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"Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-20-10 at 08:11 PM
I didn't think HGs could react any more ridiculous when nominated, but this week's nominees sunk to lower depths. I'm trying to determine what's more pathetic?...Ragan reacting like a weepy 5-year old girl crying at her first day of school, or Lane reacting by wanting to go to a bar and find a pretty girl so he can beat up her BF??? WHERE DO THEY FIND THESE PEOPLE???!!!

On a sidenote...what's with the Chenbot from last night? Did she rob Cleopatra's Tomb or what? The only person I can think of who wears more necklaces is Mr. T!

MATT - Very clever using the DPOV, he earned by not quitting in his last HOH victory, to smoke out information about other HGs. He chose a replacement that would not create turmoil or enemies in the House. But his smartest move was mentioning the pretzel message which served as a sutle statement to Kathy as if to say, "Hey, I wish you came to ME first with the info" thus still possibly salvaging her potential vote. Based on Kathy's exit interview with Julie it may have worked.
It shouldn't be a surprise that the alpha males would gang up on genius boy when the Brigade has to eat its own. So whereas others may perceive it as "snakelike," it's not a bad idea for Matt to be friendly with the other side of the House as a contingency plan. Whether it will work for him in the end--time will tell. But for right now it's called proactive play and I reward proactive play. That's why I rank him high.

ENZO - Doing a good job covering all his bases and is well-liked by all. He gets props for getting on Brendon's good side without brownnosing him. Also the only remaining HG to not be nominated. Could make a case for top ranking this week, but couldn't do it after running "neck and neck" with Kathy. I feel confident he's not throwing competitions; he's just that bad.

BRITNEY - She started off low with her Wednesday night preview statement, "Everyone's gonna kiss Brendon's A$$ now, Smooch, Smooch, Smooch." HMMMM, and who was kissing who's butt a couple weeks ago? Who acted the most excited in Rachel's HOH room? It was Britney..."Smooch, Smooch, Smooch." Who was having a fake orgasm holding up Rachel's Spice Girls CD? It was Britney..."Smooch, Smooch, Smooch." But naturally when YOU do it, it's strategic gameplay and when someone else does it, it's A$$ kissing.
Earlier this week Enzo predicted Britney would be favored in any competition pertaining to BB and HG questions. And true to Enzo's prediction, Britney wins HOH. Actually it's a perfect time to get HOH. As long as Brendon does not win POV, she should come out of this week with no enemies. In S9, Chris was the only male player in the F7 and emerged victorious. So even though her road will be tough as the only remaining female, it's not an impossible task. Lastly, if she continues to do her hair like she did on Eviction Night, I'll have no choice but to rank her #1. She looked SMOOOOOKIN!!!

RAGAN - His clutch POV victory put 20K in his bank account. That being said, at least you can NOW say he "earned" his Saboteur compensation (even though his win was against four dofuses and Kathy.) Whereas (according to Ragan) "keeping quiet isn't worth 500K," it potentially could cost him two jury votes; but it did provide the most entertaining catfight we've seen on BB in a while. Would like to rank him higher, but had to drop him because of the way he carried on during his and Matt's nominations. Also his orgasmic celebration in the Have-Not room extolling Matt remaining in the game was hard to watch.

HAYDEN - Can't fault him for making F2 plans, but why would you choose to sit next to the most likable guy in the House (Enzo)? You can talk all you want about "cutting the head off the snake," but it's a lame excuse to mask the REAL reason you want Matt out. A man as large in stature as Hayden is afraid of a five-foot nothing, 100 and nothing pound "runt" who proceeds to beat the snot out of him in competitions and has other HGs on his side (other than the Brigade) because he's playing a more proactive game. Rather sad I must say.

LANE - Raisin Bran??? Forrest Gump made more sense with his "peas and carrots" metaphor...but then again, Forrest Gump probably had a higher IQ then Lane. Although it would be a travesty if Lane makes the Finals, it would be a riot listening to him try to answer the Jurors questions.

BREN-DUM - At the Nomination Ceremony he wants to keep "fighters" in the House. So Matt's his replacement nominee??? Matt's "fight" was second to no one not once, but TWICE in two endurance contests winning two HOHs. Simply put, Brendon is a plastic man/boy who will do whatever plastic boobies wants him to.
Only one good thing I can say about "the Big Dummy." He'd be an absolute dream to sit next to in the Finals. Not sure if any HG is thinking that, but even if they are, would it be worth one more month of listening to how he worships his Skanky Ho like a Sacred Shrine? I dunno, if it were me I'd be looking for another goat.

GONZO

KATHY - Pretty amazing stuff to witness Kathy predicting her own outcome in the POV competition. She does well in one round in one competition and she turns into "The Babe" calling her shot? LOL Well no way you could have called your eviction, but at least she exited with class. If she wants to believe she was evicted because of her integrity and her age, then good for her. But the truth be told, she was a casting debacle. At least I think she'll be a breath of fresh air from the sore-losing, sour-grape bellyachers who have become sad staples on Juries in Reality Shows.

CAMEO

RACHEL - Not a bad 24-hour twist idea bringing Rachel back even though her behavior was despicable. If anything it should make HGs think twice before they record their nasty goodbye messages. I thought there couldn't be a more disturbing combination than Eggplant and Escargot. But I was wrong--a closeup of Rachel's face and HDTV is worse. A fact noted by Ragan during one of their catfights focusing on Rachel's complexion...talk about taking one on the CHIN! HaHaHa...my favorite moment of the week!

Table of contents
Messages in this discussion
"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Belle Book on 08-21-10 at 12:17 PM
Here are my rankings:

1. Matt -- smart moves all the way around, first in using the Diamond Power of Veto, and then in getting rid of Kathy. Any other person would've gotten you into trouble. Well done.

2. Ragan -- nice job in winning the Power of Veto and in giving Rachel what she deserved! I salute you!

3. Britney -- you've come quite a ways from the young woman I disliked in early weeks! I commend you for that.

4. Enzo -- it's a smart move to try to get rid of Matt. Too bad it didn't quite work out.

5. Hayden -- you've got glimmers of strategy but I don't think you're as strategic as Enzo, let alone Matt.

6. Lane -- down this far only because you're not strategic. I still like you, however.

Gap --

7. Brendon -- I would put you higher than Lane for your decent nomination strategy. Unfortunately, you're still hung up on Rachel, and that hurt you in my eyes.

Gonzo: Kathy. You had no real strategy and no real alliances. That's why you're gone.

Cameo: Rachel. Why, oh why did we have to see her again? At least Ragan put her in her place.


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-21-10 at 01:36 PM
Nice Rankings!

You flip-flop Ragan and Enzo and we're carbon copies. LOL

Well done and thanks for contributing each week.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-21-10 at 02:20 PM
You certainly won't get a carbon copy from me!

1- Enzo: He truly is the best player this season, making a side-deal with Brendon and Hayden, keeping an eye on Lane and Matt's side deals with Britney and Ragan respectively. Now comes the hard part when the players will notice that he has never been put up and may see him as the threat he always has been.

2- Britney: She's still the one that makes me laugh the most but she hasn't realized yet how tenuous her position really is. She'd need to separate Lane and Enzo but I don't think she can. It was a little early to win HOH but not if Brendon wins POV because she'd probably have been nominated by Enzo then. I'll be very interested to see how she handles her duties, especially if Brendon wins POV.

3- Hayden: Suddenly, everyone is forgetting about this athletic guy who has shown he can be smart at times. Like Enzo, he needs to cut the side-alliance deals made by the other members of the Brigade.

4- Lane: This guy has really grown on me. Despite his joke, he took his nomination in stride even when he wound up against Matt. Funny seeing how nicely he tried to comb his hair in case he'd meet Julie!!!!

5- Matt: He realized Enzo was telling him that he was going to vote him out but still wanted his jury vote but I don't think Matt realized that he told Enzo that he didn't trust him. He hasn't convinced me he can pull off his big plan. To me, he still looks more like Russell than Todd.

6- Ragan: I missed his scene with Rachel but, from the recap, he looked really immature not to mention how dumb it is to insult a juror. His cry-babyitis scene in the Have-not room was pathetic. Good job on the sabotage though.

7- Brendon: I'd like to rate him higher just to irk Aruba but he doesn't give me much to go on. If he can get it to work with Enzo and Hayden, I'll be laughing because, no matter how dumb he is, he isn't a bad guy.

Evicted: Kathy: No bags, no messages, no bitterness and no memories. It won't be hard to forget her.


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-21-10 at 03:11 PM

>2- Britney: ...I'll be very interested to see how she handles her duties, especially if Brendon wins POV.

I think it would be a very easy decision for her. If Brendon wins POV, she can't be thinking of anyone other than Hayden. She definitely will not put up Lane or Ragan. And if she puts up Matt, then she'll have to deal with Ragan crying on her A$$ for the rest of the week. That only leaves Hayden.

This seems nuts but Brendon winning POV (coupled with Brendon NOT winning the next HOH) would be the best case scenario for Britney. If both occur I think she's definitely in the F4 with a good chance of winning.


>6- Ragan: I missed his scene with Rachel but...

WHAT!!!!!!! SAY IT AIN'T SO!!!!! That sucks.

One of the many pieces of advice my father gave me is: Never argue with a moron because A) they'll bring you down to THEIR level, and when they do, then B) they'll beat you with THEIR experience.
So I know where you're coming from with your criticism on Ragan, but since you missed the scene allow me to fill you in. Rachel went on a gay-bashing spree and even went so far to say something to the effect that Ragan doesn't current have a boyfriend because he's even a failure at being a Homosexual...don't know if I got the words exact but it's pretty close.

Now I can sling the slop with the best of them and anyone who reads my post is privy to my sarcastic wit, but even by MY standards that would qualify as "crossing the line." Even despite good 'ole Dad's advice, in this case I really can't blame Ragan for fighting back.



"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-21-10 at 05:36 PM
Wednesday, I went to see a tennis match where Kim Clijsters showed the difference between a player who would simply like to win and a champ who hates to lose. Her determination turned a quick two-set defeat into a 3 set victory. Missing BB didn't matter.

Listen to your father; no matter what Rachel said, it would have been smarter to tune her out. Not as much fun but smarter. At most, Ragan needed to say that what she thinks is meaningless.

Nice thoughts about Britney's decision; let's get back to it when the nominations are in and the POV is played. I'm also interested in hearing Lane's suggestions for nominations and replacement if needed.


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-22-10 at 09:12 AM

>I'm also interested in hearing Lane's suggestions for nominations and replacement if needed.

If Enzo wins POV, anyone's suggestion for a replacement would be a mute point because Brendon is out the door. If Brendon wins POV, Lane should do what Lane does best--play dumb and keep his mouth shut. Knowing there's no way Britney would put HIM up and feeling pretty sure she won't put up Ragan, the Brigade will be officially broken up regardeless of who Britney chooses. Even if Lane is dumb enough to want to put in his two cents, he'd have to navigate around Ragan and Matt who will be working on Britney 24/7 to put up Hayden. But it goes without saying Lane would much rather see Ragan or Matt as the replacement nominee over Hayden.
"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by LFJ on 08-22-10 at 09:22 AM
"Even if Lane is dumb enough to want to put in his two cents, he'd have to navigate around Ragan and Matt who will be working on Britney 24/7 to put up Hayden. But it goes without saying Lane would much rather see Ragan or Matt as the replacement nominee over Hayden."

Getting rid of Matt would be the best possible move. It's her chance to get a strong player out AND secure votes on the jury.
(IMHO, that is)

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-22-10 at 09:52 AM
Putting up Matt would severly fracture her relationship with Ragan. Assuming Matt would be a Brendon replacement, if Brendon wins HOH, Britney is toast. Being unable to compete in the next HOH, I think Britney needs Ragan totally on her side AND Matt still in the game as the only HG she would have a chance of beating on the nomination block should Brendon win HOH.

If Brendon wins POV, the whole House (with the exception of Lane) will be scrambling. I could see Matt using the imfamous pretzel message to his advantage but pulling Britney aside and saying, Hey...know how I found out about it? Enzo AND Hayden, i.e. partnership, i.e. alliance, i.e. possibly F2 agreement *HINT* *HINT* came to me together to let me know. Now would be a perfect time to break them up. It would be no problem for Matt to solicit Ragan to tagteam Britney for Hayden as a replacement.

Of course if Brendon does not win POV, all this speculation won't matter.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by LFJ on 08-22-10 at 10:01 AM
If Britney is as calculating as she seems, I can't imagine that she doesn't see Matt as her biggest threat, and Ragan as his leiutenant. "...keep you enemies closer" is Britney's game.

But, as you say, this could be moot...

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-22-10 at 10:14 AM
It would REALLY be moot if Brendon wins POV AND does NOT win HOH as I stated in my initial observation.

Given that scenario, Britney could pretty much do anything this week, smart, dumb, or indifferent and still have an easy path to the F4 and the odds on favorite to win. Of course the HGs don't know everything us viewers know so not sure Britney can be that "calculating" to figure that out. But as the saying goes..."Ignorance is bliss."

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-22-10 at 05:17 PM
Really? I can see how it would happen but it doesn't seem that likely to me. I can definitely entertain some arguments on it.

I'm definitely with you on what she should do, and if she does that and the rest of your scenario went down (Brendon winning veto, Brendon not winning HoH), I agree. I just don't think she will do it.

The problem with Britney, and this is coming from her biggest fan on this board, is that she doesn't seem to have much mobility in her opinions on people. She was with Monet til the very end, she hasn't tried to align with Brendon, Matt, Ragan etc. (commiserate but we haven't seen a single actual deal) despite the natural alliance tides between them. We know she feels safe with Lane despite his lack of reciprocation.

If she puts up Hayden, and say Enzo goes home (Hayden's connected everywhere in the house and that's a plus for his game), then I'm on board with you. Brendon's the only person to definitely put her up and a Double Eviction allows for a quick and dirty backstab (say, Matt/Hayden going for one another).

However, I don't see her doing that if Brendon wins veto. I think she puts up Matt at the Brigade's behest.Brendon's immune, Britney can't nominate herself, and Enzo's up there already. It leaves Lane, Hayden, and Matt. The secondaries are safe in that Britney's looking to take out a threat of some sort to her game, and Hayden/Matt are more dangerous to her. We can all see Matt's good for her...but she doesn't. I think she sees him as a challenge threat and not really friendly to her game as interlocked with Ragan. I think she may just put up Matt instead of Hayden, as he's a bigger jury threat in her mind and tough to separate from Ragan, where she sees non existent play room with Hayden/Lane/Enzo.

She absolutely should put Hayden up as she's probably protected unless Hayden or Brendon won (and even then, I think Hayden would try and take out Matt). I just don't think she will, I think she'll **** this up. Amusingly enough, she's a bad judge of character in this game.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Belle Book on 08-22-10 at 04:01 PM
Even if she sees Matt as her biggest threat, Britney is also smart enough to see that she might be in trouble if she puts up Matt. Matt is a possible ally. Lane is a possible ally. Ragan is a definte ally. Enzo is a definite opponent. And Hayden is a probable opponent. I'd put up the probable opponent over the possible ally -- this week, at least.


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Colonel Zoidberg on 08-22-10 at 12:49 PM
1. Enzo - solely for the entertainment value, since he's otherwise completely useless.

2. Lane - also for the entertainment value. Should be lower since Mrs. Zoidberg was eyeballing him...but I'll always have this season of Hell's Kitchen.

3. Matt - Again, mostly for entertainment value. Huge risk making up the disease, but it's not without precedent.

4. Brendon - Don't like him, but respect his competitiveness. Needs to separate his brain from Rachel's to make a real impact.

5. Hayden - Not sure if there's still a Hayden in the house or not.

--GAP--

6. Ragan - Props for beating the system as Saboteur and playing more for anonymity and potential hilarity than actual sabotage. Less props for targeting a juror - yes, Rachel's annoying, but that was a colossally stupid move.

--CONTINENTAL DIVIDE--

7,124,124,645,123,452. Britney - Please, after the show, have your vocal cords surginally removed. The whining about every other person in the house is getting old. Scratch that - it was old at the beginning. And no, she's not even remotely attractive, especially with all the venom dripping from her words.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-22-10 at 05:03 PM
Wait a second, you're saying Enzo's your #1 and Britney should have her vocal cords removed? Enzo, who can't eat a meal without sounding like a trash compacter? Enzo the "Meow Meow"? Enzo, the player with more talk for someone who has absolutely no game?
"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Colonel Zoidberg on 08-25-10 at 05:06 PM
Enzo makes me laugh. Britney makes me want to deafen myself. Adn blind myself. That is the difference.
"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-22-10 at 05:01 PM
I don't have a list (Brit's still my favorite but I've soured on her as a gameplayer. I think Hayden's far and away the best in the house when it comes to that), but I think y'all are severely overrating how much Enzo is liked. He's essentially Kathy in a guy's body in almost every way.
"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-22-10 at 05:11 PM
Kathy was one of the worse floater ever seen on this show while Enzo set up the most secret alliance ever. One cried, one laughs. One didn't know what was going on, the other decided most of the events. How are they the same? Only in challenge performance. Challenges are meaningless. See Dr Will for proof.
"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-22-10 at 05:20 PM
LAST EDITED ON 08-22-10 AT 05:36 PM (EST)


Enzo whines incessantly. Enzo, much like Kathy, sucks up to whomever is in power at the time. Enzo did absolutely nothing for that alliance and was the closest to outing it at a variety of times. Kathy could have replaced him in that alliance without a hitch. Enzo decided absolutely nothing in this game and was lucky enough to be protected by an alliance full of bigger threats and an opposing, hated alliance.

They're both obnoxious and useless and Enzo would be the worst winner this game has seen in a long, long time. It's like saying that Danielle Dilorenzo was the mastermind of the ASS2 alliance. Or more to the point, he's playing almost exactly the same game Natalie did last year. Hide behind the big bodies, be the right mix of socially capable (I'm not denying he's strong socially, he doesn't ##### people off as of yet), non-threatening, and obnoxious (all three are mutually capable) to the point where people can see you as a jury goat, and follow the coattails to a late-game position. He may very well win because of this (Jordan was the perfect Natalie foil), I'm just saying it's a weak way to play. Enzo has been ultra-lucky to be aligned with the right group of people who didn't turn on the alliance and who were smart enough to help the group dodge bullets. Anyone in that house could have taken his role with no appreciable changes, Kathy would have been great, Brendon even better if Rachel didn't grab on.

And if I'm going on with the ASS2 analogy, that makes Hayden/Parvati, Matt/Russell, and Lane/Jerri. Of course, Matt isn't nearly as paranoid as Russell (and he should be) and won't vote out Enzo. And there's no Sandra this year. Sadly, it looks like Britney is Candice.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-22-10 at 06:06 PM
Enzo was the one that first put the alliance together and he's the one that sees the side-deals some of his mates have formed. How he acts from here will determine how good of a winner he would make. Being socially likable but not too much of a jury threat is the key skill in games like this.

With Maggie, Dick, and especially Adam and Jordan as recent winners, we certainly don't see eye-to-eye on what makes a good winner! Having missed the first 5 seasons, I only saw Dan as a worthy winner and I could put Enzo right behind him depending on his actions down the stretch.

BTW, Russell's dumbest move was to vote out Danielle.



Thanks Tribe!


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-22-10 at 06:19 PM
I wouldn't watch H. vs. V. so can't comment on that analogy, but interesting analysis on the Brigade. Regardless of how this season turns out, the Brigade will be among (if not the) story of the Season.

I guess there are several factors that contributed to its success thus far, but I feel the biggest factor would be Matt winning two HOH competitions during the early stages of this game ensuring all the Brigade members would come out of those weeks unscathed and advance as an alliance.

But the reason they were successful in keeping the Alliance a secret was due to the other "partnerships" Brigade members had with other HGs putting more focus on those partnerships instead of the strong 4-person alliance. Hayden-Kristen (romantic partnership,) Lane-Britney (sibling relationship,) and Ragan-Matt (I guess we'll call it "boy crush" relationship?) Enzo being the only Brigade member to not have that type of partnership, one can make the case he's the one who has been sponging off the others and fortunate enough to benefit from the success of the Brigade.

But I do not see Enzo winning BB12 without winning a competition or two in this last month. Yeah, I know Will won BB2 without winning a competition. But BB2 was the first BB to be played under this current format; and much like Hatch in S1 who was the only castaway who knew how to play the game that season without any prior blueprint of the game, Will was the only one in BB2 who knew how to play BB without a prior blueprint and thus won the season. This is BB12 and I can't see anyone winning NOW without winning a competition or more along the way...Enzo included.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-22-10 at 06:27 PM
"Enzo being the only Brigade member to not have that type of partnership"

Didn't you see how much Brendon and Rachel trusted him? He's been everyone's friend, even Annie. That likability has been the key in keeping the Brigade safe.

If Ragan had won both HOHs in place of Matt, I don't think things would have been any different with Andrew and Rachel leaving those weeks anyway. Except, I'd be considering Matt as a smart player for laying low, keeping his smirk in check.



Thanks Tribe!


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-22-10 at 06:40 PM
I like this...this is fun!


>If Ragan had won both HOHs in place of Matt, I don't think things would have been any different with Andrew and Rachel leaving those weeks anyway.


If Ragan wins the first HOH Matt won, he puts up Brendon/Rachel right off the bat. Don't see him making Kathy/Andrew his initial nominees like Matt did.

Brendon still wins POV. Yes I know he was willing to fall on the sword for Rachel in Week 5, but in Week 3 I believe he would use it to save himself. Rachel goes home in week 3. And not being there to win HOH the following week, the game most likely takes a different turn depending on who would win HOH week 4.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-22-10 at 07:14 PM
I'm pretty sure Ragan would nominate public enemy #1 Andrew as initial or at least replacement nominee so things develop much the same way or we have a simple inversion of moves with Rachel going 3rd and Andrew 4th or 5th.

Lane finished second to Rachel in week 4 HOH so he'd be the most likely winner. How would that be bad for Enzo and the Brigade?!



Thanks Tribe!


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-22-10 at 07:30 PM
I honestly don't see Ragan nominating Andrew. Everyone in the House wanted Rachel/Brendon out and Ragan would go with the safe choices. Just my opinion.

Although it's fun playing the "what if" game, if Rachel was evicted in week 3 it would be virtually impossible to predict the pairings in the Knockout HOH competition. So just because Lane was there with Rachel in the last pairing I won't even entertain the possibility that he would have been there in the last pairing in our hypothetical situation. Way too many combinations to assume. Especially without the Brendon/Rachel and the unconfirmed Hayden/Kristen showmances being targeted with that knockout format.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-22-10 at 07:50 PM
Michel, I may go more in-depth later, but what Aruba said suffices for me for now and it's why I sort of view Enzo as very weak. All three of the others made an essential secondary alliance that has protected the Brigade to some extent (Brit with the Vetoes, Ragan with his veto letting Matt play DPOV, and Kristen as a decoy target). I think Enzo tried to forge something like that with Brendon, but it still ended up with two Brigaders nominated and was purely protection for Enzo and Hayden...maybe good game for him but nothing for the alliance which is the only reason he isn't gone already.

I'm with you on the competition too. I think he needs to win a F4 competition (Veto or HoH) or he'll be voted out as too friendly and not the #1 in anyone's alliance but Hayden. It's the point where superficial goats come to play.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-22-10 at 09:32 PM
Hayden's side alliance is what got him nominated. The Brigade's vote, led by Enzo, saved him.

Lane's side alliance is what got him nominated last week. The Brigade's vote, led by Enzo, was going to save him.

Matt's side alliance with Ragan was one of the reasons he was nominated. He was done, for all his genius, nothing was going to save him except a bobble. I don't consider that good game play, just luck that the DPOV happened to be on the week he won HOH.

Enzo had an understanding with everyone. That's the mark of a good player. Now comes the tricky part. I think he's a sure winner if he faces the jury. I also think Matt is a sure loser if he faces the jury against anyone but Ragan. That's the mark of a bad player, much like Russell in your previous analogy.



Thanks Tribe!


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-23-10 at 00:20 AM
LAST EDITED ON 08-23-10 AT 00:22 AM (EST)

To attribute Enzo as the leader of the brigade makes no sense whatsoever, which is where your story of this season falls apart IMHO. There is no definitive leader to the brigade and, as I said, anyone could be put in his place and there still would have been votes to keep everyone around.

Of course, there are two ways to look at this. This is Fishercat's alternate universe (his viewpoint on how it went down...and I don't buy Enzo = Super Puppet Master)

Week Four: Rachel wins Head of Household. She puts up Hayden and Kristen, Britney wins veto, and Kristen goes home. In reality, Lane and Britney's side alliance may have been what kept the brigade feasible in this scenario. If Britney and Lane aren't connected, Rachel putting up Lane as a pawn v. Kristen doesn't seem like a bad option. This either means Lane goes home (unlikely), or there is now a quasi assumed alliance with Brenchel and Hayden/Kristen. The ramifications of this are largely unknown, even if Kristen goes home as she did (never mind if the brigade was sick Kathy and booted her instead of Kristen). Is Hayden pissed because the Brigade gets rid of Kristen over Kathy? If Matt wins and puts up Brendon/Rachel, does Brendon go after Hayden next week due to this lack of alliance support instead of Ragan/Matt? Basically, if Britney had used the veto as part of a fake alliance with Brendon and Rachel, this game could be entirely different.

Week Six: Lane and Ragan are nominated. The original plan looked to be Lane/Ragan and Britney, but for whatever reason (some speculate he told her outright, which he wasn't allowed to do) it was Lane and Ragan. Lane was nominated not because of his side alliance, but as a pure pawn. It was clearly played throughout the show that Lane = Pawn. He was put up because he would be kept over anyone Brendan would want to put up. Ragan was put up because he was close to Matt, who Brendon didn't trust. Matt got rid of his girlfriend...but Brendon was also assisted by Hayden and Enzo into distrusting Matt because they want him out of the Brigade. Neither of their side alliance got them in trouble. Of course, the side-alliance saved them in a way because Ragan threw both of the endurance HoH's to Matt. Whether he could win them isn't known...but that second one gave Matt the DPOV. Now, I think Ragan would have saved Matt with that DPOV, but we don't know if he would have tried as hard during veto nor do we know if he would have replaced him with Hayden or Enzo.

Also, I think you're forgetting Matt's behavior during last week. The way he acted, it was almost like he wanted to be nominated, to get intel on his alliance. The feed watchers basically said he took everything in stride and didn't try to actively get Britney nominated. I think he would have put her up if Matt tried hard enough.

I don't know about Enzo, but if it were him v. Matt in the Final 2, it screams a Memphis v. Dan finale to me. Except that Matt isn't as smart as Dan, and Matt's sob story (remember, they still think his dying wife is real) is better. But it's so hard to tell and I think will largely depend on how they go out. I'm not going to deny his prospects of winning. I think he pulls it against a non-Brigader at this point. But he's done nothing to get there. There's a reason that each member of the Brigade has been nominated for eviction and their opponent went out on a strongly supportive vote, and if anything Enzo's been the biggest liability to the group surviving as he's been actively trying to break it up in the past couple weeks.

I think Enzo wins jury against Britney (betrayed Brenchel, Kathy's a sponge, etc.), Ragan (see Britney). Brendon probably, but Rachel and Kathy setting the tone for a jury house is very dangerous. But if the Brigade gets revealed I think he has an uphill battle against Lane, Matt, or Hayden (especially Hayden, everyone seemingly loves the guy. Enzo's going to have a very tough time convincing anyone that he was at the head of it).

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by LFJ on 08-23-10 at 09:55 AM
FWIW, I agree with Michel.

Enzo, IIRC, is the one who came up with the idea for the Brigade. He was put on the block last night for no other reason than that he has never been up before, and that we can attribute to Matt's insistence. Britney even apologized to Enzo, saying as much.

From a interpersonal skills perspective, Enzo is the one to beat. He has done poorly in the comps. Contrast that to Matt, who has done pretty well, and who do you think would get the jury votes?

If Enzo can hang on, he will win it. Lane and Hayden - not such great competitors, either, but likeable enough. Matt's a loser, even IF he wins it.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 10:41 AM
Thanks!
Sorry I hadn't seen your post when I was writing mine.
"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-23-10 at 10:46 AM
The idea is largely meaningless without the power behind it. There have been a bunch of major alliances in the past. The fact is that Hayden was the first Head of Household and that facilitated the potential of a Brigade, namely having power Week One. Why do you think Hayden was the first one in this group?

And you're being naive if you think that's what Britney thinks. Her game is poor and she's not a great judge of character, but she's not stupid. The plan was clearly for Enzo to be a pawn, and the way to not upset him was to say he hadn't gone up before, straight from the mouth of Matt. It's obvious the house wants Brendon as a target...so why ##### off BOTH of them? For whatever reason, she trusts Lane, so no reason to burn your bridges there unless you have an alternate plan.

And I don't get why comps = not jury votes. If you look at past seasons, the player who wins more HoHs tends to win the game (BB2, BB6, and BB9 were exceptions). I don't think it's a huge reason they win (certainly, Jordo didn't win because she won 2 HoHs as opposed to one), but it's not a reason a person loses at jury. Matt, however fake it is, also has a better emotional plea to make at the Final 2. I don't think he beats Enzo, but I don't think he's dead in the water either: it matters how the final few weeks go: who boots whom and such.

And I'm still not sure how exactly Enzo beats Hayden.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 10:05 AM
LAST EDITED ON 08-23-10 AT 10:06 AM (EST)

Alternate universe and what-ifs are pretty meaningless. I like to stick to the facts and it was Enzo that brought the Brigade together. I wasn't implying he was a super puppet master but his fidelity to the Brigade is what kept it together despite everyone else's side deals. The quiet, friendly way he has around people, which reminds me of how Earl played Survivor, did the rest. Didn't you see which side Hayden and Lane chose when it came down to Matt vs Enzo?

Matt's needless grand schemes put the Brigade at risk and he was dead without that free pass. For all that, I see Enzo playing a smarter game than the "genius".

Do you really think that Matt could have convinced Brendon to go against Rachel's wishes? Maybe Brendon is stupid enough to nominate Britney in place of Matt if Rachel hadn't come back (that's another what-if) but how is Brendon's stupidity a mark of Matt's good game play? Again, Enzo managed to tame the Neanderthal which is harder to do than antagonize him. And don't forget that Enzo came in second to Britney so he could very well have won HOH if she wasn't there. He could have solidified his deal with Brendon and nominated Matt. See where what-ifs can lead!!


Thanks Tribe!


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-23-10 at 11:01 AM
LAST EDITED ON 08-23-10 AT 11:33 AM (EST)

Except he's not quiet. At all. But I'm guessing you're just going on what the show shows you and not the actual feeds. He did out the Brigade in Rachel's farewell message...and they didn't show it.

Why do you think they chose Enzo over Matt? Well, the reason seems very simple to me: Enzo can't beat them when it counts in a F4 HOH, F4 Veto, or F3 HOH, at least in their minds. He's an easy boot at F3 if they want to, because he's only been competitive in one competition, a questions competition, where he apparently fluked into a series of correct answers. I'm not saying this is true, for all I know Enzo could do very well and has been throwing it every week...but I honestly don't think that's the case. He wasn't even close to Hayden, Brendon, or Lane in the muddy ropes competition where he was trailing with Kathy. In a veto to keep Ragan, a true threat, on the block and prevent any brigade member from going up, he couldn't get through the first puzzle. On the other hand, Matt's been a strong physical and mental competitor in this game.

(Clarification: I think Matt's tried to be too smart for his own good and it will be his demise sooner rather than later. The wife lie, while it may help him if makes F2, won't keep him in the game. The comps are similar. His unwillingness to actually turn on the Brigade as they expect him to do, which is the most bizarre thing of all, will kill him. For all this talk of fidelity to the Brigade, Enzo was the first one to try and get Matt out of the house the second Brendon gained any sort of power, instead of target middle players like Ragan or Britney...and that's the best game move he's made in my opinion. Being the first to dismantle the Brigade is a good thing for him)

For the record, I don't think anyone's game this season is strong. We have no Dr. Will in this group. I think Hayden's probably the best for the same reasons you think Enzo is the best, and I see Enzo much more in the coattail rider than social gamer role, a subtle but distinct difference.

Edit: I am going on feed spoilers so I won't put too much in here. But if what happens this week is what is currently expected, I am going to have to begrudgingly give the Brogade credit for something, so be on watch!

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 11:41 AM
I don't look at the live feeds and only skim on the transcripts once in a while but, unless editing is completely false, I'm seeing a very calm man in his dealings with others. DR complaints or rants are meaningless since no one sees them.

I don't put any weight on challenge performance until the very end. (When competitions are as dumb as the shot drinking one from last night, I'm surprised anyone thinks they are important)
In fact it's better to lose than to win. Winning the bowling POV was the first thing that put Britney in danger, forcing her to react to Brendon's attack. I'd be very surprised to hear that Hayden and Lane chose Enzo only for challenge performance and not at least in part for loyalty to the Brigade. Even so, I'd say Enzo was smart not to try harder.

You write:
"I think Matt's tried to be too smart for his own good and it will be his demise sooner rather than later"

That's what I'm saying.

"For all this talk of fidelity to the Brigade, Enzo was the first one to try and get Matt out of the house"

Because Enzo was wise enough to see that Matt was lying and would ditch the Brigade at any time. How often have we seen players in BB or Survivor believe blindly in their alliances?

Matt made a big mistake not choosing Enzo as replacement nominee instead of Kathy. He'd be running this house now, not scrambling to stay alive.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-23-10 at 01:00 PM
I don't count food competitions, especially the shot one. I meant more in terms of vetos and HoHs that would have been reasonable to win. He's tried in some (early) ones and just didn't stand up to the younger men in the house. Nevermind the vetoes.

The editing is largely false. The editing's largely false across the board. Ragan is positively insufferable on the feeds and a cheer-worthy player on the show. I'm not including DR rants for anyone, otherwise Britney would be monumentally stupid and not just a bad judge of character.

I think Brit was in trouble well before that. Nevermind the nomination by Rachel, but after her second veto where she won in spite of not needing it, the brigade was already talking about her as a threat.

The problem with the Enzo seeing Matt as a shyster is that, well, he's not. I wish I could spoil feeds here, but if he was trying to screw over the Brigade, he would have nominated Enzo or Hayden last week alongside Lane. It was the perfect time to make his move, would have solidified alliances, eliminated a threat, etc. He didn't though, he took out Kathy, as you said. This week, we're shown him being okay with Enzo going, but it's not a statement against the Brigade more than a statement of facts: Enzo being in the game much longer isn't good for him. I give Enzo and Hayden credit for turning on Matt at the right time, but it was on a mistaken supposition if you're saying it's due to Matt being untrustworthy.

Basically, they're ditching Matt because they're assuming he's going to leave the Brigade for his other alliances. It's an incorrect assumption, he wouldn't save Britney to sacrifice the Brigade. I don't even think he'd save Ragan to do it. You can't really take this week as much evidence since Brendon was already nommed, and anyone Matt supports for nomination would be a Brigader (thus he's apparently shady) or it's someone Britney had explicitly said she's not putting up (Ragan).

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by LFJ on 08-23-10 at 01:43 PM
"The problem with the Enzo seeing Matt as a shyster is that, well, he's not."

Ahhhh. But you are too kind. No. Matt is not a shyster (sp?). He is a despicable egomaniac, and after several weeks in the house, he is not able to hide his true self from some of the more - shall I use the term loosely? - insightful players. He made verrrrry bad Karma for himself the 1st week in the house.

"Basically, they're ditching Matt because they're assuming he's going to leave the Brigade for his other alliances. It's an incorrect assumption, he wouldn't save Britney to sacrifice the Brigade."

Maybe I watched a different show episode than you, but I distinctly remember Matt telling Britney to nominate Enzo. ???
I thought he was part of the Brigade. And, then, we got the S.M.I.R.K. But you are right. He wouldn't lift a finger to help Britney, or anyone else for that matter, unless it would advance his position one scintilla.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-23-10 at 02:14 PM
But that wasn't a statement against the Brigade. Let's face it, Brendon was going up automatically. He had no other choices but to suggest a Brigade member, or suggest himself (knowing that he was going home if Brendon wins veto).

Britney - HoH, cannot be nominated
Brendon - nominated
Ragan - Promised safety in the nominations round by Britney
Matt - Himself
Lane - Protected due to Britney being Britney

That leaves Hayden and Enzo. Hayden's been nominated once, Enzo hasn't. He trusts Hayden more than Enzo. There was no other option. The Brigade is still his #1 priority and not booting Enzo last week is proof of this. I'll have more on this specific point on Wednesday.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 04:11 PM
LAST EDITED ON 08-23-10 AT 04:11 PM (EST)

"The editing is largely false. The editing's largely false across the board. Ragan is positively insufferable on the feeds and a cheer-worthy player on the show."

Didn't you read my list and how insufferable I find Ragan now after a promising start? It comes through clearly in the episodes.

Has Enzo even argued with anyone? I mean more than his bout with Britney over the pronunciation of "cawfey". Compared to almost everyone else, he's been calm on the show and I didn't see any transcripts that suggested anything that would create enemies. You can't spoil feeds but you could link to it if there's anything significant I missed.

As for Matt, how about staying quiet? It's tough to ask that of a "genius" but he didn't need to suggest anyone if he was so true to the Brigade. His suggestion of Enzo wasn't innocent. It could turn completely against him because Lane could get Britney to tell him why she nominated Enzo.

You see Matt nominating Kathy as solidarity with the Brigade, I saw it as either miscalculation or cowardice. He didn't want to go up against Hayden, Lane and Brendon who would all have been gunning for him.



Ils sont fous, ces Romains!
Thanks Tribe!

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-23-10 at 04:47 PM
Except that it's not really clear on the show to the mass audience...he was voted to be saboteur (with Enzo) for a reason. You can make that distinction on your own, but they both share a bunch of qualities, overtly whiny, generally weaker in competitions, makes snarky comments about house pariahs, etc.

I wasn't so much talking about arguments. Really, the only people in the house who are unable to control their tempers are Britney and Ragan (I don't count Brendon's intentional attacks). I was talking more about his general demeanor: he's a ##### talker (like Britney) really. He'll throw everyone under the bus and talks a bigger game than he has. I find that, personally, annoying. Plus, his complete disregard for BB rules (He has violated have not eating rules several times, never mind this week) is really annoying. Chima got booted for that kind of crap, other people have gotten penalty votes/noms (and this is a week where that matters!) for the exact things Enzo's done (he's been "warned" by BB several times for eating real food while a Have Not, including candy and pizza, as well as the Fridge Eating).

Matt staying quiet means he's nominated. Period. You saw Britney was willing to put him up as a "pawn". He had to suggest someone to avoid being the "pawn" for the third time. Unless you're suggesting that he should have taken that bullet, which is horrible strategy.

Matt's nomination of Kathy, to me, is a clear statement of Brigade solidarity. Basically, he wanted to get rid of the low hanging fruit. Kathy was way too easy of a person to keep until F4 or F3, which dismantles the Brigade sooner. He probably should have put Enzo up...but if Enzo stays at Lane's expense, he's even more screwed this week.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 06:26 PM
"he's a ##### talker (like Britney) really"

Then why do you have Brit #1 and Enzo last? I personnaly find them the two most entertaining on the show.

"his complete disregard for BB rules (He has violated have not eating rules several times, never mind this week) is really annoying."

OK, that's something I can understand. I remember reading something about that a few weeks ago but I thought everyone more or less followed suit. Personally, I'd probably have laughed at it, the rats not being my favorites. Anyone who has the balls to mess with production isn't totally bad in my book. Chyma took it to outrageous levels. If it gets Enzo in danger then I'll agree that he wasn't smart.

"Matt staying quiet means he's nominated"

He could have simply left it at: "Nominate whoever you want but please don't put me up."

"He probably should have put Enzo up...but if Enzo stays at Lane's expense, he's even more screwed this week."

With Britney and Ragan, he had the votes to get Enzo.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-24-10 at 08:41 AM
I'm really pressed for time, so quickly

Fair point on Enzo v. Lane, but it being so last minute I'm not sure how it would have settled out.

OK on Matt, but a specific name protects more than just a general statement

Simply put, Brit talks ##### and then tends to back it up with competition wins and is willing to tell some people to their face (even if they're out of the game). Enzo, smartly, isn't.

And there is a photo that was posted from last night with him hiding food on his person and then eating it. For instance.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-23-10 at 06:20 PM

>Matt made a big mistake not
>choosing Enzo as replacement nominee
>instead of Kathy. He'd be
>running this house now, not
>scrambling to stay alive.


If he chose Enzo, he'd better be darn sure who would have won HOH right after Enzo's eviction (which of course is impossible) making that a HUGE risk. If you think Matt is scrambling to stay alive now, that's nothing compared to the scrambling he'd be doing if Hayden or Lane won HOH right after Enzo walks out the door.

Knowing now that Britney won HOH, I agree with your choice of Enzo...but without that knowledge it's a huge risk. And the other concern the Brigade needs to consider is if one of their comrades gets blindsided at this point in the game, you also run the risk of that player pulling an "Andrew" and revealing the Brigade to everyone before he walks out the door. It would be hard to convince any remaining HG of your loyalty/trustworthness and they're pretty much on their own the rest of the way. That would be fine at F5, but could shoot all of them in the foot if done at F8. Lane would have some explaining to do with Britney as to why he kept it a secret from her the whole time and could affect that side alliance.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 07:13 PM
Sure, it would have been a huge risk and the second part of my statement obviously considered that Britney did win HOH so I'm not completely blaming him for not doing it. I'm more or less saying that an "enlightened genius" should play hard, not hide behind nominating Kathy. He clearly saw that Enzo was going to vote him out so he should have struck first.

Anyway, by telling Britney to nominate Enzo he's taking the same risk but with a more direct danger: He knows how close Lane is to both Brit and Enzo so his ploy should explode in his face. Nominating Enzo last week would have been the end of Enzo.

If Matt gets Enzo this week then he's better (or luckier because he needs Brendon to win POV) than I thought, if Enzo gets him then our "genius" is just another dumb player.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-23-10 at 08:40 PM
I don't know...I think too much is being made of putting up Enzo as a pawn. The primary target for Matt, Britney and the whole House for that matter is Brendon.

How is what Matt did any different than all three Brigade members parading up to the HOH room and telling Britney to put up Matt??? Anyway the reason he gave Britney was the fact that Enzo is the only HG who has not been nominated yet. I don't see the malicious intent there.

I guess I'm just not seeing this whole "if Matt gets Enzo," "if Enzo gets Matt" deal. Isn't Brendon the House's target? If Matt gets Enzo...Matt's not better. If Enzo gets Matt...Enzo's not better. The HG who IS better in that scenario is Brendon for winning POV and creating a mad scramble.

Lastly, there was more to nominating Kathy than just "hiding."
1) If Kathy had kept the pretzel message to herself that's one thing. But not telling Matt yet running to Hayden/Enzo would raise understandable concern in Matt's mind,
2) We all know the danger of the pathetically inept getting passes to the endgame. I like the "there's no free lunches" approach to playing these Reality Show games. I wish more players would take that approach, and
3) Everyone had Kathy fingered as the Saboteur. In Matt's defense it wasn't until seconds before Julie asked Matt to get up and make a statement did she advise the House the Saboteur's reign was over.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 09:03 PM
"How is what Matt did any different than all three Brigade members parading up to the HOH room and telling Britney to put up Matt???"

First, timing: Matt went to Brit first and it seemed that the Brigade reacted to what they felt. Next and more importantly; 3 votes to 1. Enzo made sure he had the votes to get Matt if it came to it.

"I guess I'm just not seeing this whole "if Matt gets Enzo," "if Enzo gets Matt" deal. Isn't Brendon the House's target?"

I see Brendon as dead-man-walking. Even if he wins POV, he can't last very long. The season is about the Brigade and how it will break down. Last week, we saw it had to be either Matt or Enzo. Sooner or later, they will have their showdown.



Thanks Tribe!


"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-23-10 at 09:47 PM

First, timing: Matt went to Brit first and it seemed that the Brigade reacted to what they felt.

Nah...not buying into the Brigade reacted to what they felt. No way I'm giving them credit for thinking they knew Matt suggested Enzo to Brit. The reason the Brigade paraded to the HOH room is because they knew Brit would NOT put up Lane or Ragan so process of elimination was either Enzo, Hayden, or Matt. There was NEVER a doubt in my mind the alpha macho males would gang up on genius boy eventually and they feel the time is now.


Last week, we saw it had to be either Matt or Enzo. Sooner or later, they will have their showdown.

It's not about Matt vs. Enzo. It's about Enzo/Hayden/Lane vs. Matt. Because there's always strength in numbers pretty easy to pick the loser in that scenario. Matt's best play this week is to pull Ragan/Britney aside and reveal the Brigade. Yes he runs the risk of Britney running to Lane, but he must do what he can to even the sides 3 to 3 and then let the "showdown" begin.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-23-10 at 10:59 PM
"There was NEVER a doubt in my mind the alpha macho males would gang up on genius boy"

No doubts? That's why I like arguing with you!

I remember three alpha macho males, namely Tom, Ian and Gregg, ganging up on Coby who had won 3 or 4 challenges for his team including sumo-at-sea. You thought they were so unfair to Coby!!!

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-24-10 at 06:03 AM
If you really think Coby was more instrumental to the Koror dominance in Palu and not Tom Westman you are truly dilusional. Tom (along with Ian) were much larger factors than Coby ever was. In the sumo-at-sea, Tom Westman won both of his bouts against a much younger Bobby-Jon. Coby won his against a competitor he outweighed by almost 40 pounds as was confirmed on the Reunion Show.

Coby did well in the challenges but it's not like Tom and Ian sucked in the competitions and were being carried by Coby's "challenge prowess."" LOL
Although Enzo was important with the formation of the Brigade, it was still Matt's two HOHs as the biggest contributing factor for the Brigade building enough early steam to become the force they were in the first half of the season.

Coby wanted nothing to do with the men in the tribe right from the getgo. Not the case with Matt. And for the record EVERY member of Koror voted out Coby...not just the "alpha males" but even the women he spent time with on the beach braiding their hair.

This is why I like debating YOU...because your apple to orange comparisons make for such easy arguments.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-24-10 at 06:28 AM

I remember three alpha macho males, namely Tom, Ian and Gregg...

???????????????????????????????????????

We DEFINITELY watched different seasons that year!

Tom, Ian and Greg were "alpha macho males???? LOL LOL LOL

Whereas Lane and Enzo carry themselves as "YO, were Mr. Macho Men" you didn't see that from Tom and Ian. Yeah, I remember Tom telling the viewers who's getting "whacked" and who is getting sized up to wear "cement shoes." Hey, wasn't that a classic episode when Ian was jumping around like a Horse's A$$ before he bench presses 325 pound???
Tom had too much class and maturity to act that way. And Ian's long, boney stature would never be able to pull it off. Even Greg could never be considered "alpha male" with his nose so far up Jenn's butt. Having to ask her permission and get her OK as to who to take on a reward is the polar opposite of a "macho man" attitude in my book.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by michel on 08-24-10 at 07:45 AM
It's called a joke...


Ils sont fous, ces Romains!
Thanks Tribe!

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-24-10 at 07:50 PM
OK...actually I was 50/50 whether you were goofing or not. That's why I threw a few "LOL"s out there. You have come up with some pretty bizarre comparisons in the past (and present) though so wasn't 100%

It's cool and all good!

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-24-10 at 08:20 PM

Michel says, "Matt made a big mistake not choosing Enzo as replacement nominee instead of Kathy. He'd be running this house now, not scrambling to stay alive.

Aruba responds, "Knowing now that Britney won HOH, I agree with your choice of Enzo...but without that knowledge it's a huge risk.


After giving this more thought, I may have to reconsider and think Matt's MORE at risk by having Enzo evicted...Britney wins HOH...and Brendon's nominated as the primary target. Here's why.

Without Enzo, Hayden becomes the obvious pawn. No way Britney ever considers Lane or Ragan as any nominee this week. So if Brendon wins POV the only choices Brit has as replacement nominees are Matt and pathetic Kathy. Given those choices she almost certainly puts up Matt and Matt is out the door.

At least now if Brendon wins POV, Matt's got a fighting chance and 50/50 shot of convincing Brit to put up Hayden as the replacement...not the same chance he would have against Kathy.

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Fishercat on 08-23-10 at 11:37 AM
A quick list, based mostly on personality with a little bit of gameplay mixed in

1) Britney
2) Hayden
3) Brendon (without Rachel only)
4) Matt
5) Ragan
6) Lane
7) Enzo

That is fluid enough, all of them except Brit could be higher or lower.

A general statement too is, even though I hate this season's personalities and the generally wussy play, I'm still very intrigued on how the season can still go. Are we going to get an entire four man alliance to the F4 from Day One? Will one of the two aux pairs (Lane/Britney and Matt/Ragan) be the demise of the Brigade? Can Brendon win every damn challenge and be a huge, Survivor-esque problem for everyone else? When exactly, if it happens, will the Brigade crumble into nothing? If they betray Matt soon, is Lane next for his pair? Or will they go to F5 with someone and then re-align...or F4? It's a lot of fun

"RE: Big Brother Love/Loathe List V12.7"
Posted by Aruba on 08-23-10 at 09:27 PM
Good questions, Fishercat. I'll take a stab at them...

Are we going to get an entire four man alliance to the F4 from Day One?

If Brendon does not win POV, I think we'll have an all-male F4...but not necessarily an all Brigade F4. Britney cannot compete in the next HOH and her four challenge wins must be on the Brigade radar making her the primary target for double eviction.


Will one of the two aux pairs (Lane/Britney and Matt/Ragan) be the demise of the Brigade?

The "demise" of the Brigade would be if Brendon wins POV. The Aux Pairs could be the reason ALL four Brigade members don't make the F4, but I wouldn't qualify that as a "demise" IMO.


Can Brendon win every damn challenge and be a huge, Survivor-esque problem for everyone else?

"Can" he? I guess...anything's possible. Will he? Simply put, No.


When exactly, if it happens, will the Brigade crumble into nothing?

As stated above, only if Brendon wins POV on Wednesday.


If they betray Matt soon, is Lane next for his pair? Or will they go to F5 with someone and then re-align...or F4?

I'm sorry, but I'm not following this question. If "they" means the Brigade, I believe they already have betrayed Matt. If it's Ragan/Britney you're referring to, that only happens if Brendon wins POV or if Enzo is evicted and Lane jumps ship to join forces with Ragan/Britney making Matt expendable. Although I can't see Ragan ditching Matt for Lane.