I work as a senior executive in a company where I have to make a lot of hiring and firing decisions. I would not hire any of these people on this show to be a CEO or business unit leader. From what I've seen so far I would consider hiring Amy to work in Marketing, Nick to work in sales, and Bill in a operating capacity. I would possibly consider Kwame for a business development role. I wouldn't hire Troy for anything - of all of them I think in some respects he has the most characteristics of a good business unit leader, but he doesn't know when to shut up, has questionable ethical judgment, and probably doesn't have the analytical skills necessary in modern business (like it or not senior executives and CEOs spend a lot of time with spreadsheets). The final five are all attractive, articulate and appealing but none of them is ready to be a CEO.

As a multi week job interview this show has shown me that testing people over several weeks doesn't tell you a heck of a lot more than the typical interviewing process does. (Of course, the real value of these tasks as a test is pretty debatable). I'm pretty shocked, not just by the number of rookie mistakes, but by the tendancy of people to repeat their rookie mistakes even after they've had plenty of information about how to do things differently. Also, since these people are trying to impress Trump, why haven't they studied "The Art of the Deal" and why don't they refer to it when making decisions?

• RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,Mizz Eve, 04:52 PM, 03-31-04
  • RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,katysax, 06:24 PM, 03-31-04
    • RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,deborah, 03:20 PM, 04-09-04
  • RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,TheApprentice, 11:14 PM, 04-01-04
• RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,managerr, 05:03 PM, 03-31-04
  • RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,disappointedapprentice, 08:01 PM, 04-10-04
• RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,SurvivorBlows, 06:48 PM, 03-31-04
  • RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,Bosco, 06:57 PM, 03-31-04
    • you couldn't hire any of these people,lickdees, 02:33 AM, 04-02-04
  • Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Chrissy gal, 09:19 PM, 03-31-04
    • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Mizz Eve, 09:40 PM, 03-31-04
      • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,qwertypie, 09:56 PM, 03-31-04
        • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Mizz Eve, 10:08 PM, 03-31-04
          • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Bosco, 11:10 PM, 03-31-04
          • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Chrissy gal, 11:36 PM, 03-31-04
          • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,qwertypie, 05:58 PM, 04-01-04
            • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Bosco, 06:46 PM, 04-01-04
              • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,SurvivorBlows, 06:50 PM, 04-01-04
                • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Bosco, 10:51 PM, 04-01-04
        • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,banzai, 12:17 PM, 10-12-04
      • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,So_Opinionated, 05:16 PM, 04-03-04
    • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Loree, 09:50 AM, 04-01-04
    • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,SurvivorBlows, 03:12 PM, 04-01-04
      • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Mizz Eve, 03:39 PM, 04-01-04
        • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,SurvivorBlows, 05:28 PM, 04-01-04
          • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Mizz Eve, 05:51 PM, 04-01-04
            • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,SurvivorBlows, 06:49 PM, 04-01-04
      • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,Chrissy gal, 04:30 PM, 04-01-04
        • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,SurvivorBlows, 05:39 PM, 04-01-04
          • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,subman, 07:04 PM, 04-01-04
        • RE: Carolyn is a young Executive VP,rtrader, 02:59 PM, 04-02-04
• RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,Bosco, 02:47 AM, 04-02-04
  • RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,katysax, 01:21 PM, 04-02-04
• RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,idiotcowboy, 02:31 PM, 04-02-04
  • RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,Pepito, 01:20 AM, 04-06-04
• RE: I wouldn't hire any of these people to be a CEO,Pepito, 01:27 AM, 04-06-04

Hi Katysax!

You do bring up several good points. I haven't read Art of the Deal, so I am unable to draw comparisons between the contestants' performances and the book. I do remember that Sam referred to the book quite often. I know that he was kinda kooky, but do you think that any of his performance reflected lessons from the Art of the Deal (assuming that you've read it)?

I haven't read "The Art of the Deal" but if I were planning to work for, or interview with Donald Trump I would read it, study it and refer to it. I would also look up Trumps companies on the web, read any public documents I could find, and search old articles. It always amazes me that people come in for job interviews and they haven't prepared.

Even though I see a lot the behavior on the show as "rookie mistakes" to be honest I'm not sure that many seasoned executives would do much better. The time frame of the show is so compressed and the tasks so artificial. Still, I do think some of these people are potentially good executives; I really do think Bill has the makings of a superb operating executive and Amy has good marketing instincts, but they are a long way from being ready to run a sizeable business.

did you say "Bill has the makings of a superb operating executive" wait until they try to find Mr. Trumps golf bag.
the tournament, a lot of people coming in, a lot of baggage , a lot of food and drinks and if they bring the wife and kids they need outings for the. I don't think Bill can handle it. But, I believe the number one rule of a superb manager is to surround your self with good people. Look what they had to choose from.

You know what you say you wouldnt hire any of "these people" but they dont care. They dont want to work for you because although you may be some big shot YOUR NOT DONALD TRUMP!!! And I know you will be proven wrong "these people" will become extemly sucessful because they wont let anyone like you bring them down!

I've heard a number of business professionals say the same thing. A lot of the contestants are good at certain capacities, but none see to be President/CEO material.

Please, these guys are NOT being hired to be CEO. They are being paid 250K in a role. Find me a CEO making only that amount of money.
True, none of them are going to be on the short list for Coke CEO, but thats not what is being offered here.
Within the Trump organization, if they get to run one of the smaller business units, they will have reporting to Trump, George (Gen Counsel), and probably half dozen others including the CFO, whoever is in charge of Trump's branding, etc. etc.
Hey, maybe Kwame gets to run the Trump Ice business.

LAST EDITED ON 03-31-04 AT 06:49 PM (EST)

Part of the problem with this show is its "obsession" with casting young, good looking contestants for ratings purposes.

Obviously the fact that the majority of the contestants are in their 20's and have a limited amount of business experience pretty much precludes them from having the lengthy business experience that one would typically want in anyone being hired for a CEO role.

Honestly, how many 20-something CEO's do you see out there??? (not counting those who are the founders of their own company, running a family business, etc.)

If any of them walked into a headhunter's office saying they were looking for a CEO placement I'd be shocked if they weren't laughed out of the office (particularly in this economy) but the youthfulness of the contestants is pretty much a Burnett staple that's probably been somewhat compounded by the practical fact that typically you don't see 40-something year old "apprentices"

Don't expect to see any Rudy Boesch's on this show anytime soon...

-SB

I think I mentioned this in other posts...these people were casted for their look and they try to make you believe this is real business. lol but come on! I mean real people don't look like that, but they would be far more talented than people on this show.

I do see they have potentials though, just need more polishing lol maybe that's why they called 'the apprentice'?

Silly people the difference between you and these people is that they are living their lives in the real word not faking the funk like you people in here. These people are all bright individuals who are making it . A copy salesman and a GOLDNUTSACHS executive going heads up. This is TV at it finest.
As for rookie mistakes what you never make mistakes in new territory? Please give me a break

In the People Magazine article about The Apprentice it said that Carolyn was hired 10 years ago to run Trump's golf course (now courses). Since she is only 35 or 36 right now that would mean that she was very young when she was given an executive position in the Trump organization. The article said she had a high level job at another major golf course when she met Trump.

I don't think I can tell if any of the final contestants would be good upper level managers, because I don't think the tasks they have been given are relevant to that kind of work.

is still rooting for Kwame!

How do you figure that Carolyn is 35 or 36? That woman is every day of at least 45. If you think that she looks young, you'd think that I'm a teeny-bopper

According to http://extratv.warnerbros.com/dailynews/extra/0304/03_11a.html
she is 35. Guess we have something in common. I wonder when I am going to be featured on a MB production.

Thrity-five? You're kidding me. I attribute my youthful appearance to having never been married and not having kids. Those things will suck the life force out of anyone. I do not mean to say that anyone's children are "things."

I guess that means I look old because I'm married?

LAST EDITED ON 03-31-04 AT 11:38 PM (EST)

LOL Mizz Eve!!

From the article linked above: A 35-year-old married mother of two, Kepcher is in charge of the Trump National Golf Clubs and has worked for Trump for 10 years.

Thrity-five? You're kidding me. I attribute my youthful appearance to having never been married and not having kids. Those things will suck the life force out of anyone.
I love my children desperately but I have to agree with you that they are life-force-sucker-outers (not to mention brain cells too!)

Not true if you take good care of yourself you can still look young

Somehow I don't think working for Trump is exactly good for your health though... nor is being in business with him, the man should come with his own Surgeon General health warning

-SB

You work for Trump soon you will have his hair

I didn't know Carolyn is that young

Sorry mizz E Carolyn is 35. She saif so on Jay Leno and on ET. Also when she's on these shows she look younger and is dressed differently.

I saw Carolyn on Jay Leno lastnight and she looks 35 to me. She looked much younger and less strict on the show.

LAST EDITED ON 04-01-04 AT 03:14 PM (EST)

>In the People Magazine article about The Apprentice it said that
>Carolyn was hired 10 years ago to run Trump's golf
>course (now courses). Since she is only 35 or
>36 right now that would mean that she was very
>young when she was given an executive position in the
>Trump organization. The article said she had a high
>level job at another major golf course when she met
>Trump.

I doubt a 26 year old was hired to "run" the course. Perhaps she joined the organization then, but I doubt she came in as the president of the division.

But even if she did, maybe it's just me, but running what was then one golf course is not what I consider to be a traditional CEO position -- it'd be like calling Kristi Frank the "CEO" of the restaurant she supposedly owns in California or Rocco the "CEO" of his restaurant. Ya, they are in charge, but there's a reason those folks tend to get called "managers" more than "CEO's" -- those positions aren't the type of senior management "business world" positions that I think anyone is talking about here.

-SB

Well Fitz Daniel Tabas Tepper, the executive producer of the Fercos Brothers Show at the Trump Taj Mahal Casino is 10 years old, so I don't think that a 26 year old CEO is out of the realm of possibilities.

LAST EDITED ON 04-01-04 AT 05:29 PM (EST)

>Well Fitz Daniel Tabas Tepper, the executive producer of the Fercos
>Brothers Show at the Trump Taj Mahal Casino is 10
>years old, so I don't think that a 26 year
>old CEO is out of the realm of possibilities.

Point #1 -- How is a position as a "executive producer" of a circus show at a red-ink oozing casino even remotely close to a CEO position???

Point #2 -- Did I ever say it was "out of the realm of possibilities?" No.

I said "how many 20-something CEO's do you see out there" that aren't running businesses that they themselves or their family started -- not that they don't exist. After just checking their website, any chance a "sixth generation performer" working in the "The Flying Fercos" family business might be considered... a family business???

-SB

I wasn't picking a fight with you. I was just sayin that it wouldn't be unheard of. Wasn't Bill Gates a CEO when he was in his twenties?

>I wasn't picking a fight with you. I was just
>sayin that it wouldn't be unheard of. Wasn't Bill
>Gates a CEO when he was in his twenties?

Again... a company he co-founded. How am I being unclear? Are you even reading my comments?

-SB

You are right SB. I just wanted to point out that she has a high level position in the Trump organization at a relatively young age. I don't know if Carolyn's current position would even count as a real "CEO", and I don't think that the job at the end of The Apprentice would be a real "CEO" either. That's why I put "Executive VP" in the subject line.

Anyway in the Trump organization Donald J. Trump is the real CEO, COO, CFO, CJO...

LAST EDITED ON 04-01-04 AT 05:42 PM (EST)

I don't doubt you can be an EVP at 36, heck, you can be one at 20-something as well, I personally know several (barely 20-something, but still technically 20-something) -- and they aren't circus performers, but genuine EVP's at large established corporations. But an EVP is not a CEO.

My original point is with regard to the original poster's comments -- and pointing out that qualified 20-something CEO candidates are few and far between -- and that honestly, few of those who are smart enough to have built such a career at such a young age are likely to throw it all away to appear on a show like this.

Not to mention that fact that just as Survivor doesn't aim to cast 16 rugged outdoor survival experts every season, no one should be expecting Mark Burnett to cast 16 business gurus and stellar business performers who would breeze through the challenges -- that's not how casting works.

-SB

Trump never said anything about this person being a CEO. On one occasion, he called the position "President" and this could mean Assisstant Vice-President or something like that. This person will work for Trump and be "President of one of his companies" the same way that Omoanorosa "worked for President Clinton" as the assisstant associate executive of personnel in the Whitehouse.

>Anyway in the Trump organization Donald J. Trump is the real CEO, COO, CFO, CJO...

What's a CJO?

Troy wouldn't work for you, he has his own company. And why would a senior executive be talking in this chatroom anyway?

Huh? Why wouldn't a senior executive be talking in this chatroom?

> Also, since these people are trying to impress Trump, why
> haven't they studied "The Art of the Deal" and why don't
> they refer to it when making decisions?

Well, the two people who have mention this (Sam and Troy) have now both been fired. Guess sucking up will only get you so far

I agree with your overall point though, none of these people is truely qualified to run an established business (although any of the remaining is likely to do as good of a job as the other if they wind up winning IMO). Which of course is why Troy lost last night, of all the remaining he was the least polished and the most likely to be a liability. I have always questioned what the "job" was at the end anyway, whether it a "real" job or more of a publicity stunt but if it is real you have to pick the person who will help you the most BUT as important you have to pick the one that will hurt you the least.

-ICB

>I agree with your overall point though, none of these people
>is truely qualified to run an established business (although any
>of the remaining is likely to do as good of a job as the other
>if they wind up winning IMO). Which of course is why Troy lost >last night, of all the remaining he was the least polished
>and the most likely to be a liability. I have always questioned >what the "job" was at the end anyway, whether it a "real"
>job or more of a publicity stunt but if it is real you have to
>pick the person who will help you the most BUT as important you >have to pick the one that will hurt you the least.

Good points, well said, ICB!!

I agree -- the tasks they have been given are ridiculous as a way to judge a potential CEO, and yes indeedy, they have made numerous rookie mistakes time and time again.

As pointed out later in this thread, their youthfulness is definitely a liability, too. But still, there is enough professional training amongst them to create a formal business plan, isn't there?