that started the whole song and dance thing). I felt this was not as negative as Rawb or Rupert whom we repeatedly saw questioning her motives and calling her a greedy beyotch. But you said you thought he was meant to be more lighthearted to a weighty episode, so maybe I don't disagree with you afterall. And in any case, as I said above, I think it probably does hurt his chances of being the winner a bit.
otherwise, I agree with what you say for everyone else

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memacmur 359 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host"
03-05-04, 04:03 PM (EST)

40. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

Good point. Tom didn't come across as badly as either Rawb or Rupert with their 'maybe she's just after a big payday' comments. As you were able to figure out from my typing-in-circles actions, I couldn't decide how they were editting Tom!
I was very suprised by Rupert's comments - even if he said them, I would have expected MB and company to leave them on the cutting room floor in keeping his squeaky-clean Hero of survivor players role.
MEmacmur

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-05-04, 08:10 PM (EST)

41. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

Wow, great thoughts everyone; you all beat me to it; I'll end up being redundant.
Just some thoughts and things that stuck out; some as I said are repeating what all of you articulated
Mogo Mogo vs. Chapera - The defensive individualized tribe vs. the offensive cohesive tribe.
There was WAY too much of Chapera's "all for one and one for all" last night that really gave me pause for thought that something will fracture this tribe. The question is will it be each other or something else.
MM on the other hand have 80 million different edgy alliances going on. Who is really with who here? The girls, Kathy/Lex, Lex and the girls, Jerri and Lex? It seems though the two flying by night are Colby and Ethan at this time. Ironic that Colby wanted Hatch off and was integral in this happening and Jerri now indicates Colby is the Hatch of the group. Likewise Shii Ann making a point of noting Kathy's power of Mogo Mogo. Likewise, Colby making note of Lex's game playing.
Kathy interestingly enough has had criticism for anyone who has displayed too much emotional involvement in this game. The irony of this is her past emotionalism herself. Will the very thing she is now being critical of be her nemesis again this time.
Ethan IMO is just standing there with the rope around his neck; his only saving grace (thus far) has been anyone else tightening the noose around themselves first. Ethan is a past winner and has no support staff. He simply is a dead man walking and he reeks of it.
Colby certainly has become edgier this season or what we are seeing of him. His disdain for the strategy employed by Shii Ann seems indicative (if you support editing) that HER type of strategy may go further than HIS type of strategy but that remains to be seen.
And Shii Ann? I still maintain her game play is solely good enough until her vote is no longer needed; in that vein Colby is right BUT he may wish he played the same angle.
Kathy and Lex appear to be the nucleus. It will be interesting to see what happens when they have to face each other and either stick together or betray one another.
Chapera's Happy Tribe has a lot bubbling beneath the surface. Who really IS running this show. From all accounts and the editing, Rob M. is getting the "I'm in charge" death wish. I am amazed every week how much we are being shown by him of how he is ruling the roost and how he is controlling everyone's move. I get vibes that he is going to come down and hard and by the very people he thinks he is lord and master over.
Tom and Rupert and the hedging Tom is feeling. My earlier thoughts commented on Tom's potential insecurity with Rupert coming into the fold may have been confirmed here. After last night it struck me that when it comes down to it, whoever makes the choices (Rob for example) may pay off in choosing Rupert over Tom and Tom's foreshadowing come to fruition.
The alliance of Rupert, Jenna, Amber and Rob. Amber the mouthpiece?? WOW! Who IS calling the shots there? Going back to Rob saying he could trust Amber makes me wonder if Amber plays any part in a Rob downfall and Rupert HOPING he can trust Amber and Rob but KNOWS he can trust Jenna scares me that Jenna will betray Rupert.
As stated Jenna AGAIN the lone person wanting diplomacy instead of competition and being the only one standing there with it. Something very strange on her editing. Like the little engine that could. Her talks of her Saboga time flushed down the toilet to start all over, picked last from Saboga and being the lone voice to not compete. Something is up with her story.
Rupert replaying PI all over again. Again, human nature is very hard to change. His past his haunting him. He is giddy with being approached by the powers of Chapera and is SOOO willing to want to trust them REEKS of PI.
Tom and his disarming hick act again. Again, he misses NOTHING. His weapon is his "good ole boy" act but watch him carefully I say; he doesn't miss a trick.
All in all, I see Kathy and Lex as the holding forces with SA and Jerri as helpful third and fourth wheels. Ethan laying his head on the guillotine and Colby's arrogance being his downfall.
At Chapera, Tom has seemed steady, Alicia is on the fray and with a wrong move could cut her throat, with a RIGHT move could help herself (but timing is everything as we know, SA in Thailand had horrible timing when she made a dictator move) and the newly formed foursome is, at some point, going to head for a major decision for each other.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-06-04, 08:20 AM (EST)

42. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

>Rupert KNOWS he can trust Jenna scares me that Jenna will betray Rupert<

I most definately agree. All along I have felt that their bond is really more of a one way street. Rupert has always felt a particular loyalty to his primary tribe...he wanted all the Drakes to go all the way in PI. I feel that Rupert is very committed to Jenna L. However, I have never felt a bond to Rupert from Jenna L. It's almost now as if she is "using" him. It would'nt surprise me in the least if she somehow stabs him in the back. Something Rupert would be blindsided by. I would love to see these two off together plotting something of their own...some kind of back up plan, or since they were approached by Romber, I would love to see them approach Alicia at some point. I have a feeling it will be Tom however, and then it will get back to Romber and this could lead to their demise. Looks of interesting things to watch out for with the Happy Chappy's. For now though, I predict they are going to kick some ASS!

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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-06-04, 09:45 AM (EST)

43. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

>However, I have never felt
>a bond to Rupert from
>Jenna L. It's almost
>now as if she is
>"using" him. It would'nt surprise
>me in the least if
>she somehow stabs him in
>the back. Something Rupert would
>be blindsided by.
This reminds me that Sue used the word "deceiving" to describe Jenna. Sue had to mean something by that. Sue and Jenna were not even on the same tribe for long. But Sue knows something about how this all plays out.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-07-04, 05:52 PM (EST)

44. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

LAST EDITED ON 03-08-04 AT 03:16 PM (EST)
Interesting with the deceiving remark Loree, I agree. I wonder if Sue is actually telling the masses that Jenna's appearance is deceiving in that what we may think of a talkative and perhaps not very strategic player etc is deceiving and that she, in fact, should be given more credit?
In regards to other little tidbits and quotes........
Tom on Rupert - liking him but knowing that it may be a mistake and it would cost him down the road was very telling to me
Colby's take on Lex that he is a competitor and this isn't his first rodeo
Rob's talk to Rupert and Jenna with Amber but Jenna made a strange comment about being unsure because what if they were coming to them the way Alicia came to Amber and Rob. We also know Tom was involved in an alliance building assumingly b/c he feels Rupert could take his place. Seems there has been more discussion about different alliances though they are the Happy Chapera's and all for one
Jenna's prior comment about the story of David and Goliath when going up against Richard Hatch in the prior challenge. Could Jenna end up going against another Goliath and winning out?

More Rob's comments about who HE determines stays and goes (ouch, sorry but that smells of downfall)
ETA: For what it is worth, I think the editing is showing the vulnerability of Ethan, Jerri and Lex. Jerri is a tool that can be used by both Lex and Kathy much like SA is. At Chapera, Alicia is seemingly the only one left out of a lot of loops but if we are to believe Rob/Amber in power, then anyone other than them is in danger. The Chapera's WILL end up hurting one another while MM are already deep in that mindset.
Jerri's summation of Colby being the new Richard Hatch sent a radar to me. Mogo Mogo do not like obvious leaders. Take the reins is a bad thing which is why Kathy and Lex have been very subtle in their roles. I am also bothered greatly by the lack of bonding I have seen with Lex/Ethan considering their history. Colby's RISE may lead to a small drop while Ethan and Jerri, the displaced Sabogas, are looked at with fresh eyes.
Case in point, COLBY made a point of saying to choose Ethan so THEY could control how long he stays. The irony if that came back to bite Colby

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-09-04, 08:21 AM (EST)

45. "RE: After Sue; The Players, The Game, The Editting"

I hope I am not the only one who likes to do this
I go back to first quotes and analysis to see how I am doing (not always a good thing) My take on Colby who I do believe, right or wrong is the boot this week was......

(This was after we saw an extremely UTR Colby)
we got to see a bit more of the fun Colby which was refreshing. I hope these Survivors figure if they can’t win, have fun. Colby may just be learning a thing or two from Hatch. He won’t do badly but the target on his back will be just as big as past winners.
I do believe this may be coming to fruition now as evidenced by Jerri's talk of Colby being the new Richard Hatch
--Jerri may get her wish and do to Colby what Colby did to her
--SA may get her wish by showing Colby her game play is the better game play
--Rob M. may get his wish in that he can break Ethan's neck at a closer range by having Ethan stick around a bit longer.
--Rob M's comment: "Colby, he ain't as tough as you think ladies"

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Get Bent 293 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-10-04, 00:24 AM (EST)

46. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

I think everyone has hit every possible perception of the survivors. I am sorry I missed so much being on vacation.
I only wanted to add. Rob may NOT headed for a downfall. His comments reminded me of the ones of Brian from "The Boring" season. Brian was edited to be in total control, and even belittled his comrades in confessionals. Now that season sucked, so MB may have learned from that editing, but you never know...

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-10-04, 08:16 AM (EST)

47. "The Robfadda Show"

The Robfadda Show lives on and on. I am not surprised at the Robfadda being chosen as the tribe narrator. I personally find almost everything that comes out of his mouth very amusing. He calls it, as HE sees it. Some of the more noteworthy quotes being, "I'm obviously the brains of this operation", "we're the misfit survivors, the baffoon tribe", On Amber, "I've got an alliance with Amber, why not, she's beautiful, I trust her, she's not gonna screw me..." , On Colby, "he ain't as tough as you think, ladies".
Let's face it, the Robfadda makes for entertaining TV. Now, let's examine all of the challenges so far that seem tailor made to fit Robfadda. He's a strong construction worker from Boston, a coastal city. Of course he's going to be a strong swimmer. Then we have the home building challenge, and the raft building challenge. Then we have the balance beam challenge....uh, I do think urban construction workers are quite adept at balance....
It just seems to me that these challenges are custom made for Rob.
I think the producers of the show had to be THRILLED that a romance developed....all the more attention to throw Robfadda's way...."Who knew? Frustration, sleep deprivation and dehydration are the perfect ingredients for love!"
The editing of Rob for the most part has been somewhat positive. It seems like you either love him or you hate him...there seems to be no grey area with him. It's obvious that Robfadda is happy with the game that is playing out. He's single handedly winning the challenges, he thinks he's in control of the tribe, he will decide who goes, he's got a girlfriend, he loves to sing and have fun...provoking Tom to sing, dance, and drink. We know he is determined with his eye on the prize and he is shown with several alliances that will probably give him options towards the end.
Do you think that all of this "Robfadda Show" is just alot of hype to build him up for a huge dramatic fall, or could it be that he is indeed being given a special edit for the F2?

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-10-04, 12:09 PM (EST)

48. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

Do you think that all of this "Robfadda Show" is just alot of hype to build him up for a huge dramatic fall, or could it be that he is indeed being given a special edit for the F2?
Though Veruca seems convinced of the former, with each episode I become more convinced of the latter. I think he is being edited like Richard Hatch in S1; in fact, it's looking like AllStars is going to follow the schematic of S1 more closely than any other installment.
Rob's already set up solid endgame alliances on his tribe -- first and most closely with Amber; next, a three-way alliance including Tom; now, a four-way alliance including Rupert and Jenna (as apparent alternates to Tom). Kind of like the Tagi alliance in S1 with Dr. Sean as an extra pawn to use.
Everyone at Mogo Mogo has been employing more of a wait-and-see strategy. I highly doubt that *any* final 2 alliance has been cemented there, let alone solid alliances of three or four. There are too many prospective "playas" there, who will want to re-evaluate their options at every turn.
Rob was blessed with an original tribe of idiots, as he correctly noted (and he just picked up another dimwit in Rupert). I wonder -- if Chapera went into the merge at a disadvantage, would Mogo Mogo be able to pagong them? I have a feeling the Mogos are too disparate to even accomplish that; Rob could manage to swing, say, Shii Ann (or even Ethan?) to get back the advantage.
If Chapera enters the merge at an advantage, MogoMogo will be toast very quickly. And much like Pagong in S1, they won't have a clue that it's coming until it's too late.
It's possible Rob is taken out by one of his own tribe at F3 or F4, but right now I'm banking against that from the editing. I totally see Rob in the final 2.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-10-04, 12:26 PM (EST)

49. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

LOL BR, that would be true
BUT, I would concede that a big fall can happen any time and what would be the biggest would be the fall at final two. So, with that, I'll concede his story/editing, etc. has been geared to a huge "running the how and the game" but it just reeks to me that a pointy needle is going to burst his balloon.
But as much as I tend to cringe when I hear his weekly spiel of how everything pretty much is when HE decides, I do admit he is doing rather well thus far. BUT, with his confidence, I see (or hope to see rather) a situation where he no longer CAN make the decision (and what irony that is)
Now with Jenna's statement about the story of David and Goliath, would that not be a fantastic represenation of her going up against the Robfather as David and he being the Goliath. Though I still wonder if he will be doomed as a result of Amber though as well.

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-10-04, 12:40 PM (EST)

50. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

I do think there are enough "clues" that point to Jenna being the other person in the Final 2 -- and even if Rob is being edited like Richard Hatch, the big surprise, as you say, could be that he *doesn't* win.
It's just that normally someone whose gotten Rob's editing I would expect to be leaving the game right about now or very soon, and I just don't see that happening with Rob, so I'm betting he's in for the long haul. I also don't intuit that he'll be booted at F3, for some reason -- I guess because that's become the norm for the "strategic" player, and somehow I feel we're in store for something different this time.
But I hate speculating too much about the endgame this early, so I'll leave it at that for now.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-10-04, 01:17 PM (EST)

51. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

LAST EDITED ON 03-10-04 AT 02:57 PM (EST)
It's just that normally someone whose gotten Rob's editing I would expect to be leaving the game right about now or very soon
Agreed but then I had thought wayyyyyyyyyyyy back in my long winded way that they were going to tweak their editing style with regard to the players. We shall see
Oh don't mind me about final two gibberish, I only take this one episode at a time, my mind can't handle more than that

ETA: I don't like #################

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redbeard103152 466 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
03-10-04, 02:27 PM (EST)

52. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

Agree with most of your thoughts VS. But one quote of Robbfathers about his alliance making it to the end unless one of them gets greedy still sticks out in my mind. For some reason with his ego and his godfather control that he thinks he has over his tribemates I cant help but feel that it will be him that will turn out to be the greedy one and it will lead to his boot.RedBeard

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Get Bent 293 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-11-04, 00:52 AM (EST)

54. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

I think Rob is getting Rupert S7 style editing. Being shown as the reason the tribe is doing well and in control. This would mean a jury showing at least I would think.

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Brat2u 93 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
03-23-04, 11:26 AM (EST)

100. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

LAST EDITED ON 03-23-04 AT 11:29 AM (EST)
This probably isn't the correct spot to post this.
From the TVGuide romance article:
"Amber's got a sweet a--", he(Rob) said last NOVEMBER while kicking back at the Casa Charlito B&B on Contadora Island off the coast of Panama....
If he's at a B&B in November, filming wrapped early December right??? So Rob's gone before the F2 at least???
ETA: I copied a link and the whole picture showed up, so sorry!!! How do I get rid of it?

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emydi 13669 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-23-04, 12:02 PM (EST)

101. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

I said hmmmmm about the November quote too when I read the article. I'm not sure if it's a spoiler or a mistake by the author though. Rob said she had a sweet ##### in Episode 8 which was taped in November. Can we contact Shawna Malcom at TV guide???
EMYDI

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-23-04, 12:27 PM (EST)

102. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

The article starts off saying "In the days leading up to Survivor All Stars..." The way the paragraph is written it sounds like all the quotes are from that time interval.
Snewser's calendar has the game proper starting on November 3rd. We know the tribes were holed up together briefly before the game started, and some press interviews were conducted. So the B&B is probably where the contestants were still lodging on November 1st and 2nd.

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emydi 13669 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-23-04, 12:54 PM (EST)

103. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

Thanks BR, I didnt think it was a mistake on TV Guide's part. ALthough, if it was CBS, that might be a different story....
EMYDI

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Brat2u 93 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
03-24-04, 11:17 AM (EST)

105. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

>So the B&B is probably where the contestants were still lodging on November 1st and 2nd.<
Excellent point BR! What do you think about the above picture? I think I see Rob and Amber's Chappy necklaces, there bathed, make-up, different clothes and beach...

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ManateeBob 38 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
03-26-04, 01:42 PM (EST)

120. "RE: The Robfadda Show"

I happen to be in the "love" the Robfadda camp, but lately Ive been thinking about whether or not we are being deliberately misled over his game this time.
In the confessionals hes obviously the same arrogant Robfadda we saw last time around, but Im getting a bit of a different vibe from the shots of him "in game". Im actually starting to think hes playing the under-the-Radarfadda strategy.
Early on we saw Ambuh talking with Big Tom about who to vote off, now it seems obvious it was Rob pulling the strings but it was Ambuh actually interfacing with BT.
When the Sabogans got assimilated he and Ambuh approached them not as "were in charge here" but "were the outsiders in our own tribe and we need you".
On the yacht the girls are pumping Kathy for info while Rob and BT are elsewhere on the boat but we know from Toms comments that it was all planned that way. (if you still have the ep on tape watch how pointed Ambuhs questions to Kathy are)
Then after the log roll when Alicia was apparently annoying all of the Chappys we get Rob talking to Ambuh saying "After this my patience is so good, I can handle anything." Again no in-her-face confrontation despite the fact we get a confessional in which he opined every mosquitoe in the vicinity is annoyed.
Clearly everyone in Chappy knows about his linkage with Ambuh, but it seems that BT was not privy to their alliance with the Sabogans, the Sabogans may not know abut he and Tom, and I did not get the impression from Sue (before the quit boat) or Alicia that they have a sense of the Robfadda being linked to every other player in the tribe to one degree or another.
If you buy into the relationships outside the game theory then again there has been no reference from either Rob or Lex about any possible agreement they may have.
Now IMO Rob messed up letting his usual ego get the better of him with the whole Rupert or the Spear fishing showdown, but can anyone show me how his in-game play has been as conceited as his perhaps deliberately misleading confessionals have?
My final thought on all this is what if Ambuh with the "smokin @ss" is really the mastermind behind all Rob's scheming anyway? He seemed to be seeking her approval over the "patience" bit, and when he lost his cool it was while he BT and Rup were out away from the girls/women. As many have pointed out the "Amber Edit" has been dramatically different from last time for her, much more screen time in confessionals, and much more emphasis on how she is actively scheming this time.

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Get Bent 293 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-10-04, 11:50 PM (EST)

53. "Sue's Web Chat"

I finally got around to reading Sue's web chat, a Jenna M radio interview, and the Insider videos. There was a lot of spoiling information in it!
#1) In the editing, we are shown Rob as a workhorse. Yet according to Sue, he and Amber were the laziest. So Rob is getting a very positive edit.
#2) Sue called Amber pushy (and lazy). We haven't seen that, so again, Amber getting a positive edit.
#3) Sue said she was in an alliance with Alicia, which we didn't see. I wonder why? So we don't realize that Alicia is now vulnerable? Maybe to the average viewer I suppose.
#4) Jenna M said that after Rupert made his comment about "... but to quit, it's hard", that Rob M told him to shut up. Why would Rob scold Rupert when Tom and Alicia said things 10 times worse? Because he doesn't respect him, because he is the new kid on the block and doesn't have a relationship with him? Or simply because he wasn't on his tribe at the time? And why wouldn't they show Rob's comment? Would it make Rob M look bad? Would it cast doubt in the viewers heads about the now alliance of four?
#5) In the Insider interview, Jerri talked about how Colby ripped on her regarding wanting to cook. The interesting thing about it to me is that Kathy told her that he said that. Why would she say that to Jerri, and why would they not show it? IMHO, it was becuase we would be more likely to speculate that Colby is more vulnerable.
These are just my observations from what we now know DIDN'T make it into the show!

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EMT135 52 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
03-12-04, 04:59 AM (EST)

55. "EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

What are everyone's impressions?
Of note to me:
Lex and Kathy--Both seen quite differently tonight, imo. Lex's involvement in ousting Colby seems rather like Colby's involvement in ousting Hatch. Might mean Lex isn't around much longer.
Kathy's joy at being with the Chappys seems to poke holes in her previously loyal persona. Maybe she's being set up for a fall.
FWIW, I don't see either of these two going soon and have a feeling this may just be the beginning of their demise.
Jerri--ahhhh. Finally, we're seeing the "old" Jerri. The "You can't cook rice," Jerri. Very different editing tonight which leads me to believe she's nearing the end of the ride.
Jenna--thought it was interesting that she was shown as the one questioning Kathy on the yacht. She's still UTR, but this shows that she is strategizing.
Rupert--Unless I missed it, Rupert did not appear anywhere in the shots of the champagne celebration. Anyone else notice? Don't know if there's any spoiler value in this or not. Could just be that after eating so much, he was spending some quality time in the bathroom and missed out on the fun. It does look like he may get more time in next week's edit.
Alicia--It seems like each passing week, we see her less and less, so I'm guessing she may not go for another 3 or so episodes.
Looks like next week will give us a much better feel for what's going on, especially where Romber is concerned. I'll be looking to see who seems interested/threatened by their developing relationship.
EMT

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-12-04, 06:53 AM (EST)

56. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

Well, with out the voice of reason, Kathy, Lex can shoulder the demise of the Mogo's all by himself! I'm glad Kathy was'nt there to go along with the plan. I really thought Kathy would be the one chosen by Chappy as she is one of the weaker ones(as compared to the men) and she has known Rob. She was seen as quite OPEN with the Chappy's. She spilled alot about the existing alliances over there. Sure looks as though she is playing it smart, trying to stay in the Chappy's favor come merge time, keeping her options open. After spending time with the Happy Chappy's, I think she was thrilled to have been picked, but I also feel that she had a sense of serious doubt about the tribe that she is on. She sees how much fun they have at Chappy(granted who would'nt on a yacht), how they are really enjoying the game, and she sees how well they all seem to get along....that has got to be depressing for her when she compares the dynamics at Mogo. I think she definately got to observe the Chappy's solidarity, spirit, and drive....no doubt about it, she's had a chance to size up the competition and she's a little weary now of the fate of her own tribe.
Lex: Definately playing hard, in his own mind....made a decision to take out his biggest threat....before merge...why, oh why does'nt he consider the possibility of getting pagonged? Definately figured out his strategy, take as many people as I can control with me through the merge. Boy, Ethan must feel left out. I admire him...he has the sympathetic edit
Shii-Ann: Almost too much pressure for her to commit to a decision....weak, weak, weak....did'nt know what to do without Kathy.
Alot of irony in the Colby confessionals regarding Jerri....poor Colby. I thought he exited with class. I don't blame him for being a little surly on that tribe...I think some of them would certainly grate on me too.
Jenna L: Once again, shown to be the weakest of the tribe, by far with the challenges...was quite happy with the Chappy's. Grilled Kathy....shows she's strategizing
And what's up with Rupert....antisocial....isolated from the group....maybe papa bear wanted to take a nap on a real bed after a big belly full. I think Ruppie better get with the program and start mingling a little more.
Robfadda: once again, the Robfadda Show....overtakes the professional athlete to win the challenge once again, our hero! Very positive, strong, determined, but certainly knows how to enjoy his down time...and next week, he finally gets the girl. Robfadda's ego must be HUGE...everything is going his way...can't wait to see what happens at merge time when the apple cart is upset.
Tom:Same edit, funny, trying to one up Rupert....feels threatened by Rupert?
Amber: Shown as supportive girlfriend/tribemate cheering for her man....having fun....probably also very happy and secure with her alliances.

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SouperStar 156 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
03-12-04, 06:59 AM (EST)

57. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

Neither Rupert or Jenna were at the champagne ceremony.
I was waiting for a cut to them plotting.
Or hooking up.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-12-04, 09:45 AM (EST)

58. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

LAST EDITED ON 03-12-04 AT 10:15 AM (EST)
You are all off to an early start!!
Forgive my ramblings.......
I went over my first "analysis" if you will and most of it is still holding water; mainly in that a leopard can't change his/her spots. Our personalities are shaped/formed at a very young age and only with a lot of work or some major impact that shakes up our lives can a person truly change who they are.
As of this week, those thoughts of mine are very apparent to me. For example:
Ethan “I’m struggling to find my niche"
Still holding fast and true. Now mind you, I really felt that Ethan's swan song won't happen until Rob has some influence on it and hopefully that will still happen. I find it very hard to believe with the animosity shown ESPECIALLY with Ethan pinpointing (as Colby) last night "doesn't like losing to Chapera AND Rob" Foreshadowing?
We know the deal here, past winner, big target. Again though, I see the main goal of his demise is more because of his "golden boy stature" that irks the likes of Rob (not too mention his cavorting with Jenna and Amber) over the fact he was a past winner. He was the hero, now he could be that goat he speaks about.
INITIAL QUOTES
Lex: "I think I’d be lying if I said there wasn’t a day that went by since being in Africa, that I didn’t think at some point--even if it was just for a moment--about Survivor, about the game, and about the possibility of coming back one day.”
Kathy "Survivor is first and foremost a psychological game"
LAST NIGHT
Lex "You don't get far playing safe. I already made a decision to change my strategy."
Kathy "You know what they (Chapera) have got that we don't have, they are having fun."
AND A DOOZY FROM WHEN HATCH LEFT
"I have got myself in the middle. I don’t know how I got there. So do you trust your gut, you trust loyalty, or you just go with sorta what makes sense? And where am I going? I don’t know"

Again, I lump them together b/c I do feel they are similar in personality and game play. Emotional people and caring people BUT we saw in the past how emotions ended up overriding practical game play and while some of you may feel (and understandbly so) Lex made a logical and timely decision, to me, it was a decision that was first and foremost emotionally based. While some may think (again understandly so) that Kathy is sizing up the situation practically, she is literally falling under an emotional spell. Mind you, I think their WILL to win is great but personalities are personalties. They are warm, parenting people who also, in turn, think that way.
Kathy is being led down an emotional path of getting what she is lacking from MM (meanwhile Tom gloats over the trap they laid for her)
Lex has laid back during the Hatch reign and seemingly was keeping himself in check but how dare Colby rise to power when Lex's natural inclination IS to be the father and leader of his tribe. He states he made a decision to change his strategy. How? Because he got rid of strength; HOW did he base his decision? I would hazard a guess more so out of emotional gratification than practicality. Even SHE questions going down the path of sense OR the path of loyalty/trust
Alicia
"Everybody knows that if you push my buttons you could get me to crack. That could be my demise.”
Make no mistake, backseat Alicia is only temporary. We saw some narrative perspective from her on Kathy as well as an obvious (to me) setting of her on the fringes of Chapera but have no doubt Alicia (and her mouth) will rise again. Why? Because that is who she is. The focus is off her mouth right now because Chapera is happy. Alicia ironically if stepping back is not in a bad position but will her mouth put her in one?
Tom
INITIAL QUOTE:
"This ain’t a little boy’s game; this is for the big boys”
LAST NIGHT:
"Rupert caught more fish with a stick than I did with a 3 million dollar boat"
Well it is starting to become apparent that Tom, while liking Rupert, has issues as to who the REAL big boy here is. Again, Tom is NOT stupid, he just pretends to be Will it come down to which big boy reigns? Probably yes. "Rupert beat me again"(Foreshadow?) Tom so far is handling his strategy well. He, like last time, is the SAME way and it worked great last time BUT only up until the last quarter
Rob M.
INITIAL QUOTE
"I’m the brains behind this operation, so we’re gonna have to make it work somehow"
LAST NIGHT
(Said by others about being trouble)
We see a lot of charisma from Rob which we saw before. We see a lot of confidence/cockiness which again we have seen before. We saw a lot of lying from Rob which we have seen before. Rob ironically ended up getting into trouble when the merger happened in S4 with his games. We shall see if history is destined to repeat itself; this time at least he IS the Rotu 4 (and then some) as opposed to trying to break it down but I fear, again, somehow, someway his arrogance regarding his own talent may get the best of him OR on the flipside, the tough talking, cocky kid from Boston gets screwed because he allowed himself to let his guard down.........
Rupert Hopefully I can do better this time.”
Well, Rupert didn't learn much in the short period of time from PI. And because we are seeing a not so HEROIC Rupert this time around, we know they are not capitalizing (as much) on his popularity but more of Rupert as a person. Rupert is doing what his human nature dictates: trying really hard to compensate for his insecurities and thinking he can get ahead based solely on that. Again, his need for acceptance will override smart playing and he may get blindsided once again.
Jerri There isn't a moment of any day that I don't question why I am out here
I still question her motives as the above quote states. I think Jerri was more hellbent on revenge than anything else (Her statement her goal was to get Colby, well that's done) The fire in her eyes of getting her just rewards was the most spark I've seen from her. Again, human nature dictates and we questioned why she got such low brow editing prior. Surely the Jerri from the beginning was just lying in wait until our beloved S2 Jerri starts showing her skin more. Now we see the emergence (Per Jerri: "Bring it on") I wonder if that is now BECAUSE we will see her downfall come?
Shii Ann
INITIAL QUOTE "It's as it they couldn't hear us"
LAST NIGHT: "You're underestimating my powers. Perhaps you should spend time analyzing your own" AND "I'm stuck here with a bunch of power players" (you said it SA)
Rowr, SA, well I guess you had your payoff, Colby, who DARED to insult your style of game play (but acknowledging it could get her far) lasted longer than the Colbyesque game play. I still feel fairly secure that SA is not long to win this time of game but be utilized in the game. She herself admits she is amongst power players and while some may crash and burn before her she is NOT meant to outlast all of them.
Amber/Jenna L.
I will give Jenna a piece of her quote from last night
".......something good is coming" (Jenna we shall see)
For this episode, I'm combining them mainly because we mostly saw from them just a real happiness and positive attitude. One thing that DID stick with me was the two of them at the end of the RC/IC challenge where they fell over each other. Obviously if you don't subscribe to how MD edits his show, it means nothing. I just raised an eyebrow on that shot as to whether one of them causes stumbling and/or tripping up of each other at some point
Some things that struck me (some already stated)
Ethan's talk of either being the hero or the goat (Ethan you already had your shot at the hero edit)
Jenna/Rupert not partaking of the toast. (not QUITE Chaperas)

Lots of talk about them thinking about the merge (foreshadowing)
Both Colby and Ethan mentioning Rob specifically (Rob is indeed their cancer. Will Ethan be directly involved with Rob)
Jiffy’s talk about the prevailing wisdom of Mogo, i.e. voting out those who are the most threatening as individuals (with a interesting, we'll see if it plays out for you) (Ouch, foreshadowing?)

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udg 3381 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
03-12-04, 10:30 AM (EST)

59. "Rupert..."

we are seeing a not so HEROIC Rupert this time around, we know they are not capitalizing (as much) on his popularity but more of Rupert as a person. Rupert is doing what his human nature dictates: trying really hard to compensate for his insecurities and thinking he can get ahead based solely on that. Again, his need for acceptance will override smart playing and he may get blindsided once again.
Rupert is focused on "taking on that provider role." He's working more on being the thing he thinks will get him far than on doing the things that will get him to the endgame.
---
UDG

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EMT135 52 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
03-12-04, 10:43 AM (EST)

60. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

Great commentary again VS.
Just wanted to point out something that goes along with your statement that people don't change and use some of the quotes you selected:
ROB
>"I’m the brains behind this operation,
>so we’re gonna have to
>make it work somehow"
>
>RUPERT
Hopefully I can do better
>this time.”
Again, his need for
>acceptance will override smart playing
> and he may get
>blindsided once again.
Looking at this, it's easy to see how the personalities of Rob and Rupert must ultimately lead to a major clash--which we will apparently see next week.
Rob is stereotypical playground bully and may sense Rupert's need for approval. Bullies are notorious for targeting people whose self-esteem is low.
Rupert, on the other hand, must see Rob as another Burton; a big bully who he can barely tolerate to be around.
I believe the conflict between Rob and Rupert is going to be BIG, more than we expect, for the reasons you stated. These guys cannot change who they are. And they are, at least in this instance, polar opposites.
EMT

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raidersfantom 137 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
03-12-04, 11:35 AM (EST)

61. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

VS, Rupert was snoring on the couch beside Jenna L. during the chapagne celebration. The whole yacht trip turned into a big strategy play by Chapera. You said it yourself when Tom was talking about "numbing" up Kathy and getting the scoop. I just can't believe that Kathy would spill the beans. Didn't she learn from watching Jenna M. in Amazon, don't say nuthin!
My impression of the editing has been a big set up for one of the best showdowns we may ever see on Survivor. Ethan is getting the "good guy" edit. He does no wrong, even when he loses a challenge single handedly, as he has done numerous times out there. He still is getting portrayed as a meek, humble player, who is trying to just go along and get as far as he can. Honestly too, last night was the first time in what? 14 episodes of Africa, and 7 episodes of ##### that Ethan ever was shown bringing up someone's name to vote out? He's the one that started the Jerri ball rolling when he and the Colbster were lying in the hut, which, IMO was his attempt to save his own skin after blowing the IC/RC. Yes Jerri was obviously the next to go after the majority of the setup, but as Colby said, one never knows for sure until the votes are read.
Rob M. is getting the "Hatch" edit so far. He's cocky, controlling, and sometimes downright evil in his confessionals, yet, he just seems to have Chapera wrapped around his finger. He wins challenges for Chapera, he stays positive most of the time around the tribe, and he even has been sensitive to both Jenna and Sue's issues. We all know though, from the confessionals that he's playing a hatch style game.
So MB gets his hero, Ethan, vs. the villain Rob, in a showdown, that just builds it's way into the merge. Can't wait!

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ADKer 143 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
03-12-04, 12:40 PM (EST)

62. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

I am an Ethan fan, but, at this point, I have seen enough of Ethan swinging in the wind. I just want to see him put out of his misery. He is a dead man walking, as VS said, and it is painful to watch. I believe that Ethan will be angry with Lex about the Colby vote, which will lead to Ethan's boot. I agree that Rob is edited as the bad guy, but he is also such an entertaining buffoon that I do not want to see him go. Overall, I believe that Rob's edit has been pretty balanced: he has helped the team in challenges and with morale; the team he leads has played a positive game, having fun and choosing new members/visitors because they will fit in, now so that they can be controlled/booted.
I believe that the MM editing is still telling the moral of the mistake of booting Richard out of fear instead of playing a positive, team oriented game. The MM's who had a lot of success in their first Survivor round mostly did so because of strong alliances. The AllStar edition is not as different from the original game as the MM's believe.
Just like the Marquesas, Kathy is the person that everyone should least want to take to the final.

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Brat2u 93 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Hollywood Squares Square"
03-19-04, 03:55 PM (EST)

92. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

>Rupert--Unless I missed it, Rupert did not appear anywhere in the shots of the champagne celebration. Anyone else notice? Don't know if there's any spoiler value in this or not. Could just be that after eating so much, he was spending some quality time in the bathroom and missed out on the fun. It does look like he may get more time in next week's edit.<
Yes, I noticed this too! I could be mistaken, but wasn't Jenna also missing during the champagne toast?

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-19-04, 03:58 PM (EST)

93. "RE: EP 7: Players, Game, Edit"

K'OBrienFan told us in one of these threads that Kathy said Jenna and Rupert passed out from all the food and drink and slept through the champagne party.

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buckeyegirl 5449 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-12-04, 02:02 PM (EST)

63. "Tom"

I thought an interesting quote came from Tom regarding Kathy while they were on the boat. Tom was fishing, and he said something to the effect of that "the girls were getting Kathy to spill her guts, and I thought she was smarter then that. For some reason that just jumped out at me. Could this be forshadowing Kathy's demise?

A Kyngsladye Original. RMMW!

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-12-04, 02:20 PM (EST)

64. "RE: Tom"

buckeyed, I certainly believe that Kathy's complete capitulation (well almost, she didn't actually JUMP into the waterfall........yet ) to the Chapera's along with Tom's comments about snaking her in as well as your note that he states that he thought she was smarter than that is very telling.
This only leads me to believe that Kathy, despite all the work she has done to play a cool, collected game, may revert back to her game play from S4 and allow her feelings to dictate

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memacmur 359 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host"
03-12-04, 04:06 PM (EST)

65. "RE: Episode 7 editting and character development"

Well, it's nothing compared to the posts by VS, but here is what I saw from this episode...
Mogo Mogo
Lex - Taking the dangerous position of tribal leader. I think he's safe for now, but it will be very interesting to see who goes next. Hopefully Kathy talks some sense into Lex and Jerri is the next to go... Lex needs some strong people on his side come the merge.
Kathy - Interesting edit. Clearly jealous of the Chapera situation, and looking to exploit being the 'one' brought over. Definitely more attention than in previous episodes, but no doubt in part to the role of the kidnapped tribemate. Also, I found it interesting that they focussed on Kathy after the challenge, and she almost looked like she was crying. Not sure if this was a one-shot thing to make her being chosen seem that much nicer, or indicative of her emotional state in the game. I think she's good into the merge, but as per Big Tom's strategy talk <GASP!>, she'll probably be pagonged along with the rest of her tribe (barring a last-minute Rupe-Jenna L-Kathy coalition forming).
Ethan - I don't think he's the next to go. And I do think he's the next to go. His editting almost followed the OFG theory, except he got to apologize twice. I think he has the sympathy edit, and will survive to the merge. Not sure how long he can last without some IC wins at that point though.
Jerri - She got her revenge, and she was shown being the pain in the A$$ we all remember. She lasts as long as Kathy can tolerate her bad vibes. Story arc for her (outlasting Colby) appears to be done. Did make an interesting comment about being underestimated. We'll see dear, we'll see.
Shii Ann - I think she's in a good place, at least as good as any Mogo Mogo can be. She's attached to the core alliance with Lex and Kathy, but perceived as less of a threat than either of those two (what with Kathy visiting the enemy)

Chapera
Rawb- Same edit, with some hints of love AND conflict in the next episode. I still think he's around for a good while.
Amber - She was there, but barely. Again, she's sitting pretty (although looking a bit emaciated).
Alicia - Very quiet in her editting too. I keep wondering if the girls on Chapera (Amber, Jenna L and Alicia) are smart enough to start plotting Rawb's demise. Again, looks like she's around for a couple episodes yet.
Tom - He talked strategy for just about the first time in all of his Survivor appearances. And then he danced some more. Almost like we're being told he ain't as dumb a hick as he can appear....
Rupert - Seemed reasonably happy if somewhat aloof this episode. Appears to have been taken by Rawb as a threat. I think Tom's comments may indicate he will help foster that feeling. If and when Chapera goes to TC before the merge, Rupert could be in serious trouble.
Jenna - Seen strategizing, otherwise not much. Well, she made an attempt at the Tom-dance as well. I still say she's around for a loooong time yet.
The most interesting thing will be what happens if/when there is a dispute at Chapera between the alpha males, and how the tribe survives going into the merge if they don't go to tribal council... it could be the one opening in their armour of numbers that does in Romber.
MEmacmur

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-13-04, 10:01 PM (EST)

66. "RE: Episode 7 editting and character development"

I haven't quite caught up with all the E7 posts, but again, I pretty much agree with everything you've said memacmur.
Lex and Jerri seem to me, if they are going to survive (which I doubt at this point) to rely on each other of necessity. Jerri's one trick may be convincing Lex and Kathy to form a 3-person alliance and convince them she can pull Rupert and Jenna to vote out the 4 Chappys (which latter she may in fact be able to do; whether she can convice L/K is another matter - however did Lex want to get rid of Colby, or keep Jerri? We saw "get rid of Colby," but the other may have been there as well). The key to this IMO is keeping Ethan over Shii Ann as a post-merge sacrifice, which Jenna certainly would not object to, and he'd be the clear Chapera target as well. Jerri also has Outback connections with Amber and Alicia. A plus to keep Jerri in Lex's mind, or a reason to boot her? I give that scenario a less than 1% chance, but all the spoilers pointing to a complete MM collapse actually makes me doubt it a bit.
Shii Ann - toast, pre- or post-merge.
Kathy - will she jump? my guess is NO, and if she does try, I don't think it makes her last any longer. early jury, except in the Lex/Jerri scenario above.
Ethan - probably Lex's next target, which only strengthens the urge to ask "WTF is Lex thinking?" I could see a very outside chance at F2 for him. I can at least see him on the jury just for his comments about Jenna, to see what he may do in a vote for or against her.

At Chapera - the "happy" edit bothers me. I see a reversal coming for this tribe - either MM despite all odds takes them down (although the winner may still come from Chappy) or they dominate, but MM produces the winner (my bet would still be Jerri; although the past two episodes make me very uncomfortable with that, she still seems, as a Sabogomogan, to have the best chance of anyone at MM). Overwhelmingly happy tribes tend to be doomed tribes (see Rotu - even though they were 7 of the F9, the winner was Maraamu).
Rob - his fall is coming, and I wouldn't be surprised at this point if he misses the F4 entirely (I already thought 5th was a likely place, but I could see an even earlier boot)
Amber - still a F2 candidate, but I see her chances at winning to be virtually 0 now.
Tom and Alicia - both with some strategic commentary this ep, and their chances increase accordingly in my estimation. Both in the F4, and one in the F2, and possibly the winner (I still like Tom of the two) seems likely to me at this point.
Rupert - still don't see him in the F4.
Jenna - still my pick to win.
possible F2:
least to most likely to be in F2: Jerri, Alicia, Tom, Amber, Jenna
least to most likely to win: Amber, Alicia, Jerri, Tom, Jenna

guess for F4: Tom, Jenna, Alicia, Amber
- HE

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-17-04, 09:44 AM (EST)

67. "RE: Episode 7 editting and character development"

LAST EDITED ON 03-17-04 AT 09:44 AM (EST)
Just a little thought process BEFORE the show (that is different)
Oh and I must refer back to Jeff's ominous quote from last week posted before
Jiffy’s talk about the prevailing wisdom of Mogo, i.e. voting out those who are the most threatening as individuals (with a interesting, we'll see if it plays out for you) The clues ARE there, we must look for them
Back in the beginning of the show, I was interested in seeing what MB would do with the All Star's. I truly believed and still believe his editing and story process would be unique this time because it is A-S-S and despite the "winning edit" the person who wins would be portrayed in a relatively special way.
I also believed that if they weren't meant to be there long, he wasn't investing the time in their story which we have seen with the likes of Tina, Jenna, Rob, Sue (Sue and Jenna solely got beefed stories due to the drama of their exit but daily camp life, etc. was a big zero)
I still believe that the players cannot change who they are and human nature is such a powerful part of us that it is virtually impossible for the crux of your personality to be shelved.
With that, and as the episodes have gone on, this really is panning out to me which tells me to go back and recall how these players did in their past seasons and whether they themselves caused their boot or by the circumstances (example someone ELSE was a better final two partner etc.)
Kathy/Lex/Rupert - all played and lost their past game due to emotional playing. There has been nothing to indicate to me thus far that they are not on course to make the same mistake
Shii Ann/Tom/Rob/Amber/Jenna - essentially their game type and level of emotion is about the same. Amber/Rob's romance may, in fact, throw a wrench in their game play but at an all over glance, nothing much has changed for them except Amber is no longer overshadowed by Jerri, Rob may have a distraction and Jenna has people with actually bigger mouths than she does Tom and SA? Same people, same game, different location and how they finish will probably be about the same as their last endeavors.
Alicia is interesting in the fact that I believe she *does* fall into the first category yet she was more or less booted simply because of her threatening appearance. Alicia had and has a choice of lasting a big longer. Will her mouth or her body get her ousted?
Jerri and Ethan fit a special category, not so much on how THEY played in the past but rather what the PLAYERS have remembered of them (much like Sue, Rich, Tina, Colby, Rob C. etc.) They are simply doomed because of who they are or were
Obviously the luck of the individual immunity will always save a skin and the luck of the dominant alliance helps as well but in the past episodes that I have gone over and the analysis we have been discussing, these people have not changed. I'm curious to eventually see if ANY of them really do learn from their past mistakes.

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Get Bent 293 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-17-04, 11:04 PM (EST)

68. "Episode 8 Updates"

I know Veruca will have a great summary of observations from tonights episode. I just thought I would start the discussion out!
My first impressions of tonight:
Rob is a top notch A$$. He is in it with Amber for the booty, not romance. She is obviously in it deeper emotionally. And as another poster mentioned he looked like a bully as he made fun of Rupert. Very unflattering to say the least.
My husband noticed that all of Robs fish were tiny, where Rupert had some big ones. So he thought Rob was too cocky about that. Although Rob did very well in the log roll, the rest of the episode was negative for his character IMHO.
Amber is a top notch log roller. Did she compete in the World Class Lumberjack competition or what? She had so much confidence, she didn't even look at the log to start.
With tonight's kissing, it may be the apex of the Rob and Amber story lines. It looks like they are separated next week. I imagine that one of them may pay for thier two-some ultra-close aliance.
Ethan did indeed leave with class (as we were shown). According to KO Fan, he did throw a hissy fit, throwing things etc. at the camp. They only showed him exiting with grace. Good guy edit.
Jerri is still a beotch. But she wasn't edited all that bad to me. She stuck her neck out, and then took responsibility for the loss in a very professional way.
After Jenna bringing gifts, it took a lot of gall to ask to keep some rice (I even think Shii Ann got a couple of looks for it from her tribemates). Jenna dealt with the extra request, and the entire situation very well. After recieving the gifts you could see the MM's soften up, so I don't think they will hold this against Jenna. Editing-wise, Jenna looked great. She was nice, generous, and still got things her tribe needed.
Rupert looked clueless as Rob made fun of him behind his back. Setting him up to be the next nice guy?
Tom, Alicia, and Shii Ann didn't even appear to be in this episode.
Kathy looked beat down, and down on her tribe in general. Her story is far from over I believe. To much set up on her possible switching and unhappiness. As I type, it sounds like a set up to a boot, but I do not believe that to be the case.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-18-04, 09:08 AM (EST)

69. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

GB great thoughts I do appreciate your input, my "take" alone is not enough . I need to learn to cliffnotes my thoughts though lol so bear with the length.
I will have to reiterate my thoughts pre-show that you can take the players away from their season but you can't take their personalities away. Last night proved that, try as you might, there are core traits in all of us that rule our decisions. Understand that tribe makeup, immunities and the like have an impact on longevity but most of the time in watching this show, the players essentially end up losing the game on their own lack of merit.
Examples........
Kathy and her consternation about her lack of hugging from her tribe. “I got hugged by Chapera in a second, but that’s not this tribe.”
To a skilled, strategic player should this be an issue? No it shouldn't yet to Kathy, who, at her core, is an emotionally fueled person, it was an issue. This only tells me that she has not adjusted her game and her she will allow herself to make the same mistakes. The storm we witnessed that Kathy was immersed in is very symbolic of herself. She is up/down, up/down and last night her coming off a wonderful day, being greeted not the way she wanted, her vision of her tribe - very very indicative of her own self.
And Kathy's thoughts on Jerri "I don't want her in the final four, I want someone who works"
Now, should this REALLY matter if you are playing to win a game? You want someone you can beat, not someone who works. Kathy, despite all her pre-training has not learned what failed her before.
As an aside, nice symbolism of the rainbow and her comment "Rainbow, that is a good omen." It is for her, as her happy days are ahead because she will be reunited with her Happy Tribe soon. But what will happen when the gloves are off at Chapera? Kathy will again feel emotionally crippled.
Now onto her male counterpart
Lex is fooling himself with his commentary to Ethan "......need to talk about game/friendship. I know hard for you to see how they can be separate, I think better for my game if you go out tonight, nothing to do with friendship, THIS IS BUSINESS, I have to play differently......"
Lex is NOT playing differently. If he was playing differently (i.e. non emotionally) then he would NOT have booted Ethan or Colby. He has an agenda and it comes from his fears and emotions. Get rid of the strong men so he can be the number one male around. Telling OTHERS it is business is telling ME that you are not conducting business. Brian NEVER spoke those words to the people he was getting rid of, he simply narrarated it to us. By telling someone it is business is showing your concern they won't like what you are doing.
And his quote "We lost the lion's share of what we had" He isn't kidding but I'm not talking about rice, I'm talking about tribe members that might have pushed you on the win side like Hatch, Colby and now Ethan.
And Jerri???? "I’m being evil right now, but boy does it feel good.” along with her "........bellboy took all my baggage away" Jerri is now a boot waiting to happen. Her self worth was ruled by her revenge and it has overshadowed any objective behavior by her to ingratiate herself with a tribe that she DIDN'T EVEN ORIGINATE FROM.
Only Shii Ann is being overlooked in the whole process simply because everyone is being fueled by their own agendas and personalities. She was able to pull it together to be MM's welcome wagon (though I will say the likes of some Chapera men would probably dislike her) and while being used as a vote source as I figured, she is not a "power player" as she so aptly described everyone else. Therefore she is no threat. Her problem LAST time was her TRYING to be a power player. If she keeps this up, she will do better. The minute she TRIES to be something she isn't, she is in trouble. But that doesn't usually get you a million as Jeff stated in the challenge
"Shii Ann, just short of the target" No truer words are spoken I will hazard a guess.
Jenna summed up MM nicely: “They’re not happy. They’re slowly losing everything they have. They’re not happy.”
Again, Chapera has not disappointed me.
Tom could be in a glorious situation. He has a friend in Rupert, a disarming personality and Rob has other big men to make fun of. He plays correctly. Whatever issues he has (and we KNOW he has one about Rupert being his replacement) he doesn't allow to dictate. What did he do? He befriends Rupert; that is smart gameplay. The problem with Tom is simply the same as Africa....... he is not an aggressive player when he has to be. Tom deflects, disarms, etc. but in a situation that he can gain the control he needs, he falls short. Recall when Tom had the opportunity to take a bull by the horns and vote Lex out in Africa? He chose not to do so and that caused a downward sprial for him.
Rupert has clearly not changed nor will he ever. He is Hercules on the outside and a little boy on the inside. Again with his "I'm so excited (re: sling) I'm going to prove my worth" How much self punishment does this man have to take? He is emotionally starved and the one fish he has to look out for is the shark (which he couldn't catch) Because every shark he meets in his life will devour him. The same chemistry he had with Burton has flared up with Rob. Rupert is not long for this game because he is too fueled by his emotionally baggage.
Alicia and her mouth. Have you not learned? Also may mean something, may mean nothing. Alicia vs. SA - TWICE? Interesting if it played out that SA and Alicia are the two boot candidates at some point, will Alicia lose again?
GetBent I agree that Rob's wish for the monetary booty has been shown as more appealing than the Amber booty but ironically I see a shift happening. If I recall previously, Rob made it known at TC (upon being asked by Jeff regarding his relationship with Amber) that he was here to play the game. Now, we are being given......
Rob and his “It would be nice to have a million dollars and take the girl away too,” along with his (constant constant) arrogant remarks. Rob may get the girl but I don't know that he will get both. Rob got kicked to the curb because of the twist in his own season, similar things could happen. However, what I find intriguing is that he is allowing emotions to start coming into play this time. Amber may, in fact, be his downfall, whether she is directly involved or by sheer virtue of the fact that they are a couple and therefore need to be broken up is another.
Amber and her potentially ironic comment "I feel 99% percent secure with Rob........" It is that 1% that gets you huh Amber? Amber is not doing anything differently except her shield this time is Rob and not Jerri; we just see more of her because Jerri was the "ooh la la" in S2. Amber is overlooked though because her shield is high profile, like Jerri was. All this could do is insulate her for awhile. There comes a point where the boot is directed at you when you are left alone at the altar.
Jenna has not vanished; she still brought home her bacon with the items from MM. Jenna's emotional investment is gone now, her goal at Saboga was tyranny on past winners. She has her wish and now can play. Jenna, by luck of the draw, ended up on a winning tribe and ended up on a tribe where even HER mouth could go unnoticed.
Jeff's final comment: “Trust will become the single most valuable resource in this game and the most difficult to find.” The game always seems to come down to this. Those who can succeed are those who will not allow their issues to be their downfall and also remember that trust in a game of Survivor is a play by play commodity. If one can separate their own issues with trust, loyalty, emotion and arrogance(along with some luck in the game) can succeed.
By reasons of editing and story alone, I see.......
---Kathy, Lex and Rupert taken down by their issues with loyalty and trust
---Jerri, Alicia and Rob taken down by their issues with arrogance and temperament
----Tom, Jenna, Amber and SA in actuality sitting the best (though SA is situated on a numbers problem with no solid previous background to fall back on)
Considerations: an individual immunity is a biggie. We have seen arrogance of Rob's nature in the past be shelved because of immunity as well as UTR with no place to turn last a bit longer in a crucial immunity which we can never foresee.
The Amber and Rob romance is highlighted in that we will see it probably be tested by either their own decision or Mark Burnett and because of the novelty but I never felt it was indicative of them winning the money
As of now, regardless of our wonderful "spoilers" Tom, Amber, Jenna and SA (outside of numbers) seem to be in the best position because they are being overlooked and not allowing their emotions to essentially dictate their game.
Would love to hear what others are thinking.

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badger 1273 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beef Jerky Spokesperson"
03-18-04, 09:49 AM (EST)

70. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

VS, great observations as usual.
re: rupert and rob. i know rob has been picked as f2 by many spoilers, but i can't help but see a similarity between the editing we saw of him last night and the editing we saw of burton and shawn last season. big egos, big bullies. whether one likes rupert or not, viewers all know that rupert has a certain vulnerability to bullies like rob, and that we saw the conflict between rob and rupert play out this way was important in giving quite a negative depiction of rob. like most bullies, rob notices those types of weaknesses in people and quicky mocks and exploits them for it; it remains to be seen if rupert can get his emotional baggage together to outplay rob.
i thought it was quite interesting, but not surprising, that rob stepped up to the plate for the archery competition. his arrow barely made it. he was just lucky that jerri's missed completely. i think this type of egotistic decision making ("i can do things better than anyone on my tribe") might be his downfall, particularly if he fails to win things.
and i think the "women" factor might be significant too. without amber, will women on the new tribe put up with rob's obnoxious attitude? will rupert be able to make alliances with the women as he did with christa and sandra?
rob definitely got the "bad guy" edit vis-a-vis rupert. the bit with amber, although a bit "nicer" and "softer" side of rob, seemed just a set-up for their "break up" this next week. even if rob isn't destined for a huge fall (oh please oh please oh please don't let this jerk win!), i just don't see this as a "winning" edit. i mean, picking on mb fave rupert?!? that's almost as bad as voting off jp fave colby. doesn't bode well. . .

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a98c4fun 17 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson"
03-18-04, 10:34 AM (EST)

72. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

VS, love your analysis. I do analysis for a living with my job and am enjoying this discussion to assist me with watching the game. I agree with you and the post prior to yours about how the editing is going and future downfalls. It will be interesting to see if Rubert can mature inside, if Rob is able to check his ego at the door when needed, if Amber can utilize her skills of picking blockers/deflectors, and so on for each tribe member.
This discussion is a great one to read and enjoy yours and all others input to make the game more fun to watch.
a98c4fun

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Loquatrix 640 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
03-18-04, 06:37 PM (EST)

77. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

>if Rob
>is able to check his
>ego at the door when
>needed
I think this is a key issue, a89c4fun. And I happen to think that yes, he can. Notice last night, his theatrical aside to Amber about how he has the patience to handle anything that comes up in life, as a result of the training he's receiving from having to interact with his tribemates (or words to that effect). This indicates to me that he's aware of other people's perceptions of him and is taking active measures to moderate his responses and to be politic.
It seems to me that Rob has a pretty strong grip on himself, actually. He's only really indulging his misanthropic tendencies in private -- either in confessionals or to Amber. The ragging on Rupert was designed to unbalance Rupert and to encourage Tom not to see Rupert as a potential long term ally in the game. I thought Rob managed that situation extremely well, in the sense that all Rupert went away with was a sense that Rob is arrogant and a pain in the butt -- note that Rupert said nothing of the "bullying when I was a child" stuff that he issued in response to the Shawn/Burton types on Pearl Islands. His response was not nearly so emotional. His feelings toward Rob seem to be more akin to his feelings towards Jon rather than Shawn/Burton, which is as a result of careful handling by Rob if you ask me.
Any problems that Rob may have down the line strike me as coming from the fact that he's physically dominating, not the fact that he's arrogant. On the basis that it ain't bragging if you can back it, up, I don't actually think he's arrogant. ::grin:: He really is that much better at this than most of those other people. As long as he keeps in the forefront of his mind that people don't like recognizing their own inferiority, and if he can disguise his ongoing physical and strategic superiority, then he could be in this for the long run.
I'll be disappointed if he doesn't win. I think he's playing a superlative game.

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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-18-04, 08:02 PM (EST)

79. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

>
>I'll be disappointed if he doesn't
>win. I think he's
>playing a superlative game.

I agree. I think Rob is playing a smart game. Most of his tribemates grudgingly say he is a good leader. Even Rob C and Sue didn't say horrible things about RobM when they did their interviews. They realize he is the reason their tribe is doing so well. So they are all kind of riding his coattails in this. RobM is one of the few that did learn from his first Survivor experience. And most of his catty remarks are made in his confessionals because he wants to be entertaining. But he is smarter in how he talks to his tribemates.

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Naked 887 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
03-19-04, 00:28 AM (EST)

82. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

Rob is playing a much better game than he did in the Marqueses. His editing has been done well also. I for one couldn't stand him in the Marqueses, and I find myself rooting for him at times now. Even against people that I formally rooted for... aka Ethan.
His bad guy persona was edited in Marqueses so we would cheer his boot. The question is why are we pulling for him now?

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mtopaz 2167 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Roller Coaster Inaugurator"
03-18-04, 02:26 PM (EST)

73. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

After every episode, I really enjoy returning to this discussion.
>Lex is NOT playing differently. If he was playing differently (i.e. non emotionally) then he would NOT have booted Ethan or Colby. He has an agenda and it comes from his fears and emotions. >
Agreed. Those who do best on Survivor are the players who adapt best to the twists and turns as the game progreses. Lex formulated a game plan long before he was even selected for A.S.S., and his refusal to deviate from "the business plan" does not bode well for him.
>Tom could be in a glorious situation. He has a friend in Rupert, a disarming personality and Rob has other big men to make fun of. He plays correctly. ... He befriends Rupert;
that is smart gameplay. The problem with Tom is simply the same as Africa....... he is not an aggressive player when he has to be. Tom deflects, disarms, etc. but in a situation that he can gain the control he needs, he falls short. >
VS - another aspect of Tom's personality is that he seems to bond with men, but not with women. He self-limits his options for alliances. He has formed some bond with Rupert (although this is not shown to the non-spoiling viewers). If and when the two tribes merge into one, what alliance will he and Rupert try to form then? If Tom stays true to form, he would only be interested in forming an alliance with Lex. This will leave Kathy feeling left out and angry. With so many women players remaining, it does not bode well for Tom.
>Rupert has clearly not changed nor will he ever. He is Hercules on the outside and a little boy on the inside. ...the
one fish he has to look out for is the shark (which he couldn't catch)Because every shark he meets in his life will devour him.>
Rupert isn't going to suddenly wise up and think strategically. If he did, he would be talking to Jenna about how to get rid of Rob. He would go to Tom, and ask Jenna to try to recruit Alicia and either try to throw a challenge and vote Rob off, or form a hidden alliance of 4 that will carry through beyond the merge, and vote Rob off the first time he doesn't win immunity. He's still stuck in "provider" mode, when it doesn't matter whether he produces 12 fish or none for his tribe. Can he offer any of them a good route to F2? If not, he's a goner.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-18-04, 05:22 PM (EST)

75. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

As always VS, great insight.
>By reasons of editing and story alone, I see.....
>Kathy, Lex, and Rupert taken down by their issues of loyalty and trust
>Jerry, Alicia, and Rob taken down by their issues of arrogance and temperaement
>Tom, Jenna, Amber, and SA in actuality sitting the best( though SA is situated on a numbers problem with no solid previous background to fall back on<
Interesting, you peg Tom, Jenna, Amber, and SA as sitting the best; out of the whole lot of them, I'd say that these are the most "UTR" of the group....I know that Jenna is a loud mouth, and was prominent and even somewhat bossy in her original tribe of Saboga, but since she's been with Chappy, she has had to tone it down considerably. Interesting that she was the alpha competing with Rupert over at Saboga, but since she and Rupe are the newbies they have both had to tone down at first, now, however, I see Rupert trying to become more prominent with his posturing as sole provider.
Tom, although quite a personality is definately more UTR, he's entertaining but knows when to check his tongue(disregard Sue of course). Amber is under the radar, under Rob's wing..deferring to a stronger player/shield, and SA has acknowledged her UTR strategy in that it would probably serve her well, according to Colby, but he just did'nt respect it.

Now, as far as Kathy is concerned, I don't see how any rational person could act any differently than she has....look where she is, and who she's left with, she's strategizing constantly, weighing options now, do I stick with the Mogo's or should I jump ship....sure would be interesting if she indeed hooks up with the Robfadda over her Mogo alliance....I bet she won't though....we'll see.
Last night it did seem as if the theme of the show was TRUST. Amber talking about how she felt 99%safe and secure, and then the ominous Jiffy observation that it is the most important at this point in the game, yet the hardest thing to find.....interesting.

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-18-04, 05:37 PM (EST)

76. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

Now, as far as Kathy is concerned, I don't see how any rational person could act any differently than she has....look where she is, and who she's left with, she's strategizing constantly, weighing options now, do I stick with the Mogo's or should I jump ship....sure would be interesting if she indeed hooks up with the Robfadda over her Mogo alliance....I bet she won't though....we'll see.
I agree about Kathy, I don't she's playing particularly based on emotions, as VS says. Her observation that Chapera hugged her while Mogo Mogo did not was a metaphor about tribal solidarity -- she continued that thought by saying she didn't think there was any way Mogo Mogo could rally now. It was not that she was upset over not getting hugged.
But she did better in S4 when she had no real alliance and had to totally fend for herself. Relying on Lex is getting her nowhere. She may have realized that, but may also have realized that it's probably too late to change course now.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-18-04, 08:23 PM (EST)

80. "RE: Episode 8 Updates"

Yes, I have the same assessment of Kathy, BR. Yes, I think she has a very accurate take on the situation at Mogo. I think her only hope frankly is to jump ship early over to the Chappy's....if she hesitates at all, post-merge, it will be too late for her. I do think that there is an awful lot of luck involved in this show....look at the two places that the fractured Saboga tribe landed on, they are like night and day. Jenna and Rupert had the good fortune of landing on the solid, goal oriented, win everything we can together to the end strategy first and foremost, while the Mogo's were too preoccupied with not depending on one another to even get it together to win the challenges....Let's face it, I think the majority of us who speculated on the strengths of the three tribes long before the onset of the game, never expected the Chappy's to be the strongest. We all believed the Mogo's were the superior tribe, strength wise.

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udg 3381 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Car Show Celebrity"
03-19-04, 02:58 PM (EST)

88. "Rob & Rupert edit..."

One thing that stood out to me tonight (stupid freaking scheduling differences!) when I FINALLY got to see the show, was how forced the Rupert/Rob fishing edit seemed. I felt like I was supposed to believe something other than what really happened. I've also read a couple of other takes on that scene in this thread. LOL
I felt like we were supposed to side with Rob, like the viewer was supposed to see Rupert as rather bumbling and as feeling jealous of and/or threatened by Rob's ability to catch fish. (I.e., Rob = Good/Cool; Rupert = Not so great.)
However, at the same time I really believed that Rupert was more upset by the fact that Rob was mocking him than by the fact that Rob was catching fish. I know Rupert didn't hear the worst of what Rob said, but Rob was obviously taking some digs at Rupert. I saw what Rob was doing/saying as malicious (as opposed to the Burton/Shawn teasing last season, which I saw as good natured taken just a bit too far).
Additionally, Rob seems to believe that he's holding back. Heck, he may even be successful in wooing trust and friendship most of the time. I believe Rupert said something about how he likes Rob most of the time, but... The "but" is that Rob can't stop his little barbs, and Rupert does get that negative vibe from Rob at least some of the time.
Which brings me to my questions:
1) Am I right in my perception that what MB wants us to believe and what the situation actually is are two different things?
2) If so, why is he working so hard to get us to believe something so (IMO) obviously incorrect? What, if anything, could that tell us about how far one or both of them get in the game?
---
UDG

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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-19-04, 03:13 PM (EST)

89. "RE: Rob & Rupert edit..."

Who knows why MB does some of the things he does. He went out of his way last season to make everyone think Rupert was wonderful and yet we hear from other survivors that he was not this great gentleman. But he was edited that way. Certain players can have their mean spirited remarks hidden. While MB shows every bad thing another person does.

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Get Bent 293 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-19-04, 03:16 PM (EST)

90. "RE: Rob & Rupert edit..."

LAST EDITED ON 03-19-04 AT 03:20 PM (EST)
My take on what MB wanted us to see is that Rob and Tom would think Rupert is not needed. They showed Rob, Amber, Jenna and Rupert in the previews pledging their loyalty, and then gave teasers that Rob and Rupert go toe to toe. I think they are trying to make us think that the Rob Rupert alliance is not that stong, if it exists at all anymore.
And my impression of Robs making fun was opposite of you. I thought that he looked bad, and looked like a bully.
Edited for spelling, although I still think I have a misspelled word or two!

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Loquatrix 640 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
03-19-04, 04:17 PM (EST)

94. "RE: Rob & Rupert edit..."

> I think they are
>trying to make us think
>that the Rob Rupert alliance
>is not that stong, if
>it exists at all anymore.
I tend to agree with you, Get Bent. It's all about the editing trying to keep things unpredictable. We've seen the Rob-Rupert-Amber-Jenna alliance saying they'll go all the way to the final four. It would be neglectful of MB (in terms of producing good, dramatic TV with all the necessary conflicts and tensions) if he only ever showed us those four people being super-chummy.
For good TV to come out of an alliance that could go all the way, we need to see at least the potential for that alliance to crack.
To me, the point of Rob's behaviour with Tom on the rock was to disguise the fact that Tom isn't in his core 4-way alliance. And thus, to keep up the facade, he had to continue ragging Rupert to his face, somewhat, so that Tom didn't go away thinking "Hey, he only ragged on Rupert when Rupert couldn't hear us, so perhaps it was just a pretence to keep me happy."
Of course, it doesn't hurt Rob to have Rupert off balance too. As long as Rupert is focusing on how "arrogant" Rob is, he's not focusing on the fact that Rob will defeat him in all individual challenges.

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-19-04, 04:25 PM (EST)

95. "RE: Rob & Rupert edit..."

LAST EDITED ON 03-19-04 AT 04:26 PM (EST)
i think you're giving rawb way too much credit. although...if that WERE so, it just shows how big an idiot he is to be thinking F4 instead of F3. he's not smart enough - or politic enough - to keep all those balls in the air

- RMMNW!!!

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Loree 8616 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-18-04, 10:13 AM (EST)

71. "The Amber edit"

I don't know why, but everytime they show Amber in a confessional I get this odd feeling. She seems such an odd narrator. It is like they are determined that Amber has some face time and they want us to know she is playing the game. I keep thinking that she has to make it to the end because of this. If she wasn't going to be final 4 MB wouldn't care if we had all these clips of Amber telling the tribe's motivation. But she was so overshadowed in her season that they can't have that again if she makes it to the end. So now we get Amber shoved in our face talking like she is running the camp. And I don't believe she is the big decision maker that all the other players look to. I think she is just reciting what the others (mostly Rob) have said. So I continue to get this strange feeling everytime they show Amber telling us what is happening at Happy Chappy. I still think MB is trying to convince us that yes indeed Amber is playing the game and deserves to be in that final.

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pinchy 200 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Network TV Show Guest Star"
03-18-04, 02:45 PM (EST)

74. "RE: The Amber edit"

Amber may not be a power player, but she does seem to hold a high trust level with more folks than just Rob. Perhaps her influence with Rob is seen by other players as motivation to try to get close to her, and could work in her favor. The picture standing out for me on this whas: who held the straws? Amber. Very telling. She is also in the caretaker role at Chapera, along with Jenna L. (after Jenna picked the short straw, Amber asked, "are you okay?") but since she is an original Chapera, she holds more power at this point.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-18-04, 07:20 PM (EST)

78. "RE: The Amber edit"

Great spec and analysis everyone and truly appreciated mainly because it is interesting how we watch the same show but see things in different perspectives.
Rob is pure entertainment much like Jon was in the sense that he makes great t.v. negative or not. I have read some who think he is wonderfully confident and others who feel he is downright nasty and arrogant. My thoughts are that he could be slammed by his arrogance over the fact he is physically threatening are more of an observation based on what other players have said about him. Rupert's take, Alicia's take, Ethan and Colby, etc. In S2 Colby was a clear challenge threat yet he lasted the duration, same with Ethan (though I think his challenge prowess has been overrated to some extent lol) So my observation that arrogance will be his downfall over his challenge threat is based more on the fact that those who do very well in challenges seem to have been able to "disarm" with their personality. Rob is a pistol but we are being clearly shown by Mark Burnett that Rob thinks he is "the man" if you will
BR and flower, I can understand your take on Kathy. Let it be known that I was thrilled that Kathy and Lex were on this show. I really enjoyed them and thought that if only they checked that emotion at the door, they may have won their seasons. My emphasis on Kathy's observation about not being hugged is more of a generalized symbolism of Kathy's thought process as a person rather than the specific event itself. Using a prior Survivor like Vecepia for example (who, I always felt was a disappointing winner because of MB's gaff in editing more than how she played) I don't suspect she would have viewed her feelings about the two tribes because one had more warmth and fun. This just leads me to some conclusions about her personality. Kathy is a warm loving person who, to me anyone, wants to play a game with a tribe she has a family feel with. That may not cut it on Survivor; this isn't a game about friendships or family as we have witnessed. But I see your points and find it so interesting how we see people different ways.
It is very easy for any of us to say how the game should be played when you aren't playing it
Interesting the take on who I feel is in good position as generally being the most UTR. There may be something to this. Again we have a special show this season. We have people who have played before and who know each other and they know how those people played. There were some who were dead on arrival purely because of who they were and some who are again being overlooked because of how they played. UTR is a safe route to get somewhat further in this game as we have seen; the question remains will these people then do what is necessary to take themselves to the winner circle.

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-18-04, 08:49 PM (EST)

81. "RE: The Amber edit"

LAST EDITED ON 03-19-04 AT 06:41 AM (EST)
Yes, an UTR strategy is indeed a very valid one and has taken some to the winners circle. But, I for one always enjoy a winner who has truely earned it. Boy, if Robfadda wins this thing though, it will be a very first for a truely alpha male, leader of the tribe. True, alpha types have won, Brian, but much more subtlely...he was not the dander up type, boss. I wonder if Robfadda can pull it off, against all odds....he will be distracted from keeping his eye only on the prize if he and Amber get split up, he is definately emotionally connected to her. But, in addition to his challenge prowess, I think he is a street smart city boy with more than a few tricks up his sleeve. I think he really was the victim of the merge in his series, but I think he has played a different game with the members of his tribe...I thought he was more verbally in conflict with the original members of his tribe on Marquesa, too abrasive....while here, I think he check's his tongue much better directly to his tribemates....and even in confessionals he seems more levelheaded about some things. For example his thoughts on Sue, he did not judge her, he just noted maybe she is making a mountain out of a molehill for publicity reasons or maybe she is really personally hurting, only Sue knows. He was taunting Rupert heavily however, regarding the fishing thing...Overall though, IMO, he does seem a bit wiser. It will be fascinating how he wheels and deals through the merge and maybe beyond. At the very least, he's extremely entertaining.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-19-04, 07:54 AM (EST)

83. "RE: The Amber edit"

Agreed flower and naturally (and this has been argued over the seasons) would Jenna have won if not for what season she was on. Would Brian have won if he was on Sook Jai. Would Vecepia have won if they didn't switch and so forth.
BUT, the game has twists and turns and switches for the SOLE purpose of seeing if the people involve can ADAPT. Your point of Rob leaving in S4 due to the switch is definitely accurate BUT if was another type of player, would he have been able to stay? THAT is a big question. Vecepia won and was a victim of the twist.
Rob's position is better this time because he was the leader to begin with
Chapera is a winning tribe
There are a number of other members with mouths and egos on there as big, if not bigger, than his
He didn't have that on S4 but that is the luck of the draw but Rob is doing wonderfully with the cards he was dealt. Viewers could debate how each person on Survivor would have done if not for the tribe they were on, twists, swaps, etc. Note that Rob may have been gone already if he was on Mogo Mogo so essentially his game play is good but so were his circumstances which I read CONSTANTLY regarding Brian and his win.
To make a long post a wee bit longer, this is why on surface the UTR players have good standing for awhile because their game play is essentially solid to be in multiple circumstances. BUT UTR usually end up with a problem mid way through to the end because there comes a point they need to step it up a bit or make a crucial decision and either fail to do so or did it and made a mistake (for whatever reason)
These players, however, have played before; I would like to think they know what they should do at or about the right time. Maybe I give them too much credit

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-19-04, 11:04 AM (EST)

84. "RE: The Amber edit"

LAST EDITED ON 03-19-04 AT 11:04 AM (EST)
Agree wholeheartedly VS!
>These players, however, have played before; I would like to think they know what they should do at or about the right time. Maybe I give them too much credit.<
Yes, they are playing the UTR strategy for now, but I too, bet these players all have a plan and when the time comes they will make their move to dominate....no doubt.

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Loquatrix 640 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
03-19-04, 01:55 PM (EST)

85. "RE: The Amber edit"

>BUT, the game has twists and
>turns and switches for the
>SOLE purpose of seeing if
>the people involve can ADAPT.
>Rob's position is better this time
>but that is the luck
>of the draw but Rob
>is doing wonderfully with the
>cards he was dealt.
>Viewers could debate how each
>person on Survivor would have
>done if not for the
>tribe they were on, twists,
>swaps, etc.
I think this is the crux of the whole Survivor idiom, VS. I was thinking about it this morning as I drove in, fresh from my statement yesterday that I'd be disappointed if Rob doesn't win after playing such a dominating game on so many levels.
Without doubt, Survivor is NOT an individual game, even after the merge -- it's all about how one manages the hand one was dealt at the outset in the context of all the other people each having their own hand to manage. It's just as much about capitalizing on any fortunate happenstance as it is about adapting to any gameplay misfortunes, as either type of circumstance could be visited upon any one of the competitors at any time.
It is essentially pointless for Spoilers to conjecture about what could have happened to X winner if he'd had what struck us as more "difficult" circumstances to deal with, just as it's essentially pointless for us to ponder alternative outcomes for Y loser if only she'd had a more favourable opening hand. The fact is that this game hinges on what you do with the cards you were dealt, whether they were initially terrific (we've seen people blow very strong hands) or dismal (just as we've seen people dig themselves out of what appeared to be a terminal situation by sheer cunning in their play with, and against, other competitors). While it may in some ways feel satisfying to see an "underdog" turn it around and eventually prevail, for me it would be just as satisfying -- if not more -- to see someone with a big target on his back take it all the way regardless. That person has had to overcome just as many -- if not more -- potentially dangerous situations as the underdog.
Rob is sitting on a very strong hand at the moment, but that's not just because he lucked into a decent situation. They've been out there three weeks, so the initial scenarios are a distant memory. What we have now with Rob and Chapera is ongoing good management of what was a favourable initial scenario. But let us see whether he is able to adapt his gameplay for the post-merge environment, and survive in what will be a much less comfortable scenario -- just as we will see whether other players, such as Jenna, are able to overcome what was a pretty poor initial position and turn it into a good place to be.
While initial luck does play into this game (and while some people simply luck their way all the way to the end, coughJennaMcough), eventually it is most satisfying for all of us when we are able to clearly see the skill of the individual in capitalizing on good fortune, or surmounting ill fortune, as he manages his strategy and relationships and physical strength and mental fortitude throughout the game. I would certainly love to see an alpha male like Rob win this tournament because that, to me, would be as a result of him doing just the right amount of all of the above despite being an "obvious threat" -- which, of course, in many ways is its own "bad luck" to start with.

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Oscirus 1596 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-19-04, 02:10 PM (EST)

86. "Jerri"

I realize that most spoilers have Jerri going next but I am starting to wonder especially after colby's comments and Kathy's "I dont want her in the final four comment". Maybe Jerri is the Sandra of this group( Initially thought to go early but lasts a long time)

Bring back the spice rack
Congragulations to the apprentice Mr Kwame Jackson

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-19-04, 02:52 PM (EST)

87. "RE: Jerri"

Oscirus - Glad you pointed this out, which is why I love speculating more so than spoiling. Sometimes it is amazing how both end up being correct but there are times when the story fits better and the spoilers are wrong. Alas, there are other times when the opposite happens lol though I enjoy being wrong much better this way
Jerri doesn't strike me as someone who would get to the final four and mainly based on my premise of reputation alone. FWIW, she has now graced us as the girl we know and (fill in your choice) Like S2, there will be a moment that we probably will be smiling when she gets the boot; you have to figure as Mogo Mogo stands now there simply is no reason not to boot her now. Kathy and SA do not like her and while Lex is utilizing her, I would hope Lex should know that Kathy is the woman he should stay with (and I suspect he does know that) So logically that makes sense anyway
If there is a MERGE however, logically I see Jerri's story playing out a bit more but I have never been one for that "winner's comment" with the exception of S1. Once Mark Burnett stated he kept Richard Hatch's comment in, all hell broke lose amongst us to find that comment every season. I DO believe things are kept in for a reason (my first post was quotes that I felt summed up each of the players and what may happen or a foreshadowing of a general event) but I don't necessarily subscribe to that "winner comment" or even that due to Kathy saying it means Jerri will crack the top four. We could honestly be seeing a true statement (go figure)
Loquatrix to quote you:
But let us see whether he is able to adapt his gameplay for the post-merge environment, and survive in what will be a much less comfortable scenario -- just as we will see whether other players, such as Jenna, are able to overcome what was a pretty poor initial position and turn it into a good place to be
Agreed. My thoughts are that Rob will not fare as well when everyone comes together as he is as the leader of his pack. I have consistenly been told by Rob (and MB for that matter) that he is just too much in charge and all decisions are up to him and so forth. I *could* take this as up front in our face, here is your man in charge till Day 38? 39? It smells of kaboom lol
With the exception of Hatch (and I hardly can use him and the first season as an example; they were guinea pigs) really has there been anyone with that level of arrogance (or as some see, confidence) to have won? I've usually seen them take a fall and the audience is thrilled Brian I do not count because he completely hid that part of himself until it was way too late (Helen as of Ep. 11 was saying Brian will play with integrity, can you believe that??) and he was surrounded by people he could beat in individual challenges and along with a weakened opposing tribe (who DID see his arrogance) whereas Rob has made it quite apparent from the beginning (not too mention how he has been received by his fellow Survivors from appearances and get togethers these contestants have mixed with over the years as well)

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-19-04, 03:48 PM (EST)

91. "RE: Jerri"

yep, i agree. the longer she stays, the better it loks for her, IMO. from a game perspective, her making it past the next episode, makes little to NO sense, but from an editing perspective, i say it's very possible.
i do agree with VS though, in that i don't really consider Colby or Kathy's comments to be a "winner's quote"
but my attention is still very much on Jerri as one of the 4 (or 5) people that COULD win this game based on editing (I've added Alicia to the list since Ep 5, when I listed Jenna, Tom, Jerri, and Amber as the candidates for Sole Survivor, but she's still a distant 5th right now IMO)

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ADKer 143 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
03-19-04, 05:25 PM (EST)

97. "RE: Kathy"

If Kathy is taking pains to justify her decision to boot Ethan by saying that he threw a major trantrum, I think that Kathy's decision comes back to haunt her. Otherwise, she should not have any reason to be badmouthing Ethan. I do not think that Kathy goes next; she would have bonded with Ethan and would not be speaking badly of him. I am a little surprised that Kathy would do this, but it does tell me that she regrets booting Ethan and wants to justify herself. Kathy protests too much in support of her decision. It was sufficient that she said that Ethan only came to her two hours before tribal council. The editing already showed a rational basis for Kathy's decision. It was not necessary for her to elaborate.
I think that the editing was sufficient to show that Ethan was very angry with Lex's decision and badly wanted to stay in the game. If there was a "tantrum", MB does not think less of Ethan for it and may want to preserve the reputation of his "good guy" winner because someone less admirable, like Rawb, wins All stars.

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Oscirus 1596 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-22-04, 11:10 AM (EST)

98. "RE: Jerri"

I realize that the comments themselves mean nothing cuz if you look hard enough I'm sure there would probably be a comment that could be attributed to any person left in the games ablity to win. However the context in which Colby's comment was used is what stands out. The show was being edited to make us believe that Jerri was being booted out so why would they show us Colby's comment? It seems to me like editing to make it seem that there is no way that she can win the game much in the same vein as Jenna(comments from and Christy about doing everything to ensure that her stepsister never wins), Sandra(comments from Jon About her not winning) and vecepicia(comments from sean about a black person never winning).

Bring back the spice rack
Congragulations to the apprentice Mr Kwame Jackson

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-23-04, 08:48 AM (EST)

99. "RE: Jerri"

LAST EDITED ON 03-23-04 AT 08:49 AM (EST)
Osciris my "take" on some of these comments are again, this is a special season with special players. I think we are going to not only see how "special" these players are that they were invited to the celebrity of Survivors but what affect their relationships from their seasons and outside of the game may affect their game play.
Lex was a perfect example with Ethan. They have a bond from Africa and then some over seasons' past. This was something that had to be shown to the audience at some point. I remember questioning why have they not shown barely any interaction between Ethan and Lex when Ethan got rolled over to MM and we KNOW they have a prior relationship? I found it interesting that when it came time for a decision, we got to see up close and personal how that relationship would be tested and what decision Lex would arrive at.
I think this is similar to the Colby/Jerri situation. Colby and Jerri as we know have an interesting past. We saw from Jerri that it was a goal for her to exact revenge on Colby and we know there is no love lost between them. I tend to think that what we saw and heard from Colby was, again, us being allowed to view these people as cream of the crop players BUT with Achilles heels, past grudges, bias on other players etc. Colby's words (to me anyway) were needed to flesh out their relationship and put it to bed so to speak much like us finally getting some dynamic of what Lex and Ethan were all about.
I sense we may see this occurring with.........
Tom and Lex
Amber and Jerri
perhaps Rob and Kathy
Lex and Kathy (we have already seen their friendship come into play)
We already DID see this with (as much as it could considering some were on different tribes)
Jenna and Ethan
Rich and Sue
Rich and Rudy
Lex and Ethan
Colby and Jerri
Kathy and Lex
(Tina was first gone so that was tough for anyone to do anything with)
I would *hope* MB would like to potentially "reward" his audience with allowing us to see how the affects of their individual season bonding and off show relationships caused some chink here and there even if only an acknowledgement but that is just a guess on my part

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DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
03-24-04, 08:21 AM (EST)

104. "RE: Jerri"

I notice how you placed an emphasis on the Jeri v. Colby but it was always my impression that Jeri v. Tina was more intense. After Tina was voted out I thought Jeri wouldn't be far behind as she was more open about wanting to beat Tina. Even though she did verbalized about wanting to beat Colby, I didn't sense it as strongly as I did with Tina.
Another thing about Jeri.....In the first episode she made comments about changing her game and being a better player by biting her lip and keeping her mouth shut. The minute she arrives on MM Colby is quick to point out to Ethan that she is excatly the same, right down to her game play. Meanwhile in confessionals she PERCIEVES herself as playing a different game and biting her lip and being nicer. It's obvious from listening to Ethan, SA, KO, and Colby that her perceptions are way off. I don't really know if this means anything, I just find it interesting.
Jeri is not considered a big fish and when/if the tribes merge Jeri could concievable last awhile as the "Big Boys" take each other out. I'm beginning to doubt if her story is completely told just yet. She's like a bad penny.....you just can't get rid of her.

DRONES

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memacmur 359 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host"
03-19-04, 05:17 PM (EST)

96. "Episode 8"

This is nice and late, and probable does little more than reiterate the points VS has made, but I enjoy making my brain think about Survivor on Fridays, so here come my opinions on the editting/etc. following episode 8
Mogo Mogo
Lex - Clearly seens as a leader of his tribe. Also, the editting seems to be much more negative towards Lex this episode. Not sure if it's just because his choice of getting rid of Colby and Ethan early may contribute to his tribe's continued losing, or because they don't want us to get too far behind Lex.
Kathy - I was flabbergasted the Mogo's were dumb enough to send Kathy to Chapera again. Their rationale must have been something along the lines of 'well, we're screwed anyways, so let's let Kathy go build some alliances on the other side.'
I think she is trying to play 'the game', hence they showed us her sympathy to Ethan, and her voting against him. She may not have liked it, but she is playing the game this time around. Of the Mogos, I now beleive Kathy and Shii-Ann have the best chance of lasting.
Shii Ann - I still think there is more to come. Not much to see here in her editting other than her continued disgust with Jerri and her prowess in thumping Alicia during the log rolling challenge. A little negative (too much complaining), but her UTR strategy seems to mimic our last winner (Sandra). Let the others fight it out....
Jerri - I still think her story is all but done. I will be surprised if she lasts much longer, unless the twist actually allows a Chappy tribe member to get voted out.
Chapera
Rawb - If anything, I think they're making him look a little more evil with each episode. Then again, he's probably getting more confident with every episode. I still think we're being set up for his fall, but between a Pagonging of MogoMogo and a few IC wins, I still think he'll be in the top 5.
Amber - She actually received some face time. Not sure if this bodes well for her or not. Clearly she has developed a good friendship with Jenna, and this ability to get along (despite her canoodling with Rawb) may take her farther than her snuggle-buddy
Tom - Hmmm. Still the bumbling buffoon, but notice how quiet he is when people try to stir the pot around him? I liken his game to Shii Anns, but instead of complaining he mumbles incoherently or 'dances.' He may be the one to actually orchestrate the fall of the Rawb-father.
Rupert - Once again, we see the hero in trouble. Will he survive against the Machivallian Rawbfather? Tune in next week - and the week after that, and the week after that to find out. I think the Rawb-Rupe conflict is a tease to surprise us with Alicia being the next of the Chappy's to go. He has been shown as vulnerable, so I see him fighting back (for a little while, at least). They never really show Rupert strategizing, which is either a big change from PI (when frankly he did no strategizing) and they're hiding that, or he's stuck in the same old sorry situation.
Alicia - Big mouth, big muscles, no balance, no alliance. Of course, not having an alliance shown is almost always a good thing, but in her case I doubt there is a very strong one.
Jenna - Again, a good edit for a finalist. Not seen in the Rupert/Rawb conflict (because good players avoid such conflicts), gave us some commentary on the emotions of MogoMogo (and as a former Saboga member, she would know), and was a good girl as she brought the presents. Interesting that they chose to show just her delivering said presents, as opposed to the discussion that must have occured back at camp. Perhaps it was someone elses idea, and they wanted to keep Jenna looking good.
Well, that's all I have for now, even though most of has already been said!
MEmacmur

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RyrieRae 416 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
03-24-04, 12:42 PM (EST)

106. "Jerri stands a chance"

If Jerri plays her cards right, she could go far. Here's how...
Jerri is an outsider in her camp. She's not an original MogoMogo and her new team doesn't even like her that much.
At the Chapera camp, there has to be some division. Afterall, they are a team, and who knows if and when they will go to Tribal Council. So some level of strategy is going on that we are not seeing because it's not that necessary when they never have to go to TC.
Now let's pretend like we've merged. Here's where Jerri could have some reinforcements...
1)Rupert and Jenna feel insecure because they are not original Chappy's. After MogoMogo is pagonged, they are next to go. They recruit Jerri (who was from their original Saboga) as an added vote with them.
2)Jerri and Amber were allies in S2 and Amber may invite her in with she and Rob, pagong MogoMogo, then eliminate Chapera, with Jerri as an "expendable." She would play the part again of an added vote so that Amber and Rob don't have as many votes against them.
Just a couple ideas, but they are definite possibilities. Especially after the editing speculation mentioned
above.

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-24-04, 02:31 PM (EST)

107. "RE: Jerri stands a chance"

The only issue I have with Jerri and her longevity is her past reputation. I think I mentioned on the first thread of this that there are some players (by sheer virtue of who they were in their last season) that could be booted for that fact alone.
Rob C. was booted mainly for that reason just as an example
Jerri's t.v. persona from S2 may have been enough for the other players to just not want to deal with her in the long term.
Remember, we aren't talking about strangers here, these people built up bias and/or respect/friendships over the seasons. Now I believe I recall Alicia and Jerri traveling after they got booted but Alicia isn't exactly in a position to rally the troops to keep Jerri aboard. As far as Amber, I'm not so sure Amber would want her around. Amber has gone to some lengths to make sure the press knew she deserved to be there after being in Jerri's shadow for most of S2. I don't know that she would want Jerri to encroach on her turf now and I also don't know (someone who knows about these players outside the game better can help here)how close Jerri and Amber actually are for that matter.
As far as anything Jerri has to really offer............
Others with "reputation issues" may in actuality have more to offer. Jerri is not exactly queen of the challenges, she isn't the fish monger either and . She may be a good final two partner but frankly, I don't think people are even looking at her in that vein. Remember, Jerri went in S2 the minute former Ogakor felt they were secure enough in numbers to let her go mainly because they just could not stand her any longer.
I will say that if Jerri was still being shown to us how she was in the Saboga days (so long ago ) then I had some really positive plans for her and actually considered her to be a front runner due to such a unique portrayal of her "character" (if you will) The fact that we are being shown THE Jerri might be the tip off to a sooner, rather than later, demise. I believe Ethan stated Jerri was acting her usual self even at Saboga. But we weren't privy to a lot of that. In fact, I was pleasantly surprised by Jerri and questioned whether she was getting a pleasant showing more to repair the reputation she was so upset in having.
Now Mr. Burnett is letting us see what had been there. With such a change in her "style", I have to question the reason.

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memacmur 359 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host"
03-24-04, 04:25 PM (EST)

109. "RE: Jerri stands a chance"

Like VS stated already - it's not that I don't think she has a chance as a player, but simply that the editting has spoiled the chances of her lasting much longer. Heck, as a player, I wouldn't mind taking Jerri to the finals with me - she's so well disliked you would probably get votes from the other players spite towards her.
She's been nice, she's been happy (Colby gone, yay), and now she is back to being the bad old b!tch she was in Australia.
Usually the producers of Survivor either portray the final 2 in the same manner over the entire arc of the series, or at least have the story culminate in the win. I just don't see how they can carry on 'telling a story' with Jerri. As such, I don't think she'll be smart enough to follow the type of strategy you described. Too bad for her!
MEmacmur

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-24-04, 05:16 PM (EST)

110. "Jerri=Neleh?"

actually i think Jerri's longevity makes a lot more sense from the editing than from game logic, where I completely agree with VS. However, I've consistently had Jerri in my top 4 candidates to win, and still do. BUT I'm beginning to see her editing a lot like Neleh's - sugary sweet (at least in her own mind), but perceived quite differently by her tribe. Or maybe a bit like Matthew from Amazon (I think someone may have made that comparison already up above somewhere). So I had thought her chances at being the winner were slightly better than F2, but now I'm swicthing. I could definitely see her being the loser in the jury vote at this point (again, based more on editing; game logic says she's likely the next to go)
If I had to make a F2 pick right now, I'd probably say Jenna over Jerri (again, I also think Tom is a strong candidate to win, but i don't see him in the Finals with Jenna...So I'd say EITHER Jenna OR Tom wins, with EITHER Jerri OR Amber in 2nd...Alicia is still my darkhorse to make F2)

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-24-04, 05:26 PM (EST)

111. "RE: Jerri=Neleh?"

Or maybe a bit like Matthew from Amazon (I think someone may have made that comparison already up above somewhere).
She sort of reminds me of a less insecure version of Christy from the Amazon. I get the impression that Jerri is already resigned to not winning the game, and she doesn't have any intention of really trying to do so.
Hell, she doesn't even seem to have much faith in her alliance with Lex. In the last two episodes she seemed relieved to find out that she wasn't the one on the chopping block after all.

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memacmur 359 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Cooking Show Host"
03-24-04, 06:12 PM (EST)

112. "RE: Jerri=Neleh?"

I like the Christy comparison.
Especially in that if Jerri was a finalist, I don't think they would have made such a big deal about how Jerri is happy just to have outlasted Colby. How now her goal is accomplished, she has proven her point (in Christi's case it was that a hearing-impaired person is able to compete in things like Survivor). She (Christie)was content to be on the jury, not using it as step one of several to winning)
With the exception of Vecipia, who I frankly barely noticed, ALL of the previous Survivor winners have been editted as wanting to win.
Given her behaviour in A.$.$. I wouldn't be surprised to find out Jenna whined and moaned as much as Seana (hope I have the name right, the redhead who just needed some boys) in the Amazon edition of Survivor, but they would have cut that out so we didn't have that to cloud our opinion of Jenna. Of course, I still wasn't happy she won, but that's what I get for cheering for an animated skeleton.
Going back to my point, which was to agree with you, I think the main reason Jerri will not last much longer is that we've been told by Jerri that she's done what she came here to do, while everyone else is still talking about what they have to do to win the whole shebang in their confessionals.
Woohoo, I manged to use 3 different spellings of Christy. I hope one of them was right!
MEmacmur

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popsicle 15 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson"
03-24-04, 03:08 PM (EST)

108. "RE: Episode 8"

I agree with you MEmacmur on Tom - he will most likely make it to the final 4. I thing Alicia will be out soon as portraying her in negative light. Jerri may still stick around if Chappy loses IC. They haven't had too many brainteasing IC and I haven't yet seen any gross food IC yet - strenght is irrelevant in those types of IC. Chappy could very well lose a couple IC
going forward.
Popsicle

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-24-04, 09:39 PM (EST)

113. "RE: After the recrap"

Just thought that the recrap did have some interesting clips of the survivors. Just loved the Happy Chappy mock TC with them imitating Sabogans. Looks like Tom had Rupert and his spear pegged prior to them getting to know him. Loved "Ethan's" hair do....but, the most interesting thing to come out of that mock TC is that they voted JENNA L. off!!! How's that for some MB irony....hmmmm, perhaps foreshadowing of her going all the way, outlasting the entire Chappy tribe?
We also got to see the Robfadda-Big Tom alliance in the making...Tom has assessed the situation very realistically, not trusting him, but riding it through....smarter than he looks....and sounds.
Robfadda really is a character, he seems set on the prize, yet sure knows how to have alot more fun along the way than he did in Marquesa, perhaps Amber is a relaxing influence on him...again, you could plainly see that he has a genuine interest in her...could be trouble when your alliance is that BLATANT. Smart of Amber to want to tone it down in front of the others, encouraging and not getting her dander up over the attention paid to Robfadda by Jenna L. Still seems like the Robfadda show to me....really getting the edit this season.

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I_AM_HE 6123 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-25-04, 02:18 AM (EST)

114. "RE: After the recrap"

very good observation on the Jenna L. "vote"
i wasn't really watching, and didn't expect any "spoilers" but i did see that. certainly doesn't give me any reason to change from my Jenna pick

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DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
03-25-04, 06:00 AM (EST)

115. "RE: After the recrap"

I haven't seen this much focus on a Survivor since....well....Rupert and we know how that turned out, don't we
DRONES

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-25-04, 08:05 AM (EST)

116. "RE: After the recrap"

I actually took away more from this recap than I suspected I would some of which you astute people already mentioned
The faux TC with Jenna as their boot.
A lot of focus on Jerri's NEGATIVES, rather than anything positive. In the interim, we have fun with Tom and Rob, a different but visible side to Amber, Jenna sprinkled throughout, the highs/lows of Rupert and not much very different on Lex and Kathy.
Shii Ann and Alicia barely visible and nothing very substantial in the recap (may mean nothing but gave me a pause for thought over their longevity)
Rob M. and his discussion for next week's move he makes. Anyone else notice the reappearance of his S4 Godfather music?? I see a revisitation of the Robfather fast approaching.
Tom's big boy comment again (again, his "showing" even the recap has me wondering at a potential final two stand)
Rob's comment again about nobody trusting nobody - this should really come into play soon especially if he does something drastic next week. Coupled with Rob's cuddling of Jenna and Amber and keeping your friends close and enemies closer. Interesting that this included Jenna.
The interesting dynamic we got to see of Tom/Rob Rob/Amber as mentioned. Rob thinks he is sitting very pretty but WE know that both Tom and Amber haven't been playing this blindly either. Amber's: I have him wrapped and Tom's I don't trust him; don't trust any of them. Perhaps Rob better be careful.
The tiff we saw between Rupert/Jerri with Jenna over the shelter. I see perhaps something coming down the pike involving Jerri and Rupert perhaps?
Amber's comment about taking the other tribe down (well that was for sure) along with the necklace making and the fake TC and the Chapera unity. We know for certain this will come to a head.
Notice NOW that Colby's showing was much more positive than what we got to see when he appeared to have Hatch syndrome. Editing
is very good at making us see what Mark Burnett wants us to see.
The huge sentencing of Rob's spending his million or worst case spending Amber's
Kathy being warned by Ethan about Lex and false sense of security.
Now just opinion from watching..........
-Rob is going to do something Godfatheresque if you will; the new/old music behind him signals that. Could this be the start of the end?
-Lex's false sense of security with his power player boots will haunt him and he will find himself now scrambling much like Ethan was doing. Kathy may even be a key factor
-Kathy will be forced to choose a side finally; this should result in her turning her back on a MM
-SA and Alicia are starting to come to the end. Their lack of any real showing last night (even for a recap) doesn't bode well to me.
-Jerri's recap of mostly negative tells me that this is coming to a head for her as well. If she were to stay longer, I really feel more highlight would have been put on any positives rather than the negatives (Ethan's comment: she checked out)
-Rupert is finally humanized; we see the triumphs/mistakes. We saw his inadequate feelings between Rob and also Jerri etc. He is finally fleshed out; I like this better personally. Rupert is steady right now
-More Tom entertainment; will have to reiterate what I said in the beginnning; HE IS NOT STUPID and sees everything. I had high hopes for him after first episode, I still do
-Jenna's showing not quite there but not quite invisible. Some key things about her. Her friendship with Rob/Amber (yet Rob considering her in the friends close/enemies closer), her being the boot at Chapera's TC, her reinforcement of Chapera's unity but I did not see her far set apart from some dynamics of MM (hugging Lex in one shot) She has balance right now, like Rupert does. Her equalizing has me believing she is holding steady like Rupert and Tom
-Amber. Strategy check showing. We had an idea of that but her thoughts on Rob and taking down the other tribe speaks more volumes that she is definitely playing the game. Would find it very ironic if she had a hand in Jerri's boot much like her faux vote for Jerri at Chapera's TC

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Brownroach 15341 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-25-04, 03:08 PM (EST)

117. "RE: After the recrap"

No one's mentioned "Tina's" fake boobs at the fake TC. That was the funniest thing to me! (Who knew Amber was such a card.)
-SA and Alicia are starting to come to the end. Their lack of any real showing last night (even for a recap) doesn't bode well to me.
-Jerri's recap of mostly negative tells me that this is coming to a head for her as well. If she were to stay longer, I really feel more highlight would have been put on any positives rather than the negatives (Ethan's comment: she checked out)
Definitely agree on all of this, VS.
I thought it interesting that Tom and Jenna were "officially" pulled into the dynamic surrounding Robfaddah now. I'm agreeing with you more and more that Rob seems destined to fall -- but not yet. The recap seemed to be setting him up to have new stories unfurl around him -- I think he will continue to dominate the proceedings for most of the rest of the game.

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Cuauhtewatemoccajava 133 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
03-25-04, 08:10 PM (EST)

118. "RE: After the recrap"

>>>>>>SA and Alicia are starting to come to the end. Their lack of any real showing last night (even for a recap) doesn't bode well to me.
Alicia was in the top 5 for the confessional count of the recap.
It went:
Rob M.
Rupert
Amber
Jerri
Alicia
Tom
Kathy
Lex
Jenna Lewis
Shii Ann

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-26-04, 07:41 AM (EST)

119. "RE: After the recrap"

Forgive me; I should have been more specific. What I meant was not theamount of time but rather the quality of their time. If I recall most of what was said was "fluff" and didn't have any substantive meaning which IMO doesn't bode well for players since we are more likely to see more "meat" if you will if these players are going to be around.

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DRONES 615 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
03-29-04, 05:23 AM (EST)

121. "RE: After the recrap"

Jerri has had a spike in negativity but I haven't seen anything positive for her since before the shelter building competition.
Everything points for her to be booted yet....it just doesn't make sense. She's a loner who's not an immunity threat. She just seems to hang on. Her inability to get taken down, even though she was targetted by former runner up Colby and winner Ethan. Ethans words to both Lex and Kathy about Jeri. Her attituedd and work ethic are horrible and she is has been a negative influence on both of her tribes. She is going to make Ethans profetic words come true bringing down both Lex and Kathy.
Jenna has a balance but it's hard to tell if it's blistfull ignorance or strategy. She, at times, acts like she is on a team instead of playing the game. She doesn't seem to have any strong alliance. The threesome she has going with Rob and Amber is going to blow up eventually. She may have something going on with Rupert that we haven't seen yet.

DRONES

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geg6 14941 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-29-04, 03:22 PM (EST)

122. "RE: After the recrap"

VS, I don't even know why I try to think these things out when I can just read your posts for something that brings it all together. Brilliant!

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-29-04, 04:55 PM (EST)

123. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

LAST EDITED ON 03-29-04 AT 04:56 PM (EST)
I just wanted to point out something from this vidcap for this weeks Survivor episode.
I know that we are all in agreement that the Happy Chappy tribe is one unified tribe, but even with their body language, they exude unity. Look how Boston Rob and Big Tom are leaning toward one another here, and also notice how Rupert, who is sandwiched between two Mogo's is standing solidly between the two, with his arms closed and folded over his chest....as if he does'nt want to go near either of them.
And this vidcap is supposedly post their pairing off with a Mogo Mogo, so you would think that they would assume a more relaxed position in the line-up, but not so....Chappy exudes unity!

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VerucaSalt 1580 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Peanut Festival Grand Marshall"
03-30-04, 07:38 AM (EST)

124. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

geg6 thank you for the kind words I love this thread; everyone has such great observations and "takes" on the situation and the people.
flower, agreed. Watching Chapera is like watching a well oiled cohesive machine. They exude unity even in a simple picture like you stated. The mere fact that they chose to body paint themselves (of course depending on what the instructions said in the tree mail) while MM did not, makes it all too clear that they are one happy tribe.
This naturally also reeks to me of a set up to throw a little trouble thier way which we all pretty much saw coming anyway as well as testing the Rob and Amber romance.
I'll be interested to see if what I *think* may happen does with the handy dandy list I made above.

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geg6 14941 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
03-30-04, 09:18 AM (EST)

125. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

VS, this is my favorite thread because of the exact reasons you cited. I just hate all the boot list discussions because it takes all of the fun of analysis out of the game. To me, this is really where it's at in any MB show: the editing. And, on that basis, I have to say that Amber, Jenna, Rupert, and Tom should be safe. Everyone else, look out!

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Flowerpower 7262 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-02-04, 09:11 AM (EST)

126. "After the tribal swap: The Players, the game, the editing"

Wow, what a fantastic episode for exposing alot of what they are all thinking! Firstly, it showed the continuing bonding of the big boys, Rupert and Tom. Tom once again, keeping his options open. In reading Markopolo's thread on the Insider, I was facinated to see that Jerri made the comment, "Now that I know Big Tom and him (Lex) are really banking on their friendship and their trust in each other...." I knew, from the episode that Lex was indeed depending on reestablishing his prior relationship/alliance with Big Tom after the merge, but I did not know that Tom was planning this too. I am ASSuming that Jerri found that Tom was indeed banking on Lex's friendship and trust in each other post merge, from her time spent with Tom when they paired off together and shared the picnic lunch together....or at least that's what Tom led her to believe....VERY INTERESTING!!!! Tom really keeping his options open!
Amber really playing the game now!....perhaps a winners edit after all! She did not expose anything of her relationships with her Chappy tribemates to the Mogo's, with the exception of telling them how poorly Alicia reacted over the log roll challenge....confirming Alicia's low man on the Chappy totem pole status once again.
Amber also did what she HAD to do in order to get the Mogo's to vote out Jerri...she's definately a playya! Interesting that she promised Kathy a final 5 place with Lex, Rob, Tom, and herself.....Says that after Rob being her first priority alliance, she next values Big Tom the most....this is as I have suspected as Tom has seemed to bond with them more so than any of the other original Chappy's.....his befriending Rupert throws a wrench into all of this though! This also exposed Kathy's much stronger bond to Lex, than to Shii Ann. Shii Ann seems so oblivious to me, just UTR excess baggage....just filling a void. Amber, on the preview, questioning her ability to keep her promises to everyone, but at least it bought her three more days.....see selling your soul is how you make it to the end game! We sure all know where her allegiance lies.
Now, for the Robfadda??? Boy, talk about playing emotionally! Surely this will lead to his demise! I think this is the beginning of the end for Boston Rob....if he pulls it out to the F2 though, IMO, he deserves to win the whole thing. His comment to Lex could have indeed saved Amber's life! He really seems to want to end the game with Amber more so than winning it all by himself....hmmmm?
We also saw Rupert scheming and plotting, for a change! Finally, Rupert is talking....telling and agreeing with Shii that Boston Rob needs to go early as he is a challenge hog...
In the previews it shows Alicia making an alliance with Robfadda, but then Robfadda backs out of it....again, showing Robfadda rapidly acquiring more enemies. I'm sure that all of the remaining Chappy's are weary of Robfadda's alliance with Amber, as they know that she is his number one priority and that any of them could be sacrificed in exchange for her....I'd say everyone's main priority in this game is going to be the same....give Boston Rob the boot, ASAP! As I've said, if he makes it to the end game, he surely will have earned it!
Great episode, Flowerpower

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cdlafl 26 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
04-02-04, 11:36 AM (EST)

128. "RE: After the tribal swap: The Players, the game, the editing"

I agree...I feel like right now, Lex and Rob have both of their stories coming to an arc...both are getting a lot of air time and their falls are being setup...kathy is close behind, since she is in with Lex...I believe Shii Ann will be the last old MM left...she is so UTR that Lex and Kathy will become shields...alicia's story is starting now w/Rob alliance, but she is still the first old Chapera to go...amber is getting a lot of air time, but her story is not really coming to arc like rob's...finally, rupert, tom and jenna are gettin enough air time, but their stories are just beginning to develop...i think they do in fact make top 5, if not final 4...that's just my opinion...of course, the "twist" on the II this week could mix some things up...

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Simom72 2 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson"
04-02-04, 10:36 AM (EST)

127. "Jenna L. vote"

I thought it was interesting that both in the show promos and in the immunity challenge, they showed us Sean voting for Jenna -- in the episode where she was voted out of the game the first time around.
Of course, I realize the questions were chosen before MB or anyone else knew who would win the game, but -- combined with the recrap scene of the Chappies staging a mock tribal council and voting out Jenna, it means that they've now shown us Jenna being voted out of the game twice. Perhaps to make up for the fact that we'll never see her voted out for real?

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bdemoney 745 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
04-02-04, 01:37 PM (EST)

129. "RE: Jenna L. vote"

Flower some great thoughts you had on this most recent episode.
One thing I would like to address though is that even though Amber stated to Kathy that she would like to have the two of them, Lex, Rob and Tom in the final five I don't think it actually means that she is actually closest to Tom (other than Rob, of course). I think she was just telling them what they wanted to hear.
She already has a final four deal with Rupert and Jenna as well and may end up having to honor that deal instead.
For instance, she knows Lex will think he can align with Tom when the merge comes and that this information might keep her around (which it did). But does she actually plan on honoring her word? That is another question.
We already know from the previews that Rob doesn't keep his word to someone next week. And even though the previews make it seem like he is talking to Alicia, I think he is actually talking to either Lex or Kathy.
Then Amber will be stuck in the middle of "two rivals" as to who to keep her word to (which will obviously be Rob). Since I am figuring the rivals to be either Rob/Lex or Rob/Kathy. Since I don't see Jenna or Rupert being 'rivals' with anyone.
Depending on who wins immunity next week, and what the immunity twist ends up being, I see Lex, Kathy or Alicia leaving next week. Although am leaning heavily towards a Lex boot right now. It will be interesting to see what this weeks information turns up....

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CRyanShort 42 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
04-02-04, 01:40 PM (EST)

130. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

(I posted this seperately, but BDE suggested it may be better put here Thanks, BDE!)
I’ve been lurking for a few months on these boards, and everyone has such great insights to offer! (I lurked not because I’m shy but because that damn anonymous email rule tripped me up. How silly…). That said, if this post seems inappropriately placed or inconsequential, have mercy on me. J
I thought last’s night episode was interesting because the entire episode indirectly discussed or mirrored the previous play of a handful of the players. Yes, because of the nature of All Stars, every episode refers to the past to some degree, but I thought last night’s commentary on previous Survivor experience was especially pronounced. Some notable examples:
~Rob made a bold play with Lex, and Kathy noticed Rob’s Godfather strategy, referring to his game plan from S4.
~Amber and Jerri’s sorority bond from Australia was resurrected and discussed, but only at tribal council.
~Shii Ann and Rupert paired because of their shared singleness as past season representatives.
~Lex once again severed one of his own with a dicey play to get ahead, just as he did in Africa.
Furthermore, and this may just be a product of chance, but the IC of the Grand Survivor Quiz fit perfectly with the tone.
My question for the group is this: based on last night’s editing choices in highlighting the castaway’s previous experiences, what messages or implications do you think MB may be suggesting for the rest of the episodes?
The very first thing I thought after the episode was how seriously afraid every person is of Rob M. Have we seen this kind of genuine fear before in an episode, and not because that feared icon was about to chop off the heads of someone? L/SA/K genuinely feared his wrath. They reminded me of ancient Greeks slaughtering bulls to appease the gods. It's just like S4 for Rob, but this time it's working. Does this fear and reverence reflect on Rob M.’s F2 chances? And what about the others? How does last night’s editing speak about their varied level of success in S8? Discuss!

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fredscott 16 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson"
04-02-04, 03:03 PM (EST)

132. "RE: After the Dissolve, The Players, The Game, The Editing"

The fear and reverence that the other players feel for Rob might benefit him in the short term, but in the long run I think that the same fear will mean the doom of his F2 chances. In the Pearl Islands, people were afraid of Rupert also, but it didn't stop them from voting him off almost as soon as they got the chance. I think, and hope, that eventually someone will rally the others and lead a revolt against Rob. Of course, it is equally if not more likely that the others will allow Rob to pick them off one by one. Only time will tell.
BTW, and FYI, the odds of both tribes remaining together, except for Amber, are 1 in 3,628,800. This is according to my Calculus II professor. Maybe Jeff was right, maybe it is meant to be.

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buckeyegirl 5449 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
04-02-04, 02:46 PM (EST)

131. "Amber's reaction"

I thought it was interesting that while we saw the other Survivor's reaction to Rob and Lex's agreement/deal, we didn't see Amber's reaction at all. Are we suppose to think that she is ignorant of the whole thing? I just thought that was really interesting, also we didn't see the new Mogo Mogo's reaction to the deal (Or whatever you want to call it)will we see it next week...is that where the betrayal part comes in that we saw in the promos?

A Kyngsladye Original. RMMW!

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yensid 786 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Fitness Correspondent"
04-02-04, 03:15 PM (EST)

133. "RE: Amber's reaction"

I don't think she heard it because she walks off pretty quickly when the new Chaps loose. Doesn't even really look at Rob. Kathy said she heard it and Amber does talk to Kathy about keeping her. The only way Amber would have really known about it is if Lex or Kathy told her and they didn't show us that, if it happened.

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