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"Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-11-12 at 10:04 PM
I need some advice here. I teach a course on film and literature at an all-girls school. It’s a popular course, and fun: the final project involves the students writing, producing and editing their own short (15-20 min.) film. They learn a lot about how movies are made: especially how stories are transferred from the written word (novels and screenplays) to the visual medium.

The two main novels of the course are Chocolat, by Joanne Harris, and Mrs. Dalloway, by Virginia Woolf. I’m not a fan of the movie Chocolat (which obscenely sanitizes the novel), but the students like it, and it’s not terrible. The students also like The Hours, an excellent film once removed from Mrs. Dalloway. (I also like the Cunningham novel, but I want to use novels written by women.) I used to use the Color Purple, but the students largely found that to be unreadable. (Imagine: they like reading Virginia Woolf better than Alice Walker. I know, right?) I’m saddened that some of my favorite novels have been made into horrible movies (Beloved, In the Time of the Butterflies) or haven’t even been adapted (Poisonwood Bible, God of Small Things).

In and around the study of these novels (and how they are turned into filmable stories), we read some short stories (and discuss their filmable qualities—some become adapted for their final project). And we watch movies—good ones—as they learn to be discerning viewers and filmmakers. And this is where I’m having trouble--because I’d like as much of the course to be women-centered as possible, and this is an industry that is still largely dominated by men.

So please help me with some suggestions on potential films to show this class. Here are my criteria:

1) must be a GOOD film. I realize that definitions of “good” will naturally vary. My students, after all, still think the Twilight movies are “good.” I at least want to expand upon their narrow definition (which usually means, simply, “I liked it”) and maybe expose them to something they otherwise might not see (like The Hours, above.)

2) must be women-centered. I want a movie that does more than just pass the Bechdel test or center on a Smurfette. I want movies that tell real, engaging stories about women.

3) must have women heavily involved the creative process: as producer, director, screenwriter, or even novelist (of the work the film was adapted from, if applicable). I’d love to have all four, but there are very, very few such films, alas.

4) not rated R. This isn’t an absolute, but for every movie I show that’s rated R, I have to send home permission slips and have multiple conversations with parents. I’m not worried about the conversations (they are, surprisingly, almost always pleasant and productive) so much as the time and hassle. Better to avoid, if possible.

Time frame (of when movie was made or set) and genre are flexible, as long as there’s some variance over the course of the semester.

Some movies I’ve used in the past, with varying degrees of success (some of which don’t fit all of my criteria, hence my desire to expand my list), and some which I am considering:

Winter’s Bone
Frozen River
The Trip to Bountiful
The Piano (even with permission slips, I didn’t show the more graphic scenes)
Les Triplettes de Belleville
Whale Rider
The Joy Luck Club
Raise the Red Lantern
Brave
Sense and Sensibility
Spirited Away
Beasts of the Southern Wild

Now it’s your turn. Comments on the above, or any suggestions to add to the list, would be most welcome.


Oh, and by the way: Hi!

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Messages in this discussion
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Snidget on 12-11-12 at 10:27 PM
(even with permission slips, I didn’t show the more graphic scenes)

Ah that takes me back to 1st period Spanish class. End of the year, and there was some film that was supposed to be really good, and maybe the ratings are a bit different for foreign films (Mexico I think, I think it had gotten an Oscar nod for foreign film that year or the year before).

Anyway most of the film was fine, but the first scene was in the parent's bedroom and while nothing was really shown, it was a bit racy for High School. I can't remember if there was any new vocabulary words (I missed them) when their lovemaking was interrupted and the man said something regarding his inability to walk at the moment and she would have to tend to their son who was yelling for them.

She started the film 5 minutes in for the rest of the day.

Sorry, no ideas at the moment, just reminiscing.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 07:37 PM
Heh, I spent a good while trying to find the movie you described. I looked at all the Oscar-nominated foreign language films from Spanish-speaking countries and didn't find one that matched. Nice story!


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Sunny_Bunny on 12-12-12 at 00:10 AM
At the HS where I was a long term English teacher, one of the books we read was The Mists of Avalon by Marion Bradley for the same class. Being that this is the story of Morgana, there was sex in the mini-series, so you will have to check it out first.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 07:39 PM
Excellent suggestion. Another teacher uses this book (and parts of the mini-series) in her course on Myths and Legends. If it weren't for that, it would certainly be on my list.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Sunny_Bunny on 12-15-12 at 01:09 PM
Oh that's a shame it's being done in another class - it really is an excellent book.

I've always wanted to create a "History and the Movies" class, where my students would do the research and then watch the movies for accuracy. I've kept it close to the vest while working on the idea, however, because I want to teach it. (I've seen great ideas from newer teachers given to the more seasoned ones in our district.)

"Persepolis (PG-13)."
Posted by Estee on 12-12-12 at 00:36 AM
Are you willing to accept a graphic novel as literature? If so, this may potentially be your book -- and film.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0808417/

http://www.amazon.com/The-Complete-Persepolis-Marjane-Satrapi/dp/0375714839/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1355283891&sr=8-2&keywords=persepolis

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persepolis_%28comics%29

http://www.amazon.com/Persepolis-Chiara-Mastroianni/dp/B000YAA68W/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1355283891&sr=8-3&keywords=persepolis

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persepolis_%28film%29

If nothing else, it may make them realize how fortunate they are just to gather in school and discuss a film.

Note that there have been problems in showing it with prior schools.

"RE: Persepolis (PG-13)."
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 07:43 PM
Yes! Exactly what I'm looking for! I especially like that this movie takes them out of their ethnocentrism. Another plus.

I should have clarified in my OP--I already have enough films associated with novels/books. (The students can only read so much in the allotted time frame.) I also show some movies apart from their books, just to help them become more discerning viewers. So it doesn't matter that this was adapted from the graphic novel; I wouldn't use the text, in this case.

Thanks for the suggestion!

And I am one to accept graphic novels as literature, so if I need to change one of my book/films later, I'll consider the novel as well.

"Two Suggestions"
Posted by Starshine on 12-12-12 at 05:28 AM
Firstly Clueless, which I found a good adaptation of Emma although it may be a bit rooted in the 1990's for your students

and secondly Orlando It takes some liberties, but overall not a bad film of an exceptional book, although now that I think about it does it pass the Bechdel test? Well I put it out there for your consideration anyway

Lovely cheese Mooney

Where are Voice of the Beehive when we need them?


"RE: Two Suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 07:50 PM
Clueless is a good suggestion--I remember liking it, though I didn't love it. Some of the jokes are very 90s--I remember laughing at how the main characters used cell phones to talk to each other until they met in the hallway; now that's so common, it's no longer funny. Indeed, might be dated. Further, I already use Pride & Prejudice (and their various adaptations) in another class.

Orlando is another interesting suggestion, and I probably would jump on it if I didn't already have a Virginia Woolf on the syllabus.

Thanks--those were two movies that were completely off my radar.


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by moonbaby on 12-12-12 at 10:08 AM
Julie & Julia
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 07:53 PM
Yes! I had been avoiding Nora Ephron because I don't want the students to think of the "chick flick" stereotype when thinking about women-centered movies. But this is a great suggestion.

Slight hesitancy about using two films that star Meryl Streep, but she's part of an ensemble cast in The Hours, not really the star. And besides, that shouldn't be a deal breaker. I like that she's in a lot of the movies that the students usually will not have seen.


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by frodis on 12-12-12 at 10:37 AM
I love this question and would love taking your class.


I think the hardest thing is to find films that are good, though. (Frankenstein, for starters.) There are a lot of terrible film adaptations of great literature.


What about a screenplay and film? Do you think your students would read Hiroshima Mon Amour? If they had a hard time getting through The Color Purple it might be a bit of a slog. It's short, though.


I have to think a bit. I'll be back.



Cake Haiku. Motion by Snidget/Shrunken down by Moonbaby/Ice Cat legal-sized.


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 07:57 PM
Yes, please do come back! As I told Estee, I should have been clearer in the OP--I don't necessarily need a movie that fits with a novel; I'm trying to fill out my syllabus with movies that I can show around what they're already reading.

There are a lot of terrible film adaptations of great literature.

Yes! And there are also some good films that are terrible adaptations, if you understand my distinction.


You're welcome to audit any time.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by samboohoo on 12-12-12 at 10:48 AM
I'm not quite sure how helpful I am. Movies I consider to be "women centered" are going to be movies like Steel Magnolias or The Help or Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood,, but I don't know if these are the kinds of movies you're thinking of. You're definitely going to explore women and their relationships in these movies.


Samboobree, brought to life by Arkie


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by cahaya on 12-12-12 at 11:25 AM
Along the contemporary line, I might mention Beaches. It was panned by the critics, but liked by audiences. Based on a novel by Iris Rainer Dart, Mary Agnes Donoghue wrote the screenplay.
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 08:03 PM
Hmmm. I suppose it wouldn't be practical to skip over the parts involving Bette Midler.

I appreciate the suggestion, though. Thanks!


Not a Bette fan, sorry. Maybe I should have clarified that in the criteria...

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 07:59 PM
Nothing wrong with those suggestions. I've thought about Steel Magnolias. Ya-ya is actually used in a different course. (That's another thing I have to be mindful of--even though I teach the only course specifically about books and films, other teachers naturally will use films to expand their students' knowledge and interest in a book.)


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by kidflash212 on 12-12-12 at 11:26 AM
Do you use any older films? Like All About Eve? Movie was based on a short story written by a woman and the film has strong female characters.
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 08:04 PM
I have, yes--although the students find them more of a curiosity than an actual "movie." Still, worth considering. Thanks!

Now THIS Bette, I'm a fan of.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Brownroach on 12-12-12 at 10:41 PM
LAST EDITED ON 12-12-12 AT 11:29 PM (EST)

Favorite exchange in that movie, at the party in Bette Davis's apartment:

Marilyn Monroe (as starlet Miss Caswell): Oh, waiter?

George Sanders (as her date, theater critic Addison DeWitt): That's not a waiter, dear, it's a butler.

MM: Well, I couldn't exactly say "butler". Someone's name might be Butler.

GS: You have a point. An idiotic one, but a point.

ETA: Miss Caswell wouldn't be a role model for the purposes of your class.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by MNgirl on 12-12-12 at 02:29 PM
Have you shown The Triplets of Belleville in the past? I vote for that. My dad watched it, loved it, gave it to me to watch, I loved it. I then showed it to my DD and niece, both 20 now, around 18 when we first watched it. They both loved it.

Funny thing is, they didn't love it at first. It takes a while for people that grew up on Disney and Pixar animation to get used to the very different style. But, both of them ended up being rather fascinated with it. I bought my own copy of it and they both ended up buying the digital downloads for their laptops.



Chillaxin with Agman, man! March 2012

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 08:06 PM
Yes, I have. Students have liked it, but not loved it. I really like what you mentioned--getting away from their Disney/Pixar comfort zone. I'll probably keep using it. Kudos for getting your daughter and niece hooked.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by dabo on 12-12-12 at 02:48 PM
LAST EDITED ON 12-12-12 AT 02:58 PM (EST)

"I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings" (1969) by Maya Angelou, TV movie (1979) screenplay by Maya Angelou and Leonora Thuna.

http://cultvideoarchive.highwire.com/product/i-know-why-the-caged-bird-sings-dvd

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 10:48 PM
Good suggestion. I know the book is used in another course, but I don't know if they use the film. Thanks.


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by dabo on 12-13-12 at 02:06 AM
My recollection of the film (which I only watched once when it was originally broadcast) is that it is pretty good. It is, of course, a TV film, paced for commercial breaks, limited on time, and limited by the broadcast standards of the time -- in other words, the book is better.

Not one of your style and vogue "Twilight" films, which I personally have found somewhat tedious and dull after the first one.

Still, Maya herself had a voice in translating her very personal autobiographical novel to film, which speaks for itself.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by WyoGuy44 on 12-12-12 at 07:55 PM
I like Whale Rider and Julie and Julia. Yes guys can like these movies.
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 10:49 PM
Yes guys can like these movies.

And yes, guys can also teach these movies.


Welcome! Hope you got a crap basket.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by WyoGuy44 on 12-12-12 at 11:09 PM
I got my carp basket many years ago. I'd like a new one though. Mine rotted
"zHrelp?"
Posted by foonermints on 12-12-12 at 11:58 PM
I thought spam was forever, like fruitcake.

← Now with more green!

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by MKitty on 12-12-12 at 07:58 PM
LAST EDITED ON 12-12-12 AT 07:59 PM (EST)

How about Erin Brockovich? As I am sure you know, it's a true story, about a strong woman, who took on a giant..and won. Not sure if it is rated R..but I don't think so. What makes it special is that the heroine is unlikely, but ultimately, wins...and it's real...not Hollywood!


Crooning courtesy of Agman

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by WyoGuy44 on 12-12-12 at 08:02 PM
I like that movie too. I'm a sucker for Julia Roberts
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 10:53 PM
It is rated R, for language. For some reason, parents find this less objectionable than an R for violence (or even worse, an R for s-e-x). Go figure.

Another possibility. Thanks.


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by LeftPinky on 12-17-12 at 00:52 AM
Along the same lines - Norma Rae (Sally Field), but I'm not sure if it was a book first. My daughter's class has used Sarah's Key, The Help and Pride & Prejudice (I like the 5 hour version of the movie, but there are others).
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Brownroach on 12-12-12 at 10:30 PM
Bagdad Cafe.

You haven't said what grade(s) you teach. It may be too offbeat. I seem to think there were briefly bare breasts--haven't seen it in a long time. But it could produce some interesting discussion.

Also, Boys Don't Cry, but again depending on the age range, and it may be too harrowing in any case.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-12-12 at 11:05 PM
YES! I *loved* Bagdad Cafe. I saw it when I lived in Germany. It's been years, but it's definitely a possibility. At the very least, I need to see it again. I'm more cautious about Boys Don't Cry--maybe with some editing.

This course is for juniors and seniors, so older students; more mature generally.


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Silvergirl1 on 12-13-12 at 00:01 AM

I can think of two. Enchanted April which was originally written by a woman, and is about women on a vacation in Italy. It's a good character study.

The second is "A League of Their Own", directed by Penny Marshall, about the women's baseball league back in the 40's.



Snow globe sig and starfish globe by Agman 2011

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Silvergirl1 on 12-13-12 at 06:40 AM

I forgot to mention "Sleepless in Seattle", which is a good Christmas movie. It was directed and co-written by Nora Ephron. Her sister also worked on the film.


Snow globe sig and starfish globe by Agman 2011

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-14-12 at 10:30 PM
All three good suggestions. Thanks!

True story: I was on the set for part of Sleepless in Seattle during filming in the late summer/fall of '92.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Silvergirl1 on 12-15-12 at 02:20 AM

Which town were you in? I was listening to Nora's commentary, and she mentioned that one scene was filmed at the Women's Industrial Exchange on Charles St in Baltimore. I used to eat there occasionally when I worked a few doors down from that place. Meg and Rosie were eating lunch there in the scene.



Snow globe sig and starfish globe by Agman 2011

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-15-12 at 09:47 AM
I was in Chicago. I think those scenes (there weren't that many) occurred at the beginning of the movie, but it's been a while. Tom Hanks and Victor Garber were there, along with the actor that played Hanks' son (whose name I'm too lazy to look up at the moment) and some others (but not Meg Ryan). I remember being surprised to see Victor Garber, as I hadn't seen him in a movie since Godspell 20 years earlier (though I did see him on Broadway in Noises Off some time in the early 80s). He has since showed up periodically in few things (Titanic and Argo being the most memorable).

Don't know whatever happened to that Hanks guy...

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Silvergirl1 on 12-17-12 at 11:46 AM

"There's no crying in baseball!!!"



Snow globe sig and starfish globe by Agman 2011

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Starshine on 12-13-12 at 08:48 AM
I was thinking Tea with Mussolini or Calendar Girls however I'm not sure that they would really work for you

And then I remembered Notes from a scandal from a book by Zoe Heller and although the driving motivation is sex (IMO) I still think it would be interesting.

Lovely cheese Mooney

Where are Voice of the Beehive when we need them?


"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Brownroach on 12-13-12 at 10:21 AM
Oh! -- You reminded me of An Education, based on a memoir by journalist Lynn Barber. A sort of coming-of-age story, with a brilliant performance by Carey Mulligan as the young lady who learns a few life lessons.
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-14-12 at 10:38 PM
I really, really liked An Education (and Carey Mulligan, who has been brilliant in everything I've seen her so far). I also really liked Notes on a Scandal--I'll see anything with Judi Dench in it, and Cate Blanchett is an additional bonus. As noted, though, I'm hesitant about the sexual themes of both, especially since they involve high school students.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by kidflash212 on 12-13-12 at 10:24 AM
Isn't the plot of Notes From A Scandal centered around a teacher who has an affair with a student? I could see some parental objections there.
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Starshine on 12-13-12 at 12:03 PM
Well it's more centred around the (non sexual) relationship between two female teachers one of whom is having an affair with a student, but that is a good point.
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Brownroach on 12-14-12 at 02:07 AM
IIRC, the Judi Dench character was a closeted lesbian who, we learned, had repeatedly insinuated herself into the lives of young attractive female teachers, as she did with the Cate Blanchett character, who was incredibly obtuse to not figure out what was going on. It seemed like a throwback to late 1950's-early 1960's movies about repressed sexuality, IMO.
"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Starshine on 12-14-12 at 05:41 AM
Well as I said the driving motivation is sex however the action if I can put it that way is more revenge based.

I don't actually know this, however, despite our increasing liberalisation regarding sexuality I feel that it must be harder for teachers to come out than any other profession, so I think that the storyline is still valid.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Max Headroom on 12-13-12 at 01:49 PM
The Help

Nominated for four 2012 Academy Awards, including Best Picture, so it should meet the definition of "good".
Female-centric plot.
Adaptation of a novel written by a woman.

"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by Gothmog on 12-14-12 at 10:40 PM
Nice suggestion! The Help was our school-wide novel last year, so it will be a few years before anyone can use it again. But it's one for the back burner.



"RE: Film suggestions"
Posted by WyoGuy44 on 12-17-12 at 04:18 PM
LAST EDITED ON 12-17-12 AT 05:23 PM (EST)

I loved the part where she ate the pie!


handcrafted by agman

"White Oleander"
Posted by thndrkttn on 12-15-12 at 12:36 PM
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0283139/

It's a film adapted from the book and it's a wonderful book. It was so good that as soon as I finished, I turned back to page one and read it again.

Astrid Magnussen is a 15 year old girl, living in California. Her mother, Ingrid, is a beautiful, free-spirited poet. Their life, though unusual, is satisfying until one day, a man named Barry Kolker (that her mother refers to at first as "The goat man") comes into their lives, and Ingrid falls madly in love with him, only to have her heart broken, and her life ruined. For revenge, Ingrid murders Barry with the deadly poison of her favourite flower: The White Oleander. She is sent to prison for life, and Astrid has to go through foster home after foster home. Throughout nearly a decade she experiences forbidden love, religion, near-death experiences, drugs, starvation, and how it feels to be loved. But throughout these years, she keeps in touch with her mother via letters to prison. And while Ingrid's gift is to give Astrid the power to survive, Astrid's gift is to teach her Mother about love.

The film stars Michelle Pfieffer and Renee Zellweiger (sp?) and while it doesn't match the intensity of the book, it's still wonderful and it's rated PG-13!

"A Couple"
Posted by trigirl on 12-17-12 at 02:32 AM
A couple of Canadian legends... Sarah Polley and Alice Munro. The short story "The Bear Came Over the Mountain" by Alice Munro. The film adapted and directed by Sarah Polley "Away From Her" featuring an amazing performance by Julie Christie. Might be an 'old' story for the students, but it is interesting in that Sarah Polley was only 26 when she made it.

Has someone already mentioned "The Hunger Games"? One of those teen lit adaptations I really liked. Suzanne Collins adapted her own novel and I think Katniss Everdeen is the best example of girl power evah! (I have teen boys and they loved the books...I loved that it was a female protagonist.)