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"The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by michel on 04-06-06 at 05:16 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-06-06 AT 05:46 PM (EST)

Since long threads are slow to open sometimes, I followed ECP’s advice and opened a new one. If you want to read the discussions in the first one, it is linked here

First we had many new posters at the end of the thread, so let me welcome Irishfan, Donracefan, JoeC and Mavs_fan. I hope to read more from you. Irishfan, I see you have good arguments for Fran and Barry. I had seen the confrontation between Lake and Michelle and them in episode #1 more to show Lake had strategy but it could be a sign of a future confrontation. We could say that F&B’s brush off last week was being mean for no good reason. We see L&M as villains but we haven’t seen them do anything bad to F&B (they did “help” however briefly). Of course anything bad happening to L&M is reason to cheer and could be seen as positive for our old couple.

This episode started with a recap of the whole season up to now. For the first 5 episodes, the statement that stood out was “MoJo excelled in leg #2”. Phil casually mentioned the first places by our 2 leading teams. This recap was meant to inform all the fans that hadn’t tuned in to the 10:00PM show. The early exposure for MoJo coming in a show where they would be heavily featured is something to take note. They received credit from Phil and an underdog status all at once.

As for the previous week’s recap, only 2 teams besides the DD’s had negative comments: Lake and Michelle for falling behind with a bad plane connection, which could be seen as unlucky to new viewers. And Dave and Lori when Lori FALTERED with the statue, which could be seen as undeserving to go on. No word on all the problems RaYolanda had. Was it really in question who would be eliminated? The same pattern has been observed in all recaps opening an elimination leg.

This short leg was a chance for teams to catch their breath. No major shuffling happened and if it hadn’t been for the traffic in Catania, there probably would not have been much drama either.

BJ and Tyler’s edit has changed slightly. The race is still fun. They make “Team order” signs to mess up the other teams. They were “wet cats” with the swordfish. What was new is that they gave us a comparative analysis of the Frat Boys. Telling us “It’s our game, we travel well and have experience in these situations”. Also saying “the Frat Boys are nice guys but they are dumb and… have dumb luck, which eventually will run out”. Did anyone see a touch of arrogance in the hippies? Calling Monica “Fish Barbie” after hugging her with their stained clothes wasn’t being nice either.

Those two teams see the race as only being between themselves, already practically dismissing the other teams. Can we really blame them? Until one team gets ahead of them, all discussions could be like comparing which team has the best farm system while the two top teams are 20 games ahead of everyone else. If BJ and Tyler do win this race, what part of their edit would be different?

If they were to win, I would expect to see at least some scenes where they are asking themselves which way to go. It would at least put some doubts in the viewer’s mind. Everything seems to flow TOO easily, to be TOO much fun. Can the Frat Boys’ early success be enough to “hide” the hippies’ final victory, to make us pay attention, hoping for a win by the “good guys”? I know not everyone likes the hippies but the editing goal was to have the majority of viewers on their side. With their popularity at 50% and all the other remaining teams under 10%, they’ve achieved their goal.

What about Eric and Jeremy? In the Frat Boys case, we’ve already established that we would have heard less talk about girls and seen less frowns from Phil. They have been lucky and indeed, it should run out. To rule them out, I would prefer hearing it in their confessionals rather than from an opposing team.

The Frat Boys say that they are “learning as we go”. They are focused now. That is two weeks in a row. Without the girls, they do well. They know they don’t match up to the hippies’ experience so they didn’t waste any time. They made sure to always be ahead and made a quick move to keep the advantage despite an agreement to stay together. They are more athletic and could be more ruthless when it will be needed.

It was MoJo’s episode more than anyone else’s. For the second time, Monica starts by telling us we should pay attention, that she has “a lot of strength…ambition…motivation and I am an asset to my team.” Joseph also notes “I am proud of Monica”. For the second time, the events didn’t quite prove them right.
Not that it mattered then, but was anyone surprised when Monica said 41 and Joseph said 40, that he immediately said “we’ll go with 41 then”? Will Joseph be right at some point but follow the wrong direction Monica points out? It stood out a bit as something that was useless to keep in but could foreshadow future dynamics in this team.

Their detour was painful to watch. Monica started by having fun, teasing passersby with the swordfish, then realizing “the fish is disgusting… is heavy” and that “this is ridiculous”. Later sitting down, almost giving up, saying “It’s the worst thing I’ve ever done”. The camera focusing on her tears seemed too much. I don’t think that if we were meant to cheer for these underdogs, they would be shown so miserably. Their pain could’ve been abbreviated. I don’t see winners portrayed that way. Especially Joseph saying “I’m gonna stab the locals in the head” and “I had to ask so many times that SOB if it was him”.

I could be reading their edit all wrong and the recognition Phil gave them in the recap was powerful as was her showing back then after saying “I could slow you down against the two guys’ teams” in that episode #2. She did hold her own quite well. There haven’t been many occasions that a team has competed on equal terms with the two top teams. But they haven’t returned to the big stage.

Fran and Barry started by telling us “we know where we’re going and we don’t have to stop to ask for directions”. It is the second week in a row that their initial comments are disproved in the ensuing episode. Last week they had learned from their mistakes yet passed right by another clue box twice. This week, it wasn’t long before Barry realized “This is not good at all” Fran agreed “We don’t know where we are” to which Barry replied “we are screwed”, Fran had to “calm down” her partner. He went on that “the traffic is impossible, we are going around in circles. This is a total disaster” to which Fran suggested “we should go back out of town and come back the other end” (??) They wasted time calling out the ground-keeper instead of going to him. Once more they let us know that since it was “Lake… helping him isn’t happening.”

Fran thought Barry “is pathetic” at the roadblock. What will happen when they are confronted to tougher challenges? I know they have good editing signs but this isn’t a race where the winner will squeeze by. There seems to be less automatic bunching points this season. This season could “make or break” the concession’s future. I think the heat will increase to get the best team to win.

Phil lets us know right at the start that Lake and Michelle have to control their bickering to get out of the bottom. Lake again talks for both, letting it known that “we are disappointed, we’ve made a couple of major mistakes” Michelle sees their arguing as “they’ve only been snags, not major tears.” He was about to make a scene for missing $2 in his envelop and had the title quote about “sleep deprivation” which isn’t a positive comment so it made him look like a complainer once more.

Getting stuck in traffic was like “all 400 000 people are all right here.” Michelle had a better reaction than Monica to the detour, noting, “I have a three year old who weighs 40 pounds, I can carry a 35 pound swordfish”. She did well.

Lake said he was “overruling” Michelle for directions to Siracusa but she told him to “look, it is right there”. He thought “we got lucky on that”. She had to correct him: “No, I am smart”.

The roadblock had to be done by her since he had done all 4. Lake wasn’t very encouraging saying they are “wasting time” and “I should’ve done it”. The feeling we have is that they cannot control their bickering. According to Phil, they will not get out of the bottom.

Phil doesn’t criticize R&Y for last place. He says “will they capitalize on how well they’ve been working together to get out of last place?” To the new viewer, it would appear they didn’t deserve that rank even if we know differently. Yolanda had other comments about her admiration for Ray. It could be getting too much for many. I can’t help to note that they are in last place and trailed by over 4 hours the first place team. They had to have some worries. We saw none of that. It must mean something. Their edit, to me, shows a team that has confidence, knows their limitations and their abilities and are aware of their competition.

When Serendipity told us they have been made to look better than they are, I answered that the simplest reason for that was to create sympathetic winners. An alternate reason could be that disaster awaits them and we are meant to feel sorry to see them go. That was the nerds’ story. R&Y seems to fit more as the real underdog story.

They know they can’t navigate so they stop to ask directions. They have to “make up every second we can” so they decide to park the car and walk. It could’ve been a fatal mistake. Would they find their car after? It wasn’t even of concern and they were on their way to Siracusa as soon as they got their clue. A little drama was added when Ray tipped over in his kayak but nothing came of it. They didn’t have to worry about being eliminated after that.

Dave and Lori’s story was never about winning the race. It was good to see their feelings hadn’t suffered from their turmoil.

This short leg still had some interesting editing developments. I know it is less adventurous to announce a final three that would include both the hippies and the Frat Boys but it seems difficult to rule out. At least, I still don’t see any one of these two as winners. Strangely enough, the Frat Boys have taken a small step in the right direction by being more focused.

What about the showdown between Lake and Michelle and Ray and Yolanda? I still expect something to come from that, but it may not be for the final mat. What could help us decide what happens? If the Frat Boys start expressing some doubts about their luck, it could indicate some incident will eliminate them. If the hippies’ self-confidence grows even more, it would indicate their downfall could happen soon. In each of these cases, I see L&M and R&Y getting to final 3 with the remaining front-runner.

More likely, teams will start mentioning that BJ&T and E&J are certain to make the finale. It will then be interesting to note who says that and who is mentioned as likely third place. If they themselves tell us they’ll make the finals, we can be sure it won’t happen. If other teams mention it, it becomes more likely to happen. Third place team could be seen as belonging to L&M. That is where the confrontation between L&M and R&Y could happen. If R&Y continue to beat each team from the bottom all the way to the top, do you think they’d be stopped before finishing the task? I still see them as winners despite everything.

Fran and Barry are getting close to the end. It should happen as soon as the tasks become more physical. I still don’t see exactly where MoJo fit in this story. They are good racers who can have meltdowns. They seem to be the exact opposite of L&M. L&M have made more mistakes yet haven’t lost focus the way Monica has a few times. All I can say is that I don’t see them as winners.


Table of contents
Messages in this discussion
"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by Earl Colby Pottinger on 04-06-06 at 07:16 PM
How do you do it? Great insight into the remaining players.
"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by Whole Lotta Rosie on 04-06-06 at 10:57 PM
Michel, Great Job.

I apologize in advance for the long post but this was a very interesting episode and I am doing my best to be more verbose than Michel. The players appear to be grouping together from both an ability to run the race and their editing.

The Leaders: The Hippies and the Frat boys.

These teams are so tied together right now at almost an exclusion to of all of the other team. I did notice some subtle differences in the editing. My impression was that BJ & T were portrayed more positively at both the Detour and Road Block.

At the Detour when carrying the fish

E&J: Oh my God it is puking on me.

But in contrast;

BJ&T: It actually feels good after a little while, kinda like an ice-pack.

Then later, at the detour:

J: You forgot your paddle, where do I get my paddle.
E: Jeremy what are you doing
J: I’m running into people.
E: Hurry up get on the that damn boat, its taking forever.

And later;

E: Let’s hurry up you have to score you pansy.

In contrast, the hippies score almost immediately. Both teams are having fun in the Race, but the Hippies continue to appear to be having more fun.

Our Stories

Fran & Berry: There was a great deal of focus on F&B this episode. They were never in any real danger of being eliminated but the editing created a large amount of suspense regarding their story.

Berry on getting lost.

I’m really not happy.
Get me outta here.
We’re just totally screwed.
This is a disaster
This is a total disaster.
We really made a mistake, just awful.

During the entire time Fran was very supportive of Berry and one they arrived at the Detour it was Berry.

Let’s have fun. Let’s sell fish.

Then after completion of the Detour

F: That was fun, that was way fun.

But, once again at the Roadblock.

F: What’s Berry doing?
B: I’m going the wrong way. I don’t know how to paddle.
F: I don’t know what he is doing.

F: He is pathetic.

Followed by Berry missing and Jo scoring. But, after Berry scores.

F: Yeah!, way to go.

Mojo had another huge episode. Others in the previous thread have insinuated the MoJo’s edit has been slow developing, while it may have been, it has been on us in full force in the last two episodes.

In contrast to the other teams MoJo were the only team to appear to have a problem with the fish detour and it was such a fun disaster . I would like to add that the ability to pronounce Jagino was very important this episode and MoJo failed at it throughout the entire scene. Michel did an exceptional job in analyzing their plight, so I will only repeat it.

It was MoJo’s episode more than anyone else’s. For the second time, Monica starts by telling us we should pay attention, that she has “a lot of strength…ambition…motivation and I am an asset to my team.” Joseph also notes “I am proud of Monica”. For the second time, the events didn’t quite prove them right.

Not that it mattered then, but was anyone surprised when Monica said 41 and Joseph said 40, that he immediately said “we’ll go with 41 then”? Will Joseph be right at some point but follow the wrong direction Monica points out? It stood out a bit as something that was useless to keep in but could foreshadow future dynamics in this team.

Their detour was painful to watch. Monica started by having fun, teasing passersby with the swordfish, then realizing “the fish is disgusting… is heavy” and that “this is ridiculous”. Later sitting down, almost giving up, saying “It’s the worst thing I’ve ever done”. The camera focusing on her tears seemed too much. I don’t think that if we were meant to cheer for these underdogs, they would be shown so miserably. Their pain could’ve been abbreviated. I don’t see winners portrayed that way. Especially Joseph saying “I’m gonna stab the locals in the head” and “I had to ask so many times that SOB if it was him”.

One additional quote from Monica:

Look at how cute and clean she is and I’ve got fish guts all over me.

Truly entertaining.

I am fairly convinced that our next two eliminations will be between F&B and MoJo. Prior to this episode I was leaning more towards MoJo as being the first to be eliminated but F&B’s poor showing at the Roadblock, especially when compared to MoJo’s gives me some cause. Poor F&B are sorely mismatched physically. But if the editing is indeed linear, F&B could last longer than MoJo, if only because their edited story has spiked a tad bit later.

I am guessing we are looking at a NEL next episode, if only because one of these stories needs a completion to its arc.

The Constant Edits

Lake & Michelle: I though their edit this episode was absolutely hilarious. Last week I began to get the impression that their edit was being manipulated. It continued this week. While they seem to go at it quite a bit, I get the impression that much of it is tongue and cheek. I am really beginning to like Michelle. While Lake is obviously being portrayed as jerk, Michelle appears to be able to handle him. .

Notice their exchange after the fish Detour.

L: We gotta drive to another town somewhere.
M: We do, that what it says.
L: Maybe in the middle of nowhere
M: Maybe, but we’ll get there.
M: You ready, to run a little bit?
Townsperson: Hello
L: Hola.
M: Not Hola.
L: I know I'm speaking Spanish just for the hell of it.

Plus this other nugget;

L: What is that right there?
M; A school bus.
L: Damn!!

That was just funny.

Ray & Yolanda. Like L&M, R&Y seem to have balance as a team. But, at the same time, they are anti L&M in that they consistently get along. Once again they trailed the field and once again we felt little danger for them. The battle between R&Y and D&L was almost an afterthought. In what would seem as the distinction between the two, R&Y in contrast to D&L were ready to ask for directions.

Two distant scenes stuck out for me in R&Y’s story. The first was Ray’s inability to get the locals help and the second was his flip in the canoe. This was obviously meant to show a certain amount of vulnerability regarding this team, but I am not sure if it is meant to be shown as a weakness. Regardless, it is vulnerability than we have not yet seen from BJ&T and E&J.

I would like to think that if R&Y were to be eliminated anytime soon we would see more development to their story. If they are to win it would be a great underdog story.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by IrishCharm on 04-07-06 at 04:36 AM
Okay, first of all I just wanted to say I LOVE this thread and waited to post in here until the part 2 was opened, but had to get that out of the way.
Now I also have to apologize because I KNOW people are going to hate me after this post since all I do is pretty much disagree with everyone else. I'm not a jerk, I swear! I seriously love reading all the input from the posters in this thread! And I probably should be in bed, but I just had to write something in this thread to make my night complete.

So, starting with Ray/Yolanda...
I totally disagree with everyone about their underdog edit and that they're still a possibility to win. I'm totally against this idea. In my opinion, you can make a case for anyone besides B/T and E/J to be considered the "underdog" team this season. I don't necessarily define underdog as someone who is always in the back of the pack, it also means competing against other heavy competers, which is basically everyone besides the two alpha male teams. If they were the underdog edit, I think we'd see a lot less balance between their competitive side and their relationship side. Every winner thus far has had some conflict amogst eachother and to a lesser extent with its competition. Some people were talking about R/Y vs. L/M but I don't really see that. There has been no developing story with these two besides that they're always at the back of the pack and that Yolanda has mucho respect for her partner. That's all fine and dandy, but where's the doubt? Even Eric/Jeremy, who have been pretty one-dimensional until this last episode had something we knew them for, their way with the ladies. Ray/Yolanda just don't have a compelling story, and if they were to reach the final three or win the race, I am pretty sure we would have seen something along these lines. It would be unbalanced to have one underdeveloped team win when all five remaining teams (a case could be made for MoJo, but I think the viewers can still recognize them and there's been doubt with them), in my opinon, are extremely well developed and known. Ray/Yolanda have been in the back of the pack, but are never given the focus. Mind you this would be easy for the editors to hit on, too. How hard would it be for them to show misdirection in the previews as "Ray and Yolanda struggle to find the route marker," or something along those lines. However, they never get this kind of focus. I just can't see them making it farther than 5th or 6th place. I'm sorry!

Eric and Jeremy have started a more competitive fued with the hippies, which is interesting to say the least. With the double D's gone, it was all competition for these two, which bodes well for them but yet they still lack that story that all previous winners have had. If D/D would have lasted longer, I think it would've been more substancial for them (A la Chris/Alex and Tara) but it seems like that will be their only storyline this season. I think we're being set up for a Yield where either the Frats yield the Hippies or vice-versa. These two teams might be one anothers' downfall. Is it crazy for me to think that these two teams won't even make the final three, and might be our 5th and 4th place finishers? I know, far fetched and doesn't seem to make ANY sense...but you never know. That's just my gut feeling right now. One of them gets yielded and they get eliminated, then the other team makes some critical error when the other teams are bunched, thus eliminating them also. Most likely, one of these teams will be in the final three, but definitely not both. If I were to take a guess, I would go with B/T just because I think the slight negativity last episode makes people waver on them a little more than anything.
Ooh, I just had a thought. Could that pointless wheelchair race actually MEAN something? Thinking back to it, it pretty much describes their whole relationship since the beginning "Yeah Jeremy you can beat 'em, he's ahead! Go!" with Jeremy finishing before Tyler (or was it BJ?). We should really look back at that again.

MoJo had focus this episode when honestly we didn't need it. And their focus in the "Previously on" segment was also uneeded. This team is always geting manipulated focus which is peculiar and I have no doubt they'll be in the final three. How easy would it have been for the editors to have been like "Yolanda shows her strength at the detour" instead, we see Mojo's struggles. If they were invisible this ep and focus was put on R/Y, I'd say they'd be done for, but there's just too much going on with this team to ignore it.

Okay, now on to Fran/Barry, the team I'm hoping makes the final three so I don't get the "I told you so" from all the posters in this thread! Haha...
One thing which really separates these two in my mind is that they aren't our generic older couple! Besides Teri and Ian (although I don't usually count them as an old couple because they were only 50!) all older teams on the race get this sympathetic, against-all-odds edit, and we're sad to see them go but it's reasonable why they left. The negativity which is thrown in there (albeit very subtle) makes them stand out a lot differently than their previous racing counterparts. They've had inter-team conflict, they've had intra-team conflict, and think about this too: how often have Fran/Barry been shown to the casual viewer? Tons of focus the first episode, and how many teams do we get "Will Fran and Barry be able to do this?" in the previews for the following week, when they're not even in danger? Meredith and Gretchen finished in fourth, and I can't remember much focus on them except for when Gretchen fell and also their elimination episode. I just can't see them as a fourth place finish, because like I said before they really aren't our fan favorite sympathetic team. And, like I was hoping, the Fued with Lake/Michelle did continue, and just the right amount, too. It really is still the only substancial teams conflict in this race so far.

Lake/Michelle aren't the usual villians which is nice to see, and in some ways their endearing. They haven't really been shoved down our throats, but they're always there and overcome all their mistakes. This "michelle is always right" thing reminds me alot of Tara/Wil's relationship in TAR2. They definitely won't win, but I would not be surprised to see them come frightfully close to the million in the end.
So this is how I see it playing out:
6: R/Y
5: E/J--We'll get a whole "shocking elimination" preview so we'll know it's either the frats or the hippies. The hippies will feel threatened by E/J and decide to yield them so they have a better chance at winning. This will most likely be when all the teams are bunched and everyone has a chance to pass them.
4: B/T--I don't know HOW this will happen, but this is our simple, fan favorite finish. bad flight? bad luck? I really have no idea, but like I said before, it only takes one mistake to lose the race.
3: L/M--The fued with Fran/Barry will take them to the finale, I think. L/M won't win, but I can definitely see them coming in second. But third just fits in my mind.
2: F/B--Can they do it? Are they actually going to win? I can't believe they made it this far! Oh, they're neck and neck! Wait, they're 10 minutes late, congratulations to...
1: J/M-- Enough story but not too much, building arch. Enough manipulation by the editors for me to declare them the winners of TAR9.
So that's all I have to say. Bashers welcome! haha, hopefully that wasn't all tea leaves and some people can see what I'm saying...

"First reaction"
Posted by michel on 04-07-06 at 09:11 AM
First of all, Thank you EarlCP for the kind words. I had a good example to follow. If you are a Survivor fan, go to our spoiler board and read Veruca Salt's editing thread. There are no source spoiler in that thread contrary to some others that you better avoid if you don't want to read "the winner is...". The analysis she makes blows my mind each time!

Rosie, nice analysis, I knew you'd like clean sheets! Thank you for reminding me of Fran and Barry's fun selling fish. Their portrayal wasn't all negative contrary to my analysis. I also liked your comparison of the tasks by our leading teams. Editing wise, the Frat Boys took a small step in the right direction, you've reminded me just how far they have to go!

IrishCharm, I welcome your point of view. You shouldn't be hated or bashed for explaining what you see in the story. We do tend to pull for the ones we see as winners but reading the editing is never right or wrong. As an example, suppose someone had said in season #7:
"Uchenna and Joyce are going to win because they feature Uchenna's strength every chance they get. Uchenna is going to win the last roadblock and carry the team to the win"
Suppose someone else had said "Romber are going to win because they are so much better competitors than anyone else. They'll win unless they are victims of bad luck since they have had good luck from the start".

The first poster would feel proven right that U&J won but in actuality #2 was closer to what really happened. All that to say(yes Rosie, I am verbose!) that I don't see it as being right or wrong, more like learning to read the story!

I appreciate your reminder of the wheelchair race. It appeared so futile that I didn't really pay attention, reading it only as "boys will be boys". It could be significant, an another sign BJ and Tyler finish ahead of the Frat Boys.

Just to defend my "pick", Uchenna and Joyce as well as Chip and Kim won and I don't recall any conflicts inside their teams. With other teams, Chip did yield Colin and Christie but that was one time and late in the season.

As far as your final 3, it is different to say the least! We'll have to wait and see. If it turns out right, I'll have been able to appreciate the outcome more for someone having read their story.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by architecturegirl on 04-07-06 at 11:23 AM
Welcome IrishCharm! For the record - NO bashing will happen here! Thats part of the reason I truly enjoy this forum - and the one for survivor as well. In fact, your opinions are all the more welcome for being different from other people's - different perspectives give a more rounded view for the rest of us. And I second Michel - anyone that enjoys this thread and is a Survivor fan should def. check out VS's editing thread! Its incredible.

On some things I am in agreement with you IC, and thus in disagreement with others. I have all along felt that MoJo would at the least be final four - but honestly, I think they'll be first or second. I agree with you that this episode actually was in favor of their being end-game. In the first few episodes they didnt receive too much air time, but then they got quite a spike once the really weak teams went by the way side - and showing a bit of conflict between them was a good thing I think. They arent constantly negative or bickering though, so I think we're seeing a well rounded team. One that has its struggles, but is a strong team. I seem to recall reading or hearing Monica say somewhere that they bicker a lot. We havent seen this much to date, but here we did. If they bicker a lot normally I would think this will likely roll off their shoulders and wont hold them back in the race. So far they've been shown to be the leaders of the second pack. And they're gaining on the boys. We havent seen any of the other teams even remotely come close to competing with the boys.

The frat boys and BJ/Tyler - One of them will be in the final three, and the other will not. I think the team that will not will be either fourth or fifth. Their edit has been so completely tied to each other, and honestly how can it not? They tend to feed of each other and depend on each other a lot though. It will be VERY interesting to see what happens to them when they're broken up and dont have each other to compete with, or work with? I think this will inevitably happen at some point. Will one team fall apart and the other continue to excel? I am growing more convinced that this is what will happen. Also - are they REALLY that good racers, or are they just good because they've been far enough ahead to not have any competition, and the resulting stress of that???

Fran and Barry - I have to say they're doing pretty well, but we keep being focused on their struggles (even when they're still doing well!). I dont see them in the final three. One of these times their mistakes - and their inability to calmly deal with things will be their downfall. I do find their fairly negative edit very interesting though. Its certainly a new thing to have a negatively edited older team. I think one more team will go before they do, but I just dont see them as end-game.

Lake and Michelle - I have to say that I am not as frustrated with their interaction as most people, nor do I think Lake is quite the jerk everyone thinks he is. He frustrates me, but honestly - I've been with someone very similar for a long time. If we ever went on TAR he would def. be considered a villian! BUT - we, like Lake and Michelle have an interaction that while others may not get it - works for us, and the bickering while somewhat distracting and frustrating - is easily brushed off and not a huge issue or detriment. So, I get their relationship and how they work together. Not too many people could handle Lake, but Michelle can and does. Their bickering doesnt bring them to their knees like it does other teams (Jonathan and Victoria - ugh!). Their main problem though - is the mistakes they make. The biggest one being - Lake doing all of the roadblocks at the beginning - even NON-physical ones! This will be their downfall. Michelle will have to do a roadblock that Lake could have done much faster - and other teams having been smarter about doling tasks out will finish much faster.
Ray and Yolanda - very simple. They have had major struggles, yet they are being shown very positive and strong. Absolutely NO FOCUS on any weakness from them - even when they were last Phil talked about their strength as a team! And I think this is the FIRST time in the history of the race that we werent shown any suspense between the final two teams coming in as to who would be last - it was comletely obvious, even though they could have easily made it seem close. No way they're going home any time soon. Final four at least.

I'm thinking our final three are BJ/Tyler, MoJo, and Ray and Yolanda. I see Eric and Jeremy going fourth or fifth as a real shocker. Lake and Michelle and Fran and Barry are interchangeable in my mind as to when they will go. Truly, when each of these three teams will go is a matter of who makes their fatal mistake when. Fran and Barry will likely be earlier rather than later though I think.

Here's my tentative lineup:

6th - Fran and Barry
5th - Eric and Jeremy
4th - Lake and Michelle (Michelle struggles with the roadblock)
3rd - Ray and Yolanda
2nd - BJ and Tyler
1st - MoJo

But really, I'd say 4th-6th are interchangeable (except Eric and Jeremy wont be 6th), and 1st-3rd are interchangeable (BJ and Tyler wont be 3rd either I dont think) at this point.
I could maybe see BJ and Tyler and Eric and Jeremy switched, with BJ and Tyler as the sympathetic boot (Lake and Michelle and Fran and Barry certainly havent been edited to be that). But, I'm not very keen on that. BJ and Tyler have been shown to be the better racers I think. And this race really has been shown to be about fun (note - Moninca was DEFINITELY shown to be having fun at the beginning of the fish carrying. Fran and Barry didnt appear to be having fun, but they were showing saying they did). The hippies have personified the "fun" of the race. I think they'll outlast the frat boys for that reason at the least.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by beau_30 on 04-07-06 at 05:33 PM
I just have to say I love reading all your thoughts, and I kind of agree with some of the thoughts and disagree. Bare with me, due to I have bad grammar. And I don't really like writing. But I just want to throw in somethings that I noticed in early episodes.

Mostly it deals with a few quotes. The one quote that sticks out in my mind is the first yeild episode were the hippies talk.

Tyler: Who are we going to yield?
BJ: The Frat Boys?
Tyler: Who we going to yield?
BJ: Frat Boys. Frat Boys

Could be the edit where in a future episode of the last yield where Hippies yield the frat boys, or vice-a-verca.

Also another quote that sticks out to my mind is the
"Hurry up Michelle, That Black Girl runs fast!"

I notice this has been spoken before, about being a show down.

Now on to another thought I had. This weeks Preview shows Mojo and Hippies at the greece olympic grounds, but no one else. Usually the previews give an edit of a team that comes in last. I remeber That Wanda and Desiree were showing getting lost in the preview for the following week and bam they were eliminated.

So could this episode coming up be a race for first place between MoJo and the hippies. You don't really see anybody else at the olympic grounds but thoose two teams, and they are there at the same time together. Could be a foot race? Where MoJo out runs the hippies next leg for first place?

Which could the previews indicate that Frat Boys Get Lost since they are going solo and get eliminated.

Fran and Barry are showing at the roadblock during a rain storm, but in a recent program it shows Ray during the day doing the roadblock which means. Rays roadblocks are up.

Giving Ray 6 and Yolanda 1. Which could mean the downfall of this team. The only way they could possible win is there isn't another swimming roadblock or a carrying something very heavy.

Now if Lake does this roadblock as well, that will give him 6 and Michelle 1. Which doesn't do well for them to if the Chip and Kims Roadblock is still in effect.

Also I think if you look at the previews close as well, it could determine the outcome of the final three teams.



Wow, DUDE! This race is far out!

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by desperado on 04-07-06 at 07:00 PM
From what I have seen elsewhere beau_30.

"This weeks Preview shows Mojo and Hippies at the greece olympic grounds, but no one else."

Ray is also shown there throwing the javelin.

"Rays roadblocks are up."

Ray does take the bungee jump as does Michelle, unbelievable eh?, and Tyler.

The Frat Boys are not shown doing anything the others are doing. FF..??

If a link to the vidcaps is required I can post it if asked/allowed.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by beau_30 on 04-07-06 at 07:12 PM
Previews are allowed, links are allowed


Wow, DUDE! This race is far out!

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by desperado on 04-07-06 at 07:40 PM
>Previews are allowed, links are allowed
>
>
>
>Wow, DUDE! This race is far
>out!

OK..thanks I didn't want to redirect or step on anybody's toes. Pgs 4, 5 and 6 for pics..

http://forum.realityfanforum.com/index.php?topic=8073.45


"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by indy42 on 04-09-06 at 02:53 PM
Doesn't the olympic games (javelin throwing, wrestling) have to be a detour so the bungee jumping is a roadblock?

In TAR 6 they had to do archery and they knocked down wooden things for a detour. Team members took turns. That may be the situation here.

Or am I completly off, and this is a double-leg, or a 2-leg episode?

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by Serendipity on 04-07-06 at 11:43 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-07-06 AT 11:46 PM (EST)

LAST EDITED ON 04-07-06 AT 11:44 PM (EST)

Beau, you are one off on the Roadblocks. Each of Lake/Michelle and Ray/Yolanda are at 4-1.

Lake: rapelling in Sao Paulo (1); diving in Moscow (2); Finding gnome (3); Assembling Greek statue (4)
Michelle: Kayak polo (1)

Ray: rapelling in Sao Paulo (1); finding gnome (2); Assembling Greek statue (3); Kayak Polo (4)
Yolanda: Diving in Moscow (1)

From the previews for next week, it looks like it will be Lake-4 and Michelle-2 versus Ray-5 and Yolanda-1.


"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by donracefan on 04-08-06 at 02:09 AM
Good observation Serendipity. So, provided that neither is eliminated next week, it looks like RaYo will be in deeper roadblock trouble than L/M. Wonder how that bodes for future episodes?

There are some really good posts by some really astute people in this thread. However, I think that we need to depart from the assumption that the kind of edits from past episodes are indicative of this season and here's why. CBS has a ratings problem. TARFE just about killed this franchise. The ratings have not recovered and now they have moved time slots to try to help. The show suffers from a bit of burnout because it is the 9th run. Everyone was a bit surprised (and relieved) when CBS announced that there were at least going to be 2 more seasons. My point is, ratings are more important than at any time in the past except perhaps season 1 when they wanted to make sure to kick off well. That leads me to one conclusion. Having viewers that feel like the team they liked won and all is good in the world of the amazing race so we can ride into the sunset is more important than ever. I think that is why they have made BJ and Tyler so likeable. I saw somewhere that they had an over 50% likeability while the other teams hovered at 10 or below. I think that is critical. Yes, CBS needs some suspense to keep us glued to the set but I don't think that's as important as having a good feel this time around. And believe me, CBS is the number one network for a reason and Bruckheimer is a winner too. They are aware of this. So, again, I think it's unwise to assume that the past is the best guide on editing this season.

By the way, I don't know of the official time between finishes for this last leg but it appears that the remaining teams are now pretty close together. The Frats and Hippies were pretty far ahead the others were also clumped. However, the delay of the opening of the first clue location (don't remember its name) caused a tightening so the effects of mistakes and/or delays will be magnified if they happen in the next episode.

We have had a superleg but not a non-elimination yet. And we are roughly half way through. I think it's time. Therefore, my first prediction is that no one leaves next episode. But I do think that we will see Fran and Barry slide down to last place. The reason behind this is that I think that they are now the weakest team left and the stress of the race and the sleep deprivation, etc. will wear on them more than the others through the race. They continue to place 4th and not be able to crack the top 3. Since teams have been leaving, that means that the bottom spot keeps inching closer to them without them moving closer to the top. The edit that they showed of the fear of heights problem next week would not have been shown (from my observations) if they were being eliminated. However, it has to cost them some time in what is a close race now. Therefore, they finish last next week without being eliminated. They will be eliminated the following week after some drama and artificially created last-minute doubt.

No team other than the Frats and the Hippies have finished in the top 2 yet. I think they are the better racers with the Frats being more athletic. Now that the girls are gone and they are starting to really believe they can win the money, they are turning it on. I don't see another team overtaking them and therefore, I agree that it will be a stroke of misfortune or another team that does them in and does it outside of the final 3. I can agree with the previous poster that they (or less likely the Hippies) go in a surprise prior to the final 3 and I also can go along with 5th place though I wouldn't rule out 4th or 6th either.

I think that Lake and Michelle are quietly staying in striking distance and slowly getting adjusted to this race. They were making more mistakes early on. Like other posters, I'm now starting to think that their arguing is just normal for them and not race stress meltdown. Therefore, I don't that that will be there downfall. Also, since Michelle appears to be doing the next roadblock too, I think they are solving that problem. I also think (maybe I'm imagining) that some of Lake's funnier lines are now being included in the edit and his jerk factor is being pulled back just a bit. I think this bodes well for them. I think they will be final 4 but hard to say where except to say that it just doesn't feel like a winning edit they are being given.

I have to disagree with others about how RaYo will end up. While I do think they are getting a positive edit, I don't think they are making the finals. I think the positive edit may be a CBS "suck up" to their demographic as well (remember the ratings). There are also just times when certain things don't make the edit or maybe their cameraman was just "off" that day. Others have used the fact that they were not shown lost in Segesta or having a hard time finding their car since they ditched it in Siracusa as an edit that favors them. They may have already been close when they ditched their car and, if so, there may have been no drama or delay in getting back to it. And in Segesta, it wasn't hidden from us that they were lost but I think the editors wanted to spend more screen time on the drama surrounding the Double Duh's getting yielded. If anything, I think not making a big deal over RaYo getting lost in Segesta bodes well for Lake/Michelle. If they had focused more on making RaYo seem hopelessly out of the race, it would have reflected worse on Lake/Michelle that the ONLY reason that the Double Duh's lost was because of the yield. By making it seem that RaYo only went a little out of the way and that they were closing fast, it made it seem (at least to me) like the Double Duh's might have lost anyway even if they weren't yielded. Just one man's opinion.

MoJo is hard to get a read on. Yes, they keep making her sound braggadocious only to be proven wrong. Yes they are getting screen time. However, I think the screen time is for the men in the audience. The eye candy known as Double Duh is gone, ratings are down, and good looking girls get male viewers attention. I just think that they are too prone to meltdown and I can't help but think that something is going to happen to them. That said, they have been in third for 3 of the 5 finishes so that bodes well for them. They have clearly been the best team outside of the "top 2" so far. In the end though, their edit (and maybe their real personas) seems to be Mr. Nonpersonality and Ms. Spoiled Barbie. I just don't see that as a winning edit. I do think they make the finals.

As far as the hippies go, I think the little bit of arrogance the edit showed us in episode 6 was to provide some suspense. Through episode five, they had placed 1st in half of the legs and 2nd in half of the legs. They were obviously being portrayed as likeable and as knowing a bit about the places they were going. It seemed like it was going too easy. I still think they win but I think the edit is going to take some twists to throw the viewers off a bit and shake things up. They are not the most athletic of the teams (as was on display for those who watched their "fight" on CBS's extra clips page.) However, if the Frats exit due to mistake or misfortune and RaYo exits because they keep hanging around last place and it finally bites them, the Hippies won't necessarily be at a disadvantage by not being athletic. CBS wouldn't invest so much making us like a team that ended up not winning but they need there to be some suspense too. That's what makes views both happy and interested. This is a winning edit...especially for this season (again with the ratings).

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by beau_30 on 04-08-06 at 08:28 AM
Thanks for letting me now that. I didn't know Michelle was going to do the roadblock.
I was off by one.

Wow, DUDE! This race is far out!
"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Episode 6"
Posted by Serendipity on 04-08-06 at 00:49 AM
Michel, thanks for starting a new thread. I don't watch nor do i care about Survivor so I would prefer not to have to read the similar topic in Survivor, but am wondering if by "outside sourcss" you mean the Insider Videos that I introduced in my last post. If that bothers you and others, I will be sure not to include any references to them again.

Isn't it interesting that we all watch the same show and interpret things differently? I guess that's because of our own life exeriences and relationships. And that's what makes this thread so fascinating.

The Hippies: Michel, right on about the arrogance! It was almost palpable this leg. I found it fairly shocking. Our fun lovers are scornful of the other teams. I must admit that I was a real fan in leg 1, but that has dcreased with each leg. I no longer see them as even final 3, no matter how well they ar doing now. They are fairly lazy racers because they THINK they are unbeatable. One mistake may do them in.

Frats: We only had hints at their competitiveness, but now with the DDs gone, it has really come out. They say they are learning from each leg and they are. Eric is really, really competitive and he is pushing Jeremy. They are no longer following and no longer afraid. I really expect them in the Final 3.

Fran & Barry: How can I hate thee, let me count the ways. I tradionally love the old teams. In fact, I adore Dave & Margretta plus others. These two are nasty complainers. We have no luck. Oh, yeah? Without luck you would have been long gone. They have hit no real danger zones as yet, but I think they will next time. However, I believe they will be saved by a non-elim and will continue on.

Ray & Yolanda: Dear me? The editors tell me they are strong nd woking well together yet the time lines contadict this. Yes, they beat the Nerds, but there was only a 9 minute time difference in the last leg. Darned editors made it look like RaYo were tied with the DDs and not the Nerds. Since the Danis arrived only 15 minutes RayYo, the editing was way off on the last leg. Ray was obviously not navigating well so Yoland has left the driving to him and has taken over the navigating job. She still criticizes his driving however. More confessionals about how much she loves Ray and even one about how she tears up watching him do tasks. I guess that's why she doesn't to any herself. RaYo are now tied with Lake/Michelle at 4 for the male partner and only 1 for the female. According to the previews, it gets worse for this team since Michelle does another Roadblock, bu Ray continues to do the Roadblocks and Yolanda sits out. The editing keeps telling me how strong, how competitive, how cooperative this team is, yet I don't see it. They won't be out next because it will be a non-elim, but I think they're geting close.

Lake & Michelle: I like this team. In reverse to the Nerds, I hated them in the first leg, and have liked hem more and more each subsequent leg. Lake is crazy, but in a good, enthusiastic way. Michelle knows exactly how to deal with him. They do make major mistakes so I wouldn't be surpised to see them go soon, but I won't be surprised to see them in final three either.

MoJo: Fast becoming my favorite team. Monica is still being edited as a dumb blonde, but unfairly, I think. Yes, she and Joseph both mispronounce words. I speak French, German and Welsh plus a bare minimum of Korean, but would still have trouble prouncing Jagina as Yageena. They are middle income folks from Arkansas who have never traveled. Architecturegirl says the race is about fun, and they are having fun. They are unfailing polite to everyone they meet and tell Phil at each pitstop how much they love what they've seen and done. The meltdown scene was quite unfair in my opinion because Monica clearly had a rash and some swelling on her forearms. That had to hurt. (Shouldn't include, but Dave & Lori said her arms were very swollen.) Much ado has been made about Monica wishing she had the clothes from some of the well-dressed Italian girls, but that's not so. She simply said look how cut they are and I'm a fis=smelling mess. I think they're doing well, and I see them as Final 3 and very possibly the winners.

I know we're getting close, but I just don't feel I can commit on the order of elimination. I do think next week is a non-elimination. I also think we will see the first Fast Forward. I expect that the Frats, being the first team relesed, will take that. I cannot see Fran & Barry doing well in the Greek games so my feeling is they will come in last. Will they be eliminated the next leg? Maybe, but I want to see the next leg first.

What I will commit to right now (subject to change) is that Fran/Barry, Ray/Yolanda and the Hippies are the next out in some order and the Final Three will be Lake/Michhell, MoJo and the Frats.

Ah, yes. One more controversial view.


"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Episode 6"
Posted by donracefan on 04-08-06 at 02:23 AM
Serendipity,

You are right on with many of your takes. However, one needs some clarity. I'm from Arkansas and I don't think that the edit we are seeing with Monica mispronouncing words is because they are "middle income folks from Arkansas who have never traveled." They go to the University of Arkansas, which is in Fayetteville and the 4th most donated to school in the country that is not Ivy League. The Waltons (of WalMart - richest family in the world) live 20 minutes away and are huge donators. President Clinton went to school there as well as many of the people that ended up serving in his administration (not that I'm a fan). Many, many rich and powerful people have ties there. In fact, my wife and I were amazed when the season started at just how prototypical of a UA girl Monica appears to be...good looking, southern belle, cute designer clothes, sorority girl/cheerleader type, spoiled daughter of an upper income family. Many people in Arkansas don't go to UA because they see it as either too snobby or too much of a party school or both. All of that leads me to the conclusion that the I think the dumb blonde, more looks than brains stereotype is what is really being played here instead.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Episode 6"
Posted by Serendipity on 04-08-06 at 03:18 AM
Don, didn't mean to make that sound like I was putting anyone from Arkansas down. I would never do that. I'm from the anthracite coal mining area of PA myself, and grew up in a lower middle-class home.

I picked "middle income" for them because it describes most of us in this country, and also because, I believe in his CBS bio, Joseph says he is very proud of having constructed and sold his first home.

I may be wrong on their income level, but I really don't think they have done much traveling in foreign countries and I don't think they have foreign language skills. They remind me very much of myself a few years ago. I began a job that required oodles of travel and I felt like a fish out of water when I wasn't being coddled by foreign customers/hosts. Fortunately for me, English is spoken in so many countries today (and spoken well) that it isn't a huge problem, but I always try to learn a few words of the language of he country in which I will be staying. Please, excuse me, where is..., thank you, etc., often brings the English out of even the most recalcitrant Frenchman. Oh, and if you're in Japan and need help, stop the 12-13 year old studens in the street (you'll know them by their uniforms). They WANT to practice their English on you and are ever so helpful.

I think the problems MoJo had at the fish market were because they couldn't pronounce Jagina's name and didn't stop to listen to what other people were saying so that they could repeat it. It is most definitely not because I think they are dumb. I don't. And I also think their manners are excellent. They remember, unlike Ray, to say thank you for help, and even thank Phil each time they are on the mat.

"MoJo analysis"
Posted by Jims02 on 04-08-06 at 11:07 AM
LAST EDITED ON 04-08-06 AT 11:09 AM (EST)

Good points, michel.

I've been really watching Joseph and Monica's editing carefully this season. They've been definitely doing pretty well so far, finishing right behind the Top Two teams for awhile, but I'm trying to figure out just how far they go.

The common theme for Joseph/Monica seems to be "Don't count us out." Numerous times, we hear statements from Monica telling us how strong she is and how others will underestimate them. These kinds of statements are almost like hints to the viewers... Does it mean a MoJo win? Maybe.

This past episode was somewhat contradictory for MoJo, however. At the start of the episode, Joseph notes how cool the locals are for helping them out. By the end of the Detour, he wants to murder every Italian in a ten mile radius. Understandable comment, since he was super-stressed, but still quite a change in opinion. This negative moment really sticks out in their otherwise positive edit this season.

Despite the slightly negative edit this week, their story arc is probably going to peak at just about the right time for a "winner" edit. Look at the past winners. Uchenna/Joyce, Freddy/Kendra, Chip/Kim, Flo/Zack, and Chris/Alex were definitely not the focal points of the show in the first five episodes. But, about midway through the season, they seemed to blossom and get more airtime.

Of the winners, MoJo's edit reminds me most of Freddy/Kendra, or possibly Flo/Zach. Not because I think MoJo's going to fall apart now, but because of the editing arc. Both of those teams were very "meh" in the first 5 weeks, much like MoJo. But then we started seeing more of Kendra's quasi-racist remarks and Flo started breaking down...

We might be seeing the same kind of story arc for Mojo, or possibly Ray and Yolanda, who have also been pretty under-the-radar so far. Still, if neither team doesn't get much more screentime, they might end up like Kris/Jon, for example.

As much as I like the hippies, I question whether they'll end up like The Clowns, Charla/Mirna, Rob/Amber: teams heavily featured throughout their respective races.

"Clarifications"
Posted by michel on 04-08-06 at 02:28 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-08-06 AT 02:36 PM (EST)

There have been questions as to what should and shouldn't be included in this thread. I DON'T MAKE THE RULES. We have moderators for that (the ones with Blue symbols) and they do a great job. Their rules are in the guidelines that clarify many points and are found at the very top of each page.

Without imposing rules, this thread is intended for speculation on the end game players based on how their stories are edited. Anything from CBS, i.e. "The Finish Line", "The Insider" and interviews of eliminated racers are welcomed. They can help see how the edits are manipulated. The trick is then to decypher them to see if they have meaning and what that is.

Previews also can help but I don't see any patterns to them. For example Wanda and Desiree's exit was almost handed over in the previews. The following week, I thought the Nerds' story was over when I heard Dave's confessional but then the previews showed Lori crying with the statue and almost convinced me they couldn't get eliminated. I wish I had been convinced!

If someone, maybe Beau who brought it up, goes over previews from this and previous seasons and can find patterns, it would be so noteworthy as to start a new thread dedicated just for that. For this thread, I don't even know if the editors preparing the previews are the same preparing the shows. I don't know how much importance they have other than create drama.

Source spoilers, which I would prefer wouldn't be included here, come in three forms:

1- The direct spoiler: "I happened to be strolling downtown and saw Phil surrounded by 8 teams waiting for something. It was the final mat and I saw...". Or "I live next door to... and they've been throwing parties since November."

2- The real source spoiler: Someone has contacts inside CBS or affiliates or with travel agents used by the show or even in hotels used. They get inside information and come on the boards. These are true spoilers. The survivor reference is the "ChillOne spoiler". He went to Panama as filming was wrapping up and got descriptions of the final players.

3-Gambling spoilers: Some on-line casino take bets on reality shows. It has happened that large sums are played on one team, forcing the casino to suspend gambling as a leak is suspected.

Such spoilers are usually found in their own thread. This being a spoiler board, the cross-pollenation is impossible to prevent. You can just hope that posters respect the intent of a thread.

That being said, Serendipity, I see you and Jims are in agreement with respect to MoJo's chances. Even the hippies, who are very good with languages, couldn't pronounce Catania so it shouldn't mean much. MoJo could very well be our winners. My main reason to doubt it, is that there is no need to hide the winner if it isn't one of the top teams. It would be a surprise, a happy one for many, if MoJo came trough. Why not show them in the best light possible since it wouldn't ruin the surprise? That's what they are doing to RaYo. The roadblock situation is a concern but lets be serious, those tasks aren't that hard. Besides the statue that Ray appeared to build in record time, Yolanda could've done fine. Call me, if not recalcitrant, then a stubborn Frenchman (from Canada)! Don't worry, I didn't take offense.

"RE: Clarifications"
Posted by Serendipity on 04-08-06 at 03:33 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-08-06 AT 03:34 PM (EST)

Thanks for the clarification, Michel. And thanks for not taking offense. I didn't mean the French Canadians. They have been nothing but lovely to me when I have traveled to Quebec as I do about once per year for a trade show.

I do find in the country of France, however, people are not always willing to admit they speak English, but if you try a little French they will usually relent. One time, I was staying in Avignon and went into a little wine bar and asked for the local white wine and i asked in French. The bartender pretended not to understand me, so I wrote it on a napkin. Two French Canadians sitting nearby told me he did this to all Americans, and we ended up having a great time. In fact, the bartender invited all of us to his family's farm for a picnic on the day before I left. When I have the time and money, I'm going to rent a little apartment there and stay for about a month.

"RE: Clarifications"
Posted by beau_30 on 04-11-06 at 05:19 PM
I like to apologize for saying that you could post spoilers and informatino in here, I thought we could use preview edits as well in some cases, since its shown at the end of each episode. Again I'm sorry, didn't mean to make anybody mad or anything.
Wow, DUDE! This race is far out!
"RE: Clarifications"
Posted by michel on 04-11-06 at 06:49 PM
You can use them Beau. Previews are fine but very confusing. The spoilers I think that should be left out are from people who know what happens. We want to see if we can find out who wins. Not be told by someone.

You have done nothing to get anyone upset. No need to apologize.

"sign up sheet"
Posted by mavs_fan on 04-08-06 at 05:46 PM
Why were we shown the sceen with BJ & Tylers sign up sheet?

This is the 9th season of this show. Is this REALLY the first time a team has tried a fake sign up sheet? I kind of doubt it. So why would we be shown BJ & Tyler trying this? Maybe they ARE the first team to try this. Maybe it was just funny. But I think we were shown this because it fortells a future trick that backfires on BJ & Tyler.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by Whole Lotta Rosie on 04-08-06 at 06:30 PM
Great job by everyone.

Once again, thanks to Michel for starting up this thread. Michel you are correct, I do love clean sheets. It is such a strong draw.

DFR: Your points on editing and how it affects the ratings are very interesting. I can not discount BJ&T at this time at all. I mentioned BJ&T’s Achilles heal in the past thread and I think You, Michel, Serendipity, and AG have mentioned their arrogance and this could be their downfall. I do think it is still heavily tied to E&J.

AG: I loved your analysis on L&M. I don’t know if this is a change in their edit or if I am just becoming more accustomed to them, but I just think they are funny. Michel has mentioned them as a classic final three foil, but he, as I, have some reservations in regards to their numerous mistakes. From an editing perspective I think either MoJo or L&M will be in the final three, but probably not both.

I agree with you points regarding BJ&T and E&J. While I have less assurance in this assumption I think once again we will see only one of these teams in the final three. Just based on their edits I am giving the edge to BJ&T.

Jims02: Great points on MoJo and R&Y. Both of their edits have been well hidden over the first part of the season. I am guessing that winner will come from one of these two teams.

IrishCharm: We don’t hate you because you a beautiful Your analysis is very solid and I actually agree with most of your comments, but it seems that I interpret how this impacts the results completely different. My boot list is almost completely reversed from yours. I lack your experience in viewing the show so I am not going to discount anything you say. You raised a very good point about the manipulated edits of MoJo and R&Y. It will be interesting to see if MoJo’s manipulated negative edit in terms to their actual position in the race can overcome R&Y positive edit in terms to the their actually position to race.

Serendipity:
You also have raised some very interesting points regarding MoJo’s edit. (This does appear to be the primary topic this season) I have been seeing their edit far more negative than others on this board. I felt that their edit turned negative in the previous episode (I’m not dumb/I’m stupid) trended negative and it was compounded last episode. Their edit could have been treated as far more empathic, but than again interpretation is important, which is why we are here. There is has definitely been an increase in their edit over the last few episodes and it will be interesting to see if it is the start of an end game edit or a short term story.

BTW I stopped watching Survivor years ago because I just didn’t like the players, but after reading VS’s thread I got back into the show. I don’t necessarily care who wins but it is fun, through editing, to try and pick the winner. With the help of FP and her editing column two episodes ago, I began to watch TAR. Again I don’t really care who wins, but it is fun to spoil only based on the editing. If you find the editing game fun you should give Survivor another shot.

Michel: I don’t have much to add to your comments because I think we are on the same page. As stated previously my main focus is between MoJo and L&M. One of these teams is should be our villain and make it to the final three. With MoJo’s spike in editing I am leaning toward them being eliminated first. L&M’s edit has been far more consistent.

Once again, great job everyone.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by donracefan on 04-09-06 at 00:32 AM
Rosie,

At one point you said the RaYo or MoJo would be the winner. Then you said Mojo would be eliminated before L/M. So, can I assume that you are predicting RaYo to win? Just curious.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by Whole Lotta Rosie on 04-09-06 at 11:52 PM
DRF

Yes, that is the direction I am leaning, but if R&Y are eliminated MoJo would jump to the top of my list.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by IrishCharm on 04-10-06 at 00:50 AM
I think someone said that The Finish Line interviews can be used in this thread. Well take a look at this.

J/S say that the teams they were CLOSEST to on the race were: The Frosties, The Pinks, David/Lori, and Ray/Yolanda.
Then, when W/D get eliminated, they say they are best friends with D/D.
D/D get eliminated, and say they "Are rooting for E/J to win." The also say "They never got a chance to talk resolve their issues with L/M"
D/L get eliminated, and say they "Were closest with Ray/Yolanda and bonded with MoJo at the pitstops."

Funny that everyone who J/S have mentioned as friends besides R/Y have been eliminated. It seems as if W/D were a fluke. Consecutive eliminations cant be a coincidence. R/Y don't make it past the final 5.
D/D said they were rooting for E/J, this spells doom for them IMO. A la B/G season 7 "We really hope M/G win!" it always spells doom. So NO final three for them.
With B/T being the fan favorite/sympathetic edit, a final three of Lake/Michelle, Fran/Barry, and MoJo looks extremely likely, and to me really satisfying.

Also, before this season started, BVM said the teams to watch out for were B/T, L/M, and F/B. It'd be too easy if that was the final three, but I think two of them making the finals would be appropriate.

Sorry guys, I'm not pulling this out of my but, this is all from the interviews. It could all be misdirection, but it's a lot of coincidences.

"The Phil Dance"
Posted by frankz on 04-11-06 at 09:54 AM
Something I’ve been wondering about. Why did they show us the Phil leprechaun dance? In the previous seasons SeeBS has not shown Phil acting in such a cavalier, carefree manner, although one can assume from interviews outside the show that he actually does have that side to him. Granted, his portrayal over the preceding seasons has become less formal and his bantering with contestants has increased but that dance was over the top (and quite hilarious actually) but so out of character from the persona they have been showing us.

Is it just because they want to show Phil in a less harsh light, or is it a foreshadowing to suggest the cavalier, carefree team will win (the hippies, of course). Or won’t win because of their happy-go-lucky attitude?

Another thing to consider is who were the teams that hit the mat right before the dance and right after the dance. I don’t remember, I seem to recall it was somewhere around team number 3 to arrive, so between team 2 and team 3 or team 3 and team 4 – Anyone know? Is that significant? Was he dancing to celebrate a win, or to celebrate the elimination of an unpopular team? Or just dancing?

I really believe there was some significance to them showing that dance and not just because they wanted to show Phil’s light side. I think we’ll realize the meaning when it’s all said and done. But I did enjoy the hell out of it. Replayed it at least 10 times.

Thoughts?


I've tried nothin' and I'm all out of ideas!

"RE: The Phil Dance"
Posted by donracefan on 04-11-06 at 10:54 PM
I think the significance is that they must get a huge kick from knowing that every time they (CBS) say "boo" we out here in message board land scream. This is too funny the way everything is looked at to see if it has a real meaning, implied meaning, deception meaning, or nothing at all. My guess is that nothing at all happens a whole lot more than anyone thinks and that a lot of this other conjecture that people allude to in these posts (myself included) when they do come true is purely and nothing more than coincidence. Buzz buzz everyone...
"RE: The Phil Dance"
Posted by frankz on 04-12-06 at 02:02 PM
Yeah, but it gives us something to do.


Shake head back and forth quickly to see the Bob motorcycle z000m!!
I have neither been there nor done that

"RE: The Phil Dance"
Posted by mavs_fan on 04-12-06 at 10:57 PM
The Phil Dance was when MoJo came running up. They were team 3.
Team 2 was BJ/Tyler - They came in about an hour before MoJo.

We will see if it has meaning or not as the show goes on.

"RE: The Phil Dance"
Posted by IrishCharm on 04-13-06 at 00:08 AM
All right, not that much to say tonight, other than YAY about being right about F/B outlasting L/M!!!

Maybe the fued is going to be R/Y vs. J/M and F/B vs. J/M

M: They're all about business (about R/Y)
M: I was glad to see Fran and Barry, because I know we can beat them. (Hmm, maybe in the end she DOESNT?!)

"Episode #7"
Posted by michel on 04-13-06 at 06:41 PM
The first thing I’d like to mention is that the latest episode was very exciting. The bunching happened early enough that there were plenty of position changes during the Greek portion of the leg.

In the recap, Phil had negative comments on three teams:
- Fran and Barry panicked in traffic.
- Monica broke down during the detour.
- Lake and Michelle bickered and couldn’t get out of the back.

E/J and BJ/T were presented positively, saying they surged ahead. No mention was made of RaYo. According to previous recap patterns, we could expect one of the three negatively presented teams to be eliminated.

-Eric and Jeremy had a relaxing episode. They were ahead throughout the Italian part of the leg, so winning the FF was deserved. This is the third efficient, quiet leg they’ve had and we even heard them say, “We make each other laugh.” Editing-wise, they keep taking steps towards a top three finish.

-BJ and Tyler had a very difficult leg but surprisingly their edit was fairly consistent. Phil told us about their carefree ways and they headed out by saying “we’re as intensely in the game as the others but we keep our senses of humour and our positive attitudes.” They were aware that “the 3 other teams have gone for the FF or they are lost. May the gods be with them!” The smile BJ had saying that showed that he saw it as good news. The bungee jump was “Fantastic, I could get addicted to this.” The next clue excited them; “Dude we’re going to be competing in the Olympics” and they “love the Olympics.”

Getting there “it didn’t feel right” because “we’re going the wrong way, we’re done” and “we lost 2 hours.” Seeing them joking about the lucky frog hat and hugging each other after completing the discus, shows that they best exemplify the theme that “The race is fun”. It was even during their wrestling match that we saw the spectators laugh. It seems to be a good sign that we saw them mainly keeping their cool, realizing that “we’re buddies and we’ve had this amazing experience”. I don’t understand why the editors extended the drama of the 15 minute penalty has Lake and Michelle were also to receive the penalty.

If I wasn’t so stubborn, I’d say this was very close to a winner’s edit. The intent to build ratings as a “too good to be true heroes” edit is more likely. (Survivor fans will remember Rupert)

-Leaving the Pit Stop, we heard Ray state that “After being on the brink of elimination, we don’t have room to make mistakes” then he restates that “we’re going to play the game from the bottom on to the top and take out one team at a time.” In Rome, on the way to the fountain, Ray goes on to say “Downtown Rome, I saw some great shops. I’m going to have to come back to buy some stuff if I win the million bucks!” It is still troubling that they fell back in the Italian part of the leg. They also made an error by getting off the train before Isthmos station. Being with 2 other teams minimized that mistake. The roadblock had them ahead of the peloton for the first time. After the jump, Ray lets us know that “I’m like Superman. I gotta go win this race.”

On the road, we heard Monica commenting on RaYo, “They are all about business. All about the race, all the time.” Then Yolanda’s remark that “I’m not sure there is much going on there” about MoJo, which isn’t fair if they haven’t gotten to know each other. Each team is seen laughing at the other as they race in taxis to the Agora. Was it just a prelude to their close finish in this leg or is something brewing between those two? We’d need to see if the comments continue.

Not only did they avoid the navigational mistakes some of the other teams made, they even beat MoJo to go from 3rd to 2nd on the way to the Pit Stop only to go back one spot after the penalty.

I don’t necessarily think that there is such a thing as a “winning quote” but having a powerful statement reinforced by repetition and adding the other references to the money and the win has to mean something. Yes, Ray could be saying it every day. The editors don’t have to leave any of those quotes in.

-MoJo had a similar first half of the leg to what we have been accustomed from RaYo. They were at the back and they thought they were in danger. The contrast in personality is one thing the editors cannot do anything about. The frequency and the intensity we see of Monica’s meltdowns can be manipulated however. Heading out, Monica is already less positive, “This race makes me feel like I’m going crazy. One minute we’re on top of our game. Then the next I’m freaking out. You always think someone is going to race pass you.”

After missing the FF due to their “crappy luck” and on the way to the train, we heard Monica again saying, “We’re out of it.” When Joseph tried to calm her that “if we get there last, then we get there last”, she tells him “it’s fine if I get upset, that’s what I do, I cry all the time.” Many posters have compared Monica to Flo. The question then becomes can Jo carry Monica as Zach did? It has been a while but I recall Zach leading the team. This time, Monica seems to lead.

Having negative remarks about another team is also a bad sign. Monica says, “We’re excited to see Fran and Barry arrive at the train station. We know we can beat them.” True, but not a very nice remark to leave in, even though it was partly softened by showing Monica encouraging Fran to jump, telling her “we love you Fran. Don’t think about it”.

The detour was very well done but they lost time on the road to the Pit Stop. I still cannot see exactly where the edit is telling us this team will end up. They do not seem to be gaining sympathy in the CBS polls. They do not seem to be gaining momentum in their presentation. This season, it doesn’t seem that a winner will be hidden until the end, even if the scare the hippies received should warn us. If they are to win, we should’ve seen a turning point in their edit. With only 5 teams left, time is running out.

-Fran and Barry seem to have season tickets in 4th place! Lets say they finish 4th and be done with it. I guess I owe a better effort. I have been very tough with them, saying that they look like tourists who have booked too many activities and will need a vacation from their vacation! It was a little unfair and they have surprised me. Can they win? Fran’s quote about “we can’t lose them, we won’t know our way” was accentuated by Barry saying “We can’t run as fast to the clues and the taxis as the other teams. We always fall behind. It sucks.” They were first out of the airport and into the taxis and Barry was “feeling pretty good!” They once more made a mistake choosing tasks. They had to know another team would be going for the FF since they were last to the clue box. It seems like their story is still about their perseverance, not about their success. Fran’s fears at the bungee jump demonstrate that it is more about facing the challenges than being first. Hopefully, there shouldn’t be any more trees that come out of nowhere to rear-end them!

-Lake and Michelle had a real implosion. It was painful to watch. Good for them if they are OK with their relation. It certainly isn’t in our scope of analysis anymore. Since they are eliminated, I’ll avoid their quotes. They were the villains but only lasted halfway. Who will take their place? They are however the first team identified as real racers after the first episode to be eliminated. It wasn’t a surprise that a mistake (Lake’s mistake) did them in. Two teams seen as tourists have gone further than them. The Frat Boys aren’t tourists anymore.

Just as a side note, there seems to be many tasks requiring searches this year. Those tasks can be killers and they depend mainly on luck although they do test a team’s patience. The hippies’ performance seen in the preview could indicate they get eliminated next week. Their edit tells me it isn’t time yet.

With more than half the field gone, we are closing in on the long-term players. Only one more elimination leg is needed before we have our four finalists. Which ones should battle until the end?

The positive edit received by Ray and Yolanda seems like long-term investment. The editors have built this team for the audience’s sympathy. It isn’t yet seen in the polls. A late push should be well received now that the groundwork has been done.

The difference in performances is still very apparent between the two top teams and the others. Since their one bad leg didn’t eliminate them, the hippies are still tough competitors. They have extensive traveling experience in Asia, something not to be neglected as they approach that continent. The Frat Boys and the Hippies should make it.

The editing differences between the other two teams are difficult to judge. Both teams have had bad moments, both have had some fun moments. Fran and Barry have a story of perseverance that could carry them into the last four teams. However, it could also end at the next elimination leg and still would be a “nice” story. MoJo have had much better results. It always has been difficult for me to see their story. They’ve had mean-spirited remarks but certainly not enough to make them into villains. To me, they simply seem to be there, more as supporting cast rather than having a real part to play. Monica is nice for the décor! Of course you could argue that “being there” isn’t bad if it means reaching the finale!

The next leg likely won’t eliminate anyone or it will be TBC. It will be done in much harsher conditions than yet experienced. We could still have evolutions in edits before we are faced with deciding who goes next. I’ve often out-guessed myself and been off 1 week. Hopefully, I’m more accurate in the long-term than the short one!


"RE: Episode #7"
Posted by Serendipity on 04-14-06 at 00:16 AM
I really need to watch this leg again to sort out my feelings on the editing. The first time thru I'm just too intent on the race. Just wanted to add a few comments though.

Michel, you almost have me convinced that RayYo will be the winners and not MoJo. Almost. I need a little more time. If they are, however, the theme that "the race is fun" won't fly.

Using the Insider clips we see MoJo interacting with all of the other teams except RayYo. While waiting for the train, Fran is giving Monica hugs and Tyler is supporting her because Lake yelled at her. And despite the fact that MoJo had a tiff with Lake, they are sharing a room in Athens while waiting for the Agora to open. At the mat each time, things are lighthearted between MoJo and Phil, and they thank him each time. Yes, there is an occasional "not nice" comment, but all of the teams are guilty of this. The scene where Monica says that RayYo is all business is extended, and both of the MoJo team say that even at the pit stops RayYo are not really friendly, but want to discuss the race all the time.

The clips with RayYo bear out that they are all business. Apparently Yo wasn't thrilled with Ray's navigation so she has allowed him to drive while she does the map reading (I do think this improved their performance). In one clip, however, she is in the back seat and criticizes Ray's driving constantly. A few seconds later we see that Yo has taken over the driving, but now she is back to harping on how Ray reads the map.

In the clip where Yo says "not much is going on there" she expands on that by saying MoJo isn't in the race enough, and that they will be the second team she and Ray will wipe out. They will start with Fran/Barry, then MoJo. She also doesn't like the Hippies and finds them too silly and not funny at all. She does like the Frats somewhat though. She doesn't mention Lake/Michelle but another clip shows her fighting with Lake. (Lake had a really bad day)

A third clip shows Ray talking to the Frats and Yo isn't happy about that. She says she doesn't want to get friendly with any of the teams. You have to be nice, according to Yo, but don't get into friendships. And once again, at the finish lines, Yo is all about the race or Ray. No teasing with Phil.

The overriding reason that I'm thinking you are possibly or even probably right, however, is because of RayYo's clips. They are clearly in this for the money only. They don't care bout the travel (they plan to travel on their own with the money) they don't care about making friends, and they will have fun spending the money after the race. Despite that, however, we hear (as mentioned above) that John/Scott consider them close friends; Dave & Lori are rooting for them; and now Lake said they are the people they were closest to on the race. Why would CBS be pushing them like this if they were not the winners and they have to build them up for us.

"One more thing aboutRay/Yolanda"
Posted by vince3 on 04-14-06 at 01:05 AM
In the preview on Wednesday and in the commercial that aired during Survivor, Ray and Yolanda are going to have a big fight in the next episode about Ray's cursing.....

Could this make them our new villians???


Because 3 Vinces are better than one.

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by Earl Colby Pottinger on 04-20-06 at 12:19 PM
Please startup a third thread with you analyzis, as we clearly see a rewrite in the stories taking place.

1) Old people in first place because of better map reading skills than MoJo.

2) Mild break-down of MoJo could be considered still at thier normal levels of emotions.

3) Both till-now-top teams coming behind everyone.

4) R & Y may be breaking up under the strain.

Thoughts?

"Episode #8"
Posted by michel on 04-20-06 at 06:39 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-20-06 AT 06:49 PM (EST)

Hello EarlCP. I think we still have some room to stretch our legs in this thread. I was thinking of starting one for the Final 4. Those are good questions you have. I hope my post can have some answers.

Wasn’t that a surprising leg? We should always remember that anything could happen in this race, even Fran and Barry in first place apparently. The important question is how much have the shake-up in positions changed the edits of the teams?

The recap was focused on Lake and Barry, almost telling us no one was in danger this week. The only negative comments were on Fran being terrified but was courageous and BJ and Tyler receiving bad news but STAYING POSITIVE, foreshadowing the leg’s outcome. Ray’s superman comment was repeated.

I’ll start with our new front-runners. Fran starts by telling us that, “after many fourth place finishes, our goal is now third place.” She knows that “we can’t do the physical sprinting that all these young ones can, but we have endurance and we’ll keep going for it!” Indeed, they have shown it up to now. Their “grumpy old folks” edit was amplified. Although most teams joined in, Fran was slapping the window to mock the hippies when they were on the bus leaving Rion. At the airport, they try to hide all the information they have. Barry says they aren’t “genial grand parents anymore” but “damn they’re all here.”

The tower detour was the right choice. Even if they couldn’t run fast, they left in second place along with the hippies who had also climbed the towers. Fran found that Barry was doing a “good job” on the road to Sur and also while digging at the roadblock. They were right behind MoJo, Fran “knowing exactly where we’re going”, and ready to “make it as fast as my legs will take me.” Barry reflected “It would be nice if an old couple would win once.” Too bad, they were talking about the leg, not the race.

MoJo’s uncertainty enabled them to arrive at the mat saying that they “never dreamed of finishing first.” It reminded me that their goal was to be third. Do they end up reaching that goal or falling just short? The old couples have often been endearing. Even if it won’t please Irishcharm, I don’t think the editors would choose the first team of elder winners to paint them negatively. All the comments on other racers were superfluous. Would it only be to show they are competitors after all? That possibility is enough to keep their supporters’ hoping. I take it as a sign they finish ahead of one more team, in fourth place.

Eric and Jeremy were very confident at the start, talking about “the other teams have gotten used to tasting our dust, they have mud in their mouths. We run faster than all of them.” They took the first nasty shot at the last place team: “Where are the hippies? Not here... AH! AH!” In the almost general laughter that accompanied the sighting of the hippies, Eric added: “Lets go back and do it over!” At the airport, they are the ones asking the agent not to give information to BJ and Tyler.

They enjoyed Muscat and stayed ahead until the detour. The camel detour sounded like it could be completed quickly, but it proved to be the bad choice. To add to the problem, they take a wrong turn, and almost “drive forever. We’ll go on until we’re dehydrated and die.” We saw that they didn’t keep their cool as well as other teams falling behind: “It’s our worse experience, we’re idiots.”

They bounced back at the roadblock where Jeremy encourages Eric to “dig like a champion” and to the camel “I don’t need your lip right now” proving they can also have fun with the race. In a useless attempt to finish first, they “take a short-cut” that could’ve cost them dearly. It has been noted that their risk-taking could be their demise. It wasn’t this time. Will it cost them next time or have they learned their lesson? They thought they would go “from first to last.” Phil’s comments about the race having been too easy up to now sounded like an indication it won’t be the last time they fall behind. Another bad short-cut could push them out of first place at the final mat.

BJ and Tyler want to profit from “our second chance. We’re going to make the best of it and enjoy every moment.” They immediately prove they can by having a fun time imitating eliminated racers. They certainly caught Lake’s intensity and I heard Dave and Lori’s theme music while they were telling us the nerds were hugging and kissing in the back. Even the editors went along with their act! They are thrilled to see they are still in this and run a strong leg after the bunch point.

Once more I was impressed with their manners, showing their gratitude in the Arabic “shukran”. They made a good call at the detour, figuring the clue wouldn’t be in the closest watchtower. The roadblock did them in. It started by Tyler telling BJ he was “digging for a million dollars”, it ended with BJ almost digging his grave. Those searches depend a lot on luck and could be fatal. For the first time, animosity crept in when BJ commented he looked for gnomes and dug in the desert while Tyler went bungee jumping. Despite the ordeal, they stayed positive and now tell us “The other teams are not going to see us coming.”

MoJo had their best result. Even with this nice leg their edit seems to be all over the place. The comments used at the start should’ve been positive since last week ended well. Yet Joseph starts by saying that “when others have good luck, it drives us nuts because there is nothing we can do about it.” Monica goes on to say we “need to make our own destiny and not rely on luck.” It was a nice quote but more about their emotions than about the race.

At the airport, Monica is the one stating, “The hippies are mad at us.” During the ride to Sur, they are surprised: “This is a dirt road…I have absolutely no idea” if it’s the right way. They comment on how the Frat Boys always “want to be first and they cut in front of us.” The detour was fun for Monica but changing detour did cost them some time.

The roadblock had Monica complaining again “you’re going to get it for making me do this” to which Jo replied “you can just be quiet and find that food. You don’t have to pout about it.” It turned out to be “awesome” and they “could be first.” Stopping to get directions and falling back to second is meaningless in this leg. Their lack of story could be a sign they are the team knocked out of the final episode. But then we see them having trouble in the previews. Those pesky previews…

The only continuity I can find to their story is that they are the narrators. They told us they could beat Fran and Barry, that the hippies are mad at us, that they are buttheads who want to follow us, that RaYo are all about business all the time and finally that the Frat Boys need to be first all the time. I don’t think any other team has given all those comments about the other racers. They could be presenting us the final four.

Then there is Ray and Yolanda. I had kept seeing them as having a positive edit. That was partly due to their calm but competitive nature and a manipulation by the editors to show their “good side”. But now, we got a new look into their relationship. She says they can “joke pretty hard but that the bad part when you play like that is that you don’t know when someone is serious.” It quickly got serious. The whole bickering showed they weren’t on the same wavelength and it came back in Muscat.

Ray says “Yolanda and I have never spent more than four days together the whole time we’ve known each other. We get to see a lot of sides of each other.”
“Ray and I haven’t communicated well at all. I’m left trying to figure out what’s going on. I can’t do that here. This is something we have to work on. No matter what, we have to get through this” said Yolanda.

Their performance in this leg was bad but it was presented strangely. They fell behind at a bunching point! How can that happen? Ray tells us “I don’t know what language these people speak but I look at these signs and can't figure out what they mean. They are all squiggly…They are confusing as hell.” They finally reach the detour in last place, but Jeremy tells us “they aren’t far behind.” The comment seemed to be left in more to reassure us than to warn his teammate. The detour appeared to be done quickly and suddenly they are on their way “to the Promised Land.” Another comment that we can interpret as having a deeper meaning than Ray’s intent.

Their edit certainly changed. It had some negative aspects for sure but then they were restrained in mocking the hippies at the start, Yolanda wasn’t sharing the laughter and Ray only had a smile. Later, Yolanda told BJ “don’t give up” while he was struggling in the sand. She had just found one to BJ’s anguish. Her encouragement came even before telling Ray about her find. So while some negativity appeared, we still had some good things to see.

Their confessionals were interspersed during the episode. No other team has received that treatment this season. Ray tells us he wants to “get it together and come back to win.” Yolanda says, “All THE FUN has gone down the drain. We have to work on it.” It would seem that how they work on it would decide their outcome. They had a dispute but they never had an explosion and kept their head in the race.

For competitors, the fun is winning. The theme of “the race is fun” needs a corollary as was mentioned. This would fit with the view that the fun has to come from the race. The smile at hearing they were third showed that it was nice but they will need more to bring joy.

Now, are they winners? Serendipity says, I’ve almost convinced him, I wish I’d convince myself first ! Remember, when BJ and Tyler’s prospects were analyzed, we were saying that their race looked TOO easy, TOO much fun to be the winners and that the editors maybe should throw in some doubts. They had plenty of doubts coming in the last few episodes so they didn’t need to look for doubts in the previous legs.

I still feel like the editors have manipulated RaYo’s edit too much to mean less than a win. Of all the other teams, the hippies have a good chance at the million. The Frat Boys will continue to have mean remarks about their competitors but a bad decision will cost them. Fran and Barry will persevere until fourth place. MoJo would be the ones telling us about it.

"RE: Episode #8"
Posted by architecturegirl on 04-25-06 at 02:38 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-25-06 AT 02:43 PM (EST)

Well, I haven't posted much of anything the past two weeks, but I wanted to get a post in before the next episode.

How many of us loyal race fans were ecstatic over that last episode??? I LOVED it! PURE Amazing Race unpredicatability. For all the editing analysis we've done NEVER would I have expected to see Fran and Barry winning a leg (kudos to them!), and NEVER would I have expected BOTH the frat boys and BJ/Tyler to be at the bottom!

Fran and Barry - as much as they've been the crotchety grand parents this season they pulled off an unexpected win. Of note to the editing - they had their game together this time around and we actually saw some of those skills they claimed to have, but until now have been in hiding. Not a bad time to bring out the skills. But, I still think that this is more of a one-time thing, or at least not very long lived. I dont see their edit getting them to the top three. Maybe third, but I really think they come in fourth. Still, way to go for the win. And they were actually quite a bit ahead of MoJo - the sun was fully out when they got to the pit stop, and it was almost down when MoJo got there. I'll be interested to see what the actual time difference was.

MoJo - This is still my pick for the team to beat. While they bicker and Monica is breaking down more often - I dont see this as a huge hinderance to them in the race that I think it may turn out to be for Ray and Yolanda if their bickering continues. Monica stated prior to the race that they bicker a lot, so I think they must be fairly good at letting the bickering roll of their backs and move on. As for the editing - this constant talking about their "luck" has to play a role in the end. Will their professed terrible luck do them in, or will they have great luck at one crucial moment? I'm tending to think its the latter. All winners are shown to struggle, and have difficulties - while constant struggle is not good, a healthy dose of it shows what was overcome to win.

Ray and Yolanda - They surged from last to third thru the misfortune and error of the boys teams. I think their bickering is causing Yolanda to start having emotional reactions and worrying about their relationship, etc. This is not a good thing. This will kill you in the race, because where bickering itself may not seriously hinder a team that is strong in their relationship - letting it take your mind off the race and put your focus on worrying about your relationship is a killer. They need to get back to a good place with each other pronto, or they're going to have problems. They are consistently the weakest racers of the group lately. It was hidden from us for a while, so I think they still have longevity, but I just dont see with all their getting lost and falling behind that they consistently do, I dont see them winning unless the other two teams have horrible "luck" - MoJo maybe?

Frat Boys - Oh, it was so nice to see the mighty fall and have their confidence busted a bit. What was it they said about the others eating their dust? Nice to see that snarkiness come back to bite them. Their portion of the episode could be called "Overconfidence will kill you". They were so concerned with getting in first that they nearly got themselves elimintated! Thats something to sit back and reflect on as a team. As I mentioned in a previous post, I thought we'd see one of the boys teams screw up and not be able to recover from the bottom. I think this may be the Frat Boys undoing. BJ/Tyler seem to have more substance to draw upon to get back in the game. It'll be interesting to see how the two sets of guys race together at the back of the pack as opposed to fairly worry-free at the front of the pack.

BJ and Tyler - poor boys just didnt have luck on their side this time, except the most important stroke of luck - having your worst leg be the first non-elimination leg. As much as MoJo talked about it - it was BJ and Tyler's luck that stunk this episode. I felt horrible for Tyler in that sand, ugh. It made me think of the girls with all those bales of hay in season six. I think BJ and Tyler have had their ego check, but have the depth and mindset to pull themselves up and get back on track. I dont think we've been shown that with the frat boys.

So, I think it will be one of the boys teams to go this week unless Fran and Barry quickly revert back to their old ways. I think Fran and Barry are around for a little longer though...


"RE: Episode #8"
Posted by Earl Colby Pottinger on 04-25-06 at 04:52 PM
Ray and Yolanda may be going for a diffirent type of edit than winning.

First, we see them working well together, then the stress of the race breaking them apart. I will not be surprised if we see the stress taking them to the point total break-up. Claims of never wanting to see each other flying back and forth.

Then the next interesting possibility. Maybe it may take a non-elimination to trigger it, but they see the light and start working together with each other again to the point that at thier personal end of the race, one of them asks the other for thier hand in marriage.

Or am I just a big soft-hearted romantic?

"Episode 8"
Posted by IrishCharm on 04-26-06 at 05:25 AM
Yeah, I'm late haha, but I really don't have much to say anymore. I am starting to have doubts about my Franbarrys making the final three, and tend to agree with what everyone else is saying. But I have thought of one thing to throw out here.

How about the theme of hubris going around this season? And how showing hubris hurts you in the race, while being humble benefits you?

Hubris shown by MoJo and E/J hurt them both. One was almost eliminated and the other could've had first but was too cocky.

BJ/T saved by the non-elim because they were humble, F/B's only goal was to make it to number three, but ended up being number 1.

Ra/Yo arched WAY TOO LATE for them to be contenders to win IMO. They aren't villians, haven't really been characters until last episode. My hinkies are telling me they are our team eliminated first in Australia.

And what about the little alliance between F/B and the Hippies? Anything there?

I dunno, just an idea.

"RE: Episode 8"
Posted by michel on 04-26-06 at 12:19 PM
Good to hear from you, AG: I have been tough on MoJo haven’t I? They do have good editing patterns and are much stronger racers than what we are led to believe. They are as close to narrators as I think we can have in the race’s format. It certainly is a good sign in a competition that you know your opponents. The fact that their comments are mainly negative isn’t as good however.
I don’t like to compare edits but it is possible that Flo and Zach’s story was sufficiently well received and certainly well remembered that the editors wouldn’t mind having a similar result. I may not see them that way but I’ve been reminded often enough not to dismiss the idea. After the first episode all I could remember was Monica jumping up and down, then they almost disappeared for a few legs but they’ve certainly have gained in airtime lately. Since we are hearing their comments on others, we could say that the editors have switched our viewpoint. We’re racing with them now as much if not more than the hippies.
Are they winners? I’d be in your camp and say they are, if not for a nagging concern. With the cast we had, they could’ve been made into the darlings of the race. Why weren’t they?

Hello IrishCharm, you say you don’t have much to add then you introduce a possible new theme to the race! Certainly, it would be another bad sign for the Frat Boys. They competed to be first when there was no need to do it. Pride has caused many downfalls. I don’t see MoJo with overbearing pride, not on a repeated basis anyway. They have been presented as having a lack of confidence, Monica saying she’ll slow them down competing against 4 men as an example. They do believe bad luck is following them however. Even if fighting against that could be a source of pride, it may be stretching things a bit far! If hubris is a theme that the editors want to point to, who will win? The hippies are mainly respectful of others and locals but have been shown to be arrogant at times. Fran and Barry would fit best but they haven’t always been humble.

I see I have convinced neither you nor EarlCP (Hi Earl!) about RaYo. That’s a good thing, since that is not my intention. I try to read the story through what the racers say and do. That is why I like to use quotes to follow the events. I try to be neutral in determining what the editors have done to the characters. Of course total neutrality is impossible but do you believe that I don’t really cheer for RaYo? My pride (!) might take a hit and I might not know what I’ll write if they get eliminated but that will simply be something new to analyze. To me, their story didn’t need to have an arc since they were always more present than their results warranted. They aren’t good racers, making numerous navigational mistakes. They shouldn’t win. The two boys teams and MoJo are better. Even Fran and Barry are better when they are in a car. What makes me say they are going to win? Phil has never had a negative comment about them. They never have been shown to worry about their outcome. Ray has had numerous “winning quotes”.

I’ll be very curious to watch tonight. Their bickering last week cannot be ignored in the recap. Will they be the focus of the recap or will it be the hippies’ struggle and the Frat Boys’ “hubris”? I think we’ll hear Phil say something like “Ray and Yolanda had their first argument but quickly recovered to finish third while other teams faltered.”


"RE: Episode 8"
Posted by beau_30 on 04-26-06 at 03:43 PM
Okay Bad Grammar, Bad Spelling ahead. So I warned you.

I'm suprised everybody waits until the last minute to get a thought in or two. I wanna put a few of my thoughts in if thats okay.

I think this is just the beginning of a RayYo downfall. There is going to be a time where I think Ray may end up like Lenny from Lenny and Karyn. I always Remeberd Karyn always yelling at Lenny for being stupid. But Yolanda is a little differnt except that she didnt let the stupid argument go about the bridge. It lasted in to the next day almost. I think she only wants the money and wants Ray to help her win the money. There will be a time where she will have to carry the team in Roadblocks, and there will be a downfall and she will end up blaming Ray for using up all his roadblock. I really don't see them having a winning edit due to the last episode especially. Like michel said about them not needing a new arc, I guess its a new Arc. We had postivite information about them over the past 6 legs. They hardly argue, then bam the Climax of their story in the last episode could be, Their story will end either with a happy note or sad note.

MoJo I don't know why everybody is comparing her to Flo. Mo actualyl does things. The only time I seen her wine was The Fish, but she was getting fustrated and the Sand because it was hot. Now Flo on the other hand complained about the boat and complained about the bike in the final four episode. Mo will not give up, she will keep going even if she wines. But I don't think MoJo has a winning edit either, or it could be. And if they did, it will not go a Flo and Zack edit, where Zack carried the team, Both of them carry the team. Joesph and Monica work well together and get along. They know they bicker and thats a good thing. At least they are honest. But A winners Edit. Tonight might be the decision.

Fran and Barrys story is actually starting to interesting. Their story is that they can compete. I think FranBarries will make it to the final three due to their navigational skills. Due to the lack of THREE other teams not being able to read carefully. BJ and Tyler made a mistake in the leg before, Eric and Jeremy made a mistake this leg, and RayYo thereis no hope. Fran and barry can get into the final three if one of these three teams makes a huge navigational mistake. We learned from this episode that anything is possible. Fran and barry wanted to get into third, but they ended up in First. They work well together with some super help. BJ and Tyler helped them with the first detour task. They were the second to find the food in the roadblock. If they can get ahead of the pack they will definately stay ahead of the pack. There is no doubt in my mind they could loose after their performance in this episode.

Hippies and Frat Boys starts a new chapter. The first Chapter for them was competeing to be first. And It was flip floping for five legs straight. Hippies story changed when they went the wrong way, whats tells us that their navingational skills aren't has good as they thought it was. But I think tehy will probably be final three due to their story take a new turn, Will they recover from almost being eliminated in two legs? Or is it the end of the road and its time for them to go home. Now on to the frat boys. If they don't have a map or anybody to follow they will end up def. getting lost. Eric and Jeremys story now is staying out of the bottom of the pack and reaching the beginning. I have a feeling that one of these two teams from last weeks perfomance will fall victim to the Philminator.

Basically my overrall view of the teams is that:

RayYo do not have the navigational skills and team ablitlity to make it into the final three. They got lucky two weeks in a row due to mistakes of two other stronger teams. If the hippies and frats boys pass them up. They are eliminated. RayYo need to be worried because these two teams are not ready to be eliminated. The only hope I can see for RayYo is a forced elimination by using the yield on the frats or hippies.

MoJo has the team work and okay navigatonal skills to make it to final three. If the team doesn't fall apart, They have a shot in the final three. Their edit still doesn't strike me as a winning edit.

Fran and Barry have team work and excellent navigational skills as we can tell. If they can stay ahead with a strong team and get in a allaince with MoJo they can contunie to make it to the final three. But again like I said about RayYo two teams still are racing not to be eliminated and can

Hippies their is hope. There have been 3 teams that have been in a NE leg and still came back and won the million, Uchenna and Joyce, Flo and Zack, Chris and Alex is all I can think of. They have a chance. Their story can take a turn from bottom of the pack to top of the pack.

Frats boys have a little hope. I think they may make it to final three if RayYo are eliminated if not, it will be them due to having nobody to follow. If they are a last team to leave from a roadblock or detour, there is no hope. Only if its RayYo.

How its going to play out.
1) Hippies/FranBarry
2) MoJo
3) Fran and Barry
4) FranBarry/Hippies/Frats/Rayo
5) Hippies/Frats/RayYo



Wow, DUDE! This race is far out!

"RE: Episode 8"
Posted by architecturegirl on 04-26-06 at 05:02 PM
hmmm....interesting thought I just had - Fran and Barry talking about hoping to get third (for the leg) and then winning. This comment was important I think. Was the comment put in just to highlight their win this leg - and I think the obvious theme of that episode - the rewards of humility and the downfalls of ego - OR is it more than just that? Could it be an omen of where they actually finish, third? If this was survivor, I'd say definitely. Its something to think about. Also, I think we saw the playing out last episode of Monica's snarky comment a few episodes back "Good, we're with Fran and Barry, we know we can beat them". Yet, in this episode with a great shot, they didnt. This is something we all noticed, and I think last episode it played out, I dont think it has any implications beyond that.

I find it interesting to note as well - that with how far and away they led for most of the race, I dont see any of us really thinking that BJ and Tyler or the Frat Boys win. We all seem to disagree between MoJo, RaYo, and Fran and Barry - but none of us are arguing in favor of either of the boys. Very interesting.

As you'll note with my vote, I think Eric and Jeremy are gone next. I may have been swayed a bit on Fran and Barry's longevity now though with this whole "third" thing in my head.

"RE: Episode 8"
Posted by architecturegirl on 04-27-06 at 09:06 AM
Ha! Well scratch my Fran and Barry 3rd place speculation!
Guess I was way off on the Eric/Jeremy getting eliminated part as well. Although they did struggle more than the others at the roadblock...I still think they're going to go rather than BJ and Tyler, although that might just be stubbornness on my part. They have shown themselves to be very good racers.

I felt bad for MoJo, how much must that have sucked to miss out on first by literally seconds to the frat boys who now have hell what? Months worth of trips now??? and then to have to listen to "And here's what you're NOT getting!" Must be that luck of theirs.
Well, I'll write more later. Busy morning. Yet another good episode though. Glad to see Ray and Yolanda are getting along again, they needed to - but they need to amp up the racing skills in a serious way.

"Episode #9"
Posted by michel on 04-27-06 at 07:13 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-27-06 AT 10:31 PM (EST)

LAST EDITED ON 04-27-06 AT 10:18 PM (EST)

We’ve reached the Final 4. Except for the Frat Boys who were originally seen as being on vacation, looking to hook up with the girls, the teams remaining were always the real competitors. Fran and Barry showed admirable perseverance even in their last episode but that was the extent of their story. It’s a shame that their elimination was mainly due to a taxi that failed to show up.

A change in recap pattern was observed. Only Eric and Jeremy who got lost and RaYo who had continued to bicker were presented negatively. Neither was to be eliminated. I guess patterns only last a certain time! AG, don't feel too bad about thinking third place was Fran and Barry's. It would have been a good spin on the story. Editing is more about long term than details, it seems

On to the remaining teams in what appeared to be “hate the hippies week”.

The fan favorite team was quick to get back on track, receiving help from Fran and Barry and RaYo. Tyler says, “I remember when I was really young thinking how amazing it would be to travel the world with only the clothes on my back. Now we’re forced to see what it’s like.” They even see an opportunity to help a hitchhiker and receive information and supplies in exchange. They use the occasion for the best line of the night: After the bedouin said, “I come from the desert.” BJ answers “I come from New-Jersey.” As if it was the same! They can’t leave before getting “Bedouin Loving!” They still have fun!

They get on the plane just in time to surprise everyone. Monica had to stop her little “hippies are late” dance. There isn’t only peace and love from these hippies as BJ is happy to “rub it in their faces…hope yield season comes” They also belie their non-materialistic claims by begging for $300 when teams only needed $181 for the leg.

They continually move up until they complete the physical detour in second place. As others have done before, they take an unnecessary risk by choosing the ferry to Hillary. Traffic brings them to the roadblock in third. The rivalry escalated as Joseph refuses to tell the location of Division #4. Standing just under the sign as he said that wasn’t very clever! At the tunnel, Tyler helps Yolanda find her way. They haven’t lost their enthusiasm when greeted by Phil who even joins in by commenting on how well they did without money. It’s not all fun and games anymore but Peace and Love goes on! They should be final 3 and complete the race around the world with only the clothes on their back. In which position? I’ve felt their “too good to be true” edit would mean they don’t finish first. They were good for the show, so third place would be right! But Beau may very well be right that they win it all.

Eric and Jeremy weren’t in the mood for a sixties revival. “The hippies are last and giving them money is dumb. It’s not competition if you do that” Jeremy lets us know that “we want to win and we’ll do what it takes.” Eric contributes this “pearl”: “It’s like getting in a girl’s pants, you lie, cheat, do whatever you can.” At least Jeremy was amused.

In the plane, they can’t even sit, keeping an eye on the doors to make sure the hippies are not making it. They laugh with Monica who feverishly dances in her seat, wishing the plane would leave. Their disappointment at seeing them boarding is quickly forgotten as they show their racing abilities by getting in first place. They easily keep it despite Jeremy’s trouble at finding the entrance to the tunnels. We had to hear them give one more shot at the hippies who for “Harvard and Stanford graduates, are reduced to manual labor.” The Frat Boys’ edit had been softened after the girls’ elimination. They are now getting the villain edit that we were prepared for by their atrocious behaviour in the first few legs.

MoJo weren’t in a good mood and it was quite a display! I had asked why they hadn’t been presented as the darlings of the race. They didn’t leave the editors much choice. No amount of softening, of hiding Monica’s blow-ups would have compensated for last night. The editors couldn’t hide their feelings towards the hippies as it permeated throughout the leg. Right at the start they hope the hippies are gone. “Those guys are screwed and I love it” said Joseph. The words they used at the start showed they had prepared for the leg: “only 5 teams left, the competition is brutal, we have to work together..slow down, take our time and we’ll be fine.” Monica emphasizes that “We cannot make any mistakes.” It would soon be evident that this gameplan would be forgotten in record time. The first indication came when Monica forgets her other competitors, fixating on the hippies, saying, “I’ll be happy when the hippies are gone.” They don’t give them money, which is OK in competition but being the target of a yield is also part of the race. For Monica however “it’s not the smartest thing in the world, saying you’re going to yield the MoJos.”

At the airport, they’ve already let their emotions surface: “I hate the hippies, they are lucky bastards” said Joseph on the plane. Monica would add throughout the episode, “I hate the hippies…they are followers…sleaze balls.” As if one enemy wasn’t enough, Monica distributes her shots and targets the Frat boys: “What is that stench? It’s the Frat Boys. Hey! You stink!” Their teamwork wasn’t much better, with Monica telling Joseph that he wasn’t paying attention and got them lost on the bike. Joseph yells at her to “stop bitching at me.” Joseph continues at the detour, telling Monica to “Stop freaking out, it’s insane, just get one.” A good decision to reserve a taxi got them in second place and their abilities kept them there. Monica still had to yell at him to remember to “read the clues carefully.”

Some early comments had foreshadowed this villain edit. I’m reminded of Joseph’s comment while holding the swordfish that he wanted to stab all the locals. One of the two villains isn’t making the final three. Because of the Frat Boys’ racing skills and the sudden revelation of MoJo’s bad temper, I expect Eric and Jeremy to move on.

RaYo had a much better leg even if the result was worse. Strange isn’t it? Heading off, Yolanda says, “As far as our arguing, we went from 0 to 120 kilometers in no time. We have not been communicating well at all. We have to calm down and try to bring back the fun energy we had in the first couple of legs.” It seemed they wanted to show that the fight had continued throughout the 24-hour pit stop. Did you think they wouldn’t be focused and would be eliminated? Editors love their tricks! That confessional was done at the same time as the one we saw last week. She was in the same place and was dressed the same way! They just cut it into two segments. That is another way to manipulate an edit.

As on the bus out of Rion, they didn’t share in the “hippy bashing”. They modestly contribute ten dollars to the stripped stragglers. Yolanda then comments, “the MoJos front like they are nice people, they aren’t nice at all.” The events would soon prove her right.

They again run a weak leg, quickly falling behind after the last bunching point and couldn’t even keep up to Fran and Barry on the bikes. It didn’t help that Ray rode in back with his knees almost hitting his elbows! At least they recognized their mistake, Yolanda saying, “We looked like bumbling idiots.” Once more Ray repeats what must be his motto: “We’ll catch up to the pack and beat them one by one.” I know I might seem to repeat myself also, but for editors to leave these sayings in regularly has to mean something! They acknowledge their opponents when Yolanda says, “Fran and Barry dusted us. They may look old but they’re Goooood!” Isn’t it a better sign to have that comment left in than Monica’s “We’re happy to see Fran and Barry because we know we can beat them.” They arrived at the detour in last place and Yolanda’s poor swimming abilities probably forced them to choose the longer detour. The last shot of them on the tandem going at full speed with Yolanda screaming: “Wooohooh” seemed to be a reminder they were still in it.

Their decisions early on forced Yolanda to do the roadblock but now that situation is evening out a little. Yolanda profited from Tyler’s help at the detour. That was quite a return on their $10 investment. Arriving at the mat, Yolanda has a big smile saying there is “nothing wrong with that” when Phil tells them they are fourth. She continues, “I’m happy, I had a good time today. I’m always happy when we have a good time.” Phil notices that they fell in love again. Yolanda answers by kissing Ray. The fun is back in their race. Contrary to MoJo, they followed their gameplan.

With all Ray’s winning quotes, Yolanda’s manipulated confessionals, the absence of worry in all of the legs where they were close to elimination and Phil’s constant positive comments add up to tell me the editors have laid the groundwork for us to appreciate their win when they come ahead of one of the two villain teams. Those should be Eric and Jeremy who by now appear extremely difficult to beat. Sure RaYo are the worst competitors left but the race isn’t about the strongest team winning. The editing analysis has very little to do with performance evaluation at this stage.

"RE: Episode #9"
Posted by Whole Lotta Rosie on 04-30-06 at 11:58 PM
Michel,

I just want to say what a great job you have been doing on this thread this season. I really hope that RAY win, if only I can somewhat share in your vindication. I haven’t posted the last couple of weeks due to time commitments and the excellent job you have been doing.

I have a couple things to add to the last few episodes. In hindsight both eliminations should have been filed into the What we should have known file. L&M story was built on their relationship. Both AG & I noticed a softening of their story prior to their elimination and we both noticed that their story was built on their ability to have this relationship even though that it appeared odd to the rest of us. Michelle’s post-race’s comments echoed this theme.

In regards to F&B, Michel made a quality comment in the voting thread last week regarding the first to worst placing. In hindsight this was a great comment. Considering their underdog status and their first place standing in the prior week episode this should have been considered the end to their story arc. I will also file that in TAR, numbers are not as significant as in Survivor. I, as others, was suckered into the 4th place comments.

On to more recent events.

E&J have done well in this race but my perception is that they are the most in trouble. Both the camel challenge two weeks ago and their inability at the prison this week were focused on heavily. Combined with their errant shortcut in the prior episode gives some cause. This is one of the more dominate teams in TAR history, but over the last two episodes a great deal of doubt has been implied in situations where doubt is not necessary. While a certain sense of vulnerability is nice for a winner, combined with an overall general negative edit leads me to believe that E&J do not win.

As a casual fan I don’t like MoJo, and as a student of the editing I don’t like MoJo. In both cases I would be disappointed if they won. In my limited memory the third place team tends to be portrayed as a villain. E&J could also take this spot.

We knew from the beginning that BJ&T would be around for awhile. I agree with Michael that we have seen enough vulnerability for them to win, but as Michel has stated many times, with tourists and competitors BJ&T seem to fit both groups. In the episode where L&M were eliminated BJ&T held, what I interpreted, a defeatist attitude. Their comments were, and I paraphrase, that “We had fun and we will be eliminated now”. They were not, of course, but that sentiment has carried with me.

R&Y are still perplexing. Their fight two episodes ago appeared to be resolved, or at least swept under the rug. Is this the end of their story? I guess I could make an argument that they are the next eliminated team. I don’t believe it. They could be a second place team with just enough moxy to fall short of the more positive winner, BJ&T. Ray has reiterated his “one by one quote” three times now. Yolanda also reiterated her “run fast’ quote during the “Olympic games” episode. I am guessing that Yolanda’s ability to “run fast" or not will be the key.

I am guessing the next episode will be a NEL so we should get another look at each of the teams before the next elimination. There are still many questions, and themes, yet to be answered.

"RE: Episode #9"
Posted by beau_30 on 05-02-06 at 10:54 AM
Right now Eric and Jeremy are tied with Rob and Amber for the most first place finishes in the race. Both of them have had 5 place finishes, but Romber fell short and lost it to Uchenna and Joyce.
Now with the way Eric and Jeremy are playing they will fall second into second place. Kris and Jon, Rob and Amber both played the game good, both of them had a good amount of 1st place finishes. So the story for them is to not win the million but to come in first to break a new record. So they will not win the million and fall to second, and possible even third, They will be in the final Three.

BJ and Tyler have been in a non-elmination leg. They showed they come back from the pack even with taking a risk. They may win it. They are showin having fun. And like people have stated in the first thread of the Editing that this race is about FUN. Of how fun the race is suppose to be. Theese guys are all about FUN! So if they win it, this season will be about they had fun, and it is the fun people that will win.

MOJO there to focused on getting rid of the hippies. This caused Lynn and Alex to be eliminated from the race by being to focused on Romber. If Mo is still keeps her focusing on beating the hippies it will cost them the million. If they get their head in the game they may win the million, but I have a feeling they will fall short to the hippies. And may be eliminated. Also how could she struggle in a non-elimination leg phil mugging. It will hurt her drastically. Joesph is playing the game, and now he is carrying Mo, so basically it flip flopped last episode. I have a feeling they will be either eliminated before the final three or make it to the top 2, but not win the million.

R.A.Y. im iffy about. They struggle alot to stay out of last place, but they have been beating people out one by one. The highest they have made is 3. I don't think they will win the million, unless its the story of the underdogs sort of like chip and kim back from season 5, once they hit the front of the pack, they held on to it and wasn't eliminated. So R.A.Y. is final three material, but will they make it to winning mat first, or will they fall victim is third.


Wow, DUDE! This race is far out!

"RE: Episode #9"
Posted by Earl Colby Pottinger on 05-03-06 at 01:57 AM
First, I am an anti-Rob TAR fan. But Rob lost due mostly to bad luck. He landed in what must be the only place in North America that is not packed with Survior fans, but also some-one misunderstood which/what 'King' he was asking for and went to the wrong location. Rob could have been more proactive but the mistakes came from outside his team.

Eric and Jeremy are a diffirent kettle of fish. Time and time again we see them make mistakes and they don't seem to learn from them. Look at thier last win, MoJo was right behind them because MoJo took a taxi. When Eric and Jeremy asked for directions they were so sure of themselves that they decided to walk rather than a cab to insure that they would win. Thier win was by seconds not the minutes it should have been.

I am sure that they are going to again make the same type of mistake to end up losing the million. We will see soon.

"Episode #10"
Posted by michel on 05-04-06 at 09:56 PM
LAST EDITED ON 05-04-06 AT 10:17 PM (EST)

The recap told us that MoJo didn’t help the hippies and that they hate them. Later they got lost on the bike. We also heard Eric and Jeremy tell us that “The hippies aren’t going to make it” on the plane. Phil reminded us of the tension-filled leg RaYo had in Oman but that they quickly recovered. The powerful image of Yolanda screaming joyfully as the tandem is going at full speed is shown once more.

Ray and Yolanda had their best episode. It started with Phil asking if after struggling at the back of the pack, could they fight their way out of last place? Yolanda says, “We’re enjoying this wonderful game. We are growing and learning…It takes time to understand” each other. Arriving before the Swan Bells tower opens, all teams bunch up and Jeremy says, “Ray and Yolanda are hanging out by themselves as usual. Ray is on a short leash.”

Ray had the good idea of reserving a taxi. They believed that MoJo cancelled them and shared the hippies’ comments about the dirty trick. They got to Darwin in a tie but once more arrived at Crocodylus Park last. Thinking of the crocodiles, Ray lets us know that “If the crocodiles eat Monica, they might choke, it’s like chewing on a plastic Barbie doll!” Yolanda jokes that “Black people aren’t stupid to get in a pool of crocodiles…or would they!!” Ray answers, “For a million dollars they do!” Another reference to the money by Ray if you’re keeping score at home. They arrived 4th at the roadblock but the yield gave them third place. Ray is now out of roadblocks but he has a great experience skydiving. Reading the Detour clue, they didn’t hesitate. Because of Yolanda’s inability to swim, they will do “DRY”. Yolanda lets us know that Ray’s musical skills will get them through it quickly.

After meeting the aborigine and receiving his instructions, Yolanda laughs for what might be the first time at the noise Ray made with the didgeridoo. The noise she made when she tried also caused laughter. They completed the detour in first place and were told to go to the pit stop. On the way, Yolanda is still laughing, “Ray doesn’t need a didgeridoo to make those noises.” Seeing MoJo arriving, they are determined not to mess up on the way in. They now have a map with all the tourist’s attractions and they know where they’re going.

Phil’s greeting as they arrived first at the mat seemed warmer than usual. He frowns at the Frat Boys, he jokes with he hippies, he showed surprise with Fran and Barry but he seemed happy to talk to this team. Ray starts with a “Wow”, jokes about the Mercedes having the steering wheel on the proper side. Phil tells him that he promises it will be ready for America. Ray comments that their navigation was perfect. Phil tells him it’s a great finish, that Ray looks happy and that is part of his appeal. Yolanda responds with a big smile and a hug, “That’s why I like him.”


Eric and Jeremy had a quick start. “Everyone is on edge…Mojo and the hippies…there’s animosity there. Our goal right now is final three” calmly analyses Eric at the start. They were first to Crocodylus Park. Before then they showed they could play dirty. After noticing that RaYo and the hippies had reserved taxis, Jeremy called one and then Eric cancelled the first two. He succeeded because the other teams didn’t use fake names. That got Joseph laughing. Later, when “Karma” got them back, they let Jo take the wrath of the two other teams. The bunching at the park pushed them in third place but the yield got them back up one spot. They arrived at the roadblock right behind the Hippies. Their trek trough the wild river had amazing visuals, especially when the camera is high behind them and they spot their rivals wading before the next bend in the stream.

They completed the task in less time than BJ and Tyler and got the proper directions first. They stayed ahead even after MoJo joined the pack to make it a three-car race. Once out of the car, they maintained that lead and finished second overall.


MoJo had a leg full of events. Joseph made sure we knew that they’re “going to beat these damn Hippies. It’s brutal and teams are getting mean towards each other” It felt as much as a reminder of that rivalry than foreshadowing the future events. Mo tells us, “We’re not vindictive outside of the race. It’s no holds barred” The comment she received from the locals after asking for a cheap place to stay was meant as a funny reply but it does also serve to show she can be naïve. What did she expect they would answer?

Starting off the next day, Jo laughs at the Frat Boys’ trick and defends their right when BJ and Tyler get in their cab. He lets us know that “the game is turning dirty now. They piss me off.” They regained their lead after the last bunching point and kept it until the Hippies outraced them to the yield. Monica fumes, “How did they get ahead of us? Those bastards! It’s not fair, we got here first.” During the wait, Jo tells her “You got to act grown up now.” She doesn’t want to be consoled, “Leave me alone.” Jo reasons, “The yield isn’t going to matter. The worse that’s going to happen is that we finish second.” She answers dejectedly, “Like always.” She goes on crying not wanting to hear the apology Tyler gives them after completing the task. The argument between teammates, which was becoming funny with Jo imitating Monica, goes on even after the time has elapsed!

Monica had fun jumping out of the plane, Jo could even “hear Monica screaming all the way up there.” In the car afterwards, 22 Km’s from the termite field that the other teams had completed, Monica says, “The other teams are 40 minutes ahead. This might be it for us. Using that yield is sleazy. The Hippies are sleaze balls.” Jo made the perfect call for the detour and they finished in second place. They had a nice surprise when they saw the two cars ahead of them and even if they wondered where RaYo were, they got ready for a “Mad foot race.” Once more, after episode #2, Monica tells Jo “I don’t know if I can beat the Hippies.” Jo told her “Yes you can, all you have to do is run as fast as you can.” She pulled it off. “You yielded us, and we still beat you” exulted Joseph in triumph. When Phil said, “I am pleased to tell you…” letting all three teams know the Hippies weren’t eliminated, the disappointment and the anger were clearly shown on both Jo and Monica’s face.

The Hippies are starting to accumulate the bad legs. After a better showing at Fremantle they cannot keep the lead they had forged for themselves. Tyler says that it is OK to tell MoJo they'd be yielding them, “We’re not trying to deceive any teams. We’re completely open and honest with them.” The repetition of the threat tells us differently. If before it appeared they were having fun pushing Barbie’s buttons to get her upset, now it has become personal. Tyler’s plan to let Jo know that Eric was flirting with Monica may not be a lie but he did it to create tension between the two teams he felt were aligned. They also had some dirty tricks in their arsenal.

The only fun they had in this leg was at the challenges. The skydiving was “Amazing, a great way to see Australia” for BJ. The termites were wonderful but “Don’t touch them, the termites will eat all the wood in your body!” The roadblock was fun only at the start. “The rush of adrenaline going to your head, that is first place.” The spiders and the difficulties of the trek quickly got to them. The Frat Boys almost caught them. On the road they lose the lead and follow, as Monica said they always do. Tyler doesn’t even bother to ask direction to BJ’s dismay. They were first at the start of the race, losing that lead is inexcusable.


The footrace:

Since it was crucial in the game, the footrace itself merits analysis. Eric and Jeremy are first out of the car and start sprinting. The Hippies, having followed up to the parking lot, now show strategy and drive closer to the path. They are out of the car second but have a small lead starting up the path. Jo and Monica are five yards behind the Frat Boys. Jeremy is the fastest runner and quickly passes BJ and Tyler and goes to the bridge. Eric also passes and heads for the rocks followed by Joseph, Tyler and BJ. Monica is about 20 yards behind at that point. Eric quickly changes directions and instead of jumping on the rocks, takes the bridge, Jo and Tyler follow him but BJ keeps going. He stumbles on the rocks and Monica beats him by crossing the bridge. The Hippies followed blindly both in the car and in the race. BJ’s inability to change course cost them in this leg. Monica refuses the handshake Tyler offered. At least Jo shook his hand.

Analysis of the teams:

RaYo have many good editing marks. They’ve only once had negative comments in the recaps. They have been shown to run a better race than the statistics show. They weren’t shown panicking when it looked bad. Ray has many winning quotes.They do have fun with the competition, the game as Yolanda said. And now Phil was shown spending more time than usual with them on the mat. I know he wouldn’t know at this point the outcome but he must chat with all the racers as time permits. There isn’t much to do besides talk (and dance!) while he waits. The editors decide what to keep afterwards. That it was RaYo’s pitstop they chose to present in more details is a good sign.

Thank you Rosie for the kind words. We do have similar views on these racers. Despite everything, a RaYo win would still bring surprise more than vindication! Trying to figure the story from the edit isn't exact science. As we approach the finale, it does seem that our first analysis had some accuracy. They could very well be our winners and their popularity should start moving up now (just look at Arnutz' thread in fanatics for an indication!).

In another thread, ArchitectureGirl wrote:
"MoJo's theme seems to be their "luck" and their struggles through each task - yet they always seem to overcome those struggles. See this is where I disagree Michel, I don’t think that they're going to gloss over the struggles of a team just to make them likeable. They certainly didn’t do it with Freddy and Kendra, or Flo and Zach. I still think MoJo could be the winners. I see them as struggling and overcoming constantly, and I find it interesting that their horrible luck that they profess to have - turned last episode and they got the taxi while Fran and Barry did not."

I had written that I don't see any reason for their edit to fit a winning story. AG’s comment made me go back to refresh my memory of Flo and Zach's last leg. From what I read, the editors certainly didn't do much if anything to make them look better. Add to that, their popularity results were dismal. So even if you do, I can't say that I disagree with you. We are simply reading different stories. The way I read it, winners usually have consistant edits. MoJo have had the wildest edit of any racers I remember, going from invisible, to strong, to complainers, back to invisible and then villains. If we were supposed to take their side in the argument with the hippies then BJ and Tyler would've told us about the yielding plans first to appear petty. Their performance in this leg was redemption however. The fan favorite Hippies appeared if not worse then at least as mean as MoJo. Redemption can mean the fall is close. It could mean they still have fight in them. I don’t see them winning but if your analysis and their “fans” are right, I would be impressed by their performance.

The race was fun to the Hippies but I felt there should’ve been more. Now even the fun is gone. The repetition of the threat to yield MoJo does make them look petty. The ratings haven’t been good but they could have been worse if not for them. They had been good for entertainement but if they are to fall, no need to help their image anymore. Now they may not be of any more use. There will be enough bunching points to let them come back in the race but edits don’t usually come back up once they’ve turned bad.

Eric and Jeremy have very few usefull quotes. They flirt, they use dirty tricks, they comment on others but rarely do we hear how they feel about the race and their excitement at being close to the million. “Our goal right now is the final three.” That had me pay attention as it sounded like how the race turns out for them. It may be one of those details but it would be too good to waste if they do lose in the final leg.

"RE: Episode #10"
Posted by mavs_fan on 05-04-06 at 11:00 PM
I thought all the teams except Ray & Yo recieved negative edits this week.

I've been skeptical of a Ray & Yo win since they typically seem to keep struggling near the back of the pack. And I'm a believer in the theory that you are what you are. If you typically find yourself at the back of the pack? You are one of the weaker teams. As noted elsewhere, Ray & Yo have spent a lot of time at the back.

The hippies were shown to be mean spirited in my opinion by suggesting there was someting going on between Monica and Fratboy1. Unless they are vindicated during the next episode with actual evidence that Monica & Fratboy1 have something going on - I don't think the hippies can win. Having said that, I think it's POSSIBLE the hippies will be vindicated - maybe that's the reason we were shown Fratboy2 hitting on Yoalanda when Ray was sky diving - to remind us that the Fratboys are horndogs.

But the marked difference in Ray/Yo's edit neutral/positive vs the other teams edits slightly negative/heavily negative has to weight heavily in Ray/Yo's favor at this stage.

"RE: Episode #10"
Posted by architecturegirl on 05-05-06 at 11:32 AM
Well Michel, I must admit that Ray and Yolanda certainly had the best edit of any of the teams this episode, and I am now convinced that they will be in the final three - although I pretty much always felt this, I just didnt see them winning. This episode convinced me that they could win - but I still just think that they are far too slow to win. They continually come out of tasks last after going in on an even footing. They were first this time, but only because the boys all failed to think about the fact that they wouldnt be hiking, or simply swimming a mile - they'd be crawling through water! Obviously a horrible choice. And even though Ray and Yolanda were WELL ahead of MoJo - MoJo caught up to them fairly well. Had MoJo not been yielded, they just may have beat Ray and Yolanda by a long shot.
In their favor though - they definitely were the only team shown to be above the fray - better than the pettiness and bickering of the other teams. This more than anything to me is in their favor towards their odds of being the winning team. I have always conceded that they got a much glossed over edit, so I will now admit that they could be our winners - but how they'll do that being the weakest team of the four, I'm not sure. Perhaps as Ray said, they've finally hit their stride after - well, almost the whole race! But great timing if thats the case!

Im beginning to think that my reactions to teams are different to other viewers, but for once I finally found the frat boys entertaining, and I didnt hate them this episode! I thought their cab-cancelling was evil, but very Rob M genius type. Yet I LOVED that karma came along and bit them right back! They were really the background team this episode though. Ray and Yolanda were important because they won the leg, but the main focus was the hippies/MoJo tension.

I stated a few weeks ago that I felt one of the male teams would go before the final three, and I stubbornly felt, and stuck with my feeling that it would be the frat boys. I am now revising that. With this past episode the editors so heightened and highlighted the hippies/MoJo clash that I think one of these teams absolutely has to leave next episode. That kind of tension is good telelvision for one or two episodes, but it will start to really turn viewers off if it goes on for too long. If both teams were to make it beyond the next episode, I dont think the feud would have been so glaringly highlighted, but rather just been a slowly continued buildup to the final. I still feel that MoJo is too good of a team, they always pull through to be the team that goes - not to mention yet again they've been shown as the mis-direction for the next episode.
Therefore, I think that BJ and Tyler are our next eliminations. For one, their edit has turned from fun and quirky to flat out annoying. My mother who is a regular viewer and doesnt pay attention to the boards is likely a good indicator. She loved BJ and Tyler at the beginning and commented after this past show that "they're really annoying me now. I dont want them to win any more." I think that the show got a lot of mileage out of them, but its their time. They've now had TWO benefitted from TWO non-elimination legs. That cant be edited out, but I dont see too many fans being satisfied with a team that benefitted from that winning. Personally I was up off my couch cheering that Monica beat them out.

Sorry if my train of thought is jumping all around - but I'm now on to the "theme" for this episode - karma. Without a doubt, that felt like what this episode was all about. Ray and Yolanda were above the fray (and the bad karma) and they finally won a leg! Eric and Jeremy played an evil trick (I really did get a kick out of it though), and karma came back to haunt them with exactly what were trying to dish out. Then with the hippies and their scheming against MoJo with the Yield and the flat out immature attempt to get Joseph jealous, well that came back to them at the mat by MoJo being the ones that beat them out for third.

Well, its lunch time I'll post more later today...

"RE: Episode #10"
Posted by CTgirl on 05-06-06 at 12:53 PM
Well here goes, my first post. I have been lurking over on VS’s Survivor editing column for a few years and have learned a lot about the editing (and manipulating!) process. I was happy to find that Michel had started a similar thread for the Amazing Race. I’ve enjoyed reading everyone’s observations even more this season since there have not been any betting spoilers around. So here goes, I’m going to take a page from VS’s book and address the numbers which Michel briefly mentioned in his post.

The first number thing that jumped out at me was when Joseph said, “In my mind, the worst we’re going to do is #2,” and Monica said “like always.” The comment was odd to me since they were held up at the yield, obviously in 4th place, and then ended up finishing the leg in 3rd place. Why was this included? Is this a prediction of what happens? I have considered MoJo as possible winners since the beginning. I do like them and find Mo’s complaining funny, because she turns it off as soon as she needs to do something else (like sky dive!). She has had great enthusiasm for the race and the experiences and has commented almost everyplace they’ve been how beautiful it is. I could see them ending up in 2nd place.

I’ve gone from finding the frat boys to be annoying and immature to having a grudging respect for them. They’ve raced well. But the kiss of death for them could have been their comment, “We’re just concentrating on making the Final Three.”

The last number reference was when Tyler commented at the beginning of the water hike, “Feel that rush of adrenaline go to your head, it’s 1st place.” That could have been ironic and might be the last time in this race that they are in first. The hippies have flipped with the frat boys – I respected them in the beginning with their obvious travel skills and now I find them annoying and almost juvenile. Starting the innuendo about Eric and Monica had a hint of desperation to it. Lastly, what was B.J. thinking not putting on shoes? They had to have known that it would be a race to the pit stop with the frat boys – who are runners. It will be interesting to find out if anyone takes pity on B.J. and his lack of pants and shoes. Have there been any other racers who have been victim of non-elimination twice? I don’t think they can come back from the brink again.

That leaves Ray and Yolanda. I had thought they were bad racers, maybe they are just slow racers. A theme could be like the tortoise and the hare: slow and steady wins the race. Ray’s comments throughout the season would back that up, as would the frats and hippies dominating the racing in the beginning. Having Yolanda do the rest of their detours might turn out to be a good thing. She’s a good athlete; maybe she is faster than he and makes the difference. R.A.Y. were portrayed in a different light this week. Instead of them saying they were having fun, they were shown having fun, and we saw some of Yolanda’s personality come through. Their edit has been the most consistent, albeit boring. After Wednesday’s show you could make a case for any of the three remaining teams to be the villain. Their edits have fluctuated – we’ve liked them, been annoyed by them and they’ve all been involved in some level of deceit. RA.Y have stayed above the bickering between the other 3 teams and not gotten distracted, as don mentions in his thread. I’m beginning to think that they are our winners. (Actually I’ve suspected for the past few weeks that they were the winners because the editors rarely pointed out their mistakes, but I haven’t wanted to/couldn’t believe it.)

"RE: Episode #10"
Posted by michel on 05-07-06 at 09:14 PM
Hello CTgirl and welcome to the boards. Very nice first post! I also lurked for a while in VS' thread before joining in the fun.
You bring up the question of numbers and it certainly would be a good ending if it were to turn out that way. In Survivor, VS always talks about those "pesky numbers" but without editing analysis from prior races, we don't have enough examples to see if it applies here. It isn't a numbers game and it didn't apply to Fran and Barry who wished to get to third place. It doesn't prevent it from happening to one or more of the remaining teams. It would then become something to keep in mind for future editing analysis. As you and AG note, Monica does show a lot of resilience and that in itself could be their story. Hope to read more of your views here and in the Survivor thread!

AG and Mavs_fan, I hope that RaYo prove me right because I'll have a lot of explaining to do if they lose! I could've presented the editing and remained neutral but I opted to take a stance, hoping to provoke a better discussion. I does make me nervous at times!

At this stage, the performance matters less in determining the outcome than it did at the start. Back then, a team that navigated well showed better potential than one who couldn't handle a manual transmission! Now, even if the teams aren't of equal ability, I'll look much more for hints that the story points to one in favor of the other. Colin and Christie were running ahead in their race but Chip and Kim won precisely because they were trailing. By the time they reserved their flight to the final city, the airline advised them of fog delays. They switched airlines while the other teams were sleeping and had an easy and a popular win.

"RE: Episode #10"
Posted by Serendipity on 05-08-06 at 02:10 AM
It's very late and I just watched the episode fully, but I'm with your mother, archiecture girl. I find myself snarling "just run to the mat like normal people and shut up" at my TV as the Hippies finish up.

Did I hear Ray & Yolanda's farewell speech tonight? Has their arc ended? They started out not knowing each other very well, had their differences, and have now learned to work together. Plus they got the use of a Benz for a year.

"RE: Episode #10"
Posted by beau_30 on 05-09-06 at 03:14 PM
Im still sticking with my theory of the Chip and Kim, Uchenna and Joyce wins, Both ended up in a Non-Elimination Leg before and came back and win it. All the hippies need to do is get into the final three. It would be a foot race to the mat and I think R.A.Y. will stay in the lead but I don't think they will win it, There Navigation skills or the final city bad luck may hurt them if they make it in the Final Three, Look what happend to Frank and Maragarita they were confident they would win , but they lost in their home city. I can't remeber the other team oh Tara and Wil. So if R.A.Y. final city is their hometown they may have the hometown curse. But I think they may make Final Three. Since there is one FAST foward LEFT.

Since their is one Fast Foward Left, Only Hippies, MoJo and R.A.Y. may take it since the Frats already used it. MoJo is probably seeing doing the fast foward with the vases. Or is that a detour, it may be a detour. But if the hippies use the FF they will get them into the final leg. Since it could be a Three way tie for the FF. But who ever takes it will be in the final three.

Right now im still confident that the Frats will not make final three. Mojo will end up second behind either R.A.Y. or hippies.
Hippies either get third or 1st, same with R.A.Y. but I do not think MOJO will end due villian pattern.

I can't talk much on the edit this episode, it was to close to tell, it was a race to the finish. then again this could be a foreshadowing of the Final Mat. ?

Wow, DUDE! This race is far out!

"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by michel on 05-11-06 at 07:48 PM
We’ve finally reached the final 3! The recap reminded us of the feud between the hippies and MoJo with the Frat Boys playing their trick with the cabs for which Jo got blamed. It seemed to set the stage for what was to unfold.

To be a little different, I’ll start with the eliminated team, the one with the edit that gave me the most difficulty. It was a tough leg for them. They missed the midnight bus that the first 2 teams caught, then they missed the 4:20 AM bus that the hippies boarded.
They were showed remaining calm even if they worried no other teams were around. They thought they were ahead!? RaYo’s mistake, going for the FF, got them back in the pack. They ran into trouble finding the Garden in Koh Kret and they felt forced to try the pottery detour. It was the scene of Monica’s final meltdown: “They’re all falling down…We don’t have enough left…I’ve left you down…I’ve embarrassed myself.” They had a nice exit and Jo grew somewhat in that last leg but couldn’t make the difference.
Their wild edit was telling me they wouldn’t make the final episode but their resilience left me unsure. They ran a good race and didn’t deserve this outcome after the great leg they ran to beat out the hippies last time. Could the let down they felt hearing the hippies were still around be responsible for their poor leg? They hadn’t shown too many problems getting from one point to another before.

The Hippies had an easy leg if somewhat stomach churning. They felt energized at the start. Tyler said “We lost our money and our stuff, it powers us up. We’ve proven we can bounce back and keep getting back into the front of the pack!” BJ added, “MoJo are too cocky for their own good. They have a date with not being in the race anymore.” It’s a strange way to phrase it but it proved right.
They wanted to use their time wisely and get money but the plane was filled before they made reservation. “Today, it seems last guys finish last.” However, they got lucky finding a last minute opening on another plane to Thailand even if it ran late. They “high-five” at their good luck, BJ saying, “We started with no shoes and no pants.” Tyler finished, “But with a lot of soul and a lot of heart.”
The location of the Fast Forward, right after a bunching point, was a gift, especially since the Frat Boys couldn’t take it. They weren’t sure they could complete it. “We’re in big trouble, it could be a big mistake” they said when the bowl of crickets seemed too large. They danced, they joked and did finish it. They made it to the Marble Temple “with cricket on your face!” They were “Cruising to the pit stop. We were last with no pants or shoes but we made it!” Phil acknowledged they ran a fantastic leg. Whereas early on, they were fan favorites, I’m guessing that quite a few viewers were happy to see a blue gnome! I’m reminded that early on we had heard teams mention the Hippies weren’t to be trusted and were always following others. Back then, we dismissed it since we hadn’t been given any evidence of bad behavior but first their arrogance showed up and the last legs have presented more of their flaws.

The Frat boys ran a very good leg and Jeremy finally scored! It was with a monkey but he seemed happy to receive the attention! It did give them the title quote again: “I think this monkey likes me.” They had told us, leaving Darwin, that “We want to have as much fun as possible, we try and compete. The other teams probably worry about us more than we worry about them.” Hearing that made me think that maybe they should worry about the others. It wasn’t in this leg but the race isn’t over!
Good planning, a good taxi driver and the midnight bus got them to the 3 Spire Pagoda just behind RaYo. Watching the monkeys, they had a strange remark: “It’s a good life style, they don’t have to work. If we win the million, we’re going to be monkeys!” Something else to take respect away from this team.
Despite some interference from the hungry primates, Jeremy knew Eric could prepare the feast quickly: “I’ve seen him prepare meals for monkeys very often and he’s good at it!” They maintained their lead over the other 2 teams, found the Buddha Garden and the detour quite easily. Even painting a Buddha they made jokes, “We’ve had gold leafing parties. We’ve gotten girls gold leafing …” They never let up! The final search for the taxi added drama but lets remember that we have no way of telling the intervals between teams at that point. They seemed to have ample time to meet Phil in second place. Even if they are hard to take sometimes, their edit has been very consistent. I think we would have been spared a few of their comments if they were to win. It would have left them some respect from part of the audience. But consistent edits are often signs of a winning one.

Ray and Yolanda found the first clue funny, left BJ a pair of purple pants and Ray said, “Now it’s down to four and one is going home. It’s game time.” Yolanda tells us she wants to “bring in our mental skills as well as our physical abilities. It’s the only way to win.”
They were ahead of the Frat Boys to Lopburi and the 3 Spire Pagoda but had to wait for the opening. They then made a mistake that could’ve been fatal. If the Fast forward had been a few miles further, they may not have recovered. They had MoJo beaten then, don’t take unecessary risks. Yolanda had a funny remark about the “after school favorite” thinking it was either playing football or cricket. It wasn’t the same kind of cricket!

They quickly changed their mind, wish the Hippies good luck and think that either BJ will have a hard time or MoJo hadn’t arrived yet. They were wrong but Yolanda finished the ceremonial feast for the monkeys in good time even if she said, “You cannot rush an artist.” Their fans must have been worried since they were last at the time. “You’ve made up a lot of ground” Ray congratulated her. They found the garden and the detour and they were “still in front of MoJo.” Yolanda once more narrated the events: After telling us that the hippies would have problems and would be throwing up, which the camera proved to be the case, she later said, “I hope the detour is something that pisses you off so you can’t complete it.” Again she was proven right with the sound of pots breaking.
Applying gold leafs to the Buddha, they showed the needed concentration to finish in third place and rushed to the pit stop. They were slowed down by local customs but Yolanda was happy with the nice shirt she was given. They were much happier when Phil confirmed their third place. More cheers greeted the gold gnome and we see that for them, the fun is in reaching your goal.
The editing has tried so hard to make this team a fan favorite that I still see them taking the big check. I know Arnutz’ thread has shown their steady rise, I’ll be curious to see their CBS ratings.

The teams had nice words to set up the final episode:

The Hippies: “Being in the final 3 is all about focusing on winning.” “Eric and Jeremy have had tremendous success, if we get ahead of them, we can get first place.” “There’s nothing stopping BJ and I from winning the Amazing Race.” It’s on, like Donkey Kong.”

The Frat Boys: “There’s a million bucks on the line and we want to win. We won’t be happy with anything else. We expect to win.” “We like to do our own thing and Ray and Yolanda like to do their own thing, whereas the hippies who just follow everybody.” "We’re ready to win. That’s what we want to do”

RaYo: “Ray is my pillar of strength, he’s my major source of motivation.” “We can be physical and we can be mental. When it comes down to the physical competition we’ll win the one on one battle” “With two other teams in the race, you’re in the thick of it. I don’t think it’s in the bag at all.” “Yolanda and I will win!”

Interpreting these quotes can go either way. The Hippies seem to neglect RaYo. The Frat Boys are aware of RaYo’s capabilities but put down the Hippies racing skills. Ray and Yolanda not only had positive comments, they also set up the showdown getting us ready for a close finish. Three strong competitors remain, they all seemed bunched during the task on the frozen lake. It could be close


"RE: The Racers, the Strategy and the Editing. Part 2"
Posted by CTgirl on 05-12-06 at 05:07 PM
Oh man, what a night for me – first Mojo gets eliminated and then Chris Daughtry on AI. (At least Lost was good!) My experiment with numbers didn’t really pan out. Michel,
you warned me that numbers don’t seem to mean as much in the editing process at they do in Survivor. We can still see where the hippies and the frats end up, but I don’t think their comments last week meant much to the end story. Michel, you were right that Mojo’s story was about their experience. I had forgotten that I had missed the episode where Monica had her breakdown over the fish, maybe I would have seen them as a weaker team and that her next breakdown would be their downfall.

I watched the episode again with an impartial view to the three finalists and tried to look for specific visuals of each team. To me all three edits were fairly even. Last week, I was full of opinions, this week I could see any of the three teams winning. There was genuine good will and positive camaraderie among them. They are all likeable and are all having fun. (I loved the side comments by BJ, Tyler and Ray during the cricket eating.) They all made snide asides, but they also helped or encouraged each other. I would still guess Ray and Yolanda win because I’ve never disliked them via their edit, but I wouldn’t be surprised and would be happy with any of the three winning.

You gotta give it to the hippies – what a comeback. I’m not as big a fan of BJ and Tyler as the general public, but they have certainly shown a lot of perseverance and joie de vivre! They stayed calm at the Darwin Airport, and commented, “It looks like today the nice guys finish last,” when they couldn’t get on the flight to Bangkok. On the airplane they commented they didn’t have much clothes, but they had “a lot of soul and a lot of heart.” They ended up in first.

Eric and Jeremy are not the same frat boys that started the race, but they are still goofy. Jeremy said, “If we win a million dollars, we’ll be monkeys,” and then they proceeded to play with the monkeys. Not as positive an image as the others, but it was still pretty funny and they weren’t as obnoxious as earlier in the race. They also donated sandals to BJ which I wouldn’t have expected them to do.

Ray and Yolanda had great visuals – they were shown laughing, discussing strategy and were much more relaxed. Ray was much more affectionate than we’ve seen before towards Yolanda. Yolanda even gave help to Mojo in the temple, “(the clue box is) deep in the back.” Their edit has taken a positive arc more so than the other two teams.

In the closing comments, E/J said that Rayo do their own thing, but that the hippies follow (how many times have they commented on the hippies following?). BJ and Tyler concentrated on the frat boys and didn’t mention Rayo. BJ said, “If we can get the advantage over Eric and Jeremy, we can win first place.” We shall see if Ray and Yolanda can slide into first!

"Post-season comments"
Posted by michel on 05-18-06 at 09:11 PM
Another season is over. I hope you enjoyed the finale! I first want to thank the numerous contributors who helped liven up the thread. It was also nice to have visitors drop by!

To go back to the question that motivated this thread, we wanted to know if analyzing editing patterns could reveal the long term players. We knew that the racers’ strategy needed to be kept in mind and certainly this year, the two strongest teams were well above the others, even if the hippies got into a stretch of poor performances. We also found out, the hard way in my case (!), that editors can manipulate a team’s edit to make them look much better than they are, even if they finish only in third place . The final order escaped me, but which teams reached the final destination wasn’t a surprise.

What can we take for next season? First, that every season is edited differently with a different theme and a different story to tell. There are some keys to story-telling that should be kept in mind as a way to see the shape the story is taking after a few episodes.

1) Teams that tell us their game plan or talk about their attitude at the beginning of a leg but don’t come through during the leg won’t last long:
- Wanda and Desiree told us they had no more self-doubts at the start of leg 2 then proceeded to question themselves for 3 episodes before exiting.
- Lake and Michelle swore they wouldn’t make anymore mistakes!
- Monica told us she was strong mentally and then she kept falling apart.
- Fran and Barry said they learned from their mistakes yet repeated them.


2) Teams on a journey or with something to prove aren’t winners:
- Wanda and Desiree wanting to prove they could do it.
- The Nerds were in their own little world and wanted to prove they could make it on their own. They first found out they were doing fine on their own and then it all fell apart.
- Ray and Yolanda wanted to prove they could work together. I know, I should have paid more attention to this one!

3) Teams with a story that isn’t about winning, exit once the story is resolved:
-Fran and Barry were shown to be persevering against stronger, younger teams. Once they were seen by others as a team to contend with, they were ready for the end. Yolanda was the one to tell us on the tandem, “They are old, but they are gooood!”
-MoJo had a story of resilience and once they beat the dreaded Hippies to the mat, they had accomplished their role in the story. You might say that the Hippies also had resilience, escaping two non-elimination legs and barely beating Lake and Michelle in another. That is true, but resilience wasn’t the Hippies’ story. It was MoJo’s because she told us she should be seen as smarter and stronger than she appeared.

4) Teams that are repeatedly shown in a negative light WHEN IT COULD BE AVOIDED aren’t winners:
-Many of the Frat Boys’ behaviour could’ve been left off the screen.
-Joseph’s cursing and threatening the locals was meant to show his temper.
When the conflict appeared between MoJo and the Hippies, something that had to be shown, the stage was set. The eventual winners weren’t the only ones to blame.
-Lake and Michelle were difficult to show in a good light but the emphasis on their fights was a sure sign they wouldn’t last.

5) Teams shown as Tourists aren’t winners:
We had quite a few of these this year, from John and Scott, the Glamazons, the double D’s, Wanda and Desiree to Fran and Barry. Even the Frat Boys lacked focus at the start but did recover. Could someone win with the portrayal they were given at first? Maybe, but lets hope, next time, we have sufficiently strong teams that a team lacking focus cannot finish that well!

What about positives? The Hippies was a team that was widely commented upon, mainly positively, for their speed, their intelligence and their abilitties. Those comments came from Fran and Barry, The Frat Boys and Ray and Yolanda mainly. Most negative comments came from one source, MoJo, even if the Frats also had negatives to say. It wasn’t enough to convince me they would win but if you add it to the fact that they fitted best the theme of “The Race is Fun” and we knew they had a chance. Their over the top edit at the start which seemed one-dimensional, was changed into a more complete characterization when doubts and conflicts set in. We had noticed the race was first seen through their eyes so we could share their fun. Along with the Frat Boys, they were the favorites to win. We spend a lot of time looking for an underdog!

Speaking of fun, the scene of the race in the swan boats was hilarious! The search for the Lake Yamanaka sign was also more fun in the roller-coaster than climbing on top of a building.

The quotes that seemed so promising for Ray and Yolanda had me confused. I put too much importance on them. It is something to remember, it could help us see the teams going far but not necessarily who will win. The confidance and the positive attitudes the hippies always demonstrated were more important in a race were “FUN” is the key.

I hope you enjoyed the thread and that we can do this again in the fall!


"Congrats, Michel"
Posted by Peetah on 05-19-06 at 11:50 AM
You have won the prize for the best thread of the season!

Thanks for all your awesome insights!!

"RE: Post-season comments"
Posted by CTgirl on 05-20-06 at 01:03 PM
You summed up the seaon well! The closing comments from last week pretty much predicted what would happen in the finale. It was right there in front of us! (20-20 hindsight is a wonderful thing.) The entire race was the competition between the hippies and the frats and the closing comments spelled it out the week before. BJ said, “If we can get the advantage over Eric and Jeremy, we can win first place.” The ad Sunday night also hinted what would happen – the fan favorite “fun-loving hippies” were portrayed in a positive light; “the flirty frat boys” were seen hitting on a Japanese woman and “the battling daters” were shown quite poorly (it was interesting how they manipulated an image of Yolanda being cold and irritated with a quip by Ray to form an argument). The ad sent up a red flag to me because the ad didn’t fit what we’ve been thinking about the editing. But I still didn’t change my mind until I started watching the finale. The Hippies had been shown in such a poor light for a few episodes, I was surprised they won. Although it was nice that brains won out over brawn!

Thanks Michel for heading up this thread. It’s been fun reading it. Have a great summer everyone.

"RE: Post-season comments"
Posted by architecturegirl on 05-22-06 at 11:10 AM
Well Michel, looks like we were both off a bit with our winner picks, but I've enjoyed the thread this season. I'm sure the experience this season will be helpful to reflect upon next season and we'll be able to see if each season has its own editing approach or if its a general editing for all seasons.
I havent posted until now because, well I was really disappointed in the outcome. I lost some of the wind in my sails with MoJo eliminated, and then I really was disappointed when the hippies won. Ah well, we cant always get what we want.

I wish this season hadnt come down to two dominant teams, but that is what we were shown all along. Perhaps we take from that, that in your face and obvious isnt always mis-direction, it just might be that obvious. I had thought we'd see one of the teams fall apart and out of the race - and instead we saw them fall apart, get saved my multiple non-elimination legs, and then come back to win! So I was right with part of that, but way off with regard to the hippies winning...

It does appear that all of the positive editing and glossing over for RaYo was to show them as worthy of the final three, not a winners edit as we had speculated. Interestingly, perhaps we werent hidden as much of their inability as we thought though - because we did pick up on it, and it was unavoidably obvious in the finale. So perhaps they glossed over enough to make them a worthy final three team, but didnt quite hide what their downfall was so we would be satisfied with where they came in.

The frat boys had a decided upturn in their edit toward the end, and I really thought this was positive for them, but in the end they came in second. Although, did anyone else notice their comment during the final episode where they mentioned somethign about not taking second lightly? I noted it because of the way it was worded (which escapes me now), but it made me think that they would come in second, which they did.

The hippies. Well, blah. I guess all the comments about giving the general public a fan favorite win were right - but I was just thoroughly un-inspired when they were running to the mat. They got such a downturn in their edit at the end that I cant think I was alone in that. They did win, so they are deserving, but I was pretty disappointed that a team that escaped elimination twice ended up winning. Seems more lucky than deserving to me.

Ah well, looking forward to another season - on Sunday nights! Yet another time slot change, but I think this will actually be a very good slot, and could help the ratings - then maybe we wont have to wonder if the editing is being manipulated due to ratings? Hope so, but I guess a lot of that will depend on who the actual winner is for the next one...cant wait to analyze that and see if we gained any insight from analyzing this season. I had a lot of fun here guys, thanks for all the great input we've had - makes it that much more interesting to see all the different viewpoints and opinions.

'Til next season!