I was disgusted yesterday when Antonia first said she didn't know how to measure a room, but then she didn't know how to use a ruler?!?!?! "Do you start measuring with on the end or where the 1 is?" YIKES!!!!! Maybe I'm so disturbed by this because in my pre-mommy life I was a math teacher, but COME ON!!! She really has no life skills. Her problems are way bigger than just budgeting her money. Maybe they should test for a learning disability like they did for Renee last year. It is hard for me to believe that someone who went to college (though I don't think she ever said she graduated) can't use a ruler. Then today, she had no idea that she would have to budget for tax?!?!? Come on, I remember doing things like this in 4th grade. She said she was a catholic school girl....her private education didn't do her too well. She almost has to have some sort of learning disability. I wonder why no one has mentioned this to her.

• RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,watches too much, 11:30 AM, 05-10-06
  • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,Lanna42, 12:04 PM, 05-10-06
    • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,eire_heart74, 12:24 PM, 05-10-06
    • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,simpledimple, 03:46 PM, 05-10-06
• RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,Pek520, 01:17 PM, 05-10-06
  • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,sunshinedrop, 01:44 PM, 05-10-06
    • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,sunshinedrop, 01:50 PM, 05-10-06
      • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,watches too much, 01:58 PM, 05-10-06
      • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,vasharpmom, 02:13 PM, 05-10-06
  • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,biggest loser, 02:06 PM, 05-10-06
  • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,NicNac, 02:15 PM, 05-10-06
  • WARNING - Pek520 ,Bebo, 03:08 PM, 05-10-06
• RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,JustBNMe, 02:06 PM, 05-10-06
• RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,TVFreak, 02:49 PM, 05-10-06
  • RE: Where was Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,Twinkles, 04:37 PM, 05-10-06
    • RE: Where were Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,EMTBGRL, 06:00 PM, 05-10-06
      • RE: Where were Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,Baxtera, 06:13 PM, 05-10-06
        • RE: Where were Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,Juliejo, 07:10 PM, 05-10-06
          • RE: Where were Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,mikaela643, 07:15 PM, 05-10-06
            • RE: Where were Antonia's math teachers?!?!?!,DebraHoney, 07:55 PM, 05-10-06

I am a Catholic school girl too and I remember this one girl who seemed just plain dumb. The sisters never really pushed her, she just moved along. Looking back on it now I realize that she may have had a learning problem. I think that they did her a great disservice. I wonder if this was the case with Antonia.

No way!! Antonia's not THAT dumb.She knew to start with the one on the ruler to measure.You could hand a ruler to a kindergartener and they'd know where to start measuring. What she was really saying is "I don't want to do this.I want someone to do it for me."If Dr. Stan thought for one minute that she was incapable he'd be having her tested.As he himself pointed out "Antonia's lazy and afraid to attempt new things."

LAST EDITED ON 05-10-06 AT 12:28 PM (EST)

.
>What she was really saying
>is "I don't want to
>do this.I want someone to
>do it for me."

Absolutely!! LAZY is the only thing she currently suffering from. I think we have all known or maybe even have worked with people who pull the "I don't know how" card when they want someone else to do the grunt work. If she put half the effort into her work as she did the way she tries to maniplulate others into working for her, she would be out of debt in no time.

As for not knowing about taxes and fees, again she doesn't want to know! She has this grandiose sense of entitlement that is out of this world. Her getting on this show is only stroking that large ego she has.

It doesn't matter what class of education you were given, if you don't want to learn, you won't retain a thing they teach you.

Well, you DON"T start to measure at the "1" on the ruler...you DO start at the end!

I am continually shocked by the lack of tolerance and compassion shown by the supposed "SO fans" that post on these message boards. So often these posts are rife with judgment and ignorance; It's actually appalling.

Look, I'm not a huge Antonia fan, but I am more than willing to acknowledge that she's in the house trying to make changes and that not everyone works at the same pace.

Furthermore, in answer to your question, "where was Antonia's math teachers?" I'd ask, "Where WERE your English teachers?" Next time you're going to judge someone at least do so in an intelligent manner.

Sorry, my bad about the grammar, breastfeeding with one hand and keeping track of a toddler, and typing with the other hand in an effort to keep my mind going to stay sane....I don't have a learning disability/motivation problem, just distraction....but I stand by the original post that I think she has a learning disability...this could be why she seems so lazy. I saw that all the time when I was teaching...students who shut down and refuse to work because they don't understand...they also seem to become master manipulators to protect their identity. They would rather be lazy than slow. I wonder if this is what Antonia is going through. Did she ever mention what she was majored in while in college?

Ooops, I apologize about the grammar again...I meant....Did she ever mention what she majored in while in college?.....Maybe it is the breastfeeding hormones playing with my brain!!!

I think that we can rule out any classes connected with money.

I agree suneshinedrop. Some people say they don't "want" to do something because they are afraid they can't do something. I think it becomes a self-fullfilling prophecy and ultimately a habit they can't break.

LAST EDITED ON 05-10-06 AT 02:08 PM (EST)

>I am continually shocked by the
>lack of tolerance and compassion
>shown by the supposed "SO
>fans" that post on these
>message boards. So often
>these posts are rife with
>judgment and ignorance; It's actually
>appalling.
>
>Look, I'm not a huge Antonia
>fan, but I am more
>than willing to acknowledge that
>she's in the house trying
>to make changes and that
>not everyone works at the
>same pace.
>
>Furthermore, in answer to your question,
>"where was Antonia's math teachers?"
> I'd ask, "Where WERE
>your English teachers?" Next
>time you're going to judge
>someone at least do so
>in an intelligent manner.
>
>
Antonia wanted to be on the Real World not Starting Over. She is just there to be on TV.
And you are the one who shouldn't "judge" the posters.

LAST EDITED ON 05-10-06 AT 02:16 PM (EST)

Pek-

If it is so appalling to you, why do you keep reading the boards? People who go on reality TV shows are not looking for "compassion".
They are looking for their 15 minutes of fame.

edited for grammar

LAST EDITED ON 05-10-06 AT 03:10 PM (EST)

You know what amazes me? The posters who think that the guidelines and FAQ don't apply to them and come here and bash other posters or criticize them for their comments about the show, despite the numerous words from moderators saying that behavior won't be tolerated.

If you're looking for a forum that doesn't permit negative comments about participants, then please check out the numerous links on the compilation thread on our General Discussion forum. But you will not be permitted to continue bashing and criticizing the posters here. We don't like posters complaining about other posters being judgmental...since that's exactly what they're doing to those posters.

Edited to remind posters to alert a moderator and then leave it alone. We've said that repeatedly. Biggest loser and NicNac, I'm talking to you.

I think Antonia was hoping by saying she didn't know how to do somehitng that the woman would show her and thus end up having measured things for her. Antonia is good at playing dumb to get people to do things for her. I can't believe she said she didn't know anything about inches on a ruler period.

In Antonia's case, I think that it's very possible that she has some form of a learning disability. I also think that part of her problem is laziness, or even, an unwillingness to learn. If she really didn't know how to use a ruler, she could have just asked someone to teach her how to use it. Because she didn't ask someone to show her, I believe that she just wanted someone else to do it for her.
I struggle with this learning disability vs. laziness issue all the time. My daughter has a LD and has become a master manipulator at getting her tutors and me to give her the answers. She has struggled for so long with these feelings and frustrations of working so hard only to come up with the wrong answer, so why even bother trying. I know now that giving her the answers is only hurting her. Help her, yes. Encourage her, yes. Be her biggest cheerleader, definitely.

LAST EDITED ON 05-10-06 AT 05:44 PM (EST)

Teacher's aren't the only source of information. I don't recall learning about using rulers in a classroom. Perhaps I did. It would have been a very long time ago. My family did a lot of measuring to be able to buy paint and fix up the house.

They gave me the measuring tape and yardstick and asked me to add together the yards and inches when we measured the rooms. I don't even recall what they were doing all the time. Maybe buying a new appliance and seeing if there was room or something but whatever the project, they gave me, the youngest learner, the measuring instrument and the math problems to do.

(edited to add: I remember that using yardsticks and measuring tapes seemed like a big leap up from rulers and I thought out logically, oh yes, I can just measure from the 1" if the tape doesn't start evenly at zero and adjust the measurement if necessary.I must admit I was a little kid when I had to think through those things carefully, though)

It seems like most parents give kids the opportunity to participate in experiences like that if only to see how well she is doing with her math skills. I don't have much to do with the whole teacher/parent/student thing, but don't they all communicate? (or aren't the parents supposed to have a clue about the level their child at which their child is acheiving?).

Sorry, but I don't see blaming a teacher for not presenting the lesson. We don't know that to be true. Antonia doesn't strike me as someone who tries to recall what she was taught or apply what she knows to new situations. She's had apartments. She didn't try to decorate those. How can you avoid measuring if you're arranging and acquiring placing beds, prints, sofas, tvs? I place the responsibility of Antonia's education on Antonia. She knows what's missing at this point.

(It is ironic that the title of this board is "Where was Antonia's math teachers?")

I don't recall learning
>about using rulers in a
>classroom.

I learned measurement in 1st grade, 3rd grade, and in 5th grade. My Elementary School tried to teach us conversions into the metric system. (We even watched a television program with "Mr. Metric and the Evil Inch Worm" --when the USA considered switching to metric.) (I'm only 37-years-old) It didn't happen. We stuck to the 'old' system of measurement. I remember learning how to measure with a ruler (complete with what all the little lines meant) in 6th grade metal shop. Of course, now with standardized testing, and metal shop not being on standardized tests, it's possible "measurement" has been removed from the public school curriculum. They don't have metal shop at my old school anymore. Budget cuts, along with orchestra. I would doubt most of my daughter's class would now know how to use a ruler, and be able to tell anyone what ALL the little lines meant.

Come to think of it? I am the one who taught my daughter to measure/ use a ruler/ read time off a non-digital clock. *sigh* "Education" is a different place today. -- Maybe Antonia has gotten caught up in the "Let No Child Get Ahead" education of America? She's pretty young after all.

It's also possible that she just always had someone else do her work for her. She is either anemic, scared of life, or really lazy. She naps an awful lot on the show! Someone needs to feed that girl some spinach! Maybe everything else will become clearer with some more iron.

>It seems like it's a parent's
>responsibility to make sure that
>a kid is learning certain
>real world applications.

In theory, children are supposed to be learning 'real world applications' at school. My observation is that parents should not be duped into believing that's what's happening in a classroom. But, since our children spend so much time in school--we like to believe they are learning something useful. Maybe Antonia's parents believed that, too? It's possible. I was a Teacher's Aide in a classroom. A child had a question about something not on the standardized test? Sorry, it wasn't "important." It's why I stopped pursuing being a teacher.
>
>Sorry, but I don't see blaming
>a teacher for not presenting
>a lesson.

Who else is to blame? The American Way is to send our children to school to learn. We are taught they are learning. We should be more shocked to learn that they are not learning. I am no longer shocked. It's too bad, really. I am all for personal responsibility. But, these are lessons that Antonia should have been given in school, and more than once.

I'm sure Antonia
>received all the appropriate lessons.

I'm in my daughter's school every year. (I am not a 'helicopter parent' either.) I am happy to know there are people out there who still have confidence in education. Maybe it's different in parochial school than public school? I don't know. I hope so.

How can you avoid
>measuring if you're arranging and
>acquiring placing beds, prints, sofas,
>tvs?

By hiring someone else to do it. I think that's what Antonia planned on doing for the rest of her life.

I place the
>responsibility of Antonia's education on
>Antonia. She knows what's missing
>at this point.

Although I DO place the responsibility on Antonia to fill in her educational gaps, I don't think Antonia is self-aware and mature enough to have come to that realization herself, yet. I believe that's why she requires other people to help her realize it, which is a form of education. No? I don't think Antonia is capable of learning everything she needs to know on her own--yet. I DO think that she should struggle to figure it out herself, though. (not just be given the answers, or allowed to hire someone else.)

Please don't confuse Antonia's learned attitude for getting away with doing nothing with people who have legitimate learning and behavior disorders there is a huge difference.

Antonia chooses not to know how much things cost not because she can't use math but because she doesn't wish to know how much things cost. She chooses not to learn to use the ruler not because she couldn't ask for instructions but because like many children she is stalling, sulking and doesn't want to do the assignment and hopes that someone will do it for her if she complains enough. That is learned helplessness not a learning disorder. Antonia would learn quickly enough if it meant not eating, not drinking, or not having a place to sleep. Up to this point however, someone has always bought the helplessness act and rode to her rescue. Up to know her coping mechanism has worked for her. She's in debt up to her ears but she's gotten by.

Instead of playing at activities IV's original idea of making Antonia pay for things should be combined with making her actually work at chores around the house, jobs etc. to earn her keep. She chooses not to know that work=living.

Antonia is lazy and self-centered and just doesnt care. She wants to go through life feeling entitled. She said she was too pretty to ride the bus. I think not. What would she do if she do if she had not had everything handed to her all of her life?
She doesnt want to anything she doesnt want to do and that includes paying her bills. It is no fun to pay bills and be responsible and be an adult. She needs to work in a greasy spoon diner for a while.

Juliejo

she'd never get the orders right.

Oh come on, People.

Every one who is here is interested in discussions of the PEOPLE of the Starting Over house - in the current form. Every, single, one. If you're here to read mamby pamby mushy mushy stuff about this place, please, go and write your own - you won't find it here.

That said, I watch to learn how to help myself in life. One thing I learned is to watch myself in giving directions to people (a la Jodi), to live in truth (a la Jill), not to give a rat's patotooty about my body after losing weight (almost a la Christy) and to cut loose my two-faced boyfriend (thank you Niambi - even though you're not there yet).

As far as Antonia? She needs to flat leave. What a "witch with a capital B" she is. Thinks everyone owes her everything. Phooey. And what have I learned from this wench? Not to have my life in a blender. GO HOME ANTONIA, AND KEEP MAKING YOUR CHILDISH FACES AT EVERYONE - SEE WHERE THAT GETS YA IN LIFE.