Granted, Trump said that Jason's decision not to talk to the client was a BIG mistake. So he's gonna take a chance on a guy who sleeps on the job running one of his corporations rather than a guy who makes a beginner's mistake?

More to the point, I believe Sam's behavior, rather than the fact that he didn't get fired, is more indicative of rigging. It simply isn't realistic that a person who is in this for genuine stakes is going to fall asleep on his 2nd assignment with the whole country watching.

Poor business decisions aside, I agree, Sam's character certainly appears to be "scripted". Given the trend for "plot twists" in recent reality shows, I wouldn't put it past the producers putting a "plant" or "mole" like Sam in the group to keep things interesting. After all, there are 11 more episodes to go. *Now don't get me started on Omerosa playing the "race card" in the second episode. Saw that one coming a mile away*

If I remember correctly from my business classes in high school, you don't normally talk directly (face to face) to the client until you're ready to pitch your idea to them. Talking to them before hand makes no sense. If the client knows what he or she wanted, why would they hire you in the first place? Plus, that would limit your creativity and defeat the idea of thinking outside the box.

I'm disappointed because this show has turned into "Sam: The Apprentice". There's no way, unless he's the boss's son or something like that, could he be allowed to sleep on the job without any type of punishment (suspension or termination). I know some places allow their employees to relax and/or take short naps, but to lay out on the floor is unprofessional and stupid. There's some serious rigging going on.

>If I remember correctly from my
>business classes in high school,
>you don't normally talk directly
>(face to face) to the
>client until you're ready to
>pitch your idea to them.
>Talking to them before hand
>makes no sense.
>If the client knows what he or she wanted,
>why would they hire you in the first place?

I disagree, the prespective I got is that there are two ad companies vying to be hired as the advertising company. The client hasn't hired either group yet, he/she is looking for a proposal from each group. First and foremost in this case you should definitely meet with the client to assess the needs. Fatal mistake on the guys part, especially from Jason who claimed to have worked in an adversting company before. The only possible firing should have been the project manager for his refusal to meet with the client.

>I disagree, the prespective I got
>is that there are two
>ad companies vying to be
>hired as the advertising company.
> The client hasn't hired
>either group yet, he/she is
>looking for a proposal from
>each group. First and
>foremost in this case you
>should definitely meet with the
>client to assess the needs.
> Fatal mistake on the
>guys part, especially from Jason
>who claimed to have worked
>in an adversting company before.
> The only possible firing
>should have been the project
>manager for his refusal to
>meet with the client.

Okay, I get it now and in that case, Jason made a big mistake. I was trying to watch another show as well and apparently missed some things.

I think that the men's error went way beyond not meeting with the client. After all, the client did not choose between the 2 campaigns. The owner of the ad agency did. He told them what to do- "swing for the fence". Did they? After saying that, and obviously trying to create an edgy image (eg people riding scooters through your offices) how in the world could he then tell the women that they had gone too far? He couldn't. If it would've been me, I would've said (to the men) "Is this your idea of swinging for the fence? Guys in suits and wives talking about how much safer their husbands are?" They were obviously not listening. When the decsion maker says, "Here are the two big things to keep in mind" then that is the time to listen even if you don't remember anything else. Then subtly remind him of those 2 things when you deliver your presentation that has obviously been crafted with his own priorities. What's he gonna say?

I work in the ad business you couldn't be more wrong.

The client won't come right out and tell you what to design but they will tell you the targeting objectives of the product. you should get that from the client.

I'll comment more on the Jason/Sam thing at the back of this trend.

LAST EDITED ON 01-16-04 AT 03:43 PM (EST)

I don't know about you, but in the beginning of my career I made amateur mistakes. I was never fired for it. I was taken to task, sent for further training, and/or demoted. I learned from my mistakes and am now the truly indispensible professional who is an integral piece of the puzzle that makes up a major university. (Plus I remain humble despite my amazing success...ha,ha,ha!) However, had I ever, ever, ever been caught acting so unprofessionally as to sleep on the floor of my office instead of completing an assignment (even one of the many that I have been given that I thought was stupid or boring), I wouldn't have lasted two seconds longer. Mistakes are forgivable, unprofessionalism and laziness are not. Justin did make a mistake, but remember that it wasn't the client actually making the decision here. It was the head of the ad agency, who was admittedly torn between both. We don't really know what the client wanted because they never showed what the substance of his conversation with the women was.

I agree wholeheartedly with anotherkim. Rule number one: Always ask the client what he/she wants. Remember it’s their money and their product.

Never ever think that it is NOT important to ask the client for their comments and/or how they want their project completed. You’ll always fail in doing so.

I’m more surprised that the Harvard MBA graduate didn’t point this out to him in the beginning; then again the Harvard MBA did pick the location on the first task.

The whole point of this show is to expose the two teams of job candidates to basic business principles and then determine in the field how successful each team will be in the practical application of their combined education and work experience. Jason failed in this regard not only because he ignored the first principle of marketing (identify the needs of the client), but because he failed to actively solicit and then act on the input of the other team members, his subordinates in this instance. The first responsibility of any team leader who wants to succeed is to assess the individual strengths/weaknesses of the people on his team and then provide them with tasks that make the best use of their specials skills and talents. In this case, Jason was told point blank by a Harward MBA and others that his strategy was flawed from the beginning. However, instead of listening to the advice of people on his team with more education or work experience, he asserted his authority in the interest of protecting his ego but at the expense of meeting the team's objective.

LAST EDITED ON 01-16-04 AT 06:49 AM (EST)

Mark Burnett hired Donald Trump to appear on this show. So an employee of the producers is choosing who wins or loses. It's the same as if Jeff Probst got to choose who went home evey week on Survivor.

This is not a game show... It is scripted television with non scripted scenes contained within it.

Of course it is 'rigged'... but MB never said it wasn't, did he?

Edited to add:

For that matter, Trump is listed as an Executive Producer for the show so that pretty much says it all when it comes to whether this is 'rigged' or not.

Trump will make his choices under Burnett's direction in order to make sure that the remaining contestants provide the greatest interest in terms of conflict and personality. The choice has nothing to do with merit but has everything to do with making the subsequent episodes more sensational. Sam breeds conflict so he will be kept for a while longer.

Next week, Sam is made the leader so look for another competition where the 'client' choses the winning team using completely subjective criteria (like lastnight's ad campaign competition). The men will not lose next week. MB will tell the client to give the competition to the men regardless of the quality of the each teams apparent performance.

If you look closely at the end credits, there is a disclaimer that specifically says Trump consulted with porducers in his decisions, but that they were Trump's decisions in the end.

Sam is good tv, end of story.

***see IceCats post above.*****

I couldn't have said it better myself. As a matter of fact I am sure I couldn't have said it this well!!!!!

Sam and Hermosa are put on this show to create controversy.

Exactly. It's was obvious from the first episode. This is not a contest, it's entertainment, disguised as a contest. As long as Sam provides good TV and tension among the cast, he will survive.

Wonder how hard the guys are going to work to have Sam's project succeed. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if some of them considered "throwing the competition", since the PM is definitely one of the three in the boardroom.

It could backfire, since Sam could take along two malcontents and paint them as the problems. But there are subtle ways to sabotage to guarantee a project's failure without ending up with egg on your own face. Will be interesting to see if that approach gets considered.

Snarky, smart, S7 Anti-Bootee Champ

great analysis!

There wasn't a whole lot of sleeping on the job discussion with Trump so he may not have known that Sam was snoozing. There was more talk about the bone-headed decision not to talk to the client. That's why Jason got canned.

I think the women's campaign ad was much better than the men. Sexual subliminal message works with high-powered men.

I agree with Ice. Maybe rigged is the wrong word, but the show is structured to be entertaining.

And Sam? Well to me even worse than falling asleep was his look of shock and denial when it was brought up in the meeting. He straight out said Jason was lying about him sleeping on the job. I don't think Sam wants to be in business at all. The guy is trying to be an actor and the more he gets his face on camera the better for him, the more outrageous his antics the more camera time. The guy is a full on DAW. His brown nosing of Trump is making me ill too. But I agree the show needs an idiot to hate, so there he is.

I too thought Sam was an actor...because I couldn't bring myself to believe that a human being like him exists. So last night I was thinking that his job is to annoy as much people as possible, while he mysteriously doesn't get fired. I have to agree though that Jason deserved the boot for not meeting the client. It's one thing to make a bad decision, but its another thing to have 2 group members point out that same mistake and still ignour them.

I can't wait until the next episode...because I think we will finally see where Sam's vision will take us. As Trump said, he will either take you to the top or send you plummeting to the ground.

And another thing...don't forget the beauty and the power of editing. I've watched quite a few of these reality shows and its amazing how they can merge conversations and get us to perceive someone a certain way. Omerosa gets on my nerves almost as much as Sam but there was something about that conversation with the racist comment that didnt really convince me. But what do I know?...I guess we'll just have to wait and see the end results and then maybe some of the drama that happened during the show will be clarified.

I too thought Sam was an actor...because I couldn't bring myself to believe that a human being like him exists.

I have no doubt Sam is 100% authentic - I've met others like him.

Snarky, smart, S7 Anti-Bootee Champ

I think the show's rigged insofar as The Donald is keeping Sam around because he's good for business (and by "business" I don't mean he's going to win and be president of a Trump business) but good for reality-tv business.

When it came down to it, what's-his-face Jason made a big business mistake but made an even bigger personality mistake-- HE WAS BORING. Given two "evils" Donald picked the bland evil to go instead of the interesting-to-watch evil.

I think Sammy will go eventually, but since there are so many others that seem at least marginally competent that Trump could award the prize to, what's the real harm of keeping Sam (none--he's ratings gold). Who cares if Sam messes up their tasks? The stakes don't seem very high because the challenges aren't real (at least so far). It's just like the women last night in their silly flight attendants uniforms-- they're all playing dress up and make believe.

I expect some aspects are rigged. And Trump may be keeping Sam around to test the leadership abilities of the other contestants and/or for good television, but I think Sam's behavior is genuine.

I think Sam's behavior is due to undiagnosed and untreated bipolar disorder. For extensive explanation, please see the first post under "Sam is bipolar!"

Just wanted to note, that I disagree with the sleeping on the job will get you fired. At my old job for a reputable large soft drink company, in the marketing division,( in head office no less!) we always took cat-naps.
There were 20 of us in the one division, and if someone got tired we were in agreement, that crashing at the back, on the floor was totally acceptable !! The same way Sam did.
Of course I would use my coat as a pillow, but, hey, it was no different.
We would come back and be refreshed and of much more use to the "team".
The boss did not care if we did this as long as we got the job done, and done well, with few errors..

It would have gotten you fired if you didn't complete the task to which you were assigned, which is exactly what Sam did. And then he multipled the offense by lying about his laziness. I hope the rest of the guys beat the crap out of him when he gets back and the other guy tells them how he lied. What little creep!

From my points and also Trump's standpoint, no doubt Sam should of.

Jason is 24 years old. He is going to make mistakes like interrupting his boss or not talking to the client. With Trump's mentoring Jason he would learn from his mistakes.

Sam on the other hand as Trump mentioned is a loose cannon. He is not moldable and was disliked by all of his teammates. Working in a business environment myself I know that no task is ever performed by one person. All tasks are performed by a team.

I ask Trump? Who would you want on your team Jason or Sam.

In my opinion, yes Jason lost the account for the men (not sam), but what would you expect? Jason is basically a college kid. He will make mistakes. But Jason unlike Sam will learn from those mistakes. I think if Jason stayed he would've grown so much more as a person. Sam on the other hand i doubt.

So basically comes down to mentoring and being a teammate. If I were making the decision Jason wins hands down.

You are missing the point. Jason was the PM for this account. The bottom line: he lost the account.

What we don't know: How much was the account worth? Regardless of the amount, his ignorance cost the team the account and more importantly, him the game.

Ask yourself this question: Can you afford Jason and/or other businessmen/women to make a multimillion dollar mistake on accounts?

As I mentioned to anotherkim, Rule number one: Always ask the client what he/she wants. Remember it’s their money and their product. Never ever think that it is NOT important to ask the client for their comments and/or how they want their project completed. You’ll always fail in doing so.

Donald Trump was correct for firing Jason. (He doesn't need my approval). Sam was definitely on my ##### list for sleeping on the job, but he was not the culprit for losing the account. The PM is responsible for seeing to the entirety of the project and must accept, unequivocally, all responsibilities for the project. He's the team leader. He made a fatal mistake and in the end it cost him the job.

As for Sam, I'm flummoxed. He is a "loose cannon." He appears to have no self respect for Donald Trump and his advisors, or his team. We'll have to see what happens to him in the weeks to come.

I think you're missing the point of this challenge. Regardless of Jason's relative youth and inexperience, he is on an equal footing with every other contestant. In turn, each contestant, Jason included, has unique skills and experience relative to every other player. Some are good looking and sexy, others have more experience, and a few have a business education. If, as you said, you consider Jason to be a young and inexperienced kid, then he should have been more aware of his skills relative to those of his team memebers. This would include checking his ego and being willing to solicit and then act on the informed opinions held by others on his team that he was making a mistake by not meeting with the client. He made his first mistake by creating a plan that ignored the needs of the client. However, he still could have salvaged the plan by changing it in light of new information. More seriously, as a leader, he failed to develop a consensus among the team that the plan they would follow was sound. If there were objections to the plan, and there were, Jason should have had the answers. If he could not defend his course of action, he should have deferred to the input from others on his team with a better idea. Instead, he compounded his first mistake by taking charge over people rather than leading them, ignoring the advice of others and by not admiting that his initial plan was flawed. Jason deserved to be fired and will learn much from his mistake. However, others on the team should at least have been dressed down by "The Donald" for not sticking to their guns in defending their recommendation that a visit to the client was a necessity. Good team members don't let their boss walk in to a bear trap like that.

Well, I certainly couldn't say it any better than IceCat. I am in complete agreement. In fact, I wasn't even shocked that Sam survived. And that lack of surprise makes for rather boring television, regardless of how annoying Sam is.

IIRL, there is no friggin' way Donald Trump even considers hiring a disaster like Sam.

I don't think that it is a surprise that Sam is still there, look at the reaction it has caused! People hate him, people are amused etc... He is causing a reaction. From the viewers, and those competing with him in the show.
Perhaps Trump wants him there, because, it is like real life. Remember he mentioned that to Nick, not all members of a team will pull their weight. Live with it, its life.
Trump is probably interested to see how the other team members treat Sam, because he is a loose cannon. Maybe he is acting, to cause reactions which will give Trump insight into the others. Who knows.
However, the kid that was fired (Jason?) I can't remember his name.. anyway, he was already a target from the first board meeting when he cut Trump off and said "Let me finish".
If he is to be the apprentice , he has to listen to the Boss. That is what Trump reiterated again this time, that Jason (?) did not go to the Boss, to get clarification of what kind of ad campaign was their target.

Someone else mentioned about Sam being the project leader on the next episode and that 'now we'll see what he's made of.'

I dont think so. From the way they showed the upcoming show, the men intentionally made him leader so they could set him up to fail. And then they have a much better chance of getting rid of him (since so far, incompetance hasnt worked).

They'll make his life miserable and fail on purpose in their tasks...or at least I think that's what they have in mind...but what about the stakes? Lose for the THIRD time to the women? Maybe lose out on a great reward like flying in a private jet to a fancy restaurant?

It'll be interesting to see which wins out...saving Sam or saving their own butts.

(BTW, if I was Trump, I would have questioned why Jason gave Sam so little responsibility and not enough to do that Sam had time to go off and sleep...why didnt he use this team member better?...THAT is poor team management. From what they showed, Sam had a small, insignificant task to do, but then again, they dont always show enough.)

You guys/gals don't give Donald Trump enough credit. Donald Trump is one of the savviest, astute, and revered capitalist of the twentieth and twenty-first centuries.

I believe Donald Trump and his advisors will see right through the teams attempt to, as you said, (in not so many words) sabotage Sam's PM responsibilities for the next task. I'm certain the team will not falter or "intentially set him up to fail." It's not in their best interest and you don't give them enough credit either.

Two words for your "If I was Trump": You're NOT .

We must keep in mind who is behind this show, none other than Mark 'oh damn burn it' Burnett. He is the one who gave us "Jon, 'the guy we all love to hate', Fairplay", of Survivor Pearl Islands fame and now he is giving us two others we can grow to hate namely, "Sam" and "Omarosa". It makes for good reality tv ratings when you can keep your audience coming back for more, especially to see what is going to happen next to the two most obnoxious players. It sure appears M.B. scripted from start to finish to me.

Valley Girl
"Mr. Trump, did I mention I love your whole family". ...... "Oh Sam, you can get up now..."

If you read the end credits carefully, it says something to the effect that the producers DO have input on Donald's decision. Because of this, it should NOT be surprising that some of the more "interesting" characters last deep into the game.

That was strange that he didn't seem to phased by that guy taking a nap, but he said the bigger sin was that the project captain didn't interview the client. Important point since the guys were just taking a huge chance with their advertiser based on their nothingness.

Their ad campaign wasn't good, in fact, it was very formulated, done before yadda, yadda, yadda! The girls won AGAIN with sex, makes me ill. I hope this isn't an underlying theme for this show's competitions, it's old already.

I would have done a series of vignettes.

I'm not so sure the guy's ad campaign wasn't that good. In fact, it was staed that the guys brought the steak, the ladies brought the sizzle. Just so happens that in this case, the sizzle is what the client wanted. And that's why the guys lost. This was Jason's call.

Someone made a very good point that while The Donald has no intention of selecting Sam, he could be keeping him around as a real life "leadership test" for the rest of the players. If someone demonstartes the ability to motivate and involve Sam in some positive way, to harness his creativity and energy for the good of the team and project, well, there's the person you want to head your organization.

So lets assume Trump-like organizations actively keep on staff and utilize "employees" like Sam to use as a tool to weed out the talents/shortfalls of others, is it that there is no other way to do this?

Seems like a waste of payroll dollars and demeaning to people like Sam. I can see the want ad now,

WANTED PROFESSIONAL PATSY
Are you a liar? Do you enjoy
long hours and constant humiliation?
You must have the ability and desire
to be widely hated within the organization
and experience being a martyr
and overall parasite much desired.
No possibility for advancement.
Call 1-800-SUCKER to apply.

I suppose it could be a good idea, but there's gotta be a better way. Afterall, does Sam know about this?

LAST EDITED ON 01-17-04 AT 11:51 AM (EST)

LOL, I like that ad!

The difference here is that this is a 13-week interview, not an internship. Sam's behavior and performance wouldn't be tolerated in an employment scenario.

The best part about Sam is he isn't a hypothetical. Instead, here's a living, breathing management challenge. Everyone in the game would have some text book answer about how to deal with the Sams of the world. Trump might just be saying, "Yeah, well, show me!"

I still lean towards Sam sticking around for entertainment purposes.

For entertainment, could be. Wait and see I guess, like Trump said in the clip for the next episode to Sam, "Do you think they made him project manager in hopes that he would fail and he get the boot."

I don't think that Sam is a plant, but I'm sure that he's being kept for dramatic interest. He's the guy you love to hate... Always good for a show.

Jason made a huge mistake so I think it wasn't that hard of a decision to let him go.

Trump has admitted that he "hasn't figured Sam out yet" and has said that Sam will either be a huge success or a complete failure.

Sam makes decisons that either make or break you. Like trying to sell lemonade for $1000 a cup. He's an idiot if no one buys it and a genius if someone does. I think Trump recognizes this and is keeping him around becasue Sam he's a risk taker.

I agree with those who don't think the show is rigged. I definitely think that Sam is being kept around for entertainment value, but more than for the audience it's to keep The Donald entertained.

I am very interested in seeing how Sam does with his shot at project manager. I hope he does well, not for his sake, but because I'd love to see one of the women fired.

The Donald was on The View today. Joy asked him why he fired Jason instead of Sam. Donald said that Jason made a huge mistake not talking to the President of the company when his team was planning the ad campaign. Joy said she thought he kept Sam for ratings, but Donald side-stepped the question. Then Donald said that Sam might be the most obnoxious person he has ever met!!! Can you imagine having Trump say that about you?

When they were announcing Donald Trump they said that The Apprentice was the #1 show last week!