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"JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by mrc on 04-16-10 at 10:23 AM
Where does J.T.'s stupid and convoluted ploy to help "poor" Russell beat the "Mean Girls" rank in Survivor history?


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Messages in this discussion
"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by MissMyth on 04-16-10 at 10:43 AM
Rustle used his dark powers to replace JT's brain with that of a 12 year old girl. The only thing missing from that letter was "Do you like me? Check yes___ or no___"

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by mindy23 on 04-16-10 at 11:05 AM
>Rustle used his dark powers to
>replace JT's brain with that
>of a 12 year old
>girl. The only thing missing
>from that letter was "Do
>you like me? Check yes___
>or no___"
>
>

THAT. is hilarious!!

"RE: Poor JT-he and his bud can cry over their beers now"
Posted by mindy23 on 04-16-10 at 11:14 AM
For how many seasons has big James been known as THE dumbest Survivor, for having exited with not ONE, but TWO HII?? Well, now he can proudly give that beloved title to his BFF, JT!

And I'm sure, when he and JT sat down, hopefully, together, and watched last night's episode, over a few beers, they had a good laugh, a good cry, and a whole lot to say about RussHell, who totally took what was meant to be the hand of friendship, and stomped on it, spit on it, and smashed it right into the face of the entire Hero's Tribe!

Well done, JT. Good job of taking the heat off of your bud. Let's see how long YOU get to carry the title of DSE (as in dumbest survivor ever)! Better yet, can't wait to see what actually happens now that you've seen the plan didn't go as 'planned'. You may actually lose that title before the show is over, IF you and your Hero buddies put your brains together and play it right.

But let this be a warning: RussHell is not one to be toyed with. Or even befriended!


"RE: Poor JT-he and his bud can cry over their beers now"
Posted by PepeLePew13 on 04-16-10 at 04:41 PM
>a good cry, and a whole
>lot to say about RussHell,
>who totally took what was
>meant to be the hand
>of friendship, and stomped on
>it, spit on it, and
>smashed it right into the
>face of the entire Hero's
>Tribe!

Well, actually, no. He didn't ask for the HII and he didn't have anything to do with the HII being handed to him -- JT and the Heroes came up with the hare-brained plan all on their own and they willingly coughed it up without securing a promise from Russhole. Yes, Russhole nodded his head during Colby's spiel while they were waiting for their turns on the obstacle course, but what was he supposed to do, say "ahh, no, I pass"? He just nodded and didn't say much of anything. He didn't say "Yes, I promise to go with you guys to the end."

So technically he didn't do any stomping on the hand of friendship because he didn't agree to anything in the first place.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by kingfish on 04-16-10 at 12:23 PM
And once again I proved to myself that Yelling "NOOOOO..Don't Do It" at the TV does absolutely no good whatsoever.

You would think that I'd know better by now after all those idiots went down into the cellar or opened those closed doors or coffin lids inspite of my warnings.

I still think James holds the title, and even Eric's idiocy ranks him ahead of JT, though.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Snidget on 04-16-10 at 12:29 PM
Dalton Ross does a recap over on EW.com. He had a similar reaction to you.

Watching J.T. write his little love letter to Russell to include with the idol was like watching a horror movie, causing me to scream at the TV screen, ''No! Put the writing utensil down! Don't you understand? He's gonna take that immunity idol and stab you with it until you're dead. And then he's gonna do the happy troll dance on top of your body, repeating his first and last names ad nauseam!''

http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20354695_20361438_3,00.html

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Brownroach on 04-16-10 at 01:02 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-16-10 AT 01:21 PM (EST)

The idea had some logic to it, but ultimately it was bad for several reasons:

1) As Amanda pointed out, they really didn't know for sure that an all-female alliance was in charge. And even if there was, they didn't know for sure that they couldn't flip any of them at the merge -- someone would have to be #5 in the group.

2) At least make sure you're passing the idol to a known quantity, where you have some gauge of their trustworthiness --- not someone you've never seen play before. They don't know anything about Russell, but they do know that, hello?, he was put on the VILLAINS tribe.


A tribe glows in Brooklyn

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by samboohoo on 04-16-10 at 02:13 PM
Agree completely with you.


Samboobree, brought to life by Arkie


"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by tribephyl on 04-16-10 at 03:40 PM
Without a doubt, in my opinion, JT's move firmly places him at the apex of stupidity.
Specially considering all of the other dangdumbest moves were usually precipitated by OTHER people.
Erik was swayed by Natalie's story.
Ian was berated by both Tom and Katie.
Even James keeping his idols was precipitated by his "trusted" alliancemates making him believe he didn't need to use them.

And in JT's defense, giving away an idol, SO FAR, has always resulted in a positive experience for the givee.
When Jenna gave her necklace to Heidi, she insured Christy got voted out, paving the way for Jenna to win.
When Todd gave his idol to James, as we know, it didn't work out for James, but Todd went on to win.
When Russell gave his idol to Parvati, while we don't know the final outcome, I dare say they both are headed for the finals.

The only time it really hasn't worked out was when Sugar used it on Matty. While it did allow for Sugar to make the finals, it didn't give her any credence with the jury.

Now, JT's big problem lies with the simple fact that his move is based in assumptions. He assumes Russell is on the outs, he assumes the ladies run the tribe. And as with all assumptions it does nothing but amplify the lack of knowledge of the assumer.
JT is ultimately the "stupidest" because he's made up a story to hang his strategy off of.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by michel on 04-16-10 at 05:57 PM
"Erik was swayed by Natalie's story"

Natalie told the story but it was Cirie's story!

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by dabo on 04-23-10 at 03:11 PM
Well, too, stupid as Erik's move was, he had virtually no chance of winning at that point. I'd still say on merit it was the dumbest single move. JT going all in on such a high risk play, under other circumstances it had a slim chance of working; and the rest of the Heroes should have equal shares in the blame for banking on it.
"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by PsychoKitty on 04-16-10 at 05:15 PM
I just couldn't believe my eyes either! In thinking about it, JT really needs to give his million dollars to Stephen - because he just PROVED that Stephen should have really won that season!!!! He had no business jumping to those conclusions and making that decision.

And onto the group - as far as we can tell only Amanda raised a warning bell on the plan, but it doesn't look like she really tried to stop it. Everyone else thought it was great, or at least not worth bothering to stop it. And I couldn't believe Colby - showing more spark than he has for most of the season! - reaching out to Russell and telling him the plan. Amazing!!!! And all this while Pervarty and Danielle already have their own idol! ;)

The plot thickens!!! And I'm sure Stephen was screaming at his TV last night too!!!


Not that I have an opinion one way or another ;)
Signature by tribephyl

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by michel on 04-16-10 at 06:16 PM
Up to now, JT simply took a huge risk in order to insure the numbers advantage at the merge. It didn't work but none of Heroes has been eliminated. James, Erik and Jason's dumb moves caused their immediate elimination. James had some reason to believe Todd. Erik and Jason had no real connection with the ones that convinced them to take the risk so they will always share top billing for dumbest move ever.

This season, the Heroes will deserve to be called stupid if they fail to read the proper tribal dynamics after the merge. In effect, having given the idol should help decipher who is telling the truth and who isn't. Seeing Russell and Parvati walking in together at the merge should tell the Heroes to rethink their whole plan. The idol can be so easily flushed out that giving it away isn't fatal. Misreading people is.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by iltarion on 04-16-10 at 06:57 PM

I agree with michel here, proving it does happen.

Also.

Ian's move was not stupid. If he decided that his friendships and looking noble on TV was more important than a million dollars, who can quantify those things to prove him wrong? If Ian today says it was a stupid move, then fine.

JT has won this game, booted Cirie, and provided plenty of other evidence of the fact that he is a fairly intelligent guy. So, is he the dumbest Survivor ever? Not even close. Shouldn't even be put in that discussion. Is this the dumbest move we've ever seen? Maybe. But it is extremely easy for us sitting on our couches, knowing what is going on with the Villians and having seen two seasons of Russell to judge. It was a risk, and risks in Survivor often need to be taken. In my opinion, it was a poorly calculated risk. Amanda said it exactly. You don't KNOW what is going on over there. But again, that is easy for me to say from the cheap seats.

>

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Brownroach on 04-19-10 at 01:25 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-19-10 AT 01:32 PM (EST)

They didn't weigh all the variables (or at least we didn't see it).

For example, even if they had the part about the female alliance right, RussHell could advertise that he has an HII and use it as leverage to build a new alliance and get someone else booted. He wouldn't necessarily have to play the idol at TC.

And, someone else on the Villains tribe might already be in possession of an idol -- maybe even RussHell himself by the time of the Immunity Challenge, if there was a clue at the Outback Steak reward and RussHell was lucky enough to find it.

It should have occurred to the Heroes that the Villains could potentially come into the merge with two HII's (as we know they are doing), while the Heroes would have given away the only one they had.

I don't think it was the stupidest move ever since as you say sometimes risks need to be taken but I agree this was a poorly calculated risk.


A tribe glows in Brooklyn

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Belle Book on 04-16-10 at 08:36 PM
I'd put it behind Erik's giving individual Immunity to Natalie and maybe behind James's failure to play either of his Hidden Immunity Idols for a very good reason: J.T. is capable of strategy. Even if I'm mad at J.T. for getting rid of Cirie, I realize it was a smart move. Neither Erik nor James are strategic people. And Erik was especially vulnerable to manipulation by people he looked up to -- and Cirie was one he looked up to, which made it easy for her to manipulate him.

Where J.T. went wrong here involves assumptions. He and Rupert (not a great strategist either) assumed that there was an all-female alliance after Boston Rob went to Sequesterville. He probably did so because Parvati had formed a successful all-female alliance in Fans vs. Favorites. That had some logic -- but the assumption was faulty. And J.T. wasn't able to listen to anyone who told him that his assumption might be all wrong. And when he & Rupert blurted it out, RussHell naturally took advantage of it. It was an idiotic move for sure, but it was that way because J.T. made a false assumption.


"POSTS REMOVED"
Posted by Bebo on 04-17-10 at 06:06 PM
Posting spoiler information in the Bashers and Fanatics forums is not permitted here - we have banned people for this behavior in the past.
"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by suzzee on 04-21-10 at 11:57 AM
I think he certainly suffers without Stephen by his side. His speculation that there is a woman's alliance eliminating the men is valid from what he sees as far as he sees it. He's convinced himself that it is and I'm not sure anyone of them could talk him out of it. I don't think Amanda tried regardless of her confessional statements. Stephen could have talked him out of it but JT hasn't got a partner this season.

He never saw Russell play and I'm sure he thinks a fellow Texan will go with the man tribe, he's TEXAN for Bob sake. And that's his mistake.

If the idol pass works like JT thinks it will then it would go down as the greatest play of the season. If not then it will be a gufu of major proportions.



agman makes me hot

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by mrc on 04-23-10 at 03:04 PM
Maybe not the dumbest, but he's pretty darn close.


"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Puffy on 04-23-10 at 09:17 PM
There was a possibility that the Heroes would have voted for Parvati. So giving away two immunity idols would have been dumb on her part. Luckily, she guessed that they wouldn't vote for her and she's a genius instead of the dumbest survivor ever.




"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by finallytyping on 04-24-10 at 00:06 AM
I felt bad for J.T. right up to the point when he adamantly said, "never trust women."
It seems to me Russell took him out of the game. Maybe J.T. knows something about Russell that we don't know. Is he really Russella? J.T. you are an idiot from every perspective.
"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by JessicaRN on 04-24-10 at 00:10 AM
I like when JT explained that he was doing the strategizing for Rupert. I actually felt sorry for JT as this all played out. He has a lot to live down. James can thank him for replacing him as the dumbest ever.
"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by MizJazmine on 04-24-10 at 02:09 AM
>I felt bad for J.T. right
>up to the point when
>he adamantly said, "never trust
>women."
> J.T.
>you are an idiot from
>every perspective.

I was feeling bad for JT too until he made that stupid women statement. Then I thought, he really is an idiot! What was JT's loyalty to and belief in Russell all about? Russell didn't care anything about JT. I mean really....

"JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever? No"
Posted by michel on 04-24-10 at 03:16 AM
Now that we can analyze the move in its entirety, I must say that it can't be considered the stupidest move ever. First of all, if JT had been right, it would have automatically guaranteed him a place in the finale. Knowing his skills in challenges and in jury manipulation, had he made it there he'd be the favorite to win. A million for an idol isn't a bad trade.

When he realized he was wrong, or actually when Rupert convinced him something was wrong, he did react appropriately, changing the target from Parvati to Jerri. That move had Russell fooled. We know this because the troll gave his HII to Parvati, convinced she was the target. The odds were still in JT's favor. Was it Amanda's poor poker face, Parvati's ability to see through the lie or some unknown factor that enabled Parvati to counter the move? It took a great move by Parvati to vote out JT so, to me, that means JT's move was worth a shot.


If Erik had kept immunity, he would have been in the F4 against Amanda, Cirie and Parvati, meaning only 2 IC wins away from the million. He had nothing to gain by giving his necklace to Natalie. That is by far the stupidest move ever and Jason not using his HII after seeing Ozzy leave with one in pocket still ranks second. Alex Bell is third, then comes James and many others before JT.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever? No"
Posted by Belle Book on 04-24-10 at 12:29 PM
I agree -- J.T. wasn't the dumbest Survivor ever, but it was a bad move nonetheless. Erik still keeps his title as the dumbest Survivor ever.


"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever? No"
Posted by Spanky68 on 04-26-10 at 03:32 PM
I agree with Michel, too.

It was the most PAINFUL to watch, because I like JT. But it doesn't make him the dumbest contestant ever.

I think that his performance in Tocantins marked him as smart. And while this move was certainly dumb, remember that we know 100 times more about Russhell than JT does.

JT was filming Heroes V. Villians when Samoa was being aired. So JT had no idea that Russhell was a master manipulator when he encountered him this season.

And I think you need to draw the distinction between "dumbest move ever" (this one was near the top, though I think that Erik's move was the single dumbest) and "dumbest survivor ever". Because even relatively intelligent people have a brain cramp once in a while that makes them look dumb.

Now if JT had been acting braindead for the whole two seasons he'd been on the show, you might be right.


Agman made this fancy sig for me

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever? No"
Posted by CTgirl on 04-27-10 at 08:58 AM
I agree with you three. JT made a stupid move but I will always remember him as being the winner of Tocantins. He was smart enough to align himself with Stephen and then manipulated the jury into giving him all the credit and the title of sole survivor. Now Erik on the other hand...
"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever? No"
Posted by samboohoo on 04-27-10 at 12:48 PM
Agree.


Samboobree, brought to life by Arkie


"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by frisky on 04-27-10 at 12:56 PM
I still don't get why JT switched the target to Jerri. Why not just vote for Parvati? Did he know that Pervy had an idol and was going to use it? I don't get why the switch was made. Was it because of Rupert's info from Sandra? Or because of Amanda's info from Parvati?

All those immunity idols got me so confused.


Perpetual *headbutt* compliments of Rolly.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Brownroach on 04-27-10 at 01:34 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-27-10 AT 02:42 PM (EST)

They knew from Amanda that Parvati had an idol. The plan was to get Parvati to play the idol (hence Amanda's little visit) while they voted for someone else. That way the idol play wouldn't nullify the Heroes' votes.

But they needed to keep RussHell in the dark, so they told RussHell they were voting for Sandra. Thus they figured that if Parvati decided to give the idol to someone else to play, she'd likely give it to Sandra (having been informed by RussHell), not Jerri. It was a way of winnowing down their prospects for who wouldn't play the idol. They voted for Jerri thinking that either Parvati would play it or Sandra would -- either way, JT would be safe (at least until the revote) and the idol would be gone.

I still think they should have just voted for RussHell.

(Edited for fine tuning.)


A tribe glows in Brooklyn

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by frisky on 04-27-10 at 11:58 PM
Thanks, Brownroach. That makes sense (your explanation, not the strategy LOL).

With that convoluted plan in the works, I really have to hand it to Parvati. Well played. She shocked everyone, too, except for Danielle.


Perpetual *headbutt* compliments of Rolly.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Colonel Zoidberg on 04-27-10 at 05:27 PM
I'll put it this way.

When Todd convinced James he was safe, James committed a dumb move - he didn't play one of his two idols. What did the tribe do in response? Just vote him off.

When the Black Widows convinced Erik to give up immunity, Erik committed a dumb move - he handed over immunity to Natalie. What did the tribe do in response? Just vote him off.

When Russell convinced J.T. that there was a female alliance on the Villains camp, J.T. committed a dumb move - he passed his idol to Russell. What did the tribe do in response? Russell handed the idol to Parvati, who passed an idol to Sandra and another to Jerri, which nullified the Heroes' votes, and as a result, a 5-5 vote was rendered null and void.

It took a much better move to get rid of J.T. than it did to get rid of James and Erik.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by michel on 04-27-10 at 06:28 PM
I totally agree with this.
BTW: Where do you rate Alex telling Rob: "Sorry but we'll have to vote you out at 4"?
That one was done without any outside help.
What about Lex's gut vote against Kelly?
Or Sean thinking that his alphabet strategy wouldn't anger anyone and wouldn't hurt anyone when it actually got everyone to hate him and it killed any chance to overturn the Tagi4?

Some good old-fashioned dumb moves are forgotten for the newer dumb plays with idols.

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by iltarion on 04-27-10 at 06:50 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-27-10 AT 06:55 PM (EST)

Burton basically cut his own throat instead of coasting for a win when he refused to assure Lil they were good for F2.

The Heroes made the smartest vote possible if you don't factor in hindsight. Russell had an idol. Parvati had an idol. Danielle had immunity. Sandra or Jerri were the obvious boots, and with Russell being told it was going to be Sandra, voting Jerri made the most sense for nearly every reason imaginable.

Sure, from our POV turning on Russell might have been the best move, but from theirs, it was far more risky than voting for Sandra or Jerri. Sandra COULD have been lying to them. She is certainly capable. And Russell could have played his idol. With him, you never know.

With potentially 3 Villians immune from the vote, the Heroes were facing long odds regardless of who they voted for. Frankly, the fact that both HIIs got played was a big bonus for the Heroes.

The Heroes did nothing wrong at TC. Their errors were made when JT gave the Villians another HII and when they all but handed Danielle immunity.

Here is some small advice: if you are facing a potential 5-5 vote, WIN the IC!!

>

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by michel on 04-27-10 at 08:55 PM
Thanks for reminding us of Burton, the only guy who got blindsided twice in one season. He wanted his tribe to throw a challenge so they used the opportunity to vote him out. Priceless!
"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Brownroach on 04-28-10 at 03:29 PM
LAST EDITED ON 04-28-10 AT 05:52 PM (EST)

Sure, from our POV turning on Russell might have been the best move, but from theirs, it was far more risky than voting for Sandra or Jerri. Sandra COULD have been lying to them. She is certainly capable. And Russell could have played his idol. With him, you never know.

I also think the boys probably feared that if they got rid of RussHell then Candice and Amanda would definitely jump and a real Woman's Alliance would take over. So they kept clinging to a shred of hope that RussHell would help them, even in the face of all the evidence to the contrary.


A tribe glows in Brooklyn

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by Colonel Zoidberg on 04-28-10 at 03:02 PM
Alex's move, if I recall correctly, was considered the dumbest move of Amazon. The other two moves mentioned (Lex's vote for Kelly, Sean's alphabet strategy) were dumb, but there were ones considered dumber (Silas splitting the Samburu tribe and Pagong's stubborn refusal to vote in an alliance pattern come to mind.)

Every season, it seems like, has that crown jewel of stupidity. Rotu's arrogant reveal of the post-merge boot order. Shii Ann flipping to Chuay Gahn without so much as the word "merge" being uttered by the Jeff. Lex sparing Amber. Ami and Leann scaring off Twila. Coby giving up immunity. Nakum letting Danni have an immunity advantage. Candice and Jonathan flipping tribes. Dreamz taking the car. James holding onto two immunity idols. Sugar's overall arrogant attitude, coupled with whatever the hell happened to that damn cookie. Timbira's meltdown. Galu cutting Erik's throat. J.T. passing off an immunity idol.

And my two personal favorites - Burton convincing Drake to throw an immunity challenge (for no other reason than that they got bored with winning,) and Erik handing over immunity at Tribal Council.

I've thought about doing an NCAA-style bracket of the 64 stupidest moves in Survivor history, but seeding would be an absolute nightmare...

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by udg on 04-30-10 at 02:46 PM
Seeding could be done via nominations. Most noms = #1 seed, on down the line.


Slice n' Dice's Sigpic Chop Shop 2004

"RE: JT: Dumbest Survivor Ever?"
Posted by LibraRising on 04-30-10 at 04:20 PM
Brandon getting rid of Kelly instead of Lex is still up there, too -- especially since he was largely responsible for stroking the Kelly/Lex rift in the first place (along with Teresa's throw-away vote for Lex) and just didn't do what would have been the brilliant, natural follow through that likely would have made him final 3 at least. I know Frank was an odious person, but still...nothing wrong with strange bedfellows!


A kyngsladye klassic with an IceCat chaser

"Thanks, America!"
Posted by mrc on 05-17-10 at 10:47 AM
You believed in JT.