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PLEASE NOTE: The Reality TV World Message Boards are filled with desperate
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"Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!"
iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-05-10, 02:11 AM (EST)
 
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"Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
HAHAHAHA!!! I haven't been that pumped at a TC since... I don't know... Maybe when Amanda used the HII in Micronesia... Maybe never. That was unbelievable.Hey, Cirie, how do you like the blindside? Props for taking your own medicine with dignity. I have always said that the gutsiest move in Survivor history was Tom and Ian being willing to force the tie to boot Gregg. Well, that just got beat. Tom was once again involved, but the entire merit badge for courage goes to JT. If just one person who was supposed to vote for Tom mistakenly votes for Colby, or if just one person who was supposed to vote for Tom decides voting for him was a waste and voted for Colby instead, or Coby if you wish, or if anyone in his alliance gets wise to what JT is planning... the point here is that there were several things that could have gone wrong. And even if everything goes perfectly to plan, which it did, JT is still left with an alliance of 3 and 4 ticked off tribemates who he just betrayed. Instead, JT throws away his cozy spot in his alliance to get rid of Cirie? Now, that's a BOLD move. Hats off to the young man. This man was born to play. Props to Tom for detailing the entire plan and finishing it with- "Tomorrow we make our apologies tonight we make our move." Great quote. Of course, it really only applied to JT. Of course, this is fantastic to me on several levels. First and foremost, Amanda once again makes it farther than Cirie. Sorry. That's twice now. Spin it, analyze it, break it down however you want. Make your excuses. None of that changes that fact. Secondly, having Cirie getting blindsided is just perfect. And lastly, Tom and Cirie were set up in opposition in Episode 1, seeing Tom, the honest leader, come out on top against the UTR manipulator is a victory for everything I love about Survivor. Certainly, not for everyone, but for me, a sweet victory. Props to Tom and Colby for not even cracking a smile after pulling off one of the biggest blindsides in history. Props to Amanda and Cirie for at least sensing danger and not appearing overconfident. No props to Rupert and Candice who laughed overconfidently when Tom played the HII. Now, the only way this season could get better is for Parvati to be next. P.O >
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jbug 16685 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-05-10, 09:46 AM (EST)
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1. "RE: Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
Yes, a great TC!When any of Ciere's gang try to get in JT's face after TC (if that is any of them have any play in them to try to do so), I'd like to hear JT......
Well, Amanda, it could have been you instead of Ciere. You were the one who ran off to Ciere & told her of our plan to oust Candice. Just be thankful we all know that you don't have any real strategy plans and that Ciere was the handler of you all. Candice, you know it was you at first, right? No one likes you; no one trusts you; you're useless. The only reason we went for Ciere instead is because she's got game! You are dispensible at any time. James, oh James. You want to win? & you think getting rid of one of the strongest men will help you do that? You didn't learn much last time, did you. Oh that's right, you were the one sent packing w/ 2 idols in your pocket. 
for talking a lot? me? Jan 2010
I realize these comments are better suited to the "be the" character but ......
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samboohoo 17075 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-05-10, 10:10 AM (EST)
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2. "RE: Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
LOL. Agree.I liked Cirie her first season. I loved Cirie in Fans v. Favorites and thought she was clearly robbed of winning. I didn't like Cirie at all this season. And, since this is fanatics, Tom & Colby have never been more hotter than they were last night. Ahhh, my brilliant brutes! 
Samboobree, brought to life by Arkie
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PepeLePew13 24731 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-05-10, 01:55 PM (EST)
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7. "RE: Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
Right, and I'm sure the thinking was that if there was a tie, they could then go ahead and put all of their votes on the other guy, making it a 5-3 vote instead of a 3-2-3 vote.
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Tublecane 141 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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03-05-10, 06:16 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
"You can tell that they don't know much about him, but her comment about him being a 'dumbass' for looking for the idol is kind of ironic, when it comes to Russell." They (that is, Sandra and Rob) are at a disadvantage, having never played with hidden idols before. Intimidating people out of looking for it doesn't work. All you're accomplishing is making sure only the hard-headed ones like Russell bother looking, which gives them all the power. And so what if it stigmatizes them? Go ahead, force them to play it. But don't be surprised when votes bounce back, like they tend to do. Not that it'll end up harming Sandra, necessarily. But it will harm someone, I'd wager.
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KuwabaraTheMan 47 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
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03-05-10, 01:21 PM (EST)
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6. "RE: Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
I was hoping Cirie would make it further, but I was definitely impressed with JT's play. He's definitely doing a great job of playing a very strategic game and getting rid of his potential rivals.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-05-10, 02:58 PM (EST)
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8. "RE: Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
Actually, with JT's complicity, they were dead in the water regardless. Even if they all decided to vote for Coby, JT simply would have told Tom to give Colby the idol. Just like Dreamz did to the 4 Horse's Patutes. The only way any of it could have worked is if they kept JT in the dark, and no one even considered that.I have not been a fan of Rupert's this whole season, but I agree with Jeff that Rupert's comment in TC was one of the more honest we've heard. When Rupert refused to break his word, he actually looked like a hero for the first time this season. I'd like to point out a couple other things about that exchange however. 1) As I have said about 10 times already, the Heroes are not getting beat due to strength. Colby had a hand in the RC loss and Tom was instrumental in the IC loss. Therefore, JP going on and on about the idiocy of booting the strong didn't apply to their situation. Is it possible JP and production simply don't want the stronger tribemembers being booted early? Is it possible production WANTS the challenges to mean something? You have to admit there has been a trend of JP complaining in TC about this very thing for the last so many seasons now. 2) JP said "Outlast, outwit, outplay" and got into Rupert like him keeping his word and having a sense of integrity was counterintuitive. They are not. One can outwit and outplay with integrity. JT didn't outwit Cirie because he lied or deceived her. He outwitted her by realizing that Tom and Colby are more likely to keep their word than her, and by realizing that like Tom, Cirie would look to get rid of JT as soon as it was expedient. If she wanted to get rid of Tom because as she said, he was "charismatic, athletic and has already won this game once," then how long before she wants JT gone? JT recognized Cirie as a greater threat than Tom, especially when she showed to have more influence over Amanda and James than JT had. CIrie never recognized JT as such, and that is how JT outwitted her. JT outplayed her by taking advantage of their 3-3 vote strategy to turn the tables. Now, I'm not saying JT has played this season with integrity. I'm just pointing out that his lack of integrity had nothing to do with outplaying Cirie. >
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-05-10, 09:07 PM (EST)
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12. "Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
"First and foremost, Amanda once again makes it farther than Cirie. Sorry. That's twice now. Spin it, analyze it, break it down however you want. Make your excuses"Excuses? I took it as proof of what I've been saying all along. In a tribe full of big personnalities including some great winners, Cirie was recognized as the mastermind. From being in a swing vote position, she quite easily managed to find herself leading the majority alliance of her tribe. That was the proof she is a great player. It took an immunity idol once again to eliminate her. That, and a very gutsy move by JT. Cirie had to consider everyone's best move and JT going to Tom and Colby was very risky. There are still 4 players in the wishy-washy alliance so nothing is certain. CT underestimated JT's readiness to gamble and he pulled a "Cirie" on Cirie. I've always said Cirie was the best strategist ever and I had JT as the best winner ever so it was truly a battle of titans. Great TC except for Probst. Say it Jeff that you think women don't deserve to play. Survivor has ALWAYS been about alliances and having all that muscle hasn't helped the Heroes, has it? Amanda? Again we heard that she isn't that smart. Amanda had 2 choices: Stay with her alliance or go with Tom. What did she do? The worst thing she could: Promising to go with Tom but not doing so. Placing ahead of someone isn't proof of much especially when the vote was decided on which player was more dangerous. If Amanda wins, you'll have a point. Right now, she could be next. 
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Jims02 7328 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-05-10, 10:02 PM (EST)
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14. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
I agree with this.Also, it's worth noting how little Colby really did to save himself. Tom gets some credit for finding the Immunity Idol and making a deal with JT earlier on. Still, this week was almost completely due to JT, not Tom or Colby. I do think it was a questionable play by JT, though, for a couple reasons. On a self-preservation level, he risks Amanda/James/Rupert/Candice turning on him immediately. Granted, it would take only grabbing one of them on his side to keep the numbers with Tom/Colby, but it's still a definite risk. Especially after blindsiding all four of them. Why put yourself in a minority alliance when you're already on top? If you want to keep Tom, try getting out Candice next week. Or just sacrifice him. Second, there's the tribal side of it. We've seen time after time after time after time that a splintered tribe can get completely swallowed when a merge comes. Having all these two-people alliances hanging around is messy, and just gives the other tribe more room to take the upper hand. Of course, the "splintered tribe" tends be a scarier problem when your tribe has more people at the merge (see Rotu, Timbira), which hasn't been the case for the Heroes thus far. 
A 2003 IceCat original
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garcor 432 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Daytime Soap Guest Star"
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03-05-10, 11:17 PM (EST)
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16. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
Funny how Cirie in her interview on this site says JT was running the alliance, while JT told Tom the other night that he had lost control after Cirie persuaded Amanda and James to go back to the original vote against Colby or Tom. Wonder if either was really in charge; probably not; they were taking turns trying to push Amanda/James/Rupert to vote one way or another. And neither trusted the other at all. If Cirie was honest in her interview, she wanted an alliance with Tom but he only considered it after he realized he was outnumbered. Makes most of the drama over voting sound like a Cirie/JT tug of war.
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KuwabaraTheMan 47 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Beauty Pageant Celebrity Judge"
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03-06-10, 00:22 AM (EST)
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17. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
It was a questionable move, but I think it made sense for his game. This was JT's only chance to get rid of Cirie, so he needed to make that move. I think it's hard to say if he'll even stick with Tom and Colby; he may have only acted with them to get rid of Cirie.He'll have to answer for what he did, but if he's smart (and if there's one thing JT is, it's great at talking to people and getting them on his side), he can spin it to James/Rupert/Amanda as making the best move for them, because of Cirie being an untrustworthy player. My initial thought had been that he might try and blame Candice, but she was one of the ones voting for Tom, so there's no chance of that. Still, while he made a risky move, I think if there's any player in Survivor history who can get people back on his side right after doing that, it's JT (well, him and Chris).
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-05-10, 10:12 PM (EST)
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15. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-05-10 AT 10:47 PM (EST)Hahaha... yeah, the game is a lot more difficult when people see you as a threat. Seems to be the same thing I've been saying for years. Amanda might be next, but she still made it farther than Cirie. I am quite enjoying you taking the other side of the argument for once. Give Cirie credit. The only reason she was booted first is because she's a bigger threat. Haha... Yeah, that's the argument I've been making as long as I've been posting. The greatest strategist in Survivor history should be able to make the Finals once in 3 seasons, right? In my book they do. Let's keep it real now. Cirie is a great strategic and social player, but the results speak for themselves. Yeah, Cirie said Amanda wasn't too smart, and then she was immediately blindsided. So, that means a lot. Oh, and yes, the women will always be defended as long as michel is around. I'm sure JP knows as I do that there would be no show without women being on it. I would stop watching, that's for sure. But the show was originally constructed in two parts. The first part is supposed to put a premium on challenges and surviving the elements, and the second part is supposed to put a premium on social game, including the all important FTC. In recent years, the first part of the game has become more and more meaningless. It is possible that JP and MB would prefer that the game returned to more of what they originally had in mind. OR, JP could just be saying whatever he thinks might push buttons. That could be it too. And lastly, Jims02, great post. Risky, oh yes. For all the reasons you just stated. But Cirie, by her own words, would eventually look to get rid of JT. Tom and Colby can both be trusted. The risk was worth the reward. Great frickin move by JT, though, ultimately, the results will tell the tale. Just to say one more thing about Amanda, as I'm watching this for the 3rd time now, and yes, I can always be counted on to defend Amanda. Cirie was trying to make the point that Amanda was stupid to want to keep Tom around. Wrong. Tom is bad for CIRIE'S game, not Amanda's. See, that's why an alliance with Cirie was ill-fated from the get-go for Amanda. Amanda's game is latching on to someone she can trust. She should have just stuck with her game and latched on to Tom or JT from the beginning. Cirie can not be trusted. Cirie tried to vote Amanda out in Micronesia. Amanda knows that. On the otherhand, people want to blame Amanda for vacillating, but when Cirie and James are your original alliance but Tom and JT are the smarter play, what would you do? It would have taken a helluva lot of guts for Amanda to turn her back on Cirie and James. So, when James agreed to vote Candice and Cirie wasn't there, I'm sure that seemed like the best thing to do. But then she talks with Cirie and Cirie goes crazy, James changes his mind about it, what is Amanda supposed to do? No one has that kind of guts. Unless they are JT.
>
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PepeLePew13 24731 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-08-10, 10:07 AM (EST)
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26. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
So? Sandra was equally atrocious in the challenges, and she won her season. A winner knows how to put hirself into position to be able to win, whether he/she is pulling the strings or not.
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Tublecane 141 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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03-12-10, 01:44 PM (EST)
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33. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-12-10 AT 01:49 PM (EST)"You could argue that Sandra did a brilliant job of maneuvering things so that she literally had a dream final four in place - she only had to worry about getting past Fairplay, Big Lill and Mute Darrah, while all of the other potential vote-grabbers were gone on the jury." Her only maneuver, really, was ousting Burton. I'd say she moreso fell into the final four. If you'll recall, her gameplan went kaput when Rupert left. Johnny and Burton controlled the vote for two tribals (or at least got their way with Tijuana and Christa), before Sandra corralled the ladies. Which was a smart move, I guess. Only Burton wasn't the challenge monster at that point, Darrah was. When you think about, it was more of a nightmare F4 for Sandra. Every single one of them could easily beat her at challenges (to be fair, basically everyone else that season could, too), and Lill and Johnny were the first and second greatest goats--Lill for having been voted out and Johnny for being a horrible human being--of all time. Sandra might've beaten Darrah, I don't remember well enough. But what does it matter? Do you think Darrah ever would've taken her? The only thing Sandra had going for her is that Lill is crazy. If she doesn't decided deliberately not to win, Sandra's toast. And relying on people to be crazy isn't a great place to maneuver yourself into.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-12-10, 05:54 PM (EST)
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34. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
Quite right. Burton goes on a reward with Lil. She asks him if they are still solid for F2 because she is afraid JFP has taken her place. Burton, in one of the more idiotic moves in Survivor history, tells her he doesn't know, which basically confirms her paranoia. Burton wins reward the next episode and takes JFP instead of Lil, sending the both of them on a boat ride while the 3 women go back to camp. So, we are supposed to give the women credit for realizing 3 is greater than 2? Of course, Sandra and Darrah are going to talk to Lil about joining them; they were on the outs. Lil was the one that was in the majority alliance. Because of Burton's idiocy, Lil joins the women, no brainer, literally, all around. Russell Hantz in S19 could have won a vote against Lil. She was an OUTCAST and annoying on top of it.
>
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-06-10, 03:51 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
>Hahaha... yeah, the game is a
>lot more difficult when people
>see you as a threat.
>Seems to be the same
>thing I've been saying for
>years.
>Amanda might be next, but she
>still made it farther than
>Cirie. I am quite enjoying
>you taking the other
>side of the argument for
>once. Give Cirie credit. The
>only reason she was booted
>first is because she's a
>bigger threat. Haha... Yeah, that's
>the argument I've been making
>as long as I've been
>posting. I'm not sure where you're getting at? What "other side" am I taking? That you have to vote out threats? I never said you shouldn't but maybe that the timing is crucial or we disagreed on what makes a player a threat. >The greatest strategist in Survivor history
>should be able to make
>the Finals once in 3
>seasons, right? In my book
>they do. Let's keep it
>real now. Cirie is a
>great strategic and social player,
>but the results speak for
>themselves. In a game full of great players, Cirie's name was the one most often mentioned in pre-show interviews as one to eliminate. Did she have a chance? Surprisingly, yes if JT had been a little less of a gambler.
>Oh, and yes, the women will
>always be defended as long
>as michel is around.
Try surviving without women!!! Seriously, I can appreciate the multiple strategies they bring to the game. >the show was originally constructed
>in two parts. The first
>part is supposed to put
>a premium on challenges and
>surviving the elements, and the
>second part is supposed to
>put a premium on social
>game, including the all important
>FTC. In recent years, the
>first part of the game
>has become more and more
>meaningless. It is possible that
>JP and MB would prefer
>that the game returned to
>more of what they originally
>had in mind. This is the point I really want to tackle because this is completely false. Since Palau, we've had bloated casts, prolonged pre-merge and much more physical challenges. Palau, Cook Islands and Fiji even had delayed merges, the game becoming individual at F9 even if they started with more than 18 players. As a result, women have been put in an unfair position. If they wanted to return to the original format, it's easy: 16 players, challenges balanced for both genders and a merge at 10. Oh yes, Women won 4 of the 7 original format so maybe that's why we've had the changes. And, Tublecane, much more than lack of challenge ability, Cirie lost because Terry and Aras were both immune at F4 (a stupid twist) and because the producers changed from a F3 to a F2 format in Micronesia after James' medevac. Without that, she probably wins both seasons.
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iltarion 1791 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Herbal Healing Drugs Endorser"
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03-06-10, 05:20 PM (EST)
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20. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
LAST EDITED ON 03-06-10 AT 05:22 PM (EST)LAST EDITED ON 03-06-10 AT 05:21 PM (EST) "Try surviving without women!!! Seriously, I can appreciate the multiple strategies they bring to the game." Men don't bring 'multiple strategies' to the game? I appreciate EVERYTHING women bring to the game. "This is the point I really want to tackle because this is completely false. Since Palau, we've had bloated casts, prolonged pre-merge and much more physical challenges. Palau, Cook Islands and Fiji..." False? 100% not. But I think a big difference between our two arguments is my definition of "recent years" as your allusion to Palau and Cook Islands illustrates. By recent years, I meant like the last two or three, not near as far back Palau. Here is my point- last season: won by Natalie though her tribe lost, badly, the first half of the game. Season 18: won by JT though his tribe also lost the 1st half of the game. Season 17, 16, and 15: tribal switches made 1st half of the game somewhat meaningless Season 14: won by Earl, whose team was infamously decimated before a late tribal swtich of sorts. So, yes, being on a tribe that gets whooped before merge has lately, especially in the last two seasons, meant nothing. If you can win regardless of what happens premerge, then viewers might as well just start skipping the first half of the season. Is it possible that the challenges have gotten more physical in an attempt to convince tribes to keep their stronger members? So, we have tougher challenges and we got JP scolding tribes for voting out the members that would give them the best chance of winning challenges. Sounds like two things meant to accomplish the same goal to me. Maybe production thinks like I do. Maybe Survivor was never meant to be Big Brother in the jungle. Maybe. Either way, let's not degrade women by suggesting we need to make the challenges easier for them. I say the problem isn't the challenges. It is the women they are casting. Women like Laura, Tina, and Alicia can compete with men in 90% of challenges. Or just women like Amanda, Parvati, Danielle and Candice are capable enough in challenges to be assets to their tribe premerge. JP listed Micronesia, what, #2 on his list of best seasons. Clearly, he has nothing against women dominating the game.
>
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-06-10, 06:28 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
Even limiting ourselves to the last 3 years I still think you are wrong because most viewers love blindsides (That's why JP love S16 btw. He'd love it much better if Penner had done those blindsides, I'm sure)The original format led to season after season of pagoning where the first part of the season was so important they meant who had the numbers at merge would win. Viewers could stop watching until the finale. Was it better? Samoa, with a larger group but an early merge finally found a balance that was good for all the players. I'd argue that the first part of the season was key in understanding why Galu fractured. Don't worry, Survivor will never be as inept as BB simply because of its format. There are strategies to apply. It will never be as random as BB is even if Gabon came close. You wrote: "So, we have tougher challenges and we got JP scolding tribes for voting out the members that would give them the best chance of winning challenges." I'll simply note that, despite having a much stronger team, the Heroes are losing most challenges anyway. What has Colby done to help them win? NOTHING. When it came to brute strength, the Heroes won 8-0. They absolutely didn't need to keep all 5 guys. But, since it was Jeff's mancrush that was in danger... As far as: "let's not degrade women by suggesting we need to make the challenges easier for them." There's a huge difference between what I'm saying and degrading women. Should women be subjected to this?  Having separate events for women at the Olympics isn't degrading, it's simply natural. BTW, I think Survivor is going overboard in their challenges for men also. We're going to see a repeat of that horrible challenge in Samoa where Ben was DQ'ed. Are they waiting for someone to get killed?
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-07-10, 02:45 AM (EST)
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23. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
Well! What do you know?! High-five!
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michel 10812 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Playboy Centerfold"
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03-07-10, 12:52 PM (EST)
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25. "RE: Jeff ♥ Colby" |
"JP and Colby are in agreement over tribal strength vs alliance building."What makes it even more unbelievable is that Colby himself chose alliance over strength both times he played: In Australia, Kel wasn't voted out over beef jerky, that was the convenient excuse, the Ogakor5 (of which Colby was a member)agreed Kel would be the first one voted out even before they reached their camp. Then, according to Mitchell, Colby wanted Keith voted out 2nd but the girls made them agree on Mad Dog. In S8, Colby was a leading force behind the eviction of Hatch. Of course, Colby didn't know he wasn't in the alliance but that's another story.
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Tublecane 141 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Blistex Spokesperson"
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03-09-10, 06:06 PM (EST)
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29. "RE: Amanda's Not the Sharpest Tool!" |
"And, Tublecane, much more than lack of challenge ability, Cirie lost because Terry and Aras were both immune at F4 (a stupid twist) and because the producers changed from a F3 to a F2 format in Micronesia after James' medevac. Without that, she probably wins both seasons."Yes, and Russell (whom I bring up because I know you don't respect him as far as you can throw him) could have won had Brett not gone on an immunity streak and he was able to take Shambo to an F2. Not that he wouldn't have taken Natalie to F2 anyway, but, hey, so long as we're in fantasy land. Everything you cite may be mitigating, or may be just the breaks. But you must admit it's not just that Terry and Aras were safe and the producers screwed her. She has two bright, shiny flaws in her endgame. 1) she's too likeable, and 2) she sucks at challenges. Take away one or the other, and she might have won Exile Island or Micronesia, with or without the unfair twists.
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MizJazmine 532 desperate attention whore postings
DAW Level: "Reality Show Commentator"
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03-08-10, 09:39 PM (EST)
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27. "RE: Boom!! Goes Cirie!!!" |
Tom constantly gave Cirie her props, even as he was voting her out. Who else has Tom mentioned as a big threat besides Cirie. I haven't really heard him mention anyone besides her thus far. I like Cirie, but I would have put her out the game too for the same reasons Tom did. They played it well but they're "pros" now, that's what they're supposed to do.
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