All very good ones thus far..especially like JustBNme's "life has never been so real" comment.

How about when they showed XXXtina only hearing part of Jill and Lisa1's converstion where Jill says "she's just a prostitute" (or whatever term she used) Then much later they show the whole thing which reveals Jill was saying something like "Oh Lisa you're just thinking she's just a prostitute."

TJ's kitchen fight with Jill where she says "Oh ya well Lisa still thinks you're lazy" They never did show us the entire conversation there and I believe there was alot more to it.

The teaser spoilers that can make you feel like a jacka$$ if you get sucked in.

LMDD, you just highlighted #28

#28 - "The teaser spoilers that can make you feel like a jacka$$ if you get sucked in."

Yes and thankfully I'm not fooled by them so easily anymore, largely due to the great minds of this board.

I agree, I think that a huge fight ensued, and they didn't show it. I'm getting a little tired of the "huggie huggie" show, and I think I might be ready for some truth. Six months ago, I would have told you I was ready to go myself!

#29: Mr. Internet...anything and everything glorifying Lisa's obsession with her imaginary love connection.

Allison's web site asking for money!!!!!!!!!!!!

#30 - Not giving us women we can cheer on instead of gripe about. It's sad that, for example, as Allison, then Lisa 1 approach graduation (or whatever), we were fed up with them and their antics instead of being able to feel happy and satisfied that they actually achieved concrete goals.

IMO, Jessica and TJ were acceptable in most eyes, Jess did do her grieveing, and TJ was miraculously okay at the end. Jill has been up and down due to the edited pieces were were given. Maybe we can have some joy with Kim, Christie and Jodi...yet to be seen however.

#31 Out with the old..in with the new!? They've cheated us out of new houseguest by keeping the old long after they've fizzled out..oops I mean met their goals hehe. (Jill) OR failed miserably (Lisa1)

#32 They've allowed alcohol to join the house, now even vodka..to promote ratings/drama

#33.The breakin
#34.The sex lies & videotape
#35.The LC's bs
JMO

the show is trying to color us all stupid...are we to believe our eyes or what they say we should believe?

>#30 - Not giving us women
>we can cheer on instead
>of gripe about.

Great point Oklablue. You have to wonder if they are going for a common denominator thing, for audience, but they don't seem to have a big audience anymore.

But yes - so much could be explored with people really trying to improve their lives. Why can't someone's goal in the house be 'how to be a huge success'!! Now that would be fascinating.

#36 Passing xxxtina off as 'honorable'
#37 Introducing Karin to the viewers as 'honorable'
#38 The mishandling of Christie's alcoholism/addictions
#39 Expecting the viewers to buy the whole 'grieving privately despite public tragedy' when Jessica was a media whore and had a reporter live with them.

>
>13. IV’s article from last year
>that bashed our forum and
>us as “having nothing better
>to do”
>

Wow, I would love to read that. She specifically named this site?

LAST EDITED ON 02-06-06 AT 07:01 PM (EST)

>>
>>13. IV’s article from last year
>>that bashed our forum and
>>us as “having nothing better
>>to do”
>>
>
>
>Wow, I would love to read
>that. She specifically named this
>site?
>
Here is the article and the link to it.....

Producer Millee Taggart-Ratcliffe and a director discuss a scene
in the control room
Later, Iylana Vanzant, the other new addition to the coaching team, entered and Dr. Katz allowed her to take his seat. I introduced myself and explained I was a big fan of the show myself and working on a Reality TV World story for Starting Over's online fans, after which Vanzant immediately added “...who have nothing better to do.” When I asked her to explain her comment, Vanzant justified her frustration with online viewers by claiming the same old argument about the inherent inaccuracy in reality TV: any viewer unhappy with her is biased, as they are only seeing an edited version of the entire story. While I had not mentioned any unhappiness with her role in the show - in fact I, like the rest of America, haven’t even seen the new season yet, making any such unhappiness impossible - I decided that it would be best if I moved on to the topic of her contributions to the team. As the self-described “Aha coach”, Vanzant believes that she is the one who detects the “underlying cause” of a woman’s problem. After declining to answer some of my remaining questions, she handed me off to another P.A., who led me to the control room.

http://www.realitytvworld.com/news/reality-tv-world-goes-behind-scenes-of-starting-over-new-los-angeles-home-2897.php

IV comment on us having nothing better to do. Oh if we love her, we are enlightened. But because we are tired of the farce that this show has become, we have nothing better to do. Oh I get it. Unless you kiss her butt, we stink.

This show is nothing more than a soap opera now. It's sad because the first season was so damn good. Personally inspiring to me. I started watching it when I was about to have my first child. So much change going on in life. I felt so connected to what those women were trying to do.

I can't relate to this show now at all. It's hard to relate to women that don't work, camera hogs, drama queens and liars. This season expection for actually getting it being TJ.

I saw most of the seasons in the summer reruns on my off times and this is the first one I've ever watched in "real time" so perhaps that skews the process a bit. However I will say IV as anyone can discount critism she doesn't want to hear although she is always yelling at her clients for doing just that.

However, what made me get interested in the show during a school break during Season 1 was Rain's "real" story of trying to figure out how to get out of a pattern. I appreciated seeing them not just give Cassie a college education but having her be part of the process of working to get it. They've moved away from guests who have Starting Over goals as in I've hit a point in my life and I have a goal to do this.... I think many of these woman don't know what they want and don't have any idea about how to get there and others come in so wounded that they need a therapy house which SO really isn't.

If they go on to a Season 4 I really do hope they will return to evaluate what the purpose of SO really is. It isn't a rehab house, a therapy house, a place to find your spiritual center not that there is anything wrong with a need to find those things but they aren't best done on TV. However, it is a great place to learn strategies and skills that can be taught and not just to the HG but to the viewers.

If IV can't understand that perhaps she should go cry on the Universe's shoulder, it's proven to be such an effective tool for helping her clients.

I thought it was insulting after Jill's "trial" when Iyanla was talking about Della Reece (the judge) sentencing Jill to stay in the house and accomplish a few more things before graduating. Iyanla acted as if Della really made up the sentence and not Iyanla.

#40(I hope this is the right number) Having a funeral for Allison's BREASTS!!!(and other things) That was my true turning point!!!What a stupid f@@king show!!!

#41. Unrealistic occupations for SO grads.(I am waiting for NASA to come pick an astronaut) They should send them all to Chucky Cheese Academy so they can at least work in a pizzeria when they leave. Nothing wrong with blue collar.

____________________________________________________________________________

I'd rather be at Disneyworld

42. Nyanza graduates

43. Colorado Kimmy graduates (with her Louis Vuitton purse in tow)

44. Spends months villifying the adoptive mom of Cassie's birth child. This woman NEVER signed on to have her life examined on a TV show NOR her son's life. To me this was the most disgusting thing. We may want to know about her life, but we really don't have the right to judge her because she had alot of people speaking for her who all had their own agenda......

Thinking viewers can't put two and two together.

Jill's letter to Dad is dated Oct 18, and we view it on Feb 8.

(No wonder she looks like she hasn't lost much weight!)

Ahhhh In on a little secret TV time is not the same as Real time!!

But I agree with a lot of your comments and even if I am angry at some of the things that insult me as a viewer and as a TV Producer (yes sometimes we do read these forums) we are all fans of the show. Why? There is something that keeps us glued to that SO hour. I think that it is the powerful energy we feel in knowing that we are not as bad as we thought we were, or just the ability to have something to talk about after the show is over...

My one contribution to the list....

41 (I hope this is the right number) The way that all of the sudden the women become "experts" and start coaching each other.

42. The way we all pretended we understood TJ's mumbling....

I disagree with #42 that would be our problem NOT SOs. On a sidenote I loved TJ and should probably come up with a # or two about how they wrongfully treated her. She is the only one who IMO truly made great strides.

If anything I think #42 should be how the editing made her seem to be backsliding (in the end) when really she was just dealing with an issue very important to her (alcohol in the house) After all the progress she had made they (tried to) make her look a fool and I think it looked worse than it really was! JMO

Are we at #43 yet...how they put under Jill's name "losing weight and eliminating chaos" of which I've seen neither...and how about #44...Iyanla giving weight loss advice when she could stand to lose a few herself.

#45 Regarding timing. We now know from two days ago that Jill's letter to her dad was dated Oct 18. Today when they showed the outdoor shots with Kelly's arrival and Lisa 1's departure, you see roses in full bloom, and Jill saying it's nippy outside. That also lends itself to mid to late October. We know everyone was gone by Jan. 9 or so. Why do they bother to try to mask the timing when it's so obviously a taped and edited show?

#46 Jill's Journal entries. On Feb 3, she posted in "real time" looking for a job. Now, on Feb 10, back to "tv time" and talking about the current show again. SO must still control the websites, at least for some time. Maybe Jill had special permission to go to "real time" for that one request, since finding a job is part of her requirements. ???

#46 The assuption that some of us viewer's like seeing conflict amongst the women instead of cooperation & support.

#47 With all the manipulative editing & scripted scenarios, the assumption that some of us will continue to watch the show.

#48 That the real "reality" may be that this show doesn't really
care about women. It just likes to give the appearance that it does, and they're not even doing a good job at that IMO.

Can I ask you a question? If you obviously don't like the show, WHY DO YOU WATCH IT???? Your love of criticism?

>Can I ask you a question?
> If you obviously don't
>like the show, WHY DO
>YOU WATCH IT???? Your
>love of criticism?

We watch because the show used to be good... and now we are all addicted to eachother on these very intelligent boards.

LOL Shazbot. AND this is a privately owned "bash" forum not connected with the show at all.

Why do people watch train wrecks, hurricanes, and other unbelieveable works in progress?

Hmmmm how does SO insult the viewers and why do I still watch? I agree this board is an awesome bonus to watching this show, I love the fact that I have this place to blame for my addiction to this show. It's nice to know that we can voice our feelings (someone has to listen) and still get along.

Back to subject the biggest way I believe they insult the viewers is by presuming that they already had US hooked and that we would still tune in despite the obvious fact that they've taken an unethical turn. What P!SSES me off is they were right..so far..as far as I go..and I think many others by the peops I've met along the way..

Criticizing the show and its participants is permitted here. What is not allowed, however, is criticizing posters for expressing their opinions.

If you're only interested in reading positive comments about SO, then this is probably not the site for you. There is a thread on the General Discussion forum that includes links to other sites that you may wish to check out.

Bebo didn't remove your post. I did. I removed it because it was inappropriate, and was alerted by a number of posters who also saw it as inappropriate.

Saying you are sad because you are not allowed to bash other posters here is not suggestive of your willingness to abide by the guidelines, which I doubt that you have read.

I didn't remove Bebo's post, because you deserved it.

And, I'll be removing this response as being inappropriate, also.

If you wish to get back to the SO posts, I suggest you do so instead of spending your time questioning moderator decisions.

I also seriously suggest you follow Bebo's suggestions to look at the link thread to find another posting site. You are rapidly wearing out your welcome here.

A Syren Spring