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kanunu 4 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson" 02-16-02, 10:17 AM (EST) "Rule changes shift power to brains?" I?m surprised that someone hasn?t commented on how the rule changes will affect the dynamics of the game. With prior votes not being counted, how will tie votes be settled? Do we assume that a tie vote would be broken by a question-and-answer session? Would they have time to set up a one-on-one physical challenge? If it appears that a TC is heading to a tie vote, will the contestants try to pick on the perceived dumber member of the opposing side? Will tribe members try to weed out the weak links first? What are the other rule changes? If Survivor becomes more like a TV game show, who would this help and hurt? From the short bios given, I honestly don?t know how each of the S4 contestants would respond to the pressures of a tie-break quiz. I don?t mean to offend anyone. I?m relying on only the short bios and probably unjustified stereotypes. Please feel free to flame away, because I hope most of the stereotypes are broken down. I sincerely hope, however, that all teachers, judges and pilots are smarter than the rest of us. I assume that four members of Maraamu ? Gina, Sean, Hunter and Peter ? and four members of Rotu ? John, Paschal, Tammy and Gabriel ? would benefit. If one of these two tribes were to achieve these alliances, I believe they would have a very decided advantage. Gina: Hopefully, a former high school science teacher has the smarts. She should also benefit if tie-break questions are about the ecology of the island. Sean: Like Gina, Sean is a high school teacher. Graduating from SUNY with a psychology and theatre major, maybe he isn?t the stereotypical junior high coach/teacher. Hunter: I can?t help but think that this pilot is smart and can perform well under pressure. Peter: Peter graduated summa cum laude from Boston University, but that was 22 years ago. John: John also graduated summa cum laude, from Bellevue University. His ambitions of becoming a lawyer should indicate his abilities. Paschal: A judge. Let?s all hope that he has the gray matter. Tammy: A masters degree in journalism from Boston University. She should be pretty much clued up. Gabriel: Gabriel should be considered a strong link, since he attended North Carolina School of Science and Mathematics. I also assume that he has strong language skills given his interest in French.   Top

Subject     Author     Message Date     ID    RE: Rule changes shift power to bra... dangerkitty 02-16-02 1  RE: Rule changes shift power to bra... Swami 02-16-02 2  Ignorance big toms goat 02-16-02 3  Don't count out the Rednecks dabo 02-17-02 4    What ARE all the rule changes? George Tirebiter 02-17-02 5        RE: What ARE all the rule changes? dabo 02-18-02 7    RE: Don't count out the Rednecks Fast Eddie 02-17-02 6    RE: Don't count out the Rednecks kanunu 02-18-02 8        Tie breaker Ahtumbreez 02-19-02 9            RE: Tie breaker Kaumanaboy 02-22-02 10  RE: Rule changes shift power to bra... janisella 02-24-02 11    RE: Rule changes shift power to bra... dabo 02-24-02 12

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dangerkitty 1913 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser" 02-16-02, 01:48 PM (EST) 1. "RE: Rule changes shift power to brains?" LAST EDITED ON 02-16-02 AT 01:51 PM (EST) Welcome kanunu! Good point you bring up. First of all, we assume nothing. If we've learned anything, it's that. Let's say that, indeed, prior votes won't count this time. This is a more complicated change than just assuming that everything else will remain the same; that is, there will be more layers to it than just continuing with the same tie-break system as before. Or more simply, just because the tie-break was a quiz before, doesn't mean it will always be so this time. The last two seasons, balance of power that carried through to the end swung on tie-break decisions. S2, when Varner was voted out, and S3, when Lindsey was voted out. Also, voting decisions were often made based on "piling on" votes. MB is out to crack that system, I'll bet. And how will this new batch of players learn of this new rule? Not until after they make the dreaded "assumption" perhaps? <insert image of evilly grinning MB here> Since the producers will know about the new rule, they can plan ahead for the challenge that decides it. For that matter, they will know in advance when a tie is possible, and the players could be taken to TC much earlier in case more time is needed, and different types of challenges arranged. The final group in S3 said that the reason that they didn't cook the rooster was that it took a long time, and they never knew when they would be called to a challenge. So there is no "schedule" that they can count on - same could hold for TC, they could be sent there much earlier than we or they might "asssume". All in all, this rule change would create a different dynamic for the players and for the spoilers. One reason I tend to believe it's true is that, as I said above, assumptions about that rule have driven voting - especially last season. It's MB's game, and he doesn't want the players figuring too much out - anymore than he wants us to. Monkey wrench, thy name is Mark Burnett. edited because a said S3 twice   Top

Swami 5885 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 02-16-02, 06:34 PM (EST) 2. "RE: Rule changes shift power to brains?" Welcome, kanunu. Actually, this topic has been discussed on diamond's thread, called 'Prior Votes Don't count.' And I agree it will change the dynamics of the game a lot, although I'm not sure the change will favour so called 'smart' people more than others. I see it as favouring the more aggressive & outspoken people. If you tick off or offend someone, but are otherwise in good stead with most others in your tribe, their vote for you will not be an albatross around your neck for the rest of the game. Also, smart does not imply excellence at social manipulation. This is a game in which social manipulators do well, by surviving as the less socially adept are voted off early in the game. In S1 Richard was the only true social manipulator in the latter part of the game, but in S2 and S3 the final 4 or 3 were all excellent social manipulators. I wonder if ties will be solved by a quick 1 on 1 challenge of some kind? That would be fun. Challenges are way better TV than questions from the survivor's handbook--those are getting old. Swami   Top

big toms goat 14 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson" 02-16-02, 07:13 PM (EST) 3. "Ignorance" Ignorance = Lack of knowledge on a subject. Just because someone is "smart" doesn't mean they can answer every question on every subject. Ask Dr. Carl from S3. It could be Survival topics, or how well you know your other Survivors or it could be something way out there like how many people in Tahiti own a T.V. I think every person has a chance to win a tie breaker. Otherwise it becomes another argument in the "Survivor is fixed" scandal. Come in a stranger, leave a little stranger   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 02-17-02, 00:08 AM (EST) 4. "Don't count out the Rednecks" LAST EDITED ON 02-17-02 AT 01:39 AM (EST) As MB noted in his second Survivor book, rednecks are naturals at the game of Survivor because that's how they tend to live their lives anyway, adapting and doing what it takes to survive. We have no indication that the trivial pursuit challenge will still be the deadlock-breaker in S4, that may be one of the new wrinkles that MB alluded to in the TV Guide piece, but in all honesty if it still is the deadlock-breaker then you can expect that those who arm themselves to survive will be the ones to win those challenges. There may be an intelligence quotient to factor into it, but the greater ability here is to be able to accurately understand the situation one is in and be prepared to deal with it in the proper way. I'll bet you anything (not that there's any way to prove it) that had there been a trivial pursuit challenge in S1 about nothing but tapioca root, Sue Hawk would have won it.   Top

George Tirebiter 2982 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Howard Stern Show Guest" 02-17-02, 01:08 PM (EST) 5. "What ARE all the rule changes?" So--the prior votes won't count, the jury has 14 members, have there been any other clues to what other rule changes might be? S4 was being filmed whilst S3 was airing here, so they could conceivably trot out the switch again, without the contestants expecting it. I believe one tribe has to move their camp pre-merge--which sounds like it may have been due to something unforeseen, rather than a gamemaster's strategy (story here) A recent article from Tahiti Presse has indicated that the Survivor tribe camped in the Hakatea area (Daniel's Bay) has been relocated, at about the Episode 5 time frame in filming, to an area at Hakapaa. Also stated: The rules of the game have been grossly changed this time for unknown reasons. A trusted Marquesean has said furthermore that the Survivor Tribal Council sits now every three days at Colette Bay. On the other hand, up to now, the two tribes, composed of 16 contestants, has been located at Hakaui and Hakatea. It is learned today that one of them finds themselves at Hakapaa. The second tribe remains at Hakaui. So is the term "grossly changed" simply hyperbole? or are there other surprises in store? To my mind, the two we already know about are big enough, but I expect MB wants to get us expecting MORE, and tuning in to see if there's something as big as the switch pulled in S3. GT (coonhead, you cracked me up with the redneck thing--as well as admitting you've read MB's book!)   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 02-18-02, 01:01 AM (EST) 7. "RE: What ARE all the rule changes?" Well, I read both of them actually, the first one because I'd started watching S1 late and later caught most of what I'd missed from the reruns, the second one because it came out early enough that it was worth looking into for what it might reveal about S2. Anyway, about the 14 member jury, I'll believe it when I see it. Honestly, though, I don't think there will be a jury with an even number of jurists, or any other possible permutation in the game, which would create the prospect for a tie vote in the final tc which would then have to be resolved five months after the fact on live television. Exciting a prospect as that may seem to some, it's preposterous. The winner has to be determined at the actual conclusion of the game, on the island.   Top

Fast Eddie 625 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 02-17-02, 03:27 PM (EST) 6. "RE: Don't count out the Rednecks" >As MB noted in his second >Survivor book, rednecks are naturals >at the game of Survivor >because that's how they tend >to live their lives anyway, >adapting and doing what it >takes to survive. Sounds like my theory of why they should have contestants who are homeless people. > I'll bet you anything >(not that there's any way >to prove it) that had >there been a trivial pursuit >challenge in S1 about nothing >but tapioca root, Sue Hawk >would have won it. If you'll recall, they fixed one competition for Sean by asking some medical qustions.   Top

kanunu 4 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "American Cancer Society Spokesperson" 02-18-02, 08:05 AM (EST) 8. "RE: Don't count out the Rednecks" Interesting points. I?m sorry Diamond, I didn?t see your thread. My bad. Dabo, I especially liked your point about rednecks. Kanunu means bullfrog in Cherokee. Maybe, I have just enough Native American blood for a permanent tan line on my neck. Why oh why didn?t I get the genetics for a tan on the rest of my body? If tie-breaks aren?t settled by a trivial pursuit type of questions, how will they be settled? I tried searching for Polynesian types of games, but kept being distracted by descriptions of erotic, naked dancing. So?maybe, there can be a hula contest. It certainly wouldn?t hurt the TV ratings. Assuming there is a tie vote, JP would announce the tie-break system, whether physical or mental. The two sides would then revote on the basis of the perceived weak link in the other side. This means nobody would be safe unless s/he has the immunity idol. It would also put a great deal of pressure on the alliances. No weak member could get through on the coattail of other alliance members. The powers that be would also have a much firmer grip on the outcome of the game. ?Surprise, Surprise,? I?m trying to use my best Jim Neighbors voice. This has to favour the stronger, more educated male contestants. I still like John, Gabriel, Paschal in the Maraamu tribe and Hunter, Sean and Peter in the Rotu tribe. Gina and Tammy look like ball-breakers, though.   Top

Ahtumbreez 10456 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 02-19-02, 08:39 AM (EST) 9. "Tie breaker" Scissor, paper, rocks, anyone?   Top

Kaumanaboy 19 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Got Milk? Spokesperson" 02-22-02, 08:48 PM (EST) 10. "RE: Tie breaker" I have it on good authority that if there is a tie, JP will ask them to pick a number between 1 - 1000.   Top

janisella 698 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator" 02-24-02, 00:16 AM (EST) 11. "RE: Rule changes shift power to brains?" Do we know for sure it has to be a mental challenge? I remember in S1 when Rudy and Sue were tied, Richard seemed to be under the impression that if he or Kelly didn't change their vote, there would be a physical challenge. Also, in S3, Lindsay said they thought the tie breaker was going to be questions about the tribemates, which is why they picked Carl - they thought he was too arrogant to know anything about them. I think the contestants were just told that there would be a challenge in the event of a deadlock; not what kind of challenge it would be.   Top

dabo 26942 desperate attention whore postings DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold" 02-24-02, 00:44 AM (EST) 12. "RE: Rule changes shift power to brains?" If Kelly W. hadn't changed her vote from Richard to Sue, we would have learned then about the past votes deadlock rule (Richard would have lost thanks to Colleen's votes) rather than having had to wait until S2 ep4 when Mitchell lost out due to past votes (1 from Keith). Actually, the trivial pursuit challenge is perfect for a tc deadlock breaker challenge, since it is static (can be done at the tc site), so I would expect it will remain the deadlock breaker, or something equally as static. I hope they don't go with games of chance, rock-paper-scissors or whatever, as I'd rather see the winner earn it. Some combination of mental and skill, such as solving a puzzle of some sort, might be interesting (but that's pure off the top of my head speculation). "If all machines were to be annihilated at one moment, so that not a knife nor lever nor rag of clothing nor anything whatsoever were left to man but his bare body alone that he was born with, and if all knowledge of mechanical laws were taken from him so that he could make no more machines, and all machine-made food destroyed so that the race of man should be left as it were naked upon a desert island, we should become extinct in six weeks." (Samuel Butler, "Erewhon")   Top

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