WaPo OpEd

The whole opinion is worth reading, but I'll give some highlights.

THE BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA (BSA) ... encourages young men to take charge — of themselves and others. And it builds character, the sort that comes from cooperating with, competing against and rendering service to those around you. For these reasons and more, the BSA is an important thread in America’s national fabric, and it is a good thing that the organization boasts more than 100,000 troops across the country ...

After last Thursday, that membership should rise. (Frankly, I think that is an unrealistic expectation as the ban never prevented any boy from joining.) ... less discrimination is still good news ...

(But) BSA’s membership may very well fall ... Religious groups sponsor about 70 percent of troops, and some of their leaders seem ready to rip this priceless civic institution apart. ... they should resist the urge. ...

the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, a major scouting sponsor, immediately embraced the policy change. ... Because the church’s organization is highly centralized, that means a very large number of troops will remain active.

Not all big religious sponsors have been as encouraging. Catholic clergy have said mixed things ... The National Catholic Committee on Scouting ... said that “we hope to maintain that relationship,” and that that the group will “study” the new policy’s effects before it phases in at the end of this year.

Some Southern Baptist leaders have been more negative. ... Even before the vote, discussions of alternative youth groups to the Boy Scouts popped up in the press, Christian and otherwise.

It’s difficult to imagine another group that could do as much good for as many boys as have the Scouts over many decades.

And from the comments section, responding to a rant about the Constutional rights of Christians having been trampled:

How have any Constitutional rights been trampled? First of all, BSA is not a Christian organization. Second, BSA was not forced to change by the government, they made their own choice to undo the change they made in the 90s. Third, this doesn't stop anyone from living by their moral code. If you believe being gay is a sin, this change does not force you to be gay. Christians are still welcomed in BSA.

Over 61 percent of Scouting's National Council of 1,232 delegates from across the country voted to lift the ban, BSA officials said. The final tally was 757 yes votes, to 475 no (another 168 delegates did not cast a ballot since they were not present at the meeting).

Anyone looking for an alternative to the BSA or GSA, there already is one, the Baden-Powell Service Association:

http://bpsa-us.org/

lolz

According to those most knowledge authorities on divine will at the Westboro Baptist Church, the Moore tornado was their deity's retribution on the United States for the degree of acceptance (any) given to Jason Collins.

So -- how and where will never-innocent people die to pay for the Scouts' act of treachery?

The plot unfolds.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/28/boy-scouts-mormon-gay-_n_3346729.html

Bryan Fischer ... has now singled out the Mormon church's support for the BSA's amended view on gay Scouts as evidence that church officials are hoping legalization of polygamy will follow.

All these kids want to do is to know how to set up a campfire, find themselves around within the woods with a compass and a bit of geograghic topological analysis, swim and boat on a lake, clear a few areas of litter in the woods, and sing a few songs by the campfire light under the stars.

And all these politically and religiously minded adults, what is it with them? Go away. It's not about them.

LAST EDITED ON 05-28-13 AT 09:21 PM (EST)

Word.

The thing these doom-n-gloomers should be asking themselves is how the BSA survived 81 years (1910-1991) without banning gays?

The ban on openly gay youths never actually served a purpose, it simply was a position statement, an unnecessary one, created in an over-reaction to the gay rights movement. Scouting should never have been politicized in that way.

The ban on openly gay adults participating in scouting unfortunately does serve a purpose, it prevents some former scouts and some parents of current scouts (sometimes both in the same person) from contributing their valuable services to scouting.

The only ban originally structured into scouting, in Britain from the start and in the US from 1910 onward, was against participation by atheists and agnostics. That ban actually served a couple of purposes as well, though it is debatable whether those are purposes worth serving when it does mean excluding some children from scouting. Imagine how ballistic the doom-n-gloomers would go if the BSA even hinted that there might be a vote on that ban.

Great, with a backlash already coming from the right, now the BSA is getting a backlash from the left.

http://www.charismanews.com/us/39006-california-poised-to-strip-boy-scouts-of-tax-exempt-status

Under the bill, SB 323, California would strip tax-exempt status from any “organization organized and operated exclusively as a public charity youth organization that discriminates on the basis of gender identity, race, sexual orientation, nationality, religion, or religious affiliations.” Some of the public charity youth organizations at risk include Little League, Boy Scouts, Cub Scouts, Girl Scouts, Special Olympics, American Youth Soccer Organization, Future Business Leaders of America, and many religious organizations that serve youth.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/30/boy-scouts-nonprofit-status_n_3362079.html

The California State Senate on Wednesday passed a bill that would strip the Boy Scouts of nonprofit status in California because of the group's anti-gay discrimination.

The bill, introduced by Sen. Ricardo Lara (D-Long Beach), would revoke the tax-exempt status of all California youth groups that discriminate on the basis of sexual orientation. The legislation received wide support in the Senate, passing 27-9 -- the first lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender-related bill to pass the Senate with a two-thirds majority.

The law would have no effect on the tax-exempt status of churches, many of which discriminate against gays and lesbians.

The law would have no effect on the tax-exempt status of churches, many of which discriminate against gays and lesbians.

Behold the final frontier.

Regardless, in the Scouts' case, it's like they're being punished for trying. And now on Earth are the Special Olympics on that list? Because you can't run in a race for the blind if you can see?

LAST EDITED ON 05-31-13 AT 01:27 PM (EST)

it's like they're being punished for trying

Yup. Thing is, the change that was voted for was the culmination of a two-year process by the advocates for change within the BSA to achieve some change. They couldn't get enough support for change until earlier this year when they decided to separate the issue into two issues, then they were able to get strong enough support to change the policy in regard to gay youth.

But if the Girl Scouts could also lose their non-profit tax-exempt status because of this bill, the Boy Scouts would probably be caught up in it anyway even had they also changed the policy in regard to gay adults. The GSA never had an official policy on gays. Not a lawyer but I'll try to find out more about the bill, the "gender identity" bit may be the catch-all.

As for Special Olympics, that's obviously reaching a bit far in my opinion. Why? How? Puzzling. Is it because it is exclusively for "special" kids?

I get that California is the leading state in being anti-discrimination, but is there no such thing as reasonable discrimination anymore?

California's "government" is such a lopsided group this does not surprise me. "...received wide support in the Senate..." is like saying "...beer sales were up on July 4th...".

This doesn't make our state a leader but a laughing stock.

>Issued by "Q" and RollDdice

LAST EDITED ON 06-02-13 AT 05:53 PM (EST)

Well, I'm sure you aren't alone in that opinion. Allow me to clarify what I said above about California leading the anti-discrimination charge: a powerful segment of California politicians with strong popular support within the state prides itself on having California be the leading (ahead of the curve) state in advancing equality of rights and anti-discrimination legislation. For some of them it is virtually a religious cause.

Anyway, I haven't found how Special Olympics might be impacted by that legislation, it is simply included in a list of organizations that would come under scrutiny. While Special Olympics has its critics, the discrimination it practices is simply that it is an assistance program for learning disabled children and adults. Unless the leading politicians here are saying that "gender identity" should be classified as a learning disability -- which I very much doubt -- Special Olympics is probably safe in retaining their tax exempt status.

"Gender identity" -- when a person is biologically one gender but self identifies as the other gender -- is where this law would catch out the Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, every same gender segregated youth sports program and so on. I can understand why that is an important issue for the LGBT community in terms of equality in the workplace and education and so on, but the fact is that gender based youth programs are by definition based on biological gender.

Here's an editorial piece you may enjoy.

http://www.ksbw.com/tv/editorials/editorial-boy-scouts-tax-status/-/7651230/20580688/-/9p2tnz/-/index.html

Senate Bill 323 is aimed at stripping the Boy Scouts of their non-profit tax status.

Co-authored by the Central Coast's own Bill Monning, this bullying scheme has already passed the State Senate and moved to the Assembly.

The idea of targeting a private group's tax status based on ones disagreement with their politics would have been shocking a decade ago, but with the recent investigation at the IRS, it is sadly not so today. Whether aimed at annoying Tea Party groups or the long-respected Boy Scouts, using a group's tax-status as some sort of punitive cudgel to beat them into submission to your political views is simply un-American!

LAST EDITED ON 06-01-13 AT 10:58 PM (EST)

Hey, BSA, a bit of good news! Yes, losing the sponsorships of the Southern Baptist Conference and the Assemblies of God and various independent churches would be a blow, losing donors has been a blow, losing donors while also losing (Potentially) tax exempt status a double whammy. But +++

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/31/catholic-leaders-urge-support-for-boy-scouts-after-shift-on-gays_n_3369669.html

+++ they still have support within the Catholic Church!

The U.S. Catholic Church’s top liaison to the Boy Scouts of America is telling Catholic Scout leaders and troop sponsors that the BSA’s new policy welcoming gay Scouts “is not in conflict with Catholic teaching” and they should continue to support scouting programs.

“Scouting is still the best youth-serving program available to all youth,” Edward P. Martin, chairman of the National Catholic Committee on Scouting, wrote in a May 29 letter addressed to “fellow Catholic Scouters.”

Martin said that despite some concerns, the NCCS had taken a neutral stance on a resolution adopted on May 23 by the BSA’s National Council.

One of the experts Martin cited was Edward Peters, a canon lawyer popular with church conservatives who wrote that while he disliked the new policy it was not contrary to church doctrine.

Martin noted that Scouting policies still bar sexual activity of any kind ...

Not to mention that the BSA has a strong program in place to deal with pederasty when they discover it, and not by sweeping it under the rug, unlike some groups.

Seriously, though, Catholic Churches are the third strongest sponsors of Boy Scout troops (Southern Baptists are way down the list), losing Catholic support would have been a major blow to the BSA.

LAST EDITED ON 06-08-13 AT 03:05 PM (EST)

So, how's the fall out going, you may be wondering? Pretty much as expected. In a Huffington Post piece this week they noted: The Southern Baptist Convention, whose 3,981 Scout troops make it the BSA’s sixth-largest religious sponsor, plans to address the issue at its annual meeting in Houston, June 11-12. There's some misinformation in that (which I will discuss later), but yeah it seems that the convention will be giving the BSA a slap in the face, but it will be up to the individual churches to decide for themselves. Assemblies of God are pretty much guaranteed to be pulling up the stakes. Good riddance.

I even read about two Catholic churches that will be discontinuing their sponsorships, that's kind of a shame but so long. One of those churches, in the Chicago area, sponsors a Cub Pack and a Scout Troop, each with about 10 members. I think that troop is really too small and would benefit by merging with another small troop, get some more diversity going.

Anyway, this isn't the first time Scouting has had a membership controversy. When Robert Baden-Powell founded Scouting he wanted it to be as open to all boys as possible. While it has basis in some basic religious and civic principles, Scouting isn't set up to prefer one religion over another, or to take political positions. In the early days they had to convince Catholic leaders that Scouting wasn't out to promote Protestantism, to convince Jewish and Muslim leaders that Scouting wasn't a Christian plot against them. Scouting spread to Japan in the early days due to Christian organizations like the YMCA, and in time accomodations were made to accept Buddhism (which doesn't have a diety in the same sense as the Abramic religions).

William D. Boyce, founder of the BSA, made it very clear that no boy should be excluded because of race or creed. As you may imagine, a lot of people had a problem with that and for a long time things didn't work out very well on the race issue. In some areas blacks were only allowed to be in black troops, in some areas blacks were outright excluded from joining. White only troops were allowed to exist in places where there could be integrated troops. Politically the BSA really wasn't set up to take a stand, it wasn't until 1974 that the BSA was able to finally take a position against racial segregation. The Southern Baptists howled about that too.

Even today Wicca children can find themselves being expelled from their troop. The BSA doesn't have a policy against Wicca, it's just not one of the recognized religions, so if a sponsor group has a problem with Wicca that's that, politically the BSA can't do much except maybe find another troop that will accept those children.

Anyway, there seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about how Scout Troops work. Sponsoring means mainly providing a place where troops and packs can meet. The sponsoring group appoints a representative who has some organizational duties, like having the right of approval over adult leaders of the troop or pack. Once a troop is up and running it pretty much runs itself, the adult leaders in charge. Almost all of the adults involved in Scouting at the troop and pack levels volunteer their time and even pay their own way.

In a well written piece in the Washington Post last weekend some misinformation creeped in, including this whopper: Mormon boys make up about a fifth of all Scouts. There is no way of knowing that. Where are people getting their misinformation? Here:

http://www.scouting.org/About/FactSheets/operating_orgs.aspx

It is information collected and posted by the BSA December 31, 2012, and no I am not saying it is misinformation because it is dated. It's perfectly valid information, but people haven't been making the effort to find out what it really means. Not all of the youths in Mormon sponsored units are necessarilly Mormons. In fact the BSA doesn't even gather information about the individual religious affiliations of anyone, child or adult, associated with Scouting. Nor for that matter information about sexual identity. Check out the application pdf.

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/524-406A.pdf

So, what about those Southern Baptists, what is wrong with The Southern Baptist Convention, whose 3,981 Scout troops make it the BSA’s sixth-largest religious sponsor ...? There's actually no way to know from the factsheet how large a presence there is of Southern Baptist sponsors. Dig around and you find that "Baptist Churches" groups many Baptist Groups together under that one heading. Find the page on Baptist Churches, it mentions there are over 60 different baptist organizations, and lists the top seven. Yes, Southern Baptists are at the top of the list. The next four on the list are African American.

Who wants to break them the news?

Dig around some more on the factsheet and you might actually figure out what units are. A unit is:

A Cub Pack, the program for boys aged 6 to 10 -- A Scout Troop, the program for boys aged 11 to 17 -- Or -- A Venturing Crew, the program for boys and girls aged 14 to 20.

So all those supposed Mormon boys are even necessarilly all of them boys.

1. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saint: 37,856 units: 430,557 youths.
2. United Methodist Church: 10,868 units: 363,876 youths.
3. Catholic Church: 8,397 units: 273,648 youths.
4. Parent-teacher groups other than PTAs: 3,443 units: 144,219 youths.
5. Presbyterian Church: 3,597 units: 125,523 youths.
6. Lutheran Church: 3,827 units: 116,417 youths.
7. Baptist Churches: 3,981 units: 108,353 youths.
8. Private schools: 2,802 units: 103,254 youths.
9. Groups of citizens: 3,115 units: 100,751 youths.
10. American Legion and Auxiliary: 2,553 units: 68,154 youths.
11. Business/industry: 2,807 units: 66,454 youths.
12. Parent Teacher Associations/ Parent Teacher Organizations: 1,561 units: 65,567 youths.
13. Lions International: 2,271 units: 64,563 youths.
14. Rotary International: 1,333 units: 42,922 youths.
15. Episcopal Church: 1,179 units: 41,407 youths.
16. United Church of Christ, Congregational Church: 1,191 units: 38,225 youths.
17. Christian Church (Disciples of Christ): 1,165 units: 33,941 youths.
18. Community Churches: 1,054 units: 32,311 youths.
19. VFW, Auxiliary, Cootie: 1,084 units: 31,199 youths.
20. Fire departments: 1,176 units: 30,819 youths.
21. Kiwanis International: 889 units: 28,547 youths.
22. Elks Lodge (BPOE): 778 units: 21,967 youths.
23. Community centers: 925 units: 21,258 youths.
24. Boys’ and Girls’ Clubs: 569 units: 19,177 youths.
25. Nonprofit agencies: 603 units: 16,662 youths.
26. Church of Christ: 546 units: 15,430 youths.
27. Playgrounds, recreation centers: 444 units: 11,610 youths.
28. Athletic booster clubs: 389 units: 11,416 youths.
29. Chambers of commerce, business associations: 358 units: 10,553 youths.
30. Homeowners’ associations: 268 units: 9,519 youths.
31. Optimist International: 246 units: 8,804 youths.
32. YWCA, YMCA: 312 units: 8,738 youths.
33. Masons – Eastern Star: 296 units: 8,664 youths.
34. Evangelical/Independent churches: 294 units: 7,899 youths.
35. Church of God: 237 units: 5,241 youths.
36. Church of the Nazarene: 156 units: 4,181 youths.
37. Reformed Church in America: 127 units: 4,077 youths.
38. Jewish synagogues and centers: 156 units: 3,738 youths.
39. Church of the Brethren: 101 units: 2,759 youths.
40. African Methodist Episcopal: 149 units, 2,416 youths.
41. The Salvation Army: 130 units: 2,233 youths.
42. Islam, Muslim, Masjid: 78 units: 2,222 youths.
43. Assemblies of God: 91 units: 2,193 youths.
44. Christian Methodist Episcopal Church: 95 units: 1,970 youths.
45. Community of Christ: 61 units: 1,899 youths.
46. Pentecostal Churches: 107 units: 1,830 youths.
47. Other community organizations: 1,656 units: 45,891 youths.
48. Other churches: 879 units: 23,910 youths.

LAST EDITED ON 06-07-13 AT 07:05 PM (EST)

Wow, what a list! (Thanks!) This is a lot of kids who just want to learn some scouting skills while the adults wrangle amongst themselves.

Surely there will be some defections to an an alternate scouting society amongst these. Whose who remains to be seen.

While the Southern Baptists are making a lot of noise, the United Church of Christ has indicated that they want to increase their involvement in scouting. And the Unitarians continue their efforts to resolve their differences with the BSA.

Southern Baptists have their Royal Ambassadors and Challengers programs for their own children, and Assemblies of God have their Royal Rangers program for their children. But where do the other kids who lose their sponsors go?

Either we can hope their units find new sponsors or they can find other units to join. If not, yeah, there are some alternatives they could take a look at.

Baden-Powell Service Association
Camp Fire USA
Navigators USA
SpiralScouts International

Well, the bad news is that the Southern Baptist Convention did not vote to sever their ties to the BSA nor recommend that their member churches drop their Boy Scout programs. They voted instead to throw their weight around, act up, and make as much noise as they can having a protracted hissyfit.

Wish I could find a copy of the actual resolution they passed, it is a doozy from what I read. From various reports, it:

Condemns the policy change by the BSA to allow openly gay youths in Scouting programs.

Expresses opposition to the policy change and intent to have it reversed.

Recommends to their churches which do continue their involvement in Scouting to oppose the policy change and work to have it reversed.

Expresses support to all churches which do decide to discontinue their involvement in Scouting.

Recommends that boys who do leave Scouting join their Royal Ambassadors religious brain washing scouting program.

Expresses concern that the policy change makes it evident that the BSA will eventually change the policy prohibiting adult homosexuals from being involved in Scouting.

and -- this is killer --

Calls on the Boy Scouts to remove executive and board leaders who tried to allow gays as both members and leaders without consulting the many religious groups that sponsor troops.

How were they not consulted? Dunno. I guess they just mean: "We told you not to do it, you were warned!"

Crybabies.

Here it is straight from Baptist Press. Oh, Lordy.

Full text follows:

ON THE CHANGE OF MEMBERSHIP POLICY OF THE BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA

WHEREAS, For more than a century, the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) has been a values-based boys organization designed to “prepare young people for a lifetime of character and leadership,” equipping them “to make ethical and moral choices over their lifetimes by instilling in them the values of the Scout Oath and Law”; and

WHEREAS, The Scout Oath contains language that is consistent with belief in God and biblical precepts that serve as the basis for Christian faith: “On my honor I will do my best to do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law; to help other people at all times; to keep myself physically strong, mentally awake, and morally straight”; and

WHEREAS, The leadership of the Boy Scouts throughout its history has restricted from membership and leadership those persons who would affect the group’s ability to advocate its viewpoints in regard to belief in God and His moral precepts; and

WHEREAS, In 1992, and again in 2000, the Southern Baptist Convention adopted resolutions affirming the Boy Scouts in their stand that homosexual conduct is inconsistent with the obligations of the Scout Oath, encouraging the BSA “to maintain its historic commitments” (1992) and “to hold fast to its traditional ideals” (2000); and

WHEREAS, The United States Supreme Court ruled in 2000 that the constitutional right to freedom of association allows a private organization, as part of its “expressive message,” to exclude a person from membership when “the presence of that person affects in a significant way the group’s ability to advocate public or private viewpoints” and that allowing homosexuals as adult leaders would interfere with that message (Boy Scouts of America et al. v. Dale); and

WHEREAS, In 2004, the Boy Scouts adopted a policy statement that said, in part, “Boy Scouts of America believes that homosexual conduct is inconsistent with the obligations in the Scout Oath and Scout Law to be morally straight and clean in thought, word, and deed”; and

WHEREAS, In 2012, an eleven-person committee appointed by the National Council of the Boy Scouts completed a two-year study and reported its unanimous decision that the Boy Scouts retain the current policy as outlined above; and

WHEREAS, NBC News reported in breaking news on January 28, 2013, that the BSA executive leadership, in concert with certain members of the BSAboard of directors, was poised to change the Scouts’ historic policy at its February 4–5 board meeting the following week to allow avowed homosexuals into membership and leadership positions within the Boy Scouts of America; and

WHEREAS, During the week between when news broke of this proposed policy change and the February board meeting, the Boy Scouts received an outpouring of feedback from Scouts, Scouting families, sponsoring organizations, and the American public; and

WHEREAS, On February 6, 2013, the BSA board determined that, “due to the complexity of this issue, the organization needs time for a deliberate review of its membership policy”; and

WHEREAS, The National Council of the Boy Scouts voted on May 23, 2013, to approve new membership guidelines that state, “no youth may be denied membership in the Boy Scouts of America on the basis of sexual orientation or preference alone”; and

WHEREAS, While those who embrace a biblical worldview are grateful that the leadership policy of the BSA remains unchanged, the executive leadership and certain members of the Boy Scouts board clearly signaled their desire to change both the membership and leadership policies of the BSA; and

WHEREAS, This decision of the BSA is viewed by many homosexual activists as merely the first step in a process that will fundamentally change the BSA, putting the Scouts at odds with a consistent biblical worldview on matters of human sexuality; and

WHEREAS, This decision has the potential to complicate basic understandings of male friendships, needlessly politicize human sexuality, and heighten sexual tensions within the Boy Scouts; and

WHEREAS, Many Southern Baptist churches sponsor Boy Scout troops and many Southern Baptists are involved in Scouting; and

WHEREAS, The Baptist Faith and Message states that “Christians should oppose . . . all forms of sexual immorality, including adultery, homosexuality, and pornography,” and Southern Baptists consistently have expressed their opposition to the normalization of homosexual behavior in American culture through more than a dozen resolutions over the past thirty years; now, therefore, be it

RESOLVED, That the messengers to the Southern Baptist Convention meeting in Houston, Texas, June 11–12, 2013, express our continued opposition to and disappointment in the decision of the Boy Scouts of
America to change its membership policy; and be it further

RESOLVED, That we express our gratitude for the thousands of individuals within the Scouting family and the culture at large who expressed their opposition to the BSA executive leadership’s intent to change its membership and leadership policies in regard to homosexuality, leading to the compromise recommendation it presented to the BSA National
Council; and be it further

RESOLVED, That we express our gratitude to each voting member of the National Council who voted in opposition to the policy change for membership; and be it further

RESOLVED, That we express our well-founded concern that the current executive leadership of the BSA, along with certain board members, may utilize this membership policy change as merely the first step toward future approval of homosexual leaders in the Scouts; and be it further

RESOLVED, That we call on the Boy Scouts to remove from executive and board leadership those individuals who, earlier this year, sought to change both the membership and leadership policy of the Scouts without seeking input from the full range of the Scouting family; and be it further

RESOLVED, That we affirm the right of all families and churches prayerfully to assess their continued relationship with the BSA, expressing our support for those churches and families that as a matter of conscience can no longer be part of the Scouting family; and be it further

RESOLVED, That we encourage churches and families that remain in the Boy Scouts to seek to impact as many boys as possible with the life-changing Gospel of Jesus Christ, to work toward the reversal of this new membership policy, and to advocate against any future change in leadership and membership policy that normalizes sexual conduct opposed to the biblical standard; and be it further

RESOLVED, That we declare our love in Christ for all young people regardless of their perceived sexual orientation, praying that God will bring all youth into a saving knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.